Happy Sad Confused - Andrew Garfield, Vol. III

Episode Date: January 17, 2022

SPOILER WARNING! Here it is! You wanted Andrew Garfield back to finally spill all the SPIDER-MAN: NO WAY HOME secrets? Well this is the podcast for you. Strap in for a very fun spoiler-y chat. Don't forget to check out the Happy Sad Confused patreon here! We've got exclusive episodes of GAME NIGHT, video versions of the podcast, and more! For all of your media headlines remember to subscribe to The Wakeup newsletter here! Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

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Hey, guys, I'm Josh Horowitz. Welcome to another edition of Happy, Sad, Confused. And today, guys, is a very special episode. It's an unusual episode. Usually, I mean, We cover careers, we bounce around a lot of topics, we have meandering, fun, bizarre conversations. But this one, this one is laser focused on one topic and one topic only. Spoiler alert, guys, Andrew Garfield is on the podcast, finally spilling all the Spider-Man no way home details.

So a bit of context for this conversation. First of all, as I said, spoiler alert, spoiler alert, spoiler alert. You've been warned. Andrew Garfield is in Spider-Man No Way Home. Oh, it feels so good to finally say it out loud, doesn't it? The rumors were true, and I feel like I've had a very interesting vantage point on this whole Andrew Garfield is or isn't in Spider-Man chat over the last few months. As you may recall, Andrew was on this podcast last May. At the time, we were talking about mainstream and his love of Paddington, Paddington 2, I think, as I recall.

But of course, we were also talking a little bit about Spider-Man, as it always comes up in conversations with Andrew. And by then, rumors were swirling that he was in Spider-Man-No Way Home. I brought up those rumors. And as I've said before, I didn't even ask him the question. I didn't even ask Andrew if he was in the film. Before I knew it, he was launching into an extreme animated, excitable denial of him being in the film. Well, that was quickly distributed and laughed at perhaps analyzed all over the internet. Was he lying? Was he not? Let's analyze the tape. Let's pour over every frame. Why is he not making eye contact with Josh? Why is he laughing here? Is that a denial? What does he mean when he says this? It was a delight to see everybody, including myself. I didn't know the truth. I mean, I thought he was in the film. Everything I'd heard like you guys, it sounded like he and Toby McGuire were in the film. But I didn't know for sure. So that became the game for months and months and months. Is he or isn't he?

the film and it was thrilling that I happened to have the first conversation with him where he had this crazy denial that everybody really enjoyed. So since then, of course, I talked to him again for Tick, Tick, Boom. By the way, see Tick, Tick, Boom. He's extraordinary in it. He's going to get an Oscar nomination. Maybe the award, we'll see. So since then, he's also in Tammy Faye and extraordinary in that. I talked to him for that. So, you know, we, we, we, we, we, we, we, we, we, we, we, We've had these continuous conversations, and then, of course, Noe A Home comes out, and yes, not only is he in the film, he's in a ton of the film. Like, I don't know about you guys.

I was certainly not expecting Andrew Garfield and Tony McGuire to be in basically the last third, if not more, of the film and to be such an integral part of the story. And not only that, they were fantastic. It couldn't have gone better. I mean, you've seen the film by now, if you're listening to this. you know how just richly rewarding it was to see all our Spider-Men together on screen and to have the self-referential quips, but also to have this kind of emotional journey for all three characters,

and as Andrew will say in this conversation, serving mostly at the heart of it, Tom Holland's Spider-Man, who's on this huge emotional journey in the film, You know, not since Avengers Endgame has there been this kind of cathartic, like, pop culture, zeitgeist moment in a theater where people just lost their shit watching the movie. So, you know, once I saw the movie and I saw officially he was in it, of course, and even before that, I was chasing Andrew down to try and get him back on the podcast for a big discussion after the fact that you can only have after the fact. Well, kudos to Andrew. Kudos to Andrew's representation, who have always been great to me. And he's back.

And he's here. And this is a conversation that is solely focused, as I said, on Spider-Man. This is 45 minutes of a chat about everything you could want, I think. It's about all the rumors that were persisting for months. The DoorDash guy that saw him in Atlanta. the photos that were leaked, the video that was leaked, his stunt double that leaked the photo. So what was Andrew thinking? What was Marvel thinking? What was going on behind enemy lines? How much, what was the process of him getting involved in the film? Was there trepidation?

Was it all scripted? What did it make the cut? What is the future? Is he going to play Spider-Man again? All of these questions are asked and most of them are answered in this conversation. I know you're going to get a kick out of this. I certainly did. Not only that, stay tuned to the end because what I did at the very end was something that I thought he would have fun with, and sure enough he did. We go back to the original tape, to the original conversation when he denied, again, very vigorously being in Spider-Man, and I had him basically comment on his own reaction. Part of that is enhanced in visual form, certainly, but I think it will work audio-wise if you're just listening.

That being said, this entire conversation, as always, I should mention, whether you're a long-time listener or a first-time listener because of the Andrew Garfield chat, you should know if you want to watch every single morsel of this conversation. If you want to see it in living color on your screen, go to patreon.com slash happy, sad, confused. It's all there. sign up, you just have to sign up at the $10 producer level, and you will, is it producer, I think so, but whatever we call that level, the $10 level is where you get all the exclusive videos, and you'll get access to this video and every single other video we've posted there the last six, seven months. So whether you just want to watch this single video or just try Patreon on out for the foreseeable future, that's the way to do that.

But yeah, I don't know, guys. What can I say? This is one I've been chasing for a while, and it's rare when it all kind of lines up in the best possible way. But, you know, my relationship with Andrew, my relationship with, you know, the Spider-Man franchise, I mean, I've been covering this from the start, been covering Andrew's run from the start. So it's really deeply rewarding when it comes full circle, and you get to have a chat like this and really do. dig in. I hope you guys enjoy this as much as I did. Without any further ado, let's get right to it. Here is me and the werewolf himself, Andrew Garfield. So you're recording immediately. I want every single juicy second with you, buddy. You should start recording immediately

because we we you know we have we have some things to discuss what i don't know what you could possibly be referring to um how you do it first of all you do it okay i'm so i'm so happy that we get to follow up on uh our last conversations and i have some loose ends and um and i can make amends to you uh that's not what this is about i don't need apologies or anything like that, but I do, let's just, should we just launch right in? Should we just do it? Okay. We're launching right in with a, he's been on the podcast a couple times. Mr. Andrew Garfield joins me, and he's always welcome here. It's been a great year. Tick, tick boom. I will talk about till the end of time. Congratulations, buddy. But as you know, this is an interesting circumstance.

And I've been looking forward to this chat for a few months. Me too. Andrew, do you have any opening statement, any preamble before we launch right in? Oh, my goodness. Like, it's hard to know, like, it's hard to know if I won the game of Werewolf or if I lost it or if I'm somewhere in between. Because obviously there is a great portion of the population would have said, we knew you were the fucking werewolf you idiot like you're the worst liar ever and then there

might be other people that would be like no he got me or he got so I I am the werewolf and it was really fun to do that and to play that with you and to play it with all the people that watched that interview and listen to that interview and my gosh it's it's kind of sad I'm kind of sad that it's over in a way I kind of wish we could continue the game there will always be secrets. There will always be games to be played. Maybe not on this level. Maybe not.

This one was pretty special to be able to, it was such a lovely feeling to be able to have a surprise party planned for everyone. And then, you know, when you have like a friend that's like, no, just tell me this is a, I know this is a surprise party, so just tell me, I hate surprise party, just tell me. And then you have to like weigh that balance between, oh god now i feel a little bit guilty that i'm not telling them that there's the surprise party and actually they may not want the surprise but then i think deep down they really do

want the surprise to happen yes so i think i kind of was like putting myself in in in that position and going well what would i want i would want to be guessing so well there is okay so we have this is this is an extraordinary unique circumstance when we get a chance to kind of deep dive into to something that we've all been speculating about for so long. So if you'll indulge me, we're going to just have kind of like a little bit of a spoiler chat about all aspects of this, all the rumors that were circulating and the timeline.

I kind of want to get into as much of it as you're comfortable doing. First of all, when this came up, when Amy and Kevin and John came to you, was there doubt in your mind? Was it like, oh, this is a brilliant idea I'm all in? Or was it like given, you know, it was an interesting.

interesting way your tenure ended and I know there was mixed feelings about it. What was your attitude when they came to you? Was it an immediate yes or did you stew on it? It's a good question. Yeah. I mean, I definitely paused because as I'd spoken to you about before, like I had definitely closed that chapter of my life and felt very peaceful and good about it and only have nice feelings towards it at this point and and a great relationship with Amy and and love, genuinely love what Tom Holland's done and what John Watts and Kevin Feige has have done with Amy and the whole crew on it. So, you know, it's, it's, I can't avoid the fact that it was always my fantasy to, to be, to play that

part within the MCU. Right. And I was never, ever shy about that. I mean, it was at the first Comic-Con that I was a part of. I, I said, you know, what are your, the question was, what, do you have any dreams for this character? I would be fun to see him team up with. the Avengers and in the MCU, like, you know, that, that, as a fan, that's what you want. And I'm a fan, first and foremost, so that was that. So when this came around, you know, I, I was in a very, very kind of like, Zen place, and I was just a fan again. It felt great. And I was like, oh, do I want to, do I want to open that up again? Do I want to be a, and, and then when the, that was when I first heard that they wanted to do something with both Toby, myself,

and with Tom, I was definitely intrigued. And I think I probably cracked up laughing and this kind of giddy, nervous kind of, a little bit like, you know, you're about to end. I don't know. It was just very, very giddy. And I was like, oh my God, that's an insane idea. And then the pitch was just quite comprehensive. Like John, John is so full of heart. Kevin is so full of heart.

And obviously, I know and love Amy. And, you know, she's been with this character since the first Toby film. So it's, if anyone knows this character, it's Amy Pascal. So it was really, and I went to their offices. and they basically just kind of said, well, this is what we want to do. We think it could really work. We don't have a script yet.

And we don't want it to be like a stunt thing. We don't want it to be like a kind of a cameo, a quick, like in and out. We want it to be actually in service to Tom's journey as Peter and in service to both of your different Peters. and we really think there's something really interesting to explore about when these three lone wolves who think they're alone in the universe and their own experience of being singular experience of being Spider-Man come together like what we think and we want to collaborate on it basically we want to have your

input and your ideas and Amy was really amazing with that because she she knows that I was you know that I come with a lot of thoughts and kind of creativity and imagination and she was very good in setting that up with those guys and they were they were just like yes this is the way we want to work we want it to be a collaboration and and the main kind of image that they kind of pitched me was catching um zandaya catching oh was there from the start mj and that was a that was that was the first pages i saw and i was kind of like oh there's no way of not doing this because that's profound that's a profound moment the idea like an older brother saving his little brother from his same fate across the universe if that portal hadn't been opened up and my Peter Parker hadn't

had been there in that moment, it's arguable that he would have had the same fate, but the fact that I had, but like you suddenly get into this incredible kind of cosmic, you know, meant to be destined moment where I get to heal the worst trauma in my life while simultaneously saving my little brother from having to experience that same trauma. Suddenly you're in, you're in very, very mythic territory and it's just profoundly beautiful. So, yes, I was kind of... Since you mentioned that scene, can we dive into that scene for a second? Because, like, that is such just, like, it kicks...

It's just, like, everyone that watches that scene gets so emotional. I was just so moved from the time I saw it. And I'm just curious, like, was it always that on the page? Because it's pretty minimal. There's not much dialogue. It's really a look. It's for asking you back. Are you okay?

And the audience just, like, feels it on your face, feels it in your body. It's amazing. Yeah, I mean, so that was, you know, yeah you don't need the image is enough right like i think that was and it was really important one of the things that i i wanted to make sure that a thread that i wanted to make sure because in terms of selling that moment we needed that moment in um in the um the lab while we're all working on our cures of me just watching seeing them together yeah feeling them together and longing for them to be together. You just need to see my Peter clocking their true love and of course

opening his own wounds but also it opens another thing in him which is oh my God I want them to have that I want them to have I want my bro to have that and I want her to have that and I want her to have that and so I think that was a really important little seed to drop to make that later moment work and then the later moment it was I forget whether it was scripted or not but yeah the the total simplicity of it and and me me just in this i think it was really important to feel like that that it was a moment for my peter of i think i just saved you i think i did and i need you to tell me that i did because because i'm i'm not seeing you in my arms right And now I'm seeing Gwen not breathing in my arms right now because that moment becomes, you know, in that trauma moment, that's what happens. You get thrown back into. So it's, I think there's disbelief, genuine disbelief in Peter in that moment to check in and say, are you, are you okay? And the affirmation of that, and then it can start to sink in. And you kind of feel Gwen's hand on Peter's back.

a little bit going you can you can rest now you know there's a there's that thing that's that cosmic thing that happens and then this is a tribute to zendaya as a creative person and as an actress and then she because she saw what i was doing and what the effect it was having and she's just such a sensitive human being and mj is such a sensitive beautiful character that i i whether it was improvised or whether it was just her idea to say that in in the writing to to check in on me to ask if I was okay. That was all her, you know, that was, so like that, but that was happening all the time

and because we managed to create actual connection. Like for me and Toby coming in, and it's a testament to the three of them, to Jacob, Zendaya and Tom is that they love each other so much and they are such a pack. It's so true love, it's such true love between them. And they were so welcoming of me and Toby into that gang.

We created a gang for a minute, for that month or so that we were in Atlanta all shooting together and rehearsing together. And so every single moment that's happening between us on screen is kind of just us finding each other and kind of curious about each other and like loving each other and just kind of supporting each other and quibbling And like, the brother dynamic, it was all art imitating life, really.

Right. One of the other reasons I think that this, that scene was Zendaya Works is there is dialogue talking about where your Peter has been the last few years. And it's only alluded to in a couple lines. But I'm curious, like, how much did you fill that out? Those last like seven years, what's your, your Peter obviously has not moved on yet. He has not found his MJ. He is still, you know, he talks about not pulling him.

his punches. Like how much more did you flesh out? How involved were you in kind of figuring out like where Peter's been, where your Spider-Man has been? That's so interesting. The writers kind of, the great writers kind of beat me to it. Like that was their first pitch was we like the idea. And they were very open. They were like, but we like the idea of you having to have kind of cut your heart off from, this is how I understood it anyway, that you've had to kind of cut your heart off in order to carry on doing the job of Spider-Man. And that was the kind of the base note. And I thought, oh, that's really, really interesting.

And then, but then my concern with that was, was like, I don't want to be, that gives me actually a little bit of a journey to go on. But, but my main, one of my main impetus is for being a part of this was I wanted to have fun and I wanted, I wanted it to be joyful. And then I thought, well, actually then, that's actually a great place to start from and it gives me this big hunger for connection, actually. Like, and especially for this brother connection across universes, because I think, and then I started going, well, if I've cut my heart off, if I've cut Peter Parker off, then it means

that I'm being, then my, then my Spider-Manning is going to be suffering too, actually. Like, Spider-Man doesn't exist without the heart of Peter Parker. Sure. So I was just kind of taking that logic that the writers had kind of offered up, and, and I, kind of ran with it and expanded it and then yeah what the and then it was just a lot of finessing and fine-tuning of that pretty great kind of cuda theater that that john watts pulls off on that rooftop scene where it's just a fucking spider-man support group trying to save their brother from the abyss like that shit's cool and that it felt very very powerful because obviously what what tom is

going through tom's peter parker is going through in that moment is the heaviest stuff he's ever had to go through as as the character it's like it's all it's his origin story and that's just so happening to happen in the third film, in his third movie, which I think is another brilliant kind of reversal, like kind of irreverent undercutting of the usual formula, which is why these films work so brilliantly. And you guys are seeing it in front of you. You're seeing the echoes of your own origin story,

which is so powerful to see in your eyes. And it's pretty cool that his origin story is, as you say, witnessed and enabled by his older, across the universe spider bros like that's very very cool and so so yeah that that scene took a lot of finessing like me and toby worked really hard to to make sure that we were kind of the same mind coming at it from different corners of the of the peter parker psyche but that every line every breath every word every moment had to be in service of what tom was going through what tom's peter was going through. It couldn't be, well, I've been through this and I've been through that.

It had to be like, I'm telling you that I've been through this because I know where it leads. And I'm telling you that I've been through this to let you know that this isn't, that this unique pain that you're feeling is that, but also that you have, that you're, that you can actually maybe find some solace that, that this is survivable and actually might just deepen your destiny this actually might be a little destiny deepener for you um yeah is there anything that um any moment any scene that didn't make the final cut that you recall that you miss that you recall on set oh man i mean to be honest it's a lot of it like the great majority of the fuck around stuff that we were doing is is in there like a lot of the improvisations are in there like

a lot of the finding it is in there. Like, I love that John included the moment of me telling them I love you guys. And that thought's so important to me. And again, it's like that kind of like that journey for my Peter of kind of starting as this kind of, I don't know, defended, like untrusting, kind of slightly cut off person into this just back into his Peter Parkiness, back into, I've always wanted brothers. Like, all that was kind of just me riffing and kind of, like, just being honest, just being really, really honest and vulnerable in the moment. I love that Jamie got to say, I always thought you were black and me to be disappointed in myself and not being black.

Those moments, that was all really fun. And I love, so, so, like, we had lots of different lines for the to, like, me saying to Toby are you going to go into battle dressed like a cool pastor or are you going to put you bring your suit and that one I think was John was a John Watts or maybe it was his assistant because that they were just in the by the monitors like writing all the different versions of are you going to go into battle dressed as you know my my you know my my my mom's stepdad right any like all those things by and that one was was ultimately the one that made the cut there was a moment oh i i i i had a thought of a moment that i

that i oh so we were trying to figure out the pointing thing like how are we going to do the pointing thing in a way that famous meme of course yes yeah and how are we going to do it in a how where's that we it took us a while to it kind of happened naturally while we're on that scaffold and deciding like you peter one peter two peter three like all that but actually there was I was like I remember having a lightning bolt and going and like and then running into set and telling John I got it I got it I got it because there's this moment where Jacob's like hey Peter and we all go yeah but in the script it was like that was that it was like we all go yeah and then I think in scripted it was like my Peter says this is this isn't going to get old at all like

something kind of sardonic. Right. Which felt a little kind of undercutty and not quite right for the moment because it's cute. It's actually kind of cute. So then like we were thinking, I could say, oh, this is adorable. Like we're so adorable. Something like that. But then I was like, oh, no, this is the moment where we get to go, oh, did you mean me or did you mean that? So anyway, and John was like, that's it. That's it. Yeah, done. And I was so happy that that worked um anyway it was so there was it was so playful and creative and free and like i love the fact that toby has his back issues and that i'm kind of like be his friend by saying i have my back issues too i was stretching at one point in that scene like i was doing like old man

stretching before that moment right which just which didn't make the car but i think it's better i think it's better that that was all toby's um no i mean like it was so many there was a great improviser line that Tom had, which was about like, did you ever get like when we were talking about Toby's web, web, web fluids? Like, did you ever get like an MRI or like a kind of like, I don't know, like, have you ever like, because it would be fascinating just in the name of science to like, you know, x-ray your your wrists and see where it or where this fluid originates and like there was all like, so there's, there's always some stuff that doesn't make it. But to be honest, like a lot of, and like, and it was at first, Zendaya picks up a candle stick or something

to like, like, threaten me with in that first scene where I come in, but then there was this basket of bread and it was, that was her just going, can I just throw bread at him? And John was like, yeah, throw bread in him. Perfect. It was all, you know, it felt like kids just playing, like all of us just kind of playing. It was so much fun. What was, um, was it the same suit? Yeah. I still fit, brough. A testament to your discipline. Well done. No, I had to, no, I had to like work on it with my trainer.

But yeah, I was very nervous about that. I was very, I was like, no one wants to see. No one wants to see an old, an old fat guy in a Spider-Man costume. Are Mark and Emma, like, were they plugged in? Like, did you ever talk to them? Have they, do you know if they've seen the movie? Like, is that, like, what's that? their awareness of this.

Emma kept on texting me, and she was like, are you in this new Spider-Man film? And I was like, I don't know what you're talking about. You're stonewalling Emma. She was like, shut up. Just tell me. I'm like, I honestly don't know what I kept it going, even with her.

It's hilarious. To the end, you've never admitted to Emma? No. And then she saw it. She was like, you're a jerk. That is so cruel. and amazing and I love it. I didn't want to tell anyone.

I took it super simple. He didn't want to rob it. Yeah, I got it. I told no one. All right, so let's talk about the leaks and stuff. Let's talk about this fun, like the silliness, the arc of this. So I have a bit of a timeline as I researched it. So January of last year, I think this was the first kind of leaky story was a DoorDash

Delivery guy that supposedly. I delivered food to you. Was that a truth? That was actually, that was real, clearly. This was my first night in Atlanta. And I'm, and I'm with two of my best friends who, one of whom is on the Walking Dead, which shoots out there. And we're at the house that they're putting me up in.

And, you know, I order take out for us. And, you know, it's COVID is high, you know. And, and I order food. It's literally my first night there. And I know that I have to, you know, it's great. I get to wear a mask everywhere, I get to wear a hat, like, no one's ever going to know I'm here, and I'm, like, going to really be low-key and whatnot. So the guy comes to the door, the delivery guy, sweet-seeming guy, nice-seeming dude. And I opened the door, got my mask on my hat, and I'm like,

thanks, bro. And he's like, yo, yo, yo. And I'm like, what? He's like, I need to see your ID. And I'm like, huh? It's like, I need to see your ID. And I'm like, no delivery food thing has ever asked me for my ID. This is interesting. And by the way, he's like kind of like really close to the door. And at this point, I'm super like, I'm going to go to set tomorrow. I don't want to get, I don't want to risk shutting down a Marvel set in the middle of the pandemic.

So I'm like, hey, man, do you mind just like, yeah, yeah, okay, sure, just one second. And do you mind just like stepping a few feet back because of COVID and everything? And he does. I don't know if he had a mask on. I forget whether he had a mask on or not. But either way, I'm like, sorry, man, why do you need my ID? Right. Because I need to check the issue.

And I'm like, well, first of all, on my DoorDash account, it's not my name. And he's like, yeah, because you got alcohol. I'm like, no, I didn't get alcohol. Oh, yeah, yeah, that's what he had said on the, yeah. I'm like, I didn't get any alcohol, man. some tacos and uh you have to be 21 to get a taco now what kind of world like dude this is a fishy this is fishy bro and then um and then i'm like one second so i'm just like hey trevor just go show you like to my friend trev like can you show the guy your ID so that this is all just put to rest

and it's my first night i'm like oh my god i'm going to get rumbled that i'm in the last like immediately and then yeah lo and behold the guy goes and goes like i just i think i just delivered food to Andrew Garf, I think he called me rude, which I definitely wasn't. I did I did ask to do social distancing, but I obviously upset the man. I didn't mean to it. I apologize for anything that may have been misconstrued as being rude. Don't like upsetting people, but it just became this whole thing and then like, I think he got in trouble, I don't know, whatever, but wherever you are, sir, I saw you, I knew what you were up to, you're sneaky, and uh and uh you gave me a good challenge that night so yeah so that happened yeah so so

you can weigh in on any of these that you want but let's see i so in march your double i believe posted a photo of himself with tom's stunt double how to what were the what was the aftermath of that one andrew were there conversations i love william spencer so much he's my he is my dude for life like He is such an incredible artist. What he does, just if anyone doesn't follow him on Instagram, you should. He is a genius skateboard clown, physical comedy, performer, slackline. Like, he does the craziest shit ever. And I'm so proud that me and him got to create the physicality of my Spider-Man together.

Because there's no one else who could do it than him and another. guy Il Ram Choi who's just just they're both just geniuses but yeah me and me and William are friends I love him but I saw I saw this post and I was like bro what I dude what are you doing like Tom Stundubble is like there or something I figure what it was but it was just like and he was very sweet about it he was like he was like come on man I'm just like let me do my thing and I'm like yeah do you think but like I'm I'm literally indoors like I'm not in the world in any way trying to keep the secret but yeah he was he was like oh yeah my bad I'm like cool I love I love him I love him

but yeah and then I think he took the post down which kind of brought more attention to it it's like oh no so then things start to kind of escalate and the rumors kind of accumulate and then as we kind of start to, so then like I talk to you and other people start to talk to you and you do some vociferous denials that, by the way, for the record, I bought it in the moment. I totally bought it. I really did. And it was only afterwards when everybody else was like, that's a pretty profoundly extreme denial.

But anyway, but then in the months in August and September, there's a photo of you guys. And then there's video, there's a tiny, I mean, I don't know how this escapes Marvel's inner sanctum. I guess my question is like, at a certain point, was there ever discussion of like, okay, let's just give it up. I mean, it'll add to the marketing. Let's just like open, let's just say we're in it. Or was it, was there a lot of conversation about like, no, we're just going to stonewall? There was no, there was, there was not a big conversation about any of it. It was all, I would, I would, I would text Amy and be like, have you seen this?

Yeah. and she'd be like oh my god what and i'm like okay so cats out of the bag right and but then ultimately it was like no we just we just hold the line and we just kind of keep going because i think it and i and i think that was the right thing to do like it was you know even though even if the majority of people were like we're pretty sure this is going to happen i think there's always even when you're pretty sure something's going to happen psychologically and you want it to happen I think when it comes to the moment where you're about to find out if it's going to happen or not yeah suddenly like a weird self-preservation thing comes in where you want where you start to to live with the

idea of it not happening in your mind and in your body and then that just ups the want for for the thing to happen so actually there's a real kind of fun chemical thing that gets created in you and even with the people that I think were pretty sure it was going to happen I'm sure there was like a little scintilla of doubt as they were walking in to see no way home which allowed them to release and say yes it happened you know I and I and I so I think it was the absolute right thing to do and and then it gave me fun things to talk about and deny and talk about Photoshop and like even though it was like clearly me on set for Spider-Man wearing a Spider-Man.

I don't know how deep you went in, but there were, like, YouTube videos, like, analyzing it. They had, like, VFX guys being like, this is not actually, but this can't be pushed. If you look at the indentation here, it's impossible. But I love that. I mean, like, we all need something to do. We all need something that we enjoy doing, you know,

and to get behind. And, yeah, Spider-Man is a religion for us. So it's like, yeah, it's cool. So in the aftermath, of this. And this couldn't have gone better. Artistically, commercially, critically, it's just like it doesn't happen like this. And it must be so satisfying from your perspective. And on behalf of the audience, it is very satisfying for all of us to watch this come to fruition. I'm sure you've sensed this. There is like this adoration, not only for this

film, but for your character, for your specific Peter in this and your arc in this. And there is a real hunger and thirst seemingly for more of you. And I know it's greedy to ask for more as this Peter Parker, but I don't know, where are you at? I know you've said in some other interviews that you're open, if it's the right thing, but just give me a sense. Like, if you're a betting man today, do you think there's another Spider-Man movie in you? I don't know. I will say this.

Like, I feel that love permeates. That love has reached me, and the kind of the enjoyment of people in the theaters have reached it's reached me and it's very touching I find it really deeply moving because you know

when we finished my second Spider-Man film you know there was a it was a kind of it petered out you know it was an awkward kind of goodbye and you never had kind of the

there was a disjointedness there so for me coming back and actually getting some getting some more time to have fun with it and to give the character some closure and to play and to be the version of Spider-Man

that I was always wanting to get to and to be with, you know, Toby and Tom and the rest of everybody in the movie, that was healing and, like, just an incredible full-circle moment. And then, of course, you have this other element where actually, like, it's breaking records in terms of people wanting to see it and then you have this incredible critical response and you have being a part of tom's origin story and i was torn open by tom's storyline like

tom being tom being isolated at the end away from his love and away from his best friend gives me chills now when i saw it i was i was broken by it it was so agonizing and the way he plays it and the way that the three of them have created this this love bond you know and to see it broken it's just that the tragedy of it is so palpable and heavy and real amidst these very light John Hughesy films like John Watson's on really with Zendaya and with Jacob they've really created something quite profound and spectacular while while being an incredibly effective popcorn entertainment film so like all of these things start to become like icing on top of icing on top of icing. And to have a friendship with Toby now that I didn't have as deeply

previously that I'm so grateful for to have a mentor in him and to be able to have a real like brotherhood with him and with Tom. It's just gorgeous. And then there's this other thing that you've alluded to where you feel kind of seen and appreciated and and kind of welcomed and and kind of feel a part of a character that you've always wanted to be a part of. And I'm really humbled by it, to be honest. I'm very, very touched by it. And I owe a lot of that to Amy, Pascal and Kevin, for bringing me back into the fold and allowing me to have another crack

and to audiences for their generosity and for, you know, I'm really humbled, man. And all I want to do is be a part of stories that make a difference in people's lives. Yeah. So to have that being reflected back and for people to be saying that that's what's happening is all the satisfaction that I want. And in terms of moving forward with the character, like, yes, I am definitely open to that. And again, it would have to be something very unique, very special and of service to an audience of service to the character. and I think there's something playful and unique and odd and unexpected to be done.

I'm not sure what that is, but if we can figure that out, that would be so much fun. I mean, a lot of folks have mentioned, I mean, like, you know, you've got Tom Hardy's venom out there. You've got the, that's a cool idea. I mean, and there's obviously, as you alluded to from the start, you always kind of wanted to mix it up with the MCU. Now all bets are off. I mean, who the hell knows, you know? I would love to continue working with Toby, like, and, and, and, and, and, and, and, I'm with Tom. Like, I think that, that kind of three, three brother dynamic is so, I don't know, uh, juicy. And yeah, anyway, yeah, there's, there's, there's a lot, but, but to be honest, man, like, I'm going to just honestly say, like, I'm so happy and satisfied and grateful to be a part of this that I, it's hard to, to, to, to, to, to, to, to, to, to, to, to, to, I'm really just kind of trying to savor this moment with the, with the, with the audience and, and, and, and just, and, and just, and just, and just, and just, and just, and just, and just, and just, and just kind of say thank you and, and yeah, I feel very, I just feel very, very humbled and grateful for the

response. Um, I'll let you go in a sec, but I'm just curious, like, does it, has this changed your relationship with the character, like now? Like, I mean, you obviously, this is a character you've always talked about just being so personal and passionate about. Um, I don't know, sitting here today versus 18 months ago before you put the costume back on, how's the relationship different between you and Peter and Spider-Man? It's definitely different. It's lighter. It's, um, it's, It's more restful. Again, because I think the simple fact that we were mid-story, and the most traumatic thing had happened in that character's life,

and then the story would kind of split. And we didn't get to continue to explore that, and that's why when these writers had this incredible idea that my Peter has been in a very dark place, I then, the process of filling out those last seven years or whatever felt healing to me it felt like oh and then this may have happened and then suddenly you're kind of imagine imaginatively walking through a character's experience without it being filmed but for your own kind of um sense of journey and sense of connection to that character and then again as i say

having having that closure with with mj and tom and gwen and the brotherhood and the re a reconnection with the heart of Peter felt like this perfect, full circle closure moment. So I feel, I feel much lighter, much like the character feels now. Much like that Peter got, got the gift of his own heart back and a lightness of spirit back and a remembrance that he can't be Spider-Man without being Peter,

without being that good, ordinary kid that's always gonna try as hard as he can to help us people as possible and to love and to be kind and to be thoughtful and to help old ladies across the street like that being reconnected to that essence of peter is definitely makes me feel a much greater the sense of lightness around around the character and and you know to to to be in the mc u with with with kevin fagie and and with you know with tom's peter and and and it's it's a very very cool healing thing. For all of us, an extraordinary film, an extraordinary performance. Congratulations all around. It's been fun to mix it up with you on this, on this silly, bizarre publicity

circuit. If you'll indulge me, I want to try one thing. Can I show you the two minutes of video and can I just of our conversation and you tell me what you were thinking? As I stop and start it? I just want to see if this worked. All right. So here is our clip, Andrew, from last May. Tell me what to stop it if you want to just discuss anything that strikes you about your two minutes of um enthusiastic denials here we go bring up the spider-man stuff because obviously i don't even want to like ruin anything if there is something to ruin except to say anything to ruin bro i just quickly just cut you off okay so immediately i'm stressed like immediately i'm like over-excited and like my heart is racing and adrenaline is pumping through my veins and like i have to i i over-competent

and say massively was this the first like on camera question about it okay so you you knew this was coming yeah did you have a strategy going in did you know what you were going to say to me or the first person that was going to ask no i didn't i didn't i was going to just trust my instinct and i really was framing it like a game of werewolf i was literally like i like for anyone who's play where it is the most stressful game ever and you and like luckily we have never played we're ever together so you don't know my tells and like i remember the first like Everyone's ex. I remember my friends told me, like, everyone's extremely good when they first play Weirwolf because no one knows about how they're going to play or what their lying instincts are. But like, so my first instinct when I played Weirwolf and it worked was to like ride the anxiety of being the werewolf and like act as if I was just like so like so like so desperate for you to not know that to know that I'm not the werewolf like so like to actually.

just like turn that feeling of knowing you are in the way you are the waywolf but acting as if you're like using it to say that you're not so it's just using the energy not suppressing it so that was what i was trying to do but it was just like i'm not it i'm not you definitely used it let's watch the rest there's nothing to ruin really like it's just got a knot of ham this is all bullshit dude it's fucking hilarious to me because it's like because i because i do have this twitter account and I like I see like how often like Spider-Man is trending and it's like people freaking out about a thing and I'm just like guys guys guys like you're proud of your work you're happy with your work you that was good that was good because like that added color to the thing and it's like

oh I know because I've been seeing within my Twitter thing and it's like oh man like I keep thinking like oh I just want to be able to tell people I'm not that that's kind of that I'm in with that. Yeah, I think if you had quit around here, we'd be okay. I wish I could just, like, be able to speak to everyone and say, like, how do you just take off? Because you are, I recommend that you chill. Like, like, listen, I can't speak for anything else but for myself. Sure. Like, like, they might be doing something, but then ain't none.

Like, I ain't got a call. So like. Still believing it. I'm still in. That makes my life easier. Okay, no, that's good. That's unequivocal. You know what it feels like, though?

This hasn't come up yet in an interview, but like, do you ever play the game, Werewolf? No. Or Mafia? Yeah, yeah, yeah. Uh-huh. You know that game? This is good.

Again, this is very smart because it's, it's like, it's framing it in a way that, like, will justify my nervousness. Right. I'm like, how do I get people off my back? How do I justify that I'm acting like an insane person right now? And this will actually make this, this might actually, because without this, people will be like, he's really overdoing it. Right. But I think this may be, my thought was anyway, I don't know if it was successful or not, but I think it's quite, quite smart. But like, the thought was, if I frame it in this way, they will, they will read my anxiety and my fear as just this being a part of this game.

I think you'll see the turning point towards the end. Let's see. I think it's kind of similar where it's like you're convincing everyone that you're not in the mafia. Right. Like I feel like I'm in a game of fucking werewolf or mafia where I'm like, I'm not the werewolf. I promise you I am not the werewolf. And everyone's like, you're the werewolf.

You're the fucking werewolf. Look at him. It's like he's doing it. Okay. So for the record, my friend, on a stack of whatever you have there, you are not as of this taping in or have. any knowledge of being in the next by the way like what you did that you fucker like that was fucking awful because I've just gone through all that rigmarole and now you're like

using legalese like language and I'm and I'm making it friendly you're my friend here you wouldn't lie to me Andrew right you're fully entrapping me and after I've just gone through all that I have to like and now I feel bad like if I fully lie like I have to like say language that can be like reinterpreted so that was very small on your on your end and indeed i think mission accomplished because if you look at your reaction here you don't know what to do no i blow it i totally blow it i feel like like i feel like haven't i just said that you have i just want to get really clear i want this is the unequivocal yes no answer you won't say it's so adorable you won't actually deny it you won't just like say point blank i started to feel guilty i started to feel really really

guilty at that point because i was like oh my god he's like putting me in it he's jamming me in a corner and i don't want to lie to josh like i really like josh and now like i'm now i'm now i'm being made to be a dick i don't want to be a dick right let's finish on here i did not get a call maybe they shot you gorilla style like in mainstream on the street listen i wanted there but so did you did get a call it wasn't a text or uh some some some smoke signal for the record. I actually didn't get a call. I got a text from Amy.

And then it was organized for me to go and meet them in the office through my agent. Okay. So you were telling the truth in really extenuating circumstances, the really stretch. Oh, I don't know about you, but this has been very cathartic. This is one of the more unique podcasts I've ever done. Like I said at the outset, I was looking forward to this. for months. And you're a gentleman to submit yourself to this post-mortem, but it's... I know we've been doing a fun dance, and it's good to complete it together.

It's been really fun for me, too. You've been a good sport with it. Thanks, buddy. Congratulations all around. Not only on Spider-Man, you know what a fan I am of Tick-Tick, boom. Everybody, if you haven't checked it out by now, it's waiting for you on Netflix. The justified acclaim, yeah, the acclaim is warranted. Andrew just kills it. this as does Lin-Manuel Miranda in the entire company. And congrats, man, again, on being part of, like, this pop culture moment that is just, you know, it's more than just like a job at box office juganaut. It's a really cathartic, emotional moment for any fan of Spider-Man, the MCU, your work, etc.

So enjoy the moment, enjoy the ride, man. I really appreciate that. And I am. I'm so, so grateful to you. And I'm really just, really, and just for the, for the Spider-Man fans out there, I'm incredibly grateful to you guys for welcoming me back into the fold with such warmth and open hearts and open my open arms. And while you're here, yeah, watch Tick, Tick, Boom, because it's such a beautiful story,

especially for you young Spider-Man fans out there, you know, anyone who's ever wanted to be an artist or live a life of their own, like, you know, their own making and to follow your own dreams, this is a story about a man who did just that and he was an incredible symbol of living our true true calling and our true destiny and I think you'll enjoy it's a rock musical

so the music the music rocks a hell will be year for you man tough to follow it up but I know you've got it in you thanks as always

for the time and I'll see you a bit I appreciate it dude thanks again and so ends another edition of happy

sad confused remember to review rate and subscribe to this show on iTunes or wherever you

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