Happy Sad Confused - Baz Luhrmann

Episode Date: June 23, 2022

This week Baz Luhrmann welcomes Josh to his home for an up close and intimate chat about his latest passion project, ELVIS, the reason why so many of his romantic films end in tragedy, and his unparalleled collection of screen test footage. For all of your media headlines remember to subscribe to The Wakeup newsletter here! Don't forget to check out the Happy Sad Confused patreon here! We've got exclusive episodes of GAME NIGHT, video versions of the podcast, and more! Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

During the Volvo Fall Experience event, discover exceptional offers and thoughtful design that leaves plenty of room for autumn adventures. And see for yourself how Volvo's legendary safety brings peace of mind to every crisp morning commute. This September, lease a 2026 XE90 plug-in hybrid from $599 bi-weekly at 3.99% during the Volvo Fall Experience event. Conditions apply, visit your local Volvo retailer or go to explorevolvo.com. Ontario, the weight is over. The gold standard of online casinos has arrived. Golden Nugget Online Casino is live.

Bringing Vegas-style excitement and a world-class gaming experience right to your fingertips. Whether you're a seasoned player or just starting. Signing up is fast and simple. And in just a few clicks, you can have access to our exclusive library of the best slots and top-tier table games. Make the most of your downtime with unbeatable promotions and jackpots that can turn any mundane moment into a gold Opportunity at Golden Nugget Online Casino. Take a spin on the slots, challenge yourself at the tables, or join a live dealer game to feel the thrill of real-time action, all from the comfort of your own devices.

Why settle for less when you can go for the gold at Golden Nugget Online Casino. Gambling Problem Call Connects Ontario 1866531-260-19 and over, physically present in Ontario. Eligibility restrictions apply. See Golden Nuggett Casino.com for details. Please play responsibly. Prepare your ears, humans. Happy, sad, confused begins now. Today on Happy Say I Confused,

Baz Luhrman takes on the king with Elvis. Hey guys, Josh Harowitz here with another edition of Happy, Sad, Confused, and yes, another, yeah, he's an iconic filmmaker. Stay what you will, but Baz Luhrman, he makes a mark with every single film of his. and they are rare treats. He's not a prolific filmmaker, but he is a memorable filmmaker. Each film, an indelible piece of movie making,

certainly from Strictly Ballroom, which is 30 years ago, if you can imagine through Romeo and Juliet and Moulin Rouge, and now his new biopic Elvis. This was a rare treat. Rare because, again, Baz doesn't work, or doesn't, at least, I mean, he's working constantly, but his films take a while. So rare in that case, but also rare in the way this happened.

You know, if you've been watching our video versions in podcast form, whether it's on the Patreon page or through the promos that I put up on my social media, you know I've been doing most of these over Zoom, 99% of them over Zoom. Well, in this case, I got an invitation, and it was an invitation I couldn't pass up. It was an invitation to Basil Orman's home. And you know I'm not going to pass that up. Bazz is actually a New Yorker. I mean, he has a couple homes, but he spends most of his time when he can in New York City, as I do.

And I was just privileged and honored that he was so gregarious and welcoming to let me into his home to have this chat. And he was such a lovely host. It was, I mean, you know, without betraying any confidences, like Baz Luhrman's home is exactly what you would expect it to be. It is gorgeous. It is impeccable. It is maybe eccentric, but in the best possible way. But it is deliciously Baz in every way. And it was exciting to see him in that environment. We sat down in his screening room and just had a lovely chat between whirlwind visits or travel, I should say, around the world for him right now. He is going from country to country, city to city. He was in New York City for, I think, like 24 hours in between visits to Memphis. and Toronto, and again, was very kind to carve out this time out in his schedule for a career chat, not just a chat about his new film, but indeed this is a chat about his entire career. And he's a lovely man, a thoughtful man, a self-deprecating man, but a true artist through and through. And I really, really dug this chat.

His new film, which is about to hit theaters as you hear this, is Elvis, which you probably haven't, you can't miss, right? This is a big movie, a big biopic, but in a very basalerman way, not a typical sort of biopic. It is, has beautiful cinematography and production design and performances. Oh my God, the performances, guys, you've heard a little bit about this by now, I assume. But Austin Butler, who's a relatively, I wouldn't say he's a big movie star, at least not yet, guys, he's about to be. He stars as Elvis Presley in this one. He's bounced around a bit.

He was kind of like a Nickelodeon kid and a Disney kid. kid. And then in recent years, he showed up in, most notably, in Once Upon a Time in Hollywood. You may remember him as texts in that great sequence on The Ranch with Brad Pitt. Made a great mark in that one in just a couple scenes, and Baz snapped him up. This was a very famous kind of audition scenario where everyone from Miles Teller to Harry Stiles was up for the role of Elvis Presley, as you can imagine. any actor would covet this sort of role in a Bazorman film and Austin got the role and man he really kills it in this he is fantastic in the film and um it is one of those moments where not only

does he jump off the screen and he does he transform on the screen in the ways that you know i think i mentioned um jim morrison in the doors way back when or or jalo as selina in recent years Rami Malik as Freddie Mercury. This is one of those kind of performances. And I really do believe this could this could catapult him. Austin's got a lot of exciting things up coming up. And I actually, by the way, had a chance to chat with Austin for MTV News. And by the time you listen to this or maybe within a few hours, my chat with him should be up on MTV News's YouTube page. And again, I'll put that out on my social media. So this is Elvis Week in Josh Tarowitz, Happy Say, Confused Universe Land, the Baz Luhrman conversation here, the Austin Butler

conversation on MTV News, all things, Elvis, and I hope you guys enjoyed it, and check out the movie. Like I said, it is a rare treat when Baz delivers a piece of entertainment, and it is a special one, as all his work is. So I wanted to mention all of that, and again, so exciting to get to do this in his home. Oh, my gosh, it was really cool. other things to mention well by the time you listen to this i've gotten such great reception to my interview with chris evans that i did for mtv thank you guys uh for checking it out and saying the kind

things that you have if you haven't checked it out again that's over at mtv news's youtube page and we covered quite a lot in that chat he was promoting light year but we talked about um everything from yes marvel and his love of star wars and musical theater to um mental health and anxiety And somehow we packed a lot in, and it's a conversation I'm very proud of with one of the biggest movie stars on the planet. So really thrilled about that. What else to say? I taped a new sketch for Comedy Central today with a newbie, a young lady, who I have not done much with before. Got to know today, and she's got an exciting future ahead of her.

She is already an accomplished actor, but also has some really cool films coming up this. summer. There's a tease for you and she killed it in the sketch this morning. I can't wait to show that to you. That will be out in a few weeks. What else can I tease? I don't know. Comic-Con is around the corner. We're gearing up for that. I'll be there in a big way. Anything else? Anything else? I guess that's enough of a tease right now. A reminder. Most, if not all of the happy, say I confused conversations are available in video form on the Patreon. I will say not the Bazzylerman one. This was just audio only. This was the rare one that was just audio only, though he snapped some really cool photos that I'll put up on social media. But 99% of the

others are in video form. And if you subscribe to the Patreon at the producer, no, no, it's the middle level. It's the second tier. You get every single video we've ever produced for Patreon. So go over to patreon.com slash happy, sad, confused. It's on a game night episodes. Happy Sad Confused episodes. Ask Josh Anything episodes. We give you, hopefully, I think a lot of bang for your buck. So everybody there has been very kind and seems to dig it. So if you're curious about it, give us a try for a month. See if you like

it. What's the worst that happens? You cancel. That's all. No harm, no foul. Okay. Let's get to the main event. As I said, you know, you guys know I love it when I talk to like a great autore, a unique talent, a unique filmmaker that I've watched

virtually my entire life. And as you'll hear in this conversation, Baz's films are very personal to me for a variety of reasons and you'll hear that in this conversation. Remember to check out Elvis in theaters any moment now, check out my Austin Butler interview and here's the main event.

Here's me and Mr. Baz. I'm privileged to welcome at last Mr. Baz Ormond to the Happy Say I Confused podcast. Not only that, I have to say, I'm privileged to be in your home, sir. Thank you. It says a lot of... Someone was just about to sit on a pile of underpants.

That's how intimate we're getting, Josh. We had to find a ruin that wasn't sort of echoy. No, it's brilliant. As a New Yorker, I always love to see. You've made your home here. You've made your home here. Oh, yeah, we're New Yorkers. I mean, we were always, like I have a philosophy, you know, dream in Paris.

You know, have fun in London if you've got money and maybe dance in Brazil, get lost in Shanghai or Tokyo. You know, Australia's home, work in L.A., but live in New York. Live in New York. It does strike me, though, like, look, part of what I think of your films is you're a world builder. And you have, you've created a world for yourself here, a far cry from the kind of environment I'm sure you grew up in as a kid. Well, yes, but interesting enough, if I really think about, I'm so old, I can say anything I like, you know, I'm filtered. That's the best kind of podcast.

Yeah, I know, this kind of podcast you want, isn't it? But I built worlds. We had a world. It's not like I lived in this dusty gas station. It was decrepit and the wind was blowing and a truck would drive in once. We, my father, we built a world on the gas station. It was like a caravansia in the sense of the real world, which means that there was when, you know, camel trains would stop.

And it was a whole little world that you'd stay at. And, you know, it had a restaurant and we all had different things that we did. I bred fish and, you know, Dad had a prodigious kind of imagination, and we all got whipped up in it. And then we had very interesting people come and live with us from artists and things like that. So I think actually I just brought my world building with me.

Yeah, a little heightened version of that in a way, just like your films of this. Yeah, I just couldn't live in the caravans here all my life. Fair enough. Fair enough. I have to say, like many, I feel such a deep personal connection with your films, and that's very unique for filmmakers to cut through and you know this by now.

Like, your films, regardless of a subject matter, they cut through and people feel a real personal connection. I mean, I'll tell you a brief anecdote in that, you've probably heard a version of this story many times, but, like, Ewan Rouge played a part in, like, my proposal to my wife. Like, he helped me propose, actually, many years ago, Ewing, and we still have the signed poster of Moulon in our home. And I know, like, I'm not unique.

Many people feel that way about your films. And I'm just curious, I mean, when did that strike you? That's not something you can chase. But that's something that you must have observed over the years, the connection that folks feel with your films is really powerful. Well, I think if the question is, did I set out to make films that people get married to and proposed to? Probably not. Sure.

But I think that I'm old enough in the process to have to acknowledge that there's a certain, set of patterns in the work that I do. And certainly there's a language. There's a cinematic language, which part of it was kind of by design. And then part of it, I think, I realize now is just who I am. It's how, I mean, a painter David Hockney, who was like some of the operas I did,

one said, oh, it's the way I see things. And I think I know it's the way I tell things. Now, not everybody likes the way I tell things, but if you like the way I tell things, but if you like the way I tell a story, then the connection is, can be deep, you know. Well, it's the specificity of vision, right? The more, the more specific, I find a story to be told

and a singular vision from feeling a singular vision from a filmmaker, even if it's obviously a very collaborative art form. Ironically, the more deeply connected you feel to it because you're feeling someone's humanity come through in a way. Yeah, I think, yes. I mean, look, and then there's filmmakers and there's a start of filmmaking

where the idea is that the storyteller's way of telling is invisible and there are others that do neither is better or worse exactly I mean as I say I just said recently I've got in not a lot of trouble for it but I said you know I loved the Batman but man cannot live by Batman alone

I think we can all agree on that yeah I really thought it was great but I mean there are my whole process is about creative adventure for me what do I need in my life and how can I put something out there

at the end of it that's useful and they aren't short talking about world building I could live inside the research world of a Gatsby and never make the film I could live inside all this journey I've gone on with Elvis and the Colonel and never make the film

at some point you've got to make the film because people are going like hey I've been funding it for years to wander around pretending you're, you know, Scott Fitzgerald, spending time in speakees, he's a little bit too much, my friend. Could you roll camera, you know? Let's talk a bit about Elvis. It's another exceptional piece of work.

Thank you me. And, look, you, my sense over the years is maybe the only thing you enjoy more than working with movie stars is helping create movie stars. And it's really a special thing. I just spoke to Austin the other day. Yeah, he's something special.

He's very special. He really is. And I look at MTV. We knew him from his shows there, and I had interviewed him there, and he was so sweet and soft-spoken to see him, like, transform from, like, this introvert, seemingly into the most spectacular enterment of all time is remarkable. I mean, you know something I don't, because I only ever met him. I mean, I'll talk about the casting process in a minute, but you're the first person I met who actually knew him before. You knew Jesus before he was a superstar. I mean, that's a song.

That's an old 70 song. But I should have said that. Oh, my God. I was kidding. But you knew him before he was going down the road of Elvis. And I only knew him when he was going down the road of Elvis. Right. But I heard he was shy and very introverted.

But that's not the man you met. Well, no. He was already down Elvis Presley Boulevard to a degree. I mean, I gave him great resources and a process and a world. and support, but I mean, it wasn't a normal casting process, I mean... Well, none of yours are, to be fair. No, no. I know

enough about your work. You're right about that. But what I mean is I did get this now mythological tape that was this kid wrapped up in a gown playing unchained

melody and weeping to the sky. And I later learned that He wants the role, but does a tape, thinks it's bad, and the fact that he lost his mum at the same year that Elvis does and there's a nightmare and all of that. So I must see him. Yes, Denzel Washington did ring me and I do not know him. He says, you're about to meet someone whose work ethic is like no other. Boy, did that come true.

And then, pretty much when he came in, like he even came in, I said, can you sing? He said, well, I sing a bit, you know, to a friend of mine. and my then Brandon I used to sing to my mother but not much and honestly just recently I had to put out a costume test I did with him

seeing that's the right mama to prove that he's actually singing all the young elves yeah so but pretty much he was just down Elvis road and it just continued I mean yes I put him through the ringer yes I checked out could he be robust enough yes I sort of had to explore

well he really plays young punk Elvis great how's it going to be when we start putting him in prosthetics and all of that kind of thing. But he just never failed. In fact, whatever I threw at him, he doubled down and went further.

Because that must be the fears. Like, you get into kind of like Kabuki theater by the end. Well, impersonation. Yeah. I mean, this is the most impersonated man in history. Literally. Like, literally.

There are literally competitions, and people go like, you go, I've seen them, you get like a 19-year-old kid going, I'm in grade six. The level of Soviet. It's like a seventh. Dan, Elvis impersonation, and soon I'll have my black belt in, you know, and I shouldn't be facetious because that's quite what they call tribute artists, quite a beautiful art form, but it's

not, and people think, I will just get a great tribute artist, but this isn't a tribute to Elvis and everything he was on the outside. This is revealing a man, and this is, you know, it's not an impersonation, it's a person, and that's a humanity thing and a soul thing, and it's a private thing. So he not only had to get all of the, you know, matching for comeback special, every move, every look, every wink, as Priscilla eventually said when she saw it, but he had to reveal the person. And that's a whole other job. It's interesting, because I heard you speak relatively early when the, like, the marketing was starting, and you mentioned it, like, comparing it as, like, a superhero story. And part of me was, like, rolled my eyes back a little bit.

Okay, this seems like marketing. Maging point. Yeah. Then I watched the movie, and I'm like, oh, this is a superhero origin story. This is a man who has, like, a secret superpower that kind of comes from beyond. He has almost, like, that classic trope of, like, the best friend who's also maybe his mortal enemy. Yeah. Were you thinking about that in mind? Like, when did that occur to you that there are some similarities? Yeah, okay, so I'm working on it.

By the way, I know what you mean? I was cautious of putting it out there. I thought, like, I held with it. I always get slammed anyway. So whatever I say. So, but you see, Elvis says that himself at the end of the other, the movie, The Real Elvis. He says, when I read the comic books, I was a hero in those comic books. Now, when I went back and I've been researching on this and living it, I went to Memphis five

years ago, coming and going for two years. But the comic book, the Captain Marvel Jr. is in the Tupelo Museum. And he copies the hair and all of that. And also, he's a, just like Captain Marvel Jr. in the comic book, he's an impoverished kid. And he goes through this damaged home with Dad going off to jail. I mean, it is, it's messianic. Dad goes off to jail. Mum and he are running around trying to survive. Then at one stage, they're living in one of the few white houses

in the black environment, in the black community. You know, and he's got this super power, which is he's got an orphan-like voice and loves. And it's not just he loves music, he is music, he lives music. So the capes and everything at Elvis and the costumes and the belts and everything. I mean, that's not a stretch to say. see that he's, he's, you know, he's, um, you know, style jacking superheroes, you know? How much does the subject matter affect the style?

It's obviously, as we discussed before, it's like you're one of those filmmakers that you see a frame, oh, that's a Basileman film. But there are still infinite variations on what that can be. How much did Elvis's flamboyance, his identity dictate how you shot the film, how you wanted it paste, how you wanted it to feel? I mean, one of the things, there are three Elvis's. I mean, there's 50s punk, rebel, then there's Hollywood pop in the inner sort of bubble. And then there's him pulling away and finally reconnecting with his gospel roots and his Memphis sound.

And he's great. And then he gets caught in a trap in this golden cage, the international hotel. For reasons he does not understand, enter the never-colonel, never-a-parker character played by Tom-Ax. I mean, in all honesty, if you were writing an opera, a three-act opera, a tragic three-act opera, you would make this stuff up. You'd make this story out and you go, this is great, I've got a diabolical but entertaining kind of, is he a villain, is he not? And then I've got a sort of Orphean superhero character. I was handed a lot of slices of reality unlike any of my other films that I had to copy, like verbatim. then I had to re-engineered backwards.

The one thing I would say about style is that I, and I worked with manly and everybody, and I had to sort of copy like the 50s, we shot on 50s lenses, you know, the 60s, 60s, and anamorphic on the 70s. So I was plugging into the periods, but I didn't want it to be nostalgic. You know?

So I was always flipping the coin. It's a bit like a lot of, like everything in the film there's a historical reference for. I do compress time. But some of the more fantastical things actually happen. Right. You know, preacher puts hand on hand and says, leave him be his with the spirit. I found that little boy as an older man, and he told me that story verbatim.

RFK gets shot while they're doing the Christmas special. You got to say something? No, but let's have a song. That happens, you know. MLK in the trailer, Dr. King, he always spoke the truth. That happens. But I was, it's very important to play games and do a bit of the stuff that I get a bit back for, the Rasmataz and the Basemataz or whatever people call it, because I'm trying to actually use that to keep you engaged,

but also to open the door and not only show what it was, but what it felt like. Yeah. Now music's a big in for that. So when, say, Austin is singing, Let's play house as Elvis. That's a great rock and roll 50s song. But there's nostalgia about it. It's kind of charming.

And you go, why were these, why were these girls in their minds? Why were they, the word is keening, this screaming sound. I heard it once when I went and saw BTS at Cityfield, you know? It's like, it's not like normal screaming. Oh, I covered Twilight. I heard it with Pattinson. Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, right? It's not normal screaming.

I hear you. And the keening, but having Gary Clark Jr., suddenly shredding the guitar like he's in the 70s, like Hendricks, then you understand that it felt electric and dangerous. I mean, if you're an adult, you're pretty hard. I don't think I want my daughter around that, you know? And that's what that's about.

That's about opening the door, translating it. So, I guess, only recently, I've really thought that maybe the style of Elvis and my own style have, connection and I don't know if one dictates the other and that is he was from a very small town and through personal life and trauma was always searching and absorbing things around him so he made up his own thing he made up his own world and he made up his own ascetic there's definitely what we call an Elvis decorative aesthetic sure and I think I've probably done that

myself I try not to be self-conscious about it and talk about it because whenever I turn in on myself I end up stumbling because I get too subconscious about it. Sure. But I think there's probably, there's some degree of parallel journey there. It's interesting because you're often talked about as a romantic, a romantic kind of filmmaker. And then when you start to look at some of the films and most of the films, the romance, it ends in tragedy. These are not, these do not end well. Then you have to add the word impossible romance.

Exactly. Exactly. And this one, like others, it's obviously very bittersweet his ending. I mean, that's great drama, though, I guess, at its core, right? Is that why you're, I mean, are both things true? Are you romantic? And also, do you just love that twist of great drama that the love that can't be, that is destined to fail is just alluring to you as well, or what?

It's an interesting one, because it's come up a bit. And honestly, people think I'm joking when I go, like, yeah, you're right. Like, not since Strictly Borum. It's been a while since I've done a happy ending. Yeah. And I think what it is actually, Josh, it's the thing about that is, is those stories are romanticism, by the very nature of it, is things are better than they can possibly be. They're heightened, you know, when you're in love, or whether it's a romance, like, you know, it's so heightened and it so does the stories. They saw on the way up.

And then they're super powerful. But the fact that I guess I end up drawing myself towards the tragedy is that that has to not be sustainable at some point it dies. But the question is what lives on beyond it? What's left is the memory or the song, you know, or the book in the case of Gatsby or the story. It's what's left behind. And it's very much orphan in shape. It's funny. I used to think I dictated the underlying Greek myths, but so many of them are Orphean somewhat, you know?

Yeah. In that the idealist and the perfect romantic goes into the underworld in trying to get back that ideal romantic perfection. Sure. And through his gift, he's going to be able to rescue it from the underworld and the king of the underworld. There's always a king of the underworld, isn't it? It's like, like, like, whether it's Ziedler or Parker or. You know, Barry Fife, you know. There's this kind of carnivalous king of the underworld who makes a trick or a hoop that has to be jumped through.

And Orpheus travels up and loses that and grows from it, but what remains is actually the growth. It remains that it resonates beyond that. So you're kind of weirded to tragedy, yeah. I have a totally random question, but when I was watching it, I was wondering, is Baz a secret Star Trek fan? because there are a couple Star Trek visual cues in the film. I mean, is that just because that was what was on the Vegas strip then? Well, actually, there's a real point to it.

I mean, I loved Star Trek as a kid. Any of that television? But actually, when we were doing a theme park back in the 90s, I think around when the Colonel dies, Sam went on a sort of theme park through the world.

and at that stage the hotel hotels had then got transitioned from being like Elvis invented the showroom or the colonel invented the showroom concept which has come back now but then that all turned into kind of themed experiences and in fact

that hotel had the Star Trek experience on in it and I always thought gee you could see it actually probably from the hospital but I always like the idea that the sign had going where no man had gone before. And early on, I had his idea that the colonel in his morphine dream

would be seeing that as a neon sign saying, going where no man has gone before, which is true both of the Velvus and the colonel. They were both damaged kids with big holes in their heart, really trying to go where no man had gone before, like sort of flying too close to the sun. So it is in there as a kind of easter egg of that. Got it.

So we talked a little bit about the casting process. I mean, again, I've always been fascinated by the stories of your casting sessions. They're very unique. And it seems like you probably have the best treasure trove of tape of talent the last 25 years, 30 years. It's funny. You know a lot. You know, no has ever brought that up that, in fact, I do.

Let's turn the screen on. I was ever brought that up. But can you? I do. I do because I so rarely do it. I don't do auditions. Like, I don't say walk in the door, not so much. Right.

When people come into my world. actors, it's the most precious thing in the world to me. And I really workshopped with them and I go, A, I'm going to try and get you this gig, no matter what I, or anybody else's thinking to, I'm going to learn something about the material. It's a privilege that I'm looking at you. This is going to help your process as much.

I'm going to workshop with you. So I find something out about this scene done by another actor or a player. So they're really deep and they're really honest and very emotional. and it's quite but it's better for the actors

because at least I don't feel like that we judged in five seconds I can be taller It's not a kettle call they at least have an artistic expression and the other thing is I form relationships with the actors

and they go on forever and you're right I mean the young actors that auditioned for Romeo and Juliet I mean at least two thirds of them are icons now that's how long ago it is

actors that came in to show me that they could sing oh for the Mulan Ridge must be yeah and like honestly you know know, when I think about Jake Gyllenhaal, for example, who was very close, very young for the role, but he can really sing. I mean, he's a really great musical artist.

I mean, very, very sadly, Heath, of course. Yeah, heath, of course. And I have that footage. And, you know, so, I mean, I don't think I'll ever release it. Sure. But I do, yeah, fly on the wall stuff. And, you know, it's vulnerable times, but spectacular and beautiful times. I mean, there's footage where you go like, wow.

Well, not only that, it's like invariably these are actors that you're catching right before, like, they're still forming and they're still raw, and they're exposing themselves to you in a very special way. Whether the public sees it or not, that's just like, it must be an amazing snapshot. I really want them to come in and go out and say, well, I didn't get it, but I felt that that was really worth doing it. something out of it because I get something out of it you know I do think that happens you know like we won't go into the ones surrounding this because you know maybe me and someone else accidentally let it slip and then it's just you can never get it out of that no headlines but I mean I mean the thing is that that those experiences on this were really rich in different ways it just so

happened that Austin all around and also the fact that Austin could disappear into Elvis you know yeah like that carried a lot of weight too you know one has to ultimately serve the story and that's never personal who do you think would have made a good Elvis 20 25 years ago of that crop that you were talking about back in the day anyone jump out at you that feels like there was a time when so I must have been thinking about Elvis very long because young of there was a time when I thought Leah had such an interesting look of young Elvis. I thought, gee, it'd be interesting as

really young Elvis. But then I kind of think like that about all actors. I'm secretly thinking like, oh, mashamish, you know, or whatever, you know, like, wouldn't they do a great hamlet, you know? Do we not for Leo can sing?

Oh, I know. Look, this is a bit of touchy point. Don't bring it up with him, because he can sing. But he always says to me, oh, I went in and sang for bars, and he really can sing. he's saying he's saying but um yeah leo can sing and you know the day he does it'll be like oh where was this guy been hiding this voice i mean he doesn't do anything oh god it's gonna be a headline

he's gonna be so he's gonna rouse on me yeah be easy lean on me yeah i mean i mean i i know he can sing after after mouan rouge were you offered like every musical under the sun like you haven't done like the you've never done the classic you know musical has that ever been a temptation to was there one that's still getting to that I mean they come my way and I mean for years before I did Mulan Rouge

whoever then was controlling I mean various people were doing Chicago right and I probably would have screwed it up you know because I'm sort of wedded to telling the to going on the creative adventures I go on it's more I go oh I want to reinvent the musical

and doing a DNA on musicals at one stage I was even thinking of Silling Mulan Rouge in Studio 54. So I had the Orphean myth and I had the idea of having familiar music. Oh no, that came later.

But it was what was the world. And then the world of 1890s Mamatra and all of that. That came to me because I just thought there was on the one hand a bit of a... It's like a lot of things I do at the beginning.

It's like I're basically seen as either cheesy or forgotten or more I guess is the word and that but what I'm interested in is why were they so great back in the day like why there must have been something yeah why I was going to Pigal not just a cheesy tourist thing yeah spore room dancing you know I grew up in it but no one said to me you know you must do water dancing I mean it's gonna be really happening one day there's six ballroom dancing theaters in development you need to do one that's right no no no no but I just

see the flipping the coin like I guess classical things and throwing off the rust. Yeah. And showing the underbelly of it. So I'm drawn to that for some self-flagellating reason. I don't know why the sufferance is now. You're getting at something that I do find interesting because you're, again, very unique among filmmakers in that you haven't been drawn into any of the franchises at any point.

And it's all we get now pretty much 9% of what we get in cinema. And I, like you said, I like the Batman. Badman was great, but, you know, man cannot live by Batman, a franchise alone. I agree, and I've spent, look, I'm a big old nerd and I love it all, but I need you and Tarantino to do your things and everything, et cetera. That being said, like, have there been temptations? Is there, is there one that, if they ever came to you, would be hard to say no to, to dip your toe into, is there a Baselman James Bond take?

Is there a Baselman anything like that? I kind of thought of a while going to, oh, gee, Bond. But, you know, I mean, and I think it's out there that I, they came to me with the first Harry Potter. And I was like, I was like, but I think, and at the time I was like, look, that sounds great, but someone else can do that really well, whereas my mission is to reinvent the musical.

So maybe it's a bit, like, maybe it's a, you know, I have a too grander sense of what my duty. is in storytelling, but I always feel there are these things that need to get done that probably I can do because I'm in the position to do it because I've made a whole lot of things that people say, well, that'll never work, or that's a silly idea. And they have. And so I go like, you know, I mean, if I was to do a biopic, I'd want to do it in a way that Amadeus. And that is, it's not really a biopic of Elvis. Yeah, it's taken the historically, figure and exploring a larger idea. I mean, the star of, or the teller of the story of

Amadeus is a guy called Salieri, the most famous composer of the time. Heard of me? No. Who's his Mozart guy? Therein lines the story. Jealousy, my friends. You know, that's what it is, and it's a whodunit. It's funny you talk about that, because as you were talking about sort of like finding these things that were kind of cool at the time and that now feel a little Dusty. I remember when I was a kid and I saw Amadeus and I shouldn't have like by all rights be intrigued by Amadeus in any way and it felt like the most alive thing I'd ever seen as like a 12 year old. Do you know, well I showed it to my daughter. It's got nothing to do with whether you're

into classical music or not. Nothing to do with that. What's so fantastic about it is is inherently where talent is put. And Amadeus, unlike Beethoven, there are these two kind of artists, really. It's like comparing Michelangelo with Da Vinci, like Beethoven, in a room banging away at a piano. You know, Amadeus, out there

living and out of life comes music. You know, Da Vinci out there, you know, much more interested in creating parties than painting Manalises. You know, not going to them, but just creating them. You know, Michelangelo, chipping away, it's done. You know, they're different creative

gestures. And I don't think you necessarily have to be in Elvis's music at all to be in the grand story that really explores America in the 50s, 60s and the 70s, and this whole American gesture between the show and the business, the cell and the soul. That's what you get out of this. You know, you might, you might dig some of the music as well, you know? I was saying this to Austin the other day, like, it must be a heady trip for him and maybe for you that, like, for some, this is going to introduce Elvis to young folks. This is their introduction. This is their Elvis. Austin is their Elvis.

Yeah. And that's kind of a responsibility and a privilege in a way. Yeah, it really is. I mean, I went through this unintentionally with Romeo and Juliet. Sure. In the...

Yep. I'm now 30 years later. I live with the reality that, you know, Leonardo in the silvery armor and Claire in the angel wings is Roman Juliet. Yeah, you go to Romeo and Juliet.

That comes up. On the one hand, Like high school teachers all over the world are happy it exists. And on the other hand, a lot of kids go, what do you mean they didn't meet looking through a fish tank, you know? Yeah, where's that line? Where's that in there? It doesn't say it in the text.

Well, there's no instructions. It doesn't say from the arras or behind the curtain. Yeah, it doesn't not say the fish tank is there. I don't know. You know. Because I've been doing this a thousand years and I've been following your career and others. I'm always fascinated by the ones that got away. Is Alexander the great the one?

And is that the one that you went through the whole process, that you lived out? You talked about kind of almost like doing it and filming the movies almost not the afterthought, but it's kind of the... Yeah. My God, I think the book, we have this, all of our stuff is in a museum, but I think the book of Alexander might be here in the New York House. And because I want to get it, because I absolutely lived that. I mean, studying it, incredible adventures. I even got into Iran to see Persepolis. I was brought in by

I was helped to get in and it was an amazing experience I even got extraordinary floor plans of Persepolis Dino and I built a studio or Dino built a studio in Morocco for the film all that but what happens is

I'm all the way down the road on it and honestly suddenly and I bear no chagrin about it but it became one of these Oliver wanted to do a show and I'm not a racer you know I can't work like that

plus we really wanted to have kids and it became a moment when I went like I've got to draw a line here and so yeah I mean it was a great cast in the book you'll see Leonardo and I think and one stage Mel Gibson

was going to be the father the king the mad king well that works everyone goes like uh-huh but um yeah yeah i had to draw a line then yeah it's it took a long time to get over because i was very very funnily enough we were trying to get pregnant and i was very very pregnant with his story you know Elvis towards the end of this i mean it's a tragic moment he talks about like in his head he's not he hasn't contributed to anything there's no way to see he really says it he really said that line he said you know siller i'm almost 40 almost 40 and i've never done

anything anyone will remember me by and that hits you in so many different ways first you're like oh my god the man's only almost like yeah i'm like almost 40 i'm almost 60 dude you know well do you think of legacy you've got a lot of work ahead of you still but like you now have this body of work and i know you maybe like were beat up on yourself years ago for not being as prolific as some but like look some of my favorite filmmakers are the methodical ones like yourself um do you do you Do you look now at the body that you've created these six films as some kind of legacy? No, really.

I, you know, I don't think... You don't look at the box set of Baz? No, I mean, I did do that a while ago, but I think actually, I just think if... I just sort of remember, oh, that was a... I mean, I have children, but they're kind of like children. Oh, that was the time when we did Roman Joy.

I don't remember years. I just went, oh, what are we doing? Oh, yeah, that's right. That was Milan Rouge time. But, but as to going forward, I mean, it's not like I do nothing. I mean, we do a variety of creative things. Between films, I go on creative adventures,

whether it's a hotel, an election campaign, or, you know, doing a lot of music. You know, I've made a lot of music, and I love making music with great musicians and great artists. But I didn't know what will happen at the end of this, because I could either just do the same old thing, which is I disappear, and they go, like, right, good, he's gone, thank goodness for that.

Or I might suddenly get really prolific, and, you know, there's a change, coming up. And I don't know what will come from that, but there is a change coming up. Well, you look at it, I mean, if you do the math, 30 years ago, strictly ballroom, your career takes off and changes. Yeah. And now 30, you know, so you've had two different lives, basically, the first 30, the second 30, the next act begins in a way. Yeah, like, will it be a three-act doctor or will the curtain come down at the end of the second act? No. I can guarantee you. And they go, like, you know, where's that, you know, sit through that third act?

but you know what you're saying is interesting as far as bookends go because yeah 30 years ago I make a film a first film quite theatrical in language because I'm trying to find a way of quoting old Hollywood movies and yet keeping the metaphor rolling in the piece and the one distributed that had that movie strictly ballroom dumps us and I go up the coast with Sam and I go called Bill Marin and we're dead in the water and the story goes you know I'm shaving off my long black curly hair believe it not I had it then and the phone the baker-like phone rings we're in a van park got a bucket on my head it's raining because some guy got killed by a coconut that fell out of a tree I'm trying not to dive coconut suicide you know coconut

coconut aside if there's such a thing and the Frenchman says my name is bioricino I'm from the Ken film festival and basically it changed and here I am 59 and I thought when the film was going away, when Elvis was going away, and it was going away once Tom got COVID. So, oh, maybe I'll never see Cannes again because they really have a special relationship with it. And then we went to Cannes with a film, and, you know, I opened it twice. It's a special place for me.

And it was very, very special, actually. And I don't say that about a lot of things. It was very special. I've been asking folks the last couple of years since we all went through this madness together, and we needed comfort about comfort movies. and I know you love film and I'm sure there are a thousand films you can name. But I'm wondering if when I mention that, that term, comfort movie. Is there a movie that you return to often when you need to level off to feel safe in the universe?

Well, I can admit that I've seen some films more than once. And it's weird the list, probably. Then there are these films. So the list is sort of like, you know, Lawrence of Arabia or Apocalypse Now or, you know, but it's weird that I look back and in all my films and it must be some sort of tick

there are always these references to these films like Bandwagon or Sunrise which is a silent film that's one of my great yeah and anything Murnow I love Murnow and it's funny

even in this I found myself going back to Murnow a bit you know like just in the sort of montage mechanics and things like that I don't think I ever have time

to comfort myself with a movie like you know and it's the way the life works you know like I when I'm making movies it's hard to look at them when I'm not making movies I'm desperate to see what's out there I think I'm very very much about

not being nostalgic about not like I'm just always interested in the new and what's out there because like Elvis like I'm from a small town and I guess I'm running down the yellow brick road and I'm always going like what's around the corner and I do want to be plugged into popular culture as it's being freshly minted yeah but I also have one giant foot in the past I never seem to be able to unstick so like this film experience through actually the it nearly went away the COVID I mean this is a film experience like no other.

Yeah. It has energized me. It has made me more vital, but it's only opened me up to, well, what is the next adventure, yeah. What's the moment that stands out from this process? I know you've already mentioned Cannes, which must have been a trip. I know the screening for the family must have been intense, to say the least. When did you exhale and enjoy yourself a little bit?

Oh, I haven't done that yet. No way. No way, because I make theatrical films. for the theatre. And you know what? I love what Tom's done with Top Gun. He's done a great job, it's great, and he's helped us

because he's made other audience segments come out to the theatre. And good on, you know, the dinosaur film doing so well, great audiences are going out to the theatre. But we are not a franchise. And I singularly carry, we don't have to be those numbers,

but we need to get a diverse audience out. My films need to be seen strangers, friends, family all coming together in a dark space looking up at a screen and going Elvis, what do I think? And yet communing in laughter in emotion, in music,

in tears, in highs and lows, that which only the cinematic experience can give us. And I feel the pressure of that. So I'm not exhaling at all, my friend. I will say, look, not to jinx it, but like even Gatsby, that felt like a swing. Like that's going to be a blockbuster. They're spending that much on it. And look what you

created. Well, yeah, but you have Pros and cons, I mean... No, you have Leo. You know, Leo and all that. But, but, you know, I just... That's why people think it's bonkers. Like, today Eminem released a single for the film. And that, the last line in the film is Elvis's influence on...

on music and culture lives on. And I've had a lot of amazing guests artists do something about his influence. And M's the key piece beginning it. It ends with Manorskin at the very end. But, and throughout the movie, you know, Doja Cat translates the words of Big Mammothorn. Doja Cat is not Big Mammothorn. But I'm opening, trying to open the doors to every segment of the audience, not to close anyone out. Last thing for you.

I'm just curious. You've worked with really some of not only the greatest movie stars, but greatest actors in the last 30 years. Yeah. Who's the one that's got in a way? Who's the one on your list now? or like that that has been gnawing at you like i need to spend time with tom hardy lady gaga i don't you know like is there someone i want to work with both of them i mean i know i met tom i think a little bit like gaga and i know each other very well and she's she reminds me of barbara strides

in that she's an all-rounder and she if she doesn't start directing next i'll be very surprised You know, but she's just such a firestorm of creativity. But I don't really think like that. I think like what I think like is what creative adventure do I need to go on? And then I go, why? I go looking for people who want to get on the boat and are prepared to go on the ride because it's never going to be, it's to a bit buckle up. It's going to be a bumpy ride.

But ultimately fulfilling, I believe. I mean, most people who come on the road with me, which is why I get out there and do a lot of this. I'm not out there because I love doing roll-up, roll-up or, you know, the public part of it particularly. Actually, I just feel the responsibility of everyone who's believed in what we're trying to make and has got on board.

And I want to make sure I do everything I can to bring the ship safe home to harbor and the harbor is getting the film to the audience, the widest possible audience. Well, we're spreading the good word today. Elvis is in theaters by the time people listen to this. Everybody should check it out. It's, as all your work is, a singular piece of work, you will not be disappointed.

And you are seeing another starborn in Austin Butler. So congratulations, Baz. And thank you for welcoming it. No, man. You're welcome. And you know what? You're right about Austin. I'll tell you.

That I'm happy to put my hand up and say, yeah, that's true. Thanks again. Appreciate it. Great chat. Sorry about the underpants. And so ends another edition of Happy, Sad, Confused. Remember to review, rate, and subscribe. to this show on iTunes or wherever you get your podcasts.

I'm a big podcast person. I'm Daisy Ridley and I definitely wasn't pressure to do this by Josh. Hey Michael. Hey, Tom. You want to tell him? Or you want me to tell him? No, no, no.

I got this. People out there. People. Lean in. Get close. Get close. Listen. Here's the deal.

We have big news. We got monumental news. We got snack-tacular news. Yeah, after a brief hiatus, my good friend, Michael Ian Black, and I are coming back. My good friend, Tom Kavanaugh and I are coming back to do what we do best. What we were put on this earth to do. To pick a snack. To eat a snack.

And to rate a snack. Nentifically. Emotionally. Spiritually. Mates is back. Mike and Tom eat snacks. Is back. A podcast for anyone with a mouth.

With a mouth. Available. wherever you get your podcasts.