Happy Sad Confused - Chiwetel Ejiofor, Vol. II

Episode Date: August 8, 2024

Chiwetel Ejiofor is already aknowledged to be one of our finest actors and now he's building an impressive directing career too! He joins Josh to chat about his latest, ROB PEACE, plus a look back and forward at his DOCTOR STRANGE work, CHILDREN OF MEN, and more. Subscribe here⁠ to the new Happy Sad Confused clips channel so you don't miss any of the best bits of Josh's conversations! SUPPORT OUR SPONSORS! Visit BetterHelp.com/HSC today to get 10% off your first month. Check out the ⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠Happy Sad Confused patreon here⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠! We've got discount codes to live events, merch, early access, exclusive episodes, video versions of the podcast, and more! To watch episodes of Happy Sad Confused, subscribe to ⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠Josh's youtube channel here⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠! Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

When you're with Amex Platinum, you get access to exclusive dining experiences and an annual travel credit. So the best tapas in town might be in a new town altogether. That's the powerful backing of Amex. Terms and conditions apply. Learn more at Amex.ca. The twisted tale of Amanda Knox is an eight-episode episode Hulu original limited series that blends gripping pacing with emotional complexity, offering a dramatized look as it revisits the wrongful conviction of Amanda Knox for the tragic murder of Meredith Kircher and the relentless media storm that followed. The twisted tale of Amanda Knox is now streaming only on Disney Plus.

Okay, it's official. We are very much in the final sprint to election day. And face it, between debates, polling releases, even court appearances. It can feel exhausting, even impossible to keep up with. I'm Brad Nilke. I'm the host of Start Here, the Daily Podcast from ABC News. And every morning, my team and I get you caught up on the day's news in a quick, straightforward way that's easy to understand, with just enough context so you can listen, get it, and go on with your day. So, kickstart your morning. Start Smart with Start Here and ABC News because staying informed shouldn't feel overwhelming. When you see, you know, on set when Venom arrives, you know, you're like, wow, you know, it's a real sort of moment because it doesn't, you know, Tom could be standing next to you.

Right, Tom and you're like, Benham's here, you know. The voice changes. You're like, oh, that's commitment. Created something pretty remarkable. Prepare your ears, humans. Happy, sad, confused begins now. I'm Josh Horowitz, and today on Happy, Say, Confused, Chewettel, Egyaport is back on the podcast. It's been over nine years since he's been on the pod.

So there's a lot to catch up on. He's, of course, one of our finest actors. From 12 years of slave to Baron Mordo and Dr. Strange, that is Range. And in recent years, he has become an accomplished director in his own right. He has written and directed the new film. film Rob Peace, which is excellent. I'm thrilled. It brings him back on the pod after a very long time. It's good to see it, Chouetteau. And you. Thank you. Thank you for having me. Of course. Of course. First of all, I mean, we've obviously talked in those intermittent years,

but for the full pod, what happened to us, man? I thought we had a good thing going. Did we need a break? You know, although, I mean, was it nine years? It's amazing to think that it's been that that long. It's terrifying how quickly the time goes. Luckily, we're aging backwards. We're Benjamin reddening it. This is the fortunate part of the whole thing. Before we get into Rob Peace, oh, please. Before we get into Rob Peace, I appreciate you taking the time. I mean, you're kind of pulling double duty.

I mean, you're always working, it seems. We know the filmography, but you are, are you in dashing suitor mode right now on Bridget Jones? Are you, how's it going? I'm in, certainly doing, we're in, but, yeah, shooting away on Bridget Jones, which has been fantastic. And, you know, it's such a great script, really. And so so much fun to kind of dive into that world, you know, with a great, great cast and, you know, fabulous director and great story.

So very excited about that. Is there any kind of like love actually, like deja vu? I mean, it's been a minute since we've seen you in that kind of a movie. And, of course, people I think are going to always make that association in a film of this type. Sure. I mean, you know, in a very direct way, it is a working type. film and so there is the love actually connection and some of the some of the cast obviously who are in love actually and and I guess there are sort of some

tonal crossovers which are always fun and it's a wonderful sort of world to be in in the way that that these films also sort of celebrate life love the sort of cities you know shooting in London and and love actually as well as such a sort of you know as well as everything else a real love song to the to the city itself And so, and this kind of has that as well. I think British Jones sits in that world as well. So it's, for all of those reasons, it's, it's wonderful. What is, what is life like for you during a production?

Like, are you like 150% just thinking about script this entire time? Obviously, you're doing some promotion right now too. But like, are you available to your friends and family? Or do they know by now kind of when Chuitel's working, he's kind of like, has to be in a different zone? Well, it depends. It depends on what it is, you know, that it's, uh, I think there are certain things inevitably that end up occupying you in a completely different way. I think you're always engaged, you know, as much as you can be with anything.

And I feel like that that's a sort of skill you learn of have when to dive in and when to kind of pull out and sort of, you know, have some space for yourself as well and obviously for family and so on. I think that changes ultimately I think that sort of changes over time. I think, you know, as a younger actor, I think you are more likely to be like, well, that's it. I'm just shutting, you know, battened down the hatches. You can't see me for, you know, six months or whatever it is. But as life and responsibilities and it becomes a little and more important to it, like, you can't be that kind of self-centered in a weird way, right? Like, yeah, sort of to justify that kind of dynamic.

So, you know, so in the end, especially with something, you know, with like Bridget Jones, It's a great character, great part. There's, you know, obviously, you know, one's fully invested in it. But there's definitely opportunities to kind of step away and to kind of engage with other things. And that's a good balance, these sort of work balance, life work balance is important. Yeah, I would imagine for something like Bridget Jones, with all due respect, you don't have to go Daniel Day Lewis on inhabiting 24-7 discuss. Yeah, it would be a strange, I mean, it'd be a fun person to be around, you know what I mean?

It'll be an interesting person to me, but I don't think I need to necessarily do that. Yeah. All right. Let's talk about this film that brings you back on the pod. Congratulations, man. Rob Peace is a really moving piece of work. This is the second film that Chuitel has directed. I think we actually talked about Boy Who Harness the Wind back at Sundance, as I recall.

Yeah, that's right. Yeah. And this one, I want to educate the audience a little bit because probably most people don't know this story at all. This is based on a book, which is, in fact, based on a true story. about a young man by the name of Rob Peace. I guess you tell me, what do you want the audience to know going in about who this man was?

Well, I think that they sort of, I guess the basics of the story in a way that Rob grew up in New Jersey in a sort of very kind of impoverished, complex area in New Jersey, orange and East Orange. And, you know, the first thing to know was that he was completely brilliant, you know, he was, you know, intellectually, he was

extraordinary, which is why he ended up going to Yale and to do molecular biophysics and bichemistry. He just had a very brilliant mind, you know, his, his complications, I think, start in a way with his father was incarcerated for a double homicide in 1987 and, well, the homicide was in 1937. He wasn't incarcerated until a few years later. And Rob was convinced of his father's innocence and his father always said that he was, that he was innocent for crime. And the attempt, really, to get Rob's father, for Rob to get his father out of prison was the first sort of became, I think, something of an obsession for Rob, really. And a sort of, sort of, understandably, but, you know, became a true obsession for him.

And in a way, that is the thing that began to derail his experience, I think, you know, that his, that the dynamic with his father and the responsibility that I think that he felt amongst everything else, the responsibility to family, to community, to the sort of, the wider sort of complications and issues that he faced was something that, you know, really had an on his overall experience. And so his roommate at Yale, Jeff Hobbes, wrote this extraordinary book about him, about Rob, and I read that book, and I was just completely moved by it.

I was so taken by how it dealt with so many sort of intersections in our society and, you know, how alive it all felt, felt how relevant, how important it felt. And, I mean, and ostensibly, look, on the surface, one might think, this seems like a far cry from my story or Chewettel's story. You did not grow up in New Jersey, though. He is something of the contemporary, both of ours. We both grew up around the same time as real Rob.

You clearly connected with this material on a number of levels. Can you talk a little bit about what, yeah, what you connected with on an emotional or literal or metaphorical level? Yeah, I think there are so many things. Absolutely. You know, it's not a lot, it's not, there are some things that I'm not connected to in terms of Rob pieces experiences growing up. And there are other things that I feel so connected to. Rob was, you know, maybe, you know, he's, well, he was three years younger than me. So, you know, really around the same time. So, so even though we grew up in totally different countries, a lot of still the reference points, you know, that he experienced, I also experienced as well as the general understanding of the time. And. the complications, I think, around social mobility. You know, Rob is an extreme example of social mobility and how social mobility can be very complicated.

But I feel like so many people experience it to some degree. And it's not something that's necessarily talked about or discussed in any sort of profound way. And there's a lot of sort of simplified solutions that people sort of come up with, you know, ultimately. because it's not investigated. But what Rob experienced, I think, in a macro level is what a lot of people experience in a micro level

as they try to understand what their responsibilities are to the people around them, what their responsibilities are to their community, what their responsibility are, to their parents, for example, inevitably to close associations, close friends, especially if they're moving through different social structures through social, economic barriers and so on, and how to kind of get people across that border, you know, is something people carry a lot of guilt about, actually.

Because there are very few people like, yeah, even as they code switch, they move around, they don't leave that entirely behind, nor would you want to. You don't want to abandon that community that defined you and reared you and brought you in to this world. And yet that often, for some, is the most dangerous place to be. And it's a fascinating thing. I mean, I'm sure, again, we can relate it to this stuff in the UK. But like here in America, there's this kind of beautiful illusion dream that like anyone can do anything.

And we can no matter what, we can achieve what we if we set our mind to it. And while that can often, that can be the case. There are strong societal barriers, systemic barriers that sadly remain in 2024. And this really shines a light on that. And it is a complex discussion for for art. But I mean, I think that's, yeah, I think that's absolutely right. And I think that kind of, that it sort of sums up why I was so kind of drawn to the story because I feel like there's been a sort of simplification of these kinds of,

of these kinds of issues as if people can just kind of cut loose certain things and move on, you know, and that, you know, and that dream is easy to attain or doesn't come with its own a very specific set of complications, of baggagees and of essentially of guilt as well, you know, and that understanding that not everybody, you know, that is one way of approaching the world. And it's not, you know, there's no judgment if you can kind of just move through and move through different spaces and, you know, push your life forward in that way. But there are people who simply cannot do that, who cannot just kind of leave things in the rearview mirror in that way, you know, even if there's complications going back, even if there's

difficulties, even if it sometimes can be dangerous, you know, people are obviously the binds that tie are very powerful for our own, for all of our human connections. And, and I think that's why I was, you know, so engaged with, with, with Rob and felt that his story was really worth exploring and telling on in cinematically. It's also a mother son story. It's a father's son story. You deliver a fantastic performance, we should say, as the gentleman that was incarcerated as Rob's dad. And I certainly don't want to get too personal. And you can talk about this as much as you want, but I know you lost your dad far too, far too young. And I would imagine, I don't know, whenever you play a dad and a strong kind of bond like this in a film, I don't know,

do you think about your own early relationship with your dad? Does your dad come to mind? Yeah, for sure. You know, inevitably, one thinks about all of those personal dynamics, you know, that, and I think in many ways it's something that drew me to the story as well, you know, that these kinds of relationships, the complexities inherent in the family dynamics, you know, especially when there are problems, you know, obviously everything, if everything's fine, then everything's fine. But, you know, so there's so few times and so few people's experiences where everything kind of goes according to plan, whatever that plan is, you know. And I know certainly for my own life, and as you say, losing my father young when I was young, and he was young, in fact, the reality is that life can be so complex, that things can be thrown at you.

And at times, if you rely on a sort of systemic normality, you know, or at least the systemic kind of embrace, you know, systemic understanding, you know. something along those lines. And I think, you know, sometimes if you're, if you feel abandoned or let down by the circumstances around you, by the systems around you, you know, it can put you in even more complex positions than you were.

And I feel like that's something that I reflected on, you know, with Rob's experience. You know, if things go wrong, it's very important to have things in place around you to help. Totally. I would imagine also as a film, maker, one of the joys must be to kind of give opportunity to actors, whether it's accomplished actors, actors that haven't done much yet, actors that we haven't seen in a certain light. You've got

two folks in here that are very well known as musicians, although Mary J. Blage has done a lot of exceptional acting in her career, certainly. But can you talk a little bit about casting both Mary J. Blige and Camilla Cabello, who hasn't done a ton of acting, but it's kind of refreshing to see her in this realm? Yeah, you know, I, well, Mary J. for example, for, for, to start with was, you know, it was just a kind of, you know, she was a very important part of how we sort of overall put the vision of the film together. She was involved in the film very early and,

and which is, you know, she's also an executive producer on the film. And, you know, we had to stop at a certain point because of the pandemic. You know, I was kind of in New York in pre-production. We were sort of, things were sort of moving. And then everything kind of got. shut down and it wasn't um it was sort of two years later that we were able to pick things back up and start trying to get it moving again and you know mary jay just stuck with us for that time

you know she's sort of never wavered in her commitment to uh to the film and i'm so grateful to her for that as well as for delivering this beautiful nuanced engaged uh performance um and she is you know a phenomenal actress she was nominated for um for mudbound She's completely brilliant in that film. And so I was very excited to have to have her on board and playing Jackie Rob's mom. And Camilla, you know, I'd seen Camilla be absolutely charming, you know, in Cinderella. And I felt that she was, you know, just in terms of her energy and her charisma as a person. And then as a performer as well, you know, just somebody who can who can sparkle and who can match, you know, a very charismatic young actor, Jay Will, who we cast as Rob.

And, you know, I really wanted to find somebody who could match that kind of energy and engage and be this very central couple and have this dynamic, you know. And Camille, you know, loved the script, love the character and was, you know, thrilled to come on board. And so I was just very lucky and excited to have them, to have them all in the film. I will say, you know, you often hear the cliche, and I feel like people are usually lying when they say this. I truly did not realize it was Mary J. Blige for like half the movie in this movie. I wasn't even thinking about it. So that's a testament either to my diminishing mental faculties or to her acting or maybe a combination of both. But it is a great.

It was Mary Day. Okay, let's go with that. Let's go with that. That's a win for everybody. But there is, by the way, there's also like a wonderful moment in the film where she, her character, gets truly emotional when Rob gets into Yale. And it's such like a sweet high and a movie that has highs and sadnesses throughout. But I'm curious, like, can you relate that to your own life?

Was there a moment, a career moment that made your family, mom, family members, exceptionally proud, emotional? Well, I think, yeah, I mean, I've been lucky to, have a couple of those in my career, which has been phenomenal. I think that the, I mean, those moments have been phenomenal, just calling my career phenomenal. One hit after another, just killing it. Exactly. But, you know, I think for me, it's things that happened early on, you know, that really had an impact, I feel, that, you know, for my mother, especially not knowing why I'd become so obsessed with, with theatre and not really knowing what all of that meant in a way.

We didn't go to the theatre very much when I was growing up. And so it was still, it was very much a kind of very different world to her. During the Volvo Fall Experience event, discover exceptional offers and thoughtful design that leaves plenty of room for autumn adventures. And see for yourself how Volvo's legendary safety brings peace of mind to every crisp morning commute. This September, Lisa, 2026. XE-90 plugin hybrid from $599 bi-weekly at 3.99% during the Volvo Fall Experience event. Conditions apply, visit your local Volvo retailer or go to explorevolvo.com.

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but I feel like when she came to see something that I did and she really engaged with it was a really big moment for me when she was sort of excited about this choice and sort of understood the choice that I had made and why was a sort of big deal for me. From what I gather in reading about the production of this, you were approached to this with this, not necessarily as an actor, but to adapt it and direct it, which I have to say,

that's a feather in your cap, as a, as, you know, as a filmmaker that's kind of still like kind of coming up into his own as a filmmaker, that must feel like a great source of pride like, okay, this is, this is a real lane that I'm following that I can continue on when people are seeing me in that realm. I think that's true. I mean, I was, you know, I actually had read the book before I was approached about it and I made the kind of assumption, I don't know why, but I made the assumption that, well, actually, it really, It was true that the rights had gone and that there was, you know,

somebody was probably, you know, way down the line sort of making a bomb. And, you know, that was kind of accurate. So I never, I thought this would make a really interesting, a really great balm. But as I was reading it, but I didn't pursue it in that way. I didn't sort of investigate it in that way. And then, you know, when Antoine Foucair and Rebecca Hobbes approached me about it, you know, the first kind of conversation, around that was

do you know this book essentially and I was like I love this book you know and they had seen the boy Johannes the wind and they were interested in talking to me about adapting and directing it and of course I was just totally thrilled and as you say

you know it was it was yeah it was very gratifying to feel that the boy Johannes the wind had touched people in that way that they had then seen and looked for other things that I might get involved in. So in these first couple films, do you find that you're consciously or unconsciously emulating any of the filmmakers that you've really clicked with? How much of it is, I'm going to use

what I learned from this person and how much of it is just sort of inherently like I'm going to carry myself in the way that I would want to be directed? I mean, I think that you hope that you can sort of amalgamate all of those experiences into your experiences because I've been very lucky you have to work with some really amazing filmmakers in my career. But it doesn't quite work that way, I found to my, painfully, I've discovered that you do have to kind of carve your own lane, you know, because the challenges that you're encountering are so unique on any film that you sort of can't, you know,

I suppose you can be, you can be inspired, I think, by the filmmakers, by the finished product, in the way that any filmmaker can. But I don't know if you can be inspired by the overall process, you know, that I think you have, but yeah, I mean, you know, in both my films, it's like the challenges that you're facing,

the complications that you're facing, the dynamics that you're trying to sort of work through are unique to that film. In fact, they're so different from, the challenges were so different from each other of those two films that, yeah, you can't quite, you just sort of have to, you know just sort of dive in individually to each project and figure it out sort of day to day

yeah you can't wake up today i'm going to give them a little mclean today i'm going to give a little riddley scott no but yeah right each i mean it's all so particular it makes sense i mean when you think about and we've talked in the past a little bit about some of the amazing filmmakers you've been able to work with but like and i i don't want you to sing out single out one to the detriment of others but is there is there kind of like a gold standard of like a collaborative spirit, a connection you felt with a filmmaker when you look back at the career so far? I mean, for sure, Steve McQueen, you know, like, absolutely. I feel very, very connected, still very connected to that experience, not just the film,

but the experience of working with Steve and what that sort of revealed to me in terms of that kind of collaboration. I certainly think that much earlier, 20 almost, oh gosh, is it 20 years, something like that, ago, more than 20 years. I worked with Stephen Frears on Dirty Pretty Things, and actually that was a very important time for me in terms of just falling in love with the poetry of cinema and the poetry of the creation of cinema, with Stephen and Chris Mangaz,

who is a cinematographer on the film. And it kind of opened me up to this, You know, I think before that, my focus was much more about theater. And then from that experience, I kind of began to think about film in a completely, in a complete different way. I'd always been a fan of film, but not some. It wasn't something that I'd thought about making until then. Correct me if I'm wrong. It's actually been quite a minute since you've done theater, right?

I have. Yeah. So, and I don't think I've ever had the privilege of seeing you on stage here in the States. Is that something that is on the list to get back on the stage? even get back to come to New York, maybe for the first time to perform here. Yeah, for sure. I mean, it's always been something that is kind of, you know, there's been a few times where I've had the opportunity to do that and then for some reason it hasn't happened.

And it is something that I'm excited about doing at some point. And it has been far too long since I've been on the stage, actually. And I don't suppose it's a muscle that goes away, you know what I mean? But it would be great to engage with that. And that is something that I've been thinking about. So we'll see. So let's hit up on some things that we actually have never even talked about in our past conversations.

Surprisingly, we've never had even the Love Actually chat. As much as we talked during the Doctor Strange years, you never could talk about it at the time. So maybe we can talk about it a little more now. First of all, can you by now clock a Love Actually fan versus a Marvel fan approaching you on the street. They're 20 feet away. You see their quince in their eye.

You're like, okay, I know what's coming my way? It's more seasonal. Ah, yeah. Christmas season, holiday season. Exactly. It's more of a seasonal thing than kind of clothing. The, the, but yeah, you sort of get a sense that around that kind of, yeah, around the holidays that,

people start to engage, to re-engage with love actually and all the way through to Valentine's. You know, it's like there's a sort of season of love actually, which is fantastic. And what's amazing is that it's been remarkably consistent, you know, since the time was released. And if anything, I feel like, I'm sure you felt this. Like there's more conversation about it almost the last five or six years, I feel like, than in that intermittent 10 years. Like, and there's all this like re-appraisal, as you know, and I'm sure we've talked about this about like the relationships

and what was what was cool or not cool now in retrospect. Where are you at? And I feel like it probably has another revolution to go. Of course. You know, I think people will go around to the other side and then there will be a whole other set of conversations. But, you know, I think it's, yeah, it's great. Is Andrew Lincoln's Mark a stalker?

Is that too much to say? How, how, this guy's a little. I mean, come on, let's be real. Well, I mean, I'm maybe not the person to ask in a way. You know, I had some skin in the game, you know. But the, but yeah, for sure, I think that he, you know, Peter would be surprised and disappointed. Let's, you know, put it that way to say the least. Put yourself in Peter's shoes.

If you're getting married and you find out this dude, you look at the videotape, How would you feel? Yeah, I mean, it would be a complicated moment, that is, for sure. That's being charitable. That is being charitable. So, you know, yeah, you know, the question is, is there some sort of romantic energy in that? I don't know, you know, it's not, but like I say, it's not really, yeah, not really the guy to, you know, from Peter's point of view, it was problematic, let's say.

Fair enough. Children of men we've never talked about, surprisingly. And I know. And what an amazing piece of work that, again, obviously stands the test of time. People often justifiably talk about that all-time oner, which you're a part of in the car, that car sequence. Is that as technically intricate and, I don't know, challenging a scene as you've ever committed to film? Yeah. Yeah. I would say that as an individual moment, that is, yeah, I mean, it was, it took several days to, to make the sequence, but it was, but yeah, with the, I suppose with the car on the hinge, um, so that the camera could pass over, over my head. Right. That, you know, the sort of movement, that all of the different things that were, that had to kind of go right in any particular moment, the car being attacked.

then the, you know, the sort of pulling back, the kind of crazy driving them, all of the thing, and then, and then, yeah, being in that kind of fraught state as an actor, you know. Yeah, your performance, I was watching it again. I mean, you, as you should be, you're on the edge to say that we've lost it. He's on his last edge, you know, and then as the camera moves past me, you know, then I have to kind of re-engage with getting back onto my back because the camera's on this head, the seats on a hinge, the camera goes over my head and I have to launch back forward and pick up where I was talking, you know, as the camera comes round with that sort of same sort of

intensity and on the edge and all of this stuff. And I think that that entire sequence going into, you know, right from the moment that, yeah, right from the getting into that car, you know, I just think was sort of extraordinary, extraordinary thing to shoot and, you know. I love to hear you talk about it because it sounds like, obviously, that was such an important sequence, it's like, it sounds like you could perform it tomorrow.

Like you know the choreography in your head still because it was so, the pressure must have been on for all of it. Yeah, I mean, it was really, you know, we really spent time really kind of drilling it in just so that we could, you know, so it just became a dance, you know, became a dance with Chi, with Emmanuel Obedsky and just with the camera

and just really feeling that it was all sort of one unit. And that's wonderful, I think, as a feeling when the camera is really part of the choreography. So you're playing with the camera as well. It's a performer in the scene. And I think the result was so extraordinary, you know, this really, really beautiful. and searing and even if I

pick up or watch the film now even having made the film knowing all of those intricate details I just I always find that I just don't breathe you know? Oh 100%. Like I'm so captured

by all of everything that's happening it's just you're it's so compelling and beautifully done. Yeah it's so magical when there's a filmmaker that has those kind of chops that also like care so much about story and character and emotion and like when they can bring it it's like he's he's one in a million core own needles to say yeah um so i alluded to this so dr strange

i mean there were there i have like six different interviews when we talked and it was always like i can't say anything i can't say so i don't i don't see some basics actually like so way back when when you signed on for dr strange what was it did it feel like a risk at the time like did you have a script or were you like kind of going on faith like who convinced you that this in your bones felt right or did it feel like a no-brainer that the company you were going to keep was going to be great. Oh, I don't know. I mean, it was a while ago now, the actual first sort of initial conversation.

But I think that there was so much excitement around the characters at the time. And I think it was still in a sort of, I mean, it was still in a sort of the opening phase, I think, of all of that. And so, you know, I just remember being very engaged with. with Scott's vision of it all and Kevin and, you know, the sort of world building of, of Dr. Strange was so, you know, so remarkable and so unlike anything, sort of anything else that, that, yeah, to a degree, it felt like a sort of no-brainer. It felt very exciting to be part of.

How much of what Scott kind of outlined of like where Morda would go, actually came to pass because obviously we saw the end of Dr. Strange and it feels like it teed up a story that we frankly still haven't seen. Did you know where it was intended to go and is there any sadness that thus far we haven't been able to see what maybe was talked about? Sure, there was some there was sort of broad like with any of these things, you know, that sort of develop over time. There were kind of broad ideas which, you know, which were always, that always felt that they would be, you know, subject to manipulation or change or kind of reinvention. And I guess that, you know, that I suppose the full, in a way, who knows?

You know what I mean? Like, it's sort of, it's still, it's still the opportunity to, for all, you know, for different aspects of that to kind of, to sort of come to fruition and to be. honest as well, there were completely new areas, you know, for, you know, for more, for more, or alts of more, that never, that didn't exist in the conversation at that time, which also have all of this kind of capacity and potential. So I don't know, there's, it sort of, it definitely depends on, which, which I think is an exciting thing. I think it depends on the vision, you know, Like an individual's or the team's kind of vision for those stories as they move forward, which I'm excited about because I do feel like there are some extraordinarily talented and engaged people within the context of all of that.

So it is a world that still that I think still holds a lot of excitement for me. Did you enjoy the experience? I've talked to a lot of actors on Multiverse of Madness who, I mean, they all obviously revere Ramey, who's a legend. But it all sounds like it was also a bit of a chaotic, a moving target, that script. I mean, it was Zielsen's talk to me about it. And we kind of all know a little bit of how that sausage was made there. From your perspective, was it fun to kind of play that different version of Morda? Morda, did you feel like it was rewarding?

Yeah, like I say, I mean, it wasn't, I didn't, you know, it was, it was something new. You know, it was something that I hadn't predicted at all. And, and in that context, I thought it was fascinating. you know and and I felt like there was something potentially really exciting about where that could could go you know and I like that broadly I mean I like the sort of idea that these characters and these worlds can be explored in these really in these really incredible incredible ways you know but that's I guess I'm sort of repeating in a way because I feel like it it's still sort of kind of kind of It comes down to the vision of the filmmakers, you know. It comes down to really what is exciting for people in that moment, for creatives in that moment and creatives within the kind of Marvel structure. No, but it is true.

No, I was going to say it makes sense because, like, obviously, in that sandbox, the beauty is, the possibilities are kind of truly endless. So you find the next great idea wins, the next great filmmaker wins. And, like, so, you know, we're seeing characters come back from, like, 15 years ago that, like, Tim Roth comes back around from the Incredible Hulk. It's like, what? This guy's still around. Like, it's like, it's when the time is right, when the story is right. When your investors, customers, and workers demand more from your business, make it happen with SAP. The AI-powered capabilities of SAP can help you streamline costs, connect with new suppliers, and manage payroll, even when your business is being pulled in different directions. to deliver a quality product at a fair price

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Tim's new protein lattes, protein without all the work, at participating restaurants in Canada. Yeah, I think there's a beautiful sort of open door there, You know, and just finding the moment to try to tell those stories where it's genuinely the most exciting part of that story you can tell and then focus a light on it, I think has the potential to be really, really remarkable. So I'm glad that that's still in the kind of, in the, you know, still around. Okay, it's official. We are very much in the final sprint to election day. And face it, between debates, polling releases, even court appearances. It can feel exhausting, even impossible, to keep up with. I'm Brad Milkey. I'm the host of Start Here, the Daily Podcast from ABC News. And every morning, my team and I get you caught up on the day's news in a quick, straightforward way that's easy to understand with just enough context so you can listen, get it, and go on with your day. Start Your Morning, Start Smart with Start Here and ABC News, because staying informed shouldn't feel overwhelming.

So in the future, you've got some stuff that you've shot, including another thing in the comic book universe, actually. You're in the third Venom film, Venom, The Last Dance. Now, did you have a question about your Marvel eligibility? It's a little confusing. Like, does anybody reference, like, hey, this guy looks a lot like that Baron Mordeau character? Like, well, I think that it's, you know, I feel that the, that the best thing to do there is to just watch the film and to just kind of engage with, you know, to have, like, you know, the, I think that the important conversations, you know, happen, I think, once everybody can sort of see the films and, you know, and then engage. I think that the pre-engagement conversations are not quite as important. this point, you know. So, but, you know, I, but I would say that it's, you know, it was fantastic to work with Kelly on that, on, in that world and, and to, and to engage with, I think, a really

special character, you know, that, um, that Tom is, you know, kind of, you know, really sort of, um, danced with. Oh, he's, he's passionate about it. I love to see it. I mean, and when, when a performer is that talented and passionate, good things come. Yeah. Yeah, I think that it's really, and it's almost when you see, you know, on set when Venom arrives, you know, you're like, wow, you know, it's a real sort of moment because it doesn't, you know, Tom could be standing next to you. Right, Tom, and he's like, Benham's here, you know. The voice changes, you're like, oh, shit, that's, that's commitment. Yeah, it's really created something pretty remarkable.

A couple other things, I know we can't talk about it much, but I'm excited to see that you, you were directed by Mike Flanagan, and whom I'm a huge fan of, Life of Chuck, Stephen King, Hiddleston. This has a lot of good elements to it, a good experience. Yeah, so wonderful. I, you know, I just, you know, I mean, I could spend days sort of talking about why that was a meaningful experience to me and sort of gushing about the way that that project kind of came together and the people that were involved and the story and the nature of of how meaningful a story it is.

And also, I suppose, the overall way of making a film, which I really appreciated, I just really felt that the care and engagement from Mike and to every member of that cast and crew and the sort of generosity that came back and was given was just, it was a very beautiful, people use that term and kind of, you know, but I don't really. I think it was a very genuinely beautiful set to work on.

And it was very, very meaningful to be there. So I'm very excited about that film and excited for people to see it. Have you seen it yet? I haven't. I haven't seen it. I'm trying to think now. Have your paths crossed with Hiddleston in the past? Is this the first?

It's the first film we've been. done together and or that we've been in together. I don't know if we were, but it's the first film that we've kind of been and shared the space with, yeah. Exactly. But we did play together many years ago. We did Othello at the, at the Dommer, so, which is where we, which is where we first met, which was many, many moons ago, but we, we did a show together.

Again, part of one of the joys of sticking around, you get to kind of revisit folks in different capacities at different junctures in their life and career, isn't it? I've one random career thing that we never talked about. Were you almost the bad guy in a James Bond movie? What happened there? Were you Blowfeld for a hot minute way back when? Oh, right. This is the, I mean, I think, well, no, inevitably, as you know around the kind of Bond franchise, there are several conversations that go on at any given moment and at certain points you can kind of intersect into that conversation in various bits and because it's so because it's just such a public space you know the you know any of those conversations suddenly get amplified to this other sort of degree

and but you know so there were kind of you know there was an intersection of conversation that happened and that I you know that I you know that I I I I I've been, you know, there's been so many films that I've been at that kind of conversation with. It just happens. This is James Bond, so it gets out, I guess. So it gets sort of amplified in a certain different way. But so I don't know. So the answers your question is, you know, not really. I mean, maybe there was, you know, but it would have to have gone on for a few more steps before that was even, you know, but there were kind of initial sort of chats about something. Got it. Is that still an interest? I mean, you've been on so many interesting. franchise as cool, you know, obviously aspects of the career, a bond villain, still a good, you know, it's been a good role for a lot of great actors. Yeah, I mean, I think that it's,

I, you know, I think there are so many different things that are exciting as an actor right now. And there are so many different kind of dynamics and just opportunities. And, and I think that, you know, I don't, there's not. really that much that I would sort of categorically shut the door on. You weren't enough to know that. Keep the door open because the best version of anything is also. Yeah. And it sort of, it just depends like anything else.

You know, it depends on the character, the people involved, like how it sort of comes together. And, you know, and then there's just, there's all sorts of kind of slightly more sort of boring things like timing and, you know, what the commitments are. and, you know, um, um, so, you know, I think, um, I think there's just a lot of rich material out there. And, um, and I'm, I would be excited to look at anything, you know. We're going to end with this. I'm going to end with the happy, say, I can't fuse profoundly random questions to a tell. Okay. These are kind of rapid fire as much as you want to go into them. Uh, are you, are you a dog or cat person or either or neither?

I'm a dog person, I would say ultimately. Um, here. But I would put myself more in the dog category. Do you collect anything? Well, I sort of tend to collect too many things. You know, I kind of, I'm a tiny bit of a hoarder, so I just, so I end up having to try to force myself to not have so much stuff around. But, yeah, memories, I collect memories. Do you take back, like, stuff from sets or not really?

Not too much, you know. Just the chairs and the furniture, just everything. Notorious kleptomaniac. If it's not screwed down, then it might just weird. Where did the TV go? What's the wallpaper on your phone? Family, just family. Are you ever mistaken for another actor, last actor you were mistaken for?

Not really. I mean, no. I would say on the whole, you know, people try to place, you know, when they're trying to place what they, you know, somebody comes up to me and it's like, what have I seen you in? And you're sort of like going through the... That awkward IMDB meant, well, I was in it.

You know, there are a few, but not consistently enough to say, this person is my doppelganger. Fair enough. What's the worst note a director has ever given you? Act better. Someone said that to you, literally? Yeah, yeah. I mean, I think they were joking, but they did say that.

It's like, not even ingest. Not even ingest. Can you do the same thing? Only better. Yeah, like you doing, just be good. Yeah, less shit, please. Like a better actor. What drives you crazy on a set?

Any pet peeves? I mean, you know, I feel like the only thing that is annoying on set is noise, you know. But that doesn't have to be, that doesn't have to, I don't mean it's like people making noise that can be that. But inevitably, you're just, you can sometimes just be surrounded by a general level of sound that just makes, that just interrupts the flow. of doing stuff, you know, and that can be anything. That can be a train going past.

That can be an hour, you know what I mean? It can be all of those kind of ambient sounds, but all people, you know, just anything. Sure. Out of it is just inevitably kind of hard because especially when you're just sort of right in the finding that moment. Yeah, it is all literally about shutting out all that noise. Yeah. So that you're just in the moment right here.

Yeah. It's all about. And then finally, in the spirit of happy, say I confused, an actor that always makes you happy. Oh, you're asking me. Yeah, you see that, you see, you see, you see them on screen, instant happiness, joy. Well, I would say, I mean, I did sit down. I remember I watch, you know, a film that I love from years ago is Bowfinger, you know. I remember, so good.

I mean, it's such a fantastic film and all kind of, you know, just. And I remember just reflecting after that of how talented Eddie Murphy is, you know, just how profoundly talented a person he is as a, he's incredibly funny in a way that sort of makes you kind of barrel laugh funny. But he has such extraordinary capacity and presence in front of the camera, you know, just an ability as a cinematic actor. So that makes me happy. Yeah.

running across the highway sequence, the keep it together, keep it together, keep it together. I can quote all. Love it. It's so brilliant. I mean, Steve Martin is amazing in the film as well. It's just such a great comedic story. Yeah.

A movie that makes you sad? Um, well, so many films, you know, but in a way, I guess, I think that, you know, in a broad sense, it's not just a movie, because various movies can make you sad, but I feel like the knowledge that is a possibility that the retirement of Daniel Day Lewis

is going to be a consistent thing. You know, that isn't just going to end at some point does make me sad overall in terms of cinema, because I absolutely miss that his present. and voice in the cinematic conversation and that kind of desire to see him do something hasn't gone away. What's the most inspiring Daniel Day Lewis performance for you? What's the one?

Well, I think, you know, I think there will be blood as something that I do find myself going back to just because of the, just the level of, you know, I mean, I know that he's committed in so many different things in so many different ways. But the kind of level of internalized commitment in that role is really profound and kind of, you know, it really sears through the screen in a way that you really feel like you're looking at this character's soul. His entire embodiment is there and present for you to kind of peruse. And that's a very powerful, very powerful piece of act. And finally, food that makes you confused, Chewettel. What food do you just not get? You don't understand why people even go

Europe. I sat in a French restaurant with a friend of mine a few years ago and we ordered the snails we did and the escargo and we sat looking at it for 45 minutes until the waiter took it away. Humans should not put that in their body. You thought, nope, that's not, that's not right? I just couldn't do it in the end. I mean, delicacy or not, I just couldn't, I couldn't figure my way through it. I'm sure people will say it's the better you know get over it but you know that was my experience it's good to have boundaries um congratulations um it's been far too long since we had this kind of conversation thank you for making the time in the middle of work um i'll encourage folks again this is a really

special one rob piece is a great piece of work fantastic performances it will move you um i hope people check it out in theaters it's getting a release which is fantastic so um congratulations man it's good to see you and you great to see you thank you thank you great to see you thank you Thank you so much. And so ends another edition of happy, sad, confused. Remember to review, rate, and subscribe to this show on iTunes or wherever you get your podcasts. I'm a big podcast person.

I'm Daisy Ridley, and I definitely wasn't pressured to do this by Josh. I'm Amy Nicholson, the film critic for the LA Times. And I'm Paul Shear, an actor, writer, and director. You might know me from The League, Veep, or my non-eligible for Academy Award role in Twisters. We love movies, and we come at them from different perspectives. Yeah, like Amy thinks that, you know, Joe Pesci was miscast in Goodfellas, and I don't. He's too old.

Let's not forget that Paul thinks that Dude, too, is overrated. It is. Anyway, despite this, we come together to host Unspool, a podcast where we talk about good movies, critical hits. Fan favorites, must-season, and Casey Mistoms. We're talking Parasite the Home Alone. From Greece to the Dark Night. We've done deep dives on popcorn flicks. We've talked about why Independence Day deserves a second look.

And we've talked about horror movies, some that you've never even heard of like Ganges and Hess. So if you love movies like we do, come along on our cinematic adventure. Listen to Unspooled wherever you get your podcast. And don't forget to hit the follow button.