Happy Sad Confused - Gareth Edwards

Episode Date: September 28, 2023

Gareth Edwards is no stranger to big scale sci-fi but his latest film, THE CREATOR, is something different, a rare wholly unique idea in a sea of franchises. Gareth joins Josh to talk about his filmmaking influences, from Spielberg to Cameron, and his experiences directing giant films like ROGUE ONE and GODZILLA. #happysadconfused #joshhorowitz #thecreator #garethedwards  SUPPORT THE SHOW BY SUPPORTING OUR SPONSORS! NordVPN -- 🌏 Get Exclusive NordVPN deal here ➼ ⁠⁠nordvpn.com/HappySad⁠⁠ It’s risk-free with Nord’s 30-day money-back guarantee! ✌ ZocDoc -- Go to ⁠⁠ZocDoc.com/HappySad⁠⁠ UPCOMING EVENTS! 10/9 -- Come see Josh and Josh Gad & Andrew Rannells at the 92nd Street Y in NYC! Virtual tickets available too. Get your tickets here! Check out the ⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠Happy Sad Confused patreon here⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠! We've got discount codes to live events, merch, early access, exclusive episodes of GAME NIGHT, video versions of the podcast, and more! To watch episodes of Happy Sad Confused, subscribe to ⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠Josh's youtube channel here⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠! Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

D.C. high volume, Batman. The Dark Knight's definitive DC comic stories adapted directly for audio for the very first time. Fear, I have to make them afraid. He's got a motorcycle. Get after him or have you shot. You mean blow up the building? From this moment on,

none of you are safe. New episodes every Wednesday, wherever you get your podcasts. We go down the corridor and they go, George Lucas is on the phone. And I was like, what? You know, and suddenly got whisked into this room and there was a phone off the hook. I was like, hello? And I do this every time where I'm like, okay, everyone's going to ask me what he said.

And in my brain, I'm grabbing a cassette tape and putting it in and hitting record. And remember this, remember this. And I'm so in awe that it's George that I played the tape back at the end and it was just, And it was just, Prepare your ears, humans. Happy, sad, confused begins now. I'm Josh Horowitz, and today on Happy, Sad Confused, it's the only filmmaker in history that I know of to direct both Darth Vader and Godzilla.

He's made four feature films. And as far as I'm concerned, he's four for four monsters, Godzilla, Rogue One, and now his original sci-fi epic. Yes, it's actually original guys. it's possible the creator it's gareth edwards on happy say i confused for the very first time hi gareth hey josh how you doing i'm doing great congrats on the movie man um i i'll preface this by saying i i meant what i said i i think you're a very fine filmmaker you're making good movies so congratulations buddy on this one thank you i don't trust anything anyone tells me like i i

every time i meet someone who works in this industry like i crank up my compliments like by double yes that's why i'm i'm overcompensating because you know you can you can yeah yeah so i've just i'm harbing what you're saying so just mind does anybody ever come up to you and say you know godzilla it wasn't for me that wasn't my like does anyone actually ever say something like that totally what you want about all the time yeah um like the weirdest thing is the The first movie I did was this very low independent, low budget independent movie. And you go and do all the film festivals around the world. And this very awkward thing happens at every single screening where they say, stick

around the filmmaker is going to be for, you know, doing a Q&A after the screening sort of thing. And so essentially got the whole theater. And then anyone who hated the movie just thinks, I don't want this, you know, hang around for this Q&A and they just start leaving. But you're by the door, right? So they all have to push past you and shuffle past you to get. out and so you basically everyone who like about a third of the audience might empty and everyone

who walks past you you're like you feel like apologizing to them go i'm sorry you didn't like i'm really sorry like and they and they probably don't know it's you they might be mumbling something about the movie yeah yeah you don't want to accidentally over here and then the awkwardest moment was i won't mention the film festival but i was going down an escalator afterwards and i just happened to like stand next to and it's like one of the longest escalators in the world and i happen to stand next to this couple and one of the guys when um oh uh congratulations are really loved your film and I was like, oh, thanks. And he went, she hated it. And I looked at his wife and she was nodding like, yeah, it was, I hated it. And then he was like, and then we both stood in

silence for like the longest escalator ride in the history world. And it was like, why, why tell someone that? But okay. Oh, Hollywood. So good for the self-esteem, you would think. But in terms of like the process of making films, when is the time when there's the most anxiety? Is it at the writing, you know, stage? Is it during production? Is it this stage? Like, when do you feel kind of like the anxiety? They all kind of compete with each other to be the worst moment. Um, pre-production there's no anxiety. Pre-production is like where you- Well, the movie's still perfect. The movie can't, there's no problems with it. Yeah. It's a masterpiece at that point. It's like, it's going to be the greatest film ever made. And every, you know, you're really sure of that.

And so that's really, that's fine that bit. Then what happens, the way I sort of view it is like a graph and as you're writing the movie the graph goes up and up and up probably to its highest ever point where in your mind you're making citizen cane right then you start filming and as you film every day that graph goes down and down and down and down and down to like probably the lowest point is like when you watch the assembly so you sort of watch the cap and then and then in post it starts to go back up and up and you kind of crawl your way back up and obviously the ultimate goal is to get to the heights you originally were and you never really know you know how well you're doing obviously and so that i'd say a very anxious moment it's probably where we're at now where everyone's

about to see it and you know you're going to give it in you know give it over to the world and end the complicating escalator again right the metaphorical escalator or literal sometimes but i mean the complicated thing obviously is also it's a different thing it's not what you endeavor to do on day one of the shoot especially given the way you approach things starting and monsters and in a way how you've kind of returned to seemingly in this one you very much live and breathe in that kind of organic gorilla space like it seems like you thrive on that and and you know you're not the type of filmmaker to kind of like shoot the storyboard and be like we nailed it you need it to kind of feel a little alive in the moment don't you yeah i mean there's

always like i think if you just literally i feel very down and depressed if all i got was what i was picturing in my head right because there's a limit to how good that can be like you're kind of subconsciously pulling from other films and visuals you've seen and stuff like this to kind of create hopefully this kind of more you know new thing and and it's like all you're doing creatively the entire time you're making a film in every single way is trying to like i see them is it like an organism right there's my DNA there's like the idea i had and then i'm trying to let in other DNA of either other people like the actors or designers or people that worked on the film or even stuff like the weather or the location, just not quite being what you expected.

And then suddenly this new thing is born that is like a merge of two other things. And that's when you get stuff that feels new and fresh when it's sort of like, that's the hardest thing to do with filmmaking is like sort of smash up your plan and build it back together. And if you arrive exactly where you were, then it tells you, okay, maybe there's something in that. Often you arrive at something else and go, oh, I'm kind of glad that happened. We would never, ever have chosen that. But now it feels like that's probably one of the most unique things about the movie is when

when something goes wrong. And also add in, of course, the filmmaker influences, the folks that you grew up on, we're of almost the exact same age. And I know you've talked about some of your influences. And I'd like to kind of start this conversation a little bit by talking about some of those filmmakers that you've mentioned in the past because I see them in your work. I see them in the creator and different elements. and there's nothing to apologize for.

These are the greats, and you're making it your own. But, like, Spielberg, for everybody of our age and the generation is, of course, looms large. And I certainly see close encounters. I saw it in Godzilla, that sense of place, that sense of scope. What's your Spielberg, Mount Rushmore? Does he recur in your vocabulary just every day you make a movie? Yeah, I think more, probably more than any of the filmmaker in that, I think I watched his films from a directing point of view.

I probably watched Spielberg movies more than any of the film as a kid and tried to learn about like shock construction. And I would start, I remember getting thrown out of class when I was 10 for being naughty. And so I spent the hour that I had outside the class storyboarding. So I knew I wanted, like I used that as like, well, I definitely knew about directing then and wanted to be a filmmaker. And I, and I was very much influenced by like Raiders the Lost Ark. Like I'd watch that over and over.

And there's something about the way that movie's constructed, like from a storyboard style kind of view, that it's like a vocabulary, like, like the words I'm using right now, I didn't invent English, right? You know, your parents speak to you in English, and, you know, it kind of gets stuck in your brain and so you speak English. And, and if you watch Spielberg movies or, you know, James Cameron, a billion times. times as a child, you know, maybe you're going to talk a little bit with that accent, you know, when you get to make a film. And I'm very, I mean, they're my heroes. I think, you know, you know, you name the movie, but it's like, you know, if I ever made, if you ever made a film as close to those seminal films that I grew up with, I could, I could die happy. The thing that makes you keep going back to make another movie is you're like, got to, I've got to get closer.

you know what i mean like those guys they did multiple masterpieces you've got like it's such a high benchmark it's it's i don't know how they it was a different era back then and then i kind of like to blame the era because it's so hard to make something that great i mean they're very special those filmmakers no honestly and i'm not just blowing smoke i think you're a throwback in that way in the way that you're tackling genre it reminds me of these guys and i'll throw in like folks like verhoven and cameron and all you know they're all dealing with heady, heady subjects,

but making it fun and, and bringing emotion to what, you know, back in the day was considered kind of like, you know, that those side genres that we don't treat with dignity. You've talked about Lucas,

of course. You obviously made your own Star Wars movie. How much blubbering did you do when he told you how much he loved Rogue One? Did the tears immediately come? Like, did that blow your brain apart when he complimented you on your film? No,

because, I mean I cherish I had we showed him around the set he came to visit Pinewood at one point and had a day where we sort of showed him everything and that just felt the most surreal thing in the world to be showing George Lucas a Star Wars film that he wasn't part of it felt wrong that sense and and then yeah he did basically we were doing exactly this for Rogue One I was sat exactly like this you know right and and doing interviews and there was this person hovering by the door and they were like, come out, come out, come. And it's like, what? And then suddenly it sort of stopped. And they said, Garris just got to take a break. And I had no idea what was going on.

And we go down the corridor and they go, George Lucas is on the phone. And I was like, what? You know, and suddenly got whisked into this room and there was a phone off the hook. I was like, hello? And in my, and I do this every time where I'm like, okay, everyone's going to ask me what, what he said. Everyone works. And I, in my brain, I'm grabbing a cassette tape and putting it in and hitting record. And, I'm just, remember this remember this and i'm so in awe that it's george that he was highly compliment like he was very he was very kind but though i played the tape back at the end and it was just like it was like it was like the try round teacher yeah yeah i couldn't store any of it you know

it's your hero talking to you it was um it yeah it's like i know i'm in the matrix i know this is not real. I'm a big believer in the in the simulation hypothesis because I shouldn't get to do a Star Wars film and have you also it happened it happened uh James Cameron obviously looms large for for all of us and in a way you know the creator feels like the realization of judgment day we kind of like the what we never saw in his Terminator movies in a slight way have you cross paths with with Cameron and those Terminator films must loom large for you. Oh yeah totally no I never I've never met James Cameron. I, on my 16th birthday,

I asked for money off everybody because my intention was to go down to the secondhand store or that we have, it's like radio rentals in the UK, I think Radio Shack in America. And they basically had a secondhand miss, like a used old VHS cassette player. And I was like, oh my God, it was my dream to have my own VHS cassette player

in my bedroom so I could just watch films whenever I wanted. And I, as soon as I got home, I put the Terminator in and it never left that cassette player for like a few months. Every time it got to the end, I just rewanted it play again. And we do work and things like I would tend to do homework. And it was just on like, like, like wallpaper in the room. And I got to be able to quote that movie off by heart. It's, I think it's, I mean, technically it's not his debut right because of piranha too. Right.

But I'll just brush over that. Like it's, I think it's one of the greatest debut. he's talked about if and when he goes back to Terminator which he's teased using AI as his way in so maybe now that the student can become the teacher maybe you can tell him a thing or two about AI I don't even tell James Cameron anything he doesn't already know he's the smartest man on the universe got of it yeah yeah I think you always mention apocalypse now and I think when folks see this movie they're going to see a really unique blend of a lot of different things including a war film a Vietnam film

I mean, there's definitely an influence there. Apocalypse now, I think, for many of us, again, blew our minds when we saw it. Seeing that and then the documentary, right, Heart of Darkness, hopefully your films aren't quite as chaotic as that. But is that a little bit of what you're trying to touch, a little bit of magic in that film? Yeah, you know what's funny? As I saw Apocalypse now, I think it was about 17, 16, 17 when I first saw it. And I knew this was allegedly the greatest war movie ever made. And so there was such a high bar set by that.

And I remember putting it in, hit and play and watching it during the day during when I was at college and got to the end and I was like, it's okay, right? And I don't know what I was expecting, but I had this kind of reaction. And like all great movies like that, I had the same kind of reaction to 2001. Right. And then I would go a day or so and I'd be thinking about the film loads and I'd go, I'm going to watch that again because I just get pulled back into it and hit play again. The second time you watch you go, that's pretty good actually. And then I'd go

about a few more days and I'd go, let me watch it one more time. And they'd be like, oh my God, I think it's kind of a masterpiece. And there's these films that if you're not exposed to them when they first came out to the cinema, you get told they're special and you obviously revisit them at some point. And I think if you weren't in that particular timeline when what they were doing was unique because they've been copied since, you know, right. And then the first viewing, if I'm honest, with a lot of these films, I don't quite get it sometimes. And, but I find if it's a really, if it is a strong movie, you just be gravitationally pulled back to it and watch it a second time and then you'll think even better of it.

And I think now, Apocalypse Now is, if someone said it's the greatest movie ever made, I would not argue with them. There's like a whole bunch of films people could say that about and I wouldn't argue with them. But it's, it's hard to put things into like, which is your favorite. Right. But, um, it's in the top. Whatever. the top handful is. It's in there. Did it come up a lot in the production of this one? Because it does feel like Joshua, your protagonist, is on this journey. He's kind of caught in, and there's shades of gray. Who are the good guys? Who are the bad guys? He's kind of on this, this quest. And I don't know, the sense of place again, it feels like it's definitely there. I mean, that's a masterpiece.

I'm not equating our film to anything like that. But the, but I do feel like there was a, you have to get into a shorthand with when the hardest thing about or one of the hardest things about making a film is that at some point someone tries to get you to say it in three sentences right and you're like if i could summarize this film in three sentences i wouldn't have made it do i mean like the shortest i'm really sorry but the shortest i can manage is two hours and we hit play like that's kind of what the movie is the whole point yeah yeah and so but so you look for little fast ways of talking about the movie and the fastest way we just accidentally landed on at one point and it kind of felt right, was if someone made Apocalypse now in the Blade Runner universe,

that was kind of like the really quick way. And both those films are like phenomenal, like legendary masterpieces. So I'm not in any way saying our films like that. But it was a quick explanation to people who would be like, oh, okay, that's really interesting. Now, I got it. You're saying you're better than Ripley Scott and Francis Ford Coppola put together. And that's cool. I mean, humility is overrated.

Yeah. I think if the two of them were together, no, no, I wouldn't. But individually, yeah. Right. I hope it's okay that we're geeking out on filmmakers. But like the other one I want to mention because we, again, we always comes up is Tarantino. Okay.

And Tarantino's been mentioned, I read this somewhere. I don't know if you've substantiated it, that he acknowledged that he cried, I think as I did, watching, spoiler alert for the opening 20 minutes of Godzilla. You have an amazing sequence at the beginning of that, of that film in which Juliet Benosh dies and it's so dramatic and powerfully done and apparently it brought Quentin to tears. Have you heard that? I did read something like that when he spoke to her he told her that story or something, which is amazing if that's true. And that's all on her. Like she did such a great performance. Yeah, no, I saw the Reservoir Dog seven times at the cinema. It blew my mind.

I think it was probably because it was the first of 16 when it came out and it was the first film that was like pulling from world cinema and classic you know a whole genre of films that i probably wasn't fully exposed to back then and kind of made this like perfect little movie you know with with those influences and and just blew my mind completely and a friend of mine uh we were at college so i was 16 or 17 and and he went up to a film festival in nottingham called shots in the dark film festival and um he did He just called me really excited one day and went, I've just met Quentin Tarantino.

And I was like, what? And he was like, he's here at the festival. He's doing a Q&A, but he's here the whole week. He's watching all the films. And I just saw him in the cafe thing, you know, and I asked him for an autograph. And I was like, I just got in my car and I went. It's like in the UK, that's quite a big deal.

Right, from where I live to Notting up. So I just drove for like two hours. And then we were looking for him everywhere. And then sort of saw him in this, in the gift shop. And went up to him. And I told him I'd seen some reservoir dog seven times. And I think I just looked like some weird, geeky, like, stalkery freak. Like, can you know, like stay away?

Right. And then we went in to watch this movie called Les Samurai, which is like this sort of... Oh, yeah. I just saw it for the first time. Yeah, great movie. Yeah, yeah. French Chihuahua film. And we go in and we're trying to look for an empty seat.

And there's an empty seat next to Tarantino. And so we're like, all pushing and fighting each other to go and sit next to Tarantino. So we ended up sitting next to him. And he was like, hey, how you doing? and we're like, yeah, good. He's like, have you seen this movie? And we were like, no. And he's like, oh, you're gonna love it.

And he spent the movie watching us our reaction. Like, he was looking at us more than he was looking at the screen, it felt like. And so I was like really overreacting to everything. Like, oh, no, you know, I was doing like one of those YouTube, like. And it's not quite that kind of movie. That listsets those kind of reaction.

No, but because you could feel him looking at you. It's like, I've got to look like I'm loving this, because, you know. During the Volvo Fall Experience event, discover exceptional offers and thoughtful design that leaves plenty of room for autumn adventures. And see for yourself how Volvo's legendary safety brings peace of mind to every crisp morning commute. This September, leased a 26 XE90 plug-in hybrid from $599 bi-weekly at 3.99% during the Volvo Fall Experience event. Condition supply, visit your local Volvo retailer or go to do that. to Explorevolvo.com.

It got Willa. They got my daughter. I need to find her. Willa! From acclaimed director, Paul Thomas Anderson. You can save that girl. On September 26th, experience what is being called

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One battle after another. Only in theater, September 26th. Experience it in IMAX. you can't hurt did it feel like when you made monsters I know there was a lot of years where you were kind of toiling and trying to get there

to become a feature film director did you feel like you were immediately welcome to a club like that you were like you were in and that some filmmakers kind of reached out and embraced you that your life had changed pretty quickly I am not in any club whatsoever like I don't know what

if you know where the club is please tell me and I'll knock on the door because no you don't i don't feel like that at all and no not at all like i still feel outside the club i don't know if there is a club everyone you speak to feels that way i think like there's this perception that there's this like illuminati gathering of like all these uber filmmakers and actors and and if there is like i i i've never invited to it so what about the the the jump from monsters to godzilla um i don't think there's ever probably been that jump

a budget jump from a first-time feature to a second feature. First film's, what, like half a million, if that, and Godzilla, I don't know, 150 million, something like that. Besides, like, much better craft service, did it feel like, what was the biggest jump for you? Did you feel, because I guess one of the weird phenomenon on something like that is, like, you probably have less experience on that set

than a lot of the people around you. The actors, your crew, was that an odd place to be on your second feature? Yeah, I think there was like an imposter syndrome for a lot of it. It was, but also in a really weird way, like when you dream about doing this as a kid, I guess it's like if you dreamt about playing in the Super Bowl, you mean, like if you wanted to play in the NFL and that's all you picture is when you're on the playground, that's what you're picturing. Do you don't mean?

Right. In a very strange way, if you end up in the Super Bowl, as weird as it is, it also feels like Of course, right? Because this is what we always pictured, you know. And so there's a strange, like, you have a schizophrenic feeling about it, where you're half like, this is so weird, I shouldn't be here. How did this happen? And I honestly spent that whole time thinking, this is not real.

And they're going to, at some point, they're going to go, it was really nice to meet you, Gareth, and we really enjoyed everything. But Tim Burton's coming in now like you're a contest winner. Like, we gave you a week on set. Congratulations. Go back to your old life. Yeah. And so I really kept waiting for, I kept looking around.

Like, if anyone famous, any, you know, act, like, the renter turned up, it would scare the hell out of me. Like, oh, here we go. Yeah. And to be, to tell a story about the heroes of it all. And when you're asking, like, did you ever get affected by this sort of thing? When we finished, so you, I don't know if you're familiar with publicity tours where some filmmaker has to sit in front of a camera and do a million interviews, but apparently they're, exist. They, um, they, so we had to do that for Godzilla and I was fried by the end of it. And we were like, with me and the writer, Max Bernstein, we were like, let's go have a

party. Let's just do something. We've got to celebrate this. So we were like, okay, let we go to Cinerama Dome. We'll watch the movie and then we'll all go back to, we'll hire a house and we'll just all have a house party and have drinks with all these people. So we did that and we got to the house party. And one at a time, I could feel this queue of people wanting to talk, talk to me. And each one had one of the questions from the public. like what was it like working with Brian Crenston what was it like and and I was like I can't do this I can't do this you know what I mean like I got I got a go and so me and a friend we just went we just went down into Hollywood and very drunk and then

about 2 a.m. 3 a.m. I look at my phone and there's a an email and I recognize the email address and it's Peter Jackson's email and I'm like Peter Jackson's email in and I look and there was a video attachment I open up the video and I'm in a I'm in a nightclub so it's like and I look at the video and there's a guy with gray sort of gray hair and a beard and I'm thinking is this Gandalf you know what I mean I'm like I don't know what's going on this is really weird and so I go out what did you take at the club gareth what did someone well this is what I was thinking I was like someone's drops me in my drink because I'm starting to hallucinate and so I go outside and I start putting my headphones on and it's like what is this and as soon

as I put the headphones and I recognize the voice and it was Stephen Spielberg And Peter Jackson was filming him on his camera, on his phone. And basically, Spielberg had just watched Godzilla. And Peter was like, I know Gareth. He'll really want to hear this because he was saying something about it. And he was like, let me film you and send it to him. And Spielberg started speaking about Godzilla, and it was nice to hear it. And I just started crying.

Like I literally collapsed, and I just went in, I'd hardly ever cry. And I just started, it just felt like that's why I did it. mean like that every all the pain of whatever it was is worth it for that little video clip you know what I mean it meant it meant the absolute world to me it was kind of like um yeah it was i think i think your theory is right i think it's a simulation i'm sorry to say because that doesn't happen that's not real that is not i supposed to happen it's never happened either it's like that was it that's all i'm getting well you've had some more pinch me moments i mean so so star wars i've never heard the story of how you actually got the gig like did you meet with kathy about like an amorphous

role in Star Wars? Like, were you up for, like, the saga films, too? Or was it always specifically Rogue One? Did you have to kind of, like, make a pitch? Like, what happened? Yeah, it wasn't quite what you think in that sense, because I was, so I was finishing Godzilla when, basically, when we went, Godzilla, as you know, was set in San Francisco. So we went up to San Francisco, and we were there and actually went to industrial light and magic by the Yoda fountain just because I wanted a photograph. And that's the day it broke that Disney had bought, film right and we all started hypothesizing oh wonder what they're going to do and wonder maybe more star wars films and we're all sitting there talking like this and then

slowly i can't remember i wasn't paying loads of attention but you get the impression that lots of filmmakers were meeting with them right and i think they'd announced jj was doing what we what turned out to be the force awakens at that point i can't remember but anyway that felt like it was all happening and in my head there was no part of me of the thought i would ever be considered for anything and so just getting on with making this film and then i got an email out the blue from kiri hart um saying do you you know hear you're a fan of star was would you like to meet up and my assumption was they're they're talking to 3 000 filmmakers i'm i'm number 2,998 you know and and so it's my turn to go in

and just say have a quick chat and i couldn't meet them because i was shooting a movie there was nowhere and it was like really painful to write an email back saying i'm so sorry but I can't I can't meet right now and I asked like maybe in a few couple of months but in my heart I was thinking if this if this is serious they'll come back and say could you is there any way we could do a zoom and so I batted it away for a bit and then we were in post-production and they asked again do you want to come in and I was like sure and we were at Warner Brothers which is right next door to Disney in Burbank and I didn't tell anyone that I was going for a meeting and so I pretended did I, like, had to go to the loo or something or I was feeling ill or something.

I don't know what they thought. And I just got out. I just left the edit quickly ran down the street. I don't know what got in my car and drove. It's only like a block away or so. And then when I met with Kiri and had this great conversation where I talked about how geeky of Star Wars fun I was, I guess. And I, on my 30th birthday, I actually went to Tunisia and I stayed in Luke Skywalker's house.

and so my god i've i've looked up that that hotel yeah it's it does not get good reviews online it's not uh i mean they're that's that's that's not their fault that's it's an amazing thing to do it it was like me to sort of i know it seems amazing i just yeah yeah i took blue milk i'm sorry blue dye and i put it in milk so i love it on the very table that this is my 30th birthday and then we went you have to drive across the country to get to the igloo and i watched the sunset And so I did really geeky things like that. And as you're doing that, it's very, there wasn't very many people back then and you'd sometimes cross paths with other couples, like I was with my girlfriend at the time.

And there'd be some like, some guy who looked just like you, probably a graphic designer, probably a effects artist. And he with this really bored girlfriend and they would exchange looks like you too, huh? You know, getting dragged around Star Wars sets. And so I sort of explained that story. And then she, that went really well and I thought, and she said what you, I kind of, then maybe they asked about what I think style, what kind of film you should do in Star Wars,

and I don't know what I said. But then at the end of that interview or chat, I just got sent an email and it said, here's two ideas for a Star Wars film, would you be interested in either of them? And it's like so rare you get a phenomenal email like that. Right. I was busy and I was like,

I'm not opening this until I've got time to read it properly. And so, and I knew, and it sounds crazy, but I didn't have time till the weekend. And so I waited until no one was around because I thought, I'm never going to get this chance again. I made sure I locked the door, open up the email, and there were these two ideas for a movie.

And I read one, and I was like, and I got to the end. And in my head, I thought, I can see why they want to do that. I'm not the guide for that. I'm really curious what this other idea is, you know. And I started reading it, and I was like, where's this going, where's this going? And that was the pitch that John Null did,

like two pages or so and sort of read it. And I was still spent the whole, time going where is this going what is this and then right at the end it was you know spoiler alert but blah blah blah princess layer you know right and i was like oh my god this is like the connected you know prequel to a new hope which is my favorite you know whole reason i'm doing anything and i spent the first 10 20 minutes going you can't make this film this is like sacrilegious you know like this shouldn't happen and then ended up um then as soon you realized, but are they offering this me? And I went back in. And I honestly thought they were talking

to like 10, 20 people about that movie. And I was one of them. And so I went in and talked about it and what I think you should and shouldn't do. And Kathy, with Kathy. And I think I went for another chat. I cannot remember. But at one point, I was like, I need to know just for my own piece of mind how many people they're talking to. And so I just sort of went, oh, how many other filmmakers are you talking to about this idea? And they went, oh none just you and i was like okay when would you do this and they were like they'd be our next film and it was like i had to act all like oh yeah sure cool you know right so this is a go project you want me and it's an awesome idea let me get this straight okay you go hang on and you go you know

i didn't do the raid right you know i'm not gareth evans you know like no go with it garras just go with it yeah what was the what was the other idea was it the boba fat what was the i i cannot talk about it because i assume they're going to make that film you know at some point and it'll be a great movie i just it wasn't is it something we've heard about or is something i've ever heard of you think uh no comment okay fair enough fair enough Goodbye, summer movies, hello fall. I'm Anthony Devaney. And I'm his twin brother, James.

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And don't forget to hit the follow button. Rogue one is a miracle. Any great movie is a miracle. It's, it works so well. It is fantastic. And I'm curious, like, what your relationship is as like, and as the creator, owner, a creative owner of a film like that. Like, do you feel the creative authorship of Rogue One that you feel for an original thing like the creator or monsters? I mean, there's so much, there's somebody cooks in the kitchen, frankly, something that, of that size. So what is your relationship to Rogue One? Is that, is that your film? No honestly what I feel all the time is it's George's film like like basically everything in that movie that's any good that people love is probably somehow from George Lucas in some way and like the fact that I we didn't realize this when we were shooting it but everyone obviously the thing that gets that gets talked about the most is the Darth Vader scene at the end and I take

zero, like I feel zero ownership of that because it's George's character. Do I mean, George invented that corridor, he invented that character, I mean, sorry, that character and the lightsabers and the rebels and, do you know mean, and the death star plans. And it's like, the eye, you know, so you, it's like when, so, okay, this is what you kind of happens when you're a filmmaker and especially a sci-fi geek, like I am, is I go into comic book shops a lot and, and those sort of stores, you know, and, and, and, and, And I walk around and I'm mainly looking for the stuff and just there as a fan, but you can't, you're lying to yourself if a little bit of the, in the corner of your eye, you sometimes don't go, oh, is that from our film? You know, whatever it, like, whether it be Godzilla or Rogue One.

And if I spot our Godzilla, you know, that's like our design, not the Toho, I sort of feel a little like, yeah, you know, and the same, but the problem is with Rogue One is when I see Darth Vader, I'm like, that's not because of our. film that's because of you know the original trilogy which totally rightly so and and so there's a it's very hard to see something where it's just because of rogue one you know i mean usually because of star wars as a whole um so yeah i i always feel like i got to play with those toys which was amazing um but any the real you know someone's going to it's all george yeah yeah Does the conjecture, the endless conjecture about that production bother you? The reality is that all these giant films have major additional photography. Yet there is this kind of war, as you well know, about this film without who did what and Tony's involvement, was Filoni involved, etc.

Do you sweat that stuff? Does it bother you? Do you feel a need to set the record straight or is it all good? No, I think, I just, yeah, I mean, every movie, you know what's weird? is this the creator we didn't do additional photography every single film i've done over than this one we've always gone back and shot a bunch of stuff yeah and i always expected to i always joked with the actors when we were doing the creator like um see you in nine months for the pickup shoot you know i mean like i would say goodbye like people in thailand we'd never see for ages you know

and you say it's okay we're coming back in nine months you know we can come back in nine months and we didn't and uh and that was weird because it is very normal to do that um I think in terms of Rogue One, like, look, I got to, I got to, making films is very hard, right? And I got to, I think I got to make a film in the, in probably the best world and story that anyone, I could ever hope to be offered. Yeah. And, and the idea of like nitpicking or complaining about some aspect of it feels really ungrateful. And so I'm, I'm sort of, even if I went back in time, I wouldn't do anything differently, you know, at all.

At the end of the day, people aren't shouting at me across the street saying I ruin their childhood. Right. And it's more than that. Look, and you have a prosperous career. You're able to make your own original film on a pretty big scale, like the creator. And that film exists. So everyone won.

It's all good. Talk to me a little bit. I mean, full circle on the creator. So this is an original idea. This is obviously, look, elements are borrowed from different things, but you have created this out of whole cloth. is there is it possible possible to make a movie like this as a one-off nowadays or do you have to kind of like promise new regency and Disney like oh I've got other ideas we can do more in this universe you mean like to be a franchise like to yeah no no we never talked about that it was never on the table um the hard's kind of shocking nowadays to be honest what don't you say I mean it's no I think what well I mean I can see why you think that but I think what's shocking is that they even do it in the first place like so hard to go, like, had a whole stack of conversations after Rogue One

with lots of different people. And I was really interested in doing something original, you know, like the movies I grew up loving. And people will nod and say nice things in a room and then it will go nowhere because no one wants to put their money where their mouth is. And they've got a point, you know, they'll point at things, track records of people taking big swings

on, you know, non-IP recently. And, and so really it's like we can blame Hollywood as much as we want for just constantly doing sequels and franchises and not original material. But, you know, it's a democracy to some extent. And you get to vote with your cinema ticket and whatever you go see is what they make. So I would just say to anyone listening to this is that doesn't matter what you like, whatever the film is, it doesn't matter, please go see it at the cinema, because that's what they're going to make more of. And so I think early on in the, earlier in the summer or maybe

late spring, we went into the studio and the head of marketing and everything. We talked about, we knew this strike was coming. And there was the big dilemma of like, what do we do? Do we push? Do we stand our ground with our estate? Like, what do we do? And they brought up, they had, every studio has one, right? They brought up this massive timeline on the computer and they've got this giant screens and stuff. And it was every movie coming out from when we were talking back then till the like end of fall, you know, this is everything available to everyone.

And they sort of went, look at all these movies. There's not one thing here that's not a sequel based on IP, a franchise or a book. And they were like, this is the only original thing. And they were like, if we take, if we don't do, like, if we, like, what are we in this business for? If we move this, you know what I mean? Yeah. Like, it's, we're giving it, you know, we're kind of like giving up. And, and so I totally agree with that.

And it felt really weird after the meeting to be outside and going, how did it come to this? When I was a kid, every week was an original film, you know, and that's the reason we have all these franchises. It's because of those movies. A lot of them. Yeah, every filmmaker we started out by talking about, whether it's Cameron, with Terminator. Raiders, which is a blend of different kind of things. I mean, Star Wars, these are inspired by other things, but they are big swings, the Matrix. These are big swings. And if we don't have these original big swings, we're not going to have the next generation of IP to talk about. So,

congratulations on this one, man. I really dug it. I love seeing John David. I'm obsessed with Alison Janney in this film. Next time we'll chat about her. I need an action figure or something. She's amazing. I do encourage everybody to check out this film. And as I said, You're really killing it, man, as a filmmaker. And I hope to see more original ideas from you in the future and more chats to come. Thanks, man. Thank you. And so ends another edition of Happy, Sad, Confused. Remember to review, rate, and subscribe to this show on iTunes or wherever you get your podcasts.

I'm a big podcast person. I'm Daisy Ridley, and I definitely wasn't pressured to do this by Josh. Hey, Michael. Hey, Tom. You want to tell him? Or you want me to tell him? No, no, no. I got this.

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We got monumental news. We got snack-tacular news. After a brief hiatus, my good friend, Michael Ian Black, and I are coming back. My good friend, Tom Kavanaugh and I are coming back to do what we do best. What we were put on this earth to do. To pick a snack. To eat a snack. And to raise.

A Snack. Mentifically? Emotionally? Spiritually. Mates is back. Mike and Tom eat snacks. Is back. A podcast for anyone with a mouth.

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