Happy Sad Confused - Hasan Minhaj, Zoe Lister-Jones & Adam Pally

Episode Date: May 31, 2017

Hasan Minhaj admits he’s feeling a little sleepy, but you would too if you had as much as he’s got going on. This week on “Happy Sad Confused,” the “Daily Show” correspondent dissects his huge moment delivering the big speech at the recent White House Correspondents’ dinner, revealing his contingency plan if the president had shown up and why the room was so tough.   Minhaj also describes what went into making his first comedy special, “Homecoming King” (now on Netflix), why he’s ashamed of one pivotal decision in his relationship with his father, and that time Amy Schumer introduced him to Madonna.   Also joining Josh this week are the writer/director/star of “Band Aid,” Zoe Lister-Jones, and her leading man, Adam Pally. The duo compare bar/bat mitzvah stories and describe what it was like working with an all-female crew on the Sundance hit, which comes to theaters this Friday. Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

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But still, it's the right thing to do. So get options based on your needs with Progressives Name Your Price Tool. Progressive Casualty Insurance Company affiliates and third-party insurers, comparison rates not available in all states or situations, This price is very based on how you buy. This week on Happy, Sad Confused, Zoe Lister Jones and Adam Pally ditched the dudes for their new film Band-Aid, and Hassan Minaj goes home for his first stand-up special. Hey guys, I'm Josh Horowitz. Happy Post-Memorial Day, Sammy.

Thank you. We've survived. Yeah, thank God. It was really stressful. Everybody knows this is always a dicey holiday to get through. Yeah, I didn't know that you had such... All those hot dogs and hamburgers. You had such a fear of Memorial Day.

I'm glad you made it through. I just fear everything. Yeah. Memorial Day is just a thing. There's sunlight involved. Well, there wasn't that much. No, lucky for you. Lucky for you.

I could stay in my cave and watch Twin Peaks reruns. Mm-hmm. Did you bring, now that it's Memorial Day and you can wear white, are you now wearing your full white outfit that you wore to the Baywatch premiere? To the... I thought I'm going to say to Diddy's party? Does Did he still do his famous, like, all-white? Hampton's party? Because I didn't get the invite this year. We keep it quiet from you. We do. But it's a fun time. Yeah, it's great. I still do

have the all-white outfit. It's sitting in my office that has not been laundered yet. So you might not want to go into my... So it's like yellow now. It's yellow right after the event because I was just pee right through the outfit at the end of an event. Which people don't realize is how you get your strength. Yeah. No, it's how I cement the evening. It's like I did a good job. I don't have to go to a bathroom. This is my bathroom. And the Rock just looked at you and shook his head. Like, come on, man.

Oh, no, we've made people turn off the podcast already. No, it was all in jest. It was a really funny one. Some good stuff today. A little bit later on the great comic talent that is Hassan Minaj. You know him, of course, from the Daily Show where he's a correspondent. You may know him from his recent White House Correspondence Dinner or his new stand-up special, which is great. We're going to talk about it length later.

It's called Homecoming King. You should check it out on Netflix. He's also performing this weekend at Cluster Fest. in San Francisco. So a lot of ways to enjoy Hassan, a very funny, thoughtful guy. That's coming up a little bit later in the show. But first up is a couple of folks that I really want to bring in ever since I saw their film back at Sundance. I saw this one called Band-Aid, which I probably mentioned to you at the time because it was one of the ones, you know, I see a lot of films at Sundance and it's hard to break through.

And this one, you know, on paper, I'm like, okay, is this going to work, whatever? It's kind of like, it was like a relationship dromedy with some people I like. But you just never know. And I was really touched by it and thought it was very sweet and funny. And it comes from the mind of Zoe Lister Jones, who is a great and talented actress and writer and now director. She directed this new film and stars in it alongside Adam Pally, who's, you know probably from happy endings, a thousand different TV shows, a very funny guy in his own right, big improv guy. Yeah, I was going to say, Improv extraordinaire. Adam Pallie, big UCB guy.

Exactly. So these guys collaborated for. this film. And Band-Aid's interesting on a number of levels. And frankly, when I saw it, I didn't know kind of the backstory of it, and the backstory just makes it more interesting. So in terms of what the film is about, you should just know that it's kind of a relationship drama, as I said, where Zoe and Adam play a couple, kind of going through some issues in their relationship. And they decide to kind of channel their frustrations and their issues into song. And they start kind of a group and start writing about the issues they're having.

Fred Armisen joins the band as the drummer. And it can sound a little, you know, precious and twee or maybe something like that. But it just works. And believe me, I have like a BS meter that's pretty strong. I was going to say, you don't do precious. Yeah. But I found it to be a really great film. And it opens this Friday, limited release.

So check it out. Look out for it. I'm sure it's going to be on demand soon as well. And, well, the interesting backstory that we get into in this conversation is that this was an all female crew. That's awesome. Yeah,

it's pretty interesting. And just, you know, the particular reasons for that and the particular outcome of that are discussed in this conversation as well as the film itself. So, you know, it's an interesting film on a number of levels. So I was thrilled to have Bo Zoe in here and Adam to talk about that. And like I said, you guys should check out this film because it's a small one in the big summer of the Baywatchers

and Transformers, and it's got a lot of competition out there, but look out for it because it's a special one. So I guess we're- We love a special summer movie. Exactly. A little special movie. Yeah, we go from Alien Covenant to little Indies that could. Cover every, yeah, just stand-up specials. We're not snobs here.

We like the good, bad, and the ugly. We appreciate all of it on any number of levels. So, yeah, so that's the first conversation. As I said, stick through this one because we've also got the very funny Hassan Minaj on the other side. But for now, enjoy Zoe Wister Jones and Adam Pally talking. And Adam Pally. I remember

Sammy. It was a dramatic pause. Yeah. It just was, I was echoing you. Oh, okay. Got it. You get two Adam Pallies. Adam Palley. Enjoy this chat and go check out Band-Aid this Friday. Welcome to the show, Zoe.

I'll hail the Supreme Leader, Donald. Yes. For listeners of the podcast, you know I'm a huge Donald Trump supporter, make America great again, make podcasts great again. And I'm glad that I have two like-minded individuals today. Yeah. Yeah. Because enough of this like media elite kind of just... It's such a witch hunt. I know. Never has there been a witch hunt. I don't know if you've heard. In history. But enough about politics. Yeah. Let's talk art, guys. Okay. I'm a big fan of your movie. Oh, thank you. Congratulations. Because honestly, this podcast, you know, it's a once-a-week affair, so I can be like super choosy

and I usually have the people that like I've done a thousand interviews with I've never interviewed either of you before This is this is based solely on merit of the project I'm just I love this movie I saw it at Sundance and I'm thrilled it's finally getting out to the world Yeah we are too

In fact I remember you I was at that fun little party you guys had where you performed at Sundance That was nice bonus It was yeah It was so scary Really? I think both Adam I were, I think we both literally shit our pants, but also figuratively shit our pants.

We both ran and took shit after. Yeah. It was, it's no wrecking. I mean, you know, like, all actors want to be rock stars until the moment where you have to, like, go out and play the music. And you're like, oh, I'm not equipped for this at all. This is not my job. I was pretending.

Except for Fred. Except for Fred. Fred was just like. Cool as a cute number. Yeah. Well, he is both a rock star and a musician, so it was fine. But we were nervous. So had you ever performed publicly before outside of the set?

For context, just to give a sense of this film. What's the spiel? What's the elevator pitch in this film? You know this better than me. It's the story of a couple who can't stop fighting, so they decide to turn all their fights into songs and start a band. Right. And Fred Armisen plays our neighbor who joins the band as a drummer.

Sex addicts slash drummer. Yes. And Zoe, of course, is a writer, director, star, gaffer, best boy, best girl, et cetera. No gaffing. No gaffing. But we did have some great female gaffers. There were some gaffes. Oh, wow.

I feel like you've done this before. Am I? I don't know. It just seems so natural. What was the biggest gaff on set, Adam? Well, just like some lunch orders were screwed up sometimes. That was a gaff. Yeah, that was hilarious.

That was the craziest day on set. There were some gaffaws, too. Yeah, a lot of gaffaws. Super gaffos. You guys, I was telling Adam, we're all born and bred New Yorkers, I know. Where were you raised? I was raised on the main streets of the Upper West Side. Wow.

The tough, yeah. The Zabar's baby. Pretty rough out there. What years are, what? I'm a little older than you guys. I'm 41. Okay. Spirit of 76.

That's when I was born. All right. Nice. You guys I know are both, what's, what's 82? What's, the year of E.T. Congratulations. Is that what we are? Is that what we are?

We're officially ETs. I'm, I think that adds up. Yeah. Yeah. So did you guys frequent the same stomping grounds? Did you go the same bar mitzvvahs, about mitzvahs, did you... No, Zoe was

Zoe's Brooklyn. Yeah. So, totally different thing. Umdi, Brooklyn and Adam Stytown. Yeah, so we had very different. I had Jewish friends and Zoe, Zoe, Zoe had Jewish friends and Zoe, Zoe had Jewish friends, but then she also had, like, other people in the world. I was, I was, I only thought, I thought Jews only existed to, like, go to Chicago.

You went to actual, didn't you go to Yeshiva? I did. I went to Salmon Schechter. That's why. I went to public school Me too I was never bar mitzvah Were you bat mitzvah?

I was bought mitzvah I was raised like pretty I was raised going to a synagogue every Saturday Wow that's yeah that's similar me But it was like a new age synagogue with like you know Chimes

Female rabbi There were no chimes We had no music No music No music No that's some like reform bullshit That's the best part of me Music is the best part of the whole thing

Melodies are solid I know I know No we just had like a lot of we had gender neutral god language oh that's cool yeah so that was cool i like that all right yeah and uh did you have uh what was the bat mitzvah like for you was anything special is it a memorable i had a shaved head so becoming a woman had a different meaning um i think a lot of people were confused about my gender at that age so i think the bat mitzvah solidified some things for me that were helpful right um you know i i thought my tora portion was pretty on point

A plus. You want to redo it right now just to show off for the audience? No. No, but Adam, do you want to? You know her portion of the Torah. I don't, but I could probably

fake the cadence of it pretty well. Did you also have... Dan, dan, dan, tan, dan, dan, dan, dan, dan, dan, dan, dan. It all sounds like a John Williams theme for a bad guy.

Sound you hear is everybody listening to the podcast Turning down the volume Massively They're like, Jews are on the microphones Yeah Switch, switch podcasts Oh, I think they can tell that Jews are on the microphone

Yeah, yeah, you can feel it There's a nasal energy in here Oh, you guys Do you also have a shaved head For your Marmitsa? No, but I was rebellious as well I mean, I had long hair I like grew my hair

Especially in Schecter I like was kind of a bit of a rage A rage kid so I had long hair And I was in a band And sometimes I would put my hair, like, back before it was cool to do it. And, like, girls, like, I would, like, not a headband, but, like, you know, those, like, one rope strings, you know what I'm talking about? Yeah.

That, like, Steve Nash wears now, which is, like, cool. But when I was 13, there was no Steve Nash. So, it was just, like, the fuck is that could do it? Yeah, yeah. So I had a bit of a rebellious streak to me as well. I just learned Adam had an eyebrow piercing in his youth. I did, yeah. You were on the edge.

I am on the edge. I am. Still are? I still am. Yeah, I probably one of them more. wild jews around i would say when you say like as far as like as far as jews go yeah he's pretty wild is that what you're looking for in this in this role when you were casting you're looking for the wildest jew around i was looking for the wildest jew around and there's really none

other than you google wild jew just his face just comes up yeah yeah yeah no google just immediately reroutes you to like a trump website yeah my whole online presence is an act uh yeah no i but but the characters were Jewish, so, you know, I did, I did need a Jew. So, so. And I'm the seventh most famous Jew named Adam in Hollywood. Yeah. So it was easy, it was an easy choice. Sure, sure. So did you know each other at all, or was this totally just blind? It wasn't exactly a blind date, but it was like we were acquaintances. Right. Friends of Friends kind of thing. We had, yeah, we had mutual friends. We had met at like a party or two, and, and I'd always admired Adam's work. And, and, and And so it just, I didn't write it with him in mind, but after it was done, I was like, oh, that's the person that should be in this.

Totally. And I had admired Joey's work from afar for a long time, going back to her early stuff with John Glazer, who's a hero of mine. Delocated. And so I was always a fan, and we hung out a couple times, and then she asked me in her movie. And I was telling someone earlier, it changed my life for sure. Aw. Really? Yeah.

Let's get into it. Why? How? Well, it was made not just, not just Zoe's filmmaking, but it was made by. No, but mostly. Yeah, no, of course. I've never worked with a director like that. Thank you.

What a visionary. Yeah. But not just that. But she made it with like 100% women besides me and Fred and cast members. Right. And I had never had an experience like that. And it was certainly eye-opening to the way that. I both act on set and have been treated on set and treat other people on set.

And it, for sure, changed the way I look at every single interaction that I have in my life. So what was the energy different for you? How can you explain what the difference was beyond? Well, I think that there's a difference between men and women in the workplace, especially in an area like movie making. men can be less inquisitive sometimes and less they act impetuously, you know, because there's no fear of repercussion for a man. Even if you want to talk about like losing, the base fear of like losing my job, it all

boils down to this like caveman sense of like, what's the worst that's going to have? Is he going to fight me? Is this person going to fight me? Like that's how men really think. So they're like, yeah, I'll chime in. A sound guy will be like, you know what you should do? Play it's sad. And you're like, thanks, sound guy.

And you brush it away because you're like, well, I guess the sound guy told me to do that, but it's no big deal. I got a note for you. Never, never, ever would a sound woman, like, think that that's okay. Right. Because they have been in a position where they have to filter an idea through so many different things because they're already a woman. And not that it's good or bad, not to voice your opinion. But when you're making a movie, everything's going really quickly. Everybody has to be focused on what they're doing.

Sure. And we, I feel like women, especially when they're surrounded by other really strong, supportive, hardworking women, they do their jobs in a different way, in a way that I prefer. So for you, Zoe, when did this idea, this thought enter? This is your first directing effort though, it should be noted. You've co-written and been a very huge creative part of several films that you've done in 10 with your husband. Was this something part and parcel with the idea or once kind of like you were like, okay, it's time to staff up, hey, you know, it would be an interesting way to do this. Yeah, I get to ask this question a lot.

I don't know the exact moment that I decided to hire all women, but I feel like it's just been a long time coming. I was raised by a feminist who I think instilled a lot of these values in me from a young age. So I think it was just kind of like cellular in a way that I was just like, oh, this is obviously what I would do if I were to make a movie and be able to make these decisions produced serially. And I think I had been on enough sets both behind the camera and in front of the camera where I was not only aware of the underrepresentation of women on Cruise, but also of the ways in which I think women have to shift their behavior, kind of like what Adam was saying. when working with men. Not all men, but I think that there's just a different way, especially when you're in the minority, in the workplace, that you are allowed to sort of take up space.

And so I think more than anything, I just wanted to create an environment where everyone felt like they could be like their most confident and comfortable self. This is Hathi Sack Infused. We'll be right back after this. American Giant is the leading manufacturer of American-made clothing. When you choose American Giant, you are saying yes to clothes made under the highest standards,

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I mean, the director is, you know, the captain of the ship and has to sort of like make the final call. And, you know, this is your vision. You obviously wrote it. But are those kind of like instincts of having been on many sets where you have to kind of like, I mean, obviously you can still be collaborative as a director. But there's a different dynamic. No, I'm not collaborative as a director.

Adam can't tell. He's, yeah. No, not at all. You're not making eye contact. You do your job. You do your job, you do it right. Was that okay, me? Mr. Jones. No, don't ask okay.

And don't look at me. Don't call her Mr. Listery Jones. Definitely don't do that. I said, Ms. I thought. No, you did not. No, you did not. I just got scared. Sorry, go ahead.

No, but I guess my question is, did that role come naturally or are kind of like the preconceived notions about women on set, like what we were just talking about? Or do you kind of have to shake that off in terms of being, you know, I feel like, as Adam was saying, the guy just kind of naturally is the alpha male and he'll be like, yeah, fuck it. This is what we're doing now. I don't even think guys need to be the alpha. I think the beta, the omega, all men. I think most men are comfortable voicing their opinion. Yeah. And even shy, like quote unquote, like shy men still will tell you, you know, what they think in a situation without any hesitation. of what Zoe was saying was like taking up space and I think that that's a real unfortunate

obstacle for women to overcome in a creative workplace so it was nice to not have any of that as a thought ever or at least it didn't feel like it for me that I felt I was getting I felt I was getting every woman's you know best self

in a way yeah yeah I mean I think I had been as you mentioned working on films for many years and so it felt like the natural next step to direct. Is that what you were asking me?

I guess so. If it was like a natural instinct. I do like to tell people what to do and I like to have a lot of control. But no, I mean, I think that what was cool about this film and what was one of my greatest intentions in making it was actually focusing on the collaborative effort. because I do think that, and part of that had to do with working with women.

I think women, like, in community, are really beautiful collaborators. And I think that speaks to kind of what Adam was saying, too, is that there's just a sense of always being aware of what's in your periphery rather than being really just focused on the task at hand. I think there's an anticipation of other people's needs that is not only super effective on a film set, but also just like a really beautiful way to work in community. Let's talk a little bit about some of the actual themes of the film.

And when I was watching it again recently, you know, it's a film in some ways, like it's about like brutal honesty, right? About like sort of saying the things that maybe go unsaid in a relationship and about channeling that into art, which, I mean, is that something that you guys have both found therapeutic and a good, a way of being for your own careers and own lives to kind of channel pain and angst into whatever you're working on or into a new endeavor, or is it best to kind of compartmentalize and keep it separate, you think?

Well, I, the first film that I made with my husband was called Breaking Upwards, and it was based loosely on an open relationship we were in. So that was, like, definitely the first option of just, like, putting all of your life into your art, which is also terrifying because then you kind of open up a lot of harrowing questions to the public. And so I think, I mean, I think that that, though, did actually help us work through a lot of the issues that we were processing in our personal lives together and apart. But then as an actor separately, I feel like I'm always kind of using the things that I'm

struggling with in life to fuel my work. And obviously, as a writer, I don't think, I think it's impossible not to sort of channel certain questions that you're navigating into the work. Are you going to say something on you? No, no. I think I was going to answer your question differently. I think all marriages and relationships are different. You know, in my relationship, we have, we do different things.

there is a certain compartmentalization of like what each of us do and how we how we operate within our relationship and and we have like common common interest in things that we do to to soothe arguments and stuff like this that don't necessarily they aren't like art necessarily that you could hang on a wall but they are part of our you know kind of tapestry of our our marriage so I I think it's different. I think it's different for everybody. Are you talking about quilting? I am, I'm talking about specifically tapestry.

Yeah. You do a quilt for every argument that you do. Yeah, yeah. And then, and then we have makeup sex and come all over it. Yeah. And then we burn them. And then we burn them. No, we, we, I think we use comedy in our, in my marriage, we use comedy, I think, to get through any.

Diffuse the. Not even diffuse. We just will, our fights tend to be like direct hits with comedy. It's like more like a roast battle. and but I think that because we're both kind of have that we that's what we love about each other is kind of like black comedic soul that it it it helps us do similar to this to the couple in the movie the way they write songs that's what they do it's like we we tend to like write a bunch of jokes and then spit them out at each other about what's going on in our marriage yet are you

both equally of the two of you equally adept and comfortable acting while naked or semi-naked I was not. Zoe seemed to be and should be. I was not. I have never acted that naked in my life. I've never done scenes that long with my shirt off, nor could I imagine anyone would want to watch it. We did a seven-minute take where we were both naked to begin with and then Adam kept his shirt off and I kept my pants off for the entire seven minutes. But I will say that having an all-female crew as a woman being naked and doing sex scenes was a game changer. It was pretty awesome. So I think that that is, that what my sense of comfort definitely like was enhanced. But for you, Adam, did you feel constantly judged? Did you feel?

No, I didn't. I felt very comfortable naked around 50 women. This feels right. It did. You know, honestly, it did. and I think it goes it goes back to making a movie

with women where men are like you're even asking the question about it right now not a single woman has brought this scene up to me

but your little fucking horny jume is like ooh they were naked oh what's that like oh do you pop a boner oh like every woman And every woman is just like, that's a beautiful scene.

That is how we fight. Oh, my God, that is how people fight. Every man is like, oh! So even there, in that, is it another example of why with all the women around, even though you're like literally starting some of the scenes with the camera like underneath my nutsack. That was B-Camp. And it's not like that type of scene either. It's like a hard, it's like a hard breakup scene.

Yeah, yeah. You, you know, it didn't, like what Zoe was saying, everybody's, like, kind of focus on doing the job and also everyone's mindfulness peripherally, let it be like, you know, it just felt kind of easier, I would assume, than, you know, having your stuff out in front of a bunch of judgeful grips. Right, right.

You know, smoking vapes, puffing clouds. I do think also just as a woman on set, Whether or not you're naked, you're just, you're aware of your objectification, you know. Sure. So I think that that is such a crazily different experience to not ever think about that. Right. In any context. I did.

There were days where I enjoyed being the object of 40 women's affection. Sure. For sure. For sure. Where, because it was so, I was so nice and I was getting, I was just getting such love and attention from. 50 women in 50 different ways. It was like a great, it was a dream. It was a dream.

For the record, I wasn't going to ask about the boner. It's okay. And yes. And no. Yes and no. I mean, I was thinking about it, but I wasn't going to be so rude to actually ask. Who said that Nicholas Cage or someone was like, don't be upset if it does. Right, right.

Classic Cage. I think they also then stopped the scene and Jennifer Connolly was like, he's inside. I think maybe you mentioned this at Sundance, Adam. I mean, in reference to kind of like, you know, again, the differences in male, female directors and opportunities that come, you know, the Sundance, you know, we've seen the story a lot in recent years where Sundance Wonderkin, you know, out of nowhere, directs a film, generally a male director, and then they get like a hundred million dollar budget to do something crazy ginormous with robots or dinosaurs.

So I am curious in the wake of this, this film which has gotten a great reception, and people really dig it. Not to say even you want to do that. I don't know if you do. I do. Okay. Transformer 7.

But like have you at least, do you get in those meetings now? Are there, or are you noticing that? No, in fact, I don't, I'm not getting that same kind of attention that maybe a male director would. I think having a film at Sundance inevitably leads to the sort of water bottle tour where you go and take a lot of meetings and people are like, what's next? Do you have another script? Do you have this? And having not ever been a man, except just briefly, I don't know how those differ for men in those rooms.

I just know that in a lot of those meetings, I'm asked to bring a lot to the time. table before that conversation goes like further. Whereas I think that in my understanding of what has happened so many times in the past few years with a lot of these male indie directors who have made pretty small films and then these huge risks are taken on them to take on, as you mentioned, like huge franchises. I don't see those risks being taken on women really ever. And even now, you know, I'm in talks to direct a film that's, you know, larger in budget, and there's so many questions about making that jump. And I, and I, I don't know, I guess I thought that we were, I keep, I keep thinking that we're in a different space because the dialogue

around gender inequity in our industry keeps growing. Sure. But we're not. And, and I think, like they're I think part of why I hired an all female crew was because of that was because like we can all talk about it and say that it's unfair and we need to make changes but you know in order to make the changes you really have to fucking make them and and that's the hardest part is that people are so habitually just like making these decisions that I think do favor one gender yeah I think it's so ingrained I think it's so society ingrained in our society it's not it's no one's fault like even we were doing EPK for the movie the other day which is where the studio sends someone to ask you questions that go on the DVD that are informative and like

they're asking normal questions us and then boom first question of Zoe right away is producer director actor star you must be exhausted and I was like Zoe do not answer that fucking do not answer that fucking question because could you imagine them doing that to Quentin Tarantino you must be pretty much oh my god producer writer A bit of an actor, not much, but still. You must be exhausted, Quentin. Like, that is a, and was asked by a woman, written by a woman. Right.

And I don't think she even understood why I was upset. Like, I think she was like, what, I'm being nice to the woman. Yeah. I'm a woman being nice to the woman. You're like, you wrote that question because you didn't even realize that you were like, this poor woman must be so tired. And even you now, you're, like, you can't, even asking a woman, are you tired?

It's like, the fuck is that? Are you tired? Oh my God, it must be exhausting just carrying around those two tips all day. And to direct? I just like, I did not get it. And that was from the studios EPK. So I can only imagine what those water bottle tours

have been like when they're asking franchise questions. When a dude walks in, they're probably like, you like Star Wars? Because I fucking love Star Wars. And they're like, dude, you should direct the next Star Wars. It's like, I should direct the next Star Wars. Like, let's do it. Yeah, and I think what's interesting,

and it goes back to kind of like how much space we are conditioned to permit ourselves to take up. Right. According to our genders, like, when I heard about, like, the way that Colin Trevereaux kind of, like, got Star Wars, it was that he, like, came in and was just like, this is garbage. This is an all hearsay.

But, like, basically, like, this script is garbage. I can make it this, this, and this, and this, and this. And that is the exact approach that I think has come up so many times in this conversation that, like, I think the idea, and I have been called an ambitious woman by people in this industry, which is, it's a dirty word. Garbage. And I've never heard a man be called ambitious. And I do think that we're a woman to come in and say this script is garbage, here's what I would do.

They would never get the job. And I think that that double standard is. difficult, even as a woman talking about a double standard, I feel afraid for future opportunities because I think that like, you know, the more kind of that women raise their voices around these issues, the more

endangered that they might go. She's going to be a headache. This one. Yeah, yeah. Yeah. She can't take a joke. Yeah, it's like, we'll hire Zoe, but she's going to yap her fucking mouth about women. And then she's going to need the nap after she directs all day. We'll give her a franchise, but it's Wonder Woman.

Well, I'm glad we had this kind of conversation, but I also do want to mention, like, just, you know, we haven't even talked a lot about the substance of the film, but we did a bit. But at the core, the most important thing people should know is to see the movie because the movie itself is great. And it's super funny and super just feels authentic and real and the music's great. And I just kind of fell for this from the start. So I'm thrilled both of you guys came in today to talk about it. Congratulations. Everybody go check out Band-Aid. And we'll see you guys on the next one.

Thank you so much. Thanks for stopping by. Once again, that was Zoe Lister Jones and Adam Pally. Remember to check out Band-Aid when it's in theaters this Friday. Moving on, we've got a really talented gentleman by the name of Hassan Minaj. We've all seen Hassan by now on the daily show. He was the last hire, actually, the last correspondent. I was going to say he's the link between two eras.

And now is, of course, one of the most prominent voices and faces on Trevor Noah's incarnation of the show. Super talented guy who, you know, I've known for years in a funny way. He was part of kind of like a pilot thing I wrote and created a couple years back. And I met him before he was on the Daily Show. And then all of a sudden I see like, this guy, this guy I worked with. He did. The next big thing. So it's been really cool to kind of chart his progress and his growth.

And he's certainly having a lot of cool things happening for him now and deservedly so. He, just like I guess a month or so ago, he, of course, was an emcee, I guess, or the keynote. I don't know what the official thing is. But he was the guy at the White House Correspondence dinner. Which is just unbelievable. Which was a tough challenge because this was, of course, like the first one, at least in many years, if not ever, that didn't feature the president for a variety of reasons. I think the last one was Reagan was. Is that true?

Reagan took a. He was shot. Okay, we can excuse that. Yeah, excused absence. Yeah, exactly. You don't need a doctor's note for that. And so he had a tough challenge, but he did a great job with it. And it just so happens that he has a lot of things going on at once now between Carspons dinner and a really great stand-up special.

His first, like, full stand-up special, which is available on Netflix now. It's called Homecoming King. And it really details his life growing up in Davis, California, being the son of immigrants, and just sort of confronting. you know, the things we all grow up confronting in addition to sort of having this culture clash of being the son of immigrants. And he's just, he's an interesting stand-up in that he's like not like, you know, rat-rat-tat-tat joke like a thousand miles a minute. He's just got his own pace and a real empathy and thoughtfulness to his humor that I really enjoy. And the stand-up special is great. It honestly is. It's really well done, well-directed, well-produced, and also just

very smart and funny. So I can't endorse it highly enough. It's on Netflix right now. And as I said a while back, he's doing a lot of stand-up too. He continues to, and he's going to be at Cluster Fest this weekend in San Francisco. So if there are tickets available and you're in the area, check it out because that's an insane lineup of people, including Hassan and Jerry Seinfeld and every other huge comic known to man. Yeah, pretty good. Yeah. So yeah, so exciting to have Hassan on the show today. I hope you guys enjoy it. And as I said, enjoy Daily Show, enjoy Homecoming King. And if you haven't checked out the correspondence dinner thing, it's on YouTube. It's waiting for you.

Yeah, what are you doing? Come on, guys. Just Google it. Why are we lecturing our audience? Just do it. They already did it. They're good. They're smart people.

Here's us on. So we're talking about. Rough Night, the big feature film that Hassan stars in alongside Scarlett Johansson. It's basically Scarlett and Hassan. For like 20 seconds. Come on, man. What are you talking about? It's a big deal, man. It's good. It's a funny movie. It's a cool being in a little studio thing with really talented people. It's like, it has like a Wu-Tang Clan cast. Right. Everybody's in. Very eclectic and super funny. Have you seen it yet? I have not seen it. Okay, I've got one over on you. Yeah. But, well, first, welcome to our podcast digs. It's good to see you, man.

Thank you for having me. You've got a lot going on. You're having what we call a moment. Do you feel the moment? I feel very sleepy. That's a good sign. That means... No, it feels really good. You know what's so cool is just with everything, just really pouring, like, your heart and your soul into, like, a lot of the projects,

really, like, just, even behind the scenes, like, really fighting for stuff. And then, like, people seeing it and being, like, I loved how you did A, B, and C. Yeah. And you just killed yourself for those things. You know, sometimes you work on. something and you'll obsess about a detail in a project and nobody will ever notice. Sure. It's so cool when people are noticing those exact things.

Well, yeah, and it's like, you know, like every other, like, artists I know, like, that achieves some level of success. You go through years where people really aren't necessarily paying as much attention as you would hope. And then, like, to have it all kind of feel like all of a sudden where it's like, bam, the homecoming king, which obviously has been a labor of love for years. But, like, then overnight. I talk about the timing of it.

Like, those are things like, I could have, I could have never written that. Right. But people were like. This wasn't a calculated plan in your journal. Yeah, people were like, oh, it's all working out. And I'm like, no, I mean, the story behind both those things was like, it's all coincidence. And it just happened to line up that way. Well, let's, I want to talk about all of it.

But I want to talk about a couple things. Because two of the recent times I've seen you perform, one in person and one on television was, of course, Correspondent or was one gig that you killed. and it's a tough, that's a tough gig, man. So congratulations on coming out of it alive and doing a great job with it. And also, you're talking about this one. Yes, you remember this? Yeah.

The last time I saw you in person was the day after the election. NRDC. NRDC. My wife is a big wig over there, so I was working it on their behalf. And this is a great environmental organization that, like, the rest of the planet, I had assumed the election was going to probably go a different way. Yeah. And there was this great benefit that you were one of, like, the headliners on.

and son John Oliver and Seth Myers. Right, right. And that was a weird room. That was a weird day. Everybody, it was like the room was in a state of morning. NRDC is this organization that fights for obviously climate change initiatives. And Donald Trump is just one. So it's like everything that we were in that room collectively were fighting for was just like was thrown out the window or that was the feeling.

What did it feel like in the audience? What was it like in the audience? Well, you know, I felt different, you know, I come from a different perspective than most of those people were like, you know, those are the kind of the big donor kind of people that aren't necessarily like consuming entertainment and media like I am. So like, if anything, I was empathizing with you guys who were like, how do you make something out of this moment? And you more than any of the other performers, honestly, I felt like, and something I noticed

even in watching Homecoming King, you kind of embraced like, you know, I don't need to go for the laugh. Let's just like have a moment and talk openly about the shit. It was so bizarre, man. And it's like, the night, also, it was just really hard for me, and I was talking to Jen about this. I almost was like, I don't know what to, I don't think I should show up because I don't have a set. Yeah. Because a lot of the stuff that I was talking about was kind of kitsy and funny.

It's like, Trump's like this, Bernie's like this, Hillary's like this. And then it would all sort of would have closed with, but sanity ruled over insanity and Hillary's our president. Right. That, the following day, it's like my mom is overseas visiting my grandma. She's calling me, like, what is happening stateside? So I'm dealing with that. Like, I'm the eldest of my family. So I'm dealing with all that stuff of, like, all right, we got to get mom back in the States.

Like, and just, like, obviously at the show, everybody at the daily show was just, like, depressed. Sure. Yeah. So I didn't really have a set, per se. So all you have is to go on your gut and be honest, I guess, in that moment. right and just speaking the heart yeah i felt bad because set brought me up and then i did my thing and then i was like that's all i have good night and then seth had to get up there actually people have been relatively like yeah people have been complimentary about it which that was that was

i was very surprised by that so what do you you know because that's a tough room and correspondence dinner that's a tough room too have you been to the dinner before i went the year before to larries uh yeah how was that it was it was amazing i mean it was it was it's it's it's it's it's It's, you know. Obama's last year. I heard he eviscerated. He totally did. You know, he dropped the mic, literally. And it was an amazing, and it was such a different. It feels like a night and day world. It was a different world. Yeah. And it's, you know, and like you had a much different kind of an audience, like, frankly, because, you know, that year, it was still, it was kind of like the cool thing for the celebs to come out. It's the cast, the scandal. It's everybody. They're all there. Nerd prom. And you had a much different kind of environment. Yeah. And, and I just, I just. It wasn't nerd prom. It was Hunger Games. I was just curious, like, yeah, like, was it, what was that environment like? Was it what you expected it to be?

Did you steal yourself for the room not being receptive or just being cold? Because it played outside of the room. I don't know. Did it play for you in the room? Did it feel like you were doing great? Or do you feel like it was working or not working or what? In the room, I definitely felt like I was getting reactions. I just was thrown by, but I was told by Seth and Stephen and Larry,

places that you think you're getting a laugh, you're going to get groans. So be aware of that. So you're going to make a joke and you're going to get a groan instead of a laugh, even though you've been practicing it and it's been getting laughs. Be aware of that. Be aware that the room is very tight. It's a very strange room. It's a big room. But knowing all of those things and hearing that from them, actually just mentally preparing that, oh, this is going to be a horrible, kind of not an ideal ballroom comedy gig, but all of my comedic prowess will be judged based upon how I do in this. When I embraced that, I was like, okay. and I just sort of fully embraced it and I figured if I

can just keep my foot on the gas and not apologize, I'll be good. Totally. Because I think my closing statement of journalists are the new minorities and then how Donald Trump doesn't care about freedom of speech, those are bipartisan positions and I felt like that kind of unifies the room. I've been roasting

you guys before, but now, hey, now you know what it's like to be me and I can empathize with you and here's how you survive the age of Trump. You've got to think like a minority, you know? It was a way, I think, without explicitly saying it, hey, I'm rooting for you, you know, and vice versa, we're on the same side. And even though the administration thinks you're the enemy of the people, your work is still very necessary. Absolutely. And I think coming at it from that, coming around home

base, with that argument in mind, helped me get the ovation at the end, you know? Were you thinking, obviously, you didn't have our presidents in the room? Yeah. But you probably also knew that he was going to see it or see parts of it, or knowing he's an insane consumer and can't avoid any mention of himself. Yeah, I prepared myself for like three scenarios. He shows up. He doesn't show up.

And then like he burst through the door. Those were like three legitimate scenarios that I thought could happen. He's such a showman. Did you have literally like scenarios like what you're going to do if that happens? Yeah, I had a card called DefCon Orange. It was a list of jokes that in case he came in, you know

and they were all just like ready to go. You have to slide it right in. You have to. You really have to. Anything, I said it on stage. Anything is possible. And I mean that with a negative connotation. Anything is possible.

So what does, do new offers come in kind of as soon as that happens? What is this Hollywood biz talk? I'm just curious because I come for that perspective. You know me. You know, you know what was, this is actually really interesting. And this is actually interesting to talk about. as soon as I finish what was so cool is

you know Don Lemon comes up and is like that was great man everybody Don gets it the worst people give it to Don the worst and then and then maybe we'll flitzer but Don really really gets it he was like that was awesome that was great

Van Jones came up the thing that was kind of like oh no it's not going to get better this was really sad Jeff Zucker came up to me who's the head of CNN and was like great stuff man it was like really great we need to do what you're doing at CNN And I'm like, no, no, no, no, no, no, no. That's not. We don't need that at CNN. We need the news. Remember the jokes? No, no, but the jokes. We need, yeah, that was really cool. Like, people were listening. They were laughing and I need that. I'm like, no. He's like, we've been trying to do that at CNN. No, it says news network. Stick to your guns or whatever their guns are. Whatever the guns are now. Exactly. That was the biggest thing. And then what was really cool was my whole family came out.

you know, like, Jen was there, my mom, my dad, Aisha, my sister, my wife, my brother, my sister-in-law, and they all, like, came up on stage afterwards. That was really, really cool. Yeah. To, like, have that, like, high school graduation moment on stage. It was really nice. And I know, I've heard you talk about this in other interviews. People don't necessarily, they see kind of like the big speech from the comedian often,

but they don't realize, like, Woodward and Bernstein were honored that night. It's just really cool of that. People don't understand the context. People think the White House correspondence dinner is a dinner for the president. they're like oh it's the national roast of the president it's it is not it is an it is an event thrown by the white house correspondent association to honor journalists so they give away scholarships they'll have like a keynote speaker somebody who's done like something significant um and the president shows up as a sign of good faith right to the press and to the public

that hey even i'm willing to take a joke yeah we're at odds sometimes but i recognize the value of what you do and even if you make fun of me tonight you'll do so in a civil manner and it's like a it's cool to the leader of the free world for a moment humbles himself before the press and the nation and it's a really cool tradition and very telling that in that that our president that did not want decided to go for the the masturbatory rally where people can just yeah yeah okay we're going to keep it positive though so okay so So let's talk a little bit, the background, which dovetails, of course, with this great special. So, A Homecoming King, you guys should really check out.

It's on Netflix. I watched it the other day. What did you think? I was super impressed on a number of levels. You see a lot of things, man. I do see a lot of things. And I was impressed on a number of levels. I mean, first, I just, from like a production standpoint, it's an impressively well-done bit of kind of almost theater as much as it is stand-up.

We worked really hard on that. And you've been working on this for years. I'm sure it's evolved in many cases. was, so this is your first special, right? This is my first special, yeah. That's why it means so much. And we spend a lot of time working on it and, you know, getting it. And what you see is sort of the evolved version of what was off-Broadway at the Cherry Lane Theater

and then what was toured around the country. So what, well, I have a number of questions. Talk to me a little bit, like, how did it evolve in the most significant way? How much different, beyond the bells and whistles of it and camera angles and all that, content-wise, has it changed significantly in the last three, four years? Yeah. It's changed quite a bit. At first, you know, because I started working on it three years ago, I wasn't on the daily show. There wasn't the ending. I'm not going to give way the ending, but it didn't have that whole fourth act. So I was working on it with my director, and we were just workshopping. And again, you're adding stories, you're changing stories. You're adding elements to it. You're trying to tinker with the formula. And we didn't really have an ending. We had that scene where, you know, I reconnect with Bethany. But still, there just wasn't... Is that her real name, by the way?

No, I check, come on, man. I'm not going to do that. Yeah, but, but, uh, but, uh, I changed, oh, you obviously changed people's names for their anonymity and stuff like that. But, um, it continued working on it, took it to the Sundance Labs. It evolved even further. Then I coincidentally got hired to join the Daily Show and all that stuff, the closing happened.

Right. Coincidentally around that time too. And that's when I took it to New York and workshoped it more than did it off Broadway toured it. And then that chapter closed. Then we faced the second chapter. How are we going to translate this very intimate storytelling experience to Netflix? How are we going to make it translate to?

Because a lot of times live shows don't translate well. It's never like being there. And I think we needed to make a choice. Me and Christora, the director of the special, was how do we get that intimacy? So we did something that, you know, was going to be. I didn't know if it was going to translate, but he was like, what if we bring the cameras on stage? On stage. You're still performing in front of the audience.

They're going to see it. But you perform to the cameras on stage and a la Birdman will just sort of circle around you. And that way, the audience at home will feel like they were there that night too. And it'll have that same intimacy. I don't even know how many moments there are, but it feel like three or four times where you like suddenly are directly addressing that camera. Yeah. And it works. And they're clearly like well-chosen moments where you're trying to break through. And we story board it to be like, what are those moments where I chose moments in the story because it's such a immigrants narrative in America, but sort of understanding identity in America. Those moments where I'm talking directly to camera, it's almost like it is my confession to America.

Yeah. Or my question. I'm asking thematic things. What is the American dream tax? What is the cost of the American dream? What does it mean to be an immigrant? And it's almost like I'm asking America, those things. So give me a sense, and the audience, a sense that don't know your background in terms of like where you grew up and how you, did you feel, you know, your first generation, immigrant, your parents, your dad was in the picture of the first eight years of your life. Your mom was not around.

It was finishing at school. Mm-hmm. Yeah. Did you feel like, you know, did you fit into a community there? Were there other Indian Americans where you were? No. You know, I grew up in Northern California. Davis is very, very white.

Like, I think like a lot of kids, I was sort of navigating, how do I fit in? Where's my place? And also trying to figure out the family thing. As kids, you're kind of comparing yourself to the way other kids are. I remember being a kid being so envious of, like, other people had brothers and sisters and mom. Like, they all had everybody in one place. They had basically, like, a nuclear household. Yeah.

And I didn't have that. Or even cousins around it and whatever. It's basically you and your dad the first day is your life, right? And so that was tough. And so that informed a lot of what you've seen, Act 1 of the special of me in my relationship, growing up in America and growing up in Davis. And then my dad as an immigrant coming to America being like, okay, I'm the only brown guy at work at my office. I'm this organic chemist. I'm trying to fit in.

And I'm the only brown kid at my school. but we're looking at the world in two very different ways. His cognitive framework is like a lot of immigrants where I won the lottery. So I'm going to put my head down, work as hard as I can. They can call me whatever they want to call me. They can make fun of my accent. But I'm going to get that house in the burbs and I'm going to laugh later. For me, like a kid that was born here, I'm going through the same identity stuff we all went through.

I just want to fit in. I want to get invited to the birthday parties at Chuck Echee. I just want to be a normal kid. And that relationship with your dad is really powerful one of the end. and really informs a lot of, like, the most emotional parts of the story. Yeah. I mean, it's a very, I mean, like, look, you know, I guess the more honest you can be in your comedy or any part of art is the more you can connect with an audience.

Yeah. And it seems like you're going through something. I mean, you've performed this so many times. I don't know how much of it is like just sense memory when you go through it again. You feel it. Well, for the special, I had performed it all over the country, but I had never told the story of my life in Davis in Davis. The special is recorded in my hometown, which is why I wanted to call it Homecoming King

and bring it back there because Davis is dealing with race and identity the same way a lot of our nation, like the way our country is, where it thinks a lot of these things, these things that people oftentimes talk about on TV, racism, acceptance, equality, those are things of the past, not here, not in our town. And so I knew that the energy of the room would be very different bringing it back. and it was. You can see it in the special. There's moments of the show that are very quiet

because it's very real. And, you know, the audience is dealing with that. Like, oh, shit. Like, was I complicit in that? Oh, man, my kids went to that elementary school or that middle school. Were we somehow a part of that? It's kind of heavy in that way.

And a lot of times these discussions happen. The collateral damage in regards to these things has to be like death or murder, really heavy stuff. Right. This is exploring the other 364 days of the year, where it's just every day these microaggressions where we kind of are sometimes afraid of the other. You're listening to Happy, Sad, Confused.

We'll be right back after this. Did it take you some time to kind of be able to confront the uncomfortable moments in life in your stand-up? Homecoming King? I mean, I had like a couple months ago, I had Gerard Carmichael on, who's another stand-up that I admire in that, like, again, he's kind of not afraid to kind of just embrace realness and emotion and not necessarily just go for a joke every 30 seconds. Does it take time to kind of get there where you can feel like you're not beholden to like, I need three jokes a minute. I think it played to my strengths more. I wish I could be like, no, I made a conscious

choice. I was slaying audiences around the country. I got to bring back the comedy. I got to keep it away from them. And I was just like, I got to tame it. I think. And maybe it's what got me on the daily show is that, like, I am more sometimes thoughtful and interesting that I am just laugh out loud, funny. And I think that storytelling and stuff played to my strengths more. And so that's why I wanted to do more of that. Can you talk a little bit about, you know, I alluded to it before, but one of the emotional, most emotional parts of the show is this kind of decision if your dad has suffered a heart attack. Right, right. And you make, you know, again, like a lot of people maybe wouldn't cop to this kind of decision that you made at a pivotal part.

your life where you decided to kind of go back on stage instead of rushing to the hospital. Yeah, I got a, you know, I was living in L.A. at the time, and, you know, in the show I talk about, I kind of had a very contentious relationship with my dad because, again, I wanted to live my life on my own terms, and he wanted to, wanted me to, you know, go to law school and basically become something. And it's really this clash, what it boils down to is this clash between I want to be an individual, an autonomous human being, and he's like, no, you're part of something bigger. Like, you can't just throw away your life.

It affects my life, your mom's life, your sister's life, so on and so forth. So it's like the community versus the individual. And lived at home, lived at home through college, and, you know, really kind of went through this rebellious phase where I'm just like, man, screw this. I'm moving to L.A. I'm living on my own. And my sister was still living at home at the time. She was in high school.

My dad has a heart attack, and she calls me like, you need to come home. and I don't I end up doing a set in L.A. And then I go home and I'm not proud of the decision but I think

it's just a choice I mean it's not it wasn't the right choice I think it was just a thing where you lash out in that moment and yeah what is your

does the show help all familial relationships or does it kind of reopen old wounds in some ways like in some ways yeah like i'm not proud of that like to me i still identify with very strongly with what thing i think is so beautiful about indian culture that i grew up with is like love and reverence for your elders like that's a thing where you just like your your kids are there for their parents this role especially as you get older shifts between as your parents get older you almost become the parent and they become the child and you help take care of them In that moment, my dad is becoming a vulnerable child.

He's being sought open and being put into surgery. And I wasn't there, you know? And I'm disappointed in that. Like, there's nothing I can do to change that. But I think it was just an honest moment. And, yeah. So let's talk a little bit about The Daily Show. So it's funny.

So we first met on another project very briefly, and it was right before the Daily show. Maybe a year before six, I don't even know six months. Yeah, I hadn't been hired yet, yeah. So, like, I feel like I'm a harbinger of goodness, of greatness, because you were, I don't know where you were at, if you were satisfied with your career or not. But clearly, it all started to change after, you got a little bit of the Horowitz magic rubbed on you. I know. So you're welcome.

Thank you, man. It was one of those things where I've always wanted to just say thank you for casting me in that pilot that went straight to private Vimeo link. And it's one of those things, you know, you always try to do everything you can to. just put yourself in the right rooms with the right people right but when you told me this is for internal use only i said sign me up let's not think of the actual audience out there let's just think about us and our 12 closest friends that we'll send this link around to and he said hey look actually execs aren't even going to see it it's actually just disparate scenes in a pitch deck your scenes may or may not make it and i said let me earn your trust i gave you quality time

riffing with the likes of kate mara it was a special day that was really cool you really called in a lot of favors, right? We did. That was a crazy day. Tyrese showed up. Tyrese showed up for 10 seconds. Yeah. So give me a sense, though.

So where were you at, though, between then and Daily Show? Were you? I was doing stand-up, doing Pizza Hut commercials. I was working on a, I was briefly on a sitcom with Raven Simone called State of Georgia. I was working, but it was never anything like the Daily Show. And I'm, again, very lucky to be a part of something like that. a lot of things in show business are not institutions like that. You're on something for a little bit a year, maybe a few years if you're lucky.

You can count on one hand the number of things you can kind of count on. That are there for 10 years or longer? And that are also at the top of the heap that everybody respects and you know it just signals quality. Yeah. And it's both funny and meaningful, which are usually you have to pick one or the other. So was that a room you were trying to get into for a while or was it kind of a random thing? It was always a dream, but again, it seems like a million miles. How do you get there?

Again, also, the cast of the Daily Show, there's only five correspondents at one time. So it's not a performing cast of 15. So you're like, John Oliver has to leave for somebody to come in. Sam B has to leave for somebody else to come in, yeah. So Michael Che had left for me to, you had left to go back to SNL for me to get a chance to audition. And you were basically the last of the hires on John's watch, right? Yeah. Uh-huh.

So when you get that gig, like, do you define your own role, like, once, like, do you hit the ground running in terms of, like, this is where I feel like I can be of service to the show? This is the perspective that I can offer? Is that something that takes time to kind of, like, work with the writers and John and then Trevor or give me a sense of that process? You know, what's interesting is that to get on the show, to write that audition piece, to, like, impress John enough, that that means that that that meant. like affirmed my instincts it was basically do more of that I had to write you know two pieces that I did with John and I was like if I do more of that then we're good and so I just continued to sort of lean into that and John was great he's very you know I would like always go up to him to try to get advice be like hey man so like in front of the audience what do I do

he's always so vague he's just like you're fine he really wants you to figure it out on your own yeah which I think is actually kind of for the better he doesn't do a lot of like stage direction he's just he hires the right people yeah yeah and gives them the space to yeah and he's he really is like believe and trust your instincts yeah who do you think you have worn the most in terms of comedy from like whether from like close proximity or just watching their work over the years um i learned you know about empathy and kindness from john how you can be an incredibly successful great accomplished person and still a kind person at the same time. Those aren't mutually exclusive concepts. And what's been so cool working with Trevor is

you can have a new and different perspective to the quote unquote American perspective and it can work and translate. And two, the second thing I've learned from Trevor is I'm very close to a person with a tremendous amount of pressure and he handles it so well. Like him taking that position It was kind of a thankless gig. Everybody is mad that an American icon is leaving political satire, and then a kid from South Africa is taking his position. No, I confess, I kind of came into it very trepidacious. I mean, like, we all worship John. John is like, you know, again, one of the two or three greats in the last 20 years in terms of redefining comedy and just being like, he was always there for us every night.

Yeah. And then this guy who like, I barely knew. I didn't watch for a little while. And then I've come around to him, I've talked to him a bunch recently, and you're right. He's kind of like the calm, smoothest, most just, he's got a great, like, way about him, not to mention an incredible intellect and sense of humor. Yeah. And that's a good combo to have in that position. But for, to watch him weather the storm and not become bitter or angry or anything like that from it is like super inspiring.

I'm a very emotional person. To see him, he was always so pragmatic. And he's like, I understand. That's okay. Like, really it's okay? Yeah, it's okay. They'll see and they'll understand and we'll all gel and we coming out of the conventions, I could feel it as a whole like group. We were really jelling. Yeah. And that was really cool. So you talk about being emotional. In the, in the crazy few months since the world has changed. Right. Has there been, has it been anger? Has there been, have you gone

through every cycle of emotion? Like where are you at now? I mean, like every day do you like many of us kind of look at Twitter and just prepare yourself for what horror is waiting for us? Yeah, but also the thing that I'm, that working at the show is kind of trained my brain to be this way is what's the bigger picture? Because to me, you can't get caught up in the orange mascot. Really what matters is what's happening on the field. What are the actual policy positions that are in play? Like the real foundational elements of our functioning democracy, those things are going to last

longer than... Yeah, don't get taken in by him going off on Rosie O'Donnell or whatever he's going to do. He's going off by Rosie or holding an orb. So the big thing

that I want to figure out is what are those big stories that were forgetting? Right. Because he's a professional wrestler, so you're trying to keep up with him

is futile. To me, it's using those things and Trevor does it really well in Act 1 headline pieces on the show is use some ridiculous thing that he did as it to get right into

the medicine. go. That's the sugar. You use the orb for a second and get a couple easy laughs there, but then- pivot right into, all right, Jeff Sessions, the war on drugs, boom, and you're like, oh, shit, here we go. Like, this is the real meat. And what's, you know, exciting and maybe kind of encouraging about kind of like the political comedic atmosphere is like, and Daily Show was really the one that kind of found this niche

and Colbert, too, like in terms of like not talking down to an audience and being able to speak like very intelligently and John Oliver does it as well. and kind of like, you know, you can have a thoughtful conversation and deliver jokes at the same time. And I don't know if that was necessarily the case, but even before The Daily Show. Like, it didn't feel like in the political realm. Yeah, I don't know what Kilbourne's iteration was like. I think I was a little too young to understand what his version of the Daily Show was like. Five questions.

It was amusing at the end with celebrities. Oh, really? But it was a different thing. It was a different thing. Got it. So, I mean, in terms of what's the day-to-day at Daily Show? I'm just curious. We get in at 9-15 and we sort of break stories.

There's the four to six biggest stories. And the thing that we try to figure out is what is the take? What is the big thing that we need to dissect and act one and act two respectively? That's it. And so the 9.15 a.m. meetings are some of the best, man. That's where, like, I am riffing and bantering and arguing with some of the smartest people in the world. It just got, I owe so much. Like, it's made me just, like, such a better performer, such a better arguer.

It's made me a lot. It just helped, writer. It's helped me so much. And does Homecoming King and the release of that on Netflix kind of like put a bow on that? This kind of like project that has been so close to your heart for a few years in terms of like, okay, this is the ultimate iteration of that? Or are you doing the cartoon in the movie next? Like the ice show or is this it? This is the best form.

This is the ultimate form of this? This is the, to me this is like, and John gave us this advice where on the show, it kind of ages like bread. Like no one's going to watch an episode of The Daily Show. from like august 11th 2005 right but you can still watch Seinfeld to this day it's like there's nothing better than a Seinfeld rerun that being said there's nothing more palpable and tangible and just like so in the ether and the zeitgeist like an episode of the daily show or SNL when political stuff is really happening you know when there's like just a pulse to where the nation is yeah these shows give you that I wanted to do the the one-man show because it's a narrative

piece that's evergreen. And the, but what was cool is because there's still this undercurrent of identity and it's still kind of political. Like the whole point for me, the question I want to raise through the show is it's not just about like, oh, I couldn't go to prom with someone that I love. It's like all things being equal could 2017 Hassaminaj go to prom with 2017 Bethany Reed? That's the question we have to ask ourselves. And the answer is, I don't know. It's also a marker. As much as it is, I think you're right. I think it's going to age well in terms of the specificity of it, which ironically also grounds it in a certain time, where it kind of talks about like, you know, your generation, your kind of, I know you've

talked about this in terms of like the kids of immigrants, the first generation. I call them third culture kids. Third culture kids. So that we're kind of in between these two worlds. We exist on this hyphen. We're third culture kids. My kids will never have to speak Hindi to communicate to me. I am this I told my I show this I'm like we're the last of this species

because we're the only ones that have to communicate in two different languages to communicate to two different worlds and we can do both and we can slip in between both seamlessly and you see that in the show

I speak in like Hindi and I go back to English and I just go back and forth back and forth and you also can speak face to face to another human being which in the next generation won't be doing that will never happen

they'll put on these this big VR thing Have you read this book called Ready Player 1? I'm so afraid of that. That's what the world's going to be. Movie coming out, Spilberg, right? Do you think it's going to be good? I hope so.

It's Spielberg, man. Got to believe. Do you watch every movie? You have to watch everything, right? I watch everything, but I watch a good portion. Do you watch a lot of movies? No. Really?

I don't see anything. Well, you're a busy guy. I have no idea what's going on. One would argue that you know more about what's going on than me. Here's where I'm out in Game of Thrones. Game of Thrones is they go to a wedding and they all get lit up with arrows. That's the Red Wedding, right? That's a beautiful, yeah.

So that's the last episode I'm at. Okay. A House of Cards. I'm at the episode where they go to the Asian Sex Mansion. Sure. Beyond that, I don't know what else is going on. That's where I stopped. What was that, like 2013, 2014 maybe?

What's the last movie you saw in theaters? The last movie I saw in theaters. Get Out. I loved Get Out. Oh my God, it was so good. So you saw the best of the year. And then I saw, on the plane, I saw Rogue One, but I just stopped. What?

I stopped. Doesn't end well for them. Really? Well, never mind. Was the movie good? No, it's good. It is good. You know, I just lost interest? It's always about, okay, we're the rebels.

There's a ship. We need to blow it up. Every single time? Okay, but I'm saying, and I kind of just ruined it, but like also by the script, don't you think everybody goes off and lives happily ever after? I haven't seen the ending. This is what I'm saying. Halfway through.

So stick with it. You might get some surprises. There's this thing and the thing is in the middle of the... Believe me. You're right. I do see way too many, especially of like the mainstream blockbuster. So I'm desensitized to a lot of them. But there are still surprises.

And Rogue One I would count as a... What's the last mainstream blockbuster? You saw that you go, I got to rewatch that. That to me is a big problem. There's not enough stuff where you go, I got to watch that again. Right. Well, get out I saw again. Get out to a movie like.

But that was not a... It was not... designed to be that. No, that's a $5 million movie. Yeah. Yeah, yeah, yeah. I mean, Logan, I've returned to. It's a good movie. It's a well-told story, you know. I haven't seen Logan. I need to see Logan. So what are your, what are your ambitions in terms of acting? I mentioned that the outset that you're in this very funny movie, A Rough Night with Scarlet and Julian Bell and this amazing ensemble. Do you want to just do more of that? I mean, you, again, Daily shows a full-time gig, so there's only so much time in the day, but... Yeah, I want to continue

doing that, and I want to continue telling, I think, meaningful stories. That, to me, is what... And creating your own stuff? I mean, what's... Do you want to do, like, you know, the eight-episode FX series? Like, is that, like, that kind of a thing? Like, I think just exploring something really, really specific. If you liked Homecoming King, I want to do more stuff like it. It doesn't have to be one-man show. But what I mean by that is, like, something that's unapologetically itself.

Right. That's what I want to do, stuff like that. And even, it doesn't have to have the biggest distribution. It just has to be that. Yeah. Well, you want the, and that's the beauty again of 2017, where you don't necessarily need to, like, play to the $25 million. You can play to, like, the million or two. that get you and not worry about.

What's it like when you have to interview like movie stars and they're doing a big budget like box office movie and the movie's not good? You don't talk about the movie. You just move on. Notice how much time we've spent talking about Homecoming King. That means I like it. Really? That's the dead giveaway. So wait.

For those listening to the podcast, if I spend three minutes on the movie and then like, hey, let's talk about everything else, probably not a good movie. Oh, so when you're just like, okay. See, because I want to be honest. So you're in angry birds. And then you're just like, so what do you eat for breakfast? Exactly. I want to be honest, but I'm honest by omission. I don't want to be like a jerk about it because who wants to be, you know.

How does the movie star, how did the movies? I'm so fascinated by movie stars. Well, you've gotten to Metball. Who did you get? Whose numbers did you get? But I'm not famous. I'm nerd famous. See, being nerdy is kind of like now that's cool now.

Political culture has become popular culture. Right. It's good time. The longest time people were like, no, everything's fine. Obama's president. All is well in the world. And then when things weren't, health care was still a problem, you know, police brutality is still a problem. These were all problems, but things had to go super extreme.

Like, Voldemort had to reemerge. And, like, the death theaters had to pull their mask off. And people have to, like, oh, my God, now we have to, like, really wake up. So it's weird now. Now because, like, people are, like, treating us like we're Zach Ephron. And that's not the case at all. You and Don Lemon are hanging out with Rihanna now. This is the way of the world.

That's what's getting weird. That's just getting super weird. So are you now texting with J-Lo and A-Rod? No, I'm not. But it was so weird at the Mechala. they were like, we saw your speech and then she turned to Aaron and she's like, baby, baby, it's the guy from the speech

and he's like, I loved your speech. It's really cool. Thought forward from Aeron. It was a good guy. I didn't even know who like a lot of the people were. I had to look at the cards and then I like texted like I think Jen like, who's Jessica Chastain?

Oh, she's the best. You should know Jessica Chastain. She's legit. You would like her. Yeah. I was like, I don't know what? That's just cool. Trust me.

I'm like, and then I was like, Amy Adams. Who's Amy Adams? I had to Google while I was at the MacGa, like Amy Adams. Who are you sitting with? Me. I was lucky I got to sit next to Amy Schumer. Best. Rihanna.

The Hadid's, I didn't know which one was which. They were at the table. Kim Kardashian. What? Lil Uzi Vert. Okay. And... When Nelson, the room is laughing at us.

And Madonna. What? Madonna was at your table. Madonna's at my table. You want to hear a cool Madonna story? Yeah. Amy opens for Madonna. She's like, let me go introduce you to Madonna.

I was like, yeah, you only live once. And then Amy goes, Amy goes over to Madonna and goes, Madonna, hey. And she goes, hey. And then he goes, this is Hassan. He was the guy from the speech, the White House speech. Did you see the speech? And she's like, I haven't seen anything. I was born yesterday.

And I was like, okay, Madonna. I like how Amy talks to Madonna, like she's like the 95-year-old grandmother. It was kind of loud. It was like loud. Madonna. Can you hear me? Yeah I haven't seen anything

I was born yesterday I'm never going to forget that That's amazing Josh Please Protect me No From ever becoming that

I'm gonna keep you in check We're gonna have a once a year visit Here in the podcast Feel free to text me when you're in any other gala I'll help you out Yeah We're gonna keep it real So how much

How much protein does the rock eat a lot You know I was And there's so many of them now that do this. Like, I, uh, I was in there. Do they have an unbelievable gift of energy? I'm so tired. When I interviewed Hugh Jackman at Sundance, he came with a giant cooler of, for,

uh, for his like chicken breast and cod. Like, it needed to travel with him. For what? He was getting ready for Logan? Probably, I'm sure. I don't think that's the day to day, I would hope. I think he was getting in, in Logan's shape. Uh-huh.

So be happy with your life that you don't have to worry about, like, eating every two hours. Yeah. The rock is an exception. The rock we know is the next level of humanity. He's, he's the future. and our next leader, apparently. He'll be our president. He will win. No, I mean, we're serious.

Like, there's a good shot. He'll win. You're performing. I know soon at, what, Cluster Fest? Yeah, are you going to be there? I'm not going to be there, but I wanted to mention it because I saw there's like, the roster is amazing. Oh, it's incredible, yeah.

So what, that's San Francisco, June 4th, so people. They got Jerry Seinfeld to come. He's pretty good. That's crazy. I saw him perform. He did his beacon thing. I went to one of those just because you want to see him. How was it?

He's amazing. Really? And I'd heard some of his stuff before, but he cycles a new material, and he's just, it's so precise. It's just like a type of comedy. You know, it's different, but it's just like kind of old school in the best possible way. Right, right. It's comfort food, right? So do you, are you performing a lot and are you performing Homecoming King stuff or different?

No, no, I'm working on my next show. Same sort of thing. Like, it'll be like a one-man show, but I'm getting it ready now. Very cool. So it's cool. You can see me around New York and, you know, getting it ready. Excellent. So look out for Hassan, always performing.

Check out Cluster Fest. if you're in San Francisco, the weekend, like June 2nd, 3rd, 4th, I think around then. And definitely go to Netflix, check out Homecoming King. It's a truly impressive, funny piece of work, but also just heartfelt, emotional, smart, all the good adjectives that I can assign to it. See, I wouldn't say that about certain films. Okay, so we understand each other. You know what's so funny, it now all clicks. When you interview a celebrity and they're in a bad movie and they don't want to talk about it,

It's the same way Paul Ryan evades questions when talking about Trump. To shift, just move on to something else? Yeah. When they're like, how can you advocate such a horrible thing? He's like, let's talk about something else. The same thing a movie star does when they have to promote Pirates of the Caribbean. No comment. Hassan, it's good to see you, buddy.

Good to see you too. Congrats on everything. Thanks, man. And so ends another edition of Havis. Happy, sad, confused. Remember to review, rate, and subscribe to this show on iTunes or wherever you get your podcasts. I'm a big podcast person.

I'm Daisy Ridley, and I definitely wasn't pressured to do this by Josh. This episode of Happy Sad Confused was produced by Michael Catano, Mukta Mohan, and Kasha Mihailovich for the MTV Podcast Network, with additional engineering by Little Everywhere. You can subscribe to this and all of our other shows on Apple Podcasts, Stitcher, Google Play, Spotify, or wherever else you find your favorite podcasts. You're in. Cool.

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Capital One and a member FDIC. Hey, Michael. Hey, Tom. You want to tell him? Or you want me to tell him? No, no, no. I got this. People out there.

People, lean in. Get close. Get close. Listen, here's the deal. We have big news. We got monumental news. We got snack-tacular news. After a brief hiatus, my good friend, Michael Ian Black, and I are coming back.

My good friend, Tom Kavana and I, are coming back to do what we do best. What we were put on this earth to do. To pick a snack. To eat a snack. And to rate a snack. Nemptively. Emotionally? Spiritually.

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