Happy Sad Confused - Hayley Atwell

Episode Date: April 17, 2018

Marvel may have given Hayley Atwell fame but a television adaptation of a century old novel may end up being the game changer for the actress. On this episode of "Happy Sad Confused", Atwell explains why playing Margaret Schlegel in the critically lauded adaptation of E.M. Forster's "Howards End" (currently airing on Starz) is the role she's been waiting for.  Plus Hayley reveals why she loves pulling pranks on her co-stars, how she landed the role of Peggy Carter, and introduces all of us to her secret American alter ego, Tiffany.   Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

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It got Willa. They got my daughter. I need to find her. Willa! From acclaimed director, Paul Thomas Anderson. You can save that girl. On September 26th, experience what is being called the best movie of the year. This is the end of the line.

Not for you. Leonardo DiCaprio, Sean Pan, Benicio Del Toro, Tiana Taylor, Chase Infinity. Let's go! Here I come. One battle after another. Only in theater, September 26th. Experience it in IMAX. Today on Happy Sad Confused, Haley-Atwell goes from the Marvel Cinematic Universe to E.M. Forster with Howard Zend.

Hey, guys, I'm Josh Horowitz. Welcome to another edition of Happy Sad Confused. I'm Josh. Here's Sammy. That was a good one. Really? Yeah, that one felt good. Felt good in the room. I don't know how it sounds. Most of the interests sound horrible, so the standard is pretty low. Yeah, that one felt good. I'm very pleased to say that today's guest is Haley Atwell. I was going to say like the charming Haley Atwell, but of course she's charming. She's a Brit. All of them, they're so damn charming. And they love you.

Well, I love them. Those Brits, yeah. They bring it. You're an anglophile. I think I am. She is, of course, probably best known to Marvel fans as Agent Carter, Peggy Carter. It's a big one. Brought to Life First in Captain America, the First Avenger, which I think you commented on my tweet

recently gave me some flack for it. This was before I even knew Haley was coming on. I tweeted like a week or two ago that reminding people that I think Captain America the first Avenger is maybe the best, if not one of the best, Marvel films. It's top three. It's not the best. I just have a soft spot for it. I know, but you're wrong.

Okay. Well, it's very good, though. You will agree that she as Peggy Carter. I loved her. I really did. She is great. And the relationship between her and Chris Evans in that film is, it sucks. is very sweet and

it's such a great ending and and then the fact that when we talk about this a little bit in the podcast the fact that you know we always joke about these the side characters the sporting characters like oh wouldn't it be great to get your own spin off she really got one like she's like the one

that like had this afterlife she had two seasons of Agent Carter on ABC she's popped up in a bunch of the Marvel film since then I don't think her time as Peggy Carter is up I'm sure with two more Avengers films coming we're going to see her pop up at some point I don't know anything I'm just saying I believe that to be the case.

So, yeah, it's been cool to see sort of the fans embrace that character and Marvel then to deliver more great product in terms of that character. So, but there's a lot more than just, uh, she's more than Agent Carter. She's more than Agent Carter. She's also starring currently on stars in the critically beloved. And I, and I mean that. It's got in rave reviews. Okay.

I saw all four episodes. It's great. Howard's End, new adaptation. of the classic E.M. Forster novel. Of course, most people probably saw, and I myself did, I think it was 1992, big Oscar nominee, Emmett Thompson. I think Adam Thompson won the Oscar for Best Actress for it. And so it's, you know, big shoes to fill, but it's a different kind of adaptation. This one, obviously, four hours long, so you have a little bit more room to breathe. It was scripted by Kenny Launergan, the amazing playwright. That's interesting. Matthew

McFadden is also in it another uh I need to get him on the podcast too I think he seems like good good people yeah um put him on the list yeah exactly uh so yeah so there was a lot to talk about will I like it yes okay I'll watch it yes and you'll like this podcast because I I will say I I've only interviewed Haley maybe once or twice on carpets so again one of those we never got to really connect we connected love her thank she's the best um so she is always welcome here and I think this this conversation will be entertaining to those of you that that already know and love Peggy Carter and Haley Atwell and those of you that just want

a charming Brit in your ears for 45 minutes. Good hasn't. Right? Yeah. Okay. So on to the main event. As always, remember to please rate, review, subscribe to Happy Second Feudon on iTunes, spread the good word. Please. Please. Please. And in return, I give you this

lovely, the talented Haley Atwell. Well, welcome. This is the victory lap for Howard Zenz. You guys are, must be feeling good. Yeah, well, it's been lovely because we're, you know, promoting it, but also the reviews and the BAFTA nomination that we got from it has just, you know, kind of elevated us all to be very happy to be talking about because it's been so well received.

I just saw your little, it's a small but powerful New York Times review. Yes, I know. That seemed to, that's as good as you could ask for as an actor. It's just delightful. Yeah, it's lovely. I think also because you don't know what the response is going to be, you just do the best you can and the job that's at hand and have a good time of it.

And then it's unleashed to the world for them to have their own experience of it. It's no longer yours. So the feedback is very welcome. You can coast on that. You can get a feed on that. I'm going to adjust your microphone a little bit just because we want to hear you loud and proud.

Yeah, yeah. And we both had birthdays very recently. Even more recently. I'm an April Fool's kid. Oh, yeah, but like my friend David a yellowow. Oh yeah. Yeah. So David and I were born in the exact same day, same year. Oh, amazing. He was on the podcast and we made that revelation. Oh, lovely. We're clearly... We're all April babies. There you go. Yeah. So how did you celebrate? That was yesterday. I went to a pink concert in Madison Square

Garden. As one does. As one does. Oh, my goodness. She was phenomenal. She was, she just, she went from rock to ballads to folk at times. At one point, you're thinking it's this contemporary dance and we insert a Soleil and then she's doing acrobatics. Yeah, so she's flying. all around. Flew all over, Madison Square. I mean, what a great view. I find myself when I appreciate something like that but then I get worried for the performer.

I get legitimately... I'm so kind of you. I did think about that because I thought the amount of security and preparation must have taken to ensure that pink the very valuable lady herself is going to be okay, team pink, yeah. But she seemed to be having a wail of a time. Right. Yeah, I was just that

I was seeing that the Harry Potter play here. Oh yeah, yeah. And there's a lot of like pirotechnics and stuff and it detracted slightly i mean i loved it it was it's an amazing production yeah but like i'm just too much of a worry ward i can't handle it oh that's nice it's sweet it's very sweet um so is uh i mean obviously theater is close to your heart is that something that you are able to do uh sneak a little theater in while you were here i wasn't able to actually i was could try i mean i really wanted to see lobby hero obviously because of chris is chris evans being in and also with kenny lonegan uh writing it and how

having adapted to Howard Zend. So there was a connection there. I was like connected to Marvel in some weird way through Kenny. Totally. But I wasn't able to see it with all the press I had to do. So Pink was my kind of cultural highlight

of my time here in New York. Beyond sitting in just a weird, sketchy office at MTV talking to me. Which has its own charm. Yeah, thank you. Just fishing for compliments. Is that Bradley Cooper and Jennifer Lawrence's face combined? I don't know why you're asking you

like it's a weird thing, yeah. I just, I just, I, wow. First of all, congratulations on being a really good facial recognition. I thought it might be you and her. No. And then I thought that kind of pointy facial hair and the hair line feels Bradley. And then, of course, they've worked together. Yes, that's a very good spot.

Yeah, I'm just delighted to see that out there. That is evidence they should never procreate. I'm just trying to do a service fear. A very pretty hairy child. Exactly, I suppose. What was I going to say? what's the difference in doing press here versus because you did this whole round of press in England

it's been on the air and received great accolades over there different kinds of questions here or is it similar kind of reactions give me a sense of what the... Yeah, the central... So a lot of people want to know about what makes it different from the film, you know, thinking like, was it very, you know, did you feel the pressure

of, you know, walking in the shoes of Emma Thompson's incredible performance at one of the Oscar? And it was always kind of funny to me because it's a bit like, you know, Margaret Schlegel for me is kind of an iconic female character that I was speaking to another brilliant actress Juliette Stevenson about this, and she was like, oh, you get the chance to play Margaret,

I love that role. And many actresses who know the book know that she's such a great character to play, so we all, you know, want the opportunity to play her. Yeah. And similarly, we all kind of would love the opportunity to play people like Lady Macbeth and Theresa Rakan and Heda Garbler and all the greats.

So it was less of like, oh, I don't know if I can do this because Emma's done such a great job, and more like, as an actor, I get the opportunity to have this in my kind of my back pocket, my canon. Sure. And I, you know, speaking to Emma about it, she was so typically generous in that, oh, there's the coffee. We're getting you caffeinated up.

Oh, definitely. One last. She'd said, you know, don't watch what I've done. You are she and she is you. And just kind of, I think, gave me the support that she's always done. really and I think the press really has been

very much about honoring what the film was but then realizing that this is a four-parter and if we pull it off then this is a different definitive TV production version of it over time that doesn't in any way try to compete with the film. The director hadn't seen the film, she encourages not to watch it

and also with Kenny's writing we felt that there was this lightness of touch to the script that he brought to it. He's not kind of sentimental or nostalgic about period dramas. He wants there to be no stiff austereness. He wants it to be naturalistic and just a human story, the story of characters that we can relate to. Well, and I will say I got a chance to it might sound counterintuitive to like binge watch something like this, but I did. I said, basically in one sitting and I think that speaks to the lightness of his touch and the material

and kind of like the watchability of it. And because sometimes you can feel like this is homework and it's not homework. Yeah, yeah. It reminds me a little bit of like, I remember, like, when I was a teenager, when David Mamet did, like, the Winslow Boy as an adaptation as a film. And I was, like, so curious, like, what attracted him to that, and the fact that he was kind of, kind of honor the story that he obviously loved so much. And just the notion of someone like Kenny Lonergan, you know, for those of them know, obviously the succlaimed playwright and did, of course, Manchester by the sea, that, for me,

was one of the early things when I heard about this project that said, oh, this is something worth taking note of. He definitely lends a kind of a cool gravitas to productions, I think, Lenny, Kenny. And for me, it was as soon as I knew that he was attached to it, it was just an absolute no-brainer that I would love to have been involved in it. And, yeah, I think it's, you know, stories are, if they're told well, they transcend the genre. And if someone who is not a fan of horror sees a horror film

that's just brilliantly told, whether it be something like Get Out, for example, which has a completely different take on the genre. And that in itself kind of is just great, good storytelling. And we felt that that was very much in the script and wanted to bring that kind of new energy to it so that people who wouldn't necessarily could feel that period drama has a bad rep of being that kind of inaccessible

or a bit wistful, a bit up its own bottom, should we say. No, that's very much the kind of case that people can watch this and go, oh, I didn't really think I'd like period dramas, but this is just a beautifully engaging script. Totally. I'm still plagued, of course, by the apostrophe and a lack thereof. I mean, I feel like we could just solve this and make me not have sleepless nights by just adding an apostrophe to Howard's.

Oh, I know. I know. And also, every time I write it in an email something, it corrects it to do that. Even my phone is going, no, no, no, no. It's like every time I prep for a Leav Schreiber interview, it wants me to write live Schreiber. And it will never allow. absolutely and also when you're when i was posting anything on instagram about it i'd have to double check the typos because that's very important oh yeah you would lose your credibility card here and talking

of punctuation in fact we had hetty mcdonald who was directing it who was at the royal court in london in the 80s with kenny so they worked together early on and she would come up to me sometimes and go um kenny's written a comma that that's actually there's a comma in the middle of that sentence so let's honor that and so it's sounds all very like, you know, oh, God, this is far too serious. But it's really, it's great because that specificity, um, when you kind of know how to play it in the delivery of a line, you go, oh, I understand why Kenny's written it with that kind of rhythm. And it adds a pace and a rhythm to it that you kind of want to keep up with because that's how the character is talking. Um, yeah, so that I actually found it, the more technical and specific it was,

the more liberated I felt. Yeah. I mean, the, also part of the fun, I think you guys had a, a premiere here in New York, so you shared it with some of the cast. Um, Is it similar doing press with a buddy who you've worked with before, Matthew McFadden, versus someone like a jerk like Chris Evans? Oh, yeah. Nightmare, both of them. Oh, I'm so unlucky. But Matthew, you have worked with at least a couple times, right?

Yeah. And I mean, you know, obviously and Chris as well, because we did the films and then we'd come back to it and then, you know, we'd hung out before and, you know, so it's, and it's also with the Marvel thing, it's kind of rare that you play a part and then it gets kind of revisited a few years later or being in a different form. format or it's kind of, you know, the part that kind of still keeps coming back, which is kind of always a surprise, you know, welcome one. Yeah, I think Matthew's comic timing and his compassion and his emotional intelligence as an actor also just spills over in between takes. And he's, he's got

such a great sense of humor about himself as he's very much of that kind of, I think, sentiment of taking the work seriously, but not yourself seriously. And so we can have a giggle and having that kind of atmosphere on set, I think produces better work for everyone because it energizes people and people want to be there and they want to, they'll put up with the long hours and, you know, the corsets and the sudden kind of like London's now in a downpour,

so we've got to be on weather coverage for a bit. And, you know, the pressured environment that working on a set is, it's kind of, I think, kind of really important to have fun with it. I do find that, to speak in generalities, that like, generally the Brits that I've worked with, I've taught, I've interviewed and I've done my silly sketches,

as you can see from the stuff on the walls. They are the ones that are both like, you know, they're trained and they know how to, you know, obey every comma, but they are willing to, you know, I've done countless stuff with Hiddleston and Cumberbatch and like, and I feel, I don't, it's an odd, it's an odd thing, but it's, it's, it's a refreshing, nice thing too, that I don't know.

Sometimes it's counterintuitive to some, I would think, that like the stiff upper lip of Brits wouldn't want to... Yeah, or you'd think that we're all very kind of serious and very earnest. And, yeah, especially if you're doing a period drama or something that's kind of a literary adaptation or something or a play, that there's a kind of a pretension around it that kind of like kind of pomp. And I don't think that's kind of the case either.

If it was the case, I think it would be very... People wouldn't want to come and watch it. You know, it would just be like, why am I being dictated to by someone who's being very serious about all this? It's just a show. So it's kind of, I think, you know, Marvel's also good at that. Marvel knows what it is. It has this tongue and cheek quality to it.

So it's always, especially, you know, Thor, for example, being so funny and so self-aware that it makes everything that much more enjoyable to watch. Is this kind of a production, in some ways, the best of all possible worlds, I would think, in that, like, you have the room to breathe. It's four hours. Um, you don't have like the hanging, you know, when you've done a couple series where it's like, you know, you're, you're probably enjoying the work, but you're, you're always wondering, are we going to get to do this again? Are we, are we, are we kind of come back for more? And this is, you know, it's, it's, it's like a film, but you have a little bit more room to breathe. And you don't have the hanging albatross of, are we going to get to do this again? Absolutely. That, I've only, I've done that once, uh, on TV show. I mean, Agent Cast was a bit different because it'd come from Marvel film. Yeah. And we knew that. And we knew that. it'll be this many episodes, it'd be limited series. So, and for the most part, especially season one, the scripts, you kind of knew what was going to happen early enough to be able to make choices or feel as an actor that you're plotting where, you know, the character arc is going to be.

Sure. It is for, I know it might sound like a nerd, but that's the sort of thing that we do is. That's the job. So that's one thing. So to do anything that's, you don't know, you're kind of chasing the ratings will dictate how long it's going on for. scripts are being written as you, as you film it, you might be reshooting the episode previously as you're shooting the next one and there's a time constraint of getting it out in time. It's a completely different kind of machine. And it's definitely not something that

we're accustomed to in the UK. It tends to be certain, certainly unless it's kind of, you know, soap operas, a lot of a lot of series will have, we'll start with, these are the six scripts. Right. These are the directors and there will be maybe two weeks of rehearsal. So you have a little bit more scope, I think, as an actor to make choices in that. And that makes you feel, I think, for me, you can own the material a little bit more. And you can go, oh, I know that I could actually steer her in this kind of direction. And that could be quite interesting, quite fun. So having all that material up, you know, at the beginning is just kind of how we work a lot in the UK

and how I like to work to. I'm a control freak, basically. I want to know exactly what I'm doing. Every comment. How many comments are going to be in the script? I just said, I go in here, I can't read the commas. I mean, it's, do you find that there is an intersection between fans of material like Howard's End and the Marvel fans?

I'm not sure. I think the, I'm sorry, I'm just looking at all the famous names that you've got on your whiteboard up there. These are New Yorkers? Oh, are they just, this is just New York. These are not people that you got. I'll start a London board for you. Oh, okay.

Yeah, would you mind? No, that's fine. So these are all native New Yorkers. Not native, but they currently live as far as I know in New York. I don't know all of them. If I'd known, I would have invited them to the Pink concert. What a fun, what a fun night with Greta Gerwig and Kevin Klein. And Emily Blunt, fantastic.

Wonderful. I'm amazed, what a great selection. Anyway, back to the wild question. Marvel fans are, they know more about my character than I do. And it's very, very lovely. I, yeah, I was doing a play in London, and a fan came up to me afterwards, and he was like, Anyway, yeah, well, the play, whatever. Anyway, so, Marvel.

And, you know, and I'm like, God, we've been working for six weeks rehearsing this and very intense play and you just want to hear what... Anyway. Why do you go into American when you're speaking, like, stressed? I don't know, because when I get emotional,

I feel like it gives... Like, the, it just comes out American. It's fascinating. Yeah. Do you have an alter ego? Do you have a name for that, the woman that just... Should we give her one?

Let's give her one. What's her name? Tiffany. Tiffany. Tiff. Yeah, like, it's really... hard. Oh my God. That's Tiffany. There she is. It's just like,

really? I'm working so hard and I just don't feel like you see me for who I am. It's disturbingly good. That's amazing. Sometimes she needs to be heard and she needs to express herself and I don't judge that. I welcome her. There is room for all of us

in this head of my. Being said, bring back Kelly, bring back Hillary. Personality disorder that I'm developing. So Marvel fans are very committed and they, after this play, the guy came up and he was like, so, um, you know, like, so the infinity stones. And I was like, is that a, what is that a film?

Is it, what is stones where is a, I don't. And he was going, are you going to be in? Like, are you going to, so come on. Can you just tell me? You can, like, with the stones, like, it will mean that you can take these stones. And I'm like, I don't know what you're talking about. And I didn't want to break his heart thinking that like I didn't,

I just didn't know. And as it was going on and he was asked me these questions, you could see his, the kind of, his face kind of sagging in sadness because he then just went oh my goodness like you know nothing like you really don't know anything and i was like no i know and it's it's partly because rival have to be in order to surprise and delight their fans it's very secretive about the process of it as they go along so i'm not privy too much um so they but they are committed in other ways and i've met them at various conventions and people who've had like my face as Peggy Carter tattooed on

their forearm and I know my value quote tattooed on their thigh and men dressed as Peggy looking even better in the skirt than I do which makes me very jealous and it's been kind of amazing how she's taken on this this world of her own really and and then with you know the period drama stuff I think it's uh I think it's kind of like hoping that Cowards End will open up to slightly bigger demographic than the people who would naturally just gravitate to period dramas because they like the look of it. And I think, you know, of course, it is very beautiful. The costumes are very beautiful.

The landscapes are very beautiful. But we wanted to add detail so it didn't feel kind of wistful and romantic or idealistic, which would take away from the actual development of the story and the characters. So, you know, I'm hoping that people will kind of as soon as they get hooked into a little bit of it and go, oh, it's funny. Oh, Tracy Almonds. Oh, we're allowed to laugh. Yeah. Oh, great. Okay. And then feel a little bit more relaxed that they can do that because we're relaxed. You know, we, we played heads up most of the time in preparation. I was going to see, I'm usually, like, when I'm reading up on a film, like, I expect to read about pranks on like the George Clooney Ocean's 11 movies.

I don't expect to hear about pranks being done on the Howard's end set. I literally live for it. It's kind of like essential to my process is pranking. So I remember I play that I did and there was an actor and we'd kind of prank each other back and forth and so it was my turn and I kind of decided to up my game. He'd kind of like jump out at me sometimes from backstage in a scary mask. That's amateur out. I mean whatever. I wouldn't see that before. And so I went onto eBay and I purchased 3,000 plastic children's pit balls, you know those things. And I had them deliver to the stage door on a Saturday morning and two hours before the matinee, I went into his dressing room and I filled his dressing room up to the like just below my knee in pit bulls and

then closed the door and had to climb in through the window um of the dressing room through the courtyard so they didn't spill out sure yeah and I put them in his costume I put them in the sink in the bathroom and just literally covered it everywhere and then all you could and then I just listened as it the him just opened this door as he got in and just go oh god hayling and just going and for and the satisfaction of knowing that you've gotten someone is just it really helps especially when you're doing a long run of a show I really does like it's it keeps you all on the edge because you don't know what's going to happen who you're going to you know just suddenly going to jump out at you at any time what bucket of water is hanging in what closet exactly exactly

so I did that on Howard's end so we had this um kind of ongoing gag that my character ultimately infantilizes Henry Wilcox by the end of it and Matthew was kind of kind of yeah We're talking about this line he says towards the end where he goes to Margaret, have I done wrong? And we had this image of him being in a diaper, eating like a rusk dribbling, having been this like staunch kind of alpha capitalist and thinking that he has the answer to everything

and then realized that in the end he knows nothing. So he's just like, did I do wrong? Who am I? So the day that we've shot that, because the other thing is we really like to try and make each other laugh in takes because weirdly it means that we're more alive to each other. other and we're more like trying to or with the all with the kind of intention of just making each

other more awake or a positive intention but just kind of going if I can make him laugh then I know that we're really connected and so the day of that scene I went into his trailer and I put a diaper in his trout in his pants a potty training like thing in his bathroom a diaper rash cream I had a pacifier in his pocket I got the every time he asked for a cup of tea on set the runners would give it to him in a sippy cup. His lunch was given to him with a bib. And he would just... Actually, sounds amazing.

I mean, has Matthew, like, take him to this? He was like, living the dream. It's like, this is what it's all been working towards. This moment where I can finally be the big baby that we all know I am. It will surprise no one to know that Haley was an only child. I know, yeah. Yeah, I just spent, you know, I remember, like, being in my room as an only kid child, being like, well...

I'll just practice sadness in the mirror for a bit. So I'll be like, or like... Three years later. Yeah, like, here I am. Golden Nog, multi-olivian nominated. I'm like just like going... It's just literally from boredom of being an only child in my room going, well, just, you know, and save myself.

And I remember, like, times when I was younger, like, if something happened and I was generally upset about it, like if I just would part... Be like, oh, my God, and then this happened. And I'd be like, oh, looking in the mirror, going, that's what grief looks like. I just remember that, right? I was always preparing.

Amazing. I think, yeah. Were you, so let's just jump around a little bit because we don't have time to go like through every single aspect of the career but like you'd done the Woody Allen film which was the kind of, I guess, the first film, right? So that's a huge break.

Yeah, first time I've been on a film set. So like where were you at when the Marvel audition came around? I mean, your career was going well. You were, you were Golden Globe nominated for Pillars of the Earth. Yeah, that happened around that time. So yeah, I was around then. And I was, you know, working actor and I managed to have a few years out of drama school under my belt, a few plays

and a bit at the National Theatre and all shakespeare company and still very much kind of apprenticeship, still feeling like I had a lot to learn and not just about the technique of acting but then also the business side of it and how those two marry and not really knowing if you know if I if I was going to be able to sustain it because you're working from job to job and it's kind of hard to know I think if you go like oh I think I'm sorted I'm gonna be fine

for the rest of my career you just never know so I was I was still kind of just going to auditions and doing the thing and working hard and got the you know got the call to say

would you like to come in an audition for this of course you go and audition for anything that comes up and I didn't didn't know who Chris Evans to me was a redhead very funny and nerdy DJ in the UK

who presented a show growing up called Don't Forget Your Toothbrush where he gets members of the audience to do crazy stuff and then they win a holiday And I was like, oh Chris Evans is going to be a superhero That's a choice It's good for him And I loved him

You know so then So I didn't know the other Chris And I didn't know comic books And I wasn't and this was also kind of I suppose you know we're talking seven or eight years ago so there was a lot of films in the Marvel franchise

that we hadn't had yet so it wasn't exploded really so I just went in and approached it like any other job learned this to learn the lines I figured out you know a bit of who she was went in had a bash at it

and then like every audition you kind of come out going I have no idea it's beyond my control now and they might just go I think she needs to be blonde so we can't cast her it might be as simple as that

you just never know and then so I got the call to then do a screen test which was a full day of you learn about 10 pages of dialogue and then you'll give them 20 minutes to learn unarmed combat fight sequence with a stunt double and coordinator and then also practicing me loading and unloading guns to see if I looked confident and I wasn't scared of them for example and it's also looking about physically how I moved

so physically would I be able to do stunts should that be required? So they also have Tomolee drones in a corner of or just staring at you sternly. They had a cardboard cutter. Because that's a test. That's intimidating. Yes, that's the real test of like,

do you have the balls to be stared down by him and still deliver? Seriously. And I remember just, you know, you just kind of, it was set up, this was done in a film studio and there was hair and makeup tests and camera tests. So you're doing, in a day, you're doing kind of a little montage mini scene

of what your character could be. And I think I also auditioned with the final scene where she's on the phone to him. And I kind of looked, I remember doing, as I was doing the scene, kind of looking over at the assistant director who had been called in to, you know, do the audition. And he was a lovely English, like, well-known AD, like, proper alpha male. And he was like, it was wiping away a tear.

And I was like, oh, nailing it. Yes. I hope you didn't actually say that out loud. Nailed it. Nailed it. And, yeah, I think that's in the can. I think we all know. Where do I sign?

Why do I sign? Yeah, there was a little bit, so I felt like it had gone really well, but it was really much an exercise to overcome the nerves of being in an environment like that. I mean, so much of my job is about being able to control your feelings and direct your thoughts into a story that's outside of yourself, you know, and with lots of people that you don't know staring at you. It's a terrifying thing. And then kind of getting it and going, okay, lovely.

And here we are. So, um, it's, you know, I feel, they even sent me, the Marvel lot sent me a, a hamper, a fondue, chocolate fondue, hamper. Oh, I only just seen the connection. Oh, I'm so slow. Uh, yeah, they sent me a fondue, chocolate fondue hamper from all the Marvel family. And, um, you know, that's really, you know, once you're in the family, you're in the fam. I will say, and I'm not, you can, you can research my Twitter from like a week ago before I knew I was talking to you, I happened to be watching First Avengers. again for the first time in a while. And it's, I think it's my favorite. It really is. It's a sweet, charming film. And it's really, it's all about that relationship between you and Chris in that film and that, that, that end scene. And of course, you grabbing his boob is integral to the story too.

Do you ever send that as a gift to friends? Has that ever come up? I feel like that's like a. No, I just do it to my friends. It's just my signature at Will Move. I don't shake hands. That was your thing before the movie. You just happened to do it.

Yeah, I had it in my arsenal as a tall, tall, tall. that went in doubt when I'm nervous, just go for the man boob, yeah. Did you have a sense? Because I've talked to Chris a lot, and I remember talking to him after he got the film in, like, that first Comic-Con. And he's been very open about, like, how he had a lot of trepidation about doing that. Was that, like, palpable? Like, was he kind of, like, talking about that?

Or was he, once he was in it, he was in it? Yeah, I think the filming of it, from what I remember is he's, the thing that, that was, I suppose, surprising, but not surprising, just like how I found him as an actor was, you know, he comes from, he comes from theatre, like his family are very much into it. And he is also a, he plays piano, and he is, he tap dances. And so although he has kind of, I suppose, a jock persona in some ways of some other, of the jobs that he's done, there was a real kind of sense.

and intelligence behind a lot of what he was doing. And so he remained, he had this mix of being just very focused. He would articulate, you know, certain things of going, I know, you know, I was very reluctant to take this to all because I knew it would be, it would change my life quite drastically. And he would want to have the conversation with people around him of going, what does, what are the repercussions of this? And also in terms of the, the, will it open me up to amazing possibilities that

extend beyond the Marvel universe or will it actually prevent me from being able to do those things. And so he had a very open kind of dialogue about that. And I think as a result, it meant that it didn't kind of go to his head. And I think he just, he's found a way to make it his own and make it work for him and still be able to go off and direct and have a go at other things. And obviously, you know, doing a play here in New York. You know, so I kind of like, I was really impressed by that, you know, I think he's a good guy. Definitely. And it's funny because It's like, it's, in a way more surprising for you in the way that you've had this long run with Peggy, clearly.

Yeah, she won't die. We joke about this kind of thing. Where, you know, on every Marvel movie, you talk to kind of like the side characters, people that aren't the leads, and say, like, oh, wouldn't it be great to get your own film or spin-off or whatever? And you're like basically the only one

where it actually happened and people have this unquenchable thirst for more Peggy Carter. Yeah, yeah. I mean, some people are kind of a bit miffed that I'm doing anything else. They're like, my post them on Instagram. Yeah, they're like, okay, yeah, well, well, well done.

But anyway, back to Peggy, when is Peggy coming back? And it's kind of, it really is amazing. I'm very appreciative of it because I, it's, there's so much feels, especially in the earliest of a career and this kind of creative art for me. You don't really know what's going to happen. And it, and so it feels like this, you know, this kind of ongoing, very lovely gift, you know. And I do want to do other things and I think everyone does.

Me and Chris himself is doing other things because you don't want to be doing the same thing. Also feeling, I think for me with Peggy as if, if, and I, if this ever was an opportunity to bring her back in some way in some form in some, another show, whatever it is, that there is a development of her. so it doesn't feel that I'm just playing the same thing, that there's enough of the story development to feel like I can do something different and new with her. So that it, yeah, it just feels like it moves it forward rather than feels like you're just kind of, you know, acting by numbers of, you know, yeah.

So where are you at in terms of that, you know, the $64,000 question you can ever answer in terms of like where we're going to see her next? We've got two more Avengers films we know that are coming. We've got this Captain Marvel movie that's in the 90s. Oh, yeah. I know how people are talking about. And they all think that are people like me being in it.

Yeah, no. yeah yeah no someone was like so like Peggy Carter you can neither confirm nor deny that you're gonna be in Captain Marvel and I was like I'm not gonna be in it

I deny actually I as Haley Atwell I'm saying I've not had the call so yeah you know I think it's I feel like I'm gonna see you in some Avengers capacity in the next God that would be nice I mean I yeah I know they're filming it

and I I We also, I have there, like Scarlett's makeup people on that also did my makeup on the show so I kind of hear that it's going on and then of course I get to the reunion photograph that we did and I made sure I was wearing a really bright green dress because I thought I'm going to be tiny

and also no one's going to know that I'm there so I just want to be like, hi mum, I look like I'm kind of wearing a green screen a little bit of material but you just kind of never know really it's such a kind of a beast unto itself and I, you know, if I'd welcome the call, if it came, but also, like, I'm not going to kind of wait for it.

I've kind of booked various other jobs that are so wildly different from that and kind of focusing on those things and just kind of, you know, if I get the call, then I'd be delighted. Was there assigned seating at the photo shoot? Was there negotiating on site where, like, actually, I feel like I should be in the second row,

I should be near Downey or whatever, or... Well, yeah, I mean, let's face it. She's the heart of the Marvel franchise. I'm saying. I was sat next to Paul Bettney, I think, or near him, Jos Whedon as well. And I was like, this is fine. This will work. This is good company. Yeah, I'll take that. So you mentioned kind of like, yeah, the amazing breadth of the kind of material that you're

handling now. You just, I think you just did a play back home, right? Yeah, yeah. Yeah, dry powder by Sarah Burgess, native New Yorker that was done at the public here a couple of years ago with Hank Azaria, Claire Daines, and John Krasinski. It's actually a three-hander. So we did that in London. It's been nominated of Best New Comedy at the Olivier Awards, which saw our equivalent of Tonys. Congratulations. Yeah, so it was fantastic. And she's the absolute antithesis

of both Peggy and Margaret Schlegel. Jenny, the character, is someone who is what she lacks in emotional intelligence. She makes up for an IQ and she's got kind of a calculator for her heart. And I put her on the kind of the spectrum

in terms of being able to pick up or not pick up social cues and kind of nuance of etiquette to make a slightly more palatable and also funny for the audience to take because she's essentially horrendous in terms of her views, her political and her moral views. Her belief is that what you do, as someone who works in high finance, private equity, is you take a company,

you absolutely rip it apart, you fire all the people that are worthless to you, and it's not your fault if they don't have qualifications to get jobs elsewhere, and that they have five children to feed. That's not her problem. And then she makes this company more valuable and then sells it on and makes profit and goes and goes home and sleeps the gordon gecko of our day she's yeah and she's and she doesn't get human relations she doesn't care that the the play is very much about how the press are the time when we've kind of completely destroyed a whole kind of community of workers and layoffs um is also the time we decided to throw a million pound party and hiring like live elephants and she doesn't get the insensitivity of that at all she's like i see them as

two different separate events. And it was really for that. Her lack of awareness, that's where in her comedy lies. So it was great fun to get the challenge to do that and to play American as well. Not Tiffany, a different kind of person than your alter ego, Tiffany. Oh, yeah. No, Tiffany would not cope with it. I mean, she'd be like, oh, my God, all the children.

Like, I just feel like I identify with them. And I just feel like we just give them all money. and then, yeah, I should just have a new pair of shoes. We should develop, I feel like, a one-woman show for Tiffany and bring it to New York. Have you done, have you done theater here? No, I'd love to. This is it.

This is the way to do it. Tiffany, one-woman show of Tiffany. One night only. One night only. Yeah. In the morning, more. Well, yeah, I think one night is enough. I mean, she makes it through without having oranges and rotten throat thrown at her, I think.

Because she is a triumph. Yeah. Has had your experiences in the theater, Which, was, correct me if I'm wrong, your first love, too. That's sort of where it through your mom. Yeah, trained in it. Yeah, yeah. Past school did, yeah.

Are those kind of the experiences that have kind of pushed you further, you think, when you look back at your career thus far in terms of where you've had the most growth or where you've made most strides? Yeah, certainly. I think, so in drama school in England where I went, Giltoe, they're very much about the ensemble, so they're about collaboration. And you do things from studying Shakespeare to the Greeks to improv, comedy, to dance. and it gives you a very kind of broad foundation

of which to then go out and start to figure out the craft and being an apprentice in the world of a company of theatre. And when I came out of drama school, I was lucky enough to work with some kind of exceptional actors who I would just watch like a hawk. So my first play, my first job, two weeks out of drama school, was with David O'elow doing a Greek tragedy, and I played I-O-to-his Prometheus in Prometheus Band by Iskoulos

and his kind of his total commitment, but his kindness, he's got a huge heart, but a big intellect as well. Just was a wonderful thing to kind of just to feel like I could kind of bask in, and I felt very safe doing that, and I was an amazing experience. And then going to the Royal Shakespeare Company and working with the late-great Tim Pickett-Smith and Penelope Wilton, these are names that I knew growing up, these great giants of British theatre and also Sir Simon Russell Beale

and Ken Stott to interview from the Ridge, Mary Elizabeth Master Antonio Right, that production was very well received Yes, yeah, Olivier Nome which is very amazing and people like that and then of course even in film,

people like Emma Thompson and gosh Ray Fines as well they were very much kind of I wanted to surround myself with people who I respect and admired and I'm intimidated by because I thought I can learn from you guys

and it ups my game but it also gives me a very clear awareness of my limited skills and that makes me feel like I want to work harder to be better that's how anyone's going to grow as you surround yourself with people who you know you respect and you look up to and that's going to rub off

I think you said something to the effect in a recent interview about like being in your 30 being some more opportunities that are exciting to you than when you were in your 20s. Did you find that to be the case when you were at a drama school and you were starting out that the roles were more one-note and that right now, both thanks to experience

and age and accomplishment, now it's getting interesting? Yeah, absolutely. Well, I'm more interested. I know what to look for, I suppose. And when you come out of drama school, for me, my experience was that you're just so grateful to be working and you just want to do it

and you want the experience. And so as long as it didn't kind of steer too far away from my values, like kind of going, well, I don't want to play someone who's kind of butt-naked for the entire thing, or you just kind of feel that it's exploitative in some way or could actually be detrimental to a certain kind of quality work you're wanting to work towards. If you can in any way be selective, then great. But if you can't, and I certainly couldn't at the beginning, you take what you can and you learn from it, you know.

And so I think just sticking it out long enough and having ups and downs, and trying to learn from each experience even about it being how not to do it or what you don't want to do or what you're really not good at doing. They're all useful too and I think coming into having just a decade, we're over a decade into since I left drama school now

of being able to be a little bit more discerning and trusting instincts and having more kind of awareness of how things work a bit. So I'm not, you know, on a set now, I know what a mark is and how to reach it. Figuring out the language and the vocabulary of being on set, what is when someone says, we're going to bring in the Chinese.

You're like, I don't know that. What is, what does that mean? And now I know it's a particular light. It's, uh, and they call it a nickname, like, or, yeah, I was like, fantastic. We're getting Chinese take out for food. Exactly. That, yeah, totally.

And like all these little kind of, you know, little kind of, little catchphrases. and also in the theatre kind of catchphrases that we have that I just didn't know what anyone was talking about. Are you a superstitious actor? Are you one of those actors, especially in the theatre, that has certain things you will or will not do that will ensure a... No, but here's an interesting thing.

I'm not superstitious, but I understand that people are, so I'll honour that, so I won't say the Scottish play if I'm next to someone who is... because it's suspicious about it. However... You will fill their dressing with small balls, but you will not say the Scottish play. Quite right. Quite right.

Yes, exactly. But we had... So one of the actors that it was in Dry Powder mentioned... Buckethe. And just was like, it's fine, I'm not super... Because it's on at the National in London at the moment,

so he happened to say it, I think, in the green room or something, or during lunch. And he hadn't been superstitious either. that then show okay this has never happened it never happened again there was revolving glass kind of pillars

that looked like giant kind of rectangular cylinder things and they shattered they felt they collapsed and shattered and glass went everywhere and we had to stop the production while a stage manager just came

and then kind of you know scooped it all up and we were so spooked As you should be. It's real. It's real. It's real. Yeah. So maybe there is truth in it now.

I don't know. We're next going to see you after this wonderful four-part series airs on stars here in the US. Howard's end concludes in a few weeks. I think on the big screen we'll see Christopher Robin. Yeah. Which is you reteaming with Ewan McGregor.

Ewan McGregor, yeah. That dazzling smile. So charismatic. You know, here's a fun, Ewan McGregor story. He helped me propose to my wife. How come? Well, long story short, my wife's favorite actor, you and McGregor. I was just starting out at MTV a decade ago.

I knew I was going to propose. I was doing a junket, and I prearranged. I basically had him kind of tossed to me on a video, like, as if we're doing an interview. But Jenny, I think Josh has something to ask you. I played her to the tape. I did my thing. We've got a Mulan Rouge poster where he misspelled happiness on it. It's great.

It's all good. But yeah, he's a good guy. Yeah, he's a really good guy. Yeah, yeah. And we have fun. So Christopher Robb, I always worry for actors on productions like that. Does it drive you insane talking to things that are not there for extended periods of time? Yeah, that's bizarre, but kind of funny.

I mean, I think it helped Mark Forster's really fun director and would just encourage me to have fun with it and to improvise and would just go, just keep the cameras rolling. Because if we, you know, keep it on long enough, hopefully it'll be funny. And no, but he was very sweet. He'd be like, oh, my God, you're really funny and no one knows it. We need to kind of like increase your screen time. I was like, yes, please, delighted.

I haven't seen the final cut. I might hardly be in it, but who knows. But it was great fun. And we would have, so we'd have, we'd have three stages of the puppets. We would have the stuffies, which were just the, you know, the right size and real weight and, you know, eyes and all that kind of business. And then once we did what they call the pass with the stuffies, a scene with the stuffies where we had to kind of pretend they were interacting with us, they then brought in headless stuffies. Oh, no, no, no. Yeah.

Yeah. made of like this dark grey material fabric and they're headless. So suddenly you feel like you're in a Guillermo del Toro version of Winnie the Pooh and it's really creepy and you've got like a headless Eeyore and so and then and actually

I remember you and at this one point he'd just done a scene and he spots Eeyore staring at him from like a rooftop or something and so the stuff he was put there and he and Ewan came up to me afterwards and he went that is one intimidating donkey and it's true because they are so

life like and they're just like they're really intimidated she's really staring at me in a really creepy way i know it's like can you it's just it's good it is yeah it was and also because they give you nothing because they don't obviously speak back to you you just feel like they're condescending you like they're giving enough you so i'll be like Kanga how you doing today what's so you've raised you've raised rule on your own and wow that's someone where is his dad and all of this and you're and Kanga's like staring at you anyway and then after the Germel de Toro pass of the head of stuff is they're these like rods with a light on the end of it and when the light goes off that's when they've stopped talking and you come in

and it you're kind of like this is insane they didn't teach that in drama school but they did teach me how to be the color blue or to how to be an element so I kind of figured that they put you through so much humiliation that you just throw yourself into any kind of situation so in a way it was kind of useful how do you be the how can you play the color blue well I'm wearing a blue jacket right now that's doing it for me but uh well it often it often is in terms of like blue you just kind of imagine blue being a particular uh sound or uh particular uh emotion i suppose and then you do like an interpretive dance based on that sound and emotion and so like the dark you know if you dance to yellow it might be very different to how you would dance blue you know what i mean

we're going to end this with an interpretive dance on the way i won't be able to see it but trust us guys we're in the middle of it That's what I came for. Thank you so much for stopping by. Pleasure. Howard's End, again, it's airing on stars. Everybody should check it out. If you think you're going to love it, you're going to love it.

If you don't think it's for you, you're probably still going to love it. You better love it. It's not what you think. It's not a stuffy homework thing. Well, it's not the stuffy homework thing. It's not like, you know. No, it's very, it's provocative. It's very engaging, I think, and stimulating watching it.

Definitely. Congratulations on all your great work, and I look forward to Tiffany coming to Broadway very soon. so much. I'm finally getting the recognition I deserve. You're welcome any time, and I meet Haley, not Tiffany. Yeah, she's back in her box. Thank you so much for having me. And so

ends another edition of happy, sad, confused. Remember to review, rate, and subscribe to this show on iTunes or wherever you get your podcasts. I'm a big podcast person. I'm Daisy Ridley, and I definitely wasn't pressure to do this by Josh. American history is full of infamous tales that continue to captivate audiences,

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