Happy Sad Confused - James McAvoy & Elliot Page

Episode Date: November 3, 2025

It's an X-MEN reunion with James McAvoy & Elliot Page! Recorded at New York Comic Con, Elliot and James compare their superpowers, talk about the meaning of X-Men in their lives, and talk everything from INCEPTION and THE ODYSSEY to SPLIT and NARNIA. UPCOMING EVENTS Brendan Fraser 11/18 in NYC -- ⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠Tickets here⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠ Check out the ⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠Happy Sad Confused patreon here⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠! We've got discount codes to live events, merch, early access, exclusive episodes, video versions of the podcast, and more! Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

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And then he surprises you and he's like, Mr. Tomliss. And you're like, all right. Didn't expect that. Prepare your ears, humans. Happy, sad, confused begins now. Hey guys, it's Josh. Welcome to another edition of Happy, Sad, Confused. Are you ready for an X-Men reunion with two legends?

I am. I was. Elliot Page, James McAvoy, recorded at New York Comic-Con, a really cool, geeky, fun conversation with two actors that are fantastic in that series and so much more. thanks guys as always for checking out the podcast um boy we're zinging and zagging one second it's martin sheen one second it's x-men and yeah this is the x-men episode so for those that weren't able to be there at new york con i want to share this this is a live event that we recorded there and uh like i said kind of a mini reunion obviously elliott and and james macboy didn't necessarily share a lot of screen time

but they certainly x-men certainly was important in both of their respective careers so uh you're going to enjoy this chat a lot. More on that in a second. Quickly, as always, Patreon.com. That's where you get all the early access. You can see and watch everything early before anybody else. You also get heads up on upcoming guests. You can ask questions of the guests.

You can get autographed merch, access to our live events, so much more, patreon.com slash happy, say I'm confused. And a reminder, November 18th, Brendan Fraser, first time guest on the pod. and we are screening his new movie, rental family, get in on that. If you're in New York, this will be a good one. Okay, a little more preamble, then we'll get to the main event, I promise.

Elliot Page, James McAvoy. Two gems. James, of course, has been someone I've done, actually I've done a lot with both of them over the years, but I don't think Elliot's ever done the podcast before, surprisingly. So this was a fun opportunity to talk about not only their X-Men experiences, But they've obviously both done so much in that kind of Comic-Con adjacent world, whether, you know, James and Split, you know, he's, you know, he's done stuff in horror.

He's done a little bit about Narnia, of course. And Elliot Inception, of course, we talk about Inception a bit. Also a little tease of his upcoming re-teaming with Christopher Nolan in The Odyssey. pretty cool. So as always, in one of these live events, so much energy, so much excitement, playing to, I think, three, four thousand people in New York Comic-Con on that stage and some really cool stories about X-Men and other things in this. So without any further ado, I think you'll really get a kick out of this one. Elliot Page, James McAvoy, joining me onstage at New York Comic-Con talking all things X-Men and more. Enjoy.

Hey, Comic-Con! How's it going, everybody? Look at you all. Look at you beautiful people. Happy last day of Comic-Con. No tears, though, guys, because we are ending with a bang. Are you ready to talk X-Men

with two iconic actors, parts of the franchise? My name is Josh Harrowitz. I host a podcast called HappySac Confused. I am so privileged to moderate a bunch of stuff here, but this one is special. I love these two actors. I love these films. Not only also, by the way,

Do these folks have X-Men on their resume? Let's just review for a second. Elliot Page, Inception, Umbrella Academy. Come on, guys. James McAvoy, from Narnia to Split. I think he knows next generation trivia more than anybody in this building. I'm not gonna test him.

I'm not gonna test you, James. Don't worry. Okay, without any further ado, Let's fill some seats and have a fun geeky chat, shall we guys? Please welcome to the stage. James McAvoy, Elliot Page. Come on out, guys. That's an amazing reception.

Thank you, guys. They told you to do that, right? That's good energy to start the day, right? That's how you usually start a day. You walk into a room filled with 3,000 people cheering you. I just have an applause button, yeah, by my best. So, okay, let's talk. Look, you guys intersect in the X-Men films, but not necessarily a ton of screen time.

So, like, have you spent more time on press tours or these kinds of things than actually on set on X-Men? on X-Men? I think, like, we did press for days of future past, right? We spent a little bit of time, I seem to remember talking to you about pitching new ideas and stuff like that when you were like, I'm just trying to have a quiet drink, dude. When we were doing the press for days of future past, but that was kind of it, and then a little teeny bit on set, I think, we crossed over.

Yeah, that's what I remember as well. Yeah. That's it. That way it corroborates the story. You guys, as I alluded to both Comic-Con veterans, Do either of you have memories of a first or indelible Comic-Con memory? It was you. My first Comic-Con ever was New York.

I can't remember what movie it was. I think it might have been wanted or something of that. You know, back on I wanted. And weird, this is a weird bit of trivia that nobody will find interesting about my wardrobe. I've not worn this jacket since that day. And that weird? And that crazy?

What a weird Easter egg. And I didn't wear it on purpose. I just realized I was like, I found it in the wardrobe before I came to, I'm so dull. Just talking about wardrobe decisions. And I was thinking, right, blue on blue, denim on denim. Yeah, so that was, yeah, that's it. Try to one up. Canadian tuxedo, you know.

Thank you very much, yeah. Thank you very much. For you, do you remember the first time? We talked, I remember for Umbrella Academy here actually, but I'm sure you have experience that goes back further. I think if I'm remembering correctly, my first was actually San Diego Comic-Con with the movie Super. And I remember having a blast because Liv Tyler was there and her and I together wore masks

like to go like walk around everywhere, which was so fun. But Liv even in the mask looks so cool. People were asking to take pictures with her, having no idea that it was Liv Tyler. That's my memory from my first. Was that a generic mask? Do you remember what the mask was? It was, I think it was the V for Vendetta, if I'm remembering correctly. Yeah, yeah, yeah.

Nice, nice, nice. So give me a sense, growing up, what in the Comic-Con space were each of you into, respectively? Comic book kids, sci-fi, Tolkien, anything that touched these worlds that you were obsessed with growing up? Do you want to go first? I guess when, I remember when, I forget what age, I would have been maybe 11, 12, and the original Star Wars was re-released in theaters and I became completely like hooked and I loved Batman, I loved Spider-Man.

Like I loved, yeah, like more, yeah, superhero stuff when I was a little kid. I read something somewhere, tell me if I'm wrong. Was Matrix a big film for you? Yes, I loved the Matrix, yeah. That explains it. Yeah. Everybody has that moment when they see The Matrix for the first time

and like, what did I just see? What was that? Yeah, I was just talking about it earlier. actually was someone who's never seen The Matrix. But I almost was so excited for them. But I guess sad that you never had that experience at that time in the theater, just how new and how extraordinary it was visually and story-wise.

Do you know what panel I'm doing here next on this stage right after? No, tell me. The Matrix? Oh, shit. Lawrence Fishburn and Joe Pantliano were coming on to talk about the audience right after here. I met them yesterday.

That was pretty freaky getting to meet them. Yeah. I mean, amazing, freaky. Stuff that I like growing up, Lord of the Rings, massive. A bit more niche, the Bulgariads. David Eddings, anybody? Yeah? A lot of sort of stuff in that.

Frank Herbert's June, like, loved it. Narnia, man. Like, all that. And then in the 90s, I guess the cartoon for X-Men was massive for me. Never read the comics. And I think my most... And I think my most sort of Comic-Con thing that I'm still love to this day and I have posters of in my office is the Goonies and Back to the Future. You're in a safe space. You're in a very safe space for this.

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Call us. As you recall, as you recall, were Kitty Pride and Charles Xavier the first comic book roles that came your way?

Had you done auditions in that space before, or was that kind of a first for either of you? I did Wanted which is sort of a comic book adaptation back in 2007 and I auditioned for that I didn't audition for Charles which is amazing they just you know back on X-Men offer only McAvoy if that's what they call you yeah I know but yeah so no I don't think I went up for too many other superhero parts other than those two yeah and for you like where were you at when

this opportunity came. Because if I have my timeline right, you've done Hard Candy, but you hadn't done Juno yet, so you're at this kind of pivotal, Heart Candy is a big film for you, but you're kind of like on the, on the ascent. Yeah, I had like just graduated high school and I had done Hard Candy and it had premiered at Sundance but hadn't come out yet. So it wasn't, yeah, so it was sort of a surprise to get this call,

which yeah, it was about X-Men. So I think that that for sure would have been my first superhero or comic related or sort of Hollywood movie in general in terms of that scale. Did you get straight up offered it or did you audition? It was, there was a screen test. Oh, right, okay, cool. So I remember flying out to Vancouver for a screen test. I did actually audition for another comic book movie in my early career to play a small part of a younger version of a character for. for the first like five minutes of the movie and then I'd be out of it.

Really good scene though. I won't tell you the film and I won't tell you the director. But we had this amazing conversation and this amazing connection. And like we're laughing and crying. He's telling me stories about his life and like real deep stuff, quite traumatic stuff that had happened to him. And he hugs me at the end and we both cried. And like as I'm walking out, he turns to the casting director and he's like,

this is the guy. This is the guy. And he never called my agent. I know. I know. And then he offered me a role years later on another movie, which I didn't end up doing with him. And I sat down and chatted with him, and I'm like, do you remember me? And he was like, no, we've never met before. And I'm like, okay, directors are weird.

Everybody knows Stephen Spielberg is an asshole. No, no, no. So, I mean, last stand, I mean, that's a different kind of filmmaking than you had experienced before. It must have been kind of a little bit of a shell shock, like just the scale of the filmmaking. Do you remember that kind of registering like, oh, this is what they say when they say blockbusters filmmaking? Yeah, I'd never been on any set like it. I grew up acting in Canada as a kid making shows and, you know, independent films. And so the scale of the production from base camp to set to all of it was very much.

new for me. And the ensemble around you, unbelievable. That must have, that must have just... That was definitely so intimidating to walk into all these, you know, extraordinary talents and extremely famous people and walking into this world. But one thing that I immediately took away from my castmates was just how wonderful they were and welcoming and, um, really just made me feel comfortable and included. So that was really nice. One thing I feel like both of your characters share is that there are powers that are kind of hard to convey on screen. I mean, Kitty, it's like essentially you're like running at a wall

and then in post like, oh, I'm on the other side of the wall. For you it's like a lot of intense like eyebrow work and pointing to your forehead. Which has the tougher power to convey on screen? Fight it out for me. You've got other powers than just been able to run through walls, though, right? Yeah, it seems to, it can shift and change. A little bit, yeah, yeah. I don't know.

I think, I don't know who's got the harder job of conveying. I mean, I'm very expressive with my eyebrows. They are thinning as I got older, which really worries me, because I don't know if I can do the same kind of work anymore. But hopefully we can, you know, CGI or AI can help me over that. Can you give us the hacky way to do it and the James Macover? way to do it in terms of... Well, I found that I was acting too much and I was doing too much, which is why I employed

the finger. Because I just thought, as soon as I put the finger up there, I don't need to do anything. That's like, wow, the finger. But honestly, like when I first said I wanted to do the finger, it was like a discussion. We had the finger conversation. I'm not joking, by the way, I'm not trying to be a dick. I don't think Patrick ever did that in the other films, and he does do it in the comic books at times,

and he did do it in the cartoons. So I was like, okay, it's something that he never did. I got to do it. And then there was a whole discussion about fingering myself on camera. I know. I would say I'm surprised, but I'm not surprised. Go for it.

So everyone agreed, yes. Did you, so when you're cast, James, at what point do you like seek out or receive seek out or receive Patrick Stewart approval because you want some tacit thumbs up from him, I would imagine at some point. Yeah, I mean, I'm, I was a fan of his anyway from like Next Gen and David Lynch is June. He played Gurney Halleck and that. And yeah, so it did feel weird, but I also knew I wanted to do something quite different

with it. It was probably more different in the first couple of movies than the last couple of movies. But yeah, you wanted him to feel respected and feel sort of like it was, the performance was like in conversation with us, even if it is different. Anyway, when I was lucky enough to get to cross over with your cast, one of the few members of the two cast that really got to do that, I got to spend pretty much a whole afternoon with Patrick and with Sir Patrick and Sir Patrick, sorry. And while I was getting hair extensions put in, and I went into the trailer, and I think Patrick was cooking, and Serene was sitting with his feet up in the recliner, and I just finished doing Macbeth on the West End in London, and I sat, thank you, thank you. And you should have seen it. It was great. And I'd go into the trailer, and Ian's like going, you know, you've just come off the stage, James. You've just done Macbeth, haven't you? And I'm like, yeah, yeah, yeah, that's right. He's like, come on, let's all do a bit.

Because Patrick had done it as well, and I'm like, what? And I honestly, I'd only finished, I think, two weeks before, and I couldn't remember a single line. And these two are like bandy and back and forward favorite bits from Macbeth. I was like, wow, it's just a different kind of actor, a different kind of machine. Did you ever, have you ever summoned the courage to do your Picard impression to Patrick Stewart's face?

You do a very good Picard. I used to do it quite well. I've not tried it in years. Engage. There it is. Thank you very much. Thank you. Really appreciate that.

I don't think I have done it to his face, actually. Patrick Stewart, come on. No, we don't have one. We don't have them. I'm sorry. So when the call comes for days of future past, very exciting for the fans, for all of you, I would imagine. The experience on that one, a wholly different kind of thing for you,

again, just to mix it up with some familiar folks and also meet some new things. What was your perspective on making that one, Elliot? Elliot. Gosh, I mean, it was really, I mean, like, to be honest, in that one, I pretty much what I do. I just do a lot of that. But it was a joy to be back with everybody again to, you know, you're doing this with Hugh Jackman all day. I mean, he's like the nicest person you could meet. So, yeah, I think for me it was just the joy of being back with such a wonderful group of people. people and to continue to be a part of, you know, such an extraordinary world and legacy of characters that means so much to people, yeah. James, I think you, yeah, James, I think you've said to me that that's your favorite

of the X-Men films, correct me if I'm wrong? Days of Future Past. Yeah. I go back and forth as a toss-up between First Class and Days of Future Past. I feel first-class sort of tried to do something quite different and do a different kind of tonal approach, if you like, which I thought was really cool. And then the Days of Future Past kind of went more sort of classic, but did it so, so well. And it was sort of, I don't know, correct me if I'm wrong, and I'm not trying to claim

anything, because I didn't direct it or write it. But it was sort of one of the first ones that did all that timeline stuff and different university kind of crossovery stuff that we kind of weren't used to as much back then. You know, back then, before the war. You know, backwards when we was on rationing and a, you know, a can of beef was a luxury. It was, it just felt a bit different and a bit new. So I go back and forth between the two of them, to be honest with me. But I got to do some, like, people are going to go like, oh, you must, you know, get so bored on those big movies and whatever.

I'm like, playing Charles in Days of Future Pass was like a proper solid acting worker. It was awesome. It was so good. Yeah, it's like Charles by way. of like born on the 4th of July he's like strung out it's like that must be really and not to mention he can't just do so much with your buddy Fastbender like I mean talk about a great screen partner to have yeah yeah well I actually ended up spending more time when Nick Holt on Days of Future Past me and Fuzzy were sort of kept apart

a lot which I never quite understood um um uh too much too much friendship um the yeah it was cool you know like i like Elliot was saying we just have We were lucky enough to have an amazing group as well and no bad eggs and just real good sort of supportive group energy, which was like one of the privileges of my career to do those four films of those guys. And talk about good energy. I mean, we feel the love in this room. I know you guys feel the love. I mean... The fans truly do make this special because these films like, it's kind of like what you're talking about on Matrix. These are cool films. but they're saying something. That's why X-Men works. It's about the outsider. These are like coming-out stories in a way. It really resonates on many different levels for you. Give me a sense of like, I don't know, fan encounters perhaps over the years that touched you,

or what do people say to you that really, I don't know, is meaningful for you in relation to your work in X-Men? When they tell me that I was better than Patrick, that means so much. It really resonates with me and my feelings on the work. the work. No, seriously, though. Honestly, X-Men has I don't know

if it's touched loads of people, but loads of people that come up to me and want me to sign something or just grab me in the street. The people who aren't even asking for a signature or a photograph, they just want to tell you that they had a tough time at some point. And

it really helped, you know, because I think the one of the creeds or the credos or the themes of it is that whether you're disenfranchised or whether you're oppressed or whether you are segregated or ghettoized or whatever you are as so many of the characters in X-Men are you are enough and you deserve your place and so and I think that that's quite positive but yeah that's I do get a lot of that from X-Men yeah I'd say my experiences have been so you know similar in the ways that men has, you know, spoken to someone, helped them through difficult times, just been a huge

part of their own journey, potentially, and discovering themselves, and those moments are always literally some of the most special interactions you can have with another person. Look, as, as often happens in these things, like they reiterate, they constantly reiterate, they recast you, you know, a recast of sorts. from Patrick. We're going to see another Charles, another kitty, probably before too long, perhaps. Depending on what you read on the internet, I've heard Coleman Domingo, I've heard Bella Ramsey, I've heard a lot of different names. I don't know if you follow that, you hear that, what do you make of those names, or just generally the idea of someone inheriting the mantle

of these characters from you? Yes, absolutely. To me, that's, I wouldn't, I don't. I don't. I don't. really follow but those names sound fantastic approved I mean it's be just so exciting to see you know people do it take on a new iteration yeah no I totally agree I look I'm excited to see what happens next I was a fan before I was an employee and no you know and I'll be a fan again you want it to be I just can't wait for it to be exciting and to be about oh no that was going to sound bad It was going to put a lot of pressure on people.

Coleman Domingo sounds amazing though. He is great. Meanwhile, Hugh just will always play Wolverine. Like, I mean, apparently we can't improve upon that. I think, I think, like, I was going to say 10 years from now, it's probably going to be 10 minutes from now when AI has taken over and playing all the roles and there are no actors anymore, he will still be playing Wolverine.

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Look, you both have such amazing resumes. Like, break it down for me. Like, what portion of folks that come up to you mention X-Men versus other things? What's the most frequent films or projects that usually come up to? you and can you clock from a mile away, what kind of fan they are? I can't clock. I get surprised often, actually. I'd say right now, it's a lot of Umbrella Academy. People love that, which is so nice.

It was so fun to make. And I'll tell you, Juno Will, that is just, that just, that just keeps going strong. So I'd say in X-Men, of course, but, you know, I'm not really in them as... Don't diminish. I'm just saying, I'm just saying, yeah. I get a nice broad range, really, but you get, what I really enjoy is when you're walking down the street and people call out a name of a character that you played. And sometimes you'll be like, oh, that guy's going to do it, he's going to do it, and then he surprises you and he's like, Mr. Tomniz!

And you're like, all right, didn't expect that. And then you walk down the street and someone's like, You're a professor. And you're like, oh, brilliant, cool. But it's quite fun. It is kind of fun. My favorite thing as well is when somebody recognizes you in the street or like in the middle of a conversation,

they kind of look at you and then they lose what they're doing and they're kind of confused for a second. But what happens to their face is not, oh, I'm confused too, is that person. What's happening to their face is they go into such constant. of who the hell is that again? Their face kind of goes like this, and they look like they want to kill you. Do you ever notice that?

You were like, they would like, ba-ba-ba-ba-ba-ba-ba-ba-ba-ba. And then you see it and you go like, like that. And you're like, whoa, whoa, whoa, whoa. And it took me, it took me like a year or so of this sort of like certain amount of fame to kind of understand what was happening. I was like, what the fuck?

I'm going to murder Mr. Tumnus right here in the Starbucks. Yeah. That's right. Let me run down a few of those credits and just the first things that come to mind. I mean, you mentioned Narnia. I mean, that was relatively early in your career. And, you know, like I was saying to Elliot, that was probably like your equivalent of, like, last stand and that it was like a giant set.

It was a giant scale of filmmaking. What are your first memories when I mentioned Narnia to you? Literally the first thing that popped into my head was Georgie, who played... played Lucy. We played a lot. We played a lot and we, I think Andrew kind of like stuck us together a lot, the director, who's a great guy, great director, just hoping that we would get along a lot and she was really young girl at the time. I can't remember what age. Georgie was maybe, I don't know, maybe six or seven, I'm not sure. And I don't think she'd acted before. So I was, I just spent a lot of time with Georgie and her family and they were really lovely. So that's the thing

it comes to my mind first and then just being on those sets was bonkers man you you get used to things but i was like ho you know i mean it was not and it was i don't even think we were texting and stuff back then it was like you're just alone with it you know maybe i'd phone home once a day or something that but you're like you're in new zealand so you're like on another planet and um but just being alone with like the kind of oh-ha-ha-niss of it always amazing And seeing yourself in that makeup and everything, like, yeah, today you would be immediately texting every friend and family member. Like, look, look at me. This is insane. Oh, man. And look, just to shout out to Howard Berger, Sarah Abano, Tammy Lane, the makeup department and that, they were, like, my absolute rocks.

And to this day, one of, like, the most fun and closest kind of relationships I've had with anybody on the set, really, because we spent so much time with each other. I remember being in trailers halfway up a mountain at 3.30 in the morning. And you're like, the ADs aren't here yet. The trailers haven't been unlocked. And we're there early enough to get the makeup done. And you're like, what is going on? So, yeah, they were an incredible crew. And Howard's just an incredible designer of makeup and it's incredible work.

Elliot, you mentioned super earlier, which is like James Gunn when he was like fully authentic, like maverick crazy James Gunn. I mean, that's an effed-up movie in the best possible way. You and Rain got to re-team after Juno. Happy experience working with James, who's just like a madman in the best possible way. It was so fun. Such an enjoyable set to be on. Such a nice vibe and energy. Everyone there had to just work together to tell this crazy story.

And such a fun, just full-blown character to play. And it was someone like James used. someone like James, you just, you really trust him when you are pushing it and going far, that he's going to like sort it out tonally. And yeah, that was definitely one of my favorite characters to play, for sure. Are you surprised the trajectory he's taken, I don't if you've seen the Guardians movies or Superman, but it's like, in some ways, it's obviously authentically him, but it's a different side of him clearly than the super guy. Yes, for sure, yeah.

But you can see just, I mean, how all those qualities and those strengths, you know, have fed into and made these great projects. Inception. I'm going to mention Inception, because that talk about a classic. How does that script read the first time you read it? Do you understand what you're getting yourself into? Did Chris have to kind of walk you through it or what? I'm a little, I mean, maybe a bit of both.

I remember sitting, because with Chris, it's very, as I'm sure people know, so secretive. you go to an office, you read the script, then you leave. And same when I just read the Odyssey. And it was the, I mean, I remember it just felt like an engine. Like you get on a ride, and it's what reading both scripts have felt like, and you're just, it just takes you in. And at first things feel maybe big or slightly confusing, and all these pieces start coming together.

But at the core of it, you know, emotionally, And, you know, just these arcs that are so defined and beautiful, sort of despite the massiveness of these projects. And I think that's been my big takeaways from his scripts, his writing. It's also, I mean, your character, in a good way for you, I'd imagine, like, is kind of the audience in that, and is like the one person in that story that's kind of like, what's going on? I mean, literally the whole movie, I'm just asking questions.

That's my... Well, that's what I do. story like what? It's very, wait, who's subconscious are we going into right now? That's what I do, the whole movie, yeah, yeah. I think, like, you kind of, I don't know, you are totally like that sort of David Copperfield. By the way, I love the film. This is why I'm about Lodge, I'm like, actually, I think you'll find. You're that David Copperfield character a little bit when you're the, you're kind of the audience in some ways, but you also, like, so young, and you stand, like, is a performer, you stand up to DiCaprio, and like you call him out so much in that movie.

And like, I don't know, I always had massive respect for you for that because he's incredible, right? He's got this amazing energy. And then when you start taking empty task, I was like, wow. You felt like that's somebody getting put in their place, you know? It was good. James, that's nice.

You've got some gamer cred, thanks to Beyond Two Souls. We should say that. Are you both gamers? Did you grow up gaming? Do you still play games? Give me a sense. I game a little bit. I gave it up just because I didn't have time and life was too busy. You know, all the movies that I do. And but then in the pandemic, me and all my buddies got together and we're like, you still got a PlayStation? Yeah, I've got a PlayStation. Should we get a game? Let's get a game. And me and all these other, like, middle-aged white dude started playing, like, online shooting games.

And we were like, oh my God, this is amazing. So that got me back into it. And so I do. I game again. What's your favorite? What's consumed the most hours lately? Straight up. Just call duty game. Call duty. Online shooty kind of competitive people screaming at you going like, I can't believe this happened to me again. When you hear someone on the other end of like the death comms, for anybody that doesn't know, when you shoot someone else and it's a real player in the real world, they open up the mic for like five seconds or whatever so that you can hear them.

And some of the shit you hear is just incredible. You're like, why does this always happen to me? Cuts out. And you're like, it's a grown man. It's so good. Do you ever on your end go, you just killed James McAvoy? No, but I did play ones with, you sometimes, if you go on on your own,

you can get paired up with a team of other rando strangers. And so there's other team of three people needed an extra, and I got chucked in at their team. They all happen to be from Glasgow, my hometown. They were like, you sound like that guy, James McAvoy. And I was like, I know, man, I get it all the time. I know, no, no. It's quite funny.

And one of them was clearly cheating as well. One of them was using some boosters all that. You got like 20 kills in five minutes. And I was very new to the game. I was like, how do you do that? I would love to learn, do what I mean? And the other two guys are like, we don't talk about it, man.

We don't talk about it. Because one of them cheats. And then on your end, again, as I said, Beyond Two Souls, but prior to that or since that is gaming part of your life at all? When I was like a kid, I really liked video games. I loved Sega Genesis. I had PlayStation. I'd say Sega Genesis is my favorite ever. And then I kind of stopped just because of like life busy. But on occasion, I'll get sucked into Nintendo Switch, you know, but I'm more like, I like Mario Odyssey and Mario Card.

this, yeah, I need something like Nintendo Switch because it's a little more before it got so crazy, so many buttons, I can't keep up, I can't keep up, yeah. Did you enjoy the, that was performance capture, and that's a whole other beast of acting that I've talked to a lot of actors that absolutely love it. It's kind of back to basics, black box theater in a way. What was your experience doing that? I loved it. I'd say it was probably one of the more challenging acting experience as I've done because you're just doing like, 20, 30 pages a day. While you're doing one scene, you're literally pausing to do different versions of a line. So going from these like completely emotional extremes, it's like an exercise that you couldn't even create for yourself. So I felt really lucky for honestly just how full throttle it was. But yeah, what a dream and to do it with Willem Defoe and it was

a really good experience. And correct me if I'm wrong. Are you, is your production production company adapting it into a TV series? Yeah, that's the plan. Yeah. Yeah. Very cool. Let's talk about split and glass, James. I was in it.

That's all I needed. Just needed a fact check. But what an opportunity. And I know you've said to me and others, like, it came relatively late in the game and not as much time to prep perhaps as you would have wanted. Not for split, yeah, for glass I had a lot of time, but yeah, not for split. So how do you, I don't know, how much time did you have to prepare, and how did you possibly sketch out all of those characters so quickly?

I think I've said like two weeks in my wife, who she used to work at M Night Shyamalan's company, she's like, you had three. I'm like, it was still a lot, okay? It's still really impressive. Yeah, like two, maybe three weeks. And it was a little bit of a version of what you were saying about like Christopher Nolan scripts, I guess, where it's quite secretive to get the script because night, not always, but oftentimes it's protecting a twist or something that's going to happen that surprises the audience. But they weren't going to fly over to hand me the script, so they did send it.

But it was like a time-limited amount of time that I had to read this script. Yeah, came late in the day. I didn't have much time to prep. I got over there. I spent a week, solid, with night, running around the production office, like, coming up with different characters, coming up with, like, anybody that was kind of around that office, much as you thought, what the fuck are they doing? Like, at one point we tried to figure out how he ran as the Beast. And I'm running up and down the production office, and there's like 30 people employed, and I'm, like, gallant. and I'm like galloping and I'm like bounding on all fours and all that and then it's going

that's the one that's the one and and then we're like well what if what if Hedwick roller skates so I'm like roller skating up and down the production office they were like these guys are just taking the piss but yeah so we figured out I think it's only like I think it's like four or five main characters that I play in split and then with the smaller parts it's I think it's like 11 or nine or something like but those smaller ones were actually trickier because you don't have a full character to inform well why are they the way they are

and what is their function as part of this community that lives inside of one vessel and so they felt a bit more like at risk of being just sort of like putting on a funny voice really do you know what I mean so weirdly even though you were playing a character that only had I don't know 30 seconds of screen time you had to put in the work to kind of try and flesh them out so that they didn't feel like

oh he is doing a funny voice and a like a wink or something you know but it was an amazing it was an amazing thing I love doing my job I love acting and people go that must have been so hard

and you're like no what's hard is working on bad material like putting in a lot of effort to something that's well written isn't necessarily hard it's like taxing but it's really rewarding as well so it was just like getting to do my job

nine times instead of one times I imagine those films are on the no-go list for your kids for the rest of their lives. Like, you can breeze right past those. Yeah, I don't think my eldest has seen split or glass. He's actually seen quite a few of my movies now, but I don't think he's seen split or glass yet. But yeah, no, definitely. Although I think there's like some funny stuff in both of those movies.

So, you know, maybe fast forward to the funny bits. The funny cut. You can do a fan edit. Umbrella Academy, we should mention, because it's such a... A special show to the fans. I would imagine a special show for you for a thousand different reasons. I mean, obviously it also dovetailed with the changes in your own life and working with, you know, your collaborators there and them adapting to your transition. What a gift to kind of work with them in that capacity.

Give us a little, yeah. So just give me a little bit of a sense of the meaning of Umbrella Academy in your professional and personal life. Oh gosh, I mean, professional life, it was just so wonderful to get to be a part of a project that was like as fun and exciting and have the response that it had and also was just really fulfilling as an actor. You know, I really love playing that character. I love this cast and crew that I got to work with for years. It was really, you know, of course, sad to say goodbye to. And we were just so lucky that obviously people responded to it in the way that they did. And yes, personally, it sort of tracks my own transition in my life and the fact that Steve Blackman was so open to making that a part of Victor's story and was, yeah. I just feel really grateful for the whole thing. You're going to be in the Odyssey. I know you can't say anything about that.

But getting that call from Chris Nolan must be such a special. It's special for any actor, but you've obviously had a history with Chris. Can you give me a little sense of just like how it happened, the veil of secrecy? Does a briefcase come with a script? What happened this time around? Just full of money. Yeah, exactly. A bag of money.

I mean, I was so excited to be thought of for it and to be asked to come back to work with him. I loved working with him on Inception and loved being a part of that movie. So, yeah, I was just completely jazzed and excited and basically went and met with Chris and talked about the part and then sat in a room and raised.

the script and, you know, it was, of course, a big yes. Yeah, sadly, I can't say much, but yeah, it was such a joy to come back, and to come back now, as you can imagine, being more just comfortable in yourself makes these sorts of, you know, projects more enjoyable, just waking up every day and going to work. So to kind of get to have a christenal and experience again now, that actually really just meant so much to me, like, yeah, selfishly. Yeah. And then just, I promise, I'm not probing for any real dirt, but like what we do know is

that you're shooting on these massive locations, IMAX cameras. We know that. Did it kind of take your breath away, kind of just being in these environments? Oh yeah. Yeah, I got to go to some pretty awesome places and it's going to be epic. It's going to be extraordinary. Can I ask a technical question? Is it true about the sound with the IMAX cameras?

cameras that like a lot of the dialogue is unusable? They're really loud and so when you are doing stuff that's close and quieter he's they basically made a giant like there's just a giant like blimp that goes over it to to quiet to quiet the sound but it's like huge. There's no like you have to ADR everything no great yeah I know he's been like he barely I think I did this is when you think of a movie of inception I think I did like 20 minutes of ADR, like he's, sorry, maybe a lot of people don't know what ADR is. It's a thing in post where you're kind of fixing sound that may like night not be clear enough

or you're fixing a line completely and as an actor, like you're in a studio watching the film and either matching to your lips or the line could be off camera. But that's something you do usually a lot, but Chris wants like the sound on the day. He hardly uses mics. You're... It's wild. Am I even allowed to say this? I'm like, oh, no.

You might get fired. He's going to edit you out of the movie. Oh, no, we made this down. You're in so much trouble. You're good, you're good, I promise you. And I'm going to tell on you and try and get your part. No. Don't do it, James.

Honestly, when you were talking about Inception, I'm like, it's one of the few films I can watch again and again and again. I didn't know that you were in the Odyssey, so that when you dropped in you were in the Odyssey, I was like, fuck. Zickman. No, I'm very jealous, and also really happy for you. Was it a dream?

Did it really happen? Inception, any takes on the ending? Well, so the ending, we got to go. Shoot. We do sadly have to go pretty soon. But before we do that, I want to give some love. James directed a movie that we're all going to be seeing, hopefully pretty soon.

Yep, California scheming. The trailer's jut... No. Anything you can tease the audience about that. You had your premiere at Toronto. Hopefully we'll see it before too long. But what a moment in a career, something that's a whole new adventure for you.

Yeah, totally. I had a great time doing it, which is not any reason why anybody should watch it. It was great for me. No, it's a really great. It's a true story about two guys in Scotland back in the early 2000s who tried to make it as rap artists

and in their own voices, in their own accents that sounded like mine, but probably thicker as well. And they kind of got laughed out of the industry. And so they came back. And they reinvented themselves and pretended to be California skater dudes, rewrote all their music, reded, re-recorded it all with American accents. And the same companies that laughed them out of the business gave them a record deal for 60 grand. And they went on to have a pretty wild drive.

ride as two young guys who essentially had to become method actors for two and a half years. And they lived it 24-7, even when they were on their own. And it's really entertaining. It's really funny. It's really tragic at some points. But I'm really proud of it. Hopefully, you'll all get to see it next year. You have 3,000 tickets sold just from this audience. Guys, give us a follow on Instagram on California Schemean. We'd appreciate it. California Schemean. Aspirations.

You've directed for television. You obviously are producing aspirations to direct. Is that on the list? Is that on the list? Or happy to do what you're doing? Maybe. I'm kind of, yeah, right now, just, yeah, producing. And that's what I'm enjoying.

Excellent. Thank you guys so much for geeking out with me and all these folks. You've honestly contributed so much, obviously, in the X-Men franchise and beyond. Thank you for your time. Thank you all of you for coming out today. Give it up one more time. Elliot Page, James McAvoy. And so ends another edition of happy, sad, confused.

Remember to review, rate, and subscribe to this show on iTunes or wherever you get your podcasts. I'm a big podcast person. I'm Daisy Ridley, and I definitely wasn't pressured to do this by Josh. Welcome and enter if you dare. Hi, I'm Hallie Keeper. And I'm Alison Leiby, and together we're the hosts of Ruined, a scary movie podcast where Hallie tells me the grisly details of a haunting new horror film each week. Whether you're a terror hound like me or a scaredy cat like Allison, we've got so many

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