Happy Sad Confused - Jessica Chastain, Alicia Vikander (Vol. III)

Episode Date: September 15, 2021

She may have been the first person to post for "Happy Sad Confused" photos but somehow Jessica Chastain has never been on the podcast...until now! Forget about how long it took and just enjoy the fun of this lively chat with one of our finest actors! Jessica is starring in 2 projects, HBO's "Scenes From a Marriage", and the new film, "The Eyes of Tammy Faye". Speaking of amazing actors, Josh also catches up with Alicia Vikander to chat about her new film, "Blue Bayou"! Don't forget to check out the Happy Sad Confused patreon here! We've got exclusive episodes of GAME NIGHT, video versions of the podcast, and more! For all of your media headlines remember to subscribe to The Wakeup newsletter here! Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

D.C. high volume, Batman. The Dark Nights definitive DC comic stories adapted directly for audio for the very first time. Fear, I have to make them afraid. He's got a motorcycle. Get after him or have you shot. What do you mean blow up the building? From this moment on,

none of you are safe. New episodes every Wednesday, wherever you get your podcasts. Prepare your ears, humans. Happy, Sad, Confused begins now. Today on Happy Say It Confused, Jessica Chastain on two dynamic new performances in the eyes of Tammy Fay and scenes from a marriage,

plus a catch-up with Alicia Vikander. Hey guys, Josh Harrow. It's here with another edition of Happy, Sad, Confused, and yes, not one, but two fantastic conversations with two of our best actresses working today. A little bit later on, I'm catching up with Alicia Vakander who has been on the pod a couple times before. Last year was on the pod, and I'm pleased to say is back today

for a, as I said, it's kind of a bit of a quick catch-up, but I couldn't pass up the chance to chat with her about this great new film she's in that comes out this Friday called Blue Bayou. She stars in it alongside Justin Chan, who actually wrote and directed the film. Really timely, and at times the serving tale of a Korean-American man who is facing deportation.

Justin's excellent in it. Alicia is excellent in it and shows off a different side of her, a different kind of a role for her. She gets to sing in it in a kind of a show-stopping scene. And again, I just couldn't pass up the chance to catch up with Alicia ever, but especially for this film and this role. So that's coming up a little bit later on in the show. But the main event, the big interview of today's episode of Happy Say Confused,

is surprisingly a first-time guest. I say surprisingly because, I mean, I feel like I've talked to Jessica Chastain a dozen times in different capacities over the years, but somehow she has alluded to me on the podcast. She has a lot to talk about right now because she is in an excellent new film called The Eyes of Tammy Fay. She stars in it opposite Andrew Garfield. And yes, as the title promises, this is the story of Tammy Fay Baker, her husband, Jim. These were, if you don't know it, very notorious televangelists of the 80s embroiled in different kinds of scandals. But Tammy Faye is a very complex figure who really was put through the ringer back then by the media.

And this is a really fascinating kind of character portrait and certainly a transformative performance for Jessica. If you've seen pictures or video of Tammy Faye, nothing like Jessica. So a real cool opportunity to see her stretch in different ways. And she just knocks this out of the park and sings and physically transforms and is getting. getting, you know, much-deserved awards attention for this. And I should say also, Andrew Garfield's fantastic in this, too. Another performance I wouldn't have expected out of him, but I guess at this point I should expect the unexpected from Andrew Garfield as well.

Jessica also is in a really great new series on HBO that has debuted. The first episode is out there already. Scenes from a marriage. Now, this is her and Oscar Isaac. Now, it doesn't get any better than that, of course. Oscar and Jessica, if you don't know, they go all the way back to Juilliard. They've known each other for a long time. So it is great to see them go toe to toe to in this really intimate dissection of a marriage, of a relationship. It is

inspired, of course, by the very famous Ingmar Bergman series. But this is all its own. And yeah, so a lot to dig into with Jessica on this. And, you know, she's just always a delight. We give each other shit in the best possible way, in the nicest possible way. But I adore her. is, of course, one of the finest actors around, so couldn't pass up the chance to have her on the podcast at last. Other things to mention, there's a lot going on. We have a new Game Night episode up on the Happy Say I Confused Patreon page. And this is exciting. Some new folks to Game Night, but not new folks to the podcast. Joe Mangonello is on, as is Justin Long, as is Christian Long. Christian Long, by the way, is Justin's brother. If you will,

listen to their podcast, which I highly recommend, Life is Short, that you hear Christian in the intros and sometimes in the interviews themselves. And they have a very fun dynamic, as you can imagine. So they've actually also co-written, co-directed a new film called Lady of the Manor, which you guys should check out very funny, starring Melanie Winski, among many other cool folks. So yeah, it's a great, great episode of Game Night. Joe Mangonello, one of my favorite humans. Always is down for a game and a fun dynamic between I think all four of us. So if you want to check that out, go over to the Patreon page. That's patreon.com slash happy, sad, confused. Other things to mention. Let's see. There is some fun stuff with Kristen Bell and Kirby Howell Baptiste. I've done

for Comedy Central. Check that out on Comedy Central's YouTube page. I've recorded a conversation with Venom himself. Tom Hardy alongside Andy Circus, his director of the new Venom film. That's coming soon to MTV. And yeah, a lot more. Taped some podcasts that are in the bank that you're going to be really into. You know, there's certain films I've been obsessing about for years, and one of them is going to be well represented on the podcast very soon. You can probably figure out what I'm talking about. Okay, but that's down the road. This week, let's get right to the main event. A little bit later on, as I said, Alicia Bacander on the film Blue Bayou. Stay tuned for that after this conversation with the

amazing and talented, the dynamic, the vivacious, the always giving me shit in the nicest possible way, the one and only Jessica Chastain. Jessica, it's happening. Can you believe it? We've finally done it. Look at us. Look it up. We did it. We did it. Welcome at Long Last to the happy second podcast. Yes. Let's hear your beeps. What's going on? What's the problem? I was just going to say I'm so happy to see you after this global pandemic that we're still currently living in. Oh yeah. Oh, that little thing. Yeah. Me too. We're still here. We're still doing our thing. You're certainly doing your thing. And yeah, a global pandemic can't stop you from. And it can't stop us. No, can't stop this, this train from going. I can't believe you've never done

the podcast, first of all. I mean, we've talked obviously a thousand times, but here we are. No, you finally got me on it. I finally got you. I mean, I feel like I talk to all your buddies. I talked to Maccabwey yesterday. Eggman goes the podcast like every other week, practically. But you have been. Mike Shannon. Just caught up with our guy, Mike. But you are the main event today. Let's talk Jessica Chastain. You've got a lot going on. my friend. I've been reveling in all the chastainiac content. I've watched seven hours of the chastain the last couple days. Scenes from a marriage, fantastic on HBO, and of course the Eyes of Tammy Fay. Shades of 2011. Shades of like that year when you had like 18

movies out in suspense. There you go. I mean, and seeing from a marriage, though, was shot during the pandemic. Isn't that crazy? And Eyes of Tammy Fay was shot. about 2019. Got it. So first of all, let's get, since we have a little time, let's give a little perspective because I was reminiscing about those early days when you kind of like jumped into the scene head first. And I remember I talked to you. I think the first time was 2011 at Sundance for Take Shelter. As the years go by, do you have like a different perspective on the madness of that year? Does it grow fonder? Does it get more abstract? Like when you think back to that year, what do you think back to now? Oh, it's an amazing. It was like an amazing year.

the most incredible year. I was so proud of all the work I was doing. I was getting to meet, like Gary Oldman was walking up to me on the red carpet and telling me he liked my movies. It was insane. It was the year that was, it was like from a play or something. This cannot be reality. So for me, that was a fantastic experience. And also it was the year that I think around that time, too, Oscar had Inside Lewin Davis. So it was like all of my buds and my friends, we were all just kind of around each other and celebrating that life was, was, our careers were starting to happen the way that we had always hoped they would. What's the, what's the biggest change in terms of how you choose roles now? I mean, A, you can choose roles now. Early on for any actor, you don't get the luxury of choice. But, but around then you were starting to get the choose. Your life has changed. Circumstances have changed. Your experiences have changed. Like, how do you judge scripts and roles differently now than you. did them. I mean, it depends because I chose scenes from marriage for a very different

reason than I chose the eyes of Tammy Fay. For scenes from a marriage Oscar, like, first of all, he emailed me way before he was even attached, like a year before. And he was like, hey, I heard they're doing this. Do you want it? Let's try to do it together. And I was like, well, I'm booked because I was supposed to play in London. I did all this stuff. It's like, if they'll wait, okay. No one wants to wait. Come on. So, but then when, Michelle, you know, fell out, he emailed me and said, hey, has a pandemic opened your schedule? Has the global catastrophe changed your schedule a little bit? Yeah. Are you brief? And I was. And so that was like a thing of like, I love him. We've been friends for 20 years. We went to school together. We have the same way of working. I adored working with him on a most violent year. And when I read it, I was like, oh, this is just going to be. It's like, play a television series and a movie it's like three mediums all in one so that to me was an easy

choice yeah and i mean the eyes of tammy fay i i watched the documentary when i was on the press tour for zero dark 30 right so that's a long one yeah that's the longestation period yeah needless to say and i was like no one would ever expect maya from zero dark 30 would play tammy faker so i try i got the rights to the movie before i even have to had a production company and then started working on it. So okay, let's start with scenes from a marriage. You got it some of the things I definitely want to talk about. Yeah, it does feel like it's like a carmic turnaround

from the most violent year because as I remember, you kind of came after Oscar on that one when Javier dropped out. Your buddy Michelle Williams was supposed to do this again as the fates would have it. Here's a curious thing. I'm just curious from an actor's perspective. Your buddies with Michelle, she has to drop out

for various reasons. You come in. Do you talk to Michelle about, like where she was at with the part or are you like picking her brain on like what you were going to do with it or you start fresh you would never know that's too weird to me yeah yeah you have to start fresh um but it happens all the time there's so many uh parts where like oh so and so was going to do this and then they fell out or i was going to do this and i fell out and then this person jumps in it happens all the time and we never talk about it because you don't want the articles out there

like, oh, imagine this person doing it or imagine, oh, if Jessica had done this. And, you know, it's, it's awkward, but it literally happens all the time. And it goes recorded. Those sliding doors stories are what I live for. I mean, maybe from your perspective, it's awkward for me. It's like, I mean, I love the finished product, but I always also like to imagine what might have been. It's all good. I'll give you one. Yeah. I, oh, should I give you this? Oh, you can't tease it like that, Jess. Come up. Because it, for me, it's, it was important. Okay. I got, and I've always wanted to work with them. I love David O. Russell. Love, love, love. I, we had talked and I got offered American hustle, the Jennifer Lawrence part. Got it. And I wanted to do it. It conflicted with

Lee Volman and Miss Julie. And I had been attached to that for a long time, and I worship. leave Olman. And so I had to say, like, I'm sorry there's a conflict and it didn't work out. And, you know, it's a good thing that movie didn't do well. Nope. No Oscar nominations, nothing at all. You're okay. Everyone's okay. And full circle, leave Olman, obviously comes around. That's why I share that story. Yeah, because honestly, she is like a goddess to me and I worship her. And I mean, everything happens for a reason because Jennifer also was way better than I would have ever been in that park. So I confess even as a cinephile and someone that consumes a ton of pop culture. I've never seen the original. I admit it now

of scenes from a marriage, Ingmar Bergman. I know, I know I need to go back to it. I don't think you call yourself a cinephile. I clearly not. No. Give back your card. Yeah, yeah. So did you, did you talk to leave after you took on this role and pick her brain a bit? Or was that also kind of weird and awkward or what? I sent her, because I know the thing about leave, and this is how I took the inspiration of her with me when I played this role. Leave is so incredibly sensitive. It's almost like she doesn't have skin. She's just like raw, wild, like vulnerable.

She feels everything. It's beautiful. And as soon as I started, and I even posted on Instagram, I was like, there will only ever be one Marianne. And it was a picture of leave and I. I just emailed her to know so she would know, I'm not doing a rem. I'm not playing your part.

There's only you. Right. I'm playing something. Basically, I'm playing Johan, but a modern day version of Johan. Got it. And she's incredibly supportive. In fact, she and I are going to do a photo shoot and a little interview in a couple days together. She loves the series.

She's like, she's a great inspiration of mine. And I'm so lucky to have her in my life. So I don't know if this is from the original series or something you guys decided on the fly to do in this one, but there's some really interesting moments of kind of like breaking the fourth wall and showing the behind-the-scenes stuff throughout a little bits, not a ton, but like enough that really captures kind of what you're saying about your relationship with Oscar that like, obviously this is such intimate material, it's so raw, it's so profoundly honest. To see you guys, and I don't think it's, usually it's a spoiler to talk about the end scene of a series,

but like there's like, you get to see you guys off camera, essentially, And to see the bond you two have is really touching. And really, like, you do see that intimacy, both on screen and then in those moments off. Did that, I guess, how did that come about to capture those moments? Well, what was crazy is, so I met with Hagai about whether or not I would join, because it was so last minute. And it was one of the best directors meetings I've ever had. So I was like, yeah, we started rehearsals three days later. And we were like, in my house, Hagai's house, Oscar's house.

It was like the three of us just rehearsing. And I think it was like week two of rehearsal, Hagai just said to us, this is so beautiful watching the two of you together. Because we would joke that we were each other's acting coaches. If there was a single that I didn't get, he would help me through. And he wouldn't tell me how to do it. He would just ask me questions. Like, why don't you like this? What is, you know, what are you pushing against?

And so Hagai came to us one day and he goes, I have an idea. I want to show you guys because whatever this is. is, the two of you, it's the reason for the series in some sense, even though it was a last minute chance that we did this together. And so he planned it all out. I mean, the wedding ring at the end, that's all like, I asked my husband's like, use a fake wedding ring. But like me coming on set, taking off my fake husband wedding ring, and then putting on Mira's wedding ring, all of that stuff, a guy had planned out. And then the end, they just said. said, we're just going to roll the camera and follow you guys.

And it literally was us kind of like saying goodbye to each other. It's really beautiful. Even for a cynic like myself, it's kind of, it's very touching to watch. You know, we've kind of danced around it. I mean, there's not much to really set up for the show. It's kind of like implicit in the title. It is essentially five hours chronicling over a number of years, this intimate marriage, this relationship, drew ups and a lot of downs.

Um, talk to me a little bit about, we, we talked about the Oscar relationship, but like, I'm curious like going back. You knew him from Juilliard, correct? Yeah. One of, one of the cool kids. He was my boyfriends. He wasn't the cool kid. Come on. Um, no, my boyfriend from college, he was his friend. Okay. Like, very good friend. So the great thing about our friendship is I got to see all the sides of Oscar that as a girl you wouldn't normally see because I was hanging out with the boys. Right. So I really, like, know a lot about him. Did he have the best hair back then or has that come with age? Maybe that's come with age. He's got pretty good floppy hair now, right? It's pretty good. Impressive. Yeah. Have you guys now you are part of an elite club also?

You've both met X-Men villains. Have you compared notes? Because I know Oscar loved being under all that makeup for for months at a time playing Apocalypse. Um, Should we tell us? Oscar and I definitely have talked about this. Okay. Okay. Not a... Not the most fun topic for some certain reasons, perhaps.

Yeah. I don't have a word in your mouth. Yeah. Yeah. I mean, the reality is our situations were very different. Yes. My situation, I think, you know, studio was bought at a certain point. I didn't even know what my characters

name was until I saw the film what's happening yes it was a it was a interesting thing but Simon Kinberg who directed it is an incredible human being and I've worked with him again I love him everybody loves Simon no bad words to say there is there a commonality among because beyond Oscar there are several actors that you return to over the years maccoy Edgar like you've got these guys like Michael Shannon did Michael Shannon tell you what's about to happen is you're getting the scoop right now i'm going to tell you literally it's a scoop let's hear it so george jones and tammy winnett oh he's playing george oh he's going to play george jones and you know mike was in a band before like he was a music is like arguably his first love in some ways yeah

and we did take shelter i took his um cd and put it in the jukebox at the small bar in uh ohio he's like he was such an amazing singer so yeah we're about to go do that and john hillcote's directing all six episodes fantastic music to my ears i just i just chatted with michael in person and um and he didn't tell you wow i guess he doesn't like to as much as uh no no you're you're my favorite now but he did when i mentioned we were going to the filmography and i mentioned how much i still love it admire take shelter i think his reaction was i don't give a fuck what you think josh and then i knew i knew where i stood with mike after all these years He really does care, though.

He talks about you a lot, actually. You know, you're the screensaver on his phone. Don't even tease. Don't make fun. No, I'm not making fun. We are text buddies. We've proceeded to texting in our relationship, so I feel like we're really getting closer to matrimony.

Don't tell my wife. Exactly. Careful. Don't tell anyone. Speaking of marriage, I'm thankful that I watched all five episodes of my wife, our marriage is intact. but there are, like, there aren't certain kinds of films and TV that can test a relationship that can push buttons.

And this is one, I think, with like a somewhat unsteady relationship, I don't know if this one's going to be the best tonic for them. Or it actually is the perfect medicine. Maybe. Because it gets you talking, right? Usually unsteady relationships, you're not communicating enough. And so maybe this will be like, you don't feel like that. They're terrible.

You don't feel like that, you and the other person is like, uh-huh, yeah. Or on the spectrum, we're doing great compared to the. this couple, yeah. Exactly. But I mean, the first one, when it came out, it inspired a lot, there was like a huge flux of divorces. Really?

Yeah. So what was, what was your idea of marriage based on film and TV when you were growing up? Like, what, do you remember, like, was there a Kramer versus Kramer or War of the Roses? Were those kinds of things in your mind or what, or? Honestly, I never wanted to get married. I really like, I'm still, like, I know I'm married.

I'm super happy. I love my husband, but it was never something I was going to do. It seems like it was a contractual thing you just said. It seems like you just said that. No, I really do love. I really, I'm happy. I'm married, but I would be equally happy to not be married. Because for me, it's not about a convention. It's not about like an obligation. It just feels like so old fashion to like do that. And also, especially for women, it doesn't feel like it's the most modern. So I'm still let your wife hear this, Josh. She's drawing up papers, put right behind the camera. What's the point, you know?

And so reality, too, like, if someone watches the series and it inspires them to have a divorce, more power to you. Because that means you were not in a happy situation. And so I'm all about everyone being free because when you can love without owning someone, that's real love. Speaking of super solid marriages, let's talk about the eyes of Tammy Fay for a little bit. Okay. So I've been doing this a while. Yeah. Another amazing performance.

Honestly, you kill it in this one. I love Andrew Garfield. Always fully excited. I mean. How good is he? That loves you. He really does. Again, and like both of you guys on paper, I'm apparently a shitting casting agent,

but I would never put you guys in the top 10 or 100 to play these roles. And yet you are the only ones out that could have done it. Talk to me about why. you were, you said you saw the doc, which is a great doc, by the way. Was that the thing you fell in love with and inspired you from the get-go? Yeah, I was really inspired by that. It's the Steve Peters interview. That to me, her doing that, Steve Peters interview, you know, she brings this guy onto her show. He's gay. He has AIDS. And she said, this is at a time when the government won't talk about AIDS. And they're being, you know, communities are dying. And they're being

looked at people who are suffering with AIDS are being looked at as like lepers and no one wants to talk to them and she says we as Christians are supposed to love everyone and yet we're so afraid of an AIDS patient that we won't put our arms around them and tell them that we care and then she's like I love you and if I want to put my arms around you and then she also says when she asked him about coming out and he says his mom and dad were sad but they told them that they loved him no matter what and she's like you know thank God because we as mom and dads are supposed to love through anything and that's the way with Jesus. And it was so punk rock said at that time because, you know, tell evangelism, evangelicals were all white men who were dictating a very

conservative, exclusive way to the Holy Land. This is the one path. Sorry, this is the only way you can get in. The only way. And Tammy Fay was like, everyone is deserving of love and everyone is deserving of God's grace. And it, to me, is, that's the movie that needed to be told. It's really striking. I mean, I live through that stuff. I remember it from a certain perspective and, like, watching certain aspects. For instance, like the montage at a certain point where you see kind of like herbing the butt of all the late night comedy. It's pretty profound. It's actually had a similar moment recently. I watched the first episode of the new the Ryan Murphy, American history, you know, the Monica Lewinsky. There's a whole

similar kind of narrative there where you just see just how it was so skewed and how they were just made to be the martyr in a horrible way. Did your opinion of her... Yeah, go ahead. You have something, yeah. Well, no, I was going to say,

and just so you know, the stuff that's in the film is the stuff that we could get the rights to. Tip of the iceberg. I'm sure they're like, oh, yeah, yeah. Because people aren't eager to be like, here you show me being an asshole. This is, yeah, this is the stuff that I said.

So imagine how much stuff is out there and like the things that they say. about this woman, where they were more interested in how much mascara she was wearing on her face and what she was actually saying and doing. And she was never tried or, you know, the U.S. government never found her guilty of anything. And yet her association, because in old-fashioned times, women were owned by men, her association with her husband made her guilty, guilty by association for everything. And the fact that she was taking up too much space, too much makeup, too loud a voice, bigger platform, too loud clothes. She had the fearlessness of a drag queen and that was very

threatening for society and for media. Does you talk about like her presentation as an actor? I mean, you know, you've transformed certainly in different ways on the screen, but maybe never to this extent. I mean, does this feel, does this give you license to kind of like be even bolder with your choices when you have this artifice kind of over you? Yeah, I don't think there's, I could be any bolder with any character. Because, like, even when you watch the trailer or whatever, and you kind of go, that's crazy. Like, this performance, Jessica's crazy.

And then you Google, because everything's online. Oh, yeah. Google her. You can find the Steve Peters interview on YouTube. And you're like, that's actually her. She sounds like that. Her voice is that high. She's got that Minnesota accent.

She's like, way out, you know, her clothes, her makeup. She was just, I think she was fabulous because I feel. Like, she was, some people think it was like she was hiding herself through the makeup. I think she was like expressing herself. Like, this is how I feel. This is who I am. And so, yeah, I could be as big as I want because no matter what, Tammy was always bigger. That was always in my head.

I'm kind of like shy. I'm always like wanting to underplay everything. Isabel Hubert is my acting like idol. I'm like underplay, underplay. And with Tammy, it was like, you got to go beyond what you think is normal. So I asked for some questions from our audience, and one actually alludes to something we're talking about. Sabrina DeLorme wanted to know,

what's your favorite accent over the years and what's the hardest one you've had to imitate? Well, definitely the one, there's two that I repeat, and it's Tammy because I just love that Minnesota accent. It's just like, and you know, and our voice is so high and sweet and it's so folksy.

I love it. It took me a long time to let go of it, and I also seal you a foot. And it's interesting because both of those characters have a higher pitched voice and my voice can sit quite low normally. So the fact that I like pitch it up and there's just like a sweetness to the way they talk. Of course, Celia Foot is more like sensual, you know, but those are those are the two accents that it's just I it was just so fun. So fun to do. So something struck me when I was, you know, I have a moment like this to kind of like do the macro view on the career.

When we've talked about so many different kinds of films over the last 10 years, I don't necessarily think. and maybe you could argue the help or even in some ways this film have comedic elements, but you've never done the comedy, Jessica. And I know you to be like a very bright, fun spirit. We've done some very stupid, silly sketches together. Like, are you naturally predisposed to react to dramatic material,

or do you shy away consciously from comedic material? Do people not see you that way? What's the story? Well, I don't think, I mean, the reality is, reality is if you look at the level of scripts, right? I get pretty great scripts that are dramas, sci-fis, like all of those, I get great, right? An A-level comedy script, it's going to go to Melissa McCarthy and Godspeed. Like, yes. I get it. So I'm like way down on that list in terms of something like that. And for me, I want to kind of go to like where the great

scripts are. I'm very happy to play Celia Foot or Tammy Fay because there's a sense of outrageousness that in like silliness that I don't normally get to do. But maybe I don't need to be the lead of a comedy when you have someone like Melissa McCarthy out there. Right, right. And where are you at now with, we kind of alluded to the Dark Phoenix situation, which we don't necessarily need to go into deeper detail on, but you had had, you've been able to manage for the most part, I think pretty well, like kind of like doing the big stuff, the Martian, the interstellar, and also staying true to your roots with these like really autot-driven smaller films. That being said, like I know for years we've talked about

and I talk about with every actor, like, where's the superhero role? And it does strike me, like, Oscar's doing a Marvel superhero, and your buddy from Juilliard Anthony Mackey is Captain America. Does it feel like at this point, like, is there a reason? Like, did it just never happen? Give me a super villain. Give me a super villain. I don't want to be a superhero because you're superhero. You're doing like 10 films. I see. You want to get in and out. Like let me be like really nasty and like really like that would be fun. But I don't want to sign a 10 year contract. Yeah. It's yeah. No, I get it. I get it. Is there like the actors and filmmakers you have worked with are again, run the gamut. Is there an actor or filmmaker you've talked

with the most that for whatever reason just it hasn't happened yet like the timing hasn't worked out I mean everybody everybody I'm sure but there's one jump out that you're like I can't believe I'm already I'm into this career this many years and it still hasn't when are the one the hell are we going to actually step in front of a camera together um well Gary Oldman in some sense because I mean he's in lawless but we don't have any scenes together right and um um uh I mean, I got to work with Ava, which was great on, um, um, we did the, the Beyonce and Jay Z video together. Right. Um, but like that also too, like to get some, my teeth into something.

Right. Uh, I've talked to so many filmmakers and we keep like circling each other, but, um, I mean, there's a lot I want, I want to work with. But I also, I want to work with filmmakers who are interested in telling, dynamic stories about women. I don't have to be the lead. I did three weeks on a most violent year, you know, but that is a fucking interesting character, right? Yeah. Come on. And so I'm happy to show it for a couple weeks, but just give me something to do. What about where are you at with, it seems like the production company is firing in all cylinders. You've got guys have a lot going on. What have you learned the most since you launched probably what five or six years ago when you were

we're starting to really get intent on producing. What's been the biggest learning curve, biggest takeaway? It's, there's always a problem. And also I will say this, oh, this is terrible to say, it's taught me a lot about actors. Oh, wow.

There are situations, I'm like, wow, like especially in terms of schedules or whatever. Now I know I'm like, okay, I have a lot of empathy for producers when we're trying to fit a schedule, someone has to like okay i have to be out by this date sure that's not an easy thing to do yeah and so i have a lot of empathy now uh on upcoming projects anytime i'm coming on to someone else's film like how can i help you make it less stressful because um i've been in situations where it's like

wow so this is what the other side is like was i know there are probably a number of obvious reasons why you started producing was part of it just also in the early going like realizing how important it was to have a seat of the creative table and and yeah i mean it was also to do whatever i could to support i mean it was in 2014 i think is when i started thinking about it and this idea of have when you when you have more power you have more say of like writers and directors you don't usually have final say because that's the financier yeah but you can push in a different kind of way also in terms of developing stories for Tammy Fay, it was important for me and because also my company is producing it and because

I'm so involved in the development, I didn't want it to be, you know, I didn't want it to be tabloidy and create a trauma. And I read an article where Jessica Hahn was like, I'm so tired of being associated with this and I want it to go away. And I was like, there is no way we should focus on that in our film because also Tammy never met Jessica. And why would we risk re-traumatizing someone. Sure. And I think that that definitely comes, like if I was the actress saying that,

that doesn't have as much pull as the actress producer saying that. Where are you at with, as I was going to say, a fellow cinephile, but I had to turn in my card earlier in this conversation? As one cinephile in this conversation. Have you seen one Bergman film? Are you really going to put me on the spot and go there?

That's a no. Wow. Wow, Josh. Josh, I thought we were so close. So too. Well, at least I still have Michael Shannon. You adore film as much as I do, apparently more. It must be, I mean, a lot of the films that I look back on the resume in the current climate, I don't know if they're going to be in theaters in 2021. Does take shelter get into a movie theater?

He does Tree of Life. Like, are you, where are you at in terms of your pessimism or optimism about a theatrical experience? I'm 100% optimist on everything, and especially for theaters. I mean, before the pandemic, I love going to the movie theater. And I would go, and there would be hardly any people in the theater, right? That's before the pandemic. So what's exciting now is when this is over, if movie theaters become more of a, like, a night out, I'm sick of sitting on my couch and watching things at home.

and where I can pause and, like, go get a, you know, shake or whatever I want, popcorn, whatever I want. Be the social media influencer that you are. Exactly. So I'm, like, sick of that. I'm ready to, like, go to a dinner and go to a movie theater. I want to get back into society. I want to sit and watch a comedy with a bunch of strangers. I want to, that's what I long for.

And so I do feel like this year and a half and possibly two years of being denied it. I mean, what you're denied is only going to make your desire stronger in some sense. Right. So I think we're going to go back to the movie theater, but in a stronger way than we were before the pandemic. One film that's still to come, delayed like many, but for various reasons, including a global pandemic, is your latest collaboration with Simon, 355. So has that extra time given you guys more time to kind of cook it in the edit room, make it more to your satisfaction? How are you feeling about it?

Because this is a big swing, obviously. It's a big swing because all the actresses on the movie. I mean, we're like the owners of it. We created it. We financed it by, you know, showing up in can and linking arms. And I don't know that anything's ever been done like this. So it's a big swing because it can change the way movies are made and it can change the idea of artists owning their work.

But it doesn't, for me, because of the pandemic, because who knows, Who knows how busy the theaters are going to be in January? If people are feeling safe to go or what? I'm not saying it like, oh, it has to make this much money to succeed. The fact that we made this movie, if anyone sees it and they like it, it's a big deal. You know, it's a huge deal because it really, it's like shocking. You know, I started in the industry 10 years ago, and the industry I started is so different than the industry that I'm working in now. and it's going to continue to change.

But the idea that actresses who, when I started, it was like, oh, these actresses are being thrown away because they're no longer valuable. Well, who's deciding this? Some executive in some office somewhere, when the reality is, these, you know, the audience dictates who they want to see. And the audience dictating that made us able to raise the money to make the film.

And then that helps the actors and the artists own their work. So for me, it's a huge, huge deal and I'm excited to see you push to the side where they rightfully belong, Edgar Ramirez and Sebastian Stan and just have them be the arm candy that they should be. I'm so excited. I mean, they're so gorgeous in our movie. I have to say, it's really, like literally everyone, like Penelope walks on screen and you're like, are you kidding me?

Undeniable, I'm sure. I can't wait to check it out. You still texting our buddy Al Pacino? How's the text chain? Yeah. He's good. He's good. He's good. I texted him. I mean, no, this was a long time ago, actually. But it's one of the funniest texting and calls I had with him. So I called him on his 80th birthday to wish him a happy birthday. And he was like, and we're all in quarantine. He's like, Jessica, they had a parade outside my house. they had like cars like drive by with people to wish him a happy birthday it's like for like the six-year-old like the nephew like you're like they all come the little I know he's just like literally the best really he's such a mention he's on the podcast twice over the years by the way this is your first just saying you know what don't give me shit I started in the very beginning doing sketches with you

before. Anyone else? And not only that, you are the very first, I don't know if you even know you know this, the very first happy, say, I confused photo that was ever taken, you, Jessica. Thank you. Every time you've asked, except during the pandemic when I was like, the last thing I want to do right now is do any press when I don't have a movie coming out, but every time you've asked, I have been there, I've shown up, I've made sad faces, I've made confused faces, I've gone crazy with McAvoy and Tom Hiddleston for you. I've got, talked to Al Pacino about you. And listen, I've done finger guns.

I adore you. If it wasn't clear, you're the best. Oh, wait, what? What happened? I'm sorry, are you cut out for a second? What did you say? You want that on the record? I said, you're the best, and I adore you.

And I'm going to let you go. And I hope to see you in person in the city that never sleeps. You're back home. I take it. You're in New York. Yeah. I, by the way, I love the Ben Lyons catching you in the park. You can do that next time.

Oh, God. It's good to see you, buddy. Have a good one, okay? Thank you. Okay. Bye, Josh. How's it going, Alicia? Good.

Yeah. Yeah. Yeah, I'm in Paris. which is nice but can't complain there this is so I don't know about you Alicia welcome first of all welcome back to the podcast it's um I've lost all sense of time because I was like I just talked to Alicia like three months ago and then I looked and I'm like oh that was a year ago so I don't know how you're feeling but yeah I actually someone asked me how old I was the other day and I missed a year that's just that's just shows it's like COVID I don't remember

I have a ton that year that year just went away Well, while it was a pretty rough year for a lot of us, congratulations. You've had some good things happen in the last year, so I'm happy for you and Michael. I hope you guys are doing well. So let's talk. Okay, you've got a lot going on. Blue Bayou, a great new film. You know, my friend, you don't always have to release like three movies at once. This is back to the early Elysia Bacander days. Yeah, well, you know, it's kind of the thing, but then I'm kind of away for a while. Right. And then they, you know, which, you know, it's quite nice. I think it could be, you know, a good thing to kind of disappear. And then people can be introduced to you again. Right.

But yeah, that's the thing. I made those films, you know, in two different years. But obviously because of this past year, they all had their release dates. reshuffled. And now they ended up coming out at the same time. And now an embarrassment of riches. And they're all excellent. Blue Bayou is a really special piece of work. And I'm, you know, like there are certain kinds of movies where it's like, to me, it's like, oh, it's obvious how someone like you would end up in them. And frankly, something like Blue Bayou, it's kind of a miracle, a film like this gets released, gets made. And I'm kind of fascinated by like how you end up in something like this, which is a relatively small slice of life.

Yeah, it's a very small, I think what I end up like doing next or, you know, it kind of changes all the time. It's like I like being very in the moment when I choose my project. It can be what I've come off of, like if I've been on a big film, what I feel like doing next or what kind of part of my own life I'm in at the moment. And with this film, I had seen Goop. That was Justin at John's first film when it came out of Sundance a few years back. And it was immediately, like, got on my radar. I was like, who's this guy? Right.

And he made this beautiful film for like 200 grand. And I was also just impressed to see, you know, the work he had done. He is Korean American, which, you know, tragically have put him in a situation where he didn't get much work. I hope that's changing right now but he kind of took it in his own hands and it's like I still want to make films I'm going to write them and I'm going to direct them and acting them

and he just knocked it out of the box I thought and I agree and I kind of talked about him with my team and then a few years back it was like it was one of my agency said well he's making another film and I don't think it was like a thing I want to read it

you know and I did and I was like I want to have a chat with him and also it was a part that it's interesting throughout my career in the beginning it was like interesting because people are like well you have a bit of a British accent and you played queens and princes in some films so you must come from a very posh background yourself you know and it's not at all how I grew up uh more about working you know class family in a smaller town in Sweden and And I've always been interested in America, American culture, and to tell, and to know maybe the stories that are not often get their light shined upon them. And I read this and had an amazing chat with Justin.

And also for him to say, you know, I think you would be so amazing in this part. And I was like, yeah, that's not a part that people would normally go to me with. Yeah. So, you know, yes, I ended up in a very small film, but it was also nice for me to get someone who said, yeah, this is what you can do. And I very much felt like I related with this character and the story and also felt like it was a very important one in the sense that I had no clue myself before reading the script, the situation that so many of these adoptions.

children who've gone through, not only in America, but around the world, apparently. It feels, I mean, you know, a story like this has to feel authentic, and it clearly, you know, Justin feels very close to this material, and yet you said it yourself. It's a great demonstration of what he can do in all aspects of filmmaking and kudos to him for getting this to the finish line. When you're in this environment, you know, you kind of alluded to this, like, yes, this is not the kind of part I've seen you in before. That's what any actor would want. want to stretch. Does it feel like you're, when you're in this environment, surrounded? I assume you shot, did you shoot in Louisiana or somewhere close?

Yeah, we were in the world. So that has to help. And yeah, of course. And for me, it was, you know, I ended up going there a few weeks before. I mean, from us having that chat, actually, I was, I think it was in Bulgaria when we first zoomed and I called my team and said, which is maybe not the procedure normally, but it's such a small phone's address. I was like, we had a great chat.

I think, you know, we said we're going to, I want to, we're going to do it. I want to do it. So you just figure it out now. And I think, and then it was like, I think he went out to prep like so closely after that course. I mean, it went really fast. And then, you know, I try to go out there as soon as I could. And, you know, with the accent too.

That was, it was so amazing to see how, you know, the culture and it's so violent. vibrant out there. I mean, the music and the food is incredible, but then also to see just how, I mean, when I was just prepping my accent, I didn't, I asked like two people who to me had completely different sounds and they were both from there. And it just shows, you know, kind of the diversity of that city. And so, yeah, I, I don't think we could have shot it anywhere else. I think that the place itself is kind of a very strong. character. Absolutely. You know, it just oozes reality from it. Is the icing on the cake of something like this a chance to sing? I don't think I've seen you sing on screen. No. So I'm not a thing. I think it was the one thing in the script. And I mean, at least a Linda Ronstart version of Blue Byer that I knew. I mean, I was like, that's not an easy song. It's not the one I would, because I do love karaoke, but it's not the song I would go for that. I must say.

And I kind of brought it up and it was like, I don't think that end, that conversation did not end up going anywhere. I think Justin meets you. I mean, it's the name of the film.

I was like, yeah. Would you mind just retitling the film for me? I was like, and I tell you, I was, you know, I was singing that in the shower

and at home and I had it on like repeat constantly that song. And then on the day, it was, I mean, somewhere in Louisiana, New Orleans it's boiling hot except for this one night when we do this garden party scene and it's like freezing something happened that night and I mean I'm in the summer dress and it's I think it's

like the last shot of the day is me singing and I've been walking around like this waiting all day yeah and then it's a big group of extras and I go up on that stage and something happens that I don't think it's happened since I think it happened and I remember it when I shot Anna Koranana, which was one of my first English-speaking roles then. I was so nervous that I didn't know what to do. I was like, all was vomiting. And I got up on that stage that my character does. And then I looked down on my hand, and it's like shaking.

And I literally, like, I was talking to myself. I was like, wow, Elizabeth, you are really nervous. This has not happened. You know, this is your job. Come on now. Yeah. Yeah. So come on that.

And, but then, you know, we shot it and actually after like two, three takes, I warmed into it and then I kind of just like, I was like, I couldn't do one more now. No, but then, you know, I was really, when I was going to, when I saw a cut for the first time of the film, it was really one of those things, oh, this scene is coming up now. But it's cool because in the end, I think it's my favorite scene in the film. And much to do. And I felt it when we were shooting it, too. It's that thing when, you know,

this couple is going through a very traumatic time. Yeah. At the stage in the film. And very often it's very hard, you know, for people to put two words when you're going through something because it's hard to say, know what to say, and for the words actually to be as profound as the thing you feel. Yeah.

And then doing it by singing a song, might actually be an easier and simple way and more direct way of doing it. And that's kind of what it turned out to be. Do you get nervous showing a scene like that to friends and family? I mean, again, you really worked yourself up into a moment knowing there was a lot,

you're putting yourself out there. No, I think because when I saw it, I really, I mean, and I feel like I said, I felt it when we were shooting it. But seeing it, it really works. And I can see that it's kind of the time when these two characters meet and they, you know, can lock eyes

and everything is said suddenly through this simple song. I love that also. So I've met Justin once or twice and like the journey that he's been on. Like I talked to him in the Twilight days back in the like when his career was just getting. I remember him in Twilight. I was gonna say, did you, did you watch Twilight?

twilight back then like was did that cross your yeah yeah no i remember him yeah were you were you team edward team jacob did you have an allegiance that i that i wasn't really not that invested no not too late it's not too no it's okay this was my life for like five years at mtv when the world sank or swam have you ever been allowed to say what wow that would be quite an exclusive to get to get out of me now. I mean, I love them both. Don't make me choose. I've spent more time with Robert Pattinson,

so maybe I have to go Team Edward, okay? Cool. I got you to say it. I love it. You got it out of me. Got it out of me. But you alluded to the other, I mean, look, it's a beautiful film. It's also, it's an upsetting film to watch at times.

I mean, it's really, you know, it shines a light on the bigotry and racism that's really an underbuburn. in American society, but not just America. I mean, it's a sadly very relevant film for our times. Is that something that weighed on you and the cast as you were... I assume like when you make something like this, you're talking about the issues that it's confronting

while you're making it, right now. And you realize that there were stories from people and that it's not an American issue. That's something that happens, you know, everywhere. and you know when I read the script the first time I couldn't believe that legally this could happen yeah and then you understand that there's been thousands of children that have been deported from their home and from their own well home country yeah that is so yeah I think making this film it was it was not a way of us not talking about those issues on that.

It was clearly a part of why we all wanted to make it. Yeah. On a much different note, you also pop up in a couple of performances in The Green Knight. David Lauer. Very different. It's hard to segue into that one, except it shares you. But it does share another passionate, interesting filmmaker, Justin, obviously, that was a labor of love for him, Blue Bayou.

And everything that David Lowry touches is very singular. And his take on that kind of Arthurian tale really has resonated with folks that have seen it. Is he a filmmaker that, again, you kind of chase in a way, like when David Lowry's making something like... Yeah, I wanted to meet him, and we ended up just having a chat. And then we got to know each other. and then I don't know it was the first time we met or later on that he mentioned that he was like yeah and I'm I'm trying to adapt this poem and I mean I immediately had a hunch it being him but I remember when he sent me the script and I was just kind of blown away and amazed and knew that you know no one else didn't do that but we've had so many adaptions in one way of the poems that are the nights around the round table. But no one has ever tried to kind of adapt the poem as a poem,

you know, being as literary in one way and as what he tried to do with this. It's as open to interpretation and kind of. magical as the poem. And I love that the conversations I've had so far with journalists about it, everyone seems like they come with a very separate, very personal angle to it, which is so much fun. And I think that was also a film where we ended having so many discussions about the intent or what it is we're making. And that was something I realized too. when I started to do my research, how many, like, endless essays about this poem that exists, actually, because you read online and people who've taken, like, PhDs in this subject. Well, that's what I, yeah, that's what's fascinating. I think about him always is, like, his reference points is such, like, a unique blend of things. Like, he loves, like, you know, the stuff that about his age, I think, like, things like Willow and, like, really kind of, like, mainstream kind of sci-fi and fantasy.

I can't wait to see Peter Pan. Exactly. And then he blends it with this very highbrow, very intellectual take. And it kind of just, it's on its own wavelength. And it's really, really cool. I'm always intrigued by what he's up to. When I last caught up with you, I think you were about to see your first movie in a theater. Did you end up getting a giant bucket of popcorn and seeing tenant in a theater? I thought. Yeah. You were seeing tenant. Okay. Yeah. Okay. So that that checked out. Yeah. It did happen. It's so nice to be back. have you have you what has your year of pop culture been since i've spoken with you have you been binging a lot well after that it was kind of another lockdown and portals so then i haven't i haven't been to the cinema since i think shows that i can't yeah yeah i think now uh in france here i'm i should go on some of the films i were in can should be out here now And I should practice my French and go and see in French, maybe.

But no, since then, I, you know, I've, I've continued to watch, yeah, a lot of TV series, I guess. What have you been watching? What have I even watching? Oh, my God. I know. That's one of those questions where, if somebody asks me, like, every... It's almost I watch so much, and it goes out. I was told today to watch White Lotus, so I'm very excited to see that.

Highly recommend. Yeah. Very nice, very nice. That looked good. That was a good face. I'm excited to see it. No, no. That's top of my list right now.

It's absolutely fantastic. You have a couple interesting projects you're developing right now that I just wanted to mention. Obviously, we talked last year about Tomb Raider. It continues to kind of reiterate. Now you've got another very intriguing filmmaker behind it. Misha Green from Lovecraft Country. you're feeling in a good place now, like with Misha's take on it? Is it kind of metamorphosizing into something different that you're excited about?

Yeah, the script is kind of, she's working on her right now. So I'm excited to read it and see, yeah, I hope it's still, you know, still something that the studio wants to make. But it looks like, you know, they're all working towards that. Well, we keep putting cool people on it, so that means there's interest, right? They're trying to make it work. So hopefully you'll get to the finish line there. Olivier Aceas, are you going to be working with it? I'm in the hotel.

Yeah, I just came from set right now. Oh, so you're shooting? Yeah, yeah, I'm here. I'm in like a little hotel room where I changed just now. Oh, wow. We've had a long day of shoot. Oh, amazing. So you're in Irmavep mode right now.

So how's that going? So Olivier is a fantastic filmmaker. What's it been like so far of that collaboration? Great. I've known it for a few years. I became a friend of mine. and then it's been one of those things and I wanted or hoped

that we were going to work one day and then they kind of fell into place. He said he wanted to make an adaption of his own kind of cult movie at Amabab and it's been a great experience producing it with A24 and then HBO picked it up.

It's limited and it's yeah, it's like his work it's a lot of amazing scenes with I've got the pleasure to doing a lot of long scenes you know that's what he likes shooting and then incredible actors because you can just choose people who want to come and join so it's been wonderful it's i think it's very much an an act is joy to get to do one of its films nice well when in doubt chase the the singular filmmakers and everyone we've talked to today, whether it's Justin with a Passion Project,

David Lowry or Olivier, you have a knack for that. So thank you for hiding away from set for 20 minutes to catch up with me. This is our 2021 catch-up session. Thank you. I was so happy when I saw your name on the list for these press. It's always such a pleasure. And so ends another edition of Happy, Sad, Confused.

Remember to review, rate, and subscribe to this show on iTunes or wherever you get your podcasts. I'm a big podcast person. I'm Daisy Ridley, and I definitely wasn't pressure to do this by Josh. Hey, Michael. Hey, Tom.

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