Happy Sad Confused - Kit Connor

Episode Date: April 11, 2025

At barely 21 years of age, Kit Connor is one of the youngest guests in the history of Happy Sad Confused, but to look at his resume he's off to quite the impressive start. He talks about it all from HEARTSTOPPER and his Broadway debut in ROMEO & JULIET to his life-changing experience making WARFARE. UPCOMING EVENTS! April 12th -- C2E2 events in Chicago -- ⁠⁠Tickets here⁠⁠! April 14th -- Bryce Dallas Howard In New York -- ⁠Tickets here!⁠ SUPPORT OUR SPONSORS! Quince -- Go to⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠ Quince.com/happysadco⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠ for 365 day returns and free shipping! Check out the ⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠Happy Sad Confused patreon here⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠! We've got discount codes to live events, merch, early access, exclusive episodes, video versions of the podcast, and more! Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

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batman the dark night's definitive dc comic stories adapted directly for audio for the very first time fear i have to make them afraid he's got a motorcycle get after him

or have you shot you mean blow up the building from this moment on none of you are safe new episodes every Wednesday, wherever you get your podcasts. The jobs that I've done over the last year, for example, warfare and Romeo and Juliet,

they've both been things that I haven't been sure if I could do them. And I came out at the other end and feel like a much better actor as a result. So, yeah, that's pretty exciting. Prepare your ears, humans. Happy, sad, confused begins now. Hey, guys, I'm Josh. and this is Happy Say It Confused. Today's episode is with the one and only

Kit Conner, Warfare, Romeo and Juliet, Art Stopper, and so much more. Thanks, guys, as always, for tuning in, for listening, for watching, however you're enjoying the podcast, I appreciate you guys. Before we get to Kit,

a few updates, things going on in the Happy, Say I Confused universe. Just the other day, we went out to Miami and had our first Happy Say I Confused event out there at the Miami Film Festival, the folks out there were wonderful. Paul Feig was my guest, a delight. We screened another simple

favor, his wild sequel to a simple favor. That episode will run a little bit closer to the film's release, so look out for that. We have some exciting events coming up in Chicago. If you're watching this prior to April 12th and you're in the Chicago area, come on out because I'm hosting four different events at C2E2. The link is in the show bio, but whether you're a robo-com, cop fan once upon a time, John Boyega or Breakfast Club, which we're doing a 40th anniversary reunion. Come on out, Chicago, because a lot of cool stuff coming there. And finally, the only other one I can mention is April 14th, and this might be actually sold out, even though it's a free event, but check in on the link because we have Bryce Dallas Howard in New York City at the

92nd Street while we're screening her new film she directed, called Pets, and then we're kind to have a live, happy, say, confused chat. But maybe there's a standby list, I think, if you click on the link. Okay, let's talk to the talk about the main event, which is Kit Connor. He's somebody that I know a lot of people are justifiably obsessed with because he really came not out of nowhere because he'd been working since he was a little kid, but Heartstopper, of course, the Netflix series that became kind of a mini phenomenon, has really launched him.

And since then, whether it's the wild robot, his turn in. Romeo and Juliet on stage in New York, where he and Rachel Zegler were fantastic. We talk at length about that, by the way. I mean, no, no spoilers, because Romeo and Juliet is Romeo and Juliet. But for those who don't know, this was kind of like a very modern, vibrant take on Romeo and Juliet, in which Kit, among other things, does a pull-up live on stage that gets the audience riled up. We talk about that in a bit, so there's a little context for you there. The main reason, though, Kit was catching up with me was his new film, Warfare,

which is opening in the States, I believe, Friday, April 11th. I want to say the UK the following week on the 18th. This is a really great film. I really enjoyed this one. I mean, enjoyed, it's not a fun movie by any means, but it's very well done. This is inspired by True Events. Ray Mendoza co-directed this alongside Alex Garland. Alex Garland's work probably if you watch this podcast. It is an intense war film. It's done in real

time. No music. You are plunged in with this group of young men played by the likes of Charles Melton, Cosma Jarvis, Joe Quinn, Will Polter, Michael Gandalfini. I'm missing like six others. It's a real who's who of young, talented men. And Kit is a part of that great ensemble. He's fantastic in it and just again shows the range that he's already exhibiting in his young career. So you'll be able to tell from this conversation, he's a sweet guy, very nice dude, good head on his shoulders and it's exciting to get to know him early on in his career because I know it's only going to get better from here. So without any further ado, here is his debut one happy, say I confused, enjoy me and Kit Conner.

Kit, Kit, there's no formal introduction, but welcome officially to Happy Say I Confused for the first time. Thank you so much. It has. It has. I've been looking forward to it. Same, same, buddy. Congratulations. We're talking warfare today. Always a lot going on with you. We were just talking, sort of towards the end of the press tour. But before we get to warfare, can we talk a little post-mortem on Romeo and Juliet? We can. We can. Because we're in New York. You spend a lot of time here. What's been the exit process out of that? I guess you kind of went into a big press tour, but like was it tough to let go of that important experience?

I mean, it was, you know, it was tough to say goodbye to all of it, I suppose, you know. It was like a beautiful group of people. Got to be out here for like six months, which is the dream. And obviously I do, I miss getting to do Shakespeare every day. You know, that was, that was the kind of always the highlight for me. So, yeah, it's been, it's been nice, don't get me wrong to, I always think that when you do a job, the sign is if you finish and you feel like you could do another week. Right. That's probably the right time to finish.

Right. So I feel like we finished it at just the right time before our body's completely, you know, disintegrated. But, yeah, it was amazing, man. It was really, yeah, it was really cool. I mean, yeah, I got a chance. to see it. It was also a special production, and you and Rachel killed it, and just the nature of it. And as you well know, you brought in like a really cool, like a younger audience, the energy in that theater. I see a lot of Broadway. I don't see a lot of Broadway with that kind of energy in the theater. That must have kept you guys going night after night. It was really cool. It was hard not to sort of take it for granted after a certain amount of time because there was this, you know, that kind of felt like our Broadway experience. You know, it felt like Broadway was young. in our eyes yeah but definitely in hindsight and sort of from a outside perspective it's it is kind of extraordinary what that production was able to

achieve in that way yeah bringing in such a young crowd and as you say like having that kind of energy especially in that in that theater it's in the round which is cool yeah yeah having that kind of energy in the round is is pretty unreal well did was the energy ever too much because I feel like there's always like a tipping point where like some of the audience actually actually does think they're part of the show yeah yeah I mean there was you know it's that's kind of the best thing is the fact that with theater you have you know depending on the audience it could be a completely different show and there was some nights where we just it was it was quiet as a mouse

and there was some nights where it was absolutely roaring and you just you just kind of take it as it is really like our last show was our penultimate show was on a Saturday night so that was kind of the one that we were really excited for, because it felt like we could just kind of leave everything on the floor. And then the Sunday matinee was our last show. And the audience were just, you know, they were so generous almost to a point where, you know,

the show probably was maybe 10 minutes longer than normal because it was just so much. So much, so much, yeah, so vocal. I mean, it's, it really is like such a treat to be an actor and to be able to see that kind of reaction. and yeah see the fruits of your labor I suppose who came to see the show that shocked you I'm sure you had some backstage visitors that were like wait they were there or maybe even saw them during the show that's a good question there's got to

be a few there were there were a couple that I was pretty pretty chuffed about we had well on our opening night we had Oscar Isaac who's obviously a you know good sort of friend and collaborator of sound gold right and Alex Garland as well. And borderline obsession of Rachel Zegler's too, let's just say. Yeah, yes. Yeah, probably. I seem to remember her seeing him on opening night and sort of immediately coming off stage and screaming

or something like that. Sure, that sounds about right, yeah. Yeah, but that was pretty cool. That was pretty cool to see him. I'm sure there were many, many others that I was, you know, I mean, honestly, I was just chuff that anyone came to see it. Yeah. That was always my kind of reaction was like, oh, thank you for coming.

But yeah, that was cool. And we have to address, I know you talked a lot about this. Did you anticipate the fever around the pull-up? When you were in rehearsals, we were like, this is going to be a moment in the show? I thought that it would be, my thought process behind the pull-ups, so Sam wanted me to hang from the bar. He had this image of hanging from the bar, which was always going to be something, I think. And there was something exciting about that.

But then again, my thought process as an actor was thinking, like, you know, the whole point of the scene is Romeo is trying to get up to Juliet. He's trying to, he's trying to be with her. So if I'm, I was thinking, if I'm hanging there, I would try and kiss her. You know, I would try and do that. So there was a point where I was thinking, am I going to be able to do that? And then it became something that was, you know, a possibility. So I just thought it was actually a really beautiful way to kind of bookend the scene. Right.

But I didn't anticipate it to be sort of what it ended up being. Right. And we had that first, I remember we had our first, I think, our first sort of open dress. And it was absurd. Like I just, I remember jumping up and captain the bar. and it was just like this this scream of excitement from the audience

and I just thought oh wow I didn't expect that to be instinctive they couldn't control themselves it was just I don't know about that they just heard me scream that night yeah I mean I thought it was you yeah I have a high-pitched scream that's very unique exactly exactly

no but it was and then the pull-up was just yeah I actually I never got bored of it a lot of the time when those things kind of really gain some traction and become a bit of a moment in the play, I feel like maybe a bit of resentment can build, but it never did for me with the pull-up. I think I actually, just because I also, that was kind of my idea, and I was like, I like it. I still like it as a decision.

Yeah, and creatively you're right. It makes sense. It's not like you're just showing off like, yeah, I go to the gym. You know, it actually narratively makes sense. I think maybe sometimes it did come across that way, but, hey, when you started to do 10 of them, it was like, okay, we get it. Yeah, when I was doing it with one hand, that was a bit much. No, yeah, it was, I still, I'm, like, I like talking about that bit,

because I think it's a nice, a nice moment. Yeah, well, set apart among many things about that production. Now coming off of it, I don't know if you, like, looked at other Romeo's going in, But is there, like, if you inevitably run into Leo, that's like a conversation you can actually now have. Yeah, yeah. I mean, like, I mean, so many, that's kind of one of the beauties, again, of the role is that so many people, like, so many of my heroes have played it and so many people that I respect. Did you resist looking at stuff like that?

I'm sure you'd seen the Basel Orman film, but did you, of course, did you go back and look again, or were you like, I need to start fresh and do my own thing? I tried to stay away. You know, I was also very tempted to watch the production in London, because that was happening while I was shooting warfare and while I was prepping for the play. So I was sort of, I was thinking, oh, mate, I'd love to go and see it. But then I thought, would it affect me in some way? Would it affect my performance or just give me unnecessary amounts of anxiety? I don't know. So I tried to stay away.

But I'd seen, obviously, I'd seen, you know, the Josh O'Connor. Romeo, I'd seen a good few renditions of it before the fact. Okay, so, I mean, it's kind of very telling, I think, for an actor to talk about a one-two punch, like Romeo and Juliet on Broadway, and then something like Warfare from Ray Mendoza and Alex Carlin. I mean, this is like, obviously, the material couldn't be more different, but it really speaks to the kind of opportunities you're getting, the kind of things you're gravitating towards. This is a phenomenal piece of work. I'm sure you're an Alex Carlin fan. We all are. This guy knows what he's doing.

to be um so talk to me a little bit about like you know in the last couple years especially you for the first time in your career are getting choices like you're you're being able to steer your own ship yeah so talk to me a little bit about where you've been at and kind of choosing to do Broadway choosing to do an Alex Scarlin film what's been your guiding force guiding light as you kind of try to steer your career in this this period good question I suppose you know What I've been saying a lot recently is kind of my, my ethos in terms of my direction and the choices that I'm trying to make is all about, you know, variety and stretching myself as much as possible, kind of going in different directions, doing super, super, super different projects and working with super different people with, you know, like one of the most refreshing things about warfare was it was a whole new process. We shot that film in a way that I certainly. had never worked before and I don't know if many have period yeah exactly but even

outside of the boot camp which is obviously unorthodox there was just something about the ethos on that set and the the energy behind that that was really kind of anti-Hollywood in a way and anti the way that a normal film set would would operate so that was really refreshing and then going and doing Romeo. Juliet, for example, was a whole new, you know, a whole new... I mean, that's a test. You're testing yourself in both of these cases in different ways. Yeah, I wanted to be able to know if I could do it. And if I didn't, then I, if I didn't feel like I could by the end of it, then I probably would have been like, okay, let's go back to the drawing board and, you know, maybe see what else we can do. Luckily, we can say two-for-two

amazing. Yeah. But I mean, and to educate the alliance a little bit on warfare, this is an amazing ensemble of young actors and that's part of it it's like I think you're alluding to this kind of everyone has to leave their ego at the door to a degree because you're all like kind of at very similar stages of like getting all these amazing opportunities yeah yeah there's Centineo Charles Melton Cosmo Jarvis Joe Quinn I'm missing like six others yeah um when I mean are there nerves going into that atmosphere this is like you know a lot of testosterone a lot of guys that like have accomplished a lot that could argue they are the alpha

I mean, how quickly does that go away when you enter a situation like this? It's interesting with warfare, because I did have those kind of nerves going in. You know, there were plenty of things that could have gone wrong. And also, again, I had, you know, the classic sort of imposter syndrome of do I deserve to be here? You're the youngest in the group. Youngest in the group? Am I going to fit in? Like, am I good enough to be able to kind of keep up with these guys?

But I remember I often get quite nervous sort of in the drive into the first day. Right. Or something like that. It's all the anticipation until you're actually there. Exactly. And I remember the day before our first day of boot camp, I was in the car on the way to our hotel that we were all going to stay at for the next two months. And I wasn't nervous for some reason.

I still don't really know why, but I wasn't nervous. And then that first day that we all spent together at the hotel, getting to know each other a little bit, and we ended up, you know, book-ending it with shaving our heads that night. Right. There was a real moment where I was thinking, oh, yeah, these guys are really, really cool, really lovely. I feel like we're going to really all get on. And I had this feeling, like, this is going to be something really special that's going to stick with me for a while. Yeah.

Except for Poulter. He's got an awful reputation as well. He really might be the nicest human being on the planet. It's kind of insane. He is. He is. He's like I had heard and I'd met him a couple times before and he had been like so unbelievably lovely to me and we met again a final time right before warfare just to kind of talk it through and see what just again get to know each other a little bit better.

And he does have that reputation of being like the kind of nicest guy in Hollywood. and unfortunately it's unbelievably true he is you're giving him a run for the money you're pretty nice yourself don't worry it's if I can be half as nice as him then that will be an achievement because he is he's he's he's just an incredibly good man yeah with with so much love and so humble I mean he is unbelievable in this film I know are you all are have you seen him in Detroit I mean playing most despicable yeah he ever like he's he's amazing Amazing. I really don't think, you know, it's all the Death of Unicorn as well. He's just, like, hilarious. He can do everything. And to be that talented and also that just incredibly kind and humble is something that I, yeah, one of the things about warfare that I have taken away the most, I think, is the fact that I now have this just group of role models that I can kind of look up to in different ways. And they all have.

different things that they can kind of teach me and with him he can teach me a lot but I think paramount is just how how good of a person he is I mean and you all have this marker forever the experience and also again this very pivotal interesting point in your careers it's one of those films that like we were all gonna look back at like that was that group at that time somehow they got collected them all together it's crazy this exists it's pretty cool it is pretty cool I'm Amy Nicholson, the film critic for the LA Times. And I'm Paul Shear, an actor, writer, and director.

You might know me from The League, Veep, or my non-eligible for Academy Award role in Twisters. We come together to host Unspool, a podcast where we talk about good movies, critical hits. Fan favorites, must-season, and Casey Mistoms. We're talking Parasite the Home Alone. From Greece to the Dark Night. So if you love movies like we do, come along on our cinematic adventure. Listen to Unspooled wherever you get. your podcast. And don't forget to hit the follow button.

Hey, Michael. Hey, Tom. Well, big news to share it, right? Yes, huge, monumental, earth-shaking. Heartbeat sound effect, big. Mait is back. That's right. After a brief snack nap. We're coming back. We're picking snacks. We're eating snacks.

We're raiding snacks. Like the snackologist we were born to be. Mates is back. Mike and Tom, eat snacks. Wherever you get your podcast. Yes. Unless you get them from a snack machine, in which case, call us. You all shave each other's head, so it's kind of both for the film, obviously, but also a bonding exercise, I would imagine. So whose head was your responsibility,

whose head did you put, whose responsibility was Kit Conner's head? So my head was mostly shaved. We all kind of did a little bit. We took turns so a lot of people would get shaved by maybe two people. I got shaved by Charles Melton and I believe it was either Will or Michael. Michael Gandalfini. Yeah, it was one of those really that I remember it was a really silly moment because Will had already shaved his head prior to it. So he was sort of just there for the ride and we'd all kind of gotten a bit excited and we all went into Charles's hotel room and you know he because he had the clippers and everything and i remember we were obviously making so much noise that will had heard from his room and like knocked on the door and just came in

so there was something immediately we were like kids you know there was just something really exciting about oh god we're going to do this this is going to be uh you know this is the beginning of it all um but yeah no charles charles shaved mine and i and i I think maybe Michael. And I believe return the favor with Charles. And who else? I think I also had a hand in Michaels as well. That's a lot of responsibility with these beautiful men.

You don't want to destroy. Beautiful, beautiful hair. And there was something slightly, I'm going to say it was something slightly wrong about it, but it didn't feel wrong. It felt great. I mean, we also had no skill in it. So I remember when I first had my head shape,

and I looked in the mirror, I was like, oh, wow, that's not good. I was like, that's really not a good look. And then, luckily, we went to the hair and makeup trailer. Can you clean us up a little bit? In the coming days, and we're able to. But those first couple days of boot camp, we were all looking like we had, yeah, sort of hand-snipped it ourselves, which was pretty rough. And what's the sort of, is the tattoo thing for real? Did you all get board of the ring style?

We did, yeah. I mean, again, this is funny because we, most of us had got it aside from Will, Joe and Finn Bennett, who had all kind of had their own reasons to, some of them just weren't there at the time that we were doing it and never got round to it. Some of them had their own reasons not to do it, but over the course of this press tour, I saw Will revealed it during one of the interviews of Charles, yeah, Joe revealed it, Finn, we did it on like Sunset Boulevard at about 2.30 in the morning, we just kind of piled into this tattoo parlor and he got his So that I think means that we've all got it now, which is pretty, which is pretty...

Your first tattoo, or are you a tattoo guy? My first tattoo. Had you ever considered a tattoo before? I was always, like, open to the idea, but again, I'm kind of, especially as an actor, you... Sure. I feel like you either do it or you don't. And I think if I was going to do it, then it had to be in a place that was, that I could hide it and stuff like that. Do I want to ask where it is?

Right here. I can show you. It's, there we are. Wow, calling me. Amazing. I also like mine because I don't have to take my trousers off to show people, which most of the others have to. There's a great picture of us all standing in the street in London

right after we got it, and we were all showing it off. So you got like half of these guys with their sort of trousers, like, just down to here. And you get to just flex. And I just get to do a little flex of the bicep, which is always nice. It's my favorite thing to do. Yeah, if you found any commonality in your career, clearly, that's it. Again, the nature of the film, I'm fascinated by this, and I think people will be when they see it. This is essentially in real time, this plunges you right into this unit, and it's a challenge.

It's kind of an interesting thing because, like, there's no backstory for these characters. It's like, we're just, like, there. And through the process of seeing this horrific incident, we kind of learn as we go who you all are. Did you find that, like, an interesting, I don't know, just an interesting challenge. like, how am I going to convey who this guy is just by action? And there's no, like, stopping of, like, telling long stories about how I got here. It's just all through the moment. Yeah, that was kind of one of the exciting things about it was the fact that the script was

completely void of emotion and character in that way. You know, there wasn't, it wasn't trying to do anything like that. The film also doesn't, the finished product doesn't try to, you know, we don't have. have any score. We don't have, as you say, really any kind of backstory or really character development. The filmmakers, you know, Alex and Ray aren't trying to, they're not trying to kind of manipulate the audience into feeling any type of specific way. They're just presenting the facts. So I think the fact that there's no backstory and things like that is very much intentional because it's it's not trying to make you root for these characters any more than

than then then you want to right away um and it just means that you see these characters go through the hour and a half event and um kind of just feel however you want to feel about it and feel however the the the however you respond to it right so from an acting perspective obviously we had to do that work of filling in the gaps almost and connecting the dots in terms of differentiating our characters kind of just discovering who these guys were right and who they are so that was really cool I mean when I remember when I first read the script I maybe had five five lines on the page wow and it didn't matter because I was like this is also I was just like I really want to be a part of this either way but but you could see that there was you know most

characters didn't have many lines it was just their presence in that in that in that moment and I think that that that's why it's such an ensemble piece I think because there isn't really a lead necessarily maybe DeFaro playing Ray but it's kind of just a Roman camera seeing everyone yeah it's really unique and I mean like to your point like I could hour in And I'm like, I think I saw Charles Melton, but where's Charles Melton? And then, like, without ruining anything, he's amazing in it. Like, the third act, like, fantastic.

And it's also to your point of kind of stripping it back, I was really emotional by the end. It's a very emotional thing that kind of like you're with these guys and, you know, the selflessness, the taking care of each other, it works. It's an experimental film in a way. It's a big swing. And it's really unique. We've all seen a lot of war films, this is a special one. I think, yeah, I mean, it's a love story in a lot of ways. It was always a love letter from Ray to Elliot, who obviously was kind of one of the reasons

for making the film necessarily, because obviously he played by Cosmo Jarvis, he can't remember what happened, and it was obviously a monumental kind of moment in his life. So that was kind of fascinating and seeing that the way that it all played out. But we, yeah, you just, I think it was our job as the actors to kind of find the humans in it. When you're training to be able to play a Navy SEAL, you know, that was what Ray really kind of taught us was how a Navy SEAL would act in this. situation and then we the next job was then to work out how a human would react in those in those situations and then kind of merging the two sure sure which was a really fascinating process all right so luxury of time let's do

a little bit of the back story the Kid Connor backstory so like talk to me a little bit about growing up you know talk to your parents talk to friends and family was it obvious early on that you were you had this in you because it's From all accounts, you were a shy kid. Yeah, yeah. I very much was. I think I am still in a lot of ways. But I was a shy kid until you got me.

Right. Kind of until you got to know me or until I was in a situation where I was kind of comfortable and then I was really loud and obnoxious. Yeah, apparently I was one of those kids that got naked a lot. Okay. There he goes again. Are off. Yeah, yeah. Yeah, one of the, yeah. Like, we'd have like a babysitter coming and, you know, interviewing for a job. And I'd be just, like, running around naked and probably too old to be doing that as well. Not even like a, not even like a baby. Right. But, yeah, so I think maybe there was that sort of their present for the people who really knew me. But yeah, I mean, my parents sent me to this Saturday stage school as a way of maybe letting that out a bit more. And it just kind of happened.

You know, I don't think I even really discovered my love for it until I really got a closer look at it. You know, I started with commercials and was just, at that point, it was just you kind of have to look cute. And I think, you know, people would say you can kind of take direction relatively well, which at that point was, you know, be happy, be sad. Right. Look at the, look at this bar of chocolate and smile, you know, that kind of thing. I can do that. Yeah. Yeah, and it was, and it was, you know, there was an art to it, but it was, it was kind of just this really simple, and it was a bit of fun.

And then it became something more, and I think I was surrounded by incredibly talented actors and filmmakers and people like that. And that, I think, inspired my love for it to a point where now I'm, like, completely obsessed with it. I am obsessed with that kind of transition because I've talked to a lot of young performers, you know, I've done. know like L. Fanning since she was 11 and like see like the folks that kind of like you're right like child performers often is a very like naturalistic thing you're just kind of like putting the camera on them and letting them be in the moment yeah but there has to be craft at some point that kind of enters into it so when you become less cute well the ratio of cute exactly exactly yeah can you awkward teenage phase what yeah so

was there a project or two that was a tipping point for you where you're like I got actually kind of bring the game up a little bit to compete yeah yeah I think that I was kind of doing two films at once in like maybe 2018 I was doing Rocket Man right and a film called little Joe two polar opposite films and very different scales and you know very different filmmakers and but I think that both of them required a bit more particularly little Joe just because it was a little bit more heady and a you know a bit more of a maybe a bit more of a character piece in a way and that that did kind of require a bit more thought you know and the way that we kind of approached it as

actors and the way that Jessica Hasma approached it as a director was was very yeah it was it was very unorthodox in a way but it was it was it was it was really cool to kind of be there and I think that was probably my first taste of the craft you know when when Heart Stopper comes around is that just one of a sea of opportunities or did you put a lot of thought and effort into going after that at the time it's interesting I I had been taking a break from acting just before heartstopper heartstopper was really my first job out of out of that break I took a break from my GCSEs which is you know the kind of British

exams that you take when you're about 16. So I'd taken a break for the lead up to that and then COVID hit. So it was, it was, that break became a lot longer. Yeah. And maybe I'd done a couple jobs throughout COVID to kind of dip my toes back in of like little theater workshops and stuff. But then I did, I did, you know, I got that audition through for Heart Stopper and it was just, you know, this really beautiful story and this really beautiful character. And, uh, yeah I was kind of desperate to also just desperate to get back in back into into the into the work right so it kind of seemed like something that I you know I just really wanted to to book it basically yeah it's so funny because in many ways like and you I'm sure you know this it's like as much as you go after cool stuff and you want to get the cool thing like you could have just as easily been in like for every heart stopper there are six shows like that sure that are very generic yeah that dealt don't have that kind of pedigree and intentionality and don't work.

And you got the one that worked. It was very special. It's so much luck and so much, you know, just kind of you got to be thankful for everything you're given. And luckily, you know, we treated it. We didn't expect it to be like that. So there wasn't that pressure going in. There wasn't that kind of, it was just a labor of love

in a lot of ways. And I think that's kind of why it may be caught on the way that it did. And it also just hit the world at a time when I think the world kind of needed a bit of. It was definitely a comfort show, I think, during a time when we needed comfort. Yeah, exactly, which is, which is, you know, again,

a bit of luck and also just something kind of, you know, a beautiful accident. But yeah, but even, again, with warfare, like, that was an audition. That was something that came through as a self-tape. And it was another thing that was almost similar to Hartstoper in that way that was like, this feels like another step.

in my career that I really want to take and a new direction and it was again I got lucky that it wasn't just a regular war film it's something really really special and really experimental and and yeah so I think in a in a similar way it's always everything's relative you know it always feels like you're you're the biggest you're ever going to get right and then until the next Something else going to do, oh, my God, this changes everything. This is so exciting. Goodbye, summer movies, hello fall. I'm Anthony Devaney.

And I'm his twin brother, James. We host Raiders of the Lost Podcast, the Ultimate Movie Podcast, and we are ecstatic to break down late summer and early fall releases. We have Leonardo DiCaprio leading a revolution in one battle after another, Timothy Salome playing power ping pong in Marty Supreme. Let's not forget Emma Stone and Jorgos Lantamos' Bagonia. Dwayne Johnson, he's coming for that Oscar. In The Smashing Machine, Spike Lee and Denzel teaming up again,

plus Daniel DeLewis's return from retirement. There will be plenty of blockbusters to chat about two. Tron Aries looks exceptional, plus Mortal Kombat 2, and Edgar writes, The Running Man, starring Glenn Powell. Search for Raiders of the Lost Podcast on Apple Podcasts, Spotify, and YouTube. any way you look at it. Come on, we'll stick together. Love movies? Love Classic movies? So do we.

Tick Bush Business is the podcast where classic film is discussed in modern times. Hosted by me, film journalist Kristen Lopez, and my co-host, author Emily Edwards, we dive into the golden age of cinema with fun, heart, and serious expertise. As published film historians and lifelong classic

movie buffs, we bring insider insights, deep research, and lively debates with a variety of special guests, ranging from celebrities like Holly Madison, to TCM luminaries Dave Carger and Eddie Muller and even family members of Old Hollywood Legends. Subscribe now to ticklish business on your favorite podcast app, and let's talk about Old Hollywood today. So where are you at on like, you know, the chemistry thing? Because obviously you and Joe have it. Like, can that be manufactured? You obviously like each other a lot off camera too. You get along very well.

I mean, do you remember the first couple days and being like, oh, There's something that we have a connection that's gonna that's gonna translate on screen. It's interesting. I had it's such a nuanced conversation the whole chemistry thing because like you know obviously the kind of Simple answer is is is I don't think it can be man of manufactured Yeah, but I also think that you know I remember when when when when Joe and I were first doing our kind of chemistry reads and and and I couldn't really tell I I couldn't I wasn't sure yeah, you know we didn't know each other at all we're both quite especially on first meeting we're both timid people I think we were both shitting ourselves and we were both very nervous and I was I was just kind of maybe I was too overwhelmed to to

clock whether or not there was chemistry but but but they obviously thought that there was and and you know from that I think we then began to work together and then And then it was clear that these scenes were really making sense and that we were getting on like really, really well and he's obviously become one of my, one of my closest friends. But yeah, you kind of just, yeah, it's, it is one of those things, but I don't think it can be manufactured, but I also don't think it's as simple as just, you know, you start getting to know each other and it's there. How plugged in are you at this point to kind of like there's so many fan of

That's the memes, the montage, the hives and haze montage. Like, it's literally, like, do you get that sense to you? Do you get a kick out of any of them? Well, the funny thing is, I mean, with all the highs and hayes stuff, like we were making jokes about that when we were shooting season one. Oh, really? You know, I think we were all kind of, like, we all love the show and all, like, see a lot of beauty in it. But we also, I think we're all able to laugh at ourselves, you know?

And I think that that's kind of the beauty of it. So we were, you know, making those jokes ourselves. So I kind of, yeah, it didn't surprise me at all. And especially when season one first came out, I was just like, oh, my God, this is kind of blowing up. This is crazy. And so I was very much, I was quite plugged in at that time to all of that stuff. It was cool. It was nice to see that people were not only connecting with it, but able to kind of see the fun in it as well.

Right. Yeah. And as the seasons have progressed, then it's. you know, becomes more intimate. Do you guys both have the same kind of like attitude of like, this is silly? We got to get through this kind of a thing. Like, what's your attitude as like intimacy is required on screen, which is always going to be awkward no matter what situation?

We got lucky in the sense that it was such a slow build, you know, because I think that intimacy is a, is a tricky thing. Some actors find it easier than others. And, you know, it was probably one of the first times. It wasn't the first time I'd had to do like an on-screen kiss, but it was certainly the most intimacy I'd ever had to have done by that point in my career. So I was a little bit like, oh, okay, let's just try and feel our way through it. You know, we had a great intimacy coordinator, David Daugherie,

and we were just kind of able to take steps throughout the three seasons that we've done to get closer to a point where, you know, that third season, obviously, we, you know we have sex and it's a it felt like a new step in that in that journey but definitely a very natural one I remember when I met you first in Comic-Con I lost all my nerd cred by the way in that interview because I called the the character you were being rumored for at the time was Hulkling and I said Hulking oh really like I'm a nerd and I should know that so I felt really badly hey I mean I know no better you know I think I maybe knew that name because

I'd been asked about it a couple times by friends being like, hey, are you playing this role? I was like, not that I know. So is the closest we're going to see you to a superhero from Heart Stopper in the Captain America costume? I think certainly for a while, yeah. Again, as far as I know, I very much kind of, again, Joe's, you know, doing that. And that's, I'm kind of happy to watch from the sidelines for that for a little while.

The Captain America costume suited you. You looked great. Thank you. Thank you. I mean, you know, big shoes to fill in that regard. So, yeah, it was pretty, that was fun, fun time to be able to do that. It was kind of, it was freezing, but good. So what is the plan going forward?

I mean, I actually don't see anything officially coming up for you. Yeah. I can't imagine you're not having some really exciting opportunities at your feet. Do you know kind of like the next six months a year of your professional career? I know, I know maybe, I have. I mean, one of the beauties of this industry is the fact that everything is kind of, you never take anything for granted

or anything as a guarantee, but I think I know the next few months of my career, of my life. Anything you can hint at in terms of TV, film, genre? I don't think it is. I don't think it is something that I could hint at, but I think it's, you know, I think it's exciting. I'm looking forward to doing it, you know, touch wood as long as it happens.

And then, yeah, I mean, there's lots of things that are kind of bubbling. Again, I'm trying to be quite careful with the things that I do just to make sure that it feels right. And again, it's kind of in keeping with that direction that I'm trying to go in. But almost contrary to that, I think there's a feeling of just if it feels right, then it feels right. So the direction is quite loose. Are there filmmakers and actors right now that in your mind, you're, that are doing it right, that are like, I like how they're approaching it, I'd love to be, I mean, you just knocked off like six of them, eight of them in warfare, but I'm

imagine there are a lot more out there. Yeah, I mean, there are so many. I mean, I'm, I'm a real fanboy in a lot of ways of, you know, of this job, because I respect, I mean, people like Robert Pattinson, I think is a career that I find fascinating. Totally. And, yeah, and kind of genius in a lot of ways, because because he just broke the mold completely and has been putting in amazing performances

and working with really talented directors and doing, making big swings, which is always kind of, it's harder than it kind of sounds. Everyone kind of goes, oh yeah, I'm gonna make a couple big swings and then when you get there, it's tricky. I will say because, look, I've done a lot for MTV and I was in the middle of Twilight,

like I was in the middle of Twilight. And seeing Rob, and I saw it in real time, come off of that, and do like the weirdest fucked up Kronenberg movies and and just like going after the coolest most interesting directors and much like you were saying kind of like testing himself and kind of like he knew he had something to learn yeah yeah and he kind of like put in the years and the effort and to see where he's at now it's kind of amazing yeah it's one of those things where you have to kind of uh you never really know I think there's a I can't remember who said I think it might have been Florence Pugh maybe um who's also I mean a great example example of that but she said something like if I if I know that I'm going to be able to do a role then it's probably not worth doing right or something I'd probably completely misunderstood no the principal's right that's but someone said that and I think it was Florence Pugh but that is a kind of great way of thinking about it in the sense

that if it feels like it's a like a job done I can do that easy-peasy then are you really gonna learn anything you know you are you gonna also chances are you probably won't be able to do it if you feel like that confident. Right. But I, I, it's terrifying, it's a terrifying school of thought because there's nothing scary than going on to a film set and not knowing if you're going to be able to do the job that is required of you, but there's also, you know, the, the, the rewards of that is, is unbelievable and I think the jobs that I've done over the last year,

for example, warfare and, and, and, and Juliet, they've both been things that are I haven't been sure if I could do them. And I came out at the other end and feel like a much better actor as a result. So, yeah, that's pretty exciting. But yeah, people like Rob Pattinson. Filmmakers, last thing you were, film you were obsessed with, series, anything? It's a good one. I mean, my friend Charles is making Beef Season 2, which I'm incredibly excited for.

and I think that Beage Season 1 was kind of just genuinely fantastic and unlike anything I'd kind of seen. Again, just pushing boundaries in a lot of ways. So I'm really looking forward to that. Yeah, I mean, something like, even a film like Conclave, for example, I think there's something so unbelievably impressive about being able to take a, seemingly maybe mundane or seemingly kind of...

No, I always say that basically was like Da Vinci Code just done like at the highest end possible. And not, no, you know, disrespect to the Vinci Code, which is entertaining, but like the most elevated actors writing, production design, music, every... It's just like, it purely in terms of, if you were to ask someone like, what makes a good movie, like, good writing, good directing, good acting, good cinematography, good, I mean, everything was just at its, top. And it made this feel so alive and so, so tense and just, yeah, I think it's such a testament to what classic, like, just being strong at all of those kind of fundamental things can make such an amazing movie. So I think that that's like a great example of that as well. Yeah, you want to be, by the mind, you want to surround yourself with the best and they'll make you well. Of course, of course.

We're going to wrap up with the happy say I can use profoundly random questions kit. Are you ready? I'm ready. All right. Dogs or cats? Dogs. You are a dog guy. I appreciate this about you.

Do you have one? My family, my parents have got two. Okay. So they're kind of, you know, I assume as my dogs. Okay. Names? Basil and Sybil after 40 towers. Very nice.

What do you collect, if anything? What do I collect? Good question. I like collect jackets. Okay. That's like the one bit of clothing that I really do. Uh, and not expensive ones. Right.

Just like, yeah. Um, I remember I was watching the Brutelist and it's like the worst thing to be taking out of the Brutelist, but I kept seeing really amazing like work, work, workman's jackets. Yeah. Whoa. Yeah. Certainly wasn't the only thing I took out of that. But yeah. Uh, do you have a favorite video game of all time?

Assassin's Creed. Oh, okay. Yeah, I was never a huge game of it, but my brother used to play it, and he's just sit by him and watch him play it, and then I played it myself. Nice. This is the Dakota Johnson Memorial Question. I apologize.

She asked me this once. Would you rather have a mouthful of bees or one B in your butt? One B in my butt? Yeah. That's the prevailing wisdom on that. I think so. Right? Just get it over with.

You can handle it. Yeah. I think, yeah. Yeah. What's the wallpaper on your phone? Oh, it's a picture of Michael Gandalfini. Aw, that's true. It's really crazy.

I just think it's really funny. Yeah. It kind of wakes me up every time I see it. He's going to hate me for that. No, he'll love that. Any context to that? We did like a kind of a little getaway while we were shooting warfare, all of us together.

And, yeah, in the English countryside. countryside on our last weekend before our final week of shooting and yeah just good times yeah last actor you were mistaken for robert patinson is that right at the which i never get mistaken for actors yeah but i was uh going through security at the airport and some guy goes hey uh you're that you look like that actor and i was thinking you know yeah that's me and then and then he goes from Twilight. And I was like, oh, oh, okay. I was 10 when those were made. Yeah, but I was like, even so, appreciate that, you know, thank you. And yeah, what's the worst note a director has ever given you? Worst note a director has ever given me. Um, I've had some pretty good people generally,

but I'd say that probably the worst note, the worst note. The worst, note is probably no note because I've had a done a job where we would just go take after take after take and I think it was an intentional thing to kind of instill to have a certain desired effect right but it was maddening yeah because you just think what you're in your own head you're like what about yeah yeah yeah but again I mean it worked I guess they they that director got got their intended response, but it was like, whoa. Just guessing. Yeah.

No, I get it. And finally, in the spirit of happy, second fuse, an actor who always makes you happy. You see them on screen. You're immediately happier. Oh, Willem Defoe. Oh, nice. Okay, yeah.

Movie that makes you sad. About time. Oh, that's a good. It does make me sad. Donable. It's an amazing. Yeah, that's a good one. And finally, a food that makes you confused.

You don't get it. Avocados. I feel like that's a basic answer because a lot of people say that. It's a cilantro kind of thing. It's one of those. Yeah, yeah. To me, it doesn't taste of anything. I like a guacamole.

Oh, well, that's a fascinating aspect of this. But then you've got all of this kind of other stuff going on in there, and it's maybe a different, and you would rarely just have guacamole on its own. Right. But avocados for me, yeah, it's a, it's a, I can eat. it but it's a it's a it's a struggle it's a no-go yeah it's a sort of whoa this is cold and sort of flavorless and fresh but right right yeah not that refreshing yeah okay I won't hold it against you everything else about you

you're is delightful thank you that's what Will Porter has ahead of me exactly I knew I there was a reason I love that man he was avocado yeah no man this has been a long time coming we've been talking about doing this for a while so I appreciate taking the time after a long press tour pleasure you're killed it. You're just getting started and already so many great things are happening. Congratulations on warfare. Everybody should check it out and I'll see you I'm sure on the next one. Absolutely. Can't wait. Thanks. And so ends another edition of happy, sad, confused. Remember to review, rate and subscribe to this show on iTunes or wherever you get your podcasts. I'm a big podcast person.

I'm Daisy Ridley and I definitely wasn't pressured to do this by Josh. The Old West is an iconic period of American history and full of legendary figures whose names still resonate today. Like Jesse James, Billy the Kid, and Butch and Sundance, Sitting Bull, Crazy Horse, and Geronimo, Wyatt Earp, Batmasterson, and Bass Reeves, Buffalo Bill Cody, Wild Bill Hickok, the Texas Rangers, and many more. Hear all their stories on The Legends of the Old West podcast. We'll take you to Tombstone, Deadwood, and Dodge City. to the plains, mountains, and deserts for battles between the U.S. Army and Native American warriors, to dark corners for the disaster of the Donner Party, and shining summits for achievements like the Transcontinental Railroad. We'll go back to the earliest days of explorers and mountain men, and head up through notorious Pinkerton agents and gunmen like Tom Horn.

Every episode features narrative writing and cinematic music, and there are hundreds of episodes available to binge. I'm Chris Wimmer. Find Legends of the Old West. wherever you're listening now.