Happy Sad Confused - Lauren Lapkus

Episode Date: September 24, 2019

Actor, podcaster, & master improviser Lauren Lapkus joins Josh on this episode of "Happy Sad Confused" to talk about the "Between Two Ferns" movie, giving up her SNL dreams, and why she's obsessed with "Small Wonder". Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

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or to match with a TD small business banking account manager. Prepare your ears, humans, happy, Sad, Confused begins now. Today on Happy Sad Confused, Lauren Lapkis, on improvising her way through the Between Two Ferns movie. Hey guys, I'm Josh Harowitz. Welcome to another edition of Happy, Sad, Confused. I'm Josh, you're you, and the guest today is, of course, as I said.

Lauren Lapkis, one of the funniest people around, One of the best improvisers I know in the world right now. She is always funny, whatever she does. And she is particularly funny in her new film, the Between Two Ferns movie. Or I think officially it's Between Two Ferns, the movie. It's currently on Netflix, and it is hysterical. If you've ever watched, Zach Galfinacus do his thing in those kind of shorter, funny or die videos.

This is that a little bit on steroids with just enough of a narrative. It's kind of a road trip movie. but Warren plays his producer in it she's awesome in it and it also features as you might expect an amazing amount of celebrity cameos from Paul Rudd Keanu Reeves Matthew McConaughey I don't know the list goes on and on

and those are all great but also the stuff in between with Lauren and Zach riffing are it's all just comedy gold so if you're a connoisseur of great comedy seek it out between two ferns the movie currently on Netflix. This was a blast. I didn't know Warren, but I felt like I did

because I've seen her in so much and she was as funny and smart and cool as I had hoped. So I think you guys are going to enjoy this chat. It's been a busy time for me. There's a lot going on.

It's a busy, busy film season. I'm still kind of coming off of the high and exhaustion of the Toronto Film Festival, but also now getting into things like the New York Film Festival, which is starting up in just a few days, premiering the Irishman, the three-and-a-half-hour Martin Scorsese film with

De Niro and Peschi and Al Pacino. That's going to be epic. I can't wait for that. So, yeah, just catching up on all the fall films that are starting to emerge. So, yeah, lots of exciting things. I was also, just to catch you up on my misadventures, I just had a quick trip to London, which was awesome, all too brief. I always love going there, but got a chance to do a really fun shoot with the cast of Zombiland Double Tap, Zamblyand Double Tap, which is 10 years in the making since, you know, the first Zombiland film, they've finally gotten back together, and it is all the originals. I chatted with Emma Stone, Woody Harrelson, Jesse Eisenberg, and Abigail Breslin. They were all fantastic and big fan of those four and excited for you

guys to see what was a very fun conversation there. We all gathered in in England because Emma is in the middle of making Cruella. She's starring as Cruella in kind of like the next big Disney live action film. So that was awesome. I also haven't got I haven't even talked to you guys since I did one of my favorite panels in recent memory. It's not it's not out there yet for you guys to consume but I hope I think it will. I think there will be a YouTube version of this. I went to I was invited by Netflix and the Paley Center in Los Angeles to moderate a conversation about Mind Hunter, the show on Netflix, which I love. And if you have not seen it, check it out. This is, of course, the brainchild of David Fincher. It's based on true events. It's sort of about the birth

of criminal profiling of the hunting of serial killers by the FBI. It's now in its second season. and I got a chance to moderate the panel at the Paley Center, which had Anna Torv and Holt McAllenay, Jonathan Groff, joined us via Skype, and most excitingly for me was David Fincher himself was a part of that panel. And, man, David Fincher is one of my favorite human beings on the planet. I mean, I don't know if there's a better, more consistently,

just genius filmmaker alive than David Fincher. So I've actually bizarrely had the privilege of talking to David. I think this was my fourth conversation with him over the years, which is pretty remarkable because he hates doing interviews. He does very, very few of them. And this is like, it was, it was, it was honestly a very rare opportunity. So I jumped at it and the conversation was so fun and interesting. And every moment I got to spend with the legend that is David Fincher off the stage was fantastic too. So I believe the Paley Center is going to put up kind of an excerpt. version of that conversation on YouTube soon.

I'll send it out as soon as they alert me to it. But look out for that one because, as I said, that was a very, very special treat. I think that's about it. There's a lot coming up, a lot of big movies to talk about soon. There's the Joker movie around the corner. I've got a new exciting series that I haven't told you guys about yet that is launching very, very soon. More to come on that.

I'm excited about it. But yeah, if you're a movies fan, like I'm like a diehard film buff, you'll appreciate this new project that I've been working on the last few months. So I'll probably be able to tell you about it next week. Anyway, in the meantime, remember to review, rate, and subscribe,

happy, say, I confused, spread the good word. And I hope you guys enjoy this conversation with the star of Between Two Ferns, The Movie, Ms. Lauren Lappkis. Um, it's a delight to be joined by Kristen Schall on the... No, no, no. I would have just gone with it for a full hour. I can answer anything you want about her life.

Lauren Lapkis, I'm a big fan of yours. Thanks for coming by today. Oh, thank you. Thanks for having me. Um, so yes, you were mistaken, apparently in your travels on behalf of this wonderful film for Kristen. Yes. Has that ever happened before?

Is that... Not in like a legit setting like that. Yeah. It was pretty weird. It was a Canadian live talk show. So it was just one of those things were they didn't say call me her name, but the guy was like, and I saw you on Anthony Jesselnik's show the other day. And I was going, I know that's her because I saw the commercial and she was in it. And it's obviously not me because I know I didn't do that. But I know Anthony like, I've met once. And I've seen his stand up so I could talk. I just responded to the question. I was like, if I call this man out, I think he's going to like have a panic attack. He was very like, you know, going by his checklist. And so I was. If you had deviated, he would have, like, could melt it down. It might have turned into, like, a meme, which could have been cool. I don't know. Everybody aspires to become a meme, right? Yeah, my friend sent me a really funny KTLA video of Samuel L. Jackson being mistaken

for Lawrence Fishburn, and then he goes off for, like, 10 minutes. I live for that. Yeah, it's great. I mean, I was like, I guess I could have been one of those, but I wasn't able to think, you know, in a moment of which way I wanted it to go. So did you watch the Terrence Howard interview yet? Oh, yes, I just saw that last night. That was really fascinating. Yeah, we should really all learn from him.

I'm going to be following along. Maybe he's got some answers. I think he's got the answers to the universe. These are dire times, Lauren. Don't you just love watching the interviewers just keep going as if that? And then they're like, and then you also said you had a star. I'm like, okay. So you didn't hear anything about every.

There's no gravity and that's a construct. But he is getting a star on the Walk of Fame. Wait, did you say you're getting a star? Right after you said that you can travel to Saturn in a minute? Yeah, and one thing I picked out of that was you're getting a star. Yeah, it's fascinating. I want you to know, I tried to get some dirt on you from our mutual friend, Ben Schwartz. Oh, yeah.

He wouldn't. He's a vault. It didn't sound like a vault. It sounded like there was nothing, which was upsetting. I don't think he would have any dirt on me. I have a ton on him, which I can tell you all for the next hour. Let's begin. But I love that earliest show that you guys did together.

Yeah, that was so fun. I mean, it was a Funnier Die web series that he was directing and we managed to, to make it into something that we thought was really funny and that it was also like an ad for Cabin Crunch. I mean, there was, it's like, you don't really know that. We got no money for Emmys for it. So it was kind of like, you don't typically go into doing like a branded content and think that it's going to turn into something legit.

That's what Schindler's list was, I think, at first. It was branded content. It was like a Fruit Leaps commercial. But it does occur to me you have done, you're of course here primarily to spread the good word on between two firms, the movie. Yes. but you have done a fair amount that's kind of like satirized talk shows in your career

between comedy bang bang of course and and the earliest show and now this um did you grow up like a talk show person yeah i mean i've i watched so much tv as a kid that i definitely watched all talk shows anything from like um regis and kathy lee to then like i still call it by the way yeah yeah i mean i was referring to it in the past but i do still watch now Kelly and Ryan. Yeah, they updated that like five times in the last few years. Wait, can I ask you one question on that before we move ahead? Yeah.

Have you been on Kelly and Ryan? No. Okay. If you go on it, I've always, when I watch it now, I don't watch it every day, but I'll watch it, there's something I'm interested in. I'm most fascinated by the walkout now with a high fives and everything. What would your technique be? Would you stop for high fives? Would you just go like a drone, like like a single-minded purpose and go past them?

It stresses me out to think about having to like perform something as I'm walking out. I just feel like I would fall down. Like I'm like not on purpose, but it's just my fear that it would be like too many things to keep track of while also like looking nice and being normal. Right. And getting up in that weird high chairs. Yeah.

There's a lot to deal with. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. But I always love the view and I feel like that's my like favorite. I still watch the view. And I think I could be a host like one of the ladies on the view. But I don't know that I really want to talk about all of the like news stuff all the time.

Right. Which slot because they all have kind of like they fit certain. roles. Well, like, Joy slash, like, Michelle Collins was on it briefly, and she was, like, amazing. But she's so funny that it almost doesn't work. She was on a different plane of existence. She's just so funny. Like, I mean, they're keeping it going with all these, like, hot topics, and it's a lot to balance. Okay. So growing up, what about late night shows? Did you have a favorite late night show growing up? Conan, yeah. And it was the coolest. Because I had a TV in my room that I had, like, you know, the basic stations or whatever, and I would just turn it on super late at

night once I was in bed and set my sleep timer and just fall asleep to Conan. It was like the best. And you obviously know Conan by now. You've done with Conan. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. It's crazy. I mean, so the first time I was on the show, I was like just so thrilled because it felt like surreal. Anytime that happens in this type of career, like where you get to actually do the thing that you watch forever, like, oh, that's, it's a real thing that was happening and people are just like me and they got to go on the show. It's cool. Except he's a larger than like weird, like a comic character. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. And he's, I mean, we did a sketch. together for his um comic con like he was doing like a whole comic con thing and would that was so fun

to get to just yeah so it was my group wild horses and and also with ego wodom who's on s andl now and we got to like go on some beach and like Malibu or whatever and doing a wonder woman sketch with him which was great he was so funny and that was like that was a great day because he was super chill and like hung out with us all day yeah yeah um yeah i love to see how he's kind of like reinvented like now he's like he's like focused in and all the stuff he likes to do the remotes the long from interviews for the podcast. I know. This podcast is so good.

It is so good. And I listen to it every week. It's just been so interesting with like all of these big celebrities like doing podcasts now where we're like, yeah, we know. Like, yeah, this is a medium where you can like have a lot of fun and make money and it's cool and people listen to it. And then they're like, you know, Conan invented podcasting or whatever. The whole like Twitter was a blaze. I just thought it was amazing. How long have you been doing podcasting?

Because you've got like 16 different podcasts. Yeah, I know. I've been doing it for like having my, I've had my own since 2014. but I've been like guesting since a few years before that. But like, I mean, that was still when it was weird and people didn't know what it was and you're like, I didn't know what it was. Right.

First time I was a guest on Comedy Bang Bang. I had never heard the show. I had no idea what I was doing. I just like went in and did it, but like didn't know where it went out to or who was listening. And yeah, I still don't listen to the show and people think that's crazy. But I'm like, I get it.

I was there. Is improv in a podcast form and audio only form a whole different enchilada? Or is the same kind of thing? I mean, it is. It's like something to learn. Like, it's a whole skill to adapt to, I think. I think, like, people find it, like, improvisers find it really fun to do because you can live in something for a long period of time. I mean, like, getting to do a character for a full hour and, like, have it go anywhere because you don't have any of the physical, like, reality to deal with is really fun. Like, a lot of my characters end up being, like, the size of a dollar bill or something just because it's, like, more I use it. I mean, I can do that. So, like, you can visualize that, and now that's how big I am. okay so going back a little bit so you grew up in chicago yeah i grew up in evansston right outside of chicago um right by northwestern university it's a great town so obviously a big theater and comedy town yeah yeah something that's just like you were brought to a lot as as a kid or what yeah i felt really aware of it my parents like um lived near second city before i was born and they

used to go all the time like the john balushi days and stuff like that so that there was always that like the lore of it that I was aware of. But most of my, like, love of it really came from watching TV and just, like, absorbing, like, S&L and anything I can get my hands on. So, yeah. So S&L was, as I understand, the big. Yeah, yeah. It's, like, hard for it not to be.

I think when you're, like, especially, like, in elementary school in the 90s, like, that was, like, the heyday. I mean, and it's also one of those things, too, where I kind of argue with myself about whether that was the heyday or whether I was nine. And, like, you know, like. No, totally. It's so hard to say, but I mean, I really loved all, like, Chris Farley, obviously. I mean, I think that stands the test of time.

And Adam Sandler and David Spade and all those guys were my favorites. And I just, like, wanted to be like them. I think it's kind of interesting because I, as I got older, my, I found more female comedians that I was, like, more obsessed with. But as a kid, I think there's some, and I have an older brother, I think I was really like, I want to be in the boys club and, like, be like them. So it was more natural to get obsessed with those guys. What was your idea of a great comedy film when you were a kid? Oh, my God. What's the knowledge more of Warwickus comedy films?

God, there are a lot. I mean, I guess Billy Madison was a big one. I mean, that was huge. But also, like, I really loved sort of wistful movies, like, now and then, or, like, the Babysitters Club. Those were, like, there were, of course I love the big, broad comedies, but there were a lot of, like, just girls hanging out together. that like I really...

I've never heard on this podcast now and then cited as a classic comedy. Oh my God. It's like it's not even a comedy. It's like it has funny moments. Of course I could list them for you, but it's a great movie. And it's like an age movie.

Big is my favorite movie of all time. And I love body switch movies and I love like unexpected aging. Like 17 again, 13 going on 30. Like I love all of those movies. It's funny they don't do more of those. I know. Like 17 again is like 10 years ago already.

And they just did little. And that was really cute. I really liked that. too. I love anything. I think it's really fun to watch actors play weird ages. Like, and Freaky Friday was just on TV the other day and I was like, oh, Jamie Lee Curtis. This is like a fun role. She gets to be like a teenager

and just like make fun of herself. So it's cool. No, totally. Even going back to like all of me, what Steve Martin. Oh, I've never seen that. Oh, you would love that. Oh, okay, good. A liner directed it. You would be into it. Okay, I'm right in the zone right now where I'm making a list of all the like big classes I've never seen and that's going to go on there because there are so many things that I have

just missed fully. And I mean, I mean, this is kind of embarrassing, but the Once Upon a Time in Hollywood was my first Quinn and Tarantino movie that I've ever seen. I don't know how. I watched. You're a 90s kid. I know. I missed it. I listened to the, um, the soundtrack of Pulp Fiction. Like, I know all the like soundbys. There's some dialogue in there. Yeah, yeah. I can piece together a plot from that. Um, hamburger or whatever. Yeah. I understand a big of a lot of drive-thrues in there in France. Yeah, but I've never seen any of them. So those are all. on my list. And I loved it, which was so funny. I was like, I loved. You guys should check out

this director. It really was. I was like, I love this movie. And I had eaten a gummy. So there was also that level of like, this is the perfect experience. But it was so good. And I was like, I told my family, I was like, I loved it. My dad's like, you should watch every other, like, what's wrong with you? But think of all the joy you have left in your life to experience. I mean, I do think it's kind of, I sometimes will shame people for not seeing things. But I also think like, wow, it's great. You just get to watch a great thing. solid and I have to tell you when I went to see Once Upon in Time in Hollywood

I was with my friend and we were seated in the back row of the theater and this old man came in and he was obviously very disoriented because it was too late. He missed, the lights were off. It was like he's trying to find somebody, I don't know, and he's standing there staring like at us but he can't tell that he's staring at us and so we're going to like say

something but it was like he's going to figure it out I'll give it a second and then he started walking down our aisle but he didn't know we were there. He pushed my friend's entire body and then put his hand on my face and his hand was on my face and they went, excuse me, and then he looked up, like it was coming from the projector area that someone was saying, excuse me, and not the nose that he had his hand on. And then I turned my phone light on and helped. And he immediately walked to a seat. He was perfectly fine.

I was like, this is bullshit. Like, you just, like, held my face. And now that there's a little bit of light, you're like, oh, here I am. Like, okay. And now you're dating. This is great. And that's my favorite. Yes, it's my boyfriend. So it's very romantic. It was a great meet you. One of my early brushes with fame, I got some attention was when I went to a press screening like 15 years ago or 20 years ago of Miami Vice. Yeah. And

do you know the film critic Rex Reed? Do you remember No, I don't know. So Rex Reed is a relatively well known film critic here in New York. He's been around for like 50 years. Okay. And he tried to, he's like older. He's like 70. Yeah. He tried to step over a seat behind me and he got caught in between the seats.

Oh my God. And like, it was like he was dying. Like he needed like the jaws of life. And I I recounted the story I was such an asshole in great detail on my blog at the time this was that long ago and it like got like

it went everywhere oh my god he must have been really used to like hopping over the seats his whole life as a movie critic and then one year just like he was the moment where he realized

he can't do this so what actor would you want a body switch in within a film I mean I think I would love to do that with a child because I think that that's one of the most fun things

so maybe like Jacob Tremblay or something. It's like literally the default child actor. Yeah, yeah, he's just fantastic. Jacob Trombley's like 20 now, by the way. He could play a 34-year-old woman really well. He's amazing. He's a good actor. I actually just had him, I do sketches for Comedy Central too,

and I had him do a sketch where the bit was that Daniel Day Lewis is playing Jacob Tromblay, so he played it. He played Daniel Day-Lau. He did a pretty good Daniel-D-Lis. Yeah, I'm sure he did. When he was on Billy on the street and he was like so sweet and some girl, Like, he talked to some little kid, and they were like, he's famous. He's like, it's not really different.

I go to school or, you know, whatever. He's just so normal. He's just normal. Yeah. It's just like us. He's just like. You were a child actor, right? Yeah, not on any real level.

I did like children's theater plays in my town. And it was like, I only be, I mean, truly, I got cast as roles that did not exist in the script. They were like, okay, there's actually, she's not good enough to be beauty and beauty in the beast or like even the candle or like whatever. Like, I'm like, they made me the mother wolf in, in that. play which is not a character and they would kind of cut to me and my family every so often and we were always lost in the woods yeah we kind of improvised and so it's my first time really like improvising something and getting laugh and thinking that was cool but that obviously served you

well later yeah yeah so when did you discover improv and was it love at first improv yeah I mean I was in high school I again like could not get into any school play so it was like the bane of my existence I auditioned for everything and my school like in Evanston like it's a really great town for that kind of stuff and everyone at my school was really talented truly like there were amazing actors there and people who have gone on to do amazing things like Jesse Mueller's on Broadway I mean there's like people

that are legit from my school but I couldn't get into any show even in the chorus it was like devastating and I had a teacher who cast me in like one comedic show and then he told me I should do improv classes at Improv Olympic and that was like huge for me because I really admired him and so he told

me about it and I was like I'm going to go do that and I signed up and I was taking classes on Saturdays for my senior year of high school with like 25 year olds who I thought were like really old and I couldn't believe they smoked weed still. I was like, you're 25. Like what? Why are you smoking weed? You need to get a life. Yeah, I'm 34 and then that's fine. Yeah, it was, it was really scary at first though. I think it, I wouldn't say it was like love at first sight or whatever. I think I was like really. But you probably got the buzz off of it too, right? Totally. But it was really intimidating and I was always afraid that I was like really boring to them because I had to like

miss one I missed one class because I went to prom and then I brought my prom photos in to show them and it was like everyone was so nice but I would like read in between like the break I would just like sit and read because I was afraid to like have to talk to them about my life because there was nothing in it I'm like I'm in high school I don't do anything so at that point even senior high school were you like how serious were you about it were you like this is going to be what I really go after? Yeah, it was always my dream to be, like, a comedian. So I, from, like, fourth grade, I think that's when I started realizing that's what I

wanted to do. But I didn't really know the path to it at all. And that was the first time I had a clear line. I had read, like, every book about SNL on Second City and all that stuff. But I didn't really know about I-O, and that ended up being, like, the best place for me. So, and so do you ever end up auditioning for SNL? I did, yeah. They flew me out twice a few years ago.

It was probably like, I might even be like five years ago, six years ago now. But I mean, that was truly a dream come true just to be on the stage and do the whole thing. I was so panicked about it. I like rehearsed my thing all day in my hotel room and like, if I sit around and don't work on this all day, then and then I mess it up. Like I will hate myself. But then it becomes like something you're not even thinking. I don't know.

I think it was, it went fine, but it wasn't remarkable. And I was, you know, out of my body. And Kate McKinnon got it that year. So it's also like, well, it's a tough competition. So was it tough to kind of, you know, obviously things have worked out? Yeah. You're like working on a thousand different things. But was there a period where you were like, oh, shit.

Like that was the whole, that was my purpose in life and now I need to reacalibrate. I think it's really hard to like lose that, to give up on a dream or something. But it was weird because I had already been a series regular on a sitcom at that point. And so I was also a little conflicted about auditioning because I thought, well, I'm on the path that I want to get on after doing. this but I also it would be a dream obviously to be on this show and it can be it's obviously a huge platform for so many of the people on it that they become amazing stars from it you there's also the version where you are on for one season and everyone forgets that you ever did it so it's like that weird crap shoot too I feel like I I was sad that it didn't work out but I also felt

okay because I already had established myself in the business in that sense where I was booking roles and like feeling like oh this is possible right but as a kid like SNL was definitely the thing it's hard, you don't have the, at least coming from where I was coming from with no connection to the industry. There's no understanding that like the people who are on sitcoms also were people who auditioned for us and I'll are do improv and all these things. I didn't know that correlation with existed. So I had to learn that, but it makes it easier once you figure it out. So you mentioned auditioning. How are you with auditioning? Do you enjoy that? I've talked to actors that some were like into it. Some people really like it. Yeah, like, oh, this lets me

work because otherwise I'm not working. I get to the front of my child. I know. I I don't think that that is true. No, I think they're fine, but I have a hard, I feel like I used to beat myself up a lot about them and I would like leave and like replay everything that I did and said. And I'm getting better at not doing that as much. But it's, it's an exhausting thing to do to have to go audition because 90% of the time you don't, you know, 99% of time you don't get the thing. So like, it's like you're putting in a lot of effort for something that, you know, maybe they don't even send to the next level of. casting people or like producers or whatever so yeah it can be really draining and bad feeling but also it can be fine i mean like you know i've i've definitely have the casting directors that i really

like and i always have a good time with them sure and that's awesome i think it's very cool that there are people who make it really fun like Allison jones is somebody who she casts like every cool thing ever and she she like laughs and like responds and like oh she acts like a human being yeah it's like great like you just feel like oh she's enjoying my performance and like it makes you want to do a better job and and you want to please her so that's nice On the flip side, what's the definition of the worst kind of audition? Is there one that jumps out? Yeah, I mean, I definitely have had auditions that are horrible.

More because I'm putting so much pressure on myself that when I messed up, I like beat myself up. And it's like, even in the room, I remember I had one audition where I had to say he's like a 40-year-old freshman. But I kept saying in my head, 40-year-old virgin because that made more sense. And then I was like, just don't say that in the room. And then I went in and said, he's like a 40-year-old virgin. And then I went, fuck! I blew it, didn't I? Like, in the audition, I said, fuck.

And I was like, why did I just say that? Like, it was out of my control. I was like, I just, sorry, I knew I was going to say that. And I didn't want to say that. And so I don't know why I said that. And then, you know, it was just, yeah. So then that was one that I've never forgotten. But they haven't been that bad otherwise, I think.

But yeah, that was a bad one. But I think what can make it hard is when the casting person is like barely looking at you, reads it like a robot, doesn't try. I mean, it's all the kind of cliche stuff. But those are real things. What's the gig that meant the most to you, like, landing something that really, like, fell at the moment, like. Wow. There have been a bunch, but I think crashing was a big one because I always wanted to work with Judd Apatow.

So that was really cool. I was really, really excited to get that one. Was Judd, like, on set for that one? Yeah, he directed a handful of the episodes and was around and stuff. Not all the time, but the first season definitely, and he did the first episode and a handful of others in that season. He's pretty great. What you see is what you got. job exactly what you imagine him to be he's so nice and he loves to like share stories from his

past and i love that kind of stuff and hearing about all of those cool old people that you you know watched on screen and he can tell you a million stories about everyone and it's awesome exactly the stories you were telling and a lot of people in the business uh like you like that like he was steeped in it from like he was interviewing like the comedians he worshipped at 14 like he's just like it's just he was engineered to do this yeah and he's like a fan at heart and i think that's really cool like he all the stuff he just done with gary shanling and his diaries and it's really it's really cool and commendable too because i feel like people there's not that much respect for others in the industry within the industry in that way where people are going

like let's talk about gary shanling i'm also a director but i want to talk about judd could like make a career of just kind of celebrating himself he's like spent the last two years like writing books and doing documentaries about oh wait another person yeah yeah it's like really great he's really selfless in that way um okay so for the next 45 minutes let's discuss homes and watson Let's go deep. That's more enough to say. It's now available on VOD, I believe. What was that experience?

Well, for me it was great, because I was in London for like three and a half months living in like a cool apartment in Chelsea. And like I really like cannot complain about the experience. Also like getting to do a movie with Will Ferrell and John C. Riley, like it's a fun time. And I think like at the time my biggest complaint would be like the costumes were very uncomfortable. I'm like wearing corsets and like it's all done exactly to the period so that was the weird thing about the movie is like it's almost shot and like the set dressing everything it's like it's like it's like a drama yeah like it's like it's like you might as well have shot like an actual you could have shot something like yes like some stunning drama in all of the locations I mean we get to shoot at the Tower of London and stuff it's like actually I brought my parents that day which was really neat because I mean that was the thing it's like so much of it for me was the experience of doing it which was a blast um you know and It sucks when people don't like things or they don't turn out how you want them to. Well, let's talk about a happier thing between two ferns, which is hysterical. Yeah, thank you.

And I'm really thrilled with it. I feel like it's funny. I like, I like watching it. And so that's good. Yeah. It's a good sign. It seems like everybody else is too. I mean, it's, I mean, it is tough to kind of like create a narrative around something

that it worked in a short form. You obviously know Scott, Scott Ockerman. Yeah. Between behind Comedy Bang Bang and the director of this. Zach, though, you hadn't worked with us? We had worked together just barely. We had done a live comedy bang bang show once, and so I knew him from that. And then we also had, I had a small role in a movie he did years ago that I probably shouldn't mention.

Now I feel like you have to. But I got to meet him, and I remembered thinking, like, oh, my God, he was so nice. And we had like a brief moment on screen together, and he was great. And one of the nicest people I had met at that time, it was like one of my first, like, you know, getting small roles in movies and having like cool little experiences where you get to meet stars and like it was neat um but he yeah he ended up being amazing to work with in this because we got to improvise like most of the movie and so yeah i know i'm sure we've talked about this to death but it is it's it's a unique kind of a film obviously because there's i understand it so what

is there too the script like i mean i think scott described it as being like the scribblings of a madman or something like he was like they it's a notebook and seven that kevin spacy kept dropped away. It really looked like like the pages were very sparse. Like there was not much there. And so it was kind of exciting for me because that's like my whole background. I think

he, Scott expressed like the crew was a little more nervous because coming into something where you can't really prepare like even just from like lighting, you know, things like that where it's like Which way do I put the camera of Scott? Yeah, who's the focus of the scene? We don't know yet. Like it's hard to say. So I mean we got like in terms of like the plot we would plan

things out and try to like get certain plot points out and there were some scripted lines just to make sure we had exact you know information but other than that we really got to like he'd be like okay we're in this bakery for the day so let's use all these different locations in the bakery and have conversations like run different parts of the road trip and um we got to just improvise for hours that you'll never see I mean no one never never never I was even watching the hundred minutes of bloopers from a earlier show I have to say I have to give Ben credit for that absolutely because he was like

I'm going to edit a movie length version of the bloopers. And I was like, go for it. I mean, I know I'll want to watch it, but I can't imagine. And people love it. And they actually prefer it sometimes over watching the whole series. I'm like, I mean, I love to see it because so much of the time when you improvise on some, like on screen for things, like it just goes away and you don't remember what you said. But there's so much funny stuff in there.

I really think people should watch. If you're going to watch something with the earliest show, watch the booblers. Also, and this one, I think it's the first time we've ever seen bloopers outtakes from Zach's stuff for between two firms, which is kind of like jarring at first to see it over the credits because I feel like they've done such a good job of kind of like keeping within that reality,

but it's kind of like a reward to the audience or something. It really like, I don't know, it was very satisfying to watch that. I think Scott wanted it. First of all, they weren't sure if there was going to be more after this, so they wanted to feel like they could put out something that kind of puts a nice button on it,

like, oh, this is how fun it is. And I think then it is like a gift to the audience because so often people can think that the celebrities might actually be offended or like, wow, that one was really... And the lines are really edgy and, like, can be kind of, like, biting stuff. But, like, they're all having fun,

and everyone can veto anything they don't want in the movies. It never ceases to amaze me. I'm sure you have this experience, like, stuff that I put up that's, like, clearly scripted or clearly an improvised sketch that people literally comment on as if people... It's real. Yeah. Oh, I get it for, like, characters on TV shows

if they've done, where they're like, you're so mean to Pete. And I'm like, this is fake. I'm wearing an astronaut constantly. It's like, none of this is real. So in this one, so is there a broad outline of the character? Like, what are you given for your character? Yeah, it was really just like a couple lines of explanation about who she is,

like that she just like wants to support Zach, cares about him, you know, a very organized person. But so much of it we found by improvising. So that was cool because I was able to bring my own humor to it. And yeah. So who keeps you inside the lines? Like, because like it sounds like Scott's willing to go off the rails too. So who at the end of the day, like, on that day when you're like endlessly improvising at a bakery says, like, wait, have we lost the plot? Are we even like going towards? I think it's like a mixed bag. I know definitely like the DP and like, you know, 80s and stuff would be like, we have to make time. And so let's move along. But Scott also was really helpful in keeping my character on a certain track because it with Zach, like, and the way his character is, it's so easy to want to just like be mean to him because it's really fun. Like to tell him like, you're an idiot. Like that's a blast.

But I, so I did that a handful of times. And then we're like, okay, Carol would never call him that. She's only supportive of Zach. So, yeah, we had to pull it back. Do you ever talk to Zach about, like, part of me wonders, and I've talked to him a bunch over the years, but not specifically about between two ferns, like, whether this is, like, his own reaction to his old talk show on VH1. Oh, yeah.

I don't know. I don't really know about that. You should watch the old episodes. Yeah. I feel like maybe I've seen. They're around. Yeah, yeah. And they're great.

Yeah. But, like, I love that he's just, he's just so anti the artifice of this silly industry of, like, the red carpet, stupid shit. He hates it all, yeah. It's just all, like, but his way of doing it is to kind of call it out, which I love. Like, I love watching him with, like, the Entertainment Tonight reporter. Yeah. And, like, they don't know what to do with him. Oh, yeah.

Yeah. I mean, I think it's cool. It's, like, such an interesting thing to watch somebody like that where, like, everyone likes him. I think that's also why he can get away with so many things like that. It's, like, we've already established that you're cool, people like you, and now you can. can tell everyone to like fuck off or whatever you want to say like I mean he wouldn't say that probably but um yeah I was like right behind him on the red carpet at the premiere and I was like catching things that he's saying in there but the thing is like it doesn't always work for everyone

like I had a moment where I was making a joke to one of the people like I was like I want to have more fun with this because it's not fun to just say the exact same thing every time but this guy asked me like what's something about Zach that we don't know and I was like he's narcoleptic and the guy was like really concerned and then I was like I'm kidding like he's a really nice sky i don't know whatever like who cares have you ever been asked a horribly inappropriate question at a junket by a horrible reporter

oh yeah i did there was one that always stood out to me because it was my first show my first like series that was on was already there chelsea a chelsea handler sitcom that was on NBC for one season and that was my first job so like i was so lucky to like get a series regular job on a pilot that got picked up like it was like amazing i had never been on a tv show so like that was very

cool. But we had to go to TCAs, and that's like where they like ask you questions about this show before it comes out and whatever. And somebody asked me like, because I had, we had shot the pilot and then we had like a break and then we reshot a lot of it and whatever. There were, and I learned a lot. Like I didn't, like I had never seen myself on screen. And this person asked me, why were your eyes so big in the pilot, but not in the second episode? And then I was like, I like first of all rude second of all I guess I learned what how I was going from stage acting to screen acting so it was like a big adjustment for me as an actor in terms of how big my performance has to be there's also multi-camera like it is big like whatever but I was so offended but I didn't know how to react because I had never really been in one of those things before I but I think I was like I yeah I don't really I don't know what's I tried to get better at this like yeah what do you want better man yeah Kansas City TV TV critic. I know. It was like, people, like, that's just a mean question for no reason.

People are not great all the time. Yeah. So, okay, so were you allowed near, because of the nature of your character, you're not probably not necessarily on set for a lot of like the quote-unquote celebrity interviews. Yeah, we got to be there while they were doing them. So, yeah, because they would happen in the middle of the day. So usually there was like this, we could either have a break and go hang out, but I'd rather hang out there and watch, you know, someone get interviewed for 45 minutes.

And it was really fun to watch. watch. Which was the most exciting to watch just as a fan of, whether it's like Keanu Reeves. Keanu Reeves was really cool to watch because he's just so like, he's such an enigma that like to be in the same room is really interesting. But it was also like one of the stranger interviews because he's, he was just like, you know, very deadpan. And I, who was really enjoyable?

Oh, Adam Scott is really fun. He's just really great. And Tiffany Haddish, I always love her and she's so funny and willing to talk about anything. Yeah, she was telling us, like, insane stories. I don't even know if they were on camera or not, but she was telling us some crazy stories about when she was living in her car and how you hook up with people while you're doing that.

So it's really funny. She's great. Is there, like, can you improvise with anybody, like any good improviser? Like, are there kinds of improvisers that aren't your speed? Do you know what I mean? Yeah, no, I don't think so.

I think I can do it with anyone that's kind of what I like to challenge myself with is to feel like it doesn't matter what's going to happen and that it'll be fine. Right. I think like doing my podcast with special guest Lauren Lapk has helped me so much with that because the premise of this show is that the guest is the host and they determine what the whole show is going to be and what my character will be and so I don't have any information going in and sometimes it's somebody who doesn't even do improv where like they'll be on some like press tour and they're assigned to my show there was someone recently and I said it at the I did an intro where I explained that because I felt like it was worth noting that this woman had no idea what the show was she thought I was just going to interview her and then I was like we're going to do improv for one hour and then I was like we're going to do improv for one hour. hour. Do you have an idea? I knew she was prepared. Like, she was given all the information.

Someone didn't pass along to her. But I was like, that's my nightmare. It's like, okay, great. Now I have to do it with you. And you might not even want to do this. And I don't want to do it with you if you don't want to do this. I would rather have on my friend who nobody's ever heard of and just do it for fun. Like, but yeah. So how will how did that actually go? It ended up going well. I mean, she's a comedian. So it was like it ended up going fine. But it was one of those feelings of like, no, she doesn't even want to. Possibly she's in her nightmare. So, like, I don't know her.

So I can't tell you. But, like, I'm panicking and just going, like, oh, shit, now I have to, like, do this hour-long thing that, like, we could, I could just say we could just abandon it. But, like, we're here and you're down. Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, let's just do it. But I had the reverse, again, kind of experience where, so I do, like, scripted sketches. And usually, you know, sometimes the, quote, unquote, celebrity talent is given the script. They're always given the scripts, but sometimes, as you know, like, they don't actually see them

or vet them or anything. Yeah. My nightmare scenario happened many years ago where, of all people, Gary Oldman walks into a room and he has not been given the script. And literally there's a set with like a pinata and like this crazy shit up there. And he literally is just like, what are we doing? Yeah. Yeah. And I think it happened to people with Ferns when they were shooting the series that there were handful of people who didn't know what it was. In that case, we abandoned it after five minutes. He gave it a go. And then I was like, Mr. Oldman, I love you. I'm not going to make you do this. Good for you. Yeah.

I made her do it, so I'm like, well, hey, I have an hour to fill, so. So what is the, do you, are you also, like, writing and self-generating material, or are you like, what's the, what's the, the five-year plan? Is there one? Yeah, I would love to have my own show. I think that's, like, my dream. But I, yeah, I recently made a short film, and that was really fulfilling to be able to be like, oh, I can, like, make this thing and just cast funny people that I know

and have, you know, I know people who have cameras and can put all this shit together. So it was a blast. I mean, I think I was almost mad at myself for waiting so long to do my own thing. And so I want to do a lot more stuff like that. What does, like, the dream or a show look like format-wise? I mean, it could go either way. Like, I have gone down the path of, like, creating sketch shows. I'm still interested in that.

And also, a sitcom would be really fun. Something just like, you know, some single-cam cool sitcom would be great. I love it. Yeah. But, I mean, it could go either way. I love doing characters. And if I could blend those two, that would be really interesting. but so as a i know you had uh or do you still do the 90s podcast yeah we just wrapped it up just a couple

weeks ago yeah but um so every 90s show has been rebooted by now has there anything left from the 90s to oh my god i don't even know if there is because it feels like every day there's a reboot of something and i just heard somebody say they should reboot flea bag or something i was like it literally just happened and it's original let's not do that it's like amazing when there's like an original show that everyone loves like let's just let that be at something um yeah i don't know i mean i even thought about like a reboot of big but i'm like i don't want to ruin a classic like and that's what everyone freaks out about on twitter like the second they announce a reboot of something everyone's like they're original like they're talking about princess bride right yes being rebooted and everyone was

like they're original and it's it's like i definitely hear both sides of that i'm like yeah it sucks because like it's very hard to do better than a great film that exists but also don't watch the new one and just watch the old one like who cares like i'm kind of of that of mind. It doesn't harness the original for me at all. Like, no,

the argument is just like spend a little more time and try to come up with something original. But like it's, your shitty remix not gonna make me love Princess Bride or less.

Right, right. And I mean, some of the remakes are good. I can't think of something right now. A single one. Like a single like, just one more.

Just one. Hold on. I'm sure if I really racked my brain, I could come up with something that I really loved, but maybe not. I don't know. But no.

Yeah, I mean, that's the thing. It's like, I also look at them and go, let me just reboot something. I'm like, I could do that and make it funny and have something interesting.

So I don't want to like reboot as a thing people are doing because it works sometimes. And kids like them, like they don't know the old one. Like there's a whole generation that has, they don't want to watch a dusty old movie. Small wonder. I know. I was thinking that actually.

It's almost like you're in my mind. Really? Yeah, and I didn't say it. Are you kidding me? I really loved Small Wonder as a kid. It's creepy now, though. It is creepy. And I was Small Wonder for Halloween like 15 years ago.

That's kind of creepy too An adult woman being A little child robot It was a great costume I'm sure Had a great theme song Yeah it is It's a great theme song

But A small wonder That's awesome Yeah shiny and bright And soft curls She's a small wonder A child Unlike other girls

She's a miracle She'll entice you And something Every sight Yeah something Um, she'll make your heart feel like Da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da. Listeners doesn't that make you want to look up small wonder?

Yeah, you got to look it up. But the thing is, if I feel like we're in as weird, I feel like we're at time right now where it could actually work because that format has been like where there's like a character that is a robot or like Al-F or something. Like they were talking about doing Alf a second ago. I don't know what happened there, but, you know, we'll see. I would be on it. You want to be out? I don't want to be him. I would like to have my face shown.

No, your face on an alien, furry alien body. Yes, that's what you mean, that's where it's where it's great. Her eyes are a little big though in season one. Maybe if they just shrunk them. Yeah, yeah, yeah. If they could see GI that, then I never have to deal with that question again. But, yeah, I don't know. I think we're at a time where we could be willing to go like really weird with it again,

like have like those, that one character that's like, there was that show. Oh, God, what was it called? it was a and I happily ever after something it was like a guy unhappily ever after he was a guy who would go in his basement and talk to a bunny

and it was like the guy from Entrage who played E I can't think of his name I got you was and then that hot chick okay so I'm like really not remember everyone's name but it was

Nikki Cox that's who it was and so it was a sitcom where this guy was like this depressed dad and then he would go down to his basement and like bitchily talking to talk to his, like, bunny, who was, like, the figment of his imagination. He was, like, a puppet played by Bobcat Goldthwaite. Very weird.

When you were in, Maritimeiki, I feel, like, at the time or something. Oh, oh, oh, I forgot that that happened in life. That's so interesting. Yeah. Wow, that's cool. But, like, we might be ready for a show like that again, where it's, like, some weird character. I'm in.

It's fake. Let's do it. Mesh it all up. Yeah. Wow, a lot to look forward to one. We did it. We did it. Congratulations on Between Two Ferns.

Thank you. The movie. You can watch it on your Netflix magic box TV, otherwise known as a TV, I guess. Yeah, or your phone or computer, yeah. Oh, you can do that too, yeah. Yeah, I think kids watched it on their phone. I don't know. Children's audience.

This is only for mature audiences only. Well, tell your kids, people. Spread the good word. It's great to meet you and catch up as I said, I'm a fan, and I'm still a fan after this conversation. Thank you. I didn't ruin your image of me. That's great.

Not all. Not all. Only enhanced. Good to have you on. Thanks. And so ends another edition of happy, sad, confused. Remember to review, rate and subscribe to this show on iTunes or wherever you get your podcasts.

I'm a big podcast person. I'm Daisy Ridley and I definitely wasn't pressured to do this by Josh. Goodbye. Summer movies, Hello Fall. I'm Anthony Devaney. And I'm his twin brother, James. We host Raiders of the Lost Podcast, the Ultimate Movie Podcast, and we are ecstatic to break down late summer and early fall releases. We have Leonardo DiCaprio leading a revolution in one battle after another, Timothy Chalamey playing power ping pong in Marty Supreme. Let's not forget Emma Stone and Jorgos-Lanthemos' Bougonia. Dwayne Johnson, he's coming for that Oscar. In The Smashing Machine, Spike Lee and Denzel teaming up again, plus Daniel DeLuis's return from retirement. There will be plenty of blockbusters to chat about, too.

Tron Aries looks exceptional, plus Mortal Kombat too. And Edgar writes, The Running Man, starring Glenn Powell. Search for Raiders of the Lost podcast on Apple Podcasts, Spotify, and YouTube.