Happy Sad Confused - Mark Strong

Episode Date: December 7, 2015

Incredible actor Mark Strong joins Josh this week to talk about currently playing Eddie Carbone in A View from the Bridge on Broadway, discovering acting while studying law, the importance of diction in acting, and his thoughts on playing villains in film. Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

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your inner carnivore. Hey guys, welcome to another edition of Happy Second Fused. I'm Josh Horowitz. Happy holidays from my little weird office in lower Manhattan. Thanks for tuning in, as always. Joining me is Sammy. Hey, Sammy. Hi, Joshua.

Don't use my full name. This week's show is with a fantastic. He's fantastic actor. Frankly, maybe not one of the bigger names we've had on the show, but when I heard he was doing something cool on stage here in New York, I immediately want to talk to him because he is one of those actors that is so reliably awesome and everything he does. His name is Mark Strong. If you know him, you know him from things like The Imitation Game, Tinker Taylor Soder Spy, Kingsman. He was the bad guy in Sherlock Holmes. He was in a very prominent Jaguar commercial. Did you see that Sammy? It was him, Sir Ben Kingsley and Tom Hilsman. Hidleston, do a shot because Tom Hiddleston's name came up in the podcast. There it is. Waiting for it. You're playing at home. That's why you had Mark Strong.

Basically, one degree away. No, but he is right now on stage here in New York. We talk at length about this. He's on stage in the classic Arthur Miller play of You from the Bridge. It is really, really, really a fantastic play and a fantastic production. He is exceptional in it as Eddie Carbone. This is kind of an unusual kind of avant-garde production of it But it is well worth seeing

They did the production in London They brought it over here It's got in phenomenal reviews It's on stage through February Get tickets if you can Yeah, they're talking Tony awards for him He's definitely gonna be not ready It's definitely gonna be not ready but there are his names in there

He's fantastic in it and Great eyebrows Fantastic eyebrows I can see him from the back row He is yeah he's a really one of those guys that like, good or bad, whether the movie may be, he is always exceptional. So it was fun to talk to him about a really fantastic career. And hopefully this one, you know, it's cool to see him in a leading role. He's frankly, usually the character, actor in things, but

played a lot of villains, but getting some much due attention for his work on stage. So, yeah, it was cool. I have a question. Yes. Did you, I know, like, you came back from this show and you loved this show so much. And I, it's a wonderful, it's a wonderful play. But you also had a pretty special night that night. Oh, no. You did a pretty special night with.

It was, so here, okay, yes. So the context is. Come on, let's hear it. Well, it was one of these things. So, you know, it's always really good. You know, it's really expensive to go to the theater and it's tough to get tickets. But, like, if you get the opportunity, as an extra bonus, you often will see some really cool people in the crowd, especially if it's like a hot ticket like of you from the bridges. and I sat down with my wife and we saw Bradley Cooper searching for his seat with his girlfriend,

Arina. Pronounce her name for us, Josh? I don't know how to pronounce her last name. She, Arrishach, Shike. Listen, I have no idea. I don't know. Very beautiful model that he's dating. And Bradley was searching for his seat and his seat happened to be literally right behind mine.

So throughout the show, I was very, it's one of those weird things where you're like, every time you hear a laugh right behind you, you're like, oh, yeah, that's Bradley Cooper laughing. Oh, yeah, that's Bradley Cooper kicking my seat. He kicked your seat? Well, to be fair, the seats are a little, it's tight quarters at the theater. That's, ooh.

I guess he's used to being on this stage, I'm very, no, no, no. Bradley was lovely. I actually chatted with him very briefly, and Emma Stone was actually there, too. Emma Stone was two seats back. This was a power audience. Aloha, we did not talk about aloha, but it was, yeah.

And you had better seats than both of them. Well, let's calm down. But, uh, no. That's what I screamed. See this seat? You can't get this seat. Fuck you. No.

Both are welcome on the podcast, by the way. By the way. We will get them both. We will get them both on. I'm sure Emma will do it at some point. And hopefully Bradley will too. I'm excited to see Joy, which he's reteaming with David Wilson. And maybe Arena Shank will do it too.

Yes, exactly. We're going to expand the purview to models. Everyone's welcome here. Speaking of beautiful people. next week's show. We're taping it next week. I think it will run next week. I'm really excited to say that we have Academy Award winner, Marion Cotillard. Well done. I'm not going to even try to pronounce it well. Can you try? Marion Cotiar. I wish everyone could you see what happened to your face when we said that. Yeah, she's in the new Macbeth, which is coming to the big

screen, her and Michael Fastbender. It's going to be, I am very... I've seen it. It's good. It's an interesting production. So, yeah, that's about all to say right now. I want to remind you guys to always hit me up on Twitter. Let me know who you want to hear on the podcast. It's a cool season for movies. There's a lot of good stuff out there. Go see Brooklyn.

Go see Creed. Go see Room. Go see Spotlight. There's a lot of good stuff out there. Suffragette. Suffragette. I have not seen yet. Suffragette.

You do the hard gene? Okay. Good to know. Yeah. It's a Philly pronunciation. It's my accent. Fair enough. Fair enough.

Yes. It's the holidays. It's time to eat a lot and see a lot of good. Good movies. Happy Hanukkah. Happy belated Thanksgiving. Happy New Year to come. So many happy Merry Christmas. You forgot the big guy. Oh yeah. Is that this kind of year? It's my main one. It's in my blind spot. Yeah. No, happy holidays to everybody and enjoy this podcast with the fantastic. I mean, he's his voice alone for the next 45 minutes. Enjoy the great voice. I feel like it's going to be so relaxing. It's very soon. I want to listen to it and then get a massage. There you go. Do it at the same time. Why not? Enjoy this

conversation with Mark Strong. Do you use his eyebrow gel? We didn't get to that, but that's a reason to bring him back. Well, this is either why I'm doing a great job or a horrible job. It's good to see you, Mark. Thank you so much for coming in today. It's appreciate it. This is one of those nights of theater that I'm going to remember for quite some time.

Congratulations on the show. It's an amazing achievement you guys are doing each and every night. night. And you've been doing it a while. I mean, you've been doing it in a different incarnation and now here for a while. Yeah. Does it feel like old hat at this point? Are you on autopilot or is each show? Never autopilot. I mean, the way the play is conceived and the kind of production it is and the fact that you have audience as close as you have means autopilot doesn't exist. I mean, you're right in the bear pit in front of people and you rely on the other actors because, as you know, there's no furniture, there's no props. Yeah.

And it's pretty intense. I always feel somewhat guilty when I'm talking to an actor on Broadway or doing a show, especially that you're doing two shows today, yes? It's a Wednesday. Yes. I feel like I'm sapping your energy. I feel like I feel like you might like if I say something stupid, your mind might think back to, what did Josh say three hours ago in the middle of the show? I don't want to get in the way of the art that you are performing today. What's wonderful is that you're able.

I don't know if this is British actors particularly because we're all trained for the theatre you're able to compartmentalise so I don't take Eddie home with me at the end of the day before the show starts there's nothing really that can throw me off course because the two hours traffic

of the stage as Hamlet I think says is completely contained I mean I'm usually incredibly exhausted before the play starts but once it starts it grabs me by the scruff of the neck and drags me through to the end I mean I'm on stage pretty much the whole time so the focus is complete and so there isn't really anything that can throw me off course

so is there is there anything that you need to click you into the performance or is it just the the language the the atmosphere of the theater that gets you in the zone when the lights dim etc there's always a kind of mental preparation that I do in the dressing room but what's wonderful is evo's conceived this beginning to the play where we basically shower right and we wash off the dirt of the day but it also doubles as a kind of of preparation for the production because essentially I shower and get dressed and then the play begins. So for me, that moment actually right at the top of the play is incredibly valuable. It really, it's the segue from real life into the life of the play.

So what's going on in your head in that couple minutes when the audience is like, okay, what am I watching and you're getting in the zone? Like, are you focused on what you're about to do? Is your mind wandering or what? straight after then Catherine my niece comes onto the stage followed by Beatrice my wife and I tell Beatrice

that her cousins have landed from Sicily and I say to her Tony Borrelli just come over to me says the ships in the North River what I'm actually thinking is so Tony came over to me

and that's interesting I wasn't expecting you know at the end of it do you know what I mean I just do a little bit of that and that gets me into it you just went into the voice a little bit and it's curious

I mean, like, you know, people have seen different incarnations of this. There was a fine production here on Broadway a few years ago, which I saw and I enjoyed. It just shows you how many different ways there are to skin a cat because they're both fantastic in their own right. But the accent is not thick. It's not over the top. It's not certainly not the production I saw a few years ago. Why the choice to not go further in terms of like doing in terms of voice? Because it's not that kind of a production, I don't think.

I think having removed everything that tries to persuade you that it's real, you know, having got rid of the furniture and the props and even our shoes, for God's sake, it's not about recreating reality and trying to pretend that what you're seeing is real. I mean, there are audiences on the stage. You can tell that it's not really. You can see the lights and the stage is very bare. What's important about this production is you hear the words. You understand the narrative.

You get to know the characters completely. It's a very, very clear kind of version of the play. Yeah. And it's just, it's, it's not necessary, really, to do the accents in any kind of over-the-top way. And in fact, I think probably we did them stronger in London, because in London it's much more exotic, a Brooklyn accent, you know, walk down a certain door to watch a certain hall, you know, that kind of thing. And we thought we were being very clever back home, because obviously nobody really knew. And they were like, wow, marvelous accents. It's absolutely terrific.

And then we got here and everybody said, just calm down. Right. You've got 400 experts in the audience each night, so don't tell them. That's amazing in itself. I mean, we should talk about that. But essentially, the accents, as long as we've, as long as people can relax, you know, they don't have to be perfect. Yeah. Well, talk to me a little bit about bringing it to New York beyond just changing voice.

Did the production change much otherwise? Not at all. I mean, we went from a very small theater originally, the Young Vic in London, which is on the cut in Waterloo. And it used to be the rehearsal space of the Old Vic Theatre. So it's a tiny little space of 400 seats. And I suppose when the play was originally conceived, it was very filmic, the performance level. You know, the audience were all around us

and were observing us do the play. Sure. There was no performance kind of required. Then we moved to the West End and to a traditional Procenia March Theatre. And the staging changed in a sense that we then put seats on the stage and had the normal house out front.

And so you had to kind of bring up the performance a little bit just to make sure people at the back and sitting up in the gods could hear. And then we come now to the lycise. which is a beautiful, beautiful theater. I think it's the oldest continually running theater on Broadway. So we're very proud to be there.

But it's increased in size again. So we've gone from 400 seats to 800 to 800 to 1,100. And it just requires a little more performance level because otherwise people on the sides or the back or right up in the gods, they won't be able to see and hear everything. So that's kind of, that's what's changed. That's how each of the productions have changed.

So what's the audience's job as far as you're concerned when you're when you're on stage because as you say somewhere on the level with you can probably make eye contact and you probably whether you want to or not it probably happens um we were talking as you walked in inevitably the phones ring my god how that still happens in 2015 but um what's the job of an audience member stillness um should they make eye contact should i be what should i be doing that's a very good question i hadn't really thought of it from the audience's perspective um think about our side mark come on I know. I do feel slightly for the people on the stage sometimes that they feel they might be rabbits caught in headlights because they are quite exposed not only to the main house, but they're very close to the actors. But people instinctively know how to behave because I think the play takes over, to be honest. I mean, whatever your conception is, the minute the big black box rises and you see what's on the stage, you know, you may think, hold on. I don't remember a view from the bridge starting with two guys in the shower or, you know, why haven't they got any shoes on or what's going on. But very quickly.

It's as described to me by people who've been in the audience. There's something about it just sucks you in. The audience, you can feel them move forward in their seats. You can feel them get quieter. It's quite jovial, the beginning of the play. There's a kind of very easy family atmosphere. There's a slight problem with Catherine, the niece, having a job, which Eddie's a little bit unsure or jealous about.

But it's a minor problem that's dealt with. And so the first kind of moments of the play are quite good fun. You know, you see a family who are obviously very comfortable, together and then it obviously all starts to kind of go wrong and as that happens I think people get drawn in and I can feel every night the house get quieter and quieter by the end it's insane the tension that collectively we're feeling in the audience with you guys it's an amazing cathartic kind of end that's what people say and it's very odd for us to hear that because obviously we're this side of the catharsis rather than the other side and so we're not

really aware of it we're obviously creating it but that's that's what people say that there is something really absorbing about it. It's hypnotically draws you in. You know where it's going, like all good tragedies. You know what the ending's going to be and you just watch the whole thing happen like a car crash in slow motion. You mentioned the lack of shoes, which I did notice. Is that something that you were open to when the director initially brought it up? Or was it something that? No, we fought him on because we didn't quite understand what the purpose of it was. Like a couple of other things in the production too. I mean, the day that it was said the Italians wouldn't have Italian accents. We were nonplussed. We couldn't understand that, but they've come from

Sicily. They should have. Of course, now that they don't, we've never thought about it for another second, because actually what it stops the play becoming is theatrical, or an obvious fiction. If suddenly people, come on and start to talk like it is, it becomes something else. And the same was true of the shoes. I mean, he said, take your shoes off and we all went, why? We didn't quite understand, but now that you see the set and you feel the kind of production that it is, it kind of, it roots us And we're not clomping around this space. The space becomes a sort of delicate area in which this tiny story about this small family becomes epic.

Is Arthur Miller, does it have the same kind of importance in England and in London growing up in a curriculum? I mean, growing up here, you know, you obviously, death of salesmen, crucible, these are all staples that I think most people go through here in the States. Is it the same where you're from? Ironically, I was told back in the 80s and 90s he was much more popular in the UK

than he was here. Is that right? Yeah, and there were more plays being done back in the UK of Arthur Miller's than here in the US. I did a play with a great proponent of his,

a director called David Thacker, who did a lot of Arthur Miller plays at the National Theatre back in the 90s. I did Death of a Salesman in 96 and he came into rehearsal in the second week of rehearsals and said, listen,

Arthur's been in touch. And we said, what do you mean? He said, he's chairing a conference over in Salzburg. And he says we can go and work with him. So we went over there. And for a week, we sat with Arthur Miller while he read all the parts in the play and while we worked with him on, you know, what our production was going to be. And it was an extraordinary experience.

But it made me realize that there's something about his plays. I think at a time when he was writing in the 50s in America, you were experiencing a boom. Yeah. Things were great. You know, people were getting washing machines and dishwashers. looking to have their own cars and a bit of front yard and there was a sort of economic miracle happening after the war here but back home we had rationing still in the UK in the 50s, let alone what was happening in Italy or Germany or Austria. It was tough times.

So to have a playwright who was writing about the darkness behind the veneer of civilization quite unusual in America because that's what he was doing. He was scratching away at everybody's sense of complacency in order to point out that, behind the curtain, things weren't necessarily all okay. And I'm sure that's partly to do with his experience with the House on American Activities Committee and all of that period that went on. You know, Marco, one of the characters in the play has a line, I don't understand this country. And I'm pretty sure that's Arthur speaking. Yeah. Yeah. It's pure Arthur Miller. I think at a time when he was very confused by what was going on in his own country. He was writing

plays that were just letting people know all was not Rosie in the Garden. So at the time, I think people didn't want to hear that, whereas back home in the UK, we were a little more open to it, I think. He's one of those towering figures that it's like, it still boggles my mind. I was, I was working at Charlie Rose's show, actually, here in New York in the late 90s, and he would come on occasionally. And it was one of these things like, this person still exists in my time. This is, this is an icon. This is someone that has created the seminal works of our time and was still so vital, even as he aged, a remarkable life. Yeah.

Talk to me a little bit about, oh, let's go back if we could. I mean, was theater the first love for you in terms of theater versus television versus film? What was the pop culture medium that caught your fascination as a child? Well, I never really, I have no family in the business. I didn't really know anything about it. I always felt that people on TV and in shows and things, they were other. They were different from me.

It wasn't a world that I was remotely connected to. I didn't even understand that you could be a part of that. And I actually started doing law first. I went down a completely different path. And in a way, had a wonderful epiphany when I realized that law wasn't for me. And if I was going to choose something for my life, it had to be something interesting.

And I'd seen people doing workshops and things at the university that I was at, and I just became interested in acting, and I thought I'd explore more about it. And in a way, it was a completely pure discovery that I knew nothing, but thought it looked interesting. And the more I found out about it,

the more I fell in love with it. I did an academic university degree and learned all about the Greeks and the Romans and restoration. theater and melodrama or everything you know the history of theater while at the same time was able to kind of work in a little studio theater they had where you could act direct you could work the sound board the lighting board you could design do everything connected with the theater and it just it kind of filled me up and it made me realize I was never happier than when I was

involved with something in the theater and then I went on to drama school where I realized I needed to be able to learn how to walk and talk and speak and make sure people could hear me at the back and had two years of a very intense theater course. So I came out trained for theater, and that's pretty much what I did in the UK. Were you good at it from the start? No. Do you feel like those first performances were raw and just like all over the place?

Those first performances were all about endeavor and confidence and bravery and having a go. But I hadn't really matured in the sense that I understood about live performance, you know, how to, the nuances of performance, the, how to really deliver a character over the course of an evening. And I've learned that over the years, I think. But you have to have that initial impetus to have a go. Otherwise, you never get started. Time for a special message from one of our favorite sponsors. Meet the Kalebjian's, this Armenian family, who will entertain you with an excellent cup of coffee. Master

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Has your diction been impeccable from the start? Because your voice is one of your greatest assets, as you well know. Is that something you had to work at? something that out of the womb you were talking like this. No, well, I think I would have frightened the life out of my mother if I was. The demon child, Mark, what is he talking like that? Hello.

You, I don't know, it's just I suppose over the years doing a lot of theatre and the diction element, clarity is never a bad thing, and it's useful for theater and film. You see, the irony in film, people think you can get away with mumbling like this

and point over, but it's often funny to me on a radio show, you'll hear somebody talking about a film and they go and let's hear a clip and suddenly from hearing people talking clearly you hear people by doing all this you think what are they saying? It's really bizarre to me that it's sort of become fashionable to mumble and everything in film

because people still need to hear what you're saying the whole point of performance is comprehension it's got to be about comprehension so you kind of learn it I learned it at drama school diction how to use your voice how many times have you practiced in the mirror

throughout your year saying the name's bond james bond because i feel like it would come out very well from your voice yeah no never have daniel's a very good friend i know yeah so that might be really peculiar um like step off my turf man something i thought we were friends to him yeah no i remember when he first got he i was sitting in his flat when he came in and he just threw the first script down on the table and went uh this looks like it might be a possibility and he agonized over it because he knew it change his life. Where did you come down? Did you offer advice at that time in terms of...

I said you have to do it. It's not something you can ever let pass you by. I mean, imagine he'd said no and watch somebody else be bond for the last four movies. You know, it's one of those life choices that just makes itself. Is that, I mean, do you have like that kind of internal list of things that you want to do,

whether it's like being a bond villain as anything, as a villain, et cetera, or work with certain filmmakers. Are you someone that kind of like keeps that kind of internal lists in terms of aspirations? Work with certain filmmakers, certainly. I mean, you know, I've always wanted to work with the Coen Brothers.

I got very close to possibly doing No Country for Old Men with them, and I met them for it. Amazing directors like Paul Thomas Anderson, and, you know, there are certainly guys out there and women, too, that I would love to work with. Because I admire their work. But I was talking about this with the cast the other day, fun enough. Most of us feel like we're not generators of our own work. I'm always impressed with actors who get into directing, writing, producing or do something else. Because I feel that I'm an interpreter. I like to wait until something comes to me

and then I can have a look at it and decide whether I can do something with it whether I feel like I can bring something to it and I often turn things away that I think that's not for me because I think I mean awards are an interesting thing when you get awards because

I often question whether they're actually about the actor or about the part that you've played because I mean they're about the part you've played you get the best parts I think you will have longevity you will be noticed people will recognize and remember the performances you've made

And I'm sure awards get given to parts rather than actors. So it's very important that you choose the stuff that you know that you can do. When did it start to turn into choice rather than I'll take anything I can get? Well, it took a while. You know, at the beginning, you know, I did theatre for almost 10 years. I did rep theater. Back then, it was weekly rep, monthly rep, rather. The generation just before me had done weekly rep where you would learn a play in a week.

That's intense. Yeah. Just keep moving. Exactly. Wow. We did it monthly. So we were performing the evenings, and then during the day we'd rehearse next month's play. And I did that for nine plays.

I did nine plays in nine months. So to keep the brain fresh, keep you moving. Yeah, and they were all different. You know, one was a pantomime, one was like a modern play, one was a restoration play, one was like the importance of being earnest. And it was gold dust that year that I did in in rep. It's called Repetary Theatre. And then I went to the Royal Shakespeare Company, and I did my fair share of holding spears and running on making short species in gold armor and had an amazing. time, but mostly watching other actors from the wings, you know, the kind of older actors do

their stuff, because the Royal Shakespeare Company is a big group of people, and there were a lot of people you could watch. And then the national theatre, I went on tour with Richard the 3rd and Lear. King, Ian McKellen was Richard the 3rd, Brian Cox was King Lear. Wow. And one company doing those plays, we went around the world for a year with it. So I felt like that was my training, and I only thought I was going to do theatre. It was going to say, I mean, because the film work really has come primarily in a little over the last decade, essentially, which is fairly late in a career to kind of find this whole new avenue. Were you resigned to, like, I'm happy where I'm at? I do a ton of TV.

I do a lot of theater. Things are going well, I can make a living at this, which is more than a lot of actors can say. I think. Or was there like something about, like, film, why is this just not happening yet? I think more of that, exactly what you've just said. I have sort of described myself as something I don't really play chess with my career

I'm not that kind of actor where I think if I do this job that could lead to that then those people will notice me then I can get that job and then maybe I can win something you know it just does that's not really what I'm after

what I'm after is continual work I want to I remember the head of my drama school the first day we were there he said listen if there's anything else you can do I suggest you leave now and the other thing he said was if you want 50 years 40 50 years

40, 50 years in this business, there's no hurry, take your time, learn stuff. And I really took that to heart. Yeah. So when I got that first job in rep in the wilderness, people said to me, why, why don't wait for a film, you know, or wait for something in London? I said, no, no, I just want to work. And so I was doing theatre and then I just, a point came where friends of mine who had also been in plays with me was suddenly doing movies. And I remember just thinking, how, Has that happened? How come they're doing movies? Did I miss the meeting?

What happened? Exactly. Who were your peers that you're talking about that time? Well, I think he's specifically of a TV series I did in the UK called Our Friends in the North. And that's where I met Daniel, because Daniel Craig was in it, an actor called Christopher Eccleston, an actress called Gina McKee and I. The four of us, it was about us. It was 11 hours of television, very unusual then, back in the early to mid-90s. We aged from the 1960s.

through to the 90s. It was a kind of state of the nation piece about the UK, very popular in the UK, but not particularly relevant over here in the US. But after that show finished, I remember going back to the theatre

because I thought, well, I've got to do a play a year. That's what I want to do. And while I was in the theatre, after about nine months of the others not getting any work and me feeling terribly sorry for them, they all got movies.

Gina went off to work with Michael Winterbottom, Chris went off and did a movie. Daniel did a film called Love is the Devil with John Mabry and Derek Jacoby. And I remember thinking, oh, and what they'd done is they'd all, on the advice of their agents, very wisely waited to get into the movies. And I hadn't ever really thought about it. And then it took a few more years before I finally said, I'd like, you know, that's something I'd like to try. Having done a bit of television.

Sure. So I moved really from theatre through television into movies. I'm fascinating. You've mentioned, and you talked openly about this before, that you were, yes, apparently pretty close to getting the Anton Chaguer role in no country. just to see what your interpretation would have been versus Javier's. Was it a much different take you had even in the audition and meeting process?

Not particularly. I think the character was... That's one of those where it's the character that... I mean, obviously what Javier did was amazing. He was brilliant. And actually, I think he's better casting, definitely. I mean, he's more, he's kind of more brutal. You know, he's much squarer than I am,

and stronger and that amazing sort of strange hair he had made him such a peculiar kind of character. Right. I think he was absolutely perfect. but I would have done something slightly different but at that time I was kind of just about to start playing a number of villains and the Brits you know we have a very honorable entree

into Hollywood playing Brits when I'm playing villains when I think of I don't know Jeremy Irons or Alan Rickman or Anthony Hopkins you know everybody got into Hollywood kind of playing dark characters I kind of like also that you've you know a lot of people you know worry about typecasting You've kind of embraced it in a way.

You did that fantastic, like, Jaguar campaign with Sir Ben Kingsley and Tom Hiddleston. Did you get a Jaguar out of the deal, at least? Or do you drive around in one? They let me have a go-in one. Is that something that you've, that is typecasting a real thing that you've experienced? Or is it something that you feel like you've, again, playing villains is not such a bad gig, especially in the kind of films that you've gotten to do it in? That's a really pertinent question, I have to say, because

when I was starting out everybody was terrified of typecasting it was something that you had to avoid like the plague you know you just couldn't and a very good friend of mine Jason Isaacs I remember played a mean character in the Patriot film called Patriot and then consequently turned down

many bad part bad guy parts that he was offered in Hollywood and I think later always felt perhaps he should have done those parts but he was so worried about being typecast that he didn't take those parts and he many had to wait for ages for the kind of the smoke to clear

before he was able to carry on you know getting regular parts I suppose I remember talking to him about it and I started to get these parts and people started to say are you worried about typecasting I think times have changed I think when a part is good it doesn't really matter what it is and everyone I was being offered whether it was in Sherlock Holmes

or Robin Hood or kickass or you know stardust or wherever it was coming from they were all really fascinating characters in their own right. The fact that they were villains was, to me, neither here nor there. Sure. Was Sherlock in particular one that, because I remember just as a, as a, as a, as a appreciator of film, I feel like I saw you, you got a lot of great notices from the Ridley Scott film body of Lies, as I recall. And Sherlock, Sherlock seemed like a big moment because, you know, that's a huge tent pole film. And, you know, ostensibly they could have gone with a bigger name for that kind

of a role. Was that something you had obviously worked with Guy? Was that something that was, was fought for in terms of getting you in there or was did guy have enough kind of juice at that time to say this is the guy this is a great actor this guy needs to be this character i think they had to fight for me yeah you know because obviously the studio didn't know who i was i done a film with guy called rock and roller sure people really enjoy yeah and joel silver was involved with bringing it over to the states and he was involved in sherlock home so i think it was a guy and joel together went into warner brothers and said look this is the guy you need i'm curious i mean we talked you talked a little bit about working with people like what I know in a production.

I think you said Richard III with Brian Cox and in McKellen. Over the years, what you've observed from the greatest actors and decent actors, like what that difference is, if that is a tangible, describable thing that you've noticed over the years in terms of truly the best of the best versus those that are jobbing decent actors. Is there something that you can pinpoint in terms of what makes the greatest ones that great? That's very tricky. Like I said before, the parts that you play are very important.

If you can do something with a role, people will relate to it, notice it, be impressed by it, whatever. You know, it just, it's very important the parts that you're playing. If you're shoehorning yourself into something that you can't do, obviously, I don't think it will show you in the best light. Yeah. But as to, you know, good and bad actors, so many actors have learned over the course of their careers, you know, who started out not particularly good and then, you know, did something. amazing. And they've kind of learned on the job, as we say. Yeah. But it's very hard to pinpoint why people

can and can't do it. It's just a kind of instinct. I think what's for me, what's just as important is not only what you do on stage or on film, but how you behave off it. And being at the National Theatre in the Royal Shakespeare Company, those were things that I've really noticed was how those

stars, in inverted commas, um, behaved when they weren't on stage and they were always encouraging and generous, the best ones anyway. And they happened to be, those were the best actors. I mean, Gary Oldman, who I worked with on Tinker Taylor Soldier Spy, was a hero of mine, is a hero of mine. He's slightly older than me, so I was very conscious of the stuff he was doing.

He was choosing an incredibly eclectic mix of characters. And then I got to work with him. And I think I was a little nervous because I wasn't sure what he would be like. And I did that classic, I made the classic mistake of judging him on the characters he's played. Right. Actually, he's one of the most generous, supportive, kind people I've ever worked with. And that, to me, is the sign of a truly, truly gifted actor. It's funny you mention him because I think I've mentioned this before.

I agree with you. He is probably one of the top actors I've ever seen that everything he does is sublime. Seeing him on a talk show like 10 or 15 years into watching his material, I finally realized I was hearing his actual voice for the first time. And I never experienced it before. I had no idea who Gary Oldman was. The true mark of a, of a chameleon, is that man. You've worked with some amazing filmmakers, especially in the last 10 or 12 years. And it speaks well of you that many of them have repeated, whether it's, you know, Ridley

Scots and Guy and Matthew. I mean, working with Guy Ritchie and Matthew Vaughn, like, is that kind of a different experience because, I mean, do you view them more as peers than someone like a, like a Ripley Scott, who's obviously of a previous generation. Is it a different kind of an experience? I do, I suppose. They are my friends, you know. But I have an enormous amount of respect for them

because those guys came up against the brick wall of the British film industry when they were trying to get their first film made Lockstock and Two Smoking Barrels. There was a classic, cleaky thing going on in the UK. They turned up with this script. Nobody was interested. Nobody would give them the time of day.

And they circumvented the British film industry. made their own movie, had a massive success with it, then did again make the second movie, had an even bigger success with that. And now Matthew is making, I think he's made five films. Every one of them has been successful. Fantastic. He's not only making money, but they're critically acclaimed. Yeah. He's a really, really talented guy. And Guy went into the studio picture world and he's making these huge movies. And, you know, he comes from 500 pound music videos originally. Right. He's really learned his craft and his trade over the years. I have an incredible amount of respect with them.

And I think when I worked with them, they'd started out working with some actors, some non-actors. I think what I gave to them was a proper actor. That's what they saw me as. A guy who turned up, knew his lines, hid his marks, and delivered a performance. Because so many people don't do that. You'd be amazed,

who don't really even have the basic techniques of film acting, let alone having learned their lines, let alone being nice people to work with. So that counts for an awful lot. And I'm sure that's why I've worked with them more than once. Do you, it had been a while since you'd been on the stage, I think, 10 or 12 years, right? Something like that. Did you have concern the first couple of times you stepped on stage after all that time?

I was terrified, to be honest with you. I really enjoyed the rehearsal process. Evo Vanhova, the director of you from the bridge, made a fantastic environment for us all to work in. And I remembered how much I loved doing plays, having not been on stage for 20. 12 years. Sure. You know, the idea of getting black words on a white page up onto their feet and suddenly you are embodying a character, you're performing with other people, and you're telling a story with your body and your voice, you know. It's an amazing experience. So the rehearsal process was wonderful and then we got to the first public performance and I,

you have to try and imagine what it's like to be in the dressing room where there's a speaker on the wall, which is the relay from the stage manager who's letting you know. Okay, half an hour to go, 15 minutes to go, five minutes to go. There's the countdown to performance. And at the five minutes, they switch on the mics in the auditorium. So suddenly you hear the buzz of the audience. So there you are in your dressing room. You've rehearsed this play for four weeks.

This is the first public performance. You have no idea what it's going to be like, whether it's going to work, whether you're going to remember your lines, any of that stuff. And you're listening to the buzz of the audience and the adrenaline courses through you. everybody describes it exactly the same and then you walk down the corridor down the stairs you stand behind the set and then the lights go down

and the noise of the audience goes down and then a light comes up and you have to just walk out there and do it and that is a really truly terrifying experience when you haven't done it for a long time and I had I think probably

what could be described as stage fight rather than just nerves nerves are quite useful because it means you're switched on you're ready to go and you know you're in fight or flight mode which is the best condition you're razor sharp you need yeah exactly be your best stage ride is something else completely that's like waking up in the morning opening your eyes your first thought is i'm alive your second thought is sheer terror and i experienced that and um tried to cope with it by i stopped drinking coffee i started trying to breathe regularly there are techniques on stage that you can do

which are forget about yourself you know act with the other person right put the spot on the other person exactly don't make it about you and using those techniques and um you know simple common sense getting some sleep and whatever so how did the stage right manifest though i assume you weren't forgetting lines and and just screwing up it was just how what you were feeling and yeah you go out on stage and there is another voice in your head that is commenting on what's happening that is noticing the audience that is challenging you to remember your lines um it's a strange idea it's like a it's like a because you have another voice in your head when you're performing this this whole idea of method i find very interesting the idea that you subsume yourself completely to a part how can

that be possible you can see the audience you know on a film set you can see the camera you know it's not real sure the point is not about being 100% because what you have to use some craft in order to know how to use the camera right uh how to deliver what you're the lines that you're saying to an audience so part of your brain is always involved with making sure you don't bump into the furniture, you know, dealing with problems. If somebody else forgets a line or drops a line, you can cope with that, making sure you're in the right place on the stage, all of that. 5% of your brain maybe is doing that. With stage fright, I'd say 50% of your brain is constantly teasing you, challenging you, reminding you that you're terrified. The trick is turning that

off, quieting that. Yeah, and that's what you have to do. And basically, I had to do a number of previews before that voice started to disappear what um you talk about that uh you explained it very well kind of that feeling of going out on stage for that that first time way after um rehearsing does anything on a film set hit that high for you what would have been the highest highs for you being on a film set when does it feel the best that it can feel whether you're talking specifically about a specific instance or generally i think when you know you're working with the best people to When I did Body of Lies with Ridley Scott, being on set with Russell Crowe and Leonardo DiCaprio, the three of us. Yeah, you're in a room knowing there are not two better actors working together at this moment right now.

Yeah, and you've got an amazing script and you've got a fantastic director. And, you know, there was a moment where I thought, this is about as good as it gets, you know. And the same is true when I went on set at Kingsman, you know, and there was Michael Kane and there was Colin Firth. and in fact I walked on set on Michael Cain with the first day he was standing there in front of the crew and I walked in there and he went oh it's you

I like you I think you're a good actor I like you in front of the crew and Matthew Alverswood's went wow he didn't say that to anybody else you got the Caincymore silver approvals is huge yeah yeah so those kind of moments

are really great you know and feeling like you're in the company of something like Michael Cain who is film history yeah you know I felt the same when I was you know, when I work with Roman Polanski, you know, you felt like this man is connected to film history, connected to Jack Nicholson, connected to Chinatown, you know, the great one of the great movies. So when you work with people, like Ridley Scott, too, who've made such amazing films, those are the times, I think, when it's best in the movies, when you're working with people at the top of their game. Was Polanski an easy guy to deal with? I mean, I've talked to a lot of actors that have worked with him.

He's not necessarily the warmest, cuddliest filmmaker. No, he's like an imp. He's like a mischievous imp. And what I remember most of all is the terrible jokes he insisted on telling him at the time. He'd tell these jokes and things they were the funniest jokes. They were awful. They were appalling jokes. Did you pretend to find them amusing? Or did you? At first I did. And then I was just like, oh, stop it. Maybe he's testing me. Maybe he's purposely telling me bad jokes and I have to tell him back.

No, he was a fascinating guy. He was very into the reality of every moment. Yeah. You know, he didn't want you to rush moments because you can cheat things on camera. um he never wanted that you know if you had to unlock a door he wanted you to get the proper key make sure the key actually fitted in the lock the lock actually worked and open the door in real time right he was sort of obsessed with minute details like that and he was constantly fiddling with my costume you know what buttons i had and whether my collar was up or down he was very very into the um the reality of all those tiny little details he wouldn't be directing this production of a view from the bridge this is not necessarily his style no he has done theater

hasn't he? Yeah, I think he has. Yeah, but I don't, well, I don't know. Yeah, who knows? What's the post-mortem now that it's been a few years on Green Lantern? How do you rationalize what happened with that in terms of the success that it didn't necessarily turn out to be

in terms of financially? I don't know if you consider it artistically satisfying or not. When you look back at it, what do you think? My take on it, films are alchemy. All creative undertaking is alchemy. You know, novels, paintings, theater, films, whatever.

So you're hoping that all the ingredients are going to work. Jeff Johns, I think, is a really clever guy, you know, at D.C. And they put together what I think is a really faithful film to the comics. Sure. Unfortunately, it was coming out in the same year as X-Men, Thor, and Captain America. So you had a real glut of superhero movies that year. And I think it was the last one to come out. Right. And what it is, I think, is a very faithful film to the comic book.

And if you're a 13, 14-year-old boy, it's fantastic right unfortunately a lot of the people you know who had their eyes on that movie weren't impressed with the initial CGI clips that came out so already a kind of whispering campaign started is this right is this not right and you know the internet can be a terrible thing and I think that a whole sort of rumor started around whether or not Ryan Reynolds was the correct guy to play how George or whether the CGI was right so it opened at the end of these four three other superhero movies over the summer

with a slight kind of negative vibe about it and it just didn't recover from that I don't think I was really proud of what I did as Sinestra and I've had a lot of really kind comments about it that it was a really classic rendering of that part and that's why I played it I thought God if I can look like that guy and I love transformation you know

I think as an actor that's what I'm interested in most of all if I can look like that guy and deliver that I'll be very happy and i like the film i think it's fine you know much like john carter is a i love john carter i really do it's a it's you know it's a it's a really good film yeah film unfortunately these days also has the whole kind of side issue of gossip yeah and comment and all of that about it as well and sometimes films never get a foothold in order to take off right uh and allow people to watch them they they both those films i think had a kind of cloud of negativity around them when they came out, which is unfortunate, because I like both

films. Do you consume a lot of film? Are you able to in this, some of you're a busy man right now, but this is the good time of year where some really good stuff is coming out. Yeah, I do. I've kind of started loving the smaller independent films, you know, the big short, I think. I just watched recently. Oh, I haven't seen it. That's good. Yeah. Yeah, really great. And Brooklyn, another wonderful film. I'm sort of enjoying those kind of films, I think, and spotlight I thought was terrific as well. And I may go and do a film actually with Jessica Chastain called Miss Sloan, which is a story about the lobbying industry.

Oh, is that right? So films like Spotlight and the Big Short, you know, standard in good stead, because I think people are up for films that kind of slice into that kind of world, the world that we don't necessarily understand, but kind of lay it bare. If you want to catch a different side of Jessica Chastain, you might want to look up some of the comedic shorts that she's done with me over the years, which are amazing. She has an untapped resource in terms of comedy, I'm telling you. Oh, really?

She's fantastic. I always love it when you hear that about people. You know, they have this other thing that they can do. Amazing. She can do it all, clearly. Any, I don't know how old your boys are. Is there a lot of Star Wars talk in your house right now? Do you care much about it at all?

My wife's brother was a massive, massive fan of Star Wars, a total geek. So, yes, the boys have seen the first three, and they love them, and they're very, very excited. I feel like you could have a really good place in the Star Wars universe. Whether, I mean, the badies generally. are British, as we know in Star Wars. There's a Sith Lord in there somewhere for me, surely. Seriously, you would look great with a hood and a lightsaber and I don't know. Or an imperial outfit.

I'm just saying there are ways to go. Yeah, yeah. Well, I'm available. Okay, fair enough. And looking ahead, we're going to see you. I've seen some trailers for Grimsby, which is clearly talking about a change of pace. Sure. That's going to be a fun one.

Sasha Baron-Cowen is operating on a whole other level of comedy. A genre I've never really kind of been involved with, you know, action comedy. and Sasha's kind of comedy, too, which in itself is out there. I mean, he's a natural-born clown and loves to push the envelope as much as possible. And it's going to be hilarious and offensive all at the same time. But they're saying that it's, you know, it's a fun watch. Did it feel like that was one word, not only did you have to put your trust in the director, but also Sasha, because Sasha clearly knows this type of comedy that he wants to produce

and clearly knows how to do it well. He's an amazing guy, I have to say, I mean, a very bright guy. I went to Cambridge, you know, really intelligent, and he's a real seeker after the truth of comedy. You know, he'll often give me lectures about comedy, you know, say you can't do that because that's a joke on a joke. Interesting. You can't have two jokes operating in the same thing. You can just do one or the other. And he would often kind of talk to me about improvisation and the kind of the science of improvisation, if you like.

He's a real kind of, he's a guy who really tries to track down why things are funny. while at the same time, you know, rejoicing in the hilariously offensive, as only he can. So, you know, I love him and we get on really well. The improvisation was a really extraordinary experience, and he gave me the confidence to do it, really. Is that still thrilling for you? We're like, you know, you've been doing this a while, but like, oh, wait, there are still avenues, there's still aspects of my own talent that I can access that haven't been exploited yet, that I can test myself, I can push myself, the work's not done yet.

I don't know all there is to know yet. Well, I felt like, you know, as we were talking about Sinestro, that's a whole world of prosthetics and science fiction that I'd never really tackled, which I really enjoyed. With Sasha, I get the opportunity to do improvised comedy, which is something that I've never really done. Both of those things, I suppose, I was nervous about. But if you don't keep trying to discover new things, how will you ever know what you're good at? Is Kingsman, which I think the sequel was coming pretty close, right? You're going to be shooting that relatively soon. Is that basically like a holiday to work with friends like that on a project of that type?

Is that something you're very much looking forward to getting back into? Yeah, well, Colin, I've worked with four or five times now, Colin Firth. I mean, I know him very well. And Matthew, I've made three films with. So I describe it as you no longer need to do the dance with those people. You know, when you meet somebody new and you're on set with them or you're on stage with them, you have to work out how you're going to interact with them and how you're going to get on for the next God knows how long.

With Matthew and Colin, I no longer need to do the dance because we all know our steps. Has Matthew told you much, or have you seen the script yet for the new one? No, I keep getting these cryptic messages, call me, call me, and I keep trying to call him, and he's obviously writing it, and I haven't been able to get hold of him, but I think it moves to America. That's what he was saying, right, yeah. And he was talking about shooting in Kentucky and Singapore, but that's all I know. That's a wide range. Hopefully you get Singapore too. I mean, Kentucky sounds lovely, but I think you should get some Singapore time in there. Well, I hope so. I mean, New York as well, and London. And he said, as far as he knows, Merlin is involved in all of those locations.

So I think I'll be spending my summer with Matthew. I just saw Taryn in his next film, Eddie the Eagle. Oh, have you seen that? It's excellent. Is it? It truly is. It's like, it's a good, feel-good sports film. He's a much different kind of character for him. I think he's super talented. You see how amazing that is for Taryn. He comes out of drama school. Yeah. Go straight into Kingsman. Yeah. And then the very next film he gets is another lead, Eddie, which is completely different. I mean, it's a wonderful, it's a wonderful beginning, you know. And it seems like a good head on his shoulder from talking to him after Kingsman. I mean, that's, that's got to be screw with a kid's head, I would think, but yet he seems to be handling pretty well. He's a cool guy. He's coming at the industry with respect,

which is what you kind of have to do. And that thing I said earlier on about wanting 40 or 50 years in this business, you know, it's one thing getting lead in the movie and then perhaps getting another lead in the movie, but you've got to sustain that now for the next 40 years. You know, you've got to kind of, there's only very, fingers of one hand, like Tom Cruise. Right. Who else? I don't know. Is part of you happy that this kind of career that you have right now didn't happen when you were 25, or could you have handled it, you think, back now? I'm delighted at the way it's kind of happened because it's been a slow burn, and I feel like as I've gone along the way, I've learned everything that's taken me to the next level and the next step. And so to round it up to be here on Broadway after, I don't know, what, 25 years is, if somebody told me that at the beginning, I would have taken that, you know, like a shot.

It's a wonderful place to be, and I feel like what I bring now is the stuff I've learned over the last 25 years, which I couldn't have done when I was a young man. Well, you certainly do that each and every night on stage. I can't tell you. It's one of my favorite productions I've seen it in quite some time, and I hope people check it out of you from the bridge that's going through, what, February is that? That's right, February the 21st, I think. Very nice. So get a ticket if you can. Check out an amazing performance and an amazing ensemble and an amazing production.

The keyword is amazing. Mark, it's really been a pleasure to catch up with you today. Thanks for your time. It's lovely chatting. Thanks a lot. Thanks, ma'am. Cool. Thanks, guys. Yes.

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Goodbye. Summer movies, Hello Fall. I'm Anthony Devaney. And I'm his twin brother, James. We host Raiders of the Lost Podcast, the ultimate movie podcast, and we are ecstatic to break down late summer and early fall releases. We have Leonardo DiCaprio leading a revolution in one battle after another, Timothy Salome, playing power ping pong in Marty Supreme. Let's not forget Emma Stone and Jorgos' Borgonia. Dwayne Johnson, he's coming for that Oscar in The Smashing Machine, Spike Lee and Denzel teaming up again, plus Daniel DeLuis's return from retirement. There will be plenty of blockbusters to chat about, too. Tron Aries looks exceptional, plus Mortal Kombat 2, and Edgar writes the running man starring Glenn Powell. Search for Raiders of the Lost Podcast on Apple Podcasts, Spotify, and YouTube.