Happy Sad Confused - MR. ROBOT w/Rami Malek, Christian Slater, & Sam Esmail

Episode Date: October 13, 2025

It's been 10 years since MR. ROBOT debuted and blew all our minds. Happy Sad Confused is celebrating this groundbreaking series with a reunion taped live at New York Comic Con. Rami Malek, Christian Slater, and creator Sam Esmail join Josh to reminisce about the show that changed all their lives. UPCOMING EVENTS 10/14 -- Aziz Ansari in NY -- ⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠tickets here⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠ 10/22 -- Nobody Wants This cast in NY -- ⁠⁠⁠tickets here⁠⁠⁠ Check out the ⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠Happy Sad Confused patreon here⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠! We've got discount codes to live events, merch, early access, exclusive episodes, video versions of the podcast, and more! Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

I'm not going to lie, the schedule and Sam put me through absolute hell. But it was a challenge that I embraced and looked back on with great pride. Prepare your ears, humans. Happy, sad, confused begins now. Hey, guys, it's Josh. Welcome to another edition of Happy, Sad, Confused. Today, a 10th anniversary reunion for Mr. Robot, recorded live at York Comic-Con.

Thanks, guys, as always, for checking out the YouTube version or the audio version, Spotify. However you consume, happy, set confused. You guys are awesome. Thank you, thank you. Thank you. I'll mention, by the way, speaking of Spotify, we had an amazing, amazing stat come up recently. We hit number one on the film and TV charts for Spotify. Not only that, we hit number 14 in the overall charts of every single podcast.

That's right. we were above call her daddy when when could i have expected to put those two words two things in the same sentence call her daddy and happy say i confused same show basically um so thank you all i appreciate all your support um this is such a cool episode i'm so excited this came together uh i've been very busy at near comic con doing my thing moderating a bunch of panels including some live versions of happy sag infused and this was the one that kicked off thursday night at comic con over at the Jacob Javitt Center, we brought together the cast and creator of Mr. Robot. Most notably, Rami Malick and Christian Slater and Sam Esmell.

What a treat. This show came around 10 years ago, and it really, you know, to use all, you could use all the clichés, and they're in this case kind of really true. Groundbreaking TV, the production ambition of this, insane. It's a heady show. It's a provocative show. It's an anti-establishment show. And it launched, of course, Rami into the stratosphere, winning his Oscar for Bohemian Rhapsody, et cetera.

And of course, like, reintroduced, not that we needed a reintroduction, but Christian Slater gave him such a juicy great role. They were both a delight. It was great to have them on the big stage. We packed, I think, over a thousand people in that space for this event. And it was just great to celebrate a show that really, I think, It's got in its love, but maybe not even enough. So, by the way, I did a rewatch of it recently. And if you haven't seen Mr. Robot ever or in a while, check it out because it is certainly, as I say, in the panel of its time, but really ahead of its time in many, many respects.

And it's rare, I think, to see in this conversation, you know, Rami let loose a little bit, let his, let his hair down, so to speak, be fun and light. He obviously was comfortable with Sam and Christian and me. The guys really were very kind before and especially after the panel. And I think we're just happy to get together and reminisce. So so excited to share this with you. Before we get to that, quick reminder, check out our Patreon. Patreon.com slash happy, say I confused. You get early access to episodes like this, all our episodes.

And we are stacked by the way with amazing episodes this fall. We might do three episodes a week at times. Like, I'm just, I'm, I'm, I am embarrassed to say that so many people are coming out of the woodwork that want to do the podcast right now, but I mean, I'm so, it's hard to say no to some of these folks. So we're going to jam them in where, where we can. Check out our Patreon, though, because we do give the early access and we also offer discounts and announcements on all our live events. I'm doing, if you're listening to this on Monday, the 13th, there's still time or Tuesday, Tuesday night, the 14th. I'm chatting. with Aziz Ansari at 92nd Street Y, showing his film Good Fortune. Next week, October 22nd, I'll be with the whole gang from Nobody Wants This. That's going to be a blast at 92nd Street Y, and there are many, many more live events to come. Patreon.com slash happy, say it confused as your friend for all that kind of stuff. Okay. I take you now to our live event taped at the Jacob Javitt Center.

Thank you to everybody in your Comic-Con for being so accommodating and helping make the magic happen. And thank you to the fans who came out and made it so special. And most of all, thank you, the Sam S. Mill, Robbie Malick, and Christian Slater. Without any further ado, enjoy. Welcome. Welcome to a very big night. This is, you're inside my podcast, whether you know it or not. Happy San Confused is my beloved podcast. New York Comic Con has been very good to this pod last year. In this very room, we celebrated 10 years of Happy San Confused. It was a special night. And I can't do an 11th anniversary special. So instead I'm celebrating another show's 10th anniversary,

and it's an excellent one. It is a classic one. We are here to celebrate Mr. Robot. Are you ready for this, guys? Sam Esmell's amazing, innovative, provocative, cinematic, bold. Every adjective you can think of describes this show. It gave us an amazing ensemble. It gave us

Christian Slater It gave us Rami Malik Come on, guys There's so much to discuss tonight It's been 10 years since they've been here at Comic-Con They've been having a blast backstage And now we're going to have a blast on stage in front of you guys.

Are you ready for this? Should we bring them one out? Please give a warm New York Comic-Con welcome to Christian Slater, everybody. Christian, come on out. Give it up for Rami Malik, everybody. And to the creator of Mr. Robot, it's Sam Esmow, Sam, come on out. The love is real. The love is strong. Welcome, Guzz.

Keep that score going to... Is that good workout music to jog to, to work out to, Rami? Is it good to work out to... The score of this is pretty good to work. Pretty great, yeah. McQuil did an excellent job. Yeah, yeah, yeah. I can still throw that on.

Do you throw it on everything? Totally. When I do ketamine, it's like the best... Dissociate to? I feel like I already missed a good opportunity. I feel like a thousand folks should say hello friend on the count of three to these folks. Are we ready? At the count of three, say hello friend to the cast and Sam Esmell.

One, two, three. Hello, friends. Hello friends. Do you ever get that in a Starbucks, any of you? Does that ever happen, Rami? Does somebody sneak up behind you and say, hello friend? Never. No, never happened.

I don't know. Thank you for it. Um... Congratulations. Ten years. Um, you guys clearly get along. It's been a love affair backstage. Talk to me a little bit about...

Is it surreal to be back here, first of all? Just ten years have passed somehow. Yeah, it's incredible. I mean, look, hey, Comic-Con, New York. It's the coolest. I love it. And I kind of wish I'd worn a costume. That would be fun.

Did you think about gearing up and costume grab, you know... We talked about it on the way over here. Yeah. I thought it would be fun. Did you take your costume? Do you have it? All right, I'll go get it. No, no, no.

Talk to me a little bit about, I mean, look, it's one of the great gifts of any show is it's staying power. We are still, this show is still very relevant, maybe more relevant than ever. Does Mr. Robot still feel a part of your lives 10 years later? Hmm. Well, it's on Netflix now, so that's nice. Right?

I mean, that, yeah. Yeah. Yeah. I mean, it's had its resurgence, hasn't it? A little bit, yeah. Yeah. Yeah. I mean, listen, I think sadly what's weird about the show, because when I wrote it, it was during

the Obama era, right? And I wrote all these, like, crazy apocalyptic things that happened in the show, and I was fictional, you know. Right. Sam, it's your fault. Yeah. Now the shit is fucking happening. happening and yeah that part I don't like so I get but it is staying yeah there if you're

talking about staying power I guess that's one way of looking at it that's there are moments when I like Sam you just can't write that though that's implausible it's not yeah but I kept saying wrong me it's not gonna fucking happen it's never gonna happen then it happens yeah all right let's go back to the very beginning some folks here might know the origins of this but Sam give us give us the the Cliff Notes version what where did this all begin. How long had you been thinking about this concept? Well, I mean, you know, I'm sure a lot of fans here probably have heard me talk about this ad nauseum. But I grew up very much a nerd and very into computers and very fascinated by tech.

And, you know, when the internet explode, I'm very old. So I was around pre-internet. And when the internet came out, it was obviously something that impacted my life in a big way. And I just thought there was an interesting tension there. between technology and humanity as it sort of became popularized in the odds. Is there a baby? It's their first Comic-Con panel.

Hello, baby. I hope the parents are with the baby. The robot fans come in all shapes and sizes, Sam. And then a few events started happening that sort of crystallized. story for me. Arab Spring being a big one. I'm Egyptian, and I remember watching that. Salam alaikum. So am I. And then the financial crisis of 2008. And what I took away from that is that the world felt in crisis, how naive was I back then, that that was what crisis was like.

And that these young people in not just Egypt, but in the entire Middle East, was using technology to organize and start a revolution. And that really inspired a lot of what the story of Mr. Robot and specifically the character of Elliot. And, you know, as I think a lot of you know, I started writing it as a feature, got a little long-winded, and decided to turn it into a series. That was primarily because my producer at the time, the late, great Steve Golan, had come out with a show called True Detective, which was mind-blowing, and I thought, oh my God, this, you know, this is as cinematic as anything in the theater, and I was so gung-ho to turn it into a series. I'm so grateful I did. So for Rami and Christians, do you have any recollection of the first time you read the material

or met with Sam and, like, what you made of this? Like, was it immediately apparent that this was something special? Or was this just another job at the time? Like, who knows? Some turned out great. Some don't. It's a job. To put it simply, it was quite exquisite and special from the very beginning.

Besides the title, I did question the title. A lot of people did. So many people. Oh, yeah. Yeah, they wanted to change it at one point. Yeah. I mean, it is kind of a silly title. To what? I mean, what would they, do they have?

I don't remember. In retrospect, it doesn't, oh. Do you remember? You know the alternative. It's okay. It's stuck and it works. Yeah. We enjoy it.

I remember, yeah, I remember just turning over that first page and it was one of those moments where it was like reading a good novel, where for me, I almost want to spread it out over time, but I can't. I just ended up, I ended up going through it at some pace and then slow down. down because through a certain, at a certain point, I wanted to savor it because there was something in my subconscious that was already starting to inhabit this character. And I thought if I was going to audition for it, I should just try to soak as much of that in as possible. And it was riveting page to page. And when I got to that ending, it was

such a sucker punch. And I kind of just stared at it for a moment. and took it in and I felt the weight of it. I felt how special it was and I could only hope that I would be a part of it. It was, yeah, it was a monumental experience of having something sent to you that actually not only you liked as a work of art and fiction, but something that you thought might be a part of,

could, if it was to be a part of your life for some time would be very substantial and significant. And purely just from an acting person, And like, look, you'd been doing it for a minute, but to be the lead in a show and to see the opportunity of this character must have been like, oh, I can really, I can really sink my teeth into this. Well, I mean, I have to give Sam credit for that. That was, and, you know, everyone at USA and NBC, I wasn't that typical lead for a show at that time. I mean, people weren't really thinking outside of the box. I mean, nothing about the show is typical.

I mean, you got to remember, it's like I had never set foot in a writer's room. Oh, I know. This is insane. This man directed 38 episodes of a 40, 45 episodes of a show. Not recommended. With virtually no experience. Yeah. And honestly, if it weren't for people like Bonnie Hammer and Alex Sepiel who were running,

were in the network at the time. This wouldn't have happened. I mean, they really, I mean, they were kind of crazy for giving us this opportunity. I mean, they really were. I mean, it was a story about a guy on a fucking computer typing, which is not like the opposite of what most people would say is drama on TV. And they really just took a chance on us. And I'm, you know, I think we're all pretty grateful to them.

The show wouldn't have happened without them. Christian, do you remember any kind of turning point? I mean, you guys were here at New York Comic. actually almost 10 years ago to this day. I mean, was it, was it when you started to see the fan reception or going to comic cons like that you knew this was, maybe you were proud of it, but you knew that it was clicking? There was definitely some moments where we would take like audience photos and people would all be wearing the Mr. Robot mask. You know, like the whole audience was filled with people wearing the Mr. Robot mask. And that was kind of like, oh, wow. They're really quite interested in this show, aren't they? I mean, this was amazing to me. You know, and it was thrilling.

I mean, to be a part of something that was such a part of the zeitgeist there was quite remarkable. And to be a part of that was very, very exciting. I got to tell this one story. So we were shooting the first season as it was airing, which, again, insane. I don't know how we did that. And it was kind of having this ground swell. People were really digging it. And there was stopping us while we were shooting it.

We were having to shoot scenes and people would come up to us. And it was kind of crazy. And I remember at one point, because, you know, Christian to me was like a god. I mean, I was a huge fan of his, pump up the volume, Heather's, true romance. I mean, this guy was a legend, is a legend. I remember we were shooting, I don't know if you remember this, we were shooting, I think, episode seven or something, and I was just backstage, and I was pretty exhausted, and I was sitting next to you, and you told me, you know this doesn't happen very often, right? And I was like, what do you mean? Because I didn't know anything. This is, again, this is literally my first time really doing anything. And you just said, this was special. Now, something's different about what's going on. I'm like, dude, you fucking did true romance. Come on. And you said that, and it really stuck with me, because it was really, I mean, now having

done a few other things, yeah, that was pretty special. That does not happen a lot. And, yeah, it was. Yeah, it meant a lot when you said that to me. I just remember that. Well, I'm glad. Yeah, I'm glad. I mean, I wanted to, listen, it was a big deal, and it was very special.

And I guess part of me just wanted to make sure, you know, because I've been in other situations before where maybe I didn't appreciate it as much as I probably could have, and I really just wanted, I guess, everybody around me to really see how unique and special this was. And so, yeah, so I would walk around reminding everybody. This doesn't happen. No, I had the same experience, and I think it was the same episode where we were both reading the New York Times. Yeah. Do you remember this? Well, I'm about to remind you. And we were on the cover of the art section. And you said that same thing.

You looked at it and you go, hey, take this in. This doesn't usually happen. This never happens. And we got picked up for two seasons like that, right? I mean, that was cool. We got picked up before the first episode aired. Before the first episode aired, you know. So, oh, that doesn't happen.

And then... Again, thank you, Bonnie. Thank you, Bonnie. That was the coolest thing. Oh, my God. Stop leaving savings behind at the pump. Get up to 7 cents per liter in value every time you fill up at Petro Canada. That's 3 cents per liter in instant savings plus 20% more points when you link an eligible RBC card to your Petro points.

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Mates is back. That's right. After a brief snack nap. We're coming back. We're picking snacks. We're eating snacks. We're raiding snacks. Like the snackologist we were born to be.

Mates is back. Mike and Tom, eat snacks. Wherever you get your podcast. Unless you get them from a snack machine, in which case, call us. As actors, did any of, like, how much did you know at the start? How much did Sam clue you in on all the twists and turns that were to come in the seasons? And did any in particular catch you off guard that you recall? Are you talking just the first season or...

You're talking the entirety of the show because there are a bunch. He left out a few things. What would have been helpful to know maybe in retrospect, Christian? Anything? Wow. Is there anything specifically that would have been? been helpful to know maybe in that respect. Maybe one or two things.

I mean, there were some moments. But you know, I mean, this show, it was extraordinarily complex. I mean, I remember when I read the script the first time, and I had an instinct about it too. There was just some feeling I had and then I met. You knew. Yeah, and I met with Sam and, you know, and I said, is this guy, Mr. Robbins?

Is he really there? And he was like, you really want to know? And I said, yeah, yeah, yeah. yeah. And he, you know, he told me, and I just got very excited about it. I just thought, oh, man, that is really cool. You know, to play a figment of somebody's imagination was just that much more exciting for me. And then look, you know, that was season one. And there were other things, of course, that came up that were surprising, that were shocking, that at times I had, you know, difficulty even accepting or being comfortable with. But, but I mean, I think that was part of the

challenge of the show and the things that made it that much more special. And, you know, you just kind of had to, like, get out of the way of yourself and your own ego. And again, go back to appreciating the moment, that this was something very, very special. And we were talking about mental health and childhood trauma and all those kinds of subjects that were very difficult to tackle. And it made me uncomfortable at times. But Sam was always great, always there. I think held all of our hands through the whole thing and made it make sense to me.

So were you consciously holding stuff back or were you making stuff up as you went along? No, we, and I should say, because Kyle Bradstreet is also here who's, I couldn't have done the show without him. He was my lieutenant. Remember that I started writing this as a feature. So I did know the end. So the vomit draft, right? The vomit draft, yeah.

So I did know where I was going. But I just felt like I was, just to be honest, I was super paranoid about telling too many people. Because, you know, I... Yeah, paranoid does... Sorry. But no, so I would hold a couple of things. hold a couple of things close to the vest. And I think that season, and also I didn't want to, I wanted to really treat each season as one specific emotional arc, knowing that we're building

up to something in that last season. So at the start of every season, I would take you guys aside. That was the coolest thing. I mean, I get in the phone call from you and listening to him for like two, two and a half hours and just go through the whole season was awesome. Yeah. That was very rare. I mean, I still, to this day, look back and think that's a very rare, I think, elegant, sophisticated, and I think very, just very unexpected from someone who has so much on their plate to go to each actor and describe not only their storyline, but each episode in great detail, one by one. could easily gather everybody in a room and do it in one session, but I think that time. The take that time is, uh, is something that's quite selfless, but for the integrity of the show, essentially, and why did you put yourself, did you feel responsibility to each character? Absolutely, but because ultimately, I also think that if the show or anything, a movie,

if it becomes about plot and plot mechanics, you start to fail. Because it really, I used to say this in interviews all the time, fuck plot. And I really mean it because it's really about people and the characters. And that to me is the most important thing. And I wanted, when I talked to you guys and the rest of the cast members, I wanted them to feel that they were the most important part of that season because that's the way it should feel to that character in their storyline. I wanted that experience with them and I wanted that intimacy with them.

And also, I have to say, you know, we do have a lot of twists and big reveals in the show, but I never wanted it to feel gimmicky. And that comes from a place of plot. I really wanted it to feel like it was coming from what the character was feeling and what they were going through. And, you know, it could be in reaction to what's happening, but it's most of the time it's in reaction to each other. And I just think that deserves that intimate conversation that I would have with you guys.

For you, Rami, was there any person or persons that inspired your characterization of Elliot? Was Sam sometimes an inspiration for Elliot at all? Oh, yeah, there were a few, I suppose. The walking down the street. And not touching people and all of that. Oh, is that very much you? Well, I think, yeah, I think we did that.

I still live. I don't like touching people when I walked. I know, obviously, a lot of you are New Yorkers. A lot of fucking people on this street. So you got to do your bob and weave, because. Yeah. And you had the. I did do that.

I prepped, I started, I came here early. I was not living in the city. And I think for a good 15 days, I was trying not to touch anyone. And going to elevators and not looking at cameras. And is that method? Was that method? I talked to a psychiatrist for quite some time. In fact, that was the person that became our consultant in the writer's room.

Yeah, I kept bringing all these thoughts to say, I go, what about this? And I think someone in this situation might be going through this. And he's like, where are you getting this? So that was a therapist that you found, like you had? It wasn't my personal therapist, that's just fine. No, no, sure. Yeah, nothing wrong with therapy. No, I like therapy.

I embrace therapy. Yeah, Protoa. But she was great and she specialized in DID and she knew everything about it and she had, you know, she had a lot of experience in it. And man, she really helped us with all the details every season. Because we would comb through scripts, I mean, Sam, especially we would spend a lot of time. I remember even being abroad and waking up at certain hours just to go through scripts with Sam and in detail. And I have so much that I had just discovered from, from, from you know,

all those sessions. I won't call them, they weren't therapy sessions, but I was, I was learning. You wanted to get all of that particular disorder and, you know, surrounding disorders to be as authentic as anything that, you know, on the tech side. And, you know, there are moments where you reach someone who is dealing with that sort of, you know, a certain, anything that might be stigmatized by our culture and can relate. And that's one of the most profound experiences that this show has ever given me is, you know, we talk about this tension between, you know, how we communicate as human beings through devices personally and how dissociative that is. But when you have someone who responds to this show in the way that certain people,

people do. It really does make you feel as an actor or someone as part of the creative community that what we did had a real effect on a lot of people in the world that was simply not only powerful for them but gratifying and rewarding in a way that a lot of other jobs might not be. And you got to remember, DID in particular, can be such a trope in movies and we've seen it before right multiple personalities or etc and I was so fucking paranoid about being insensitive and treating and giving it just the regular or Hollywood treatment um that we really needed to nail it even as dark and ugly as it could go like we wanted we leaned into it and it scared us it scared us a lot I think but it was necessary

because otherwise it would just turn out to be one of these like plot gimmicky things that would really kind of do a disservice to what we were exploring with DID. What were your references? I mean, the relationship, you know, Fight Club is referenced. Did that come up in the first season in terms of kind of depict what this relationship was all about? Oh, I don't know about that, but it was definitely an influence on, you know, what I loved about Fight Club was how punk it was, but also how anti-capitalist it was. And by the way, that was kind of the first time where I thought, oh, can you be political in art?

And then that movie kind of told me, I think all great art is political. And that really moved me in a way. And that was a huge influence of like, oh, don't be afraid to. Because, you know, when I wrote this pilot, I was like, man, I'm really going all anti-capulous here. Are corporations going to finance and fund this and market it, even though I'm shitting all over them? Sure enough, they will. Thanks, USA. Again, thank you, Bonnie.

Appreciate it. I mean, so many big swings in the show, it really, like, as I said before, this man directed 30, I can't say this enough. 38 of the 45 episodes is insane. It's madness. Especially the level of production that you were doing here. I mean, there's the famous, you know,

continuous take episode, there's the silent episode, There's the bottle episode in the apartment that's like a play. I mean, did any of those, I mean, what's the biggest swing you feel like you took as a creative? I mean, it has to be 407, which is that episode that was like a play. Because not only was that complicated from a production standpoint, we had to have multiple cameras running all at the same time. I'm literally, Video Village, you know, usually have one or two cameras. I had, I think, 10 monitors.

and some of the monitors were split because we had more angles. We had cameras covering the whole set. And the material, obviously, knowing the episode, was so tough. And the performances, you know, needed to be at a certain level. And these guys were just on one. And we shot that, I think, in four days, I want to say. And it was insane. It was just, it was so crazy as a director to have to keep track between Christian and Gloria and Rami and Elliot and watching them just do these magic tricks and exceeding every expectation I had.

But just to juggle all of that and make sure that the cameras were always at the right spot because I didn't cut like we did each act. It's like a play. It was like a play. So I didn't do like, okay, Romney, we're going to do your coverage and we're going to move around. That's how you normally do. No, we had them all do the entire act, you know, all the way through in real time. And that was just tricky, not just from that technical standpoint, but just channeling that, sort of trying to get those performances. But, I mean, honestly, I'm glad we did it that way because I think it really fed into how you guys played off each other.

And you turn that set into a stage. essentially. Yeah. Stasha did as well. Yeah. Anastasia White, our production designer, who I might add was basically nine months pregnant when we were making that episode and somehow pulled it off and had a baby at the same time. Pretty crazy.

Yeah. I would imagine it's hard to pinpoint like the biggest acting challenge for you, Rami. I mean, you're playing scenes opposite someone that's in your head at times. You're playing scenes opposite yourself at times. at times, you're playing scenes just totally in your own head. I don't know, what jumps out at you as the biggest acting challenge of Elliot? Because it feels like you accomplished this role, you can do virtually anything. I think it was there was a sense of gravity to that character from the very beginning.

I mean, the immense grief, the profound alienation he's dealing with, just a sense of gravity. just a sense of loss, someone who is an addict and someone who is a non-conformist and doesn't really know how to communicate with people. But still, there's a steely determination inside of him, and I always was able to tap into that that I knew he could get himself out of any corner he was painted into,

Even if he was doing drugs, even though he had a mental disorder, there was this unique resilience that I found in Elliott day in and day out that always imbued me with some sense of hope about humanity, that even these outcasts, these misfits, the people we just don't give enough attention to in life, sometimes can be the most powerful human beings and the most affecting human beings. even with all of the profound pain that they're dealing with. And so I felt a sense of duty to really work as hard as I could to protect that human being, to nurture that human being,

to side with him at times, and to argue with him at times. So it was a lot of mental gymnastics day in and day out, And I'm not going to lie, the schedule and Sam put me through absolute hell. But it was a challenge that I embraced and looked back on with great pride. I mean, I would remember going through Monday to Friday. And by Friday, I feel like I would look at my body and felt, you know, like I had gone through something, a bit of a battle, and then geared up over the weekend.

and we were right back in it. We were shooting what, ostensibly, I think, other shows would probably give you now, what, three weeks to do? And we had seven days to shoot an episode. So there was no time to do anything but sit in Elliott's skin. And that was not an easy place to be, I must say, looking back on it, it was challenging, but it was worth every second.

And to add to, you know, the audience that I see here, now I have the privilege to be working in other countries and, you know, the way this show resonates in places, I was in Belgrade doing a film years ago, and these kids, these young kids, all had on these F-society T-shirts and masks outside of this hotel in Serbia. And I'm like, how? How is this happening?

But there's just this renegade culture that I think you've helped just allow so many people be able to feel comfortable in their own skin. Perhaps Elliot has, Mr. Robot has as a whole. So I'm immensely proud of that. Anything you put me through is well worth that. It's very gratifying. Well said. Well, I would imagine the intensity of you've kind of alluded to this. this, but like people in the wild meeting you and wanting to talk to you about this show

and this character and feeling seen. Like, you know, this, you guys centered a character we kind of alluded to this, that just isn't typically seen on screen in this way. And that's that's profound for somebody dealing with mental health issues or depression or all the stuff, addiction, something like this. No question, just observation. Statement. We'll take a statement.

It also changed. changed your life and career, all of your lives and careers. Talk to me a little bit about, I mean, Rami, obviously, the Oscar came after and these amazing opportunities came after. This must feel like a game changer for you in terms of your career, in terms of just exposing you to a wider audience and proving to yourself and others what you're capable of. I think there was an acknowledgement from Sam just one. wanting, seeing something in me that was, that had a profound effect on me.

Even the acknowledgement that I could take on this role from his perspective was that was a feat. Even though, you know, those are small moments you think about in retrospect. They're exponentially larger looking back on them now. Yeah, this show changed my life in ways I owe an immense amount of, you know, debt and gratitude. to everyone involved. I learned so much from it. I was able to carry myself a certain way going on to future projects, but there was something

about Elliot that it's the same thing we keep referring to. He's this unexpected hero, and he gave me this sense of confidence playing that role to step up and be a leader in a number of different ways. And to your point, I was discovered for Bohemian Rhapsody from producers having watched me in the show. So that was a huge launching pad. And in playing that character, you know,

and sometimes you could see a Freddie Mercury as this grand flamboyant extrovert, but there was very much a, shy introvert in that human being as well. And I knew how to do that quite well because of Elliot. But yeah, I gravitate to those characters who speak to people in a very unique way can speak to the masses by even just simply being an outsider. Paramount Wolfe

Check out the big stars, big series, and blockbuster movies streaming on Paramount Plus. Cue the music. Like NCIS, Tony, and Ziva. We'd like to make up our own rules. Tulsa King. We want to take out the competition. The substance.

This balance is not working. And the naked gun. That was awesome. Now that's a mountain of entertainment. Paramount Wolf. From the darkest corners of our imagination comes a game show that's more ridiculous than terrifying. Welcome to Tickled to Death.

I'm your host, Roz Hernandez, and I'll be guiding guests through the creepy questions and chaotic games, all to win the ultimate title of Horror Movie Champion. Listen to Tickled to Death, wherever you get your podcasts, And hit Follow, unless you want the show to follow you. It's also lovely to see. I mean, you guys clearly are in each other's lives. I was going to say this is not an exclusive.

You guys were at the U.S. Open together, so, I mean, you guys are still kind of tight. Christian, for you. I mean, you've been through many, many productions, iconic productions, and it doesn't always happen that way. You don't keep tight friends from every production. Was it just the nature of this shoot, the intensity of the shoot, the particular people? Like, why are you in each other's lives so much so to this day? I think we just genuinely like each other.

Sometimes it's that simple, yeah. Yeah, you know, I mean, it started from day one. You know, Rami and I doing that first scene in the Ferris wheel, the Wonder wheel. You know, that sort of locked us in a cage for, you know, a couple of days. And, you know, we both were just acting and acting animals there, trapped in a cage and working together and sort of figuring out how he likes to work, how I like to work, how Sam likes to work. And it was a great start. I mean, what better start could you ask for than going out to Coney Island and riding on the Wonderwheel with a couple of cool guys? It was great.

And since then, I don't know, Sam. I mean, yeah. We go to movies all the time. I'm like, it's my date, I'm his date. Yeah. And then our wives. Our wives get along. Yeah, that's right.

Did they get out of the way? Well, they exclude us sometimes. They do their own. But we have game nights. We, yes. Remember that mafia game? Yes. I killed it.

Oh, man. Yeah, yeah. It got ugly that. Remember though? Oh, yeah, yeah. Who's the best at mafia in this group? His wife. She fucking killed all.

Oh, yeah, yeah. She won that night, remember? She won, but I won in L.A., is what I'm saying. Oh, in L.A., that's right. It's bitter. He wants to win them all. Do you all right? I'm all right.

That's bullshit. I'd rather win. Who won't, does anybody own, Christian, do you own any Mr. Rowe? The U.S. Open just to say, that was awesome, right? We had a good time. They had a great time. When they see you two together out in the wild, someone sees the two of you together. That must be insane.

Like, oh, my God. They let us out of the cage. Look at us. Yeah. Do you own any Mr. Robot jackets, any paraphernalia, Christian? Yeah, I have my stuff, yeah. I have it, you know, in storage somewhere. Okay.

I have the hoodie. I was gonna say, who's got hoodies? Oh, yeah. Because Rami gifted it to me. Oh, yeah, that was his rap gift to me. It's all beautifully framed and everything. I didn't do that. I kept my...

We couldn't remember how hard it was. Sam was intent. Okay. Well, well, no, no, because... No, no, after you. After you. Go ahead. I was just going to say, we didn't just have one hoodie, obviously.

You had two. We did for a while. In the first season. I thought we had a ton of hoodies, but there was one. It was one. That Romie. The hero hoodie. Yeah.

It had the little rip on the pocket. Remember? It was like the little. Yeah. And that was the one you gave. That was why it was so special. But here, he put me through, I mean, this is it. I had a uniform the entire time.

It had to be perfect. And I'm... Costume designing. it was very straightforward, yeah. It was not straightforward. Because I tried on about 15 to 20 different black hoodies. Sure. And none of them would work.

I remember at one point the sleeves went from one hoodie was sewn on to another hoodie. And I was like, this is not working. And I had one of my own, and I thought, this is a little trick I used to go into a costume fitting sometimes, and I dress as kind of how much, as close as I can get to the character without it being straight in your face. And I did that, I walked through the office one day

with this black hoodie I had bought from a thrift store for 10 bucks. I'm like, maybe he'll get it. Maybe this will be the one. And sure enough, Sam sees me, goes, wait, where'd you get that? I totally forgot. forgot this. Yeah, yeah. That's why I wanted to tell the story.

But that's it. It was a $10 hoodie, and I go, oh, what, this? This old thing? No, you don't want this. I've been wearing this for years. And he goes, no, that's exactly what I've been looking for. But you can't have it. It's mine.

And that's this hoodie you own now. That's the framed hoodie. Was that the first one? That's the first one. Wow. Does that make that gift even more special? A man of many times. This is why he's the mastermind, guys.

But the irony is, Rami, you probably, in the rest of your life, can never wear a hoodie on the subway. You know what? I put on a black hoodie this morning, I was like, wrong day. Long day for that. I can't wear a black hoodie anymore, no. I can't go through the airport in a black hoodie. Forget about the subway. That would, no.

I can't, sorry? The subway, no way. Not on the subway. No. Sam, does this show get made today? A lot has changed in the world. How would you approach to this show differently today? Are you kidding?

I mean, honestly, I feel like the show we did was not nearly as fucked up as what it would be like today. I mean. Yeah, it's like Pleasantville now, I mean. Have you considered anything else in the Mr. Robot world in the last few years since the show went off the air? Can I tell a really funny story? I told Romney this. I'm going to share it to everyone, because I actually am curious if this will happen.

So I almost got hacked. A couple months ago, I get a phone call, and it's the, you know, hey, so, you know, we think someone's, your Gmail's been compromised, blah, blah, blah, and we need to get some information to help you. And I'm like, dude, you're the wrong person to do this. And he's like, I'm sorry, I don't understand. This is Google and word blah. And I'm like, okay, I decide to play along.

Okay, let's see how far we get. So he's like, okay, and let me, I'm going to send you a link. And I'm like, I'm not going to click on the link that you send me. Aren't I supposed to call you back? No. no, no, you can call, but like, you're not going to get me, and I'm like, can't you give me a case number? The whole, this went back and forth for a while. Just cutting to the chase, at the end, he, yeah, I finally get, like, he's like, oh, I'm going to send you a number.

It sends me the number with the two-factor, and he's like, you have to give me that number. On the email of the number, it says, do not ever share this with anybody on the phone. And I'm like, dude, this is where you've lost. Like, will you please just give it up? I'm just curious, what are you trying to get from me, you know? And this dude finally drops the act and is like, I just really want a season of Carly and Joey badass. I just want that spinoff.

Could you please do that? And he just confess, a huge Mr. Robot fan. Do it for him, Sam. The dedication. I would love nothing. more to go back into the muster robot world but man I just feel like we told that story and it ended I think in a really great way and to go back into that I just how much time did you spend on the it was a while it was a while I was just I was

very curious you know I just wanted to know I'm that's how they get you curiosity you're just fan I was actually flutter to I thought it was just a random hack and it turned out no he was a fan he was actually a fan felt spoken like a true, like a true insecure artist. You turned it around. Can you stand up and announce if they're here, please. I don't know who you are, but thank you. It's very nice. I'm flattered.

I have an important dumb acting question. How hard is it to spend time typing on a computer, like an act while doing it, to actually convey some kind of dramatic... I'm playing chess. Remember we had the chess scene we had to do? Yeah, that was hard. It's hard to make that exciting visually, but at the same time, everything that was on the screen was important for storytime. It was always authentic, so it never just felt like you were typing for the sake of typing.

Also, we had this incredible cinematographer Todd Campbell, who had a laborious task of making those shots look as, as unusually elegant as they could possibly be. I remember sometimes I'd step on set and be like, well, they're not ready. The camera was positioned at an angle that most certainly would never be used in any film or TV show. Like, nope, you're gonna be that far on the side of frame.

And that was pretty exciting. Seeing yourself put in the bottom right corner of a frame on day one, I was like, This is dicey, but let's see where it goes. And it eventually evolved into a great cinematic style that is, you know, a collaboration between you and him. We're talking about typing. I took it into visual.

D.P. Okay. All right, good. You talk about typing? No, no, no, no. But he is right. You can see, like, virtually any still, any frame of Mr. Robot. That's Mr. Robot. Yeah. I remember Todd when we're shooting...

Now you're talking about cinematography. It's mastermind. I mean, but we were shooting the second episode and we were doing those kind of compositions. And I remember Todd came up to me because he didn't shoot the pilot. He started on the second episode and he just came up to me and he's like, dude, are we going to get fired? And I was like, what do you mean?

And he's like, well, this is all we're shooting. We're not shooting. shooting regular. And I'm like, yeah, that's the look of the show. And he's like, yeah, but are we going to get fired? And I was like, actually, I don't know. Maybe they'll, I don't fucking know. And then the next day, you know, dailies come out. They go to the network. And Todd would come up to me and be like, so, are we fired? And I'm like, not yet. And I think, you know, after that first week, we're like, okay. Hopefully they're not either watching the dailies or they, they, they, they, They think it's okay, and it was okay.

But it was one of those things where I remember that when I talked to Todd, because I interviewed a lot of cinematographers, and Todd was really the one, a lot of cinematographers, because I knew that was the look of the show from the get-go. And when I would tell that to the cinematographers I did interview, a lot of them were like, oh, you're not going to do the main shot like that. We can have like a B camera doing that. And I'm like, no, no, no.

That's, no. This has to, and so when I talked to Todd, and I interviewed Todd, not only did he love that, then he started pitching all these other fucking crazy angles where I'm like, okay, all right, that's enough. But you're higher, but you're great. And it was awesome because I really feel like that identified how sort of alienated Elliot felt and not just Elliot, every character in this show, Terrell and Angela and Darlene. I mean, it really showed how isolated they were in this world and how kind of, you know,

in those scenes with Terrell in the boardroom, the kind of the evil corp kind of overbearing and being over him and looming over him. I mean, it just, it would have never, we would have never captured that essence in any other visual aesthetic but that. 100%. We are sadly running very low on time, so we're going to end with this. Since you are trapped inside of my podcast, you have to answer rapid fire. happy, say I confused profoundly random questions, guys.

You can all jump in. One can jump in. Here we go. Dogs or cats? Dogs or cats? Dogs. Dogs? Dogs. You're staring at four dogmen up on the stage. I wrote Flipper. Remember Flipper? That's... Anybody collect anything on the stage? Any collections brewing? Anything? Oh boy. Christian has shame. No, pass. He passes. Come on, you have to. No, Brittany will kill me. We'll save him, we'll save him.

Answering. Okay. I like action figures. Action figures. Yeah. Christian, you're in the right place. You're among your people. You know what?

I guess, yeah. Yeah, I really am. You are. Okay. What's the wallpaper on anybody's phone? Anybody don't want to cop to you? What's the wallpaper on their phone? The generic one?

No, it's on your... The background on your screen. Yeah. Emmy, when we first started hanging out, she took a picture of this swamp, you know, we were driving and we pulled over and she took a picture of this thing with a... She's a great photographer, and that picture is still my home screen. It's been there since 13, you know, it's 13 years ago since we met. Group-a-a-for Christian Arami, who's the last actor you were mistaken for?

Does it ever happen? Do you ever get mistaken for another actor? What do you got? Who? Yesterday I was waiting for my daughter to come home on the bus, you know, from school. And this guy came out to me and went, oh, hey, Kevin.

I had to be Kevin Bacon, I'm sure. Yeah, I was like, close. Ever happened, Rami or not? Yeah, no, it happened. quite a bit. Oh. Yeah. Who do you get?

I'll get Oscar. Oh, Isaac. Yeah. Oh, really? Weird, right? Yeah. But it does happen. I get Bruno Mars.

I used to get Bruno Mars. Serious? Yeah. Bruno Mars. Yeah. That's the thing. We met and he goes, oh, my doppelganger. I was like, oh, this is a thing.

In fact, I was at a, I was at a Dodgers baseball game once. and this sweet little girl came up to me and she said, could I have your autograph? I said, sure. Oh, no. Yeah. And she showed me a picture of Bruno Mars. And I said, oh, I'm sorry, I'm not him.

And she took a beat and then she wept. And I said, I didn't know what to do. I did. I took the picture and I signed it, Bruno. Yes. So, you do what you go to do. I was like, yes, love, keep on foot loosened. Kevin Bacon.

That's it. You go, brother. Yeah. Kenny Loggins. Wow. Well, what a gift to have Sam Esmel, Kevin Bacon, and Bruno Marshall. Yeah. Legend.

All of you. No, in all seriousness, guys, congratulations. This show just stands to tell you. stands the test of time. It is fantastic. It was fantastic back then. It is fantastic today. Thank you for sharing your time tonight. Can we thank these people I'm sure? I mean... Well, I was going to say.

This is insane. And so ends another edition of happy, sad, confused. Remember to review, rate, and subscribe to this show on iTunes or wherever you get your podcasts. I'm a big podcast person. I'm Daisy Ridley, and I definitely wasn't

pressure to do this by Josh. Hi, I'm Brandi Pissanti. For the last 15 years, I've started on one of the most successful reality shows of all time. Story tours. On my no show, The Real Reality, my guest and I will reveal the real story of what it's like navigating fame and notoriety. Because it's my show, I can do whatever I want, I can say whatever I want. No filters, no rules, no network executives. And I believe that's what the world wants.

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