Happy Sad Confused - Nicholas Hoult, Vol. IV

Episode Date: November 7, 2024

It's a busy time for Nicholas Hoult with 3 films out this Fall, JUROR #2 from Clint Eastwood, THE ORDER, and NOSFERATU. Oh and he's playing Lex Luthor in SUPERMAN next year! Josh and Nick talk about all of it and more on his 4th trip to the podcast! UPCOMING LIVE EVENTS 11/9 -- Barry Keoghan ay 92NY in NY -- ⁠Tickets here⁠ 11/12 -- Pamela Anderson and Gia Coppola at 92NY in NY -- ⁠Tickets here⁠ SUPPORT OUR SPONSORS! BetterHelp -- Go to BetterHelp.com/HSC for 10% off ZocDoc -- Go to ZocDoc.com/HappySad Check out the ⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠Happy Sad Confused patreon here⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠! We've got discount codes to live events, merch, early access, exclusive episodes, video versions of the podcast, and more! To watch episodes of Happy Sad Confused, subscribe to ⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠Josh's youtube channel here⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠! Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

When you're with Amex Platinum, you get access to exclusive dining experiences and an annual travel credit. So the best tapas in town might be in a new town altogether. That's the powerful backing of Amex. Terms and conditions apply. Learn more at Amex.ca. The twisted tale of Amanda Knox is an eight-episode episode Hulu original limited series that blends gripping pacing with emotional complexity, offering a dramatized look as it revisits the wrongful conviction of Amanda Knox for the tragic murder of Meredith Kircher and the relentless media storm that followed. The twisted tale of Amanda Knox is now streaming only on Disney Plus.

So do you have secret selfies of yourself as both Batman and Superman in your iPhone currently? Yeah, yeah, I do. And next. Amazing. Maybe for Halloween I'll be Wonder Woman. Prepare your ears, humans. Happy, sad, confused begins now. I'm Josh Horowitz.

And today on Happy Sayer Confused Nicholas Horowitz. Bolt is here. It's been five years since Nick has been on the podcast. What happened to us, we're going to try to find out and also try to squeeze in some talk about his very busy fall. Nosferatu, the order. Juror number two. Oh, and he's also Lex Luthor in the Superman movie next year, so we'll hit on that. But to me, he's still just Nick, who taught me how to season my sandwiches. Here he is back on the pod where he belongs. Hey, Nick. Five years. Five years. I can't believe it's been that long. That makes me very sad that it's been a long. But I'm glad that you remember the sandwich seasoning,

and that was the big takeaway from our last chat because it's important. Has your sandwich life improved? Sandwich life has improved. Yeah, you really have taught me nothing about film or acting, but seasoning my tasty sandwiches. I can't teach you anything about film or acting. I don't know anything about that.

That's not true. A little bit of salt and pepper on a sandwich is useful. The good news is I did revisit our past three conversations, and the bar is so low on anything substantive. It's just, it's so, it's, we're already ahead of the game, I think. Are we going to have a substantive chat? Are we going to chat about serious things? I don't know.

Is that our vibe? I don't, well, you can try. I, I'm willing to go there. I'm emotionally available to you and only you, sometimes my kids, but. I appreciate that. Well, I like to think of myself as the third Nicholas Holt child. Saw an image of you stuck to my fridge and it made me happy. If you could do little drawings of stick, stick family at us, that would be useful.

Okay, I'll get that over to you. That's about my drawing capability. So, yeah, since our two favorite topics generally on this podcast, at least with our conversations, are food and film, which of the three films that you're promoting this fall had the best catering? Should we start there? Do you remember number two, I think, had the best catering, Tony's catering, because Clint Eastwood has been using them as his catererers for maybe 30 or 40 years.

They're his peeps, they're his go-toes. Food was fantastic. And also, this is actually, let's dive right in. Let's do it. Character, eating like the character. Rob Egoes wanted me to lose weight for, during, look at me, I'm getting the movies, looks up, for Nospheratu. And that shot first.

So for Nospheratu, I wasn't eating. I stopped drinking and I wasn't eating particularly. huge amounts to lose weight for that. Then the order, Bob Matthews, was actually, he didn't drink. He was a very clean living person, but he was very healthy as well. He lifted weights and stuff. And so I was trying to, like, and he was kind of physically bigger. So then I was eating lots and lifting weights, trying to get more like him.

And then during number two, I was just a person. So I just continued to eat normally. And the catering was very good. So I got to enjoy the good catering. and that was very nice because also the really lovely thing about working with Clint Eastwood is he kind of a lot of the time you'll finish at lunchtime he doesn't like to do a lot of takes or like spend like long days on set so we'd go in you'd have breakfast you'd shoot for now six maybe seven hours or something break for lunch and normally on another film you'd go back

for like another six hours or something with Clint everyone sits around he still goes to you know wherever we want to eat and you all sit there and have a nice meal and maybe a bit dessert, a bit of pie or something, and then you go home. So it's a very nice way of working. It does feel like he cracked the code. He's like figured out how to make it like quick and efficient and somehow also creatively so satisfying. Like it sounds like all the the quintisms are true.

The I assume he doesn't he doesn't call action. There are only two or three takes. All of that is what you're not. There's no action nor cut. It's it goes quiet. I mean, he's had the same team with him for so many years now. It's very smooth and focused. But it's a wonderful thing that he has.

I think he's correct the code on life in many ways and filmmaking. It's a trust he puts in everyone to do their job. Everyone wants to do great because it's Clint and they care for him. And his process in terms of he'll go quiet and he'll say whenever you're ready or just go go and do the scene. And then you might hear stop or that's enough of that. and then he'll say like one of his favorite says he just says pretty pretty good and then wait wait is this a curvil enthusiasm were you were you yeah I think that's where he gets it from but he'll say that and then and then we'll move on he'll say that's it and it's I don't know the one of the

I'm not someone who accepts things very easily probably I feel like I'm always like I'm like give me one more take or I can do better or like whatever. And so it was really interesting going from working with Eggers to Justin Kozell to Clint, his ability to just trust the process. Yeah. And the audience. It's not to spoon feed and not to overhear any elements or anything. I think I mean, he's got a great musical quality to his films. And I think he's not influenced by what's faddy or like this is what people want right now. So we're going to we're going to make it big. And, like, loud and, I don't know, he just, he just is and does.

And it's the same process in life that he's got this, this great calm and collectedness and a wicked sense of humor. And it's all, it's just fun being around him. So I felt very lucky to have that experience. I would imagine also inspiring. I mean, this is a guy in his 90s that still just gets so much out of it. Like, do you imagine yourself the kind of actor that's just going to act until they say, we're good, Nick, you can go to the home?

and then in the home hopefully i'll be like hey you guys want to you want to put it on a show what do you think come on we can do something right um do i think i i think so i think i like i like the community of filmmaking and that's something again i'll say about things because of all these people that he's like that he's worked with who loves and he's got this great community around him and and and also in terms of the community of people that love his movies that support him as an actor and a filmmaker. So there's, I don't know, I like the process of filmmaking.

I like the process of acting. Because maybe we've spoken about this. I feel like you get to live a thousand lives being an actor. You get to experience so many different walks of life and places and things and ideas and history and whatever it might be that I'm kind of, I feel like it's kind of a secret hack for like getting to live the most life you possibly can

while you're here in the time we have. have. It's also such a much better than talking about seasoning sandwichers. Look at us go. Wow. We are so elevated this time. It's also a joy to see you and Tony Colette together again after all these years. This is like one of the fun things. Like I was actually to name drop I just had Tom Hanks on the podcast and we was talking about reuniting with Robin Wright 30 years after Forrest Gump and to kind of revisit filmmakers and actors at different points in your life. Talk to me a little bit about the meaning of kind of coming back around to work with Tony now as an adult

in such a different time and place in your life that must have some resonance for you. You know what? It was really magic. Partly because, I mean, Tony, you know, it's such a wonderful person. She brings, like, light and joy everywhere she goes and laughter. But it was also something whereby

she took great care of me on about a boy. She really was, like, a maternal figure to me throughout it and just set me off on such a, like, the perfect trajectory. in course, I suppose, and the example she set of what filmmaking could and should be and how actors should be. And then we hadn't really seen each other for a long time.

So in those intimate years between, also, you know, when you're a kid, you're just doing and you don't really know, you know, like, roughly like, oh, these are famous older people that are in movies, but you don't really know. Like, I hadn't seen all her work. And then since she's given so many wonderful performances, well. So getting to go back and watch all those and watch her even more and just be blown away by her talent as an actress. And even like I'll be scrolling through Twitter or whatever and it'll be like greatest performances in films and like one of her scenes in hereditary will come up. And I'll just sit there for like a minute or two watching that. And I'll be like, oh, my gosh, she is incredible. Like I love doing that and seeing like all the little facts. Like this was the first take. This moment wasn't scripted and all this sort of stuff. I'm like, oh, exciting. I always think about I was going to say, I was going to say, She worked, I mean, I think she did Sixth Sense.

Obviously, Oscar nominated before you. And I think people don't remember how young she was playing a mom. I think she was like 24 or something. So math did not work at all, but she's amazing in that too. The first scene we shot together was like her last scene in the movie, the last scene of the movie. And so it was this weird thing where my character, you know, I was looking at Tony now as an adult.

She's looking at me, but we're also, we know each other so well from a past life. but like a different version of ourselves and suddenly we're in this scenario. It was really interesting. It was kind of like a short wiring of lots of different emotions and things. So I think we probably talked about a boy way back when.

What is your relationship at this point to killing me softly? Is that something you've sung in the last 22 years or did you retire and then and there? You know what? I have retired. I think a couple of times people tried to get me up to sing karaoke and I was mortified and so embarrassed.

But I found out doing press with Tony, it is her karaoke. And I was like, no, surely not. And she was like, no, no, no, the cool version, the Fuji's version. And I was like, it's still the same. I was like, I know you're not singing the version from the movie, you know. I can't imagine you. The definitive version, the only one we're talking about.

Yeah, it's like, yeah, the Fuji's version. Does Hugh Grant come out and play the guitar with you when you do it? I don't know. But, you know, I thought that was funny. Maybe I should make mine a mystical shake your ass. Maybe I should bake that my karaoke song. you could you could just instantly become a TikTok star if you just decided one day I'm going to I'm going to bring it back and the internet would exploit it would melt down

we'd have to shut it down for a day Nicole back doing his thing I think it would be good for my career if I did do that so I think so I think so as soon as we hang up on a Google vocal karaoke bar and I'm going to go do it on a Wednesday afternoon During the Volvo Fall Experience event, discover exceptional offers and thoughtful design that leaves plenty of room for autumn adventures. And see for yourself how Volvo's legendary safety brings peace of mind to every crisp morning commute. This September, leased a 2026 XC90 plug-in hybrid from $599 bi-weekly at 3.99% during the Volvo Fall Experience event. Condition supply, visit your local Volvo retailer or go to explorevolvo.com. You can get protein at home

Or a protein latte at Tim's No powders, no blenders, no shakers Starting at 17 grams per medium latte Tim's new protein lattes Protein without all the work At participating restaurants in Canada Okay, let's hit some of these other wonderful films The Order couldn't be more different than these other two

Retaming with Justin Kurtzol As I understand it, a pretty intense filmmaker I think I've interviewed him actually about the Ned Kelly gang. Oh, yeah, yeah. Did you find him intense when you're? A bit, a bit. Is he intense? Is that accurate or no?

You know what? He can be, but he's also not. He's full of so much love. And I thought going into the Kelly gang, I was like, oh, this is going to be full on. But actually, he's very funny and light. And a lot of the time, he'll, like, you'll be doing a scene and he'll be like,

he'll shout out something. I remember doing the scene in that where I'm sat on the sofa in just my socks and a pipe, naked apart from that, talking to George Mackayah. And we're doing the scene, and then Justin yells out from the other room. He goes, ask him if he loves you. Ask him if he wants to kiss or something like that. And I was like, I was so giggling. And he's like, go ahead, do it.

And I'm like, okay, I'll do it. Justin also has a way of looking at his characters, not with an empathy, but with an understanding. and crafting them in a full 3D world and not just really exploring the grey area of human nature as opposed to just going, all right, this is good and bad and off we go. And also his ability to come up with new ways of working as an acting he sent through manifestos before we started shooting

where it would be things like, you know, some things where he'd be like, oh, send me a voice note talking about the guns you own or how you feel about America, but then also, like, write a letter to your loved ones where you know you're going to, you're about to die and write a letter to them about how you feel. And, you know, when you land in Calgary,

provide the group of actors that are around you in your group, take them for dinner, take them fishing, all these things that just make you feel slightly ingrained in the character in a way so that the acting kind of becomes less of the performance, I suppose. Did you look at other, I mean, obviously, this is a real figure, but like this is a pattern, obviously. We've seen men like this before and after, these charismatic leaders, whether, you know,

I think of like, you know, David Koresh is of the world, Jim Jones, et cetera. Like, is that an interesting rabbit hole to go down to see the common denominator of these kind of folks? There's so many rabbit holes with these sorts of characters. And it depends. You know, there was also a long list of movies and reading and whether it was reading things, you know,

that Bob Matthews, would read, you know, reading the Turner Diaries or Oswald Spengler and these ideas. And then, or like watch documents is about really weirds, even though that happened after the events in our story, how the, you know, government can sometimes mishandle these sorts of events as well and how that then emotionally affects people in terms of what they feel towards their beliefs. So there's, yeah, there's all sorts of rabbit holes to go down. And I actually did find deep, deep in the web somewhere, you know, a recording of Bob Matthews. So I could listen to him, give his, one of his speeches, which are, which was interesting because it was actually, it was, you know what?

It was actually kind of not long before filming started that I found it. And I'd already, before then, I'd already worked on a voice, an accent for Bob. You know, we'd read The Silent Brotherhood, the book, the film's based on it, and gone into like, where he was from, how he would have talked, the different sounds of been specific with his accent. But then I found this recording and I was like, oh, well, now I can really pick out the sounds. But also his voice wasn't as I had crafted it.

His voice was kind of less, it was kind of higher pitched and almost a little bit airier than I thought it would be. And so I sent the recording to Justin and I'd already been sending him so many voice notes and recordings and whatever and blah blah in the voice that I had interpreted. I'd been like, I was like, which one do you want me to do?

Do you want me to flip and do like one that's more closer to Bob? Or do you want me to stick with the one I've got? And he said, stick with the one you've got. He's like, I prefer that, which is kind of a great thing about playing a real character that isn't so known. You know, you don't have to do an impression. It can be a ghost or an interpretation. No, it's an exceptional performance.

And so fun to see you and Jude kind of like, yeah, chew it up. That was also one of the fun things that Justin did that I didn't know. He told Jude to follow me for a day. And we were kept separate until we read that. That's crazy. In a scene, we didn't, we didn't hang out. Justin said to me, he said, I don't want you to be friends with Jude. I don't want you hanging out with him.

And I was like, all, I was kind of hoping to be friends with Drew at all, but okay. I was like, I'm a big fan. You sure I can't just take him some tea or something? So we were kept separate. And it was funny because all those things, you know, I'm not a method actor, but anything that emotionally or physically makes things feel a little bit more real is helpful. whatever that might be if it's staying in an accent if it's hanging out doing things that make you feel more

like the character or whatever so then it's like being kept separate you know if you if you're good friends with someone and you then obviously they when you see their face it makes you happy and you're like oh yeah great um I didn't really know jude or and then suddenly there's this element of like we're meeting for the first time in the story and in real life in some ways

so there's an adrenaline to that that can't be faked so it was great um okay so then on the spectrum from here. Okay, so we figured out Clint. Super chill makes the chill sets that like everybody wants to be on. Kurtzl seemingly intense, but can have a quip or two to put you off guard. Then we got Eggers. Let's talk Robert Eggers. Nosferatu. I think I told you when I ran into you into Toronto. This is my most anticipated film. I haven't seen this one yet. But Eggers creates a world like very few can. Had you been talking to him about doing this one or others, had you been in the Eggers orbit for a few years? Like, how did this one happen? I had first met Rob just after the witch came out. I loved that, Ozi.

And I felt like he was a true master of creating tension and a singular voice in filmmaking, you know? And so we'd met, I think, I think I was filming in New York at the time. So we'd gone to like a bar in Brooklyn and just hung out after that. And then kind of very loosely stayed in touch over the years. And then there had been a version of this film maybe a year or two before this where we've briefly spoken about it

and then it all kind of went away again and then I think it was about a year later he got in touch again and said hey I think it's going to go and would like to be part of it and I just feel like Rob is first of all like when I look at the Northman and particularly the lighthouse he's making such unique special films

but also you know getting some of the best performances I've ever seen, you know, if you watch Willem and Rob in the lighthouse and blown away by their acting. So I was like, I will do anything. Um, Rob Eggers is directing and if, and that would continue forever for me because I just, I, he's, he's very singular in his approach. Um, this is obviously, you know, a reimagining, I suppose, of the 1922, uh, version of Nosferatu, but, but Rob has, has gone in and, and, and, really focused a lot on Ellen and her, you know, Lily Rose Depp's character, this, her, the internal evil that she's battling and the lust that she has and, and this connection between

her and this and Count Warlock, Bill Scars Scar Scars character and, you know, their performances are amazing, but also Rob as a director is so prepared as opposed to, I mean, that sounds like I think that Justin and Clint aren't prepared, but so meticulously prepared in terms of how he writes the script, the detail within that, the language being, you know, obviously era-specific and tight and complete, the descriptive language within it. And then his storyboarding, you know, the whole movie was storyboarded where him and him and Jerry and his DP, they've formulated every shot. I've never experienced this. So they've built sets for that movie whereby a lot of the takes, we shot on film and a lot of the, a lot of the, a lot of

the scenes would be like there would be two shots for the scene or three shots so the camera everything has to happen in in camera and so it would be they'd know that the dolly would you know start here and then the camera would move here but because of what you see in the shot at the beginning there has to be a wall there but then to get to where we want to go that wall has to to fly away so i've never been on sets like this before where everything is so thought through and planned and rob's so specific in in terms of the dialogue, the framing, the costumes, which cigar your character should be smoking, all of that, that I just think it makes

to a really transportive cinema experience because you're going to this gothic horror movie that feels completely authentic. And it feels, to me, watching the movie, it feels like classic cinema from another era, you know, it doesn't feel like a movie that gets made, I don't think, anymore. Did you, and I don't know if you knew Bill,

prior to this Bill Scarsgaard, but I'm fascinated with what he's doing with his career. And it's similar to you, like you guys that both do not shy away, despite kind of like being like, you know, having the leading man look and kind of can do that forever for the next 10, 15, 20 years as long as people want you to do that, you kind of revel in playing also some despicable characters. And Bill is like just leaning into these kind of grotesque, crazy villains. Have you guys kind of like bonded on that level of talking a little bit about like, yeah, We can play the straight arrow hero, but it's fun to play the batty.

First, I love Bill. I've met him once before just at a party and really liked him there. But also, yeah, I think he's so talented. I think he's a true master of being able to completely vanish into characters. So I just enjoy watching it. And what he's done with Count Orlock and this is really special. I remember the first time Rob played me a recording of the accent he was working on on his phone in rehearsals.

And it was so weird, because you know the sound on a phone is so tinny and doesn't fill a room, but the voice he had created filled the room. And it was so imposing and peculiar and lived in and accurate in terms of, like, this history and geography, but also, like, just real. And that's what I think is so special about how he's created this character, because, you know, for all intents and purposes, it's the monster in this movie. But it's not how he's played it. He has made it real and authentic to the world and terrifying, but also, you know, imposing

and rich with, it's just imbued with so many things. It's really exciting to be in scene. He's scary. It's scary to be in scenes with him. He's physically, you know, Bill, he's tall. I'm pretty tall, but I end up a lot of the time, you know, in scenes with people where they're like, this person's meant to be physically imposing. And I'm like, well, they're not because I'm like six, two or three.

And I'm like, okay, I'll act scared, but it just doesn't feel. like I'm that scared of this person. But Bill, you know, particularly with that kind of, he's tall, and he had this big costume. He's got quite a noble look, this magnificent star. She's kind of weirdly, oddly handsome. He's not fully a monster. It looks like, you know, this real count.

And so, yeah, it's a wonderful performance he's given. I'm excited for people to see it. Because it doesn't feel like he's just playing a monster in a movie and trying to be scary. It feels like he's a real living being or creature. has emotions underneath of it all as well as being this um this evil spirit so it's it's exciting and yeah i like i like it i like bill's career as well i think he he does take risks and doesn't take the obvious route and uh i think that's it's more fun for me as a film fan to watch him do that

and to watch him play all these different characters because i'm like oh i want to see what bill's doing in a movie because i know it's not going to be right simple and obvious Well, again, I apply that to you as well, and that leads us kind of like the journey, if you'll indulge me, a little bit of the journey, I'd love to explore, of getting to Luther and Superman. I know we have a long way to talking about that, but to contextualize for folks, I mean, look, we've talked a lot about kind of these big auditions you've been on over the years and these close calls that have come or not. This came relatively like just a year or two after very, very close call on Batman. So were you, was that, I don't know, I mean, that's got to be a blow. you're so close to something that you know is going to be a really cool opportunity. Like, were you reticent about going in again for another iconic superhero

after going through the emotional, whatever it was, to almost get Batman? Yeah, of course it's an emotional blow. Because your imagination doesn't know. You know, like, you're aware on a practical level. You're like, I know that I'm auditioning, you know, against Rob. And Rob's fantastic in that movie, and I think that was the right decision. but also you get excited about the prospect you know Matt's a fantastic director and the script and everything I was like this is going to be a cool movie I want to be part of it

and a brilliant character so then yeah there's obviously a period of like before you it's like a weird period where before you can get to the acceptance and like see the movie and be like oh yeah that works that was the right choice you have to go through the period of like oh what could I have done differently why not like do you know all that you run through all those things obviously um and then was i hesitant about going in i think under different circumstances i would have been yeah because um it's a lot to put yourself through emotionally and also even more so than it's also weird now that this process has suddenly somewhat become public i know yeah yeah that's the weird you know because there's plenty of times that people go and audition for things and

you never hear about it you never know it's like that's happening all the time but now there's this weird thing where it's like, and it's only public for people that care. Most people day-to-day don't care about this stuff. But like it feels weird then because you're like, oh, and, you know, it's one thing to have your failures. It's one, another thing to have them like publicly broadcast seemingly to everyone. Not to mention it's happening like almost in real time. It's like these things like leak out and you're like, he's meeting on Friday and it's like,

you're in the middle of it. I can only make your respect. Yeah, adds an element of drama to it, I suppose. But that's also interesting. I mean, I remember, you know, a week before we did the Batman test, I was driving in my car and I had the radio one and I, and they were like, and they were talking on the radio about how Rob was going to be the new Batman. And I was like, well, I was like, it's not confirmed yet. I was like, I'm auditioning next weekend. I was like, give me a chance. Call it, call into the radio show. Guys, Nick from London here. Hey, it's me. So, yeah, I would say I would be hesitant about it.

going through that process again but then at the same time i think james gunn's such a fantastic director and i was so excited about what he was going to be building with dc and with peter saffron that i was that um i'd spoken to him and kind of i don't know the idea of being a part of what they were building was exciting to me um and i think there was also an element of when we spoke with this idea that i'd because because they they knew that i'd been through that process that they kind of didn't necessarily want me to have to go through that again, which is very kind of them, it's caring of them. So there was kind of this element of them being like,

hey, we like you as an actor, et cetera, et cetera. We kind of want you to be in this world. And so it was then actually quite a nice element of like going into screen test. It was weird because I literally finished shooting the order, I think on Thursday or Thursday flew back to LA, maybe the Friday, did the screen test for Superman Saturday, Sunday. then flew to Savannah on the Monday to start shooting Dura on the Wednesday. So it was like in terms of like gymnastics physically but mentally as well,

they're being like, okay, we're finished shooting that. Make sure you know the lines for these scenes for the screen test and then you're going to run down to be with Clint and start that. That was a lot. But also it felt like it felt in many ways like a not a win-win situation because obviously that's not how you go into those things. But I took an element of pressure off myself, I suppose, because I was like, hey, you're also just going in to see if you and James like working together

and enjoy that process. And so it wasn't like, this has to be everything, and right now. And, you know, so that was kind of a better approach, perhaps, mentally as well for me. Your business doesn't move in a straight line. Some days bring growth, others bring challenges. But what if you or a partner needs to step away? When the unexpected happens, count on Canada Life's flexible life and health insurance to help your business keep working even when you can't.

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parmesan delivered. A cabana? That's a no, but a banana, that's a yes. A nice tan, sorry, nope. But a box fan, happily yes. A day of sunshine? No. A box of fine wines? Yes. Uber Eats can definitely get you that. Get almost, almost anything delivered with Uber Eats. Order now. Alcohol and select markets. Product availability may vary by Regency app for details. So do you have secret selfies of yourself as both Batman and Superman in your iPhone currently? Yeah. Yeah, I do. And Lex. Amazing.

Maybe for Halloween I'll be Wonder Woman. So, okay, again, I know we have time, but talk to me what you fell in love with about this character in particular, about your take on Lex. So you've seen Lex played by icons, Gene Hackman. It's hard to top him. But you're not about topping him. You're doing something different. What's different and exciting about you or Lex? No, it's never about that.

It's about, I think, you take from all the previous interpretations of the character and the comics, and you build upon it. That's the fun thing in, like, movies and comics and all kind of, all media in a sense of the history of all of it. It's all kind of a building, amalgamation of it. And then there's weird connections I make where I'm like, oh, you know, I'm working with Clint, who obviously directed Unforgiven, and that's what Gene won one of his Oscars for, his brilliant performance in that,

and, you know, watching Michael Rosenbaum as well, and all these brilliant people that have played that character. First and foremost, it always comes back to James and his style and how he crafts his movies, which I'm just a fan of. And I think it's the perfect tone. and world that he's built with this script. And then it's about emotionally just trying to tap in and understand the character

in a way that makes it real to you and authentic to you. And I think that's what's really fun for me and playing Lex. It's funny because when I first read the script, I remember reading it. And there was a little inkling part of me that was like, oh, I think you'd have fun playing Lex. And I didn't say that. And then when James called me to play Lex, I did kind of cackle, I think is how I'd describe it. I didn't say anything.

He said, how would you do it? I think he said, we want you to play Lex. And I just laughed because I think there was something in my instinct when I first read the script where I was like, I think that's more what I should be doing in this story. And so then it was, I was very excited because I was like, oh, it felt like, universe-wise everything and aligned in a way that made sense to me

and I was like oh you kind of your instinct you override I override my instinct sometimes I think my gut perhaps to my

to my better judgment to my worst judgment and I was like oh you kind of knew right back then that that was probably the right thing to happen and now it has

so then it was quite a then it was just an exciting process because you know going back watching watching the previous movies but then, you know, reading comics, reading books, trying to understand that physically and emotionally and just dig into that to give, you know,

hopefully a real performance that's got real emotion and some good stuff grounding it and something that people will enjoy watching. And last thing on that, was there a comic you kept coming back to? There's so many to pick and choose from, which one did you find most helpful? There's so many, and James has already spoken about quite a few that influence, obviously, the overall film and All-Star Superman.

And there's little things that you draw from each birthright and all those comics. But the one that I really rang, and I mean, I read a lot, but the one that I found myself picking up again a lot was Luther Man of Steel. Yeah, there was a lot in that that I kind of just resonating. with me. All right. More to come on that. We'll continue that conversation.

I feel like, you know what's funny. Looking back at our past conversations is how often Tom Cruise has come up, way before you even met with him about Top Gun and then Mission, we were talking about you working with Tom. I find it so funny. Oh, yeah? Yeah, truly. And then, of course, that almost happens on both Top Gun and really almost happens on Mission, which I guess the great scheduling is the one that kind of screwed that one.

Yeah, well, we were about to start filming and that it was cut. filming and that it was COVID. We were in Venice and and we were meant to be shooting those scenes that happened in Venice and then the carnival got shut down and then Italy started to shut down and everyone and then we flew out and then

production got delayed and then I couldn't make the movie because of yeah sketching. Is that weird to see because I see we saw the film since because Isai Morales is obviously not someone you're usually going up against for roles because of different age, etc. Was that a much different

kind of character than you were even going to play? I don't know because I don't know how I would have played it. I mean, I knew roughly what we were doing in prep and stuff. And yeah, it probably was fairly different. Of course, it would be fairly different because we're different people. I like what he did. I thought he did a great job. Yeah, it probably would have been very different.

But I think those movies also evolve a lot throughout shooting the process. Famously so. Chris and Tom have. It's not like there was ever a. solid script and a version of that character that you'd go, that was what it was going to be. You know, it's very fluid in terms of how they create. So, so it's very difficult to say what would have been. Is that a continuing conversation? I feel like you are inevitably obviously going to work with Tom. He clearly is a fan of yours. Are you? I would love to. I would love

to. I haven't spoken to him for a little while. But, you know, I love that. I love Topga. I think he's what's he making at the moment? He's going to do... He's doing the Urius movie. Yeah. Yeah, yeah. That I'm hyped for because I'm like, oh yeah, let's see, let's see that. Like, I think that's an interesting and inspired choice for him to go and make that film. So, yeah, I'm a fan. Hopefully at one point, we'll do something together maybe. Did you catch up on the other side of the common book world? Did you catch up on Deadpool and Wolverine? You know what?

I haven't seen it yet. Which I'm probably the only person in the world enough to have seen it. I've been going to see stuff. I just haven't seen that. Sometimes when a film's like so big and so popular right away, I kind of hold off

and go and watch some of the smaller things that are out. And then I'm like, I'll see that down the road. What's your favorite of your X-Men run? Do you have a favorite of the films just from a character? or just how it turned out perspective? Days of Future Past would be their favorite movie for me.

I remember reading the script and being like, whoa. Partly on a level of like, you know, joining both casts together meant that there were scenes where I'd be walking down, you know, the corridor of Cerebro and I'd look over and Hugh Jackman would be there playing Wolverine. And, you know, I watched him play Wolverine when I was 10 or 11 watching the original. original X-Men movie. So I was like, this is crazy. But then also, yeah, I just felt like the story was really, really strong and the emotional. It was fun to make, like, yeah, just, yeah, I enjoyed that movie. Yeah, I spoke to Maca Boy recently, and he also, he, well, he loved

his first class as well, but I think selfishly from a character perspective, I think he really enjoyed what he got to do as Charles and the Days of Future Past. Right, right, right, right. Yeah. Yeah, First class was also magic in terms of the making it, and that was the first one for our group. And so making all those new friends and everything, that holds a dear place in my heart as well. But I think, yeah, for me, I think I got slightly better character stuff in days of future past us, maybe as well.

You know, before I let you go, I do want to mention, we've never on the podcast, because of all this giant gap, we never even talked about the Great, which I... Oh my gosh. I know. Like, we missed that entire... era of Nick. And what a fucking great show. What like an amazing character, characters you got to play. Thanks, man. Truly, truly. Do you miss it? Do you miss that dialogue? What a

delicious, delicious set and scripts to utter as an actor, I would imagine. You know what? I do really miss the great. Tony McNamara's writing is so singular. And yeah, the dialogue, the Like everything about that show was so much fun. All the cast, working with Elle. And I missed the character because, honestly, it was like, it's very rare that you get a character that's so fully realized on the page, I think, like, he is. And so ridiculous but fun to play.

And it was weird doing, like, the last scenes, the last day of shooting, Ellen, like the last scenes together as those characters anyway. It was like, we're both really upset. And I was like, and I knew what was going to be. miss it deeply and I still do and it was obviously the right thing to um to finish but also it's it's it's rarely you get to play a character for some you know we did two two and a half seasons three seasons I played that character so I don't it's rarely play a character for as long but

also have so much fun uh playing it and and I do miss yeah I missed the dialogue the other day we did one of those interviews where it was like they they run through old lines and you have to guess what they're from and instantly like The ones from the grave would come out, and I'd be just dying with laughter, because I'd, you know, I'd drive to work in the car, and I'd be learning my lines, and I'd look at the page, and I'd like, this is so good. I'll never get to say anything like this ever again in life. So, yeah, I enjoyed that character a lot, and I'm working with Tony and Allen, all that team, so hopefully we'll get to do more down the road, because, you know, I love what they're creating. Hey, I have good news. In the past you told me, which I never knew, that you were up for Harry Potter, and in fact had multiple. callbacks. They're casting for the new Harry Potter, so it's not too late, Nick. Are you ready to do it? I think it's about, I think I can probably play 11 still.

Never comment on the height, just like Harry happens. I was walking with some glasses and a scar on my head and like, hey, what's up? I'm ready. Yeah, you know what? Which Chris Columbus, who obviously directed initially that produced Nosferatu. So I got to to spend time with him. On that, it's so weird how everything, you kind of end up running into people and also made one of my all-time favorite movies, Mrs. Doubtfire.

So that was fun and exciting to spend time with him, but I'm a fan of his too. But yes, yes, I'm ready to play Harry Potter. I'm just waiting for the phone. Thank you for your service. Thank you for your phone to ring. Yeah, which is more likely, is it James Bond or Harry Potter, if you had to choose?

It's Harry. Yeah, obviously. I can play 11. 11 years old. There's no question about it. All right. We're going to end with the happy, say, I can use profoundly random questions, Nick. Are you ready? Here we go. I'm ready. I'm ready. Dogs or cats? Dogs.

What do you collect, if anything? Um, oh, oh, oh, what have I been collecting recently? Um, uh, books. Okay, we get it. You're smart. You read, okay. Okay. Old, nearly empty tubes of toothpaste. Better, better. That's what I was looking for. What's the wallpaper on your phone? Oh, it's my, it's my, it's my wife and kids.

Very kids. It's, it's my, it's all my movie posters. It's my, it's my head shop. It's my, it's my resume, it's my CV. Nice getting. Spanish. Killing me softly. I get it.

Last actor you were mistaken for? Oh, I feel like there was one the other day. Someone was talking to me and they were like, and I was like, oh, they think I'm someone completely different. I was just accepting the compliment. I can't remember who it was. That's okay. I get Sam Claff in a lot.

Do you? Okay, okay. Yeah, we've probably spoken about that. The local CAF in London, the local CAF in London, they were convinced those him for so many years that I went with it again. What was the movie he made with Amelia Clark called? Oh, yeah, yeah, I know exactly. Yeah, yeah.

You know that one? They would always ask me about that, and I'd be like, oh, yeah, I'd just go with it. I'd be like, I was good at that. And, yeah, great. What's the worst note of director has ever given you? Act better, but it's also kind of the best note in some ways. Does that help? Really?

Can't I mean? Well, you mean, you can do what you want with that. I suppose. Okay. Okay. And finally, happy, say I confused. An actor who makes you happy always. You see them on screen, you light up, you're having a good day. Oh, uh, Willem Defoe. I like it. Uh, what's a movie that always makes you sad? Always makes me happy. A movie that always makes me sad.

I'm glad that's the question, and not an actor that always makes you sad. Myself, when I see my face. You know what? Up. Yeah. That's a good barometer, whether you're a human being or not, yeah.

Oh, my gosh. Yep. And very appropriate for our constant food conversations, a food that makes you confused. What food confuses you? Tried mango. Really? Like too sweet?

You'd rather just have the fresh mango? It's about the drawing process. It's not confusing about that. It's because I always, whenever I eat it, I go, hmm, do I like him more than fresh mango? And I think I do, because often fresh mango isn't ripe enough. Or you've gone through the chaos, because I can't cut mangoes very well. The chaos are trying to get in there. And then when I'm eating the fresh mango, I'm going, hmm, is dried mango better?

I didn't have to go through all this process and you're not as ripe or sweet as I think you should be. So it's a it's a never-ending battle inside my brain between fresh and dried mango. All right, we did. I think we had a semi-intelligent chat today. Almost. It's good to see. Almost. We gave it a shot.

It won't be five more years and we will see each other soon, hopefully, in person. Congratulations on the bevy of riches this fall from Nick Holt. Thanks, man. Very good to see you. Sorry, it's long person, but there we are. No, I appreciate it. And so ends another edition of happy, sad, confused. Remember to review, rate, and subscribe to this show on iTunes or wherever you get your podcasts.

I'm a big podcast person. I'm Daisy Ridley, and I definitely wasn't pressured to do this by Josh. I'm Amy Nicholson, the film critic for the LA Times. And I'm Paul Shear, an actor, writer and director. You might know me from The League, VIII. or my non-eligible for Academy Award role in Twisters. We love movies, and we come at them from different perspectives. Yeah, like Amy thinks that, you know, Joe Pesci was miscast in Goodfellas, and I don't.

He's too old. Let's not forget that Paul thinks that Dude, too, is overrated. It is. Anyway, despite this, we come together to host Unspool, a podcast where we talk about good movies, critical hits. Fan favorites, must-season, and Casey Mistoms. We're talking Parasite the Home Alone. From Greece to the Dark Night. We've done deep dives on popcorn flicks.

We've talked about why Independence Day deserves a second look. And we've talked about horror movies, some that you've never even heard of like Ganges and Hess. So if you love movies like we do, come along on our cinematic adventure. Listen to Unspooled wherever you get your podcast. And don't forget to hit the follow button.