Happy Sad Confused - Nick Offerman

Episode Date: June 20, 2018

Need a little unadulterated joy in your life? We've got two recommendations for you -- a delightful father/daughter tale called "Hearts Beat Loud" (out in theaters now!) and this week's episode of "Happy Sad Confused"! What do they have in common? The great Nick Offerman of course. On his first visit to the show, Nick talks about his long awaited first leading man role in a film, what it's been like for him in his post "Parks & Recreation" life, plus Josh and Nick give their mutual friend, Michael Shannon a call! Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

During the Volvo Fall Experience event, discover exceptional offers and thoughtful design that leaves plenty of room for autumn adventures. And see for yourself how Volvo's legendary safety brings peace of mind to every crisp morning commute. This September, lease a 2026 XE90 plug-in hybrid from $599 bi-weekly at 3.99% during the Volvo Fall Experience event. Conditions apply, visit your local Volvo retailer or go to explorevolvo.com.

I'm here for Bet Rivers Online Casino and Sportsbook with poker icon Phil Helmute. Thanks to Bet Rivers, I'm also a slots icon. Great. And a same game parlay icon. Cool, cool. A blackjack icon, a money line icon. A roulette icon. If you love games, Bet Rivers is the place to play in bet.

Bet Rivers. Games on. Must be 19 plus and present in Ontario. Void were prohibited. Terms and conditions apply. Please play responsibly. If you have questions or concerns about your gambling or someone close to you, please contact ConX Ontario at 1-866-531-2600 to speak to an advisor free of charge.

Today on happy, say I'm confused, Nick Offerman gets a chance to be the leading man for once in Hearts Beat Loud. Hey guys, I'm Josh Harowitz. Welcome to the podcast. Welcome back, Sammy. Thank you. It's been few and far between lately to have you on the intro. You're a busy lady. It's been really hard listening to just you.

I think you speak for all happy second views listeners. Because you know, I had so much to say about Mandy Moore, too. I was like, how did I miss the Mandy Moore intro? You were missed on the Mandy Moore saga. I felt that. But I'm back. I pressed on and I knew you'd come back around. Thank God.

And here she is. Just so everyone knows, Josh has some new snacks here. Oh, yeah, what do I got over there? You've got a bag of organic bunny fruit snacks that looks like there's about six gummies in there. So what's that from? Okay, so all of those snacks, by the way, I think were brought in by team Mandy Moore. I think Mandy was a little starving

and they brought those over to her. And she, there's a nutter butter. Two cliff bars. We've got nutter butter bites and planners nuttrition. Why are you screaming at all of us about the snacks? Because I just noticed it said nuttrition and I got very excited.

You're a little too aggressive about the snacks today with all due respect. I know. I came in very home. hungry. But then I saw your craft service. Well, I'm trying. Look, I have booze available now. I've got food available. I try to make this a hospitable place for guests. If you can rummage through the literal trash. It is kind of like a trash heap over there. Wait, Sam, we have more important

things to talk about. There's actually a lot going on. So I just got back from Los Angeles for two big events. One, we hosted, MTV hosted, I hosted the red carpet for Jurassic World Fall and Kingdom. That was a lot of fun. You can watch that entire red carpet show. It's still available, of course, as everything is in 2018. It never goes away on the Facebooks and the Twitters and all that. But I think the best place to find it is probably on MTV's Facebook page. That was a lot of fun. Talk to Pratt and Bryce Dallas Howard and Goldblum. And that movie comes out this Friday, I believe. It's going to make all the money in the world. And then, of course, MTV Movie and TV Awards. Of course. I missed you, Sammy, but you were there in spirit.

With all our favorites, the whole cast of Black Panther, I chatted with. Oh, Michael B. Well, it's a Michael B time. Oh, you, uh, what happened? Something pretty big happened to you. What happened to me? You interviewed Kim Kardashian West and Chris Jenner, bucket list. Someone's bucket list.

Someone's bucket list. That was unexpected. Yep, they won a best reality show. I can't say they were at the top of my must interview list, but I'm... How'd it feel? It felt like an odd moment in time. Did they hug you? Were they like nice to you?

No, no, no. They were perfectly nice. They were perfectly nice. I have nothing negative to say about their physical presence and attitude towards me. Am I going to- They just didn't really care about you? We're perfectly nice. I have nothing negative to say about them.

I'm not going to pretend to be the biggest Kardashian fan in the world. No, but you're a big Kanye fan. Okay. You're trying to get me in trouble. So, yes, I did get some quality time with the Kardashian Jenner's. Wests, yeah. So that was odd and interesting. And, yeah, there are a ton of backstage interviews I did, Ray Carp interviews.

I've been tweeting it out. So if you want to watch me talk to all our favorite celebrity friends, check it out. You had a lot of Pratt time last week. I did. You had like six interviews with Chris Pratt and like four. No complaints, of course. any particular, like, off-camera Pratt highlights? He always has some funny, weird things.

Well, it wasn't off-camera. We did reminisce, as we always do, on the carpet. Because, like, four or five years ago, I did an interview backstage at the movie awards with Chris. I might have told the story before, but we were basically kicked out of the MTV Movie Awards. And so that's always good for a laugh. And we talked about sort of how far Chris had come

getting the Generation Award. And only a few years ago, we were basically kicked out of the show because we were in the wrong area. So that was fun. I thought it was very sweet of Chris to say when I was talking to him during the red carpet. He was like, you know, tongue and cheek, he was like, obviously, Josh, you made this happen.

And I'm saying that now on camera because I'm not going to thank you during my speech on stage. I was, pardon me, was like, is he going to shout you out? I feel like I was saying to other people, it was as close as I'll ever come to getting, I think if I had a chance

of getting a shout out during a speech, it was probably Pratt. So it's never going to happen. Until Michael Shannon gets the Generation Award. So speaking of, today's guest is not Michael Shannon. It's Nick Offerman, who we all love. He is in a wonderful new movie called Hearts Beat Loud. And he, the reason I mentioned, I thought of him when you mentioned Shannon, is Michael

Shannon has a little cameo on this episode. What I? I know, Sammy doesn't know about this. What do you mean? Is he here right now? I've chained him underneath the desk. No. So Nick and Mike go way back to the Chicago Theater Days.

And when I taped this about a week and a half ago, I noticed that Michael Shannon was doing a Q&A at a theater that same night with Nick Offerman. And so Nick and I were talking about it. And as you'll hear during the conversation, I gently suggested towards the end, maybe we should call Mike. Let's see what he's up to. So the last five or six minutes of this podcast features Michael Shannon. on the phone with us, and it's wonderful. It's fantastic. It's like a little dessert to wait for.

Yeah, but not, you don't even, I mean, it's not like you're slodging through anything because Nick Offerman is so great, and he, first of all, a voice to die for, perfect for podcasts. Beautiful, beautiful voice. And he, he's great. And he, of course, if you love them on Parks and Rec, he, you love his woodworking skills. I was going to say, did he make you, like, did he make you a new desk while he was here? wish one day maybe did he make you feel like less of a man oh yeah well that doesn't take much for that but yes of course he's very manly he is very manly had a he had quite a beard he was showing off

um and i do um heartily recommend his new film uh because as i said in the opening um this is the rare leading performance for him like you know he's obviously been this like great character actor and supporting player but this is probably his first like substantive lead in a film and it's getting great reviews and i really enjoyed it it's a very sweet movie It's him and Kiercy Clemens. You might have seen her in Dope. It's a father-daughter story. It takes place in Brooklyn,

and they're kind of like bonding in, they kind of form their own little band as she's about to go off to college. And it is a very sweet respite from the trash fire of our world right now. And I recommend it if you want like a hundred minutes of delightful music. If you want a sweet respite.

Sweet relationships. Tony Colette's in it. So there's a lot in there. Another one I missed. Another intro I miss. Okay. It's not all about what. I know it's like you're purposefully saying things to hurt me now.

Okay. Well, it doesn't take much of that way. So, yes, so a lot to enjoy in this episode of Happy Set Confused, Nick Offerman and, as a bonus, a little Mikey Shannon, which is always a good thing. Always. As always, do you remember what we usually say at the end of these interests? It's been a while, Sammy. I remember that everyone has to remember to review, rate, and subscribe.

Speaking of which, I saw our biggest fan, Alison Brie, over at movie and TV awards. Did she review rate and subscribe? Not there. I mean, she was busy. Like, she wasn't like... Well, she could have done it. Allison and Dave, we're waiting. We are waiting.

Season two of glow coming soon. Yes, review, rate, and subscribe on iTunes, spread the good word, and enjoy hearts beat loud, go see Jurassic World, support our guy Chris Pratt, watch the movie and TV awards interview. on your Facebooks and such and so forth. And go back and watch Parks and Rec. Okay. It's a good Pratt and Offerman. Mm-hmm.

It's good. It's another sweet respite. You love my sweet respite. It's so weird. Why is that weird? I never heard anyone say that before in my life. I love sweet, sweet respites. Okay.

That's the new name of the podcast. Sweet Sweet Sweet Restit. Welcome to Sweet Respits with Josh Horowitz. Enjoy this conversation with Nick Offerman. He makes things out of wood. And movies. But doesn't make things out of movies. He makes movies.

Oh, there's, I got it. Thanks. Oh. Good. I'm so, yeah, this, this movie is so nice. It's so, uh, you don't have to pretend to, uh, sell yourself or the devil. This one, it's an actual legitimate love. Yeah, it's just a really love.

movie that people are finding really medicinal. And, you know, it's weird. Like, even, like, we're getting a lot of nice reviews, but even the reviewers have this reluctance to just be like, you know what, this is nice. Can't we have something nice? They're like, okay. That's not the default position. They're like, okay, so this is nice.

But I mean, I guess I have to accept that there's the capacity for niceness in this world. If you're looking for good feelings, then maybe this is the movie for you. It's just been so long. We're not used to it, Nick. I know it, it's true, but it's everyone, like, the audience responses are so nice, so gratifying because they're like, they keep saying, like, this is, thank you for, like, you know, making us feel warm. This is a nice sentiment to receive from the public.

It really is. Are you okay with just having a normal conversation? We're off and running now if you want. Sure, yeah. No, official introduction. No, I haven't embarrassed myself yet. I don't think so. No, still.

Farts are welcome here. still proud. Can you tell who the spirit animal of this office is? I think he's doing your Q&A tonight. I think he's doing my, my dear old friend Mike Shannon. I saw that he was doing the Q&A tonight and I was like he's stealing my, the one thing that I feel like I have ownership over. I mean, let him, I let him have being the greatest actor on the planet. Sure. But does he really have to just cramp my style that way to? Yeah, you might, it sounds like you might need to snug up your leash a little bit. Do you see how much Mike is in the office? We've got this here. We got that over there.

He was just here like about a month ago. He's, I'm such a fan of his. I mean, I think I met him when he was 19 or 20. I was going to ask. So how far, yeah, what's the connection? Is it Chicago days? Yeah, we met, I mean, our little theater community in Chicago in the,

I think I met him in 93. And we were both, you know, just kids who enjoyed drinking alcohol and performing on stage. And we were in the same little gang and his

one of his first big hits where people noticed him was Tracy Letts first play Killer Joe right

and I built the set I was a set carpenter amazing on Killer Joe and I still I mean it's so funny

now that to see the immense success of Mike and Tracy and it's it's weird because you know I saw Tracy in a production of

Mutiny on the Bounty in like the mid-90s. Right. And that was my first experience of him acting. And I hadn't even really put it together that he was Tracy that also wrote the plays. Yeah. And I was like, who is this, you know, crazy? Like Sterling Hayden from the 50s.

Like, how can I get this guy who's three years myself? senior to be my dad immediately. I think a lot of us had that sensation. We obviously heard about August of Sage County. And then like simultaneous to like when that was happening, he was starting, and in the last five years especially, like he's suddenly Mr. movie starts.

Yeah, I'd love to write another Pulitzer winning play, but I'm busy winning a Tony. Right. Right. Yes. I can, yeah, I said to somebody else, I can only imagine the talent in him and Carrie Coon's child. That's going to be an embarrassment of riches. Well, but the way life goes, it's.

be like some uh and of course i wish them the very best but my a good friend of mine uh was this was the son of two really cool counterculture hippies in illinois and he turned out great but as a teenager he was his rebellion was to be a super square straight edge who would always threaten to call the cops so i hope i hope i think tracy and carrie will they're probably more even keeled and Yeah. They'll raise a future leader. Definitely, definitely. I promise not to make the entire podcast about Mike Shannon.

We're going to celebrate your amazing work. But I'm curious, what was he like back in the day? Because he's such a unique character. And I try to, like, I've talked to him like a dozen times over the years. I'm borderline stalking him. He knows this. And I feel like I still am only scratching the surface of understanding what's underneath the icy facade. I mean this absolutely is a compliment.

Mike has always been obsessively simple. Like, as long as I've known him, and, you know, we were like kids casting about, you know, trying to find our manhoods, you know. But we always took our work so seriously. I mean, there was this notion, you know, in our generation anyway, step and wolf had sort of come to, their prowess, maybe a decade or so before we got there.

And so there was this idea of like, okay, now we're the young people willing to urinate on stage, but they did that already. So like what, I guess we got to defecate. I guess we got to, yeah, that's the only logical progression, right? What, yeah, what step up will the audience tolerate? And, and so that was, that was part of our experimentation. but even though we were, you know, casting about for what kind of wild men we were to be, it was all with the utmost of respect and, and deep reverence for theater and for storytelling.

And Mike from the get-go, he just was special. He had that magnetism on stage and everybody that saw him in anything from the stage of the big stage of Steppenwolf to the little stages of like the Red Orchid Theater Company, um, everyone was like, oh, this guy, there's, we got to get him. Like he's, get that guy. He's the, he's the, he's the real deal. He's special. And so it has never really come as a surprise that, you know, the stage is only grown and grown until it's become the world. Right. That says, please give me more of that guy's face. Do you think that, um, I mean, in your, in your life, Have you seen a correlation between talent and success?

And I guess success, I mean it in kind of like the silly way of like massive success. I mean, you can be successful in Chicago theater actor, and that can be very fulfilling. But, you know, it always strikes me that like acting in particular as one of those pursuits where without a little luck, you can be the greatest actor in Peoria and know. and will ever see it. Absolutely. I mean, I think Mike and I would be, would both immediately say. We, we both have tons of friends that we consider more talented than we are. You know, I have a few specific ones that also moved to L.A. around the same time I did.

And it's, it's all the weird river of life where the different ingredients of your own personal character combined with the serendipity of what opportunities befall you. I mean, one of my friends had some immediate success. He did a couple pilots, and we were all like, oh, wait, he's, you know, he's on his way. Right. And then for some reason, he was a specific character. He was a very funny sort of Steve Buscemi type. And the zeitgeist just suddenly wasn't looking for that flavor,

and they were looking for Chris Farley types or whatever it was. And after a couple years of desert, he said, you know what? that this isn't working. I'm going to move back to the Midwest and have a really satisfying life, running a college and like raising a family. And I cried, he's a dear friend of mine. I cried really hard when he left. I mean, I was really bereft. But I also admire and envy his choice because one thing I've not had is the security and warmth of like being with my family and having that Midwest experience. I live with my, um, my wild cat superstar wife and our dogs, you know, and we like travel around the country and dance for people. Metaphorically and literally sometimes. Yeah,

which, which is really fun and gratifying. And I, I love our home and our, and my life with her. But, you know, that I come from, uh, this wonderful farm family. And so that certainly is something I don't have full time. Sure. Uh, seems like you've created it. around you, though, through your, you know, through your pursuits in terms of your carpentry pursues, et cetera. Like, you've been able to kind of recreate some things that aren't necessarily part and parcel of the Los Angeles Hollywood experience that make you feel like you're living the life you need to lead. That's very astute. I, only in hindsight did I notice, as I began to write books and, like, reflect on, you know, my decades thus far, I noticed that I had left this

family, you know, when I was writing books, I said, okay, what the hell are you going to write about? What have you learned? And I said, oh, I've had amazing teachers. Let me write about them. And my first teachers are my incredible family, not just my mom and dad, who are the greatest American heroes, but my aunts and uncles and my mom and dad's parents. They all were great teachers. And I noticed then that unwittingly, by getting into small Chicago, theater, specifically my theater company, the Defiant Theater. That's a family. It's a family group, much like a farm, where a lot of people are working really hard for little to no pay to bring produce or something tasty, you know, to the people. And then when I moved to L.A., Megan and I met

at another great little theater company called The Evidence Room. But it wasn't, it was later in our lives, you know, for these little broke theater companies, youth is a really important ingredient. You have to be willing to like get paid nothing and not have kids or responsibilities or health insurance. And then in your 30s, which is what we were doing in L.A., that's more like, we're all grownups and people don't really come to the theater like they do in Chicago. and so then I again unwittingly started my wood shop which was first me and actually my friend that moved away that was why I missed him we started the shop together got it and and but then I peopled it with and now I have like usually six people working there and it's very much a little family so in hindsight

I have absolutely sort of maintained my Midwestern garden yep as it were because I I I I know inherently that if I focus my passion and my affections into a group of people, it's just a lot healthier than if I, you know, spend all my money on a yacht and pay people to be my friends. I thought it's worth trying out. It could be an interesting exploration in your 50s. Who knows? Yeah, you never know. I mean, I shouldn't knock it.

No, don't knock until you tried it. Megan was here about a year ago. Do you censor good mojo in the room? You feel something? I thought I caught a whiff of that musk with which I am so besotted. We're all besotted. She's delightful. You met at a very, like, intriguing time.

I mean, she was, it was a couple seasons of them, but Will and Grace. Like, Will and Grace, she was on top of the world. Like, she was killing it. She had just arrived. The world was like, holy shit. Oh, so this is, yeah. There's a new Mel Brooks in town, and his name is Megan Malalley. And you were not.

That's correct. That's also. correct. To be fair. Um, was that kind of like, I don't know, was that a bit of a head trip? Like, why is this fabulous woman who has just been discovered interested in me? And, and also is it, how do we make this work? If, uh, it's just, it's an odd power imbalance. And there always is somewhat of power imbalance, but this feels like a striking one. Oh, it was, especially for someone that wanted success and was pursuing it. Yeah, it was crazy. And it was terrifying. Um, and it really, I, I remember feeling butterflies in a way for weeks that I've never felt before since of,

I think, you know, this comedy legend who's also a gorgeous woman and I, I think this is happening. I think there's electricity sparking here, but that can't be. I am familiar with arithmetic. On paper, this is not right. You can't crunch these numbers. Right. And, and I was really, I, I couldn't have, I couldn't have articulated it at the time, but I was just terrified as like a broke, ignorant theater basement dwelling troll. But it's quite a match.com profile you wrote for yourself. That's my, that's my flavor, ladies.

Swipe left or right. I don't even know. I, but I don't know. I had, I had a deep confidence in myself that was, that was, that was. was instilled by my parents. Like, I knew, I knew that I was a man of value in certain arenas, just not the arena of, like, successful television comedies or fashionable, uh, dressing people. Like, there was a lot of her world that I had, I had never stepped into. And honestly, I mean, even when we started dating and I moved in with her, uh, she, we had to go to some stuff that fall because it was, uh, she won her first Emmy.

fall. So there was a lot of like events to go to. And so she took me shopping one day and bought me. It's the pretty woman sequence where a hundred percent. Because I literally had one pair of overalls. And I was proud of that. And she was like, we're going to need some other nicer overalls. And we went shopping at like a fancy store. And you know, she dressed me up real pretty. And then at one point she said, run over to that counter and just get some underwear and some socks and I went over there and I said I just need you know whatever you know please give me some of your finest underwear and and they get and they pulled out some socks just some like dress socks and I don't they were like $42 a pair right and I and that was that was where

it all could have come crumbling down where I was like what the hell are you doing what are you doing what are you becoming can you live in this world and I went over to Megan and I I was like, I will go to Sears and buy some goddamn black socks. And we had like, that was like our first fight. She's like, just get the socks. And, you know, and I had to really learn to acquiesce into this world where, and like all things, I mean, she's 11 years older than me. She's been an amazing teacher to me besides a beautiful lover and partner. And one of the things she taught me right away was she said, I, I, I, I.

am making way more money right now than I ever did we both were in our late 30s when we got our big break TV shows so we both lived as an adult for you know 15 years and she said when you get more income you know there are choices you have to make you can be miserly you can send it all to your church but whatever you choose to do it's just another opportunity to be creative yeah and one way we can be creative is to dress in a way that says, I love life, or I think I'm beautiful, or whatever, or

you know, I'm good at cutting down trees, whatever your personal message is. So how expensive are the socks you're wearing today, would you say? These socks are by a, I'm proud to say they're made in America. It's a company called Wigwam. Okay. It's a simple white athletic sock. Oh, nice.

And I think it's a working man's sock. Yeah, yeah, totally. Um, did you, I, the lesson was buy socks out of Megan's purview. Right. Yes, honey, I'm all set for socks. This is how, this is how you cheat on her is like, you go socks shopping by yourself. Yes. And so if we could keep this between us, I would appreciate it. We'll cut this out of the podcast.

No worries. So in the, so you seem to have like an astonishing level head on your shoulders, given the amount of actors I've spoken with that have struggled for a year or 10 years or 15 years or whatever it is I'm just curious like did the thin did the skin get thicker or thinner in the years of

constant auditions like were you able to kind of like keep it in check or were there years of of you know clenching your fists towards the heavens saying why not me I'm lucky that I mean the first part

the first answer is I used to drink a lot. That'll pour a lot into that cup. That needs to be part of the disclosure, but I'm lucky that I really have had great teachers that so my dad and my mom and my sensee in college who taught me Kabuki Theater, Shozo Sato, he laid some wisdom on me that really stuck about the world and about always maintaining the attitude of a student. And it really has served me well.

So when I got to Los Angeles and I started auditioning, and as anyone does, you know, mostly failing or being rejected, it was pretty easy to discern that it wasn't merit-based, that the whole system is so superficial and it's so arbitrary. I mean, you know, I was lucky. even to have an agent and get auditions was a big deal and I'd make it pretty far in like a pilot casting process and then the word would come down that the network had decided

to change it to a black person and you would say okay well I mean if you had your wits about you it was easy to understand that it's never personal and it's and often the people making the decisions are not creative people, they're business people, and they're following their intuition that says, I don't like this guy's mustache, or this guy looks like the guy that my wife is sleeping with, or whatever, you can't control.

And so in a sort of bucolic, you know, farmy way, early on in Los Angeles, I said, you know what, I'm not going to pursue this business. I'm not going to be ambitious. I'm not going to play the game on their terms. Yeah. I know from my years in theater in Chicago that my work is solid. And that's how I'm used to getting work.

People see me in something. Mike Shannon saw me in a play called The Ugly Man, and he and his partner Gus Van Sweringen, this amazing Chicago theater guy, they were going to do this three-man play, and they were looking for their third guy. And I noticed the second and third night they were at my play. And they said, we really like what you're doing.

We want you to come do this thing with us. And so that, literally, that experience of winning the approbation of those two guys, that fueled me for years. Where I was like, well, those two guys know that I can do good work. So here I'm auditioning for Baywatch. I'm not going to worry too much about your opinion. Did you really auditioned for Baywalk? I did. Well, it was a, when I said I was moving to L.A. from Chicago to make fun of myself and lessen the pain, I said I really wanted to get on Baywatch. And I had a Baywatch air freshener dangling from my rearview mirror. So I literally was driving towards Baywatch at all times. And I, and that was, it was kind of a joke. But then early on in L.A., I met the casting director of Baywatch for something else. And I said, listen. I have this joke with my friends in Chicago.

If there's anything I could come do, like if you just need, you know, a plumber or a mechanic or something. And Baywatch was kind of wrapping up. They ended with some sort of Baywatch... They watched Nights. Louisiana situation. I think there was definitely Baywatch Nights. There might have been, yes.

I think you're correct. Yes, there was other... It was like the CSI Miami of the time. Okay, yeah. And so there was some talk. She liked the idea. of the joke, but we thankfully did not pull it off.

But to to wrap up the answer to that question, that's where something would happen every couple years that would say, stick around, everything's going to be okay. The best one was early on with Megan.

We were in Malibu walking down the beach one time. The sun was setting. It was beautiful. And a single figure was walking along. And we were ankle deep in the water. It was perfect, as idyllic as you would think. And it was Gary Shandling. And Megan had met him, and they said, hi, and I see you, this is Nick.

And we chewed the fat for five minutes, and he kept kind of looking at me. And then we went to part, and he said, and nothing had been mentioned that I was an aspiring actor or anything. And he said, stick with it. You've got something. Wow. And I said, okay, I will. And I mean, that comedy legend, Gary Shandling, I said. That just bought me three years where I was like, look, you all say I suck, but Gary said to stick around.

As you were exiting a bad audition, you just like holler behind you. By the way, Gary Shandling, don't have potential. Suck it from Gary Shandling. Did you see the new Apatow dock on the Gary? I can't wait to see it. It's amazing. Yeah, it's sitting with Megan and I have been on the road, and that's the first thing on our pile. It's pretty astonishing.

Okay, so let me run through a couple of the kind of random, weird roles that occur in someone's career, particularly yours. I'm just curious, because it's just so striking to see prior to the late 30s big break. For instance, in City of Angels, you played construction worker. That's right. How was that experience? It was great. I had just been in L.A. for maybe a couple of years, and I actually got cast in this really nice scene in the movie, and I'm a huge Vim Vendors fan. And so even though I knew that the American version would have to be garbage, I mean, you know, it's one of the greatest works of art.

It's not even really that insulting to City of Angels. It would just be an American, you know, anything. It's the Big Mac of Inventors movies. But I got this really nice scene where Nicholas Cage suspects he's become immortal. No, he's an angel who is testing to see if he's become mortal. and he does so by jumping off like a third story construction site. Right. And I was this security guard who finds him and like, hey, buddy, are you okay?

And he's like, yeah, am I bleeding? You know, he's finding out if he's now mortal. And we ended up having this nice conversation about women and men. And I was so excited. I mean, it was Nicholas Cage, you know. And this is peak Nicholas Cage at the time. Yeah. And I'm living in somebody's basement.

Right. And I was writing, it shot at a construction site down in Orange County, maybe an hour south of L.A., rode my motorcycle to set. I was maybe 28 years old. I'd get there. Brad Silberleng was the director. He came to my trailer. You know, it was like the third time I even ever had a trailer. He's like, hey, Nick, how you doing?

Yeah, good to see you. So, um, we, uh, we've already, uh, got the information. Like, we've done some rewriting and we've already sort of covered what you're saying. scene was about. So we've cut the scene. We are going to kind of still do it. We're going to have them jump off the thing and we're going to have just some construction workers like

yell some stuff down at them. So if you want, you could stay and do one of those lines. Also, we're having lobster for lunch. So we'd love for you to stay for lunch. It's lobster day, Nick, so you might not want to pass off this. And I was like, well, that sucks, but

I do love lobster. Okay. And the crazy thing is, so I did it. And so we do the scene in Nicholas Cage lands, and he wakes up, and we yell down, and he senses blood on his face, and he says, is this blood, and I yell, is it red? And that's my line in the movie. The astonishing, I'm so glad that I did it, because the astonishing lesson was, from all corners of the nation, people I hadn't talked to in 10 years would call me. and be like, dude, was that you that said, is it red? And many friends, when I would see them

like across a crowded ballgame parking lot would just yell at me. Is it red? Is it red? Is it red? I was like, well, I believe my career has peaked. Was that your moment comparable to? There's a delightful moment,

and we'll get a little bit more into Hearts Beat Loud, this wonderful new film you're in, but there's this delightful moment where you hear the song that you've done with your daughter on Spotify, and it is this kind of like transcendent, like, oh my God. Just like a beautiful moment. Is there a moment like that in your career?

I hopefully don't tell me, is it red? No. No, I mean, the, I suppose the only thing I could compare to it. I mean, I've never had anything that Brett, Brett Haley, the film director, says it's very much an homage to a similar moment in that thing you do. Yeah, yes, yeah. I've never had anything that, you know, singularly revelatory. But when the advent of Parks and Recreation as a popular piece of culture and specifically my character went hand in hand with social media and the creation of memes and GIFs or GIFs, where do you come down on that? I go GIF.

I had to read something on camera yesterday and they told me to say GIF and it really, it upset me greatly. Yeah, I mean, I think I'll forever be happy with either either. or either. Either gift or either, Joe? Yes. But that all happened. And so there were a lot of really trippy moments where Ron Swanson, through no fault of mine or the show, he was sort of picked up and carried in little elven wheelbarrows by the culture to so many places. And so suddenly he would crop up.

And that's still happening where, like, in India, there's a picture of Ron Swanson that's being used all over the place to demarcate men's rooms, which is amazing in so many ways, but also so fucking tripping. And so sometimes I will be, you know, you'll be in any random American city. And there's also a lot of graffiti where they take a stencil of Ron Swanson and just spray it around. So like my mom and dad, for example, took a really terrible train trip from Chicago to New York where there was just trouble. There was some, you know, a 12-hour trip turned into 27 hours. So they roll into Grand Central at five in the morning and they're just miserable. And they go to get on the escalator and the little sign on the escalator that's like some sort of person walking, like don't do something. someone who just stuck a Ron Swanson head on the thing,

and their trip was made. Totally fine. So there are revelatory moments, but nothing like that thing in the movie. That's pretty crazy. But before we come closer to the present, there was one other IMDB credit that I feel like just sums it up, appeared in your life.

In Sin City, your credit is playing Shubb? That's right. I was a huge fan of the graphic novels of Sin City, and when I heard they were doing it that's I think the only time in my life like I campaigned so hard to get an audition for Lord of the Rings when Peter Jackson started

I wrote him letters I called like you know you were just big into Tolkien growing up you were that was it your thing? Yeah absolutely in a small town a cultural vacuum Lord of the Rings and the Chronicles of Narnia those were my jams and I knew him inside and out

and I wanted to play Samwise Gam I was like, you cannot, you cannot beat this goddamn, I'm your man. And I did actually harangue, I did audition for Gimli. I had an audition on tape for Gimley. That was as close as I came, but Sin City, you know, it happens a lot where you hear, oh my God, they're making a movie of a wrinkle in time. And you're like, oh, my God, you know, how can I get, say, how can I get in front of Oprah?

But in that case, I heard they were doing it. I was a huge fan of the books. And in the books, there are these two comic relief characters named Shlub and Klump, a huge, weird giant, and then this tiny, like, weasily dude. And I, you know, without this time reaching out to anybody, I got an audition for the role of Shlub. and I read and met with Robert Rodriguez

at the Four Seasons in Beverly Hills, which was super, you know, weird and surreal. And it happens this way sometimes where you go in and do it, and it's really fun, it feels good, but he's an albino giant. I mean, he's like, you know, he's a monster character. So, you know, you don't, I'm like,

I don't know that I'm the best casting for this. And then, and then like five weeks or three, Three months later, you just get a call where they're like, hey, you got this job? And you're like, what? That doesn't make sense. And so it was an incredible education. We shot it at his crazy place in

Troublemaker studios, yeah. And he was really innovative. Like, it was all green screen, really early green screen. There's a shot of me and my sidekick. A great actor named Richard Gomez, played Clump. we're driving in a little convertible on a ridge highway in the mountains, in like the Alps

and we're in the convertible on a green turntable with a jib and with the camera movement and the turntable they then just take that and put it on this animated mountain range and at the time it was just mind-blown it still is kind of it was super fun

you know Nick they're making a Word of Rings TV show for Amazon I have heard that yes It's not too late. Well, maybe not. I learned a long time ago, I mean, Lord of the Rings may have been the last time that I ardently pursued something. I learned that that is not the way to get what I want.

But do you secretly between us want that? It depends. I can secret it into the universe where you and help with the mojo. Here's the thing. It depends. And part of the reason I don't pursue it is because I might not want it. Right. And it all depends.

Let's just say I get the call, and I don't know if they're doing the whole thing over again, or is it Silmarillion or who knows? I mean, honestly, the ideal for me would be to land a plum cameo of which there are two, Tom Bombadill or Bjorn. But so the call could come in and they could say, we want you to be Aragorn or Gandalf or just something, you know, it's a bit more of a time commitment. super jizz-worthy. Exactly. But so all that means is you have to come to New Zealand for four years or whatever. Right. And then you're like, oh, I can't do it because I'm going to stay married rather than come play Strider.

Okay. Well, let's see if we can at least confront this difficult decision. Yeah. If they'll shoot it in Ohio, which is a solid pitch. They have trees. What more do you need? Yeah. They have flat.

Dancin's around over there, I think. I have his number. It's a two-for. You get dancing and all for a minute more. I'll get you dancing. Speaking which, there's our segue to this delightful movie. It's a sweet movie.

This is an adjective not used enough for movies these days because they're not necessarily sweet. Hearts Beat Loud. Brett Haley is this great filmmaker writer as well, right? The co-writer on the script. Yeah, he and a guy named Mark Bash have written their last three

beautiful hit movies. And they're all great. The hero was the last one. You appeared in that one. I did, yeah. That was my gateway to this one. And this one is striking for a number of reasons. I mean, it didn't even occur to me, but, you know, I've heard you say in other interviews,

that this is, it seems like this is by far the largest, just in terms of, like, screen time and, like, headlining a movie part for you in a film. By far, yeah. I mean, the biggest role before this would have been in the founder. We're a wonderful supporting role to Michael Keaton's lead as Ray Crom. the founder of McDonald's, but just two nights ago, we premiered the movie,

and Megan saw it for the first time. We saw it at a great arts complex in Red Hook called Pioneer Works in this cool outdoor garden. It was this really groovy premiere. And Megan and I, you know, we're each other's biggest fans, but we're also, you know, we're a partnership. So we're also each other's acting coach

and critic and, you know, arbiter of all things. And so watching things together is always gratifying, but also there's some nerves. And so I'm sitting there holding hands with Megan and at some scene, and I'm just, I'm deep breathing and like, you know, I hope this doesn't suck. I hope she still thinks I'm good. And then I get the relief of the scene is ending and then it cuts to me again. And I'm like, gosh, God, this whole goddamn moving. This is hard.

Yeah. And thankfully, she really loved it, and we're still together. But yeah, there was a lot of firsts, and I'm so grateful that Brett and his partner, Mark Bash, through working together on the hero, they said, we have this idea about a single dad and we've been looking for the dad and we think Nick is the guy, so we're going to write it for Nick. And I've never gotten to just play a guy who, the movie focuses on my relationship. relationship with my daughter played by the crazy exploding rainbow unicorn Kiercy Clemens. I mean, she's, she's great. She's an uncontainable star power. And then she starts to sing and your head explodes. My relationship with her and then I have a vulnerable attempt at romance with Tony Colette,

who's also my landlady. Just spoke with her this week for the podcast. She's amazing. What a legend. I mean, and we've been talking about her. lot with this movie. She has two movies opening today. She's, she's unsung. I mean, and you start to dig into it. Everybody appreciates her, but you start, and I think it's going to happen, I think even into award season. You start to dig into that career and the

range. She's up there with us. She's an edifice of great artists. So my relationship with both of them, I was just getting to play these scenes that I've literally never gotten to play. Yeah. A scene where I've had too much to drink and I'm on her threshold trying to, you know, basically and failing to say, will you please love me? And every take of the scene, I would say, you guys, like I felt like a freshman at prom. I was like, I've never danced with a girl before. This is amazing. It was so fun. And even also in the day's work, there'd be like, what's, Brett, what's this scene? He's like, oh, we're just going to shoot you walking down the side. walk and I would say what do I have to fart or do I have to like what do I do like am I eating a pork chop like you don't just shoot me walking down the sidewalk and he's like yeah we do we care we just care about how your day is going and I start crying and I'm like this I I've read of such things but

it was really something yeah because I can imagine like you know especially a talented a gentleman like yourself like sometimes a script might come your way where you're expected to like 50% sent up the funny. It's like, yeah, you do the Nick Offerman thing. Sure. You just, you make it funnier, right? Yes. And that's probably like a recipe for disaster, and not necessarily that's... It can be. I mean, generally,

it happens more in TV than in film where you get a script and they're like, we're thinking of casting, you know, great improvisers. So you guys can really, and you're like, you could stop right there. Like, how about you, how about you get some great writers? And then you cast great improvisers. and we'll put that chocolate and peanut butter together and make a delicious candy.

So you spent, there's no segue here except that I noticed you've been here in New York for a bit. You were at the book con shenanigans because you and Megan have a book coming in a few months, right? Yeah, we have, speaking of candy, we have this book coming out October 2nd called The Greatest Love Story Ever Told. And it's, Megan is the art director in our house. And so she, this book is like, I'm just so lucky in so many ways to be her partner because she had the idea for this book. And we did the book together because it's about, you know, I'm required to be involved because it's about us. But I mean, she's the brains. And the beauty, but I still, I still hold down brawn.

You've got, you've got the delicious beard in front of me. Is this default, Nick Offerman? Is this for a role? Is this just like? It is default. Yeah. Yeah. One left to my own device.

is I go full wizard. You've also like, so was the Ron Swanson body, the natural Nick body, or is the body I'm seeing today? Because you're in good shape right now. Thank you. I mean, in a nutshell, I was very athletic my whole life. I was good at football especially. Then I was a avid stage combatant in my theater years. And then when I hit my 30s, one aspect of Chicago theater is you go go do your play. Maybe you spend your day building scenery in a shop. Then you go perform in a play. Then you go to the pub and drink four pints of beer. And that's, you know, it's an enjoyable part of the job. And then you discuss, you know, you break down that evening's versus. And then in my

30s, that habit began to affect my health and my physicality. But it didn't occur to me to do anything. I was like, well, I'm a natural man. Like, this is where I'm going. I'm going to, now I'm going to be husky. And so. Full figured. Yeah. Beefy.

And I still was always a carpenter. So, like, I've always been very strong and athletic just with a little bigger waistline. And when Parks and Rec happened, they really liked that as a representation of a Midwestern, you know, protagonist guy. And Mike Scher, early on said, you know, I would love if you would stay beefy if the show keeps going. And for your boss to ask you to go ahead and order that second cheeseburger is a wonderful circumstance.

For the show, Mike. Yeah. For you, I will do that. So that was seven years. And it was really fun. And, you know, it was delicious. But sincerely, you know, we finished the show when I was like 44 or so. And my doctor was like, you know, your arteries are showing some damage and your heart, you know, you could maybe lay off that second cheeseburger and maybe replace the first one with a turkey burger.

And so first I started paying really good attention to my diet and that knocked off 15 pounds in a day. like um and then uh you know what about a year and a half ago i was uh meeting with the director about a superhero role and i was telling him um it was a wonderful meeting because i i know what's i know the score by now and i said look i'm so glad that i'm number seven on your list of guys to meet uh i know that you can't cast me in this movie uh i said the the the smartest, most audacious thing you could do would be to cast me. I'll be funnier than any of these other guys. They're great, but what I will bring is, I think, I don't know anyone that can get a laugh with a grim set jaw. They may be better actors and better looking. You've got some unique

talents. If you want to chuckle, I'm your guy. And, but I said, I know you can't do it, but I love, I'm thrilled that we met today. And good luck. And, and, good luck. And, and, While I was saying this to him, something occurred to me when I was shooting Fargo, I was out to dinner with Patrick Wilson and we were eating like emperors and drinking beer and it was wonderful. We did it a couple nights. And then we're shooting the next day and he's in these 70s burgundy state trooper pants. I was like, God damn, that guy's built like a superhero. And I was like, wait a second. Patrick, how do you go out and eat all that fried chicken and beer?

and you look like that and he's like oh I run I run a few miles every morning and when I was having the meeting for the superhero movie just in my head like a little bell went ding if you want if you want to be considered for this superhero role in the future going forward so that day I started running and that was a year and a half ago and I've been running three or four miles a day five or six days a week there you go and it's uh I don't do anything I do things organically. That just occurred to me and I was like, oh, I'm going to do that because it'll change up how

I'm perceived. I'll get new interesting roles to look at. Because after Ron Swanson, I was getting offered a lot of derivative sheriffs, football coaches, ex-marines. Or, on the indie, on the interesting Todd

Solan's indie side, it was like overweight guys in their briefs crying in the mirror. Which are wonderful things to do. But that was like all that was coming my way. And I was like, I wouldn't mind playing maybe a more attractive guy crying in the mirror. And so I think that I'm on my way to something. I don't know what the finish line is like. But as an actor, I love to be, I love to change and be unrecognizable if I can. And one of the tools in my box that I've been able

to exploit is a nice head of hair and whiskers. So I can, that gives you a lot of permutious. mutations that I have not nearly exhausted, but also if you can, you know, if you can do a De Niro thing or a Christian Bale thing where you get in great shape or you add weight or whatever. And so I'd, just for fun, I'd love to try something where I get super buffed out just because that's a way I can look. Yeah. That's something that's available to me. I'll never play someone who's the great actor from

Inglorious Christoph Waltz Like I'll never be cast as someone Who can speak a lot of European languages But I can be cast as someone With intimidating biceps That is You're ready for the spandex now

You've been practicing at home You've seen that there are abs That are possible Somewhat visible What can I cry in a cape that's amazing do you know what you're off to do next what the next week

let's see I'm building I'm getting close to finishing up nine ukuleleys in my shop and it's a prototyping phase where I'm setting up the shop it's a long really enjoyable process of setting up the shop

to be able to repeatedly make ukuleleys for sale on our site Offermanwoodshop.com we have that book coming out, Amy Poehler and I have a show called Making It Which is so fun and heartwarming It's funny, you know

As a former Stage mate of Mike Shannon In the peeing on stage 90s of Chicago I'm doing an NBC I'm doing a show about gluing felt And I'm here promoting my sweet movie

That's PG-13 About me and my daughter But I have taken a new job that I can't talk about yet, but I'm so excited about. And I wish I could tell you about it. I'll tell you about it off the record. We'll leave that for the next time. Should we call Mike?

Should we conference him in? Would that end the relationship? No, it wouldn't hurt my feelings. Let's try Mike. Do you want to try him on the phone? Sure, yeah. Okay. Nick's going to call Mike Shannon.

Taking it off of airplane mode because I use my goddamn manners. You're a professional podcaster. man have you guys considered doing a podcast you and Megan well you know no um podcasts uh i would love to do one so would she but the thing that we're aware of is um and from talking to our friends who have had very successful podcasts is it's a hell of an albatross like you might once you start it's even if you get through six months of like uh it's constant work it's really great maybe you get to talk to a ton of amazing people then you get to month seven

and you're like, Jesus God, we have to keep this in the year four for me So we're generally not usually not looking for more projects The plate is full All right, ringing This is exciting, ringing Mike And he'll be, it won't be

crazy because he's doing my Q&A tonight Do you feel the anticipation? patient like him. He's got a new iPhone. Oh, hello, Mike. Hey, before we dive in, I just want you to know we're on a podcast right now. Would you like to say hello? What's your favorite podcast, Mike, Sean?

Oh, my God. I think my favorite podcast is that one of our KS. No, no, no, no, no, no, Mike. Colby Bryant talking about the NBA. that Mike, that is my favorite podcast. No, no, guys, guys, no, have to have... Oh, fuck. Mike, I'm just a little bit upset that you're moderating tonight

because I want you to, like, leave me something because I feel like, I don't know, that's the one thing that I have over you. Oh, no, I think there's a lot more than just that, Josh. I mean, I think you get higher marks across the board. That's very sweet. I tried to... In every category, except

Typing. Well, that's what... I even ordered a bread to him. He has... Hold on one second. Hold on. Oh, he's... He's at a restaurant, and he just said,

I didn't order the breadsticks. Is this a live podcast? No, we're recording, so we can cut out any... Anything incriminating. Yeah. You can... And by the way, Josh, I didn't appreciate you editing our podcast. Oh, wow.

I did. I did. Okay. Is that okay? Okay, okay, good. I was trying to save you, Mike. Because I realized how what I said could have gotten you in a lot of trouble. I was worried about, I was worried about that moment.

And I'll cut this out, by the way, too. All good. No worries. No worries. You don't have to cut it out. All right, all right. Sometimes we say things that could be misconstrued. Not at all.

No, no. I appreciate it. I just don't want you to, I don't want to allude to something that's going to confuse the audience, but all good, man. And I would offer that Josh has great hygiene for radio. He does. I mean, you kind of half expect a guy who's not paid because he doesn't really. I guess he doesn't have to.

Yeah, I mean, he's sitting in a room alone with a woodworker, so I'm used to a lot of exotic smells. Yeah. You'll be happy to know, Mike. What do you think of that picture? of of the picture with you with the bunny hat on yeah and it says what are you pointing at home

I think at first glance there are 37 things to enjoy in that photograph you'll be happy to know this was yeah I thought woodworking studio smells okay well they do but when you you when you rip into usually an exotic tropical hardwood like coca bolo or boobinga there can be

the tang of body odor um it can it can smell a little bit like you've just cut open a baboon do you dread paper cuts or or splinters more i hope they never know that that smell well it's it's it's warmer uh because it's surrounded by sawdust and the other sense of wood glue and beeswax and varnish. It's tempered. Here in this office where it's redolent of thumbtacks and hard drives and highlighter markers. It's a little... Is there a big bottle of bourbonner?

Let's see. Yes, there is. And it's still sealed. So it looks like we have our work cut out for us. and Mike, I'm going to see you this evening And I'm deeply I'm at 8.30, I want to be here I'm going to bring me to the buddy maybe

Okay, great Well, I'm really grateful And I will show you some physical affection When I see you tonight Josh, are you going to be here? I'll be there for both of you guys If you'll have me All right, I will cajole him into showing up now

Mike, thank you for letting us bother you One more person to the mix here Mike thanks for letting us butt butt into your day oh hello hi is this case this is it's Nick Offerman Nick Offerman hi

we're on a podcast that is obsessed with stalking Mike and so so we called him on the podcast seems like a good idea at the time I love it Did he give you some juicy pearls? It was gold.

His contribution was rife with Mike Shannon flavor. Fantastic. Well, I hope you're doing well, and I look forward to clapping my arms about both of you. Well, we would love to see you. I would love to see you. I guess, Michael, get to see you tonight. You can come over and... True.

No sitter. No sitter should be had. that's uh sometimes sometimes life hands you uh parenting responsibilities and that's we can almost leave the little and a lot of the big one but i think we could still go to jail well you if and when you eventually see this movie it's uh it centers around i'm a single dad and it's all about me and my daughter and parents seem to find it very moving so i hope that you do I love all parenting drama. Well, this one will get you right in the beanbag.

All right, darling. I'll talk to you soon. Okay, thank you. Talk to you soon. Bye. Wow. All right. I feel like I wasted so many great talents on an inane conversation there.

But thank you for indulging me, Nick. Oh, my pleasure. That's somebody trying to remember, I like listening to It must have been, oh, I know what it was. It was when Hubell was on Mark Merrin. They got into a war. Oh, something about looking at who they had on their phone. They were going through the famous people they had in their contacts.

Amazing, amazing. Well, thank you for going on that. That could have gone much worse, I feel. Hearts Beat Loud. Let's sell this amazing movie because we both feel very strongly about this one. It really is a touching sweet piece of work. Brett Haley is a very fine filmmaker. and I'm so glad that he wrote something

worthy of your talents and... Oh, thanks. I mean, he seems like somebody... I mean, I love that he did it for Sam on the last one, Sam Elliott, people should go back. And Blythe Danner on the one before that, yeah. Yeah, he's a great talent to watch. So everybody should check out Hearts Beat Loud.

By the time you listen to this, it is out and about. Nick Kiercy Clemens, Tony Collette. What more do you want people? The more that you will want after seeing the movie is the soundtrack, which also drops today and I have a playlist on Spotify, which is a web location where you can listen to music. Thanks for that. Like tons of different music.

Yeah, so I hear. And actually Spotify plays a part in our movie's story. And it's, I'm grateful to say like the reviews are very positive. But for me, I've been consuming this movie 24-7. We did Sundance, then we did South by Southwest Festival, and a bunch of smaller festivals. So I've been with a lot of audiences. And the most wonderful review, after all the movies I've been in, I've just never had people have this sort of warm, teary sense of gratitude. Yeah.

And say, like, thank you for that loving hug of a movie. It's certainly different in a great way than anything else that's available at the multiplex now. So definitely worthy of your time. feel good for a couple hours in a world that can feel pretty confusing and dark at times. Amen. Thanks for coming by, Nick. It's always a pleasure. My pleasure. Thanks for being gentle with me. And so ends another edition of Happy, Sad, Confused.

Remember to review, rate, and subscribe to this show on iTunes or wherever you get your podcasts. I'm a big podcast person. I'm Daisy Ridley, and I definitely wasn't pressure to do this by Josh. Hey, Michael. Hey, Tom. You want to tell him? Or you want me to tell him? No, no, no.

I got this. People out there. People. Lean in. Get close. Get close. Listen. Here's the deal.

We have big news. We got monumental news. We got snack. Packular news. Yeah. After a brief hiatus, my good friend, Michael Ian Black, and I are coming back. My good friend, Tom Kavanaugh and I are coming back to do what we do best. What we were put on this earth to do.

To pick a snack. To eat a snack. And to rate a snack. Nemptively? Emotionally. Spiritually. Mates is back. Mike and Tom eat snacks.

Is back. A podcast for anyone with a mouth. With a mouth. Available wherever you get your podcasts.