Happy Sad Confused - Paul Giamatti

Episode Date: December 4, 2023

Dive into the world of cinema and beyond with Paul Giamatti on #happysadconfused! Ever wondered what it's like to work with legends like The Rock or to delve into paranormal podcasting? Josh Horowitz gets all the juicy details. Make sure you SUBSCRIBE and join us for an unforgettable chat with the versatile star! Get ready for laughs, revelations, and a peek behind the Hollywood curtain as Paul Giamatti shares his experiences on "The Holdovers" and his unique podcast, "Chinwag." If you're a fan of in-depth celebrity interviews and the art of acting, you can't miss this episode of "Happy Sad Confused." SUPPORT OUR SPONSORS! BetterHelp -- Go to BetterHelp.com/HSC for 10% off your first month MasterClass -- Go to MasterClass.com/HSC for 15% off Check out the ⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠Happy Sad Confused patreon here⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠! We've got discount codes to live events, merch, early access, exclusive episodes of, video versions of the podcast, and more! To watch episodes of Happy Sad Confused, subscribe to ⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠Josh's youtube channel here⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠! Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

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Fear, I have to make them afraid. He's got a motorcycle. Get after him or have you shot? What do you mean blow up the building? From this moment on, none of you are safe. New episodes every Wednesday, wherever you get your podcasts. On a scale of 1 to 10, how close are you with The Rock?

You've been in two films with The Rock, San Andreas, and Jungle Cruise. What a great question. I'm going to stay close is like, I mean, I mean. Don't dance around it. Come on. Three? I mean, it's not like we're like communicating all the time. I think if I saw him, it would be really nice to see him.

Prepare your ears, humans. Happy, sad, confused begins now. I'm Josh Horowitz. Today on Happy, Say I Confused, it's Paul Giamatti. He's been a rhino, Santa Claus, an orangutan, and John Adams. Eat your heart out, Daniel DeLewis, is what I'm saying. He's also re-teaming with his Sideways director, Alexander Payne, in the wonderful new film, The Holdovers. It is fantastic.

He is fantastic. It has taken a while, but Paul Giamati is finally unhappy, Sad Confused. Welcome, sir. Thank you very much, sir. Thank you. It's good to see you, man. Congratulations on the film. We're going to cover a lot today.

First of all, you should know, as much a fan of your work, your acting work as I am, I have newly discovered you as a podcaster as well. I have a feeling Paul Gianmotti would rather be talking about Bigfoot and simulations right now than an acting career. In fact, I did the podcast because I was tired of not talking about Bigfoot. If you have been ghosts and things like that because I've been obsessed with it and show. Thank you for mentioning it, Josh. Chinwag is, yes. Thank you, sir.

It's called Chinwag. And I do it with a friend of mine, Stephen Asma, who is a philosophy professor, but not what you think of a philosophy professor being like. And it is. We take weird topics like that and we talk to people who are experts in them and people who are not. And generally, also the idea, it's not an interview show. It's just a kind of conversation. So anyway, it's fun.

But thank you for mentioning that. No, it's a great listen to be honest. And I know from our past, I haven't talked to you in a while, but I remember you were never like the guy that loved doing all the press stuff, not because you don't enjoy folks like me or whatever, but it's just not, it's a weird, it's a weird circumstance. And to hear your genuine enthusiasm on that show is just, it's really wonderful. I'm genuinely enthusiastic about all that stuff we talk about.

It's super interestingly. Were you, were you, were you an X-Files guy? Did you, in all your guest spots, you never did X-Files. I was never on X-Files, no, no. I also want to point out I've never been on any iteration of Lowe order. I just want everybody to know that. And I feel like I don't exist as an actor. As a New York actor, too. Yeah. Yeah. As a New York actor, I clearly, it's all a fiction. I don't exist. But no, I was never on X-Files. I did enjoy X-Files the first few seasons. Then I kind of lost the threat

of it a little bit. But I did enjoy it, yes, very much. So that kind of thing in general, yes. Have you ever been in the company of an actor that's enjoyed this kind of stuff as much as you? is Maggie Smith, is Russell Crow, are they big enthusiasts of... Russell Crow is into stranger things than you might think. Our first guest on the show was Billy Bob Thornton, who I worked with, who is into stuff like this. So I do occasionally come across people, and a lot of people, they're not so vocal about it. He is, he doesn't care. So he'll just tell you anything, but he definitely was, he's a guy that really clicked with this kind of stuff.

Yeah, he will happily talk for 45 minutes about being a first. of antique furniture. Exactly. And it's super interesting. Super interesting. So segueing, this is why they hit me the big bucks, into your film, The Holdovers. I don't expect Paul Hunnam to be a big believer in the occult or any of this conspiracy stuff.

That's not his bag. No. He's a skeptic. He's a stoic. He's a hard facts, man. It's all about just like, yeah, he doesn't buy into any of that kind of nonsense. So for those that don't know, as I alluded to before, the science. obviously is a great reunion between you and Alexander Payne, the great filmmaker that

helped kind of reinvent your career in some ways. I mean, you obviously had a prosperous career, but sideways. I guess reinvented, but kind of really gave me a big gift that changed it for sure. So Sideways 2005, were you, let's recollect that one before we come to holdovers for a second. Like at that time, were you, what was the most shocking part of that? Was it the role itself? Yeah. I'm not just getting at it. I'm not kidding.

Tom and I were both constantly convinced we were going to make it a few days and they were going to fire us. We were like, there's no way this is actually going to pan out. It was shocking that we were in it at all. I'm not kidding. Did you have any sense in the process of being cast? Was it a struggle or was it sort of like Alexander had the juice then to cast who we wanted and this was it?

I think it was, I mean, you'd have to ask him, but I don't think it was the easiest thing in the world to sell it with me and him. But I don't think it was the hardest. He found, you know, Fox Searchlight was willing to do it. I think a couple other outfits were not, which is fine, and understandable, frankly. And so, you know, it was, but they finally stepped up to it. I don't think it was too hard, but it was not the easiest. And then in the wake of it, I mean, there's that aspect, yes, just getting it made and having it be something you're proud of, but then for it to be a legit kind of phenomenon in that realm, that kind of film doesn't often, certainly nowadays, even less so sadly, become a mainstream.

Yes, the awards were wonderful, but it's almost the more shocking part is how well it did financially, and it was just like a cultural moment. Huge cultural phenomenon, and it was really that, yes, all of that was, I mean, I thought we'd made a good movie, but certainly the reaction to it was far beyond anything I conceived of, probably Alexander. I mean, I don't know that anybody thought people were going to I mean, I think it's most actors and directors, they don't have something. They're not lucky enough to have something like this that lasts. I mean, it was 20 years ago, and people still talk to me about that movie, like, it just happened.

Like, it was just made. You know, it's like it's had that kind of, that just doesn't happen much anymore. That something has that much cultural staying power in people's memories. It just doesn't happen. And not to mention in every restaurant, this is probably a nice thing, but like you probably get a bottle of peanut sent over every other night of your life. Yeah, there's a lot of that, but unfortunately, I don't drink wine, and I know nothing about wine and never have. And so I break a lot of, like, some Ilié's hearts around the world.

You see that their spirit die in their eyes. Oh, they're just like, I'm at you, sir. I'm giving you the wine list, and I'm like, I don't have a clue. I don't even know which one's red, which one's white, and sorry, dude, but I know nothing about it. I was watching some of some just a refresh. It's been a while, but I watched like that wonderful scene between you and Virginia where you're talking about Pino. I have a feeling after all of these years. I don't know if you caught this. I don't think you're talking about Pino in that scene, Paul. Well, that's interesting. I mean, no, I don't think I am. Yes, no, you're right. It's a metaphor. Was he aware of that? Because I was never actually thinking he knows that.

She knows it. He's not self-aware not to know that. He doesn't know what they're actually. talking about, but she gets it. She gets it. So it has been a long time since you've worked with Alexander. Was it instantaneous? Is it usually instantaneous when you work with a filmmaker, when you just have whatever that silly chemistry, whatever we call it? Is that immediate on the first couple of days?

I mean, I don't know that I've had the opportunity to work with somebody like him twice. I mean, I'm amazed I worked with him once. Now I can't believe I worked with them twice. But I think in the first place, there was some kind of immediate. rapport from the audition I did for Sideways. There was some kind of funny rapport that just felt, I didn't think I was going to get the part, but I just remember thinking this guy, I can't believe, I'm so lucky to meet him, and he's great, actually, and we get along very well. And there is a lot of, we don't talk a whole lot about character and things like that. We kind of don't need to, it seems

like. I sort of get what he wants. He sort of gets, and I trust him and he trusts me, which is a huge gift to an actor that's not that's rare that's more rare than you would think the complete trust he has in everybody on the set is rare really rare well it goes both ways because obviously trust is so key for you as an actor to make an ass of yourself because like if you make an ass of yourself and you have a director you trust it's not going to end up in the film like you can go for it and yes that's true so many it's so many ways in which trust will play out and and you do have it to him you're in You're in very safe hands the second you start making a movie with him. So very safe hands the second you start watching a movie of his.

Yes. No, I mean, I love it. As a movie lover, he hasn't really made a wrong move for me. It's just always a treat. And this one is no different. So does he tell you when he's developing this that he has you in mind for the role? And is that generally a good or bad thing as an actor? Like, oh, this could go either way.

No, it's incredibly. I don't know that I can't think of any that, again, ever happening with anybody else. And certainly the level of friendship and trust I have with them, I know it's going to be something great. And yeah, he did tell me about this movie. And we were trying to get it done. He showed it to me in stages as it was being written. It was great. And then we tried to get it made several times.

And scheduling-wise, it didn't work out. But, yeah, the second, I mean, I'd do anything here. I don't, I'd do anything. guy wants me to do. But it happened to be this, which was great. And the shorthand for folks that don't know, Alexander was actually on the podcast recently so folks can watch that one. But like for this conversation, this is about kind of three, three souls at a boarding school that kind of have to find each other in that kind of lost period, that lost holiday period where they don't really have, they have to establish kind of their own sad, happy, found family in the, in the holiday times.

You create a little found family, yes. And and and find that they all. all have empathy for each other and help each other move a little bit forward. They don't, they don't suddenly, everything isn't suddenly solved, but there's a little bit of forward movement for all of them. Yes, spoiler warnings, but the sequel to this isn't necessarily and they lived happily ever after. The reality probably is, yeah, I did it. Like, this is a moment.

Yeah, who knows what's going to happen to them. But they've, they've found each other, they had this great experience with each other, and it allows them to at least think about moving forward. I had this sad realization when I was watching the movie that I related more to your character than to Dominic's character. It's like. Now, was that age because you feel like you're getting old now? Yeah, exactly. Oh, my God.

Well, Paul also curmudgeon in me, of course. But yes, the age thing is a big thing. And, uh, yeah. Yeah. It's sad. But, but this guy, Paul, is somewhat I would imagine in your bones. I mean, you, you spent time. at prep school. You come from academia. I imagine there's some corduroy in your wardrobe.

Maybe there's a bow tie or two. Really? Do I look like a bow tie guy? No, yeah. I actually don't, no, no, no. I don't have any corduroy. I used to have cordon. I used to wear a lot of corduroy as a child. I wore a corduroy big in the early 70s. I don't think I've ever by choice. I've worn bow ties in movies. All of that said, you are correct that I was, that I was, that I was. that it is in, it was very familiar territory to me. So what can you draw upon? Is there specific stuff that you can bring into the, again, you were in the process a little bit in terms of the development process. So did you inform it with any of your own life experience? No, I didn't, no, I didn't tell them anything to do with the script. It was, all of that looked great as they

kept moving along. And no, I didn't have anything to add to anything except sort of unconsciously, probably a lot of memories. I mean, I just, I was saying to somebody, I saw myself in the movie the first time, and there were all these people I recognized from my life at certain moments in it, in a weird way I've never experienced before, that I didn't even really know I was sort of in some unconscious way referencing and drawing on people, colleagues of my fathers and teachers that I had. I mean, I had teachers at prep school like this.

still when I went there, there's only 10 years or so after this movie takes place. So a lot of those guys were still there and they're all guys. And it's like, and they're very settled into this whole schick about those schools and they're very settled into their personas that they have. And it's a real thing. It's a deep, deep thing for those guys. And so all of that was just there, which I think Alexander knew. I think it's also why he was like, I'm writing this for you because I think you know this. Right. So I was talking to him a little bit about this.

Like there's such a palpable, great feeling of production design. And I know it's obviously all shot on location. Like it has such a strong sense of place that is very reassuring and familiar. Even if I didn't live in that time, I've seen the movies of that time. And as many have said, and this is a true meant as a compliment, it does feel like this lost film from that era. And it's just delicious to kind of like discover it in that way. do you i mean that must that that sense of place on set must have been palpable and really informed

the environment one of the things i really love about his movies and about him as a director and him as a person is he's got this incredibly acute sense of place not just like regions cities but also rooms institutions schools hospitals like he's got this incredible fascination with real places and with like the texture of places. And it's great. It's really cool. And he loved Massachusetts. And he loved it was so great the weather.

And it was so important. And then the interiors of those schools. And then the production design contributed to it in a fantastic way so that you really just felt effortlessly transported. You didn't have to do a lot of work. It was all there. But that's hard stuff to do, especially the 70s and the 60s. Well, any of it is.

because it's very easy to overdo it. Yes. We did a step over a line where now it's everybody's got crazy giant bell bottoms on and everybody's like and you go too far and it doesn't and then you don't believe it anymore. And then not enough.

So it's really hard to hit that sweet spot and they really did in this. What were you like when you were Dominic's age that the character in the film? I mean, like you don't, I imagine you don't get into, you know, Yale by being like a little, little shit who's kind of like fucking around. You probably,

did you have your shit together as at that age or no some ways i think i did i mean it's funny i don't it's fine it's hard people keep asking me in this and i'm like god i don't really know dom i was not like dom dom has got his shit together right and it's like i mean i feel like most kids now my son who's a little bit older than dom he's got his shit together it's like they're way more confident not arrogant and not hubris or something but there's a kind of confidence of ease and stuff that I just didn't have. I was, I was kind of a, I didn't belong to any one sort of social group. Oddly enough, my big social group was the swimming team, which is weird when I think about it. I was not a big jock or anything like that, but that was, I was not, and I was, I was, if I was

interested in the subject, I was really into it. And I, and I worked hard. But, you know, I was kind of stuck to myself, but I had friends. I don't know. It's a really funny, thing that I wasn't miserable, you know, I wasn't like that. I wasn't like, but I wasn't, I wasn't the class clown. I wasn't like, I don't know. Yeah. Well, I mean, again, you contain multitudes as we talked about at the beginning, as we all do. I mean, yeah. Yeah, I suppose so. It's interesting. It's interesting. To more. More perks. More points. More flights. More of all the things you want in a travel rewards card. And then some. Get your ticket to more with the new BMO ViPorter MasterCard and get up to $2,400 in value in your first 13 months.

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I'm kind of also very fascinated by like the first phase of Paul Giamatti's career because when I look back to like the 90s Paul Giamatti, when did you graduate out of Yale School of Drama? School of Drama was the 94. I graduated from college in 89 and actually started, made some money, made a very small living as an actor in Seattle. And so I- regional theater like a regional theater is kind of not even that experimental theater stuff but i actually did some tv movies some movies tiny little parts and things like that industrial films local commercials things like that so i actually had a funny little barely scraping by career in seattle for a few years before i went back to drama school but then when i look i guess most of this period that i'm talking about is maybe after you graduate drama school and kind of before man on the moon if we want to like set a marker

like an arbitrary marker and i'm fascinated because like there is this run you like worked with like every cool filmmaker in the 90s you're right i need you're right it's a rattle of you all for folks i don't know it's cameron crow it's woody allen it's sidney pollock it's spielberg it's peter weir um that's crazy that you're saying it john woo i worked with john woo Paychecks. Yeah, I worked in Welsh Foreman. You're right. We get up to that, actually, you say that, and that's crazy.

I'm like, I worked with Sidney Pollock. Sidney Pollock. Sydney Pollock. That's crazy. So were you, so, in the weeds, you didn't, you were so in the weeds. You didn't kind of have a second to take, take a moment. No, it was, and I've just forgotten about it. No, at the time, I was like, I'm working with Sidney Pollock.

I mean, it was definitely, Peter Weir was really like, I mean, he's, I put him up there. I got Alexander, and then Peter, up there. He was fantastic. And so you were, of course, in Truman's show, which again, is just one of these classics I've seen probably a hundred times in my life. And I remember, I've always wanted to ask you this, like, because there's all this war about the recasting of the Ed Harris role, which was originally Dennis Hopper, as I recall. And you were in the control room for folks that want to go back and look. Yes, I play the guy who runs the control room. There wasn't really a part.

I mean, there were kind of a lot of those parts in that movie. He would, his, his, sorry, his audition process was amazing he brought you in and he did a fake talk show he played a kind of cheesy talk show host this was your audition and you just improvised you then he kind of came back to people went I like you I got a part for you you're going to be the guy who runs the control room is what he and he did this with a lot of people and he had every extra and he would go talk to them and they had their own stories they all had to have their own story so he did that and yes he brought us saying I think I worked with Dennis Hopper for like a half a day or something. I mean, and that was amazing because Dennis Hopper was a hero of mine.

And he was the nicest guy in the world and he just was like, yeah, not, I don't know. Not, not work and not clicking. He like acting much anymore, I think, you know. I see. Got it. He just was kind of over it. And so he was like, I can check out. I mean, it was him.

He was like, you should get somebody else. And Ed Harris had like three days to prepare them. And I think he got nominated for it. He's amazing in that film. And he's amazing. And he had like three days to prepare that part. But you jump out in all these films. Like you're in Saving Private Ryan.

You're in my best friend's wedding, which like not only are in that, you have like this crazy, very pivotal scene with like Julia Roberts at the height of Julia Robertsing. Yeah, maximum Julia Roberts. Do you remember shooting that? You're kind of what, are you like a bell hop? Yeah. And I have a smoke with her in the hallway.

And I encourage her. of like, you know, don't worry about things or something, I don't even remember. I vividly remember shooting it. I had no idea what the, all I had seen was that scene. I didn't know what the movie was about nothing. I didn't know what the hell. I don't even know what it was called. And it was just, but that's what it was like doing parts like that. Right. You just swoop in. They're in the middle of their thing and you just pull you in. They do the thing and they throw you out. And it's like, thanks, you know. It's just like, and it's, it's to me still the thing that when I work with people doing that it's the hardest thing to do yes it's the hardest thing to do it's a key into the vibe what

everyone's going for and not miss a beach eye lines maybe or you know who knows what you're going to have to do you're the bartender and you have to remember all this stick with the glasses and the and get the line i mean it's the hardest thing to do so i always have huge empathy for the people doing that so i mentioned man on the moon which i remember at the time was like one of these like gigantic big deal movies. It was Milo Schormann who was coming off. I think he had just done people versus Larry Flint. He was, again, also height of his powers. Amazing. The famous like casting call for Andy Kaufman, where it's like Edward Norton, is it and it ends up Jim Carey. And you're playing Zamuda, this another fantastic character, arguably the second

most important character, second or third in the film. Yeah, I suppose so, yeah. Was that as intense a casting process as what Miloche was going for for Andy? Like, how did you, Because, again, that's a step up from what you'd been doing. It's true. Yes, it was. And it was, that was anxiety inducing that one because I was a little bit like, wow, how did I end up here with Miloche Foreman and Jim and all these people? I do remember having to go do an audition with Jim. I auditioned.

I put myself on tape. And then I went and met Milosh with Jim. And I had to do a thing with Jim. It's funny. I haven't thought about this in years. And that was wild and kind of intense. And it was sort of improvised, I think. I don't really remember what we did.

We sat in a hotel room, the three of us, and sort of did this stuff. And I ended up getting the movie. And I was a little bit like, wow, how the fuck did I just end up here? That was a little disorienting. Well, the whole experience sounds wild and intense. I mean, Jim infamously, basically staying in character, went full Kaufman. And having full of you only clifton when he was Tony Clifton, which is even way less plus.

That was the thing that was the thing that was way more. intense and crazy than just Andy Koff. And there's a doc. I don't know if you've seen it. I haven't seen the doc. No, I've never, I have to see the doc sometime. It's pretty fast. I remember when they were making it. The idea was to do something with all this behind the scenes. Right. And then I don't know it sat around for a long time. He finally made that

documentary. He clearly was making Milos, poor Milos driving him crazy. Poor guy. Crazy. Crazy. He had to spend most of his time just correct. And he would do, you know, he was doing crazy stuff. He brought 40 Hells Angels to the set one day, which was great, but it was just like that. And then those guys were everywhere and he would, I don't know, he did so much crazy. It was like, it was really wild.

It was fun. An experience. Good to laugh about now. Yeah. Yes, it was. Yeah. No, it was fine at the time. I was like, sure.

This is great with me. Yeah. I'm fine with this. Have you done anything nearly as extreme for a role? Are you the guy that kind of like, come a shoe cobbler for a year for uh dano de lois style no no and it's i and i get it and it's admirable i don't i don't have any kind of you know it's it's i know people who did lincoln and said it's a time machine you walked in the room with them and it was lincoln and it put you where you needed to be

the only thing it's ever kind of by default that's happened on was i did this john adams series for hbio which because of the sheer amount of time right i had to be there and i had no time off from that and all day long and in the costumes all day long was this kind of almost inadvertent method thing where I just was the guy all the time and it was like yeah and I would on the weekends I would have dreams about it and I would wake up in the middle of light talking my sleep my wife at the time said I woke up one night was shaking her and going who's going to be secretary of state who's going to be secretary of state to her so it was it just that just happened by because you were so immersed in it it just happened what was the decompression

what's the day after like on something like John Adams or you just like that was a tough one that was that was a thing where it did linger in my mind for a long time that part and the way he talked and everything lingered it and now I've been called upon occasionally it's kind of hilarious to be John Adams and things to do his voice and I can immediately snap back into it the whole feeling and everything of that character because it was just such it was so present all the time and can you snap back into it being an orangutan again is that how ingrained is that? teeth, I meet those huge teeth, those huge prosthetic teeth, and then I would feel, I would feel right. The teeth were amazing. Was it more or less painful than it looked to, to undergo that

process? Because that's, that's, I mean, it's glorious and wonderful, but that's got to be a bear of a role to do. That was. This is Planet of the Apes, of course, by the way. Yeah, it's Planet of the apes and I played this orangutan in it. That was heaven from beginning to end. I loved that doing that so much. I didn't want to take that makeup off. I was like, there were days when we were calling makeup and we wouldn't work. And Timper would be like, I'm so sorry. I'm like, I'm so happy to be in this fucking makeup. I was like, I was, because that was a childhood dream. Yeah. To be play out of the apes. So I was like, if I, if I never act again, I will be so happy I got to play a talking a ragat day. You must be the one person upset about this wonderful

mocap stuff. You're like, bring back the I want to go. I am a little bit. It's like those, I like the new ones. They're great. But I am a little bit like it's missing something with that tactile thing of those real faces. And the original makeup is so iconic and strange, actually, too, that there's

nothing. Yeah, it's not necessarily realistic and that's kind of okay. That's, it's this uncanny, what are the fuck am I looking at? They're not quite people. It's not quite real. It's like, it's great. I love it. And Rick Baker's makeup and the Tim Burton thing is amazing. But, you know, it's, it's not the same thing.

You've got to get in touch with Guillermo. I'm sure he would happily put you in nine pounds, 90 pounds of prosthetics. I love it. I love wearing that stuff. I love him. You've always been, as I understand it, like a sci-fi fantasy guy, right? Like that was like, like, how did that manifest? Was that everything and anything?

Were you like, Isaac Asim, Arthur C. Clark? Like, all of those guys, sure. I was more science fiction-y than I was fantasy. Got it's funny. As I've gotten older, I've read more fantasy stuff, but it was more the science fictiony stuff and more, yeah, the more sciencey stuff, even though, but like Philip K. Dick, which isn't really sciencey, right, but stuff like that, but not so much elves and forks and stuff like that. But that stuff is cool. I like it. Yeah. I didn't read as much of it. You were supposed to play Philip K. Dick for a long time. Wasn't that like something that you were

trying to do for a long time? Yeah, we tried, there was a biopic. and several iterations and different ideas of it and it just never happened it was just working with the family who were great and everything but just never did i would have loved to have done that where are you out on the blade runner films you like them like both of them all of them the original one and the and the and the and the 249 i did i i like them i'm i'm a little bit they're great movies as movies as adaptations of philip k dick i don't know that i love them but that doesn't matter that's me being geeky about Philip K. Dick, but they're great movies. Has there been, I'm not, I'm not well versus you are. What's been the best

Philip K. Dick adaptation? I think the best one, well, if there's two, I think the best one is the Richard Linklater, scanner darkly. Oh, sure, the rotoscope. Yeah, yeah. I think that's actually really good. I'll tell you something funny. I saw Barbie, and at the end of Barbie, I turned to my girlfriend, and I said, now he was no feminist, but this might be the best Philip K. Dick movie I've seen. Wait, give me more. Well, especially the ending. When she meets her creator and she's sort of talking about, I was like, my God, this is

like, I was like, nobody else getting this is Phil K. Dick. I was like, this is crazy. I was like, this is amazing. There was something about the whole like going, the weird world of Barbie is like the things. There's one of his books where everybody takes this drug that puts you into this kind of cartoon world and stuff. I mean, there's a bunch of them like that. And then clicking out into the real world and stuff.

I was like, this is like a Philippa Big Dick. It's like your, it's like your PhiloKid Dick thing. I thought it was great. There it is. There's Chinwag meets Paul Giamati's movie career. That's what I'm looking for. That's what I wanted. That's the goal.

There we go. That's the good stuff. We got there. And were you, I want to talk a little bit about your, your role in Spider-Man. I mean, rhino sticks with you. A little bit. There's not much to be said, but yes.

No, I have a lot to say. I have a lot to say. Great. Okay. no no no um but like that's i mean was that an enjoyable role that again lets you kind of like choose some scenery in the best possible way yeah oh yeah probably too much scenery and that was yeah it was great that was shot out of a cannon that was just so like wow and it was interesting to see how much was created on the fly with that and it was practical stunts and stuff which was really cool and

Andrew Garfield was amazing in that. There were times when I was like, you don't probably have to be doing this. They have a guy in a suit and nobody will be able to tell that it's not you. Right. He was so committed to that role.

Oh my gosh. Amazing and physically amazing. Yeah. And it was crazy. I mean, it was like, I'm in a truck and I'm yelling in Russian. The only thing, everything I said was in Russia.

Most of what I said was in Russian. And I think they showed it to an audience who was like, what is going on? What is he saying? And so I had to re-dub it in English, which was... And so a lot of it in English, I don't even remember.

It was so, it's such a blur. That's like six Spider-Men ago. They go through Spider-Men so quickly, as you well know. But, like, there was all the talk of the Sincer's Six at the time. Were you, did they even talk to you about that? No, no. I don't remember, yeah, I don't, it's like, I had just come off of doing a play for a while. And so I was a little bit out of it.

And so I don't, I don't remember, I don't think they ever talked. to me about any of that stuff. No, not that I remember, no. You're saying going from, was it Iceman comma, to Rhino, a little discombulated? I did Hamlet. Oh, you did Hamlet at Yale, right? Yeah. I had just finished doing Hamlet. And then I was like, oh, right, I've got to go play the rainbow. So it was like, I don't know, it was just weird. It was a surreal period of my life. It also has to tell you something about, like, you know, your career is fascinating in that you have been able to toggle between character, actor roles and leading man roles. But like, you get to be Hamlet on stage and they're like, can you be this crazy out there villain in two scenes in Spider-Man?

No, and that's great. And that to me, that's like, it doesn't get any better than that than be able to do things to complete polar opposites of each other and stuff. That's, if that's happening, I'm happy as a clam. So no sadness when they brought back, it seems like every Spider-Man villain, except for rhino in that last spider-man movie i felt for you paul i was upset no and i have to i have to admit i have not followed all the spider-man movies i'm not i shouldn't be admitting this but i haven't followed it no i think in the first place the rhino is a tricky one i think the rhino's a bit of a tricky one because if you really go rhino he's wearing like the rhino suit with the horn and everything it's hilarious and i kind of thought are you going to do that am i going to look like a

rhino with my face cut out thing they didn't do that they went with the mechanical thing but the rhino might be a tricky one in the first place i think you know i'm in i'm enraged for you okay you don't have to be it's i know when you woke up this morning promoting the holdovers you did not expect the deep dive into rhino i apologize definitely did no it's quite all right don't worry about exceptional offers and thoughtful design that leaves plenty of room for autumn adventures and see for yourself how Volvo's legendary safety brings peace of mind to every crisp morning commute this september lease a 2026 xe 90 plug-in hybrid from 599 byweekly at 3.99% during the volvo fall experience event condition supply visit your local Volvo retailer or go to explorevolvo.com

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I feel like it's taken you away out of the film game for a little minute. Like, I feel like the last time I saw you really front and center in a role, film will roll worthy of your talents, maybe private lives. That's one I did during billions. And that's a great movie. It's a great movie. That's terribly underseen. I wish more people had seen it. Well, but that would be.

You're right. That would be. And that was probably one of the only. film things I did I did maybe some other things but yeah but I didn't know it takes you away so I mean I've off you want to rest yeah no I get it I mean what so was that like in retrospect obviously very proud of the work of billions and really worked for a significant audience like I mean it's look you have to make choices you can't do everything is that at the end of the and I got it and and you know they did let us do and as it went along they let us do more and stuff and I did this I did

this crazy show called 30 Coins that's on HBO Max. They let me do that between season six and season seven. And they started to, because they were also, didn't want us doing a whole lot, especially not TV stuff. So that was limited. But yeah, no, you're right. It did take us all away from doing that stuff. And where are you at right now in terms of, like, again,

like I think people always think that actors can steer their career more than they actually can, where even like, even the ones like yourself who have this amazing career, they're still waiting for a script. a great director to call. But what's your priority right now? Like you haven't done theater in a long while. You haven't done theater a long time. I'd like to do a play.

That would be really nice. I don't know what play or where I'd like to do it, but I'd love to do a play. Yeah, that would be great. And I don't know. I've been enjoying doing these kind of kooky genre things, this horror show that I did and stuff. Stuff like that would be fun.

I don't know. I do have the luxury of being able to take it easy a little bit. Yeah. To billions and stuff. And that's nice. So I don't know, but theater would be nice. I'd like to do a play. Is there anything in the kind of genre world that you really have dug? Are you like a black mirror guy? Are you like what's? You know what I thought was great? Barbarian? Did you see Barbarian? Oh, barbarant's fantastic. Yes. Yes. Fantastic. Is that Gregor out of nowhere this guy? Yeah, amazing. Really good movie. Really well made, really delivered. I was like that is good man. So that I thought that was fantastic. I've got some some random questions as if the last few questions haven't been random for you.

If you thought that was random, strapped it, buddy. Totally great. It's great. Okay. You worked with Tom Cruise, of course, on Rock of Ages. Do you get the famous cruise cake? I'm obsessed with the cruise cake. Do you know about this? Yes, I got the cruise cake for, I think, maybe three years. Oh, wow, you fell off the cruise cake list. I fell off the list.

I don't know what I did. I don't know what happened. But for those, did it move? Is there any reason? The shining moment, I got the, I got the gigantic coconut cake, humongous and delicious. Amazing. Wow. I wonder if it's better never to have had, it's like better to have loved and lost. Like, do you want the cruise?

You're right. It's a wound. It's a wound that I thank you for bringing up. Thank you for putting salt in it today. Thank you so much. I'm just bitter, Paul. I've hosted the last two world premieres of Tom Cruise movies. And who hasn't got one fucking cake?

not one fucking cake well if I had any way to get in touch with him you'd have a cake I would I promise if I see him I'll tell him that you need a cake well we were talking here's a semi serious question we were talking about found family in the case of the holdovers

and that's what a film set is these are these like these little found families and it's a very it's a fascinating thing we're like often these families don't last maybe sometimes you keep in touch with folks maybe you don't are you the kind of person that keeps in touch Are you the person that makes an effort?

Increasingly, as I'm getting older, and I fear loneliness, I'm more, I'm more, I'm, no, increasingly as I'm getting older, it must be something about getting older, I don't know. But I do keep up with people more, and it's, and I do try to, and you do form more lasting friendships, but you're right, you know, it's that thing, it's that, it's that great thing, though, I think it's true of actors, and I think it's true of that movie, and it's true a lot of things. It's that idea of, you know, maybe, maybe the family you were born into isn't the one you actually should be sticking, you know, or hanging out with. So, you know, you find these new families all the time. And it is, I think, something that matters to actors. And sometimes it takes

five years or 10 years or 15 or 20 in the case of Alexander and it comes back around and you're different places and that must be a beautiful thing too. It was a very beautiful thing. Yeah. On a scale of 1 to 10, how close are you with The Rock? You've been in two films with the Rock, San Andreas and Jungle Cruise. What a great question. I'm going to say close is like, I mean, I don't dance around it. Come on. Three?

I mean, it's not like we're like communicating all the time. I think if I saw him, it would be really nice to see him. And it was nice spending time with him and it was great. We don't call each other or anything like that. We don't get together for dinner or anything like that. three strong three rising three yes

we can only hope we can only hope but I did do those two movies both of which were a lot of fun I got to say for some reason like the one San Andreas was really fun for some reason on the IMDB I think until you die San Andreas 2 will be listed it's been listed forever and I don't think

it's going anywhere so you have to make it or just leave the search I don't know what to tell you it's been talking about it's true. You're right, though. And every now and then I hear somebody brings it up, they're like, my agent will be like, but you know, San Andreas, too, they're talking about that. I'm like, really? Then nothing. Then nothing happens. It's a satisfying movie. It works for what it is. Doesn't it? Love it. And loved doing it. And, and again, not the same dream as playing a talking ape, but a bit of a dream to be the, like, scientist guy in the disaster movie,

who's like, you people have not been listening to me. Nobody listened to me. Yes. You know that guy. It's fantastic. It was great. Is there any genre or franchise you want me to secret into the universe for you? What are we missing? Are you done, do you want to be in a, I don't know, again, you did the comic book thing. I don't know, I would like to be, there's been this kind of really great revival of kind of like, specifically Agatha Christie, but the kind of like drawing low murder stuff. Yeah.

I love stuff like that. And I think it's great that people are making stuff like that again, like Nines out and all. I get the Christmas stuff. And I feel like the kids these days are digging that stuff. And that's nice. No, no. You don't say it. Don't say it that way. That's that, that's it. That's as it came out of my mouth. I was like, that's it. I just ruined my chances. You were in, knives out three and then you lost it in the space of 10 seconds. Oh, God. But I would like to do something like that. Yeah. Yeah. It'd be fun to play like a detective like that, but or to play it's just somebody in that movie. That world of that kind of world I love that

whole thing. A rival to Benoit Blanc in Knives Out 3. Sure. Yeah, that would be great to be the guy who's going up against him. Yes, I like that. That's very good. Yes. You're welcome. Okay, we're kicking up one more notch in the final stretch. The happy, say, I confused, profoundly random questions. What do you collect, Paul Giamatti? Do you collect anything? Books. Books. I collect books. I collect books. I have a huge book collection. What's the wallpaper on your phone? It's like a weird It's a weird, hold on, so that you can see it. I can't really see it. It's like a strange kind of fantastical painting of a Mexican wrestler.

Of a masked Mexican wrestler. I can't get a check out. Yep, yep, that's accurate, yep. Star Wars or Star Trek? Star Wars or Star Trek? Star Trek. I get it. Thank you.

Thank you for getting it. Last actor you were mistaken for? I think I've been mistaken for Larry the cable guy three times and that might have been the last time that's not appropriate that's sorry that I mean that's that's the honest truth other than that that I don't think I've been mistaken for anybody else no I think it's Larry the cable guy pretty much can can you do a CRISPR walkin impression have you ever tried one in your life I haven't really okay what does he do now I'm like what does he do it's like staccato kind of All of this kind of thing, right?

It's all like, hey, all this kind of, I can't think of, like, what would he say? That was it. That was it. That was what. Oh. Oh. Oh. Oh.

Oh. What's the most annoying thing about you, according to friends, family, coworkers? Holy cow. That's a really good question. I never answer my phone. Oh. That annoys people. Not a good text or not a good.

Not a good. Yeah, I'm bad with a lot of that stuff. What's the most common complaint from you on a set? What gets under your skin? Huh, that's interesting. The most common complaint from me, don't tend to complain all that much. I don't think.

I suppose I would be I suppose if it's I don't know that's really easy going Paul that's great this is a good this is wonderful I'm literally sitting here going I don't complain about it if it's going too slow or I don't complain about it I don't complain about somebody not knowing their lines

it's okay I mean it's like I can't think of anything we get it you're perfect this is wonderful too hot if it's too hot I don't like it a sweater yep worst note a director has ever given you I don't love faster all the time. I don't love faster. And it's like, which is fine sometimes, but you get it sometimes for no really good reason.

And I get a little bit tired of faster all the time. Got it just like kind of a lame default. And sometimes like, okay, now I'm just talking fast. Why am I talking so fast now? I mean, it's not a bad thing. You should keep things moving along. But I got a little bit faster. Who's an actor that always makes you happy?

You see them on screen. Robert Duvall. Not a false note possible from that man, right? A movie that makes you sad? The third man. Good. And a food that makes you confused. You don't get it.

Oh, wow. Jesus Christ. This is tricky. A food that makes me... You see it on a menu. You're like, for me, it's like... Why do you get... Yeah, like what?

Yeah, beats. I don't... What is the beats thing? I don't get... What am I? I'm missing. Goat cheese. Goat cheese. I don't understand why goat cheese is the thing. Cheese great, but goat cheese of all things. Consistency. Goat cheese, I don't like. Yeah, it's crumbly, it's weird, it's sour. I don't like it.

Yeah. It's just like Paul Giamati. That's how I would describe you. Crumbly and sour. God. All right. Very good. Never, never. Congratulations on the holdovers. Thanks for putting up with my my silliness um fantastic really great thank you i'm always a fan of yours it's it's taken a while to have this kind of conversation over the years but i'm glad it's for the holdovers and gives us a chance to reflect in this way um good luck with the silly season i hope to see you somewhere out in a silly party at one of these things and congratulations again man thank you very much sir i really appreciate this is fun thank you all right i'll talk to you soon thanks man bye and so ends another edition of happy sad confused remember

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