Happy Sad Confused - Rachel Brosnahan

Episode Date: January 30, 2018

Let's be honest, a year ago very few people knew who Rachel Brosnahan was. Hell, even a couple months ago, before "The Marvelous Mrs. Maisel" debuted on Amazon, she could still pass by unnoticed on the streets of New York where she lives. That's all starting to change very rapidly now that her Amazon series has landed and garnered amazing reviews, not to mention a Golden Globe for Best Comedy Series and a Best Actress award for Brosnahan herself.  On this episode of "Happy Sad Confused", Brosnahan talks about what it's like to be the face and voice of Midge, the memorable center of this delightful series. Plus Rachel reveals why her pivotal role on "House of Cards" was such a surprise, what role she lost out on really wrecked her, and why Raven-Symone's work is forever embedded in her brain.  Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

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Get after him or have you shot You mean blow up the building From this moment on None of you are safe New episodes every Wednesday Wherever you get your podcasts Today on Happy Set Confused, The Marvelous, Rachel Brosnahan on The Marvelous Mrs. Maisel.

Hey guys, I'm Josh Horowitz. Welcome to the show. Welcome, Sammy. I see what you did there with The Marvelous. I'm redoing the intro. I'm going to redo it because you hated my intro. Maisel or Maisel? What do you mean?

Do you watch the show? Yeah, but I feel like maybe because, you know, I identify so much. I'm Mrs. Maisel. It's like a Jew, you know, I say it in my Jewie. It's Maisel. Maisel. Maisel.

Well, that sounded Jew, yeah. No, it's Maisel. I only discovered this show very recently. I will confess, I watched it post Globes, post the win, I think it won both best comedy and she won best actress. And it was on my list, and I got to it. And you know what? You guys are right.

It's really good. Yeah. It's a fun, Alex Boresteam. Boorstein, of course, Shalube. I was going to say, MV one and only, Tony Shaloo. I think Shalub probably listens to the podcast. Shalub, your work in Men in Black. Okay, never mind.

But, like, I think it sounds like I'm kidding, and I'm not. Right. That, obviously, everyone who knows me knows men in black is hugely important to me. Were you a Monk Watcher? No. Think of, you probably have 120 Shalub hours waiting for you. I was not a monk watcher. I was the movie he did with Tucci, with the Tuchy, with the Tuch.

Big Night. I was thinking about last night, and I'm like, that's not. Yeah, I'm a big, big night. I'd like to get the tooch on here. He'd be good. Yes. What are you crazy? He directed a new movie with Army Hammer in it that's coming out soon, so maybe he'll be in town.

And now you and Army are close. We're besties. Speaking of besties, my newest one, Rachel, I really liked her. She's wonderful. Rachel Brazzed ahead and just exited. You got a chance to say hi. He did. She was so lovely.

It's a little. You know, that violates the rules. I try to keep you away from the talent. I know, but she was late, and I was late too. So, yes, she was so lovely. I couldn't believe. I'm about 5-1, so everyone knows. And she's right there with me.

I wonder, now I'm just curious, like, people listening to the podcast, what did they imagine the Sammy in their brain? What did, how tall was the Sammy in their brain? They think of like, like, uh, like a Jennifer Lawrence. Mm-hmm. And then they're like, but prettier. And that's what she looked, but like effortless. Right, right. I'm not so done up, not so like...

Right, just more like... More natural. Oh my God, it's like almost makeup takes away from it. That's what people think. Anyway. And they know what you look like. Yeah, well, I'm a monster on the internet. You can find me very easily.

Yeah. And Rachel, what I like, like, she noticed all the correct things in your office to notice. Yeah. She was with it. She was with it. We like her. We were fans of the Rachel Brosnahan. And I like that show a lot.

Yeah. For those that don't know, You should by now, but the marvelous Mrs. Maisel just concluded, I guess, concluded it just surfaced or was released its first season, but probably just two months ago, and was immediately just embraced by critics and audiences. A second season is about to be shot here in New York. It takes place, I think, in the late 50s, about kind of like a Jewish housewife. Yeah. Who kind of goes through an unexpected divorce and finds her voice. Her husband leaves her.

Yes. I don't want to ruin the whole thing. Finds her voice as a stand-up comedian. Is that a good tease? Yeah, that's a good log line. Okay, good. I'll buy the show. Okay.

And it's very well done. It's from Amy Sherman Paldina, who of course did Gilmore Girls. So it's got that very like, rat-a-tat-tat dialogue. And she sort of looks like, I think Rachel sort of looks like Alexis Plydell. Oh, I can see that a little bit. I know. Alexis Pledel meets Evan Rachel Wood kind of a thing? Yeah, yeah.

So yes, she's getting well-deserved accolades for her performance. for those that don't know also she you might have seen her I saw her in house of cards she was in a couple seasons of that I was Emmy nominated for that actually say who would when I found out that that was the same person yeah I was floored yeah she was like kind of like the prostitute who's hired in the first episode first episode and then to seduce our good old buddy Corey Stoll yes class friend of the show yeah and then you know her character she becomes sort of a main character and it's she's dark and yeah and it's She, you know, she looked totally different.

It was such, like, her character now, she's so fun and bubbly and this was, yeah. Yeah, that lady's got range, this one, this brasma had. Yeah, I'm like, oh, when I found, I'm like, oh, she's good. She's good. She's got the chops. I agree with the Hollywood Foreign Press Association. So we had a blast. We took our silly hobby sack, confused photos.

She changed out of her glam outfit for the talk shows, and then we just, you know, got into our onesies and talked. He was on Kelly this morning. That's right. Yes. She, when I came in, what she was finishing up saying to you was thank you for the therapy session. Did she say that? She, I don't listen. Are you here? It's like, how do you do this job? I don't know. She goes, thank you for the therapy session. Thank you for the therapy session. We went deep. So then I'm like, oh, I got to listen to this one too. You might actually have to listen. Sammy doesn't listen to the podcast. I do if I like the guest.

I don't even pretend that you listen to every episode. No, I don't listen to every episode. I don't commute. So it's like, you know, and I listen to music unlike you. Yeah, I don't. I've listened to the boy from Oz soundtrack this morning all the way through. You have a great showman on your... Of course.

Okay. Okay. Okay. All right. Let's let Rachel dominate the rest of today's episode, as she should. A very talented young actress with great things in her future and great things in the present. As Marvelous Mrs. Maisel is currently streaming on. on Amazon Prime, and everybody should check it out if you haven't already. And remember, review, rate.

And subscribe. You don't have to do all of them, but you can choose one. Yeah, but if you're there, just do all of them. Okay, just do all them, guys. Enjoy this conversation with Rachel Brosnahan. Why, look, it's Rachel Brosnahan. Hi, Rachel. Hello.

It's good to see you. Thank you, too. Rachel has just been refreshed and recharged by delicious half of a lunch at least. A large sandwich and some coffee. More coffee. It's good to have this opportunity to chat with you because we spent all 90 seconds, I think, together at the Golden Globes. I think that's correct. So, look at my microphone, just like wobbling around everywhere.

I just got a mind of its own. Yes, exactly. So let's start at the Globes, because that was a fun night, I would expect. That was a pretty fun night. Totally overwhelming. but really cool. It was my first time, so it was pretty wild. Were you able to kind of enjoy it prior to your name being called, or was it kind of like, is it like in the back of your brain the entire time?

No, it wasn't. It wasn't that that made it overwhelming. It's just, there's just so many amazing people around and so much excitement and so much booze. But this one was really, having not been before, I don't have anything to compare it to, But this year, with the birth of this Time's Up movement, sort of piggybacking on the resurgence of Me Too, it felt different. And it felt, from what I understand from people who have been before, more purposeful.

And so that was really special to be there. Once you're in your seat and you know the category is coming up, like what's running through your brain like in the, when you're reading the nominees and all that? There was some miscommunication about when the category was coming up. So I didn't know that the category was happening when it was happening. I mean, Carol Burnett walked on stage, and I was like, oh, my God, Carol Burnett. I love her.

She's amazing. And then she started to read. And I was like, oh, oh, oh, shit. You know, and then it just all, and then it was like, and then that's it. And then I blacked out. You're just coming to now a couple of weeks later. Yeah, yeah, exactly. And now you're back into kind of the reality of real life.

Yeah. Because you guys are, I think, starting production pretty soon, right? Yeah. I just had my first costume fitting yesterday. Nice. So, okay, so it looks like, it feels like this has all happened pretty quickly. Like, and I confess, when I spoke to you at the Globes, I haven't even watched the show yet.

I'd heard like the, I know, I know. You sensed it on me, I think, when you talked to me. No, I had no idea. No, I had no idea. No, I had no idea. No, but, uh, well, you know how it is. Do you have, like, this, I have this running list of, like, 20 TV shows I need to watch. I do, too.

I'm so endlessly behind. And, and then I watch it, and I'm like, what took me so long? I hope you feel that way now. I do. That's why you're here. Don't worry. You wouldn't be here otherwise. So I'm now a tremendous fan of your work and this wonderful production.

But, I mean, a year ago. Take me, I don't know when you shot the first season. But like... I don't even... What was a year ago? I don't even know. 2017. What was it?

Beginning of 2017. So where were you at in your life at the beginning of 2017? And does it feel like a different kind of a life? Or is it sort of just like, this is a different job? It happens to be a few more eyeballs? Or does it feel like apples and oranges or what? All of the above, I think. So

now that I'm putting my timeline back in order in the beginning of 2017, I was just finishing, actually almost exactly this time, just finishing up a run of Othello at New York Theatre Workshop. Right. So I was immersed in theater and especially

downtown theater and a smaller theater. It was such a special production. And we had already shot the pilot of the show back to back kind of. We We shot the pilot and then I went into rehearsals for this play and just got to live in a theater for months. And I did feel at that time like I was living all of my dreams and all these dreams I didn't know I had. Theater was my first true love.

And then also to have shot this show that felt so different from anything I'd ever done. I was so excited and terrified that anyone had trusted me with it, you know. And then we were gearing up to go back into the season in, I think we went back in April. Got it. So I think at this time, I was in mild panic not knowing if we'd actually been picked up or not. Got it. So a couple things I want to follow up on that. I never got to see that production.

I'm still sad about it because that was you and David Craig, David O. Yellowow, who's been on this podcast, who's the sweetest man on the planet. Isn't he the sweetest, and the smartest person I've ever met in my life? He was literally discovered when I was doing my research that he was literally born in the exact same day, same year. We are soulmates. We are brothers from another mother. Whoa. Crazy.

Cool. So was that, I mean, you say, you know, growing up being really into theater, and that's being a passion, continues to be, I'm sure you'll return to it. What about that was, I mean, obviously the caliber of actors you're working with. It's insane.

The material, pretty good. Pretty okay. Shakespeare knew a thing or two. Did it feel like that was, I mean, do you look at these kind of opportunities as like steps up, advances for you, opportunities for you to learn new things? Or is it just sort of like, let me relish the moment and go on to the next thing? Again, all of the above.

I had always imagined, in the earliest dreamy stages of imagining what your life might be like if you're lucky enough to earn a career as an actor, I had initially thought I would only do theater. That was all I ever wanted to do. And I also went through a brief period where I thought I would do musical theater before learning that I cannot sing at all. But I, and so the film and TV thing was sort of just something to try and something to learn. And I got to learn slowly, which was a huge privilege, doing tiny roles on shows that were out, great shows and not great shows and be in school at the same time. So I had only done one play in New York prior to Othello and one other professional play in Chicago. go at the Steppenwolf.

So the idea of being able to do another play, I'd never worked off Broadway, which had always been a dream, with this caliber of actors, with Sam Gold, at the New York Theater workshop on Othello, in this iconic role, was just so many dreams at once.

I didn't even know what to do with myself. And I can't remember, I believe I already knew that I was doing Othello when Maisel came up. Okay. So the opportunity, to do two things that were so new. I'd also never done Shakespeare, really,

so that were so new and terrifying and exhilarating at the same time. It was so, I still don't, I'm still processing that. Let alone this little phenomenon we're in the middle of right now. So are you the type of person that, like, did you make, like, markers for yourself? Like, by 20, I want to be doing this.

By 25, I want to do this. Like, are you goal-driven in that way? I'm a little type A in that way. But no. I think very quickly the idea of a career in the arts felt like you just couldn't do that. And despite, I think, a lot of desire to try to set goals that way, I felt like it would be an impossible standard. I think I learned early on that everybody's journey in this and any kind of art is completely different. And so to put that kind of pressure on myself would have not gone well. I don't think we've not been motivating. And as you well, and there's so much of it is unfortunately out of your control, especially in the arts and what you're doing.

I mean, it's... It's a lot of hard work, a lot of luck, and a lot of people willing to take chances. Yeah. Was there... So you grew up, you were born Wisconsin. Yeah. grew up... In Highland Park, Illinois. Illinois, right. So was there a point...

Do you remember, like, a specific moment where you told your family, like, I want to pursue this? Was that, like, a big... thing or was it kind of a gradual like everybody kind of came to realize Rachel's serious about this or what? I think it was pretty gradual but it didn't become real until it was time to look at

college, time to decide what I wanted to study in college and where I wanted to apply. I think prior to that it was a hobby that, but I didn't like anything else. It was like the only hobby I had and the only thing I was really interested in.

So there was certainly a shift at the point I think I really decided that I wanted to go to school to study drama and that would be the path that I was set on forever. There's so much pressure on kids at that age that feels so wrong to know

what you're going to do for the rest of your life at 17, even before 18. It's almost like I don't trust the people that know with certainty because how can you really? I mean, it's great if you do. I guess more I admire and I'm jealous of people that have that certitude at 15 or 17. Yeah, I do too. I mean this was certainly the only thing

I ever wanted to do, but that I really felt, I felt like I had to decide when I was 17. Were you, like, heavily into pop culture as a kid? Like, what was your jam in terms of, like, stuff that you were into as a teenager? Not really. I came from a really athletic family. My dad played tennis, skied, lived in Boulder for a long time. My brother played hockey forever. My sister played soccer.

I played basketball for a second. It was terrible at it, but grew up snowboarding. and ultimately I did some sports in high school. So not really. I read a lot. I was a ferocious reader. Always in my face in a book. And I feel like that was what I did for fun.

Do you remember the first actor or film you became obsessed with? This is so funny, but this is so silly. But honestly, look at the posters in my office. It's not silly. I've got a big trouble little China poster. I did love back to the future. I loved Xenon Girl of the 21st century.

I don't even know what that is. Yeah, it was a Disney Channel original movie, and I loved it. I was really young then. I mean, but I watched it. Stop giving me away. I bet a lot of your listeners know about this. Xenon Girl of the 21st century.

Raven was in it. She is so Raven. But I don't know why. I think it's because the connection for me between being an avid reader. And also, my mom says I was a little bit of a serious kid. Like, I was pretty focused on the things that I liked, and at that time that was reading.

The connection between reading and acting, I think, comes in in the imagining of worlds that I couldn't imagine. So I loved fantasy books. I loved Harry Potter and the Lord of the Rings, and I'm half British, and I grew up reading all these British books here. that nobody's ever heard of. Sure.

Harry Potter was once, one of them. How deep into Harry Potter were you? Oh, do you dress as Hermione? Do you have the midnight? Oh, yeah, total Potterhead. Yeah? For sure. I love to Harry Potter. What house are you?

And what have you sorted yourself? I don't know. You know, like, everybody wants to think they're a Gryffindor. I would like to also think that I'm a Gryffindor. I think I'm also a little bit of a Ravenclaw. Okay. Yeah. Yeah, yeah.

We could go on about this for hours, but I'll stop before it gets embarrassing. No, this is where I want to go deep now. No, no. But I, yeah, I think it was that Xenon Girl of the 21st century to return to her and all of the genius that is that film was it took place in space, but also on Earth. Right. And I don't know. I just, I felt like that was the first time I was ever like, oh, I want to be in something like that. I want to do something like that.

We also grew up watching a lot of silly comedies. You know, I loved Flubber. I loved Robin Williams. The best, yeah. Oh, my gosh. Just was genuinely, actually, so deeply inspired by Robin Williams. I loved the movie Annie.

I loved Bernadette Peters. Yeah, I mean, it, it, uh, yeah. We watched Austin Powers a hundred times. All the classics, all the good stuff. I mean, yes. I mean, I will not quarrel with Austin Powers. I think I'm still catching up on a lot of classic. Okay.

Okay, I can't believe I'm going to admit this. I've never seen Jurassic Park. What? I know. We're not even talking, like, I was thought you were going to say something like Citizen Kane or Casablanca, but you're...

No, no. Like, it was a very odd selection. I missed out on a lot of classics. I did watch Casablanca and Citizen Kane much later in my life. Sure. I feel like not until I got to college. You need to sit you down and watch Jurassic Park.

I still have a lot to catch up on. So I hear. I've heard great things. Did you meet Emma the night of the Globes? Emma Watson was there. I did not meet Emma, but I really think she's great. I mean, inspiring in every way.

Not only the Hermione part, but, like, I mean, she's a feminist icon. She's the best. She's an incredible woman. I also love her love for books and reading. Yes. I love her, where she puts the books all over the world. Hiding in this uplaid here. Yeah, yeah.

It's pretty cool. I love that she's spreading the love of reading as somebody who really loved reading herself. Have you had the opportunity to do any sci-fi fantasy yet? Have you gone up for a crazy sci-fi fantasy movie yet? Whenever anybody says, what do you want to do next? That's it. Oh, really? I did a small role early on, I think when I was still in college in a movie called Beautiful Creatures.

That was, yeah, that was the closest I've ever come to that genre. But I'd love to do some of that. They're making a Star Wars movie every year for the rest of the time. I'm in. Hello, Star Wars, people. I'm here. And not so available at this moment, but soon. Exactly.

I'm talking to six months after the next season or two. But I think that's the attraction to period pieces, kind of. I've done a couple period pieces, and it's also a world that feels sort of far away. way. Yeah. I love the attention to detail that is involved in bringing them to life. No, and obviously we'll get into the Maisel. I mean, one of the things that I really love about it is just, and many people I know are attracted is, is both the familiarity and the foreigners of that world. Like, I feel connection to it just because, like, you know, my dad was in his 20s in that time period. And you grew up on the Upper West Side. On the Main Street to the Upper West. So there

you go. So it's, yeah, it's kind of a comfort food for me watching. I'm sure it hits different points for different people. But anyway, we'll dive into that in a second, but I want to get more into the kind of the background before we got there. So the first film you did was this movie, The Unborn, I think, right? Great Gary Oldman was in it.

Hey, he's going to win an Oscar. Yeah, I never met him, but he was in that movie. Was that when you were still in high school, or had you moved to New York by then? I was still in high school. Okay. Yeah, it was sort of like a, I had a very small Chicago agency

that sent me out on this role, and I was sort of told, was so confused, just was so confused. I was like a chicken running around with my head cut off. I had never auditioned for a film. I didn't know what any of the terminology meant. I didn't know what a callback was. What's a mark? What's first position?

I had no idea what was happening. But somebody must have either thought it was very funny or I was right for the role. And was New York something that was important for you to get to? Was that sort of always the place you wanted to end up in? It was. I had this very romantic idea about New York and the theater and the city. And I always, I always, even before I really knew I wanted to move to New York, I think I always wanted to live in New York. So have you been living here continuously since school?

Yeah. I moved to L.A. for about five minutes and then came back. It was not for me. I hear. There's a lot of L.A. basting on this podcast. Oh, no. I like L.A. in some ways. We're in New York.

We are the best. Yeah. Come on. Let's own it. Do you feel like a New Yorker now? Do you feel like, I mean, there's this debate of, like, when can you actually feel like a New Yorker? That is an ongoing debate. It's been 10 years.

Okay. I just switched over my driver's license. And I felt different afterward. What's the, what do you think is the New Yorkiest thing about you? What's the, I mean, do you mutter to yourself on the streets? Oh, yeah. Well, as an actor, we do a lot of that. You're like running lines on the subway.

That's true. You just do it. And you practice your faces. And the happy, sat and confused. Do you do it on the subway? Oh, no, I'm so sorry. I revealed, we did our happy, second-infest faces to warm up for the conversation. And I revealed that.

It's true that I've been caught in the bathroom back to sing my happy-sac-confused faces. Do you ever do you do you ever do on the subway and you're, can you see your reflection? No, I'm not that. No, no. But now you might. I see the 50 people around me. I'm not crazy. Now that I've inspired you.

Okay, I will. And I'll think of you when I'm making my confused faces. Oh, gosh. I hope I come across you on the, on the F train. So what were we were saying? Oh, yeah. So New Yorkiest things about you, you think? I drink black coffee and I like it.

that's probably it okay uh i i really enjoy strangers i feel like that that's something that new work did to me strangers are the greatest here better than maybe well not anywhere in the world but anywhere that i've been i you know the kindness and gruffness simultaneously of strangers in new york is something that i will continue to find great joy in for the rest of my life i think I always say I need kind of like the collision. I don't drive even. So like I don't drive here. No, I know.

But like I literally don't have a driver's license. Oh, good. So like I need like the collision of people to like to feel alive. Yeah, to feel alive and to kind of like be engaged with society. Like otherwise, I don't know. I feel like I would be a hermit. And I'm totally. You know, it's weird.

I don't. So for the five minutes I lived in LA and prior to moving to New York, I listened to do a lot of music. This is sort of pre-podcast, pre-all of this. Um, but I, I listen to a lot of music and actually here I don't almost ever because when I'm on the subway, I'm, I'm, I'm, I'm, I'm creepily watching people and, like, eavesdropping on their conversations and, but I just, I had the energy in New York and the people here. It's pretty amazing. You obviously shoot the show here in New York. We do. Um, do you expect, I mean, like, you know, New Yorkers are notoriously, I think, relatively plaza. I don't know about the shooting or no. They do not. They are, blasé to angry. That's the only scale that it. exist. They're furious, so they don't care at all. They

do not like it. Maybe they'll treat you with more respect now that you guys are actually, they've seen it. I feel like it's downhill from here, honestly. Well, I mean, we're going to be shutting down more streets. They're going to get angrier. You've seen the scripts. We're going bigger guys. Sorry. Amazon up the budget. Well, I'll never

forget when we, I told this story something the other day, but we shot on West 4th Street in front of a I think it was West 4th or East 4th. front of a, um, a record store. And, and there was this man who was very angry that we'd shut down the street and he couldn't cross in front just for like a second while we were rolling. He was so mad. And just to make himself heard, he, he, he rode on his bike with his child in, in this little basket thing, just in a circle in front of the set. You know, like, and he didn't really even, he was like yelling things. No, he said some bad words that I'm sure he'll regret later in front of

his kid, but, but he just, but there was no sense to it. It was just like, shit, you know, like, ugh. Yeah, just gutter old, can't control yourself, Tourette's a little bit. Just to make his point. Yeah. Um, uh, and then he drove off. I like that guy. Yeah. That guy's good people. He's a real New Yorker. That's my dad. Larry Harowitz, I apologize. Um, so, uh, was house of cards like the, when you look back, like, was that kind of like the big turning point? in terms of, like, where you had, like, were you, like, a consistently working actor and making a living?

Like, did you, like, no, I was not making a living before that show. I actually, during the first season of House of Cards, was nannying simultaneously. Oh, my gosh. Because it was, because I was only supposed to do, like, one episode and never really knew that I was going to come back or when I was coming back.

So I held on to this nannying job as long as I could. And they were very understanding when, ultimately, I had to piece out. I'm nominated for an Emmy, so I need That wasn't until years later. That first season, I really was just trying to... It was episode to episode. Just trying to pay my rent.

Yeah. Yeah. So did Fincher direct you in that one, or was it by then kind of handed off to other folks to direct? So I was in the pilot very, very briefly, and that was him. The pilot, yeah, I think just the pilot. And then a couple of episodes later came back and we had a slew of wonderful directors that followed. So by the time, like, you got that gig and it started to snowball, like, had you... Did you go into jobs with expectations and hopes and dreams, or were you kind of like already kind of beaten down a little bit

where it's like, I'll take this and we'll see what happens and on to the next. Like, I mean, where were you at when House of Cards came and how much of a surprise was what it turned into? From where I sat as a complete outsider, it was a massive surprise. I'd never heard of Netflix. Neither had anybody else. Yeah, it was a breakthrough for them. Yeah, I have some very fond memories of I was living in L.A.

initially and of being out in LA and auditioning for like tiny guest stars on other shows because again I was I was only I had like two scenes in the pilot so it was a small role and auditioning for similar sized things on other projects and them being like what are you up to and me going I'm you know I shot an episode of this new show on Netflix David Fincher and them going oh okay how am I going nobody cared at all. TV? No, oh. People could not have cared any less about these experimental weirdos over at Netflix. So the whole thing was a giant surprise.

It was a giant surprise that I was able to come back. I also, I think at that time was very aware that I was just waitressing and just nannying. And then at any second, I mean, to some degree, I think I still feel that way. At any second, I could go back there. So it really was job to job hoping to keep working and to keep playing roles that felt challenging and inspiring to me. because Rachel on House of Cards turned out to be something that pushed me further than I ever thought I could go as an actor, something that felt so far in and so far out of my wheelhouse and Beau and all the folks at the top over on House of Cards really trusted me and gave me this enormous gift that allowed me to stretch my muscles over there. From what I understand it, it wasn't like you were like, if there was a typical audition for you, it certainly wasn't call girl.

It wasn't that kind of a part, right? Even at that time. Yeah. Yeah, no. No, I was auditioning for a lot of asexual 16-year-olds. My bag, that's my jam. Yeah, like very, very young girls. I think I was 20, 21, very young.

Felt young, too. And in some ways, and in others not. But, yeah, it was really different. How did the family take to that kind of? an adult's kind of a performance. They were not thrilled. I still, honestly, I still am not sure if my dad's seen it. It might be for the best.

I mean, yeah. Yeah, that's not, no. Those were the dreams they had when I told them I was going to be coming after. Why can't you do more xenon? Exactly. That's what they said. That's exactly. They begged, where's xenon?

What happened to xenon? Where's my little girl who loves xenon? Yeah. Where is she gone? No, I think for a long time, my mother said, which I think was funny, is that Housa cards led to a series of other roles that were sometimes very dark. I have died a few creative ways now on television, and that, I think, was the most traumatizing part of it, was my mother called me,

spoiler. Is it still a spoiler? At the end of the third season, it was like, why didn't you tell me? I had to drive around the neighborhood. I was so upset. I couldn't say anything. So I think they're really thrilled now that I'm not, no longer deceased on television. Yeah, no, no brutal murders yet on Marvelous. It's amazing.

Who knows? Still time. We have a second season. God. We got up the empty somehow. Yeah. Give the viewers what they want. Do they want that?

Don't ask. Don't ask that question. I don't know. So did it feel like the kind of the world had opened up a little bit post like House of Cars in terms of what you got the, I know, I know. on Manhattan for a bit. So it feels like there was at least some momentum that was starting to build in terms of a career. Yeah, I think because of the profile of that show,

because it really was the beginning of this new era of television, this peak TV thing, there were new platforms suddenly to create and to view television on and so much great TV. It didn't feel as experimental as it may once have been considered. So I think just the fact that people had seen it. and that the show was prestige certainly helped me get in the room. But I was still auditioning very much. I still audition a lot.

It's a hopefully long journey for lucky enough to go on it. So prior to this amazing opportunity coming around, did you feel like you had come close to other opportunities like where you were in the running or were a passion project? You were like, this is going to be the one that's going to change everything. I don't know if I always thought it would have changed everything for me personally. Sometimes at that time I had a hard time looking outward, but yes, there were many, many, many, many that were just devastating, you know, when they didn't work out.

Is there one you feel comfortable revealing? Oh, sure. There was this movie, you know, I've never actually said this before, but there was this movie, I think I was 18 when I was auditioning for it called Restless. It was a Gus Van Sant movie. I saw that, yeah, and Mia Boshakowska, right? And came very, very close on that. And it was just, at that time especially,

I'd never read a script like that. I was so enamored with Gus Van Sant movies. And those were some of the movies that I think had inspired me the most. And I, oh, I have never wanted anything so badly. And that was that horrible thing where it really looked like. It was, at least from where I sat, really really looked like it was going to go my way. or just...

Yeah, KEM Red with a lot of different people. Went back to New York, came back out to L.A. But it was also new. I didn't know what was normal or what was not. But, I mean, oh, I have no... That was probably one of the first, just, like, gut-wrenching letdowns. And then they keep happening,

and you realize that's just part of it. I was going to say, does it get easier? Because actors at almost every level, until you get to some stratosphere that is 0.01%, Most people have to still audition. Oh, yeah. It does. It does get easier because I think I started to understand that it wasn't personal.

That it's not that they, you know, I wasn't in competition with anybody else. I suppose I took that out of, that was something that helped to be able to move past that, like, it wasn't like me against somebody else. It was either that it was my role and I was completely right for it. or I wasn't, and so it felt less personal. And I started to realize that this was going to be forever and that that's okay and that I've learned so much from each one of those experiences despite them being really, really varying degrees of awful and hard.

I've grown from each one. And honestly, there's a lot of reasons at the end of the day that I'm actually, you know, I would have loved to have done that film. I think it would have been incredible, but I graduated college. I didn't end up having to take time off of school, and I learned so much during my time. I took a little bit of time off,

but not the kind that would have been required for that. And I learned so much while I was in school, and so I can look back now and say, like, you know, we moved on and it worked out well. So moving up to this wonderful show. So, like, was this, what do you remember of, was this just one of many auditions at the time for Marvelous Mrs. Maisel?

Or was it one that stood out at the time as something that, to your point, was one of the ones that they were passionate about and felt like a lot was riding on in some ways, at least personally? It stood out. It was one. So at that time, I had just come off of Manhattan, which was a show that I adored working on that was too short-lived, which was devastating in its own way. And I had spent then at that point nearly five years doing television. and I really wanted to be focusing on theater and looking at some really great films and trying to see if I was in a position

where I could establish more control over my own work, as much as you can anyway, in this position. But trying to steer the ship a little bit more. And so when this came up, initially I said I don't think I want to do any more TV. And then I read the script. And honestly, by the end of the first page, I was like, I've got to have it.

what do I have to do how do I convince them that I can do this by the last five pages of that script my God oh my God and I was on the floor I was like crying

no I um no I but I fell in love with it and I really really wanted it did you feel it was a strike against you that you weren't Jewish going up for the part

were they looking for I don't know you know it wasn't something I had really considered I had played Jewish characters previously I also grew up in a very, very Jewish community. And although I am not Jewish myself, felt well-educated,

which is obviously not the same thing, but had really, truly been welcomed with open arms into my friends' houses and celebrations and holidays and Shabbat dinners and Shivas. I heard you did your time, did a few bar mitzvahs. Did quite a few bar and bar mitzvahs. I could maybe bar mitzvahs, at this point.

I was no of our Mitzwith, so I might take you up on that. Oh, my goodness. I'm the least Jewish Josh Horowitz you've ever met. You do not want me to bar mitzvah. That would be not a good thing to do. Season three, you never know. But I think, you know, it was, there's a, there's a, the script felt familiar to me. Right.

The family felt familiar. I recognized some of the characters and loosely was inspired in the creation of Midge by some of the women that I have known and loved in my own life. but it wasn't something I thought a whole lot about, although I'm sure that they saw every, every, every eligible maiden in the land before arriving. Also, just, I'd never done comedy.

Right. And I've heard you talk about this, that when you first read it or first approached it, you kind of approached it from a dramatic perspective, right? I didn't know, genuinely, I can't know how stupid when I say this, I really didn't know that it was as much of a comedy as it was. I think I really read it as like a, like, you know, I was like her husband left her.

Her whole life has fallen apart. Things are really tougher. And I, and they are, but I didn't read it with as much of a, it feels like pretty explicitly a comedy now. No, I think it's a fair point. There are different perspectives on it. There's a little bit of everything in there. I was surprised when I began working on the project. So does, because.

I mean, we've talked in our exhausted 90-second conversation at the Globes carpet about this, that you're in a different space very much now as you approach season two. Not only have you sat with this character for months, but now, like, the world has sat with this show for a month or two and is, like, has analyzed it to death, and you've been talking about it to death.

I know. So stick with the sound of my own voice. Well, I mean, I'm curious, like, do you still have the same sort of passion for the character? Are there new questions that have come up for you? about Midge in the wake of like everybody's interpretation and reception of it. Totally. And that's actually been a far more exciting thing than I think I ever thought it might be.

We're in such a bubble when one is making a show like this. You live in a bubble. You just work and work and work and hope you can come out the other side and that people love it as much as you do. But there is so much incredible television out right now that I don't think, at least I wasn't allowing myself really to think that people would like it because you just don't know

if anybody's going to find it if they're going to respond once they do And you've been through it with Manhattan which was a very well-received show but was like I confess I never caught up with it didn't catch on much like it didn't get that much attention

No and it was difficult to find and it was on Hulu the first season and not the second season which I think cost us some of our audience exactly so yes I'd already had my heartbroken once and so I

I, yeah, I, this, we're still like so in the middle of it, but it is, but it has been nice because it, I am just as excited about it as I was before. I'm excited to grow with her. I've learned so much from being a part of this project, which, which does still feel so out of my wheelhouse, um, being surrounded by brilliant talents like Amy Sherman Palladino, Dan Palladino are cast, are crass, are crows, are cr crew. I could talk about our crew for years. I mean, I wish somebody would film our camera operator shooting these scenes. Our camera operator, Jim, is doing gymnastics to shoot these scenes in one long take. Our editors are... Those are great, yeah. It's just, I mean, to be a part of this group has been one of the coolest things that I've ever done, and I'm so lucky. And so I'm thrilled that we have a season two. I can't wait to go back. And the response and the different things that people have, the different things that people feel passionate about, the questions that they have, have forced me to look even deeper. And that's exciting. And then

also infuriating when you feel like people miss the point, you know. But what's, I mean, again, you've had some time to kind of reckon with this character for a bit. And there's a lot to love about her. I mean, and like, you know, you've talked about the confidence of this character. And, you know, you strike me as a confident human being sitting before me. I mean, is it feel like some of that rubs off on you and that there are learnings that you've applied to your own life from inhabiting midge for a sustained period of time? Definitely. I think I'm fortunate enough to have always felt fairly confident in my own life. But when it comes to my work, I have always really struggled with it, as I think many, many actors do. Each new job, and

especially when you're taking risks and people let you take risks is horrifying, just terrifying every single second. And so to be simultaneously horrified and trying to channel this confidence to play this woman. Suppressed the confusion and fear. It was just the hardest thing I've ever done. And I think genuinely fighting that battle has hopefully rubbed off in my real life. And there are also some incredible women actresses. out there that I look up to who I feel I can embody all of the things that I would love to be.

But, you know, like the confidence that Midge has is a constant challenge. And also, the thing is, is that there aren't a lot of women like that on screen. It's not something that many of us are asked to play. And I think it's important that you see it and that you see us try. It's interesting, though, because you talk about, like, both this role, where like, you know, the stand-of-comedy was obviously something very foreign to you and still it still is. If we go back to our House of Cards conversation, that was kind of like out of your wheelhouse at the time. I mean, if you look at those, that that's got a, that should, if it's not already, it should be a confidence boost that like when I put myself out of my comfort zone, those have already believed in my greatest successes.

It's hard to see that internally, you know, when you're just so petrified. You're paralyzed. On the subway, when I'm practicing my happy second few spaces, you think about that. I mean, the thing is I think what does feel great is that as an actor, like, that is the dream. To be able to try to embody so many women that feel foreign, that's what I went to drama school for. And I feel so lucky and I'm so thrilled by the work, by the journey, and that's what it's about at the end of the day. So the goal is to keep being able to do that. And it has certainly felt fulfilling, if not all.

always confidence boosting. It's funny, like, this might sound like a silly question, but do you feel like a pressure to feel happy right now and satisfied? Because, you know what I mean? You're constantly reminded, I'm sure, by people like me or something when you're on the carpet. It's like, this is amazing. Like everything, oh, my God, what a dream come true.

And it's like, then you go back to your apartment and it's like you have their same problems or whatever that everybody has. It's like you're not suddenly, the problems don't go away. That's totally true. You know, there is some pressure, but also it's not easy to rise. I mean, it's not, sorry, it's not difficult to rise to. This feels huge, and mostly because, I think, at the end of the day, like, accolades are cool.

It's a very cool thing, but really my love is the work. And the thing about that stuff is that it allows me to keep working. It buys me some time. It buys us time on this show, and it also means that people, had the opportunity to find the project. I think one of the coolest things about the Globes was that people who hadn't heard of the show suddenly discovered it. And that was

awesome. And it hopefully means we can be around for a little bit longer. But it is, this period has felt sort of overwhelming in a really wonderful way and also a way that I'm not quite sure what to do with yet. But I'm looking forward to getting back to work.

You're a grounded New Yorker. Not like this crazy. We live in New York. It is actually nice to be here, though, by the way. Like in L.A., I was like, I've got to get out of here. Get me home to New York. Have you started to see scripts for the new season? Not yet. Okay.

No, not yet. So they showed the costumes for the scripts. Well, I haven't really seen many of the costumes, most of the inspirations for the costumes that are being built because almost all of Midge's costumes are built from scratch, which has also been a really cool process to be involved in, just to watch how that happens. But, no, I haven't seen anything.

I've been given a little bit of an overview. I sort of know what we're in for, but I look forward to starting to read scripts. Are you shooting the next two back-to-back, or is it going to be a break in between? Well, we don't know that we have a third. Oh, I thought it was renewed for a two or not. We got picked up for two right away, which was... Oh, the two right away, I apologize. Yeah, which was so the pilot came out.

It's going to get out of the door. It'll be fine. I mean, from your mouth to Amazon's ears. Okay, there you go. But we got picked up after we shot the pilot for two seasons. Got it, got it. So have you taken a job outside of Maisel since Maisel? Not yet. Maisel finished, and I needed like a three-month-long nap.

It shows like running a marathon in the most exciting way, but also really needed a nap. So I went down for a couple weeks and just sort of took some time and read some books and touched my dogs and, you know, and traveled a little bit. And then we very quickly went into press. The show aired in November. And then we kind of picked up steam from there. I executive produced a short film, which was the first time I done that. Yeah, called FEM, which will hopefully be coming out later this year. And, yeah, we're about to go back in.

But I think now that the show is out and established, I'm looking for the next right thing. Are you noticing, I mean, again, this is all pretty fresh in the last couple months, but are you all immediately noticing kind of like different kind of meetings and different kind of offers? And is that encouraging and exciting that the next break hopefully fit in some downtime, but there might be some other cool opportunities? Yeah, yes. It's been cool.

There's been like, you know, people sort of checking in that I'm very excited about, but we're largely unavailable as we're going back into production. So hopefully something can fit in. Right. But, you know, I think for the first time, this might sound silly, but for the first time, I felt comfortable saying that I needed a break, and a break where I was actively looking for new projects, but it was the first time I'd ever felt comfortable saying, you know what, I'm going to wait for the right thing and something that I'm really passionate about.

And that feels like the biggest luxury that's been afforded from this moment is to be able to have more control over the kinds of projects that I'd like to be involved in, and I'm excited about what may be next. Wait, it just hit me. Isn't Amazon doing a Word of the Rings series? This could be the perfect segue. Oh, my God. Oh, my God.

From your lips to Amazon's ears again. I want you in all the franchises. I just want to put some ears on. I just want some ears and some funky. You can really be a good elf. You have an elf-in kind of look. Wow, thank you. I mean, not in a complimentary way.

That's the highest compliment. We're going to get you in the Xenon reboot. We're going to get you in the World of Rings. Do you know what? I want to produce the Xenon reboot. Yes. that's where I'm going to take my producing career it can't be a musical though right

you discovered definitively you're not a I couldn't be in the musical very definitively no but I could maybe cast the musical I could recognize some musical talent or non-talent at least I know from your Instagram and from this conversation

the dogs come up a bit is that your second love next to acting or the dogs in your life? They might be my first love really yeah no I'm a crazy dog mom. I love my dogs more than I should probably admit on this podcast.

No, they're my children. They're amazing. Nikki and Winston, thank you for asking. No, I feel like if I ever have children one day, I'm not sure that I'll ever be as active, a real mom as I am, a dog mom. But I

show their pictures to everyone far and wide that they have such distinct personalities and they love each other so much. happy cold. That's what I'm saying. It's very warm. So I'm glad to be back. They play together all day and they really support each other. Do they come to set at all? They do. They come every day. That's a beautiful thing. I know I'm the worst. I'm every set's worst neighbor. They're really, they're really well behaved. Amazing. Amazing. Says everyone who's ever had a dog.

These are different. Yeah, yeah. My dogs are different. Stop looking at me like that way. It's been a great pleasure to get to know you a bit today. As I said, I'm a real fan of the show in your work, and I'm excited to see what comes next, both on the show and outside of the show. Thank you. And for Nikki and Winston, I feel like there's good things I had for them, too. I feel like the future is bright for Nikki and Winston. I'm going to go rent and see them on now. We'll talk later.

Yeah, please. Let me know what you think. I wonder if it holds up. Yeah, I don't think so. No, I think you're wrong. I can't watch it. I'll be too sad if it doesn't hold up. I'm sure it just gets better.

All Raven's work does. She's a raven. Thanks for coming. Thank you. This was really fun. You did it. I've never admitted a lot of those things before. And so ends another edition of happy, sad, confused.

Remember to review, rate, and subscribe to this show on iTunes or wherever you get your podcasts. I'm a big podcast person. I'm Daisy Ridley, and I definitely wasn't pressure to do this by Josh. Goodbye, summer movies, hello fall. I'm Anthony Devaney. And I'm his twin brother, James. We host Raiders of the Lost Podcast, the Ultimate Movie Podcast, and we are ecstatic to break down late summer and early fall releases.

We have Leonardo DiCaprio leading a revolution in one battle after another, Timothy Salome playing power ping pong in Marty Supreme. Let's not forget. at Emma Stone and Jorgos Lanthamos' Bugonia. Dwayne Johnson, he's coming for that Oscar in The Smashing Machine, Spike Lee and Denzel teaming up again, plus Daniel DeLewis' return from retirement. There will be plenty of blockbusters to chat about, too.

Tron Aries looks exceptional, plus Mortal Kombat 2, and Edgar Wrights, The Running Man, starring Glenn Powell. Search for Raiders of the Lost Podcast on Apple Podcasts, Spotify, and YouTube.