Happy Sad Confused - Tom Hiddleston, Vol IV

Episode Date: November 16, 2023

Tom Hiddleston is back where he belongs, as Loki, but also on Happy Sad Confused. Here he catches up with Josh about season 2 of LOKI, the potential end of his MCU run, and much much more. #happysadconfused #joshhorowitz #tomhiddleston #loki SUPPORT THE SHOW BY SUPPORTING OUR SPONSORS! HelloFresh -- Go to HelloFresh.com/HSCfree com use code hscfree for FREE breakfast for life! ZocDoc -- Go to ZocDoc.com/HAPPYSAD Check out the ⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠Happy Sad Confused patreon here⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠! We've got discount codes to live events, merch, early access, exclusive episodes of GAME NIGHT, video versions of the podcast, and more! To watch episodes of Happy Sad Confused, subscribe to ⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠Josh's youtube channel here⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠! Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

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none of you are safe. New episodes every Wednesday, wherever you get your podcasts. Okay, it's official. We are very much in the final sprint to election day. And face it, between debates, polling releases, even court appearances, it can feel exhausting, even impossible to keep up with. I'm Brad Milkey. I'm the host of Start Here, the Daily Podcast from ABC News.

And every morning, my team and I get you caught up on the day's news in a quick, straightforward way that's easy to understand, with just enough context so you can listen, Get it and go on with your day. So, kickstart your morning. Start Smart with Start Here and ABC News because staying informed shouldn't feel overwhelming. When Kenneth Branagh directed me as Hamlet, before our first performance, he assembled the company of actors together

and gave us a little talk, a few notes, about two hours before the first show. And at the end of it, he said, and this is what I would like to say about playing Loki, it's not nothing it is something prepare your ears humans happy sad confused begins now

I'm Josh Horowitz and today on happy sad confused I'm burdenedly glorious purpose reuniting with one of my favorite human beings it's Tom Hiddleston back where he belongs in person on happy sad confused thank you so much

face-to-face, in the same room. The band is back together. On the same timeline. Yes. In the same, I don't know, what would you call it? We're the same variants and the same timeline. Exactly. He's on message.

We are talking, spoiler alert. If you haven't watched Season 2 of Loki, we're going to talk about some spoiler things. Yeah, spoiler, you heard it here first. We're going to spoil it for you. Everybody dies. No, that was Avengers. That was a different thing.

It's so good to see you. No, first of all, it is. It really is. It's been too long. It has been way too long. Congratulations on everything going on in your life. But let's start with the work. Let's concentrate on the work.

This is a massive achievement, and it must feel so gratifying for a thousand reasons. With all due respect to Tony Stark and Robert Downey Jr., I think Loki has had the greatest arc of any MCU character. When we think of where he began and where he is now, perhaps at the end, it must just fill you with so much pride. You could never have imagined this journey. journey for this character could you never never never in the thousand years um and that's so

kind of you to say that um it has been the journey of a thousand miles it's it's been you know i i was cast in 2009 um by kenneth brannan to play loki and thor and i recognized then that i had been given this extraordinary gift of an opportunity to play a really interesting complex, tragic, poignant character who was going to be the antagonist in this, you know, heightened myth. And I thought, wow, this is, I've never had the chance to do this before. And I could never have imagined that that journey would continue into chapter upon chapter on chapter of a kind of epic journey.

Well, yeah, I mean, you couldn't even imagine what the MCU would become. The MCU wasn't anything, then, let alone to be selfish enough to think about, like, oh, they're gonna really satisfy like my character needs. Like, but like it wasn't about your character needs. It was about the story and about woke. I mean, I guess the first big jump was when they found out, when you found out you were gonna be the villain in Avengers. And it's these steps up like, oh, really, wow,

you see that the power of this character. Yeah, absolutely. And I think it was, I was always thought that initially, that really depending on the story that was being told, there was always so much range and so much breadth and so much depth to the character from the ancient myths. And I, you know, I've spoken about this before, but that's the whole, the joy for me is that there is in human imagination

some need to characterize chaos and playfulness inside of a character, that ancient mythologies of different kinds, not just the Norse myths, have done, that somehow it's necessary to, collective human imagination, for someone to embody the disruptor, the trickster, the boundary crosser, fluidity, somebody mercurial, somebody unexpected, somebody spontaneous, somebody dangerous, somebody occasionally necessary, and depending on the story you want to tell, you can put Loki anywhere and he'll always have a take. So I think that's what's been so

fruitful and so rewarding for me is depending on the point of view of the story loki's role has always been different right can you compare and contrast for me kind of the first moments of loki and and where we see him at the end perhaps the end of this journey and how much that was on your mind because there are many callbacks especially in this final episode yeah so yeah i was going to say and i've heard you in fact had some ideas of bringing back a line etc yeah was that important to you to if indeed this is the end, we should have some symmetry. Absolutely. We're dealing with time, the secularity of time,

the non-linear nature of memory and meaning, and there was some sort of, even in the genesis of the idea of Loki as a series, which was that you're pulling Loki out of reality, pulling him out of an arc on the timeline, completed. It starts, in the audience's mind, with that first Thor film,

as a young prince and a younger brother, he finds out he doesn't belong. It finishes with that confrontation with Thanos and a private admission in the presence of his brother that he is an Odin son, and he sacrifices himself. And that's complete. And in the DNA of Loki as a series,

we're going to refashion and reconfigure the character around his understanding, of that journey and I think in episode one of season one the confrontation with Mobius is shattering because it's like a confrontation

with self that actually there was his glorious purpose was entirely inglorious and without meaning and but it's a second chance and I think if any anyone has a second chance

in life you're always aware of that first go around and so because we were playing with time loops and timelines and then part of his ability it starts as an affliction but he can travel between temporal realities why not in some musical way

hear these refrains because the audience is familiar with the music the audience is familiar with these melodies these melodies he's been playing on for six films and 12 episodes and I knew I think I knew it would be rewarding I hoped it would be rewarding for the audience to hear those again but reinvigorated and reinterpreted and redefined and I can be specific if you'd like well yeah so what was the specific additions that you had on set that were important to you a specific line or two as I understand it yeah there

was always I was always trying to um a real headline for all of us, two things spring to mind, in the writer's room, which was a really amazing kind of series of weeks and months of conversations. Kevin Wright, our producer, Eric Martin, our head writer, Kasra Farahani, our production designer, who was also in the room and the writing team. Really, we had it on the board. I'm Loki of Asgard and I am burdened with glorious purpose and the meaningless of that the meaninglessness of that for Loki impels him into an egg-essential crisis but it also impels every other character Mobius Sylvie B 15 Casey Renslayer

Obie and the TVA as an institution the TVA had a purpose right which was to keep the sacred timeline in order and then it's like wait are we the bad guys We were kidnapped from the timeline. We had our own lives. We had our memories erased. Does the TVA have a purpose? Can it be refashioned, reconfigured, rediscovered. So there was that.

That was always like just keeping this idea of interrogating purpose alive because that felt very resonant with the show. And very resonant with the beginnings of the character. Even in that first Thor film, Loki's engaged with ideas of belonging. and identity, who am I? Right, what am I? Am I the monster that parents tell their children about at night?

What am I? Tell me, he says to Odin. He's always trying to work out who he is. Who does he think he is and who is he really? Mobius confronts him with a different point of view. Sylvie confronts him with another point of view as a mirror. So that was up there. And then more specifically in the finale,

I remember so well, Erin Moorhead and Justin Benson. It was like a Thursday morning or a Friday morning. And it was an extraordinarily elaborate set. The temporal core control room or the loom room for short. But basically they're all standing, looking out through the observation window at the loom. I mean, we were all there for weeks and weeks and weeks, playing these loops, playing these repetitions. and it felt like this extraordinary company team effort every time. But it was built on two or three stories

and below the room was a real staircase that went into an airlock and then these blast doors would open on to the gangway. And early morning and Aaron Moorhead said to me, I think in about 40 minutes we're going to be on you in the airlock. So have a think about what you feel you need to say and I was like understood sir

so I took myself easy easy task wrapping up this whole thing we had a version of it in the script but it was like they knew that it was going to be significant for me for the character it's the last thing he says

and I went I left the stage and I went out into onto the lot at Pinewood Studios in London in Buckinghamshire and I went for a little jog just around the lot you know I love to run You love to run as well.

It's where I do my best thinking. And I was listening to some film scores, one of which was actually the score from Thor by Patrick Doyle. And actually I was just thinking, I became actually overtaken by the significance of it being the last thing I was going to say and the length of the journey and how significant it's been for me in my life. And thinking of all the people. that had helped me along the way and people who'd created this character with me and stuff and I said it just this the line came to me in a it just you know as it that's how creativity works I guess you know just I was like oh yeah I know what I should say and I went in and I found Kevin right and Justin and there and I was like I've got it I think now okay and they shut their eyes and I said it goes like this

I know what I want. I know what kind of God I need to be for you, for all of us. And it's the line that Loki says to Odin at the end of Thor, and he is, it's a desperate plea for approval and validation. It's the, a cry for help from a son who feels he doesn't belong. And it doesn't work, and it's heartbreaking. And this time, it's, this Loki has lived through that moment and understands something much deeper. And it just felt like a kind of, I actually understand, now I understand what I have to do.

It's not about me, it's about you. Right. When he works out to his friends, his family, he says goodbye to his friends, yeah. I don't know how many times we've talked about saying goodbye to this character. I know. It's good. Every couple of years, we meet up and go, is it time to say goodbye? Sometimes there are fake tears on carpet. Sometimes it feels realer than other times.

It feels pretty real sitting here today. And it does feel like, look, for any drama at have stakes, you need true closure. You need an end, right? Yeah. So I guess, you know, obviously anything can still happen. It's Marvel is what it is. But if this is it, does it feel like this is the way to go out? is the way to go out? Does this feel like I left it all on the table?

I mean, I, I, of course, I don't know. And as we've discussed, like, there have been thank you notes exchanged between myself and Kevin Feigy and Louis Di Esposito and Victoria Lanzo saying, you know, me saying thank you so much. What the role of a lifetime, you know, I'll always be grateful to you and they say, Tom, you know, you'll always be part of the family. Come and see us any time. And eight years later, still playing the character. Yeah, yeah, yeah. It's like, we'll just keep saying thank you. Um, and, and, So with that in mind, but I, I do, I did, I do feel very proud and satisfied with where we, with where we landed. Because I think as a team, we brought it full circle.

And it is this ultimate journey of redemption. You know, this someone who felt that it didn't belong, someone with a shattered heart. Someone with a broken soul finds a group of people who he feels he belongs to. And rather than leaning into the grief and hardening his heart, he opens his heart and refines his soul. And it felt very meaningful. And mythic, I guess, I hope. I wanted to honor the the

kind of ancient weight of this character so in the tradition of especially the series of Loki is there a moment you would enjoy revisiting to kind of like go back relive eavesdrop on yourself I would I mean

immediately when you ask me that question I think of the the early scenes and the early period of rehearsals for the first thought with Chris Hemsworth because the atmosphere of like it was so there was such a thrilling sense of excitement and potential goodbye summer movies hello fall i'm anthony daphne and i'm his twin brother james we host raiders of the lost podcast the ultimate movie podcast and we are ecstatic to break down late summer and early fall releases.

We have Leonardo DiCaprio leading a revolution in one battle after another. Timothy Salomey playing power ping pong in Marty Supreme. Let's not forget Emma Stone and Jorgos Lanthamos' Bugonia. Dwayne Johnson's coming for that Oscar. In The Smashing Machine, Spike Lee and Denzel teaming up

again, plus Daniel DeLuis' return from retirement. There will be plenty of blockbusters to chat about two. Tron Aries looks exceptional. Plus Mortal Kombat too. And Edgar writes The Running Man starring Glenn Powell. Search for Raiders of the Lost podcast on Apple Podcasts, Spotify, and YouTube. Hey, Michael. Hey, Tom.

So big news to share it, right? Yes, huge, monumental, earth shaking. Heartbeat, sound effect, big. Mait is back. That's right. After a brief snack nap. We're coming back. We're picking snacks.

We're eating snacks. We're raiding snacks. Like the snackologist we were born to be. Mates is back. Mike and Tom, eat snacks. Wherever you get your podcast. guess unless you get them from a snack machine in which case it calls us of like both of us looking at each other and can you believe we're here playing these characters of this scope

and dimension and that felt like a yeah it's a very very um those memories are very uh precise for me still um it's amazing to go back and wonder what that was like. For a show called Wokey, you assemble a hell of an ensemble and they all have so many moments to shine in both of these seasons. I want to mention a couple of them.

Sophia, of course. Do you have a favorite moment of working with her or a scene and exchange that jumps out? Great question. Do I have a scene that jumps out? Immediately I want to sort of talk about that scene in the bar in episode five of season two. Because that felt like, we talked about, the two of us talked about their relationship through this season.

Obviously, at the end of season one, they both feel so betrayed by each other and they feel so hurt. that actually even coming back to a place of being able to talk to each other is difficult. But they're almost dramatizing an argument about destiny and free will. And Sylvie is saying, you've got to write your own story. I'm writing mine.

Like, you can't depend on it. They don't depend on the TVA or anyone else to write your story. And it's so confronting for Loki. But they help each other grow. and we wanted their disagreement in a way through the season to we wanted the audience to feel like

they're both right right I kind of think maybe Sylvie's right maybe the TVA should be burned down actually maybe Loki's right maybe maybe it's better to stay and fix something that's broken maybe the institution can be reformed And there were these, we used to refer to them as lily pads, these lily pads through the show where you'd have these really deep conversations

between the two of them. So I thought at the bar immediately because she says to him, what do you want? And I don't think he's ever been asked that question in quite such direct terms. And that's when you hear him say, I want my friends back, I don't want to be alone. Which is true of the guy we met in Thor.

He doesn't want to be alone. He wants to belong. And so that's a really big memory. And then I think also what came to mind is that scene at the end of the end of season one in the Cedadell when we were rehearsing the fight. And we shot that scene right at the end of the schedule. And there was obviously that huge fight

where they both feel with such intensity that words will no longer do it, they kind of have to fight. And eventually he stops her and what that scene should convey and together working out exactly what the words were. And it just was such a great, it was such an amazing day or two on set with her. It was just so free and so collaborative and really playing the music together,

finding those right words and locking. them in making sure that every word was so carefully chosen um yeah just great and and before you ended your time working with the great owen wilson did you ever summon the courage to do your impression never no he did he was going so well he knows he knows he knows about it i mean he was like yeah it's fun and he knows right he is a sense of humor about yeah yeah but but um god it's been it's been so enjoyable working with him right it's just he's his capacity for invention he's such a brilliant writer and that's how he came into this you know that's how he came into to doing what he does as a writer bottle rocket bottle rocket yeah and he is he's

you know there are some things that he comes out with it's just like I could never have been written down right could only have come from the mind of Owen Wilson right right now and but what we love about it is and what we've got we always talked to to Eric Martin and Kevin write about, which sometimes, you know, they would be thinking, it's just so fun when Loki and Moby's are together, which is so nice to hear, obviously,

but we would both remind them. Remember that it's fun, not because they're having fun, they're often in passionate disagreement. Not actually fun for the audience to witness, but they're basically disagreeing all the time. No, no, no, no, Loki, you're doing it wrong. Of course I'm doing it right.

This is the way you do it. like why you have to take it to you know and it's something about the fed aren't there's an underlying level of respect right um in that I think they've taught each other something profound right about the experience of being alive um Loki got a second chance he found that out from he got given that by Mobius Mobius was taught by Loki that actually free will does exist and he has a life on the timeline and you can be whoever he want to be but in real time it's it's still bickering about cracker jacks and yeah who's wearing the who's wearing the suit in the you know who's going out on the gangway it's the classic midnight run dynamic they hate each other

but in the end they need each other yeah and they teach each other absolutely they're friends I don't think Loki's ever had a friend and Mobius is his friend um as you potentially exit your partner Zawai has entered the MCU has yeah you must have had a number of laughs exchanges about this like back when I did it it was different just so you know we didn't know it was going to be you know yeah yeah well I'm so proud of her yeah and um she's terrific in the marvels I'm just only saw it recently and um yeah it has been it has been bizarre to to share those stories I mean I wish I kind of want her to talk about her own work in her own work in her own But yeah, I'm so proud of her and we've had some definitely had some laughs along the way about zippers and bathroom brays.

Which costume is more, as if it decided who had the more uncomfortable costume? Have you? I was, you know, I've now like, where I'm wearing regular TVA clothes, so I'm okay. Like a human clothing, yeah, yeah. Yeah, back in the day on the first store, it was like, you know. Yeah, they didn't care about you guys back then. your life has changed a lot and congratulations like the family there you have a family now thank you very much and it's a beautiful to see thank you has you know the cliche question is a true

question has it changed your perspective i mean you're an ambitious guy you love the work you love the arts of course it has to um it uh i think i probably knew it would but i could never have imagined how deeply it would until it happened Yeah. And, yeah, it's before and after. Let's talk about some other random things. We always talk heat. Have you read Heat 2 yet?

I have a copy of Heat 2 given to me by Justin Benson and Aaron Moorhead. I haven't read it yet. This is a glaring omission in my... I confess, I haven't gotten through it yet. But it's on the bookshelf. Yeah, we have to get through it. And you know he intends to make a movie. Yeah.

I'm going to fancast right now. now, you know the Chris Sherlock's role, the Valcoma role, is key, right? What do you think, Tom? I mean, I look far be it from me to like fan cast myself. I did it. I just did it now. Would you be interested as a diehard? I could read it. I could read the material of, of course. The idea of it is thrilling sitting here with you. It's still like a seminal text. Yeah. It's still absolutely like extraordinary film. In fact, I think Justin and Aaron, Justin Benson, Aaron Morhead,

are directors for episodes 1, 4, 5, and 6 had not seen it, I think. And I was talking about it. And they were like, okay, Tom, and as he's talking about this film, we better go and watch it. But it didn't disappoint. They came in the next day.

They were like, okay, yep, 100% get it. Wow. Well, you would have lost tremendous respect in the middle of production. If they'd been like, I don't get it. Yeah. maybe they were faking it more of a bad boys guy I think it was real they were like wow

because also here's the thing about Justin and Aaron is they are so forensic about detail and that's why I love them as filmmakers that's actually true of the entire team on this and it's like God is in the detail no pun intended but but it truly is if you if you look after the detail

you kind of you find yourself looking after the big picture and and they were like in awe of the detail and heat they were like okay yeah we get it Michael man forever forever and ever Ferrar's pretty good you should check it out you'll like it I think I can't wait um he is so great honestly and then I read something maybe it was an interview you did with him or somebody did with him and we actually it was earlier this year and we actually sent it to each other the three of us we were like read this like oh he's sharpest yeah yeah I always say he's the only person I ever did a podcast with when I was doing it in my office, he sits down and he brought out a binder of notes from his films, like schematics, just like, yeah, yeah. But you want

that, right? Of course. You just want that from a filmmaker. I think it's that thing of like, I think, I obviously, I feel like an audience member first and a performer second. And the reason I'm a performer is because I was in the audience. And I think sometimes we're in the audience, you don't necessarily know why you feel you're being looked after. You just know that the filmmaker has done all the work for you. I always say that. It's like you can feel the certitude, whether it's like the precision of the shot, the attention to details you were just talking about. You want to feel like you are in safe hands. You're being immersed into the world. It's okay. We've got your back. Just just feel how you feel. Yeah. And come on the journey and connect to

the story in whatever way you want to connect to it. And I think I've learned as a performer that the more, and it's from watching people like him and others, the more precise one can be in one's imagination. Even if those details aren't completely legible to every audience member, they'll still feel a kind of confident hand on the Tiller. I know you've wrapped with Mike Flanagan. I feelmaker I truly admire, a wife of Chuck, Stephen King.

Adaptation, very cool. there's talk of a bunch of other projects but nothing official are you so night manager has been mentioned that like maybe one or two more seasons have in fact been green lit what can you know there's a this is kind of in the lap of of simon and stephen cornwell um at ink factory who um happened to be john le carrie's sons um and i think there are yeah there's definitely some some some ingredients have been bought and uh they're in the kitchen on the table and, you know, there's, the stoves are being turned on. So, really just latching onto this metaphor.

There are cooks in the kitchen. We'll see what can be cooked up in that kitchen. Yeah. There's definitely kind of, I think, we'll see, but there's, uh, plans. Do you know the next gig or are you kind of looking right now to figure out what the next move is? Apart from life of Chuck, I don't exactly know. I mean, I, I, I've, as I speak to you now, I think, to be completely honest, I have,

have wrapped my days on the life of Chuck and I had the most wonderful time with Mike Flanagan and his team and his company there's a real company of actors that he works with all the time but also some new performers and on this Stephen King he is a kind of primary interpreter of Stephen King I think yeah and what I loved about this material and the short stories out there but I don't want to get into spoilers was it seemed to me to be resonant of the Stephen King who wrote the Shawshank Redemption and that there's a there's a warmth and a kind of spirit that's really on the side of life in the story that I really connected to when I read it it was just the most extraordinary script

I connected to it immediately and then was and it's Mike Flanagan who's written the screenplay and so when we met I just sort of said look I just this is amazing can I come and do it please can I come and do it and and yeah and we had a great time we were talking when you came in about you know your old friend our mutual acquaintance Mr. Eddie Redmayne who yeah was amazing as the emcee and cabaret coming to Broadway a seminal text for him right yeah what's the seminal text for you what's the one that you keep will keep returning to if that is I don't if I've ever returned to anything Is there an early role, something you did on stage as a student or anything, that you're like,

oh, now with all the wisdom of my years, I can reinterpret? And the answer can be no. I don't know. I think for me, it's probably, and this will feel like a predictable answer. It's going back to Shakespeare, which feels like you're kind of going back to the same. It's not like going back to one role. It's just going back to a kind of a breadth of mind. a breadth of vision, a kind of poetical breadth that I find,

I find so rewarding to inhabit it. Well, it does feel like so many actors of your stripe do that and they kind of come back at different stages of their life. So it's like, you know, in 25 years you'll do Lear, etc. Like it's... Touch word, you said, I've got any wood in here. Wait, that wood and it doesn't look real. Someone please do it.

But yeah, because there's something at every stage of your life. Yeah, that's the joy of those plays. The only of those plays is that you, I think, if you are lucky enough, if performers are lucky enough, I mean, there are some people obviously who we all dearly love Kenneth Branagh and Judy Dench and Ian McKellen and Patrick Stewart and these great actors who've been able to go through their lives and almost there are certain moments that are defined by a period. So you can, you start out as, you know, you're the young lovers. You're Demetrius or Lysander in a Midsummer Night's Dream or you're Romeo or.

or Prince Howe or something and then you become you know more of a kind of Henry V than you start playing the soldiers Cori Linus and maybe the Roman plays and then you get into this sort of

these incredible like Hamlet and Leontes in the Winter's Tale and possibly Iago or the Scottish gentleman I'm so superstitious I can't say the name and you're in that sort of incredibly rich potent sort of period and then if you're lucky enough you get to play the father and the grandfathers and the wizards you know prospero and lear and we're going to be talking I don't know if the podcasts are going to exist in 30 years but whatever form it is I really hope so I really hope people still value like in person no it's

being straight into there yeah In the post-apocalyptic clanscape, you're going to be performing Lear on a rubble somewhere. God, yeah, maybe. I hope there's an audience. Although, I would say, did you watch, there's a clip recently? Dame Judy Dent was on the Graham Norton show, and she's written a book about her experience with Shakespeare. Yeah. And Graham Norton says, you know, are you kind of like a Shakespeare jukebox?

We can just kind of like. Yeah. Turns out she is. It turns out she is. Yeah, she does the sonnet. But what was also really interesting was like, like a, like a great musician or a great artist with a kind of, um, repertoire.

Yeah. It's, it, her whole life has been dedicated. You know, she calls the book, I think the man who pays the rent. Hey,

Judy, I'm giving me a big plug here. Um, the man who pays the rent by Judy Dench. Um, but, but she's done so much of it that, and so much of it is in her mind.

Um, but what I thought was really interesting was that the audience were completely instantaneously, spellbound by it in this digital age that there's this ancient wisdom and she spoke these true lines. I think it was the sonnet went in disgrace with fortune in men's eyes. So hopefully that will last, right? I think it's lasted this much time. It's going to last another thousand years. So that, I guess, is my returning, my returning role. If I'm lucky, if I'm lucky, if I'm lucky. What would scare you more at this point? Broadway musical or getting the call to be James Bond?

terrifying it's like number one that's terrible number two terrifying yeah yeah only thing more terrifying is the James Bond musical I suppose absolutely like white knuckle um have you seen you haven't had time to see he or read heat two rather last film that really rocked your world have you been able to see much even in production so I don't expect you to see let me think let me think I barbenheimer At once Did you do the double feature?

We did it on Monday night Oppenheimer Tuesday matinee Barbie Both Wonderful It was great It was great I mean I feel like

I don't want to do a disservice To Christopher Nolan and Greta Goig By making them a hybrid That was not the intention No no But it did become an extraordinary cultural moment It was such a win-win for everybody Because they were both great movies

They both succeeded. They both proved that, well, Barbie is IP, it is very audacious. Yeah. Yeah. And I loved it. I was, I found it really touching, actually. Do you think you're Knuff? No, no way.

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I'm trying to get you a job. I'm going to do a sequel. I see. I see. Yes, you're working up. I didn't, well, okay. But I wanted to, I wanted to just, you know, be respectful of all the cans. You're self-doubting.

Great work. Yeah, yeah, yeah. I don't deserve to be, don't deserve to be in that beautiful pink world. Okay, it's official. We are very much in the final sprint to election day. And face it, between debates, polling releases, even court appearances. It can feel exhausting, even impossible to keep up with. I'm Brad Milkey.

I'm the host of Start Here, the Daily Podcast from ABC. News. And every morning, my team and I get you caught up on the day's news in a quick, straightforward way that's easy to understand with just enough context so you can listen, get it, and go on with your day. So, kickstart your morning. Start Smart with Start Here and ABC News, because staying informed shouldn't feel overwhelming. All right, some profoundly random questionnaires from the Happy Second Fused. family random questionnaire. Okay. What do you collect? I don't know this. Do you collect anything? Do I collect anything? Not off the top of my head. I don't think I act. I don't think I

consciously collect anything. I randomly do collect things. I've like got more old dog-eared tennis balls. Like I put a new coat on and be like, why are there three tennis balls in here? That can be painful if you sit down in the wrong way. Be careful. Often, I'm like, what is that? I think I've got, I do, I don't consciously collect anything, but I do have lots of old call sheets, which I sometimes, I put them in a little file and I keep them, I think, and it always takes me back to that moment. Yeah. Those actors, that time, yeah, it's fun to do that.

It's fun when you find like the call sheet that sums up the whole experience. Right. it becomes like a time capsule 100% have you ever asked for an autograph or photo with a co-star I don't think so I have professional I asked I the most the one I can think of the photo I did ask for a photograph four years ago when I was at the US Open and we ran into Roger Federer and I was completely overwhelmed because I love Roger Federer and I went

He was so gracious and so sweet and I felt so so silly for asking but I was just like I was encouraged to buy my present company and then by his team they were like no no no go and ask him he loves it yeah and he like me and then actually he then became we became friends

not friends but like sort of pen pals and so I've been to see him play tennis and stuff and yeah play with him would you ever play I've never I've never hit with it I mean the hubris in hey anytime you're interested fancy playing you know it's like okay Tom you know you'd have to treat me with cake gloves what's the last time you danced I don't know if I'm allowed to say I didn't realize I was hitting a yeah yeah I actually I mean I dance all the time truthfully I don't I dance anywhere anytime everywhere. I have a vivid memory. And I think it was at the Toronto Film Festival and I was talking to you at a party. I want to say it was where I saw the light. And I might have created

this in my mind. I was talking to you and the music started to crank up. I think Idris was like DJing the party or something. And you, I think you said the words to me, oh, I think it's time to boogie. And I think you walked away and you danced. A party if I saw the light? I think so. Have I conjured this up? Was this like an acid trip that I was? There was a party. Yeah. I might have conflated parties. No, no, no. That's right.

That's right. I do remember that party. I just remember you kind of like drifting away. I'm so sorry. No, no, no, no. Because it was. When, when, when, when, when, when, when, when, you know that feeling. When, you don't get, you don't get, you don't get the, you don't get the, I didn't

not dance at my wedding. I danced one dance. Josh. Did we dance more? Will you give me dance lessons? No. I'm not formally trained. Yeah, I get great.

I get great. I always got great pleasure from dancing. which possibly people know but yeah dance anywhere all the time listen we're all in the same boat headed for the lighthouse the trick is to enjoy the trip while you can dance other ways besides dance

dance for me it's for me it's the music you know and also like this when a jam comes on and you know it's time you've got to go yeah it's time buggy as you told me yeah what would your partner your friend say is the most annoying thing about you if I got them to like to say like you know what this Tom's great this is one

little that's a good question um I'm sort of like I don't know there's some sometimes I'm like I'd be playing tennis with a friend and he were like he would I would play for I don't know an hour and a half or two hours and he'd be like should we start and I'm like let's keep going he's like oh god so he's committed because I just love it yeah And, but also, I'm always like, I don't know, maybe that, I think my friends would say, here he goes, you know, why do we have to do an extra kilometer? Why can't we just do the 5K? It's just ridiculous. I mean, it's absurd. It's all the 5K for a reason, not the 6K, Tom. It's not 6K,000. Just stick the 5. Yeah. What's the worst note a director has ever given you? The worst note a director has ever given me. I've been lucky. I've had some good notes, you know.

I actually can't think. Sometimes, I can't even remember an instance. I know it's happened, but I can't remember when or who it was. But you get a note, it feels like inside a performance, the goal is to be completely instinctive and unselfconscious. And you're working actually from a place of interiority. You're inside something, inside the character and their motivation. And sometimes, I don't know, direct it can say, you know when you do this thing with your eyebrows.

You're like, I didn't know I was doing that with my eyebrows. Right. No one's actually said that. I've actually heard that from other actors have said literally that. Exactly. When you do this thing with your left hand, you're like, did I do that with my left hand? Now you're self-conscious. Now I'm thinking about my left hand is just going to hang there.

Right. Like some sort of dead weight. Yeah. Yeah. So the Talladegh-Nights thing. Yeah, yeah, yeah. But most hasten to eye, this is like, I can't remember this happening. Right.

Yeah, yeah. Okay. So last thing in the tradition of exit interview. If indeed this is the end of your tenure as loki, I'm going to ask you a series of questions as if this is your exit interview. Okay. You ready? Tom, why did you decide to leave the company? I feel content that I fulfilled my purpose here.

Did you get along with your peers? If I were being honest with you, Josh, I would say initially, it was bumpy. Not going to name names. Hamsworth. But over time, I grew to understand my misguided point of view and made appropriate changes. Were you recognized enough for your accomplishments? If I were, I don't know that it matters. That's not the point.

That's not it. That's what it's about. Yeah. Did the role meet your expectations? More than 10,000, 5,000 million times over. That's a billion. How much, 5,000 million? I'm an English major.

What advice would you like to give to your team going forward that you leave behind? Sometimes purpose is more burden than glory. Very appropriate. And would you ever consider working here again? For all time, always. Well, whether this is the end of the journey or not, I know enough from our past conversations not to be definitive about it. I know you hear this from the fans, but thank you for elevating,

you know, I mean this was a character that was so rich on the page, but I can't think of someone that could have made more of it, it that has delivered more of a passionate performance and has just been so invested from the start. Thank you. Thank you. Thank you. Josh, honestly, thank you. I've said this before, but we first met at Comic Con in 2010 and even like it was we had made the first Thor movie. we were presenting it to the audience at San Diego Comic Con for the first time. I could feel the excitement in Hall H and people had told me about the passion of this audience and I genuinely would not be here without that passion.

Like it's I feel it really is like and that's why I think I was trying to describe when I was thinking about shooting that finale is when I was walking out onto the gangway and climbing up those stairs I was I felt like I was carrying everybody with me who's been on the journey with me who's my you know the directors the actors the writers and you know you're a huge part of that no no you but but you are and and people who I know who listen to the podcast and you're such a champion of film and and storytelling and it's been it has been like you know we've made a series about time and I've given this character so much of my time

and so it's not it's not insignificant it's not when Kenneth Branagh directed me as hamlet he before our first performance he assembled the company of actors together and gave us a little a little talk, a few notes, about two hours before the first show. And at the end of it, he said, and this is what I would like to say about playing Loki, it's not nothing. It is something. It is always a privilege, my friend. It sounds like we're never speaking again.

We will speak again. But truly, congratulations on this. And I can't wait to see where the journey takes you next. Thank you, sir. Always a pleasure and an honor. Thank you. And so ends another edition of happy, sad, confused. Remember to review, rate, and subscribe to this show on iTunes or wherever you get your podcasts.

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