Happy Sad Confused - Toni Collette

Episode Date: June 5, 2018

Sometimes it takes a twisted little psychological horror movie to remind you that Toni Collette is one of our finest actors working today. Make no mistake, after you've seen "Hereditary" (and you really should!), you'll remember once again that she's one of our most versatile actors.  In this first visit to "Happy Sad Confused," Josh takes Toni down memory lane, from her humble beginnings in Australia, the shocking successes of "Muriel's Wedding" and "The Sixth Sense" to mixing it up with Vin Diesel for "XXX: The Return of Xander Cage".  Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

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Eligibility restrictions apply. See Golden Nuggett Casino.com for details. Please play responsibly. Today on Happy Second Fused, Tony Collette, on perhaps the performance of her career in Hereditary. Hey, guys, I'm Josh Harrowitz. Welcome to another edition of Happy Second Fused, my little old podcast where I talk to big old movie stars and filmmakers about their projects and lives.

And I'm very pleased to say that today's episode, is a first timer to happy second views. First time I think I've ever chatted with her. Tony Colette, one of our greatest actors on the planet. I feel very comfortable in saying that, especially when you take a look at the filmography for a second. You take a look back at all the varied work that Tony Colette has done over the years.

And Oscar nominated for the Sixth Sense, but that's really just the tip of the iceberg from Muriel's wedding, the little Miss Sunshine, in her shoes. A lot of underrated smaller films in there, too. And now starring in the new film from A24, our favorite little studio that could, the crazy, oh my God, drama, horror, thriller, suspense, it's hard to pin down. It's a lot of things. Hereditary is the movie. You've probably, if you listen to this podcast, you're a movie fan, and if you're a movie fan, you're kind of in the know on what people are talking about. And people are very much talking about hereditary.

I'd heard the buzz building on this since it premiered at Sundance. I didn't catch it there, sadly. But I finally did a few weeks ago. And it is, it's maybe my favorite movie of the year. It's definitely up there. It's definitely top 10 material, probably for me by the end of the year, safe to say. I want to see it again. It's, you know, it's one of those movies that I don't want to to reveal too much about it, but suffice it to say it is a, it's a kind of a family drama in some ways. Tony Colette as the matriarch of this family, though her mom at the outset of this film has just passed away and she is a mother and she is a wife and she is plagued by a fractured relationship with her now deceased mother and struggling with major issues that come up with

her own children. And it starts out kind of as a relatable, really sad portrait of a family dealing with grief and loss. And it kind of goes off the rails in many different interesting ways as it progresses. And by the end, man, it's an intense couple hours at the movies, but it's a very, very impressive piece of work from the first-time filmmaker. That's amazing. and from Tony Colette and this great ensemble of actors, including Gabriel Byrne and Alex Wolfe. It's a movie that I think we're going to be talking about throughout the year. So check out Hereditary and check out this conversation with Tony Collette. A couple of disclaimers.

You might hear even now I'm taping this introduction from the confines of my lovely apartment, which is lovely except that there's constant construction going on around me. You might hear drilling. It's a lot of fun. And I actually taped this conversation with Tony just a couple blocks from my apartment. So you're going to hear the same drilling because there is construction everywhere in my neighborhood. So apologies, a little drilling in the background occasionally, but you're going to hear the delicious, wonderful Australian voice of Tony Colette to soothe you. So it's going to be okay, guys.

Beyond that, beyond this conversation in the movie, just to mention a couple other things. If you are an arrested development fan, if you've not cut up on the new season, it's quite good. But also, I want to mention it because I did a really fun trivia contest with none other than Will Arnett and Jason Bateman. That was a blast to shoot, and it is currently up on all of MTV's social platforms on MTV News's Facebook page, on MTV News's YouTube page, Twitter, all that jazz. So look it up. I'm very proud of it. It was a lot of fun to shoot with those two guys. So smart, self-deprecating.

And, yeah, just if you're a rested fan, I think you'll dig it. Other than that, not much else to say, except that things are going to get a little crazy around my parts the next couple weeks. I'm headed off to Los Angeles soon for my annual trip to the MTV, formerly known as the MTV Movie Awards, now the MTV Movie and TV Awards. I'll be there in a big way. Tiffany Haddish is hosting. It should be a lot of fun. A lot of our favorite people are going to be there. Chris Pratt is getting the Generation Award. And I'm also going to be seeing Chris at the Jurassic World premiere, which MTV and I get to host, actually. I'm hosting the red carpet for that next week in Los Angeles. So I'll spread the good word on social media. But it's going to be a live stream, I believe. So you'll be able to watch me talk to everybody from Jeff Goldblum, Bryce Dell. Howard and of course Chris Pratt about Jurassic World Fallen Kingdom. I'm seeing it tonight actually

and I'm legitimately really excited. I touted on this podcast in other places how big a fan I am of the director Jay A. Bayona who did The Impossible and a monster calls. And I'm hearing good buzz. So, fingers

crossed, this one's going to be a big I think it's going to be both a big fun summer movie, but Bayona's got some style, and he can really deal with, like, heavy emotion, too. So I'm hoping for something a little even more special than you might expect from a summer blockbuster. So fingers crossed on that one.

As always, please spread the good word of happy, say, confused. Rate, review, and subscribe on iTunes. Tell your friends, tell your family. That's the way this show gets bigger and better. And we can bring you guests like the great Tony Colette. So without any further ado, let's go to that. conversation. Enjoy this chat with Tony and go see Hereditary. Out in theaters now in your neighborhood or if not now quite soon. Check it out. It's great to meet you. I'm such a fan of

yours. Oh, nice to meet you. Thank you so much. Yeah, you were just saying, you know, we were comparing notes on the jukeet experience. And you're right because I think, I would think you know, having done this once or twice, you can decipher the person that walks in the room that's just sort of like BSing you and the one that is actually kind of moved. Genuinely, excited about things. It's crazy. So congratulations.

I hope you're enjoying this crazy ride. It's interesting. You know, I don't know. I think I've made almost 70 movies. I've been doing this since I was a teenager and now I'm, you know, this year I turn 46 and I have to say I think this is the first film in my entire career where there's been such a palpable

excited feeling for a film that hasn't even come out yet. Yeah. There was that, I mean, it premiered right at Sundance, right? It did. I wasn't there. I didn't go to, there were a couple of screenings at Sundance in January, and then it screened at South by Southwest. There was also, I mean, there have been several screenings since then.

But, yeah, I watched it for the first time a couple weeks ago at a screening in L.A. And then I watched it at the London premiere. I was just saying to my manager, oh, I don't know. I don't think I can watch it tonight. We've got the premiere here in New York. And I love this film, but it's so heavy. and I can't help, but when I watch something that I'm in to kind of feel what I was feeling on the day,

so it's too exhausting. Yeah. It's funny because, like, yeah, even the experience of, like, jaded film critics going into a screening for this one, like I saw this a couple weeks back, and I've been hearing the buzz building for months of these festivals, as you mentioned.

And, like, I walked into the screening, and I think it's going to be the same for general audiences, too, because they're going to have heard a little bit about it, hopefully not too much. And I feel like we all walked into the screening room and we were all like bracing ourselves together. No, I mean, truly, we were all like, are you going to, are we going to get through this?

Are we okay? It was like actually a really kind of a moment of solidarity among jaded, horrible New York film critics. I think that's happening for people who are seeing it in general. There's kind of a sense of safety in numbers, right? And also, I don't know, certain films kind of lend themselves to a communal experience, and this is one of them. This is certainly something to try and see in the theater,

in the cinema, because, I mean it's not your average film and it's funny watching it with an audience because the moments of nervous energy that erupt just because they need a break from this kind of relentless suspense building tension is amazing to behold it's totally fascinating and kind of makes it fun

definitely so okay so we're going to come back around if it's okay to hereditary I do want to talk at length about that But, like, you know, I've surprisingly never, I think, chat with you over the years. I've covered movies for years at MTV. Yeah, I don't think you have. Maybe you haven't done enough, like, tween comedies for us or something. What's wrong with me? No, it's not you.

Don't worry. But I have to say, in addition to being a fan of yours, I got a chance to kind of like watch and listen to some interviews with you. Oh, wow. Okay. And I feel like, this is on you now. Like, I feel like I already am in love with you as a human being now, beyond as an actor.

Oh, my God. Well, you just seem like a very cool person. Like, you feel like someone that I, it's basically on you the next 40 minutes, It's not to disappoint me, is what I'm saying. I don't want to, yeah, I don't want to put pressure. But I kind of do want to put pressure on me. Because, like, one thing that that kind of translates in watching you speak and listening to you speak is, you know, you're not too precious about the craft. Or you are, but you, but in terms of talking about it, you're, you know, and I feel like, you know, I don't know if there's a differentiation, but like when an actor kind of takes it all, they can take it seriously.

You should take your work seriously. I agree, yep. But in, I don't know, the mysticism around it and kind of like making it a little bit more than it, it's a job, like any other job in a way. Yeah, it's a job. And it's just a movie. But I think the difference is when, with most jobs, you do something outside of yourself and any artist uses themselves. So it somehow does become a little personal. But yeah, I'm not a fan of really talking about acting simply because I don't quite understand.

understand what I'm doing and I and I like it that way I used to try to articulate what what it was for people and felt like I needed to give answers about how I worked and how the you know the process and I just you know you know there is certainly things I'm aware of and that I um that I attempt to do but I also like to get out of my own way because I think that's when the best like most alive moments can happen it allows for spontaneity and that's the most exciting part when a scene kind of takes on an energy of its own when you work with someone who's just as present and open and willing to just let go, that to me is an exciting day of the office. And that was probably the experience on Triple X return of

Zander Cage, I'm assuming. Do you know what that was for me? Doing that film, and in fact, I wasn't looking to do anything heavy. I had said to my age, I had, you know, the films that I love have a certain emotional depth to them. I just love, I love, you know, I love funny films. I really appreciate comedy, but it needs to be balanced with point you see. And so I'd done a couple of films, and I just felt like, oh my God, what am I? I'm thinking about it a year and a half later, what is going on here? And I thought, the answer is to not be emotional at work. So Triple X was an exercise in not being emotional at work for me.

And what I realized is that's not very satisfying because I thrive. You felt detached from it a little bit, or was it? Yeah, that's just like what I thrive on creating emotional honesty. That's what it is for me. So, yeah, when this came along, I was shooting a kind of light comedy in Paris and having the time of my life and my agent said, I don't know, you weren't looking to do anything like this, but, and I mean, I couldn't deny it. It was brilliant and I knew in my heart that I had to do it and it was just a matter of

how to get through it. And this is the film, I think, where I learned how to take care of myself as an actor. I mean, I've been doing it since I was a teenager, I'm about to turn 46, it's almost 30 years. And it was this film because just knowing how intense it was and what it would require of me, I didn't, I didn't just do what I did in the past, which was like throw myself in and see what happens. I really was, you know, I did things like I went to the gym and just energy, it was very basic, just very literally shifted my energy at the end of the day so things couldn't remain stagnant inside me. And part of that is based on.

this specific project, I'm sure. Well, you read the script of this one. Again, we're not going to get into spoiler stuff, but if you see the trailers, you'd get a sense of, like, the intensity of the entire material, let alone you're the arc of this character, which, yeah, if, like, this is not the role if you're Daniel Day Lewis, method actor,

you would kill yourself on the project like this. There needs to be some degree of letting go. I think there's some confusion about what method acting is. I've been, I literally looked it up the other day because I was like, what is this anyway? Yeah, well, I think that it came about, at a time,

Staniske came about with this method acting after a period of, you know, filmmaking was new, and the acting was really presentational. Yes. So the basic idea behind it is to align yourself so closely with the character that it feels completely honest. And, I mean, I think that's what I try to do, but I think method acting, what people feel method acting might be,

is that one, you know, one tortures oneself, you know, and you, you know, there is no way in the world someone can completely immerse themselves in a character and in that character's world. It is impossible to let, you know, just psychologically impossible. There are cameras, right there are. Yes, and I mean, you know, you're going to text your friend and you're going to, you know, have to stand in the shower by yourself

and you know you are, you know, like it's just... Yeah, Abraham Lincoln wasn't standing in the shower, ordering breakfast, room service. The idea of method acting, it just feels indulgent because, I mean, any actor worth their soul is going to try and make their performance as honest as possible. That's at the end of the day. That's the goal for any actor, how you get there is how you get there. But yes, it seems, but it does seem, I don't know, I've talked to enough actors, and I think it seems like a trait sometimes of young actors who don't know any better, and it feels like

I feel into that as well. I'm doing work. Yeah, when you feel, really feel the grit, then it feels somehow like it's more important. or more profound or like you're really doing a job. But I don't think that's necessary. And I certainly didn't do that on this movie. I felt it between action and cut and then I really pushed it away. Yeah.

Well, yeah, and I think of, you know, and I love all stripes of actors. And I think in the one hand, certain kinds of actors make, I think the best ones often make it look effortless, right? And I think of someone like Anthony Hopkins or Gene Hackman. It just feels very just organic and full-bodied. and there's not a moment of thinking, even though I know they're a huge celebrity, there's not a moment of me seeing the wheels turn. Great.

Because once you see somebody's technique, you're drawn out of it, and that really is a disservice to the piece on the whole. Yeah. You know, if you're taken out of the story, it ain't working. So the breakthrough on this one is more about self-preservation, though. I think so. Not the actual, what's happening between action and cut.

I mean, that you know how to do, and you've known how to do, but this is about taking care of Tony a little bit. Yeah, that happens. on this movie. I'm a grown-up now. Was your family with you for this, or did it feel like the kind of thing? Do you try to keep your family around when? Yeah, for most of my jobs, yes.

But with this one, my kids were in school, so I was going back to LA on the weekends until the last week or two, then they came to Utah. So I had the luxury of solitude during the week and then a completely different world on the weekends, yeah. So are you good at saying no? Or are you like, is your default when you're reading a script, I'm going to love this or I'm going to look for a reason not to love it. If I am thinking about it in any way, if I'm on the fence and trying to break it down

intellectually, then I know I'm in trouble. It's usually, it bypasses my brain and there's just this knowledge that, oh, my God, I have to do this. If I don't do this, something's going to die. You know, it's that strong. Yeah. And it's so, so how, like, generally speaking, how quickly into a script do you get that, that, that pretty quickly.

But I'll always read it to the end. because people put so much effort into it and, you know, it's anything could happen, anything, but, you know, more often than not, it doesn't. So, there's something like this read is scary? Like, does it, like, on the page?

Initially, I mean, I was told I was being sent a genre film and I started reading it and I was like, there's been some mistake here. This is just, it was kind of beautiful. This frank kind of look at some real emotional pain. it's about this family grief. I think ultimately the film is about grief. But it was just so raw and natural.

And then, obviously, you know, that goes somewhere else. And it just totally still fascinates me that Ari was able to make what is very much a horror film, but to base it in something so real. It's really, it's all of us. It is the human condition. It is bizarrely, I mean, again, after people see this film,

they'll know what I'm talking about. It's like, it is bizarrely relatable, even considering the horrific things that happen. And I think that he's really clever in that respect because he makes you feel for them. You empathize so greatly and you invest in them. And then you are taken somewhere completely unexpected. And I think that makes the film even scarier. In some ways, it's about, you know, what we pass on, what we inherit from our parents. And I think, you know, most of us fall into this trap.

It's not a trap, but it's just the reality. of, like, when you're a kid, you view your parents as parents. They are what they are to you and not independent. Humans existing in the world, yeah. Right, exactly. I mean, did you... I'm curious, just, like, relating it to your own life. Like, was there a shift when you kind of started to think of your parents as not just

your parents, but as adults that had a life before you were around? Oh, yes, of course. Yeah, I mean, don't you think that happens for everyone? Yeah. It has to happen in order for a child to become a child to become a child. independent autonomous person but yeah I I love my parents so much and there was a point in my life where actually thought how will I ever love anyone else this much I'm just was so um you know they're very different to each other and they're they're both so loving and supportive in different

ways and they make a great couple as well there's so much to admire about them and they've had they've had some really, really difficult things happen in their lives. And I think for anyone to overcome their own personal crap, in order to, you know, there's always going to be a certain amount of emotional baggage that you somehow inherit from your parents. I mean, it's just a matter of, to what extent, really. I mean, it's part of the course, it's just part of what it is. But they really, you know, had a lot to overcome.

And I think we gather ancestral, you know, it's in the blood. Someone told me this morning they went to this healer and they looked at her blood and could see like a specific viral thing from like generations before. It was just a strain of it. But it was like, yep, got to get that out. Amazing. Nothing to do with her immediate experience with her own family.

And that just fascinates me. Did, and then, you know, you go to the next generation. You have two kids, I believe, is that right? You must, and they're at an age where, I mean, you know, from the start, I don't have kids myself, but, you know, I'm sure as they grow up, you're seeing more and more of yourself and also independence. And, like, are there traits of yours that you're surprised to see as your kids grow up into their own individuals? It's really weird for me. I can see my husband in my kids, but I find it really hard to see myself in them, but other people say that they see me in them.

and I've had moments where I remember in my 20s I was walking down an aisle in a grocery store in London and I felt like my mother from the inside. It was the strangest thing and it's happened. It wasn't like seeing it in a mirror. No, it was internalized it. Internal feeling. And that's happened maybe half a dozen times

in my entire life. And the other day I kind of walked up to a table where a bunch of my friends was sitting and I was just kind of stood at the end and they were like, oh my God, you are so your daughter right now. So it kind of works both ways. Have either of your kids a fake appendicitis yet.

I really hope they never hear that story, but... I mean, I hesitate to regurgitate a story that I read on Wikipedia or IMDB and I hear on a talk show, but it's just so telling and remarkable this story that it should be repeated in every interview, frankly, you ever do. What does it tell you? I mean, it's so embarrassing.

Yes, I faked appendicitis so much so. It got to the point where they removed the organ from my body. I did have a pain in my stomach, stomach. My mother had her appendix removed at the same age and I thought, oh, just give this go and see what happens. And it just got out of hand. And I mean, it's a long time ago. I don't quite understand the thought process behind it if there was one. And I'm embarrassed to say that I think it probably was to gain attention. It wasn't, was it trying to get out of like school

work? That too. Because I can relate to this. I was like a massive truant and, oh my God. See, I wasn't. I was a good girl. I was really good at school. and I applied myself. I actually was one of those widows who enjoyed school. And so, yeah, in leaving school, in year 11, that was so shocking to my parents, but I had found acting and I knew it was my thing.

I can't believe I made that decision, but... What did they make of it when you sort of intensified your love of acting? Did it catch them off guard? Were they supportive? Was it sort of like, let's see this run its course, but... Well, my parents were, you know, they said, well, why don't you just stay at school

and you can kind of dabble in it on the side. And, you know, there's that quote that parents throw at their kids. Like, it's good to have a backup. You want to have a backup plan. So have your dream, but have something a little more grounded in reality. But I was a very strong-willed.

I still am a strong-willed female. And I knew it's what I wanted to do. And I'd done, I think I had done my first film and a few plays. I went to drama school for a little while, and then I was doing a production of Uncle Vanya opposite Jeffrey Rush at the, you know, beloved opera house in Sydney

for the Sydney Theatre Company. And my, I remember my father afterwards just saying, okay, I get it, you know. So it took them experiencing that to, you know, telling them, sometimes telling somebody, it doesn't work, you have to kind of show them. Did, I mean, do you remember what that felt

like the first couple times you were on stage or being in these kind of, larger productions and like was it a rush was it a oh yeah i felt so alive so awake and uh i loved it that i mean i guess that is what the um addictive part of it was i also remember like the first real not real it was a school production but the real experience i had of of acting was um both kind of petrifying but also a relief my grandmother had died just before this school production and I was nervous to perform and also it was a musical

so I was singing and it was Godspell and there was a scene where Jesus died and all of the other characters were mourning and I used the opportunity to channel so much pain that I was going through and so initially I think my relationship with acting was very much about expressing things

that I couldn't figure out how to navigate otherwise and so that in itself was like oh what a great thing super power I have to deal with stuff. Did you feel like, here's one thing that I discovered when I was just looking at the filmography, your first film had a crazy cast, right? There was some amazing performers? Like, was, was Ben Mendelssohn a contemporary of yours?

Ben, that was, well, that was the first job I did with Ben. There's a film called Spotswood, which was retitled the efficiency expert in America, which is, you know, titled that it grabbed you and get you into the cinema. But it was Anthony Hopkins, Ben Mendelssohn, Russell Crow, and a bunch of other amazingly talented people and it was my first time away from home I was 17, I was living in Melbourne

for a couple of, I had my own apartment, I was given money, you know, and I was meeting all these incredible people and I was pinching myself and you know what, I still pinched myself because I, you know, my very, very last job was a film with Dan Gilroy who was shooting at the Hollywood Forever Cemetery

I remember getting in the car at the end of the day and driving out of the cemetery and directly up the road that is perpendicular to the cemetery that you drive out of is the Hollywood sign and I still get a kick out of the fact that I am on the other side of the world because I loved TV and film when I was a kid

and to actually be just being allowed to do it it still kind of blows my mind at times I was going to make another triple X joke but I decided against it Yeah let's not do that with being much When did So did you feel like you had a class of like actors

that you kind of came of age with like the, like the Ben Mandelsoons, the Russell Crows, was there a fraternity? They seemed ahead of me. They're a bit older than me, and I always felt a little kind of beneath them and, not beneath them, but, you know, younger than them and slightly intimidated,

like they knew more than I did. I often feel like other people know more than I do, but that's changed in the last, I don't know, 10 years. I'm sitting in a puddle here. I opened a bottle of water, and now there's... We should find something for you. It doesn't matter. It's not on me, and it's not touching.

You're okay? Yeah, it's totally fine. Yeah. So, um, so was the dream? or was there an aspiration of getting to America, getting to Hollywood movie making? Not at all. I just loved either being on set or being on stage,

and it was an experience unto itself. When I did Muriel's wedding, I had zero concept of an audience, really. Well, no one had any expectation for that film to go as worldwide as it did, I assume. Yeah, but I also had no idea of, I wasn't planning a career. It was literally one foot in front of the other,

and it was a combination of, you know, it was really dumb luck and, you know, application. But, yeah, yeah, no, I mean, Muriel's wedding was, I remember the first time I watched it, because I hadn't, you know, these days I get sent a copy or there's a, you know, a screening. Yeah. And suddenly I was flown to the other side of the world.

I was a bit jet lagged, which felt a bit trippy, and I was sitting in a cinema of over a couple of thousand people in Cannes. And then there's this massive screen, and there I am up there. And it was really strange because... The human brain is not equipped to deal with that kind of... No, it ain't. But I did this thing where I literally relived every scene. I just sat there laughing and sobbing,

and it was one of the wildest experiences of my life. And, yeah, I guess I've never really had expectations or plans. And I think the fact that I am open to what the universe throws at me somehow is allowed various experiences because I've never tried to control it. Well, Exhibit A, what you were just saying about hereditary looking for the light comedy but be ready for the dark psychological horror film.

A little bit of grief. A little bit to say the least. So did, and Muriel is also curious because I think that's your second film. You're obviously the lead in that film. And did that feel like, was ignorance kind of bliss in terms of just being the lead of your own film at 19 or 20, whatever you were at the time?

It didn't feel like overwhelming at the time. It just felt like this is a ride and I'm just going to take it. Look, when I read that, it was the same, it was the, not every job has this. I mean, there are things I do because it will feel creatively satisfied, but there are a handful of jobs which feel like they are preordained life experiences that I have to have. It felt like a religious experience. I cannot tell you how there are so many people who look at that character and they're fond of her. And then there are others who are like, I am Muriel.

And I think I myself fell into the latter category. And it was just, it was life-changing on so many levels. Yeah. So what happened in the wake of that? I mean, I know what happened, right, looking at a filmography and the kind of films you followed it up with. But I'm just curious, like, did that immediately have you coming to Hollywood and doing a spade of meetings and kind of like,

or did it feel like there was new opportunity immediately? or was there a lag time? I'm just curious, like, where? Well, Miramax picked up the film, it can, and then, you know, they did an amazing job of distributing the film. I think as I get older, I realize how important marketing is.

People need to know that it is a business and people need to know that the film exists. And they did a really, really great job. So I, you know, I traveled to so many festivals all around Europe and America, and, yeah, I had a bunch of meetings in L.A. The film industry is quite small compared to the film industry in America. I found a great agent and manager,

and then the whole machine starts kicking in. You start reading things and getting offers. But I think initially I was getting either offered roles that were lead roles that were kind of similar to Muriel or smaller roles in other films because people were kind of excited to work with me but didn't quite know how to kind of fit me in. So I did a few roles kind of in that vein.

Worked with Matt Reeves before he was Matt Reeves on the Hallbearer. That's kind of crazy. That movie, people forget that that movie, frankly, exists because he kind of like reinvented himself all these years later. Right, exactly. So, yeah, that was amazing to suddenly, like, honestly, I grew up outside of Sydney, and then to find myself in New York. New York is like this, you know,

I mean, when I first got here, I really was that kind of wide-eyed out of towner who's, like, got my face pressed against the window, totally amazed by the fact that the cabs are yellow and there is steam coming out of the road. It was just so full of cliches, but they're so familiar and it's so exciting as a, basically, as a tourist. I recall, I grew up here in New York because I've been here forever, and I recall single wild party. Oh, yeah. So that must have been a big moment for you, too. I mean, judging by what you just said in terms of what New York meant to you, and to be, actually. And I know music is obviously something very close to your heart to have that kind of opportunity. Yeah, I started in musicals.

I mean, I started singing kind of led to a love of acting. And the Wild Party was a new piece. It was so crazy that there were two productions being mounted at the exact same time. But I worked with incredible people. I love George Wolfe. He's the most wonderful director, so passionate and with such infectious energy. Was that the production? Yours had Earth a Kit?

Yeah, I was working with Earth a Kid. and a bunch of other really, really incredible people. And it was very satisfying, completely exhausting. I don't know how people sustain a Broadway career because the amount of energy that you have to put out night after night is just, I mean, theater itself is amazing. But if you're hoof in it and singing, like, it's just, it's like, I think I remember at the time feeling like,

it must be like, it's a kind of militant experience. You have to be so, so disciplined. And I walked past, actually, I was walking back to my hotel the other night. I walked past the public theatre. Yeah. And I felt such a fondness. And I was just really remembering, I mean, that time and even just like experiencing snow. I mean, I was running around any trainers.

I didn't know how to dress myself properly. It was all so new and novel. Even at that time. But, yeah, I remembered this work, like, when we were. first started, and there was one of my numbers, which was, it was almost like this woman who's like, blabbing, she can't stop. And there's a lot of movement to it. And when we first started doing, I remember just feeling so exhausted by it. And then by the time, you know, you get to the end of the rehearsal period, you are like master of it. You could do it standing on

your head. And just the sheer physicality of it and the resistance that you build up is, is inevitable because you're putting the effort in, but it's fascinating. It's amazing because, like, and I try to see a lot of theater if I can here, and it's like, I can fool myself when I'm watching a movie or TV show, like, I could do that. You know, we could all do that. You know, I can do it once or twice. But then you're at the theater and you see Angels in America and you see like, you know, someone just like, I mean, eight hours. It's like it's not, it's a superpower. It's crazy. Yes. Um, you, you, you surprise me haven't had the opportunity, I presume, to do much in the way of movie musicals itself. I mean, like Connie and Carl is probably the closest you've come. Yeah, right. Um, it's. Um, it's, um, it's, Is that something that you've, I mean, you've talked about sort of not, like, you know, kind of, you can't steer your own ship too much in this industry. But, like, is that something that you wish or still hope to kind of... I really do. Yeah. But, I mean, I think musicals have got a bad name, and rightly so.

Some of them are shocking. But when they are tastefully done and when there's something real to latch onto and the music, the music will enhance the story. and it can be quite profound. And joyous. It depends on the story, but I very basically just miss singing. And I still write some music, but it's, you know, my day job has very much got me kind of busy. Yeah. I can only imagine the music you're writing during hereditary on your off time.

It could, it's your dark material, the dark works of Tony Collette. Yeah, that'd be a nice volume. I mean is there like a pie in the sky musical that's still kind of on your bucket list to tackle or just one that you love as a fan that in recent years that did touch you that did kind of work for you?

No, no, no, to be honest, no. But there's always new work that's coming around. But you're open to it, yeah, yeah, yeah, I really am. So Sixth Sense has always mentioned as it should be because it's a great piece of work I watched it again the other day because it holds up so well. I've always been a fan of Knights. So that, and that, I mean, you know, people are drawing parallels on a surface level,

and it's really just a surface level to hereditary. They couldn't be more different films. Oh, it's a completely different film, but I can see the similarities, for sure. And certainly in filmmakers, like where they're at in their career, your filmmaker and this one is a first-time filmmaker. And by the way, the confidence, like just the confidence he shows behind the camera of this is remarkable. And similarly, Knight. Was it the beginning of his career?

It was his second film? Exactly. And I'm always, when I look at his work from six cents on, I always see like a certitude, a like, just like, this is a guy that, for good or for bad, he has a vision and he's taking you on a ride. Did you sense that, like, going in? He was a young man.

Yes. And was that, is that a high for an actor? It must be. Absolutely. With both Ari and Knight, there was a complete clarity of vision. And it stood alone. It was original and it felt strong. And, I mean, you would, honestly,

you'd be surprised the amount of directors who don't realize, that they are in charge. Like, there needs to be some, you know, it is a very collaborative medium and I am really open to the idea of everyone working together. But the director, you know,

has to be at the helm. Somebody has to steer the ship. And those guys, yeah, both of them. Did, I have a great fondness for About a Boy. Not one but two directors on that one, Chris and Paul White. Yeah, Chris and Paul are amazing.

I was going to say, actually, one thing that struck me when I was rewatching, you played a mom at a very young age. I was 24. In fact, I remember I turned 25 during the shoot because there was a little surprise birthday lunch thrown for me. And it kind of like, it caused,

all different, very different sort of roles, but you played a mom many times in those years, it feels like. Yeah, I really did. Was that something that struck you as fine, the parts are good? Was it, I mean, this was... Yeah, the parts were great, and it was an opportunity to show that these were all, you know, vastly different people,

and they happen to be, you know, mothers as well. Yeah, they couldn't be ignorative and the Batta Boy character from, obviously, any of them, yeah. Yeah. Clearly. Are you, were you shocked as everybody else when Nick Holt turned into, like, Superman? Like, one day, we didn't seem for, like, five years,

and all of a sudden we saw him, and he was, like, 7-3 and looked like Chris Farie, but it was, like, crazy. Yes, it was crazy. I mean, I remember seeing him a year after making the movie, and we were, you know, back together doing press and just being blown away by how much he'd grown, let alone that huge leap. He's a beautiful boy.

He, I mean, honestly, a sweet, sweetheart. He's a great guy. I love it. But my God, he's a hottie as well. It's so bizarre. Another film that really touches people. I don't even know what the box office was, but who cares at this point? It's the lasting power is in her shoes, which.

I loved making that movie. Curtis Hanson. I love Curtis Hanson. Look at his filmography. My God, a guy that could do anything. It's so varied and so, I mean, honestly, That's another, I mean, people have drawn similarities between Knight and Ari, and they may be a little more obvious,

but I have to say I find similarities between Curtis and Ari because Curtis is someone who is just, I think I feel safest as an actor, and I feel like I can really be as vulnerable as I need to be to make something real, only when the director feels just as dedicated and married and saturated in the story as I am. And Curtis was definitely all of the, those things my god we had i think on that we had a two-week rehearsal period that is that never

happens and i thought this is going to be a waste of time we're going to play pin the tail on the donkey or something got this on d-2 but it was so thorough yeah and arie is so thorough they are so in their heads and and beautifully so it's so inspiring and uh yeah it's more it's about clarity and it's about it's about depth it's about really understanding how people work and being um not only having the understanding inside their own skulls, but being brilliant communicators, being able to articulate exactly what they want. And it becomes infectious.

It's really inspiring when you work with someone that you feel gets things on a really, really deep level. I've asked this along these lines, this kind of question to actors over the years, because I'm always curious, because this kind of line of thinking comes up a lot where, yes, you need somebody that both has the passion and the vision.

And what does an actor do on day two or three when they realize, oh, my God, I was sold a bill of goods. This guy doesn't have it. There's a hack. Like, how do you preserve, how do you save yourself? I am a very hopeful person, so much so that sometimes I read scripts. And even when in reading the script, I think, oh, I could make that better. I can, you know, I can. And so I always do really hope for the best.

Once you're already in it, you just have to, you just. You know, I'm still as dedicated. There's no point not doing that. It's just not going to serve anybody. So, you know, you make the most of it and get through it. I mean, it's only happened a handful of times. So I've been very lucky. And yes, I will knock on word.

But, yeah, for me, that has been rare, and I'm very thankful for that. Because it is a bit soul-destraing. I have one job, which is, like, the worst job of my life. And I just, even now, it makes me cringe. I won't name it, because you mentioned it's a New York shoot. right? That was here. Yeah, yeah, yeah. So what do you learn as much from those kinds of experiences as the successes in terms of like whether what warning signs to look for when you go into a shoot or is it just sort of like it's the law of averages? No actor is ever going to, you know, escape unscathed in their resume. I think for me, that really made me, I think it's really important to know why you are taking a job. So if you have your own ideas that you want to address or. you know, then that can be achieved despite the experience, you know? Right.

So you just need to be clear about what you actually want out of it. So what, I mean, we kind of alluded to this at the start, but like what has this been like? You've been talking your head off, and rightfully so. Yeah, there it is on the floor. You're remarkably coherent given how much you're talking about this film. But it's all, but it must be, it must be heartening to have some perspective to kind of like be on the roller coaster.

few times and to sort of know, I mean, you alluded to this. Oh, I know it's all swings and roundabouts. This is not my first barbecue and I have to say it is a totally fascinating experience and I'm really excited for Ari. He looks to me and says, is this normal is this? And I'm like, Ari, no, it ain't. So enjoy it because it's not always like this. Yeah.

Yeah. So having said that and having said that you can't kind of like steer your own ship too much, you just finished this film with Dan Gilroy, like all the Gilroy's confused. There's too many talented Gilroy's out there. You shot a TV series, I believe. I did, yeah. It's a BBC Netflix co-production called Wonderlust, which

we shot in Manchester, which I loved. Nick Payne, who's a brilliant playwright, wrote every episode, and it was I mean, I'm so lucky. I think it really is all about the material for me, and just working with good writing is such a pleasure, and I feel

so privileged. It's just, you know, really special. And by the way, and I apologize for the construction on our building here. People need to get their work done. I just saw Brett Haley's Heartbeat's World, which is a sweet, wonderful movie. And Nick's doing the podcast in a couple of days, Nick Offerman. And that's, again, you got to shoot that here in New York. I know, it was so much fun.

It was a completely different experience. I guess it was the kind of experience I'd hoped for before I did a red tree. Because it was so easy. It was so much fun. You know, it's not really my movie. It's Nick and Kiersy and it's gorgeous. and it has like these, it has some depth and poignancy and it's moving, but it's also like truly elating.

It's just got such a light, positive vibe to it. And to be a part of that, it just felt like, you know, a little gift. It was so much fun. And I know you're ramping up in terms of producing. That's something, that's something that you're prioritizing going forward. Yeah, I really am. I've been optioning some material and, you know, some pieces of being adapted. I've got some original ideas and, um,

So I'm producing, but I also do want to direct. I think we have found something that I would like to direct. So it's just, it's all a jigsaw, and things happen in their own time, and I trust that, and that's part of the process. I'm not trying to, you know, ram experiences. There also needs to be time of no work, because that feeds your work as well. And I need to go and, you know, at the end of this, I'm just going to go and it's my kids finish school on Friday, And I am putting my phone away, and I just cannot wait to just be with them and do, you know, not much.

I'm going to take the hint, and I'm going to let you live your life. No! No, it's all good. I'm totally teasing you. Again, I remain such a fan of your work, and I'm so happy for you on this project. Oh, you're so lovely. Thank you. Truly a special one.

Hereditary. It's Adam Theater, so we're going to publish this, I think, a day or two before it comes out. So by the time you listen to this, it's probably out. Go see it. I only saw about 80% of it because my hand. were over my face for a little bit of it. So I look forward to seeing the entire thing. Oh, that's funny.

But, yeah, it's a hell of a piece of work, and I hope you enjoy this silly ride that it is. Oh, thank you. I'll see on the next one. Thank you, Tony. All right, cheers. And so ends another edition of happy, sad, confused. Remember to review, rate, and subscribe to this show on iTunes

or wherever you get your podcasts. I'm a big podcast person. I'm Daisy Ridley, and I definitely wasn't pressure to do this by Josh. I'm Amy Nicholson, the film critic for the L.A. Times. And I'm Paul Shear, an actor, writer, and director. You might know me from The League, Veep, or my non-eligible for Academy Award role in Twisters. We love movies, and we come at them from different perspectives. Yeah, like Amy thinks that, you know, Joe Pesci was miscarriage.

in Goodfellas, and I don't. He's too old. Let's not forget that Paul thinks that dude too is overrated. It is. Anyway, despite this, we come together to host Unspooled, a podcast where we talk about good movies, critical hits. Fan favorites, must-season, and Casey Mistoms. We're talking Parasite the Home Alone.

From Greece to the Dark Night. We've done deep dives on popcorn flicks. We've talked about why Independence Day deserves a second look. And we've talked about horror movies, some that you've never even heard of like Ganges and Hess. So if you love movies like we do, come along on our cinematic adventure. Listen to Unspooled wherever you get your podcasts. And don't forget to hit the follow button.