Happy Sad Confused - Will Forte

Episode Date: March 9, 2015

The amazing actor, comedian, and SNL alum Will Forte joins Josh for a delightful chat about the creation of his show The Last Man On Earth, his love of the F word, writing for Jenny McCarthy and the MTV Movie Awards early on, being terrified the first time he had the opportunity to audition for SNL, and much more. Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

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Eligibility restrictions apply. See Golden Nuggett Casino.com for details. Please play responsibly. Hey, guys, welcome to another edition of Happy Said Confused. Welcome to my podcast. The My refers to me, Josh Harrowitz, your fearless host. This is where I talk to smart, funny, interesting, cool people, and that certainly describes my guest this week. the amazing actor, comedian, former S&Ler, and current star of one of my favorite new shows, The Last Man on Earth.

The guest this week is Will Forte. Will is awesome, as you know. You like awesome things if you listen to this podcast, so you like Will Forte already. But you've, of course, seen him on SNL for years where he killed it. And then post-S&L kind of remade his career with a, a cruise. crazy acclaimed performance in Nebraska, directed by none other than Alexander Payne. Thankfully, he's not abandoned completely absurd comedic roles and projects, as evidenced by this new one, The Last Man on Earth, which premiered last week. I am an immediate fan of this one.

I saw the first two episodes. I hope you guys did, if not, check it out, because truly, I cannot endorse this one enough. It is from Will's depraved, deranged, But also, Phil Lord and Chris Miller, former guests of Happy Sack Infused, go back into the archives and listen to that conversation, and also creators of the Lego movie and 21 Jump Street and 22 Jump Street. So they're on top of the world right now, dominating all of Hollywood. And it's so cool to see them collaborate with Will on this comedic take on the end of days. I don't want to say too much more. You don't want to spoil this show. but trust me, it is worth your time.

As is this conversation. Will is one of the good guys in the business. Everybody knows Will Forte is smart, funny, and just like one of those guys, what you see is what you get. You want to hang out with him. You want to spend time with him. And I was lucky enough to do just that in this conversation.

And so will you, by proxy. So here we go. My conversation with Mr. Will Forte, but as always, a quick reminder. Go over to Wolfpop.com. check out all the great podcasts over there and hit me up on Twitter. I'm there waiting for you, waiting to converse, waiting to correspond, waiting to hear your criticism and hopefully compliments at Joshua Harowitz is my Twitter handle.

In the meanwhile, enjoy this delightful chat with the delightful Will Forte. feel the building actually sway. Like you actually hear it creaking. Oh yeah, you'll feel it. Nice. Oh, my God. What are you judging, Will? Trying to see those pictures.

Is that... Can you tell who... Channifer Lawrence's face on Bradley Cooper? Nice. Really? Yeah. And is that... Gettie Lee...

That's just Gettily. That is... Come on. Don't fail me. one of those two people is very close to you right now like talking to you right now like the name Josh right now that's me and that's J-WOW

from MTV's classic Jersey Shore don't pretend like you don't know. Dude I love J-Wow I know you do that's why I put it up there feel free to adjust the mic to your liking okay this is great if this is good for you it's good for me it looks really it suits you what's happening

are you going to like the mic I'm getting ready I'm getting ready it's hygienically clean don't worry do you recognize the Vigo poster a Ghostbusters 2 fan no yes I do

I was for a second it took me a second to I didn't know Ghostbusters until you I mean I was like I know that face but has been a part of my life how do I know that

thank you for swinging by we were just chatting this is the end of the exciting promotional tour for show that I've already told you, but I'll say it on the record on the podcast. I love, I've seen the first two episodes. Last Man on Earth, congrats, dude. Thank you very much. So a slightly different press store than the last time I saw you, which was an exhaustive one,

a great one for Nebraska. Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. Does this feel like apples and oranges compared to what you went through? Because that's like... It does. I've... Cocktail parties, et cetera, screening series, whatever. That was months and months of, you know, I was delighted to do it, you know, to be a part of that movie was an experience that I never thought I'd get to have. So I would you know, I would

still be on the circuit doing that stuff if they had wanted me to. Bruce Stern was still returning your calls. You would still be there. That's too bad for the falling out. No, no. We did not have a falling out. Josh. Sorry. I heard things. No, but it was

you know, this is, we finished shooting just on Monday. So, so I don't know if there would have been even more stuff that I'd do, but, but like, you know, we had to pack it into this final, final six days. So what I kind of love also is that this is, this is the first, like, major, like, baby of yours since Nebraska. And I kind of love that in a way, A, because it's always something close to your heart that you love, but also, like, I'm sure there have been some interesting new opportunities that have come after Nebraska. And I feel like it speaks to you that, like, this crazy, absurd. bizarre thing like how the hell did it get on network television that's awesome is the next big thing from you do you know it's it it is it is it is it is i've been very excited about

this show it it uh i went into the process thinking it was just going to be a writing job and then i i just loved it so much that that uh that i thought i got a i got a yeah i got very close to the character and the premise and and and i just i couldn't let go of that I originally thought it was going to be a cable thing, if anything. You know, if anybody appreciated it, it seemed to have more of a fit cable-wise, but then Fox was really into it. And they talked us into doing it there, and I'm really happy they did. They've been very supportive and let us make the show exactly the way we wanted to.

except no F words. Wow, that's what you can do on the podcast here. I love F words. Say it, use it. You can do it. I can. You get it out of your system. I love to say F word. No, I thought you're not,

fuck is the F word, not the, I was just saying F word. F word. You know what? You can't, on Fox, you can't even say F it. Really? F that. Yeah.

If they do, they blur it out. And actually, I was watching, on S&L, I did this sketch. I was a motivational coach, and I was giving Peyton Manning and a bunch of other people who was, they were all, my basketball team. I was giving them a speech. And in the speech, I was watching it the other night. They had a primetime sports special. I think it was the night before the Super Bowl.

And they bleeped out eff it. He says, you know, let's get the F out of here. And they obscure his mouth, so you can't say F. They, where you literally can't see, they, like, you can't see the word even coming out of the mouth. It's a letter. It's a letter in the alphabet. That, that's, we only have 25, 26 things to work with now, people. Yeah.

Yeah. Yeah, it makes me mad. It's like, so, I'll say it's fucking stupid. Whoa, dude. Come on. Our children are children. Let us say fuck. Look, look, you're still looking me in the eyes and you're respecting me.

Kids need to hear it at some point. It's true. I'm not saying, let's, I'm not saying let's say fuck on network TV. I'm saying, let's say F. Right. It's 2015 people. Did your parents say the effort? Did they use profanity at home?

Every word was, no, they were. Clean your fucking room well. Damn it. I think we had more of a damn it family. Yeah. Damn it? I still feel weird cursing in front of my parents. I'll be honest.

Ooh, I feel pretty good about cursing in front of mine. They're fine with it. They're used to it. Well, they've seen your work. But it's like I'm a, I think, I like to think I'm a good son. I have a good relationship with them. Right. Oh, my God. I went on Seth Meyer's show last night and showed a birthday card my mom gave me where she

had, it was my 41st birthday and she sent a card with a picture taped to the inside. Like, she as a joke to my dad, she took a picture of me as a baby with horrible diaper rash. I forget what the joke was, but she included. included this picture in there. It's just like a shot of me lying down on my stomach and my butt is exposed and with just horrendous diaper rash and then my balls are hanging out. And that's, that's, it's this pretty awesome. That's beauty. That's a beautiful relationship. Awesome picture. I might have it here. This could be a bonus. Okay. Anyway, my, so I tell the story and I'm

talking about my mom giving me this card and how awesome my mom is. She was so bummed. she just like to me to me i was saying mom this this is going to anybody who sees this is going to think you're way cooler than than before the picture are you are your family or your parents like did this kind of like catch them off guard the way this career has developed was this something that they could have ever like what's their take on your success in your trajectory they're they're they have been so supportive The moment I said I wanted to go into comedy, it's tough. You dread telling your parents because you know they'll be worried about you.

And, you know, you want their support. And they just, there was never even any part of them that were anything less than thrilled that I was doing something that I loved and you don't want to try to go for it. So every step of the way there, it's, you know, we all, I mean, I don't want to. to say that they have low expectations for me, but they're, they're, they'd love me and they're happy if I'm happy. And so, and I'm generally pretty happy with whatever. So, so I, you know, all this stuff has just been gravy and we all feel that, that excitement of unexpected blessings together. It's like, you know, oh my God, we were happy before and now I get to do this. Yeah. What the

fuck? Like, this is great. With the F word. Yeah, what the F word? What's the, what was the backup plan? And When did the backup plan go out the window? Was there like a... Well, luckily for me, my backup plan was writing. And so I got to do my backup plan. The backup plan for acting is writing. Right. What was the backup plan for writing, though?

For writing? I don't know. I don't know. You know what I would have probably tried to do is teach. you probably try to teach at a college somewhere that seemed that I was something I was considering back in when I first went out of when I first I guess you say graduated right from college instead of went out of college

when I first went out of college proud UCLA went outer and how quickly did did a good writing job because writing jobs are pretty lucrative and especially the places you were working

I'm sure you made a nice living at Third Rock, et cetera. My dad was a financial analyst stockbroker and so I just did that right out of college for like a year and a half

and just it wasn't for me so I realized I wanted to try comedy and went to the groundings and I graduated in 93, went to the groundings around 94 and a half, and then probably in 96 is when I got my first writing job at MTV, the Jenny McCarthy sketch.

Right. And that was so great. Which is still going in. It's 20th year now. It's amazing. It was not here in New York. It was out in like closer to Burbank. But what a fun experience.

getting to do that show. How long did that last? That was, it was always only going to be for a season because I think that Jenny had signed a contract with MTV and this was kind of the last thing she had to do. And she had a sitcom lined up at NBC, I believe. So this was just to fulfill, to my knowledge. I think I remember this.

I think it was always only going to be for a season. And then she went and made the show, which I think was called Jenny. I was going to guess. I'm guessing that show probably just called Jenny with an exclamation point or some kind of... So I did that show. It was great fun to be a part of it

and I was super stressed while I was doing it but looking back now, it was the least stressful most fun job to start out with. It really was great and got to work with a lot of great people. John Benjamin.

and John Glazer. Amazing. Isn't that funny where like those shows that are forgotten shows I've talked about this on the podcast before but one of my first jobs

I was working for John McEnra's talk show at CNBC which was like the lowest rated talk show literally in the history of humanity but like everybody that worked on it

like it was just like behind the scenes of course they all went on to become you know Oh is that right? Yeah yeah Who else wait do you know like Brooke Posh who's now like running

Oh I know Brooke Posh Yeah she was literally a segment producer with me we shared a cubicle It's crazy um so when you're writing for someone like jenny mccarthy was she good at sketch comedy was she did she i mean we're not gonna dis you know jenny like she's got her talents but was that her forte she is a very likable wonderful nice person and there were some things that were like it's

it's you know i i don't think that she had ever done sketch comedy so so uh you know she i will say i i did not expect her to be as funny as she was and she's she's just just, she's so winningly nice and likable. And I thought that show was actually really, there were some very good things. And if there were, you know, it wasn't ever her lack of sketch experience. That brought it down of those other factors.

You know, us writers dropping the ball. But there were some great things. The guy, Joel Gallen, who used to produce all the movie awards and stuff, stuff. He did it. And so the short films were so fun. And as I said, John Glazer and John Benjamin, a bunch of other people. You know, Ben Carlin came in and worked a little bit on it. A bunch of, and by the way, Melissa McCarthy, who is Jenny's cousin, it was, I think she was just working as a PA and this is right before she started at the groundlings and she was it was just so

fun she was so cool and she got to be in one of the sketches and I was in the same sketch and we were both police officers sitting next to each other so I kind of have the I believe her first co-star on camera saying that I got to be in the first you know her first television appearance I believe. I'm pretty sure. Maybe she did something before that that I didn't know. Let me on the honor system here, dude. But, you know.

So, and you mentioned, because you also, you wrote, and I think you were at S&L by this point, but you wrote sometimes here and there for VMAs and movie awards, some of the MTV award shows, too, right? Did you get, did you work on short films, or was that, like, stand, like a. By the way, I want to go back and make sure I say that, that, that was a great experience, and Jenny was wonderful to me, and I think she is very good at sketch comedy. Okay, fair enough. Yeah, I hope it didn't come across any other way.

No, no, that's true. I'm the only awful person in this room. Don't worry. But what was your experience writing for some of the MTV Award shows? I was curious about the award show writing experience. Is that something else? I loved you. As I said, you know, Joel, my favorite movie awards were the ones that he produced.

He was really good at those. I always thought those short films during his era were. were so great and I loved parts of those things writing those short films was always really, really fun. Writing the patter,

the patter that the presenters have to say, that's a special hell. It's the worst. There's nothing left. I have so much respect when I watch an award show that has cleverly written dialogue or, you know,

So it's so hard because a lot of times you're just writing this stuff that's, you'll write funny stuff, send it over. Right. The person who's will never even look at it. And it's maybe their PR person who's looking and going, no, that's not funny. And they, you know, sometimes it's not. And a lot of, I mean, it's hard to write that stuff. So it's, but it's just tricky because it's, there's so many levels that you have to get through.

And a lot of times it's just really. really last minute, and you've just, you've tried writing so much stuff. And then, and then, you know, somebody will get up there and inevitably go like, yeah, that's the bullshit, the writers wrote for me or something like that. Yeah. How many times I've seen them sell the writers down the river when that month? And it's like, fuck you, dude. We wrote you some great stuff. Right. That seven people had a hand in the story. So don't throw us into the, you know, throw yourself under the bus. And but then every once in a while, you'd give something to like

Samuel L. Jackson and he just sells the shit out of it. So he was, he was, he was great, you know, so you got, you got both. It's always the lame people who, right, who, you know, sell out the writers. So along the way, when you're working at some of these sitcoms after Jenny, are you, are you still harboring like, okay, one day I'm going to get the shot at doing stuff on camera? Is it sort of like, if this is my career, so be it. What's your attitude in those years? No, I didn't not give up. I loved writing.

It was great. And, you know, I think you talked about this earlier. The money is... You can make quite a career. Not at MTV, but the... Oh, I know that. That was not a dig. No.

At, once you get to, like, a primetime sitcom, because I went from Jenny McCarthy show to Letterman. I somehow got to have that experience, which was amazing. Very hard. I was not great at it. Right. But it was,

you know, he was one of my heroes. Of course. Then I started doing sitcoms and it's just a crazy paycheck. It's so great. And I was in a couple sitcoms that didn't go very far. Right. And then I got the experience of going to Third Rock from the Sun,

which was so great. The Turner's ran that show, Bonnie and Terry Turner, and they're awesome. And they just had this way of collecting really talented writers who are also very normal, nice people. Right. And then when Third Rock from the Sun was over, I got to go over to that 70s show, which was also the Turner's. Mark Brazil who had written, I think he wrote it Third Rock from the Sun. I think he was a third rock writer, and then had the idea for that 70s show,

which he did with the Turner's. And then, so I was allowed to go over to that 70s show. And it was another just great experience, a bunch of wonderful people. I liked that show so much. and the hours were incredible. So it was just like, oh, this is, nothing bad about this.

In fact, I liked it so much that I was doing a grounding show. And Lauren Michaels happened to be there that night. And I got, you know, offered the chance to audition. And I almost didn't even go audition because I, loved writing the 70s show so much and I was shitting my pants that I would do a horrible job so eventually you know Mark Brazil talked to me into going to audition he's you know this my my freaking 70 show boss he he had been an actor early on in a stand-up and and had said you will not forgive yourself if you don't go do this and I was you know he's so wonderful

and gracious about it I went went out and auditioned got the job and then I just melted down. I loved my job at the 70s show but definitely it was a fear of fucking up my dream. So as much as I loved writing

I know it was more of a fear based decision so I didn't do the show for a year and then thank God they came back a year later and you know offered me a chance to to re-audition. Was everybody in your life saying you're crazy like for passing up

SNL? Because it seems it's like everybody in your field is working towards like that kind of opportunity. Even if you're making a hell of a living, this is like you got the golden ticket, it seems like. I mean, my friends and family are all very supportive and I did a good job of

pretending that it was just because I loved writing so much. And I did. That's not, you know, That's not inaccurate for me to say, but like ultimately the lie that I had told to myself was ate away at me to the point that I was like I would never be able to forgive myself if I didn't at least give it a shot. So the second time when they offered you, is there any moment of like second guessing it yet again and saying maybe I actually will say no again?

No, this time I had a girlfriend at the time was very supportive and she said, you got to you got to do this. Yeah. And, and, and she was, she was right. And it was, you know, I went for it. And it was, it was, uh, terrifying. I was so scared for like three years. I was terrified of, of being on that stage.

It also was to be terrifying just getting, I mean, you, I guess you'd had a lot of experience in writers' rooms and just throwing stuff out there. But like, it's infamous that first meeting where you're throwing around ideas and pitching to Warren himself. That's a tough crowd. Was that also an intimidating part? Or was that almost the least of the problems? Was it more of...

I mean, certainly as you're first getting in there, it's a nerve-wracking experience to be around a bunch of very funny people. Yeah. But, you know, you quickly get to know these people and they become your friends, and then you're not nervous pitching around them. It doesn't help you in the performance part of it, where there are all these strangers up in the audience, and then you're knowing, oh, there's,

also this camera that's beaming me all over the place. And so what changed three years in approximately? Was it just sort of, well, I, three years in, I almost got fired. There was, you know, over the summer, they make all the casting decisions. And, you know, the show was, you know, it takes a little, there were, there were some wonderful, uh, actors. comedians are and actors and everyone is great

but every you know sometimes you have a bunch of wonderful individuals but there's like the you know the the cast is it just doesn't have it just it's not jelling in the right way didn't seem to be jelling for some reason

and and you know nobody knew what what it was and Lauren was just trying to figure it out yeah I was I was the very last person that he brought back and he had even said and this kind of is interesting because you had just brought up

you know having that experience as a writer in a positive way Lauren brought it up in a negative way and he would in like he said you know I think that I think that you are kind of in a writer's mindset

and you you know you'll really be confident in the things that you write for yourself but if somebody else casts you you kind of are thinking from a writer's point of view. And of course, I'm like, you know, in my head, I'm like, screw you, dude. You don't know what's, of course you're wrong. And he's like, well, you know, I just, I want you to get out of that and start taking ownership over these roles.

And by the way, he was totally right, 100% right. And there was something about the experience of being pushed to the, you know, just thinking that, it just was all like oh who cares anymore because i almost got fired i'm this is a new lease on life and then suddenly you're like i let it go and then suddenly you're like i let it go and he was totally right and i started just you know when people because i because i would remember being in the writer's room and being kind of pissed when somebody would do your stuff wrong and you're like how do they not know to put the inflection on this word or that you know little things like that and to me

I know that while I was doing other people's sketches, I would be kind of tentative because I would envision them being frustrated with how I was doing it in the way that I used to be when other people were doing it. So Lauren is a very wise man. And, you know, thank God he gave me that second chance. And that was kind of, you know, I still had nerves, but that was definitely a turning point. Yeah. And then really at about,

The year six is, I think, when I started feeling like, I still felt like I was a new guy. You know, even when this next wave of people came in, you know, Andy and Kristen and Bill and Jason, I still felt like I was relatively new. So at about year six, I started feeling like, okay, I'm part of this place. Right. I work at S&L, damn it. Time for a quick break to tell you that today's episode of Happy Second Fused is brought to you by Audible. Audible.com is the place for audiobooks. There are over 150,000 titles to choose from from every category imaginable.

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And if you don't like what you choose, no problem with Audible's great listening guarantee, you can exchange any book you're not happy with for another title anytime no questions asked. So go to Audiblepodcast.com slash happy today. Well, it's that weird thing, too. I would think that we see it on a cyclical level at S&O where, you know, someone's around there. it takes them usually a couple years to kind of find their voice, find the character, find something, and then they kind of get into a zone. And then it's like, you know, realistically, unless you're, you know, like Darrell who stuck it out through like an amazing, like crazy run,

like you want to, you have to think about the next thing. And I would think you're, and films are starting to happen for you then. You obviously wrote Brother Solomon, McGruber eventually happens. Like, you have to have that kind of split mindset, I would think. I mean, you wanted to vote 110% of your energy to SNL, but are you also thinking along those in those years like I want to do a movie, I want to try it out. I mean, I've seen it succeed

for many others here. I should give it a shot. Well, definitely it's nerve racking because during your summer breaks, you'll go off and you'll hear about all these people doing parts in movies and stuff like that. I rarely was you know, I just

people weren't coming after me for that kind of stuff. for you know and and um that was hard to take you're like what what why don't anybody like hmm um when did when did brother solomon happen in that brother solomon was uh part of uh when when i left uh carsey werner and uh by the way it's worth noting that they were very good to me too carsey winner is the production company sure that ran 70 show and so mark and And Mark Brazil and Tom Werner and Marcy Carsey were just so supportive and let me go. But the one stipulation was I had to write a script for them, a movie script.

Yep. And I would get paid for it. It's like, wait, you're going to pay me to write a movie script? That's a punishment. Yeah, exactly. I love penalties. So there was this pilot that I had written called Dos Armanos, and they wanted me to try to turn that into a movie. So that's what I did, and it turned into the brother Solomon. And, you know,

they, they helped us make that. So what, how do you look back on that one in terms of obviously to not set the box office world on fire, sadly? But like, do you, are you proud of it? Do you feel like what, what did you learn from that experience in terms of? I think I learned a lot from that experience. It was, it was, you know, I went in there and I, I'm, I'm pretty stubborn with stuff, but I was not in a situation where I could really call any of the shots. So it was a great learning experience. You know, Bob Odenkirk directed it, and he's awesome. And, you know, I feel like I learned stuff about screenplay structure,

about my own gifts and lack of gifts as an actor. it was a big learning experience like it and I you know I love the movie but it you know it it was just a big learning experience and what do you take away from and we we always talk about this and we rightfully should because I'm team McGruber all the way which is like something like up until the opening of it yeah I would think Like, it's probably, I don't know, you tell me, was it testing well? Were people, like, high on it? Because while now, hopefully, we're willing into existence a sequel because of this diehard fan base, it wasn't a huge box office hit at the time.

Yeah. Were you surprised by that? Like, up until opening weekend, you were like, I did it. I cracked it. It's going to happen. I wasn't surprised by it. I was, you know, I still, I still wonder what it was, was it, you know, I understand why, and I'll tell you that that experience, like going into this show that I'm so proud of, the last man on earth, you know, it comes out in two days and I'm so proud of the show, but I'm prepared for people to not watch it.

and I'll be okay with that if that happens because of the experience I have with McGruber where you realize like, okay, we were so proud of that movie and they're still very proud and then you go and you just watch it, you know. It finds his own life, like even if the first thing. Well, it was just, you know, it's devastating that weekend. You're just like, what are you supposed to do? Like, I thought this was good. Maybe I just am wrong.

I don't know. And, you know, and it didn't even get reviewed that poorly. there were some great reviews from some very reputable reviewers in there it got slammed by a lot of people but then again we didn't expect it to get any great reviews it's like it's a you know a movie made by three fucked up dudes and we were basically allowed to do whatever we wanted and so what I it just taught me like the only thing you can control is how proud you are of something and like don't compromise fight fight when you need to fight pick your battles i keep hearing pick your battles but i'm a pick every battle person yeah and that's the that's the thing about this show that has been wonderful is like even in McGruber it all turned out

just how we wanted it to but like you know I still I was not you know I it's I was not in the I was not the decision maker right um you're making a studio film it's a decent budget

they were very supportive and stuff like that and I'm not you know but but but like that's the thing with this show is that I I am I like get to be kind of the decision

you know kind of the main decision maker I guess and then like I'm not gonna you know it's I'm stubborn and I'm like and I've on this one it's you know there you just with with this

scenario you got studio and you got network and it's like you know you got a there are so many different opinions and everyone is valid but it's like not everyone is valid some are just stupid but that's the thing I have really stupid ones but it's my show so like you know I'd I'd rather I'll be wrong with my own decision than actually that's not true I would like to be right with somebody else's decision right that's fine with me right but I feel like I'm I'm reasonable and I will listen to opinions but

like, pick your own battles is not something that I do. I pick every battle and I fucking fight it and I, I dig in and, and, you know, I hope people will watch this show and and recognize that because it's, it's a show that we don't compromise, compromise very often. Right. And, and I think it shows in the show. I, you know, it's, but it, but at the same time, it's like, who the fuck knows, you

You know, maybe nobody watches it. And I can live with that because this is exactly the show I wanted to make. Not exactly. I wish that I could say fuck. Not even the F word. And there are, you know, a couple little things that you just can't do because of network TV. Sure. But, like, I'll say Fox was, Fox freaking held to their end of the bargain and really, like, you know, every once in a while would be uncomfortable with different things.

And then if we fought enough and they knew it was important to us, they were like, all right, we trust you. And it's, you know, I have a great deal of respect for both them and the studio for, for, you know. Go and see some weird places. Yeah, I mean, they really, like, and I'm very happy because we've just been getting back these reviews that have been excitingly positive and, you know, I'm, I really hope that the show does well because. of their standing behind us, I wanted to do well for them. Yeah. That's the main thing. Like, I can handle it.

If it doesn't do well, we gave it our best, whatever. But I really wanted to do well for them because they really, they really, you know, it's a different show. And I want them to be rewarded for trying out something that's so different. Well, and this will help other insane ideas like yours, not necessarily from you, but other interesting talents. They'll take more risks, frankly. If this one succeeds, it's not just about your show. I mean, I'm not saying that, look, there have been a million risky shows out there. I'm not trying to pretend like this is the groundbreaking one.

The riskiest show of all time or that, you know, nobody's ever taken a risk. You know, it's every show is risky. That it's on a network. And frankly, when I saw this, I was like, wow, this is on Fox. Like, this is a little out there. And I'll even, I'll say like this, you know, I know that the, I think that the, the way this, the current state of television. There's so much good stuff out there

and God, so many awesome shows on cable and I think the networks have been losing audience to cable obviously and this was, we got in at this this very lucky time when they're like, well, let's try something that is a little more network or a little more cabley.

And so we, you know, but still there's that thing of like, you know, they still want it to be a mass. It seems like it lives at Fox and it's something their audience was like. So, and I totally get that. But it's, you know, so it was a lot of,

a lot of conversations about what, you know, just figuring out a way that we don't compromise the show at all, but that we, we, you know, make them feel comfortable with it and that it's a tricky process and a frustrating process at times but like you know I'll say as frustrated as I could get

sometimes with the notes they would make the show better for sure because in having to address their notes there are very few times when by going through the process of addressing something you didn't need fixing you realize it did need fixing

and maybe it wasn't the solution wasn't what they were pitching. But at least you re-examined it and found a different way that made it better. Before I let you go, I have to ask you, on the McGruber tip,

I'm obsessed with Val Kilmer. I always happen. I literally have a Willow comic hanging here that he autographed to me. Peck, Peck, Peck. It's a proud moment in my life. He's an iconic class. He's a unique dude.

Give me like quintessential, bizarre Val Kilmer, like in it the best possible way. What's your indelible image memory of working with Val? He's, here's what I'll say about him. everything you said is he's one of a kind just incredibly intelligent

and bizarre but the main memory I have of him is showing up one day to work John Solomon who's one of the three amigos with McGruber and is working on Last Man on Earth now we were together and he was wearing this cowboy shirt

all I wear are plaid shirts and I looked over there and I said oh that's a great shirt isn't that's the kind of shirt I would wear and John said yeah yeah that is a definite forte shirt shirt he took this he just ripped the shirt off and handed it to me and that's that's the kind of person Val is and then he was just walking around shirtless for a while until he got another shirt

and it was just you know he's just sweetheart. He is. And as you say, super, super bright. So great. And did you ever,

have we talked about this? I don't know. He lived with me for a while. Tell me. No. I didn't know. He, you know,

had this, this, uh, big ranch in New Mexico, but he would, he would have a second place in Malibu. And, and he was going to move

into another place in Malibu, but he didn't know where the other place, he hadn't found a place yet. and he was, you know, for some reason he thought he would have found a place and he had to get out of his other place earlier, you know, before he had found this place. So he said, can I stay with you while I'm looking for this place? And I thought, oh, sure, thinking a couple days. Well, the second he comes and then the second day that we're there is the assistant shows up with like two huge duffel bags of books. And I'm like, oh, this is, this might be a little.

This is the new normal for me. it was the best experience of all time being like he is just such a delightful like it's such a gift to have him in my life like it uh you know the the 20 year old version of me who was oh my god huge doors fan and just like blown away by by him and the doors you know would not believe that there'd be a time when i'm sitting at my my dining room table and he's sitting across from me one morning and we're both doing our own shit and he has his stereo playing

and you know Roadhouse Blues comes on and we both just I'm a huge Doris fan so we're both we both just start singing singing Roadhouse Blues and and then we followed it up with LA Woman

and and it just it was just a moment like oh my God this is freaking my life you know this person who I just come to think of as a, you know, just a, a buddy was, it was, it's like, oh, shit, wait a second, that's Val Kilmer. He's my, and he's my roommate. How long did that go on?

That was, you know, off and on. He was, God, he was making a movie at the time. So he would go in and out. It wasn't, you know, there's not any sad element to this. Like, it's just a purely like this frigging fun period of time where, which I'll never forget. Well, if you want to look, I mean, back in the day, indoors is amazing. But in terms of like comedy lead performances, I mean, real genius. Oh, real genius.

He's so great. Brilliant. Top secret, obviously, he's, he is so great. And then top gun, he's so good. I'm just like, he's great. One of my favorite roles of all time is his Doc Holiday. Oh, yeah. It's so good.

I have two guns, one for each of you. Yeah. You want to grab a random question or two from the creepy Indiana Jones fedora? And I'll let you on your way. Don't be frightened. do you seem frightened. There's nothing on here. Seriously?

Is there literally nothing on there? There's nothing on there. There's a question mark. There's a part of a letter and a question mark. Someone's getting fired. Okay. Now I only have to do one more. Okay.

No, I'm kidding. Fair enough. No, that seems like a good part of the bargain. French fries or onion rings. Onion rings. Wow. Done. Did it.

Drop the mic. Okay, let's see. These are, though. I'll go through the whole hat. Were you ever grounded? And for what? I was grounded several times. The one that jumps out at me.

This is horrible. Sounds wonderful from my perspective. The one that jumps out of me the most, oh, geez, this is horrible. I was sitting with my mom and my buddy. And I forget what happened, but I mooned my mom for some reason. My mom laughs. And then my buddy says, oh, my God, my mom would kill me if I ever did that. And my mom's like, saw that.

And she was like, oh, yeah, that's right. Get up to your room. And she went nuts. And she goes up to my room and threw my guitar out the window. And it was just like, it was a mess. There's a lesson to the kids out there. Don't moon your mom, kids. Or at least don't know a friend that rats you out.

What was I thinking? Looting my mom anyway. It's a wrong mood. You determine your own. There was no sexual element to that. I wasn't reading anything into it. I don't know why you mentioned that. When I was a kid,

my hero was my dad I love my dad still always my hero when was the last time you threw up it was pretty recently actually what's going on in your life dude you're a grown man why are you throwing up it was well

there was a was it was it illness related is there a drink involved? No, I haven't thrown up from drinking in a long time. Not to say I don't have a drinking problem. I vomited

from illness within the last year. Okay. God, I can't remember what it like, it was before we started the production of the show because the show has been so time consuming. You don't have time to throw up. I don't have time to throw up. I don't have time to throw.

up and every once in a while I'd feel like maybe I was starting to get sick and then it would just go away. Somehow it hasn't settled in okay. You'll do one more. Okay, one more. Unless you want me to, you can call me off. No, you, you, you, you, favorite Godfather movie. Three, for sure.

Stop. Get out of my office. You know what? It's underrated. I will say it gets a bad rap. It's not a horrible movie. I know that most people would answer Godfather too. Yeah. I love number one. I love it. I mean, that's...

It's a perfect movie. They both are. They both are. And I have to watch two again. I really recently watched the first one. So I want to watch the second one. But I still, I, you know, I love it when,

but then, wait, the second one then is when De Niro is young. The De Niro's stuff in the second one, is probably the best of the trilogy. That music kicks in. You want to go watch, California? I love that.

That stuff where, Michael, the first, one is the one where Michael goes in and shoots the... Yes, at the end, the whole group of them, yeah, yeah. I mean, that, God, it's just kind of, God, it's mind-going, yeah. All right, Will and I are going to go watch Godfather the trilogy. Why not? You've got 10 hours on your hand.

Now, I feel bad. I thought Godfather 3 was great, too. It's all right. It's just like, how do you live up to the first two? Exactly. And I have a feeling if he had made that third one way closer to the first two, might have, exactly.

You know, it's just, the expectations were. And we didn't have Duval. There was that contract dispute. They had George Hamilton and said, who was fine, but I mean,

Duval, Tom Hagan. Come on. We need Tom Hagan. Yeah. Congratulations yet again. Thank you very much. Honestly,

it's a hell of a piece of work. I hope everybody checks out. I usually don't keep swag, but I've got my ball right here. Thanks for sending this. I know you sent it yourself, the Wilson-esque ball. That is,

you know, I drew all the faces on the ball. that actual here you can draw over it for me they must have like copied copied it because i didn't draw all the balls all right you guys were uh but i'm saying in the show when you see the balls those are the legit ones that those are all there is one face that was not drawn by me it was on one of the colored ping pong balls i think they're thomas and max okay good to know if you watch again it's the i have a definite uh what am i what's the word artistic technique what's the

I can't think I've been go take a nap well it's okay I haven't eaten eat something go eat something and make some more shows

I'm so hungry what are you gonna go eat I don't know just anything anything at all onion rings there you can sound great it's good to see

well congrats it's good to see you thank you very much I'm so happy you liked it too thanks buddy that's the show guys I'm Josh Horowitz

this has been happy say I confused hope you've enjoyed the show hit me up Twitter, Joshua Horowitz. Go over to Wolfpop.com. Check out all the amazing shows over there. And most importantly, check back in next week for another edition of Happy, Sad, Confused.

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