Happy Sad Confused - Zachary Levi

Episode Date: March 20, 2023

It's been quite the journey for Zachary Levi -- for both professional success and more importantly, personal satisfaction and happiness. Here he joins Josh for an honest chat about his path to self love and of course his superhero journeys, from THOR and GUARDIANS OF THE GALAXY to SHAZAM! SUPPORT THE SHOW BY SUPPORTING OUR SPONSORS! BETTERHELP -- This episode is sponsored by/brought to you by BetterHelp. Visit BetterHelp.com/HSC today to get 10% off your first month. HONEY--Get PayPal Honey for FREE at JoinHoney.com/HSC BOLL & BRANCH -- Get 15% off your first order when you use promo code HSC at bollandbranch.com Join Josh for upcoming LIVE Happy Sad Confused events in New York! March 22 -- Jodie Comer. ⁠Get your tickets here.⁠ March 28 -- Matthew Rhys. ⁠Get your tickets here. ⁠ To watch episodes of Happy Sad Confused, subscribe to ⁠Josh's youtube channel here⁠! Check out the ⁠Happy Sad Confused patreon here⁠! We've got discount codes to live events, merch, early access, exclusive episodes of GAME NIGHT, video versions of the podcast, and more! For all of your media headlines remember to subscribe to ⁠The Wakeup newsletter here⁠! Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

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Ready with exceptional service every step of the way. Let's dream together. Visit Merchantsbank.com to get started. Merchants Bank is a proud member FDIC. Prepare your ears, humans. Happy, Sad, Confused begins now. Today on Happy, Sad Confused, Zachary Levi, from Shazam and superheroes to finding self-love.

Hey guys, I'm Josh Horowitz, and welcome to another edition of Happy, Sad, Confused. Yes, first-time guest on the pod today, Mr. Zachary Levi, Shazam himself, talking about the latest outing in the DC EU. That is, of course, Shazam Fury of the Gods. This is a great chat. He's a thoughtful guy, very open and honest. You're going to dig it. Trust me. More on Zach in just a second. But first, I want to give you guys some updates on some really cool live events we've got coming up. All right, guys. So March 22nd, just about, ooh, as I tape this couple days away, very soon. So March 22nd, get in on this New York City, come on out in person. There is a virtual option. It's me and Jody Comer.

This is going to be special. At the Symphony Space on the Upper West Side, we're going to talk about everything. Killing Eve, the last duel, upcoming projects, the new Broadway debut. It's going to be a fun night in New York City. Come on out. And we're so excited to say that we are offering now a virtual option. We weren't able to at first, but we made it work, guys. So no matter where you are on the planet, join us live for this special edition of Happy Say I Confused that benefits my mom. wonderful nonprofit group Harlem is. So, yes, link in the show notes.

You know what to do. But come on out, guys. If you can be there in person, great. If not, join us virtually. It's going to be fantastic. Then March 28th, another first-time guest, like Mr. Zachary Levi on the podcast, is Matthew Reese, the charming, the dashing,

the talented Matthew Reese. He is currently being seen in the new season of Perry Mason, but we're going to, again, dig into everything. You know I'm going to talk about brothers and sisters. and the Americans and his film work and his stage work, all of it. March 28th, that's at 92 NY. Again, join us in person if you can. There are virtual tickets available for that as well.

All the info in the show notes. Okay, so those are the two big live events, and there's more to come. Of course, remember, you get the first access to all of these events on our Patreon. Patreon.com slash happy, sad, confused. used. Okay, so that's enough of the exciting plugs except to say if you aren't subscribed all rights to the podcast, what are you doing? Get in on that, whether it's iTunes or Stitcher, whatever your platform is, Spotify, where you can now watch the podcast as well. Remember, video versions are available on YouTube. You know what to do. Okay, so let's talk Zachary Levi.

So the movie is out there, guys. This isn't a big spoiler conversation, though. There is one part of this chat, I want to get this up and out in front, a little bit of it is a spoiler section. It's probably about two or three minutes of it, and there is a spoiler warning. So if you haven't seen Shazam, Fury of the Gods, just keep your ears peeled because there's a little spoiler moment, roughly halfway through the conversation. But Zach's a really great conversation. He's, you know, one of these guys, like the nerd made good. The nerd turned into a superhero, and we love that kind of story.

He loves video games and comic books and musicals. And he's just into all the fun stuff growing up that we all were. And now he is a superhero in his own right. And the new movie is Shazam Fury of the Gods. And these are fun movies. I mean, look, I know it's like not the cool movie to love because Shazam is more family-friendly. But like, is it so wrong that superhero movies can be for the whole family

and a little more light-hearted? I, for one, am happy that these films exist. I hope he gets to do more of them, plus period of the gods features. So many folks we love, Rachel Zagler, Helen Mirren, and all the regulars from the first one. Check it out. It's in theaters now. And as I said, Zach is a very open, introspective conversation. He wrote a memoir last year about his kind of mental breakdown that he had a few years back,

right on the eve, actually, of getting the Shazam role. And I think it's great that he talks so much about mental health and the trouble that he's had to deal with and how he's come out of it on the other side and how it is still it will always be a struggle as it is for so many of us so I think you're going to find some wisdom some fun stories and a lot of nerding out in this conversation we talk about his auditions way back when for Captain America and Guardians of the Galaxy his love of video games past present and future he's a big last of us guys fan guys just like all of us so I think you're going to relate to a lot of

lot of this conversation, as I did. And yeah, we got a chance to meet up in person. This was at the very end of his press store. So, as always, very appreciative to all the publicists, but also, most especially, Zach himself for finding time in the schedule to connect on, you know, a meaningful level, I think. Um, okay, final plug. Remember to review, rate and subscribe to happy second fused, spread the good word. Follow me on all social medias, Joshua Horowitz. And come on out if you can, New York City. Two exciting events, March 22nd and 28th. All right, here it is. My Conversation with Shazam himself, Mr. Zachary Leva. This is the first time you've been on the podcast, Zach. We've talked so many different times.

Congratulations in the movie. Thanks for the time. Well, thanks for finally having me on your podcast. I figured finally two movies in, you finally earned it. Two movies in, I finally earned it, yeah. Okay, so talk to me first. This is, we're talking at the end of another crazy press tour. Yeah. How do you keep sane during these press stores? Because like, look, I mean, it's not digging ditches.

You're not in a coal mine. True. You're all over the place. I see you on Instagram. You've been traveling the world on this. How do you maintain happiness and peace in the eye of the storm? Well, like you said, it's not digging ditches. It's not fighting foreign wars, you know, all these things.

I do think it's important. that we allow ourselves the grace to, regardless of what life you live or vocation you're in, we should allow ourselves the grace to have our critiques, have our things that we wish could be better or different or whatever. And then I allow myself that. But then I have, you know, try to give myself context and perspective and say, yeah, and but also you're getting paid for this. I'm getting paid to fly around the world, you know, first class and staying in beautiful hotels and eating wonderful meals and meeting lovely people like yourself who are who like me want me to be there and want to ask me questions about who I am and the superhero I play so you know it's not

if you'd really just allow that to sink in and you go this is my job this is what I'm being paid for that helps to maintain I think for at least for me a humility a gratitude and therefore a better vantage point on what it all is because as you know you know you know you know, um, junkets, um, press junkets, which you do a lot of while you're doing all this. Podcasts to me are kind of the best. I love podcasts. I love long form conversation because you can actually have a conversation. Oh yeah. This is the therapy for me. Honestly, I started this nine years ago because I had like yourself done junkets forever and my brain was over. It was done. You get five minutes to ask, you know, oftentimes questions that you need to be kind of, you know,

forgive me for saying, but banal or like kind of clicky enough to be like, you know, like on both tours now, the number one question, one of the number one questions is always like, so if you could have a superpower, what would it be? Now, listen, one could get very tired of hearing that question and answering that question, but what I try to do is just recognize that the person across from me is just trying to do a job. They're trying to do their job. And yes, maybe there could be more interesting questions that could be asked. But to the extent that I can just, okay, oh gosh darn, I have to reintroduce a little more enthusiasm or energy to just answer that kindly and as authentically as possible. And you do that, sure, a bunch of

different times, but it's still, you know, it's, also listen, I love human beings. So, and I'm a huge extrovert, shocker. So it doesn't drain me. You know, all these things don't drain me. Like, they might drain other people. I don't know what it's like to be a hardcore introvert and have to go through junkets. And you're like, you know, and also your sleep schedules all. messed up because you're flying to all these different places and your body clock's like, where are you right now? Yeah, Joaquin Phoenix doesn't have the same answer to that question. He's not like, I'm feeding off your energy, Josh.

Although he seems like an incredibly interesting person who, if given the right circumstances, you know, can I'm sure probably make it through these days too in a way that is maybe enjoyable for him. I think that's one of the biggest things. You just have to understand how do you need to look at it and how do you need to do it. in order to get through it and enjoy it as best you can and help other people to enjoy it along the way. And you know, you do that and it's a much easier,

more enjoyable experience. I would also imagine, we've had kind of aspects of this conversation before, there's that second site of like the journey that you've been on and the appreciation of where you're at. And you know, this ain't your first rodeo, you've been through it. You've had the ups, you've had the downs. And to be where you are, to not only have one Shazam movie,

but two Shazam movies that people are really responding to well, you have to take like some real satisfaction because you know how many forks in the road there are and how it's it's sure it's talent but a lot of its luck and right place right time oh yeah and that has to never escape your brain no never it never should it should never feel I don't know I don't think anybody really deserves this stuff you know like like if you really think about like deserve but I mean does anybody does anybody deserve anything I don't You know, we can unpack that on a much larger philosophical conversation, but I think it's always particularly for somebody in my position. It's like, wow, I dreamt about being this guy, not just a working successful actor, which I've been able to somehow manifest in this almost 25 years of doing this, which is insane.

But then I get to be a superhero that I always dreamed about being ever since I was little kid. And then as an actor dreaming about, you know, getting one of these plum roles. think honestly this is one of the most plum because I have way more fun and I think a lot of other superheroes might have because they are serious adults as they need to be the world is constantly in peril if you read any comic books or see the movies the world is constantly in peril so you have adult superheroes that must be very diligent about that and I get to you know be this kind of you know goofball and it just it's so much fun and so none of that is lost on me none of that is ever taken for granted at all I I don't want to ever take it

for granted i don't ever want to feel like this is normal because this is not normal there are so many people that dream of living the life that i get to live and i am going to respect and appreciate that for as long as i live and but but the really the one of the upswings of all that is when you do look at life like that it's so much better life is better then you're not constantly in a place of feeling like you're being jipped or you're missing out on something or somebody's you know whatever it is like I think that there's a huge there's a real truth about energy and and attraction and manifestation and all that stuff and if you're constantly in a negative place like I was not too long ago six years ago but you know when I was having this mental breakdown that

I had I was not attracting the things that I wanted in my life I was not I was not becoming capable of handling the responsibility of the things that I wanted to bring into my life And then going to therapy, having this insane, life-saving, life-changing experience in therapy, learning that I never loved myself, which was like, what the heck? I had no idea about that. I always assumed I loved myself. Nope, didn't. Can I impact that?

Yeah, let's go. So how does that revelation happen? Is that like literally, and obviously you don't have to go as deep as you want to. But like, is that with a therapist that literally says to you, do you love yourself? Like, have you ever thought about it? Like, is it like... Well, you know, listen, I went to, I went to, uh, worked with this organization in Connecticut that basically, I mean, I had a dozen different modalities of therapy.

I mean, I had like a, uh, a psychiatrist, psychotherapist and a dialectic behavioral therapist, art therapist, meditation therapist, life coach, nutritionist, trainer of the gym four days a week, Pilates, yoga, like all of these things. I was in a bad place. You knew you were broken. I was broke. I did not want to live anymore and I didn't know why. And there was so much that I needed to learn.

And I didn't even learn all of it there. I've learned continuously since, you know, leaving that place. But some of the main, main work that I did there and the things that I learned, one of those big things was, yes, I did not love myself. And it took a lot of these different people in this three weeks of intensive therapy asking me various questions along the way that all kind of lead you there, you know. And, but one of the biggest, certainly, one of the biggest revelations I had, I was with, I think it was my dialectic behavioral therapist, DBT, as it's known in short, and she had asked me, by the way, a question that I have no doubt I had been asked before, but it never fully clicked. And that's another thing about therapy. You know, you could hear a thing or, you know, a dozen times. A dozen, exactly. And it won't click until it actually clicks. But she said, you know, when you, when you, when you, um, when you screw up, when you, you know, do something wrong or fail or whatever, you know, how do you talk to yourself? And I was like, well, you know, I investigate myself. I'm like, you idiot, you know, well, using much more colorful language than that, you F an idiot, you blah, blah, blah.

I don't even know what the rating on the back comment, whatever you want. Okay, well, you fucking idiot, you know, well, you're really fucked up, blah, blah. I mean, like really, really harsh ways that I talk to myself and they go, okay, would you talk that way to anybody that you love in your life? I was like, no. I mean, not, not aware. I wouldn't be aware of it. I wouldn't intentionally do that. Absolutely not.

And they said, okay, so then why do you talk to yourself that way? And right in that, it was like that math. And I was like, oh, oh, oh, God. Oh my God. If the indication of how you see yourself is how you talk to yourself. And by the way, it is one of the largest indicators of how you see and feel about yourself is how you talk to yourself. If that's the case, then no. No, I did not love myself.

I did not like myself even a lot of the time, you know. So that was a huge revelation. And then in the last six years, it's just been a lot of working on that, working on figuring out, you know, how to balance my life, how to be a healthier version of me, physically, mentally, emotionally, spiritually, all of that stuff. And one of the big ways that you do that is you take your thoughts captive. Every time I start to harsh on myself as I did, I went, whoa, whoa, wait a minute.

Nope. This is exactly what you do. And I learned it from my parents, who learned it from their parents, who learned it from, you know, it's all this. This is inherited generational trauma. And so you can forgive all of it. You can accept all of it. It's all doable. You just have to recognize that everyone's doing their best. We just get bad programming along the way. It's so the challenge, obviously, among many, is that you're, especially in your profession, it's so based on constant judgment and evaluation. So it's hard to turn off that switch. I mean, you know, as we talk, we're about to go into opening weekend and the numbers will be great or good or not great or whatever and then the reviews will be great or not good and and you're going to have to just navigate that again and probably turn off that part of your brain that wants to eviscerate yourself listen man uh yeah i mean it's already been tough i i am i i most actors can't watch himself on screen you it's very difficult to divorce yourself from the experience you know you were

having while shooting those scenes and what you were thinking and what you were feeling and you know I don't know. And I'm constantly just critiquing myself physically like stand up straight, you buffoon. Like my gosh, your posture is horrible. Like all of the entire movie. I just can't help it. And also looking at myself and my performance choices and me like, oh man, like you're such an idiot there. That da, da, da, da, da. Like, it's very, very difficult. It's very difficult. But, you know, listen, I did my best. I have to accept that I know that I did my best and all the other stuff is out of your hands. But yeah, I mean, even on like on, you know, on Twitter today, uh, scrolling through, There's people that have, you know, really some advanced reviews

or just, you know, fans who have seen it. And there's this incredibly positive stuff out there. And then, of course, there's these other people, like the internet is full of, which is, you know, a very just negative to be negative people who, like there's a whole contingent of comic book fans that it's really unfortunate that there's this one particular group of people that think I, well they don't like me because I don't I don't agree with them on other comic book movies and you know who I'm talking about and and but instead of there being a conversation like they take so many of my words or things completely out of context they and then they go stir up all the other all the other other people that they know online and they all just want to attack and attack and attack and attack and it's really sad because I I mean this is just one example of so many examples of the amount of of just venom and toxicity and bullying that goes on in these cyber dimensions.

And people, they really get off on it because it's like they feel very powerless. I mean, I, again, so what I try to do is I just try to empathize and go, oh, these people that are being so vicious online, I can only assume that they are very powerless people who need to feel the flex by being, you know, anonymously online, tearing other people down and hoping, and for the real. reactions and then they feel bolstered in that and it's just it's it's sad but I know I can see through that filter so I don't allow it or I try not to allow it to creep in and make me start you know being negative with myself you know this show is brought to you by better help let's talk about

therapy guys I'm so happy I can even say that in 2023 because back in the day it felt like you weren't allowed to talk openly about therapy I've had it in the past it's helped me in my personal and professional life, and it's helped so many friends and family members too. Let's be real, guys. If you're thinking of starting therapy, there's no better day than today, and that's where better help comes into play. It's entirely online, guys. It's designed to be convenient, to be flexible, and suited to your schedule, to your very busy schedule. All you have to do is fill out a brief questionnaire and get matched with a licensed therapist, and you can switch therapists at any time for no additional charge. You deserve help, guys. It's okay to ask for help,

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order when you use promo code H-S-C at bowl and branch.com exclusions apply C-Site for details. That's Boland Branch, B-O-L-L-L-A-N-D, B-R-A-N-C-H dot com, promo code, H-S-C. How would you handle, okay, so prior to kind of like this kind of change in philosophy and change in life, and which coincidentally or not coincided with Chazan. Oh, yeah, very much. Um, so how had you handled it? Again, this has come before, even in our conversations, like, you were very close to getting Peter Quill. You almost got Star Wars.

Pretty close. You were, you were in the running. Yeah. Um, you were, you audition for Captain America. So like, when those like come and they feel close and you're like, oh my God, the next 10 years of my life, I'm going to be a garden of the galaxy with James Gunn. We're going to kill it. Yeah.

I mean, yeah, it's, it's, well, at those points, at those points, in my life, I didn't know it at the time, but I was a very unheeled, broken person. You know, I felt like I was more whole, but so, in fact, it's really crazy to think about that I was somehow able to manage surviving through so much of my, you know, 18 to 37 when I had my breakdown. I mean, I, you know, for all that time, I was, I was white knuckling it through and all the, all the rejection as an actor, you know, it's not like you're going and saying. selling vacuums and people reject the vacuum, they're rejecting you on some level, which is

very, I don't like your face. Yeah, I don't like your face. Literally. Literally. I mean, you know, or not, and, and even though they, they, they might not have anything to do with the value of it, but rather they're looking for just a different type of thing. But it's very difficult to not feel like they hate me or whatever, you know. Yes. But somehow I was able to really navigate almost all that and never, I never really truly dragged me down. Maybe it's just because I felt so supremely confident in my calling to be an actor. And I always felt like, you know, ever since I was a little kid, I was meant to do it.

But I don't know. I mean, listen, you know, certainly as I got older, just because like it, you know, like mental health is like dental health. Like it starts as a little cavity. But if you don't get in there and fix it, it becomes much worse in time. So when I was younger, actually, my mental health, though my things were askew and off, it hadn't really, really rotted as much yet, you know. And by the time I, then I was 37, it had gotten to the point where I needed a full-blown root canal, you know, mental root canal.

So, you know, Captain America, I mean, that was quite some time. And there were other things that were kind of even before that. I can't remember exactly. But I remember, I remember going for Captain American. I was thinking, well, you know, I look like Rogers pre-serum. I got that part, no. Like, clearly they could help me work out and I could get big and I, you know. But wasn't meant to be.

I didn't, I did not have that energy. Chris Evans had that energy. Did you get the costume on? Was that one of those? No, no, no, no, I didn't make that far, no, no, no. I know I had a great read. I just wasn't their guy, you know? And then as far as, you know, Star Lord, listen, I mean, I,

it was kind of a crazy sequence because I was cast as Fandrell the Dashing in the original Thor film Kenneth Brano directed, was amped to, I was like, oh my God, I did. Captain American, whatever. Dude, I get to be Errol Flynn. I get, you know, this swashbuckling Lethario, like, come on, what a fun role. Directed by Kenneth Bronna, with an English accent.

Like, he even liked my English accent enough to hire me, the American to do it. I was like, this is tits. This is great. Let's go. And then, but Chuck, you know, which was also a massive blessing in my life, but had these moments that were heartbreaking where they, like last second, they pick

us up for like an additional six episodes and they said you can't go do that movie and i was crestfallen i was so bummed uh and had to you know and that and that role went and josh dallas ultimately played that role so well and he was in the first film and but then that uh circled back with the second one with with with um basically the same thing happens to him uh he's on once in one a time. He can't do it. Figey's like, hey, would, you know, was Zach going to take this role again? And to be honest, look, and I, and I, I insisted on talking to Kevin about it because I, for, for two reasons. One, I saw the first movie and I didn't really feel like the

Warriors three were utilized in that grade of a way. And I was like, is that going to be the case again, because if it is, I don't really want to do that, you know, and he's like, no, no, no, no, it's going to be a, you know, huge part of this movie. Not so much, uh, as it turned out. And, but the other thing I was like, hey, listen. I also don't want this to preclude me from being able to be another character. You know, like, if this is the only chip I get to play, then, you know, thanks, but I would rather wait for something else. He's like, no, no, no, you know, Chris was, you know, Johnny Storm, and then he got to be Captain America.

Also, Ray Stevenson was Punisher before he was false stag. I mean, there were a few, you know, kind of, technically, though, these were not, these were kind of Marvel tangential films, so it. This was prime Marvel, like within your, yeah, yeah. So it was like, he was kind of, you know, saying it could happen, but also I was like, whatever. Anyway, point is, ultimately, you know, it seemed like it would all be fine. So I did the film, the Warriors 3 weren't really used all as much as I hope they were going to be used. But I appreciated the job.

And, and to his credit, right after that, Guardians was kicking on. And so they were like, and James, I knew James through friends and mafia, games. nights and stuff like that. And he wanted me to come in read for it. And I did. And he was like, okay, let's do a call back. And I did that. And it's like, okay, we're going to screen test you. You know, you might very well be the guy. And it ultimately didn't work out. And that that one hurt because it really felt like, I don't know, the way that we get into our own heads of like, oh, this is, I think this is it. Right. And then our expectations get so high. And really so much of our disappointment, if maybe not all of the disappointment we feel in this life is just

unmet expectations so don't have expectations the moral of the story don't have expectations do you watch the movies did it take you a while to like could you walk because like pratt's obviously great in that but i don't listen that Chris is so good in that role and no i saw it uh in fact i think i was at the premiere i think i went to the premiere i didn't just do this i wasn't gonna yeah i wasn't gonna you know be salty about it or whatever i mean i again it's like if anything i wasn't angry with anybody else. I was angry with me. I was like, you could have done better. You screwed it up. You did this instead of that. Whatever it was, as opposed to just recognizing that it just wasn't mine. And, you know, then going through all this therapy and then like you were saying, on the

heels of that, I'm still basically finishing my therapy and I get this audition after I'd already passed on the audition for Shazam two months prior. Like, I'm never going to get that job. Again, I was in a place where I wasn't loving myself or believing in myself. But, so, passed on it two months later i'm finishing up therapy here comes this other audition for a supporting role which turned out to be super freddie adam brodie's role which is also so crazy that he and i are these josh schwartz kind of ciphers in the whole josh schwartz uh you know a universe the josh schwartz multiverse exactly um but i i unbeknownst to me i was auditioning for that role they was all very you know under locking key and they see that they're like oh actually that's great but you could be

shazam and then and then a week later i'm shazam and i really I owe all of that, I fully believe, or at least a large part of it, to going and doing that work. Because I really believe, I mean, aside from the fact that these roles were meant for Chris Evans and for Chris Pratt and all the Chris's, all the Chris's and all the Ryans, they have all the jobs. Actually, Zaks are doing pretty good in Hollywood, too. Let's be honest. But, you know, aside from the fact that these were their journeys and these were meant to be theirs or whatever, I wasn't ready for those, clearly. I hadn't done enough work on me to be able to handle whatever the responsibility would come with such a film and a franchise

and I needed to be in a better place and I got and I just started getting to that place and the universe God said boom cool I'm responding to that like I see your intention I see the work and I know that you're sticking to it and you're dedicating to this and you're going to be ready to handle all of these things well done finally you you know you you realize that

So, yeah, it's all very, it's all kismet to me and synchronistic and, and so therefore, you're able to, and the moment it was harder, but certainly now, I can't think of another superhero I would rather play. And I know that sounds biased and assuredly, assuredly I can't remove all of my bias. But come on, I am literally paid to be a teenager superhero in my body. Like, I get to be a kid again. Who gets paid to be a kid again? only actors and only rarely because there's not that many roles that are these things you know so okay so take me to the set of the first Shazam because that's a film that just radiates with joy and warmth

as this does the second one as well and again I'm sure there was gratitude and happiness I mean it strikes me like you had been look you'd been number one on the call sheet before obviously for many years for Chuck and other things but you're in this much different place this much different context this

very elevated circumstance yet I don't feel any tension emanating from that film. I feel like love and happiness and joy. And that starts with you and with David on set, I would imagine. Yeah, I mean, listen, like any collective organism, it's top down, you know. I wish more businesses, I wish more industries understood this and really led with that and understood the responsibility that comes with being a leader. And by the way, but also the privilege, the opportunity.

that you get to go and protect and foster and care for the people that you are, you have, whether you like it or not, you were elevated above. As the number one on a call sheet, you have certain push and pull and clout that other people don't. And you have to recognize that. That's part of your job and responsibility, I believe. And so to that effect, and because I just love people so much, I mean, it's part of why I love being an actor so much.

I get to go work with hundreds. Like, not everybody does. gets to go work with a couple hundred people all milling about every day you know like you might but you might all be in a cubicle separated from each other like we're just this whole you know little circus this whole little three ring circus that that puts up tents and takes down tents and depending on the location and where you're going and it's just so much fun and uh and because this the heart of this film or the franchise the first film and this sequel is so much about the fun of it is the enjoyment of it is the wish fulfillment of it it's the family and the the the humor and the heart

and the charm the adventure and the spookiness that's even in there that you know very reminiscent of amblin lucas film kind of tone um that should be infused with as much enjoyment as possible and because i love fun so much uh you know like i'll i'll bring a speaker to work and we'll play music all day long or we'll joke we'll we'll have fun i try to gather people when we're not working and have barbecues and pool parties and things that build relationship build community because that's all stuff that only lends itself to the you know the finished product and making it a better thing um and and you know happy bees make tasty honey that that's that's that's what it is so i just want i just want to foster the happiest hive you've and you've added to the hive with some

amazing cast members this time around. I mean, that's got to be a good phone call to get when you're like, by the way, Helen Mirren is in. Oh, bro. I was so stoked. When I found out that Dame Helen Mirren was going to come and be Hespera and that Lucy Lou, who I've had a crush on for forever,

who's so badass, was going to be Calypso. And then Rachel Zegler, who I didn't know, but immediately came to know, and now the world is coming to know, what a bright and shining shooting star she is, who just, you know, graced us with her second stop up this insane ladder.

She's like, I'll come and play in your Shazam sandbox before I go be snow white and, you know, and the new lead of Hunger Games and all the things. So what delightful additions to the Shazamly, this trifecta of female awesomeness. And they were all so just down, so game, just roll up their sleeves and come have fun with us and just brought it. They're all just so, they're so different and so great in all of their respective roles. Today's episode of Happy, Sad, Confused, is sponsored by Honey, the easy way to save when shopping on your iPhone or computer. Are you guys like me, do you feel kind of a buzz when you find a deal?

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slash hc so i feel i can say this because i've seen this in commercials and i'll put a spoiler alert in this part but that we finally do see you mix it up with another major dc character oh yeah yeah you got so excited you're talking about no tag don't say anything it's in the commercial i didn't make the commercials i mean it is i mean yeah it is in commercials now which I'm a little torn about, but, yeah, it's, bro, it's so cool. That was such a cool thing to shoot. And even, like, the whole kind of mislead earlier on in the film,

which is so much fun. Again, spoiler word, if you haven't seen it, don't listen to the next two minutes or so. But, yeah, you have the misdirected with, like, the cutoff head as the Superman that was in the first one. We don't get Gal. Yeah. So was Gal in that scene, too?

Was she in the scene where you go to read? No, no, no. I mean, Gal, Gall shot all of her stuff remotely. She was working on a film, I think, in Europe. I can't remember where she was, but we shot with a body double on both the restaurant scene and then that last scene, and then we were able to comp it all in. Yeah, movie magic, baby, movie magic.

Yeah, I mean, I'm sure you probably have, like, a split mind on this because, like, from the beginning, there's been this excitement about Shazam finally coming to the screen, and then, like, the greedy comic book fans, like myself, are always like, yeah, but are you going to fight Black Adam? Are you going to fight Superman? Where's Wonder? It's like, can we just tell her own story?

Like, I mean, yeah, it is, listen, I mean, I, as a comic book reader and lover since I was a kid, like, I get it. You want to see them collide. So does David, so does Henry, so does Chris, so does Peter. Like, everybody, everybody understand. I mean, I want to do all the fun crossovers and all the fun team-ups. And, I mean, it'd be amazing. But I don't think people realize just how difficult.

All that actually is, like it's not, you would think, one would even hope that things, you know, are so easy that you can just make it happen that this actor and that actor and this other actor all have a schedule that works perfectly that you can go make these things or do these things or that even people have the interest or the, you know, whatever. I mean, you know, there's a way, there's so many nuanced things about it. And yeah, you hope that people can just appreciate what it is that you're doing for what it is worth and not always be bummed because it's not that. It's like, well, I don't know what to tell you, you know. So we've mentioned James gone a couple times. I mean, you go way back with James. It must be surreal to like now see him at the top with Peter of this DC. Yeah, I mean, I don't know.

I don't know that I would call it surreal to me. I mean, I think it's, I mean, like I was saying, none of this is normal. everything's surreal I guess but but it also to me kind of makes perfect sense I mean when I found out when I you know heard the news um I wasn't like oh my God I was like oh right no you're right yeah like that guy's got the resume I mean listen James I think has shown multiple times now that he's able to take a franchise and the world of that franchise and really build it out in a fantastic way. I mean, he's not more than just these two examples,

but specifically with Guardians of the Galaxy and the Suicide Squad. I, you know, not to knock Ayres and the original or anything like that, but I thought this, his, James', was a superior version of that film. And I thoroughly enjoyed it. And again, and that is a difficult thing to do. By the way, it's almost double difficult

because now, you know, David Ayers had his hands full in the first one because again it's a niche it wasn't this big thing IP that everybody knew right so how do you do that and then so so airs had already you know that he was tasked with that then james had to be tasked with doing that while also being held to some standard that was already set before him and still i think made a really fantastic film with great balance of all the action and the drama and the comedy and whatever and he did the same thing with guardians took this niche IP very few people that ever heard of and made it so mainstream that Now, you know, all, because there's a lot of people that are coming to the Marvel universe for the first time with these movies, right?

Yeah. Like, you know, not me, of course, but, but, you know, a lot of people are learning about Iron Man around the same time they're learning about Peter Quill. Right. And they're just as equal to them, which is really a testament because they weren't and haven't been in the comics for many, many, many, many years. And, you know, Guardians has a friggin' ride at Disneyland, for God's sake. I mean, that's how well James did and built that universe. for somebody like him to step into a visionary seat at D.C., and, by the way, I think smart to allow him to focus on the creative vision part,

while then Peter, who is his longtime manager, business partner, all of these things, and, you know, diplomat and businessman, allow him to focus on that stuff, and then see if we can't go build something that's cool. And I look at all that and I go, yeah, I get that. And let's go run with that. And, you know, and hopefully they've got more plans for me. I don't know.

We'll see. So, okay, we've dive deep on the superhero part of you. But that's just, like, one aspect of you. I mean, you are this kind of like, and I think back when you were a kid, probably it was even more unusual. Now you're allowed, I feel like, to, like, as a kid, to, like, love everything. Yeah, you can love Broadway theater and acting and music and nerd culture. When we were kids, I don't know.

It felt like you were going to be awesome. That was not mainstream. None of that was mainstream. I mean, Broadway. I would say that, I would say ironically, that, well, not ironically, but, you know, nerd culture, meaning video games, comic books, and the like, that was very taboo to cool, right? It was the opposite of cool. And then with, you know, the advent of all of, really, you know, kind of like Downey's Iron Man forward, all of that culture has become mainstream pop culture.

And it's really a bummer actually that there are still like some like OG nerds that hate that. They're like, well, we were here first. It's like, don't you want all the people? Don't you want more people to love what you love? To love what you love? As opposed to still thinking you're a nerd for like, like come on. Like take the win, you know? And yes, but it's also a pride thing.

Like we thought it was cool first. It's like you know that. Not everybody, it doesn't matter. You know that. You know that you were here first. We all know it together. So, so, but it's really cool, I think, and interesting that that has definitely become cool. Broadway and theater, let's say, I still think has a little bit of a more of a nerd kind of, you know, lens on it.

Because it's a thing that in school is still, like in middle school, if you're in the band or you're, you're in, you're an actor, or you're in the arts, that's not as cool as sports. and that's still kind of a balance that we're working out. But I will say, you know, things like Hamilton, certainly, all of a sudden it's like, oh, that's cool. Like that really brought that whole, you know, more modern culture, even rap and all that. You know, you kind of put that in, and now there's a touchstone. Now people can be like, oh, I actually can like that.

That can be cool. So, yeah, it's all, things are shifting and I love that they are. Because to me, I was always so strange to me, I guess being the actor, or the nerdy actor kid. I was like, why can't this be just as interesting? But we have all these weird, stupid, social, I mean, clicks in general.

Middle school, starts in middle school. Kids are total assholes because they're all trying to be like the older kids who are in high school, who are all trying to be like kids in college who are all trying to be like, you know, working adults. And it becomes this whole like, who's cool and who's not and the have-nots and all this stuff.

And we got to do away with all that, you know. It's just stupid. So on the resume, obviously you've sung a bunch, but animation primarily. I don't know if you've ever done the big live action film music. No, not yet, but I want to. Yeah, where is the cats? Where is it? Mamma Mia 3!

Give me, give me a man after midnight wants some. Is there one on the list that hasn't been made yet or needs a... No, I don't know. I don't know. I think it would be fun to do. something original. Yeah. There are some incredible classic

I know they've been trying to make guys and dolls for a long time. I'm talking about this word. Yeah, I know, but I don't know if it's ever going to happen.

I don't know. It's close a bunch of times. Yeah. Well, listen, unfortunately, you know, unfortunately, from a film

opening box office or, you know, whatever standpoint, the track record still isn't great for movie musicals. So I understand why studios are a little

hesitant. Like, you know, everyone thinks they have a good idea, and then they make the thing. And even when it's great, you know, like Spielberg, West Side Story, all that stuff, it's like, but if the appetite's not there, or they just miss the mark in what people are looking for or marketed it or whatever, you know, in the heights. Like that, I thought was a really delightful film, but it didn't do as well as they hope.

So I don't know. I don't know what the answer to all that is, but I love music. I love singing. I love acting. I would love to put all that together into a movie. I just haven't found it yet. Have you, do you still dive down the video game rabbit hole? Like, what's the most hours you've lost to a video game recently?

Uh, we're a lifetime. What's the one lifetime? Like, yeah, well, lifetime, that's a good question. I mean, I would say, even though I didn't, like, it was at a time when you couldn't really log those hours, I would say the amount of time I played Golden Eye on N64 with my friends was, like, unhealthy. Like, well, I guess it's all really been unhealthy, but it's, I mean, so much. I literally, I mean, talk about a nerd. Although I was kind of like.

In retrospect, at least by the time I got to my senior year, I was kind of a cool nerd, if that makes any sense, and that I was still accepted by some of the cool kids or whatever. Like, I had a lot of friends. But, like, I was a kid, I swear to God, I had a little red duffel bag, and I brought my Nintendo 64 with four controllers, four rumble packs, and, like, four different games, and Mario Kart and Gold and I were two of them, and I would bring them two parties. Sure. I would bring it all two parties, and we would play or we would not play. Yeah.

Yeah. So, Mario Kart, GoldenEye, lots and lots of hours. um halo the original so many hours uh um call duty modern warfare two the original so many but lots of the war all those so is a prerequisite for anybody in your life loved ones this is me take it or leave it you might lose me for a hundred hours well yeah well yes yes and no like honestly i've gotten a lot better at it because they're like unfortunately i would get to the end of so many these games or i get you know and i and you have this moment of elation because you've completed it you've completed and I'm a completionist by the way like I need every side mission I need to

find every little secret like I want to get there 100% baby and you get there and you're like yeah and then you stand there and you go nobody cares nobody cares this means nothing I could have learned a foreign language in the amount of time that I spent crusading through these worlds but they're still fun and I do feel creatively stimulated by them and I I think that it helps me in my storytelling and all that stuff but yeah I don't know that last last game I I spent lots of time playing was Hades. I don't know if you played Hades. It's this rogue, I think they're called Rogue type.

Basically, you're this character, Zagrius. It's all Greek mythology. You're like Hades' son, who's like half God, half human, and you're trying to escape hell where you live. And you have to go through all these chambers and battle through it. And if you die, you just keep going back to the beginning. But you keep leveling up. You keep getting more powerful every run.

So eventually you get out. out and then you could start putting all these modifiers on it to make it more difficult and you open up all these other weapons and stuff and oh my god I played so much so much I played like you complete it though did you finish oh I well I completed a lot of it but like I didn't even do all of the modifiers because I was like I this is a sickness I am addicted to this game it was a metaphor for life it really was but it's such a great game and the new ones coming out soon, and I have no doubt I will be so sucked into that. So thanks, Hades.

I find a nickel for every second. Where are we at on The Last of Us? Are you a Last of Us fan? Well, a huge Last of Us fan. I think I said this, you know, I tweeted this out to Neil Druckman when the first game came out and I played it. It's one of the best pieces of entertainment content on any side's screen of any really medium of entertainment

in the last 20 years as far as I'm concerned. That first one and the second one was even better which is unheard of. It's unheard of. So what Neil and the gang at Last of Us have done, I mean I was picture of Pascal I have a lot

of love for I was gutted that I didn't I wanted to play that role so bad I wanted to play Nathan Drake in Uncharted first. I hit a naughty dog when I played uncharted back in the day I was like who's got the rights of this movie and they're like already sold I was like But they make great games

Did you get in there? Did you get an audition? That's fine. Whatever, it is what it is. We'll go do something else. But anyway, suffice to say, I loved the video games so much and I love that they made a series

and I'm only three episodes in, I think, to the series because I've been doing the tour and I haven't really had a lot of time to watch anything. But I love it. I love that so much of it is so akin to the actual

the way the video game, particularly that, first episode and they're trying to get out of Austin and like I mean there was like literally some of the same shots and was like yes I love this so it's great I'm so stoked for them okay so looking forward you're gonna take a hopefully a little breather after this press store I mean I guess you could call it that yeah I mean there's other work to be done and other projects and I mean I'll go home I'll do some personal stuff I'll go see friends and family I'll I'll go home I have to keep preparing for this new role that I'm doing a film called Not Without Hope with Joe Carnahan which is about

It's a true story about these four football player, you know, kind of best friends back in like the mid-ish 2000s who went on this very ill-fated fishing trip. You might remember this. And they went off fishing off the coast of Florida. The boat capsized and three of the four did not make it. And it's a really harrowing tale. But I think one that I'm very proud to be a part of telling to honor those men who lost their lives. And I don't know.

I mean, stories like this, I think it's important that we. It's like, you know, it's like the perfect storm. Like, you know, you go into it and you know all those men are going to die. You know what the end of the movie is. But you go with them because you want to connect with them. And in a way, remember them and be reminded of the fragility of life, you know. So anyway, so, you know, going to do that and that. And then we go shoot that for a while.

And then I shot this movie, Harold and the Purple Crayon, which comes out in June, and then I'll go promote that. And we'll probably talk then. I don't know. Yes, yes. And you have to escape Hades one more time. And I got to escape Hades, at least once more. Zach, it's always a pleasure, man.

Congratulations. Shazam, Fury of the Gods. I feel like I have to raise my fist. You got to do it. Fury of the gods. That's so furious. He loves spandex and saying his own name. One and only.

He's exactly really good. Thank you for having me. And so ends another edition of happy, sad, confused. Remember to review, rate, and subscribe to this show on iTunes or wherever you get your podcasts. I'm a big podcast person. I'm Daisy Ridley, and I definitely wasn't pressure to do this by Josh. Okay, it's official.

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Here and ABC News, because staying informed shouldn't feel overwhelming. Goodbye summer movies, Hello Fall. I'm Anthony Devaney. And I'm his twin brother, James. We're host Raiders of the Lost Podcast, the Ultimate Movie Podcast, and we are ecstatic to break down late summer and early fall releases. We have Leonardo DiCaprio leading a revolution in one battle after another, Timothy Salome playing power ping pong in Marty Supreme. Let's not forget Emma Stone and Jorgos Lanthamos' Bougonia. Dwayne Johnson's coming for that Oscar in The Smashing Machine,

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