Happy Sad Confused - Zachary Quinto

Episode Date: June 26, 2018

By night, Zachary Quinto is stealing scenes in the revival of the Broadway hit play "The Boys in the Band" and by day he's pretty busy too -- shooting a guest spot on a hilarious TV show, plotting a myriad of projects as a producer, and even squeezing in this chat -- his debut on "Happy Sad Confused".  Josh and Zachary cover quite a lot in this fun and at times serious episode -- from Quinto's formative acting days back at Carnegie Mellon alongside his "Boys in the Band" co-star and friend Matt Bomer, to the meteoric rise of "Heroes", his incredible journey as Spock and subsequent friendship with Leonard Nimoy to his perspective on Kevin Spacey and his own decision to come out years ago. Plus, there's Zachary's revival of "In Search Of", coming to The History Channel next month, and rumblings of another Star Trek film -- or two. Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

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none of you are safe. New episodes every Wednesday, wherever you get your podcasts. Today on HappySat Confused, Zachary Quinto returns to Broadway in the boys in the band. Hey guys, I'm Josh Horowitz. Welcome to my podcast. Welcome back, Sammy. Welcome to the intro.

Welcome to your own show. Thank you for. No one ever welcomes you. Thank you for having me on my show. Thank you for being here. It's an honor. Oh, that's really weird. Um, anyway, uh, Zachary Quinto is on the show. Yay.

Yay. Zach. Zach. Can come Zach. Yeah. We're buds. Um, yes. Zachary Quinto, first time guest on the podcast, uh, a long time coming.

He, Zachary's great. What a career. What an amazing, uh, run on Broadway he's experiencing right now. He's in boys in the band. And he is, he was, he was, yeah, right? You saw the show. My favorite. He's so good in this show.

She's not lying. I do remember now when I asked, uh, Sammy saw it ahead of me. and I asked her what she thought, the one thing, I mean, she liked a lot of it, but you said Zachary steals the show. The second he steps on stage, the whole show, you can't take your eyes off of him. He's just, I love, I think he's so, because he's so quiet in it, too. He's, but he's a great one-liners. Oh, yes, he's, and just like the way he holds himself.

He's so everyone goes to see him, and it is great. He makes a big entrance. So, yeah, a little context about this show. Boys in the Band is a 50-year-old show. 50 years ago, it was on Broadway. It was a real important play for its time in that it's a story of, I think, nine characters celebrating a character's birthday. It's a birthday party that kind of goes off the rails, and it's nine gay men.

The current cast is all... Wow. Right, that's true. Yeah, okay. Well, we're close enough. Okay. I don't want to reel too much. No spoilers.

Exactly. No boys in the band's spoilers. It's like Avengers. Exactly. Thanos is at the end. Snap of the finger. but notable about this cast they haven't changed much of the show apparently

I think they've cut a little bit It's a one act now It's like a tight like 100 or 105 minutes So it's a good night of theater Love that No intermission, just the dream And it's the current cast Is nine out men

And many of them quite famous men And it's kind of like it's produced by Ryan Murphy It's directed by Joe Mantello It's got this great pedigree behind it And it's Zach and it's Jim Parsons And it's Matt Bowmer friend of the show, Matt Bowmer. A great cast.

Andrew Rannell steals every moment. You're not going to tell everyone the special secret about the show if you have the right seat. Oh, right. Just a little, it's a little tip to my friends out there. If you go see the show and you're sitting along one of the sides, Matt Bowmer is a shower scene and if you look in the ceiling, there's a mirror and you can see a little of the top of his butt. And I warned Josh about it, but I don't think he remembered to love. No, I remembered.

I just, I wasn't in those optimal seats. That sucks. Yeah, well, I've seen Magic Mike and Magic Mike X-X-S. Oh, yeah, yeah, yeah. I've seen enough. I mean, it's a wonderful body to behold. Yeah, it's a great top of the butt. Great top.

Yeah, one of the best I've ever seen. You're making things awkward because I'm just trying to get people to buy tickets. No, it's all good. It's all good. It's just I've had this experience twice now in recent shows. where I've happened to know one of the actors and I see the show and they're naked on stage

and then I see them afterwards in the show and there's just like that... Are you talking Lee Pace is full frontal and angels? Yes. That's a little more intimidating than the top of the butt. Right.

Yeah. That's true. Yes. There's, yes. You could like sketch Lee Pace after. I know every inch of Lee Pace and Lee, if you're listening, I'm so apologize.

You have nothing to apologize for. Yeah, exactly. Anyway, what were we talking about? Matt's butt, yeah, Matt's butt, Zach, wonderful in the show. The show runs through August, get tickets if you can, boys in the band. We certainly talk a bunch about the show. We talk about a lot of things, though. I know what you were excited to talk about.

Heroes. Well, I would love to save the cheerleader, save the world. I was a huge Heroes fan. I forgot that Kristen Bell was on Heroes. She was? Yeah. Who was she? I don't know.

When I was doing my research, it was like, unless I misread. Was it like Gossip Girl? She did like the V-O. at the beginning. We sound like such posers now, but I think, I think she was. I don't remember Heroes too well.

I remember Hornroom glasses. Right. I confess, like I was one of those, like many, I think, that like watched the first season. And we talk about it. He does talk about sort of,

because Heroes was this big break. And that was a show that just like burned so quickly and then kind of burned out. Partially he talks about because of the writer's strike, I think. But, man, it worked out so well for him.

During that writer strike, he landed his first film, which was Star Trek. I was going to, what, you're, you were, you were, oh, tell me all about Spock. I played it cool, but yes. You did? Yeah, we talked a ton about Spock. You didn't play cool.

It's what I'm curious about. No, no, no. He knows what I am. You can't hide it. You can't hide what, yeah. No, I mean, it was cool because, like, that was, that reboot of that franchise did occur around 10 years ago, around, like, when I started at MTV. So I've definitely, like, been through, that's another one of those casts that I've been

through the saga. go with. So it's, uh, it was kind of a good full circle moment to talk to him about both the Star Trek films, the importance of theater in his life. Um, and he's also really frank and really, um, uh, you know, I don't know, you just like a positive force for good in that, you know, talks about his decision to come out when he did, which was after he did Angels in America off Broadway and after he was deeply affected by, um, uh, a rash of satin suicides. Uh, so I mean, He's just like an important voice to hear about, especially in these times. And by the end, I feel like we go to a dark place in terms of like all the horrible stuff going out in the world right now.

But hopefully we wrap it up in a nice bow and give you some hope on the way out. Hopefully. Hopefully. He's a smart and really, really talented dude. I'm a fan, Zach. There you go. So enjoy this conversation with Zachary Quinto. What else to talk about?

Oh, you saw one of our, a friend of the podcast last night. I sadly missed it. Last night I saw Middle Ditch and Schwartz on, they did Broadway. They are selling out across the country. Yeah, two-man long form improv got a standing ovation on Broadway. We're so happy for it. If they're coming to your town, go see Middletch and Schwartz.

It's amazing. They're the best at what they do. It's crazy, yeah, how fast their minds work. These two idiots are pretty smart. You can say that about Ben, but Middle Ditch is pretty smart. I guess. I'm like, wow, the way that they tied back into jumping into the other one's asshole at the end is really brilliant. It's just like the most lowbrow, but weirdly brilliant stuff.

I love it. Yeah, you would. You would. I highly recommend. Wonderful. Well, happy to hear that that is selling out. And yes, if you have the opportunity, go seek them out. You were just saying they're going to be at Comic-Con.

Maybe I'll see them there. Who knows? Your Super Bowl. It's pretty much. Yeah. Lots of Comic-Con talk to come. I will be there. Sadly, Sammy won't.

Unless my mom decides to change her birthday. It's so inconsiderative of mine. I agree. She knows it's my favorite weekend of the year, too. But there's lots of exciting things to come. There are. It's not over. It's just getting started. But that's for another podcast to talk about.

We'll get there. In the meantime, please review, rate, and subscribe. Please. Please. Spread the good word of happy sick and confused and enjoy this conversation with Zach Quinto Zach Quinto. Zach Quinto. It sounds Australian the way you just said.

Zik Quinto. That doesn't sound Australian. Oh, it's him. He's here. God. Enjoyed the conversation. My look, it's Zachary Quinto in my office. How's it going?

It's good to see you, man. It's good to see you, too. Yeah, this is a different kind of environment than we usually do. I know. Usually a crazy carpet or a junket or something silly. But look, you're in my weird world. I get to really take in how you interact with the world around you. How long have you been in this office?

A few years. The one at our other Midtown MTV office was very similar. But thankfully, I'm at a better part of town now. For sure. I miss the Times Square. For sure. But I always say this is kind of like the bedroom I wanted as like a 12-year-old. Great. I could see that.

The movie posters I worshipped, got lots of figures and silliness. It's awesome. And a list of cool New Yorkers, of which you are one. I am up there. How long have you made your wife here in New York, Zachary? I came back here five years ago when I was doing the Glass Menagerie, and I decided I had been in L.A. long enough. And I wanted to just have the experience of living in New York, which I, you know,

I'd always fantasized about. Yeah. I would expect also you started to get to a point in your career. where you didn't need to be in L.A., right? There were enough opportunities, and certainly I know theater is an important part of your life that, like, you weren't missing out. I did feel that way.

I did feel like, yes, I had gotten myself to a place where I could generate or at least, you know, field the opportunities that were coming to me remotely, you know, not in the epicenter of things. Although, you know, that said, I do feel like I love L.A. I'm a person who really enjoys and appreciates the city, and I miss it. I miss it, actually. So now that I've come to New York and really establish myself here and, like, created a home for myself here, I'm going to now explore the options of L.A. as well again, which I'm looking forward to.

Yeah, for sure. I've explored your apartment via video appraised. Don't worry, I wasn't a home innovating. That's all right. I mean, it wouldn't be all right if you were home invading, but I get it, I know. I thought we were at the point where I could just, like, barge in whenever I want. Probably. You have a lovely apartment, you and Miles.

Do you just put up with the crystals that he loves, or do you actually believe in the crystals? No, I really, I've come to appreciate them, and he's converted me to crystal aficionado of my own, sort of, yeah, my own. But, but. For context, there's an architectural digest, like, tour that you guys did of the, of your lovely place and uh yeah they did a crystal counter uh in the video because miles is yeah has a lot of them around i think they counted like 55 and that wasn't even probably the secret crystal room they didn't even get they didn't even get to the stash of ones that we hid for the photo shoot but there is a lot of crystal energy in the apartment which i think is actually yeah really

you know yeah valuable has he been with you through like a production like he has he seen you on like through a was he with you like glass menager just the first time he's seen, okay, so, you know, we've been together for five years. So we, we met right before I did the Glass Minterian Broadway. I guess I'm just curious, like, is it a different Zachary during a production? Because it's a different, you know, it's a day, it's a tough, not a tough job, but it's a day job. It's a, it's a, actually, the interesting thing is it's a night job. And, and I think one of the differences is, like, it's nocturnal Zachary.

Right. I really have been, I've been saying to him for the past couple weeks, I was like, I've got to get back on a, on a better sleep schedule because the Tonys were the 11th of June, I guess, and the tone, you know, that's a notoriously late night. You know, I think we were out and up until

almost the sun. You have a show the next day or not? We did have a show the next night, but it just really screwed up my circadian rhythms and the show in general. I mean, we're not doing a long play. Our play is relatively short, you know, by comparison, but

it's just the energy, you know, getting kind of worked up that late at night, and it takes me a while to decompress. So I've been up a lot later. Like, on average, I'd say I've been up to like 2.30 or 3 in the morning for the last few weeks, and I don't love it. So are you generally a creature of habit? I mean, do you must enjoy in some ways the, this is as rootinized as you can get as an actor. Yes.

I am, am I a creature of habit? I don't think so. I kind of roll with whatever is in front of me, you know, if I have 5 a.m. calls like I actually do tomorrow, then I roll with that. But if I'm working at night, I'm definitely a night owl more than a morning person. So doing a play suits me. But I do like not having to struggle to get my day started because I'm tired, you know. So that's a bit. I'm trying to find the balance of that right now. So you're shooting something long. I'm doing a couple of episodes of Kimmy Schmidt right now. So, yeah. So I'm shooting. It is a good cause. for likely insane calls. So I have been working on that. It's just like, you know, five days or something like that. But it's been really fun.

Yeah. Getting to work with Jane Krakowski, who I adore and who's so talented and funny. Totally. So that's been fun, yeah. I confess, I have to catch up. I only got, I love the first season, but it's like, you know how it is. Nowadays, it's an embarrassment of riches. It's funny.

You mentioned Glass Menagerie, which I got a chance to see you and Cherry. And I remember seeing that show, and it was fantastic. And it was, I had, like, seats very close. And I was, there was an older couple sitting next to my wife and I. And it must have been like the worst nightmare for an actor because not for you, thankfully, but an older gentleman right as soon as like Cherry came out, screamed out at the top of his lungs. Is that Cherry Jones? Just like breaking the silence. Is that like for you, this, is there still the, in the pit of your stomach the worry that like someone's going to scream about, I love you, Spock?

Like at some point. No, I don't know. I don't feel that. I don't feel that. No. Now planted in your brain. I'm sorry. No, that's okay. You know, I think the funniest one I've had on this play actually is, I don't know how much your listeners know about the play, but it's a play about nine gay men. It was a revolutionary play in its time, which was premiered in 1968. And it's had a lot, you know, it resonates profoundly one way or another, especially in the LGBT. TQ community, and for some of the older guys who were around when the play came out, this production has been really, there have been a lot of them coming to the show, basically. And we were doing, and I play this very acerbic kind of character, his name is Harold. And at one point in the play, you know, part of the structure of the play is that it's very funny, and then it gets very serious, like very dark. And my character tends to break the tension with sort of one-liners and

little interjections here and there that really kind of have an, like they lighten the mood. Defuse the tension, right? Yeah, yeah, yeah. And so in one of these moments, toward the end of the play, when it's really heavy, I have one line where I interject something. And then, like, the audience laughs. And then this man in the audience just went, oh, oh, Harold. Harold. Oh, Harold. Twice. Like, actually. Classic Harold. And I almost broke because it was so, like, wait, what? Like, you're not watching in a movie, you know? Like, it was pretty funny. But, you know, it's part of the joy, for sure.

Yeah. Yeah, you have kind of like the ideal role in some ways that an actor wants because you are the guy that everybody talks about the first half of the show. Right. For 30 minutes. Right. And then you get to come in with a forish. And, I mean, everybody gets like a... Nobody had thrown a little entrance for the most part. And some assertive great one-liners, but you in particular, it seems like you get the lion's share, perhaps. Yeah, yeah. So, I mean, you kind of alluded to some of the intriguing aspects of this show. So I think nine principal characters, right? Nine actors.

Nine actors. So Ryan Murphy produced it. He's producing it. All-out actors. I mean, there's so many fascinating aspects of this. You go a ways back with some of the actors, I know. Yeah, well, I went to college with Matt Bowmer, who's in the play. we've known each other for 25 years

crazy to say that and I've been friends with Andrew Rannells and Jim Parsons for the better part of 10 years and then I've done a movie with Charlie Carver who's in the play and a play with Brian Hutchison who's in the play

so of the eight other guys in the show there are only three of them that I hadn't met before this and now they're brothers in arms as well so there is a lot of Interconnectivity and other people in the play have other paths of... Right.

So there was a real sense of bond coming into this and connection. And yes, and, you know, it's the 50th anniversary of this play. It's never been done on Broadway. It's a powerful piece. And it's shocking to me how resonant it still is 50 years later, how funny, but how resonant and how, yeah, the themes, I think, are really. still there. Absolutely.

It's intriguing because one thing I want to mention you mentioned you go back with Matt all the way to Carnegie Mellon I believe I'm seeing Joe Manganoa later this week actually. Oh cool. A fellow Carnegie Mellon friend I believe. Joe grew up about a mile away from me.

Is that right? We knew each other from in our even before Cardigan Mellon. That's so funny. So it must be inconceivable to think about like you knowing Matt back then. I don't know if either of you were out back then or what, but just even the notion that 25 years later, you would be out in a Broadway play like this,

collaborating on this level. There's like three different levels of just surrealness to that equation. Well, one of the great joys about getting older and being as fortunate as I've been in my work is getting to share that with people who have known You know, whether I know them from college or just some early days of making a go at it. There's something, you know, Jesse Tyler Ferguson is a really good friend of mine. There's just like, there's just something really special about watching your friends create their own path, forge their own path, and succeed.

You know, I think it's really special. And it's really, you know, with Matt, it's his Broadway debut to come back to. you know, to come back to the same theater where I did the glass menagerie, which is another layer of specialness to this experience for me. And, you know, as soon as I found out, we were back in the booth, I called my agent and was like, I want my same dressing room. And so once I worked that out, I called Matt and said, hey, I'm going to be in number four.

I hope you'll do number five so we can be neighbors. And that's the way it worked out. Did you, I mean, what do you remember of back in the Carnegie Mellon days? Like, were you, did you take the work very seriously then? So seriously. Oh, my God. This is Melozac right now. Yeah, I was like, ugh.

A little insufferable back then if I met you? I don't know if I was insufferable, but I was sufferable. You know what I mean? Like, I was definitely like, yeah, I took it very seriously. I really did. And I'm glad I did. You know, actually, I loved college. I just, you know, I soaked it all up.

I was just very eager. I was very, you know, I really wanted, I think I was, I think, you know, as I got later, as I got into therapy and started to kind of unravel my, my underlying, like, engine, right? Like, as I got to, as I started, as I lifted up the hood, let's go, let's lean into the car metaphor. As I got under the hood and I started to kind of look at the parts that, that drove me, I think I really would say that I was, I was hungry for value. validation in college in a way that, you know, made me want to be the best, right? Because I wanted people to tell me I was good and I needed that, I think, in a lot of ways from teachers and from people who I respected and looked up to. And so, yeah, so I was really ambitious and, you know, I really cared a lot about doing well and being considered talented and really, you know, that was,

that drove me. And I think that's a common story for a lot of actors I found. Or for any profession. I mean, that's, I think, how a lot of people find their careers is finding like some kind of early validation. Yes, and I'm not, you know, I'm not, um, how should I say, I'm not judging myself for that. You know, I definitely feel like it's part of what got me to where I am. I, you know, I wouldn't necessarily even change aspects of, of myself back then, but there are aspects of myself I probably would change, you know, and just to, just to just know, like sooner how to provide those feelings to myself

rather than looking for them outside of myself but I think it is a very common story not only for actors but for human beings and I think it's something that people spend lifetimes exploring or not and yeah so but I did take it very seriously was it was a rude awakening coming out of out of school did you feel like you were like

ready to take on the world? Oh I was ready to take on the world yeah for sure when I came out of school anything was possible in my mind. And I was, you know, that ambition carried over into the real world for me. I was super focused and like myopically so in a way just on my career, the flip side of that or the downside of that was that I kind of tied myself worth into, you know, the accomplishments that I was able to achieve or not, you know, and that was, that took a lot of softening as well. but yeah I was really you know I was like let's do this you know and what was the path in your mind was because like if you look at the early resume it's a lot of episodic television I had a very very conventional experience coming into the business you know and see a SI out of the way get all that yeah do it check CSI check uh touched by an angel check you know I mean I I I might you know the way it was in my mind actually was that I would come to New York I never imagined that

that I would be in L.A. So that was a huge and an immediate curveball was that in L.A. I was welcomed with the opportunities to do, you know, to have a manager and an agent, right? So audition right away. And I think in New York it was, for whatever reason, going to be a little bit more. So my idea that I would come here and work my way up off Broadway. And that was how I thought I would do it, just got full. flipped on its year.

Just because you were getting some work in L.A. I was getting more opportunities presented to me, so I went to L.A. right away. It's interesting because, like, again, looking at your career, like, I didn't realize at the time, like, was Star Trek the first film? Yeah, that was my first movie. That's crazy to me. So, like, you must have been going up for films, like, or was it? I didn't really go up for films as much as I did TV.

I really, you know, TV was sort of my milieu of, you know, like, that's just the way it worked for me. I didn't really have... Were you concerned at the time that, like, because, you know, again, knowing how seriously you did and do take the work, like, you didn't, you know, the ultimate ambition wasn't to be on heroes eventually. You know, I mean, that was probably a nice, great, exciting opportunity, but it wasn't like, I've made it. That was probably, like, this will get me to a place that I'm, that's more creatively

satisfying, or maybe I'm making assumptions. Well, I mean, what was my ultimate ambition at the time, I guess, was just to get to work, to be recognized for my work and to work consistently. And it just, like, the way it played out for me because of the people that I chose to work with, you know, they were mid-level agents and managers. And they had more relationships and more access in the world of television. So that's where my path took me, you know. And so my goals and ambitions, I would say originally, were kind of calibrated to the opportunities that were being presented to me.

So at first I was, you know, going up for co-stars, and then I got a couple of those and then, you know, guest stars. And then it was like, oh, well, I want the lead, you know, the guest lead on an episode of something. And then I want a recurring role in something. Got it. So the time Heroes came along, I had been systematically kind of building this career for myself doing television. And, and I would say something like Heroes, which was a phenomenon when it, when it came out, you know, at that time, I felt like, okay, I have achieved what I had been, these goals. that I had been setting for myself, creatively, it became clear that, you know, after the, well, you know, the first season happened and it was this kind of global phenomenon. And then the second season started and then the writer's strike happened. And that really changed everything on that show. It was, I think Heroes was one big, one of the big casualties of the writers. I mean, a lot of shows suffered from it. But because it, like, interrupted. our second season, the upside of the writer's strike that it was that it allowed me to go film Star Trek during the writer's strike. The Star Trek, the script had already been written. So we weren't, we were allowed to make that movie during the writer's strike. And so I didn't have to miss any episodes of heroes, which we were in the middle of negotiating how that would work. But by the time we went back to heroes, it just never regained. It felt like they was always playing catch up to that initial. And they hadn't really, yeah, they hadn't really plotted it out far enough ahead to like keep it.

And, you know, my character was never meant to stay around as long as he did. And so, yes, I mean, it became clear to me that year when I was doing Heroes and Star Trek that my ambitions were already outpacing the level that I had achieved. And I needed to do something to kind of keep up with them. And so that's when I started my production company. And I want to get to that because it seems like you ramped up, especially after Star Trek on the producing front. So let's cover a little bit of training. Trek first, and then I want to go into that.

So, like, as I recall, I mean, you know, I started my MTV career right around when the whole Starved Kelvin Universe started, and it was so exciting for me as like a... I remember that. I remember, yeah, I remember you guys coming out of Comic-Con, the whole thing. I mean, the casting process must have been insane for you. I mean, I remember, like, rumors of, like, Adrian Brody going up. Like, big-name actors were going in. Were you aware of, like, the competition?

Did you feel like you were... you had as good a shot as anybody? I mean, my experience of that was so singular. There was something to me where it wasn't even a question. I don't know how to explain it because I didn't have any reason to be so sure of it. And I also wasn't even a Star Trek fan, you know. But I had, somebody had told me that they were making the movie, that JJ was directing it

and that I should go up for Spock and it was like the minute I read that in an email that someone sent me it was like it was already done and I started talking about it in interviews that I was doing for heroes and I talked about it enough that by the time they started casting the movie

April Webster, the casting director had caught wind of me talking about it and reached out and I had like got a meeting with her And I'll never forget how it played out. I went in on a Sunday. It was April 15th. And I went in, they would, I went in like a couple of day or two before because they

wouldn't let me have the script. So he's like, well, he has to come in and like read it, read the sides, et cetera. I don't even think I, I don't even think I read the whole script, but they just gave me my sides. And so I took a notebook and I wrote my scene. in the notebook so that I could take it with me and work on it at home. But it was only like a three-page scene.

It wasn't a lot. And then I went in on Sunday. And April's amazing. She's a fantastic casting director and just a great person. And so she and I worked on it and read it together and then put it on tape. And that was it.

And then I was leaving the next day on Monday to go on a trip. And I was going to Paris for Heroes with like Tim Cring and Jeff Loeb to do like a press, event in Paris. And then I had built another month of travel. So I left April 16th.

I was in Paris for a week. And then I went traveling for a month in Europe by myself during May. And I came back a week before my 30th birthday. And I didn't really think about, I just did the thing with April and then left. Got back to New York right before my 30th birthday. And while I was in New York, got a call that JJ wanted to meet me.

I flew back to LA for my 30th birthday party. I met with JJ the next day. And then the next day after that, I got the job. So it was super like, it doesn't happen that way. You know what I mean? And it was just so, I don't know, it's just, that might have been a really boring story. You're going to have to edit that. No, it wasn't. No, no, no, no. It was it good. I mean, so I'm curious, were you, was that you alone or were you reading with other actors? Were you reading with Chris and other potential Kirk's? No, I, I ended up reading. I was the first person, I was, to my knowledge, I was the first person that they saw for Spock. and I was the first person that they cast.

So that was in June of May and June of 2007. And they didn't cast Chris until like October, I think, right before we started shooting. Because Chris went in and read for it and they didn't hire him. And then they went in auditioned a bunch of other people. And then he came back in. And then I read with him. And I read with Chris and two other people, I think. I'm guessing Mike Vogel

because I remember he was the other one the one that was talking about Yeah, yeah And also Timothy Oliphant Yeah, I heard about that too And I read with those guys And I knew Chris because we had a lot of mutual friends And we had

We had known each other And so I was really gunning for Chris Just because I really Yeah, for sure I mean there's so many things That we could talk about there I want to talk about the Leonard Nimoy relationship which is obviously something that has been so important in your life

and must have been totally unexpected. This kind of mentorship, friendship does not happen often. It could have just been a, you know, he had no dog in the race to, like, you know, embrace you the way he did. I'm just curious, like, you know, what was the first point of connection between you and Leonard? I mean, was different.

We met in an elevator at Comic-Con that day when they announced that I'd be taking over the role and it was packed full of people. And we got in, and they ushered, they shepherded him in first. And then I got into the elevator and all the publicists from Paramount and da-da-da-da, and all these people and all these people. And they introduced us in the elevator as we're going up to Hall H. And I remember he was like, oh, yeah, whatever. And then just before the door is open, he just turned to me and he said, you have no idea what you're in for.

And he walked out of the elevator. And I was like, well, there it is. Thanks so much. But that really did kick off. And then he and his wife, Susan, with whom I'm still incredibly close, invited me to their house for a barbecue that they were having. And at that barbecue, Leonard and I set up a day for me to come over. And we had lunch, just the two of us at his house.

And that was really the beginning, you know, of this incredible friendship. And, you know, there's something really, my dad died when I was seven. And he and Leonard were just about the same age. and there was something very profound for me personally at that time. You know, I'd just turned 30. I was kind of at this milestone and crossroads of sorts in my own life. And to have this paternal figure come into my life in such a powerful way was incredibly stabilizing and really grounding for me.

And I think that our friendship was built on that. Right. You know, and Leonard was never one for over-sentimentalization. um you know he he was a very uh he was just so incredible i mean he really was so wise and um you know well if you and if you look just like at the way he lived his life post trek and was able to kind of like reinvent himself in in so many different ways and explore whether it was photography or directing art art collection i mean yeah he really yeah he really did it all and especially in a time when like you know nowadays you know you do

an iconic role on TV or in film, there's a much more openness, it seems, to letting somebody explore different parts of their lives. In the 60s, it was, you know, TV stars did not become film stars and were not welcomed with open arms to other aspects. I mean, was that, was that, you know, he wrote the book, literally I am Spock, and then he wrote the book, I am Spock. So he, like, went through that journey.

Yeah. Did, was that something that he talked to you about in terms of, like, how to deal with what was, what he knew was going to be a, Um, you know, something that would hang over you. I don't, I mean, we talked a little bit about it, but I don't really feel like, um, I wasn't up against the same kind of restrictions that he was. Yeah, I think it was a little bit different. And I, um, I learned from his relationship to the character and, um, but I don't know.

I didn't really feel like that was, I was, I was on the same. path in that regard, you know. But we talked about it. I mean, we really covered all our bases in the, you know, we were friends from about the last 10 years of his life. Yeah. You, um, so after Trek, it seems like you,

I'm trying to get my chronology right. Yeah. Did you go right into Angels off Broadway, Angels in America? What did I do? No. Wait, did I? Yeah, kind of. Well, I did I did, yeah, track and then I did more heroes. Right. and then so Heroes finished

and then I did margin call and then I did Angels So even when you were doing Angels you came out after that I did I didn't even yeah yeah right

which is interesting to me I mean I've heard you talk a little bit about sort of the connection between you did an it gets better video but you know it occurs to me like you know I saw the new production of Angels which is remarkable and Lee Pace went through this kind of journey himself,

having done angels and decided this was the time to talk about his sexuality. But did you feel like at the time when you were doing angels that that was something hanging over you or even in the wake of doing TREC, like were their conversed, did Paramount give a shit? Did like... I mean, did Paramount give a shit?

I don't know. I mean, I feel like the institutional homophobia, which still exists in our industry, was, you know, percolating for me in the studio system. I don't think it was ever overt or... It wasn't like the meeting. How are we going to handle this meeting? No, no, no, no.

I think it was sort of... It's more insidious now. Even then, it was more insidious. But it still exists. It still exists today. There's no denying that. And I, you know, but I didn't feel... No, I didn't feel hindered by my own personal journey

or my own identity, my authentic identity, I just didn't feel particularly ready to discuss it in a public forum. And when I did Angels in America, there was for me an onus that I felt to at least acknowledge it for myself. I mean, I was already out in my life. It wasn't like I was hiding or denying myself.

I just, I remember pulling Tony Kushner and Michael Gryfe, the director aside, and saying, hey, you know, I just want you to be aware that I feel like this may be a part of my experience in one way or another coming out publicly and I don't want it to distract from our collaboration or our effort to make this the best production of this play that it can be. I want that to be the story. And ultimately, I didn't find the footing to do it during that production. It wasn't until a year later when I was doing the press tour for

margin call that I actually made the decision to come out. And it was very organic for me. It just wasn't the time when I did angels. I wasn't ready. That's when I made the It Gets Better video when I was doing Angels in America. So I was ready to offer my support and, you know, a sense of compassion to people who were going through the struggles that a lot of those, there was a real rash of teen suicides that summer. But it wasn't until the next year that Jamie Rodemeyer, who is a young man who made and it gets better video himself. And then months later, took his own life, that I really, in an instant, woke up and said, I can't do this.

I can't be the successful, accomplished, working actor who's achieving all these things that I set out to achieve for myself and deny my true identity. I just can't do that. I'm not capable of that. And no lead in a studio film franchise or all the money in the world isn't worth that level of disparity that I need to carry around with me, that fractured sense of self, I am incapable of that level of dishonesty for myself. And when I look at the world around me and see that kids are killing themselves because they're not able to get there themselves

at such a young age, when I've had now 15 years more than them or 20 years more than them to reconcile those two parts of myself, I just can't do that. I need to, I need to do something to stop kids from being bullied to death. Were you bullied as a kid? Yeah, sure. I mean, who's not, right? Yeah. I was.

But I will say, you know, for me, and I don't know to what I can attribute this, but in the face of bullying, I was made stronger. In the face of bullying, the way that I dealt with bullying was, you know, sure, I was made afraid of it to a certain extent. Like, oh, God, I don't want to be picked on or I don't want to be pushed into the lockers. I don't want to be called a faggot. But it, I, it, like, planted this root for me of, like, actually, even though I don't know this yet, or even though I can't, let me say, even though I can't articulate this yet,

I know this on some level that the part of me that makes me different makes me special. And I am special in a way that none of you people that are sitting here calling me names or pushing me around are ever going to understand. And I'm going to just go over. here and incubate that and find the people in my life who will amplify it and support it and nurture it. And I was very lucky. I was very lucky to be surrounded by family, friends, and teachers who did just that. And so that was the thing for me was like to be able to empower kids to know that it is the thing that you hate the most about yourself that can often become the

most powerful amplifier of who you really are and what you have to offer the world. And that was really, I was really lucky. I don't know, I don't know where that came from. But I'm grateful that it found its way in my life that. You mentioned, so you, the first film, I believe you produced his margin call. So is that, you know, you've got Kevin Spacey in that film. Does that color that experience it? I mean, what was, you know, Kevin was obviously, I mean, no one's going to quarrel with his talent.

He's an amazing actor. He's a brilliant actor. And, you know, and everybody in the industry knew he was gay. That wasn't the issue. I mean, for some, they resented that he wasn't using his platform. You can, that's a whole other discussion. But the circumstances in which he did come out were certainly less than ideal. I mean, you know, took him to task as many did.

I mean, he seemed to exploit a situation and tried to kind of deflect in a bizarre way. Right. What was your, I was curious, like, what was your interaction with him prior to all this horribleness? Well, here's what I can say. Yeah. You know, there is no part of me that wishes him ill. I respect his talent profoundly, and the opportunity to work with him was incredible, really. Kevin is of a different generation, and I think he really, his relationship to his own sexuality was entirely influenced by that generation.

of thinking. And also, you know, a lot changed in our industry very quickly and rightfully so. I mean, it took too long for it to change, but it changed very quickly once the domino of Harvey Weinstein kind of fell. And so I think what was acceptable 10 years ago became immediately, not that what Kevin did was ever acceptable, but you know, the mentality of our industry, there was a much higher level of tolerance of bad behavior. And so, I don't know, I mean, I feel like there was, to boil down your question, that experience was a great joy for me. Right. And what I learned about him later doesn't diminish the joy that I had in that experience, of which he was one part. There were, you know, the putting the movie together.

producing the movie Stanley Tucci, Paul Bettney, Jeremy Irons, to meet more, I mean, Jayce's, you know, debut, all of those things. Like, Kevin was one part of that. But, you know, I feel like there are consequences for, for illegal and inappropriate behavior. And I feel like we're seeing that now that just because you're powerful and just because you're a powerful a white man, gay or straight, you're not, you know, you are culpable. And I think that that's absolutely as it should be. No, I mean, it's, it's been brought up on this podcast a lot, as you can imagine, not to mention, like, my own career started working for Charlie Rose, my first career, so I don't know if you knew that. Yeah. So, I mean, it's, yeah, fascinating times. And I said this

when it happened. It's shameful that that that's how he chose. I mean, it's, it's just sad, you know. And because he is infinitely more, you know, accomplished than I am and an older and been at it longer. And if only there, but you can't, you know, people are wounded. People are wounded and their childhoods are horrific. And, you know, you can't, like, there are, there are extenuating circumstances. And I just, I think it, you know, it manifested in a particularly dark way with him. And it's unfortunate that we're now deprived of what he could offer creatively to the world. because of behavior that he chose to engage in.

But that's nobody's fault but his own. On the positive note, do you launch the producing career, which has been flourishing ever since, and you're very active. You have a new TV show coming soon. Yes, starting next month, yeah. In search of. Also in, you know, the spirit of Leonard Nimoy. I remember as a kid watching White's camera action,

has anybody offered you that TV show yet? No, I think I'm good now. I think I've covered my basis. This seems like a no-brainer, though, Because this is like, this lets you travel the world. Sure. And we went all over the place. And answer questions or try to answer questions that maybe you have or that are fascinating to explore.

Where did you go? What's the coolest place you got to visit? I think Morocco was the coolest place I got to go. I've never been there before and I loved it. But we were all over the place. We were in Melbourne, Australia. We were in Liverpool. We were in Sardinia.

We were in Greece. We were in Morocco. And then all over the United States as well. well. So there was a lot of travel at the beginning of this year. We did 10 episodes, starts airing July 20th on history. Do you find Bigfoot? No, we're not looking for Bigfoot. That's season two. That's season two, right. That, I mean, you know, the original show, like, when we set it up at the History Channel, they really wanted to kind of keep the integrity or the spirit of the original show. But my thing was like, we've got to move the dial.

You know, we've come a long way in the last 40 years. Let's look at where. where, you know, we are now. And let's look at some of the blue chip episodes like aliens. We do. We do monsters of the deep. But then we do things that I'm more interested in, like artificial intelligence, life after death, mind control. We do an episode on sinkholes. We do a two-part episode on the Last City of Atlantis,

time travel. I'm missing one or two. But those are sort of the themes of the first season. Yeah. So, and the producing is spanning all sorts of different forms. Because I also noticed that early on you were producing a ton of shorts. Like, I didn't. What was that?

Well, that was about, you know, we set up our production company. And a lot of things have changed since, you know, I'm actually now moving my company in a new direction and not working with the guys that I started my company with anymore. So things are really transforming in great ways and growing and expanding. But originally, we all went to college together. And we decided to start this company. I decided to start the company and then found my friends who were in other areas of the business. And it sort of made sense for us to all come together to do before the door pictures is the name of the company.

And so, but we had never done it before. You know, none of us. One of us was a producer of sorts, but kind of an assistant to a producer. And so we did, we cut our teeth on a lot of like short form content. And that was, yeah, early on. And then aligned ourselves with some friends who are making work in New York in a film kind of improvi group. And so we executive produced some of that stuff. And that was really just to learn how to do it.

And Margincall was our first feature and our first project that we all kind of came together to make. So what's the priority now? What's the, what is the like a mission statement for what you're trying to? Yeah, I'm kind of striking out on my own now and doing my own stuff. And so for me, it's about, you know, I'm developing a lot of different stuff in different mediums. So I have a bunch of film stuff, but I have a bunch of TV stuff. And I also am kind of really open to projects that could live either place. Because I think, you know, any more the landscape of certainly television and accessibility

and how people digest their content. And it's changed so drastically in the last five years that, you know, I feel like any stuff story can be broken open or stretched out or slowed down or explored in different ways, depending on what the medium is. So I've been trying to look for content that can lend itself to many different perspectives and many different modes of storytelling and building. It's interesting, isn't it? Like how we kind of have to let go of some of the things that we, like the forms we grew up with.

I know, like, on my side of the microphone, it's like, you know, the dream growing up was like, you host like an hour-long, late-night talk show. Like, that's the form. And it sure it still exists. like you can break it down into its components now. And what I realize is like I've been doing that in a way for 10 years. Like I've been doing interviews. I've been doing interviews. I've been doing interviews. Like, oh, I just do it. It's just consumed in different forms. Yeah, right. Exactly. Don't chase something that doesn't matter to kids today anyway. Yeah. Be organic and be malleable

because that's the way the business has unfolded in the last five years for sure. But, you know, 10 years definitely. So I do think, yeah, that, you know, I'm always interested in complex. characters, relationships. We're doing some really cool stuff and developing some really interesting ideas right now. There's the Tab Hunter project, right? That's right. Yeah, Tab and Tony.

I was approached Tab Hunter, for people who don't know, as a very, very famous actor from the 50s. He was kind of one of the most bankable matinee idol box office movie stars of the 50s of the golden era of Hollywood.

And he is gay. He's still alive. He's an amazing guy. And at the height of his career, he was in a five-year relationship with Anthony Perkins. At the height of Anthony Perkinson, they were both sort of these huge actors. So TAB wrote a book called TAB Under Confidential, which they then made into a documentary. And then I was contacted by TAB and his partner, Alan Glasser, and their producing partner, Neil Konigsberg, about the desire to tell the TAB and Tony's story. And I was immediately interested and had a call with them and met them for lunch in L.A. at Muso and Frank. It was like super old Hollywood. And decided to come on board and to develop that with them.

And so I called JJ, actually, because I thought, you know, his perspective on this could be really unique and interesting. And JJ was really interested. And so set it up with Bad Robot and then we sold it to Paramount. So we're in development on that. And Doug Wright, who's an incredible playwright and screenwriter is writing the script on that for us. So we're in the middle of that. Would you act in that? I don't know. I mean, you know, I can't, I think 10, 15 years ago I could have played Anthony Perkins at this time in his life. But the relationship happened when they were in their mid to late 20s.

And though I look good for 41, I don't look that good, you know. I feel like it's a little bit of a stretch for me to play that young. So I don't know. But there are other roles. And the script isn't yet written. So we'll see. I'm really so excited for what Doug comes up with. And that's one.

thing. And then just a number of other, you know, I'm adapting a book into a film or maybe a long-form TV idea. We don't know yet. We option an article from Vice that we're developing as well. There's a comic book property that I have in development. Some TV stuff. Yeah, like podcast stuff. I'm just really interested in what the possibilities are out there right now. And of course, I always have to ask about where we're at on Trek and it seems like there actually is stuff going on. There is stuff going on. I mean, I had dinner the other night with S.J. Clarkson, who's a great collaborator.

S.J. is amazing. We worked on heroes together. Right. And we really hit it off. And this is the Hemsworth one, right? Yes. This is the Hemsworth involved. So maybe it's time to travel.

Who knows? But somehow Hemsworth's getting involved. Well, I don't know because I haven't read the script. And I think it's still under construction, as they say. But, yes, he is, yeah, playing, yeah, yeah, all of it. Is there something? Because, you know, even if you just look at the first film, you've already gone through the ringer of this character.

His mom's died. His planet's been destroyed. Exactly. He saved his best friend in the sequel. Is there something that you want to explore with a good old Spock at this point? What's left? Well, Ponfar. We haven't got to go through puberty?

We haven't explored the pawn far. Is that puberty or menopause? I don't even know what that. I mean, it's somewhere between. No, it's like, I think it's like heat, like going into heat, right, every seven years or something. I don't know. I mean, you know, we'll see. I do think it's a character that is, it's tricky, you know what I mean?

Because there's only, there's a very finite range of emotional landscape that can be traversed. And so I don't, I don't know yet where we're going to go. But I'm excited to see. And the bottom line is like, I love the character. I love my fellow actors. And so I'm really looking forward to the opportunity going back and making another one. Have you gotten the dirt ultimately on this Tarantino one?

There's so much confusion out there about whether it is with you guys. Oh, my assumption is it's with us. I mean, that's how it's been presented. I don't know. I mean, look, until, you know, deals are done and contracts are signed and schedules are cleared,

I mean, nothing is set in stone. So anything could happen. But my understanding is that Quentin had this idea that they were shaping it and forming it. And he's off to do... Once upon a time in Hollywood, I believe it. Yeah, his Manson movie. And then, you know, it would be after that that we would go and maybe do one with him, which is pretty exciting.

Yeah, pretty cool. Okay, coming full circle, finally. You've got Boys in the Band going through August? August 11th. Okay. Still time to go check. Check this out. August 11th at the booth theater in New York.

Right. It's what, like 105 minutes of delicious theater, something like that. Yeah, it's about that, about that. And you're enjoying this run. You're soaking it all up because not only is the character rich, the material's rich, it's, it's a, you know, it's an important, quote unquote important, but it is an important kind of marker of a time as well as something, as you've said, that's clearly resonating today. So this has got to be something you're, you know, I mean, it's yesterday was gay pride, you know, it's Pride month. It's really special to be doing this play right now, you know, and to see how far we've come in 50 years, socially, politically, legislatively. But, you know, we're also in the throes of a really tumultuous time.

We have an administration in power right now, which is incredibly bigoted and intolerant. And I feel, you know, set against the agenda of the LGBTQ community, among many other minority agendas. And so I think it's a valuable and important time to be holding this mirror up to audiences and asking them to recognize this progress so that we don't unravel it, you know, that we don't go backwards. Well, it does feel like, yeah, up until like a year and a half ago, two years ago, we felt like, oh, it's all progress.

There's no going back at this point. And then it's like, oh, shit, we can. Shocking how fast and violently things can change. Yeah, it's a bad, it's a bad dream. We're all, bad nightmare we're all waking to wake up soon. This past week in particular was really just so unsettling and troubling and sad. And, I mean, it's just barbarism. I mean, it's really to me, and, you know, I'm not shy about my political point of view.

But I do agree that there is this divisiveness that we've all seemed to fall and in, We all seem to have fallen into that I just don't, you know, it doesn't, it is a disservice to humanity and I just wish there was some way around it or through it. I mean, I think that the sad part is that the only way around it is through it. And so I think we're going to have to, I think there's going to have to be some real consequences to this kind of divisiveness before we learn again how to appreciate each other. respect each other, love one another, you know, that it really can't be. And it is both sides. You know, we've created these portals, right? Our phones and our podcasts and our, we've created these echo chambers where we can go, cable news and, you know, whether you, whether you go and watch Info Wars or you go and watch last week tonight. It's like you're just reinforcing what you already believe, you know. And it's so damaging. to the way things you used to be, you know, that it's, you know, it's unfortunate. It really

is. But I feel like, yeah, anyway, I'm on a soapbox. I'm on a tangential soapbox. But bring us hope, Zach. I mean, you just, I need hope in my life. In 2018 midterms, is that the, is that the answer? Politically, is that the answer? Well, it's our, it's our only hope now. I mean, I think that, you know, the, the, the, I mean, you must feel optimism every night doing the show and sort of seeing the people that come out and seeing. Sure, but again, it's, you know, it's people who, yeah, it's like people who want to see. It's like the, the diabolical nature of this administration, particularly of Donald Trump, is, is shocking. And, and what he is able, because he has zero. integrity and what he's been able to do to destabilize the certainly the source of

journalism and news and you know he's muddied the waters he's muddied the waters yeah um that that you can't that he's able to evade in such a um yeah like calibrated calculated but also not like i don't know it's it's it's it's it's it's so diabolical but not thoughtful So it's like, it's just recklessness. It's really recklessness. And the damage that's going to be done is, is pretty staggering. But I don't know. Look, I feel like yes.

Okay, so yes. What can we do? We can change the balance of power in the Congress. You know, we can change the House and the Senate to Democratic control in order that more generous agendas are being served, or at least these restrictive and punitive agendas are being curtailed. and, you know, I don't, well, I mean, yeah, I just, we'll see what happens with this smaller thing and, right?

I mean, God knows, but it's right around the corner, isn't it? I'll be here before we know it. Well, you know, we've got Pence right behind him, so it's not like that's... But, I mean, I've also talked to people, you know, there are a lot of people who are educated and who are well-versed in the political landscape that really feel like he has a chance to win a second term. Which is... Well, you saw the stat the other day that like 90% of Republicans are still...

Yeah, it's shocking to me. It's just shocking to me. What we're presenting to the world right now is some of the darkest, you know, messaging that has ever, ever come out of this country, certainly. And it's so demoral. I mean, I just, just that fucking jacket that she wore the other day when she was... I mean, just like, just what that is, what that, like the recklessness of that... That alone to me was so, I was so despondent that day because it was just like, oh, this is just a game to these people, actually. This is just that there's not one person in that world that was thoughtful enough to say, you know what, even if you, even if that's true, even if it's some kind of a stunt, even if it's a distraction.

You don't mean it the way you mean it, it's going to come across. But also just the damage that it does to the morale of your country is worth you giving it a second thought. And it just, nobody there cares. It's just a thoughtless, careless place. We're coming out the other side, Zach. It's okay. Really, really ending this on an up note, aren't we? No, no, no, no, it's going to be okay.

There'll be go, check out the boys in the band. Look at all these amazing New Yorkers that are. The New Yorkers up there. My neighbor is right there lives directly across the street from me. I won't tell you who it is because I want to get away and tell you what we shut the rest out. is afterwards on this all. Totally. That's the next step, you know.

The old galker stock, we're going to bring it back. It really is. It really is. In all honesty, congratulations on the show. It's a great piece of work. I hope people check it out. Yeah, come see us until August 11th. And check out in search of Bigfoot season two.

But he's going to figure out time travel and like after death. Artificial intelligence. Artificial intelligence, life after death. Very cool. Mind control. I didn't even make you order mozzarella sticks and Spock's voice this time. You didn't. I feel like.

It's a miracle that you've come back to talk to me after that five years ago or so. We've evolved. Thanks. Maybe you have. It's good to see that. Good to see you too. Thanks. And so ends another edition of happy, sad, confused.

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