HardLore - Justice Tripp (Trapped Under Ice/Angel Du$t)

Episode Date: August 18, 2022

Colin and Bo finally sit down with the living legend Justice Tripp from Trapped Under Ice and Angel Du$t. The highly influential frontman has a lot to say about modern HC, TUI's biggest moments, and transitioning from dangerous pits to beautiful hooks.   HardLore: A Knotfest Series, Fueled by Monster Energy Edited by Steven Grise • Title sequence by Nicholas Marzluf Join the HARDLORE PATREON to watch every single weekly episode early and ad-free, alongside exclusive monthly episodes. Join the HARDLORE DISCORD for community discussions and to participate in our future Q&A episodes. FOLLOW HARDLORE: INSTAGRAM, TWITTER, SPOTIFY, APPLE FOLLOW COLIN: INSTAGRAM FOLLOW BO: INSTAGRAM, TWITTER   For sponsorship opportunities, email us! [e-mail] Hosted by Simplecast, an AdsWizz company. See https://pcm.adswizz.com for information about our collection and use of personal data for advertising.

welcome. It's hardlore time. What's up, Bo? What's going on, brother? Just this, just this guest we have. Just a, just a lunchtime, fun time. Yeah, that doesn't have anything. The audience don't know what the fuck you're talking about, but they can now. But this is the earliest we've ever recorded. So earliest. Brack a dog. Bo is blowing boogers out of his eyes while I have, I've been awake for 12 hours. But more importantly, our guest today, Mr. Justice Tripp of Angel Dust,

trapping and rice, and more. Let me give you some applause here that you do. Welcome, Justice. What's that? Thank you so much for being here today. Can y'all hear me? You can be great. Cool.

Do you know how fateful this is that you were here, like how inevitable this was? Oh, absolutely. Just waiting for my time to check. I have two things right off the bat. One, do you remember the first words that you ever said to me? Shit, man.

Was it at the Halloween show when you had the bald cap on? No, that was way later. Oh, wow. What was before that? Before that, that was good. Before that was Ruckus played a show with Trappender Ice at Chain Reaction. Oh, okay, yeah. You were in the back.

You didn't lock the door for some reason. Oh, no, this is a common thing. It's so you, and I feel like you are peeing backwards for some reason. So I walk in, I will, you were peeing backwards. You were just, it was like a very on brand thing. I walked in. I was like, of course he pees this way. Peeing backwards.

I mean like, I was like my ass into the urinal and like, no, it was like, it was a regular toilet. But I feel like, like, like you would expect to walk into a bathroom and somebody's ass. is there as they're peeing like oh there's an ass there's there's an ass so there's a dick on the other end that is peeing but you were dick first for me so was he like around the toilet you were around the toilet dick first in my direction and got to keep an eye on what's coming so so the first thing i see i was like there's oh that's travenor ice guy and his dick and you you had the same thought so your first words were that's my dick man it sounds like something a drunk person would do but i definitely there's no way i was drunk

you know you were you were an edgeman yeah one of you were one of us we had you on the team there but to be fair to be fair since the day i knew you you were like a weed smells good edgeman you know yeah i've always been a big fan of weed straight up like i smoked me when i was like a little kid and stuff and then um had like a traumatic life experience that maybe be like all right I don't want to do that anymore you know um but yeah like having the cock out was very on brand then it's like dude I don't know what it is uh about straight as people and just like energy and like I feel like a lot of my straightest friends just don't need to to turn up they're like already turned up naturally and that that's a good example of how I was then it's like now I like you're

like what if I fucking does backwards? I'm on some different shit Yeah I'm like so far from that place mentally I'm like damn what I want to know what was going through my brain I think I used to have a thing I was thinking about this the other day we were at truck stop And like I remember I used to Consciously like remove all the fabric

From my from my groin area And I like wanted people to see my dick like at the truck stop Not because I'm like super well endowed Or it's a macho thing Just like to prove that I don't care Like, wouldn't this be crazy if you, if you saw me this way? I just wanted everybody to see my dick in a legal sense, you know, like in a bathroom stall. In an acceptable way.

Like, it makes sense that a dick is here. And there is one. I just wanted people to know I was afraid, you know? That's it. It's not, it wasn't a sexual thing. It was an absence of fear, which is. Now I want nobody to see my dish. Straight up.

Amen, dude. Doesn't even work. Colin, what's the other thing? The other one is my first. So this is a touring podcast, brother. Yeah. That's what it's for just to share these things. My first U.S. and European tours were with Traffinter Ice.

Dude, special, special tours. Very special. So, and that was, that was 2010. Uh-huh. So this was, Traffin'Rice was. Do you know what's so funny? Sorry, not to interrupt, but Nails and Harms Way, 2010 was also in Europe. And I remember, I remember.

I remember seeing your like Twitter, you wrote it on places, like your handle. Mine? Yep. Justice was really proud of me that I did that. I don't know if you remember that.

Yeah, excellent branding. You were on branding, like you were branding before anybody else, I feel like, like, what was the fucking app with the video app? Vine. Vine. Fine.

Colin was like, Colin and Will Sassow were like the two first viral vine. Dude, and Will Sassau love me on there. Really? Oh, yeah. I would see him like liking or commenting. I forget it wasn't the time. But I remember being like, oh, my God, Will Sassau knows who Colin is.

I'm basically famous. I felt the same way. I was like, Will Sassau knows who I am. Justice is basically famous. But those tours, that was at a time where, I mean, I don't know. I'm sure it was still magical for you as you'd been a band for three years at that point. You have a legendary demo, a legendary demo, legendary seven inch of legendary LPA.

I'm going to blow some smoke up your inner ass. I got some smoke later. Okay. Down for smoke all day. You're getting it. So you're the biggest man of the world at this moment. It's Bain trapped under ice, Alpha and Omega in Europe. Cruelhand is there in the States, too.

So crazy tours for this era. Wait, was Crohn not in Europe? No, I don't know why. Somebody from Cruhan was in Europe. Maybe they just rolled, I feel like Chris Link was what I was in. He might have been playing for Bain, but I also, I don't think he was there. Maybe I just wanted him to be there. So I'll take any opportunity to towards Chris Link.

Absolutely. Dude, he had this bit at the time where he was like a karate sensei. Do you remember that one? Yes. Oh, my Kiyai. I can't even describe how funny it was. Like standing and balancing himself on things that were actually impressive. Like, I don't know, you'd be like at a venue and there'd be like some weird things.

high in the air where he'd be balancing at one foot and doing an improv like karate sense a whole instruction thing to an audience of two you know he had to train or something like in that karate you know he took at least the beginner class to know the key eye stuff and like he had a whole it was there uh but yeah dude 2010 summer the summer was my first u.s tour yeah you are baby baby i was 18 on the first one. You guys were so sweet to me. Doesn't that make all the difference in the world?

It really does, man. It really does, yeah. Probably try to hit what was going on, you know? Okay, good to know. You know, I always wondered. I had a conscious thought about that trip when I saw you at Sound of Fury. Just because you're physically the biggest

I've ever seen you at this point, including when you were, you know, you had your show me. face. You've like outgrown chubby Colin, you know. Not on the scale, but maybe with, width wise. I was thinking as I was thinking,

there's no way you're lighter than, than that time. I felt, I felt like your biggest. And I was thinking about you, like when I met you and you were like a child, like actual little kids. Scronny.

Like scrawny even. Big time. I was, I was, but like, I was a weird, weird little string being freak, man.

And I, Jared Carmen One of the most insane, amazing people to ever live genuinely thought I was autistic on those tours Because I always was listening to music Because I was 18, I was like, all right, I don't know what to do So I'm just going to listen to music Yeah

So then in one day I swear to God Jared Jared in a very Jared way It's like, yo, are you like autistic or something? I don't think so I'm trying to be mean He just

No he's not There was zero malice to that question He just wanted to know But I got here's Are you done? No no please gone We'll go in and out of it Yeah of course

I got I got some smoke For trapped under ice Possibly the greatest And you know One of like three Great hardcore music videos Was the Believe music video Oh yeah

Dude that's not really cool. When that yeah, it's like, it's like live Seeley's in it. It's fucking rad.

I just remember at the time you know, hardcore bands putting out music videos is always like kind of like and I'm even considering like our own. It's like, it's not really something.

That's why there is no God's hate video. We just were like, we're just straight up. Too shy. They're just like stupid. Like they're, it's dumb. The only cool thing

about hardcore is like the live setting. So to be able to bring that into a video and to like pull it off. Genuinely, I think I watched that thing a thousand times. Wow. Like a thousand times when it came. That's like $8 that you gave straight up. Ad revenue. Some resids. Yeah. That video was made by Sean Cullen. You actually played guitar and turnstile. Which is Sean, yeah. Yeah. And it was like I think it was like a school project. And I think he actually had a pretty good idea. And he's like somebody who likes hardcore a lot. And at the time, everything was extreme. And I think that's like, he's like, I want to capture extreme.

And we planned the show. There's like a free show. And we just put like cool bands from the area on it and be like, hey, it's free. And just pull up. We're going to play. It's going to be crazy. And it was at a venue that allowed crazy stuff to happen, bad stuff to happen. Like people get their ass whooped and stuff.

And then everybody knew it's like, oh, this is going to be a video. And trapped into race is kind of hype. now so we're going to beat the shit out of each other. Really good shots of that happening. How many times did you guys play the song? I think only twice. That's pretty good. I've been witnessed to a couple bands

so I don't want to name who played who did that at a show that we were all on and played it like seven times. Oh my God. Do the whole like, hey, move up for this part. Yeah. You know. I think.

after the second shot, I remember, I'm certain it was two shots because we were all looking at each other being like, yo, people aren't going to survive this. It's going to be bad. Like, it's getting bad. It was like the first shot was pretty crazy. And the second one, I think people were like, all right. They needed to do it again. So I guess I got to step it up. There's like a young D thing in there.

And he's like, you know, one of the most peaceful people in the world. But even he was being. He was bullying? Too much, dude. Yeah. Everybody was putting on. it's the coolest music video ever. Coolest song.

Yeah, paired with a great. Like, it's just like a good vibe. I have a bootleg tape, a VHS tape. I obviously don't have a VCR player, but I have a VHS tape of Youth Today filming. It's like the behind the scenes of them filming the No More music video. And they play it like 10 times.

Oh yeah. You know what I mean? And it's like, it's just, it's crazy that you guys only did it twice. And it looks fucking insane. I love that music video. So there's my smoke. Definitively, one of the more dangerous pits I've seen.

Another pit I bring up a lot of really dangerous mosh pits was Harmsway at Rainfest. Oh, yeah. We opened, Colin, we opened with the strength beyond strength breakdown. It was the year before you were priests. So I think it was 2000. I was there. I played with, that was Pressure's last show when I played Jones in Pressure. Oh, that sounds right.

Yeah. Yeah, Leeway played that year. Yeah. It was like leeway terror. Yeah. Trappedon Rise. Yeah. That was, yeah, I remember that.

Mospit was pretty aggressive. Like the whole, that's like a legendary moment for scary Moshpit stuff. But I remember seeing like that actually, so that not long after that was when Trapped and Race took a little hiatus. And for me, that show was actually one of my reference points of being like, don't be wrong. Like I grew up in the sidebar. and like seeing skinhead shit and stout shit and like, you know,

just like scary dudes beating each other's asses. And I liked that. And I thought it was like really exciting as a kid. And it like probably saved my life, like wanting to be in this little room and beating the shit out of my friends. I love that. There's a time and place for it. But for Trapped and Race at the moment, there was like so much of that.

And then I have this one image in my head, harm's way playing. And this girl got kicked in the nose and her nose split down the middle. And it was like open. Like two noses. And I could just see everything. dog, I could see everything. Yeah, like two separate noses. And then like all the inside stuff.

Holy shit. Dude, I never want to see that again. And again, like the trapped under ice pit was getting a little more wild. And I was like, yeah, I could take a break from this. Wow. And again, it's like nobody was attacking this woman. No, of course. She uphit, a pit queen for sure.

She's down. I've seen her pit a lot. But it's just a hard image to swallow. actual, like obviously injuries, mistakes, actual violence, like are a bummer for sure. I remember. I'm totally down with all that. I remember Harmsway playing upstairs at Charm City and the only people moshing were you and Sam. It was like early like no gods, no masters era Harmsway.

Oh, that's cool. Yeah. It was cool. Sam and me, Sam's like was such a. active member of the pit. Absolutely. It's like there's so many bands that came through

that me and him loved and it didn't matter who was down or not. Me and Sam was getting out. That's the mark of a great mosher, for one,

is just being there all the time. And here's your thing. The mark of, again, the best moshers make the best bands because they just play what they want to hear. They know what,

what excites them physically, so they're just going to do that musically. And Sam, he beat ass. I saw it. I've seen it. He rocks ass in the pit

and he rocks that ass on a guitar. He's such a fucking legend because he just genuinely loves heavy music and what makes you mosh. It's like so interesting. I think of music from a songwriter perspective and I can show Sam something. And he's immediately,

he like sees the pit and he'll be like, nah, it's saying it. And he can take him be like what you forgot. Yeah. So the T. song too true. I talked to him at length about it.

And he was like, he was like, that was a visual song where like the mosh part was completely written only with the visual of like what I wanted to see pit wise. He was not like, okay, here's what I want to achieve music? It was like, okay, here,

what, what pit do I want to see? And that's, and it's just his hand, he was like, my hand just did the rest. So that that really just made sense me. And he was prolific. It was prolific. To me at the time, I was like, okay, I think I get it now. But Sam

was the guy where on that tour like you were to one when we got to Europe, but Sam was the first one to be like, what do you like? Why are you doing this? And then we got along pretty fast because it was like, oh, I just want that's all I care about. Yeah.

And then it got to, I think it might have been Grand Rapids or somewhere. And you had like food poisoning or something. So you couldn't sing. Yeah, yeah, of course. So the whole tour sang for you. Nobody wanted to do believe. And I didn't know why. So I was like, I'll do it.

And that was where all of you guys were like, that was sick. Like, thanks. Was there a video of that? I don't know. I've never looked, but maybe. Yeah, right, dude. I've never found a video, but it breaks my heart because I really wanted to come in and see it. You know, I was like, can I come in everybody?

I was like, no, you're sick. Like, people are going to be bummed if you're in the back of the room. Makes sense. I saw back back, like way back pre-being able to drive, went and came into the city and saw American Nightmare with, I don't even remember, honestly, who else? And Wes had, like, couldn't sing. So people from the tour were singing. But he was just side stage. And it was very much like, what are you doing?

Was it a converged tour? Dude, you know what? I don't remember who else played, but a band called Pelican from here, like, opened. And I was like a young, you know, I just wanted to like sing along and stage dive. You know what I mean? So Pelican played and they're like kind of a stonery band. They played like. Yeah, yeah.

So they played like a two or three minute song. And then they were like, hey, thanks. We're Pelican. We only have 30 minutes. So this next song is 23. minutes long. And I just remember like turning around and going and sitting somewhere in the back, just like being

a depressed high schooler who just wanted to jump off of something. Yeah, they're more of a sitting at home, relax, heavy man. You were, you were lucky. There's a place for that. You were lucky on that show, Justice, because it was like a tour of front men.

Dude, it was, what a cool, it was like you, Luis, Aaron Bardard sang. Cam, Frank Rohan sang one. Oh, yeah. I feel like everybody in Cruelhan sang one. That one, they were also cool. Yeah. That, that group of guys in Cruelhan at that time, like Cam Nate, that, that combo?

They were four piece, right? No, Seeger was there too, which Seeger's fucking sick. The ability to stage die from every member, I feel like the current lineup of Cruelhand, too, like Cruelhand just stage dies. It's like a requirement. That's the test. Yeah. You can be in, but still. You can you play?

Can you do a gainer? Yeah, that was a magical tour. That was where I saw a ghost. Do you ever see a ghost on tour? I saw a ghost? You saw a ghost on the tour? Go ahead. Yeah, we've already talked about it.

I don't want to repeat the story on the show, but I saw Katie from Nashville, K-80. K-80. There was a ghost in her house. I saw it. She confirmed it, so it's totally real. I messaged her after that episode and she did again confirm that there's like

a little girl ghost in the house. And I didn't even talk to her about it, brother. It was like, I started to tell her about what I saw and she finished my sentence. Yeah, yeah. That's fucking, man. You ever seen anything like that, Justice? Aliens or ghosts or anything?

I've had some pretty crazy scenarios. I have like sleep paralysis a lot. And it's actually, I almost sound like a hippie. I don't want to get too into my hippie shit. No, get into it. It's cool. I have like sleep paralysis and I'll have like a lot of times where I feel like everybody has this shit. I'm not being like, I'm clairvoyant or shit.

Like I'll have, you know, people like visit me in dreams and stuff. And then what it's really scary is like when you have people visit you in a sleep paralysis. So you're like in your home and it's somebody you know pops up. And they're like, what's good? You're like, you're like, fucked up, you know? Do you get sleep paralysis at night or only during like naps during the day? At night. I've had them.

It's been chilling a lot recently. I don't know. I think maybe we'd help bad. Maybe not going to be a wood right now. Yeah, yeah, right. Because I don't like it. No, no. It's scarier shit.

It doesn't happen to me too often. It happens. If you're heavy, it happens more often. It happens to James all the time in the van. Really? In the van, he'll be, if he's like sitting shotgun, he'll be sleeping. And he'll just like, huh. And he'll be like, yeah, I couldn't move for the last like five minutes or whatever.

I've never, I want to, I want to feel it. Dude, it's the weirdest shit. Sounds awesome. I've never seen anything. People will, like, see stuff or like experience, whatever, which, you know, I'm sure is like a little dream state, a little just weird. and like that creeps me out, but I've definitely napped

and just been unable to move but could see my whole room. Wow. I never done that. I never had a wet dream either. I don't think I ever did either. This sounds so awesome. Yeah.

It's the best way to wake up, dude. You guys are so lucky. I've never had one. Oh, I never had one. That I'm aware of. I used to have them, like, constantly. There's a problem. I was wondering,

To bring up American nightmare, again, they had, we keep the wet dream alive as a lyric. I don't, I don't know what that means. They're sexy. Is that what it is? They're so sexy that you're going to have wet dreams about that. The guys are dreaming about him, waking up, oh, fucking, and then you got to do laundry, you know.

Yeah, I wish I had one, man. You'll get there, baby. I think with sleep paralysis, specifically, I think, and maybe wet dreams too, but, uh, I do think there's like a spiritual connection of some sort with that kind of stuff. Oh, brother. And I've seen these little instances that make me feel like that. And one of particular, we like stayed in New York.

And at the time, Cheddar was in the band. And Dorian was in the band. Fucking crazy. And I fell asleep on the floor. And we were all like kind of creeped out at this house in New York City. And we lay down on the floor all three of us to sleep. And I had a sleep process. And I woke up.

And I saw like a figure in the room. And I was like, damn, that's crazy. I didn't want to wake nobody up. And then I looked over and Cheddar was like, man, man. He's like, making weird noises and shaking and shit. And I realized he was having sleep paralysis. And I was like, you know, that's crazy. Should I wake him up or not?

Uh-huh. He jumped up. Oh, my God. He's like looking around. And then Dorian starts shaking and shit. No way. All three of us had sleep paralysis at the same time. Dude, I bet you Dorian texted Cheddar and was like, hey, do you want to scare him?

That's like the most. You're probably right. And I'm just figuring this out right now. But Cheddar's thing was he was like, I didn't see anything. And again, I did see a figure. And I didn't say anything to anybody right away. But Dorian was the first to be like, there was an old man in the room, dude. Like, I saw him.

And I was like, yo, I saw something. But shit's weird. You know what? You know what does happen to me is when that's going on? I hear noises. I hear like, like the sound. Imagine like a door falling over. I hear like that down the hall.

Fuck that, dude. But it's just like. your blood pumping. Like it's not it's like in the moment you're like holy shit and then you're like thinking about it

you're like oh wait I can hear it again just really quiet because it's my pulse you know like weird it's fucking weird man it's weird shit you just reminded me though

of one of the worst one of the worst times somebody who we don't talk about anymore was touring with us had a spot for us to stay in New York City parking was fine we got there like 7 a.m.

So the sun was up and it's summer but we're like oh we're like get to sleep all day. We'll go get some good lunch in New York and then go to the show or whatever. We get in, it's a loft with cement floor with no carpet, just cement. And then there's like a dude in attached to the living room. He's got like a little like nook for a computer just blasting nine inch nails. Like seven a.m. and won't turn it. In New York. In New York. Not, uh,

S in Germany? Not as in Germany. And when asked to turn it down, he said he, he, He was like working, he was like working on a paper or something and he like had to stay up. No headphones, apparently. And then dude was sleeping in girls bed while all of us were just suffering on the floor. Crazy. What? I can be miserable. Yeah.

You like it now? It's different. Like I just just got back from a trip. And dude, probably a typical. response, but like I can feel my body getting older. But at the same time, I've become more proactive in the last couple of years about like functional movement and my body health and stuff. So like, I got through it.

But like, um, it's hard. Like, just like the idea of sitting in the van, I didn't realize how bad. Take two years off of touring and then you go back to it. You can see clear as day everything that's fucking you up. And like, all my digestion problems are a result of tour. All my fucking back problems I've had in the past are resolved of tour. Even my shoulder problems I've had. Dude, your digestion problems are pretty legendary at this point.

Pretty legendary. Really? I'm unaware. Yeah, they're pretty legendary on tour. But, like, at home, I get into, like, a little thing and I'm good. And I convince myself, I'm like, oh, this isn't a problem anymore. But I have a celiac and lactose intolerant and then mixing a little IBS. I'd be shouldn't.

Yeah. You're a fellow soldier of the irritable bowel? Yeah. I had an ex-girlfriend who had celiac real bad. She would get, like, seizures and shit. It was scary. What the fuck? Dietary seizures?

Yeah. Like, at what point do you just... All right, never mind. Yeah, take it easy, brother. She just got married. What point would I just... Mozzle top, Jenna. I just...

All right. Basically, if I ate McDonald's and had a seizure, I'm fucking killing myself. All right? I'm not... Come on. Let's... One time I was trying to, like, impress her. when we were first dating and I found a restaurant

that had gluten-free pasta. I was like, oh, we'll just go get, you know, it'll be easy. And we sit down and she orders it. And she starts eating it and it's, uh, there's no noodles. It's broccoli with sauce. I would have shot you dead in the fucking restaurant. So it's, so it's gluten-free pasta in that there's no, it's like saying, hey, this is a vegan burger.

And it's just bread. You know, like, there's nothing to it. Come on, Zoe. Celiac is no joke, though. That's always here. Damn, dude. Brutus is going to come up here at some point, too. He's been checking us out.

He looks nappy. You're the original dog guy. He must come up. You started dogs, basically, in my mind. How long you've been into dogs? Spike. Spike was like the first dog I ever saw. Oh, yeah, Spike.

Who's that? Who's that? Who's he? This is Brutus. Brutus. Brutus. Brutus the barber. He's really cuddly. He, like, wants to.

He wants to sleep right now, but he wants to do it right here. Yeah. Straight up. Maybe he won't. What's better than that? Yeah. Keep him in there. It's interesting to hear that you've recently become more, I guess, self-aware of, like,

your body, like taking care of your body and stuff because you've always been like a beefy boy. Yeah. You're the, you're the OG fitness guy. You did the squat rack video, you know. Start a lot of things. You killed Meloddick hardcore. Yeah. How do you feel about it coming back?

I think I'm not annoyed by it because at the time it was like everybody was trying to do it and everybody was trying to do it so bad now there's like a couple of bands that are doing it and doing real well

you know like one step closer for example was like I fuck with that I respect that shit you know like but you know at the time it was fucking out of control and everybody sucked

and they thought they needed special treatment for making trash you know what else it is right now is and I say this liking quite a few of them but like hardcore

dude's playing actual death metal is like the new. Yeah. You think that's the new melodic hardcore? I mean, kind of. That's the new like, uh, I don't know, beat down is just like, ah, we skip beat down and we're just playing. We just played this membership.

Yeah. Which like, it's working for them. Yeah, I'd rather that than fucking verse clones. Still get me wrong. Like either way. You are. Yeah.

You're, you're preaching right now. Yeah. What bands in that land do you think deserve the past? Like who really is is owning that lane? Right now? Yeah. I mean, other than one step closer? No, no.

The, uh, the, the, the, oh, oh, I really dig 200 stab wounds. I think they're very good. Oh, they like saying. Oh. I like, I didn't know. Yeah. I didn't know if they were like in that or if they were too more as like a straight, just like death metal weirdos because they're all, they're all. They've, they've been kicked in their life.

Yeah. sure. They're incredible. Tang with Sugabog, they, they've been kicking. Yeah, big time. What did Corpse Grinder call them again? I forget. Did you see that tweet that Corpse Grider called them like Sudafed Botox or something on stage? No. Have you seen the Campbell Corpse American Dad mashup?

No. Dude, it's one of the funniest things I've ever seen. I'll put it in. Yeah, please. Here it is. That was incredible. Who else? I like,

I like Frozen Soul personally. Yeah. It's just like kind of bull throwery. And I dig the like snow, like live. They like spray like fake snow. That's fucking awesome. Oh man. That's cool.

Like that's sick. Like I can get behind that. You know what I mean? But I don't want it to be like a thing where there's like all of a sudden 20 in a year. Yeah. Is it my time to go death metal? Dude, I would now. I would love that.

Are you a death rental guy? So I've always been, I've actually talked to a lot about this. I'm like a death metal poser, but very intentionally. Like with hardcore, I've like submerged myself and, you know, in a lot of cases, it enriching my life. And in some cases it, like, bum me out. Like, you meet the dude in the band that you grew up loving. And he's a loser. And it's like, it's like crippling.

It sucks. And I've always, like, tried to keep death metal kind of distant. And like, I've started to, like, write death. metal music on guitar and then I'm like I gotta back off like I'm figuring it figuring it out and I don't want to spoil it for me I'd like just to be blown away by some shit it's like I like like like you don't want to start wrestling because then you'll know what they're doing that's what happened to me and it's the same thing um so you're saying it ruined death metal for no not ruined wrestling oh well there's certain things where I'll be like oh that he's

choking him right now because they're tired you know right right right Like they're resting. And which I get, you got to, I'm tired too. I'm tired right now. I need to rest right now. Why don't you fucking joke me? But with death metal, it's crazy to realize that's the actual hardest hard music ever. Agreed.

Yeah. Like, Hey, breed is just death metal. Their best hate breed stuff is like, yeah. They're like, hey, let's use this part from this song. Yep. So incredible. Dying fetus. Unbelievable.

Dying fetus wrote every good breakdown ever. Ever, dude. They're all taken. And then you talk to them and they're like, yeah, this is a death threat part. Right. Yeah, yeah.

Dude, so cool. I remember reading a thing that obituary talked about Master Killer being like a big influence for them. One of them manages Marauder. Yeah, I love that. Maybe not currently, but like very recently. Maybe not.

Maybe not currently currently. I would like to start, you know, there's some, some, uh, death metal OGs. I'm back in Baltimore now. Mm-hmm. I got some death metal rockers around here. And I've, I've, like, humored the idea being like, we should get, we should rip. We should make some shit. You, how long were you?

And next step up as, as one band? Come on. How long were you in, in California? You're out there for a minute. Seven, eight, yeah. Yeah. A little over 70 years, maybe, maybe, yeah. 78 years.

You look great. And what's it, is it good to be home? I don't want to, I'm not trying to pry, you know. Oh, it's awesome. Like, I came out here for like the specific reason of like, you know, like seeing, being friends and family and like, never did I have a, like, you know, people say like, like, L.A.'s better. It's like, duh.

It's like fucking L.A. You know, it's like got all the shit. But there's like things here that pertain to me. Like, there are. It's like, I'm from Baltimore. like this is very much who I am. So it's like very comfortable for me. It's a happy place and I've been very productive since I've been here.

It's like interesting. Like I almost like have been bred and taught to thrive in this kind of environment. Like in L.A. It's like there's so much going on and I get like real ADD and have trouble focusing. And then, you know, like I'm off seeing this friend and doing this and then trying to writing sessions and stuff like that. Here it's like, I'm just going to sit down and make my music. And that's what's most important to me.

And then I'm going to go spend time with friends and like, you know, more small town stuff. But Baltimore is in a really cool place right now. It's like more inspiring than it's ever been. It's like shows are cracking. Comtown really changed Baltimore, man. I don't know what Comtown's influence is. But I do, I can see that. I'm sure they've, you know.

They changed the perception. You, Trappin'Oise and Comtown are maybe the two biggest, most influential things from Baltimore. I don't know if you've heard of turnstile. I have. That's the other one. But I'm just, but I think I heard of it. But I'm talking about inspiration. Would there be a turnstown without Trepenter Rice?

Without Comtown, would there be a Trepenter race? Oh, no, dude. Yeah. I've never listened. I listened to an episode of Comtown, and I was like, this is just chaotic. I can't do it. I don't really do podcasts. but I will say individually all of those

They're all hilarious So I've like watched all their stand-up And little separate things they do Obviously I'm a huge fan of Stavi He's a legend I can't believe he doesn't acknowledge you He don't follow you back man I need some respect

Dude I think he's more of a fool like Because I like I live in Greek town for a long time Trapped in the Rice was a Greek town band So we're two of his We're two of Greek town's largest biggest exports. Yeah.

But he'd be around. Like, fools will, like, show me like, oh, he bought his house from a member of Trapped Under Rice. Oh.

Fucking Tony Hare was like, filling in for us at the time. Playing guitar for us kind of a lot. And I'm pretty sure that's where he got his, he bought his house from Tony. I just played a show with, with Benji's new band.

Benji. Benji. From Trapped and Rice. Oh. He lived on the Bay. I never think it was Benji. That's what it was just been. He reintroduced himself to me as Benji, and I was like, you are Ben.

You're in Trapper Ice. Yeah. I know he does Benji, but I always think of riding out when I spun. Yeah. That's the king of Benjys, dude. That is the Benjee for sure. I love him. But Ben Asparza, that's what I can call Ben.

He's the king of Benaspars. He's never been another. He played on death clock ticking, so he's a king of something, you know. He's a cool drummer. He's got, he's freaky. He's freaky. You know I love What's up with that one?

You got to bring it back. We've played it. We're recorded. Interesting. Oh, that's good. Yeah, interesting. What would new Trapped and Array sound like to you? What would you make?

What would I make? Okay, so I think that you were headed towards a balance of you being of sick fuck, fucking freak, doing your freaky thing. And so what's, what's crazy is on Heatwave the song

Uh chun dun dun dun dun dun dun dun dun dun I remember that from that 2010 tour because that was a that was a Big Kiss Good Night demo Really?

And uh we have a caller go ahead so that was a that was on the like demo like you showed me the whole pre pro for the record And it was like, okay, this is going to change music.

And, but I remember that part, dun dun, being like the thing that the whole band was universally the most excited about. And then it wouldn't come out for seven more years or something. Ain't that some shit? That was like, so when we recorded Big Kiss Good Night, we had everybody got a card,

like a, my voice matters more than everybody else. card. Everybody gets one, you know? And they were all used against me. They were all used to break my heart. And maybe it's for the best because Big Kiss and I did really well. It didn't need that song. Like, yeah. My two favorite songs got cut and they're both somebody's like they're one and only above everybody. What would you call that? Like a fucking veto just like the ultimate veto. Yeah. Wow. Yeah. And I was like, yo, I like had a heart to heart with the person. You know, And I was like, how could you do that?

What did you use? What did you veto? I think mine was a song that we were working on, and I was having trouble writing vocal stuff to it. And I just felt like there's a great song. It's just far from what I could do. And I didn't feel inspired because it's so far from me, you know? Yeah.

And there's something that nobody's ever heard, never came back. And the funny thing is, like, what Heat Wave, some of those songs are songs that got vetoed from Big Kiss Goodnight for being too heavy. But then when Heat Wave comes out, people are like, no, these songs aren't as heavy as Big Kiss Good Night. It's like, it's literally the songs we cut because they were too heavy. There's, there's, yeah, it's, it's, it's, it's, it's, it's, it's, it's, it's, just like the, just the vibe at the time. You know, you have the cherries on the front.

People are, people are, people are like, they're, they're, they're clouded. Their judgment is clouded by, by the, by the other factors. And, and Angel Dust exists at this time and is thriving. So they hear you. They hear Angel Dust Justice because that like the singers evolve, you know? You can't do. My thing is this. Everybody's a music critic and nobody can just,

nobody can pinpoint that. They can't say, okay, I'm not as into this because justice is like softer now or whatever, however they perceive me. Yeah. And or there's cherries on the cover, so I'm not into this. Or the songs are shorter. I'm not into. That's fine.

But you get people making definitive statements. and not this is a criticism, but it's not like beef or anything because I'm not upset about this, but another podcast talks a lot about that stuff, about Trapped Interi specifically. And on that podcast, they said definitive things. Like, it's definitively not as heavy.

It's like, no, it's definitively produced different. There's definitively cherries on the cover. Yeah. Finatively, I'm an angel dust. You can't say it's not as heavy. It is. The idea is the songs were like shorter and packed in more. And that does take away an element of heaviness,

I guess because you have less buildup into a moment. A story to tell. But that's fucking satisfaction. That's lowest of the low. You know what I mean? Like those records are special because in Trapped Deney's never had that, the short fast songs. So that's what we were going for

with that. And the other thing they said a lot on that podcast was that it failed. The record failed. It didn't succeed. Well, what a success. That record outsold any other Trapped Dendrace record. And with that, did it really? Yeah. With that,

it outsold most hardcore records ever recorded. Yeah, right. Intatively, very successful. Just it didn't fit. And that's what people need to say when the people who are music journalists or people who are reviewing music, I think they need to like back off of their perception and talk about what music is and what is reality.

Because you can't paint a picture where I put out some shitty record that didn't do well and I can't write riffs. I'll out riff any motherfucker. I got Sam Traffkin in the pocket dude like that fool's just sitting he's on deck at home right now just evil riffs all day but it's like I did it

I already did that right right you know it's like not like making music and I would love to make heavy music at some point but it's just not I need it man I need more for you he's got more he got more in the tank dude I write shit all the time

but you know it's like very focused on other things and I don't have really the time or energy to like invest in starting like a new band from scratch and uh well thank god you have this other legendary band that you don't have to scratch from just do more yeah true i mean well trapped and race isn't going to be active anytime soon which is uh equally it's a breaking news by the way yeah hard law exclusive hard law exclusive i think most people have figured out by now that trapped under race isn't active it'll be back

Yeah, I'd like to play some shows and I don't want to be that band that's like 10 years down the road still playing shows on some old shit like we have sauce. Another interesting thing with Heat Wave that I'd like to, there was like a whole game plan

with doing like a second record like soon after Heat Wave. There was more Sam-centric where Sam was like building those songs that I think are more what a classic TUI fan might expect

structurally. And that just didn't happen because life happened. There you go. Yeah. I feel. So when you were, you first told me like we're doing more songs, we're going to do a seven inch.

I begged and pleaded with you. I said, do an LP, brother. The people need an LP. So. Yeah. I don't know if, I don't know if you heard me.

And that's why he waves us. But what you were saying before about, uh, kind of removing yourself from music reminds me of a story where Stickman was recording vocals for wisdom and chains, like doing a guest part. And he's doing the part. And he's like in this,

he's full stick man, you know, one of the greatest false time. And it's like not what Joe was hearing. So Joe is like, like across the window going, you know. And then Stickman goes like,

like, how are you going to like this, I make the rhythm, you know? Right. This is my rhythm. And that I think, about that all the time when somebody's like you're off key or you're off beat. I'm like

brother, that's my beat. Yeah. I decide what is on and off. Yeah, right. And that like, Sick man is so prolific like that, you know? That might be the most inspiring thing I've heard. That's what I'm saying,

dude. Justice, you remember do you remember the show one of the greatest book shows ever that no one was at in West Texas that we both played? Oh, yeah, holy shit. I wouldn't say nobody was there. It was kind of lit.

It was for a big little... People were there because 10 bands played. Yeah, yeah. It wasn't like a 10 band audience, but... Yeah, right. Yeah, exactly. It was trapped under ice, terror, backtrack, take offense, harm's way. And then it was like 100th straight from the path.

I think we're like the two bands that were kind of outliers. So it was our tour, which was backtrack, 100th, take offense, and, betrayal. Betrayal. Yeah, they play Trial, dude. That's right. Shake well. Shout out. Kale, dude. Kale was born in betrayal. Oh, really? Be Kale. Dude, Kail was a monster on that tour, dude. He was just like

killing the drums and he was so young. His energy was out of control. And that tour, we had like an off day in like Lubbock, Texas or something. Somewhere at the Pine Box. I have the, I thought about this because I have like a screen printed flyer. I'm

It was in Lubbock? It was in Lubbock or? I think Lubbock, yeah. Yeah. Is the Pine Box that bar? That's like, was it a bar. It's two big sections.

But it was, you know, it was, we were on the occasion strain tour with them, Tara Stray and us, but the Acacia Strain didn't jump on this show.

So it was like the two tours kind of like combined. And it was fucking awesome. But like probably paid maybe 40 people. Yeah, but that that was so sick because of all the band members there It was all band members like yeah That's all it was cool, it was a lot of fun

That's why I felt so packed I have this like memory of I'm like It was definitely more packed than that but it was like Probably 70 people in the past Exactly, that's what I'm saying it was like And then we took a yeah that that that was a fun that was a fun one Just this one show that that could have been a fucking Fest honestly speaking of which Tell me about the 10 for 10 tour justice

Oh yeah Yeah. And that was, I hate the marketing thing. And everybody wants to make videos and like promote it. Be like, 10 bands, 10, how does you go wrong? You're like, what else could you want? It's like, they're like hitting us up nonstop. You're like, we need promo videos.

And they had like people like at the shows like with cameras. So we could keep promoting it. Yeah. The concept is really cool. Absolutely. Absolutely. Yeah. So it's 10 bands for $10, which.

It's weird marketing. What a deal. Yeah. I know. How does that add up? Like, does the math work there? No. There was,

I think there's, I think everybody did good. Like, I think financially it was chill because, you know, for a lot of us, we were still new bands and we, and we weren't used to making money.

So I remember the offer was like good. I think we got off for like $400 a day. And at that time, that was unheard. Yeah, totally, totally. It's weird now because I know young bands that go on tour and they get,

you know, like their first tour it's $250 a day. But it has to be now. We paid the price so that they can go to KFC you know. Dog trapped on a race tour for like 10 years making $100.00.00% and like

in the venue is out. I'm like killing it and it's being like, yo made $100 bucks. It's crazy. We're rich. We're paid as far. We might be able to get a hotel this night. Dude, on like a $250 or 300 night, it was like holy shit, dude. Oh, we're the biggest man in the world.

The biggest man ever. And you just look at, look at the math of the 10 for 10 tour, you know? Yeah, yeah. Let's think about it. Like the glass house, for example.

If they got 400 bucks, that's 40 people. 40 people. Before the venue cut or anything. So the, for any. The glass house, there was,

I feel like, I feel like, how many of those shows sold out, realistically? All of them. Oh, there's, I think there's one show that did,

like, they're bad, did bad, but it's like a weird area. It was like, it was like, um, Louisiana somewhere.

I don't think it was New Orleans. I think it was like somewhere in Louisiana was kind of weird and cuddy. And I remember being like, damn it's crazy that there's not people who want to pay 10 bucks to come to the hardcore show. So every other show I think was sold out.

Was the lineup kind of rotating or who was on that? Terror. Terror, madball. Let's think here. Bain. Vision or disorder on a couple of shows. Angel Dust, mongoloids.

Angel, no. There's some weird. yeah, yeah, that's what I said. Poisoned the Well, Mad Balban, vision of disorder sometimes. Terror. Death before dishonor. War of Ages's private stereo. There was some definite Christian metalcore.

Is that War of Ages is Christian metalcore? Sounds right. And I think there's another one to where it was like, and it was cool. Like it's just far from my wheelhouse. Yeah, of course. It was definitely like a clash of worlds. I don't want to put nobody's name on this, but there's like a funny relationship that I always think about with that tour.

there was somebody on that tour who was in a band that's like just scary gang guy and he lost his shoes he had some bands that got lost and he started like he found somebody I want to say in War of Ages or one of the metal bands that were a little more outlier but maybe it was War of Ages

I don't want to put it on him but one of his bands and he like punked this dude for his shoes all crazy and I've never seen it was like jailhouse behavior I've never seen this before he started making the dude like hold his pocket and stuff. And it's like this little skinny dude on the tour. And he like would like be walking,

you seem like walking around like backstage and the dude be like holding his pocket and like rubbing his feet. Like the duration of the rest of the tour. Damn. Yeah. And there was like nothing anybody can say about it because just these two worlds collided

and that's what it is. Like you hold in a pocket now because you wanted to play aggressive music and steal some scary guy's shoes. He's so he didn't steal the shoes. He'd be like, hey, dog, it's time for a kiss. to give you, like, his face and stuff.

It was crazy. You know how shit, dude, like. You don't say, that, that would an era, man. Yeah. There ain't nobody holding a pocket on tour anymore.

It's not. Okay. Glasshouse, 800 cap. 800 caps. That's $8,000. $8. Which is not a lot to gross. They're sponsors.

Oh. Okay, they're sponsors. That's it. Okay. There you go. So let's see the sponsors do another, like, I'm just guessing,

like another couple thousand on that show. That makes sense. Like 12,000 in guarantees. And then like I know even some of the bigger bands took a hit. Like they made less for it. Just to do the coolest looking to wherever. Yeah. What time would that should start?

Like, like four. Vision. When would they? Yeah, four o'clock? Yeah, maybe so. I went to the Glass House one. It was awesome. The Glass House show was crazy.

I remember seeing some ass weapons outside. Absolutely. Do you know anything like that? No. That was power for the course, brother. Dude, that was L.A. like coming to anything in California, especially LA, but anything in California, it's weird now. California is a huge hardcore scene. And, you know, there's definitely scary people involved.

But for the most part, it's like a really good vibe. And as long as you're not being a like a troublemaker, you don't have to deal with the scary people. But it was every single time I came to California, there'd be like beatings and stabbings and shit. And I was like, I would say whoopings now are like every time you'll be like, why did that happen? they'll tell you and you'll be like, man, good reason. He's a really good thing doing that. You know, like it's pretty appropriate. Fools were getting it for no reason back in the, like, no good reason at least.

Yeah, it was wild. Different time. Yeah. Different time. Oh, yeah. Better time? I remember when black, when blacklisted first played Chicago and like all the Philadelphia dudes came with them and just like demolished the room. You know what I mean?

It was just like, hey, this man is cool. Like, there was no, there was, oh, man. Blackless. Dude, imagine the head spake. And, you know, again, I've been, I've been to the sidebar. You know, I spent a lot of time there when I was a kid. And definitely part of the experience is I'm going to get whipped. Like, I've had my nose broke 100 times.

My teeth aren't gold because I think it's cool. It's because I'm tired to get him punched out of my fucking head. It's pure. It's not for any reason. But it's like, just imagine some of the conversations, like going, hey, let's all get in the van and go to Chicago and just tear it. Yeah. That was it. That was literally the conversation, too.

Yeah. I was like, oh, Blacklist is playing this fast. Like, let's go kind of a thing. And just I was a child. That was 15. Dude, Philly was so unhinged when I was a kid. Like being real close to Philly. And Baltimore is crazy too, but it's like a, you know, we got a lot of skinheads and like, just like psycho weirdos.

But I feel like when I was a kid, Philly was the place. This is what I, I remember thinking, oh, I don't go to Philly because I'm going to get stabbed because every time like when the old heads from Baltimore, we go to Philly, somebody would come back stab. Like, you got a fight and I got the new thing here. I was like, damn, I'm trying not to go to Philly. I'm going to get stabbed. I don't think, like, can you, here's the question. Can you remember the most frightened you've ever been in a pit? to death threat in Connecticut.

Sounds about right. My second is probably 100 demons in Connecticut. And then my third would probably be death threat in New York City. There's like a different breed of person. And I say this as one of those people. Like I like Death Threat is the band that made Love Hardcore. Like I liked Hate Breed. I was like, this is cool.

And I went and saw Hate Breed and Death Threat and was playing in Baltimore. And those dudes were just like super nice to me. me and like treated me. I was like a little kid. I had, you know, some friends. But I was like the little annoying kid that everybody was like a little mean to, even if you were my friend. Etheret made me feel like, I don't know, like an individual. And they were like, I just remember they're being so cool and nice to me. And I was like, I really like this, but I was poor. I like grew up. You know, I grew up in like a section eight house and I probably was still living section eight at that time. And they gave me a CD because there was no way in guys.

I was green earth, I could afford a CD. Like a friend definitely paid to get you into the show. And their band was good. And I was like, damn, this is for me. And like the neighborhood I'm from, like, all the kids were obsessed with death rent. It was like, fucking, the biggest band in fucking in Essex. I mean, Death Red had and has the, like the hate breed intensity,

but with the like youth of today message. So it's like, it's just the, it's all world. There's no world. there's no sub-genre of hardcore that can't hear death threat and be like there's something for me here yeah they did tour like that too they would play with some like kind of like i guess youth crewy type bands and it would work because half the song is that never thought about that and then they and never thought about that damn and then and dad and did that but in like drop and drop beat is it actually drop i mean it's either drop or standard but it's in beat for sure um

I asked because I remember when blacklisted would cover Life of Agony. Blacklisted was ahead of the curve like a ton. Both in like, dude, they would do like noise with like the pedal loopers between songs, which like we directly ripped off immediately from them. They would cover stuff at, you know, singing like George would be singing and stuff. But they covered fucking River Runs Red in Chicago at time at Knights of Columbus. And it was the most horrifying thing. because I hadn't even heard Life of Agony yet.

It was like early. You know, it was before that kind of thing was really like common to, for people to know about. What year was that? Did you say? I remember I was with my first girlfriend, so either freshman or sophomore year of high school.

Wow. So 2003. Early. That's early for Life of Agony in, like, modern world. That's what I'm saying is like, dude, Blacklisted was like weirdly ahead of the curve, like a lot, a lot, a lot. absolutely and not a super not like a super hard band when you go back and and listen to the track there are parts but until yeah until the part until the part and but man yeah i definitely saw some bloodshed i would say dude what i for nigh for nigh i i mean that's an all-time track for sure that's the evilest track it's crazy remember dude remember the the fucking dead man's hands of course splits terror ringworm which was incredible Oh, yeah.

Blacklisted First Blood and then suicide file hope con. Yeah. There was almost a fourth one with coat orange switching tongues. There was almost a fourth one with a coat orange in harm's way. Well, there you go. Somebody lying. Let's revive it. I'm sure we could talk to some people and get it going.

That's some pirate shit, though, right? But I got to be on the track. Easy. Yeah, you can be on the track. Like if you all do it like eye for eye, I got to be the Joe hardcore on the track. Yeah, that's right. Uh, scariest pits. Yeah.

Honestly, it's probably something like hoods at some point. I believe that. Um, I remember the killer covered Slayer, they covered, um, south of heaven once and that was really scary too. That does sound scary. Killer covering Slayer in Chicago.

Yeah, at Knights of Columbus. Yeah. I don't want no part. That is unsafe. With some like key Boston bands there at the same time. So it was like actually horrifying. South of heaven.

Swear to God. That is the funniest thing I've ever heard in my life in like a cool way. That's the cool thing. So you have to remember this show. It was I want to say Harm's way played it,

but it was trapped under ice and the killer played for sure at the Knights of Columbus Hall. But I'd imagine if you didn't play, you would have been there. But Luke's daughter sang. We were on tour. We were on tour.

Yeah, we were out of town, but I remember that. Yeah, C. I think it's interesting because, like, with music, you kind of see that sometimes. Somebody's, they have a kid and, like, you know, like this guy who plays folk music might be like, my kid, you're going to come here and sing a song. But this is the killer in Chicago. Yeah, right. And his daughter was like, maybe like, maybe 10 at the time.

Yeah. And she, like fully understands this shit. She's not, not like, this is an alien to her. It's not like, it's not weird. It was like seeing like a hardcore singer that happened to be 10. Yeah. Yeah. It's like young Freddie in the fucking screwdriver shirt.

And it was like growing men is beating the shit out of each other, dude. Like, he's so committed. I was like, dude, that's the most dangerous and safe, protected 10-year-old girl on the face. We've got to ask, Luke, what's she doing now? She needs a band. Yeah, they're grown. They're like high schoolers now. He's got two daughters.

He's the man. Luke rocks. And back in the day. Brand of the show. Friend of the show, Luke Gray. He used to, you know, it was like MySpace back in the day, like when she was born. That's, that's, you know, whatever it was posting on. And he would post pictures like holding her on a swing set.

And all the comments would be like, God, I would hate to be her first boyfriend. Like anything like along those lines. Yeah. It's a tough, a tough dad to have to date into. So Angel Dust comes around a few years after you've been ruling the world. people mosh and killing each other left and right you know you're doing something different

outside of the box for what people expect from you first tours with switching tongues so hey it all comes back brother turnstile too yeah turnstile angel dust switching tongues so downpresser downpressor stigmata a lot happened

yeah oh complete coincidence and now here you are. That's your main gig, right? Yeah. I mean, I don't look at anything as a gig. I just like do what I do. You know, like, I like baked stuff. And I'm fortunate that people like pay attention to what I do, you know? And but like I'm always open to doing other things. Like I'm not like a, like it was a thing for me. I feel like trapped under race. Like people saw me as trapped in a race. Like that's like literally would be that. Like I definitely did full full transparency.

Like I definitely thought like you were only hard dude only into, you know, that kind of music at all. So when I first heard Angel Dust, I was like very surprised. Yeah. You know, it's understandable. But it's like, you know, like we go on tour and like people would be like, hey, we found three other bands that sound just like Trapped on Rice to Open for you guys. You're going to love it. I'd be like, what the fuck makes you think I want to hear that? That's crazy.

I don't want to hear a single band that sounds like Trapped on. And then like when you start branching out, so people are like, what is he doing? He's fake. And it's like, I'm just doing music that I like, you know? And it's weird because like hardcore is so much a piece of who I am and heavy music. It's like definitive. Like I am a hardcore fan.

It's hard to like hide that. And I think that's what makes Angel Dust authentic is that I do wear that on my sleeve. And the other members of Angel Dust, past and present are all involved in the hardcore scene. You know, we had a point where it was like, turnstile guys are so busy and how am I going to play shows as Angel Dust? And the only thing that would make sense is if somebody was somehow involved with hardcore music, punk music, and gets the whole thing, you know, some parts. Is Taylor Madison in the band now? It's kind of like the vibe is, like whenever he wants. wants to do it. He's got a lot of stuff going on.

He's the best. And, dude, he's incredible. Like, but yeah, it's like the tour we just did. It was like Super Heaven was out on the West Coast. And I was like, hey, you're going to be on the West Coast, you're going to play these shows? And he's like, yeah, let's do it. He's going to come record with us too. Oh, cool.

Going to record a record pretty soon. And it's cool. Like, my team is like all writing music. And with, again, with the Turnstall guys, like, they were so busy for a long time. It was kind of, I was driving a ship. Yeah. And sometimes they could be passenger.

Sometimes they could. And it's cool. They're still going to be a part of it. They're still in the ship. Good. Way less. Yeah. They've got a fucking yacht they're running, you know?

Yeah. I'm like, you guys want to hop on the fucking front of the kayak or whatever. Do you remember the worst stage dive I ever did during Angel Dust in Atlanta? No, I don't. Colin. It was in the middle room at the old masquerade, the old purgatory. And there's like a wooden like, like a lip kind of at the front of the stage. You know, like those like half foot little wooden rails. So I was running a stage dive from from the stage and I like went to plant my foot on the thing. But I slid. And I just like into the lip and just like laid there and looked at Pat and was just like in a pile. it was so fucking embarrassing How did you do that to them?

I don't know I don't know Worst stage dives are I've been responsible for a worst stage diver too You know I've I've almost never been caught I don't know if you remember Like caught yeah like no like Received at all

Hey guys come jumping at me I'm taking off I'm one of those guys I'm like No I'm a catcher dude I'll catch a foot I don't care I caught bow with my neck dude straight up damn they kill me

but on that European tour I don't know what my fucking obsession was with these goddamn dives that was when I was doing the full on like arms out swan dive into nobody every time dude I never was caught so like I'm wondering now like why does why does a different body part hurt like every hour my body parts alternate pain

and I think it all goes back to that just like no no polish guy caught me no german guy caught me the polish guys will catch you i don't believe polish guys are well i i i think i think only one of the poland shows were good even that that's it where yeah that in itself is a feat i've never played a poland show that wasn't one of my favorite shows of all time well okay one of them was only me and franz do you remember that one was it the weird like tattoo fest thing was it a fest? There was like a weird tattoo fest we played that was as a show.

Maybe, yeah, it was, and there was like a, I just remember being in the green room upstairs and my MacBook charger are like actually exploding. That's what I remember from that. But also, that was the only time you played to True on the tour. So me and Franz were like, to the point where like, I swear, like, the minister of Poland was like asked to ask us to stop. You know, please.

We beg. Sankuya. Dude, how incredible is Franz on the road? Like, that fool, he was, like, tour managing us and doing merch. And then he would, like, mash for every song. Yeah, for every band. And somehow, like, he'd be at the merch table. He'd mosh and run or sell merch and he'd be back in the pit doing his thing.

And he's like, he still has that energy. Yeah. I think my... We met him when he was in Triceratops. Like, when he was drumming in one. Like we played Legion of Doom in Columbus. And he was like, we stayed at his house. He was like one of the first people we met from Ohio.

Um, two of my favorite underutilized drummers. Like a drummer that you, that some people don't know he plays drums and he gets back. He's like, good. I've never seen him play drums. I've known him for 12 years.

Yeah. Keeps his secret and then he, he house back there and he can do the thing, dude. He's awesome. So there's three drummers? Can Pat play drums at all? Um, it's kind of an ongoing joke that I don't know if it's a,

Joker at this point, but Pat swears him down. He can play drums. And he's like, they got the drum chat, like the drum guys chat. And he's always talking about the drum guys chat. I'm like, I can, I play drums. He's like, I play drums, dude. But you never know if Pat.

I play drums, dude. Yeah. I play drums. It don't mean I can do it. Man, I love him. Got to have him on. Justice, what's your on the road diet looking like these days? brother, it's a joke.

Nice. So I have like, you know, some allergies and some things I can't have. And then on top of that, I'm trying to eat clean. So, uh... How? But it's a fucking egg salad sandwich. So, you know, when you go to the gas station, they'll have like two boiled eggs, like in a bag.

You get in the boiled egg. I do. I get the boiled egg all the time. You guys are keeping the boiled egg operation running? Dude, she says the beat red one. Those ones are so fucking good. Yeah. My gas station's,

stop is four to six hard-boiled eggs and then like maybe one or two bags of the pickles, like the weird pickle bags. Yeah, yeah, those are good. Those are good. Yeah, yeah. Those are good. They start good, but then I'm getting into a point where I'm like, it's like fucking with my brain a little bit. It's getting hard to stomach them.

I mean, there's an actual, like, scientific term for that called diminishing marginal utility. That's a whole other thing we can get into. You know when you're eating a burrito? Yeah. And that first bite, you're like, this is the best moment of my life. life. And then the last three or four, you're like, this don't, this does not, this is not what I was eating five minutes ago. It's never happened to me before my life. Okay. Well, um, you guys don't smoke pot, but pot is really good for, for that. Like, every single bite is better than the last. I can't

imagine. You're like, I need some garlic salt in this burrito. You start putting weird things. I need some ketchup and it's like anything that you want to burrito. When did, when did you break edge? Um, um, um, So my relationship with straightage is kind of a weird thing. Like I had like a like a little like a some moment where I was like I don't want to get high or drink or whatever. And then you know as a young person, everybody's like, oh, you're straight age. And then you get older, you realize it's like this is a thing that people really committed to. So I've kind of always taken stance of being like, you know, like I'm down with straight as but I'm not straight as like y'all. So I don't like I only got like straight tattoos and stuff.

Let me also say that I really love and admire straightage because my personal. relationship with straight edge, definitely like, dude, everybody I grew up with is on drugs. Do you know what I mean? Like most everybody. And a lot of my friends like overdosed and gotten a lot of trouble and stuff. And like very close to me, it's like it's everybody. And I don't think it's a coincidence that I avoided that like hardcore straight edge is like what. And it's like I think it's the coolest thing. Like if I if I like meet young people their straight edge, I'm like so excited. I want to talk to him about it. And like I know how much just going to give them if they really commit to that lifestyle, you know.

But I've always had problems with anxiety. And when I was a kid, I was medicated. And around the time I moved to LA, I was, like, having trouble with anxiety. Yeah. It was, like, pretty overwhelming, pretty crippling. Like, couldn't leave the house. What are there other things that you get, like, specific things that you get anxious about? Or is it just like, they don't have my fucking donut at the place?

I can't. Every. Okay. Just wake up anxious. any weird interaction that like doesn't feel whole and complete you know that's that's wow yeah it's it's bad like I was like I was definitely medicated when I was a kid and uh as an adult I was like you know I don't I don't want to be one of these fools it like I can be straight edge and like take all these weird medicines that make me a robot I can take Xanax and develop all I don't know

any adults to take Xanax right you know it's like that's a that's an addiction wait and to happen yeah for sure any again I was prescribed when I was a kid, but it's like, if I take his annex right now, I'll be like this. You know, this is the best feeling I've ever had. I'm going to be addicted to this. Yeah, yeah. Right. Same. Want it.

I want to feel that way all the time. Anybody would. It feels great. But like, um, so for me, it's like, I remember, I had a moment where a friend that was straight edge, I like took us annex and I wasn't prescribed at times somebody gave it to me and he's freaking out like, you're not straight edge. You took this thing. And I'm like, I've been prescribed this since I was 12.

And now that I'm 30 years old, it's not a, it's not a okay for you. And it becomes a class thing. I don't have health insurance, so I can't get a prescription. And furthermore, I don't want a prescription of anything that helps for anxiety. And maybe I'm wrong for that.

I don't know. No, but I, I, in my older age, you know, it's the kind of thing where like you find out about straight edge and you're just kind of like naive.

Then you've, you learn and you get more into it and you're like an asshole. And then I think everybody kind of chills and it's just like, you know, this is a thing for me. I really don't give a shit. And like, although I, I wouldn't necessarily do this, I think if there were, if there was a straightest person out there who reacted really well to,

like, THC gummies that helped them with anxiety as opposed to taking some kind of pharmaceutical. Yeah. It's all about the function to me. Yeah. Like, I don't, I really don't think that that, um... I'm going to start smoking cigarettes. And there's nothing anybody can say. Well, I'm just saying, it's like, it's like saying, oh, you ate taramisu.

That's got fucking rum in it, dude. So. And it's like, No. How much Tarramisu would you have to eat to get fucked up, brother? I'm going to start smoking three packs a day and be the fucking most straight-edge motherfucker you've ever seen. If it helps you, I'm with it. But I will see that the risk to reward ratio with cigarettes and like the turnaround. It's like not as helpful.

I don't believe it. I would say you want you hit the weed and you'll feel great. I don't. And like, I don't think it looks the same. I think a sigged looks a certain way. You think it looks cool? Oh my god, that's a cool thing ever. Dude, I see a guy ripping a sig and I want to know.

I'm, I'm wanting, I want to have him on the show, honestly. What, what show or movie has made you want to smoke? Madman, dude. Yeah, I've heard that. I'm addicted to cigarette. Yeah, it's my cat. I'm sorry. I got the hornet cat.

That's why I always say to him. I'm like, dude, get him a friend or something, you know. He's got a buddy. It's because I got the door closed and he wants to come in here. Oh. he must have sex with us he must to get in on this one. The two coolest smokers

I think are Franz. Franz is a person who smokes and I'm like I want to smoke. That looks cool. Matt Barry from the berries and he's played an angel dust a little bit big bite. He's a fucking badass smoker, dude. What's his style?

Dude, he hits it so hard. He's like. So this way? It looks like a lot of work. He's like, You see the cigarettes retracting. Oh, that's cool. Like somebody's done, dude. I like those guys that are like, I don't know how I don't have, oh, I got a pen here where they're like like a full body suck, you know.

Dude, that's Johnny Sack from Sopranos smokes the cigarettes exactly like that. The military way is cool. Oh, yeah. Because that was, dude, do you ever know the lore behind why they do that? No. To hide the ember from the, from the enemy. I don't know. They got the fucking the blicky in the other hand, brother.

They can't do that. My mom smoked in the house, my entire childhood. Just like chain smoking. So now, like, if I catch a whiff on somebody's clothes or anything, like there actually isn't a bigger turnoff. No, I'm the same way. I hate the smell. I just think it, like, my dad smoked.

And I was always like, there's a smoke. There's shit everywhere. Like, in his car was like, I was in. I got I got driven to school in the fucking VW SIG, dude. A 98 VW. SIG. But it smelled. The windows up. Yeah.

Oh, that goddamn window. It was cold outside. Oh, God. My clothes would smell like it. Anyway. Cigarettes aside. We don't make your shit smell like that. And if it, if you do, like, right when you get done smoking, we just smell like it for a minute.

But I think it's more on your hands than anything. You like that. But I always get the same thing where people are like, it smells good. Yeah, yeah, yeah. So wait, you're saying that on the road, do you avoid fast food because you have to? I'll eat fast food, but I got to be really particular. And I always feel like really annoying because I'm like, hey, I need this burger, but I need you to take off this, that, and the other. I'm basically allergic to everything that's not meat and vegetables.

Right. And even things that I'm not necessarily allergic to might upset my stomach. And then even with that, then you get into like beef and like beef is really fatty and that upsets my stomach. Do you think maybe a little bit of some of this is, you did to yourself? Because I remember at one point you were like, I eat 20 White Castle a day. I've done White Castle, but it was more McDonald's was my problem at the time. Dude, when a McDouble was a dollar seven. How much is it now?

Dude, it's like 140. No, it's two for 350. Okay, let's be good. Two for 350, but that's still 175 apiece. That's quite a expensive. Quite a raise. Quite a raise.

That was specific when I was bulking up, when I was like 215 pounds, I would do like seven McDonald's straight, so like 14 beef patties. And then I did like to go a mad diet where you drink a gallon of milk every day. While I was lactose intolerant, that like that sealed the deal.

That was it. Your body never forgave you. Were you just like as gassy as possible then? honestly I kind of like adapted really fast and I grew really fast like it like put hell of weight on me but um afterwards I noticed like after I like calm down with that that's when I like fully couldn't do dairy at all and a couple months later I was like still experiencing like other symptoms and then I tried to go vegetarian so I was like eating like this is like a couple years later I tried to go vegetarian and I was eating like wheat gluten lots of like like like like

patties like soy wheat base shit and I thought I was like I started losing weight but rapidly and people were like calling me and being like yo are you okay I saw a photo of you like lost all the wakes

I was just shitting everything I ate yeah same badass are you still do you still are in the gym often or yeah more than ever

I had like some some injuries that got really bad like I had some I literally had trouble walking for like a year or two My back was so fucked. And I tried everything, man. I, like, paid lots of doctors.

And I don't have health insurance or no shit. Phil? Dude, no. You know you got to pay a fine every year. Like, you could pay. It costs less. You don't got to do that. You don't got to do that.

Listen to this guy. I don't have health insurance either. I haven't in the IRS. It's just like Baskin Robbins, man. They always, no, it's because you live in fucking California. Oh, is that why? It's one of the, yeah, it's one of the only places where it's like, they're trying to ring.

money out of everybody. Whatever. I like having insurance. I get to, I just got into going to the doctor, man. It's awesome. It's great, isn't it? When you have insurance, it's really fucking amazing.

Well, it's just that there is medicine for literally everything that's wrong with you. That's not true. I thought, see, I felt that way until like last year. And, dude, if you had any idea how much I've paid and how much time I've spent going to doctors and being like, let's

figure out what's going on, you know? And like, you got to go to my guy. When I got diagnosed with celiac, the final result was I had a doctor and I was like, I want to do blood work. I want to do this. Like, let's do everything, bro, anything possible. And I've had blood work done and been like, what's going?

I got to figure out what's going on my stomach. And he was like, look, man, you have celiac. He's like, I'm not supposed to tell you this. I'm not, I'm supposed to do the tests or whatever. But don't waste your money and it's going to be really grueling. And apparently the test they do, they like just basically make you eat lots of gluten for like five weeks, I think it is, which I don't even know if I'd survive that. Like, I think I would die, you know? I'm, like, so sensitive to that shit, like, I would be fucked. So you have to, like,

eat gluten for five weeks, and then you get off for five weeks. And then they do all these tests, send you all these places. And it's, like, a lot of money. And again, I was like, I'll pay the money, but the doctor was like, you've been coming here for years. I'm not allowed to just tell you, but telling you, like, this is Celia. Man, you know, that's a good doctor. But, yeah, I'm like, thank you for that. Shut out. I think he could get his license taken if I said that. A friend of the show.

A friend of the show, Justice's doctor. Dr. Gluten. I asked because my doctor's name is Daniel J. Lewis. So I got that going for me. Is that true? Yeah. Wow. What's Daniel J. Lewis about?

Method acting. Yeah. Yeah. He's training for a role right now as a doctor. Yeah. Yeah, that's good shit. So what's next for you, musically? You got cold mega going on.

doing, that's like actual solo stuff. Yeah, I just like to run it back real quick so people don't think I'm, I can walk great now. Okay, I didn't believe it and I didn't want to bring it up again. So I'm going to, I just, I just like, let him want to look at that. You are, are you, do you think you're stronger now than you were on at that in that era? Dude, I'm, I'm, I'm more fit than I was when I was 25. Guaranteed. More mobile, healthier.

I feel so much better. You were fucking big. You were. I was big. You were big. I think, you know what it was what fucked me up? It was like, I'm not meant to be that big. Like, I'm meant to be fit or whatever.

But, like, having, like, James Pliggy around. I think, like, he's probably the number one person that I would see. Or like, Dan Ceeley or something like that. I'm like, see these big fools. I'm like, I want to be big too. Seeley now is like, Horrified. He looks like a movie star.

Yeah. He has a movie star muscles. He's a monster to be so big. Well, as somebody else, I will say, was a monster. monster deceptively was Brendan Yates. Mm. It's a skinny monster. Like, dude, no body fat ever.

So like, but when he was like bodybuilder guy in like 2010, 2011, he had a legit like movie. He had like a Zach Ephron body. Yeah. I think the thing with actors, because they're like always short and like more compact. So on screen it like you see everything, you know, it looks like more and less space. And Brendan's not short. not like short guy, but he's like a little bit more compact. And he's always stayed around like, I think like the 140 range.

But even like it's big, it's probably like 145, but no body fat. Wait, what? That's like Chris. No, dude, Brandon had to have been in the in the 160s, 170s at that time. How much you think how much you think Chris's ways? Like now like. Currently, I just saw him. Yeah.

170? Not even close. He's in 140s. Are you kidding me? I swear to God. I can throw him. him a mile. How much you want to make it back and throw a football over them now?

I'll bet any amount of money. Name it. Fuck, I just had something. It was Brendan. God damn. Keep talking. Jared is Jared the strongest guy in Traffin'Risland? Oh, I got it.

Oh, dude, he's so big and strong. I don't know if he's, like, I don't know if he's been doing, like, conventional lifting. No, he does muscle ups on a fucking. bench at a park cliff somewhere yeah I was gonna say like he's like more like practical strong like he's so again like conventional lifting is incredible and I love it and there's people who do it

functionally I like damage my body a lot doing it Jerry's the kind of fool who just goes and does finds a tree branch and does like 46 muscle up straight I did that with him for us for like six months and it was the strongest I'd ever been really I can't do I can't do that many pull-ups now

but I don't I was I remember now, I think the most fit band is actually bitter end currently. Everyone in bitter end is a legit monster. That's not true. One of the guys is not. What are you talking about? Jacob, Jacob, he's skinnier. He's skinnier, but he's still like...

He can't even. He's half the size is the other guys. But he's taller than all of them, and that adds a lot. I guess so. That's hard, dude. If he's the writing guy, then he gets the exception. He's the... Which, which there is.

So there you go. It's like the bulldo... Who's the bulldoze guy with the glasses? Whatever New York guy at the time in the midnight... Polish guy's Polish. Yeah, the Polish guy with the glasses. He's that they're that, you know? They don't have to be strong.

But I ain't fucking with the Polish guy with glasses and bulldoz. Dude. Got a vibe. Okay, speaking of Polish guys and glasses. On that European tour, I saw the most... Like, to this day, meanest pit move I've ever seen in my life. Was it,

was it, was it, I don't want to put him on blast. He's the most savage. It was, it, like, I was like,

I literally, I literally did this. When it happened. He took a guy's glasses off their face. And, and exploded them. And just kept mosh. And it was,

I was like, and now he's like a record label owner. And I, I, I've wanted. vest. I remember that tour. My friend,

there's our friend Adam Malick was like, yo, put this name on the guest list and the most insane mosh pitter will show up and just devastate the crowd. And I was like,

what is this? It's like a myth or like a, like it sounds like fantasy. It's like saying bloody Mary three times. Yeah. Who's going to tell this guy that he's on the list? So he put his name on the list

and we started playing. And then that's when the fool came out. That's my boy. He's incredible. I think that on that tour was the only time. ever talked to him, but I was, I was in all, he was like Godzilla to me, dude. His, his only English at that time was, uh, I was I was like, hey man, what's up?

Are you, are you, you know, I don't know if we're putting his name on the, fuck, his name's Michael. He doesn't care. He broke some ice glass. He's done a lot of crazy stuff in the pit. Um, but I was like, are you Michael? And he said, no English, Polish or die. He walked off.

Holy fuck. He's like, I'm here to pit. I ain't trying to speak you. No fucking. But how did that feel to you? Aren't you Polish? Um, well, uh, like, you know, know, family is Polish.

I don't claim Poland. I remember once you would, you would proclaim to me that you had an East Rock Polak cock. So. Yeah. I live in a, I live in Ukrainian village, uh, Polish neighborhood in my. Oh, yeah. That was go together. Yeah, yeah, very much, very much.

So all my neighbors are all, all from Polska. Neighborhood my family is from is like, like that. Like all Polish and Ukrainian. They smash classes over there. Is that an ancient pastime in Poland? Oh, now we were smashing glasses all day, for sure. I lived a lot of my life above the Polish bar, the mom managed.

I've seen a lot of glasses get broke. They love to just get drunk and braw and shit. But I don't think that's a Polish thing. I think it's like a... Well, it's a working class thing, which kind of goes hand in hand with being Polish. You fought for pierogis or what, didn't you? Any progis anymore.

I'm looking for the gluten-free parogis. That is so tragic, man. Dude, I'll tell you what, I had a friend growing up who was from Poland. All of my like, my first like three girlfriends were all from born in Poland. Like the neighborhood we grew up in me and Chris was all like Polish kids. And dude, Polish fathers are the scariest fucking people on earth. Yeah.

Like my friend came home late, got his ass beat. It was just like, like I was just like holding my skateboard like I got to go home. I got to go home. Did you go home? Yeah. I went right home. My mom is the opposite. Problem with being Polish is the mom

handle shit the same way too. So I've got some Polish mom and dad weapons for sharing, you know? Let's start. We're at 90 minutes here. Thank you so much for your time. We'll start winding it down because I'm going to shit myself here.

I don't even want to wind it down. Here's the truth of the matter. I'm so bummed. I like talking about hardcore so much and I don't get to do it as much I'd like. I'll shit myself. I will shit in the chair. It's all content, brother.

I'll take the conversation to the bathroom. You can do that too. I'll just yell. It's right there. I can yell. Dude, it would be awesome, actually, if you had a mic in the bathroom. Just burn, burn, uh. I can't let you hear the bidet stream.

I don't care about the farting and the shitting. But at the bidet? Of course, I got the bidet. What am I? He's a champion of the bidet. I got one in the, I got two bathrooms. Both are bidet up, dude. Is it the, like, the jacket?

Japanese one like the shoot like it's like in the toilet brother brother I sit every day on a a heat seeking submarine basically they find I don't know how it finds the hole but it finds the hole exactly like you get move I don't have to move direct hit

sank my battleship okay B five do you do the thing where you let it in like you like bring it inside of you Hold it there for a second. Oh, really? Is that the move? So I, this is graphic.

I like to finish up, you know, fire up the stream. And that creates a whole other event. It loosens up what's going on in there. Oh. And then you find out you were harbaging a fucking fugitive, you know? Really? Yeah. Dude, Will Yip has one.

or he had one in a studio, I still have. Yes, he does. It's like the nicest one I ever used at the time, at least. And, like, you know, you can, like, suck water up your butt and, like, clean it all. And I was using that a lot. I was, like, taking advantage of that. Yep.

And then I didn't know that you can reserve some water. You can hold some water up there. And I found out we were tracking vocals. And I'd spray some out. It was really. Was it water or was it? I mean, it's like, What the, you know,

coagulation of... Good word. I don't know quagulation that you work. No, I like that you went with it. Sounded good. The bidet is still there.

Damn. Hi, guys. I was my clean dick. I feel like a bidet can just like over that much time accumulate funk. Absolutely. My wife,

my wife ain't happy with me, brother, because I ain't going down there. That's on her. Every time she's like, how does it get here? And I'm like, just the way I was made.

You know, it's my shape. I feel like at that point, you got to take it out back in the yard and hose it off or something. I got a scrubber just for that. I'm not using it, but she can, you know. Damn. Yeah.

Dude, in Thailand, our first night in Thailand, the toilet, there was no toilet paper. It was a bucket and a hose. I mean, that's more efficient than toilet paper if you think about it.

Absolutely. I don't know if I don't use toilet paper if I use like the bidet or something like that. Like there's always remnants. You got a wipe after, of course. So, well, the expectation is to use the hose and then your hand. Get the fuck out of here.

No, I swear to God. I swear to God. I swear to God. Ask Andrew. Andrew Morrissey never talked about this to you? No. He at one time said that he preferred it. He said that he preferred it. Fuck him, man. Andrew, I love you. You're sick. The hand, just touching your booty hole feels

wrong. Wrong. Listen to the shower. You got it. I like I don't know if Clippa listens to the show but I like the one time that Clippa was like, I'm tired of having shit in my ass, man. And you were like, what do you mean? And he's like, there's just always shit in there. He's like, you know, you got the same thing

if you wipe your ass right now, there's shit. We all wiped our asses to be like, look, nothing, dude, that's how it. And then he did. Bring back. Somehow. We always. He's tat.

He's a very different man now. He's like, still a psychopath, but very responsible for himself, way more self-aware and way, uh, like I feel like Clippa now does not have no shit in his ass. Oh, wow. Congrats.

It is avoidable. That's one of those things. I'm telling you, there's a solution for everything. We can FaceTime right now and get him to do a, a spot check. You think he would do it? He would do it for sure.

He doesn't, that's one thing hasn't changed by him is he doesn't give a fuck. But he's not embarrassed. He's, call him. I'm going to try FaceTime real quick. Clipa. Clipa. Was he the original second guitar player of Traffman Rice or did he come in a little later?

Yeah, he was original. Original second guitar player of Traffin Rice. Okay. So Colin, you got a Squatty Potty. No, I don't use a squatty potty. I told you. I put my feet straight up on the bowl. Oh, that's not a bit.

No, that's not a bit. I do it. I train my whole life for that. I'm like, I'm in there like this, dude. You have incredible hit mobility. That's how you sit on the toilet. Not the whole time.

you don't have to do it the whole time. But when I'm like, when I'm needing a little inspiration or something. Okay, okay. I'll throw him a little. This is Colin who, Colin does the kick. Colin does the kick to go straight up over his head.

He's got great hit. I'm pretty good. I've seen here. Come on now. Really? Yeah, when you do that? Oh, we're doing it. We're trying.

Is he on? I'm going to drop. Okay. We'll see. Clupa is going to wipe his ass for us live. He might have, hey, yo. Clippa. What's up?

You're on the podcast right now. Clippa. Oh, shit. Look at that with the God's Hage shirt live, dude. You can't make this shit up. Can you explain the bit to him? Check it out, because you can't hear it. You can't hear Colin.

We're doing the podcast right now, right? Hard lore. You're live on TV right now, Clipa. On television right now. Oh, shit. You said that. I was about to say a bad word. I'm just kidding.

So check it out. We're, uh, we're wondering if we can get a spot check on your, on your ass right now. What does that mean? Oh, go. Oh. It's kind of like, talking like bathroom habits and, uh, the potential of having Duky in your butt. And we, and, you know, we talked about a time when that happened. We've all, we were all sharing stories.

We've all had poop in her butt, you know? Yeah. And we were wondering if we could get a live action. poop check right now. Like, when you look at the sink, what's dripping out of the sink? Water, right? Yeah.

Because that's where water comes from. If you look at your ass, you look at your ass, there's going to be some dokey dripping out that motherfucker. You know what I mean? Yeah. It's totally acceptable.

Is there, could you get to a bathroom and just check right now the little wipe and see what's in there? No, because I didn't even take a shower today. So he failed the spot check. It's a murder scene. We know this poop in that.

but. Oh, sure. The toilet paper was not brown this morning, but we've been walking around. It's like hot shit. Oh, okay. Say something going on. I know for me that would be the case for shit.

There's something going on. All right. Well, I thank you, Klobla. Panther panter I just got. There you go. Gorgeous. Oh, damn. What's up, Lemon?

He's scared across the street. I don't know what the fuck he's going. Yeah. All right, brother. I'm going to talk too soon. Are you in Baltimore? Yeah. I'm gonna go ahead.

We got to do some podcast shit. I'll talk to you soon. All right. Thanks, but. That was incredible. That was good stuff. We need to do that more often.

I know. Ask checks, spot checks on random. Did you all? Yeah. Oh, yeah. He heard him great. Clear as they.

Yeah. Yeah. He's a, I like that he's with our friend Lemon. When I met Clippa. Dude, it was like perfect. We met him. He played in like a metal core band.

And he just had like a really good vibe. And we were starting trapped under race and we were like, dude, that, that, like, weird psycho metalhead would be so good in the band, you know? So, like, we're like, let's get to know him more. So we, like, started kicking with him. And the first thing I found out about him was all his friends had food names. So there's like, lemon, ketchup and chicken was his homies. And he's still lemon?

Like, apparently. Well, yeah, lemon's lemon. Lemon's around. I don't know about ketchup and chicken. There's probably like salt and pepper around or some shit. They all had those names. What was clip? Not about ketchup.

Clibba, dude. You know? A favorite. A favorite dish. Yeah. Any warm bowl of clipper. Well, it's not going to get any better than that on this. No, I don't think so.

What's, okay, you got to do more Trapp and Rice. Yeah, I mean, yeah, I'd love to do Trapped and Rice. We talk about it. We obviously have, we got the TUI group chat. That's what TUI is right now. It's a group chat, mostly. And, you know, I love the team. Brennan's obviously very busy.

Jared's obviously very strong. Dude, what is Brad up to? that's the thing dude brad's ready to go me and brad that's the that's the most likely to at the moment you know i love brad brad's a father um he's married he's doing great he just dude he's brad like brad is a unique personality yeah for a while so he stayed with me a couple times and i made my guest wifi password bradford just so he could log on and i might still be bradford to this day because just because he stayed over You can do a guest password

Brother, you don't know what I'm Got what I'm working with dude He's deep man, he's in the Matrix I'm Matrixed out Yeah I'm so far from the Matrix I recorded music and It took me so long to like set up

Like get my little interface going and shit I'm happy to help you anytime All right Yeah Glad you guys walked me through Let me ask you this And this I feel like this could be the answer

You write Angel Dust stuff You know how easy it is To make an Like an incredible melody is like 10 minutes of work a lot of the time. You know? Some, I think it's, it's, you kind of have it or you don't. Because like, I think I have something. I'm good at that.

And there's some people who are just better at that than me. You know, like, I have friends that you show them something. And they write an incredible melody. I might write a good one. It takes me a little bit longer. And some people are just like more prone to certain things. But that's the easy part. And like also that's the thing that people for certain people.

And that's the thing that people remember. writing an original hard mosh part right now has never been harder it's impossible it is very very hard I'm gonna be real I think that's the easiest part now

then okay well then I expect a fucking fucking give me a new record but the problem with that is I don't have a team that's locked into that and it's like not my biggest aspiration is not the right to heaviest thing you know, at this point in my life.

I've been hearing you say that for 10 years now. Yeah. But it's something I do care about and I do love. It's like for me, the experimenting part is the most important thing. It's like learning, growing, trying new things. And it's like we all do that. Like I was just thinking about Taylor earlier. It's like Taylor's at a point where he's been doing this shit forever and he still keeps

growing and like you hear that on every recording he makes. And like your whole team. Like it's like like seeing God's hate full transparency. see, I actually didn't come to the second day of Santa Fury because my throat was so bad. I like, it was a coughing blood and stuff. And I was like, I can't talk to people. And you can't go to Santa Fury and not talk. So I'd like sit in a little apartment and just be like, I was just watching everything online.

But like just watching like clips of God's hate and stuff like that and being like, how do these fools keep evolving? Like how do they, you know? And that's a, that's a fucking. It's hard, but it's like a actual skill, you know? Absolutely. The ability to experiment. and grow and keep growing.

And for me, that's been like, okay, how do I experiment with these tools? And now it's production. I'm, like, really focused on production. And I would love to do, like, a Trapped Under Ice or Heavy Band through the context of what I love about production. And, you know, like, my love for guitarist has grown in a slightly different direction. I think, dude, 20 minutes sit down, I can make riffs all day, you know? I can make heavy riffs.

I beg you to prove it to me. And then record it. That's all it is. I feel you do. And I do think I've had this conversation with Jared a lot. Like if we were doing that and we were recording Trapped and Race, like, it would be so sick to do it at the pit. And, you know, I'm like, I like the idea of having people involved. Like, I've never been like, our band is sacred.

This is just the five of us doing this. Like, it's cool. When we did Biggest Kinite, Chad Gilbert had a lot of input. Nick Chet was there, had a little bit input. And, like, you know, different friends. We've always sent stuff. As long as we've been a band, we've been sending songs to members of Bitterrand and just getting their feedback.

And, yeah, I would like to do a Trapped on a Race record and have you guys be a part of that process. That'd be fun. You know, I'm in, dude. I'll do whatever you want. But motivating the team. You got to call the team. You got to, hey, if everybody can do it, you and Taylor, you start making some calls.

I'll make the calls. Members are trapped in it. I guarantee he's me, brads me like this. Let's go, when? Tell me when. He's just down. That man, he's on dick. Who's the biggest hold of?

Is it, Sam? Dude, honestly, um, Brendan obviously is very busy. And he is a key piece of the identity of trapped in the race musically. Like Big Kiss Good Night. There's so much of Brendan's flavor on that, you know? I mean, the drawing is very. Very unique. Yeah.

Yeah. Yeah. And Sam has a family. He has two kids. Wow. And we all live apart from each other. I don't think there's any, there's no person I could blame and say this person can't do it. It's more just a life thing.

All have such very different lives. And, you know, I guess what me and Brendan at the end of the day, like our lives are music and entertainment. And we're both willing to like make it happen. But can I make it happen at the same time? Brendan can make it happen can damn make it happen the same time Jared is a fucking jacked firefighter

in the woods after you like but Brad is like you know Brad has a very he has his life he has a kid

and he has a wife and he has a career and stuff but yeah nobody's not willing just we're all grown you know and logistics and schedules

fucking sucks sucks just is what it is but with that being said I'm down to fucking riff let's make some heavy shit I'll make the calls. If it happens at some point soon, you're welcome.

Look, we'll give them, we'll give them six months to a year to get their shit together, right? And when they're not doing it, the three of us, Taylor, I don't know who else we got to get in there, but we just write the TUI All-Stars. We've always joke, there's always a joke in the van, the Trapped and Race van of, of, you know how bands get back together with like a member. years later and like what that's going to be and then you have to change the name and all that stuff. So our theoretical scab trapped in race band was called J5. Just either Justice or Jared plus four other people. Jared plus four other people would be unbelievable.

Day five just playing TUI. I know that you would be at the gig too. Oh, I would fucking. Dude, Jared's voice, it's crazy that it's not used more because he had a band he sang in. and then they ended up like not put I don't think they even put it out his voice is awesome

so Jared on the mic you two Taylor who's who's our fourth who's our fifth member of the J5 am I playing drums I pictured you immediately on guitar but yeah you could play drums

yeah so that's what we need what's got to be J5 we'll figure out we'll figure out J5 I'll play guitar I'm playing guitar in J5 okay really open to

making heavy music and I do make heavy music by myself but it's private I want to be right I'm not I'm not doing so yeah I mean that I'm not gonna get I'm in the same boat right now I'm I'm I'm in like the writing mode where you can't sleep and you're what or you're at the movies but you're actually just like structuring a riff in your head dude do you ever be at the movies and you're like

then did the movies and you're like yeah yeah there I have entire songs like like note for note in my voice memos. Like finish the job is somewhere in a voice memo start to finish. Check this out. So every Angel Dusts recording has anywhere between, I come into the recording with between 70 and 120 demos.

That's not an exaggeration. I don't write music full time. This is what I do. So like, and it's kind of pathetic. Like once you, when I say that and then you like, I love what I do, but it doesn't sound like when you put out the Angel Dust record, it doesn't sound like, man, this guy had 120 demos and spent his entire life making this for years. But in reality, that's like, that's like three weeks of demos for you, right?

Yeah, right, yeah. Yeah. So, like, this is my voice recordings. This is just like little notes, it's like that. But you have, like, new recording 501. 5.01. 5.1. That's like new recording.

That's only 5001 new recording. They also put, like, if you're like, I don't know. Address, yeah, I got 122 at Shea travels. I don't even know what Shea travels is. It might be like next to a restaurant where I eat at or something. Right, of course. What do I got? And then like, there's just like a bunch of weird, you know, like different recording names.

Dude, you don't want me. That's 6 feet deep. Yeah. Hard. That's just like, okay. They're all in there. So yeah, I'm with you. Yeah.

And then. Dund did a dad and did didn't do that dad and that's yeah it's a to have that mind is almost a it's almost like a weight to bear and it makes relationships hard makes life hard and I don't know I love ready music and I'm always down to so let's riff Colin what you got. That's that is the question right now. What do I got? It's the problem isn't what do I got? It's what do I do with it? Which variation of what I got do I use? You know?

It's what don't I got. That's the problem. It's like, I have this riff that I've been trying to make work for like three years, but I don't know which variation of it I want to do. Dude, those always end up being the best songs, like the one that you've been like sitting on for three years and you keep fucking with it. When you find the thing. When you crack the code, that's what I call it.

It's a song. Be Harder was one of those. I believe it, dude. That's a mega track. That was a science. That was literally like my, that was my college. thesis, I feel like, if I went to college. Sometimes you've got to just show the, send me the riff, dude.

Like, I might have the thing and I might not. I never, I never claim to be the guy that has all the answers. I'm just another guy in the spectrum of guys who have ideas. And girls, you know, obviously there's a lot of girls. Guys is non-binary. Yeah. Yeah. The guy. I am not.

I'm, I'm off that spectrum. I rarely write. It sucks. I just don't really have the brain for it. Yeah, but you can. play master of providence. I can't.

Front to back. So who writes to harm his way? Predominantly, over the years it was a lot of James. I never do that. James,

like isolation, no gods and on was a lot of James. The last record was a lot of Nick, our new guy. This next record's a lot of Nick as well.

Yeah. Every record, there's like a song that I like kind of influenced, you know, with a riff or two, but like that's kind of it.

more of a more of an arranger guy unless of uh you're an arranger and a jumper yeah it's it's hard for me to just be like oh we need a part here um did it like it's difficult that's what i'm that's my expertise dude having um input outside of the riff and structural stuff is a whole another art too and it's songwriting it's part of songwriting but like having somebody around that that can give you input because you get in your own brain I like write shit all day long. Defang's really good at that. Like, I write a song and he'll be like, this is cool, but what if

shh, that's, that could improve. That's always so fucking, like, and you feel so dumb in the moment. You're like, why? And it's always the simplest thing. Like, slow that down a little bit, or do that backwards. And you're like, I'm an idiot.

And a genius. James, dude, I mean, isolation. But that's like, that's like one, One finger on the first string. Yeah. Type writing wrist, right?

Yeah. Like Josiah style. That was James in his parents' basement using his dad's flying V sending us demos. No joke. Isn't it amazing? Like the one finger explaining the riff thing is such a thing. Brendan is like right to turnstile like a lot of it. You know, and like for a long time, that's how he wrote turnstile.

It was like one finger on the string. He'd like record drums and he'd be explaining it to you. And it's stuff that doesn't make sense. on guitar. As guitar players, we would all be like, that's not right. But it sounds cool. Yeah, that's exactly right. And Josiah, again, a good example of that.

Like, that fool got the whole song in his head and it'll tell you every part of it, but couldn't play it, you know? And no, if you're doing it wrong, you're like, not anything it. You got to do. Wow. That, I was definitely that until, God say, I learned guitar to start that band, basically. Who way? I always assumed you were a real riffer.

No, no. I feel like right now I'm currently the best guitar and it's just because I'm trying to write this fucking one song like me trying to play this one riff in certain ways is making me better guitar but no I I could bear early twitching tongue stuff was like

mostly Taylor and if I was doing something and it was me being like Neenie Neenie just trying to Neenie my way through it you know Anyways Did you guys say that um

Pligis is like a really humble person or? Extremely. Look at how he looks, man. I think it's five. Anything you try to give him credit for, he's just like, man. There's how much to say about it.

You know, he's like, yeah. I think he's going to be the next guest. Sometime next week, I think. And maybe we can get in it. But I don't think he, yeah, I don't think he gives himself enough credit. Yeah. I really don't.

I give him enough credit. you give him too much. I look at him for one second. I'm like, man, I got to give him some credit. Yeah, he deserves some credit. Like, if you ever lift weight with him, like he's so humble about everything, like he'll be like reping out like 600 pound deadlift,

just like it means nothing to him. I don't know what his lift is right now, but I've just seen him deadlift the most weight. And I'll be like, I'm very, um, not articulate, but I like to talk about things. And like, I want to know. And like, what's analytical?

I'm very analytical. And like, I'll be like, yeah, notice when you set up you did this thing, like, what did you do? How did you do this? How did this is incredible? And he's like, yeah, man. You just got to do it. You just do it. You know, it's like, always like simple information.

Yeah, yeah. I know there's more to it. I know he's like thinking a lot about it. But he's, he's, he's an amazing person. He's very, like, encouraging. When I would go and like lift with him, like he said on tours, he would be doing that. And I would be doing less than how. half of what he was doing, deadlifting.

You know what I mean? But that's impressive. But he would be like, yeah, oh, man, you got long arms. Like, you're going to be really good at deadlifting. Bench is going to suck, but I suck a bench too. Like, that's like the conversation, you know, where it's like, it's very just like, very encouraged. I mean, the guy's a teacher, you know?

Yeah. It's not about him. No. You know, he doesn't care anything about him. That's where me, I'd be like, did y'all, everybody saw that? That's how I, I got to be less like that, man. My ego is. Hard Lord's putting my ego out of control.

I got to check. Over over 2,000 views. You know? Yeah, it's just these numbers. I can't count that. It's just getting out of control. I got to check my phone. There's a way to calculate your views and stuff with,

I know nothing on podcast. Brother, this is on YouTube.com. You fuck with YouTube. Oh, this is all just YouTube. And we're on the podcast, too. But, yeah, you can see the audio. The audio is, the audios are all pretty consistent, but the videos are like kind of depends on the guess yeah yeah i've listened listen to maybe five

podcasts like ever in in their entirety and it's usually like smiles turns it on i've even like in the beginning i've definitely handed it by my phone and been like find the podcast i can't do that yeah but now it's on Spotify so it's yeah yeah huge um i listened to little bits and pieces of something y'all did a while ago and then uh some extra grind episodes and in the van we've done Comtown because everybody's like, you're gonna love this. Yeah,

and you love it. Tomtown makes my head feel like it's gonna explode. Yeah. You can't listen. I've never listened to a full episode of Comtown. Only clip.

Yeah. I can't listen to a podcast with other people around me. I feel like that's a headphone thing for me. For driving at night? Maybe driving at night, but I'm a music guy at night. I'll just.

I need to be like activated. You know? I need to be an active driver. Dude, I always listen to like history. podcast and shit. I don't want to subject other people to it. So I put on my headphones, you know. Did you, did you all get a chance to actually experience Sound and Fury? Did you guys do a, did you just sound a Fury episode? Yeah, we did. Yeah. Yeah. Like a recap of the,

because I know you were doing the podcast and I'd know if that like took away from your ability. It did a little bit, but, uh, but for the most part, we, I mean, I had the best time. I had a great time. Yeah. It was a lot of fun. It was so cool. Good vibe. Really good vibe. Yeah. I don't think you've found better honestly Did you guys have a favorite I mean you guys already talked about this on the podcast I'm sure but just for me

What was your favorite? God's hate was genuinely incredible The terrorist set was really good Terror was my that was the one for me Terror was really good I watched Angel Dust Angel Dust was awesome I watched

Hmm I'm trying to think of who were other standouts You love speed tsunami speed speed was incredible Yeah I feel like this might be a typical answer, but it's for a reason. Between Speed and Scal. That was like the two most, like, exciting, like, what the fuck moments, you know?

Yeah, I think for me it was Speed because it was their first show here. Yeah. Yeah. And they're just getting a reaction that bands would kill for. Yeah. They're like, Harmsway's been to band for 16 years. We would kill to have that kind of reaction. You know what I'm saying?

I've been seeing those kids are, like, yeah. Since they were like babies, you know? It's cold. Come on. Yep. He's been around. My man, we played in, I forget the name of the town, but it's like a smaller town in Australia.

And there's the smallest show we played in Australia ever was probably like 40, 50 people. And everybody was like kind of uncomfortable and standing in the back. And Deco was just like a kid, but also a giant already, you know? Yeah. It's like humbling everybody and singing along.

There's like photos from that show where it's just me and him. It looks like I'm playing for him. Was it Walling Gone? Were you playing Wall and Gone? Maybe. There's also Cabrara.

Canberra. Canberra. It might have been it's like a smaller town. One time in Wallingong, this is real short. I fell for three minutes.

Three minutes are trying to get out. Like, the beginning of a song I started being like and like took the whole like took the whole song

to stuff. stop falling until I eventually just like shattered onto the floor. And there's no video. And I'm going to, I'll have to radio in somebody from Australia because so many people at me and be like, I might, I was the day at the time you fail for like a full song.

Dude, how did you do that? That sounded so authentic. He's good at it. Thanks, Mike. I fell in Brisbane once and there was like a lady there who I was trying to, you know, so I was embarrassed.

Of course. That was the first time we run. ages ago. And then I've only fallen in in Brisbane, Munich, and Chicago. And I ate shit in Chicago on the Ghost Main Tour. I tripped over an entire pile of cables at the metro and just like, straight back.

Falling on stage is miserable. So embarrassing. It is the most embarrassing thing. I want to shout out a classic fall that I just witnessed. soul blind was playing and my boy Sen playing bass and sings. I was in Bakersfield and there's like a little

like a little fucking ceiling thing that was hanging down kind of low like some concrete that was a little low and I like made note of before he played but my boy like running jumped into it like did want to be like his feet kicked up over his head he took such a spill

and like there's like not vocals or bass happening for like a hot minute but He handled it like with a lot of class and I definitely think it's worse to fall with an instrument than not. Oh,

dude, yeah. Right? Yeah. I never done that though. Knock on wood. Yeah. Yeah.

Well, guys, we're at, we had just hit the two hour mark. We did it. Yeah, that's perfect. Oh my God.

I like that I felt that the same time you guys felt that I was like, yeah, we could do it. Stop now. Time to wrap it up. But thank you for coming on.

We'll have you on back on. eventually that was a blast dude yeah I just I really like talking to guys if you guys want to get together on Zoom and just talk about hardcore sometime we could do that too

yeah we won't record it that one will be private that's just for us what do you want to plug anything for we log off just rock and roll music hardcore it's cool

a lot of cool music coming out right now I think it's a special time for music and like I genuinely feel that more than ever felt that in my life like music is cool right now Hardcore is cooler than ever.

And it's a lot of cool young bands. And I think that's the reason why. Yep. So everybody keep doing your thing. Like keep it up. Thank you, Turnstile, for. I had somebody DM me the other day who was like, I heard what you guys are saying, but I don't understand the Koyo.

Like Koyo isn't hardcore. I don't get it. And I had to hit them with the like, yo, it doesn't matter what they sound like. It's a code of ethics, brother. It's all here. Yeah. And that is such. important thing that like sound of fury

was a perfect example we've already talked about it but you had fucking Texas death metal and gay creeper and cola boy you know God's head and scowl and pity sucks like it all works because it works yeah it's the cool

hardcore people have always been fucking with the Smiths and Morrissey and shit it's always been like a theme it's like why can you do a hardcore band it sounds like the Smith I don't wonder about to do that actually I take that back but Colin I gotta go. No, but I know what you mean.

It's like, who gives a shit? There's a reason that everybody can play on the same stage. Yeah, absolutely. All right, chel. All right. Be good. Thank you for having me. Thank you for coming on.

Absolutely. Oh, could you say it's hard lore time real quick? It's hard lord time. Yeah. Beautiful. Perfect. Thank you. Good night, everybody.

Bye. Bye. All right. Bye. We stop recording?