HardLore - Nate Newton (Converge)

Episode Date: November 9, 2023

Thumbnail photo by Reid Haithcock. Colin and Bo talked to Nate Newton from Converge, Cave In, Doomriders and MUCH MORE in-person in Manchester, UK, and as stated in the intro, Nate is true legend both personally and creatively in hardcore/punk, a pioneer at juggling multiple incredible bands and expertly filling multiple rolls in all of them and we can't wait to have him back on. We talk Converge's thoughts on Jane Doe when they finished the album, joining the band without knowing any of the songs, his first musical endeavors, causing a literal riot in 2002 and more. Converge is and has always been in a league of their own, as a band and as people. Thanks Nate for coming on and the band for rocking so hard. Join the HARDLORE DISCORD: https://discord.gg/jA9rppggef This episode is brought to you by Loop Earplugs! Try a pair of Loop Earplugs by using https://www.loopearplugs.com/HARDLORE and receive an automatic 10% off at check-out, applicable world wide. Get 20% OFF @manscaped + Free Shipping with promo code HARDLORE at MANSCAPED.com! #ad #manscapedpod FOLLOW NATE: INSTAGRAM | https://www.instagram.com/riffblastergeneral/ FOLLOW CONVERGE: INSTAGRAM | https://www.instagram.com/converge TWITTER | https://twitter.com/convergecult FOLLOW HARDLORE: INSTAGRAM | https://www.instagram.com/hardlorepod/ TWITTER | https://twitter.com/hardlorepod SPOTIFY | https://spoti.fi/3J1GIrp APPLE | https://apple.co/3IKBss2 FOLLOW COLIN: INSTAGRAM | https://www.instagram.com/colinyovng/ TWITTER | https://www.twitter.com/ColinYovng FOLLOW BO: INSTAGRAM | https://www.instagram.com/bosxe/ TWITTER | https://www.twitter.com/bosxe Check out our merch at https://knotfest.com/store/?view=hardlore Find all of our videos at https://knot1.co/3vWXsbx   HardLore: A Knotfest Series, Fueled by Monster Energy Edited by Steven Grise • Title sequence by Nicholas Marzluf Join the HARDLORE PATREON to watch every single weekly episode early and ad-free, alongside exclusive monthly episodes. Join the HARDLORE DISCORD for community discussions and to participate in our future Q&A episodes. FOLLOW HARDLORE: INSTAGRAM, TWITTER, SPOTIFY, APPLE FOLLOW COLIN: INSTAGRAM FOLLOW BO: INSTAGRAM, TWITTER   For sponsorship opportunities, email us! [e-mail] Hosted by Simplecast, an AdsWizz company. See https://pcm.adswizz.com for information about our collection and use of personal data for advertising.

Hello, welcome. It's almost hardlore time. Bo is still on tour with Harms Way, so we've got another very special extended mini for you this week. When we were at Outbreakfest in Manchester, UK, we caught up with Nate Newton from Converge, Cavan, Doomwriters, etc. Nate is a true extreme music pioneer, a jack of all trades, and an inspiration to us both. This was only supposed to be 15, 20 minutes, and you'll see it's almost an hour. So we thank Nate for his time and we hope you'll enjoy. Hello, welcome. It's Mini Hardlore Time. We are live at Outbreak Festival in Manchester, United Kingdom. How are you, Bo? I'm doing really, really well. Who do we got? We have a very special guest. Somebody that we've been a fan of for the greater parts of our lives, I would say, inspirational musician to us all. You think we're fucking around. But we're absolutely chuffed to have Nate Newton from Converge, Caven. That was very British of you. Yeah. Was it? You chuffed. Yeah, proper chuffed, might. I've been here a week.

I'm British now. Yeah, I could tell. Yeah, thank you. Yeah. I look British? You do. How are you doing? I'm fucking great, man.

Good. How long have you been in Europe now? Since yesterday morning. Oh, you came from home? Yeah. Oh, shit. I thought he has it been here. I was on tour with Kaven a week ago.

Wow. Kavan and Yob. And then before that, I had a day off after the... In order, it went, converge with Brutus that ended in Columbus, Ohio at some fucking festival and then we had a day

I had a day off to fly from Columbus to Denver to meet up with Kaven and Yob and then we did that tour and then I came home for exactly a week and then flew here. Were you a big Kavan guy before joining the band? Yeah. They're my friends

you know. So yeah, I loved him. Me too. I don't know. Do that, let me ask you this. Does the Cavan camp know how I feel about Cavan? Is it common? Is it commonly known?

Because I tell Adam as often as I can. He does. Adam, no. Yeah, he actually, he's mentioned it before. There we go. I'm in the Cavan army, dude. I'm a general. You're a Sonic Death Waller.

100%. Yeah, I've been, I climbed that wall long ago. That's killer. I love Caving. They're my friends. I feel like I watched him grow up. I'm like five years older than those guys and even though we all kind of came up together

like I don't know it's been cool watching their trajectory and being part of it and now being part of it is amazing I mean I would much rather have Caleb back than me being in the bus Yeah how did that feel when you got the call Um

it just it felt like it's hard to explain I mean it wasn't like I got the call it was you were the only man for the job well thank you for saying that but it

it just kind of happened out of necessity like all of us were fucking completely shell-shocked by everything nobody nobody knew how to respond everyone was fucking just fucked everybody was sad

and of course grieving and then literally at his funeral. Some of us were just talking about doing a benefit show. And then in that discussion, it just came up like, hey, you know, if you guys decide that you want to do this, I'll fill in, you know. And that was it. That was all it was going to be.

was just played the benefit shows. And then they had final transmission come out and they wanted to just play some shows to commemorate that and like, you know, book and the band, I guess. Were those things that they had written with him?

Yeah. Okay. Those are the, he's on every one of those recordings on that record. It's essentially just demos for what was going to be an album. Gotcha. And they obviously didn't get to finish it, so they kind of just hacked a lot of stuff together and made them those songs as finished as they could be.

And you were saying, was it yesterday? Ramen was yesterday? Yeah, boy. You were saying a few weeks ago when we ate ramen. Yeah, that the shows, they were playing a lot of later stuff and people were digging it. On this most recent tour, yeah. We did only material off the new album and two covers. Wow.

And people were into it. The response to the new album has been fucking amazing. And this is your first with Kavan. This is my first album. Unbelievable. It's just been really great. And I'm, I love Kavan. They're my friends.

They're like family. And I'm really happy to be a part of it, but more than anything. I've said this in a bunch of. other interviews like I'm really fucking so happy to see those guys just healing and happy again and like enjoying playing in Kaven again because they had a lot of weird kind of negative feelings wrapped up in the band for a long time the the grief in the songs as you explained it yeah like perfect sense yeah I mean that was a big part of why we decided to just play new material it was like they've played those songs for so long

there's so many memories and so much grief in them that it's like I never even thought about that you know it was like okay we the band has kind of been reborn in a lot of ways and like

it's really fucking lucky and most bands don't get another chance like that and so it's like it's time to move and your you know your touch is very much there sonically I notice

on the record? Yeah, I guess. I mean, I guess I sound like me. That's what I like, man. That's what I want. And that's another thing is like you and Kavan Converge, inspirational to me as a guy who always wants to do 50 things at the same time. Well, thank you. What was the band

before Converge? My first band that actually anybody outside of my hometown gave a shit about was called Channel. And we, our first 7-inch was released by Jamie Josta.

Still born. Yeah. Number one, Stillborn. That was me. Do you hear that, Jamie? Yeah. What did channel sound like?

Killing time? No. No, it was... Oh, man. You know, and a... D-N-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-ha-ha-ha-ha-ch-ch-ch-tch. You know that kind of...

You play bass. I played guitar. Oh, shit. Curbball. We, he does it all. Oh, I'm a fucking triple threat, baby. You're a quadruple threat, you know why? Because you're sexy too.

Oh. Thank you. Thank you. I don't hear that one much. You know what? Look at those fucking pants. Tell me this ain't a sexy guy. Take me back in a time machine to touring in the early 90s.

Okay. Take me back to my first tour ever. We had printed out MapQuest directions to and from venues. Oh, that didn't exist. Exactly. That was revolution. Yeah. I had an atlas.

I had an atlas that I bought. It was leather bound. Oh. Well, it was fake leather bound because I, you know, cruelty free. For the animals. For the animals. Did you have like a rolodex of numbers to call? I did.

Yeah. And I mean, we all had like book your own fucking life and all that shit. And like you would like go through like the personals and MRR and be, you know, look for anywhere that would book a show. Burdle. Wow. Yeah, it was very different. Have you been vegan that long?

I'm not vegan. Oh, okay. My man. Vegetarian. Vegetarian since I was 13. We'll get them. Since you were 13? Since I was 13.

I don't think we're going to get it. Have you been to McDonald's? Yeah. You know the Big Mac? I'm familiar with the Big Mac. If you give it another shot, you might like it. Have you tried to make plant here? I have.

What do you think? It's a Beyond Burger. Yes. Dude, but it's like, work. worse than a beyond. You think? It's less beyond. What's the opposite of beyond?

Here. It's a Hear. It's a here burger. It's a right in front of a burger. It was fine. Yeah. You know, whatever. It's all you got.

So you have to say it. One of my favorite questions to ask people who do sing in bands, whether it's backup or full fronted bands, is like, when did you learn you could do the Nate voice? The iconic Nate voice. The Nate voice. Yeah. When did you figure that out? pretty early on I think

I mean like going back to channel like I did a lot of backup vocals and stuff then too but like everybody I'm imagining a moment where you're like Joe I sound fucking sick

no no it wasn't like that it was just like I realized like oh I can fucking do this and hold a note but like back then the screaming in hardcore it was more shrill. And so like I was shredding my throat and probably not long after that, my second band

Jesuit, I played guitar and sang in and that was when I, like it clicked like you don't have to fucking be at the top of your register all the time and like that was sort of when I learned. So you sound like you're permanently at the top of your register and your voice just I've never heard it falter. And I can't I can't go up. It does. It does. Okay. Believe me. I don't. But the, like, the key is instead of trying to push as hard as you can, it's just like get like a kind of normal yell-talking voice and just pick a tone.

Yeah. And just clinch. I do the same thing. Mine doesn't sound cool one of you. I got to blow it. That's bullshit, man. I've heard you. But I got to be cool at all.

You know, see what just what just happened? I got to die. I was shitting. Oh, well, you can go ahead. All right. Okay. Yeah, it's tough. Jesuit, Channel.

Converge comes along. Converge comes along. Change the game. For me, I guess. Yeah. For me too. Channel and Converge, we did our first tours together. Wow.

I met those guys. I actually met Aaron Dahlbeck first. The same night I met Jamie. Josta. We did a show at the King's Head Inn in in Norfolk, Virginia, and it was Jostah 14, dive, channel, somebody else, I don't remember. And Aaron was like just

roeying for dive. Early 90s style roeying, which just meant riding in the car with them. Yeah, yeah. And yeah. And so that was how I met all those guys. And then we just became friends. Jamie's philosophy on how to grow his bands is one of the craziest ones we've ever heard.

I would love to know what that is. He strategically made every decision possible to just be the biggest thing whenever possible. The initial origin story summed up was he and a bunch of friends went to see Fugazi.

They were moshing and got kicked out along with other kids who were also kicked out for moshing. He didn't know. There were many people that that happened to. And his thought was, man, there's a lot of people who want that outlet, but there isn't really like a music for it. We got to write a demo. And they literally, he said in our episode, then they went and wrote not one truth. I mean, that.

Yeah, that makes sense. But I was the strategy of like, okay, what's big and what's missing? Yes. But I would argue that there was absolutely, I mean, Sepulterra was touring, Slayer was tour, they toured together. I was at that show. Fudge Tunnel opened and clutch. But like, yeah, there were shows where people mushed.

I saw them. I was at them. I guess it was the, maybe the demographic of those who were kicked out, who he wasn't seeing at other shows and blah, blah, blah. The eight shitheads who were. Yeah, yeah. And he was like, I'm going to write a demo for them. Yeah.

He did. He did. He wrote it for me. Yeah. I mean, that demo is fucking. great. You know, I get it. Let's talk Converge.

Let's talk Converge. What do you want to know? So you, were you not an original member of Converge? No. I am Converge as technically I'm their fourth base player. Oh really? Holy shit. Yeah, their first base player was Eric Ralston, who I never knew.

And he left very early on. Then Jeff Feinberg, who moved. to Montreal to go to McGill University and he started the band Iyer and so he left the band and then Brodsky played bass. He plays bass on When Forever Comes Crashing. And then when Forever comes crashing and

until your heart stops came out right at about the same time and Kaven was like you know we're gonna fucking hit it and Converge had a tour booked with Today's the Day and they needed somebody to go on tour with them and they were like, well, you're irresponsible and don't have a job.

You want to play base on this tour? That was the criteria? Basically. And I was like, yeah, sure. And so then I drove up to, no, I didn't. I took a Greyhound bus up to Massachusetts three days before the tour started. And they were like, all right. right, let's practice. And I was like, cool, I don't have a bass. And so we went to Mr. Music

and the band fund bought me my blue pea bass that I still have. Oh, that's, that's fucking awesome. And then they were like, all right, what songs do you want to play? And I was like, I don't know any. So I sat in Kurt's bedroom and he showed me how to play all the songs. And I fucking did not know how to play any of them. We went on tour. My first show with Converge was Crazy Fest in Louisville. was that when the shit was getting thrown into the river? No, this was before that. It was still at a big indoor venue. But there were like 2,000 people there

and I didn't know how to play any of the fucking songs. That's insane. Because we think about converging, we think of the pros. The most pro. Oh, no, dude, I just, I brought a distortion pedal, turned it up all the way.

And I was like, all right, I'm just going to jump around and jump into the crowd a bunch. And the parts that I know I'll play them. Yeah. Yeah. And that's pretty much what I did. Let me ask you something. Because I think then by that timeline, there's an infamous video. That was 98.

Oh, infamous video? Yeah. Because I believe in the background there's a Jane Doe banner. So you would have. No, that was at least four or five years later. There's a video. You're talking hate verge? No. Well, I would love to talk about it. You're going to ask me about Gainesville Festival right now, right? Was that when allegedly a certain instrument was used as a weapon? Yes.

Okay. Yes. Allegedly. Allegedly. Allegedly. I've never seen a video of it. I know you're lying to me. Just be open about it, man. It's cool.

That was one of the first things I ever saw of Converge. Like early, early, like not even on fucking YouTube because YouTube wasn't around yet. It was on Daily Motion or something. I think I may have seen it on a... On a VHS team. Oh, cool. That must have been like 2003 or 2004 because we were playing, you fail me, but it wasn't out yet.

Do you remember what happened? Yeah. Yeah. So that, no, no, it's all good. That was arguably the stupidest thing I've ever done in my life. And I've done some stupid fucking things. But I will say it looks like I, smashed someone over the head and I didn't.

That's not what happened. Oh. Shoulder. No. So I'm not going to name names. Yeah. Someone who I was friends with who, really it's their fault.

They started. There you go. But the whole thing was like you ever go somewhere and you're just in a room and you're like, I need to get the fuck out of here because this shit is about something's going to happen. Yeah. It was that kind of energy. You could feel it in the air.

It was last night at Burma. And like, there was just tension. and what I remember is the security being very, very rough with the kids at the show. And people being very fed up with it. And there was like this fucking makeshift stage barrier that was made out of two by fours and plywood that was really not fucking safe. And like it was just almost buckling and like security were just not, they were being fucking real bullyish

assholes and they didn't understand where they were what was going on. 99% of the time. Yeah and so a person who will go unnamed finally was like I'm fucking done with this

bullshit and he ran out on stage and started kicking down the support beams on the barrier which was ill-advised not smart and I would have done the exact same thing.

Yeah, and then that resulted in a security person grabbing him and putting him in a full Nelson. Yeah. And dragging him off the stage while another one was hitting him. Oh. And there's so much to this. I hadn't slept in like 36 hours because we had just done our first tour in Japan. and we flew straight from Japan to Florida to Boston

we had literally four hours and then we flew to Florida landed in Florida got in a van and drove straight to the festival you were hallucinating you saw four arms I was out of my fucking you saw Shiva you saw Goro from Mortal Kombat and of course she was gonna swing

he's the hardest boss yeah and well so that happened and so it looks like I hit someone and actually what I did was break the the whole I like got between and pried the arms off of them. Oh. With the like with the arm of the base.

Dude, that's like a ninja turtle move. Like got in between him so the dude let go. Whoa. That's even cooler, honestly. And then all fucking hell broke. Then all hell broke loose. Yeah. And I just remember seeing that as a, as a young and it'd be like,

that converges. It's insane. We were that day. Would you say that was sick? That was the same thing. Insane and idiots. Absolute idiots. And it goes,

it just keeps going from there. It got completely insane. It also goes very well. Because Jane Doe, the phenomenon. The phenomenon. Did you, was there a palpable feeling finishing this record? Yeah.

Where you were like, guys, I think we did something. No. Really? No, I, dude, you can ask Jake about this. I remember, like, vividly sitting in the back of the van driving to play some shows right after we finished it sitting with Jake being like dude I don't know if this is a cohesive record like I knew that we had written some really good songs and I knew that we were all really

happy with the songs right but then the record itself I was like I don't know if all these songs go together or like if if the order is right right or whatever. Because that was the first time that we ever were like, well, honestly, it was the first time that anybody felt like we were capable of doing what we wanted to do. Because that was Ben's first album with us. Which is crazy.

Yeah, and that was like, you know, do this. And then he would just be like, but, you were like, that's better. You did something. Do that again. four more times Yeah Yeah

Yeah But Where did you find Ben Ben? Ben actually So Ben's from the Cape And he From a cave

He's been playing in a cave He's been playing in a cave He's from Cape Cod Cave Cod Yeah No he Played in a band down there Called Force Fed Glass

Sick And then he was I think Kurt recorded Force Fed Glass Like really early on So Kurt was like And then he poached him to play in his project band

Blue Green Heart. And they put out one seven-inch. And then when Damon was no longer in the band, we tried out a couple of different drummers. And it was just, well, my friend

John DeGiorgio played on the Poacher Diaries. Oh, wow. Oh, sure. And then that didn't work out just like, you know, he wasn't he was not cut out for touring at that point in his life. And then, you know, we tried out some other people and it just wasn't working. And then Kurt was like, well, you know, this kid Ben that played with me on the blue-green heart seven-inch, he's really good.

And we're like, yeah, sure, let's jam with him. Came in and he was like a convert super fan at the time. So he knew it all? Really. Literally was like, what song do you want to play? and like just fucking nailed everything

the first time like enough for a full set and we were like oh this is the dude amazing yeah and it was just immediate like that's the

Benzar drummer that's awesome and that was that yeah and that was like 2000 I think it would have to be

you know what's fun about Jane Do not to harp on but that's a record that I can listen to still that I still fine things. Like I only just

within the last year, and I mean this, realize that in, there's Phoenix in Flight, Phoenix and Flames. Yeah. The one is just drums and vocals. Yeah. That's it. Never knew it. Really? Never caught on. That's funny. Just learned, just realized

it the other day. Well, yeah. AirPods changed a lot. It changed. Dude, AirPod Max. Spatial audio. Dude, it's crazy. Yeah. There's little nuggets and whistles on back there on, and anything that I just never knew were there. that's pretty cool. Yeah, man.

It's funny that cohesion. It's funny though because I listen to that record now and there's like oh, why did we do that? I'm like fucking, oh, that riff does not need to be there. Like that, get that out. I wish some of the songs are... Too close to it. Some of the songs are overwritten

in my opinion. Over interesting. Over thought. But I would say your concern being cohesion is ironic. Because it's probably seen... I guarantee you the first review was like five stars. Very cohesion. Oh, no. No, dude.

The reviews were not good. That's crazy. Yeah. Like, it's funny. That was the first album that the band ever had like a publicist working on it. Like the EVR had a publicist working on it. And Jake has a fucking binder full of reviews. And most of them are like, it's okay.

It's mediocre. I don't get it. This sucks. I don't like it. It's like a literal paradise. And then there were like a few. that we're like, this is incredible. And I mean, we knew that we had made music that we liked and that we were stoked on.

And like, for lack of a better way of putting it, that we had made a statement, like, this is what we're doing. Yeah. Like it or not, you know. Nobody sounds like this. So here you go. We do. Yeah, I mean, I guess. To us.

To me. I mean, to me, it was like, I mean, to me, it was like, I mean, you know. I mean, it's just Roershack entombed and drive like Jayhu and Hoover. But that's like, that's, that's an unreasonable combination of things. Is it? Outside of the converge vacuum. Yeah, I guess. If somebody was like, we sound like entombed and drive like Jahu, I'd be like,

yo, turn it off. Stop. Don't do that. Don't do that. But now you say that. I go, that makes sense. Yeah, that makes sense. Yeah.

I don't know. I mean, it's just a, but I don't, I don't even know where I'm going with it other than like, it rock. We knew that we were stoked on what we had done, but... Eventually you did. Was there like a... Was that like a spark at that point? Like, did the rocket ship really start to go?

Yeah, I mean, like, as creatively it did. And like, there was a fire under us to just, like... I don't know. Maybe it's just me. I don't know. Like, I have always kind of... Maybe I'm an elitist prick, and I... But I don't like most.

I think most music's not good. I mean, look at how much there is. There's so much. How can it all? But especially then, like late 90s into the early 2000s, especially in hardcore, like it was just, there was a lot of really bad, boring shit going on. What was the direction where it was going,

where you heard it and you were like, oh, this is not for me? When it started losing me was the New Age Records era. Preach, brother. Except for Unbroken. Unbroken, where punk is fuck. Yeah, for some reason, all the old heads in Chicago love Unbroken. Love Unbroken.

And it missed me. I was too young. You know, that would make sense. It was like I had to be there kind of thing. Like, everybody else was kind of doing like the New York hardcore warship with like chuggy Mosh part. which will always have a soft spot in my heart. Oh, yeah, well.

But, like, it was getting really polished. Of course. Everyone was doing these, like, really, at the time, what seemed like very polished recordings, and, like, it was just, it had lost the punk in it. Like, what I was saying to you earlier in our conversation, I was like, you know, when I stopped being able to hear the punk in it, it just stopped being interesting to me.

And with Unbroken, the first time I was, The first time I saw them, they were a fucking sloppy mess. You love that. And it was, they were a sloppy mess that didn't care if they got hurt. They didn't care of anybody else got hurt. Love that. They were just like, they went ape shit. How do you feel about that now?

If there's like a fight on a stage or in the pit, this is, I know that you guys are Well, it wasn't a fight though. It wasn't violent. But now even even like a guy is knocked out, somebody will come on the stage and be like, stop the show. Stop. Stop. Stop. to the singer.

Stop. Well, I mean, I saw, like, that's why we're here. But I saw that in the fucking 80s, too, though. Like, that wasn't, that's not new. The stop the show after. Yeah, like, when someone got really fucking hurt, people stopped.

You know, it was at metal shows where they didn't stop. You would go see fucking Slayer, and dudes would get, would break a leg in the pit, and everyone would just stomp them. Do you stop for fights, converge?

Yeah, do you have policy? Yeah. Yeah. You kind of have, we say this, lot, but after the Travis Scott thing, like you kind of have to. Do you have a fight riff? No.

You'll come back. I mean, we've stolen hate breeds thing of playing Eye of the Tiger in the past. But for the most part, I'm just like, stop. I'm just going to stand here and look really displeased for a while and just give you that I'm going to dad you. Like I'm not angry. I'm just disappointed. I've seen you dad.

You know? Like I've seen Come out of you and I'm always like Papa no That would scare me as a show go right I mean it's not It's just I don't know

But it's just At this point Like I've talked about this with other people Never run on a podcast though So you know you're going to get it first here People talk about The violence and hardcore And like in the

Formative and Classic years and how people glorify it somewhat or they look back on it like oh yeah tell you this cool fucking fight story or this happened or that happened and like and now it happens now and I'm like fucking why why? I can tell

the violence in general yeah I can tell you from my perspective when I started going to shows the reason why those fight happens, fights happen, were because there were fucking Nazis there trying to kill you. Like, literally, or trying to recruit, or literally

showing up just to fucking ruin everybody's time and hurt people. And they're not around anymore. Yeah, no. You know, like, in Virginia, we ran them out. And like, I'm just like, why now?

Now you're just, now this is just a dick flexing contest. Who the fuck cares? Fighting bad, violence good That's my policy Mutual understanding of violence God, yeah, yes So you're a crowd killer guy

No, no, no, no, but like, tasteful Tasteful, Crockin. I don't think, what is tasteful crowd kill? You know, it's there's, it's elegant When you get over to the side And there happens to be a swing Yeah, that's, that's fine But you know, you know, when a guy is just going boom, boom, boom

Oh yeah, well, there's some dudes Not dude, there's some people men, women, crowd killers who they get out there and you're like you could be a fucking ballet dancer

you, you are graceful and I like watching you mush Exactly. Nor everybody should strive to hear But you're not trying to hurt anybody You know

And then there's other people That are like I'm gonna fucking fuck everybody up And I'm like Why? Like what's the I don't do that Why?

I'm a swan. You were not a swan. You were a gooseling. I'm a graceful guy though. Am I not? Did you say a brusely? A gooseling. A gooseling? A gooseling? A gozzling. A gozling. Thank you.

You're Ryan Gosling. Thank you so much. You're a Ryan Gosling of hardcore. We did it. You're only over here right now for a very short while. What is your base? What is my base? Base rig? What is your base? Do you have a flying thing? Do you have stuff that stays here? I just there was like backline rental it's just my normal shit

it's a Ampeg 8 by 10 and orange 80 200 B what I've been doing lately for fly-ins was I have a quilter base block 802 solid state

and it's fucking amazing I decided not to bring it because both shows have the orange heads there. And I was like, well, this will be four pounds lighter. And no pedals or nothing? No, I run, so I have a pedal board. I forget that I play bass now.

I should ask you what you should use it. Oh, yeah. All right. So I have a bunch of, I have my board that I just had on the cave-in tour. So there's shit on there that I don't really use and converge. But my go-to, no matter what, a Nunez Tetrafette drive, which is actually just a guitar distortion pedal, but it just. It works really well for me for bass.

Every time I use a bass pedal, it just doesn't sound right. Interesting. I use a combo, bass guitar pedal as well, so you're right. But I pair that with an ODB. Oh, there you go. Fartin. That's a lot of stuff going on there, man. That's noisy.

I like it. It sounds. Yeah, yeah, yeah. And then I've got, I always have, like, at the head. I don't put any mics on my cab. I've got a Ever anywhere? No.

So you're D-I in front of house. I've got a radial JDX speaker simulator DIY on the back of the head. Yeah. And then downstage on my pedal board I have a shift line

cab zone base which is like a cab and amp simulator like IR loader. Yeah. And so just two DIs direct and you can and mix the tone.

You're not going to be able to do it, but you can just pay attention. But I love that because Converge is also considered the best sound. Tony, you know, like tone guy. We're Tony. Tony. Tony, Tony. Tony, Tony.

Tony. Tony. Tony. So I like that the, the, the D.I. blend with a live. It's so good. It's so fucking good. Yeah, I mean, like, we have no mics on any cabs on the stage.

Everything is, is D.I. Now. like amp and cab sim and then the cabs are just for stage volume yeah you don't have to blow your ears up save your hearing yeah or don't but like really what it

the reason why I started doing it that way was just because fucking like fucking you know Mike's move and yeah like or like the cable or what shit just gets fucked up and it never stays where you want it.

And like, so, uh, we started doing that and it just takes all the issues away. And then like, for example, on the, on the Kavan Yob tour just now, um, we were out. And you're running the, the two DIs that way. And, uh, my cabinet died on stage. Completely died. Couldn't tell up. Didn't matter. Didn't matter.

Yeah. It mattered to you, but. Yeah. Once you knew that you're okay. I mean, I knew that it was, it was fine. I can still hear it. And I was just like put in the monitor. Put in the monitor.

That's awesome. So, yeah. Do you have, and I know this might seem crazy, a personal favorite converge record? Like the one you did when you were like, nady, likey. I mean, it's always the newest one. But in particular, I guess I'd say there are two. You fail me. Love.

So everybody talks about everyone always. kind of cites Jane Doe is like the turning point record for Converge. And for me, it was you fail me. I know. I feel like on Converge, or on Converge, on Converge. On Converge? On Jane Doe, we were just sort of figuring out that we were capable of doing the things that were in our heads.

And you, on you fail me, that was when like, what is going on in Kurt's head, man? I still wonder that daily. for so many reasons I'm sure he wonders the same about me but on you fail me that was the record where I feel like it really came together but also like that was the first record

where we took a step back and we're like does that need to be there oh shit that's hard are we doing too much in this song I think we're doing too much Like that was when we really started self-editing and like

and just approached it differently. That was that to me is when converged. The converge that everybody knows now that's when Converge became converged. You family, no heroes? Yeah. And then what was your other? The second one would be Blood Moon.

Okay. Because that is so outside of all of our wheelhouses that it was like really for me it was just like, holy shit, we actually did this. And there's like certain songs on there that I wrote music for that like I listen to them. I'm like I can't fucking believe that this is us. This is me. How collaborative is the writing for Converge? Very. Nice. I mean, sometimes someone will bring a complete song to the table and play it and we'll be like,

that's sick. All right. Let's do it. How's that go? Show me how to do that, you know? Usually it's very collaborative. Usually when I write a song for Converge now, I don't write a full song. It's rare that I'm just like, here's the song. Yeah. It's more like... Because Kurt's gonna noodle and do this. Yeah, well, and I want him to. Yeah.

You know? Why else have... Yeah. Yeah. And I mean, if I feel, you know, if I feel that he shouldn't do that, I'll tell him. And he'll do the same with me. But, like, I bring, like, skeletons of songs to the table. And I'm like, here's what I got.

I'm Skeletor. Present skeletons. Yeah. Here you go. Ooh. This part is the femur. you go. But I'll just like, we'll go back and forth.

Like give him a back and forth. Like here's, I have an A and a B riff, maybe a C riff. And like, let's jam on this. And then we'll kind of, that's when everyone starts throwing ideas in. And like things actually become songs. Who, who's the Mosh Park guy? Who is the biggest advocate for Mosh Parts in the band? All of us are.

Good. Great answer. That was a trick question. But we all have different ideas of when and where they should be. So break down everybody's idea of what a perfect mosh part should be. From your perspective. Like what's yours? In converge?

Yeah, yeah. From the converge perspective, everybody's mosh input. Because I'm a mosh scientist. I consider myself Ph.D. You know, it would be tough for me to say... Undergrad right now. You're doing good. It would be tough for me to say what it is for other people.

through AIDS size My okay my two favorite mosh riffs yeah hit me in Converge

are the breakdown in heaven in her arms dude that is my favorite he put that on the list that was on my list because the riff baby

I fucking love it's on the list it's on you see you can go back and see it and then my other favorite one is from

the dusk in us and it's at the end of broken by light okay and Kurt wrote that and like it's really short. When we play it live, we usually stretch it out longer just to

just to watch people do whatever they're going to do. But like that's the other thing is like I believe in like just teasing the mosh. Like you just get a little bit. That's all you're getting. So you better. That makes him need to listen to it again.

That's what I'm saying. That is the ancient secret. There's songs where you can give it to them and then there's songs. Yeah. You get a taste because you've got to play it. Yeah. I mean, I like, like a good mid-paced fucking banger all the way through, but it's got

a, like, it's got a flow. It's got a reason to get to the end, too. Yeah. It's got a, it's got to, like, take you on a journey. If it's just like, here's a fucking mosh riff, here's another mosh riff. Oh, no, of course. Here's the third mosh rift. I'm like, that's just fucking boring.

It doesn't work that way. You got to earn it. They must be earned. They must be earned, you know? There's another shit. The Mosh must be earned. Off the top of your head. Do you have a favorite breakdown of all time?

Of all time. Yeah. Any bin. Even like the top three or four or five. Fuck. Just a part where. Integrity March of the Damned. There you go.

You put Judgment Day on part two, right? Yep. That's a good one. The dive bomb. Yeah, come on. But the end of March of the Dam. The first time I heard that record, that I was like,

whoa, holy fucking shit. I want to kill everything. Pardon this interruption. Wow. Bo, it is so good to see you. So good to see you. 10 months.

It feels like years. We've got some ads to tell the people, but it's very special today because now it's, you're putting them both to use every single day on this toy. I literally, first and foremost, I'd love to talk about loop. Loop earplugs, baby.

Tell me about your experience using Loop on a U.S. tour for the first time. U.S. tour for its time, first time I use them every single day. I have used them every single day. They've done on my keys every night. I've enjoyed them. They're really easy.

They go right in. They stay in, which like I'm moving. I mean, because they have so many different sizes in every single pack. I'm a medium man. You're a medium man. As am I.

Some people are bigger. Some people are smaller, but they've got you covered. Every single pack comes with every size. Sizes you ain't even heard of, frankly. You don't even know about it. And the important thing to remember is this is all about and promoting ear health. You're going to shows.

You're a musician. You're writing. You're a fan. Whatever. Protect your ears. You're never getting it back. In your case, every single night, if you were exposed to harsh sounds for 30-something straight days, if you were right next to playing guitar live with no ear protection every day,

you'd come home with permanent ear damage. That's the truth. that's scientifically to protect your ears if you're listening to live loud music if you're listening to live music if you're going to see even to the movies Lana words him to the movies loop ear plugs man they got you covered whatever decibel shortage you need they obviously it's also manscape time as well tell me about have for the first this has got to be revolutionary having manscaped on tour tell me talk to me I trimmed

last night with using my my tremor let's see I use the preserver every single day I use I play in the boxers the boxer briefs every night they're good they're good big fan dude I got to imagine reviving post set every night yeah yeah that's the real experience it's it's really nice I don't I don't look forward to touring for that long ever again if I ever do it but you better believe i'm going to have a whole separate manscaped bag with me yeah that's it's kind of actually what i did i have all my like gym and post show things in a little duffel and i go straight for the manscape stuff every time and then you know luckily if you use code hardlord 20% off and you get the big lawnmower pack you're going to get a travel bag with it you're going to

get all the stuff we're talking about from the preserver the reviver if you get the body watch it comes with the scrubber and I didn't bring it on the road. I don't have the scrubber? Dude, I didn't bring it. I've been using the scrubber more than ever. It's so awesome, right? I love it.

I can't stop scrubbing. I can't stop scrubbing. It's crazy. Well, it's so good to see you. I'll see you soon. I can't wait to do a big, huge episode when you get back. Yes. Harmsway, common suffering tour.

Still going now. Still going. Back to the episode. Are we talking only hardcore? No, no, no. Because we have like, The first one is mostly metal. Killing Time, backtrack.

There you go. Amazing. That's a song that if I could see it covered every day and I'll be in the pit. Yeah. Yeah. That's a good one. Killing time. My one regret with the Jostom one is that I couldn't get him to say Killing Time.

I love the way he says it. It says, Killing time. Going on tour. That was really good. You just summoned him. I've known Jamie for a long time It's not a breakdown That's okay

We've got those Okay, I'm gonna go It's a tie Okay Between two songs on the same record Even better Sepulterra Either Amen

Or territory Propaganda was on ours Propaganda was on ours The thing about territory That's interesting Is the breakdown It's just ging, gink, gink, gink, gink. Yeah.

Because the whole song is the fuck out. That fucking record. Masterful. It's, it's, how did they do that? You know? So I know a lot of fucking death metal dildos that are like, fucking, when that record that record fucking sucks. That's when I'm like, fuck you.

That is one of the greatest metal records of all fucking time. I would say any genre. Yeah. One of the few. perfect front to back pieces. It is so fucking good. That record changed my whole shit up. I was like, okay, this is

I mean, I already loved Sepulterra. But then that record came out and I was like fuck everything else. That was like an Igor I love you. Igor's my dude. Those are the guy like the Cavaleras champions of new music. They are. They go on fucking band camp

and just check shit. They're They're real as fuck, man. That patch on immediately. They're the best, man. And Igor is, you know why I love Sepulterra? Because they're punks. That's exactly right. They're not metal dudes. And that proof is KASAD is like

the example of what you would not like because it's like it's getting polished. It's getting cleaner. But the fucking tracks and the ethics are so undeniable. It's got groove. That's why. It's not just like metal part. Breakdown. It's all grooves.

Even the fast shit. It's all grew. And weird shit too, like nomad with the counten where it's then sped up. Yeah. One day, go. Yeah. Yeah, I could go on.

And thinking about that, that's probably their third language and the lyrics are brilliant. Yeah. Dude. It's good. Yeah. Brilliant. Like, I can't write that shit.

They're the best. They're the best. Igor, like, when we took Pet Brick out on a Euro tour last year. And, I mean, I love Igor. all we did every night after the show, like we were sharing a bus. It was us full of hell and pet brick. We would just sit in the bus lounge

and fucking pass, like just pass the fucking cord around, plug in our phones and we're just playing music for each other all night. And it was like, you know, check out this crazy metal record. All right, now listen to this free jazz record. Now listen to this weird electronic record. And it was just every night.

It was fucking awesome. And like, like Igor, you know, he's like, by all fucking standards, he's a metal god. Yeah,

right. And he is so not a metal dude. But he's rocking sick of it all shirts and shit. Dude, I mean, he's a punk. But I mean, like,

listen to Pet Brick. Yeah. They are fucking incredible. And it's, like, you don't see many people from his era and his generation.

I mean, he's still very relevant. but like who came up when he did who are still really pushing the fucking limits. He's like, all right, I already did that. I'm going to do some other fucking wild, weird shit now. And it's designed for you to not like it. I'm challenging you to like this.

It's the last extreme way to make it. And he's real. Like all those guys are. And so, yeah, man, I have nothing but love and respect for them. As do we. Yeah. A couple of questions we ask everybody. And then we'll let you go.

One is phrased a little funny. It's who do you do? And it's like on stage, there's guys that are girls we see in our lives as musicians, that we see them do something to play a certain way. We take that with us forever. D.D. Ramon. I can see that. The way you jump and play kind of high up on the neck.

Yeah. I can see that. Didi Ramon. I totally see that. Daryl, Jennifer. And Keith Huckins. Who's Keith Huckins? played guitar in Rorschach, dead guy, kiss a goodbye.

That makes sense. Yeah, that works. Yeah. Amazing. Great answer. Great hands. Right off the rip. Yeah, that was good.

I could see. I don't know I do. Yeah. We think about it all the time. Yeah. There you go. The other thing would be the golden arches question, we call it. We already talked briefly about dear Ronald.

This is a magical. We're in a mythical place in this scenario. Okay. You're in America. You're driving down the highway. You got enough time to stop and eat. The band is. The band is.

Sorry. You see a sign, like on the side of the highway that's got every fast food place that you've ever heard of. Okay, it's magic. What's the one that you're seeing? You're going, oh, shit, they got. And you're pulling off. That converge collectively goes, er. Let's go, guys.

Fast food? Accelerated cuisine counts, too. It counts as well. I mean, does like Wagamama count? I don't know. I don't know. I don't know. What is Wagamomom?

Is it a chain? You've never been to Wagamama. Mama? No. You're in the UK right now. No. And you've never been to Wagamama. Never been to Wagga. I've been here ten times. I've never heard these words. Are you serious? Yeah. You should go there. Waga Mama. It's like an Asian

Fusion. It's got a boo place. Wagoo mama. Like waggoo. Fucking ramen and Oh. It's awesome. It's a chain. It's a chain. It's fucking everywhere here and it's really good. And that's the spot. No one's ever mentioned this to us before? That's amazing.

We've never been. This is. one fucking, I looked it up. It was one point three miles from here. You're doing like a long-mile potion castle. Yeah, you're bit. You ever been to Wagamama, man? How about I knock you around? I'm dead serious, man.

But I do that with distortion pedals all the time. People ask me. You just make shit up. Yeah, I use a fart box. I'm fucking bass jazzerciser, man. Oh, no, like, you know. Oh, who makes that fucking F-R-T electronics?

It's sick. You should check it out. Is there a US place? that you would pick with the Golden Arches question. Where converging? I mean, Taco Bell. Beautiful. I can always make it work at Taco Bell.

That's the point, you know? That's what we're all about. Yeah, but, you know, I love a Chipotle. Yeah, I'm a soldier. He's got PTSD. He's got PTSD. Yeah. He's going to be okay.

I got chip PTSD. He got your PTSD. Why did you get chip? No. It was just over, over COVID. It was just like constant. It just, I have had to eat it so much in my life that I won't do. I feel you. I love it.

Well, I mean, I don't go there all that often, but it's like a, if I'm on the road, and it's like, all, I know that we can all eat there and be, no one's going to fucking. And they got Coke products. Be a baby about it, you know. You like soda? Some. I'm very, honestly, I really only drink one soda. What is it?

Ginger beer. I love ginger beer. Yeah. No problem. I'm a ginger beer guy, but like, otherwise, no. They got that, they got that, um, it's not iron brew, but it's like the, Crazy Jamaican ginger beer here. Crazy Jamaican?

Is it called that? I might be. I'm not sure. But it's like spicy. It's like brutal. That's my shit. It's so good. I'm in.

I'm down. Yeah, man. I'm having a great time. I mean, this is an hour. What time is it? Seven. Oh, is it really? Yeah.

All right. Yeah, I'm going to have to cut this one short. Let's go. Very soon. Thank you so much, Nate, for joining us. Thanks for having me. We'll have to do more because I can go on. Oh, yeah.

I am fucking boring and don't do much in my life, so I will talk to you all goddamn day. Converge, Cavan, Doom Riders. The list goes on. Our list goes on. We didn't talk about Doom Riders. Who could not make a shirt on the Death Wishee store that I would not buy. I challenge them to go back in time and make one that I wouldn't order. They couldn't do it.

Well, now you gave you some fucking shirts that you have to make now. It's true. Yeah. Available now. Click the link. Link and below. Click this link. Thank you, Nate, for joining us.

You're the man. Thanks for having me. You're the men, too. Oh, thank you so much. Let's go. Bye. Bye.