HealthyGamerGG - Curse of Productivity Ft. Amouranth

Episode Date: August 17, 2020

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Hi, how are you? Okay, awesome. Thank you very much. Yeah, so thanks for coming on. And do I call you Amaranth or is that? Kate is fine. Kate? Yeah.

Okay. Thanks for coming on, Kate. Yeah. It was nice to meet you a couple weeks ago on the scuffed podcast. I watched your stream from time to time, but it was really cool to hear your perspectives on kind of mental health. So thanks very much for sure. does. No, no problem. I think I'm going to have you on my screen too. So if you need to crop my window so that you're not shown twice, then you can do that if possible. Okay. Thanks for letting

me know that you were doing that. So and it's Kate, you said? Yes. And what did you, so I saw that our topic today was going to be something about social media. Yeah, I was thinking just more of like the various effects that social media from the creator side can have on the mentality of the streamer or YouTube or whatever it is. Yeah, I'd love to hear your perspectives on that. Yeah, well, something I've noticed for me personally, I think the biggest change with social media is like I feel like I don't have as much personality as I did before I started streaming, you know? like day in and day out. It's like, because I guess everything's so monotonous that I feel like I no longer partake in the activities that made me me. That's kind of frightening.

A little bit. To say that you like have less personality or no longer have personality? Yeah. It's like really weird. It's like I guess for smiling, it's a lot harder for me to do that like I used to. Like I just noticed to myself like I guess less bubbly because I used to do like Disney princess parties and stuff for our kids birthdays before. I started streaming and that became like something that was like a part of my like normal identity too where I was just smiling all the time. You know, it was like positive person. And I guess like

social media, I've noticed that physically my mouth doesn't feel as comfortable smiling because I don't do it as much, you know? I'm hearing emotion in your voice. Yeah, yeah. I'm a very emotional person too. What are you? Do you mind if I ask what you're feeling right now as you say that? Concern. Okay. What are you? concerned about. How to like keep that balance, right? Because I think that's like the biggest problem I found is chasing long term happiness as like goal oriented for being a social media person like what I want to achieve in life versus like short term mental like happiness. I guess like short term indulgences versus like keeping the grind up to achieve long term dreams.

If that makes sense. Yeah, it does make sense. You know, usually I say this later, but can I think for a second? yeah go for it because i'm hearing a lot of important stuff from what you're saying k yeah and don't don't get like too concerned if i sound emotional part of my problem is i can't breathe very well so like i get over anxiety feelings much easier than normal people i guess because i have a breathing issue so like i can't breathe deeply when talking about things so i just like sound like i'm about to cry but like emotionally i feel okay oh okay that's useful to know so um hmm i I'm curious about your breathing issues, but I think that's more on the medical side. Yeah, it's just something.

I notice that if I like stop and I breathe and then the waiver in the voice fades. But like if I keep going in a sentence without breathing, it just sounds really bad. Yeah. It sounds worse than it actually is. How long have you been breathing like that? I guess my whole life has been deviated, but it's gotten worse. I've gotten older. Because I think the cartilage is like growing against my favor, you know, just as my nose.

ages. Interesting. Something I have to fix soon. But that's like another issue is like scheduling time to get things like that fixed when it would take like a hiatus from social media and losing that momentum and stuff. Okay. So it sounds like there's really a cost to taking care of yourself. Yeah, exactly. Yeah.

I'm, you know, not to sound bleak, Kate, but I'm almost like hearing that you're kind of losing a part of yourself. Mm-hmm. Yeah, I agree. I mean, that's fucking frightening, you know? And so what are, and by the way, Disney princess parties sound awesome. I think my kids would absolutely love that. They wear, they have, we got them Elsa costumes for Halloween like two years ago. Yeah, yeah.

And maybe one year ago. It's rusty now. But, and they wear them like once a week. like my older kid will just be like today's an Elsa costume day and she'll just like at 1230 yeah she'll just like it you know after lunch she'll go upstairs to her room

and she'll actually like change and then she'll fold her clothes and put them away which is really awesome I mean because she doesn't leave the mess she used to leave the mess but she'll just like today's an Elsa costume kind of day and it's not really a costume it's just like she just puts on her else dress best Halloween costume money we've ever spent oh yeah yeah they'd love

that stuff. I used to do it like every weekend. So I saw all the dresses, all the kids belt the songs. It was like really like really fun wholesome time. Yeah. And and I guess tell me about what that person was like, the person who did those kinds of things. Can you tell me about it? I guess that kind of thing. It wasn't so much that like I was different in the way I was thought about things, but just like I felt like I was more happy. But I think Some of that comes to do with like the whole spontaneous nature of that job, right? Every party was different. And I noticed that with streaming every day, even though you might be doing different things on stream, the routine is mostly the same.

Okay. And I feel like that's hard for me because I do have ADD, you know? And so it feels like that's like almost like emotionally like life sucking, you know? But at the same time, I also have like a huge goal that I want to achieve. And I know that social media is like the best way to get there like monetarily, you know? And it's also like I feel really lucky to have social media because so many people once have a platform and they don't ever get it. So part of me feels like I need to be able to take advantage of the opportunity while I have it because you know it's how long it's going to last, you know? Yeah.

So I'm hearing like you kind of being stuck or pulled in a lot of different directions. on the one hand, do you have goals? On the other hand, you're grateful and lucky to have the opportunities that you have. And at the same time, I'm sort of noticing that, like, taking advantage of those opportunities and being grateful for what you've been given also comes at, like, a significant personal cost. Yeah. That's really tough. I mean, how do you...

Yeah, I mean, it sounds... because I'm sort of hearing you give a piece of yourself like every single day when you do something that's a little bit more grinding and maybe you don't feel like it, but you recognize like this is an amazing opportunity. So you sort of like want to do it. And you do want to do it. But it just it seems it sounds like it's hard to do. Yeah.

What makes it hard? I guess like for me, I don't take breaks. That's probably what makes it hard. Because I think for the past four years, it's been like, stream, stream, stream, stream, like, not just like two hours a day, but like anywhere from, I guess, eight to 15 hours days of streaming. And I don't take vacations or days off because I'm like, oh, no, the momentum. I would lose all the momentum in working towards because like in streaming, what I've noticed is like to build something, like sub number, for example, is the easiest to measure just by the numbers. It can take months to build a few thousand extra subs. But then if you disappear for a week, you can lose them like that.

You know, so it's like a very like high cost type of job for if you take time off. Hmm. Yeah, that's hard. So it sounds like you have to, every day off is like taking away something you built. Right. Do you feel trapped, Kate? A little bit. Because I didn't like, I guess for me, it's like I started streaming about four years ago.

So this has been most of my like young adult life. Right? And it's like if you don't do stream, it's like you can't. There's really no other job that I can think about that would have like the same freedom of getting to do what I want and also the same level of financial support that it brings. It's like just living plus what I want to achieve later. And can you do you mind sharing what you mentioned that once or twice? What do you want to achieve later? I want to open a animal rescue ranch.

eventually, like no kill, no cage. So it would be like dog sanctuary plus some like more farm animals too, maybe. And that's going to be like a huge thing that I went like about a big scale. So it's really difficult for me to like justify time off because I feel like it's taking away from that opportunity, you know? So it's like a difficult balance. It's like long term, I know that doing it like I have is mentally draining. So I'm probably not performing. in my top level. So like even though I'm streaming every day, I'm probably not growing as much as I could be if I was actually like mentally healthy. Because you know, there's a vibe that people have. And they're like, they got it all together, more charismatic to be around. But then if I focus on my

short term happiness and like get myself put together, then I have less momentum and more distractions to keep me from actually doing the job. It sounds like there are a lot of things more important than you. Probably. That's part of it. I mean, that's what I'm hearing, right? I'm hearing that, like, there are a lot of things. Like, it's like Kate versus growing your stream. Kate versus the animal rescue ranch. Kate versus Amaranth.

And usually, like, Kate ends up at the bottom, which I think is how you end up four years without a break. Right? Because I'm kind of noticing that, you know, whatever, you would take a break, there's just some voice in your head that says, but like, actually, this is more important. So you can't do that. Yeah. What does that do to you?

See, I don't know. That's a scary part. Like, I feel like I'm past, like, people always say, like, don't keep going. You're going to burn out. But I feel like I would have burned out by now, so I might be past that point. I just don't even know anymore. How do you feel? I'm like that perspective.

How do you feel? feel on the day-to-day basis? I don't really know. I don't think about it. You know? It's like, I just do it. Sometimes we don't think about things because we don't like what we would discover. That's the thing. I don't really know what I would discover. How do you feel about yourself? That's the scary part is I don't know anymore.

What's scary about that? I feel like a robot a little bit. I mean, that's how you treat yourself, right? Every day, wake up, grind. And for a good reason, I think one of the hardest things, Kate, is that some of the worst things that we do to ourselves are not out of like selfish reasons, but actually selfless reasons. When we sacrifice, we do it for bigger causes, right?

Causes with a capital C. Yeah. And it's hard because if you don't make that sacrifice, then you know, you're one step away from the rescue ranch. And you're one step away from all of those animals that need love and protection and support. And it can almost feel like your sacrifice, like it's like there's either you sacrifice yourself or you sacrifice them. Right. Is that how it feels? Yeah, I would say so.

Like just the long term. And don't feel bad yet if I'm crying. I'm like, I'm okay. I can still talk. It's just my body. This is how I respond to any kind of stress, whether it's anger, sadness, anxiety, overwhelm happiness. I just cry.

That's just me. Yeah, that's pretty much how it feels, I guess. It's like, do I cater to myself, which feels shitty? Because to me, it's like the animals of such a shorter life. And, you know, there's the whole concept of like if an animal gets stuck in a shelter, it sometimes can live just a few days. kill it because there's not enough space. So it feels really bad to like try and value my life over theirs, you know? So how does it feel if you value yourself over that? Selfish, I guess. And how long have

you been trying to not be a selfish person? I guess most of my life. I've just always had like a very big respect for animals and wanting to help them since I was a kid. I think part of that comes from like not really having many like social guides in my family you know because my parents didn't really have friends coming over I never had like a social example I was never good at making human friends I was always just friends with the dogs on my street can you tell me a little bit more about that yeah I guess like I would just go outside sometimes and like every day like my neighbor's dogs just come up and roll over for belly rubs and it was just like a genuine connection where it felt like you could actually connect to them without needing to be good at talking.

You know, and then come from like a family where it's, my parents are always working. And I was like left at home most of the time. You get really lonely, right? And so animals became like the only thing I cared about. Just how it is. You said animals became the only thing that you cared about. But I wonder if it's animals really made you feel cared for. Yeah, that too. It was like a mutual.

Yeah. What was it like? So it sounds like you grew up without siblings? It's a little complicated, I guess, because I had an older brother who's who's my half brother that I really connected with. But then when I was four, he moved in with his dad since I was from my mom's second marriage. So he left the house. And then I was stuck with my other brother who had like the middle child complex.

If you've seen that before where it's like they don't get the attention of the young one, but they also don't get treated with. respect, like the older ones, so they just kind of like act out out of spite. So he was kind of rude to me until he became an adult. Like, you know, like big brother like pigs on. Like, no, you can't play with me. Yeah. Like sibling violence, I guess, not like actual damage. Just like without hitting each other. Yeah. So just sibling rivalry maybe. Yeah. That's better. Yeah. And what was, I mean, can you tell me a little bit more about, you know, what kind of situation you grew up in or what your house was like growing up? I guess it was just pretty boring life, you know,

because it's such that my parents were working, but we didn't have enough money to actually do anything. So we had enough money to survive, but we never traveled. We never, like, spent much time together. So it was just kind of like, there was nothing wrong with the family, you know, like there was never, like, domestic violence, was never, never abused. Like, my parents argued a lot, but I feel like most couples with financial problems do that anyways. So nothing out of the ordinary. It was just like a lot of alone time, I guess, because they were always working. Sounds like you understand why there was a lot of alone time. Mm-hmm.

Yeah. And you kind of, you recognize that that was sort of a necessity because they had to work. Yeah. Do you remember how you felt? Bored a lot. So like, I didn't actually get my own dogs, I guess. So I was like 12 because my parents didn't want me to have that. responsibility as a child because they weren't there enough to be able to help.

So I just like started playing video games a lot and like did art and stuff. So I found though that like with my ADD like stuff like art, there's only, I can focus on that. Like there are a few things that can hyper focus on like training dogs, art, horseback writing. And I think like graphic design, if I've made like web, web images, how you used to like do like roleplay on neopets. because it was a dork and very lonely. So like certain things they could hyper focus on.

But another thing is I was just like really bored super easily. Okay. And what was high school like for you? More of the same, to be honest. I was kind of like, I guess, a social outcast because I didn't have any social guides in my life. So I never kind of learn how to talk to people and how to like be emotionally savvy with other humans. It was more of just like the loner waiting people to talk to me and that never works. When everyone's waiting for people to talk to them, I sound.

that as an adult. So it's like, no, no, that's not proactive enough to actually make friends. And so it sounds like you've learned a lot. It sounds like you weren't really modeled. There wasn't good modeling in terms of how to, you know, engage with people. But at the same time, just the fact that you're talking about it like that suggests to me that you've like figured that out and you've grown in some way. Yeah. I think we talk about it on my own podcast a lot when I have other girl. And so winters come on is that we're all so afraid of reaching out to each other because we don't want to be seen as like a leech that like ends up just all of us are lonely and don't talk to people. And how did you learn to overcome that? Um, I guess just by being online,

it's easier, right? Because it's like, you send them a message and you're like, hey, come here my podcast. It's so much different during the walking up to somebody and being like, do you want to be friends? It's like a lot less scary. And, and do you feel like socially more adept now? interpersonally or not so much? I feel like I can manage better at conventions especially. Like I feel like I can talk to people easier now. But there is always like that fear, I guess, from social media that's like you don't know what their intentions are if they're meeting you at the convention. Like I always have that security and stuff.

It's just like it has a problem. I have a problem trusting people now because I have so many like stalker types that do follow me. So it's like I can manage better socially, but there's still part of me that like can't truly connect in a genuine way. Sure. What do you mean by their stalker types? I just have various stalkers, but you don't really know who they are in person, right? So like all you know is your persona. So you don't really know what they look like often.

So you can't really like trust them at conventions when you meet people because you don't know who in real life was actually being really creepy to you online. So I'm noticing a change in the tone of our conversation. It seems like a little bit easier. Does it feel that way? Yeah, it's just I'm trying to breathe more. Good for you. Breathing is important. Yeah, I had a couple of thoughts about understanding the relationship between your body and your mind.

And, you know, we can go down that road in a second. but just to kind of give you a quick heads up. So, you know, I ask you sometimes, Kate, some questions about how you feel about yourself and you're saying, I don't really know. And that in and of itself sounds kind of scary, right? Is that fair to say? Yeah. And then at the same time, I'm noticing that you also say that this is just how my body reacts.

Like, and so, yeah, perfect. So that's a great observation. So the question is, like, how does that work? And in my experience, oftentimes people who don't know what's going on in their mind feel it in their body. And so if there is some kind of like, so I mean, I really see this oftentimes more with men, but like they don't know the vocabulary or they feel colorblind to their feelings. but they can like sense it in their body in terms of like tension or you know they get like a lot of tightness around the shoulders they can clench their fists things like that so we can talk a little bit down the road if you'd like to about maybe how your body is sending you signals about how

you feel about things even if you're not consciously aware of them right also you know i mean i don't want to go down the road of actually having a medical conversation but one other thing that I've noticed is that, you know, there's good data that suggests that breathing issues and anxiety are actually, like, very tightly connected. So, for example, diseases like asthma are worsened depending on your mental state. And there's actually, like, physiological reasons for that. So depending on, you know, hormones like cortisol and like other things, they can actually make your breathing worse. So high stress states for prolonged periods of time will negatively impact your respiratory system.

So there may be something kind of there. But so those are just like that's, you know, one or two thoughts. I wanted to hear a little bit about kind of what your upbringing was. Because sometimes when people are feeling a certain way in terms of what I'm basically hearing from you is that you're not really sure who you are anymore. You're kind of like losing yourself in the grind. Yeah. And it seems like a lot of the reason that you grind that way is because of these like big goals, like goals with a capital G.

And so I was, and part of the reason that you have those big, I mean, I think part of the reason that you sacrifice yourself is because you do place other things above you. And so the reason I was asking about your upbringing is because sometimes people are sort of taught that. So they're taught that they may be not. as important as other things or they're taught oddly enough like selfless sacrifice to the point of hurting yourself can be taught two ways

one is if you were very very neglected the second is if actually someone did that for you and then you're kind of like that was the behavior that was modeled right does any of that sort of like ring a bell or resonate or gain traction with you I know I sort of kind of

talked about a lot of different stuff I understand what you're saying, but I don't think that any of that was actually in my childhood, because for the most part, you know, my parents worked. Like, they still told them that they loved me. You know, it's like they've gotten fresher with each other. But, like, as an adult, you understand why. As a kid, you're just like, oh, shut up. So, y'all is so annoying.

So I have a thing because, like, you know, you can hear them doing in, like, your room or outside. It's just about, like, stupid stuff. Like, you didn't get cabbage. This is lettuce. It's really, really stupid things. So I don't think that my childhood really, affected me in that way as far as my upbringing, maybe just the isolation set me on the path for like social issues.

Like nothing that really like it's not so much anything that they did specifically. I guess more of what they didn't do as far as like show examples and like this is how people socialize with the job. Sure. Yeah. That sounds like they were pretty busy. So they may not have had time to do that. Yeah.

So thanks for sharing that. I think I'm kind of with you there. Kate. It doesn't seem like this is something that started. your childhood, not everything does. And so then let me ask you something, you know, when did you learn, how did you learn to like put yourself last? When did you start doing that?

I'm not sure when. I feel like part of it was probably when I was streaming, I think, in 2017. And then while I was streaming, one of my dogs started having bloat, which is I didn't find that's out to later what it was. But that's when, like, the dog's stomach, if he eats too fast or drinks too fast, and then goes to do an activity, sometimes the stomach can start filling with air. And then it turns on itself, and it starts expanding. And it cuts up all of their, like, organs, and they just, like, die within 30 minutes.

And that's what happened. I didn't know what was happening at the time. It was super traumatic. Yeah. But I feel like after that is when I started playing myself last, probably. I know that I couldn't stop it, but I still feel responsible for him dying because I was streaming at the time. I know like there was nothing I could do, right? It's one of those things that happened.

It could literally happen if like someone else is feeding your dogs, you weren't home, or if you just put your food outside and go do something else. Like it could happen at any time. It was just some really bad coincidence that happened all I was streaming. Yeah, I can hear that your mind understands that. But how do you feel about it? Shitty. Okay.

I can understand that you would feel that way. What does that mean? just like if I had been there with him while he was eating maybe he wouldn't have ran and got his bloat started you know but I know that like especially since I didn't even know what it was at the time I would have no idea right it wasn't something that I was aware of and was just like neglecting the situation it's something that's not even talked about by vets very much they just say oh dogs of this breed can be prone to bloat but they never actually explain what it is or the symptoms or anything oh my god yeah so it's like

It's like common in German shepherds and stuff. Oh, was it, was your dog a German shepherd? Or a German shepherd. I grew up with a few German shepherds. So, Kate, I'm hearing you kind of like, I'm seeing emotionally, I'm seeing one thing. And the words that are coming out of your mouth seem to be something else. So like you're saying, it wasn't my fault. It's a coincidence that could have happened at any time.

It sounds like you really understand that. And yet you still feel pretty shitty about it. I'm guessing that you feel guilty. Like there's a disconnect. It's like I know I shouldn't, but I still do. Yeah. So why shouldn't you feel guilty? Because there's nothing I could do at the time for him, right?

Because it's like it happened at midnight. And the only way for them to even have a chance of living if it starts doing that is to get them to like an emergency clinic. And there were like none around me at midnight. and then the operation then can may not even work to save. Sure. So it was like something that like really was just an unfortunate thing that I couldn't do anything about. So I know that it's not my fault like that he had this. But I also just, it feels bad, right?

Because it's like you wish you would spend more time with them. Yeah. And so I want you to pay attention to what you said there. I know it's not my fault, but it feels bad. And what I hear you doing right now is reassuring yourself. Does that make sense? Like you're almost like a friend consoling yourself. You're trying to tell.

I did feel like it was my fault. But like I've come to terms like, no, there's like, it could literally happen at any time. You could be out of town and someone to compete them and it could still happen. Yeah. Or you could be with them and you wouldn't. I mean, you can't know what's happening to their stomach. Right. You know?

So it sounds like you feel pretty beat up about that. and, you know, I asked you, when did you start putting yourself last? And then you came up with this story. So how has this affected you? I think it made me feel like afterwards. It's like, yeah, I gave him like, I guess I got him when he was like six months old. So I've had until he was five and this happened. And I was like, he got to live five like really good years.

Imagine all those dogs in the shelter because I did get him from a shelter who gets to live there for like a week. And because no one claims him, they just kill them, you know? So I guess like feeling guilty for that, even though like I know I shouldn't kind of like made me have fine my life purpose. So in a way like it's something I'm really passionate about. So I know that good has come from the incident as horrible as it sounds. But it just feels really bad though because he didn't get to live longer, you know? It really is a real tragedy. And so I just like I had to see him die, right?

I like saw him having seizures. It was like a really traumatic like nightmare type of traumatizing event. for a long time. And I still have nightmares occasionally of like a zombie version of him coming out of the ground and running around, which is really fucked up. But it's like, it affects me still after three years. But I also know that it's something that I can't do anything about. So what do we do when something affects us and we can't do anything about it?

We cry. Yeah. Right. So Kate, I'm getting the sense. that you're still carrying this burden. And even though you know it's not really logical, at the same time, so if we think about behavior,

behavior is not just motivated by logic. Right? And I'm kind of, I'm getting the sense that there's like that emotion is part of what keeps you from taking care of yourself and taking a break and things like that, because it's sort of like, like, does that make sense? Mm-hmm. And what do you think about that?

I don't really know. It's more of just like one of the things like I really want this skull. And so I just keep going. And then that's why I'm confused. I'm like, do I chase the long-term dreams that I know would make me like fulfilled in my life ultimately, like what I really want to do, my passion? Or do I like take care of myself in the moment and like indulge? and like indulge in little like moments of joy to keep myself mentally sane at the risk of like

my momentum of the career because it is a very momentum based thing that I found with social media. So it's like if you take a little time off and your like monetization directly is impacted. You know? Yeah. Can I think for a second? Yeah. Go for it. It may be a long second.

It's okay. My second's thinking about Evan very long too. Are you less deserving than other people or animals? Hmm. I don't know if it's so much I consider myself less deserving. It's just that it's hard for me to want other things, like, as much. What do you mean by other things? Like, taking free time off feels less rewarding to me than having my animal ranch fulfilled.

Because it's like the things I could do in the meantime. like take a day off go for whatever mental health things people do to relax what does they go to the spa do they travel i don't even know i haven't done any of it it's like i don't know i just like free time having free time quote unquote doesn't feel as rewarding to me okay sorry i'm gonna alone though right all i have is like me and my dogs which is great but dogs can't go everywhere right and so i don't only have like a bunch of friends local that i could like even think of activities to do with. Okay.

So, like, time alone feels less rewarding, I guess. I'm wondering if actually, like, not only were social skills and not modeled, but relaxation and recreation weren't modeled. What do you think? Probably. I mean, I don't think my parents ever did that either. Like, we never took vacations or anything. It was mostly because we didn't have the money, too.

Yeah. But that's, you know, that's probably created my lack of. desire for a vacation because I've never seen how like fun it is. You know, I've never been exposed to the thrills of relaxing. Okay, I'm going to need a minute because this is, things are coming together for me, but I'm also there are a lot of different directions. Can I just think? That's fine. Okay, so let's just think about this.

Trying to sketch out a plan. To transform your life. Oh. but really to transform your way. Okay. Sorry for the silence. I know it doesn't make for very entertaining. Twitch chat, I just glanced over.

I made the mistake of glancing at Twitch chat, and they said get cats. I already have dogs. What kind of dogs do you have? Have a border collie and a Caucasian shepherd. What's a Caucasian shepherd? They aren't very popular here. They're like Russian mountain dogs used for guardian protection. they guard Russian prisons big.

And ballpark, I learned this, I made this mistake on the first or second time I ever did the stream where I asked a young woman where she's from. And I realized I'm not supposed to do that. But I'm just curious. Generally, what part of the country do you live in? I'm in Texas. I'm in Texas, too. Oh. I grew up in Texas.

Same. I think I lived in the same house until I moved out. Okay. So I think some of this stuff is like spiritual. Some of it is like a little bit more psychological and some of it is a little bit more physiological. And I realize we haven't been talking very long. So generally speaking, I try to tie things together for people at the end. But I think you've done such an awesome job of like sharing so much, like so much rich information that I'd like to lay out a couple things. And then I'm curious about how. we can help you or maybe explore whatever sticks, because some of it may not stick. Any of it may not stick. Does that sound okay? Yeah.

So the first thing is like, I get the sense, Kate, that it's you or them. Right? Like you make a lot of decisions every day where it's like, I have to do this or like, I get to choose one or the other. And the crazy thing is that like that fundamentally needs to change. It needs to be you and them.

And I think you already actually suspect this in some ways where you kind of say, if I don't take care of myself, I can't quite pop on streams, sometimes the way that I should or I need to. And that like the quality of your streams could actually go up taking care of yourself. And as someone who works like in stress management is my day job, that is what I see overwhelmingly. People tend to have this idea that, you know, I don't have time for wellness. So I'll leave you with a really fascinating, I think, quote from the Dalai Lama. And the Dalai Lama said, people should meditate for half an hour a day. If they don't have the time, they should meditate for how long? What do you think?

10 minutes. Beautiful. No. He said, if you don't have the time, you should meditate for an hour. Right? Do we need it more? Yeah. And I know.

it sounds absolutely crazy, but like, that's actually how it works. People who don't have time to meditate for half an hour, when they meditate for an hour, everything gets better. And they find the time. So when I teach, like, so I do some work with like corporations and stuff. And like part of what I tell them is that you can't tell people to take care of themselves off of the clock. So what I actually encourage like companies and hospitals to do is like bake meditating time into their day and pay them for it. You'll see a return on your investment. It's crazy. But what I tell people is when they call me in for like a meditation training, I say don't have me come at 5 p.m. Have me come in the middle of the workday and they don't have to stay longer. It's dedicated time to take care of yourself

because that's actually part of your job. It's part of your job. And so the first thing that has to change is that you've got to stop thinking in terms of either or an and. And then the question becomes, okay, how the fuck do we do that? So that's one thing, right? So like, yeah, so we'll get to that. So, but I just want you to notice that your mind is programmed to think in terms of either ors. It's like, I have to do this or that. And I just don't accept that logical premise.

So you're going to wake up and like, you know, you're going to say like, okay, I could do this, but I don't feel like doing this. I don't, I really don't want to do this. and then your mind is going to automatically go to like either I do this or I do this. But like just try to take a step back and try to find an end somewhere in there. Can you start stream a little bit later every day? Can you stream for like less than 15 hours? You know, can you like put some kinds of limits around it? Take care of yourself and stream.

Second thing is I think you've got to unburden yourself. And I know there's a lot of these questions are going to be like how. And so we'll get to that. But I mean, I get the sense, Kate, that you carry around a lot of weight, which really does not need to be on your shoulders. And what I mean by that is like you have this pressure to create this ranch. Like I don't know how to explain this to you, but like you can't really do that. Right. So like for the same reason that like there's the random bloat stuff and I don't mean to bring up something negative.

But my point is that there's a certain amount of RNG in real life. and for you to slave and sacrifice yourself for like this thing is I just don't think that that's fair or even reasonable. Can the ranch happen? Absolutely. Should you devote yourself to it? Absolutely. And at the same time, there's a certain amount of fucking RNG. Right?

So like it sounds crazy to me that like you're doing all of this stuff, but like take a step back and recognize that, you know, the ranch is going to happen if it's going to happen. the other thing is that like what you kind of mention this nightmare about a zombie dog what i'm actually envisioning is 10 years from now you succeed at the ranch and instead of like disney princess kate running it and it's going to be like have you seen snow white like the old one yeah so like you know how snow white runs around there are a lot of animals like surrounding her that are singing and dancing and stuff like that that's what i envision the ranch is what the ranch should be and what What I'm actually seeing is like zombie Kate running the ranch.

Because that's what you're going to turn into the way that you're going. And it's going to be like everything is like scary and like you're like a zombie because you've burnt out. And you're like, I don't even know what burning out is. That means you burnt out. You're already burnt out. This is burnout. Yeah. That's what I was like wondering because everyone's like always sworn about a burnout.

I'm like, I never felt that coming. Does that mean that it's fine past that point? Yeah. So let me give you a quick heads up. If you don't know who you are as a person, you cry at random times and you feel like your soul is being sucked away by social media, you might be burnt out. Probably. Those may be signs of burnout. I don't know what that sign of, but burnout sure is how like kind of fits there, right?

Yeah. So I really do think it's worthwhile to kind of take a step back and think about, you know, in order for you to really make the ranch what you want it to be, what it needs is not. not like burden. Like it's not like a sense of like severe duty that's going to create the place that I envision when I hear you talk about it. It's actually like love and caring. And what I'm hearing from you is that like that person is slipping away from you, which is why it's so fucking terrifying. You're just not that person anymore. It doesn't feel like you are. That person is still in there. We got to let her out. We'll get to the house. But I genuinely do think that taking care of yourself is going to help you be the person that has that compassion to get.

If you look at studies of burnout, the first thing to go when someone gets burnt out is empathy and compassion. That's what your mind and body and physiology and neuroscience sacrifice. So if you look at physicians who are burnt out, the number one sign of burnout is a lack of empathy. People stop caring about their patients. So they go there and they like do the work of saving their lives, but they stop caring. When you, you know, when you're working with a patient who's been diagnosed with cancer and the family, like, wants to talk to you about things that are not medical, the compassionate physician sits down and has that conversation. The burnt out physician, which doesn't mean that they're an asshole, is like looking at their clock and thinking about,

okay, when can I get out of this room and, like, finish up my orders and check in with the nurses and do all my documentation so that I can go home at a reasonable hour, like 8.30 at night. And I've been here since 7 in the morning. And it's not the physician's fault. It's just compassion goes first. So I genuinely think that, like, you've got to start taking care of yourself so that you can be the compassionate person. Like, that's why I think you're losing yourself because you can't, you can't be that person. Right. I think in my case, because I don't have other people around me, it's like that has been towards myself, compassion and empathy. what do you mean towards yourself like like losing it losing it towards myself like my self care and stuff

yeah absolutely i don't work with other people it's a very isolated job and and that we kind of see too because i i think like you know because i i get the sense that i mean clearly you've told us that you actually like don't take care of yourself right and that for example you have some potential medical problems that may need to be re-evaluated and stuff but you can't find the time in the day right So the last thing is that, like, I encourage you to, I know this may sound bizarre, and maybe we can have a brief conversation about, like, religion or spirituality, but like, I encourage you to think about taking what life has given you. So, like, you're lucky and you're grateful, which is awesome. But also, like, you know, just because you're lucky and grateful and you have this opportunity doesn't mean that you have to sacrifice yourself. I mean, something about this just feels to me like you're not counting. on the forces, whether they be Twitter chat, your general charisma, your RNG, or your cosmic duty,

are like they're supporting you. And then you don't have to do it all yourself. Like, I came onto this platform and I tried to do it all by myself and like it doesn't work. I can't do it. I can't save the internet. And it's ridiculous. But that's how we feel, right?

Like you feel like you have to do it all yourself. But like don't, I mean, I don't know how I'll say it. I mean, as someone who is recognized, recognize that I am very, very well supported by like thousands of people. Like there are people who are in your corner too. You don't have to grind out every sub to make this ranch happen. Like if the ranch really is going to happen, it can't be done just by you. Because you're talking about making it big, right?

Yeah. And so are you thinking about personally bankrolling it? Part of it's going to be like fundraising. I feel like through social media. but I guess for me personally I want to make sure that I'm like I have enough money saved up for like emergencies or just general life things for myself so that that way every um discretional income that I make can be spent towards the charity organization aspect of it so that it's not my income anymore but instead it's like through the charity yeah so I think that like so just like stop and think

about that so that when you when you wake up on a particular day and you're like hey, I need to start streaming right away or I need to keep streaming. Like, I don't know how those thoughts, if those thoughts, like, factor in to your decision in the moment. Do they? I guess at this point, it's not really thinking about it. It's more of just like ingrained in me. It's like I get up and I do this.

And like I wouldn't know what else to do with my day at this point where it's like, as far as working productively towards the goal goes. Yeah. So then I think we get to the next thing. So I like your idea of a charity and stuff like this because as someone who also had a mission to create an organization and personally bankroll it, it's not sustainable. You're just going to tear yourself apart. I was working a full-time job as a doctor trying to start Healthy Gamer and it just doesn't work. So the last thing I think is kind of like more practical, which is like, okay, so like what do we do about this stuff?

Right. And I think some of this stuff is actually like super, super like nuts and bolts. It sounds to me like you literally don't know how to take care of yourself. Yeah, a little bit. And I don't mean that to be like, does that sound condescending? No. Okay. I just have, like, if I've never been taught in my home life, I also never like tried to do it as an adult, then naturally you just like don't know what to do.

Yeah, absolutely. So, you know, here, so then we can talk about practically like how do you take care of yourself? and some of this stuff also involves like behavioral reinforcement because on the one hand I'm feeling like this sense of like you know duty or Dharma to create this thing for animals and like make the world a better place and on the other hand like even when you don't like that at least the grind feels rewarding because you know you're moving towards this like ultimate goal yeah and then the flip side is like if you don't stream for a day then you're just kind of twiddling your thumbs and like doing laundry and like kind of hanging out around the

house and you're like I don't even know what the fuck I'm doing my life. Yeah. And so how can we help you get some kind of reinforcement through taking care of yourself that you can start to like learn and appreciate? Like that's also an important practical thing. Um, so thoughts about what I've said so far. Yeah, I mostly agree. I think another part is just like, I know that there are certain things that help me clear my mind, but it's also like justifying them, I guess, getting to a point where it's like, oh, that would be great. But then afterwards, it's like, look at all the time you wasted that you could have been streaming with.

So if I, if I, like, took time off to, like, maybe go, like, horseback riding or something, which is, like, a meditative activity for me. You know, you can clear your mind and think beyond nature. It's great. But then it's, like, afterwards, you're like, and I just spent the whole morning not streaming kind of, like, flipside guilt. Yeah. So how long have you been feeling that guilt? Probably for maybe like three years or so.

So is this also like it sort of started when your dog passed away? Yeah. Okay. So Kate. Okay. So there's so much to talk about. So first of all, I want to just kind of check in with you about how this conversation is going. I'm noticing that a lot of times I have like emotional conversations with people where there's a lot of like catharsis and like realizing what's really holding you back kind of stuff. Are you hoping for something like that? Is that what you want?

I guess that would be nice. Also just like it's, I feel like it's also just an important conversation to have about like it's okay to feel this kind of way for screamers, you know, where it's like the grind makes you like, you're going crazy. I think that's like normal to know that you're not crazy. Yeah. And that is a lot of people.

That is important. So can you tell me about, you know, what about streaming makes you feel like you're going crazy? I guess, like, I personally do have ADD, so it's like just like the chat in general doesn't work well with my ability to retain information or to prosecute it all, you know? Okay. Like I'm talking to your conversation with Ms. Gifts, and he also has the same issues that I felt like. There's like problems like focusing on like conversations typically if I like if I'm looking at chat like right now I have chat closed because I get I get so distracted. I have difficulty like taking in just like my environment things happening around me. I'll often be like in my own head and I'll like sometimes just like bump into stuff at stores.

I just don't realize like anything's there. And then like I'm super messy. I also do the thing of like leaving fridge doors open jars off lids when I was living with my roommate. They would often think that I got abducted because they would come home and like there would still be groceries outside of the car because I would be like making trips unloading the car and I would just like get distracted and do something else. And then the cabinet would be open. The jar of peanut butter would be left like with the lid off. And like the milk cap wasn't screwed on but it was still put back in the fridge. So it was like stuff like that where they're like, what happened here?

Is she okay? Yeah, it does seem like you got abducted. Everything's like half done, right? So it's sort of like someone just walked in and just snatched you out. Yeah. And so that sounds like ADD really does. Yeah. Yeah, I mean, that doesn't make you crazy.

But you said something about social media and streaming and how you kind of feel crazy sometimes. I think I just said I juggle too many things, right? Or like I try to, which would be like, I guess, okay if I was healthy, but because I don't get enough sleep because of the pressures of social media having to constantly make stuff, get stuff done on all the platforms. I feel like my mind can't handle it off on a functional level, like, because I have three YouTube channels. I have two, no, three Instagrams. I have two Twitters and I stream full time as well. And I also have to have photo shoots during the week for Instagram and like it's, it's why? Why do you have three Instagrams? Because I have my personal one

in case something ever happens to my main one. And then I also have my dog's Instagram because I'm trying to grow that towards like the animal stuff later in life and network with trainers and things on that. So yeah, I have, I'm very diverse and I feel like my ADD mentality thinks, like I can handle this because I'm used to multitasking. Yeah.

But because I'm not taking care of myself, I just feel like I'm actually going insane more than I normally would be with all the multitasking. What is going insane? What do you mean by that? Like brain fog a lot. Like I'll just like stop. Like I can't remember what I was doing and stuff.

You know, it's like different from like processing information. Like mid-task, I'll just be like totally blanking on like what I was just doing. Okay. So you're noticing like a cognitive impact. Yeah. When you say the word insane. To describe it is like having a browser and you keep opening new tabs to the point where just no longer responds.

Okay. So I'm not hearing anything kind of emotional in terms of insanity. What I'm hearing is like more like cognition. So it's like like you're kind of, you know, your program crashes like making pv and j.orgie has crashed and it's just. Yeah. Just stop. And then there's like peanut butter and jelly jars in two different places. Yeah. It's a lot of like different effects, I guess. Because the emotional side feels like because I don't like care to like my own self. I don't have like as much personality or know myself anymore, you know, but then there's also the cognitive side where I feel like I'm doing so much that like my mind is actually stopping its performance. Okay. Who did you used to be? I guess just more like spontaneous and energetic and fun. Like I still have like a lot of energy but not like in my emotional side. It's weird. It's like I have

physical energy, but I'm not like as bubbly or happy on a daily basis. If that makes sense. It's weird. It's like hard to explain because I guess English doesn't have that many good words for it, but it's like emotional energy is a lot less. What keeps you, what kind of keeps you from being happy on a day-to-day basis? I probably just overloaded my system. Like, like I don't have enough free time to do the things that I know would be helpful for myself. like the distress. What? Like the like the like taking long walks, I guess with the dogs or like horseback

riding things. I'm just like there's enough hours in the day to accomplish all the different aspects of my social media empire and also still take time for myself. So it's like I know what kind of like what would help. But then it would also be detrimental I feel to the career side. So it's like a lot of conflicting. Yeah. feeling. I also do not have a good sleep schedule, which is like, I know that it's bad,

but I also feel like every time I try to like finish my tasks faster and go to sleep, there's just always more to do. How many hours? Yeah. So, you know, you know, the problem with sleep schedules is that they're wonderful in theory, but like practically like, who the fuck has time for a sleep schedule? Mm-hmm. Does that make sense? Yeah. So, my average is like four to five hours. How many hours a day do you work? Um, I guess technically every time I'm not sleeping, I'm working in some way because it's either like getting ready for stream, you know, like makeup and hair and all that.

Or like I'm doing photo shoots for my other platforms or I'm like answering messages and email. So I guess I work constantly if I'm not sleeping, which I guess in my case should be considered napping because it's really not that restful. Hey, this is fucking awful, dude. Yeah. What? How do you feel when I say that? True. Like a big true.

What's true about it? It's not healthy. I mean, that's true. What else? What's awful about it? I don't know what else. It's hard to put into words. I guess like just the feeling of being trapped again.

Trying to figure out how to dig further, right? And you do. Yeah, that's something I haven't really been able to do lately. What are you trapped by? I guess the, what, it might be like just my psychological feeling of what the job requires, but just like having to be constantly uploading content everywhere just to keep everything alive and working together towards like constant growth rather than loss, I guess, of numbers and relevancy and monetary and all that stuff.

And it's not so much like an ego thing. Like, I don't really care about it. If it was just like, you know, myself, like, I feel like I have enough confidence as a person. It's just like the dream that I have. It's like so intense that I feel like, no, I don't want it to slip away because it's like a very rare opportunity that most people don't get, I feel. To actually, like, be in a position where you can actually accomplish what you want. So you feel lucky and it's almost, I'm almost getting the sense that you feel beholden to the dream and the big dream because you can actually achieve it. Yeah.

It almost feels to be. And they never get to even have a chance of achieving them. And so you would be an ungrateful little shit if you had the chance to achieve your dream and you let it slip by because you wanted to sleep for five and a half hours instead of five. Right. So, Kate, I'm going to say something to you. It may sound kind of weird. I think what you've done is you've managed to build an empire. And empires, I know this is going to sound like kind of a silly question.

It's not a trick question. So, you know, what requires more of your life force? One YouTube channel or three? I'm actually not sure because I feel like for me, once I'm in the mode of working, you know, Like, it doesn't feel much different. Maybe I'm just so used to it. So we're, like, working a little bit, I might as well work a lot because it feels like the same amount of energy for each task, you know?

Yeah. So that sort of boggles my mind because the short answer is three YouTube channels take more energy than one YouTube channel. And sometimes we, you know, I kind of talk about thoughts. And I think what you've managed to do, Kate, is you've built this empire. And the bigger it. grows, the more of you it takes. Mm-hmm.

Right? And like as you get closer and closer to success, you get more and more like lost. Because like now there's three Instagrams and three YouTube's and then like not only do each of them require their own thing in two Twitters, plus streaming, plus photo shoots. And you could give, it was fine to sacrifice yourself when there wasn't like that much. the empire wasn't as big and hungry as it is now. But you fed it and it's grown. And then it wants more. And the only place that you know like where to feed it is from yourself.

And what I'm almost getting the sense of is that like you're getting consumed by it. Yeah. I mean, the first in the first five minutes you were talking about like losing yourself in social media. And now what I'm kind of getting a picture of is like you've like created this monster and then the more you feed it, the bigger it grows. And the bigger it grows, the hungrier it gets and the more food it needs. Right. And then you're just getting everything growing.

Yeah. What do you think about that? It just is what it is if you want to go that route, right? It's like I don't only know how to keep it growing without. like cut it without cutting back a significant amount and still like catering to my happiness right it's like it's almost like I have to choose and the problem is I don't want to choose I'm very indecisive like I want both and as a result of that I feel like I can neither yep so there it is right I feel like I have to choose no you don't have to there's there's your thinking that's the you or them

you feel like you have to choose I don't think you actually need to choose I know it sounds crazy but I think you can take care of yourself and that the empire can I mean there may be practical things in terms of I don't know if you like work with other people or like you have employees or you like farm like pay some stuff yeah so I mean there's always that kind of stuff but and ultimately if you want to grow I think that's the route you have to go because you can't do it all yourself but I think that this is this is the crux of the problem and I think in your case I have something that I really want to tell you, but I think it's going to terrify. Lay it on me. I've already terrified myself a lot. I think you've got to let go of your gym. And I'm not saying that you shouldn't pursue it. Right. But like you can't, there's no such thing is like long-term happiness.

That very idea is false. This is like pot of the gold at the end of the rainbow. And I see this time and time. in time again. So my favorite examples are from investment banking. So these are people who work really hard in college to get their dream job. And then they get their dream job

at a place like Goldman Sachs. And then they're like an analyst there, which means that they're at the bottom of the totem pole. And if they just keep grinding and keep grinding, things are going to get better. And then they find themselves as associates and they have more money and now they can fly first class

for the 10 days that they get to themselves every year. Right. And then the other 355 they're working. And then they become vice presidents. Then they become directors. And then they become managing directors. And then they make $16 million a year. And they've made it.

And they sacrifice so much. They're 58 years old. They've been divorced three times. And that's the end of the rape. And then they look back at their life and they're like, this is it. This is what I did it for. And they're filled with regret and loneliness. And it's not what it was supposed to be.

It's not what they thought it was. It was a fantasy. And then ultimately, like, each step of the way in theory, things got better. And they moved closer and closer to their goal. And, like, are you moving closer and closer to your goal? I am. And how does that feel? it's like a light at the end of the tunnel, right?

It's like, oh, I'm almost there. And then I can like feel the peace and enjoy it. But then part of me is like, what if I get there? And I'm so fucked up that I can't even find that happiness I'm looking for it. Yeah. And I think the scary thing, Kate, is I'm hearing that the closer you get to your goal, the worse that you feel. And the worse that you feel, the more you hold on to the fantasy. Because that'll make it okay.

And in my catch 22. Yep. And so I think, Kate, you got to start living for today. And if the light at the end, like, I have faith in you. I think that your passion and compassion and drive and dedication are not going to disappear if you take a week off. Like you're not going to magically transform into a fucking lazy asshole. You know, like if you take a. a week off. I want you to have faith in yourself that you'll get there one day and you're not

going to do it on your own and killing yourself in the process is certainly not going to happen. And as your empire has grown and you've gotten closer and closer to like success, you like fall more and more into the dark side, right? And then you like, you reach all of your ambitions and then you look back at your life and it's like empty and filled with like ruin. And that's not good. Yeah. And I know it's really, really scary, but I think you've got to start letting go. Like, I'm not saying don't try. But what I'm saying is like, don't attach yourself to that outcome. It's kind of like you're looking at the top of the mountain. And you're kind of saying, it's going to be amazing when I get to the top. It's going to be amazing when I get to the top.

Which you should really be focused on is like, how am I going to take the next step? You can't ever avoid taking the next step. And is that the right? step or the wrong step. And what I'm hearing right now is that like you've pulled a muscle and you're forcing yourself to continue to climb. And like that's not the way to get to the top of the mountain as someone who's tried to climb a mountain pulled a muscle and kept going. Crazy story. And maybe I'll share it one day. But does that make sense? Like I just don't like I think you've got to take care of yourself into here and now. And like don't. I mean, I know it sounds weird to say don't worry, but just

have faith in yourself that you'll get to where you want to go. Yeah, it makes sense. It's just like, I guess it's hard to let go of the grind because of the way that, if I was on YouTube, I feel like it'd be easier because you can schedule a bunch of videos

and then take a week off and it's fine. It's like you weren't, didn't even disappear. I think Twitch is unique in the fact that like when you're not live, people are constantly being distracted with other people who are alive. and it's like if you're gone for a week, that's how habits form and they just watch other people. And so it feels like you're losing everything that you've built.

And it's just difficult to like justify time off because it's how it is, especially with like the way the subsystem works. Like people are falling off every day. I feel like it would be a little easier, but Twitch would probably never fix this. If they had like a certain day, like the first of the month where subs were charged, then you can like schedule your time off. But that's just not how it is. So it's really hard to like justify that.

Yeah, so I don't know that you should take a week off, but what I'm thinking about is like it starts small, right? So you've built up this empire by feeding the beast one bite at a time and then two bites and then three bites and four bites. And I think your road to balance is the same way. So I think it's not so much about don't, because like you say that the pile of tasks you have to do is endless, right? There's always something else to do. So at the end of the day, you know, you have a hundred. tasks and you can do 40 of them on a given day. Like, what's the difference between 38 and 40? So what I would encourage you to do is set aside some amount of your day to take care of yourself every day. Don't think about it as doing less work because you actually may not even do less work. It's just carve out the time for like one hour a day to like do something for yourself. What do you think about that?

Yeah, but it's definitely more, I guess. some reasonable of an approach to me. But the heart of discipline and actually falling through with that. Yeah. Yeah. So discipline is like, I think discipline is not the right word. Discipline is not what you need. What you need is practice.

Right? So this is everyone's like, oh, I'm lazy. It's going to be hard. I guarantee you it's going to be hard. It's not, you're not, it's not discipline. Discipline is not actually the answer at all. You don't need to be disciplined. You're never going to be disciplined.

you're always going to be a creature that is like pulled by your impulses that's what people with ADD are and I think that's actually okay like ADD is a problem because you leave peanut butter jars open but it also allows you to thrive in a social media environment because you can manage eight social media accounts plus a Twitch stream yeah people without ADD can't do that shit like your mind is actually designed to thrive in this sort of environment and you need to to practice doing something else. And so I don't know if it's like horseback riding. Like, do you do scheduling or no?

Do you do schedules? No, not really. Or just like when I feel like I can't handle anymore, I'll just like do something and then, but then during it, it's like I'll feel great. And then afterwards it's like, oh no. Yeah, so much. It's like it clears my mind in the moment.

And then after you feel like the guilt. Yeah. So let's talk about that first. second. Okay. So just because you have, okay, this is going to sound like a stupid question. So sorry if it's confuses you because it's so stupid. But are thoughts facts? No. Okay. So like you're going to go horseback riding and then you're going to feel guilty, right? And then that guilt is going to generate thoughts. Does that make sense? Yeah. So you're going to say like, oh, I wasted so much time.

But those are just, they're just fucking thoughts. They're like patterns. They're like conditioning. It doesn't actually mean that's true. Like sure, you spent an hour horseback riding and you could have done some things during that hour. But even if you had done things during that hour,

you still would not ever be doing enough. Right. It's kind of like, let's say that I'm trying to empty the ocean with a teaspoon. And then I spend an hour of horseback riding instead of emptying the ocean. And then I come back and it's like, oh my God, I could have emptied 30 teaspoons out of the ocean. And it's like, yeah, that's technically true. But who the fuck actually cares?

It's not going to make a difference. That's true. And what I want you to do, so this is like very important for like people who are watching too, is that do something to take care of yourself. But don't do it to take care of yourself. Do it as an experiment? So go horseback riding today's Friday. Do you stream over the weekend? Yeah.

Can you go horseback riding over the weekend? Like I imagine it's safer in terms of COVID stuff, right? Because Texas is crazy right now. So your homework is to go horseback riding. And more importantly, you're going to go horseback riding. And then what you're going to do is pay attention, watch and see when the feelings of guilt arise. And like, just let them arise and they're going to have those thoughts. And like, you kind of like, you know, it's sort of like when you're trained.

training a dog, like the dog sometimes barks. And if you kind of like give into it, it's going to like agitate more. But if you kind of just behave with tranquility, then you kind of like, it'll calm down. And see what happens with how long the guilty thoughts last if you don't feed into them. You don't disagree with them. Kind of say, yeah, you're right. I could have, I could have done more, but I chose not to. I'm going to feel guilty.

So be it. What do you think about that? I think that it's it's probably likely I'll soon forget with my way of thinking of like if I don't focus on it I'll move on to something else in my mind. Okay. So this is also so good. I was getting the sense that something about that wasn't sitting well with you. And so then the question becomes so then like how but so what are you going to do about that Kate? Like this is just because you forget about things like you can't in my mind you have to figure out some way to and I can help you. but, you know, just because your mind is likely to forget doesn't mean that you can't, you can't give up practicing because you're likely to forget.

It's sort of like you have to do with this in spite of that. Does that make sense or am I losing you? Yeah. Yeah, it makes sense. So, I mean, that's also where I'd say like you're streaming right now, right? And how long are you streaming today? I don't really know. Typically, it goes until I'm like, okay, I have things to do.

And I don't have like a set schedule for my in time, typically just for my start times. Okay. Can you go tomorrow for smack riding? No, not tomorrow. Why not? Because I already had stuff planned for tomorrow's stream on, like, cooking and like a dog walk and stuff. I plan out my streams weekly. So that's why it's like also hard.

I have to like kind of like schedule, I guess, the time off. Hold on. Hold on. I'm confused. I thought you didn't do well with schedules. Not for my own time. My free time. Okay. So now we get to a really important point. This has to be part of your job. It's not free time. Yeah. You remember when I was telling you like when I go to a corporation, I'm like, yeah, you guys are going to have me teach meditation.

Can't be at 5 p.m. when everyone's ready to go home. It has to be during work hours. You need to reduce the amount that you work. not squeeze this in is extra Kate this must change this is part of your job because zombie Kate is not going to get as many subs as fun Kate

Living Kate Let's call her living Kate and zombie Kate Yeah Right So this has to be part of your job And where's the rebellion? Go ahead rebel I don't have any right now

Really? Really So when do you make your schedule for the week? Sunday night. Okay. So do you have, can you do it? Can you go horseback riding on Sunday?

No, I have a podcast. Okay. I have to schedule it for sometime next week. Okay. So schedule it as part of your day. And if you need to, to feed the social media beast, take a lot of selfies. How does that feel?

It's not so much like a selfie type thing. Okay. of just the stream aspect of it. Okay. Even better than no selfies. That sounds far healthier to me. But you got to schedule time for yourself, my dude. Like it's the only way this is going to work because you're just getting lost.

Kate is getting consumed by Amaran. Yeah. And you've got to like help her out. Like she needs your help. She's like, it's almost if you want to get super like Freudian and psychoanalysis. you were you were sacral you were leaving kate alone at home while amaranth goes to work for 16 18 20 hours a day and you're doing exactly to yourself what your parents did to you which is not abusive it's just you always come last because there are more important necessities yeah makes sense emotions

i don't know it's hard for me to like feel emotions lately like as far as like expressing them Like, I feel them, but I don't know how to describe them. Yeah. What do you feel? Don't worry about describe. Tell me what you physically feel. I feel like tension, I guess, still in my body. But I also don't sleep.

So I'm not, see, part of me is wondering, like, how much of it is because I don't physically take care of myself versus, like, the actual job itself. Both. It's not either or. There's your either or thinking again. Is it because I don't take care of my physical self or because of the job? both, right? And I can tell that you've got some emotion. I think maybe what I said was maybe a little bit more hurtful or gain traction than I intended.

No, I wasn't hurtful. That's just how my body copes with, I guess, physical stress too is like emotional crying and stuff. No, that doesn't make sense to me. So because what triggered your response is something that was emotional in origin. Your body copes so it's a cycle. Like I said something and then that triggered an emotional response. Does that make sense? Yeah, maybe just like part of it could be also like knowing it I have to change and also being like scared to actually do it.

Yep. That I can get behind. What are you scared of? I don't really know. I guess failing. Yeah. See, you're doing a good job. So now we know there's fear.

Right. That's what you're feeling. There's tension, but there's also fear. Yeah, I guess like there's so many like different aspects of like the way of physical and emotional and like ambition and stuff that it's just kind of like is very confusing to process. Yeah, I completely agree. So I think you have a lot of emotions that you've stuck in your basement or attic because we're in Texas and we don't have basements. Yeah. And I think the problem is like just like,

cleaning out your attic or garage, when you go in there and you've stuffed a lot of stuff in there, it can feel really, really overwhelming. And there's fear and there's ambition, there's hope, there's responsibility, there's duty. And it can feel... The coping mechanism is to just like suppress all of it and just keep like bearing yourself into work. Yep. Very insightful, right? And that's not going to work, huh?

I didn't mean to sound condescending, but sorry. No, it's fine. I say that to males that I look for too. I say dude and hun kind of interchangeably. I've got to be gender equal. Mm-hmm. So I will call women dudes and I will call men, hon. Yeah.

And therefore I offend everyone equally. Do you mind if I ask, how old are you? 26. Yeah. And are there people? that can like do you have support in your life i guess like my parents just are generally supportive you know know but like i guess i don't really talk to many people so it's like yeah and no like in theory supportive but like not like on a daily basis do you share your struggles with anyone not really

what does that feel like my dogs can't talk back so huh my dogs can't talk back so yeah um i don't know i You kind of tend not to think about it when you don't practice doing it, right? If you just suppress everything and just keep working and you don't have time to think about it, you don't realize how much it's like fucked up up there. Yeah. I want you to take a deep breath. That slow exhalation. It's hard for me to like physically breathe deeply, which I think contributes a lot to anxiety.

What makes it hard for you to physically breathe deeply? Like my nose doesn't inhale air very much. And when I do it through my mouth, it feels like I can't get it quite to my diaphragm. Like, it's very drying. Okay. Okay. So what I want you to do is slow down your exhalation. So really slow.

Slower. Okay. Slower. Tiny, tiny, tiny, tiny. Huh? It feels like I'm running out of air to exhale. It feels like you're running out of air to exhale or do you feel hungry for air at the end of your exhalation?

both. Like, I feel like it needs to be longer and then I need more immediately. So it sounds like taking deep breaths is actually somewhat uncomfortable for you. Yeah. Interesting. I think it's because, like, with my nose, it's like, it wasn't as bad when I was a kid. So my whole life, I've been used to nose breathing. I've never developed, like, the mouth breathing, except, like, I guess maybe when I'm asleep and don't realize it. But, like, as I get older, I feel like it's becoming more of an issue.

So it's, like, I'm having to shift it. and it's uncomfortable to because I've built it up the other way. Can you do me a favor? Can you pinch the tip of your nose like this and then breathe? It's like a little better. I've noticed that too when I like shift my nostrils a certain way. I can get more air through it. Just pinch and take a deep breath.

I just realize how ridiculous we look. I know. Can you notice a difference though? Yeah, it's a little easier. Okay. Interesting. Yeah. So, Kate, you know, I think of all of the conversations I've ever had on stream, this feels to me to be the most incomplete.

What do you think about that? What do you mean by incomplete? I feel like we have a lot more left to talk about. What do you think? Yeah, probably. I would say so. I guess because I'm a unique case, most people don't, like, do this type of, like, constantly for years. Yeah.

what comes up when you say that exhaustion a little bit and like sadness for myself you sound really tired to me i joke with chat i'm always tired they're like how do you keep having energy when aren't you tired by now i'm like no i'm always tired you know it's like the whole thing he's always mad what's it like to be tired all the time just overwhelming to my system like i don't even know why i'm crying it's not that i'm sad it's just like my system is physically overwhelmed. Yeah. I think you've gotten so good at suppressing that your body is like, hey, we have a bunch of emotions. And then your mind is like, uh-uh. And then your body's like, okay, we got to put them somewhere and they come out through your body. Yeah, probably.

I've been like this too since I was a kid. Like, you know, if my mom was like yelling at me to clean my room or something, like just any kind of confrontation. And it might be because my breathing problem just induces more anxiety. I'm not quite sure. Like, just like mundane parental conversations, I would just start crying. And it's not like a sad thing. She's not like insulting me. It's just like any type of like confrontation where I'm like having to do something I didn't like naturally want to do because I'm like a messy kid.

It's just like constant crying. Yeah. Kate, have you thought about working with a therapist or do you work with a therapist? No, I thought about it. I haven't done it yet. What's gotten? Oh. I can probably answer this, but what's kept you from here?

If I've been paying attention, I should know the answer already. Let's give you the benefit of asking you. What's gotten in the way? Just working so much, I guess, the time. Yeah. So I think you've got to really seriously consider it. And I think a couple hours throughout the week, like three or four hours throughout the week. I'd say ideally every day, you got to schedule as part of your job, something to take care of yourself.

Yeah. because you owe that to Kate. Yeah. It's really weird because I think people, whenever you cry, perceive like you're really sad. And I'm like, I'm not even sad. I'm just like physically overwhelmed, I feel. Like I'm not like emotional about a certain thing at the moment. You know, like all the things considered, I have a pretty like good outlook on life.

You know, I'm like, yeah, I'm really lucky to be here. I have all my stuff in order and stuff. I know I don't take care of myself, but I'm not like emotionally torn up about anything at the moment. It's just like my body expresses being overwhelmed with crying. Yep. So and it's my belief, Kate, that you do have part of that, that over physical feeling of overwhelmed is probably like emotion that as you kind of have hinted at is suppressed. Right?

Because when like how does it feel to be tired? You said tired and sad. There's some guilt. There's some fear. I imagine there's a lot of. A thing. It's more of like. I guess it's like a different type of sadness.

It's not like, you know, like, oh, no, everything is terrible. It's more of like, oh, it sucks that like I'm losing myself, kind of like sorrow for like my personality, I guess. Yeah, that is very sad, right? Just listen to the person. It's just like a sad thing. It's hard to put into words. Yeah, so it's almost as if you're like not connected to that person. It's almost like it almost sounds like dissociated.

to me. A little bit. You know, like, you're like, oh, it's like, it's sad that that's happening to Kate. Oh, well, back to editing YouTube videos. Exactly. Right. And that's, that's, that's, that's the crocks of what we're talking about today. It's like you've, you've lost touch with yourself. Mm-hmm. And I think part of what keeps you from re-engaging is because, like, if you re-engage,

you've mentioned fear. I think part of what you could be afraid of is like, the torrent of stuff that's going to come if you engage. If you reconnect with Kate, Amaranth is afraid of getting bowled over. Yeah. And if you fall apart is Amaranth, then everything you've worked for gets blown away.

And so why would you risk connecting with Kate? Yeah. I'm sorry I don't have more for you. Oh, no, it's fine. I don't have expectations. I just feel like it's good. I'm sure there's like a lot of people who make content and who like feel similarly. Like the grind is like taking away part of what made them them before the social media grind began.

And they just don't know how to talk about it or who to talk to or if they even can because they sound like ungrateful little bitches. Yep. I was going to, you know, I've been waiting for an opportunity to ask if you sound, if you feel that way. do you feel like an ungrateful little bitch i mean i don't i don't feel like i am i'm just afraid of like if you talk about this a lot are you perceived that way right it's like if you're like man it's so like it's so uh i guess exhausting to be able to do what you want for a living day in and day out with no one to tell you otherwise and get to make a lot of money doing that yeah must be must be really terrible you little bitch type of thing it's like how i enjoy people's the reaction

to it. Like, oh yeah, try shoveling shit in the street for 12 hours. See if you prefer that, you ungrateful bitch. This is how I feel like people would be... Yeah, the internet loves it when content creators don't get to be human.

Yeah. They hate treating you like humans. Go. Like, there's a lot of gatekeeping around suffering, too. You know, we say, like, oh, you're not allowed to suffer because you have it better than other people, which is just not true, unfortunately.

If only it were true. Any kind of apologies if this has been a little bit of meandering on my end, but like any kind of takeaways or anything that you felt was helpful from today's conversation? Just reconfirming that my feelings aren't ungrateful and crazy, and that it would be understandable to feel that way. Yeah, I think very much so. I think not only is that understandable, I think you deserve to feel that way, and I think you should feel that way, and I think it's okay to feel that way. Yeah, I don't think that anything that you do invalidates any of the things that you feel.

I don't think that your gratitude, your luck, your empire, or anything, like, takes away the right for you to feel the way that you do. And I do think you're going to need courage. And practice, not discipline. Don't need fucking discipline. Discipline isn't for people like us. You don't need it. I have not a good amount of that. Yep, right.

And I'm sure people watching would be very confused because what they see is someone who works like 16 to 18 hours a day. Right. 20 hours a day. They're like, oh, is this person not disciplined. It's not disciplined. I don't know how to take time off. It's not discipline.

It's like robot hyper-focused. Yep. And so some people, Robot hyperfocus on video games. You robot hyper focus on streaming and people are envious of people who happen to hyperfocus on things that lead to monetary success, which is fair. But at the end of the day, I feel like you're just as out of control as someone who's like addicted to video games and playing at home because you're not in control. You're consumed. You're on autopilot. So. Yeah. And you know, Kate, like I said,

I'm sorry that I feel like there's still a lot to cover in terms of like practically, I think I'm going to make a note based on our conversation today about like if you're completely stuck on autopilot and living a life, whether it be a grind or video games, like practically how do you get started? And the first thing, so I think I'm going to think about this and try to maybe make like a video or something. But the first thing that I would encourage you to do is to make set aside some time in your day, schedule time for yourself is part of your job.

Okay. You know, and, and like, even if it's like, and even like 30 minute meal time is like not a bad I think. We haven't talked at all about food, but I don't know if you eat and take care of yourself. I don't, I only eat on stream because I never, I moved into this house maybe like a year and a half ago, almost two years now maybe. And I never bought a table and chairs because I'm always working. So I eat at my desk.

When I'm working. Okay. Any questions for me? Um, not really. I guess if, uh, you want to have like another talk, since you feel it's incomplete, I'm always open. Yeah. What, how do you feel about that?

I think it would be good, be a fun, fun endeavor for me too. Like, I like talking about it, even if I cry through some of it, it's still like, enjoyable for me to discuss things like that. I find them insightful. Good for a lot of people who don't have that avenue to talk about it. So I think that that could be really useful, Kate. I think the, because what I felt from our conversation today is that there's a lot of like really practical stuff. There's sort of like some emotional stuff.

Like I would have loved to dig in and get to a particular emotion. But oddly enough, I don't think that like discovering a particular emotion is the most important thing for you. I think the most important thing for you is for you to like literally schedule time to take care of yourself throughout the day. Yeah. And like I know it sounds small, but like the cool thing is that you've built this monster and you can build a different one. The one where you take care of yourself. And I do think you can find balance. In your case, Kate, it's all about a lack of balance.

Yeah. And generally speaking, when people are unbalanced, I don't think they're as successful. Yeah. Do you want to learn how to meditate today? Sure. So I'm a little bit reluctant to teach you a breathing meditation. I mean, I can always try. Yeah, but that's okay. We don't have to teach you a breathing meditation.

So actually what I'm going to teach you is something also a little bit more practical. So I want you to sit up straight. So you said you have a lot of tension in your neck? Yeah. What I want you to do is tuck your chin towards your throat. Yeah, like that. So do you feel like you're kind of, the back of your head is kind of stiffening up? Does that make sense?

Yeah. Like tuck your chin towards like, you know, where your Adam's apple would be. And now I want you to hold that spot, hold that tightness, like in terms of, you know, you're not, you're kind of like, yeah, like looking down almost. And then I want you to turn your head to the side. This could be hard with headphones. but keep it tucked up and tell me what you feel. Not like an incredible amount of sordness just because I do exercises a lot for this. I just,

I still like feel it when I'm like, we're supposed to be like in a resting position. I like feel my body being held tense, but it's not actually sore. Yeah, I understand. So, so, and then come back to the middle. Okay, so,

and then go to the other side. So keep your chin tucked and then turn. And then you should feel something along like either here or on the, the back side. Do you feel that? Yeah, probably the back side. And then come back to the middle, and then this way, and then back to the middle, then go ahead and close your eyes. Okay. And now we're going to go to the other side and just focus on that sensation.

Of the tightness. Yep. And then back to the middle, and then over to your left. And notice that as you tuck your chin in a little bit more, you know, you know, you know, you may feel an increased sense of tightness. Mm-hmm. So keep that chin nice and tucked. And now back to the middle. And then over to the other side.

Now, as we're doing this, your mind may start to wander, especially as we go through subsequent rounds. So just notice those thoughts. Now back to the middle. And let yourself flew back in. So now just go ahead and relax for a second. your chin relax, eyes closed, and now feel your body. I still feel the tension a little bit on like the back on both sides.

Okay, so just go ahead and let your shoulders hang down. Like imagine like your arms are actually sleeves on a piece of clothing hanging on a hanger. So don't hold them up, just let them hang. Good. Now what I want you to do is take a deep breath in and push out. your diaphragm and then out, good. You can use nose or mouth, whichever you prefer. Deep breath in and out. And again, now I want you to sit with the person that you are. Try to figure out who is this. Who are you right now? Is this Kate? Is this Amaran?

Is this the future starter of your animal rescue sanctuary? Is this a girl for? from Texas. Just be with whoever you are. Let your palms be face up. Feel the warmth in your hands. Try to stay nice and straight with your spine, but let the rest of you relax. Now we're going to take a deep breath in and we're going to raise our shoulders during the breath. Spike up your shoulders and then as you exhale, let them come down. A second time, deep breath in. and then out and relax and then third time and out

now in the space afterward go ahead and notice what thoughts may come and I'll try to trigger some think about all the work that you could be doing all the things that you could and invite those thoughts to come invite the beast of duty

responsibility of being trapped of having a mission trying to make the world a better place. All of those big thoughts with a capital B and a capital T. All of those things that are more important than Kate. All of those things can be there, but they just exist in your head. That you are actually more than those thoughts.

Whatever your goals are, whatever your aspirations are, whatever you strive to be, that all of those are just located in a tiny, tiny part of you, that there's so much more to you than those things. And now we'll do the last phase of our exercise today. And that's going to be what I want you to do is open your eyes for a second and look at me. So keep your arms by your sides, let them hang down.

And then as we breathe in, what we're going to do is actually I'm going to put my arm up and then touch them up top like a namaste and then as you exhale let them come out good and then again breathe in and then out now close your eyes we're going to do three more and try to match the arms with your inhalation so as they come up as you fill up air your fingers should touch and as you exhale as your breath finishes your hands are by your sides Two more. Deep breath in, and then out, and then last one.

And now we'll sit in silence for a few minutes, about 60 seconds. When you're ready, go ahead and open your eyes. Yeah? The world is a different place. So, Kate, one last thing that I'll leave you with. Reality isn't what you think it is. All that shit is just thoughts. I don't know if that makes sense to you,

but like this is really what you are. And I think you should work hard every day. But nothing, I mean, this goal that you have is the light at the end of the tunnel, and it's not worth sacrificing today for it. Because the scary thing is sometimes the light at the end of the tunnel is actually another train. Yeah. What was that practice like for you? It was less tense.

Yeah, good. It was a little more like relieving of the tension. Good. What was your mind doing? Not really anything. Great. That's the point. That's why we meditate.

To give yourself a break from your mind. Because your mind does a lot to you. It does a lot for you. So take a break from it from time to time. Yeah. For me, even though I have ADD, since I have breathing problems, If I have to concentrate on breathing, that's the only thing I can do. Because it's so difficult to actually breathe.

So it kind of counteract issue. Sounds uncomfortable to have breathing problems. Yeah. Yeah. Cool. Well, any last questions for me before we wrap up for the day? No, I think that's pretty good here. Do you mind if we follow up with you about whether you went horseback riding next week?

Sure. Would that keep you more accountable? Probably. Should we do it or should we ask your viewers to do it? Maybe both. Okay. Yeah, good. They can include it.

Yeah, because I schedule weekly. So a lot of what you stream is for them, right? And so let them help you out too. Yeah. And maybe your viewers can do something for themselves during the same hour that, you know, stalkers and stuff aside, I don't know how much information you can freely give out. But if you're planning on doing something to take care of yourself,

I think it'd be really awesome if your community could do the same thing. And then you guys could like meet and kind of check in with each other about doing it. Yeah, that'd be nice. Cool. Thank you very much for coming on. And I hope we were able to help in some small way. Yeah, definitely. It's good to know that I'm not crazy yet, just close,

but not there yet. We're good. No, I think you're the very opposite of crazy. I think you're a normal, wonderful person who has had life, social media, and streaming get to them because that's what it does. And I think

underneath, I hope you'll be able to find some kind of balance between Kate and Amaranth instead of leaving her at home. Yep. You've got to work on it. It has to be something that I do proactively, because it's not going to happen if I just keep being like, oh, at some point, sure. Damn straight.

Wise words. Kate, wise words. It's something that I think everyone can take home. Taking care of yourself is not something that happens on autopilot. It's something that you do. Mm-hmm. So good luck with that. Thank you.

Really appreciate it. Take care. You too.