HealthyGamerGG - Jaake (HG Community)

Episode Date: February 9, 2020

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What sucks about it? When I need him, he's not here. How does that feel? That's the crux of it probably. That's probably what it sucks the most. All right. So Jake, help me understand what we're talking about today and how it can be helpful. Yeah.

I guess I'd say my relationship with my dad isn't the greatest. It's definitely not toxic in any way. I don't think. It's not abusive in any way, but we just seem really disconnected now. days. I don't, I hardly ever talk to him. We don't share a lot of interests in common. Okay. The conversations I do have with him are like, hey, can you go do this for me real quick? And I'll be like, yeah, it's fine. That's basically, yeah. It sounds like you guys have kind of drifted apart. Yeah. It definitely started back when, well, it got worse, I'd say,

when my mom passed away in September of 2018. Okay. And the way I, yeah, the way I described it to my dad or like how I felt about it was, I felt like my mom was like the kind of like the glue that held me, my brother, and my dad together. And it was, we were trying to like figure out how to make that work without her. And I just, I'm not really sure at all. Okay.

After, yeah. So, first of all, What do I, how would you like to be addressed? Jake is fine. Jake, okay. Because there's like two A's in there. So I wasn't. Yeah, the two A's was a typo and I just left it.

Brilliant, man. I know. Okay, so it sounds like you've, you've drifted apart from your dad and that you're unhappy with that? Yeah. I just feel really disconnected from him. And I, from like, maybe when I was, like, when I was, like, when I was, kid when I was in high school and stuff when I was around him more and my mom was involved and we did

like stuff as a family but I haven't I haven't done anything with specifically with my dad in years okay um and it sounds like I think you it sounds like you've made a very important observation which is that your mom was kind of crucial to like keeping you guys together yeah I think so you have a brother too yeah yeah his name's Joe okay um so Joe I'm turning Jake down Yeah Hey I just saw the messages He's loud

Can you keep talking Jake Uh One two Testing one two Is that better Am I still loud Moses Hey Hey man

I just saw the mod messages Okay Are we good So Oh it's training yeah I think we're good Okay How's your Indian

Okay Let's try now Hello Hello Testing one two Okay call on cell phone, talk these too much. Okay.

Is that better? Jake, can you say something? Something, something. One, two. Can you hear me? Okay. All right. Are we still good?

Okay, we're good. Thank you guys very much. I've told my... I don't know if you guys have seen this thing. This is a boomer device. It's called a phone. It's kind of like a... It's sort of like a DM, but like voice only.

So it's a little bit different. I'm not very familiar, but I think I've heard about it. Yeah, it's kind of like a Twitter DM, but it's like, it's like voice. And you have to like, you have to, it's like a voice call. So it's a weird, it's a weird device. So sometimes I ask my mods to use it because that's how they communicate with boomers like me. And yeah, it's like, it's like a mobile discord, basically. That's exactly what it is.

It's like, it's a specific device that's like a mobile discord. Okay, but, so you were saying you have a brother? Yeah. Older, younger? Younger, he's 16, I'm 21. Okay. What's his relationship like with your dad? Probably the same, I would say, from what I notice anyways.

I presume he lives with your dad? Yeah. Do you live with your dad? Yep. Okay. So you guys all live in the same house? Mm-hmm. So what's it like at home?

Um Joe and I do our own thing He'll be downstairs watching basketball or on his phone or whatever And I'm usually in my room Playing a game or on the Discord nowadays And when you say your brother and you do your own thing Do you guys do things together or it's like You guys are basically roommates instead of family

Basically roommates instead of family Okay And were you guys roommates instead of family when your mom was around? No, I think my mom pushed for us to do a lot of things together. We took trips and we had like a movie night and everything. Okay. I feel like we did it.

Yeah. Sorry, go ahead. No, I feel like we just did a lot more together when she was around. So you use the word pushed. So there's a difference between her pushing for y'all to do things together. and y'all just doing more stuff when she was around. True. Right?

What's the difference there? I think she would come up with things for us to do, and we'd do it. So what's the, so was that an organic process, a natural process, or was she pushing? I think it was more organic. Okay. So it's not like she had to like wrangle you guys to do it. Yeah, no, I don't know. No, I don't think that happened in any capacity.

Because what I'm kind of implying is that it's possible that, you know, the dynamic, one is sort of an active process and one is a passive process. Like when she was around, we just used to do more stuff together. And the other is that, you know, she may have been someone who, like, recognized that you guys, that an active influence needed to be there for y'all to, like, all interact in a family manner. and if she was able to see that family dynamic and fulfill that role within the family, which is usually how things work. So we have different roles that we kind of play within the family. Like there's usually a patriarch or a matriarch within, like, a family group.

So it may be like a grandfather or like your uncle is sort of like the de facto head of the family, where if someone has a problem, like they turn to that person. Sometimes, you know, does that make sense to you? Yeah. So your mom, it sounds like, filled the role of not only, so the question is, was she just glue or was she also like actively recognizing that you guys are kind of individual people and that y'all need like effort to be pulled together? What do you think? I think it's, I think maybe it was active to her. I think she, she saw like these guys won't do anything together unless someone bring something up.

or like yeah i i i think she probably realized that yeah okay is that something that you had like thought about before this conversation um no not specifically and it wasn't it was definitely not something i thought about until she was gone yeah so i think so let me ask you jake so let's say i have a family situation where you have three people who are essentially like somewhat independent or or loners or call it whatever you want to no judgment and there's one person who kind of ties people together so like not even a family situation but i've been in friend circles where there's like one person who's kind of the organizer right and so like they're the person who's like okay what are we doing this weekend okay we're going to plan a trip here and what happens

in that social dynamic you're smiling i just thought that's me and my friend group okay so Okay. Yeah. Right. So there's the light bulb. Good job. So tell me, what are you thinking? I'm thinking like, I'm always the one that hits up the group chat and is like, hey, let's go hang out at whoever's house. Let's go to get a bite to eat or whatever. That's usually me. So when you are not around, what happens to your friends? What happens to your group? They don't hang out, I guess. Nobody. Okay. Yeah. And so. they hang out with other friends like not in our group yeah but your group your nuclear it's not that they all become antisocial yeah and it doesn't sound like you your brother and your dad become antisocial

it's just y'all's group is not going to coalesce right that's what i'm hearing from you yeah and so what do you think about that like what does that mean for your family well I'm thinking like I've tried to get us all to do stuff I thought hey it'd be fun if we like went and saw a movie every now and again like every month or something and that's one idea that sticks out to me and it's it's frustrating because like dad isn't here most of the time he's just not in the house he's out with his friends he's out or he's working and getting a hold of him is something. sometimes difficult. How does that make you feel? Kind of sucks. Well, there's like two sides of that coin

because I like being independent and I like being able to do my own thing without having my dad butt in or whatever, but I also like having him around so I can talk to him and try to plan something to do. Yeah.

What sucks about it? When I need him, he's not here. How does that feel? That's the, It's corrective it probably. That's probably why it sucks the most. Yeah. Yeah.

Just when I need him, he's usually not around or he's about to be busy. Do you feel guilty for needing him? Sometimes. I feel like a bother. Sometimes. Yeah. And then if you feel like you're bothering him, what do you do? And how does that, how do, what feelings does that create for you?

What feelings does it create? What does it feel like to be a bother? someone. It's just not good. Yeah. Okay. So now we're coming upon something really important, okay? So a lot of times we have difficulty understanding ourselves and we have difficulty understanding how to act. And I get the sense, Jake, that what I sense within you more than anything else is blindness. And I don't know if it's just because it's dark where you are. But like this, the way that you are framing your problem is like, like you're blind. Like you can

feel something is there. You can feel that there's a problem. This is how I feel about a lot of problems in my life. But you just can't see them. Like, I just, that's not right, but I don't know in what way it's right. Like, I know it's not right. But I just can't see it.

And you say you feel that way about a lot of things in your life? Yeah. Yeah, I think so. It's not until it comes to like a head or I've come past the problem that I realize, like, oh, that's what the issue was. Great, right? So now, earlier, I don't know if you caught the questions that I answered at the beginning of

stream. Did you catch those? Some of them, yeah. I didn't catch the last one. Okay, so I was establishing a theme, or at least I thought I was. Let's see if you or Twitch chat can remember what that theme was. Like, what's the theme? Turn on your monitor, Jake. Not flow state, not intuition. Incorrect. Incorrect. Incorrect. Nope. Okay. So, I guess I was nothing. You go big dicks responsibility, toilet awareness. I love Twitch ads so much. No, no, no.

Boredom. Okay, what did I say about boredom? One person got it. What was I saying about boredom? Did you catch that one? Yeah, the reason, well, I think specifically it was that the reason you play games is because you're just bored. And yeah, so here's the thing, right? So like, remember I was, so I'll just lay it out.

Too far of a connection. Not Twitch's fault because I know you guys understand that you guys understand a lot. So it's my fault for not asking, not laying enough of a foundation. So like, what do we see when we went when I talk to you, Jake, you said like, I just saw another light bulb and you're like, oh, like blindness is actually I would feel about a lot of things in my life. Right. So what this tells me is that much like, like, like it's not that books are boring or. you know, school is boring or things like that. It's that you yourself are boring. No, your dopamine, your dopamine circuits are exhausted, so you're just not going to enjoy things, right? There's like a

personal component to the way that you interact with the world. And what I'm hearing from you is that there's a personal component, like the reason, like you have a blindness debuff. And so there are a lot of things in your life which you can sense that something is wrong, but like it's you who is unable to see. That's not situation specific. Does that make sense? Mm-hmm. And so, and I think part of that blindness is that you have very, and it's not your fault, this is completely normal. You seem to be a little bit elixothymic. And what I'm, what alexothymia is is inability to determine what your internal emotional state is.

So when I ask you, what is it like? You say, you use words like, it sucks. That's bad. Right. There's no, there's no color. It's like you know the direction of the feeling is generally negative. You don't know if it's shame. You don't know if it's anger.

You don't know if it's fear. Those are wildly different emotions. And it's really hard. Like if I were to tell you, Jake, I'm going to ask you to do something. I'm going to ask you to go on stream and talk about your feelings and your relationships. And I think that's going to be scary for some people. If I tell you that fear is the emotion that you're dealing with, what do you think that does with your ability to deal with that emotion? To deal with that emotion?

Yeah. If I tell you, you're going to do something and I think it's going to be scary. for you. What do you think your chances of success are? Lower, probably. Why? Because I'm, oh, I'm supposed to be scared and I'll be scared, right? Okay. So that's a good point, right? So it could engender, it could engender like some amount of like a self-fulfilling prophecy is kind of what you're saying, that if you expect to be scared, you're going to be scared. Now, if I say, Jake, I'm going to have you do this experience

and it's going to be bad and it's going to suck. Like your capacity to deal with that How does that relate to if I say it's going to be scary? I'm not sure. I guess I'll just be waiting and expecting it to be bad. Just waiting for it to get bad. Okay. So I think that that's a completely fair and reasonable answer. My hope is that if you know what you're dealing with, your capacity to deal with it will

potentially increase. That's my hope. So you have a good point in terms of this. There could be a self-fulfilling prophecy that if you expect fear, you're going to have fear. at the same time, I think your problem, and I have faith in gamers, that generally speaking, your problem is like a lack of diagnosis. It's not a lack of solutions. Like, I think you're a smart enough guy to be able to figure out what to do if you know what the problem is. The problem is that you don't know what the problem is. The problem is you're kind of saying like, okay, there's this symptom which is like my dad and I are not connecting and our house seems separate. And I ask you, how does that feel you say it sucks, right? So there's like all kinds of, emotions there. So like, you know, there's a lot about losing your mom, I'm sure, and that you felt connected to her. And she probably was like available to you in a way. Let me know if I'm on the

right track or off the right track. But we're just going to fast forward a little bit because I think I've got a sense of something. She made you feel like when you needed something, you weren't a burden. Yeah. Right? And so like you could feel, you didn't feel alone because you felt this connection with her and you know you're 21 you know you're not fully grown and all that kind of stuff and like she had an open door for you she never made you feel like a bother when you needed something from her that's and you yeah and now that's missing from your life and then you go to your dad and then he makes you feel like a burden right like he makes you feel like you're like bothering him and he's got like better stuff to do and then like if if a kid feels like they're a bird

burden, what are they going to do? Stop, stop bothering somebody. Exactly. Which is what I do. Yeah, I just come to my room and I hang out. Absolutely, right? Mm-hmm. And so are you, how do we understand that?

Is that like, like what's motivating you to go to your room? It's important. I mean. Instead of talking to your dad. Oh, I don't want to bother. Like, I just don't want to bother. You don't want to bother him. So is that like fear or shame that's keeping you in your room?

Shame, probably. Okay. Now here's the other thing. Is there compassion or love driving you to your room? Like, I love him so I don't want to bother him. Absolutely. What do you think? Is there a consideration?

Yeah, there absolutely is. Weird, huh? Yeah. Really weird. We don't think of love is an emotion that keeps us away from other people. especially our family members. But it's absolutely there. And that's why you can't,

it's such a bizarre concept. You care about your dad. You don't want to inconvenience him. You don't want to be a burden for him. And it's because if I don't care about someone, who the fuck cares if I burden them? True. Yeah.

Right? Yeah. It's like, if I go to Mickey D's and I get like some chicken nuggets, like I don't care that y'all are busy. I want my chicken nuggets. I don't care how busy you are. I'm here for my chicken nuggets. True, yeah.

But when you need something from your dad, when you're hungry for something, you go to him and you actually like care about him. And the bizarre thing is that your love for him actually like drives you away. Yeah. Because you put him. Yeah. Go ahead.

Well, like things I've told to other people are like, he's an adult or whatever. He can do whatever he wants. I'm not getting into getting it in his way. like, especially when he's like back dating and stuff, people ask me how I feel about it. And it's like, he can do whatever he wants. He's grown up. There's, oh, whoa, whoa, okay, a lot of here, a lot here.

Okay, so the first thing is, how does it make you feel that he's dating other people? He can do, he can do that. I don't have any. So let's define things. He can do what he wants to, Jake. And I don't mean to sound condescending. I just think this is, I just can't. can't help myself. And you seem to be okay with this. So if I, you can tell me to go, I think this is

cool. Yeah. F off at any point, okay? If I ask you, if I ask, like, if I take a 10 year old kid and I ask them, what are the different feelings a human can feel? I don't think one of the answers I'm going to get is he can do whatever he wants. That is not a feeling. Yeah. Yeah. So when I ask you a question, how does it make you feel and your response is he can do whatever? That's not a feeling. That's your blindness. That's the blindness debuff. What is the feeling? respect? No. Oh.

So that's, so, okay, that's a beautiful answer. So let's understand what Jake did. Jake did something very, very special there. He reverse engineered the feeling based on his words. He said someone who says, you can do whatever you want to, is someone who feels respect for another person. That's how you got to that feeling.

It's not actually what you feel. Does that make sense? Yeah. I'm pretty sure. because you were like, that's me respecting my dad. Right? When you say that, that's you respecting your dad. Yeah, I think so.

Okay. So, respect and encouraging the independence of another human being are those positive feelings or negative feelings? Positive? Absolutely. So I'm going to ask you a question, and I want you to just give me a direction. When I ask you, Jake has to... How do you feel about your dad dating other people? Is the emotion that you feel in here positive or negative?

It's negative. That's not fucking respect. No. Right? Mm-hmm. So very good. Good job. It starts with directions.

Is it good or is it bad? It's a bad feeling. Because that's a defensive statement. I think this you're going to be able to understand it because you're very good analytically. He can do whatever he wants to is a defensive statement from you. It's something that you're saying. saying to protect. Yeah.

Tell us. Yes. It absolutely is. Explain it. Tell us. What did you just figure out? So I don't have to reveal how I actually feel about it. I say that so people stop asking me about how I feel about it.

Very good. Yeah. So how do you feel about it? Not good. It scares me, I think. Good. See, that's an emotion. It scares his emotion.

What scares you? about it. One of, I feel like, well, okay, I have to describe a scenario. Like, he was dating a girl a while back, and she was around the house a lot more than his current girlfriend. And every time I saw her in the house, I just got really angry. Like, it would make me angry that she was here very long. And like, one night I couldn't find my keys and she was in my room helping me. And I just couldn't take it. Like, I wanted her out of my house. of the house. I kind of freaked out.

Yeah, man. It really made me angry. Yeah. Yeah, bitch. Fuck that bitch for trying to help you find your keys. For real. Oh, my God. The gall of her trying to help you with a task.

How dare she? Out of here, bitch. We don't need. That's how you felt, right? That's what I said too, yeah. Oh, wow. Yeah. Yeah, he was real mad.

So Jake, help me out, buddy. What the, is that? What's going on there, man? I think it might come from a place like she's replacing my mom. Sure. Because especially when she would, she cooked us like dinner one time. And for some reason, I just wasn't, I was mad. I was just like, don't, I don't want you to cook me dinner.

I can cook for myself, blah, blah, blah. Like you cooking me dinner. Yeah. How dare you? How dare you do these nice things? How dare you show me kindness. Mm-hmm. Uh-oh.

Uh-oh. Oh, there we are. All right. Sometimes, I swear to God, Discord cannot handle what's going on in the interview. Yeah, I totally agree. It's like the servers are like, this is too much. This is way too much. Too much.

Okay. So first of all, Jake, I remember. I just want to say fantastic job, dude. You're doing a fantastic job. I've seen more light bulbs go off in your, on your face in the last 30 minutes than it's a good job. So I think that the reason that that's actually really important is because it's hard to sometimes face the things that parts of your mind are actually shutting down. Like there are parts of your mind that are actually trying to like keep these things hidden

from you and protect you from them. And the weird thing is like there's some weird like flipping going on with like positivity and negativity. We're like she's trying to do this nice stuff for me and you feel like anger and rage. And then you know, you say these respectful nice things about your dad because you love him and you care about him. But you feel on the inside is like negative. So like what's going on there? Okay. Do you have thoughts or questions at this point?

Yeah, but can we like come back around? Like continue the conversation and come back around. Okay. I just got to think about that. this. Totally relevant currently. I'm trying to figure out how to tie this stuff together for you in a way that. So I feel like we're halfway there, right? Okay. Yeah. Does that make sense? Yeah. You don't quite know, like, we're not clearly not done yet. And you understand something, but like you're still confused. So I'd like to just figure out how to not have you feel confused.

But I don't know how to do that. So I just. need a second, okay? Well, maybe, maybe I can ask my question. Yeah, go for it. Um, so last year, I was, I went, early in the year, I went to, like, therapy and stuff, and I talked about this sort of a therapist, and he had said that it's possible my dad's just incapable of an emotional connection. And I don't, I don't even know what that means to start. Like, of course he is, like, but I just don't know how to wrap my mind around that I guess

yeah so let's not try to wrap our mind about it around it yeah so Jake how did it how did it make you feel to hear the therapist say that your dad was incapable of emotional connection

um I felt defensive I was like what do you mean like I actively argued with him about it I think I was like what do you you mean like he loves my mom obviously they had a really good relationship he's done a lot of

things for us blah blah like yeah so i think that was an appropriate thing because that sounds so i wasn't there that therapist knows way more about your situation it's a big caveats but i think that's stupid and it probably it could have been yeah and i think the reason you rebelled against it is because so here's what i found in therapy when i say something to someone this isn't therapy by the way but just general principle. Because case and point, I'm saying things to you that actually makes sense. And therapists apparently do the opposite.

Okay. So this is what I found. When you say something to someone, like you're the expert, right? Like, I'm actually not the expert. Like, this has to be very clearly understood. It's my job to say things to you and for you to tell me, yes, you're right or no, you're wrong.

And like, what do, like, I can, come up with some complicated like formulation and that's what therapy is about is like coming up with these like really complicated individualized formulations this is not that this is just talking about a snapshot of who you are what you experience in 30 minutes what can we understand about you it's not about fixing anything it's just about what can we see within you and i think the reason you rebelled against it is first of all so there are two reasons you could rebel one is because you can't live up to the you can't accept the consequence of what

that means for you, which is that you lost one parent and you're going to lose another one, basically, emotionally. So it's possible that that's going on. But my sense is that you probably recognize that he's capable of emotion and that it's just

wrong. And like the thing that infuriates me the most is like when you respond in a negative fashion towards that statement, the therapist is probably, thinking that's a defense mechanism on your part and that they're going to be more convinced that they're right. Like it infuriates me. Like one of the things that I dislike the most about therapy, and sorry, I'm going to get off on my soapbox for a second, is that there's no such thing as a

falsifiable hypothesis. A therapist can never be wrong. If you disagree with them, that's just denial and they're right. And if you agree with them, well, they're right. And then they can always dig for what's underneath, what's underneath, what's underneath, what's underneath. Like, there's no bottom of the pit. It's just an endless pit of hypotheses until they find something that's right. Or you leave because they're not helping you. And then they're like, yeah, he just couldn't handle it. We went too deep. And- Just couldn't handle it. There's just no, like it. So that bothers me personally about therapy. Like, that's why part of the reason I don't like doing it, because there's no way to know when you're wrong. Like, you can't prove a therapist wrong. Anyway, so rant is over.

So let's kind of come back to you. Okay, I'm going to have to think for a second again, okay? Okay, so we can go in one of two directions. We've got about half an hour left. Okay. Maybe a little less. So one is I can try to tell you how to face your actual situation in the house and actually make a change in the way that you interact with your dad and your brother.

or we can talk about what's going on inside you. I don't think it's going to be easy to do both. Both of them involves both of it. But like, what do you want at the end of the next 30 minutes? Do you want to understand yourself better? Or do you want something of a game plan to like go into your family situation? I want to understand myself better. Okay.

Okay. What pisses? Okay, so let's talk about why you get pissed off when people that your dad date try to. Okay. So then this is our goal. I'm going to try to map as many emotions as we can in 25 minutes that are going on inside you. And the goal here is once you see the emotions, you don't want them to hold power over you the way that they do. And by power over you, this is what happens.

She comes into your room and starts to help you look for things. And then something weird happens inside you. Some like coiled serpent rises and takes control of your mind. And then you tell her to get the hell out of your room. And you as a human being don't want to do that, right? Can we, like, do you want to do that? No, no. Yeah.

I think I apologized to her later on it. It was like, it wasn't personal against you. Yeah. Yeah. So like, like, you don't want that thing to control your life. We're not saying it's bad. We're not saying it's evil. We want you to be in the driver's seat.

You're piloting a meck and you have a keyboard and a mouse and like you control the character. It doesn't control itself, right? That's what we want. so and then you came up with this beautiful once again canned answer of oh i didn't want her to replace my mom i don't think that's what it was does it feel like you were afraid of her replacing your mom no okay good so we let's start there right that's fucking bullshit answer and it's the kind of thing that oh my god therapist love that oh she's afraid of him replacing his mother it's a deep psychological conflict they just eat that they take a big ass spoon and they stick it in that bowl of

oatmeal and cereal or whatever pudding, and they just like scooping up. It's bullshit. Yeah. Okay. You want me to just lay it on you or you want me to walk you to it? Lay it on me. Jealousy. Jealousy.

I think you're jealous. Because they get to spend time with my dad and I don't. There you go. How does that feel? It feels correct. Right? Because you're a what when it comes to your dad? What are you when it comes to your dad?

His son? Yeah, and How does he make you feel when you want his time? Oh, Alberta. Yeah. And what is she? Not apparently. Absolutely.

How do you feel? How does that sit? It's frustrating, I think. Yeah. It's hard, right? Mm-hmm. And, like, you know what makes it like, so this is the other thing,

is jealousy is at the root, but then like, you know what really pisses you off? Is that you're jealous of someone who's actually a nice person. That you have negative feelings towards someone who actually doesn't deserve it. Yeah. I think that's wrapped up in there. What do you think? Yeah, I agree.

Like, when she was in my room looking through my stuff, it was just very uncomfortable. I didn't want her there. I was really angry. and it was like can you repeat what you just said I had it tied in my head but I can't so there's the jealousy right because she your dad makes time

for her yeah she was being a nice person and I was over here being angry at her for no reason in my head it felt like no reason I guess yeah yeah exactly right because it's not fair to her And you're a decent guy. Yeah.

That's the root of your problems. This isn't a story of shame and fear. This is a story of caring about your dad, not wanting to burden him, trying to make his life easier, and blaming yourself for feeling jealous of someone who was nice. And you knew that that wasn't right. You beat yourself up for it. And that's what caused you to blow through the roof. It's because you knew that what you felt wasn't right. and that what you were doing wasn't right.

And your incapability to control yourself is what really, like, sends things over the top. Yeah. How are we doing? Good. It's like, it's like the, I see the blindness thing here, especially. What do you mean by that? Like, I was just, I felt that those emotions were not fair to her.

Absolutely. But I couldn't understand why I was. Feeling that way. Yeah. I couldn't see it. And so here's the thing. So now we're going to tie things back, okay? So there's the interaction with her, but the interaction with her is tied to the relationship with your dad.

Those are, if the relationship with your dad was different, this interaction with her would never happen. Does that make sense? Yeah. So let's just like, let's try to tie things back very cleanly, okay? So she's helping you out. She's a decent person. and at the beginning of this you feel actually we're going to start at the end

so you feel frustrated with yourself for being angry at someone who is clearly nice and the reason that you're so there's frustration with yourself or anger towards yourself that's one emotion another emotion is anger with her now why are you angry with her we've already talked about it I'm just right because she gets to spend time with my dad and I don't

there you go see beautifully said right it's not even just it's she gets to spend time with my dad and I do not. Do you guys see the simplicity and truth of that statement? That's the core of it. Jealousy, even that is like too much of a psychologically BS term. She gets to spend time with my dad. My dad wants to spend time with her. He carves out time in his day to spend time with her and he does not do that for me. It doesn't seem like he wants to spend time with me. That's the next thing, right? It doesn't seem like he wants to spend time with you. with me. Beautifully said. Simple, clear. And that makes you feel like what? Angry again. I don't know.

Angry? Yeah. Angry at who? My dad's girlfriend. And, well, I guess kind of my dad. There we go. Right. So we got to go deeper, buddy. Mm-hmm. So now we're going back. So you feel angry with your dad. Yeah. I feel like, I definitely feel like I've made attempts to spend time with him and connect and he just doesn't like see that I'm doing that or he ignores it I don't know what he's doing and how does that make you feel worse even more angry yeah yeah right so it's tough so your problem is not one of isolation or disconnection your problem is one of anger mm-hmm among guys you imagine well we did like like some personality test.

I got a 17 in anger. I was the highest of all the mods and stuff. Okay. Yeah. So you're upset with your dad, right? Yeah. And now here's the really, really crazy and devastating thing. For you to feel a different way,

how does that, how do we bring you to peace? What has to happen for you to be at peace, Jake? I just stopped being angry at my den. I have to, I guess, understand why he's not spending time with me. incorrect. That is the sort of right answer, but this is, I'm going to just say this very bluntly, you have to understand that this is not all on you. Any answer to that question that begins with the word I is incomplete. This must be clearly understood. Do you get that? Yeah. You're nodding. What do I mean? Because I feel like I'm being big. We have to understand why. Yes. He must take

responsibility for your feelings. He must take responsibility for his role in your relationship. And the sad thing, the sad bitter truth that I have to tell you, Jake, is that personal growth is a shitty secondhand answer to your situation. And I know that I advocate for personal growth and you're doing a wonderful job because you're a member of our community and you've clearly paid attention and you're growing and you're learning. But the first thing that you have to understand is that there is a share of this that falls to him. And I would be as far as to say, so this is also something that therapists don't do. They don't assign blame. I think he's doing a bad job. Now, is it excusable?

Possibly. Is he grieving? Absolutely. Should we be compassionate? Absolutely. So you've heard we talk about Dharma? Yeah, yeah, yeah. So I don't think he's doing his Dharma.

And this is where, like, you have trouble blaming him and holding him accountable because you love. him because you understand grief and because you care about it. You're doing a couple of very devastating and subtle things. The first is giving people an excuse for not treating you the right way. And we do those to people that we love. There's a big difference between saying, you shouldn't have treated me this way and I forgive you for it. And it's okay to treat me this way because you are grieving to. Do you understand the difference between those two statements?

Yeah, yeah. I think so, yeah. Help me understand what the difference is. Because in one scenario, he'll keep continuing to treat me this way. Yeah, so there's a difference.

I'll say them again. I'll just be okay with it, I guess. No, you won't be okay with it. Right? No, I won't be okay with it, but I'll let it happen. So one of them is there's a difference between admitting that someone

treated you wrong and forgiving them for it, right, for you to say to your dad, I lost my parent, and in that moment in 2018, I felt like I lost both of you. And because that's how you feel. Like, you lost. Yeah. That hurt a lot when you heard that.

A little bit, yeah, yeah. Body blow. I'm okay. Yeah. It's okay. Just take a minute. No, I'm good. I can.

Don't move away from the feelings. Don't gloss over. We're not going to keep going. Just close your eyes. I might have already done it. Yeah, you did it. so fast. So try to go back there. There's a moment where you moved your hand in front of your face. That was the moment where that came out. What was the feeling there?

I lost both. It's just sad, I guess. Yeah. Really sad. Yeah, man. You think? Yeah. So this is what I'm saying, buddy. Whose fault is it that you lost two parents of 2018. Well, for one of them, we don't, I mean, I don't know what happened to your mom, but like, you know, your dad has a hand in that, right? We could blame cancer, I guess. I don't Yeah, so you can blame cancer for your mom. Who do you blame for losing your other parent? My dad? Absolutely. So this is what I mean. So there's a difference between blaming someone and forgiving them and making excuses for their behavior. And I'm not saying that the excuses are not fair. I think they're reasonable and justifiable. I think his behavior is understandable and

expected, and therefore he deserves your forgiveness. But I cannot stress this enough. If you want peace of mind, you must admit a wrong and then forgive. Not excuse the behavior. Huge difference, night and day. One will lead to the situation that you're in now, which is you make excuses, you cover for him, you love him, you feel like a burden, you care about. You care about. him and you are tortured inside. You're being eaten alive. Mm-hmm. It'll keep things smooth day-to-day.

The motions there are positive because you love him. And so you just take all of that anger and that hurt and you just stick it in there, you just stick it way down. I take it out on my league teammates is where I put it. Okay.

Take it on your league teammates. These assholes who are cooking you food and helping you find things. right? Mm-hmm. So if you want peace with your father, first of all, he's got to step up.

Right? And you can ask him, you can help him to do that because he may be struggling too. So like I think, you know, he has a Dharma in this situation because he's the parent,

you're the child, so I think more of it falls. In my mind, this is my black and white way of thinking and this is not, you know, in therapy, no one gets blamed for anything. But I think he's not doing his Dharma.

Which does he have an excuse for? Absolutely. Should we be compassionate? Absolutely. But is he stepping up? No. He needs to be twice as present. He's got to make up for two parents.

Mm-hmm. Right? That's his karma. That's his karma. Is it fair to him? Absolutely not. But his life does not, and this is something that I want everyone to understand as well. Fairness has nothing to do with whether you do your tarma.

Is it fair to him? Absolutely not. He lost his wife. He lost the glue to the family. He lost the glue to the family. He lost the way that he connected to his sons. So is there compassionate? Absolutely.

Should there be forgiveness? I certainly hope so. Does he deserve to suffer? Absolutely not. Does it suck for him? Absolutely. And he's still not doing his time. And oddly enough, I think your road forward involves blame.

Right? You've got to, you're never going to heal unless you assign what is yours and you assign what as it is. It's like if you need, if you're fighting a boss and you have like a healer and you're playing a tank and the healer is an NPC and the healer never heals you, like it's not your fault that you die, but you take everything on yourself. Yeah. And it's just, it's just not going to work. Right.

And so then the other thing that you've got to do is just think about, you know, how you approach him and understand that part of the reason that you retreat so easily to your room is because of all the other thing that you retreat so easily to your room is because of all this crap in in you like that you love him that you care about him that you don't want to blame him you do blame him you do blame him and that blame is killing you it's eating you alive because he lost his wife too mm-hmm yeah i really does hurt like a lot what hurts blaming him because because i do try to like cover for him and i help help him and i wish him the best but like I

I guess I not until right now I haven't admitted that he I am blaming him yeah right so now we see a pattern within you that you blame yourself for the way that you feel go ahead you finish it I'm angry with myself because I blame him

for not doing his Dharma in the sense and who else have you been angry with his ex, his ex-girlfriend. Absolutely. Because of your feelings towards them. You blame yourself for your feelings. So that's got to stop. Right.

Okay. Thoughts? Questions? I'm just thinking about other aspects of my life where I blame myself for feeling the way I do. Oh, yeah. You know, when you said earlier, so now that's the beautiful statement. So I think now we're at a good closing point. You said, I'm blind in many areas of my life.

I would suspect I would put money that that blindness is this thing. That the thing that you blind yourself most to is judging yourself for the way that you react to situations. Yeah. That you think are unfair and make you a bad person. I think that's true, yeah. There we go. Blindness buff, cleanse. Okay, so let's talk.

you have thoughts questions I'm not just thoughts I guess just it's really cool to do this I really appreciate you taking time you're very welcome and I really appreciate you coming on because I think I think Twitter chat

I think Twitter chat feels the same way right so these are common things right we're good people and life gives us negative feelings because sometimes the ones that we love don't do things that are nice to us that's just like that's not that uncommon and because we love them, it's bizarre, like what's driving you. So now you understand. So now let's talk about behavioral change for a second. How can you change things? The first is that when you go into

your room, understand that some of it is feeling like a burden and feels bad man, but some of the reason that you're retreating is out of love because you care about him. And you recognize he's hurting too. And if he needs solace with like another woman and like wants to move past your mom and stuff like that, that you actually don't blame him for that. And he can't do that at the, like, he still owes you guys something, right? It's not fair for him to do that at your expense. Yeah. If he makes himself unavailable because he's dating women, like, that's not right.

And you don't have control over that, but you should know what is right and what is not in your mind to attain peace of mind. Because if you, if you kind of point this out to him, and I don't, that's hard, right? Okay. So you don't just go to him and say, this is what's going on because he's not going to understand. Don't just show him the Vod? Yeah. I mean, you could, showing him the Vod may not be a bad idea. But I think it starts with a conversation.

Yeah. You have any idea like, I mean, I can share a couple of thoughts, but you have any idea like how to start that conversation? I think I've tried to start that conversation, but at the time I just, I wasn't sure what the issue really was. Excellent. I mean, not excellent. I keep on doing this. You know what I mean, right? It's excellent that I've realized that, yes.

Yes. Right. Yeah. Yeah. And it's excellent that you realize that you couldn't have the conversation because you couldn't see. Yeah. Right. So what do you think are the key points of the first conversation?

I think I need to make it clear that we both have a responsibility to each other. And we both, like, have to equally put in to this relationship. we have to, I feel like he's not putting in enough. Okay. I would say that's actually the goal of the conversation. That's not where you start. I would start by saying, I feel like since mom passed away, we haven't been a family. And she was really...

I've said that to him before. And what has he said? He just kind of like, he like passively agrees and then I, and then I like, I try to, articulate how I feel about the whole scenario and I just couldn't like I okay and basically we just end the conversation I do whatever you know so I would I would start with I would think about the first emotion maybe sharing with him is that you feel like a burden asking him for his time because if he passively agrees like you want to Yeah, I think it's I think it's gonna be tough

So ideally what you guys I think this is a prime Case for something like family counseling by the way So I think if you guys have access to something like a family therapist This is exactly what you should do We did that back when my mom was around a long time ago Okay so so you can just concretely ask your dad You know you can talk to your brother and your dad and say like hey I think this is important Would you be willing to do it? So if he's a passive agreeer

Then what you have to do is modify the way that you talk to him by making things concrete asks. And you can say, like, I don't want to burden you, but I do feel like this is important for our relationship and our health. And I feel like we're drifting apart. And in the past, you've sort of agreed with that. But I think we need to take some kind of concrete steps to stay together. Is this important to you?

Yes, very, yeah. You ask him that. oh yeah yeah okay right and then you prepare yourself for the response and the response may not be if it's it may be some kind of lukewarm yeah and like then that fucking sucks for you right i don't even know what that emotion is like but i mean probably some kind of really bad disappointment and stuff like that and then you know at some point you have to you can't make someone do their tarma right but i i would be pretty concrete with him because it sounds like a lot of stuff is like unsaid and ambiguous.

Like you would be surprised. Like he may feel like you need space and that he may have recognized that you value your independence. So he may actually think that he's doing you a favor by like not interfering with your life and stuff like that. Yeah. But I would kind of start with, you know, having a conversation with sort of sharing that you feel like sometimes asking him for his time is a burden.

that you want to be spending more time together. And I think you have the Dharma. I've, go ahead. I've asked him to spend, like, in conversations in the past about spending more time together, and he all, every, every single time, the answer I get is, like, we just don't have that much in common. And I don't know how to deal with that, because, like,

I mean, we, we do, I think, like, he just, I think he just, I think he thinks. because I just enjoy playing video games and that's like it. And like, I, so that's tough. Yeah. So here's. I don't mean to go back.

No, no, no. No, I think this is important because at the end of the day, you know, we're about actually changing people's lives, not doing therapy. So if he says something like that, I think you've got to ask him, how important do you think it is for a father and son to share interest? in order to spend time together. Do you think the important thing, like when I, just ask him that.

Yeah. Because it's not like, I shared very few interests with my dad, but we still hung out. Yeah, I don't think it's very important. Yeah. And so you can say like, yeah, I agree that we don't share interests,

and I still want to spend time with you because you're my father. Or you can say that. You know, agree to the statement. What do you think? Are you interested? and if you really want to go hard, this is probably damaging,

but if you feel like you want a little of the asshole out, you can say, do you think having a son who doesn't share your interests is worth spending time with? Right? Because that's actually what he's saying. Like if you, I mean, you have a lot of different golf clubs in your golf cart, right?

Or to put it since you're... I tend to pick the driver and just send it home most time. Right? So like you're a sought-off shotgun kind of guy. Mm-hmm. And so, like, sometimes, like, that's something, like, it's like a sniper rifle, like, high penetration, but, like, to the point. It's not, not like, it's not spray and prey. So, you know, I think you've got to decide, like, what feels right in the moment. Or you can say, like, dad, I don't, to be blunt, like, I know we don't share a lot of interest, but I think we share more of them than you think. And I think we've spent so little time together. I don't think you know what my interests are. Yeah. and see what he says.

And then if he continues blocking and stuff, I think unfortunately what that means for you is that, you know, he just may not be ready yet. And if he's not ready yet, that that sucks for you, but it sucks for you and you continue living your life. And you make sure that you don't let that happen to your brother.

Because you have a Dharma to him that if your dad doesn't step up, you have to. Sorry. Yeah. Right? So you can also have this conversation with your brother. Or you and your brother can sit down with your dad or whatever. I definitely, I think I spend more time with my brother than he does.

Yeah. So, so then you have, you have the Dharma of being what for your brother? What roles do you fill if your dad doesn't step up? Patriarch kind of role? Yeah. So you're an older brother and what else are you? What roles does your dad have for you? Both parents?

Absolutely. And if your dad isn't around, what role does you? do you have for your brother? The role of both parents? Plus older brother. Plus older brother. Oh, sick. All three, cool.

Right? And is that fair to you? Absolutely not. Everyone's asking about Dharma. So now you guys see it. Right? This is what Dharma is. It's not complicated.

It's not grandiose. It's not saving the world. It's being more than you can possibly be for one human being. I have to think on that. I'm entirely sure. Yeah. Good.

So maybe a good place to stop for the day. What do you think? Yeah, I agree. You want to do some meditation? Sure. What does the doctor recommend? Shout out Blind 4-4-4, the best mods for supporting me and Loaf and Moses and Cammy. I can't forget Cammy and Nefer.

You guys are the best. I also wanted to say that Moses isn't just picking mods. I signed up to do this a long time ago. Yeah, dude, you're the first mod that's come on. So I think we're fair about not having nepotism. But let me just think. Shout out Caden, too. I'm trying to decide.

So I feel like you need strength. Okay. Because I think the task that you have ahead of you is not easy. I'm just trying to think about what practice I can teach you over the internet that will give you strength. And I can't chant today because I'm going to cough, but chanting would be a good one. Okay, so I'm going to ask you to sit up straight.

Okay. Can you sit cross-legged? Yeah, I was the whole time. Okay, good. Okay, so sit cross-leg, but with your back up straight? Mm-hmm. So I want you to, so just watch me.

So we're going to start by keeping our, keep your hands in front of you like this. So make kind of like a namaste. and what I want you to do is you see how my elbow so oftentimes a must-day looks like this with elbows in an angle but I want your elbows to be parallel to the ground and relax your shoulders right so do you see my posture so it's it's and then what do you feel in your hands warm warm do you kind of feel the pressure from your elbows I don't know how else to put it does that make sense so like with this your wrists are going to be relaxed

but with this, your wrists are going to feel pressure. So now what I want you to do is close your eyes and then just very slightly so you can relax your elbow some. And then I want you to just separate just a tiny, tiny amount. So create a tiny gap between your hands. I just saw your eyebrows go up. What did you feel? Okay, so close your eyes. So just focus on your hands.

Tell me what you feel. I feel the air between them. Okay, good. Is the air cool? or warm? Cool. Okay. Now I want you to focus on the inner surfaces of your palms and see if you can feel heat. Yeah, I definitely do. Okay. Now start to increase the gap between your hands. Spread them apart a little bit. And just too much. In a little bit? Good. So a little bit more open. Good. Right there, right there, right there. And now I want you to continue to feel that warmth

between your hands. You may feel a slight tension to pull them together a little bit more. Just notice that tension, then pull apart just a little bit more. And I want you to kind of envision, for lack of a better term, a warm space,

almost like a box, between your hands. Does that make sense? Yeah. Yes. This shit is so weird, man. So expand a little bit, and keep slowly expanding.

until you lose the box. It's almost like there's like a conduit of warmth between your hands. There's maybe another way to put it. Does that make sense? Yeah. Okay. I'm not trying to be suggestible. I'm just trying to describe the weird-ass sensations. Pull them apart until I feel the air again.

Like the cool. Yeah. Exactly. Yeah, probably around here then, yeah. Okay. So just focus on that a little bit. and now what I want you to do is try to remember what it feels like to feel this heat and now I want you to put your hands like this open your eyes so this is a mudra and place this mudra in front of you

so like right above your hips like crotch basically so rest it relax your shoulders close your eyes let the tips of your thumbs touch and then feel the heat emanating out of your hands can you feel that conduit kind of coming out? Focus on that sensation and try to sit as still as possible and just focus on that energy. Practice for about 60 seconds.

Now with your eyes closed, I'm going to say some stuff that doesn't make any sense. So I want you to just focus on that sensation and then feel your body. Feel the vibrance of it. Feel the vitality. and feel the strength. And understand that there is a great challenge that lies ahead of you,

that these emotions will exist within this body, and they will influence your mind, and they will try to get you to do things. Emotions aren't right, they're not wrong. All you need to be able to do is hold all of it together. And that recognize that in this moment, this vessel is capable of holding all of that and whatever may come. That if your dad drifts away,

this person can handle it. That if you need to be your mom, your dad, and an older brother for your brother, you are capable of that. Feel that heat and that energy in the perfection within you, the purity of your vessel. And that no matter what life throws,

as long as you can find this place, you can handle whatever they throw at you because you can't. And now put your palms together in front of you, rub them together, feel the heat, the friction, Cut them over your eyes. Take a deep breath in and exhale.

Slowly open your eyes. Then relax your hands. That's fine. How do you feel? Good. Feel good. I feel confident. Good.

That's what it's for, man. Does that make any sense? Sometimes, like, I don't understand how to explain what I feel. Like the sensations? Yeah. Yeah. Yeah, that made sense. Like, did you understand, like,

that make any sense about, like, how you have a shitstorm ahead of you, but that you're going to be able to handle it? Like, that thing that you were, like, this person can't handle it. The person I'm talking to can't. But that thing that you were, that can handle it. If you don't, like, I'm paranoid that people are just nodding their heads. Like, does that actually make sense? Because it doesn't make any sense to me when I hear the words.

It, yes, it makes sense. Okay. Great. So this is the challenge. challenging thing about experiences in meditation is like they're not conveyable with words. Like if you're feeling it, you get it. And if you don't understand, like, if you don't feel it, you're like, what the, is this guy talking about? Like, what? Right. Anyway, I'm glad. So I think you should do this practice every day. You must cultivate strength, my friend. You have not been. And then do you do yoga? I do not.

Where do you live? I live in Iowa. I live in a town about, A thousand people. Okay. So see if you can somehow learn yoga. Start doing yoga if you can. The internet's probably my best bet there. Yeah. Yeah, I do sometimes.

Okay. So exercise more. You need strength, buddy. Like your body needs to be pure because like the emotions that you're dealing with are just, you can't handle it unless your body is going to be optimized. It's not going to go for you. And if you can see a family therapist, I think this is prime for, family therapy.

Okay, I'll bring it up. Thanks a lot, man. Any last questions and thoughts before we wrap up for the day? Not that I can think of. Okay, awesome. Thank you very much. I really do appreciate it. Thank you. And chat, how do we show our love to Jake?

Okay, they're showing love. Give me strength buffs. Give me some strength potion. Yeah, man. Awesome. Thank you very much, Jake. Good luck, too. Yep, thank you very much. Thank you.