HealthyGamerGG - Why You Feel Unlovable | Viewer Interview

Episode Date: June 17, 2021

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Welcome. Thank you. Sorry, I'm really nervous, actually. Yeah, most people tend to be nervous. We'll get over that. Don't worry about it, bro. So, and why don't you start by telling me, what do you go by? I'm struggling to, I probably don't want to reveal my real name on stream. Sure, sure. Yeah. Doc, something like that. That's totally fine, man. Yeah, that's why I just ask, you know, I'm not, it's just like, what do you want me to call you? So Doc is totally fine.

So what were you hoping to talk about today? Or what are we talking about Bro? So as you already properly titled, I do have, I would say just a very, I don't know, it's probably just a traumatic experience after another. It's pretty much my whole life, at least for like the first half of it. And then a little bit of like what's been going on recently. Okay. And to a degree, maybe my, obviously I can say for sure, but it feels like I have a very unnatural reaction to it almost. And just the way that I've been dealing with it is, it's, I've sort of been troubling.

I've been sort of troubled with, how do I say that, just in general how to even approach others about my own shit, if that makes sense. How to approach others about the things. that you internally deal with? Yeah. Mostly because I tend to be very open about what happens to me. Okay. In a way, that's not very, I would say that outwardly doesn't really seem very emotional.

And it feels like there's like a disconnect between who I am now and who I was just a few, yeah, just a few years ago, I would say. Can you tell me who you are now? Hmm. It feels like nowadays, I'm kind of living in person almost. Like it's, it feels like I'm basically just someone who's watching my own life happening. I don't really have, I don't really have like, I don't know, like I don't feel like my life is very important in that, like not in a depressed kind of way. like not, I'm not saying I feel suicidal as much as I'm saying, but it feels like I don't really, I feel like I would rather help someone else fix their life when fixed my own. Okay.

I think that's a good way. I think that's a good way to say that. So would it be fair to say that you're not, you don't feel invested in your own life? Yeah, that's a pretty good way to say that, I think. Okay. So you're just kind of like, yeah, go ahead. I'm the type of person who would rather clean up your room than my own, if that makes sense. So you put others ahead of yourself?

Yeah. And in a way, I do believe that that's like the only thing that keeps me happy anymore. Like, it's rare for me to just be happy on my own or to feel happy because something happened for me if that makes sense. Yep. Stupid example, I made 10K on crypto, just like from investments. and I didn't feel anything. Easy. Yeah, right? But I never felt anything about it up until I basically started telling people who are close to me,

who know that they're going to get some of that. And that's when I started getting a little bit happy about it. I see. So like the money doesn't mean much to you, but like when it can help the people around you, yeah. That's when you start to feel happy. Yeah. And I don't know.

I just don't feel very goal. goal-oriented anymore. Sure. It's like, I guess for the gamers out there, I could say, it's like, I went from being an ADCarrie main to Yumi support. Okay. I don't know exactly what that means,

but I can follow the gist of it. I became a healer. Yeah. So maybe let me ask you in a different way. Would you say that like you no longer have main quest and you're just doing side quests? Yeah, exactly. Actually, that's funny. So that's kind of how I'm,

was describing it to one of my best friends yesterday. It's just random side quests. Yeah, exactly. And it sounds like it hasn't always been this way. You said that a few years ago, maybe it was different? Yeah. I would say maybe like, everything like for five years it's been like this. Before it, I used to be at least competitive to some extent.

I was always like sort of the way I am now, but now it feels like I'm continuing what I've started, if that makes sense. Sure. Before that, I felt like there was some drive behind it. Like, I actually tried to be, I don't know, I tried to be someone who's got a presence in people's life who was, and just someone who had like his own goals, if that makes sense. Like I was very excited to be independent. I was excited to be what I'm still trying to be a teacher.

That's what I'm going for right now. It's what I'm studying for. But nowadays, it's just, everything just kind of feels like it's just happening. Like, I close my eyes and five minutes later, I'm a year older. And nothing happened if that makes sense. Yeah. Like life is passing you by. Exactly.

I'm not even necessarily sad about it. And that's what's scaring me. Like, I feel like, yeah, I don't know. It's kind of like just happening. And I don't really feel invested. in my own life anymore. I'm just invested in, for example, what my little sister is doing, what my friends are doing to some degree. And I'm hearing you. Yeah. Just like a side note, I don't really know how to like incorporate it into like how to just bring it up. So I just say

the way it is. I also have this weird struggle that I don't see many people having, but maybe some people here do. In a way, I feel like I'm a narcissist who also hates himself like nothing else. If that makes sense. Like I'm the person who I hate and love them most in my entire life. Can you tell me about that? Sure. For example, like about the loving myself part,

it's something that doesn't really need context. I just feel like in general I have a, I have an ability to get on people's level very well. I think I do have, I mean, it does sound like I'm like narcissistic, I feel like I have a very good amount of like social intelligence of that makes sense. I think I'm, I can't really think of any friend circle in where I'm not at least somewhat of a prominent person. Okay.

And it's not because just, it's not because I'm someone who's so just who sticks out so much that people just want to know me. It's more like I just get to know other people and then they eventually just know me because of that. like and it's just something that I feel like I have a little bit I have it's like the only thing that I have proud like pride over the fact that I can understand and get along with like pretty much anyone I have a very wide set of friends I it goes from like shit posts on the internet to people who I've been studying with in my university to also people who are like basically bottom of a society in terms of like infamism. Like here just from being infamous, like they're not bad people. It's just, it's hard to explain. Like it's good people in bad positions, I would say. Okay.

So doc, let me ask you a question. So what I heard you just described as sort of like an assessment that you're pretty good socially. I'm confused about what that has to do with being a narcissist who hates himself. I guess I've been trying to tiptoe around it, but I also sometimes feel like at least in that type of intelligence, because I really face many types of it, if that makes sense. I think that I'm one of the best, and the only people who manage to become my very consistent and best friends are also similar in that regard. and I guess if I wanted to describe it in a way that seems more logical maybe to people who can't relate or it would be something like sometimes life feels like it's like watching a movie and everybody

else leaves before after like the ads are over and when the movie actually starts people are starting to leave and talking about how good the movie was and I'm the only one like actually well me and like some other people obviously but very few people are actually like watching the movie that we came here for it. That makes sense. Okay. So I'm going to try to cap, so you use the word narcissist, but what I'm sort of hearing is like a lot of people in life are plebs.

Yeah. And so is that what, so having that idea is why you, you recognize, or that's what you describe. When you call yourself a narcissist, is it that attitude that you're talking about? Yeah, sort of. I know that's not like actual on the paper narcissism, but it's just like, I don't know how to describe it. Yeah, yeah. I get you. Okay, so we can talk about other people being plebs. Okay. But not in like a derogatory way. I can still love a pleb. But that makes sense. I get you. You know, you can be compassionate and respect the plebs, but there are still plebs.

Right? Yeah, pretty much. Yeah. Yeah. I mean, you can be on the Challenger League and you can, you know, pat those silver tier players on the head. And they're still silver, right? Like, they're not less human than you are. They just happen to be silver. Yeah. And it's like, I guess that's a really good example because like it feels like I really am like with Challenger player who doesn't really have anything to do. The Q times are long. Games aren't fun. It's always the same. So I'm going down. So I'm making a smurf account that happened like a fixed amount of people trying to. going to go up. Yeah. I mean, no wonder it sounds like you're living life in the third person. It's like, but it's also because it's like it really does feel like it's the only thing really

that's really fun for me anymore. Yeah. I mean, it kind of makes sense. So like I know we're kind of going into the lull analogies here, but if you really think about it, like if I'm a challenger level player playing in like silver, let's say, silver is a thing in lull, right? Because there's, yeah. So like, and if you think about it, like how much fun could, I have being an ADC if I'm a challenger level player playing in silver. It's like completely boring. If you also kind of think about it, what would be more fun would be like a Yumi support, right? Where it's like, there's just no point in playing this game if I'm like trying to play. But like at least I can get some enjoyment. Like if you think about it, I mean, sometimes I'll

play with, you know, Dota players who are like very good. And whenever they play, you know, with me, like, they love playing sport. Like, it's just, it's just, it's a waste of everyone's time if they play mid or carry. But like, with support, they can run around and like cheer me on

and they have a lot of fun when I do well. Exactly. You know? Yeah. Maybe everything in life can be learned from Lull. Maybe that's the takeaway. Yeah, pretty much. So, but help me understand the hates himself part. I get the, I get the arrogance. All right.

That one's, um, it's a bit more complicated. And I think it would make a little bit more sense once, uh, I've, I've told a little bit about like my past, but in a way, this one's, um, like it makes part. It's most, but I think it's mostly, this is just me guessing because honestly, this is something that I can't really tell for sure why it is the way it is. but I've had a major glow-up in life. I used to be very unattractive inside and outside. It was a very weird person, to be honest.

It's hard to explain, but for a while it felt like, especially like middle school and beginning of high school, like there was nothing I could do to make people like me if that makes sense. And this is something that I, had to combat by essentially copying normies. To put it like very simple, simple, it's something that I just kind of started to copy my best friend at the time who was only my friend because he lived in the same house and like he felt like he had to be my friend. But he was very popular and he was someone who really helped me out just by telling, just by showing me, like, how to, how do not be the type of person who, for example, can't understand that everything I like doesn't necessarily have to be something that everyone likes.

And I think that's what it was because, because of my, like, perception that everything that I like must be something that's so high up in quality that everyone would like it, even if I, even if I have no clue what it is. but I grew to be a very annoying person, which then was also paired with what I at first actually thought was probably racist because I lived in a village where, like I lived in a small town, small village where people were not actually, like no one knew really people

who had my type of complexion, I would say, which later then turned out not to be true because it was actually just rumors about my mom that led to that kind of. kind of situation because people were telling their children not to play with me at first, and it just devolved into more and more, not hate, but like dislike. I was very cringe. Wait, people were telling that.

Like, their parents were telling their kids not to talk to me. Just like when I was in like elementary school too. And it just these are the same people I had, I was within elementary school. We're always in my class up until like, beginning. of high school. And this type of like not bullying, but just excluding, made me feel like there's nothing about me that's interesting enough to ever make like any meaningful connections, aside from my family, which even there was a, it was really hard. Can you tell me a little? And it's just really, oh yeah. Can you tell me a little bit about your

family? Sure, that's like, that's an entire thing to unpack. So do you want me to just go in chronological order or just tell me and tell you about what my family's like right now? Okay, so I can just talk about my family life, I think. I was brought up by my single mother at first because my biological father, who I hope isn't watching, he basically bailed the moment that I was born. Or ever, yeah, that's pretty much it. I was an anchor baby. Why do you hope that he's not watching? Because I, it's hard to explain.

At first, I thought I hated him because that's just like, but that's like basically indoctrination from my mom because she didn't like him and she just kept telling me to, I wasn't supposed to like him. Nowadays, it's more like I actually really do dislike him just for the fact that he basically left me, just left me. But at the same time, it's more like the fact that I know what type of person. he is. He's someone who, this is not an ambition of guilt just in case. He's someone who I've heard these, uh, deals drugs in a major city in Germany right now or might be dead by all that I know.

I don't know. Um, and he was someone who's never contacted me and contacted me ever in my life other than when he actually needed something from me. For example, just to put things in perspective, my mother was German. Um, this probably also answered a few questions about my but also my biological father he was Moroccan and he used me or my mom rather to make an anchor baby and just come to Germany using that I see and yeah trying to live the high life right and yeah she was this is just the type of person he is he did that he did similar things a lot like when I turned 18 apparently he was just about to be thrown out of Germany. I don't know why.

He was about to have his papers taken. So suddenly he started texting me again. And he was playing up a big game. He was telling me how I was his only son that mattered. He has a lot of sons, by the way. But I'm the only one that matters. And he really wanted to connect with me again and he misses me. And that kept on for like weeks.

And how did you feel? Honestly, I didn't buy it. I didn't buy it. I was just annoyed, to be honest, because at that point, I was just like, I don't really want to know him now because as much as blood can be thicker than water. In that one instance, I just thought it's been 18 years. This dude's just a stranger to me now. Like, he can't be my father, no matter what he does. He's always just going to be a stranger the same way that any stepfather would be, if that makes sense.

Because I don't know him. And, yeah. when that all went down, I was just kind of annoyed, but my mom was for some reason also trying to enable it, even though she herself was like the reason I disliked him at first and didn't try to seek him out. So she was trying to patch things up between y'all? I think she was just receiving money from him, to be honest. As I said before, he may or may not have been dealing in drugs and have made, has probably made a lot of money under the table. and he used that to like try to get to me, sent me a lot of gifts, asked me what I wanted to have, stuff like that. When we actually met up in real life, which happened like a few weeks after all that trying to get in contact, he gave him like a shit ton of money just in my hand, right? And you really thought that was going to work.

And I guess it did for what he wanted to achieve because the same day that I met him for the first time in 18 years. So it's also the day that he dragged me to. the town's hall and made me tell some people in a bureau that I'm his son and I actually need him still and because I did that that's why he never got like shoved off to another country so that's like the only reason you really tried to like engage with me again and after that yeah and after that I never really got to hear from him again like at first I think because he felt a little bit bad about it but it was noticeably less and after a while he stopped

me altogether again. And yeah, that's the type of person he was. And in the meantime, since he was not my only father figure, or this is the wrong word to call it, I didn't really have father figures aside from my grandpa who was very, he loved me very much, but in a way that someone would love his dog, if that makes sense. Like, he didn't love me for who I was, but just the fact that I was, if that makes sense. Like, he showered me in gifts and stuff, but it's not really something that you could call raising someone. I love him very much still. It's not something that I would hold against him.

I just don't think that he knows any other way to care for people. Yeah. So if I can just try to understand that. So it sounds like your grandfather loved you the way that a grandfather loves a grandson, as opposed to loving you for being you. Exactly. But I do believe that, like, I have a very special place in his heart. and he doesn't have a special place in my heart too.

But maybe he doesn't really know who you are. Exactly. Yeah, it's more like he doesn't know how to find out who I am or who anyone is for that matter. He's sort of, he's just the type of person who's just really old-fashioned and superficial. Sure. Like, he likes people who do what he says, basically. That's a good way to call it. Yeah.

So he's, he, but basically, now talking back, like going back to my mom. She was a single mom, obviously. And she, however, it was someone who, despite being over 40, like at the end of her lifespan, she was very, I would say, energetic. And she behaved like someone who was still like in puberty. She was like always 16 at high, ever since I've known her.

Seriously. and that's something that can be charming but can also be very exhausting especially when you're a kid that feels like you have to basically educate your own mom on stuff if that makes sense I always felt like I was repaired maybe some people can relate I bet some people can can you give me an example of what that looked like um complete naivitne just complete naivete like she was someone who had lots of husbands in her in her lifetime, I would say. Always the same type of person and she just would never learn from her mistakes in that regard. What kind of person?

Same type of person my father was someone who just used her for like just to get to Germany basically or for any other means to just get some sort of benefit out of the relationship, also for a relationship. We would all marry her for pay for a visa for money, stuff like that. Weirdly enough, always people from the same family as my father, almost always. That is very weird. Thank you. It really was weird. Like, she even like I'm my real name. It's actually the name of my biological father's brother. So that's like the type of person, I don't know, the type of family that I'm that I used to live and it was really weird. And basically, they were all in my opinion very bad

people, which is also why I don't want them to see this, but they probably won't. They can't speak English. Yeah, but this all kind of, so can you tell me what? Yeah. Sorry, go ahead. I was just led to like a childhood where I had like a very a very inconsistent concept of what home is if that makes sense I used to live with my mother for don't let me lie like eight years stuff like that and at some point I think at that point I had two different stepfathers already one of them was like mutual the other one was really bad really I like I'd get to see them fight every single day

luckily not nothing physical, but it was just something that I've seen every single day. And at some point in life, she also figured that she wants to live like, and she wants to live her own life, she doesn't really want to live for her children. That makes sense. So she shoved me off to my grandparents, which is also why I'm saying that my grandpa really was like the only father figure that I had for a while. Because I was raised there, like with my grandparents for like half my life at least. now I'm here again.

Grandpa is still upstairs. Yeah. And at some point, like after being with my grandparents for a while, that was something that I could call my, like my actual home. But one day, that's when I, like around the time that my little sister got around to maybe six years old, that's when the child protective services are, no, actually no, just basically just, the town in general just came up to my mom and asked her whether I'm still living with her or not.

And they figured that I wasn't. So we basically threatened her that if I wasn't coming back to her place, they would cut the, what's it called? Like just, in Germany, we get money for having children, basically. Sure. Yeah. Don't know what it's called. Sorry. But, yeah, since she didn't want to miss out on that money, which she didn't give to my grandparents either.

like she was just kind of living off of that. She figured that I'd have to come back. And after that, things were really awkward, to be honest, because I've been living somewhere else for six years. I didn't really trust in my mom. I was 12, 13, something like that. When you came back? Yeah.

Okay, so you spent like 6 to 12 with your grandparents. Exactly. And when I came back, It was just extremely awkward because I didn't, I didn't really connect where with my sister yet. And she was just a stranger to me to be honest at that point. But your sister was staying with your mom. Yeah, exactly, because my mom always wished for a, like my mom always wished for a daughter. So that was like, the main reason she stayed with her because my big brother was also shot to my grandparents at some point.

And, yeah, when I was there. Things just immediately went kind of haywire again because, as I said before, she had a lot of, like, I had a lot of stepfathers and none of them were good except for the last one to some degree, but I'm going to get to that. It's always been, like, I was always afraid that they were, like, they were bad people to such an extent that I was scared that they would touch my little sister when I'm not around. sort of like that's how bad they were sometimes um talk it sounds like not many people wanted you yeah they didn't and i can't even thought them which is also like this plays also into like my um self-hatred too way because i feel like in a way i've just masked that up and i'm still that person i'm still someone who people don't want and now i'm playing this character or it's not even a character because like i don't think i'm acting like in a way i'm acting like in a

way that's like fixed but rather uh depending on who i'm in front of it's just like a matter of role taking if that makes sense like i'll i'll be the mirror that reflects someone the best way possible or i try to be at least like i want people to just be comfortable around me and so i'll act accordingly sounds like you're a chameleon yeah pretty much um but i i think i have like a few core, like a few core things about my personality that don't change. But mostly, yeah, that's what I am. A crypto savant. Exactly. No, but yeah, people really didn't want me back then, especially like anything outside of a realm of like my grandfather, a grandparent's house, that's everything that didn't want me. School teachers, my own mother.

my real father stuff like that. They all didn't really want me around. Tell me about school teachers. Oh, sure. This is actually like a mixed part I said that wrong because I had many teachers who were very nice to me, but the thing is I think it's probably a natural thing in people to always like have the worst stuff that happened to you more in mind than the rest. And for every five teachers that were good to me, there was one teacher who would bully me in front of a class.

At some point, that was even the school rector. That was like the worst time of my life in a way because that person made me fail class. Like, I actually had to repeat one class, even though I had a really good, like, I had really good results at the end of the semester. Thing was that she just gave me an F in one course in the Germany. It's like, if you have an F and you're like final results, when you just don't get to progress to the next class. Why did you get failed?

Do you know? Unironically because she didn't like me and stuff like that happened with her all the time to the point where she actually got demoted. Like she's not in that school anymore. It's like she's spending the papers from her. That was really just me being unlucky. Like she didn't really have a reason to dislike me. She was just the type of person who would like single someone.

So that sounds like it was just bad luck. Yeah, pretty much because like it's really weird because like two years after that I got into the same class again. and she ended up having a hate bone on someone completely different. And that time, I got, I got off from Scots Free and nothing happened. Interesting. Okay. Yeah, but I had a few teachers. Oh, go ahead. Please.

I had a few teachers who would very deliberately make me do things that they knew the entire class would make fun of me for. Like what? Especially like, just, I don't know, like, it goes from like simple. stuff like asking me stuff that they knew I wasn't going to know to literally bringing up like my entire like family relations in front of a whole class just to make fun of it sort of like it was really weird what would they say was um for example I had like a really bad fight with my mom at the time and he'd just bring it up and asked me how I could have how I could be disappointing to someone who and then he mentioned something that my mom was very famous for

in relation to me having a lot of stepfathers that brings a lot of infamy with it right okay so yeah not like he was not a very nice person and that guy's like

I don't know that guy is like still in my brain yeah I don't think that's ever gonna leave for some reason it's just like it felt really unfair at the time because I felt like really I had no chance to even if I was a normal person

if that makes sense I don't think I would have made friends at the time but yeah when that when you say that person is still in your brain that sounds awful and also what what space do they occupy in their mind in your mind and what way are they still in your brain i think there's like an entire half of my psyche that's like dedicated to like and weirdly enough it's like the most traumatic thing for me even though on paper there's much worse stuff that's i'm still going to tell you but the bullying uh it just made me feel like there really wasn't nothing and no one who would ever really going to who's ever

really going to love me for who i am instead of just what i am which is for example a grandson if that makes sense but um it's so may like till this day now i'm very popular where i live um and still when i walk around somewhere i feel like when people are laughing i i always feel like it's probably something about me because people used to make fun of like the most mundane things about me the way i drink water the way i walk like stuff like that and that and that's the just makes you feel like there's really nothing that you can do that feels normal, all right. And now it's like this half of my brain that I know isn't real anymore. Like it's, I often call, I like to call it logic against behind.

Like my heart's telling me this, like people are still, people still feel this way about me, but my brain knows it's not that way. Sure. Sure. I'm noticing you laugh a lot. Yeah. It's because I'm starting to realize now that I'm probably at a point where I've been telling a lot of stuff that's really bad and I'm not showing the emotional. I don't know, I feel like I'm not showing like an emotional response that's fitting if that makes sense.

And also it's something that I just, someone just said coping humor in the chat, which is. No reading to a chat. Sorry. I'm really sorry. No reading. Chat, quiet. I just... Eyes forward, mister.

Yeah, I got it forward now. But basically, for me, it's something that... This is going to sound weird. I have an uncle who's very, very, very, very, like, he's suffering a lot from BPD. And he's one of the only, like, people I know who are, like, very genuinely kind and nice, but he's got a really bad problem, which is he alienates people all the time by basically talking about his tragedies in a way that

makes people feel like they have to say something to it, like they have to console him. And I think, in my opinion, people who have that sort of negative energy around them, like all the time, like if it's really very consistent, people have a problem with actually connecting to that person anymore. Like, they don't really want to be around that person anymore. I like to be the type of person who's comfortable to be around.

And so I don't like to have. And so even if I were to still feel like overly emotional, I feel like I would still try to mask that because I want people to feel like I'm just telling them a story. And they don't really have to like pat my back and be like, oh, I'm so sorry for you. Because I know it's going to make them feel bad too. Like it's because especially because of the things that I do tell people, I think it's something that most people just don't know how to respond to at all.

So what I'm hearing is that, yeah, can I jump in a second? Yeah. So I'm hearing that you have an uncle who manipulates people into being compassionate and caring. Very true, yes. And you will be damned if you manipulate people into doing the same thing. Exactly. It's just for him, it's like his saving grace is, but he himself is as caring and as compassionate as he wants others to be. Like, he's at least doing.

that like back to people and he's very much like if he loves someone he would do anything for them sure but he's very egocentric i would say in the way that uh um i'm probably front running like what i'm about to tell but i was um gonna eventually tell you about how my mom was murdered and uh i had to like i watched it i was there for it and my uncle uh somehow had this idea in mind that he had it worse than me, for example, which I feel like if he had told that to anyone else, they would have probably snapped at him. I wasn't really angry because I know what's going on in his mind, but like, I can, I can see how this sort of behavior can probably piss off a lot of people, if that makes sense. And he's alienated like all of his real life friends just from doing

that. But, yeah, it's like I try to be the type of person who, if I do decide to tell someone's stuff, I don't want them to feel like they have to react in some specific way. They don't have to tell me anything. If I'm telling it, I wanted to be like I'm just telling an interesting story. Okay.

It's sad but interesting. I'm confused about how to react to you sharing that your mother was murdered. Yeah, it's, I think that's everyone. That's part of, But for me, it's very, like, a conflicting thing because as you can probably, as you've probably picked up, especially like my early lifetime with her, not a very good experience. Not necessarily horrible, but also not very good.

And I always felt like I wasn't really like an important part of her life, especially during that time. But as I said before, she had a lot of, like, she married a lot. and people really did think that she was just someone who's very easy to have to say it very and to put it in like the most positive light that I can't however she really was in love with her people that she married she was just really she was just really unfortunate in the way she picked people and so they would always like end up breaking up with her before she even like was ready for that herself and it gave her something that, I don't know, it changed her to a degree where she was extremely jealous.

In the most, like, I don't know, it was really unhappy to see, even to see and to witness, but I wouldn't want to, I wouldn't want to have been like her married partner, even if, even if she, I was someone who wasn't hurt because she was like very, I don't know, she was so jealous, but it really felt like there was nothing you could do to please her. And when my last step probably came around, that person was a very nice man. In my opinion, he was a very nice man at first, for example. She was someone that actually was completely outside of the, how do you say that? Completely like outside of what she usually looked for in men.

Very complete, like a very different man. Actually, like someone who's integrated into society, someone who works a lot, like someone who wanted to work instead of just sit alone and sit, sit at home and drink and talk to underage people on Shatterbate or whatever, Chatterolet, I think. And just someone who felt like he was a normal person, like someone that, as weird as this is to say, that was like around the time where I actually had friends. And meeting other families was like complete whiplash for me.

Seeing how other families, like even with even by while having a mind that these people are probably trying to like play it up and be nicer now that I'm around, now that I'm visiting. These people were nice to a degree that I've never known. It was such a weird experience to see like a normal functioning family. And it was so distant from what my family wasn't, in my opinion, aside from like maybe what my grandparents were. But when that person came around, it felt like this guy was going to bring that sort of

feeling that I had when I was at my friends, like at my friend's house for her to visit, it felt like he was going to bring that to us, which he did, actually. Like, he actually did that. He had something about him, but I'm listening. What did he bring? I think you were about to say it. Okay. Yeah. He just brought something that I would call common sense. He was someone who actually wanted to be like a presence in my life, in my sister's life. He wanted to be someone, He was someone who actually loved my mother instead of just trying to abuse her for something. And I think that confused my mom because she was so, like, adjusted to people being the worst to her. And so because this person was so different, she started being the worst to him.

Not at first, but like at some point, it went to a degree where, for example, she, she would go to work. And he usually came home before she did because he went out earlier too. And he had put on some weight. He wanted to lose weight. So he just went out and drove his bike, like rode his bike. So he came home later than she did. And her immediate reaction to that when he came home was,

who were you with? Who did you cheat on me with? Very extreme reaction. She would take his phone and demand that she knows, that she gets to know all his passwords. gets to read all of his Facebook messages and stuff. And then she, at some point, even started, like, throwing his phone around and having, like, extreme temperate tensions, so you wouldn't even understand what she's saying anymore.

Which was very sad because she had, like, made so much progress at that point in to, like, in a direction where I would call her, like, an actual mom instead of just a person I call mom, if that makes sense. She was still someone who I felt I had to educate and care for in a way. but it at least felt like she loved me and like she actually like now loved and appreciated me in a way a mother would her son instead of just someone who's like living with me. And this was around the time that she was dating the good stepfather or married to? Yeah, this is the good stepfather. So even though she was kind of sorry, just to clarify, even though she was kind of maybe being not so nice to him,

it sounded like she was more genuinely caring for you. And for her too, like he was very much in love with her, like to a point where I would say this is the point of, his love for her was probably the thing that's feared like my family's entire fate in a way. Because the thing is, if you treat someone who hates you badly,

he's just going to want to distance himself from you, right? But if you treat someone badly who love, who loves you, that person's just going to be confused and not know what to do. And some people can deal with that sort of pressure in a way that doesn't end in homicide. And some people can't, I would say. And this person, after two years of having been the best father figure that I have had up until that point, apparently, I don't know really what happened. I don't even know if it really happened, but my mom claimed that he punched her lights out almost.

I heard her screaming. I went there. I immediately became running. And what I saw was her on the ground crying. She was mad in the floor. Just looking at me like, just like, what did I do? I talked to her and she said that he had punched him a few times. But to be honest, her story didn't completely check out.

And I feel like she actually lied about it in a way. Because like his story, which was that he shoved her side. and that he shoved her aside very hard and that he accidentally pushed her against the door frame. Seeing the wounds that she had, but it was much more likely than him actually punching her full force three times in the face. That didn't really check out.

But nevertheless, I was mad. My big brother was really mad. And we threw him out, not in the nicest way possible either. But I eventually started feeling bad for me. I came after him and I helped him at least find a hotel to stay in. And at the time, I was working at the same place as my mom. We had a small casino, just eight slot machines. It's nothing big, but it was ours.

We were working in it up until like 8 and 1 a.m. every day. And one time, like a week after that happened, I would occasionally bring him food, stuff like that. So we would like even then live comfortably because for some reason I just knew they were going to get back together. And he ended up visiting me in that casino while I was working and just smelled like a smell of alcohol, smell of puke, really puffy eyes. And he was talking to me about how horrible he felt, how this is like the worst time of his life. Because he's separated from her because he doesn't know what to do. He feels like and he even told me at that point that sometimes she can be like the nicest and sweetest woman to him.

And sometimes she's just so insane to her and to him that he doesn't know what to do. And he asked me for a hug. I gave it to him, he connected, and I figured I was going to help him to get back with my, get back with my mom again, which I did. I believe myself to be someone who's very good at reaching, like, any sort of goal, as long as it contains making someone do something, even if it's at least something that they have at least somewhat in mind. Like, I think I, it's not really, I don't know if it's something that I can. called manipulative, but something along those lines.

They have to give you the side quest and you can make sure it gets done. Exactly, exactly. If I can feel that there's like, even if it's a secret quest, if I can feel it, I can do it sort of. That's what it's like. But yeah, I did that. And for four months, it went really well again. And then basically like a complete repeat of everything that I said before happened again.

And yeah. We threw him out again. And this is something that I missed to tell you. Before that he actually told us that next time he was going to get thrown out, like once he came back in. He said that in a very, not in a cryptic or mad way, he said that very matter of fact. We didn't even think anything about it.

He said that we were going to regret it. And my mom immediately asked him, what, are you going to go back to Portugal? Because that's where he was from. And he was like, yeah, you'll see. And I felt like that's what he meant. And so this time we threw him out again because it happened basically the exact same thing happened again.

Except this time he also tried to push my sister or something. I wasn't there for it. And because of that, like we eventually checked out like her mom's bank account, like her shared bank account with that guy. And we realized, I can't talk. Sorry. We realized that 500 euros were missing. It's like, I think. that $600, something like that.

And we figured he really did just get a ticket back to Portugal or something like that. Well, he visited me again at work, this time at like nighttime, much more fucked up than the last time. Very puffy eyes again, small smelt like shit, to be honest. And one time, yeah, like he, we were just talking about shit, not even about my mom, just talking about stuff. because I felt like this was the last time we were going to talk, which was right. And he again asked me to hug him and he was talking about how he feels like this is again the worst time of his life, but also there's nothing he can do about it. Like he felt like there was nothing to do.

And I told him, yeah, I don't think you and mom are ever going to work out. It was like, yeah, but things are going to be better soon. And the next day, I was in bed. My mom was laid at work. she just came home. I heard the garage just closed down. So I figured she was going to come in soon. And suddenly I heard basically the loudest sound that I've ever heard in my life.

It's felt like an explosion right next to me. And it happened again and again. So like three times. And I looked outside of a window and I saw my mom laying on the ground. And my stepfather, or at least a silhouette of a gun in hand. and yeah I panicked called the police the father and at that point I actually thought or even knew like in my mind I knew I was going to die next I felt like this is this person that's going to come up here and he's going to kill me and he's going to kill my sister and this is like my last moment in life

that sort of feeling is something that I probably will never shake I it's hard to explain it's something it feels like that sort of adrenaline makes you feel like someone else is controlling your body and you're only watching. And it's like, I don't know, it's like auto mode. But yeah. And that thought was even more, like that part sounded even more convincing to me the moment I heard another shot. And I didn't even bother to check to look outside of a window this time

because I was scared to see and to see what it was or to see someone actually come in. So out of panic, I just called the police and I took it one. bottle stood next to the door and thought that if someone's going to come in, maybe I can try to overwhelm them. If not, I'll die. I'll die anyways. Maybe I can save my sister, who knows. But no one ever came. No police and that guy didn't either. So at some point after like probably 15 minutes of waiting or maybe three, who knows, I was very, I was in a very weird mindset. I actually looked outside of a window and I saw another person laying down on the ground. same person with a gun

yeah and like an hour later police came and that's how my family got torn apart to a point where nothing feels but now it does again

but it felt like life was never going to be normal again and I think it's just something to before I finish the story sort of it just felt almost

ironic that the moment that life feels like it's starting to get better in regards to like my family life, a moment that my, me and my mom get back together in a way where it's, where it actually feels like family. That's when life also takes her from me.

It was kind of ironic, I guess. That's quite the story, Doc. Yeah. It's hard to tell people sometimes because it feels like, I don't know, I feel like it's actually so much that people oftentimes don't believe me unless they actually live around me and know it happened.

It does sound unbelievable in a lot of ways. Yeah, I know. And to those who doesn't sound unbelievable, too, it sounds like something they can't really respond to. Usually when I'm at a loss for words, it's because there are too many things to say. I'm sorry. No, it's okay.

How does it feel to share that? It's something that I can't really explain, to be honest, because as I said before, I'm very open about like, I don't know, it's hard to say. I'm very open about stuff that happens to me. I tell people all the time. And it feels like I'm making it real again in a way because like sometimes I feel like my brain is trying to not forget it, but make it seem like it happened 20 years ago when it was only three years ago. And when I tell it, I feel like it's still.

real. It's something that really didn't even I don't know, it's something that happened not too long ago but I overcame it if that makes sense. Like I think, I think that in a way at least I probably overcame it as well as I possibly

could without any help. That makes sense? Because there were times where I didn't want to live anymore. That's especially like the first the first week after it happened. Second week, ironically, I was already working again because I felt like if I were to go back into like a normal everyday life,

I wasn't going to forget it, but I was at least going to get used to the change if that makes sense. Because like I'd basically uprooted like my entire life. Like nothing's the same. Yeah. Can I? Yeah. You have more to say?

No, no, it's fine. Can I think for a second? You may. I'll allow it. Thank you. I feel like this conversation has 10 main quests in it. They all feel really important to me. Okay.

I'm going to start listing them out. All right. Actually, let's start with this. How are you feeling right now, Doc? Still nervous? A little bit more comfortable than before. But having been bad, I don't really feel much, to be honest. Is your mind telling you that we think something about you now?

I can imagine that there's people, especially like in, I don't know, I can imagine that there's people who now have listened to that who believe this is not true. Because that's like a reaction I get a lot. there's probably a lot of people who think I'm weird for reacting to it the way I do, and maybe a lot of people who are also relating to at least part of what I just said. Because I think, I don't know, I think that for a lot of people, especially like people who maybe were outcasts or either outcasts like in middle and high school or even just people who are gamers, I think there's at least something that they will probably relate to in that. What do you think I think?

No clue. Okay. Good. I'm happy to hear that. Because that means I don't have to dispel anything and we can just get into it. I have a very good opinion about you. Well, let's, it sounds like disappointing you will be easy then. So, yeah, it's, yeah, anyway, you don't have to, we can, I'm sure we can hit that tennis ball.

across the court several times back and forth. So let me just, let me just kind of toss out. I'm going to just think out loud, okay? Okay. So we started off the conversation and you kind of mentioned that you had had traumatic experiences, but that you basically, like the main thing that I heard originally was that you're kind of living life in the third person. And that the only time that you kind of get excited is the only time that you can really

feel happiness or joy is like when you're helping someone else out. And, and, you know, also, like, so we sort of kind of notice that you sort of feel like separated from your life. You're not invested in your own life. But you can be invested in others. And then you sort of mentioned this thing about, you know, like you're a narcissist who hates himself. And what, as we kind of dug into that, we sort of recognize that, you know, you do actually think about other people as plebs. And as weird as that sounds, I don't think that that's actually arrogant. I think that I think you can accurately assess that you've sort of developed like a high level of social intelligence and you kind of know how to interact with people, you know how to make yourself

likable. And that sometimes people are not like aware of those levels of interaction, right? Which sort of makes sense. It's kind of like, you know, you can be a master chef and taste lots of things, whereas, like, you know, the majority of people may just want their tendies and like they don't really care about, you know, like, which is fine. Like, it's like, that's how humans are. Like, some of us are master chefs and some of us are fine with tendies. You know, some of us are like socially, like very aware of nuance and such. And other people are just sort of like, I'm going to be a pleb and, oh, my God, did you see this pair of shoes on? Instagram, I want it. And, and, you know, like, that's fine, right? Like, yeah. I wish I was like

that. That's the thing. Like, I don't think, I don't think, I don't think lesser of them. I just feel like, I wish I was still like that if that makes sense. And, and, and some people are challenger level at league and some people are silver, right? Like, that's, it's okay for people to be good at things and other people to not be good at things. Um, and, and, you know, you mentioned hate yourself. And this is where I think we can really start to see a couple of themes, which, you know, if you've been watching the stream for a while, I'm sure people can piece this together. You're reading Twitch hat, by the way? No. Okay, good. Actually not. So, so I, you know, you said one thing that struck me as odd is that there was a friend of yours who was living with you

and he felt like he had to be your friend because he was living with you. Can you help me understand? in that statement? Oh, it's just apartment complex. He was living underneath the apartment underneath me. Why does he have to be with,

why does he have to? Because he just was that type of person. He wasn't, he's extremely extroverted. That person's like an entire thing to unpack too because he was, he was my late step forward. I was like the guy who did that.

He was his, what's his called nephew? you. So it's a, yeah, that's like a tangled, tangled story. But, but what I'm curious about is, is why couldn't he like you for being you? Because he told me he wouldn't have liked me if I hadn't lived in the same apartment, in the same apartment complex. It was very, he was just someone who was very extroverted and he just knowing that someone, just someone his age is in the same like house as he is, he, he didn't. He, he was. just felt like he had to do stuff with me because he just always needs someone around and that

was like the perfect scenario for him. So he in a way shaped me into someone he would like, if that makes sense. Because I was a very, I was a very nerdy person because as one might as one might tell, since I didn't have any friends, internet was my friend. And it still is to his day to a degree because that's why I feel more comfortable. Even like I'm not shy. I have a lot of friends nowadays. I have a lot of people to hang out with. I just oftentimes feel like I do want to stay alone either way.

Yeah. So Doc, I may start interrupting you a little bit. Okay. That's fine. Completely fine. So, so and so this is I think like a. It was not the answer I was expecting in terms of, you. you know, why you felt that way. But, but I'm really seeing a big theme here, which is that,

you know, you're not worth liking, right? So, so, so, and we'll, and I can see you swallowed theirs. That's good. So there's probably some kind of emotion. So, right? And it can hurt to hear it. But like, let's just kind of like run through the, the evidence of that. Right. So I, and I think that, and this is where we have to get really tricky because I think you are worth liking, but I think that it's very reasonable for you to believe that you are not worth liking. Because, like, honestly, the evidence kind of points in that direction, right? And I think it just happens to be bad karma, for lack of a better term. But to start off with, you were an anchor child, right? Your dad, like, basically the reason that you were conceived was out of a sociopathic desire to stay in a

country and for material gain. Yeah. And to have an absent father who tells you that he likes you, I mean, you're not really buying it, but then you also get like very clear evidence, right? And this is not one of those things where, I mean, sometimes we deal with situations of cognitive bias or distortion where that's what I thought we would see with your friend, which was like, oh, you know, maybe you just didn't realize because you felt unlovable, but he actually was your friend because he liked you. But it turns out maybe that's not the case. And that if anything, what he taught you is that you're not. worth liking, but if we can doll you up and make you pretty and make you likable. If I can turn you into something that you're not, then I can like you. Yeah, pretty much.

And so, yeah, go ahead. I was just going to say that in regards to the cognitive dissonance that you've mentioned before, I get that and I still, for me, it's, I think it's a little bit different than for most people, because I have this sort of thing where it feels like I got two thought processes at the same time when talking to people. But it's like the logical part of my brain that knows, no, this person probably really does like me. And I'm very confident in that assessment. And there's also the other part of my brain that's like, yeah, but do you remember back then? You never really know if people actually like you or this is just a facade because they either don't want to be mean.

Or because they're trying to like bait you into being like funnily stupid again, sort of. Yeah, good. So I'm glad that you recognize that because I do think it's different from the cognitive. I think it's quite different. So for some people, what happens, so let's just illustrate this for a second. For some people, what happens is that their heart ends up controlling their mind. And so even though the mind should logically see that this person likes you, the heart convinces them otherwise. And they take someone who actually likes you and distort it into. what the heart actually believes. In your sense, I don't think that you have that cognitive distortion or cognitive bias. Yeah, it's more like my heart is trying to give me that, but it's not working. Yeah. I just feel a general form of like discomfort. Yeah.

That's like at most. That's it. Absolutely. And I think if we want to be really honest about it, like I think that there's a good reason. It's not that your heart is actually illogical. I think it's actually quite logical, right? Because if we really look at your life, what we see is, you know, dad, you know, like abandonment and all that good stuff.

And then also like, oh, son, you're the only son that matters to me. Pro tip. If you have a parent who has lots of children and tells you that you're the only one that dot, dot, dot, dot, or just in general. That makes me hate him more. Just in general. Like, like I see this a lot with like narcissistic kind of. I mean, we, I think the word gets tossed around a lot. So there's just a particular kind of person who will say, you're the only one.

Yeah. Right? So that kind of idealization, that's something you should be careful. Like even when it comes to Dr. K, like Dr. K is the only one. No, I'm really not. You know. No, it's like, I wouldn't say that. You were like, I just, this is going to, this is probably something you've heard a lot before. I came to know you because of your first interview with Regful. And Regful was someone that I, at that point in time, related to a lot. weirdly enough because I feel like he had very different problems to me.

And still I felt like he was someone that I could relate to very well. And when I found out that he was like talking to a therapist online, and I checked it out and I felt like this is someone who actually sort of can look behind that curtain that people put up. And at least in my like, this is going to sound weird to say, but I feel like people who are primarily on the internet, aren't easily understood by most therapists in the same way that they are by you and by you for some reason. Yeah.

So there's a simple reason for that. And it's that therapists look at patients and what therapists should do is look at people. Yeah. Right? And I mean that, you know, I think the more person that you see, the easier it's going to be to relate. And if we really look at, you know, Byron, I think one of the things that made him special was that he was really good at, like, being himself and being very authentic, which is why it's interesting because we do hear that a lot of people, like, really connected with Byron. And I think that's because, like, he showed off all the facets of his being. So you didn't get a curtain.

You got a person. Yeah. Yeah, it felt like, in a way, it felt like just hanging out with a friend when you watched him. Yeah. That's probably what most people felt like. And so just kind of going back to kind of themes of, you know, being unlovable, which is just what I'm going to call it. Right. So there's your dad. There's this friend who sort of shaped you into a person who's worthy of being friends with. And then also like people like kids in your neighborhood explicitly being told to not hang out with you.

Yeah. Because of just rumors about my mom going around. Yeah. also just me being like the only colored person in the village. That's what I thought was the case. The way I was trying to make it easy for myself, I think. Yeah, just a standard case of racism. Yeah, but I tried to make it about that because I feel like if it's not, then I can't do anything about it.

It's not my fault and it's fine. Exactly. But it turned out to not be that, which means what? First of all, I needed to change. And second of all, people knew about my mom too much. Yeah. So it's kind of interesting, right? Because when you say you need to change, like, if you attribute their dislike of you to racism, like, that's not your fault.

Yeah. But if it's not racism, then it's sort of like kind of your, not necessarily that it's your fault because I still get the sense that you're pretty level-headed about that. But that it, like, you really are. There's something wrong with you. Let's put it that way. Yeah. I was just very, I was just a v. a annoying kid at school, basically.

But it's also, I think it was kind of a result of just not having any friends in my age, ever, up until I, up until I, like, turned. 14 with my friend that lived in the same apartment complex and then 16 when I basically started with a new slate and a new class that was really welcoming and nice. Yeah, so I'm just going to kind of go back to unlovable, okay? I'm just going to lay out a couple other things. So one is like, you know, being told that, you know, being sent off to your grandparents' place, and then your mom telling you that they always wanted a daughter. I'm going to keep this kid. But this kid I'm going to send off.

Like, that's got to hurt. It did to a degree, but I was luckily young enough to not really like think about it too much. My grandpa did a really good job of like making me feel like I was at home. But it was still on my mind, yeah. Yeah, yeah. So, so, so, and this is where I kind of get, you know, back to this idea of like, you know, what's it like to never be wanted? And I think it's something that I say that at some point it just makes you feel like, I don't know, you just ask yourself all the time, what's wrong with me? What did I do wrong?

Why are people like always snappy at me? Why, why can't, uh, it just felt like, why can't I have, why can't I have anything nice? it's literally just, I don't know, a PS2 game or something that I got on Christmas, right? Yeah, it just felt like I must have messed up somewhere and there's no way for me to get out of it on my own because I just don't know what to change. I didn't know. At some point I just figured I would see, like I had like a few people who were at least neutral towards me and I just tried to like hang on. onto those people and be as, I don't know, I try to be almost like them and just weirdly worked out. Doc, I mean, this may sound kind of weird.

Like, I don't know how to find the words, but like, I can imagine that the person that on some level you feel you are has a main quest that isn't even worth pursuing. Yeah, pretty much. Right? I'm like, why would we want to bother with this guy's main quest? Like, this guy's main quest isn't even worth it. Like, there are, like, other people who are, like, normal. And, like, them doing their side quests is, like, more important than our main quest.

Yeah, it's what it's fair like. You know, I'm kind of almost imagining these RPGs where, you know, sometimes, like, in RPGs, you've got good characters and bad characters. and there's the side content that you can do to develop a character. And some characters just aren't worth developing. Yeah. So you just leave the side quest is just sitting in the quest log, but they're not really worth using. Like, their stats are low. So like, why bother?

Yeah, pretty much. So I just went back to character creation, basically. Yeah, well said. Right? And you reinvented yourself. Yeah. And I don't know, is this going to sound weird, but I feel like in a way, everything that happened in my life, at least to STEM degree, made me who I am. Because I don't know how else to say it, but I feel like I've been in almost like every single position that someone of my age could begin in the way that I've been someone who was extremely unpopular, bullied.

I know what it's like to have parents. I know what it's like to be an orphan now. I know what it's like not to be loved by your parents, but I also know what it's like to get their attention, mostly because of my grandparents, but also just the last two years of my mom still, I don't know, it's just like the last few years of living with my mom,

we're actually pretty nice, which is why it's so, which is why it's still hurt to lose her so much. Like, it's hard to explain. But all these things, it's obviously a lot more to it. It just came together to make me, feel like I can empathize and sympathize with almost everyone to a degree where I became popular,

not because of... Doc, I'm going to interrupt you. I'm going to interrupt you. Okay. Okay. So two things. Sorry. You got to let me.

So one thing is that feels like I don't know what else to call it, but a main quest yoink. You know, I don't know if you played one of these games where you're like, you know, you're like at the end of the main quest and then you get like disconnected. And you have to start over at the beginning. It's like, like, you know, just when you were putting your life together. And like, you had a stepfather in the picture who like actually treated you nicely. Yeah.

And your mom was also like being more loving towards you. And then he murders her and kills himself. Like, what is the point of progressing on a main quest that ends like that? I don't know, taking care of my sister. That's not the main quest. Right? So I understand that's what you do. And that's probably how you get through suicidal feelings, which makes sense.

And I think that's good. What are you feeling now? I think this is probably the first time in one and a half years, but I feel like crying about it. I don't know. It's, I don't really like, as I told you before, I'd talk about this in a way where, as if I was talking and telling someone a story. So I don't force people to, like, go in depth about it. Now it's tickling a spot that hasn't, I don't know. So it's kind of strange because, like, literally on the screen, you're, like, sneaking away.

You've moved, like, further and further. No, no, I think it's fine. I think it's just like, it's interesting, right? Because like you're not like as the conversation goes, you're like sneaking, which is fine. I don't, I don't, I think you should be allowed to retreat. But it, you know, and I think like how, you know, how does it feel to be tickling that spot again? It's hard to explain. It feels like, as I said before, it's like, it's like a.

I'm making it real again. I don't, I feel like at least people who go through trauma can kind of relate to this in the way that sometimes there's really bad things that happen feel like suddenly that 20 years back in the past even though it's really happened like way like not even that long ago. And I don't know, I feel like I've never really gotten to talk about it with someone in a way where I could actually be sad about it, if that makes sense,

since I was always kind of like the first support killer for my family, at least mentally. I play some sort of a father role for my sister. My grandma basically needs me to... Yeah. It's like, I don't know.

It feels weird to actually be at a spot where I'm the one, like, being in a focus about it. And in a way where I don't have to feel like whatever I'm saying should not be, should not like go over some sort of limit to the point where someone dislikes me. Good. So that segues to my next question. What do we think about you now? I've honestly no clue.

I don't know. From experience, I would say there's probably still a lot of people who even don't believe it and even worse there's probably a lot of people who relate to it too much

which for those people I do feel bad for I hope no one can but it's unlikely yeah is it okay if we see you

yeah can I tell you what I see? Yeah I see a survivor. Yeah. I think that's what you are.

And there's like, there's respect there, but there's also sorrow. Like a lot, right? Because we can respect a survivor, but it's also like, there's only one way that you become a survivor, which is by surviving shit. Yeah. And you can be likable. I mean, that's cool. Like, I think it's neat that you leveled up your, you know, learning how to talk to other

normies. skill. Yeah, I tried to mix up my charisma. Yeah, right? So like you're as much as I can. You're like an alien and human clothing. Like that's neat and all. But I think at the end of the ad hoc, like seriously, what I see is like a survivor.

Yeah. I don't know. I always felt like at first, that's what I felt like to. Over time, I just started out. So like, I don't know, I wasn't going to bring this up because this is like actually something that me may. I don't know, this is also like part of I don't like myself, but I feel like I, I don't know, I was too close to my stepfather. So now I'm like in this weird limbo where I hate him more than anything.

Like he's, this is going to sound weird. I'm even more pissed about the fact he also killed himself because it basically took like my, like the only thing that I could be mad at if that makes sense. and afterwards I started to think about how this person who had such a bad thing in mind also managed to have the audacity almost to like come up to my into my workplace and ask me for a hug just the night before he was going to do something like that it's I don't know it's like this weird conflict conflict in my heart was like this person was basically like my

the first father figure I had and also the worst person that's ever come across for me that's ever come across to me I guess it's like yeah I think you explained it really well I'd be really surprised

if someone didn't understand that and can I tell you what I heard yeah that you know on the one hand it sounds like he was the first stable father figure who, like, cared about you as a person. And also that he is so selfish, right, for so many reasons. Like, it's not just, like you said, there are just so many elements to it where, like,

you know, coming in and asking you for a hug, like, he gets the comfort, right? Like, he gets to determine. He gets to, like, plan things out and in a sense be at peace. Like he's figured his plan out. I'm going to say goodbye. I'm going to get a hug because I care about this kid. And then I'm going to do this thing. And I'm not going to stick around for the responsibility.

Yeah. So that's pretty much what it said. Like he even left a note before he did it since he knew he was going to kill himself. And in that note, he was basically just talking straight shit about my sister, about my mom, about my brother. but completely left me out. Like, no word, nothing. It just feels weird to, sorry? The first time in like years almost that I'm crying, almost crying.

But it feels like, how do you say that? It feels weird to be the best friend of your mom's murderer, I guess. Yeah, I get the sense that there are a lot of really, do you feel responsible? Do you want me to help you stop crying? Yeah, sure. I'm asking it's a genuine question. Yeah, I'm hinted.

Okay. Give a second because now I've got to figure out how I'm going to do that. Worked. Good job. I was like, oh, fuck. He said yes. I wasn't expecting that, Doc. This is the part where you say, no. This feels good. I'm feeling so good. No, like, I need to cry.

Like, it's a elevator room. It's like, no, he said, yes. What do I do? I'm sorry. He's supposed to feel free, and it's supposed to be good. He's supposed to be able to handle. Yeah, it was good, but it's what everyone goes for. I, um, quick,

penis joke. Petus joke. I was trying a blink I was trying to blink. I bet worked. That's a I panicked. I didn't know what to do.

That's a sorry about no, I mean it's fine. Yeah. If I was going to say no it was going to be weird. You're just, Well, I have to, like, watching me cry for five minutes.

So, yeah. Yeah, no, I mean, I'm totally fine watching you cry. You know, it's, you know, that's, that's cool. That's what we come here to do a little bit. If it's of, like, if it makes, if it takes things into, like, a different perspective, it's also rare that I genuinely. So that's, like, the first for two things now. Yeah, yeah, yeah.

I did get the sense that that was a not quite as a defense. of a laugh. No. Yeah. That was genuine. Yeah. It was a funny reaction. Yeah.

Hmm. So, Doc, I feel like there's a lot to say, but I also feel like maybe it should be said at another time and another place. Like, I think it's important to process what we talked about. I'd like to still talk about one or two things if that's okay with you, but I just kind of want to check in with you about, you know, where is your, you? your stamina bar right now. Okay. Do you want me to answer that directly or is that like in regards to maybe a sort of aspect of my life? No, I mean like like for this conversation, like

where are you? Oh. Like in terms of. I'm still. Actually, I'm still full. It's like I can still go on. Okay. Okay. So so in my experience when we have something, like this, which is sort of like, you know, a good cry followed by a genuine laugh. Like, that's what healing sort of can look like sometimes. But it's also like we should give ourselves the time and space to kind of process and decompress from that a little bit. I want to share, I think, a couple of almost like more practical thoughts and questions for you. The first is I'd like to explain a little bit about, you know, your experience of living in the third person and share some terms and concepts and things like that. I'm also really curious about what your

romantic relationships are like. Oh, that's, that's going to be. You know, so I'm kind of curious about that. Give me just one second. And, you know, just like, because I can imagine that a lot of what we're talking about will, you know, make romantic. It'll complicate your experience of a romantic relationship. I'm surprised that that's something you, that's the conclusion you could draw out of it because it's true. in a way. I just didn't think that that's something that's correlating. But yeah, it's very true. Because I don't know, would you like me to answer right now? Or I mean, so, so I, you know,

I am curious about it. I think that I imagine we could spend another, you know, hour and a half talking just about that. So I'd love to hear a little bit. But yeah, so I mean, please. Yeah. I mean, I can like sort of put it shortly. But I, um, I think. had a lot of relationships to make in my life in general after like turning into a normie to to like to to put it like that and um it for me it's rarely been the case that I was actually genuinely genuinely romantically invested to be honest it's more like people would come up to me I would like I would talk to them and eventually it would just like the topic of Romans would come up. And for me, it was just like a matter of saying yes to someone because I didn't want

to see them cry and I didn't dislike them enough to not feel like I could have that sort of relationship with them if that makes sense. But I never really have, I guess, infatuation. Like I don't really have any sort of feelings of infatuation for anyone. And it usually just led to relationships. But for me, like just like just. a friendship plus almost but like in a obviously I wouldn't like I wasn't gonna like I wasn't gonna like jump up their feelings I wasn't gonna do like I wasn't gonna cheat on them or anything that's not it but more like I just felt like I was almost like not invested yeah not not invested romantically I still I still enjoyed their company I still like them and love them as friends almost like

yeah and but that changed at some point when I met someone who who's nowadays my best friend ever. It's like unimaginable how compatible we are. If you're watching, hi. But this person is, it feels like having a mental twin almost. And this person is someone who actually wasn't, let's just say they actually don't look for the gender that I am. They actually look for women,

but still worked out for some reason, because we were just so almost, I guess, excited about the fact that there's someone who is that compatible with us, if that makes sense. And at some point, it just, we just figured we would try it out, worked for a few months, but eventually we figured, yeah, no, it's like, it's weird since, like, just our sexual orientations weren't working. they're like working in tandem I might say yeah but we're still best friends and yeah so someone like the most important person in my life I would say um yeah so and every so and every since then I've tried to see if I can have that sort of feeling for anyone else which I can't it's it just won't worry it happens for some reason and it's but also I've remembered some

this is going to be this is going to be a bit depressing again I've remembered some stuff in my life that's happened which I apparently managed

to lock away which somehow led me to just be almost completely unable to I say that I don't really feel like any sort of

sexual attraction to people anymore in general and it feels like nowadays back then I used to be with a lot of women just because, like, with a lot of women who are also, like, with a lot of men. I'm not, I didn't like break any heights, but I was very active in that regards because I felt like if I'm with someone, if I'm, if I get intimate with someone, then I feel like I'm still desirable.

Almost that's kind of like, I think that was like subconsciously going on in my mind. But eventually that, it didn't feel like that anymore. It just feels like it's uncomfortable for me now, and I don't really get, like, romantically close to anyone anymore. Yeah. Okay. Thanks for sharing that. I thought that was a great summary.

So I think it makes sense for a lack of a better term. And here's, so here's kind of like the main. So I think there's a lot to talk about. So, you know, I'll make a recommendation now and later in more detail that I think, I don't know. have you ever seen a mental health treatment provider like a therapist? Yeah, like right after that, like right after my mom died, we were assigned to someone who was very kind.

But I don't know, she was a therapist, but it also felt like just talking to a friend, to be honest, like nothing really, there's not really anything that came out of it. Yeah. So a lot of times when we, you know, when people come on here, I'll say, you know, you should consider working with our coaches or work with a therapist. In your case, I'd say you should definitely work with a therapist. Yeah, but I was going to sign up for a coach at first, but I figured probably that's too much. I mean, like, I think coaching is, I'm sure that coaching will, you'll do well in coaching, but I think for what I'm about to explain, I think

therapy is definitely like worthwhile. Now, so I just want to be clear. So I'm not sure that you know, you have an illness or anything. I'm not diagnosing you with anything. But like what it really is, huh? I've been diagnosed with PTSD, but somehow I don't feel like, it's weird to say it. Unless this feeling of like completely numbed out emotions is part of it. I don't really see it all that much.

It is part of it. Okay. We're going to explain that in a second. But I'm not surprised. Anyone is going to diagnose you with PTSD just to be saying. given your story because there's no way that this stuff happens to you and you don't wind up with PTSD. At the same time, I don't know that there's really like a clinical, like, you know, there are a lot of questions that when we diagnose with someone with PTSD, like you have nightmares, flashbacks,

things like that. But I think that like this is definitely, so here's what I'm hearing from you, Doc, is that your life and your experiences have shaped the way that you interact with life. Yeah, definitely. Right? So, and the biggest thing is like, so this is now a psychological term. So I get some degree of, I think probably depersonalization. So with trauma, our brains can do two things. They can create a situation of de-realization or depersonalization. So de-realization is the feeling that the world that you're existing in does not feel real.

You were real, but the world becomes fake. So it's like, I feel like I am living in a video game. The other thing that people experience is sort of the opposite, which I think you're more depersonalization, which is that I'm like, I feel like I'm not actually living my life, but I'm watching a character who's like playing a video game take the actions of my life. So I am not real. I think I would even like describe it as me being prepared. who's playing the character.

Like, it's really to explain, but like it feels like I'm remote controlling myself. Absolutely. So did I say the word controller? Or was I just thinking? So, so what, like, anyway. So the other way that I kind of think about it is like, you know, I do get the sense that you are controlling yourself living life, right? Like, Doc is playing the character of whatever your real name is,

who is existing, you know, presumably in Germany in 2021. So that sounds to me like depersonalization. And that's actually a feature of trauma. And if we really look at it, like, why does this happen? It's because when we have these very traumatic experiences, our mind kind of unplugs from the reality of it. And so in some cases, like these periods will be like very, very, like acute and temporary.

So people will have like periods of de-realization where it's. almost like they're like, you know, on psilocybin or LSD or something where they like kind of feel like completely disconnected and it's like a trippy kind of surreal, sometimes scary experience. Sometimes they'll also be associated with like amnesia episodes where like people will have a fugue state where you wake up in a different place like 30 hours later and you have no memory of it. So our brain has. Yeah, it can be weird. But like our brain has all these mechanisms to essentially like unplug from traumatic situations because they hurt. And it's been really interesting because the first thing that you said is that, you know, I feel like I'm living life in the third

person. And then just now when we kind of, when you cried for, you know, some amount of time and it's been a while, you said like you try to avoid it because it feels real. And I'm making it real again when I think about it. So I think it's good to make it real in a way. Like it's hard to expand. Yeah. So we'll talk. So that's the thing, right? So I want you to just pay attention to like the language that I'm sending back at you. Life feels like not realish, right? Like I'm living it in the third person. Like there's no point in the made quest. It's all about the side quests. It's about the periphery. It's not about like my life. Third person, autopilot, side characters, side quests. You are the NPC in other people's lives instead of being the PC. Right? Like you're like,

Like, it's kind of weird. Like, even when it comes to your romantic relationships and stuff like that, you are the person that they have to date before they find the one they love. You're like the NPC in their story. It's not your story. They're attracted to you. They're infatuated with you. They approach you. So you're like, you know, it's kind of weird.

I got a really good. This is something that I talked about with my old puripist ones where she was asking me since I told her, since I also told her that I felt. like some sort of superiority almost over people. Like just from like a cognitive point, not actually feeling like I'm better as like I'm a better person or I'm more just but I can do more sometimes. And she asked me if I felt like a king. I said and I replied,

I think the best like the best summary of what I feel like is when I said, I'd rather be the, I'd rather be the person telling the king what to do rather than the actual king. makes sense like I want to be an advisor. It feels more comfortable. Yeah. So that's the role of the NPC, right? It's like they're not, yeah. So I think that there's just a very, it feels to me like there's a very simple connection

between making it real again and like living your main quest. Because I think what you've managed to do is like put your main quest on pause, like on purpose and for survival. because it's just too much, man. Like, there's just too much. Right? There's like all the low value stuff from early on. Like not like, and that would have been enough, man.

That's enough to get you on stream. That's enough to talk about. And then you toss in. Yeah, go ahead. Sorry, I just wanted to say that this is like one of the weirdest things to tell people. But like I do believe that to some extent at least, what happened like the stuff that was continuously happening in my childhood and like a bunch of a point where people stopped bullying me and where it started getting actually like popular

that stuff probably sticks more to my head than anything else it's as weird as it sounds no so i don't think that sounds weird at all like so you can i mean you even told us that it can be a confusing observation that your teacher bullying you feels more traumatic than you know i feel we aren't even saying this, but your stepfather killing your mom and then committing suicide. And yet, I encourage everyone to just notice that if we want to be good scientists, we need to let our observations shape our hypotheses instead of letting our hypotheses shape our observations. Right?

And if that's what your experience is, so much of like our, so much of the reason that we get the, okay, sorry. what are you feeling? For me it's just I don't know how to explain it I think it's just like the nature of it being such a continuous thing and it's not even just about like teachers bullying me

I could have tapped with that it's the fact that everyone joined in and that feeling of like there's nothing desirable about me and that's something that is really hard to shake even now I often feel like I can actually see a lot of

people relating to this when friends call me up and asked me to come out. Oftentimes I'd say no, even though I know I would have more fun going out with them than I would have staying in just because I don't want to feel that I don't want to feel uncomfortable in the way that I feel like when I'm outside, I'm exposing myself to just the chance that I might do something that might make people look bad at me. Like, it might make people look at me in a way that's just, like, I'm weird again, something like that. Even though I know it's not going to happen. It's just something that always stays in my mind.

Yeah, absolutely, right? And the reason it stays in your mind is because it was put into your mind over and over and over and over and over again. This is where when we get to your sort of like asexuality and inability to be infatuated with people, because I think that like this is where, you know, this is a little bit more bread and butter. you have to really think a little bit about if you cared about someone and if you were in love, how would it, so you have that kernel, like you have that core of unloavableness, right? Like everyone dogpiling on. And as long as that exists, I don't think you will let yourself fall in love with anyone.

I think so too. I'd have to be very, very comfortable with that person for what to happen. And that's where like, so it seems that when you get your, you know, your, your, your, your twin, your mental clone, like that you can actually start to have those sorts of feelings. But I think it's sort of like, because it's just too much of a risk, right? It's going to hurt. Like, it's fine for teachers and other randos to bully you. Like, it's fine for your friends who you don't don't really know who you are to like not invite you somewhere, totally fine. But if you let yourself love someone and they respond to you in the way that many people have

in which you're terrified of happening, like, that's going to be too much. Yeah, because, and the weird thing is it's not even like the, it's going to sound bad, I think. It's not even like about me being afraid to lose someone that I know as much as I'm afraid to lose that slight grip on reality that I have, but maybe there is something lovable about me, if that makes sense. Exactly. So that's, so you're absolutely, because, because right now, there's still a question mark, right? In your mind, there's still a question mark that maybe I am

lovable. But if ever you love and that person finds you unlovable, then it's like, it's going to be the final nail in the coffin. Yeah. Which makes perfect. I mean, it's not true, but it makes perfect sense. Does that make sense? Like, do you understand the difference there? Yeah. Okay. So, and this is why I think this is really like therapy level stuff. So, so like, like when you, when you have someone who has been through as much as you have, I think it takes really like a good therapist to help you start the process of like making life real again. Because I don't think it's like, it's not like a malfunction. It's a survival mechanism. Right. So you've depersonalized. You've like withdrawn from life because life like hurts way too much.

Yeah, pretty much. And this is where you can also get into other kinds of things like, like, you know, maybe the reason that the teacher's bullying you hurts more is because you'll let yourself get closer to that. Whereas like when it comes to your mom, you really have to do your level best because the guilt and stuff especially. We haven't even touched on that. But like that, you know, so like all those things, Doc, I think at the end of the day, like I think you are a good person. I'm not just saying that because I'm Dr. K. I think like genuinely like you seem like a good dude. Right. And I'm not trying to pity you, but like I think I get to a little bit,

right? I don't like you because I pity you, but I think like you got to let me pity you somewhat. And I can like you as a person independent of the pity. I hope you can see that like I can see you as being a good dude. I mean, you're dank, you made some money on crypto, you're busting out the lull analogies, and maybe that's you being a chameleon for me. You know, but I don't think so. But it's also, it's a little bit, but this is also like part of my co-personality. Just, I like making these metaphors, but are easy to. So, like, I can like you for those reasons and have compassion and pity because it sounds like, boy, have you been through a lot. I guess that's like this sort of thing that prevents me from telling people because I don't want them to think that I'm just saying it for attention because that's like.

Yeah, because you saw an uncle do that and you know what that, you know what manipulating people into compassion looks like and you don't want to do that, which makes sense. Yeah. So, so, you know, just the last thing that I'd leave you with doc is like there's this principle from from Indian philosophy called Advait Vedanta, which I think is a very useful. way to overcome conflicting emotions. And what Advait Vedanta says is that essentially like dualism or conflict is like an artificial construction of the mind and that reality just has like one quality. So like if we think about, you know, is this a good glass of water or a bad glass of water? Like neither.

It's just a good glass of water. Whether it's good or bad has to do with. the constructions that my mind puts on top of it. And so I'd say your road forward involves probably some combination of like therapy to start out. Second thing is you have to learn how to love again. Yeah. And then third thing on a really spiritual level, and I think this is your main quest, because I think that some of these qualities that you describe about the plebs and like your level of awareness actually speaks to me of a certain

spiritual IQ, right? Like, it's not even necessarily emotional. I think it even extends kind of beyond that. And then I think your real happiness is going to be when you can sit, and this is also kind of involved in treatment for PPD, for example, like when you have all of these conflicting emotions that like both of them can coexist and be real. And ultimately, like, even beyond that, you don't even have a head or a heart. That's actually an artificial construction. And what you are is like just something that's even formless. But that takes time. And you know, you can do that long term.

I guess to a degree, formless, that's something that I really do feel. But I guess in a more negative sort of way. Yeah. So for. Yeah. So that form like so even formless is like not ad fight. Because formless and form is actually like two opposites. Right.

So there's there's a way to. even transcend that axis and not feel formless or feel form, but just to feel. I feel, period. Not anything on the other end. And I know it's getting kind of weird and abstract there, but like just for you to kind of exist. And as you understand Advaite, then you do particular kinds of meditation practices, you know, like this sort of idea that like it clearly isn't your fault what happened to your mom and you feel responsible. So those two things can feel conflicting and you can work on transcending both of those. Yeah.

That's going to be hard. It's going to be hot. That's step three. End of the main quest, my dude. Step one is seriously, you should see a therapist, man. And it's just like you, you deserve some help in the process of putting yourself back together, which I think it's clear you're a survivor. And like you've managed amazingly well with, you know, a lot.

lot of bad RNG. I mean, I mean, I also like for this session, I've been only talking about like bad stuff in my life, but I think something that really helped me cope, weirdly enough, is just like the exact opposite of what's plagued me in my earlier years because nowadays I'm very sort of popular where I live. people there's a lot of people who I can trust

at least like my brain knows I can trust them like they're just metaphorically speaking again my heart will never do but it's like it will always tell me that I shouldn't but I know that I can I love these people to death

and they've been really good at keeping me company over like my worst time of it of course as I said again so it's a funny story actually I met these people, like most of my nowadays best friends at all. I met them in my time working in my casino.

They used to be like in a school next to mine. We were just like very, very, very, like far acquaintances, I'd say. Like we didn't really know each other will, but we knew each other's names. That's it. We just started talking and just turned out that they were the type of people who were like extremely compatible with the person that I am. when I'm at my most comfortable, if that makes sense, because they are the type to, if they have a problem with you, they'll just straight up tell you. They don't have any, like, they don't really

talk about anyone behind their backs, but they'll just make fun of you right in front of your face. And then they'll also make sure that you know it's okay, though. Like, they'll make fun of you, but they're trying to make you laugh with them. I love these people today. And they help me a lot with what's going on back then. And also, stupid thing to say, but there's, there's, just there's a server on disco, there's a few people who really helped me just by being who they are. They know

they're probably watching too. Oh, sorry. Was that me or you? That was me. Need something? I don't know. Anyway, I'm sure if it's... Yeah. Sorry, but it sounds like you've had

a lot of really important people who have helped you through hard times, both in in person and on Discord. Yeah. And to a degree, taking care of my sister also really, in a way, gave me a goal that I'd been, I don't know, previously didn't think I had just something to do, basically. Yeah. And it felt really nice to like see her grow up to be like a really well-adjusted and nice

person. And I often like to say that she's like, who I would be. be if I didn't have any problems at all. Like, not, uh, I didn't have any, like, behavioral, behavioral problems, if that makes sense. She's, um, I know, she's got strength for her. I got weaknesses, basically. She's, I'm very proud of her for that.

It's been, but it just feels good to like, what would she say? What would she say about you? I'm pretty sure. I could just ask her right now, but I'm pretty sure that she would probably say, um, she, She's often said, like, even in front of her friends, but I'm more of her father than my brother.

And she's also, like, told me occasionally that I'm her best friend. And it's just, I don't know, it feels nice to, like, know that there's really some people who deem me as important, I guess. Yeah. I would imagine you're very important to her. Now we have a good cry. Is this a good cry or a bad cry? Yeah. I was hoping you couldn't see.

I hope it was. I was hoping the camera quality wasn't good enough for that. This is a good cry. I guess something that I already knew, but just kind of proof to myself again just by talking about it, that makes sense. But yeah, this is a good cry. Yeah, good.

Well, I think, Doc, thank you very much for coming on. It requires balls of steel, my friend. It's been very rewarding. Yeah. I'm just glad you, I'm glad you let me. It's really nice talking to you, seriously. Yeah. You're very welcome, man.

I really am glad you came on and, you know, give your sister a hug for me. I will. All right. Take care, man. Thank you so much. You too. Ah, damn, chat. All right, so I know we normally meditate this time, but I am, ooh, dude.

I cannot teach meditation right now. Thank you.