Here's Where It Gets Interesting - 152. Momentum: The Ripples Made by Ordinary People, Part 7

Episode Date: July 8, 2022

On today’s episode of our special series, Momentum: Civil Rights in the 1950s, Sharon establishes the foundation of another man who played a pivotal role in Brown v. The Board of Education. Today, in 2022, the idea of someone serving as Chief Justice of the U.S. Supreme Court with no previous experience working in the Judicial Branch of government, would be unheard of. And it would certainly be unheard of for a gubernatorial candidate to win both the Republican AND Democratic primaries when running for office in California. However, that is exactly what prosecutor, turned Governor, turned Chief Justice did, in what would become a 50-year career of public service for Earl Warren.  Justice Warren carried his national prominence to the Supreme Court, and was determined to have all 9 Justices agree on the Brown vs. The Board of Education decision. The makeup of the high court proved to be consequential, as the Justices brought a broad diversity of viewpoints, rather than consisting only of professional judges. While Justice Warren was ultimately successful in leading the court to making a unanimous decision, the President who appointed him – President Dwight D. Eisenhower – would come too deeply regret his decision to appoint him. How did Earl Warren and Thurgood Marshall know each other, prior to meeting in the courtroom? And how do wiretaps from the FBI tie into all of this through a secret bureau program? Hosted on Acast. See acast.com/privacy for more information. To learn more about listener data and our privacy practices visit: https://www.audacyinc.com/privacy-policy Learn more about your ad choices. Visit https://podcastchoices.com/adchoices

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Whether you're helping that special person take their content up a notch or adding that extra quality to your own shoots, Canon's got you covered. Shop the Level up sales event today at canon.ca. Hello friends. Welcome. Welcome to episode 7 of Momentum, our special series, which is about everyday Americans and the struggle for freedom during the Civil Rights era. I'm Sharon McMahon, and welcome to the Sharon Says So podcast. We've already talked extensively about J. Edgar Hoover and Thurgood Marshall.

I've already told you that Thurgood Marshall was a secret FBI informant and that J. Edgar Hoover was wiretapping phone conversations of members of the Supreme Court. We've discussed many of the people involved in a Supreme Court case of the utmost importance, Brown versus the Board of Education. We've talked about Linda Brown and many of the other people who agreed to do the important work of ending racial segregation in the United States. Today I want to chat with you about a man named Earl Warren. Earl Warren was a man born in the 1800s in California to Scandinavian immigrants. He eventually graduated from college and went to law school and then began a 50-year career

in public service. He was a prosecutor in California and became widely known for going after things like organized crime, illegal gambling, prostitutions, things that were viewed as society's ills in the 1930s. Earl Warren made a name for himself prosecuting those people. And he later went on to do something that is basically unheard of in the United States today. He won both the Republican and the Democratic primary elections for governor of California. So needless to say, he was elected governor. In fact, he won three terms as governor of California. He eventually ran for vice president. He did not win the vice presidency,

but his national prominence continued to grow. It was during that time that he started developing some bad blood with another California politician you may have heard of named Richard Nixon. Richard Nixon had presidential aspirations as well, and he wanted Earl Warren's support. And Earl Warren ultimately threw his support behind another man you may have heard of, Dwight Eisenhower. Dwight Eisenhower later made Richard Nixon his vice president. And of course, Richard Nixon went on to become the president who resigned in disgrace. But because Earl Warren openly

campaigned for Eisenhower, Eisenhower promised Earl Warren that the first time a seat on the United States Supreme Court became available, that he would give it to him. In 1953, the Chief Justice of the Supreme Court, Justice Vinson, had a massive heart attack and died in office shortly after Brown versus the Board of Education was argued. So Eisenhower made good on his promise. He nominated Earl Warren to the Supreme Court, really thinking Earl Warren is a man kind of like me. He's a man who transcends party, whose popularity is widespread, a pragmatic realist who cared about people. He was a man who dedicated his life to public service, just like Dwight Eisenhower. And so Eisenhower elevated Earl Warren to the role of Chief Justice of the United States Supreme Court. And he later deeply regretted that choice.

I told you in a previous episode that the case Brown v. Board of Education had to be argued twice. And the first time, as I mentioned, was when the previous Chief Justice Fred Vinson was still alive. And then it was re-argued after Earl Warren was seated. And one of the things I think is very, very interesting to note is that Earl Warren had never been a judge. He had worked as an attorney, as a prosecutor, but he had never worked in the judicial branch of government. And also, very interestingly, neither had four of the other Supreme Court justices in the early 1950s. It is very interesting to think that five of the nine Supreme Court justices in 1954 did not have meaningful judicial experience. One of them worked for a very brief time in a police night court, and the others had different types of

governmental experience. But this ended up being quite consequential. They had a very broad diversity of viewpoints. So we, of course, know that Earl Warren was the governor of California. Justice Frankfurter had been a law professor. William Douglas came from working at the Securities and Exchange Commission. Robert Jackson had been an attorney general. working at the Securities and Exchange Commission. Robert Jackson had been an attorney general.

And Hugo Black is the one who had briefly been a police night court judge early on in his career. By contrast, of course, today's Supreme Court justices are professional judges. And being a professional judge certainly has its advantages. It really acclimates you to how the legal system works and what judicial thinking is like in ways that perhaps being an attorney general or a governor don't. The relationship between J. Edgar Hoover and Earl Warren began in the 1930s when Earl Warren was still working in California as a prosecutor. And we now have declassified documents that were uncovered and FOIA requested. By the way, a FOIA request stands for Freedom of Information Act. And that is where a private citizen can say

to the government, I would like these papers. And as long as they are no longer classified and you are willing to pay a fee to get them, the government has to send them to you. And this FOIA request uncovered a program that was called Cooperation with Governor Earl Warren. And these files show that during the time period between 1948 and 1953, the FBI gave secret information to Earl Warren. In fact, in this document, J. Edgar Hoover had written, quote, he should be advised that the information is furnished in strictest confidence, end quote. So that is demonstrating that the FBI is telling Earl Warren things secretly. And these documents also reflect that the FBI sometimes did favors for Earl Warren, like providing him with a private car and driver. J. Edgar Hoover had written in these documents,

Whatever the governor requests, I want prompt attention recorded it. J. Edgar Hoover and Earl Warren would later part ways. I'm Jenna Fisher. And I'm Angela Kinsey. We are best friends. And together we have the podcast Office Ladies, where we rewatched every single episode of The Office with insane behind-the-scenes stories, hilarious guests, and lots of laughs. Guess who's sitting next to me? Steve! It is my girl in the studio! Every Wednesday, we'll be sharing even more exclusive stories from The Office and our friendship with brand new guests. And we'll be digging into our mailbag to answer your questions and comments. So join us for brand new Office Ladies 6.0 episodes every Wednesday.

Plus, on Mondays, we are taking a second drink. You can revisit all the Office Ladies rewatch episodes every Monday with new bonus tidbits before every episode. Well, we can't wait to see you there. Follow and listen to Office Ladies on the free Odyssey app and wherever you get your podcasts. Earl Warren also knew Thurgood Marshall before he became Chief Justice of the Supreme Court, justice of the Supreme Court, because in 1943, the family of a nine-year-old girl named Sylvia Mendez filed a lawsuit because Sylvia and her brothers were blocked from attending an all-white school in Orange County, California. The school district officials had told them, no, you know,

you need to attend the Mexican school. And so on behalf of 5,000 other Mexican Americans, the Mendez family filed a class action lawsuit. And ultimately, the outcome of that lawsuit, which Thurgood Marshall wrote a brief for, was that the Ninth Circuit, which is a section of the judicial branch, the federal judicial branch in the United States, the Ninth Circuit said school segregation violates the 14th Amendment. This is the 1940s. And shortly after that, Governor Earl Warren signed a bill into law ending public school segregation in the state of California. I should also note that one of history's biggest criticisms of Earl Warren was that he was a very strong supporter of Japanese internment during World War II. Japanese internment was an official United States government program

that forced Japanese Americans living on the Pacific coast of the United States to, in many cases, give up their businesses, give up their homes, and force them to move into internment camps away from the coast. The fear was that after Japan attacked Pearl Harbor in Hawaii, that people who were of Japanese descent might feel like they wanted to assist Japan. And FDR and other government officials like Earl Warren worked to relocate people of Japanese descent into internment camps further inland, in many cases in other states. Later in Thurgood Marshall's career, he was asked about when he headed to the Supreme Court to argue Brown

versus the Board of Education for a second time. And the interviewer asked Thurgood Marshall, what did you think of Earl Warren going into the Brown case? And Thurgood Marshall responded, well, when Earl Warren was appointed by the president, I was given the job of finding out what he was all about. And I went out to California and I checked both sides. I checked the conservatives and the liberals, and all of them said the same thing, that the man was simply great. Great. And the two judges on the state Supreme Court, well, they both said, if he doesn't do right, you call us up and we'll come and kick his butt. Except they didn't use the word butt. And the interviewer asked Thurgood Marshall, so you came into this case thinking,

well, I got a chance, and Thurgood Marshall said, you're darn right, and that was the first time I thought we might have a five to four, five to four decision. Of course, there's nine justices on the Supreme Court, and that is what Thurgood Marshall thought he had a hope of. He thought he had the hope of convincing five of those justices to see his side and to end legalized segregation in America's schools. Warren had already demonstrated that he was against school segregation segregation and he was determined as the new chief justice to try to get all nine justices to unanimously agree on the outcome of Brown versus the Board of Education. Earl Warren felt like if any justices dissented, that means disagreed, if any of them dissented, that it would be a license for segregationists around the country

to say, we don't need to listen to that. We don't need to desegregate. It's only five people. They can't tell us what to do. Look at four people disagreed. Earl Warren saw that writing on the wall and wanted to erase it before it even happened. Thurgood Marshall later talked about how he had been informed that one of the Supreme Court justices, Justice Reed, had hired a law clerk specifically to write a dissent in Brown v. Board of Education. Justice Reed knew that his words would be carefully scrutinized and he wanted to give it the proper attention it deserved, but he already knew going into it that he was going to dissent. He was not going to vote to end school segregation in the United States. had been in the hospital. And Chief Justice Earl Warren went to the hospital, brought Justice Reed the papers, the files from the case. And Earl Warren said to Justice Reed, it's up to you. Is it going to be you or the country? And Justice Reed thought about it for a moment and decided to vote with the other eight justices

and create a unanimous Supreme Court opinion ending school segregation in the United States. Thurgood Marshall later recounted that as he was listening to the decision being read, Justice Reed, who checked himself out of the hospital to be there for the release of the opinion because he wanted that unanimity. He wanted that cohesive unit of nine men reading from the bench. Thurgood Marshall said Justice Reed would not stop staring at him. And so Thurgood Marshall started staring back at him. And Marshall was certain that Justice Reed was going to dissent because, remember, he'd been informed about this law clerk who had been hired. And so Thurgood Marshall was shocked when a unanimous opinion was delivered. And Justice Reed later talked about how he just wanted to see the look on Thurgood Marshall's face.

And so he never stopped staring at him during the entire time it was being read. One of Earl Warren's biographers would later say that Earl Warren understood that a unanimous Supreme Court would couple a legal result with a sense of moral imperative. I also find this fascinating about the Brown versus Board decision. The court could have gone further. They could have ended all segregation in the United States and said that the 14th Amendment protects people from racial segregation and everywhere that it exists, it needs to stop. They could have done that, but they didn't. They stopped at ending school segregation. And Earl Warren did that purposely. He was worried that if the court issued an overly broad, sweeping judgment that all segregation needed to end immediately, that people would just ignore it.

It would not have any effect. Nothing would, in fact, become desegregated. But because he was specifically ordering public schools, which are government institutions, to desegregate, the government itself has much more control over those institutions. And so even though it did not go so far as to end all legal segregation, it did have other positive effects. One of the things that it did was embolden civil rights activists. It gave them hope. It gave them encouragement. It allowed them to create more momentum to work for change. It led to desegregation efforts in other places. So Earl Warren had worried that if they went too far, it would result in chaos. but if they kept it more narrow, their ability to enforce it would be greater.

The opinion was purposely written in more plain English than many previous Supreme Court decisions. Supreme Court decisions use the vocabulary of the law. They're written for legal professionals, and it's not always the easiest thing for the average person to just sit down and read. It's not a best-selling novel. But they purposely crafted Brown versus the Board of Education so that the average white Southerner, the average segregationist would be able to look at it and understand what it said. And this is one of the quotes from the Brown versus the Board of Education opinion written by Chief Justice Earl Warren. It said, segregation of white and colored children in public schools has a detrimental effect upon the colored children. Of course, remember that

colored was a phrase that was socially acceptable to use at the time that we no longer use. was a phrase that was socially acceptable to use at the time that we'd no longer use. The impact is greater when it has the sanction of the law, for the policy of separating the races is usually interpreted as denoting the inferiority of the Negro group. Any language in contrary to this finding is rejected. We conclude that in the field of public education, the doctrine of separate but equal has no place. Separate educational facilities are inherently unequal. So this decision was issued on May 17th, 1954. And the next day, May 18th, the New York Times said, The highest court in the land, the guardian of our national conscience, has reaffirmed its faith and the undying American faith in the equality of all men and all children before the law. The Washington Post said,

it is not too much to speak of the court's decision as a new birth of freedom. Abroad, as well as at home, this decision will engender a renewal of faith in democratic institutions and ideals. Rosa Parks was later interviewed about listening to the Brown versus Board of Education opinion, and she said, you can't imagine the rejoicing among Black people and some white people when the Supreme Court decision came down in May of 1954. Many of us saw how the same idea applied to other things like public transportation. It was a very hopeful time. African Americans believed that at last there was a real chance to change the segregation laws. And Martin Luther King said, to change the segregation laws. And Martin Luther King said, for all men of goodwill, May 17th, 1954 marked a joyous end to the long night of enforced segregation.

This decision brought hope to millions of disinherited Negroes who had formerly dared only to dream of freedom. And a letter sent by a man named William Patterson to Walter White, who was the secretary of the NAACP, where Thurgood Marshall worked, said, Dear Mr. White, permit me to congratulate you on the great victory for democracy won under your leadership. The decision of the Supreme Court will have extremely far-reaching reverberations, even if it is not yet implemented. The struggle for much implementation, as will end the Jim Crow systems, can have a tremendous educational value. The opposition to the immediate ending of the practice of segregation indicates the demoralizing effect of segregated schools on white youth. It has made bigots out of millions who have not learned in their separate schools that there are no superior people. You have rendered a great service. May it be a continuing one. Sincerely yours, William Patterson.

And what he didn't know is that William Patterson would soon be imprisoned and men like him purged from the ranks of the NAACP because of J. Edgar Hoover. I'll see you next time. Thank you so much for listening to the Sharon Says So podcast. I am truly grateful for you. And I'm wondering if you could do me a quick favor. am truly grateful for you. And I'm wondering if you could do me a quick favor. Would you be willing to follow or subscribe to this podcast or maybe leave me a rating or a review? Or if you're feeling extra generous, would you share this episode on your Instagram stories or with a friend? All of those things help podcasters out so much. This podcast was written and researched by Sharon

McMahon and Heather Jackson. It was produced by Heather Jackson, edited and mixed by our audio producer, Jenny Snyder, and hosted by me, Sharon McMahon. I'll see you next time. And hosted by me, Sharon McMahon. I'll see you next time.