Hidden True Crime - CHAD DAYBELL TRIAL: Chad's Defense Narrative Exposed on the day Tammy Daybell was killed

Episode Date: April 28, 2024

On Tuesday, photos of Tammy Daybell were shown to the jury and the Coroner, Brenda Dye, testified along with emergency personal and first responders that came to the scene that morning. The 911 call was played on October 19th when Chad called to say he found his wife dead. Our interviews with Heather Daybell are sourced in this podcast. Listen to Heather Daybell's full three-part interview with us: PART ONE PART TWO PART THREE Join Hidden True Crime as we follow Chad Daybell's trial beginning to end. Host Lauren Matthias is in the courtroom every day, doing lunch lives on YouTube and summarizing each day and week right here on Hidden: A True Crime Podcast. LAUREN MATTHIAS was a television reporter for a decade, and has followed the Lori Vallow and Chad Daybell case since 2019. Lauren and her husband John Matthias, a criminal psychologist, started Hidden True Crime in 2020 with their Season: 'Beyond the Veil' a psychological deep dive into the doomsday murders and prophet.  A podcast that started at their dinner table has now turned into the dynamic husband and wife duo of Dr. John Matthias, a forensic psychologist, and Lauren Matthias, an investigative journalist, delving into the psychological facets of unthinkable crimes every week. Thank you for your support through sponsorships, subscribing, listening, and becoming at Patreon member at Patreon.com/HiddenTrueCrime Our Sponsors:* Check out Acorns: https://acorns.com/HIDDENTRUECRIME* Check out Acorns: https://acorns.com/HIDDENTRUECRIME* Check out Armoire and use my code HIDDENTRUECRIME for a great deal: https://www.armoire.style* Check out Effecty and use my code HIDDENTRUECRIME for a great deal: https://www.effecty.com* Check out Happy Mammoth and use my code HIDDENTRUECRIME for a great deal: https://happymammoth.comSupport this podcast at — https://redcircle.com/hidden-a-true-crime-podcast1836/donationsAdvertising Inquiries: https://redcircle.com/brandsPrivacy & Opt-Out: https://redcircle.com/privacy Learn more about your ad choices. Visit podcastchoices.com/adchoices

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dot com just use code hidden true crime to save 20% off plus if you subscribe you'll get an additional 20% off discover your true age today hey hidden gems hello hello i was in court today and it was an important day to be in court because of the body language what we saw from chad dabel what we saw from jurors what uh we saw from john prior and i'm going to tell you everything as well as some contradictions that we have heard from people. And so I also want to share with you the notes that I was taking. These were all the things I wanted to share with you while we were hearing from people during the report of Tammy Daybell's death and the 911 call.

And I just want to first relay there were jurors crying during the Brandon Boudreau testimony, a couple of them. So that's something to note too. I did see tears from the jurors today. It was when Brandon Boudreau was testifying. So first off, Chad just looked at picks of Tammy on the computer right before the sidebar. And there was zero emotion. Okay, this is something you needed to see in the courtroom.

And I have corroborated this now with multiple witnesses. In fact, I'm getting texts after I knew this and saw this. And the person next to me saw it. And the person next to me saw it. There was somebody else that texted me and confirmed the same thing. So do you guys remember the moment? This is a moment where they're playing the 911 call. So for Chad Daybell, Chad Dayball is the one making the 911 call for his wife Tammy

because he is allegedly just found Tammy dead in her bed at 6 a.m. And also let's talk about the fact that Garth called and he didn't know what to say. And then Chad took the phone from him. What was that? And Chad starts getting emotional halfway through. the 911 call and Pryor puts his hand on Chad's back and at that moment so before that Chad just like making like a cry face. Pryor puts his hand on Chad's back like he's comforting him and then the tears but there

weren't tears the crocodile tears start coming he grabs a tissue he wipes his eyes and he was really able to like there was what looked like and tears or not tears. It doesn't really matter if there were tears or if there weren't tears because the jury can't tell. The jury's far enough away from them. They're looking right at them, but they would be far enough away to not be able to tell if there were tears or not tears. But it was clear from, I think, the video and other people looking that Chad was making a face that looked like he was crying moment.

But here's where it matters. Those were the most tears that came out of Chad Daybell. And again, by tears, you can call them not tears, not not tears, take your pick. I did not see tears, but let's give them the benefit of the doubt and say that there were tears. That was the only time that Chad Daybell was really, really specifically crying. Okay. Well, this matters. This matters.

At the sidebar, during the sidebar, and I'm going to make sure I get my timing right, and other people have written me about this and said the exact same thing. I'll read you another text I got. this is what the three people on my bench happened to see. Chad was looking at pictures of Tammy deceased. So while they were having the sidebar deciding whether or not to show the pictures of Tammy to the gallery, Chad was seeing them on his computer. He did not cry.

They were looking at them. They were scrolling through them. Chad was not crying. He was able to look at those okay. Let's give Chad the benefit of the doubt for a second. And let's suggest that he really was crying while listening to the 911 call he made telling the 911 operator that Tammy was dead on October 19, 2019. Who was he crying for? He could have been crying for himself, remembering this tragic moment,

where he had to call 911, and he had to let them know his wife was dead, that this was hard for him. Because I'll tell you, when he was looking at photos of Tammy, he wasn't crying. I'll say that as much. Here are a couple of texts I received. I want to share. I'll keep. This is somebody that was another witness that didn't see what I said,

and he wanted to let me know that this is what he saw. And they said, I could see on Pryor's laptop, him going, through those death photos of Tammy DeBell. Chad did not appear to have any problems with looking at those without emotion. The over and under on how many tissues he was going to need when the jury saw the photos, up to eight. But in reality, zero. No emotion when he was the one looking at those photos.

And I'll actually disagree with this witness on the fact that he said he would maybe need up to eight tissues while the jury looked at those photos. photos because I was actually really close to Chad Dayball while he looked at the photos. And I was watching and I saw him grab a tissue. In fact, this is one of those moments that I wanted to put this in chat and I couldn't. So I was I was keeping my notes here. I said he's holding a tissue in his hand. He just grabbed it. He's not doing anything with it yet. He's crying. But he hasn't moved his hand or used the tissue he is holding. From my end, it looks like crocodile tears. He just can't muster a tear. No tissue used. Chad has now just put his non-used

tissue down and he drank some water at the beginning of the next sidebar. He has cry face as he looks at the jurors during the sidebar, but zero tears. He's now, not even holding the non-used tissue while making the cry face. So when was Chad Daybell crying or giving him the benefit of the doubt crying? The most, the biggest cry face when John Pryor put his hand on Chad's back and Chad looked to a breakdown, that was when he was listening to his 911 call saying that Tammy Daybal was dead, telling the 911 operator that Tammy Daybilt was dead. when was he not showing any emotion when now four different people five three people four five people

have now seen that he was looking at Tammy Davell's photos and showing no emotion when nobody knew he was looking no one and he was sad from what I could see that when he was watching the jury look at photos of Tammy DeVell. He appeared to be sad. That was what I just read you, that I couldn't get on chat, was on our YouTube chat, that he was holding a tissue.

He grabbed it, was holding it. He never used it. He had a cry face. I did not ever see a tear. I did see a sad face. So that's what I saw, and it wasn't just me that saw it. After court,

I went and corroborated a lot of what I saw with other witnesses. That's what I do. I see what they saw. I looked behind me to see where another person might have a really, really good view of Chad Daybell. And then I went and spoke to both of them after court. I ran to them, hey, hey, can I talk and tell me what you saw as well? They also saw that. They saw the same thing.

They didn't see the computer, but they saw him not crying, not using. his tissue and only they specifically said we saw that he only sort of really honestly started really looking like he was crying, whatever that was after John Pryor touched his back. So looking at dead photos of his wife, his 49-year-old wife, that is how Chad Daybell reacted. I'm thinking we might have gotten more tears out of the jury today. You know who was having a lot harder time than Chad Daybell? Aunt Vicky, Tammy Daybell's aunt. At one point, she was crying, and at one point she needed to be escorted out of the courtroom.

She couldn't see the photos, too. They were not showing the gallery of the photos. I've seen them, and I'll tell you about them. I saw them last year. But she was at one point escorted out of the courtroom while the jury looked at photos and while they were being described by the people unseen by a bailiff. only to come back once that point of court was done. So she had to leave.

Chad held a tissue. Just found my mom. She's on the... Chad doesn't know. Are you in Madison County or Fremont County? She's clearly good. Chad takes the phone. Oh, we don't...

Oh, sorry. Okay. Okay. Are you in Rexburg or? Did your address show the Rexburg address that you're in Fremont County? Sorry, guys. Okay. Who was he crying for?

Oh, man. I'm going to get somebody up to you right now, okay? So that moment where John Pryor tapped him on the back, that was that particular thing is what made him cry. So let's talk about the paintball gun. We know how I feel about the paintball gun. The paintball gun incident that we are no longer on our channel referring to as a paintball gun incident. Because if we call it a paintball gun incident, then John Pryor wins by changing that narrative. It is a gun.

It is a shooting. It is an attempted murder. Those are all the things we can try to call it and remember to call it on our channel. But John Pryor making this a paintball gun incident, it is not. And everybody knows that's been watching my channel, how I feel. Phil about the alleged shooting of Tammy Debeau on October 9th, 2019, where someone put a rifle in in front of her face and tried to shoot her. And she said that on the 911 call.

Pryor's saying that, no, she was only calling 911. 911. You don't call 911 when there's a paintball gun. But Pryor's trying to allege that that's why she was calling. And I want to call Pryor out for something. He questioned a witness. A woman who was there works for Rexburg Police Department on the scene

where she was there and she was relaying what happened. And this was the time code that I couldn't get because I wanted to show you how she explained that this whole thing happened because I'm going to contradict what she says, Chad said versus what Chad told somebody else. And I do have that.

But she's telling, but John Pryor is asking her about this paintball gun incident. that isn't a paintball gun incident, the not, the shooting. And she says, are you aware, are you aware that Tammy DeBow only referred to this as a paintball gun? And she never, ever referred to it as just a gun. And the woman said, that's not true.

You stopped it. You didn't play it. And he goes, oh, well, I wasn't aware. she aware she actually referred on her 911 call 10 days before she was murdered 10 days before she was murder 10 days before she was murder she calls about someone pointing a gun in her face and john prior saying oh i didn't realize she ever called anything else i don't know that let let's listen to the 911 call again and he played it and and the witness called them out they said well yeah she she called it a gun after but you didn't play it you didn't play it it was the guy on the stand thank you i actually looked at my

for that reason. I was like, I don't think this was the woman. I think it was the woman whose time code I don't have. It was the man sharing this. You're right. Thank you. Law enforcement, a male. I get all my witnesses mixed up. So just remember what I'm referring to is not her, the scene of death, which was the female witness, but the male law enforcement who, who, who answered the report of the shooting when Tammy Daybell called. So thank you for correcting me. So Tammy Gabel says on the 911 call, there's a gun. There's a rifle. It's in my face.

And John Pryor says to this witness, she never said that. She never called it a gun. And he said, well, you stop playing it. You stop playing the 911 call before we got there. Let me show you. October 9, 2019, 21 hours, 49 minutes, 20 seconds. Pretty much. Can I say, Sheriff, not this?

Hi, I need to report something. Okay, go ahead. What's the address? Okay. At 202 North, 1900 East, the corner with the blinking yellow light on Statenham Highway. Is it a suspicious person? Yes. Okay.

What was he wearing? He was all dressed in black and he had a sea mask on. And he said the blinking light now is where you saw him? No, no. I he's gone now because I pulled up into our driveway and he I was getting stuff out of the back to see in my car and suddenly he was there and he had a paintball gun and he was okay and he was going to shoot at me and I kept asking him what he was doing so I could tell it was a paintball thing and then he just kept doing it so I yelled to my

husband and then he took off running around the back of my house okay give you just one minute stay on the line with me okay so October 9 2019 21 hours, 50 minutes, 28 seconds. That was north 1900 years. We've been stuck. Yes. And Judge, I'm done with the, so I was listening pretty carefully.

I heard the word paintball gun and I heard the word paintball thing. Would you tell me on that tape where the word gun was used? Later on. Later on? Oh, are you telling me there's more evidence here? Of that recording, yes.

Where's that? More further on in that recording is they she talks more she talks I didn't hear that I heard it stop That's because you stopped it So there was mention of a gun is that right? I believe so You believe so yeah it's because you stopped it Let me play you The full 911 call

Here we go He didn't say anything or he just kept like he was holding the gun like he was holding the gun like he was, you know, had a rifle and was shooting at me. So, but nothing came out of the gun either. So I don't think it was loaded. He had a gun. It looked like a rifle or something. He was shooting at me.

It was a gun. Who do you think put into her brain that it was a paintball gun? It was the guy standing next to her not doing anything to protect his wife. Tammy Daybell told, the 911 operator, the truth. There is a man pointing a gun at me like a rifle or something. He's trying to shoot me. But nothing came out so I don't think it's loaded.

She didn't say, but there wasn't any paint in it. She knew exactly what it was, a rifle pointing at her. So I wanted to bring that up. That's important. That's really, really important. I hope that they get into that tomorrow and make sure that everybody knows that she knew it was a gun or a rifle. He was shooting a gun at her. I'm going to play something really important.

So it was the female witness. That's what I meant to say. It was the female witness. She was an excellent witness today. She was there on scene when Tammy Deba lost her life, lost her life, when Tammy Deba was murdered. When Tammy Deba was murdered. she explains what Chad told them and they read the report today of what Chad relayed happening and the most important part is when she shares that that Chad said that her body fell out of

the bed because her feet were tied up in the sheets and that pretty much her body fell except off the bed except for her feet because her feet were tied up in the sheets. Do you guys remember that? Do you remember that? We're going to listen to what he told Tammy Daybell to John, or excuse me, we're going to learn what he told to Heather Daybell. Heather Daybell is a sister-in-law of Chad. She is married to Chad's brother Matt.

And we're going to listen to what she saw that day. I'll kind of jump to when Tammy died. So Matt and I were here in Vegas for a conference. When the phone rings, Matt answers it's his parents and they said, Tammy has died. They don't know what happened. They just know Chad's called. Tammy died. That's all we know.

We'll try to get a hold of you, you know, when we know more. I am, I just, I'm weeping. I'm a, what? What's going on? on. Matt called Chad. He said, Chad, I have a conference I have to go to. I just want you to know mom and dad called. I'm so sorry. I will call you later when I can. So Matt leaves. I'm in this hotel room. Again, I'm not close to Chad, but I wanted to hear him. I wanted to hear what happened from him. Because again, this incessant knot in my gut is.

never left me. I called him, Chad, I'm so sorry what happened. Can you tell me what happened? And he lays out a very scripted story. She starts coughing, like 10 o'clock at night. She's coughing. And she's coughing so hard, she's like thrown up and stuff. But she calms down. But about midnight, she starts coughing again and finally calms down and he said then at like six in the morning um the sheets come off of me and i hear a thud and he said tammy had rolled off the bed so he said woke me up i went around and i could clearly see she was dead she was gone and he said she always her feet were always hot

when she slept at night. So she kept her feet off the bed. And so he said, you know, the weight of her feet had pulled her off the bed. And in my, I think this makes no sense. So he said, then I called

Garth, yelled out to Garth, come help me to put Tammy back on the bed. and he said she choked she and i said i said chad are you getting an autopsy done and he said no the coroner came he she could clearly see she had choked and she had choked because she'd thrown up she'd choked and that she died that's how she died to me this is new so that's the story i got and i he said and the funeral is in two days.

And I said, Chad, we're not even home. Can you wait until we, and his brother Paul was out of town as well. And he said, no, it's in two days. So Matt and I had to skip there. I mean, we got a rental car. We had flights to get home later in the week, but we got in a rental car, called my kids, can you bring me a dress to wear to the funeral?

We barely get to that funeral. And got to the funeral. So why did he say it was in two days? What was his need for it to be rushed? Most people don't realize how much their personal information is being bought and sold every day. Data brokers are making billions, pulling details about you from public records and the internet, and then packaging and selling it, usually without your consent. That's how your information lands in the hands of scammers, spammers, even stalkers.

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ORA gives you all of it, together, at the same price competitors charge for just one. one service. Start your free trial today at aura.com slash remove. Protect yourself now at ora.com slash remove. Explanation. He just said it's in two days. So Matt gets back from the conference. I'm, I'm a wreck. And I said, Matt, something's not right. I don't know what I'm thinking, but I sure hope Chad didn't neglect helping her or I don't know what's happened. And Matt said, do not accuse my brother. He was ticked at me. We didn't speak the entire drive back to Utah.

And I didn't flat out say Chad killed Tammy. I didn't say that, but I just, it didn't, it was not right. and so we go to the funeral the funeral to me was weird in that it was Chad spoke kids like no one outside of their little unit other than the bishop and this one of the songs they played

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Chad chose the Mormon hymn put your shoulder to the wheel. Before we get into everything else, that bombshell story. from Heather. Put your shoulder to the wheel is about continuing to work. It is not a funeral song in the Church of Jesus Christ, the Latter-day Saints. It's a song about working. It's a song about never giving up and to keep going and to work, work, work, sweep, sweep, sweep, publish, publish, publish, publish, um, on and on and on. That was the song he chose for Tammy Daybell's funeral. Put your shoulder to the wheel. Keep working. Tammy. Tammy was and what had happened and then they walked me back to the bedroom where her body was.

At that point in time, did either one of them seem to have any emotion or anything like that going on? Yes. Both or which one? Chad was definitely more emotional than Garth was. He was sobbing and then would gasp for error. Garth was a little bit more reserved and didn't say very much. So when you got back to the room where Tammy, was, what was the first thing that you observed?

I observed Tammy's body on the bed. On the bed. And her feet were hanging off the corner of the bed and the mattress was pushed off the box spring just a little bit. And she was covered up with a blanket up to about her shoulders. Really quickly, I want to share how she was found because I have actually seen the photos of Tammy Daybell. But let me explain to you, though, hearing how she was, I'll tell you one thing everyone can attest to is that Tammy was laying diagonal across the bed, in the middle of the bed, and that her feet were off the foot of the bed.

It wasn't that her feet fell off. It was like someone wasn't able to put her on all the way, and her feet were off the foot of the bed. and then the mattress was sort of diagonal and coming like skewampas too off of the bed. Like how she was laid was very suspicious and very upsetting just to see that. I also want to tell you this and while we look for that contradiction, we may or may not find it. So I'm going to give a trigger warning right now to anyone that might be sensitive to hear some of the details about the photos.

But I want to explain to you what the jury. saw and a little bit about what I know about the pink foam. So this is a trigger warning to anyone who might be watching that loves Tammy or doesn't want to hear about this. So the pink foam that was coming out of Tammy's mouth, I just want to say that there was a lot of it. We had all heard about that before the trial, but there was a lot. I saw it last year. In what the coroner testified to last year that I assume that she'll probably testify this tomorrow is that there are also towels in the corner of the bedroom because my first thought was like why wouldn't Chad wipe that off like why would he leave that there it's because it kept coming and that

there were towels in the corner of the bedroom full of the pink foam that Chad had been wiping off prior to 911 or prior to emergency personnel getting there. There was so much. Yes. During the walk back and while I first entered the bedroom, he was kind of explaining to me the course of events that had happened that morning. What do you recall him explaining to you at that time?

He had told me that about midnight, Tammy had woken up with a coughing fit, and he said she had vomited on the bedroom, floor and then had moved into the bathroom down the hallway and had continued vomiting. And he said he got up to help her clean up and then put her back to bed. And then they both went back to sleep. And then at approximately 5.40 a.m., he had felt the blankets shift off of him in bed and had woken up.

And he said that he had thought Tammy had fallen off the bed. So he told her to get back on the bed. and then when she didn't answer him, he stood back up, turned the lights on, and found that she was unresponsive. Did he indicate at that point whether Tammy had fallen all the way off the bed or just part of me? He did.

He indicated that she had fallen partially off the bed because her feet were wrapped in the blanket and the sheets. And so her feet were still up on top of the mattress, but the side of her head was on the floor. Boom. What did Chad do or say next, if anything? So let me reiterate. Reiterate.

Chad told them when they arrived and it's in the report that Tammy's feet remained on the bed. She fell off. Her feet remained on the bed. But she fell off. But her feet stayed on because her feet were tangled in the sheets. She tells Heather, he tells Heather, that morning very clearly that Tammy liked to sleep with her feet out of the bed. And it was her feet that fell out of the bed.

In fact, let's just listen one more time to Heather Daybell, share this. I'll fast forward to it. We won't listen to the whole thing, but I want you guys to hear this one more time. One more time. I called him, Chad, I'm so sorry. What happened? Can you tell me what happened? and he lays out a very scripted story.

She starts coughing, like 10 o'clock at night, she's coughing. And she's coughing so hard, she's like thrown up and stuff. But she calms down, but about midnight she starts coughing again. And finally calms down. And he said, then at like six in the morning, the sheets come off of me and I hear a thud. And he said, Tammy had rolled off the bed. So he said, woke me up.

I went around and I could clearly see she was dead. She was gone. And he said, she always, her feet were always hot when she slept at night. So she kept her feet off the bed. And so he said, you know, the weight of her feet had pulled her off the bed. And in my, I think, this makes no sense. So he said, then I called Garth, yelled out to Garth, come help me to put Tammy back on the bed.

And he said, she choked. And I said, Chad, are you getting an autopsy done? And he said, no, the coroner came. She could clearly see she had choked. and she had choked because she'd thrown up she choked and that she died that's how she died

she choked she choked so there you go for those that haven't seen Heather Davell's interview or for those that want to revisit it I did post part one which is this part in the description of this video there's also part two and part three as we go through this

as we go through this trial, I think that Heather Daybell's interview is one of the most important interviews out there. And I think there's a reason, in my opinion, that John Pryor subpoenaed her, whether or not he calls her to the stand. I can't imagine that she'd help the defense. So my belief is she won't be called to the stand.

But why is he subpoenaing her? What's the reason then? Is it to keep her quiet, to keep her away from the courtroom, to keep her from talking? I think Chad Daybell was right when he called Heather Daybell his dark, very, very dark sister-in-law. Even Melanie Gibb knows Heather Daybel as the dark sister-in-law. She said it in her testimony.

Heather Daybell knows a lot. And I think if there's anything the defense in Chad Dayball is most afraid of, it's Heather Deabel and what she knows and how she's what we call a potter or what she was called, someone that has shared what she knows. and yeah so I think there's a reason why there is a subpoena and I think that Chad Daybell is very afraid of his very, very dark sister-in-law. We need T-shirts to say dark and proud. Anyway, I'm going to go take off and catch my flight, but I just thought those things

were very, very important to cover Brandon Boudreau. Weeping on the stand, jurors crying during the testimony. The jury today saw photos of Tammy Daibo. I have seen those photos. They are heartbreaking. They are suspicious. They will notice the things that are suspicious. And I hope that tomorrow the prosecution comes for it to not let John

prior have this narrative of this. shooting incident on October 9th with Tammy Daybell. John Pryor painted today a false, false narrative, saying that she only referred to a paintball gun, and that is not true. Tammy Dayball called police and said, there is a rifle, there is a gun, he is shooting at me. So let's hope that John Pryor doesn't get his narrative because Tammy Daybill's narrative and her voice is that it was a gun.

Someone was trying to shoot her on October 9th, two weeks before her actual murder. I'm leaving very nervous. I want you know, there's why I'm going live. I'm very stressed out. I'm very nervous. But I'm going to go home and I'm going to take care of my family and I will be back tomorrow.

And thank you for sticking with me. Thank you for subscribing. Thank you for being hidden gems. I will be in touch and may just... be served. Most people don't realize how much their personal information is being bought and sold every day. Data brokers are making billions, pulling details about you from public records and the internet, and then packaging and selling it, usually without your consent.

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