Hidden True Crime - CHILLING Journals, Jail Calls & the “Walk the Dog” Letter Revealed! | Kouri Richins Trial Day 12

Episode Date: March 12, 2026

Day 12 of the Kouri Richins trial brought major moments in court as lead investigator Jeff O’Driscoll finally took the stand, Carmen Lauber returned for more questioning, and prosecutors introduced some of the case’s most talked-about evidence yet. In today’s recap, we break down the ongoing battle over Carmen’s jailhouse interviews, the defense’s attempt to challenge her credibility, and why that cross may not have landed as hard as expected. Then the focus shifts to Detective O’Driscoll, who walked jurors through how the homicide investigation developed after he took over the case. We also get into the children’s grief book Kouri promoted after Eric’s death, the evidence suggesting it may have been ghostwritten, and the shocking revelation that investigators say Kouri’s own mother sent a copy to police. Prosecutors also introduced text messages about the book, Kouri’s marketing plans, and her goal to sell 100,000 copies. And that’s not all. Jurors also heard about discrepancies in phone records, how investigators zeroed in on Carmen Lauber, what was found during the search of her home, and the jailhouse interviews that prosecutors say helped build their case. Then came one of the day’s biggest moments: the recorded jail calls between Kouri and her family, followed by the infamous “Walk the Dog” letter read aloud in court. We also break down the handwritten notes, timelines, texts, and journal entries shown to jurors — including Kouri’s written account of the night Eric died. This episode covers: • Carmen Lauber’s return to the stand • Detective Jeff O’Driscoll’s testimony • Kouri’s grief book and ghostwriter evidence • The anonymous package sent to police • Jailhouse interview clips played for jurors • Recorded calls with Kouri’s mom and brother • The “Walk the Dog” letter • Cross-examination highlights and what the defense is pushing back on As always, we’ll separate what happened in court from what stood out most — and talk through what may matter most as the state nears the end of its case. Sponsors: First Day Life Inc.: Our listeners get up to 57% Off AND a Free Gift with code hidden at https://FirstDay.com Jones Road Beauty: Use code HIDDEN at https://jonesroadbeauty.com to get a Free Shimmer Face Oil with your first purchase! #JonesRoadBeauty Mint Mobile: Shop Mint Mobile plans at https://mintmobile.com/HIDDEN —new customers get 3 months of 5GB for $45 upfront ($15/mo); taxes and fees extra, see https://mintmobile.com for details. About Hidden True Crime What started as a simple conversation at their dinner table became a captivating podcast. Join the dynamic duo of Dr. John Matthias, a criminal psychologist, and Lauren Matthias, an investigative journalist, as they delve into the psychological facets of unthinkable crimes every week. Their unique perspectives and in-depth analysis offer a fresh take on true crime storytelling. Thank you for your support through sponsorships, subscribing, listening, and becoming a Patreon member at⁠ ⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠Patreon.com/HiddenTrueCrime⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠ Learn more about your ad choices. Visit podcastchoices.com/adchoices

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atora.com slash remove. Hello, hidden gems. What a day in course. today. Am I right? Who was watching with me today? Lead detective O'Driscoll testified. And yeah, we got a lot out of him, in my opinion, which we're going to go over all today. A lot of evidence. A lot, a lot. One of the things, just a little teaser, I just got to say it here, we learned a lot about grief book mom's grief book. That's the nickname Corey Richens has had since the beginning of this, right? Because one month before she's arrested in 23, in April 6th, 2023, Corey went on Good Things, Utah to share about a children's book she is authored. And then a month later, she's arrested. So all of us, you know, that's essentially how she got

national attention in this. And here we all are now following the trial. really, it all started with the grief book interview. And by the way, that that was my old station, where I worked, where she did that interview, that now infamous interview. And we have had questions about this grief book since then, or at least I have since 2023. And we learned a lot. First off, we did learn, despite going back and forth, that she absolutely had a ghostwriter. Now, the reason why we've speculated that maybe she hasn't had a ghost writer and Kit over on the channel wordwise has also discussed her thoughts about it is because this book was so poorly written. Like, it was just so bad that Kit, who's a professional writer over on the channel wordwise, speculated that there's no way that she had a ghost writer because it was that bad, that Corey had to have written it herself. It was that bad.

No, no. we have learned there absolutely was a ghostwriter involved in writing a children's book that bad. And then we also learned, which we'll get into more in detail, but I guess I just don't want to bury the lead today because it was like my, it was the craziest thing to me that my favorite thing to learn today was that her mother actually sent a copy to that grief book to police. And the reason, well, listen to this. And then I'll tell you why I think this is so important. Let's listen to this. Did detectives investigate who anonymously sent the book? Yes.

Subpoena was sent to Amazon to request the information on who the sender was. And it came back as Lisa Darden. Scott, 8-34, please. Is this an accurate depiction of the order history provided by Amazon in response to a subpoena? Yes, it is. It in March 21st, 2021, 23? Correct.

Your Honor, the state moves to admit and publish 8-34. No objection. 8-34 is admitted and published. Detective is... Lisa Darden, Corey Darden's mother. Yes, she is. Yes, her mother sent the grief book. Did detectives investigate who wrote the book?

Yes. who wrote the book. Checks on the 401, 4.3 and hearsay. They object, of course. To this. We found text messages in I'm sorry, in Ms. Richon's phone between her and a contact named Book Writing Lane,

who was a book writer, publisher of some type, regarding them writing the book for her. Are they a ghost writer? Yeah. Okay, so, Again, we learned two things there, the ghost writer. And then we learned that her mother, her mother sent a letter to police with the book,

an anonymous sender, I should say. She sent it through Amazon, her mother, Lisa Darden, to police after Corey wrote the book. We'll get into that letter later, but sort of explaining like, here's the real Lori, or here's the real Corey, I guess I'm thinking of Chad Davel. You guys talked about Chad David there. Here's the real Corey. Corey Lori. It's unfortunate. Their name's rhyme, but they do. Here's the real Corey. There are two sides to every story. And Lisa Darden from Amazon sends this anonymous copy of this children's book to police. Why does that matter? Because, I mean, a hidden true crime, we like to understand the hidden motives, right? We've all been wondering. I've been wondering, why did she write this book and then share this book on local TV stations. Good things Utah. And, you know, I mean, sure, was she wanting to make money to? She's, she's a businesswoman, a failed businesswoman, but a businesswoman nonetheless. Yeah.

Yeah, she did have plans to make more, write more, have somebody else write more. But I think it was appearances. As Dr. John talked about in his recent sort of analysis of Corey Richens, go watch that if you haven't because it's important. discusses, it's called narration. I don't know. He's a psychologist. He has an imprint. But she wants to make the narrative of what she wants. She's creating her own narrative. And in this situation, with her mother sending the book to police, what is this about controlling the narrative? This writing this book and doing a children's book on grief, I mean, there was a part of me that had some empathy for Corey and thought, you know, maybe she really did want to help her kids while making money.

She was thinking, okay, I failed at real estate. Maybe I can become a children's book author and my children need a book on grief and maybe I can make a business out of this. No, I think she purely wanted to control the narrative. And that's why she wrote this book and that's why she appeared on Good Things, Utah. Now we know. Okay. I just had to get that out of my system.

When we do these very comprehensive recaps here, I hit into crime, things. for joining us. We usually go in order of the days. We can say this happened, this happened, this happened, but I just had to jump to that. I just had to talk about it. I had to get it out of my system before we continued. One other thing I need to get out of my system is let's just talk really quickly. Well, you know, it's an order. Corey walks in what she was wearing today. I want to talk about what she was wearing. It was different. It was different. Here she is. It was a little bit different than what she typically wears, I don't know, like a little boho vibe, little peasant shirt, you know, like the early 2000s sort of. I liked it. I mean, look, I know that a lot of us

don't like the defendant, but I thought it made her a little looking a little softer, maybe, you know, ready for the lead detective that's about to testify that's going to bring home some really damning evidence, you know, I don't know. I don't know. I don't. know some of you liked it some of you didn't i liked enough that i tried to leave an amazon review i did find it here you go i don't know if they're going to approve it but i did say core ritchins is on trial for murder but this shirt makes her look not as guilty i'd say a solid purchase from her defense team or whoever purchased it maybe her mom now i gave it five stars i know that some people say you have to purchase something for it to be approved i don't know if they're going to prove that but i am

trying i you know i found it i found it on amazon thanks all of you for helping me. You know, there you go. It was different. She still has her famous side part bun, but the shirt threw me a little bit. Just wanted to talk about that too. All right. Okay.

Moving on, moving on. Let's get now to the day in order because Detective O'Driscoll finally took the stand. The walk the dog letter also finally took. the stand, the infamous walk the dog letter, the grief book, you know, the infamous walk the dog letter. And also, you know, Carmen Lauber, the drug dealer also called back. And then, of course, you know, Corey's outfit, like day 12, it was, it was a hit. First, though, the day started off with, like we all know, legal arguments. Boom, boom, boom. Yes, they always do, right? With the Corey Richens trial. But we knew that today. We knew that today going in that they would. And today,

these legal arguments mainly focused on two things. First, the ongoing fight over interviews that Carmen Laubert did with detectives while she was in jail. And second, the testimony from the lead investigator Jeff O'Driskel, who eventually took over the case, right? He jumped on in 2023. And when was she arrested? Just like a month later, or a month or two later. So he's important. You know, what happened? Odryskel becomes lead detective. Boom, two months later, Corey's arrested. So I want to know. The morning started with the state and the defense arguing about whether jurors should be allowed to see and hear Carmen Lauber's jailhouse interviews. Just like we left off yesterday. And prosecutor Bloodworth said the state wanted to admit some of those interviews as evidence.

But again, Attorney Lewis objected to certain portions of the interviews being shown to the jury. And the judge said he wanted to review the interviews piece by piece before deciding what could come in. So the court basically went line by line through the transcripts. Lewis, attorney, defense attorney, Wendy Lewis, pointed out sections she objected to. And Bloodworth, prosecutor, Bloodworth, where the prosecution argued that he believed they should be admitted. So then at one point, the judge explained that if the interviews were played for jurors, the video would include text on the screen so they could follow along with what was being said. That's something courts sometimes do with recorded interviews, so the jury doesn't miss anything. Judge Mrazik also confirmed that he was denying Corey's request for a mistrial, which was brought up yesterday.

Another one was brought up. Luddworth also told the court that Carmen would be back in court later in the day to testify again because the defense had a few more questions for her. Surprise. He witness Carmen. Defense has more questions. poor Carmen, like they are just not releasing her from that subpoena. They will not. Anyway, the conversation then shifted briefly to Carmen's probation issues.

Lewis brought up an allegation that Carmen violated drug court rules after she was seen holding an alcoholic drink. The judge pointed out that the information Lewis was referencing came from an unsigned affidavit, which isn't exactly the strongest piece of evidence. The judge told Lewis that if she wanted to explore that issue, she could ask Carmen about it directly when she took the stand. Lewis also said she had screenshots of text messages between Carmen and a detective that she planned to question her about.

And before breaking for recess, the attorneys also discussed the overall timeline of the case. The prosecution said they only had two witnesses left before they would rest their case, which we've also been told. And those witnesses were sent to and Carmen Lauber returning for additional questioning and Detective Jeff O'Driscoll, the lead detective. Two very big witnesses. So defense attorney Nestor told the court that once the state rests, the defense would need some time to speak with Corey before starting their own case.

So we're getting close to the point where the defense will finally begin presenting its witnesses. And after the break, court resumed and Carmen Lauber took the stand again. The defense has been trying to undermine her credibility, arguing that her story has changed, and that she doesn't remember key details since the beginning of time. Lewis started by asking Carmen about being released from jail in 2023. And then Carmen explained that she was released on probation and that her probation supervision was transferred from Wasatch County to Summit County. She said Detective Maynard became her probation officer.

That's weird, I think, but okay. Carmen testified that she usually texted Maynard every day, but she sometimes forgot. She's human. Lewis asked whether Carmen told him about everything related to her probation. Carmen said yes. And then Lewis introduced a document showing the terms of Carmen's probation out of drug court. It was displayed on the courtroom screen so the jury could see it.

Lewis asked Carmen if she had violated any of the conditions since signing that agreement in May of 2023. Carmen answered no Lewis followed up you haven't violated any conditions Carmen hesitated and asked if Lewis was referring to the weapons condition she said quote if there was a weapon found in my room if that's what you mean well she acknowledged that a weapon had been found in her room Lewis then asked about an alcohol violation Carmen admitted that she went to a concert in November of 2023 with friends according to her instead of paying a friend back for the ticket,

he asked if she would buy drinks and snacks, and Carmen said she did not drink alcohol, but she admitted she was seen holding a drink. Lewis pushed back on that. She pointed out that Carmen had previously told Detective Maynard that she actually consumed the drink. Carmen says she didn't remember telling Maynard that. But when Lewis showed her a document

where she told Detective Maynard she drank alcohol, Carmen conceded that if the transcript said it, then she must have said it. Yeah, she drank. So Lewis also brought up another violation. Carmen had a curfew while on probation, and she admitted that she returned home a little late after that concert. Carmen explained that she had an ankle monitor. So officers would have been able to see exactly where she was. And Lewis asked if an officer had caught her drinking at the concert, but Carmen didn't agree.

Then the questioning moved to a letter, Carmen wrote, to judge maybe in 2024. Carmen had asked the judge for permission to visit her boyfriend in Las Vegas once a month. So in that letter, she wrote that she had been 100% compliant with probation. Lewis pointed out that wasn't actually true because of the earlier violations and Carmen agreed. And after that, Lewis asked for a sidebar with the judge. When questioning resumed, Lewis said she had nothing further, but asked for Carmen's subpoena to remain in effect in case they wanted to recall her later. Honestly, well, first off, they just will not release poor Carmen. But honestly, my opinion, this whole line of questioning felt pretty anticlimactic to me. I mean, I really was waiting for some bombshells because remember, we, I guess I don't want to say we wasted the whole day yesterday, but they fought the whole day yesterday. about Carmen's interviews and other evidence that was going to come out with O'Driscoll. And Carmen's interviews were like everything. The defense fought so hard. I just thought,

what are they going to get her on? It felt anticlimactic to me. Like the defense spent a lot of time going after Carmen's credibility, right? But it mostly centered on minor probation violations. At least they feel minor to me. But I've never been in drug court. Maybe you guys disagree. For me, it came across more like piling on than delivering some huge, impeachment moment, and after all the build-up about Carmen over the past couple of days, it didn't really land the way you might expect. But after Carmen stepped down, the state called its next witness, and Detective Jeff O'Driskell from the summit county sheriff's office took the stand. Finally, the last witness of the state, the last witness to testify for the prosecution.

Detective O'Driscoll testified that he had been with the sheriff's office for about 10 years. He became a detective in July 22. In March, 2023, he was assigned as the lead detective in the Richens case, taking over the investigation from Detective Woody. He explained that he had investigated deaths before. But this was the first case he worked that turned into a full homicide investigation. That's interesting to me. His first full homicide investigation. And that's where the testimony was headed next.

With O'Driscolliskel beginning to walk jurors through how the investigation progressed after he took over. After that introduction, Bloodworth asked Detective Jeff O'Driscoll how he approached the investigation once he was assigned to the case. O'Driscoll explained that when he first stepped in, he had limited information about what had already been done. But one key facts stood out right away. Ventinal had been found in Eric's blood and in Eric's gastric contents.

Nobody's argued that. That is a fact. And even with that information, O'Driscoll said he wanted to approach this case. case with fresh eyes, almost like it was the first day the incident had happened. In other words, he didn't want to rely too heavily on previous assumptions. He wanted to start from scratch and work forward. Interesting. I like, I like that idea. Just start over. Start from scratch. Fresh eyes. So one of the first things investigators did was request a doppel history. That's a statewide database that shows prescriptions for controlled substances.

Basically, it helps investigators see whether someone legally had access to certain medications. So that document was admitted into evidence, and according to a Driscoll, the result showed no record found for Eric Richens. In other words, Eric did not have a current prescription for any controlled substances. Investigators also started digging through Eric and Corey's phones. Bloodworth asked about text that mentioned THC. see gommies, which had come up earlier in the trial.

O'Driscoll said they found two texts between Corey and Eric from November 20th, 2021. Jurors were shown the exchange on the screen. And in those messages, the two were chatting about Eric going to a rodeo with some people. And then Corey told him to take a gummy. They did like gummies. Eric and Corey definitely took a lot of gummies. So Corey tells Eric to take a gummy. But Eric replied that he wanted to get some food first.

And by the way, I'm not judging the gummies. I'm just saying this is definitely a part of their lifestyle. A lot of people take gummies, so they're no different. So you wanted to get some food first. And the jury was then shown another set of messages from January 31st, 2022. And in that exchange, Eric, and just timeline-wise, so January 31st, 2022, that's about a month before Eric was, before he died. Another interesting thing about January 31st, 2022, that's when that life insurance. policy, like became, she filled it out, I believe. It was either January 30th or 31st.

It became official February 4th, I think. But she was filling it out that day. So that's kind of interesting just to put a, you know, think about that while we read these messages. So a message from January 31st, 2022 after Corey finishes filling out a new life insurance policy for her husband. And in that exchange, Eric told Corey that their boys were wondering when she was coming home. Corey replied, no, you are wondering, not them. And then she then texted that she would call him when she was on her way. Well, Eric responded with a message that felt a little accusatory. He wrote, no, I would never go hang out with girls and miss the boys' games and scouts. Sorry, but that's not something I would ever think about doing. End quote. So the conversation

then shifted to something more routine. Corey asked him, can you bring me home some soup please and eric replied what do you want beautiful she told him what she wanted from dairy keen or needers eric then asked gummy time and she responded yes and then from there bloodworth moved the questioning to something that has gotten a lot of attention in this case which is the children's book corey published after eric's death called are you with me and before we get into that you guys know I really want to talk about this. I really, really want to talk about this, clearly. But before we do, a quick word from one of our amazing trial sponsors, first day life. One thing about parenting that nobody warns you about is how much mental energy goes into

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Bloodworth asked O'Driscoll, how he first learned about the book. O'Driscoll said he saw Corey talking about it during an appearance on a TV program, Good Things, Utah. Shout out to Good Things, Utah. Investigators ended up issuing a subpoena to ABC for Utah to figure out how that interview came about. Now we know.

So according to O'Driskel, Corey had actually applied through the shows, website asking to appear as a guest. Jurors were then shown emails between Corey and the production team. And in one message, Corey wrote that she wanted to come on the show to talk about a children's book she had written. She described it as what appeared to be the first children's book about losing a parent. She explained, really, by the way, really? The first? I mean, okay, doubt that. But moving on. She explained that her husband had passed away. and that she wanted to share their story.

Producer wrote back saying they would like to feature her on the show, right? It's right up, good things, Utah's, you know, area, right? I mean, that's perfect. Corey responded that she was excited and she said she could share three tips about helping kids cope with losing a parent. The producer asked if she could appear in the studio on April 6th for a live interview. Corey confirmed she could and asked how long the conversation would be. And then the producer does what a producer does and sends back talking points, the dress code and other information about the segment.

So about a week later, Corey emailed again with suggested talking points and even included a promo code for people who wanted to order the book on Amazon. Although later, she wrote back saying the promo code wouldn't work. So instead, the Kindle version of the book would be available for a free download for two days. Interesting marketing. as in skip the promo code or buying the book, I'll give you guys a free copy for two days. Another thing that makes me think,

is this about a narrative or really selling books? I don't know. At that point, the email exchange ended, and O'Driscoe also testified that he was aware Corey promoted the book on a radio station website as well. Ludworth then tried to admit documentations showing that interview, and Attorney Nester objected,

arguing that there were authenticity issues. The judge called the attorneys up to the bench for a sidebar to talk it through. And after that, the jury also saw the description that had been attached to the book listing online. It described the book as a heartwarming and reassuring story meant to gently guide children through the loss of a loved one. It said it was written by a loving mother who personally faced that challenge. The story, a loving mother, just a mother, right? All these, like, it's just so flowery.

all these adjectives that are unnecessary. It was a heartwarming and reassuring story, written by a loving mother who personally faced that challenge. The story follows a child who lost their father but is comforted by the idea that he is still present in spirit like an angel watching over them. The description said the book celebrated hope, healing, and the unbreakable bond between parent and child. Next, a screenshot from the radio station's website showing Corey appearing as a guest was then displayed for the jury.

And then Bloodworth brought up something that was honestly pretty strange. He asked O'Driscoll about the sheriff's office receiving an anonymous package containing the book along with a little note. So what did that little note read? The little note read. Quote, here we are. There are two sides to every story. This is the true Corey, a devoted wife and adoring mother thought you should know from anonymous, end quote. Well, when you send an anonymous something something to the police station, the police station's probably going to try to find out who anonymous is. And that's what investigators did.

you know, I just, if you're going to send something anonymously to law enforcement, probably going to find out. But, you know, okay. So investigators eventually trace a package after serving a subpoena to Amazon. And according to O'Driscoll, the record showed the book had actually been sent by Lisa Darden, who is Corey's mother. Ludworth then asked who actually wrote the book. Odriscoll testified that investigators found text messages in Corey's phone between her and a contact called

book writing lane. He described that contact as some kind of book writer or publisher and characterized it as a ghostwriting company. Ludworth moved to admit those text messages into evidence. The prosecution also introduced messages between Corey and

members of her family discussing the book and one set of text between Corey and her brother, DJ, Darden, jurors saw messages where Corey sent him a copy of the book cover and said it turned out so cute. That's a supportive brother. Her brother asked when it would be on Amazon and she told him they were submitting it and it should be up soon. He told her that he was proud of her. Again, that's actually sweet.

Supportive brother. Corey replied that she was excited and added that she had already spoken to a writer about writing another book. So I think now also in her business book. brain is taking over. Her brother asked about the cost and pointed out that she would probably have to change names. Corey responded that yes, she would have to change names and get an attorney to avoid defamation issues. Hmm. Hmm. What's she thinking? Okay. She said it would cost around $10,000 to write that book. Let's pause that really quickly. She is not a good business one. I'm sorry, but $10,000 to ghostwrite a children's book. Does anybody need a children's book,

ghost writer? Because call me. I will do that for not $10,000. And it'll be better than Corey's poorly written children's book. I got you. I got you. I'm sorry, but like just that alone. I just have to stop there. This is not a good business woman. It does not cost $10,000. to write a decent children's book, a ghostwriter. Look, children's books are hard to write. Don't get me wrong. They're different than adult material. They're unique.

The format matters. How you say things matters, the pictures, the illustrations. I get it. And maybe she's combining the illustrations. And if that's the case, okay, maybe that's why too. But guys, there's got to be, it should not cost $10,000. Moving on. That was not the point of that.

that evidence, but I just had to stop and say no. No. So she said that it would cost around $10,000 to write that book. DJ asked that she was planning a book launch. She said not yet. He told her that she had nothing to worry about and to stay calm. Again, I think a very kind thing for a brother to do. The prosecution then moved to text messages between Corey and her mother. And in those messages, her mom asked what the name of the book was. And at first she said, are you there? So she She doesn't even remember the name of the children's book she so lovingly wrote. Remember the loving mother that really spent all this time writing this? She texts her mom the wrong book title.

I'm sorry. Okay. So, again, I don't think this is why they're sharing this is evidence, but like, okay. Okay. So she tells her mother the book is, are you there? And then she later clarifies that the title is, wait, she's like, wait, never mind. Are you with me? And she said she didn't know what she had been thinking when she originally gave the wrong

name to her mother. Like she is really, really, you know, you can tell this book has just consumed her mind so much so that she remembers the title. She doesn't know why she was, she originally gave the not wrong book title. I don't either. But Bloodworth then tried to admit another batch of test. I just, who forgets the name of the children's book that they're going on tour for? And it's like to your own mother.

Like, you're like, guess what? And her mother's like, I just, her mother was why like, I can't find it. I need to send it to police. And so Corey's like, wait, let me remember the book title so that you can anonymously send it to the police station. So they can then subpoena Amazon, let me get you the right title. I'm sorry, but it's like, okay. I mean, you can't make some of this stuff up. Okay.

So Bloodworth then tries to admit another batch of text between Corey and her brother. The defense objected again. I love when the defense objects because then you're just like, oh, you know this is going to be good. But the judge overruled, the objection. Was that the objection that got the hot mic?

I can't remember which objection. Okay. So anyway, these messages were from March 22nd, 2023. And in them, DJ asked how much money she made per book. And Corey said she made $5.35 per book through Amazon and said that Amazon handled the printing and shipping. By the way, and then she also said she's going to launch her own website and that would in the next 30 days. And that would be focused on marketing. I'm just going to pause again really quickly because we all know that Corey Richens is not a good business.

woman. And so, look, I've always said, I'm terrible at math. Someone, you know, my husband's even like, I think you have a learning disability when it comes to math. My second grader brings home math. And I'm like, you know what? You know, go, go ask your father. But I can do enough math to know the math isn't mathing here. So she's spending $10,000 to ghost-rated children's book. And she makes $5.35 cents per book, how many books would she have to sell just to make the money back? I don't know. But don't worry. Never fear. She's got a website plan. And that website, that URL is going to be the marketing. Because everybody is going to Google and that website is just going to shoot up

and thousands of books will sell from that website. So, okay, because that will be her marketing focus, a URL. GoDaddy.com. she got the URL. So Corey even shared a specific goal. She said she wanted to sell 100,000 books by the end of the year. Okay. I mean, you know, think big. But they say if you dream it, if you build it, you know, dream it, go for it.

Can you, can you do some math? Can we, can somebody pull some numbers for me? But also like, I just, to be a first time author, I just, you've got to really, again, I don't know, I don't know. You've got to think really highly of yourself to think that this is the grief book. You've never written a children's book before. You're just going to pay a ghostwriter write this. Can't even remember the title. It's going to be so good you're going to sell 100,000 books by the end of the year. Anyway, okay, moving on. You can kind of see her business mentality. Delusional, really. It's fantastical. Okay. At that point, Bloodworth asked to approach the bench again,

and the judge called a brief recess. And after the break, the jury returned, and Detective O'Driscoll continued his testimony. Bloodworth then asked O'Driscoll if his investigation eventually led him to Carmen Lauber, and O'Driscollegel said yes. His investigation led him to Carmen. And he explained the former housekeeper. And he explained that the investigation started to point to her direction. Why? Because after they reviewed the autopsy and toxicology report, which showed very clearly, very factually, that Eric died from fentanyl.

Around that same time, investigators had also just received the downloads from both Eric and Corey Richardson's phones, and we're starting to go through that data. The cell phone data, the so bright info. And they analyzed the phones. Investigators began comparing what was stored on the devices

with the official phone billing records, and that's when they noticed something interesting. There were discrepancies between the phones and the carrier records when it came to call logs and text messages. So investigators started looking at the numbers that appeared most frequently in the phones. Yeah, that's what you do.

And according to O'Driscoll, one number that stood out belonged to Carmen Lauber. There was a high amount of communication between her and Corey. That led them to start digging into Carmen's background. And O'Driscoll testified that investigators discovered Carmen had a history

involving drug use and distribution and that she was currently in drug court probation. Detective Maynard had some previous involvement with Carmen. Remember, that was her probation officer later. And he already knew a little bit about her. Investigators also reached out to officers in Wausuch County who were familiar with Carmen's case. And during those conversations,

they learned that a man named Nick Bond Savage had been in drug court with Carmen and the two were good friends. So what investigators do, they began pulling phone billing records for Nick as well. And when they reviewed those records, they noticed something else. Nick had a high number of phone contacts with someone in a state prison. Investigators requested those recorded calls between Nick and the inmate and started listening to them.

During one of those calls, they heard a conversation about getting an Xbox controller. And according to O'Driscoll, Nick told the inmate something along the lines of either he could get it or Carmen could get it and he would pay him back. And then Nick made another comment that caught investigators' attention. No, Driscoll said Nick said something like, no, I can't have Carmen do it. I just gave her money the other day and she told me she just made a bunch of money selling illicit streak drugs, end quote. Yeah, that's a quote. That call, guess when that call took place?

March 4th. The same day, Eric died. March 4th. March 4th, guys. So sad. So hearing that gave investigators even more reason to look into Carmen, obviously. And at that point, they began surveilling her. They also conducted what's called a trash pole, which means they collect garbage that had been put out from her home.

And according to O'Driscoll, when they searched through that trash, they found drug paraphernalia. After that, investigators requested a search warrant for Carmen herself, along with her car, phones, her house. The search warrant was executed on April 26, 2023. So again, just remember, Corey was arrested May 8th, 2023. So this was just like May 26th, 23, less than two weeks before her arrest. Nodriscoll testified that he personally conducted the search of Carmen's home inside the house. Investigators found THC products and also a firearm under her bed. And because Carmen was a felon, she was not allowed to possess a firearm.

So that's a problem. Driscoll also said they found a newspaper clipping of Eric's obituary in her bedroom, along with a hat from C&E Stone Masonry. While that search was happening, another deputy stopped Carmen while she was driving. Her phone was seized during that stop. Deputies also discovered that Carmen was driving on a suspended license and she was arrested in Watsh County and she was booked into jail. After that, Odriscoll and Detective Maynard began interviewing her. Those interviews took place over several days. Bloodworth asked O'Driscoll about the approach they used when interviewing Carmen.

O'Driscoll explained that because Maynard already knew Carmen, he was aware that she had a history of self-preservation and had previously offered information in exchange for help with charges. He said that was something they kept in mind going into the interviews. O'Driscoll then added that after serving the search warrant and seeing Carmen's bedroom, including the obituary for Eric, it seemed apparent that she might have been. have had some guilt or concern about her possible involvement in Eric's death. And at that point, defense attorney Nestor objected and asked the statement to be struck as speculation. The judge agreed to that and struck O'Driscoll's assumption about how Carmen might have felt. That's fair. Bloodworth said he wanted to argue the point and the attorneys approached the bench.

After the discussion, Bloodworth rephrased the question. he asked O'Driscoll whether, in addition to Carmen's motive for self-preservation, seeing the items in her bedroom gave him the impression that she might have felt some guilt. O'Driscoll said that was his impression. He then described how the first interview with Carmen went. Detective sat down with her and explained what they had found during the search of her home. They told her those items could be violations of her drug court conditions, which could potentially expose her to felony distribution charges again. along with charges related to the THC and the firearm. They also told her they were investigating Eric's death

and believed that she might have information that could help them. And according to Adriskel, they told Carmen that, hey, if she's willing to provide information about what she knew, they could help her with the charges she was facing. Let's make a deal, Carmen. And at that point, they didn't push her with a lot of questions. Instead, they laid out the situation and told her to think about whether she wanted to help over the next few days. Bloodworth then asked O'Driscoll how many times he had interviewed drug dealers during his career.

O'Driscolls said dozens, if not more, than a hundred times. This might have been his first homicide investigation, but it was not his first interview with a drug dealer. He testified that interviewing Carmen, though was more difficult than mutual. A lot of time had passed since the events that they were asking about, so she struggled with her memory. on top of that because of her tendency towards self-preservation. He said she often minimized her involvement and held back information. Interesting. He's being very honest. At first, Carmen didn't say that she bought drugs for Corey.

But over time, according to O'Driscoll, she became more forthcoming and eventually said that Corey had asked her for pain pills. Carmen repeatedly told detective she wanted to help but said she was having trouble remembering details. And to help jog her memory, investigators showed her maps, property records, and other materials they could find to try to build a timeline of events. Odrysco testified that he repeatedly told Carmen to say what she actually remembered and what was truthful. Detectives told her not to make things up and emphasize that they needed specific details. He said detectives kept telling her they needed more information, more info and more. in total, Carmen was interviewed six times, adding up to about 10 hours of questioning. All of those interviews were audio and video recorded.

Transcripts were also prepared, and O'Driscoll said they totaled nearly 1,000 pages. Bloodworth then asked if O'Driscoll had heard how the defense characterized those interviews during the trial and whether he believed that portrayal was misleading. Adriscoll said yes. He believed it was misleading, since he is a lead investigator in the case, O'Driscoll had. has been sitting in the courtroom throughout the trial and heard the defense arguments firsthand. He explained that during the interviews, detectives emphasized that they needed solid information from Carmen that could actually be used in court. Ludworth then asked about a statement Detective Maynard made during one of the interviews about a get out of jail free card. And O'Driscoll

said Maynard was trying to stress how important the investigation into Eric's death was compared to any separate drug investigations. Carmen might be involved. in any investigation. Bloodworth also asked about a moment when Carmen said something like, Can you guys write it down and I'll sign it? Odryskel explained that detectives were trying to get a written statement from Carmen to help establish a clear timeline. Carmen was worried about writing things down in the jail cell block and instead asked if detectives could write it for her, but Adriscoll told her that wasn't how it worked. At that point, Bloodworth moved to admit video from one of Carmen's jailhouse interviews.

The video was played for the jury. Let's take a listen to this interview. It's just not me. I can tell you, I affected people's life by still don't know. Right. By doing it.

No, whether it was intentionally rather he had a bad problem or rather he was hurt. I don't know. But either way, if it was done purposely, he didn't deserve that. I don't know that for sure because I'm not, I don't know the personal situation. Totally agreed.

I would never do enough, ever to anybody. I'm saying that we're going to need you to really settle down and maybe, I'm going to, try to write up tomorrow, whatever we need again, I can go through. Well, we're going to talk about that too. If I need to go through whatever I need to go through and figure out. You know what I'm saying? These details that you're giving us are kind of hazy? that's good to me

it's common for people to try to kind of minimize your own involvement but we're not interested in smack and eat with this but this at the end of the day it was the reason we're here and say hey do you know about

approximately the time but I thought those feels from you I don't know if she's going to be probably not a good idea but I'm just saying we're going to need you to kind of settle down and think about details and timelines because we understand that you aren't a part of

you know, conspiring. But the details about everything we've been talking about are the on-side investigation. It's something that like none of us are used to. Yeah. So right now

we're in a good place to where we've got the information, but there's a difference between us knowing and understanding what happened. We're able to present that to the prosecutors who have to present it to a court, right? That has to be way more detailed down the line but further it gets into the case. So that's what we need your help.

what that means. You want to write out what you... I didn't tell me that I probably want to remember what you told you in. That's okay. And that's fine because the right story is all you can give us. You can't make something else that you don't remember, right? So just tell us... That's what I can't remember.

It was like... It wasn't something that I had to go to boot in or anything. Where does it time change now? When did we go? March or April. Is it March 15th? Yeah. So...

It was dark because I had a fool with it. Because I didn't even know where this house was. so I had I had to use So what time of the day was it? I mean if it was dark It was for the evening So

afternoonish evening No no It was dark Because I had to use the light on the car So I had to put it in the driveway So I had to pull into the driveway And pull the light

Okay let's say this is the house And if I'm coming that way And I know I know I turn the bright came down the street it was right there and I pulled into the driveway and it was just a... It wasn't a big fire pit

like it was a tiny fire pit it wasn't like probably you know the white sand of rocks not sandalops but white flat rocks that people feel

yeah yeah it wasn't big it wasn't a big deep one real real yeah like I want to say there was like maybe two or three on top and it wasn't even

it wasn't even a complete one and what was like what was the money packaged in It didn't have nobody name, didn't have nothing on it. It was up against. Sorry, I'm thinking about all your communications with Corey. Can we pause it for just one moment?

Oh, maybe on the phone, maybe in a cloud, maybe anything like that. I wouldn't even know how to operate a cloud. Okay. Would it be in your phone? I have no idea. Yeah. You guys have all my phones, yeah. Did you erase me?

I mean, that's why I asked you about him being deleted because I don't know. I don't know. I think that's a fair question, Carmen. And we're getting down to the right. I feel like we owe it to you to kind of start talking to about all we do know. What we do know is within a day or two after Eric Dine and you got to be phone. Okay. I think that's could have died.

Possibly. We also know that there are texts between you and Corey that we're going to leave. believe. I get it. I delete them too. Again, we're not looking to put new charges on here. But we're getting down to that area. We need to be more open on us with each other because there's

things that we're talking to you about that conflict with some evidence that we have to extend. And again, I'm not here to beat you over the head with it. As a cooperating witness, that information is actually really good for you. And frankly, it's now time to talk to her about the conversation at the page.

So here's where it's that with McKay in your drug court. Okay. They are looking for, and this can be upsetting, let me finish. They are looking to all your drug court deal and ask for seven years on your two first. Five years for the first, the one felony and then a 40% portion of a second. The only exception to that and the only thing that they're willing to kind of help you out with is if you can help us out with this and by so he means like give us the details that will ensure Corey gets convicted of murder oh my god this is a serious case

i'm not sorry i don't i know i don't don't freak out okay because this is a long process and this is a good thing and this is a good news for you so there's there's one more consideration that McKay has. Do you need a minute? No, go. And this is kind of funny because it's nothing funny about it. Well, the second part is

it looks like you guys figured out how and when people were going to test looking at your text message. You and Bon Savage. That's fucking awesome. I want to know how you're Are you tracking with me? What I'm saying? I'm happy what you're so.

We need heart. details that there's no more sure I'm going to do whatever because I have struggled so hard to get me more than that that's great motivation and I literally want to complete drug court and I want to have at a state all this behind oh I'm still on the way to get my path like I don't want no time nobody I want to change my phone number we and Troy were talking about it like completion of drug court wants to let's go out yeah I don't you call on that he laughed I said you know you know is to Vegas. I think that's what you need to do, Carmen.

I didn't, like, even my daughter's all over. And he's an amazing person. Like, I've never had some of that came in my life. Like, I'm willing, like, the day of graduation, I want to be gone. My, my son.

We have some hurdles here. And that's why I said, I know I want to work to the 40s. Sorry, sorry. I don't want. I want to do what I'm going to help do what needs to be done. what needs to be done

to fix this. Well, I feel like that as you're telling us that, you know, there was some talk about can you give or MJ had and it was kind of very superficial. Can you retell that story with all the detail you can remember?

I really can't. I don't even know it was because I kind of like I said, I can barely remember some of it because it was so long ago. I want to say it was the Michael Jackson and I bet that I don't tell me how that conversation would be structured she sent you a text and she she tells you she says can you get she said a person Michael Jacksoning that I know

so tell me how that would have been said because I didn't know Michael was it look it up look it up because it's not okay this too but um the thought was insinuated that she wanted you to get something that somebody could die on I know one thing that when we got one, it wasn't dark and that. I mean, I don't even have fit on really old. So there was a couple of there was several. There was one. Okay. Now are you in some.

I can see in your face. So I wanted, so cute, but okay. So I want to say when she asked, but like I said, we'll give you all the time in the world that you need to think and remember karma, but I just want you to know that if, if you

You're going to work with us here. We still need that we have like pieces that we can, like blueprint. You're the biggest piece. I don't want to be that big piece. Well, the good news is that that big piece helps you out. That's what he was a damn big thing. He didn't. It was that intentionally he did not do that.

We believe you and that's why we're here working on what your feet out of jail. Free cars looks like based on this. There's three other boys that don't have the dad. There's a family that doesn't have a brother. But like you guys did, she's living her life right now, and that's everybody else's fucking suffering. Like them... That's what I'm here. I'm sure they didn't.

They, I mean, I've seen it. Eric was their, that was their, that was their, that was his price, that's, not them boys were his everything. People complain about he was going all the time where he worked so much, but you know what? At the end of the night, but he'd come in and them boys were there. And they was, like I said, that it weighed heavy on me. What? So we need to start getting this on paper. What's going to happen tomorrow with your OSC hearing?

McKay is, you're going to appear for it. McKay is just going to say that he's not prepared to speak to it to get us a day or two. Okay. So we're going to come back tomorrow. Okay. Okay. We can get it cleared up as far as our end of it as quickly as we can get a timeline down. I know this is exhausting.

I am concerned about sending paperwork back with you and your cell because everybody's going to be like what's at you. Yeah. I think I just write it and I sign it. Well, no. That's not saying. Because this is going to have to be your testimony. Do I have to go to court? A couple of things.

That interview was interesting for a lot of reasons. I'm actually glad they showed it. I do think the jury should be seeing this evidence. There's a lot of speculation about how much the state or law enforcement coerced, investigators coerced Carmen into telling their story. or their truth opposed to her truth. A lot about the deal that she made, the immunity deal she has

in order to tell her story, questions about whether it's her story or the state's story. One thing I thought was also interesting, too, I see actually a variety of opinions here, and I actually think that's really interesting because what matters is what the jurors are going to fill about Carmen, right?

Clearly, the defense is really trying to hone in on making sure she doesn't have credibility. but one thing I thought was really interesting was this idea. The defense really kind of emphasized that Carmen was pretty much said to the law enforcement or to investigators, look, write whatever you want, write your statement and I'll just sign it. Whatever you guys want. Just write the statement, I'll sign it. Your truth is a truth.

But now we see sort of that exchange and it comes across a lot different to me, to me. to me it comes across as Carmen saying or being uncomfortable about perhaps a learning disability or something she struggles with saying look can you guys help me write what my story down not whatever you guys want me to say I'll say it but I don't know what are your opinions on that yeah what are your opinions someone just said her credibility grows each time she's on the stand. Other people are saying in chat that she does certainly have credibility issues. So I'm curious what you just think. After the video finished playing, Bloodworth followed up about something mentioned during the clip and during the interview, a man named McKay had come up in the conversation.

So Adriscollegal explained that McKay was the prosecutor they were working with at the time, and the jury was then shown another jailhouse interview with Carmen. And this interview took place on May 12th, 22. And in that video, Detective Maynard spoke with Carmen about the investigation. At one point, he told her that the goal of the investigation was to convict Cory Richens. Carmen asked if she had to go to court on Wednesday. Maynard told her it was related to a grand jury proceeding. Carmen then asked if she was going to be charged with someone in the case. and Maynard told her that she would not be charged at all. Let's watch this.

And this is a jury, but that's more of the change series of ship, like to the highest extreme. Well, but here's the thing. You've cooperated. At the end of the day, everybody is on the same page when the goal is to convictory for an aggravated murder. These parallel drug investigations,

those aren't priority. Right. shit was on every day everywhere. That's not what we're here for. Right. I was just thought, thank you, though. That made it. Well, that's why I have to clear this up because I'm not going to like give you an inch of promise it.

Right. If it's bullshit, I'm not going to say it. So do I have to go down there when things? So yes, that's part, that's something totally different than all of this. That is basically formalizing your testimony. This is street cop level and a hand of the room, right?

That's where it's formalized with a grand jury. But then they have none, they can't come back on me, right? No, they're not to charge you. No. Okay. So after that video, Bloodworth switched focus, back to a timeline of the investigation. O'Driscoll testified that he arrested Corey in May of 2023. And after her sons had gone to school that morning and during the investigation,

detectives also searched Richon's home. O'Driscoll said that during that search they found an orange notebook next to Corey's side of the bed and some pages from that notebook were admitted into evidence. Yeah. And they were shown to the jury on the screen in court. But they were not read out loud during the testimony. So don't worry. Don't worry. I'm going to read just what was written in that journal there Thursday, March 3rd, 22nd.

Here we go. Guys, what's fond to read Corey's journal? Let's be honest. All right. Here we go. Thursday, March 3, 2022. The day started out as a typical day. Ashton had a dentist appointment that morning to get a filling put in for his cavity. And after the dentist, we headed back home so Ashton could stay home with Weston and a babysitter while I went to do my weekly volunteering at that at the school. that afternoon evening i made dinner we all ate as usual and ended the night like any other evening around 8.30 i read the kids books and at about nine a.m they all climbed into bed eric had been on his phone most of the evening in a texting war with a hunting guide from mexico and a few other people trying to get his horns back to the united states and around nine o'clock nine fifteen he was screaming mad at these guys and through his phone at that point, he said, let's go have a celebration drink. The following day, I was closing on a huge

investment home in Midway. I had been working on this deal for four months, and closing day was finally here, and Eric and I were going to toast for the closing. We went into the kitchen and both starting grabbing ingredients for a Moscow mule and lemon drop shot. He was going on and on about these guys in Mexico and was so mad about the entire situation. We finished talking, made our way back to our room and brushed our teeth. As we both climbed into bed, we could hear Ashton tossing and turning. He was having nightmares again. I told Eric I would go sleep with him and try to calm him down.

We kissed and said, I love you, and good night. And I went to Ashton's room and laid with him. 30 minutes later, I could hear Eric snoring and finally fell asleep. March 4th, 2022, 320 a.m. I woke up from sleeping with Ashton and went to crawl back in my bed. It was dark and awkwardly quiet. Eric snores more times than not, so I thought it was weird. I didn't hear anything.

I crawled into bed and went on Eric's side of the bed and put my arm over him. He was cold. very cold. So I pulled the blanket up on him, but his body just felt so strange to me. It was heavy is the only word I can think to describe it. So I nudged him and said, Eric, Eric, nothing. I kept nudging him and just remember the stiffness of his body. I jumped out of bed and ran and turned the lights on. He was pale, yellow, mouth open. An urge came over me that this wasn't good. I grabbed my phone and called 911. I ran up to Eric to see if he was breathing or had a pulse, but he didn't.

Panic had sunk in as I was talking to the dispatch. She had me pull Eric to the floor to do CPR. As much as I didn't want him basically falling on the ground, I pulled him as hard as I could to get him down and began CPR until the EMT arrived. They immediately took over, getting out there fibulator and started compressions. The worst part of all of it was when they were pumping his lungs, blood went everywhere. It's like on replay in my head and I want it to go away. I began screaming at the EMTs that they weren't doing it right.

He shouldn't be bleeding. How could I really know what is right and what is wrong? I have no idea. I screamed, cried and just sat in the corner of the room by my dresser rocking back and forth, hoping and praying this was a dream. fading in and out of the moment, hoping to go back to the night before when we were laughing, kissing, and saying good night. The EMT finally asked me to leave the room. He could see I was visibly upset and couldn't function.

He took me to the living room and had me sit down. I couldn't. I paced back and forth until an officer came out and asked if there was someone I would like to call. I called my mom back to back until she finally picked up. I told her to come quick. The ambulance was here. Something is wrong with Eric. I was upset and crying still.

I paced back and forth until I fell to my knees, praying this wasn't happening. At that point, the head EMT walked in to tell me he didn't make it. We did all we could do. I lost it. I immediately ran to the bathroom and began throwing up. During all of this, my kids had woken up, and I quickly yelled for them to stay in their room.

They knew something was up. They saw ambulances and cop cars for what had seemed hours at this point. I could tell their fear through the walls, but didn't have the courage to dare see them or talk to them at that point. Pause. I find that interesting that she didn't have the courage. I don't know. I'd be running to my kids. Courage for why, you know.

I don't know. She didn't have the bravery to tell them. I wonder why. I wonder why. I'll keep going. I was curled around the toilet when my mom walked in with the EMT lady. I could tell she had no words. She just rubbed my back. She already knew who's gone. The EMT told her, I was distraught, so was she. We couldn't even speak. She started to say, what happened, but I had no answer. You have no idea. We said, I love you. Good night. I went to sleep with Ashton. That was was it. It just didn't make any sense. I told the EMTs I needed to call my father-in-law.

They found my phone for me and I did. I said something was wrong with Eric and he needed to come quick. I told him the ambulance was there, but he wasn't breathing. The odd thing about when I called Gene, Eugene, that's Eric's dad, was that it was about 3.45 or 4 a.m. by this time and he sounded so perky when he answered, almost like he was expecting my call. It was very strange. You know, that's interesting. I actually, some of it feels like a journal. You know, I was a journal writer for a very long time. I still in some times.

I write my thoughts out. Some of it felt like someone processing their thoughts, right? That's what journals are for. Other times, you know, that moment I stopped where she said she couldn't find the bravery to talk to our kids, that caught me. It felt a little bit like a tell. Like, where would you need bravery to talk to them? Like I could see someone saying I couldn't bring myself to tell them this heartbreaking news.

But bravery, that's different to me. Bravery means why would you be scared to tell them? Again, difficult, heartbreaking, sad, bravery. It's an interesting choice of words. I also found it really interesting how she ended that call or that, excuse me, that journal was sort of putting something on her her father-in-law, being suspicious of her father-in-law.

And she ends with, I call Jean, he seemed perky, like he was expecting my call. It was so strange. I mean, that almost feels like projection a little bit too. Like, she,

we're all trying to understand if she's being suspicious, if she's acting strange, if she's acting weird. And she then ends this journal entry with my father-in-law, It was strange. It was acting strange. And that was it. Anyway, there is a dish just so you know what's coming up. There's a handwritten timeline.

We've got more journal entries. We have more texts. We have a lot. But first, another quick word from another incredible trial sponsor that makes these recaps possible. So really quickly. I used to think good makeup meant a whole routine, foundation, bronzer, blush, highlight, or 10 minutes later, you're still blending. And honestly, as a busy mom and someone who's constantly on camera, I do not have time for that, especially on trial days. You should see the crazy going on behind the scenes to be in front of the mic on time.

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Just head to Jones Roadbeauty.com and use code hidden, and after you purchase, they'll ask where you heard about them. Please support our show and tell them. Hidden True Crime sent you. So now we have a handwritten timeline by Corey. So I'm just, I'm going to read this here for all of you. March 7th, here you go. Picked up truck. March 12th. Cody cleaned out garage. March 14th. Cody took computers. March 4th, Eric passes away. March 5th, friends. Bruce, Chelsea, Allie Kay, Bryce, Ronnie. Amy, sleepover, have a few drinks and reminisce. We laughed, we cried, we danced all night. Earlier in the afternoon, Katie mentioned a green folder and asked if I knew where it was.

I mentioned I didn't know what she was talking about. She quickly changed the subject and said, we would figure this out. March 6th, I call locksmith to open safe. March 7th, picked up truck. March 12th, Cody cleaned out garage. March 14th, Cody took computers. Then there was another that with some changes made, it said. Here we go.

March 4th, Eric passes away. March 5th, friends, Bryce, Chelsea, Ali Kay. Oh, Bri. Ronnie, Amy, sleepover. Have a few drinks and reminisce. Is this the same one? Oh, yeah, just with a few changes. We laughed, we cried, we danced all night.

Earlier in the afternoon, Katie mentioned a green folder and asked if I knew it was. I mentioned I didn't know what she was talking about. She quickly changed the subject and said, we would figure this out. March 6th, I call a locksmith to open safe to look for this green folder. This green folder that Katie was talking about, Katie Richens. The safe code had been changed and I could not open it. So Bryce, Amy, Chelsea, Ali, Bri, Ronnie, they slept over. Amy tried to stop me from opening it, redacted, and the cops were called.

March 8th. met with funeral home signed march 11th funeral march 22nd corey starts counseling march 24th boys start counseling april 11th detective what he called and asked to talk to the 12th on the 12th or 13th sky that would be sky lazaro her a former attorney sky told me to tell her the 14th april 13th search warrant on house march 28th filed first complaint on the trust for the house. May 3rd filed for partial summary judgment on C&A. January 10th, Woody calls Chelses in for an interview. January 12th, Chelsk goes in for interview. I lied to that she was the last person I talked to at 11 p.m. Oh. So Chelsch checks phone records. We never spoke that night. January 13th, Jim drives Red Trek for oil change. Cody finds out.

and goes to get it. July 17th, 2022, finds find out about private investigator. He was outside of my neighbors while Carter's 10th birthday party was happening. September 7th, Amy driving by the house, trying to take pictures. November 22nd, Katie files a motion to bring boys in on case. November 30th, first court hearing. Katie and Amy would not turn on cameras. Judge reschedules court from March 2 to determine if kids need to be involved and if the PI has to follow subpoena and give us all his info. November 7th, Amy has served subpoena. January 3rd, Mike McMinrose gets interviewed. November 23rd, 2022. I found out Eric had been consulting divorce attorney. Then there is this one she wrote about the day Eric died. Eric home 6 to 630, fighting with

Mexican drink in bed. He drank half, brushed his teeth. I was in bed. After I brushed mine, talked through the doorway, Moscow mules, lemon, water, vodka, rum. January, March 21st goal. Feuderal didn't have my phone. Kids, bed around 9. Drink around 9 p.m. In bed around 9.30, 9.45, I laid down. Instantly heard Ashton went in, came back at 3. We have text messages now between Eric and Corey, which were also put admitted into evidence, and they're really interesting. So here we go. These text messages on January 5th, 2022, so again, a couple months before Eric's death. Eric says, there's a guy down here that is going to buy the sheep tag from Todd next year, and he tried to get a tag for me today and said, I was crazy for not shooting this ram we saw. He wasn't even that big.

Corey responds, hey, while you're sitting there doing nothing, need your opinions. I know this may change with Jeff said, but for now, I have to put together an analysis for Matt, which is what I'm doing now because he has an investor that is thinking he will come in at the full 2.9. I need estimated costs on the following. So he's going to come in at full on. probably February 9th. I need estimated costs on the following. Exterior work, HVAC, plumbing, electrical flooring, painting, sheetrock pool, miscellaneous equipment, VR and golf, tile,

cabinets, appliances, light fixtures, finish work, landscaping, add up to $4 million. He knows these are guesses but wants a breakdown. Eric says, I have no idea. I would be way off just trying to guess. It's bedtime. Why are you still up? Corey. I need to have this done tonight. He has a meeting with him tomorrow. Eric. Hmm. Well, I think it will come out to about six million. Corey. Oh, M.G. Ha. Nevermind. Eric. To fix all the rotted plywood and everything else, 125k exterior work, 650k, HVAC 200K, plumbing 200K, plumbing, 200k, electrical, 200k, flooring, 250k, painting 150K, sheetrock, 150k, pool 300k, miscellaneous climbing wall, basketball court, golf simulator, 600K, tile, 125k, cabinets, 150k, appliances 100K, light fixtures, 50k, finish work 200K, 200k, and landscaping and driveway,

and pulling the sewer and electrical 750K. Not sure what that adds up to, but that's my best Yes. Well, Eric knows his stuff. Corey responds, Thank you, kind, sir. That's what I needed. Then Eric responds, add 250K more in the driveway and landscape. Corey then says, okay, cool, done. Four million, $450,000. Still not bad. All in all. We can sell for $14 million to be safe. Eric respond. Yeah, but I bet I'm low on a bunch of things. And remember how we don't have time to do this project? Corey says, that's fine.

He said he knows it's a guess for now. No, we're not doing it. But Matt doesn't finance anything without an analysis to give to his investors. They want to see some sort of numbers. And then we're going to have texts from March 2, 2022. It starts with Eric. So, by the way, March 2nd, 2022, two days. before Eric dies or a day, depending on if you believe you died, the evening of the third morning

of the fourth is when he's declared dead. Eric, you want to grab lunch today with a celebratory shot? Corey, I can't. Celebratory shot tonight. I got to do all this final paperwork this morning because everyone is funding tomorrow. And then I promised Virginia, I would go on a walk with her because we didn't have time yesterday. I'm sorry. Eric. Okay, love you. So, and then these are the jail text between Corey and her brother DJ on May 24th, 2023. So Corey is arrested May 8th, 2020. So this would be just a couple weeks after her arrest.

DJ says, did Eric ever talk about suicide? Corey, not suicide specifically. He would always say things like, if anything ever happened to me, you guys will be set for life. Like when he would go hunting or snowmobiling, that kind of thing. And then these are texts with Corey and her mother, Lisa Darden.

Corey says, oh, okay, cool, Hayden. Who's that? The guy that worked for us? Lisa says, yes. And then Corey responds. That's weird about what? I hardly even know him. I helped him do a business license and get insurance one time.

Lisa responds. Another one wanting their 15 minutes of fame. Corey says, oh God, ha. And then there was a phone call on August 22nd, 2020. And by the way, we're just reading this stuff. So we're just, they're just showing it is what I mean. Without a lot of commentary. So we're just going over it.

A phone call on August 22nd, 2020. 23 between Corey and her mother, Lisa. So this is the first thing that we actually get to hear. And I want to listen to it with all of you. And there was something about a love letter put on the seat of the truck with the sandwiches. I said, I don't think so, run. I never heard that. I said, I believe they were eating in the onset.

Yeah, supposedly you put a love letter on the table. that he's cooked with the sandwiches. Yeah, exactly. In the office? Yeah. So it's just bullshit. Yeah. He became deathly ill.

Well, Bailey was theirs. Like, and that's what I put. That's what I put. God, they can come up with some wild kids. I go deep. It's like, what do these people do? Just sit around a damn table and see he can come up with the craziest story. Well, you know, they're saying I put a love note on a poison to stand with it.

Yes. Yes. Yes. Yes. They give you your name. On balance I say. On the seat of the truck is what it said. What in the hell?

Oh my God, they are nuts. And they're going to feel so stupid. And that's the thing. like all of them there's really. When people get up to actually testify and say, know that's a lie. That did not happen. I was there. You can't compete with somebody who was actually there on your belief.

Right. You know, so I'm just like, you know, and the stupid part is the freaking detective, those just all those idiots, they know this. And I almost wonder if they didn't tell the prophecy. So they're saying it was on, they're saying just a few days later, Valentine's Day, Corey made Eric's a sandwich and placed it on the seat of his truck along with the supposed love note. Oh, my gosh.

What the hell? And then the next question is, when Eric gave the sandwich, he immediately broke out in high, They've had trouble breathing. He later told these screaming stock where he tried to poison me. It is so fucking fast that you would go to this. Lie, lie, lie. And Austin was right. I did go back and look where they do start with, I believe.

Well, I'm going to have a whole bunch of I believe today when Rick called me. Well, exactly. And that's what I was like, well, you believe that I believe. Yes, exactly. So Ronnie said, wouldn't you call any names? I said, I'm not. He's supposed to call me today. I said, and then I want my question answered.

I believe, I believe, I believe. I'll show you, I believe. And he just sent me a text and asked me when I'm free today. But just sure as I said, go ahead and call, Ronnie's going to call back and we're not done. Wow. It just seems like they're just reconcored. kind of, as you guys point out, like, they're just, um, their narrative. Just the one thing they seem to always do is try to get their narrative out there. Some people wondered, did they, you know,

you know that jailhouse calls are recorded, were they trying to get their narrative out there? Um, about Valentine's Day. You know, it's, it's fascinating. It's clearly just a bunch of lies. She left the sandwich or she left a note for Eric. She left the, a sandwich in the car and she wasn't with Eric that evening. She was with her paramour, her lover. So, I mean, it's clearly, again, Corey is a liar that does that mean she's a murderer? I don't know, but she's certainly a liar. It's just like a bunch of lies. So after that, Bloodworth moved to admit another recorded phone call. And this one was from August 22nd, 2023, and it was between Corey and her brother DJ Darden.

And the call was played for the jury. So let's listen to this jailhouse call that we call a home wave call. My God, I know. Like, no, the fuck, that did not happen. I was like, no, that didn't happen. Here's what happened. Nanny can testify. That's who fucking lived there.

That's not what happened. Yeah. Like, that's not at all what happened. Where the fuck are you getting this bullshit? Yeah, and like I even like have... No! Like my bake statement got near late. Like, I didn't make any fucking...

Yeah, I know. I was like, nope. I was like, nope. These sandwiches are bought from a restaurant up... From a diner up the road. Receipts to prove it. This shit didn't happen. They're working in the office, and nanny's there and testified and all of this is true.

And everything they just said is completely horseshit. So, again, just sort of... This idea that, you know, it's, there's just, everything's a lie. Everything feels like a little bit of a setup, you know? Everything's, well, you know, it's insane. Investigators are insane. It's just all a bunch of BS, you know, even though actually, no, the investigation is accurate. So after the call finished, Bloodworth moved onto something that has gotten a lot of attention in this case.

he asked to admit what's been called. Ready, ready for this? The infamous Walk the Dog letter that Corey wrote to her mother, Lisa Darden, the Walk the Dog letter. Investigators found the letter inside the book among Corey's personal belongings. And according to testimony,

the letter was written on either September 12th or September 13th, 2023, and investigators recovered it the next day on September 14th. The letter was six pages long, Some portions had been redacted before being shown to the jury. Bloodworth asked Detective Jeff O'Driscoll to read the letter out loud in court. Let's listen to him read that letter.

Detective O'Driscoe, can you please, starting at the top where it says page one, read this letter aloud. Page one, walk the dog, but take vague notes so you remember. Here is what I'm thinking, but you have to talk to Ronnie. He would probably have to testify to this. But it's super short, not a lot to it. He will need to tell Sky at the meeting next week. Upon information and belief, just like they say, a year prior to Eric's death, Ronnie was over watching football one Sunday,

and Eric and Ronnie were chatting about Eric's Mexico trips. Eric told Ronnie he gets pain pills and fentanyl from Mexico, from the workers at the ranch. Not to tell me because I would get mad, because I always said he just gets high every night and won't help take care of the kids. There are pictures in my phone of Eric passed out on the floor or in the chair. Ronnie should have texts from Eric talking about getting high as well. Eric told Ronnie he keeps them in an allergy pill bottle in his work truck, so I wouldn't find them.

Ronnie never told me about the conversation. Eric finally told me and asked if Carmen could get him some. Eric never wanted anyone to know. He had an issue, especially get caught. He always wanted Corey to go down for him. When they traveled, Eric would put his drugs in Corey's bag at the airlines right before they boarded. That way, if they were caught, Corey got in trouble, not him. Once they got to whenever, wherever they were going, Eric would pull the drugs out of her bag and it would cause a huge fight.

She was pissed he would risk her going to jail for his drug use. He just would laugh about it. Eric couldn't ruin his image that he had drug issues so he would do whatever he had to. Corey has never done any type of pills, didn't like them. Rarely would she consume THC only if Eric begged her because it was a special occasion. Reword this however he needs to to make the point, just include it all. The connection has to be made with Mexico and drugs. Ronnie will have the messages to prove Eric confided in him about getting high.

It can be short and to the point, but has to be done. Upon information and belief, L.O.L. They never found pain pills or fentanyl in my house because he hid it in allergy bottle and work truck. And Cody emptied out work truck within a week. So they were never found. When you talk to Ronnie about this, meet up with him in person. I worry sometimes your house and phone are bugged. Maybe drive down to SL and meet him after work without Bree.

Tell Ronnie, don't overanalyze it. It was a quick two-minute conversation, L.O.L.L. Tell him, I need him to do this. Bring me home and then we will get those damn bitches. Also, please text Lotto or call. Tell him, do not text me anything about us doing things together ever, like church, skiing, trips, nothing that puts us together. It doesn't look good. We're so close to the end. Let's push through. have the conversation with Ronnie before he meets with Sky,

then tell him to tell Sky at the meeting about the conversation. Hang in there, we're almost there, love you to the moon. Take vague notes of all this so you remember before you walk the dog. Before you walk the dog. Many people asking why it's called the Walk the Dog letter. It also said walk the dog very large at the top. I mean, some of the dog. of you are saying in chat, this is your first time actually hearing this and it's worse than

you thought. I, every time I hear it, I think this is not good for Corey Richens. I don't know what the jury is thinking, but I mean, this shows Corey literally spinning lies. We've heard her spin lies, right? We've heard her sort of trying narrative control, but we're actually seeing her writing out what other people need to say, how you're going to spin this, you know, Mexico and drugs, even though we know that Eric was hunting there. We now are making more sense of Allie Staker's testimony and whether or not we believe her. And, you know, I do want to point out, too, that one thing the defense has always strongly

argued with this letter is that it was client attorney privilege. And that's how it was found. But clearly, that narrative didn't win. They played this as major evidence right now. the final day of the state's arguments. They're playing this. I'm curious what you guys think about it. Corey, of course, came back to say that she was writing another fictional story.

I guess this time without a ghost writer. I don't know. It's pretty obvious to me. It's about her own life. And nothing seems fictional at all. To me, it sounds like a cover-up and, you know, witness tampering. and what I would like to think, what I think, I think that this letter is very damning for Corey Richens.

This case as a whole, as a whole, I think the defense has some chance in this case. I do. Unlike other people, I've always felt the defense. There is a chance. The majority of this case is circumstantial evidence. There is no murder weapon that anybody has found, no fentanyl. they have nobody stating that they were getting drugs for Eric.

There's no, you know, bombshell text. There are a few things that work in the defense's favor in this case. It's circumstantial. And so the question will be how a lot of circumstantial, a lot of circumstantial. And it depends on how the jury is going to put all that circumstantial evidence together. this piece, like if I was a juror on the edge and I wasn't putting the pieces together, like maybe the juror sitting next to me and the jury sitting next to me, like had it figured out and I was that one jury that was juror that was on the fence, this letter would be like a,

oh crap moment to me. Yeah, it would be the nail in the coffin for me as a juror because I would be thinking, oh, she is really trying to spin a story. The webs we weave, the tales we tell. Like, she is desperate. And again, if one thing is for certain in this trial, the jury is realizing that Corey Richens is a liar. That's been made very, very clear in this trial,

as well as being just a terrible business woman. And unlikable, maybe even. but this this letter although it doesn't prove guilt at all it's just chalk this up to the long long long long long list of circumstantial evidence and it's like you know okay here she is in jail still trying to spin her narratives and not just spin her narratives but get those closest to her to help her And now we see that she's talking to her mother and involving her brother. And we hear text from her mother and brother today too. And we see that her mother sent an anonymous book to the police station to say this is the real Corey.

But now we're also seeing Corey writing her mother and saying, look, you got to tell my brother to say this and you got to spin this. And it's not a good look. It's not a good look. Getting this into court was a win for the state and the prosecution to be able to show this letter. I wish we could have seen Corey as they were reading it a little bit more. I wonder what she was thinking. Anyway, once that finished, Bloodworth said he had no further questions. And before we get to that cross exam, though, because the cross exam of Detective O'Driscoll is very important.

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September 12th or 13th. And then defense attorney Nestor then pointed to the beginning of the letter where Corey told her mom to pass along information to her former attorney, Sky Lizarro. By the way, many people have wondered me, including if this is why Sky Lizarro, you know, decided conflict of interest and stopped representing Corey. But none of us know. Anyway. So again, Corey tells her mom.

to pass this information to her former attorney Sky Lazzaro and then during a meeting the following week, Nestor started to ask about a section where Corey referenced something a man named Ronnie supposedly knew from watching a football game with Eric. Bloodworth

objected saying there wasn't a proper foundation for that line of questioning and the judge sustained the objection. Nestor then asked O'Driscoll if investigators had ever spoken with Ronnie about the portion of the letter that referenced him. Adriskel said, that they had tried to speak with Ronnie.

I wondered this too. Had they spoke to Ronnie, Corey's brother about this. So, Adriskel is now explaining that they had tried to speak with him, but they were unable to do so. Next, defense attorney Nestor brought up a part of the letter where Corey claimed that Eric had put drugs in her bags and that it caused arguments between them. Nestor pointed out that witness Ali Staking had testified earlier that something like that indeed had happened. and Adriskel said he had heard that testimony from staking during the trial. Well, Nestor then asked if Adriskel had personally spoken with Corey's friends about that allegation. He said he had heard about it but had not actually spoken with her friends about it.

Nestor kept working through the claims made in the letter. Another section said that Ronnie supposedly had messages on his phone where Eric confided in him about getting high. Nestor asked if investigators confirmed that story with Ronnie. O'Driscoll said again that they attempted to speak with him, but he would not talk to them. She said that she also asked about whether Ronnie's phone had ever been searched. Adriscoll said it had not. Then Nester brought up another line from the letter where Corey wrote, Eric told Ronnie he keeps an allergy pill bottle in his work truck so I wouldn't find them.

So Nester asked whether O'Driscoll had told Corey, out an empty oxycodone bottle have been found in the nightstand. And O'Driscoll said he personally did not find that bottle. He explained that it was discovered the night Eric died and was transported with Eric's body to the medical examiner's office. Nestor then asked about Eric's work truck and she asked whether Eric's brother Cody had come up and picked up the truck within a few days of Eric's death. And O'Driscoll said he wasn't personally aware of that happening, but he had been in the

courtroom when Cody testified about it earlier. Nestor also asked whether the Walk the Dog letter was ever actually delivered to Corey's mother, her brother or her lawyer, and O'Driscoll said he did not believe it had ever been delivered to anyone. From there, Nestor shifted the focus to the investigation into Carmen Lauber. She asked about something called a trash rip at Carmen's home around February 1st, 23. This was before O'Driscoll had become the lead investigator on the case. Nestor pointed out that investigators found drug paraphernalia in Carmen's trash. She also suggested that while meth and heroin were recovered, there was no fentanyl found in the garbage. Later, toward the end of March, O'Driscoll's team obtained. A warrant to place a GPS tracker on Carmen's vehicle. Nestor then asked

about the early stages of the investigation and to Corey, O'Driscoll said that when he first became the lead investigator. He remembered applying for the search warrant for Corey's home. And by that point, Eric's medical records had already been obtained. Nestor started to ask about O'Driscoll, interviewing Corey, but Bloodworth objected, arguing that it went beyond the scope of direct examination. So Nestor shifted gears and asked about O'Driscoll's interview with Chelsea Barney. O'Driscollar clarified that he did not interview Chelsea at the sheriff's office, but instead spoke with her at her home in Heber. That interview took place on April 2023 before Corey was arrested. Henneser Asa O'Driscolli told Chelsea that investigators had evidence showing she and

Corey communicated the night Eric died. O'Driscoll explained that investigators were interested in their communications because they appeared to text each other almost every day. But there was a noticeable gap in their messages between March 2nd and March 4th. He asked Chelsea about that gap. Chelsea later provided records from her phone carrier, and those records matched up with the timeline. Still, O'Driscoll said the gap initially caught investigators' attention because it raised the possibility that messages had been deleted. Nestor also asked whether O'Driscoll was aware that Chelsea had previously been interviewed by Detective Woody, and he said, yes, he was aware. Next, Nestor asked about an interview.

O'Driscoll conducted with one of Eric's friends named Jake Sorensen. Then she returned again to Carmen Lauber. Nestor asked whether any fentanyl was found in Carmen's house during the search. O'Driscoll said no. She also asked whether detectives ever asked Carmen if she was under the influence during her jailhouse interviews. O'Driscoll said he didn't remember. Nestor asked whether Carmen initially denied ever being asked by Corey to obtain fentanyl. Adriskel said yes, she did deny that.

He also acknowledged that Carmen had said her daughter overdosed on fentanyl and that she didn't mess with that drug. Nestor then asked who first brought up fentanyl during the interviews with Carmen. O'Driscoll said law enforcement did when they told her that Eric had died from a fentanyl overdose. Nestor also brought up a line from one of the interviews where detectives told Carmen something like, she was the biggest piece. O'Driscoll then explained that Carmen had said something along the lines of, can you just put all the pieces together? And investigators responded by telling her that she was the biggest piece

and that she held all of the carts. Nestor then pointed out something about the timeline. She said that within days of Carmen agreeing that Fentanyl was involved, Corey Richens was arrested. Odryskel confirmed that was correct. Next, Nestor asked about the hydrocodone bottle that had been mentioned earlier in the trial. O'Driscoll said it had been in a few different locations over time and that the sheriff's office did not currently have it. Nestor then asked about February 14, 2012, which prosecutors alleged was an earlier attempt to poison Eric.

She asked whether O'Driscoll personally investigated Eric's whereabouts that day, and O'Driscoll said, that work had been done by cell phone expert Chris Cotrademus. Nestor asked whether O'Driscoll had received information from Cotrademus about Eric's location that day. And O'Driscoll responded, I believe so. The truth is, I don't remember 100% for sure if and when I knew about the location data from Eric's device. Nestor then pressed him further. She asked what he knew about Eric's whereabouts that day and whether he could tell the jury what Eric actually did on February 14th. At one point, she asked, you cannot tell this jury what Mr. Richens did on the

day he was allegedly attempted to be murdered. And the prosecution objected to the way question was phrased. The judge told Nestor to ask a more precise question. She rephrased it and pointed out that O'Driscoll didn't know where Eric was that day. A Driscoll responded that he could consult with other members of the investigative team because he doesn't personally retain every detail of the case. He also emphasized that while he was the lead investigator, he wasn't the only person making decisions. Nestor asked whether investigators ever determined if Eric was around the Midway House on the date when Carmen allegedly left drugs there. And Adriskel said that covered a broad range of dates and he,

he did not know the answer. She also asked whether drug dealings between Carmen and Corey continued after Eric died, and O'Driskell said he was aware of one drug transaction between them after Eric passed away. Nestor then asked whether Carmen had done any work for Corey around the time. She received a check from her. Odrystrel said Carmen claimed she had done work for Corey, but he wasn't sure about the specific week when the check was issued. And from there, the questioning turned briefly to the large midway home that had been discussed earlier in the trial. Before we get there, though, I do want to say a few things. I know that some people disagreed with me on the live stream chat earlier, so that's fair. I feel like the defense was doing a decent job with some of these questions,

specifically pointing out that nobody has any idea where Eric went the day he died. Like, that's a blank page there to be filled out. That matters, right? That matters. So, anyway, I'll keep going. So now we're going to talk about the midway home because I actually also thought those texts between Eric and Corey were interesting, implying that maybe Eric was kind of in on the midway home, right? So the questioning now turns briefly to the large midway home that had been discussed earlier in the trial. And Nestor asked if O'Driscoll ever spoke with the realtor involved in selling the home. He said he didn't know who the realtor was. She asked if investigators spoke with the people who handled the closing of the house to find out whether Corey attended.

O'Driscoll said he didn't know much about the real estate side of that situation. He explained that the fraud and home-related issues were handled by the prosecutor's office rather than him. Nestor then asked how many search warrants had been executed at Corey's home, and O'Driscoll estimated it was around 10. She asked whether any fentanyl had been recovered during the searches. O'Driscoll said that anything potentially containing fentanyl had been sent to the state crime lab for testing. Nestor asked whether investigators found any cups, straws, glasses, or similar items that tested positive for fentanyl. O'Driscoll said no. So again, like, we don't even know how did Eric ingest this, right?

I think the defense is wanting some points here. They're kind of pointing out all the things we don't know. what we know we know, but what don't we know. She also asked whether any of the pills Carmen allegedly gave to Corey were ever recovered and tested. Adryskel said they were not. Nestor then asked a pretty basic but important question. She asked whether investigators could determine the exact time Eric died. Adjiscoll responded, I don't think anybody can.

Nestor also asked whether any pills found in Carmen's house were tested. Adriskel said, that would be a better question for evidence technician. Ms. Gibson, that's Chelsea Gibson, since she handled the physical evidence. Near to the end of this portion of testimony, another detail came up about Eric. Before his death, Eric had been on a hunting trip to Mexico. Remember, he had that hunting violation. He couldn't hunt in the United States, but he could in Mexico. And nothing was going to stop Eric Richens from hunting, I guess.

That's how much he loved it. You'd even go to Mexico to do it. So Eric had been on a hunting trip to Mexico, and Odryskel testified that investigators found a Google search on Eric's phone from the night he died. that checked how far it was from Utah to Mexico. And by the way, I think she's bringing that up to say, was he buying drugs in Mexico, right? Was this hunting trip really just a hunting trip? Or was it a place where he could get drugs, right?

Alyssa's street drugs. I get it. The Mexico thing matters. It's confusing. Next, Nestor asked about the number of pills that allegedly went to Corey each time. O'Driskel said, based on the investigation in statements from Carmen,

it was usually somewhere in the range of 15 to 30 pills at a time. Nestor then asked O'Driskel, weather detectives had ever given Carmen rides to meet with her attorneys. O'Driscoll said yes. They had done that a few times when she needed help getting to those meetings. And from there, Nestor shifted the focus back to Corey's phone. She asked about the gifs, Jiffs, that were found on the phone around the time Eric died, that was funny.

Nestor calls him jiffs and O'Driscoll made it very clear. He calls them gifts. So they had one of those moments. O'Driscoll said those gifts were accessed on the device. Nestor then asked that O'Driscoll be shown an exhibit, and that exhibit contained text messages between Eric Richens and Corey from March 3rd, 2022. As the attorney started to move into that exhibit, the judge called for a sidebar. And then after that, the judge decided it was time to wrap things up for the day with plans to resume at 8.30 a.m. tomorrow where Nestor will continue for cross-examination of detective O'Driscoll. I thought we were going to get through the cross.

I thought maybe we would see the prosecution rest today, but no, no. They suggested it would be Monday, maybe Tuesday. It's Wednesday. Tomorrow's Thursday. So maybe this is going to be a five-week trial. Now it's starting to look like a solid five-week trial. Now, cross-exam is going to come tomorrow. This gives the defense a little bit of time overnight to come up with some really

solid questions. And then, of course, the prosecution will redirect. Okay. You guys can disagree with me. You can totally disagree with me. I know many of you do. I felt like the defense was winning some points with their cross-exam. Rather than just poking holes in a story, they're not doing that. They're showing the holes in the story, in my opinion. They're showing, we hear from the prosecution what we do know, right? The web we're weaving. The defense is showing where there are holes in this web, where maybe this web doesn't attach perfectly.

where we don't know. They're bringing up Mexico again. Can they question whether or not he was doing more than hunting in Mexico? Can the jury question whether or not Eric got these drugs? Can the defense question where Eric was the day he died? Can the jury question how these drugs were ingested? And again, the one thing everyone's certain of is that Eric died from a fentanyl overdose, but they didn't find any fentanyl and any straw or any glass.

You know, the prosecution says it was a Moscow mule or a lemon drop shop, but actually we don't know. What was it? We don't know. The medical examiner said that they found nothing that implied it was an injection and it was in his gastric and, you know, so that he probably drank it or ate it. But, yeah, I feel like the defense,

made some points today. The defense brought home what isn't solid in the investigation, not even like where they messed up in the investigation, not even like poking holes in a solid investigation, showing where there are literal holes, where there are unknowns. There's still speculation. Yeah, we don't know.

There is a lot that is questionable. And I think that this is the defense's greatest strength. in this case, and I think they just showed that a bit. It also makes me wonder about what they have planned for the defense. I've heard that they're going to put on a defense, you know, and it's their turn next. Is this the stuff they're going to drive home? Are they going to paint a picture of Eric Richens who possibly visits Mexico for a number of reasons, and it's maybe not just for hunting?

Are they going to paint Eric Richens as someone who loves his gummies and maybe he got gummies in Mexico? And there was more than THC in those gummies. I don't know. I don't know. I think that the state has a very solid case. Don't get me wrong. I'm plain devil's advocate here, which I like to do to keep open, to keep an open mind. Like, the state has an excellent case.

you heard what Kathy from gossip rumor and innuendo thought. So I've had my aha moments during this trial. You guys have seen it where I'm just like, oh my gosh, she's going to be found guilty. Like I see it. I see the connections. Boom. And then there's other moments where I'm like, there are a lot of holes. The defense.

If you have one juror that's not seeing it because of the circumstantial evidence, you know, a carl for those that follow. day bell if you know you know. How will they take all of this? We'll see. There is a lot of evidence though and remember that evidence will all get laid out while they process and deliberate the verdict and they'll look at all that evidence and they'll connect the dots back there and they'll be like, oh yeah, remember that, remember that, remember that. They'll have their notes, but they'll have they'll have evidence to look over. I'm not sure if it'll be a very quick verdict. But one thing I'm really good at always getting wrong,

like I'm famous for getting this wrong, is how long it takes a jury to deliberate. When I think they're going to be quick, they're slow. When I think they're going to be slow, they're quick. Whatever I say will probably not be that. But I'm jumping ahead. I'm jumping ahead to jury deliberation when the prosecution hasn't even rested. And then the defense hasn't even put on their defense with their witnesses.

They didn't release Carmen from her subpoena today. I'm sure the defense is going to call her back yet again. A lot of people they haven't released from subpoenas probably because of the defense wants to call them back. So there you go. Those are my thoughts. But I thought today was one for the books when it comes to trial days. I mean the grief book, the walk the dog. letter, the texts, the journal entries, things we don't know, Corey's wardrobe.

I mean, it was like, she was like, you know, I know that today is going to be big, so I'm going to wear something unexpected. And she did. She did. I gave it a good review on Amazon. So, there you go. You know, for those that are just joining us and following us along, I know a lot of people have caught up on this case.

I do recommend that you listen to Dr. John Matthews. Thias's take on this case. We have that in our full playlist. I'll try to put it in in pin comments. In addition to that, we have a full trial playlist. Oh, oh, really quickly. We're going to play one more thing for you guys since it's been brought up, a blast from the past. A blast from the past. Again, you know, this whole thing started with this, this, this, we know a lot more about Corey Richens now. That's why I want to revisit this. But this interview with Good Things, Utah, many of us following the Corey Richens case,

and those that have watched our backstory. That's what else I was going to say is we have a great backstory for anyone interested that follows this case beginning to end. That's also in our playlist. I recommend it. I feel like we do the best job, kind of breaking it down, giving it a concise timeline of this entire case, how it unfolded. but here is

Corey at Good Things Utah ABC4 my old station there she was she wrote them this is what we learned today she wrote them she brought some talking points

she had a ghostwriter for this book couldn't even remember the title was so excited prepared her talking points for those that I've been counting the correct counter you guys are amazing Mrs. Martin you're amazing

a new task for someone that maybe somebody else that wants to do counting, count how many times Corey Richon says, you know. But here we are. Now that we know more about this grief book, we know that she had some business plans. We know that she was going to have her mother

sending it to the police station to say, here's the real story. Let's watch it together. Shall we? A sibling or friend. Talking about loss with kids can be a tricky subject. Joining us now is author of,

Are You With Me? Corey Richens to share her three Cs to helping kids cope with grief. And Corey, I want to start with your story. What happened in your personal life? So my husband passed away unexpectedly last year. So it's March 4th was a one year anniversary for us. And he was 39. It completely took us all by shock. And we have three little boys, 10, 9 and 6. And, you know, we kind of, my kids, And I kind of wrote this book on the different emotions and grieving processes that we've experienced last year and, you know, hoping that it can kind of help other kids, you know, deal with this and kind of, you know, find happiness some way or another. And to make sense and process, I'm sure, and I'm sure you felt that going through and trying to explain it and articulate it for you and your boys. Yes, exactly, exactly. And so I've done, you know, I'm new to all of this. So kind of doing, you know, research and reading books and things to try and understand, you know, not only how to grieve as a widow as a wife, but also, you know, with my kids, how to help them, how to help them understand what just happened. And what I have kind of found is, as I mentioned, it's kind of the three Cs is how I has visualized it. And it's, you know,

know, connection, continuity, and care. And it's, you know, making sure connection is the one, major one, and making sure that their spirit is always alive in your home, you know, and memories are always brought up and doing things that your loved ones love to do, whether it's riding bikes or their favorite dinner and just constantly, you know, talking about them. And Corey, do you mention at dinner, here's dad, or dad would like this meal? Yes. Let's bring Dad on a bike ride. Yeah, exactly.

And it's, you know, explaining to my kid just because he's not present here with us physically, that doesn't mean his presence isn't here with us. And he's doing these things with us. And he's, you know, here for birthdays and he's here for Christmas. And, you know, and it's just comforting to them to know that, you know, they're not living this life alone. Like, Dad is still here. It's just in a different way.

A different way. Well, I opened up your book in one of the first pages. I saw as a little boy, it looks like he's standing in a hallway at school and he's saying, are you still here? Yes. Yeah. And that was like the first day of school and, you know, all the nerves that kids face on the first day of school with New, you know, and just hoping, you know, dad, like, walk with me,

like help me get through today, like give me the strength to do that. And it has found, you know, it's been a lot of peace for my kids to, you know, to really remember that in the back of their head that they're never alone, you know. So you actually wrote this book with your children. I did. And it's only been a year. How did you process and say you go from processing death to I need to write a book and help others? You know, I just watched the struggle that my kids were going through.

And I actually, you know, I went on Amazon and Barnes & Noble and trying to find something that we could use to cope at nights. Nights are the hardest. It seems like for everybody when, you know, dealing with anything. But I just wanted some story to read to my kids at night. And I just could not find anything. I couldn't find anything that really, you know, suited them or help them find comfort and peace. And so, you know, I was like, let's just write one. And so, you know, I took things that my kids have said to me this last year and we kind of articulated it and put it into a story.

And, you know, just have hopes that it will help other kids. Grief is not linear. And this sounds like it's a touchstone when you need it to come back to. you and your boys. So the first one you had mentioned was connection of the three Cs, keeping the person's spirit alive, the second continuity. Yes. And that's, you know, just making sure you're trying to stay, you know, as much as you can on routine. And, you know, whether that's, you know, sports, you know, sports or pick up and drop off from school or community activities, just, you know, trying to stay in a routine as much as possible.

And then the last C is care. What does that mean? So, you know, on top of just loving your kids and hugging them and kissing them and, you know, extra cuddles and everything, I think it's important that I've learned to really affirm, you know, their feelings. When they're mad or they're sad, you know, it's just that affirmation of, I understand, like, that you are upset, you know, because of this. Like, let's talk about it, you know.

And so I think really it's not, you know, it's the emotional and physical touch of it. But really letting your kids understand that you know why they're feeling the way that they are feeling and it's okay. And let's deal with it and talk about it. There's a promotion right now. Get a free copy of the book, April 30th and May 1st through Amazon, Kindle. You are an amazing woman and mom. And we thank you for being vulnerable and sharing this and touching the lives of others.

Thank you. I really appreciate being here. Thank you, Korn. Thanks, Corey. You know, you know, that was really, thanks, Corey. A couple things years ago, John pointed out how she actually states in there that she needed to learn how to grieve herself. She's like, I was trying to learn how to grieve. And you thought that was a bit of a slip-up, a bit of a tell. And I agree with him. That, you know, she's always trying to figure out, how should I act? How should I be in this situation? How should I grieve?

The other thing too, guys, it's actually what the talking points there were terrible. That is not grief. That is not grief. I found myself so angry when she's sitting there saying, yeah. So I tell my boys that, no, your dad's here. He's here. He's just here in a different way. No, he's not there, Corey.

He's not. It almost feels like a way, again, that she's a coward. Remember that, you know, the night where she says, it writes in her journal, I wasn't brave enough to tell my kids about their father. Why weren't you brave enough? You know, again, difficult to tell your children, sad to tell your children, brave enough, why would you need bravery? Why would you have to, you know, feel brave to tell it. Is it about something you did? I don't know. And in this situation, I feel like it's the same thing. This book is whitewashing grief. It's not.

not processing grief. You know, processing grief is realizing, you know what, your dad isn't going to be at your soccer team, soccer games. And that's heartbreaking. That's awful. And to acknowledge that and to grieve with a child over that and to fill that heartbreak with them. That's grief. What's avoiding grief is saying, oh, no, your dad's here. He's just here as a spirit. Don't worry about it. It's just, he's just here in a different way. that's actually dismissing grief. That's not acknowledging the depth of their pain and their sorrow. And why would she need to whitewash that grief maybe to feel less guilty?

To see, oh, it's not so bad. I didn't do something so bad. Honestly, to me, this entire book and the premise of this book and that interview makes her to me feel so guilty. because it is a book that completely diminishes and whitewashes grief. And why would you need to do that? Maybe if you're not brave enough to face that your children no longer have a dad and maybe because you're responsible.

But I don't know. That's up for the jury. I didn't know I'd go on that soapbox. But it is interesting watching that interview now. I haven't watched it in a long time, knowing what we know now, Corey has become less likable to me in this trial. That's for sure. I have tried to give her empathy.

She does have some of my empathy in certain things. I won't share what. But I have found a lot of that diminish in this trial. And, you know, I like her less and I don't know if I ever liked her. But it's been difficult to see her in this trial. She's a liar. She's a manipulator. She twists the narrative.

She's not as smart as she thinks she is. And I think how she, watching how she consoles her children or the lack of consoling her children and this grief book. And just understanding the history behind it. And, yeah, I'm glad that those boys are with two aunts and a family who I know adore them and love them and that they're safe.

So a couple other things and then we'll end. So our poll showed 93% think guilty, 7% think innocent. But we did do another poll per your request and added another option. 90% feel that Corey Richards is guilty. Eight are undecided to not guilty. Yeah, this case isn't so perfect, right? Somebody also asked, why did I leave that channel? Well, it's a loaded question, a little personal story.

I worked at that channel twice. The first time in Salt Lake City, and it was great, and I left because Life called and I moved to a different state and I actually got out of reporting for a while. then I jumped back into reporting. And while back in reporting, I met John. And John surprised me and let me know that he was actually moving to Utah. We met long distance through a blind date.

And I thought, oh, okay. And it was in southern Utah. And that's where I knew my old station had a bureau where I could be the southern Utah could have correspondent. And so I called ABC4. and I worked once again for them. But this time in southern Utah, so I covered Warren Jeff's, you know, Colorado City, Healdale, St. George.

It's where the Jody Hildabrand, Ruby Frankie, case started where Lori Vallow and Chad Dayville met. It's an interesting place. And so that's where John and I started our married life. And it was actually, I had a child. And then the child, a little baby boy, he was colic. I was determined to be a reporting mother. I love reporting. And a working mother and the Las Vegas shooting happened.

And John was out of town and I was called to work. And I had to work all day in Las Vegas. They said, you're working for Las Vegas today. And I was up there and away from my baby. And I thought this is just no longer feasible for me right now as a mother because I want to be home. And so a few months later, I quit. ABC4 for the second time and then couldn't take the journalist out of me. And I started hidden true crime.

Essentially, the AP wire came down about the Lori Ballo Chad Daybell case. And I couldn't stop researching and I started saving stuff. And John and I had always talked about doing a podcast together since he was a criminal psychologist and then the prisons closed during the pandemic. And that is where John does his assessments. And I had just quit reporting. And we thought, oh, well, let's buy two microphones off of Amazon and start recording our conversations. And that is how Hidden True Crime was born. So yes, so ABC4 is a wonderful place and it was a wonderful station. And it was where I was when my child was born and where I had met wonderful, wonderful people or I had some maternity leave. So all right, there you go.

That was a loaded question, but I thought, why not? I'll share it. There you go. Tomorrow continues with Detective O'Driscoe. I think it's going to be an important day. I'll be watching. This will be a redirect to our live tomorrow. Thank you to those that support us in our live streams. And thank you to those that support our channel by subscribing, by liking, by giving your hypes. Thank you. It means so much. YouTube's changed a lot since we've been on here. And we appreciate you guys. We appreciate our hidden gems. Thank you for your kindness. Covering this is a big job and I'm up for it. But thank you, thank you, thank you. And oh, thank you, Caroline, HTC is the P in my pod or the P2 my pod. I appreciate it. It's been a big, big effort, but we're thankful for our trial sponsors, and we're thankful for all of you to support us and make this possible.

So we will keep going. And yeah, so our full backstory is something to check out if you haven't, as well as John's analysis, as well as his first analysis of that interview. And then we also, for those that don't know, we have said there's some new news in the Ruby Frankie Jody Hillabrand case for those of Impala. Three days ago, we did a story where E. Frankie. and Russell Frankie using their names for lawmakers are speaking out. So we share their voices over on a video if you haven't seen that too. So check it out. Thank you, everyone.

Thanks for subscribing. And we will see you tomorrow. Cawf and all. Thanks for sticking with me. We'll see you. Bye-bye. Most people don't realize how much their personal information is being bought and sold every day. Data brokers are making billions, pulling details about you from public records and the

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