Hidden True Crime - EXCLUSIVE: Family of Slain Dad SLAMS Teen Murder Suspect—Sarah Grace Patrick is GUILTY and …

Episode Date: July 15, 2025

17-Year-Old Sarah Grace Patrick was arrested earlier this month for the murders of her mom and step father. And now, her step fathers family is speaking exclusively with Hidden True Crime. About Hidden True Crime: What started as a simple conversation at their dinner table became a captivating podcast. Join the dynamic duo of Dr. John Matthias, a criminal psychologist, and Lauren Matthias, an investigative journalist, as they delve into the psychological facets of unthinkable crimes every week. Their unique perspectives and in-depth analysis offer a fresh take on true crime storytelling. Thank you for your support through sponsorships, subscribing, listening, and becoming a Patreon member at Patreon.com/HiddenTrueCrime Learn more about your ad choices. Visit podcastchoices.com/adchoices

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Zootopia 2. Now available on Disney Plus rated PG. Hello, everyone. I am with a very important person here. Sitting down for your first interview, Kristen. I'm with Kristen. Douda, Kristen is the niece of James Brock, also known as Jamie Brock. Jamie and his wife, Kristen, not to be mistaken with this Kristen,

Brock's who were married were murdered on February 20th. And since that time, earlier this month, their, or Kristen's daughter, James' stepdaughter was arrested, Sarah, Grace, Patrick, for murdering the couple. while they slept. Investigators say there's a mountain of evidence. Vera Grace's family has spoken out and her grandfather says she's innocent, doesn't believe that she did this.

After crying in a eulogy, after going on TikTok and sobbing and saying that she misses her mother, her family is now saying she is innocent. But now here for the first time ever, I have someone from James side of the family to share their version of what they believe happened. Speaking out for the first time, and Kristen, I know you are nervous.

I know you have notes. I know you have important things to say today. And so I want you to know right now that this interview is for you and for your family to share what you want to share to have your voices heard for the first time. And for those that are just learning about this case, we have an entire backstory here at Hidden True Crime that will be linked. in the description of this episode, as well as in comments here on YouTube. And so, Kristen, first off, let's just start from, I think I have one main question for you

because of recent interviews with Sarah's side of the family. Do you believe that Sarah is innocent? No. No, I do not. Do you believe that Sarah killed your uncle and his wife, Kristen? I do. Yes. Okay. Why do you think that? Pretty much from the beginning, honestly.

I think anybody that hears that she didn't hear gunshots, I think that it's been put out here recently that the house was unusual and the rooms weren't that close, but that's not true. The rooms were very close. The house was small. The bedrooms were all located in, one area of the home. And I mean, of course, I'm not out there with a measuring tape, but if I were to guess between the doorway of Jamie and Kristen's room and Sarah's room, maybe eight feet. Okay. And not only gunshot, but also the heart monitor that woke up their little girl,

five-year-old girl, Jaley. Do you believe that was going off for how long? hours had to have been um but it came out and it's public now that jaley not only heard the heart monitor she heard the gunshots and her room is next door to sarah's so jaley heard the gunshots too yes can you confirm just how many gunshots are wounds there were because we have heard mixed right um i confirm exactly um but multiple i mean more than two or three. I mean, so you can, you combine the gunshots and the LVAD monitor going off. I mean, that's a lot of noise for a house that's small and the bedrooms are close together. Right. And so in other words, she allowed, so if this is true and she is, she is guilty of doing this,

she allowed her sister, Jaley, her half sister, five years old, to go and discover the crime scene. That's right. what does the public need to know about Sarah Grace Patrick that we're not hearing? Because again, we're hearing now that she's not who the media has painted and that she is traumatized by losing her mother and that she has cried and given a eulogy. What do we need to understand about Sarah? I think we can start with the eulogy. it's public knowledge now that the investigators immediately thought it was a red flag that she said,

I'm sorry at the end of her eulogy. That video has been out since, I'm pretty sure the day after the funeral, her dad posted it. It's been public this entire time. But what people don't know is that after she got done and the funeral was over, she went one by one to everybody in my family, everybody that knew James, and also hugged us and said she was sorry, which is an odd thing to say when you just, your mother was murdered. You know,

we don't know exactly what she meant by that. So I'm not going to say that I do. But if it's weird that she said, I'm sorry in the eulogy, it's very weird that she went around and said that she was sorry to people who lost, you know, and we did. We lost an uncle and a brother and a friend,

but she lost her mother. You know, we were sorry. that that is interesting because an investigator has stated people have pointed out that at the end of her eulogy Sarah said sorry but some people thought that meant sorry she was crying but you're saying that the sorry is continued after the eulogy absolutely too many people not only did the sorries continue on the day of the funeral the sorries continued to my mom in particular and I can speak for my mom that's why I'm here is to speak on behalf of our family you might see my face but this is from everyone.

But she continued to call and text my mom for five months, multiple times a week, to tell her that she was sorry that Jamie was dead, and she was sorry that she lost her brother. And, I mean, she manipulated and lied to my mom and torture her for five months. Did you suspect her? of your side of the family suspect Sarah Grace as being responsible for this? Or did you,

did your mother, James' sister, believe her? Nobody believed her. Really? I don't know anybody that believed her. And I can't speak for her family. And I won't say names because it is an ongoing investigation, but I can say that multiple members of her family told my mother that Sarah was involved. And so what does that look like? When you say involved, was she acting on her own? Did she pull the trigger? Was this a conspiracy? What do you think happened? The theories, you know, I don't think any of us have a solid theory. I mean, maybe now. But then, And we didn't think it was possible that she acted alone. And I still don't know that she did because it just seems odd that she would be the one to pull the trigger.

No gun found in the house. No. Yeah. And Jamie and Kristen didn't own a gun. Is that correct? They did not own a gun. If there was a gun in that house, that would be shocking to me. Yeah. What kind of person was Sarah Grayston that you guys would suspect her? Because we've heard that she was smart, that she was going to go to college and graduate high school and make her family proud, that she was beautiful, that she had her life put together. Are we not seeing the same picture that you guys are seeing of her? I can't speak a ton of it on her. I wasn't around her a lot. But I'm not.

here to tell a story. Every time I was around her, she was very sweet. She was very, you know, open to talk to whoever was around. She struck me as a sweet girl. She did. Um, but I didn't live in the home with her. And so, you know, Jamie has said multiple times that we, you don't know the real Sarah. He didn't go into detail because to be honest, you know, when he would tell my mom that she would be like oh jamie you've never raised a teenage girl before you know and you're not supposed to think anything more of that but he would he said multiple times she's not the sweet sarah that you guys see she's not who she puts online you don't know the real her that is that is interesting so that that is your from your uncle james wow about his stepdaughter tell me about your

uncle, you shared a voice message with us from your uncle James. It was really sweet. We shared it in our backstory. Tell us a little bit about who he was and how you want to remember him too. Yeah. I guess when you hear that I'm Denise, you think, oh, you know, everybody has an uncle. They are not close in age. They're not that close. But that wasn't the case because he and my mom have an age gap. So we grew up in the same house together. My mom and dad were divorced. We lived with her mom and so did Jamie because he was a kid. And so we grew up in the same house together. And, you know, we eventually, you know, moved out of that house. He got married. He had kids. But after he was divorced and everything, we were in a point in our lives where we were both, you know,

didn't know what we were going to do. And so we got a house together. We lived together. We lived together as adults, you know? And we were very close. We always stayed very close. A really good guy, right? Right. A lot of people have a past. Your uncle had a bit of one that people have shown online and tried to, I would say, paint him in a picture that maybe isn't completely perfect. But no victim is perfect. I want to point out there's no perfect victim. He was wonderful. He was loving. He was good. He was good. he was, so you were as a roommate. Yeah.

Yeah. You would know better than anyone. And about the past, you know, like you said, everybody has a past. It's not every day that your post from Facebook get brought up for the world to see from five years ago, eight years ago. It doesn't matter. That's not a normal thing that happens. Everyone, you know, has fights on the internet or, you know, whatever. But, you know, as far as the case.

goes, that has nothing to do with the case as far as we're concerned because we're confident that the investigators have looked at every avenue. They know their past. They know every, I mean, they know everything. You know, we weren't trying to not say anything. If we could help, we wanted to help. You know, if this could help find who did it, we wanted everything to be explored. Yeah, absolutely. Ryan Reynolds here from Mittmobile, the message for everyone paying big wireless way too much. Please for the love of everything good in this world, stop. With Mint, you can get premium wireless for just $15 a month. Of course, if you enjoy overpaying, no judgments, but that's weird. Okay, one judgment. Anyway, give it a try at mintmobile.com slash switch. Upfront payment of $45

for three month, equivalent to $15 per month required. Intro rate first three months only, then full price plan options available. Taxes and fees extra. See full terms at mintmobile.com. But you know, you mentioned your mother suspecting, everybody's suspecting Sarah. Did you also suspect her despite wanting them to search, you know, every lead they had. Did you suspect? I did, yeah. Yeah. We all did, but that didn't, we weren't stuck on it, you know.

We wanted to make sure that everything got looked at. If it wasn't her, if it was her, it doesn't matter, you know. And was that more because of the circumstances, as you point out, the house layout, how there's no way she couldn't have heard something? Was that why? Or were you also thinking, wait a minute, I've heard there's more to Sierra Grace. At first, yeah, the gunshot's super weird. But, yeah, I mean, it goes back to Jamie saying that about her,

but members of her own family said it after the murder, you know. And that says a lot to me because, you know, if I was in that situation, I don't think any of my family members would have said that about me. So if you're going out on a limb to say that about your close family member, I think that speaks volumes. Take us back to February 20th, if that's okay. When all of a sudden you learned the news, where were you? And what was happening on your end? A normal day.

I was at home. So my mom got the news first. Her husband is in law enforcement. So he actually came home to give her the news. And then he called me to tell me that, you know, I needed to come there and what had happened, which at the time we didn't know. It wasn't immediately told to us that they were killed. And how did you finally find out then?

It was several hours later that they actually gave us what had happened. We just knew that they were both deceased. So, you know, that gave us hours to wonder what in the world happened, you know. How is it both of them? But the kids are okay. So were you in touch with Sarah during all of this or no, just not? Because I know you didn't know her that well. Did you hear what? Nothing. No. You know, we made sure to ask that they were okay and that they had somewhere to go and everything. But no, we didn't talk to her at that time.

That must have been heart wrenching to hear about your uncle. Yeah. Yes. Do you feel since the arrest that perhaps they will see justice? I think so. I think the, I think a lot of people are saying that it took so long and they just had to make a move the investigators to make an arrest. And I don't see that at all. I think that they, I think it's a good thing that they took so long. because to me, if you are going to have four warrants, two for murder, and have a judge sign off on that to arrest someone, I feel like that's pretty solid. They did their due diligence and getting the evidence that they needed.

Absolutely. You mentioned, too, that you're speaking out now, not just for yourself, but your whole side of your family for Jamie, side of the family. Why are you choosing to do this now? Can you share why this was so important to you, your mom? mother and the side of the family for you to finally speak out. I mean, I, you know, it's like this anytime, but when something like this happens, everyone speculates. And when you only hear, you know, from one person or from one side, you know, that it gives fuel to the fire. So after the arrest, we were told by members of Sarah's family to not post, to not do

interviews. We were asked to take down anything that we had put up about Sarah being arrested. You know, we didn't take anything down, but, you know, we had no intentions of doing an interview. You know, if they're not going to do it, we won't do it. You know, it is still an open investigation. We can only say so much anyway. We can't give everybody on the internet that is asking questions the answers. We just can't. But when it came out that her family was doing interviews, then I think that every side needs to be told. I completely agree with that. Every side does need to be told. Absolutely. You know, so do you think that was to maybe keep you guys quiet a little bit?

And so you're saying it's time for us to, yeah, share our side. I don't know what the motive is. The only real motive is it's public. It's in the interview that her grandfather did. he's hoping that someone steps up to be her lawyer. And that's his right to do whatever he wants to, but that doesn't mean that we need to stay quiet. You know, while they were looking for the killer of your,

of Kristen and James, your mom was out there actively posting, requesting help, getting the word out, right? Because that's what you have to do when tragedy hits, when true crime hits your family, unexpectedly. Nobody ever expects to be victims of true crime, right? It happens. Your mom was a very active participant in getting information out there and asking for help and begging for help. And one thing that people pointed out, while Sarah Grace was very active on TikTok crying, was she joining with your mom at all to try to say, yeah, like, let's look for answers.

Like, was this a united effort? So they were in contact. Like I said, she talked to her all the time. But as far as, I mean, my mom probably posted every single day. She was absolutely relentless. And never once did Sarah just repost her TikTok. Just something so simple, you know, just push share. You know, she never did that. She was active in the comments, you know.

She made her own TikToks, but never. anything that was straightforward saying, help me. Help me find who did this. And what strikes me as weird is, she didn't seem afraid either because I may, in that situation,

I may not have posted because I would be afraid that someone came into my house and killed my parents while I was asleep, apparently. But that didn't seem to be the case. Yeah. You know, Sarah's story has it remained the same? No, absolutely not.

We have heard the story, and I'm not just speaking for me, my mom, my family, her family, and perfect strangers on the internet have heard her story 1,000 different ways. What's changed? Anything and everything. I mean, if she could change it, she did. she went from not hearing certain stuff to hearing certain stuff, that what she did immediately after, what they were doing before they went to bed. I mean, it's like she didn't practice, maybe, what to say.

So, okay, so, yeah, pretending she didn't hear anything and then say, no, I did hear. here the shots and the monitor. Yeah. Yeah, still letting Jaley wake up and go find them. I can't get over that. That's like one thing I can't get over. I know.

What do you think the motive is then? People are wondering, why do this? Honestly, I don't, I mean, I have a theory. I can't share, but, you know, regardless of what it is, If, you know, if it's what most people think it is, I'll say that. We, you know, anybody that's ever been a teenager, you've gotten mad at your parents before. You have not liked what they said. You, you know, thought that they were the worst person ever.

You were mad. You, you know, whatever. But what you didn't do was kill them. You know, one thing that's been talked about with Sierra is possible mental illness. You know, because, again, we see her on TikTok day in and day out, crying over the loss of her mother and stepfather. And to, for those of us watching this from afar, we're going to wonder about mental illness or what is happening,

what this is. It's so shocking to see these TikToks and then find out that she's arrested for this crime. But I have a question because Dennis, someone that has done interviews saying that he believes, leaves his granddaughter is innocent, said she has no mental illness. Can you help us understand what is true and what is it? Is there mental illness that Sierra Grace was dealing with? So this is a popular opinion on the internet. As far as I know, no, she doesn't. And her grandfather just went on the public record to say that no, she absolutely did not. So we have to tend to agree

with that. I mean, he said that they were very close. I mean, he would know. Yeah, he did, he did say that. Yeah, he did. So, okay, so no mental illness, crying on TikTok, giving a eulogy. I mean, she's really well spoken. What about, you know, the boyfriends or ex-boyfriends that there were, there, there's been speculation online, a lot of it. So I have to ask. about an ex-boyfriend and a possible older man. Was she dating someone at the time? Or what was the situation there? So the boy that's going around online that got arrested,

to my best knowledge, has absolutely nothing to do with it. This was her ex-boyfriend. They had long since been broken up. At the time of the murder, she had another boyfriend that, I don't know exactly how long they had been together, but they had been together long enough that Jamie and Kristen knew him. He had been to church with them, and he was at the funeral. He was at the funeral while she gave the eulogy. He sure was. Wow. Anything else you can tell us

about this man? I cannot speak on him. It is still an investigation that's ongoing, so I don't want to speak on him. I respect that. We'll move on. I understand. And I respect the investigation and respect your boundaries during this interview. And moving forward, again, if there's something you don't want to answer, please just tell me while I ask away. Another question I have is this yard sale. There's been talk of a yard sale online after the murders that they were selling all the belongings in the house. Can you help us understand? what this yard sale was and what actually happened?

Because there are a lot of rumors. So the investigation went on for quite a while. They pretty much gutted the inside of the house. They were not kidding when they said that they did not leave any stone unturned. My mom was laughing because I don't know exactly what happened, but Jamie had done some deal where he bought like, not kidding, 500 tires. And so he had them all stacked up nice and neat in the backyard.

They looked inside every single one of those tires. So it was a mess. So it was really do your best to come and find anything that you want. So, you know, he has, Jamie has three older sons. They all came to find something of their dads. They all had something in mind. and they had to look forever. My mom went to look.

She had something in mind that she was looking for. And Sarah was there to get what she wanted. And while everybody was looking, just for example, my mom was looking for the one thing she wanted was a hoodie of Jamie's that she had sent him that had ramen noodles on it. Just something so silly, but that's what she wanted. that's the sentimental thing that she wanted. And his oldest son, Tristan, I can't remember exactly what it was, but it was like a, like a can or something, like a monster can or something.

It was just what they were looking for was absolutely just it, you wouldn't know unless you were them, you know. Sentimental to them. Exactly. And they found it weird that what Sarah was looking for was an unopened comforter. um my mom found a really like i said it was really hard to find stuff so my mom is digging they're literally digging through trash i mean there's trash bags full of stuff that's their stuff and trash bags you know because they wanted to figure this out they went through everything so my mom's you know knee deep in trash and she finds this shirt of christens and she tells sarah that you know look at

this this this was your mom's like this is so cute and sarah's you know and sarah's you know she tells sarah says that it's her mom's favorite shirt. And my mom said, oh my gosh, you need to take this. You need to make it into one of those teddy bears or one of those pillows, you know? And she says, no, you can have it. Wow, that's telling. But she wanted the unopened comforter. Right. There's another story just like that. My mom's best friend went with her to the house. I wasn't there. My mom brought her best friend with her to help her. And there was a piece of artwork on the wall that I'm guessing Sarah made, but I'm not going to say that for sure. It was a kid's artwork. And so my mom's best friend told her to, you need to take this. And she was just like, okay, you know, I've been in that situation.

So I'm not speculating. Like, you know, my dad passed and I brought home the weirdest stuff with me from his house, you know, just stuff that he had rode on. And, you know, so the, the unopened comforter doesn't totally sit right with me, but, you know. Yeah. Does, uh, yeah, that's interesting. At my bank, I was literally getting pennies using wealth fronts. Cheching, there's this much that I'm getting an interest and I didn't have to do anything. Clients like Angela earn up to 4.2% APY on their cash with the wealth front cash account. started at Wealthfront.com. Client was paid $1,000 for their testimonial, creating a conflict of interest. Outcomes vary. 3.3%. 3.3% base API why as of January 30th, 2026, is representative variable

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I know that she saw her here and there. You know, she saw her at the funeral and she saw her at her graduation that was recently, but I really don't know. Okay. Do you know how, and if you can't talk about it, it's okay. But do you know how little Jaley is doing? You know, we're all so concerned for her well-being. I mean, she's, you know, she's five.

She's happy most of the time, but it's not a secret to most people, I'm sure, that she is traumatized. She is, you know. Nobody should have to see that, you know. And she talks about it here and there, but, you know, we don't. don't we answer questions you know she wants to talk about her daddy you know about her mom she she does that and she's she's comfortable doing that now but you know she she is traumatized from it you know and and we do get to see her her and my youngest son are besties you know and she loves her aunt Kim my mom so you know she's happy but not something she should have seen

absolutely so sad And incredibly close to her parents. Like, I mean, she was with them all the time. She was the baby, you know. You know, they're, Jamie's three of his kids were grown, you know, married kids, you know, everything. And then he has this little girl, his baby. And, you know, she, she loved her mom. She did.

I am not taking anything away from Kristen because she absolutely loved her mommy. But she was a daddy's girl. I mean, they were so close and my mom would keep her overnight. She'd want to go stay with Aunt Kim and, you know, play with my son. My son would go over there. And as soon as she would wake up in the morning, she would call her daddy without even telling my mom, be like, Daddy, I'm racy, you now. My mom would be like, Jamie, you don't have to come and get her.

She can stay. I know you're busy. You know, he had doctor's appointments and all kind of stuff that he was always going to. And he'd be like, nope, if my baby wants to see her daddy, I'm coming to get her. So they were tight. They were very tight. My heart goes out to her. It's just so sad.

I think the thing that we can't get over, I mean, it's the thing I can't get over either is just the crying TikToks, the eulogy. And they were real tears. We see real tears, you know, coming. No, not real tears? I think one of the, there was an interview, the interview with Dennis.

the investigator or maybe she's not an investigator, but she was the one that did the press conference. And she was in this interview day before yesterday, whenever it was. And she said that it was a red flag to her, the eulogy, but that she wasn't there. So she didn't know if she was really crying or not. She didn't see it. Okay. But I did. I was front row at this funeral where I watched her do this with my own two eyes and not a single tear

was shed. And this isn't something that I thought about afterwards. This isn't something that I've gone back to the video and looked for. I was thinking it at the time. I was thinking, what is this voice that she is doing that sounds like crying, but a tear has never shed? And you can see on the video, she doesn't wipe a tear. She does not have a tissue. She does not shed a tear. Her eyes are not read. It's not speculation that she was not crying. She absolutely was not crying. Okay. Okay. So what were your thoughts then? Your front row watching this eulogy, what's going through your mind? I mean, I was just, it was one of the weirdest things that I have ever witnessed. You know, my mom spoke at the funeral. Jamie's oldest son spoke at the funeral. One of

their good friends spoke at the funeral. There was tears everywhere. Everybody was, couldn't get through their speech. You know, needed someone. My mom needed her friend up there with her just to get it through it. And I think it's weird that Sarah, after losing her mom, got up there in her dress and did this big, long speech and didn't ever shut a tear. Didn't ever stop to gather herself.

I think it was very weird. So were you suspicious at that moment? You know, we had all kind of, you know, talked about it here and there, you know, after the murders. The funeral wasn't right away. So, you know, we had talked and everything, but at the funeral, that was kind of a big, like, wow. And then after the funerals, you know, they were together. Their funerals were together. And so then afterwards, there was going to be like a lunch for everybody to eat and everything.

And when she came around to start saying that she was sorry to people, I had brought my best friend with me that was close with Jamie. And we left. We didn't even say by to anybody because I was like, I cannot allow her to say that to me. I just watched her do it to my mom, and I'm not going to allow her to do that to me. Yeah. Since the arrest, have you gone back and revisited some of the TikToks and the eulogie? Like, since she's been charged with these murders? Or do you avoid that?

You know, if it comes up, you know, I might. But I don't really need to. I was watching them in real time. I mean, I saw it in real time. She was not shy. about what she posted and she was not shy about talking to my mom and my mom's best friend who were both relentless and posting and trying to find who did this. She had no problem talking. She had no problem. Anything that she said in those TikToks, I assure you that she was blabbering

to everybody that would listen. Red flag to you. Absolutely. Yeah. And again, not reposting your mother's efforts, not really asking for much help, just sort of seeking, would you say sympathy? That's what I see. I, you know, of course, I don't know what she was thinking, but to me it was, I mean, it's weird either way, whatever it was, sympathy, trying to make people look elsewhere because she is a sad person that lost her mom and she absolutely, you know, she did. She lost her mom. She deserves to be sad, but the, you know, the weird, the weird TikToks just kept getting more weird. So, I mean, what are you supposed to, it's, it's very, I don't know, I don't know what to say about it.

I mean, I guess it's left up to people's imagination what she was trying to do. Investigators say there's a mountain of evidence and we haven't seen it all. The public hasn't seen all the evidence. I won't ask you if you know more, but do you know about more evidence than the public knows? Some, yes. But I would not doubt for a second that they have mountains of evidence because I know of hundreds and hundreds and hundreds of correspondence between my mom and the investigators, and that's just my mom, you know, given information leads to follow, things to look at, that doesn't even account for all the people that, you know, did reply to my mom while she was, you know, posting and looking that would say, hey, I know this. Should I tell the investigators?

Absolutely. Because we don't know what it is. We don't know what little thing could help them. So I, five months seems likely a long time, but the amount of stuff that I'm sure that they have doesn't even, they really worked hard on the case. And I know that they were working every single day because they would tell my mom and they would update my mom. I know you mentioned that you have your own motive, but you don't want to talk about it. Understandably, respectfully, I get that. Can you share whether or not you think there might be another arrest made? I can say that it wouldn't surprise me. That's fair. What else did you want to say? I want to make sure your voice is heard. I know, like I said, you're not just speaking for yourself, but for the whole side of your family for James. James and Kristen, but you are related to James. What else do you feel like it's important to share?

You know, just because I, you know, I am speaking for Jamie's family. We, you know, are absolutely devastated that, you know, about Kristen too. This isn't, you know, one or the other, you know, we. Jaley is our family and she lost both of her parents, you know, not just Jamie. She lost both of her parents, you know. Kristen has another child that's not Sarah. You know, he lost his mom. Jamie has four other kids, three grown, one not, and Jaley. So all of them, they lost their dad. And I think that you need to, people need to be really cautious about what they say.

you know, because you don't know and digging up stuff from some of this stuff I'm not even sure where people get it from, you know, I'm like, I knew them, I talk to them all the time, I'm friends with them on social media, like, where in the world did you even get this, you know, but they have children watching, you know, grown children. Jamie has grandchildren, you know, this is stuff that they're going to see. And, you know, it may turn out the none of that's true. So why, you know, why put that out for, to be out there forever, you know? And Jaley already is, you know, going to have it hard enough. She, this is forever for her. You know, she is this child that this happened to. And so the other stuff really is, you know,

not necessary until we know more. And I'm confident that there's a lot more to know. Yeah. It must be heartbreaking to see. family members talk so probably just like just common you know just hearing us discuss your family and your loved ones on YouTube and on social media and you're right this will last forever for them you know and it's kind of important for us to you know say something publicly because we can't put out every fire you know his his kids are saying stuff to people don't say this about my dad you know my mom saying don't say this about brother but there's you know, a thousand fires and only a few of us. So, you know, if you can put all the fires out

at once, maybe, you know, just say like, you know, this, I guess some of the things that I've said have, you know, cleared up some of the answers, maybe, you know, especially the big one that I keep seeing is the mental health. Something had to have been, you know, she had to have been in all of these mental hospitals and medicine and stuff. And, you know, her grandfather came out publicly and said no. And that's her grandfather. So he didn't know. He's obviously going to know more than I do. So we'll take his word for it. We would tend to agree that that's the case. You know, we never heard any different. You know, Jamie did say, you know, what I said he said about her, about you don't know her, never anything about any kind of mental illness or anything. As a hidden true crime,

dug into who James was in his life so we could allow our. our listeners to get to know him better. One thing was very clear that he overcame a lot in his life. And he was a fighter and he was resilient. And he was working really hard and he was a good dad. Is there anything else you'd like us to know about your uncle James? Just, and this goes for him and Kristen both. They, you know, they never met a stranger.

They were talkers. They were jokers. my mom was we were just saying the other night I was over at her house that you know they would come and get jaley or something and Kristen would just be talking talking talking and then they would go to leave and she'd start talking again and jambi boo behind her like oh god we're never going to go home you know and so you know I want to make it clear that she you know I didn't see them as much as my mom but they were super close to my mom both of them you know and so You know, he, they were, their lives pretty much revolved around all of these kids.

Everybody keeps saying, oh, my God, they had some many kids. They did. But they, I mean, that's what it revolved around, you know, three of them lived there. You know, the other ones were always around. His 12-year-old is actually at my mom's house right now. So, I mean, all of these kids were very loved and taking care of, you know. I can't imagine what they're going through. And thank you for reminding us that there are so many children whose lives have been affected by this.

Is there anything else you want to say today on behalf of your family? And if you want to look at your notes, you can't. But, you know, I want you to feel heard today. I think we covered it all. I think that's it. Unless you have something. No, I think, I think that's it. I think some of the deeper questions we all have will play themselves out and be answered soon.

Absolutely. Possible other arrests. We respect and understand that you're protecting this investigation. And I think that much of our curiosity will have to wait. But I want you to know that we feel for your family and your loss. and if we can help in any way, we want to continue following this story for you and we're so sorry that true crime is affected

and come into your family's life. Yes, thank you. You're welcome. And thanks for letting me talk here. Absolutely. Absolutely. May justice be served. Summer adventures are better with Minky Couture. From road trips to ball games,

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