Hidden True Crime - Jennifer Soto's NEW Police Interview Audio and Immunity | The Disturbing Case of Madeline Soto

Episode Date: September 10, 2024

Case Background: Madeline Soto was a 13-year-old girl living in Kissimmee, Florida. She was initially reported missing on February 26, 2024, after her mom, Jennifer Soto, went to pick her up from school and Madeline was nowhere to be found. At the time, Jennifer Soto told police that Madeline was dropped off across the street from her school in a church parking lot by her mom's long-time/live-in boyfriend, Stephan Sterns. Stephan Sterns said he watched Madeline walk from the church parking lot towards the school but didn't watch Madeline walk all the way to see that she made it in. A massive 4-day search effort by multiple law enforcement agencies to find Madeline quickly ensued. In the immediate aftermath of her disappearance, investigators turned their attention to Stephan Sterns. Law enforcement found several disturbing pictures and videos on his phone of Madeline. He was later arrested on 60 charges, including capital sexual battery, lewd or lascivious molestation, and unlawful possession of materials depicting sexual performance by a child. Tragically, on March 1, 2024, Madeline was found deceased near a wooded area on Hickory Tree Rd. in Osceola County. This is the same area where Stephan Sterns's car was reported as being seen on the day Madeline went missing. Through several press conferences and news statements, law enforcement has stated that they believe that Madeline was already dead the morning she disappeared and that Stephan Sterns was actually moving her body at the time he was supposed to take her to school. Police also revealed that security footage shows Stephan Sterns dumping Madeline's backpack and her school laptop in an apartment complex dumpster at 7:35 am that morning. Additionally, police have video footage of Stephan Sterns returning to the dumpster, with what appears to be Madeline visibly deceased in the car. In April of 2024, Stephan Sterns was indicted on first-degree murder by a grand jury. On June 10, 2024, prosecutors announced that they will be seeking the death penalty against Stephan Sterns for Madeline's murder. Audio Credit: Gray Hughes Investigates    / @grayhughesinvestigates   About Hidden True Crime: Lauren Matthias was a television reporter for a decade and has followed the Lori Vallow and Chad Daybell case since 2019. She and her husband, Dr. John Matthias, a criminal psychologist, started Hidden True Crime in 2020 with their Season, 'Beyond the Veil,' a psychological deep dive into the doomsday murders and prophet. What started as a simple conversation at their dinner table became a captivating podcast. Join the dynamic duo of Dr. John Matthias, a forensic psychologist, and Lauren Matthias, an investigative journalist, as they delve into the psychological facets of unthinkable crimes every week. Their unique perspectives and in-depth analysis offer a fresh take on true crime storytelling. Thank you for your support through sponsorships, subscribing, listening, and becoming a Patreon member at Patreon.com/HiddenTrueCrime Our Sponsors:* Check out Acorns: https://acorns.com/HIDDENTRUECRIME* Check out Acorns: https://acorns.com/HIDDENTRUECRIME* Check out Armoire and use my code HIDDENTRUECRIME for a great deal: https://www.armoire.style* Check out Effecty and use my code HIDDENTRUECRIME for a great deal: https://www.effecty.com* Check out Happy Mammoth and use my code HIDDENTRUECRIME for a great deal: https://happymammoth.comSupport this podcast at — https://redcircle.com/hidden-a-true-crime-podcast1836/donationsAdvertising Inquiries: https://redcircle.com/brandsPrivacy & Opt-Out: https://redcircle.com/privacy Learn more about your ad choices. Visit podcastchoices.com/adchoices

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It's an interview with Jennifer Soto, Madeline's mother. And the interview took place on April 18th, 2024 at the state attorney's office. And so to put this in perspective, Maddie's body was discovered on March 1st. And at the time of this interview, while Stefan had been charged with 60 counts of sex crimes, no one had yet been charged in Maddie's death.

So six days after this interview, though, with Jen Soto, Stefan was charged with first degree murder in Madeline's death. And he is now facing the death penalty. So things to know, at the very beginning of this interview, we learned that Jen is with her attorney and she appears for this interview due to an investigative subpoena. We also learned she has derivative use immunity. So in other words, Jennifer was compelled to be there by the subpoena and has this derivative use immunity, which allows us to understand one possible reason why

she hasn't faced any charges. However, keep in mind that derivative use immunity differ from total immunity. And it does not mean that Jen can never be charged. Rather, it means that what Jen states in this interview can't be used against her in court. But if the government has other evidence of a crime, she could still be prosecuted. At the time of this recording, Jen Soto has not been charged with any crime. Let's take a listen to the interview. Good morning. We are at the state attorney's office in Kissimme. It's 8.57 a.m. It is April 18th. 2024 I am William Jay I am the division chief for the homicide unit with me is Danielle Pennell also from the homicide unit in Kissimmee can the detectives

identify themselves detective Mark Morris detective Kyle Smallwood and with us is with your attorney Matthews Bark all right we went over some things before we went on the record and told you have the opportunity to ask any questions that you need to ask. If you need a break to consult with your attorney, that is absolutely fine. We'll all step out of the room, turn off her reporters, and let you exercise your constitutional right to have counsel. There's no problem with that. There's water fountains here. There's restrooms. I don't know if you're a smoker or not, but if you get desperate, we can make an outside break time, but we are kind of under time constraints. With that all said, would you

raise right hand, please? Do you swear or affirm to tell the truth, the whole truth and nothing about the truth? Yes. Okay. Thank you. All right. This is an investigative subpoena, so you've been compelled to be here. And in our country, under the Fifth Amendment and the 14th Amendment,

has applied to you under the Florida Constitution as well. You cannot be forced to incriminate yourself. So anything you say today can't and won't be used against you unless you just don't tell us the truth. And I've already explained your attorney, Mr. Bark, whether or not you've made any inconsistent statements in the past, That is dirt under the bridge and either a misdemeanor was committed or it wasn't, but we're not going to be using that as a basis of some sort of perjury by false statements.

Because those other charges wouldn't be perjury anyways. So the most important thing today is to tell the truth. I also explained derivative use immunity, which means if you said that there was a gun, and obviously there's no gun in this case buried in your attorney's yard, we couldn't go dig up that gun if you told us that, oh, yeah, there was a gun. The gun that was used is right there. We wouldn't be able to do that. We would have to show that we learned all those things independently from this interview.

Okay? Do you have any questions? All right, so let's get started. Before you start, let me just make sure we're clearing the record. I had off the record we had discussed our position on the concerns we have. Minnesota was interrogated by law enforcement previously. She was under a tremendous amount of duress and stress being that her child was missing. and then she was informed, was found deceased.

There's been media posterity about this. There's been people asking for her to be prosecuted, tar, feathered, executed. And so with that said, we have the concern that you brought up about if there's something said inconsistent today, not being used against her for filing a false police report. All right. So, for example, if she said something that was, false then. And we have no idea that it was false now before this interview, but she comes in and admits that it was false today. We can't use these statements or that omission that it was false against her just like we couldn't use anything else against her from this interview. Okay. Okay. All right. My understanding is that on February 25th of this year, you're working at the hotel on Disney property out of Coronado Springs.

Yes. You have to answer out of loud and last. enough to get coffee before. I know you're upset. I know. Yes. All right. And did you get off at 10 p.m.? Yes. All right. Did you go directly home? Yes. About how long does it take you to get home? About 25 to 30 minutes. And when you get home, who is downstairs, if anybody, you have a two-story. Is it a townhome? Is that the best work for it? Yes, it's a town home. If anybody is downstairs, who was downstairs? I saw my daughter Madeline and Stefan. Do you recall what Madeline was wearing?

And do you recall what Stefan was wearing? When you get home from work, do you need to kind of eat a late dinner before you get settled in for bed? Yes. And do you eat there at your home? Yes. What do you eat?

I think I had a pump-up waiting for me in the house, sandwich. Okay. Did anybody join you and sitting down eating? No, I ate in my bedroom. Okay. Did it look like anybody else had recently cooked food or eaten any food there that night? What I saw, no, I know. I didn't see anyone cooking or it doesn't look like anyone had my cooking. Okay. I believe in one of your former interviews, you mentioned that Madeline might have gone over with you kind of what she got at the birthday

party since you didn't have the chance to go because you were at work. When and where does that occur? That occurs right after I get home. It occurs in my bedroom. Everyone's in my room. And so by everyone, let's just be clear, since I understand you have some roommates. So what do you mean by everyone? Madeline, Steppen, and myself were in my bedroom. Okay.

At this point in time, do you recall what Madeline was wearing? I don't know. Let me ask it a different way. Can you tell me whether or not she was wearing a long-sleeved green sweatshirt and jeans? Oh, no. Okay. Would she have kind of been in her bed gear,

or do you think she could have still been in the dress that she wore to her birthday celebration? She would have been in pajamas. I can't recall the exact pajamas, but she would have been in pajamas. She had already, by this point in the evening, she had already showered and changed out of that birthday dress. And was it your understanding from your understanding

from your sister that she had gotten dropped off about 830, she'd be in Madeline? 8.30, 8.45, something around that time, yeah. And what's your understanding as to when Stefan had gotten there? If you know, if you don't, don't guess it's fine. Actually, while he's saying that this is important. So there's things that you might think should be a certain way, because that's just the way things go. But don't just guess based on past history that it's the same as what happened on that

particular day. if you don't know, you don't know. Then, yeah, I'm not sure exactly what time he got there. Okay. You were at work, so I just didn't know if, like, sometimes families check in, hey, I made it by text or by phone call or anything like that. Do you not remember anything? I don't remember.

Okay. How long were the three of you in your bedroom? I'm going to say for about 30 minutes. Okay. And did Madeline tell you about the party? Did she tell you? Did she tell you what food they had there at the party? Yeah, she, um, they had her favorites.

What are her favorites? Um, Puerto Rican food. So, Addroso Sond Gondoulets. All right, so you're gonna have to translate to English. I know Frioles and a rose and a couple other things, but help me out. Um, if I recall correctly, she had requested rice, it's a type of rice and beans. Mm-hmm. It's rice with pigeon peas.

Okay. And the need, which is, I'm not sure how that, it's a pork, but I'm not sure how they cook it. Okay. Um, so it's cooked pork. Um, that's typically what she requests for her parties. She does like her favorite meal. Okay. And what kind of gifts did she get?

She got a lot of money. Okay. That's what she ended up showing me. I think she had a few trinkets, but like most of it was just a big wad of money that she was so excited for. All right. Um, is there any particular reason Stefan couldn't? make it up to the party because it's my understanding he didn't exactly work or anything. He wouldn't have been invited.

The party was held at my mom's house and my mom and him have never had a great relationship. She's never liked him. So he wouldn't have been invited to the party at all. It just would have been my whole family and then me if I hadn't worked, I would have been there. Okay. Now during this 30 minutes that the three of you are in your bedroom is Madeline engaging in any of her kind of nighttime routine? or, you know, getting ready for bed?

What else is going on, if anything? We spent a long time talking about gifts and having her show me, you know, we counted out our home money. I can't remember if she had finished with all of her bedtime routine. Okay. Does she brush her teeth at night? In the shower. In the shower? Okay. And that occurred before you got home? Yes.

And my understanding with her night. medication is that's that's something that you would like to make sure she had a bedtime or so something like that yeah so were you present for that occurring or did that occur after you got home that that did not occur on my call um I believe I had instructed Maddie when she got home to go ahead and take them herself okay and is that something that she's allowed to do um from time to time Yeah. I mean, say they, is there what my understanding was there was some hydroxazine. Is there anything else she takes at night?

Just hydroxine. All right. And the Merrillax is when? Merrillax is. So that would have been earlier while you were at work too if she took it? Yeah. May not have because she was at the party. Yeah.

Because she's been, because I had been training at work that week and we had been going back and forth with my mom's a lot, the Merrillax wasn't consistent. Okay. All right. Now, Madeline, does she lay out her club? for school the next day or is that something she gets in the morning makes a game time decision like my kid? Typically it is a game time decision morning of. Okay. What about this specific evening? Do you remember anything about it? Yes. This evening we had I had already discussed prior to step in coming to visit that he was going to help me take Maddie to school that day.

So because I knew that that was what was going to happen that night I had asked Maddie pick out of clothes. have everything ready, have your backpack ready, your water bottle, everything you need ready, so that way you could just grab your stuff and head out. It won't be too much of a hassle in the morning. And so she did, she picked out her clothing. I asked her what she was wearing and she told what she would, what she had picked out and said, okay, fine. All right, so she picks it out, but does she physically take it out of somewhere wherever she stores a clothes and put it somewhere? I'm not sure. Okay. I'm not sure if you took that clothes. upstairs with her or anything like that.

All right. So you didn't see them in your room and did you have the opportunity to kind of see her cupy part of the living room to see if she had put them on her bed or anything like that? I hadn't seen them. Does Madeline have like a water bottle or a hydroflask or whatever the kids call it that she likes to sleep with and bring up bring up or bring wherever she's sleeping? Probably not. That stays downstairs in her backpack and then she'll clean it in the morning and then fill it back up and leave it in her backpack. That typically stays in the backpack. Okay.

Favorite stuffed animal or stuffed animals? Anything that always goes with her wherever she's sleeping? She does have a few stuffies and blankies. Did I see any that day? Yeah. Specifically, did you see if she brought any of that stuff upstairs with her? No, I didn't see any of that stuff upstairs. Now separate question. Generally, habitually, like your attorney was saying, there's a difference between specific memory, but generally, would you

Would she do that? Not saying that you saw it that night? Generally, would she do what? Have stuffies and blankets and her favorite stuff? Yes. She typically would. So if Stefan says something like Maddie's building her nest and getting settled in, would that, do you mean like her stuff is part of this nest? Or what do you think that would mean if you know? Sure.

Okay. Do you recall getting that text from Stefan that night that Maddie had settled into her nest for the night? I don't remember the text now. Okay. My understanding was that at some point you told them it was time to go to bed. Yeah. Do you recall about what time that was? Around 11 o'clock.

So that's consistent with getting home at 10.30, having this half hour discussion, eating your pub sub? Is that a yes? Yes. All right. Do they comply with your wishes to go upstairs when you say that at about 11 o'clock? Yes, they do. Okay. Is there any further communication between either you and Madeline or you and Stefan about,

all right, kids, it's time to go to bed, anything like that? Or was that the last you had heard from either one of them that night? I think at some point, Stefan comes downstairs to use the restroom and then goes back upstairs, but I don't, after that, I don't recall interacting or saying anything to stuff. Okay. And my understanding is that you had some sort of parental controls over Maddie's phone. Is that accurate? I'm not sure by parental controls exactly.

I didn't have any limits or anything on the phone set up. Well, like for instance, if she wanted to install Game Pigeon, does that have to go through you? Yeah, yeah, yeah. So any permissions for any apps, she would have to ask me for? All right, and does that ring a bell as to occurring that Sunday? Game Pigeon? So that's the last time you hear from either one of them until the morning. My understanding is that Stefan comes down as Neil and

your dog. So is there any communication other than perhaps Stefan coming down to use the restroom? Is there any other communication that you have between Stefan and Matt? Do you see them? Now, I've said communicate. Do you see them? Do you go up and check on them? Do you see Madeline or Stefan from the point you kick them out at 11 p.m.

until you see Stefan at 8 in the morning-ish is what you guess for the dog? Yeah. No, I didn't. I didn't see them. Okay. Now, when you go to sleep, do you sleep through the night or do you kind of wake up and not have consistent good sleep? I sleep through the night. Okay.

So there wouldn't be any points in time where you get up and you're taking steps or just checking on your phone because you can't go back to sleep. As far as you remember, when you go to sleep, you're out until the dog thing in the morning. Yeah, exactly. Did you hear or see anything during those hours? involving Stefan or Madeline. Here's anything. All right, what's the first thing you remember when you wake up after having gone to sleep? I wake up to step in trying to put the leash on the dog.

Okay. Now is this the first time that you've ever woken up to Stefan trying to put a leash on your dog, or is that something that has occurred before in the past? I'm going to say this is the first time. It's not normal for any of us of the leash on the dog. on the bed because if he's on top of any like bed couch anything he'll pee he gets really nervous you have to do it on the floor so I found it really weird that he did that but all right so let me ask a little more broadly is this the first time Stefan's ever come into your room while you're sleeping to take the dog out for you

in the morning I can't recall before okay did you find it unusual then or what did you think when this is occurring when it happened I think it was more I found it off, but I was more worried over the dog. I was like, please don't pee on the bed. I don't want to do. So I was more anxious over that. He put the dog on the leash and told me to lay down and go back to sleep. And I said, okay.

So were you not laying down when he tells you to go back and lay down? No, when he got, when he put the leash on the dog, I shot off the bed because I was going to help him. I was like, no, no, no, let me do it. And he's like, no, go back to sleep. I'm fine. I got this. Okay. Now, do you go back to sleep or do you check your phone or do anything?

I think I go back to sleep or do you look at anything. In this period of time that you have been awoken by Stefan, do you hear or see anybody else in your household? I hear somebody in the kitchen. I'm not sure who it was. Could you identify it by size, like there's steps? Could you identify gender? Could you identify gender by their voice? Anything like that? All I heard was sounds of like cabinets shutting, like somebody in there shutting, like looking for something and shutting. Okay. Now if your daughter had been awake, would she come in and say goodbye to you before school or not just let you sleep? Would have hoped she would have come by and say goodbye to me.

I can't remember if this is one of the first times that Stefan actually took her to school. so I would have hoped you would have said good night I'm sure all right so do you fall back asleep I do and when do you wake up and how do you wake up I wake up at like nine o'clock in the morning to my alarm um yeah I wake up at nine o'clock in the morning to my alarm I get ready I think at around 9.30 9.45 I leave for my doctor's appointment okay So in this period of time from when you're waking up and getting ready, do you see anybody else in your home? At this point, I'm not too sure.

I know throughout the day I've seen my roommate in the kitchen cooking and doing her thing, but I don't recall if it was up this time. Did you see your daughter this morning on the 26th? No. Did you have any texts or phone calls or any other type of communication through any possible app on your phone? Like, hey, mom, love you at school, whatever. Any communications from Madeline? All right. How about from Stefan by the time that you wake up at nine, any texts or communication from him?

Maddie's dropped. I'm off to the game store or whatever he's doing. No. I didn't hear back from Stefan until 10, like 10, 20-ish. And he had told me he left his phone at home. that whole morning by accident. And I had asked him how the morning went. How was Maddie?

And he let me know that this morning went great. We made great time. She got busy super quick. He was going to take her in a while for breakfast, but she changed her mind. All she wanted to do was sleep in the car. So he let her sleep. He took her to school and dropped her off.

He said he dropped her off. And that was it. And you had a 1015 appointment for a blood draw? Yes. And did you go anywhere else prior to getting to your appointment for your blood draw? Did you go directly there or not directly there? It's basically the question. Oh, I went directly there.

All right. And after your blood draw, did you go directly back home? Yes. About what time did you get home? The time between 1115 and 1130. Did you have any other appointments or doctor? appointments or doctor's appointments later in the day? I was supposed to have had one, but I canceled it. When did you cancel it? That same day. Why did you cancel it? Because it was a

$350 Votox appointment that I didn't want to spend the money on. I changed my mind last second. Okay. When you get home from your blood draw appointment, is there anybody else at your home? Yes. Uh, Stephanos home. All right. And can you describe what he's wearing, what he's doing, his demeanor, what's going on. I can't recall what he's wearing. It might be a red shirt with a graphic on him. Okay. He's sitting in my bedroom on my desk. Prior to you getting there, he's in your room, or is that where you guys go to talk? He was hanging out there in my room. Okay. My room is kind of like the general hangout spot.

Okay. I walk into my room. He's sitting there on the computer chair. he's talking, acting normal, asking about the morning and how everything went and he let me know the errands that he ran that morning or what he was up to. And what did he say he was up to? He said he had dropped Maddie off at school and then afterwards went to a vape shop so he can buy vaping things. Okay. But that the store wasn't open.

So he waited a long time for them to open. They never did. So he drove around, killed time. and then eventually made it back to my house at like 10-20. When later on, when he was, when I got home and he was home, we started discussing, or he started telling me that he was going to go back out to run a few more errands in a little bit down 192. And he gave you the name of a few stores that he might stop at.

And I'm like, okay. I asked him if he wanted, to meet me at my house by 2.30 so that we can go pick up Maddie from school together. And he said, yeah, he'll be back by 2.30. He said, okay. So was that the plan to get her together, or was it ever discussed that he would get her alone? The plan was for us to get her together. Okay. All right. And so does he leave before you leave? Actually, before this, while we were still discussing, while we were having the conversation in my room, he did mention at one point, oh, while he was sitting there, that he had to

reboot his phone or that he had to update his phone. And what was it? He had to update his phone. So I told him, stop avoiding it to do it. Like it's a up-age take a while, like, do it. And while he was updating his phone, he said, I don't know what I did, but I just, factory reset my phone. And I said, that's weird.

I didn't know that you could do that. He said, yeah, a button popped up and I pressed it and it just reset my entire phone. And I'm like, oh, that sucks. So does he leave before you do to go do these errands he was telling you about? Yes, he does leave. Do you stay at home until it's time to go get Madeline? Yes. Do you hear anything from Stefan while he's out doing these errands?

No. Okay. So 2.30 rolls around. Is Stefan back home yet? No. At this point, I leave. Do you call, try and call him or text him or communicate with him? Yeah.

I had been calling him, like, maybe starting 15 minutes before I'm supposed to leave just to see where he was. Did he answer? No. I leave at 2.30. Around 10 minutes later, I get a phone call from him. And he said, I'm so sorry. I left my phone at home again on accident. I was driving down 192 and my tire exploded or shredded.

And I had to pull over into one of the plazas and change my tire. He said he hurt his thumb doing that. And that, yeah, he was late. didn't make it back on time for that reason. All right. When you leave to go pick Madeline up at 2.30, do you take her phone with you? I do. And how is it that you come to get her phone to go with you?

At some point in the morning, I was organizing and putting things away, and I walked into her bedroom and I saw her phone on her dresser. And I just assumed, oh, she must have left a year while getting dressed and forgot it. Okay. Was it on? Most people don't realize how much their personal information is being bought and sold every day. Data brokers are making billions, pulling details about you from public records and the Internet, and then packaging and selling it, usually without your consent. That's how your information lands in the hands of scammers, spammers, even stalkers.

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Okay. All right. So you go to school and due to time constraints, like an NFL football game, we're going to kind of jump ahead a little bit. My understanding is that you want to be first in line. And you have to get there early to do that. And I understand that. Yeah.

She doesn't come out. She doesn't out. Did you call her phone? I did. Why did you do that? Because I forgot I had had it with me. I was like, where is she? Why isn't she out yet?

So I start calling her phone. And then I start realizing I'm hearing vibrating. And then I look down and I see her phones with me. I'm like, oh. Okay. How am I going to get a hold of her? Because I'm the first in line. The cars behind me already have children.

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So I'm going to kind of jump ahead. Did Madeline ever complain to you about believing that Stefan had taken her Christmas money? Yes. Tell me about that. Christmas money went missing. And we were both, um, it, I was, I don't even know how to say this. We have collected all of her envelopes with tricks us money

and consolidated it into one. I'll put all her money into one. And then I said, I will put this somewhere safe and I thought I had put it in my night stack. A few days later comes around, whatever. We start looking for it or asking for it or something like that, and we can't find it. We can't find it at all.

Let me just narrow it down. Did she accuse Stefan of taking it? I'm not sure if she did direct. Correctly. We both had the suspicion, but we're like, no, could he have? No, I don't think so. But I eventually found that money. Okay. I was just going to have it to the mystery end. All right. So you just started this job at Disney Coronado Springs like a week or two earlier. Is that right? Yes. And your sister and other family members would help with Maddie getting to school because of your job? Yes, my mom and my sister, yes.

Okay. Why is it that now, Stefan, on February 20th? is coming up to help as opposed to any of your family members helping getting Madeline to school? I had asked for him to come and help me because I think I was working a lot of night ships or like really late shifts. And I just wanted the opportunity to see Maddie. Like, because I wanted to spend more time with my daughter throughout the week while I was working. Versus had she had stayed at my mom's, I wouldn't have seen her all week. Okay. So that was just me wanting to see her.

spend time with her. Did Madeline stay at your mom's house fairly frequently? Every few weekends here and there, like just for the weekend kind of thing. So like if she described it to her friends as like her second home and like kind of offer up, it's better, better jacuzzi and pool, does that sound like that's the place? Yes. Where does Madeline sleep when she's over at your mom's? She will sleep in bed with my mom. Okay. Did she ever have sleepovers? Like how friends come over and sleepover? Slumber parties, no.

Did she ever go and attend any? No. Is there any particular reason? I mean, she's a 12-year-old girl on the cusp of being 13? Yeah, I've been very uncomfortable with sleepovers just because I know what can happen. Anything can happen in a sleepover. Well, then you can be the host house like we kind of were. You never hosted any sleepovers for her friends?

For her friends. Did she ask about it? Yeah, she did ask. Was it probably a source of contention or arguments? It was, I guess what was the source of argument was her and she wanted to really sleep over her best friend's house. And I just kept saying, no, no, no, you never know what could happen. I don't know the dad. I don't know the brother.

I don't know anybody either. Like, I don't know what can happen to you. I was just afraid of her getting assaulted. Did Madeline do her own laundry? Yeah. Did she cook for herself? I was teaching her head to make a few things. So, I mean, yeah, she could, I guess.

What's her normal routine for getting ready for bed? Can we give her her meds? I'm sorry, take your time. We'd get ready for bed. I'd give her her medications. She would get in the shower. Take a long shower, I understand? Like an hour plus, yeah.

She loved it. She'd get out. She'd get dressed. She'd let her hair towel dry for a while and then she would brush it. We would watch some teeny. She'd probably have a snack before that as well. Okay. What were kind of her nighttime uniforms? I mean, everybody kind of has their pajamas, but they're not necessarily pajamas. What was her routine nightwear? She really liked wearing shorts. So she had a few pajama outfits. But she'd be wearing shorts and baggy t-shirts.

Okay. How about her routine getting ready for school in the morning? What's that about? We'd wake up. The alarm would start ringing around 7.30. We'd snooze it up until 8 o'clock. Then she'd get up. She'd get dressed.

And then she'd lay back down in bed while she would wait for me to make her breakfast. So she would, she's a breakfast eater? Yes. Okay. She'd have breakfast. Then she would start, you know, with brushing her hair, brushing her teeth, putting on makeup. Maybe I would give her her ADHD medications for school. Is that every day or just school days?

So it sounds like you're heading out like 845 or 9. Yes. It takes like, what did you say, 15, 20 minutes to get to school? Yes. And first bells 938. 9-20. Okay. So on Monday the 26th, 730 seems like a really early time to depart to go to middle school,

even if you're getting Mickey Dees. What was the discussion about when Stefan and Madeline were going to leave on the 26th? There wasn't one. So you didn't know anything about these plans or did you? I knew that they were going to go to McDonald's, but not 7 o'clock in the morning. That wasn't. Okay. I had assumed like 8 o'clock.

But even then, 8 o'clock is kind of early, like 8, 8.30, because you could just go to McDonald's, be done by 9, and then drop her off at school. But McDonald's right, the block away from the school. And Madeline's not driving, so she can eat while she's riding. Yeah. And she takes about an hour to get ready in the morning? Yes? Yes.

So if they were leaving at 7.30, you'd think she'd have to get up at 6.30 to get ready and go through a routine, right? Yeah, that's extremely early. Okay. And is that what Stefan told you? after these events unfolded was that they left early like 730 what did he ever tell you it was early I can't remember the time I think I dropped her off in front of her school sometime between 815 and 845 you say I what do you mean by that did you drop her

off that no I'm speaking sorry okay step and stephen let me know that he dropped her off 815 and 845 on the road by the church close to her school. And I remember asking him, why is so early, that's too early. School doesn't start until 930. Why did you drop her off that early? Oh, I don't know. We just left the house and made a good time. I wasn't paying attention to the clock.

Okay. Did Madeline ever have, like, effects from taking the hydroxazine in the morning? Like, still be kind of sluggish? Yes. How often would that occur? Was that like every morning or not every morning? Not every morning. If we happen to give her medication later than normal and routine, that would happen.

And were there ever any instances where she had taken too much of the medicine? Perhaps you and Stefan had given her medicine not knowing that the other person had? Yes. That's happened one. How before? Just once or more? I want to say once. Were you taking medicinal marijuana in pill form at any point or THC?

Yes. And what are those pills or tablets or capsules look like? They're purple capsules. Did you ever suspect or confront Stephen about giving those medications to Madeline? No. So during this incident where Madeline had been double-dosed with hydroxazine, And do you recall any conversation you had with Stefan and inquiring as to whether or not he had accidentally given her any of your THC?

That hadn't occurred to me. I had asked him the day that the one morning, now he wouldn't wake up and get ready for school and she was just out of it. I assumed it was medication related. But I didn't mean, I'm like, did this one medication hit her too hard because we gave it to her late? I called poison control. I needed to see what would happen. With at this point, I think I had gotten to admit that he gave her a second dose of the sleeping meds as well,

because he thought I had given it to her in the first place. Okay. That was with hydroxene. I didn't know anything about THC, the marijuana. I'm just asking you. Oh. I'm asking me if you remember having that conversation. There is a conversation on your phone about you, you were relaying that Madeline said that she suspected that it was different bigger pills and you relayed that to Stefan.

and had a conversation with them. And if you don't remember it because it was a year ago, that's fine. My next question is you have two female roommates. Yes. And one of them has a child, a son that sleeps part-time over there. Yes. And so my understanding is they're kind of, it's like a, I don't know what's called it, like a bed and breakfast. There's numbers on the doors upstairs. I don't know. I just to make it easier for the roommates, I just labeled each bedroom. So they're in two and three? Yes. All right.

Now, bedroom number four, at one point you told the police that your sister was staying with you, and that's why the sleeping arrangements were as they were. Was your sister ever staying with you? Or did I misunderstand what you said? No, my sister wasn't staying with me. Okay. So let me ask you this. At what point did Madeline's bedroom kind of become the living room?

When did that setup start? I think as soon as a few months into us moving back into that townhouse. And when would that have been? I'd say June of sometime in 2022, but I'm not sure when. Okay. It's my understanding that it's December of 2022 that you and Stefan kind of break up? Yes. But he still remains in the townhome.

Yes. Why is that? So even though you're broken up, I still considered him one of my best friends. I wanted to give him the opportunity to live there and he had just he had gotten a job in Disney the mystery will and I didn't want him to continue to lose that because he didn't struggling for a long time to get a job or do anything with his own mental health okay so I just wanted to give him a chance to like do something be be something so Did he pay rent?

Yes. How much rent did he pay? 600 bucks a month. All right. I'm sorry. Here from. No footsies. Like, all of it.

So in December of 2022, kind of when the breakup happens, prior to that, what were the sleeping arrangements in your home? Was he sleeping in your bedroom as a couple? Yes. So who's in bedroom number four, if anybody? That room remained empty for a while. For a little bit, there was another roommate there, but it remained empty for the most part. And were your female roommates already there in two and three? Yes.

Why doesn't Madeline have that bedroom for? I wanted her to have bedroom four, but my dad really wanted rent. That whole unit that I live in is owned by my father. Okay. So let me ask you this. Do you pay your father anything to live there, or does he just handle the collecting the rent from your rentees? Lessees, whatever they are? I pay in rents as well.

Okay. What do you pay for the rent? My portion of the rent was $400 a month. All right. And what do the two female roommates pay? $8.50 and $6.50. Okay. Prior to Madeline having her own bedroom set up in the living room,

where was she sleeping in that town home? In my bed with me. Okay. And this is dark. during a time frame when you were together with Stefan. So is it the three of you every night? Well, when we had first moved in, it was just me and Maddie.

So it was just me and her on the bed. Then I think we eventually got her her own bedroom. Stefan moves in eventually. And then, yeah, at that point, it does become the three of us on the bed. So Madeline's 12, and she has her own bedroom. And how often is she sleep in in her own bed alone? Hardly. She doesn't like sleeping alone. And she doesn't like the living room. It's too big, too quiet.

She says it would be too dark and then there would be spiders. She would see spiders. So you say hardly, were there ever nights where she just slept alone in her bed? Or is it 100%? Because there's a difference between hardly ever and 100% to me. If she ever slept on that bed, it was like once. Okay. All right. So now you've broken up with Stefan in December of 20, 22, right? He's still paying rent and he's there full time in bedroom number four. Is that where he goes after you break up? No, he stayed in my room for a few months.

We had broken up, but we weren't sure how to discuss it with Maddie because it was the beginning, it was the middle of the school year and I didn't want to affect her in any way. So we just played it off. acted like everything was normal and fine for the first six months. And then eventually she caught on. And then once she did, we admitted to her that we were broken out. And then, yeah, at that point is when he moved up to bedroom four. Okay.

And once he moved up to bedroom four, where there are instances where Madeline would sleep alone upstairs with him? I'm going to say... I want you to think carefully before you answer, because obviously we've gone through your phone and we've seen all the conversations that you've had with Stefan. So it's clear that that's occurring. So I'm giving you the chance to answer the question. Yeah.

I'm just trying to figure out how many times it's happened. Okay. Why are you allowing that to occur? I saw step in as someone that I completely trusted with my life, my child's life. I thought he had cared for her as a father would. He had been in her life for more than half of it playing the father role. I thought he cared for her the way I did. Now, does there come a point in time in 2023 where you've kind of had enough of roommate, ex-boyfriend, Stefan, and ask him to hit the road?

Yes. Is that fair to say it was like October? Maybe, yeah, like the end of October, because then I gave him all of November and told him he had to be out by December 1st kind of thing. But yeah, that sounds about right. And then did you kind of ask him to leave a month earlier and it was a source of arguments? Yes. Okay. So now at this point in time when he's being asked to leave, have you had any conversation with Maddie that mommy isn't together with Stefan anymore and this is kind of the ways of the world?

Do you have that conversation with her? She had by June. She figured it out already. So she knew we weren't together or anything like that. So she, by December, yes, she had already known. leaving and that was okay why is he coming back to visit after he's out we're still friendly with each other at this point Christmas is coming up and we wanted to spend Christmas together so he comes up for a few days during Christmas and then he does

visit a few more times after that but for the day and it's to pick up packages he keeps getting mail delivered to my house packages. So he just comes up and picks them up. And when he comes to visit after he's been kind of kicked out, is he paying rent or how is this working or is he just coming to visit? Is your father making any arrangements to rent bedroom number four because this is his income that he's losing? Uh, yeah, we had had it, we had like an ad posted to see if we can get any renters. So we were trying to rent it out, but then we had to stop. And what happens if you ended up renting room number four?

Is Stefan gonna still come up and visit you and sleep in your bed? I don't know. I didn't even thought of it at that way. At one point you told investigators that Stefan was quote unquote stuck down there until they could afford for him to come back. Were there plans for him to come back? We had discussed him coming back and living with me. We weren't sure temporarily or like for me to help him out with the place for a little bit before he can fight his own place and move out. Or we were also considering talking about living together as a companionship.

I think with my best friend who's helping me out with my child. Because you told investigators that a lot of the reason your relationship fizzled off with Stefan was that your antidepressants. You had moved on to other people, had you not? Yes. And so despite having moved on with other people, you were still having Stefan come up and visit, and there were plans to cohabitate with him again, potentially. Possibly, yes. Maddie had the opportunity to go visit her biological father in the fall out in Texas.

Is that yes? Yes. All right. Do you remember texting the biological father, hope nobody touches Maddie or tries shit or films her under? the bathroom. You remember sending that text? Orange County Sheriff's Office back in February?

No. Because that seems like a very oddly specific thing to text the father. So you didn't know anything about what was going on filming underneath bathroom doors? No idea. I don't know why I would have texted them. June 16th of last year, about 9.30 p.m. Oh, actually, I can't actually think back to that. Okay.

Um, I think around the time that Maddie was going to fly out to Houston, there had been an airline person that had gone into the bathroom and placed their camera on the toilet to film and I remember thinking I don't want Maddie I'm afraid of Maddie being alone on a plane because what if an attendant does that to her say hold on let me pick something in the bathroom and in reality they're setting up a camera this did happen to girl so I want to say it may have been concerns over that okay now June 16th of last year at 9.30 p.m. and 27 seconds, you texted Stefan this. Maddie's no longer sleeping

with me. I can't risk it. What does that mean? How often was Maddie sleeping with you? All the time. Well, you keep on saying often versus all the time. Was it 100% of the time or not 100% of the time? If she wasn't, if she wasn't with my mom and she was with me, then yeah, she was sleeping with me. And if she's at mom, she's 100% of the time sleeping with mom? With my mom or she does have her own room, I guess. Like there's another spare room she could use, but for the most part she prefers to sleep with my mom. Okay. Now my understanding is that you had some sort of period tracker that you kept track of Madeline's period with?

I had a calendar app that I would write. I would write what days she would get her period. And obviously Madeline doesn't have a job so she's not going out and buying products that she would need if she had her period, right? You would have to do that for her? that for her. Is that a yes? Yes. So do you remember her using any of those products at all in February? Because I assume you take the trash out or does she take the trash out or how does all this work? I take a trash out. In February, no, I didn't notice her using any of her feminine hygiene products. Did you have any conversations with her about that?

No, but I didn't notice until after everything. Because it would have been due like at the beginning of February. And this all happens at the end of February. So she's almost due again in March. So you never had any conversations with her about not having her period at the beginning of February? No, there have been, she's had other periods that have been missed or like super late. So I just assumed this was going to be one of those situations again. Okay.

But no, I didn't. Did you ever discuss her periods or lack of? of periods with Stefan? I don't think so. It's my understanding that Maddie had to take Marillaax. I'm familiar with that myself because of my daughter when she was little. So she had constipation issues. Yeah. Would it ever cause her of discomfort, physical pain, bleeding? Yes. And how are you aware of that? She would tell me there have been moments. So we've gone to, we've gone to doctor's appointments. They've run a lot of tests on her. They told me why her body is doing what it's doing. But she's shown me like she's shown me like if there was blood or if she's in the bathroom and she just can't go like it's stuck.

She showed me that too. So did she ever specifically seek treatment for tears or bleeding or anything due to her bowel movements? No, I don't think so tears or anything like that. I don't think there was ever a care. Okay. On February 26th, the whole purpose of Stefan coming and taking Madeline to school was so that you could get some sleep. You had missed your medication Saturday night, so on and so forth, right? Yes.

Is there any particular reason Stefan couldn't have driven your car to take Madeline to school and therefore not embarrass her and he could just drop her off normally? Yes, but because he's not on my car insurance, I was very nervous to let him drive my car. You did let him drive your car after this occurred though, right? Yes, but he was very insistent because he wanted to go look for Maddie and he had a spare on his car because he had a flat so he couldn't drive his car. So he just really wanted to go out. So I just let him, but I wasn't comfortable with it. During your previous interviews and you did it once today, you kind of interchanged I, we, or Stefan dropping Madeline off at school.

did you see Madeline at all on February 26th, 2024 that Monday? Yeah. Do you know anything about how she died? Did Stefan tell you anything about how she died? Does Stefan tell you about his plans to go back down to Northport in your car that Wednesday morning? Got any question? Mark? I'm getting close.

I'm going to jump through because I was making notes as we're going on. So how frequently did Stefan come up here after he moved back to Northport? I'm going to say how many times total do you think he came back here? Two to three times. Do you remember if those were around specific dates? One was like the week of Christmas. I can't remember when the other one was. Was Stefan in town the week or two prior to this last time he came?

Well, but I don't remember. Everything is becoming on blur. Do you remember sending him a text message asking if he can babysit Maddie you go have lunch with your friend. This was a few weeks before. I remember, I remember going out a few weeks before. I don't remember asking him to babysit. I don't know where he was.

Did you ever go to lunch with your friend? And he babysat her? I, I did go to lunch with my friend, but I don't think he was, I don't think he was here. I think Maddie stayed home alone for a few hours. Okay. When you mentioned Maddie caught on about you guys being broke up, how did that happen? What, like, what does she say or? I forgot.

We were, we were, we were having a conversation. She goes, are you guys broken up? I'm kind of looking at her. I'm like, why do you ask? She was, because you guys are kind of acting like you're broken up. You guys haven't hugged and kissed in a long time. I'm like, okay. How do you think she felt about that?

Fine. She didn't act. Sad or happy or anything? You're just like, whatever. Now, you mentioned, and you mentioned to me before, too, that you found her phone on her dresser, and like her little bedroom area. Does she have a specific spot where she plugs in her phone to try?

How does she charge her phone? So on her side of my bed, she's got a long charger. She'll connect it there to charge. Don't know how she charged it that night, though. Don't know if she took her charger and moved it to the room upstairs. Not sure. How do you charge your phone?

I charge my phone with my charger next to me on my side of the bed. Okay, is it one that you plug in or? It's a magnetic one. Okay. Now, when you go to bed at night, is there any kind of routine that you do with your phone? If you're texting, look on TikTok or whatever, and you go to bed, you just say your phone down and go to sleep or what's that routine like? I'll TikTok until I start dozing off and then I'll put my hands. phone with the charger, make sure my alarm's on, and then I'll, yeah, just lay down, close my eyes

and hope not to think of too much, just fall asleep. Okay, that night, Saturday or Sunday night, when you guys, when spending this half hour time together, was all you that you were doing was talking about gifts and counting her money or are we guys doing anything else? Just asking her for more details about the party and tell me what I missed. She seemed like she had a really good time. When you got home from work that day, where was everybody? I think everyone was in my room, being out of my room. Okay, everybody meaning...

Maddie and stuff and more. Okay. Sorry. All right. Now, it's obvious that you and Stefan communicate via text message and phone calls and stuff like that. What does Google meet? What is Google meet? That is like Google's version of FaceTime.

So just face chatting. Okay. Video chatting. Okay. When the birthday party, when her birthday party was planned, was this planned before you got your job or after? The birthday party? I think it was planned before.

Because once I saw my schedule and I saw that I, it was during a training day and I was going to call out. consider free be scheduling the party, but my family does insistent to just keep it that day. I said, okay. All right. So Stefan moves out of his room, and I think he mentioned that your dad had plans on renting that room again to somebody else. Is that right?

Yeah. How was that room set up? How was Stefan's room set up after he moved out? Pretty much the same. The bed was in the same location, the TV, the dresser, the death. desk and the mini fridge, everything stayed in the same location. Okay, was the bed and did it have comforter blankets and all that stuff on it? When he moved out, everything was empty.

There was a mattress protector cover on it. But I had clean sheets and clean blankets to put on, like, they're available. Where were they available? In the closet. Okay. Um, and I, I did, yeah. Do you know if he made the bed? I don't know, but I would just be.

What did the blankets look like that would be used to make that bed? They would be white, white cotton, um, linen sheets with, they're white, but they're white stripes different. shades of white. So white stripes going down it. That was a fitted cover, then a sheet, and then the pillowcases. And it should have been like a warm blanket in the closet somewhere. The same color, white or? Any gray. Okay. When you say there's pillowcases, how many pillows were on the bed? I know that we had taken things out of that room before. I don't know if we used those pillows.

I'm not sure what pillows were up there. Okay. Did you ever go into the room after you discovered that she was missing. Did you go upstairs to that bedroom? No. So when you go to sleep in your room and you're either with Maddie or without Maddie or with Stefan, is your door open, closed, lights on, lights off? When I go to sleep? So I have a cat. I can't shut the door. I have to leave a cracked. So it's seized cracked with a little like a little like a doorstopper behind it so it doesn't open all the way because my cat will just

probably get up over yeah but we sleep with the door cracked okay lights on lights off lights off with a YouTube video playing in the background making playing rain sounds

okay would that would the screen be illuminated or is it something where a screen like a phone how the screen goes black and it still plays it goes black yeah

Do you remember it happened that night if you were doing listening to those YouTube videos or? Probably was. I listen to it every night so I probably was. Does it shut off automatically? Um, around like four or five a.m. But then I'll, I'll notice and I'll press play again. Is it fair to say that you're easily woken up or no? But it sounds like that or Now, the purpose of you telling or having Maddie's sleep with Stefan upstairs is because you told me before that you needed a good night's sleep. If you needed this kind of sleep previously to when Stefan wasn't there, what would happen? You mean if Stefan wasn't there and I needed this good night's sleep?

If I had missed my men, the way I missed them at night and I wasn't feeling or I was feeling just how I was feeling. I'm not sure if I would have had her sleep with me on the other side of the bed or if I would have sent her upstairs to the guest room. But she sleeps like a monkey. She sleeps. She rolls. She'll sort of one end of the bed and end up on top of me by the end of the night. And she's a gymnast, I guess.

But have you ever sent her upstairs to sleep? I don't like not for any of these reasons. Have you ever sent her upstairs to sleep by herself? I'm going to need to wrap this up. Okay, one more question. Does anybody use your phone other than you? No, except for the day that we were sitting in front of my house and forensics was in the house. That was the only time I've ever let anyone use my phone, and that was definitely.

Seven. What about do you wear an Apple Watch? Yes. Does it track any of your movements or anything like that that you know of? Do you sleep with your watch on? No. I heard they have put it on there honestly. Do you have anything real quick, Dan, you know?

Do you have anything that you think we should know that? Matthews, Portually. Good down there? Yeah, I'm good. All right, it's 106 a.m. We will conclude the investigators in an interview with U.Ns Soto. Thank you. Ashley's President's Day sale is going on now for a limited time.

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