Hidden True Crime - Kouri Did WHAT?! | Tea, Trial & Unfiltered Reactions

Episode Date: March 1, 2026

Kathy from Gossip, Rumor and Innuendo is here to talk all things Kouri Richins with Lauren. Sponsors: Blissy: Wake up with clearer skin, smoother hair, and cooler sleep—use code HIDDEN for an extra 30% off at https://blissy.com/HIDDEN Nurture Life: For 55% off your order, head to https://NurtureLife.com and use code HIDDEN55. About Hidden True Crime What started as a simple conversation at their dinner table became a captivating podcast. Join the dynamic duo of Dr. John Matthias, a criminal psychologist, and Lauren Matthias, an investigative journalist, as they delve into the psychological facets of unthinkable crimes every week. Their unique perspectives and in-depth analysis offer a fresh take on true crime storytelling. Thank you for your support through sponsorships, subscribing, listening, and becoming a Patreon member at⁠ ⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠Patreon.com/HiddenTrueCrime⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠ Learn more about your ad choices. Visit podcastchoices.com/adchoices

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atora.com slash remove. Your means can be used against you in a court of law. I loved it. Love that. Hello, Hidden Gems. We have been in the weeds all week, haven't we? Chain of custody, toxicology levels, CPR positioning. And frankly, at least for me, we deserve a break, in my opinion. So today we're going to switch things up. And a hidden true crime.

We always do say a little dark humorous therapeutic, right? Especially after days of 3D crime scenes. Sidebars. More sidebars than. And, you know, I can count. And correct echoing through the courtroom. Kathy, I don't know if you've heard correct so many times. We've been counting them here at Hidden Judecrant.

I've noticed. I hadn't noticed. That's so funny. And let's be honest, you're some serious main character, energy unfolding at trial. So today I've brought him back up. Kathy, here with me today from gossip, rumor, and innuendo. She is here and she is the queen of clever commentary. you somehow manage Kathy to cover true crime in a way that makes us laugh,

but without completely losing our humanity, I mean, or not all the time. So tonight we're talking tea, side eyes. And yes, I think we need to do a little roasting at the woman at the center of this saga. Because honestly, if you're going to allegedly write a children's book about grief and then end up in a murder trial, the internet's going to have thoughts. The internet's going to gather. And yeah. And I know that you have thoughts, Kathy. So here we are.

I always have thoughts, Lauren. It's so good to see you, friend. It's so good to see your bright and shining face. I'm so thrilled to be here. I'm a long time hidden gym. I have a secret crush on Dr. John. I just, this brain is so sexy. Oh, my God.

I know. I know. I know. You know, we were the law. I have to say, like, you know, that like, love is blind show where you're really like is you kind of learn the love isn't necessarily blind at the end when they all kind of go their separate ways john and i really were like love is blind he just called i didn't know what he looked like we talked for three hours and i was like take me now i was

like we talked murder we talked that's amazing yeah that's my husband still secretly thinks that Alex Murdoch is one of my co-workers. I can't. He's like, is that the guy in the next office over? I'm like, never mind, never mind. It's ridiculous. Yeah. Yeah. Anyway, yes. Yeah, doesn't he, does he know you have a YouTube channel yet and that you're kind of a big deal? He does. He does. He does. He does. He does. He does. Because you are. No. Everybody talks about you. Everybody You're so sweet. My kids are so over me in this channel. Like, on, I say to them, I'm going to go on live stream.

I got to record something. As soon as I start, they start banging dishes in the kitchen. They're yelling to each other. They're ringing the ring doorbell. They don't care. They don't care. It's a big deal. I'm just mom who is like, where's the dinner?

And can you feed these dogs, please? It's it, regular girl. That's it. Well, that's what we also like about your channel, too. Because we just want to hang out with you. We just want to hang out with you and the banging pots and pans and hear what you think about the trials. And honestly, like I said, I've been breaking it down and then I'll go to your channel and just be like, okay, I need to like break. I need to see what you're seeing.

And by the way, you have caught some details. I haven't. You laid it into the defense when in opening statements you were like, I've got eyes. Don't lie to me. I see that that hydrocodone bottle did not expire in 2016. I'm not an idiot. It was 2020. The alleged murder happened in 2022.

And I was like, wait, I've got, I didn't see that. Oh. I have these highly sensitive recording devices on my face. They're called my eyes. I see things. I can hear things. Ma'am. And when Miss Corey was on that 911 call, I was just like, the way the prosecution

had their opening statements where she was like, I was like, could somebody get the Muppet off the recording and let this woman speak? Because I need to hear this defense attorney say something because I don't know what this madness is. She's playing for me. No, ma'am. No, ma'am. I did not appreciate it. No, yeah, yeah.

What did you think about those opening statements? I mean, you were not a fan of the defense, I'll tell you that. Oh, not a fan of the defense. Now, Kathy Nestor and I do share a first name, though I'm praying she spells hers with a C and not the right way with a K like I spell mine. That way we're not that much the same. But the way Mr. Bloodworth rose from his seat and began his Shakespearean performance. I was like, I loved it.

And at the end where he had those three memes, the first thing that popped in my head is your means can be used against you in a court of law. I loved it. Love that. The memes were wild, by the way. You've been covering this case for years. I've been covering this case for years. I was not expecting the memes in opening statement. That was not on my opening statement.

Wiping tears of money. I've never seen anything like it. Okay. So we've seen some crazy depraved whack jobs, right? The Jimmy Waffles and Alec Murdoch. There's a lot of crazy people out there. But this woman, her husband's body is barely cold. And who is she sending these memes to?

Jeff, whatever his name is from Dumb and Dumber, I think it was wiping his tears with $100 bills. Yeah. I need you to pretend to grieve for at least a week. Like, seriously. Right. Right. And she was sending those to her boyfriend.

And now I'm even like, Or did which, yeah, it was the boyfriend. The paramour. The paramour. I know that word, the paramour. I mean, I get it. I get it. I just call him the boyfriend, but I know the paramour.

Right. That's like a fancy way to say sidepiece. That's legally used. Side boy. Side boy. Poo more. Same same. Yeah.

Same. Same. Yeah. It was crazy. The idea that she's like, okay, I have this very successful husband who's a dedicated father and he's running the business and he's doing all of these things. Okay, maybe he doesn't go to church anymore. Maybe he doesn't like buy you the perfect thing for Valentine's Day or whatever things you like, right? But he's still a good dude. He seemed like a good dude. So if you don't like him,

she could take what she came to that relationship with, a bright and shiny smile and no cash at all. And she could go live with her little handyman boyfriend. Okay, girl, go on and do that. But, Mm-mm. Yeah. She's awful. She and the paramour could have run off into the sunset, but instead they're sending me, right, with like dollar bills wiping tears from their eyes. Yeah, those memes, man, got me. And then they did start, you know, honestly, I will say after the prosecution's opening statements, I was like, oh, Corey's done. I thought they were really. Yeah, they were well done. Done. Done. Done. Yeah. Done. Yeah. but they had the text in there too about we'll be together and you know all the google search results and my god she didn't have the common decency to google on incognito ma'am i'mma i don't need you to be better at crime can thank you i was going to say can we talk about this she's literally writing her paramour to use that word the paramour to say i just want to be watching a murder documentary with you. I mean, the irony. And then she goes and she searches for luxury prisons and

how to cover up a murder. And I'm like, and the FBI force you to take a lie detector test. Ma'am, you should have watched to the end of CSI and law and order and all your documentary. You didn't pay attention. She was too busy playing kissy face with that ratchet little lover who's going to come to the stand and testify against her because now he's all like, I promise to tell the truth, she did it, she did it, did it, did it, did it. As you pointed out, they used his full legal name. It was like the middle name. You know when your parents really mad and they used your middle name, they were calling him his full. I was like they used his full government name. This is a bad situation. How quickly did they break up afterwards? Was he like coming to the house? Was he her

date to the funeral. I need to know, like, what are the contours of this relationship? Was he help to write the grief book? Was he the co-author on the grief book? Was he like, what do we do? I know. You know she didn't write that book. She did not write the chat. Did they have chat GPT back then? She had a ghost writer for the book. Fiverr. I think someone said Fiverr. I think it was a fiver piece. But, yeah, and it was a terrible book, which, I mean, that's the one thing. Look, I'm late now. I'm, well, I did. So that was my station. I worked for the station where she went to and she appeared. Yeah. Get out of here.

My old co-workers, I was like, oh, look at this. If you are a parent, you already know how chaotic life gets. And during trial season, it's next level. When I'm deep in court coverage, the last thing I have time for is making four nutritious, different meals for a cute but picky eater. This podcast is sponsored by Nurture Life. Nurture Life is a meal delivery service focus on helping busy parents easily feed their babies and kids from 10 months old to 10 years old. The company, they provide fresh meals and

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They thank you to those at the station who sent me every page of that book before, you know. You know, I'm trying to like listen. You've been listening to, you know, I'm just like the defense is saying this, the prosecution's saying this. We don't know what the jury's thinking. We know what Kathy's thinking. She lets us know, but we don't know what the jury's thinking. We have no clue.

Right. Yes, jury no. So, you know, I'm just listening. But the one thing I can say, I keep telling everyone is, that grief book sucked. It was not about grief. It was about ignoring grief. It was not about having feelings.

It was like, ignore your feelings. Like, don't feel bad. Don't feel sad. Your dad's in the sky. Don't worry about it. So, you know, whether she wrote or not, no one should have published it in my opinion. But it had to be self-published. That had to be self-published.

But someone's pointed out to that she might not have even written her self-published book. somebody she knew how to hire someone on fiber but she still didn't know how to like google incognito you know so i don't know like i said i don't know what murder or documentary do you think she was even watching i don't i don't know not a good one not an instructional one because ma'am listen there's not a woman alive who's not half an fbi agent oh we will look we will look in the phone we will look on the internet we will look wherever we need to look but this lady no she didn't didn't watch anything good or thorough. I was very, very annoyed that she's so bad at crime. Now, I don't want people to be good at crime, heaven knows, but something tells me there's some

women out here who are often their husbands left, right, and center, and just going to church and like, you know, serving coffee and cake on Sunday, we have no clue because they're good at crime. It's not Ms. Corey. I'll tell you that much. Mm-mm. Mm-mm. Sorry. Not Ms. Corey. She don't know what she's doing. But she also gave up a rich man for a poor man, so I'm looking at her askance anyway.

Like, okay, girl, whatever. Yeah. Yeah, dude, I don't, yeah, gave up. Yeah, gave up or murder? That's the question. Right, right. I also suspect that her mother, Lisa Darden, in my opinion, for entertainment purposes only,

might have helped her out. Yeah. Well, I don't think you're the only one that means that. I mean, the prosecution is completely, you've been following this, I've been following, and they kind of laid that out. They were like, by the way, side note, there's this other death over here of Lisa Darden's partner that, you know, you guys decide. I mean, they really were.

They're like, we can't prove it. But it's, yeah, it's suspicious. And they definitely got. And Ms. Lisa askance, I'm looking at Lisa, askance. What do you think of the body cam, by the way? we also saw that first day. I mean, that first day was heavy. That first day felt like five days, if I'm going to be really honest.

Today was like short and sweet. They were like, okay, a lot of sidebars. But like that day felt like a full week to me. And we saw. Yeah, for sure. What did you think of the body cam? I was struck by the body. The thing that really, really got me was the fact that she kept covering her face.

And it was like, I was like, it's so. odd to me that she seemed to be making cry noises, which, okay, I say she was dry crying, but I don't know, but who could tell because she kept covering her face? And the one police officer kept saying she wouldn't look him in the eye, right? Because like, I've had situations where like there was an accident, police came to my house, whatever it was. And I was just like, even if I thought, like, I don't know if this guy can help me. Like, give me some information, help me, what do we do? What's the next thing? She was sort of like this hiding the whole time. Oh, it was so suspicious to me. I was like, because that's exactly what the prosecution threw out there.

Or not the prosecution. It was the witness. The witness, which witness was it that said my biggest. Vincent Wynn. Yes, yes. Vincent Nguyen said my biggest issue was, he didn't say my issue, but, you know, she kept hiding her face. And it was, it was abnormal. It was peculiar with all of the destinies he had. he'd been to. And so you were sitting there going, you and me both. You and me both. I was like, uh, uh, uh, uh, uh, and then her sister-in-law, she has two sisters in-law, Amy and Katie, I think. I had confused them. It's funny because I was listening to your deep dive today. And I had thought that Katie was the one who got throat punched. It was Amy who got throat crunched over the safe.

But Katie was there the night of Eric's death and she was saying Corey was all done up and her hair and her whatever and I understand that in sort of like the drama and all the swirl of everything that was happening, certainly Katie could have misremembered

some of it or has had her mind altered with everything that has happened since then. But Corey did look good. I was just like, oh, considering your husband's over there dead like a carp on the floor, girl, you look Barry pulled together. I would be a whole mess.

But okay, she had a top knot and she had matching pajamas and she just was like, oh, oh, no, it's terrible. And the fact that she never seemed to go comfort her children, it's unimaginable to me. Unimaginable.

Little kids. My kids are big. Like my baby is 18, but don't let anything happen in this house. The dogs, my husband, everybody wants me. They want to be next to me. And they want to look to me for like, what are we going to do next?

And it's my job to sort of like calm things down and make sure everything is okay. She just sat there rocking and holding her face. And far be it from me to judge how someone grieves. But the fact that she wasn't immediately to her very young children was very striking to me. I completely agree. That's the thing that affected me most too. And Katie is over there. And she's like, the kids, the kids, the kids, like that was their focus.

And that was actually my focus. In watching it, like, I had emotions, man. When Katie started breaking down and crying, I started crying. Like, I was in. I felt so bad for her. But they kept saying, the kids, the kids, you know, who's taking care of the kids? And it wasn't even, it wasn't even registered. Not even on her mind.

She was not on her mind. Her top not, you know. Did you notice the part where, when Katie was testifying, she said, finally, Corey goes in to comfort her son who's very upset. And then I guess her sister-in-law or somebody walks in and says, oh, well, what about the real estate deal? And on a dime, Corey switches. And she's like, well, yeah, the money has come through and we got to do the, da-da-da-da. Like, she's back in business mode. And I was like, oh, okay, oh. Like, I like to, I pride myself on being able to compartmentalize. But I can't imagine. someone that you have, even if she didn't like her husband that much, like a person you have agreed to share your life with,

the father of your children is in this terrible situation. And you're like, yeah, but we got to get to this closing and we got to make sure, where am I, did somebody iron my pants? Where's my good signing pin? Like, ma'am, I'm going to need you to have all the seats in the world. She's a mess. Yeah, and while comforting her child, according to Katie. It was that moment where she's like, oh, yeah, the business, yeah.

Okay, let's get this house. Okay, moving on. That was a bad moment for me too. Unbelievable. And immediately she was like, I'm selling this house and so-and-so is going to run Eric's business and da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da. Like she had it all laid out all together. And I'm like, okay, ma'am. All laid out like there was a pair more on the side or something.

Oh, wait, there was. Yeah, there he is. Oh, look. He's just waiting. Send in memes. And they were planning their getaway to secrets resort. And I'm like, okay. I know the irony of that as secrets.

I'm like, I don't know. Again, how many murder documentaries did you watch? Not enough. Not enough. Not enough. Secrets resort frequently appears on Dateline. I don't know what it is about the resorts, but it's on date line. And I don't even know if there's more than one secret's resort, but there's

that podcast, a date with Dat With Daedlein with Kimberly and Katie and Kimberly. They're so funny, but they always talk about Secrets Resort because everyone's always going up to Secrets Resort. I'm like, I'm scared to go. Is it only people having affairs?

Like, what's happening at Secrets Resorts? I mean, the name would imply that, right? But again, it's like, okay, let's, you know, the defense wants us to believe she's innocent. Let's say she's innocent. don't take your sidepiece to secrets after your husband suddenly died. Oh my gosh. Oh my gosh.

Read the room. Read the room. And that's if she's innocent, you know. Oh. Maybe she's just a cheater and not an unaliber. Like, a stupid issue. I don't know. A cruel cheater.

And, yeah. Again, like just like, read the room. Yeah, that reading the room is not Corey's specialty. I guess you're innocent. That is not something she does well, including the courtroom. One lawyer, Mr. Ramos on day one,

I don't know if you notice Mr. Ramos's affect on day one. He was quite keyed up. He was the last attorney to get up and cross-examine, and he was like, it was sound and fury signifying nothing. told a story on my members only the other night. And I said, when I was a kid, first of all, we lived in church. We were always at church. But there were like certain were quite, first of all,

only the men could like stand up and say a prayer. Women never could. And so among the men, they would like jostle to see like who got to say the opening prayer, who got to say the closing prayer. And there was always this one man who I don't think is alive anymore. So I'm just going to use his first name, Brother Thomas. For whatever reason, they never let Brother Thomas preach a sermon, lead the singing, he couldn't pass the community, he couldn't do anything. But periodically, they would let Brother Thomas say the closing prayer. Now, the closing prayer is supposed to be like, it was good to see everybody, see you next week, thank you God, something like that, like three sentences.

But Brother Thomas would use that closing prayer as his moment. And he would preach a whole sermon, 15 minutes, whatever it was, in what was supposed to be a two-minute closing prayer. He just was doing the most in the closing prayer. So when I saw Attorney Ramos up there, I was like, this is Brother Thomas. He is up here just doing the absolute most on a nothing witness. Like, sir, first of all, I'm going to need you to dial it back a little bit. And he was like, it's like, okay, Brother Thomas, we see you.

You're like, Brother Thomas, sit down. And he's like, correct. Correct. Correct. Have you heard, I mean, if we're talking about Brother Ramos, let's just, let's call him brother. The correct. The corrects. Like, I mean, calm down, sir.

He has said correct. I mean, he is, he is the info behind our correct counters. And it's not correct. He says correct a lot, but he doesn't use the vowels. So it's like, correct. Right, right. It's K-R-E-C-T. Oh, my gosh.

And so we started counting corrects on our channel. I think he might have had like a little bit too much caffeine or espresso or a Red Bull or 12. It's funny because the first day he was so wound up. And then the second day, I was like, oh, Brother Ramos has the internet. Because he was just like, hello, I'm tiptoeing in here on kitten feet. And I'm still going to have some personality, but I've dialed it down a little bit. and I'm going to act like I have some common doggone sense. And I was like, okay, okay, he saw what everybody had to say about him.

Or maybe his boss pulled him aside and was like, Mr. Ramos. Or particularly, or you know what I also think is happening is like all the wives are watching? Because we had one of the attorney's wives in our chat. And she was like, by the way, we're like, oh, welcome. Like, it was very fun, you know. Every case. Every single guy. When my channel had 200 subscribers, I covered my very first case and the wife of the district attorney from Berkeley Springs, West Virginia, reached out to me after the trial.

I was like, my husband and I loved your. And I was like, what did I see? I kept calling the prosecutor, the prosecutee, because he was so cute, but he kept messing up the numbers on the exhibits. And I was like, he's real cute, but he can't count. I said all these things about this man thinking nobody is watching me. This is the internet. YouTube's wide. And him and his wife, apparently, they might still watch my channel.

I have no idea. But yeah. This is why we call the Internet the World Wide Web. The World Wide Web. Absolutely. And for all you know, he's coming home and watching Kathy every night, you know. So he's like, after a busy day of murder trials over there in West Virginia, He comes home. He's like, baby, let's on walking. Put that crazy lady on the YouTube.

Let's have a test then. Let's see if he's watching. Let's, let's, let's, let's, oh, my gosh. I think he's going to start saying correct instead of correct. Let's find out. Oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh. Let's test it. He does. He's going to start enunciating. Yeah, or he'll change it up like, right? You see. Do you agree with me? Let's just see. Let's just see. Let's just find out. See who's watching. It's so funny. They always do. If not the neighbors, the lady up the street. I was getting snow off my car today and my next door neighbor was, my neighbor across the street was like, well, you know, the gardener died, right? And I was sick. I get to school. Well, you know, he was sick. And his son can't watch the business because his son has always had that mental problem. I was like, really? I had no idea. I'm getting emails right and left. I get tea in emails all the time. and I'm, you know, and I keep them.

Constantly. I, you know. Constantly. People slide family members. Family members come with something. They will find my email. Everyone wants to dish the tea too. It's like they're holding on to it.

They're like, hold on. I'm like, I got to tell someone I got to go on. Click send. I'm like, thank you. Thank you. Hit and try. I'm in, like, let me tell the gossip lady. Listen, I shouted out in my, in my streams.

If there's somebody I want to talk to, I'm like, gossip rumor mail at gmail.com. Now the people that I want to talk to, like whoever kidnapped Nancy Guthrie, I think they should email me and just whisper in my ear where she's at because I can really use that million dollars. Also, I'm thinking about turning in my next door neighbors. I don't think they did it, but I don't know. I don't know where they were that night. But yeah, they might have. But a lot of people have a lot of tea. And it's in the beginning of my channel, people kept saying it's a sin to gossip. It's a sin to gossip in one sentence. And then the next sentence they would go, but did you hear about? Did you know, you know what I saw? I'm not gossiping,

but I'm just saying like, okay, girl. The biggest gossips are the ones that say you shouldn't. So, I mean, when, when, you know, yeah, people say when people say they don't like drama. And when people say they don't gossip, you're like, okay, okay. I'm listening. Drama is like, long as it's not mine. Yeah, as long as it's in a courtroom. I like drama in a courtroom. Yeah. Yeah.

Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. And I do want to say this too. I will say I really loved and admired Katie's testimony. It was heartbreaking.

It was real. It was raw. I thought she did a tremendous drop up there. And you also pointed out on your channel. I love this. Like, what a sister. Like, what a sister, you know? He's an F around and find out, you know, like this, you know.

And so I, yeah, I understand. Be standing by her brother until the end. Her brother is not here to be the voice. And she's like, don't you worry about it, Eric. I got you. She understood that her brother was in a tough situation. He's in a tough marriage. It was his second marriage.

He didn't want to leave this family. Like, I get it. It's all so complicated. walking away from a relationship. You have, it's beyond like money or a house or a car emotionally. And they've got three little kids together. He's like, I want to be here with my family. You know, you want to make a good, solid family.

And now your wife is over here doing all this craziness. And the sister is like, listen, my brother is not here. But you thought you got rid of us. I'm telling you, ma'am, you did not. You did not. I love the way that she advocates. for his brother, though he's not here. Both of those sisters and the dad, everybody, I love it.

And I don't think they've missed a day of trial. I doubt that they will miss a day of trial. They will be there to stand for their brother every single day. I could not love it more. Less than I mess with my sister. I agree. I agree. I'm going to go for them.

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interestingly enough, is also standing by her. You don't always see that. You know, Chad Davis family wasn't showing up to trial. Lori Vallo's whole family wasn't showing up to trial. Right. Corey Richens family are showing up, and she even has a friend. I mean, good for her.

I believe she's innocent. Yeah, good for her. You know, good for her. So I'm listening. I'm surprised she still has girlfriends. I know that she had a best friend who she bought a house for, but she stole the best friend's money and the house got foreclosed. Oh, yeah.

Oh, tell me more. Oh, well, listen. Okay. I mean, go. Yeah, I'm here. Because Corey was a house flipper and a real estate investor. At one point, her best friend and the best friend's children needed a place to stay. And Corey said, listen, I know you're in a tough spot.

I'm going to put you in this property. you pay me this $50,000 down payment, and then every month you'll pay like rent, basically. She was supposed to do a rent-to-own deal for her very best friend in the world. Corey took the money, pocketed it, never did any. Corey was like, you can't get a mortgage in your name because, you know, the divorce or the credit

or the whatever it was. She told this woman, I'm going to take care of you and your kids. This woman and her children move into the house. Corey never paid anything to the bank. She never paid a dime. The house got foreclosed. And the friend was like, I gave you $50,000 for a down payment and was paying monthly rent. And Corey was like, gave her nothing back.

And the friend was evicted because the house got foreclosed and had this best friend. And the children ended up homeless or semi-homeless. I imagine they went to live with relatives or something like that. But Corey, miss, I'm going to help you. turned her best friend and children out into the street. It was unbelievable to me. It wasn't one of the court documents somewhere along the line. I've got to go refresh.

I somehow missed a lot of trunk of court docs. Oh, my goodness. Absolutely awful. I've watched every scandalous bit of this story. It's crazy. It's crazy. It is crazy. It's unbelievable.

I realize how crazy it is. And you and I have, like I said, you and I have covered a poisoning, crime recently, you know, as you call him. What do you call him, Jimmy Waffles? Jimmy Waffles. James Craig. Jim Cray case.

You two were covering. Yes. Jimmy Waffles. And it's that, can we talk about that too? Because that case also had a lot of twist and turns. Like, if it's not horrible enough for you to poison your spouse, because that's what the charges are here to, if it's not just like awful enough, you throw in with Jimmy Waffles, like, a hit from from behind bars, you know, on one of the lead detectives, homicide detectives,

and then you're trying to make deep fakes of your wife and pulling your kids. It was going to be pulling in the kids. It's bad enough that you would commit a crime like this, right? You're like, you're a narcissist, you're a sociopath, whatever. But to pull your kids in and try and turn the kids against the mother. And I just, I don't understand what sort of morosephous. She let you go to bed at night and just lay your head on the pillow and sleep peacefully. I couldn't do it.

I had a squirrel with my car. Like, that was when, that might have been the year my youngest son was born. So 18 years ago, I hit a squirrel with my car. I know exactly the spot on the street where I was and where the squirrel was. I couldn't drive down Windsor Road for the rest of the summer. I just was like, that's the spot. The squirrel. I just, I tried. He was in the way. Like, I was a wreck. But this dude is like, I'm going to poison the way. I'm going to bring the kids in. I'm going to lie to everybody. Like, it's unbelievable to me. I know. It is unbelievable. And by the way, I too remember when I hit a squirrel, it was in Ohio. And it would have been 2003. So yeah, the same thing. I remember. I remember. It was like running across and chasing another squirrel. And I was like, it's probably like a love story. You know? And, and I remember. And I remember. And I remember. And I. And, and I remember. And I remember. And I remember. And I. And, it was like, it was like, it was like, and I

ruined it. Like it was, it's over. Lady in the tramp of squirrels and you have flattened one of those squirrels. Maybe it was a paramour though. Maybe it was just a paramour and I shouldn't be so worried. Like maybe, maybe. That was her side nut. That was her side nut. It's okay. It's okay. Right. It was the side scroll. Maybe I needed to get over that and realize it's okay. But, but, but, not as bad. But yes, I too have core memories about hitting a squirrel. So I feel you on that. And you're right. And like, how could they do this? And then, you know, you have Corey Richards.

And again, innocent until proven guilty. We're mid-trial. I'm listening. I'm listening. I'm listening. I'm open. You know, convince me otherwise. But even then, the twists and turns in this case are just kind of as wild.

You've got the financial, you just mentioned the best friend. You've got another partner and the mother, you know, Lisa Darden involved. You know, maybe. And then you've got the walk, the dog letter. And her drug dealer is supposed to testify. And I believe it was this case that prompted me to say, I think I made a short about it years ago, there is no drug dealer confidentiality. You might have attorney-client.

You might have doctor-patient. You do not have drug dealer confidentiality. What you say to your drug dealer may be used against you in a court of law. But also, I pointed out, the drug dealer has now changed his story and said like, no, no, no, no. I know when you first interviewed me, police, I said I gave her fentanyl pills. But now I'm like, no. This piece has gotten really big. NM.

I think I gave him something else. Yeah. I was like, hmm. Was that me? Were you talking to say that? No. No. No.

Was he, does he have a lab? I mean, even if he thought he gave her one thing, right? If these are illicit street drugs, how does he know? It's not like he's running, he's got a lab in his bathroom where he's like, well, let me test this. Hang on, let me, the test tubes are almost, okay, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. No, this one does not have the bad stuff in it. That's those pills over there. These pills right here, they're fine.

So here, you can have a couple of these. Like, no. And if you can't trust your drug dealer to give you clean, illicit narcotics, who can you trust? What has the world come to? if your drug dealer is not reliable. I agree. Come on. World come to.

Get yourself a better drug dealer. Yeah, it is madness. It's madness. It's madness. Zion. Get yourself a better drug dealer, right? Which, by the way, it's a situation. It's a situation.

Speaking of Zion, what do you call that part of the world? You were like calling the Idaho a wall. You're like anywhere. You're in the East Coast. You're on VSD time. We're East Coast time. I'm on the West Coast and you just like chalk and you just put us in a box. What do you call us out here in West Coast?

Idaho, Iowa. Idaho. The way that came about was Lori Valo was on trial in Idaho. Idaho. Was one of her trials in Idaho? Sure what? Somebody was on trial. And somebody was in Idaho

And every time I went to say it, I would say Iowa. And I was like, okay, so the trial today in Iowa, then I was like, it's not Iowa. It's that other one. I did go to public school, but I do know how to read a map. And I know, but like,

when I do my videos in the morning, it's not a news report. It's me sitting here with a cup of coffee and an unwashed face. just like I write down a couple of bullet points and I'm rattling things off. And for whatever reason, Idaho did not flow off my tongue. And so I was trying to say Idaho, then my brain stumbled over Iowa and it just became out of Ottawa. And so since then, like I know all the states really, really good up to like Illinois.

Because I've lived between Illinois and New York City my whole life, like that whole stress. Like West Coast. You're like, oh, that's the West Coast. Basically. So everything passed Illinois until you get to California is Idaho. It's just all of that over there. Right. So Camas, Utah, Lori, Lori Valo's Idaho trial, Arizona, Idaho, Wallet. I got you. I got you. People were like, how do you spell it? I was like, I made it up. I don't know. You're like, I. Choose your own adventure. You should have a spelling. You'd be like, this is how you spell.

Make it in the AP. I have a sticker. Oh, wait, I have a sticker over here. It's probably too small for you to see. Oh, wait. Oh, the light is, wait. Oh, there we go. Yeah, it says on here, it's so small.

I can't even see it. The world, according to gossip, rumor, and innuendo, LLC. So the whole, like, northeast, I refer to as the godless northeast, everything south of basically Pennsylvania, I refer to as South Carolina. Florida, of course, is Florida. Texas is Texas. The middle of the country, I list as over there somewhere. And then all that other stuff in the Idaho, Iowa region from Washington State down to like those square states, that's Idaho, and then there's California. It makes perfect sense. Okay, so going back to what we're saying, in Idaho, Walla, Walla, we just

don't have as good of drug dealers or reliable as drug dealers as y'all back east look at me I used to ban they banned y'all today in trial so I just used that I saw that I was just like okay but then I learned

that dude is plural so maybe because she kept saying y'all y'all and it's like man we're going to need you to be more specific I have to ask you this very very pressing question the haircut the the buzz the buzz haircut that

Katie Richens Benson's husband has and the judge also has it. Is that a Mormon haircut? It's probably like an Idaho Walla Walla thing. Yeah, I mean, yeah, yeah,

kind of. I mean, it's simple. When you have a lot of kids and you need a lot of haircuts, you just kind of have a rotation of like sit in the chair. You know what I mean? Simple. Yeah, yeah. Simple. Simple.

That makes sense. Yeah. And then you throw in that they're ranchers, which is like really cool. It's like the real deal, you know. So awesome. I know. They're real like cowboys. Real life cowboy.

They said that the farm is now a conservatory or something? Yeah, I don't. That's kind of over my, I mean, head. I mean, I'm spending, yeah, I'm like, okay, I got to get into that. I'm right now focused on like 3D crime scenes and like trying to figure out how many nanograms or, you know, because I've heard that it's like, I've heard, too, like someone wrote me, you know, I don't have a reliable drug dealer. I don't have any drug dealer

at all. So I don't, I don't know like the nanograms. So when they're saying the levels. And so I was saying, you know, hey, by the way, this is how much fentanyl allegedly. And someone wrote and they said, this was so much. In fact, let me see if I can pull up. They're like, you have no idea how much this is. I'm like, oh, so I have to go study that too. So yeah, that actually pointing out to what you're saying about the ranch and a conservatorship, I'm like, I was going to go try to learn more about that too, but there's a lot

on, I play. That's wild. Yeah, like, they said it was like seven times the legal or the whatever, seven times a lethal dose. I was like, what is a serving size of fentanyl? I don't. I don't even know. I mean, my reliable drug dealer is CVS. I get all of my HRT from the CVS. If you want to know all about like how much progesterone will make you sleepy at night, 200 milligrams is the answer.

But how much fentanyl? I don't know. I can tell you how many of those melatonin gummies will make you sleepy. But this other stuff, I don't know. I actually think I OD on melatonin every single night. Well, I don't know. I hope there's not a lethal dose of melatonin. Maybe we should talk if melatonin's your specialties.

There is. My doctor took me off of melatonin because she did a, blood test and she's like, why is your melatonin level so high? I was like, oh, because I take it every night. I was like, I thought it was like, the more the better, the more the merrier. She's like, no, stop taking it. Really? I don't even tell my doctor I'm taking it. Years ago. You have a doctor that like follows your melaton levels? That's a new. I get hormonal blood tests every three months. And she told me like a couple of years ago, she's like, it just showed up randomly because it was like, like your level is supposed to be like, say if your level is supposed

to be like 50. My level was 2,000. Like in my bloodstream, I had 2,000 whatever grams of melatonin. It was way, way, way too much.

Like, I've got so much melatonin the ear. I'm just chewing it. Like, oh my God. Yeah, you could have too much. Okay. You could have too much. Good to know.

But I do not get, I get those from CVS, not a drug dealer. Yeah, say, I was getting it from Target. Like, yeah, the Walmart, the target the wherever yeah i was i was like oh these are my street drugs i got the gummies not even the

weed yeah they're my gummies they're not even the tmc yeah which by they're making a really big deal out of eric and the t hc gummies or the defense is at least trying to but i would say you know i don't know how far they're going to get i guarantee you half those jurors can you enjoy melatonin in a gull like i mean can you put um fentanyl in a gummy like that's a question right a thing? I think they're probably a thing. I don't know. Like I said, I don't, you know, this is not an area of expertise for me. I'm relying on other people for that. But I do wonder, do we know for a fact that it was in the Moscow, Moscow mule? Did you know I can't say Moscow anymore because of Moscow, Idaho? I go Moscow, Moscow. And now I forget which is the right way in which way.

That's so funny. That's so funny. Yeah, the Moscow mule. The only reason I know a Moscow mule is because it takes ginger beer. You're supposed to use ginger beer. And I'm a ginger beer snob. Like certain ginger beers I won't drink. I used to make ginger beer at home. But the bottles kept exploding on me. It was a whole thing. Yeah. But I love a good ginger beer. Like a good, authentic ginger beer. Not the ones you get at the grocery store, the ones you get at the Caribbean restaurant. So did she have good ginger beer? Didn't we find ginger beer in the house? There was ginger beer. Yeah, she had cock and bull ginger beer. That's the good. stuff. Okay. Okay. Yeah.

It's just fresh ginger and like brown sugar and lemon. That's all you need for really good ginger beer. And that particular brand that she was using was like the good, good ginger beer. Okay. Okay. And this is not sponsored everyone. Hashtag not sponsored. If they want to sponsor me, they can send me a whole case of that stuff because that particular brand I can't get in New Jersey. I have to go to. My sister has to send it to me from Ohio. So, yeah, cock and, cock and, cock and bowl. Ginger beer.

That's a good stuff. I have another question for you. I wanted to know your thought on the cremation burial argument that we heard, which, by the way, yes, and I can give some LDS cultural aspects to that. But yeah, any thoughts on, any thoughts on hearing that? What do you think of that? So it was interesting to me that, I mean, certainly many families have these discussions, right? Where they're like, I want this to happen. I want that to happen. If I pass away, blah, blah, blah.

Because Eric's mother had died three years before, they had the whole conversation. Yeah, we want to be buried. I want to be next to mom, whatever it is. The fact that Lisa Darden chimed in and was like, after they'd made all the funeral arrangements and was like, oh, well, what about the fact that he wanted to be cremated? And Corey was like, oh yeah, yeah, let's cremate him. In my opinion, that was their ham-fisted attempt to try and cover up the fact that he was poisoned, in my opinion. But I was not sure. I knew that he was a returned missionary. If he was drinking alcohol and taking weed gummies or whatever, I get the feeling that he wasn't like super devout or whatever.

I assume, I don't know. but what is the LDS stance as it relates to burial versus cremation? Yeah, so, and yeah, people have asked me too, and I assume, you know, there was also a point, by the way, I also want to say where Katie said, I did know he drank. I just, he didn't do it in front of me. So that also tells me that this was an LDS family and they respected each other's beliefs, right? Your feelings are your feelings. And so he was, you know, but there was no secret that maybe he was. a little bit looser in some of the teachings, right?

So he drank and curry drink. All right. So I would say traditional LDS sort of, I don't even know if I want to call it doctrine, but I would say just traditional practice is that culture of the, yeah, the culture is that there is not as much cremation and there are more so burials. And it's because of the belief in the resurrection and that

your body and your spirit will be reunited later on and that bodies are sacred and it's a temple and you don't desecrate, you know what I mean, and you take care of your body. And so it is becoming more common in the LDS faith to cremate. I think it's becoming a little bit more mainstream, but certainly like historically it was not mainstream. I would say burial, definitely and that many LDS people probably still do not want to be cremated for religious. So I wouldn't be surprised at this family, who I do know is very traditional LDS. These people go back to this area. The Richens family is like, it's sort of like the Richens family.

Like there's a reason they had a pre-nup and a ranch. I think they go back in this sort of area. It's rural, Camas, it's farmland, they're ranchers. So I think you can even put them in like the homesteader sort of category. And so this is like a long history of like a family. in this area, a long history of probably LDS tradition. Even the dad, Eugene said that religion was something that they taught their family.

Yeah, it's very important to them. Yeah, very important to them, very important how they raise their children. So I'm picking up on all these clues. I would assume that they truly did not want him to be cremated for religious beliefs, like that it wasn't just like a, you know. But right, and, and look, again,

read the room. Okay, you're not guilty, Corey. Okay, let's just pretend that for a second. Right. A little bit for a second, you know, whatever. Again, read the room. Like, if you didn't do it and you're not guilty and this family who's grieving their child, like, sit down and let them bury their son. Like, did you really have, you know? And Lisa Darden take a back. seat mother-in-law. You've got no say in this, you know? Like, this was not your child. This was not your spouse. You're just the mother-in-law. Ma'am. Ma'am. Know your place. But I get the feeling that Corey was strongly influenced by her mother in lots and lots of ways. But she's, she was a grown woman, right? She's her own person, obviously. The fact that she was sort of like, oh, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. I thought, you know, we were going to do this thing. I thought we were going to cremate him. I'm glad that his sisters and his family, Eric's sisters and family stood up for him and were like, no, no, this is

what he would have wanted. We're going to put him next to mom, all the things. Like, good for them. I have a lot of respect for, like, I'm not, I'm close to like the people I live in the house with, the kids I gave birth to, but I have a very large extended family that I'm not necessarily super close with. I'm certainly not geographically close to them because they live in the Midwest and I've lived on the East Coast for 30 years now and rarely go back. But so I like I have a lot of admiration for people who come from these like very tight knit families where it's like sisters and brothers arm and arm whether you're in life, whether you have passed away, whatever it is, you know? Right. I love it. I love I think it's the most beautiful thing. Yeah. I think it's so sacred. It's so sacred. I agree. Family. Yeah. Well, Kathy, yeah, it means something. Yeah, I've taken up a lot of your time and I really appreciate it. And so, so thank you. I'm so thrilled to be here with you. It's such a treat to be on your show. I'm so happy. Well, I'm honored. I've been wanting to have you on for a while. And I thought, you know what, I really do need to like, I just need to like regroup after a few days of process. and just talk it out with a friend.

But tell us where we can find you. I know that you are not yet at 50,000 subscribers. We want to get you there. You are so needed in this true crime community. Oh, my goodness. Like I said, I think the thing you do is you break it down. You are hilarious. You're witty.

You're clever, but you don't lose your humanity. And that's what we all need in this true crime community. So thank you for being that bit that we can just like, I don't know. Yeah, it's helpful. It's helpful to me to go to your channel and laugh. So where can we find you? You can find me at Gossip Rumor and Innuendo, usually about five days of the week where I break down, you don't have to watch eight hours of trial. I will squeeze it all into 20 minutes. I'll tell you every single thing that happened in trial the day before in a way that won't cause you to go to therapy. I mean, you should definitely go to therapy. Everybody should. but watching my channel won't send you to therapy. I take out sort of all the guts and the gore and just give you like that good, good. Also, I will critique a hairdo and an outfit.

I'm just saying. Govern yourself accordingly. I am not above. I am not above being the costume critic. Yes. I have a second channel called Confessions of a Neighborhood Gossip where I tell true stories about my life, lightly fictionalized,

because I do have living relatives, and they don't know about the second channel. So I tell true stories of things that happened in my life, but I lightly fictionalized them so we can all get a chuckle out of it. And in those stories, nobody dies.

But you find out what my mother-in-law said at the last family reunion. I'm just saying. Is your mother-in-law still with us? He is. She's right over there in the Bronx. Okay, but so is this a secret from your mother-in-law then? She doesn't know about the second channel, but I have told some stories on there about her.

She doesn't know I'm talking about her because I have changed the names and some identifying characteristics. Frequently on that channel, I'm talking about like my relatives, but I say, oh, with Ms. Johnson up the street, Mr. Jones that lives around the corner like that. Yeah, right. I got you. I'm picking up what you're putting down. I see you. I'll be over there. Excellent. You're all about Mrs. Johnson. All right. All right. Well, thank you, Kathy so much. We'll have a link to Kathy's channels in the pinned comment if you're watching on YouTube and in the description of this episode, whether you're listening on podcasts or on YouTube. So thank you. And we'll see what the next week brings. We'll have you. We'll have you soon again. We'll see you. And what is the judge? What is Corey?

Best of luck. Isn't that what he always says? Best of luck. The judge, a.k.a. voice of God. Best of luck. Best of luck. Enjoy prison. We know where you stand.

We'll see you, Kathy. Bye bye. Bye. Most people don't realize how much their personal information is being bought and sold every day. Data brokers are making billions, pulling D.T. about you from public records and the internet, and then packaging and selling it, usually without your consent. That's how your information lands in the hands of scammers, spammers, even stalkers. It's why you get endless robocalls and why ads seem to follow you everywhere. That's where

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