High Hopes: A Phillies Podcast - Does Bryce Harper Deserve A New Contract? | WIP Daily

Episode Date: December 7, 2023

Joe Giglio and Tucker Bagley react to Bryce Harper and Scott Boras requesting a contract extension from the Phillies. To learn more about listener data and our privacy practices visit: https://www.audacyinc.com/privacy-policy Learn more about your ad choices. Visit https://podcastchoices.com/adchoices

Whether the action is at the link or the bank, there's never an off day on Broad Street. It's the biggest news of the day, every day, with takes from someone who's never short on them. It's WIP Daily with Joe Giglio. Welcome on in, WIP Daily, Joe Giglio with you. Appreciate everyone listening, subscribing, and following the podcast. Of course, our video feed, 94WIP's YouTube page. Check it out. Subscribe there.

I know a lot of you have been doing that and watching our videos. We appreciate that. A couple times, a few times a week, Tucker and I will put up some videos. Tucker will join me in a few minutes. We'll get back tomorrow, I'm sure, on the show to the Eagles and the Cowboys and all the football stuff, NFL picks coming up on Saturday. But there's a story out there, and I was hoping there'd be more in terms of really impact stuff from the Phillies

at the baseball winter meetings. Very quiet. The big news, obviously, Juan Soto's going to the Yankees. My dream of getting Juan Soto here to the Phillies hits another snag, but I will not be deterred. Eventually, I'll try to get that guy here. One guy that is here and has been an incredible Philly is Bryce Harper. And he'll be here for eight more years and he'll go down as an all-time Philly. I think

he's going to end up prior to what he is. Hey, Mount Rushmore Philly is in my mind. But this story coming out of the winter meetings, and it really started, if you go back and you really comb through and listen, it started, I first started hearing this, you know, almost like reading between the lines when he hit his 300th home run in late August. And then it continued. And it's been out there. And then yesterday at the winter meetings, Scott Boris just took a blowtorch and just flamed the fires to make sure. We all hear it.

And that is that Bryce Harper wants a contract extension from the Phillies. And if you're sitting there listening and saying, wait a minute, contract extension, he just got here. Yeah, you're not wrong. Or at least the first half of his contract, he's still in. So Bryce Harper has eight years left on his contract, the one he signed when he got here in 2019, the 13-year, $330 million deal. He has eight years left. He's been a Philly for five years, and he's been a wonderful player for the Phillies and worth every penny. John Middleton may have put his foot in his mouth a year ago, whenever that was, and he said that he's underpaid, that he's a bargain, that he's a value. He is. I mean, he's got like the 20-something average annual value per year on the contract.

And it is a bargain for the Phillies. And I imagine that Bryce Harper, when he and Scott Boris sit down and say, man, look how much that guy gets paid a year. Look how much that guy gets paid a year. Look at the Machado extension. Look at what Juan Soto is going to get. Look at Otani. We are underpaid. But guess what? Bryce Harper signed this contract. This was Bryce Harper's choice. He had a lot of different possibilities when he had free agency five years ago. The most logical one, and the one I think we all thought was going to happen just the most logical one and the one I think we all thought was going to happen just based on his age and the caliber player was was an opt-out Manny Machado put an opt-out in his contract and he basically well he did he opted out last year

and forced or I guess he was going to opt out after this year so that opt-out forced the Padres to to add like years to the contract and tons of money because he had leverage. He could be in this free agent class right now and have left the San Diego Padres. They didn't want that to happen. They gave him a new deal. Alex Rodriguez, 2007, in the midst of a 10-year deal that he had at that time, he opted out. He had an opt-out clause. He opted out. He forced the Yankees to give him 10 more years on top of the one he already had. So that happens. Bryce Harper doesn't have it. This whole thing is one of the most ridiculous things I've ever heard that he wants an extension. Let me read you some of the quotes here from Scott Forrest.

Then we'll dive into what's going to happen next, what they should do, and really just how this doesn't make any sense right now in any way, shape or form other than Bryce Harper just wants more money and more security and more years. And he's picking a very, very smart time in the moment to do it. The Phillies aren't making any of the big moves right now. So it's not like, you know, we're not like, well, they can't pay him because they got to go get this. Well, they've already made it clear they're probably not going to make any other big moves. They've already talked about changing his position. So he's got the leverage there in that he's doing this for the team. There's a lot going on here.

Let me read you some of these quotes, and then we'll get into it, and we'll get Tucker's thoughts in a few minutes here on all this. So this is Boris yesterday at the winter meetings in Nashville. Quote, he feels he's been there for five years. He showed them who he is and why he's a franchise player. I think he's changed the player community, how players view Philadelphia. Consequently, he came and said, this is something I want off my mind. I want to know this is done because I want to know, because I know that I want to play well beyond the contract that I have,

which is wonderful. I mean, Bryce Harper, we know how much the guy loves baseball. I felt that from when I read the Sports Illustrated cover article about him when he was 15, 16 and getting his GED to get out of high school quicker, to get to the big leagues, get drafted and all that. He loves baseball. He's one of those one percenters that aren't just great talented, but they're in love with the game.

And that's a lot of the reason why he's so good and why he's going to reach milestones. And he's going to be in the Hall of Fame fame and he could do it for the next eight years in a Phillies uniform. Um, so John Middleton had a quote recently. My intention is for Bryce to never wear another Jersey, but ours, this was last month at the owner's meetings. And when he retires for him to continue to work with us as Mike Schmidt has again, wonderful. This could all happen. Uh, Bryce Harper, Boris is citing the Patrick Mahomes restructure of his contract with the Chiefs after he signed a long-term deal. Again, that's a salary cap league, so that changes things a little bit.

And, you know, Boris also citing that Jon Minnold said that he's a bargain. So this is putting the Phillies in a tough spot because no one has a higher Q rating in Philadelphia sports wise right now than Bryce Harper. No one, Joel Embiid, great player. MVP doesn't have that kind of status in this city in terms of fans. Jalen hurts is very close, but I think if you pulled a hundred fans,

you said, who do you like better? People would pick Bryce Harper. I just think the way he embraces the city, the guy talks about WIP callers and hits home runs for them. He is connected with this fan base better than anyone I've seen maybe ever, but certainly in a very long time. He's got it. He's a great player. He led them to a world series, hit the cover off the bar early in the postseason last

year, and I'll see us again. He's got the sweet stuff. I get why Boris is doing this, and I get why Harper's doing this, but this makes no sense on any level. So let's just go through it. He just played his age 30 season. He's about to be 31. We're so far away from the end of this contract that if you're trying to project what kind of player he will still be when he's 37, 38, you're nuts. I have no idea. I mean, if you ask me to guess, I think I could come up with a reasonable guess based on the profile of his player. He hits home runs and he walks. Those things usually age well.

But one thing I don't know is will Bryce Harper's body hold up? The swing is violent. He's had back issues in the last few years, none of which have destroyed his seasons, but have certainly acted up back spasms. We've seen hitters that have violent swings. And at some point, the back is just it goes i mean david wright his career ended because of it don mattingly's career ended because of it i'm not saying bryce is training there but you never know i mean you just don't know it's why these

kind of contracts are risky i mean they're risky to begin with let alone if you already have the player signed up then there's the reality of the injuries that we do know about, whether it be, you know, the elbow the last couple of years, or just the fact that he has, he's only played 141. He's only played more than 141 games one time as a Philly. And he's only done it, you know, and the last time he did that was 2019, his first year here. He's missed time. Obviously the pandemic year was, you know, everyone played in the 50s or 60 games, right? But the next few years, he's missed time. And we don't know. I have no idea if he's going to miss a lot of time the next few years. Now, I think the move to first base long term will help him stay healthy. It's less wear and tear on his body. I think he'll end up being a good first baseman and productive and have a lot of good years left. But again, if there

were three or four years left in this contract, I could understand the concept and the idea of like, all right, what's the end going to look like here? Let's get ahead of the end. Oh, we're going to let this thing go down to the end. Is it going to be about how he's playing? Is it going to be, he's a part-time player down the stretch, you know, when he's 40, 41.

I'm sure the Phillies love the idea that he wants to be here. I'm sure they love the idea that he could chase his 500th I'm sure the Phillies love the idea that he wants to be here. I'm sure they love the idea that he could chase his 500th home run in a Phillies uniform. Heck, depending on how the next decade works out, maybe his 600th home run in a Phillies uniform. He has a chance. We went over this when he hit 300 in the milestones,

have 2000 runs scored and 3000 hits. I mean, because he started so young and he's been such a prolific player, he has a chance if he stays healthy and plays into his hits. I mean, because he started so young and he's been such a prolific player, he has a chance, if he stays healthy and plays into his 40s, to be very high up on many lists, runs batted in, runs scored, home runs, hits, all of that. And I know that stuff probably means a lot to Bryce Harper. So it's cool that he wants to do this in a Phillies uniform,

and I'm sure the Phillies see the value in this because he's an icon already and he'll just continue to rise up the list of icons in the history of the city. So keeping him here, the Schmidt thing, the ambassador thing, wonderful. I mean, I think it's awesome. But eight years left, what if his career goes bad? I mean, what if injuries really set in? What if he declines? And then six years from now, with two years left, this looks like the Ryan Howard contract. It could. I mean, if you're saying it's not,

I think you're discounting how players age in baseball. Yes, there are Barry Bonds, and there are David Ortiz, and maybe Bryce Harper can be something to that effect, where he's very productive, very late, and it's like a big poppy. It's certainly possible. But again, like a big poppy. It's certainly possible. But again, there's also Ryan Howard, there's Don Mattingly, there's David Wright. And with so much runway between now and then, we don't know. And the other thing that really hits me about it is the Phillies have to, I think, put their foot down before this becomes

the Scott Boris retirement community in about seven or eight years. They already went too long with Trey Turner. I said that the night they signed the contract, that's even before I watched him play for a full season, and I didn't think he was worth that kind of money. But do you think Trey Turner is going to be a productive shortstop at the age of 39 and 40? I don't. I mean, he had led the league in errors last year, and it was his first year of the 11-year contract. There's no way he's playing shortstop at a high level in his last season. Not a chance. Now we're going to have a 41-, 42-year-old first baseman chasing records? And who's the next Boris client that those two guys want here?

And they bring him in, and he's here forever. Like, they've got to put their foot down that they're running a baseball team, not the Bryce Harper Baseball Academy. Like, there has to be a point where common sense plays out. Like, hey, Bryce, we love you, man. We're so happy you're here. But you didn't want an opt-out clause. If you did, you'd have more control over this. And let's play the next five, six years out.

And if you're still productive, we're all still happy. Yeah, let's open up that conversation and say, maybe let's tack on two more years and we'll go to age 40. And then we'll see where we're at and see where you're at in your career. Kind of like the Dodgers do it one year, year to year with Clayton Kershaw. I mean, he's a Dodger, but there's not been any 10-year contracts for Clayton Kershaw. It's year to year. He leaves the season, he clears his head, and they say, we want Clayton back as long as he wants to play. He comes back and he's really good. I mean, that makes sense to me. But the idea of a contract extension with eight years to go is one of the most patently absurd

things i've ever heard in my whole life as a sports fan tucker what do you think here as we um you know we're trying to make a list this morning of players and you know really popular or really good phillies that didn't even last here the equivalent of you know eight seasons i mean scott roland didn't play that much here you go back i mean a lot of really carlos charise didn't even last here the equivalent of, you know, eight seasons. I mean, Scott Rowland didn't play that much here. You go back, I mean, a lot of really – Carlos Ruiz didn't play the equivalent of 1,200-whatever games here. A lot of good fillers. Darren Dalton, they didn't play that much here.

He has that much left. Yeah, I think it's crazy, and I think what's even crazier is, you know, we always mention his age, right? He's 31. He's signed through to the age of 40. He has eight years left. He's already played 12 seasons in the majors right like at this point with his current contract he's gonna play 20 years that's a big number for a guy who plays the way he plays and plays the

style of baseball he plays for him to be productive after 20 years is pretty crazy to think about not many guys have ever done that but then to to sit here and say, not only does he want to play for 20 years, he wants more on top of that. He wants to actually play 25. He wants to play more seasons than someone like Pete Rose or Ty Cobb in the majors playing the way he does. I just don't think it makes any sense. I understand that Bryce Harper wants to be here. And you know, I think it's kind of funny. You look at what he's done in totality with the contract so far. He's only hit 30 home runs twice. So he had 100 RBIs once. He has yet to play in an All-Star game as a Philly.

And I don't think there's anybody who would sit here and tell you it's a bad deal. Right. Like everyone is over the moon, excited about how Bryce Harper's first five years of the Philly have gone. But I don't know. You can't come here and say hey i want to be here forever i want to be here for life i told my agent i didn't want an opt-out clause even though he told me that i should have it and then 30 of the way through say hey you know what change my mind and all that i actually want more money i want more years i want a bigger deal i see everybody else getting more money than me and i want that and i don't doubt that bryce harper loves it here i don't doubt the the love affair between him and the fan base is is true and and real and authentic but it just it feels like maybe now's not the time bryce like understand that you still have

nearly a decade left on this contract i mean your son's gonna be in middle school by the time this contract is over he He's going to be 12, 13 years old. I think what the Kershaw thing you brought up makes a lot of sense. Like there's a world where him and the Phillies can certainly be business partners and be, you know, in business with each other for the rest of his baseball career and beyond. The Phillies have done a really good job of taking care of their legends and their Hall of Famers past their playing career. But let's get there first like let's not discuss it and try to plan out the next 20 years when he's 31 years old it makes no sense i mean it only makes sense for bryce harper i mean that and scott boris and and they what tucker said is is real they see what's going on i mean juan soto

a year from now is going to try to get $600 million over 15 years with Scott Boris's agent. Shoei Otani might get $500 or $600 by the time you listen to this podcast. So that's where the market's going. Bryce's deal per year and just overall, I mean, at some point, it's going to close to be doubled. And he's looking like, but he signed this contract. He asked for this contract. He wanted this kind of contract. I mean, the Dodgers would have given him four, you know, 160 the minute he hit free agency if he wanted to take it. And he could have been back into free agency last year. So he could have done anything he wanted when he hit free agency at 25 years old.

He chose to go his route, not the Machado route. It's been a wonderful marriage. He's got great numbers, even though they're not counting stats. He's got like a 149 OPS plus. He's been great. He's awesome. He's one of the best hitters in baseball. He's going to end up in Cooperstown one day.

And he's been a remarkable signing for the Phillies that has changed their franchise. And if they want to continue that for years, do it. But not now. With eight years to go, and again, this player hasn't been the picture of health the last couple years. Eight years to go with the swing that violent as he goes into his early 30s before we even get to his mid-30s. It wouldn't just be ridiculous.

It would be one of the most ridiculous contract things I've ever seen any team in any pro sport do. The Phillies should just tell him, hey, Bryce, let's take a deep breath. We'll talk in a few years. Appreciate everyone listening, subscribing, following WIP Daily. We'll talk tomorrow, I'm sure, about the Eagles and the Cowboys.