High Hopes: A Phillies Podcast - Final Out: Phillies Bats Fall Silent In Loss To Reds

Episode Date: May 20, 2026

Jack Fritz reacts to Chase Burns' domination of the Phillies on Tuesday night and looks ahead to tomorrow afternoon's rubber match between the Phillies and Reds. Presented by Miller Lite.To purchase Ring The Bell by Jack Fritz and Kevin Reavy go to RingTheBellBook.com

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watch on YouTube or listen on Apple, Spotify, and everywhere else you get podcasts. Oh, welcome on in is the Final Out, sponsored by the Philadelphia Parking Authority, offering valet park at the Philadelphia Airport. Jack Fritz hanging out with you on a Tuesday night reacting to a rare clunker for the Don Mattingly-led Phillies. I was told we're not going to have any more games like that. But nevertheless, Don Mattingly. and the Phillies have a tough one tonight, and we are here to react to it all.

The game wrap-up is sponsored by Roto Router. When Plumbing Problems Hit, wrap them up quick and call Roto Router. Their team tackles clogs and leaks so you can stay in the game. Roto Router, your MVP for plumbing solutions. 215-592-94, if you were in attendance for this one. Another good crowd down at the ballpark. The rain luckily held off. I mean, it was kind of off and on, seemingly, all night, out here in Westchester.

did end up in a nice, nice sunset after a rainstorm. Not bad. Also, so hot, I appreciate the the rain today. And Murf didn't have to take phone calls. So really just a win all around besides what happened on the field. So 2.5-592-94-94 to give your reactions to this one. My biggest takeaways of the game are brought to you by Morgan and Morgan, America's largest injury law firm. and like I kind of mentioned at the top there, this team has played crisp, clean baseball really since Maddenly has taken over. There's been little miscused, but for the most part, locked in, fundamentally focused, you know, creating some havoc on the base paths,

being clutch, having good pitching. And tonight really wasn't any of that. We'll get to more on Lazardo. Lazzardo is fine. not blaming him for tonight. But not a banner, Harper night in the field. I know we had the one play at the plate that I didn't see video of. I was driving around getting my one son to sleep.

So I heard it on the radio. But besides that, I mean, there was a couple that he just went too far over. And I understand that there's a want-to to make plays. But at the same time, we got to be smart. and tonight was some examples of just trying to do a little bit too much over there at first base. Just let's not get the ball. He's a great defensive second baseman. I thought Harper was just over-pursuing.

And then Crawford, who, you know, every single night, it feels like it's an adventure out there in center field. There was ball hit tonight that he should have been able to catch. Like it was a tough-ish play. But if he gets a good read, which by the numbers, he gets some of the worst reads in baseball. But if he gets a good quality read on it, he's able to track that ball down and not let the inning start with the triple to L.A. DeV Cruz and not let a little snowball effect after that. And Crawford had to play last night that he did make a catch on, but still the read was just off.

Seems like he's really struggling on line drives. doesn't have a good gauge on if they're well-struck or not. So he's a bit of an adventure out there. Crawford is, and not to make, they didn't lose the game tonight because of Justin Crawford. Like, that's not. It's more just what we've seen from him so far this year. I do like what he brings to the plate.

I don't want him batting higher than seventh. I also am just not sure. Between the center fielder, who I don't think, think has center field instincts. Harper, I don't think, has first base instincts. Like, he has enough athleticism to make it work. He can make good picks and ball said to him, but there were some times the night where just the natural first base instincts weren't there. They have Trey, who I don't think is a naturally instinctive shortstop, you know, three guys where you watch him every night and they don't exactly scream great defensive prowess. But on Crawford, I just

I don't think you should bet higher than seventh. The defense out there is an adventure. You know, it's one of those things. Being a track-fly ball, might be something you're born with. I think we have this idea that you can work and work and work. And sure you can work to get better at it. But I just think that there's sometimes there's something natural

that just takes over where you can naturally track a fly ball. And I don't think he has it. Because it's not like they're just, I think we have this idea that he just started playing center field this year in the Phillies minor leagues and in spring training. That wasn't the case. I mean, they've put him out there in center field, and it hasn't been great. You know, they've kind of moved into a corner guy last year at AAA, and they would go back and forth between center field and left field.

But if you watch him, I think he's more of a, I think he's more of a, I think he's more. more of a left fielder, but he has a center field profile of the plate, which leaves you kind of feeling, well, what do we have here in Justin Crawford? So, again, I think he is a winning player. I do like what he does. I like what he brings the plate. I just wish he was more locked down in center field. Again, I hope he can learn it. I hope he can get more comfortable out there. But I also think it's something that you're kind of just born with the ability to track the baseball in center field. And I'm not so sure he has it.

So, again, was not the reason they lost tonight, but listen, when they lose a stinker like that, and there's really not that much to say, I just, I've been thinking a lot about Justin Crawford and his future and what he can be. I mean, his dad was super fast, but he ended up being a left fielder as well. He just might end up being a left fielder. Now, you know, Spike has mentioned a couple times, you know, would you put Crawford and left and Marsh and center for the rest of the year? You know, Marsh probably better out there. And I still push back because I want to see if Crawford can do it or not.

I don't think you have to pull the plug on it right now. But I do wonder if down the stretch, if games get more important and defense gets more important that they do make a little bit of a switch there. but if he is a corner guy, we've had a lot of pop. I mean, he better hit for a super, super high average and be a stud on left field. And then it becomes, what do you do with Brandon Marsh? Brandon Marsh did not have a great night of dish tonight. I struck out three times. One at bat was really bad.

Chase the 2-2 pitch up in the zone and took an ugly hack at it. So again, it was a stinker. Some bad defense, not crisp, which has not been the case under Don Maddenley. They're due for one of these. It is baseball. And now that they've won a lot of games and they've won five in a row before tonight, I feel like it is safe to say, hey, sometimes that's baseball. And they also just struck out a ton tonight.

But at the same time, you know, sometimes you do have to tip your cap to a pitcher. And Chase Burns was unbelievable tonight. So, you know, Chase Burns did his job, completely kept the Phillies at bay. I mean, 92-mile-hour sliders. I think he generated like 13 whiffs on that slide of tonight, which is crazy, if not more. You know, that was it earlier in the night. But Chase Burns, six innings, nine Ks. We talk a lot about Paul Skeens.

But after watching Chase Burns and Skeens in the same week, I mean, there's a case for Burns. He's ERA is 1.83 and his fastball is electric. and then the slider off of that is it's pretty stupid. For as good as Chris Sanchez won two punches and the fastball change of combo, you know, Burnsy feels like he's kind of right there. So he's a special talent.

Second year in the league, 23 years old. And not to like, you know, hammer home the point. But it's like he's 23 and Painter's 23. You see what Burns has been. And then Painter feels like a work in progress. I'm so pretty hopeful for the future of Andrew Painter. like that's a burns and skeins and miseroski like those are are generational pitching prospects and unfortunately i think painters is going to be more of a work in progress towards being a

a high quality major to league started rather than just hitting the ground running and it's also so interesting it's like you know i don't get why well maybe like like why college pitchers and high school pitchers you know you think that a high school pitcher would be coming into a major or a a professional organization and they'd be ready to hit the ground running at like 22 just like college guitar but you look up and down like major league rotations and you look at the best pitchers in baseball it's a lot

it's a lot of college arms it's a lot of college arms and you know maybe because they let guys pitch they don't protect the arms so you know chase burns goes to tennessee two years transfers awake gets in the Wake Forest pitching lab and turns into that. And that he is special. Now, the Phil's guy was very good tonight as well. Hazers Lozardo was perfectly fine.

You know, it was not one of those Lazzardo starts that you left feeling like, ah, he didn't have it tonight. He had it tonight. The defense in the fourth let him down, had him throwing a lot of pitches. But six innings, two runs is perfectly fine. He's, he had the one stinker against Colorado, but really since the three bad starts, he has been Hazius Lazardo-esque.

So certainly good to see him being more consistent than not in his last, what, six outings, five outings? So Lazzardo was fine. It was a stinker, one of those nights. 2-15-5-9-2-94 to get in. Jordan and Princeton, what's happening about? Well, Jack, there were two good things about the baseball game. I'm sorry. Three good things I should say. One is I enjoyed it with my son, who's here in the car with me. He's got a bit for coming up. I'm very excited. Two, the sunset was gorgeous among the storm clouds. Really gorgeous sunset. Three, I've been in the new Hall of Fame Club yet. They did a fabulous job with it with all the memorabilia and the new museum-like parts to it. So that was the good stuff.

Yeah, I haven't seen... everything that happened. Yeah, I haven't seen the new Hall of Fame Club yet, but I've heard good things. It's good to hear that it still has the charm. It has significantly more charm, and they added a lot of nice historical pieces from all the different hours of Philly's baseball, a lot of nice tributes to Halliday and other guys that have passed, and, you know, the original Philly, so it's really nice, nicely done. On the field, you know, not so nicely done, as you said, Luzardo had a fantastic start, but what my son and I can't stop talking about is the fact that Rafael Marshant is in this lineup to begin with.

And I guess that we've got to rest guys, but we're carrying three catchers right now. And his OPS is so low, they might as well bury it beneath Citizens Bank Park. And when you have a guaranteed out in the lineup, it's very frustrating. You combine that with Justin Crawford experience, which was middling tonight, and a bullpen that wasn't particularly good. It was a stinker, as you said. But, you know, it's always nice to be at the ballpark. 36 bucks to sit in the Hall of Fame Club.

Go to those Tuesday night games, everybody. That's a good message. It's a good message. I appreciate the phone call, Jordan. Yeah, the Hall of Fame Club, new. The New Era Team Store, new. So they're gearing up for the All-Star game. Bont harbord to get ahead.

He did hit the ball 108 miles an hour off of Jays Burns. leg, you know, as we are monitoring the Bryce Harper All-Star situation. Even though barring something catastrophic, it'll be, it'll be Matt Olson starting at first base. But at least get him in the Schwabes and Harper in the home run derby? Come on, man. That would be a treat. Dave's in Maryland. What's happening, Dave?

Yeah, just a dud of a game. Chase Burns was really good. The defense was just pathetic tonight. that was kind of my takeaway that Crawford and Center and then Bryce just playing first base and second base trying to yeah trying to yeah I mean that that kind of led to that inning and the Tanner Banks voodoo magic of getting people out has kind of worn off this year because he's really putting them some bad spots and yeah just a bad night I'm heading up tomorrow to the game. So hopefully

I get to see a a Noel's gem tomorrow hopefully, but uh... Wow, you better you better, you better I don't know, I don't know what you got to do to make sure you get a Knowles an Ace-like performance tomorrow, but

man, I'm just going to yell the whole, I'm going to yell out of the whole game to don't use your 14 basketball and hide it. Hide it. Yep. There you go. So we'll see. Yep, have a good one. All right, Dave. Appreciate the phone call. Yeah. Knowles tomorrow. We'll get to that coming up a little bit later.

On the other side, we'll get to the wow moment of the game and some other things that stuck out tonight. All that's coming up next here on the final out on Sports Radio 94 WIP. Check swing, number towards first. Bear hand pick Harper fires home and on one hop. Marshawn digs it out. Oh, my goodness. What a play on both ends.

Do or die, and the Phillies get the out at the plate. Reds say they want to challenge it, which we'll see. Here is the call. After review, the call on the field is overturned. The runner is safe. The catcher does not maintain control of baseball. Miss Nadia will the same in the challenge.

And there you have it. Another run on the board. As a call overturned and it's three to one Cincinnati. Yeah, that would have been big. That did not get overturned. And the call stays. It's still 2-1 with two outs. rather than, you know, keep the bases loaded and won out.

So, you know, that's kind of the turning point of the game. That was still the wow moment of the game, which is brought to you by the New Jersey Division of Travel and Tourism, from waterfalls to Fairways, Mountain Resorts to Lighthouse Tours. Find your wow right now at visit nj.com. It is the final out, sponsored by the Philadelphia Parking Authority, offering valet parking at the Philadelphia airport. Yes.

So that was kind of turning point of the game, you know, in if they that's where I kind of was wondering if maddenly is still has the the four-leaf clover because you know basis load early in the game there was a base-load situation that they they navigated themselves out of and then that one I was like man are they really going to be able to navigate them navigate out of another bases loaded spot maddenly the maddingly touch but nevertheless they went down four-one and it started raining and I think I think everyone was kind of ready for that one to to be over now

Dave brought up but yes the the Tanner Banks miracle run from last year where you kept watching him none of the stuff popped he did have some stones I do believe that he he did have some stones and he isn't afraid out there but sometimes stuff is just stuff and while the second like the, like, Harper made a mistake in the field as well. So it wasn't all on him, but, you know, Bladay leaves the, leaves the ending off immediately with a double. It's a lefty, lefty spot. And then, you know, Walk Stevenson, who can't hit. And thankfully, Cabrion Hayes, who might be the worst offensive player in baseball,

it exists because he grounded a field of a choice, a great play by Edmundo Sosa. But, yeah, the Tanner Banks, again, miracle run from last year that might not be there in in 2026. And then Chase Shugert is awesome. I mean, you look at the Pirates bullpen and how desolate it was over the weekend and needing quality arms. And they just gave away essentially Chase Shugart, who is pitching to like a 1.70 right now.

And it's not even, you kind of watch them. and you're like, ah, stuff's not that great. And then it's like a 97-mile-an-hour sinker that he starts at a guy's hip and brings back across the inside part of the plate. And he pitches east to west very, very well to where it's like both his slider and his two-seamer sinker and his sweeper looks like the same pitch, same spot out of hand. And they stay on the same plane for a long time. And then they just go exact opposite direction.

So maybe he starts cutting into Bolin. He's not going to cut into Keller. Kirkering has been fine. You know, Bolin Shugert, maybe that is a pressure point for Don Mattingly and Caleb Gotham to switch. And because, man, Bolin, like you watch him and he see the stuff, but it just hasn't translated. And that's a bummer because it's 98 and a real sweeper and a feel for a change-up. It should work, and it's just not working.

It's just not working. It's surprising, you know. So Chase Schuagert is pitching his way into more and more high leverage spots. And then, you know, Trey, while the last is bad, I'm trying not to hold against him. There's nothing worse than when he pops out first pitch. And like the Reds bullpen is walking. batters at a historic clip, some of the worst of all time.

Maybe just let them walk you, or at least make them work a little bit. I just hate, I hate first pitch swinging against relievers late in games. Like, make them work a little bit. If you want to swing first pitch against Chase Burns because you might only get one pitch to the entire bat,

okay. But against, against back-end, reliever types. It's not your face in Mason Miller, you know, in that situation. So I just, I don't like, I really don't like when the trade swings first pitch. Work account for me one time. But to Tray's credit, I think the, I think the last three games, he's hitting the ball hard. I thought, I thought, I thought the last game in Pittsburgh, he was doing a good job of seeing the ball late and trying to drive it the other way. And the last two nights,

you know, he started off yesterday's game with a 109-mile-hour double off the wall and left, which was good. And then tonight to home run, I mean, that was a tank shot, slider up in the zone that he didn't miss. It's crazy being able to

take a Chaseburn slider out. You still have to meet the barrel to the ball of a 92-mile-an-hour slide. It's not easy to do. So three straight games, of Trey hitting the ball hard, maybe starting to backspin it a little bit and come out of the slump that he's been going through. On the other side, we will give a little look ahead to

tomorrow and give our player of the game. All that's coming next here on the final out, on Sports Radio 94 WIP. Welcome back. It is the final out. Jack Fritz hanging out with you here on WIP. 2-5-592-94-94. you want to sneak in a phone call, or if you just want to line up and get ready to talk to Broads coming up next. I don't know what Brod's got in the holster tonight. If a Phillies lose a stinker, flyers, eh, Sixers, eh? The A.J. Brown's wedding? We'll see what old Broads has cooked up for everyone tonight.

The player of the game is brought to you by South Jersey Gas, making a smart play. Save Energy and Money with South Jersey Gas at SJG SaveEnergy.com. And it's Chase Burns, who was great. And Lazardo v. Burns. I was actually glad. I thought it started raining like the 4th. I was like, man, it would be a bummer if like this great pitching matchup got washed out. So unfortunately, it didn't go to Phillies way.

But, again, Burns was awesome. So sometimes you just got to tip your cap. There are a lot of great pitchers in this league. And, you know, they took out Skeens on Sunday. Kind of felt like they were going to take out Burns tonight. That would have been amazing. Now, I do think they had a better plan against Skeens. But, again, Burns is also on tomorrow.

Big one as the Phillies go for another series win. Still have won every series under Don Mattingly. And we don't need that to end tomorrow. They're facing Andrew Abbott, who got off to a Boree. brutal start to begin the year, but it's starting to look more and more like Andrew Abbott. And, you know, he's a crafty, little lefty, has good command, won't overpower you with stuff, but it's starting to look like the Andrew Rabbit of last year, who was a really, really good pitcher for the Reds.

And then for the Phillies, it's Aaron Nolan. And boy, do they need to get Aaron Nolan going. The question is, can they? That's the big question, because when you watch them, it's not like the stuff's exactly popping. It's not like you can see, then there's evidence that, hey, he's like Lazzardo when he was struggling. You could say, yeah, but the stuff's fine. He's going to be fine. With Nola struggling, I don't exactly see the stuff popping.

It looks at the stuff's dying as it's getting to the plate and just begging for the hitters to blast it. So, yeah, I mean, the four seamers getting crushed at a rate that we haven't seen for Knowles. The command has not been there. You know, maybe the ABS has something to do with that. But, yeah, the Aaron Nol, you keep just thinking, you try not to, but it's hard not to. Think about there are still four years left on this deal, four years, and it kind of feels like it's teetering out right now. Oh man, he's not even giving you equality innings anymore.

He's closed your eyes and hope that it's not, you're not down six by the third inning at this point. So hopefully no one can get going. But again, I just, when you look at his stuff, it's not there. It's not there. So I don't know. I guess just a hope and a prayer with Aaron Nolo on the Mount tomorrow. I wish I had more optimism for you.

I wish I was seeing something that made me feel like there was some light at the end of the tunnel, but I really, really don't. That's going to do it for me. Broads is coming up next. I'm sure he found something to talk about. He will entertain you and happy for the rest of the night. Luke Nichols produced the program, and we'll be back after the game tomorrow. I'll be with the afternoon show.

Reacting to what is hopefully a Phillies series. That's going to do it for me. Bros. coming up next here on Sports Radio 94WIP.