High Hopes: A Phillies Podcast - Final Out: Phillies Comeback Falls Short in DC

Episode Date: June 3, 2023

Jack Fritz reacts to the Phillies 7-6 loss at the hands of the Nationals on Friday night. To learn more about listener data and our privacy practices visit: https://www.audacyinc.com/privacy-policy Learn more about your ad choices. Visit https://podcastchoices.com/adchoices

Oh, come on in. It is the final out. Why? Why? Why? Why? Why? Why? Why? Why? Are we doing this again? Why are we sitting here on June 2nd, tied for last place with the Nationals? Why was it such a scratch and claw affair to get back into a game against the Nationals? Why did we tie it up and give us hope? And why did they blow it? Because they are the 2023 Philadelphia Phillies.

Welcome on in. 23 Philadelphia Phillies. Welcome on in. It is the final out sponsored by Regency Furniture. Affordable never looks so good. Nick Earnshaw producing behind the glass there had no idea what

the band was that was just playing. So you know things are off to a hot start here on the final out and as we sit here on a Friday night the Phillies are tied for last place, the Phillies are tied for last place. The Phillies are tied for last place with a huge payroll, with high expectations.

Frankly, I'm not surprised. And I mean, I'm surprised like we're here, but I'm not surprised that tonight happened. It's just, this season has just been an absolute dumpster fire. And it has been something that is shocking. It's been, this season has just been an absolute dumpster fire. And it has been something that is shocking. It's been something that's incredibly disappointing.

And it's been something that has killed baseball buzz in the city of Philadelphia after the end of last year had sucked everyone back in. And again, I've said it countless times in the last two days, in every Phillies related discussion that I've been in is that I wouldn't give up last year for the world. I wouldn't give up the playoff run for the world. And it was the most fun time I've had as a sports fan. The Super Bowl run was fun, but if you know me, baseball is my thing.

And I love this team. I live and die with this team. I will continue to watch every game. I will continue to react to every game. I will continue to do everything about the Phillies. But the fact that they had to scratch and claw and fight so hard to get back into a game against the Nationals and then ultimately end up losing is just an awful sign. I'm not, I can't sit here and say, wow, the way they bounced back, the way they battled back is really a good sign going forward. Old Jack would. Old Jack would be sitting here.

If they were, if they were 500, if they were even two games under 500, I would be saying, you know what? That little run there, being able to come back in this game, yeah, they lost. It stinks. But they were to come back and make something of nothing. I wish I could sell you on that. But I can't. I can't. I can't sit here and keep trying to find ways to believe in a baseball team that flat out stinks. Because that's what they do right now. And that's who they are. They have shown us all year long that they're just not very good. Am I proud of Nick Castellanos for what he did tonight?

Yes. It's a great sign. Two homers, a big night offensively, big hit late that I wish could have tied the game up. I wanted them to win this game. But they didn't deserve to win this game. They didn't deserve to win this

game because early in the game they gave it away for no reason and because of a bullpen game tomorrow, because the team doesn't have a fifth starter they couldn't pull Wheeler and I know people are going to get on Thompson and they're going to say how could you not pull Wheeler he started let up loud contact it was the third inning fourth inning like you have to let him go there because you have no one starting tomorrow besides,

well, you're starting Matt Strom, who can apparently only give you two innings. This is an absolute dumpster fire, a dumpster fire of a baseball season. And it stinks. It stinks to be here. But it is what it is. It is what it is. I can't put a cherry on top of this right now and spin it. They lost. And frankly, like the Nationals bullpen's bad. They look like the more locked in team tonight. If Nick Castellanos didn't exist, that's a blowout. You know, like it is, it's a really,

really bad spot. And I'm sorry to be so down. And I'm sorry to be, you know, just sort of apathetic towards this baseball team. But it's where I'm at. And they're 25-32. Tied for last place in the National League. Their starter, their ace, their best pitcher, who I thought was turning a corner, was off again tonight. And it just opens up the door for more questions about this team. Like, Nola, you have no idea. Tyrone Walker, you have no idea.

Wheeler, you have no idea. Ranger, you have no idea. They don't have a fifth starter. The lineup. Topper changed it around tonight. Everyone's like, oh, what is Rob Thompson doing? Well, he's trying something. But people wanted.

They wanted him to try something. And you know what? It sort of worked. They scored seven runs tonight. Nick Castellanos accounted for a lot of it, but still. They largely did their jobs. Trey Turner didn't. But,'t, but what else is new? It's just, it's tough to deal with.

It is tough to deal with, given the expectations. But, I don't know. I wish I could sit here and say 104 games left now, long season, plenty of time to turn it around. Sure, that's there. But if you watch this team on a night-in, night-out basis, it's hard to see it happening. And the evidence is just continuing to pile up.

Drew Ellis got a hit tonight. He also cost impossible runs early in the game by getting picked off first base. He also cost them possible runs early in the game by getting picked off first base. The fact that Drew Ellis is starting for this team on June 2nd is not a good sign. It is not a good sign. I've been worried about this team for a week. I don't like worrying about the team, but they're giving me no reason not to. 215-592-9494.

A lot to get in on. A lot to react to. Another loss tonight. It's been a dreadful start to the year. And they are now tied for last place. And my final thing before going to the phones is this. Is the game happened. You know, and Wheeler wasn't great,

and I don't disagree with Rob Thompson leaving him in there to try to eat some innings. He wasn't in a ton of pitches. It just wasn't his night. There was some bad defense early. But you want to talk about, and I am not in the camp of firing Rob Thompson. I think that would be a mistake. Frankly, I want my team to have some conviction. I want them to have some belief in the coaching staff.

I don't want to have a team that fires a manager every year to spark the team if they get off to a slow start. And when I look at Rob Thompson, I see a guy who is dealing with one, two, three, four starters. You have no idea what you're getting. No fifth starter. 30 and 100 guy out of the lineup in Reese Hoskins. Trey Turner being just terrible at this point,

like just a bad baseball player. Offense largely underperforming. The guy who led the NL in home runs last year is batting 160. His best reliever's been out for close to a month now. Like, there's a lot of things working against Rob Thompson. I thought it was freaking egregious in the eighth inning tonight to put Connor Brogdon in that game. Brogdon's been pretty good this year,

but Brogdon's been pitching in games you're losing in mostly. Losing in games to try to keep you in it so your offense can come back late. There is no reason for Sir Anthony not to be in that game. That is a Sir Anthony spot. He has pitched once this week, and I know you have a bullpen game tomorrow, but who gives a bleep about the bullpen game when you are 25 and 31 heading into the game? 25 and 31. You have to win baseball games when you are given a chance to win the game. It is a tie game that you fought back in to make it a tie game in a must-win game in June because your team has been an absolute dumpster fire this year. You can't lose that game by not pitching your best freaking relievers to try to win it.

You have to win that game. Conor Brogdon cannot be in that spot. That is Sir Anthony Dominguez's spot. He has pitched one freaking time this week. One time. One time. I know you have a bullpen game tomorrow. I don't care about tomorrow. You

had to win that game with the momentum back on your side. Egregious. Egregious error. Egregious error. Sir Anthony Dominguez had to be in that baseball game. No ifs, ands, or buts about it.

There is no doubt about it. That is a Sir Anthony spot in the eighth inning in a tie game that your guys just laid it on the line to get back into it, to get back into that game. They showed some fight. And you let them down. You let them down. 215-592-9494. Jeremy's in Cherry Hill. What's happening, Jeremy? Hey, I just need a rant, okay? I understand that this team came back from six down.

But this team needs to show up, okay? Nobody on this team is held accountable. Trey Turner is hitting 145 in the last two weeks. JT is hitting.07. What is this, okay? I am sick and tired of this team not showing up. The last five, six games have been awful. I thought this team was back after they came back against the Diamondbacks last week,

but no, it's complete, utter lack of care. have been awful. I thought this was back after they came back against the Diamondbacks last week, but no, it's complete, utter lack of care. I don't know what it is, okay? Besides the fact that they came back from the sixth run deficit today, they have no heart, okay? You get swept in New York the last few days. Pathetic. You're facing a rebuilding awful to say it nicely. I understand

like we suck against them. We lost to the awful Washington Nationals today who are rebuilding. Okay, the Phillies are the reigning national champions. That is 2022. This is 2023.

It's a new season. I don't know what is going on with this team right now. Something needs to change. Well, Jeremy, frankly, it's just, it's, I mean, Jason Kelsey said it best. I mean, it's the whole team. It's the whole team. Every single aspect of this team is bad right now. Situational baseball base

running starting pitching bullpen's been pretty good i i for what it's i mean they are it's fine whatever who cares uh and the starting the the line has been dreadful like it's just it's it's the whole team right now and rob thompson tried to change it up tonight you know he he he dropped turner which i was happy he did he Schwarzer back in the leadoff spot. He got two hits. Good. Like, maybe it's a good start. I don't know.

I don't know. 2-1-5, 5-9-2, 94-94. If you want to get in and react to what was yet again another loss. But on the other side, there actually is one big positive from tonight. And one thing that does make me worried. What is it? We'll get to all that and your phone calls coming up next. Swung on, hit of the air, center field, pretty deep.

Going back is called at the wall. He jumps and it is gone. And Nick Castellanos with a two-homer game. This time a two-run shot. And This time, a two-run shot. And it's now a 7-3 Nationals lead. I don't care if they lost. That's our player of the game brought to you by South Jersey Gas, committed to providing safe, reliable, affordable natural gas.

Make the switch at southjerseygas.com. Love my home. Nick Cassiano has two homers on the night, four for five on the night, big double late. Like that was great. Um, it's funny. He had more home.

He already has more home runs in June than he had in May. So how's that make you feel? Um, and if they're going to climb out of this, they need these guys to like, they need one guy to just go bonkers. If it's not going to be Schwarber, I'll go Schwarber at a good night.

Harper is in a, in a weird kind of fun. He should have had a home a weird kind of – he should have had a home run tonight. I think he thought he had a home run tonight. And obviously it didn't go out of the way to catch the wall. But he's two for 21 with runners in scoring position to start the season since getting back from the IL. So they need someone to just carry the team if they want to get out of this, uh,

funk they're in. And maybe it was, uh, maybe it was Castellanos. Maybe Castellanos can go, uh, nuts here for a little bit and, and get this team,

you know, kind of put on his back for a little bit, but who knows if it can't pitch, it doesn't really matter. And even if it's not the bullpen letting them down, it's usually the starters. And that's a, a terrible spot to be in.

Owen is in New Jersey on the final out. What's happening, Owen? Hey, Jack. I hope you're doing a lot better than me. I don't think I am, honestly. Do I sound like I'm doing much better than you? No. You're kind of on par with me right now.

Good, good. That's where we need to be. Yep. So, I mean, this is where my mindset is. I kind of feel like the season's wasted, honestly. And, I mean, to make myself feel better, I'm consoling myself hoping they do something big next year, honestly. Yeah, that's the big question with the team at this point

and how people feel about it is, like, is this just one bad year or is this team not as good as we thought it was? And frankly, for me, I know it's been a tough start to the year. And Owen, you kind of sound like me. I think it's just a bad year. Like, I don't think these guys are massive losers. I don't think the manager's a disaster. I thought his mistake tonight in the eighth was egregious. Full disclosure, yeah, that was bad. But I just think that there's been a lot of bad that has happened this year that I don't think relies totally on a manager. I think a lot of this is players having down years

and some injuries are mixed in there. And it's almost just a season from hell that you have to just kind of chalk up as wasn't our year. And that's a bad spot to be in. And it's not very fun. Yeah, and I mean, again, I'm looking at the offseason just to see positives. My mind is going, I just hope they fix the starting rotation next year. I feel like that was something they didn't really do anything with this offseason.

And honestly, like, I hope they do what the Rangers did in the offseason, which is just completely overload their rotation. And, I mean, I know it's probably not going to happen, but I hope John Milton's comments are real and he goes after Otani next year and just goes for the wham, just, just like spend money like it's nothing. We got a $500 million guy to go with two $300 plus million guys? Anything to get us back to where we want to go, really. I mean, unless Painter is going to, well, they said August 1st, so I mean, at this point

it feels like August 1st by that time, we'll be 20 games below.500, so it doesn't matter. Well, at least you can get some experience, right, Owen? Yeah, I guess so. I mean, a lot of pitchers that are good this year were on bad teams, like Steele, for example, got experience last year in the second half of the season. Maybe that will help him. Oh, man, what inspiring stuff, Owen. I appreciate the call, man.

I mean, the fact that we're talking about that on June 2nd, that we need to get Andrew Painter some second half experience is just... I don't laugh out of... I don't think it's... I can't believe we're sitting

here doing this on June 2nd. Last place, Nationals. They looked on par with the nationals tonight you want to talk about a bad sign look like you're on par with the nationals dylan was at the game which makes me just feel awful for him dylan what's happening pal ah man jack i mean thanks for sharing where you're at i'm basically at the same spot and the thing is like i'm the holdout guy you know i have this high tolerance for pain. I'm patient. I remember last year going to that game against the Mets where Girardi put in

Nelly and we were all yelling about it. And that was well into the time over those weeks and weeks where everybody was saying fire Girardi. And that was the point where I was like, I'm out on Girardi. It was really late into that discussion, right? And today is kind of like the night where I think the gas tank of hope that gets filled at the beginning of every season for me, I think I hit empty. The night I think did it for me. The night where you got Wheeler on the bump against the Nationals after you get sweeped by the Mets,

having the season we're having, 25-32, with the differential we got in runs, it feels like we really are that 25-32 team, and I can't believe we're here. But tonight felt like that. And you got a bullpen game tomorrow, strong for two innings, like, great. But, I mean, we can't even win a series against the Nationals.

We're tied for last place in the division. What are we this year? I'm not going to have any expectations. Dylan, this is for you and for everyone out there listening. What are they good at? What is this team good at? Can you tell me one thing they're good at? That's the thing about the team.

In theory, you can. The approach that we are taking is that we can mash the ball we have a rotation that in the playoffs if you need three guys you can get you three wins we in theory would have had that marred by injuries yes but it's all falling apart without the bats working and you can see the entire kind of like house of cards falling down because you're just not seeing that production this year. And then you found that with a lot of unforced errors and mistakes that we're seeing that are yes, uncharacteristic from guys like Trey and some of the mistakes in the air we

saw tonight. It's, it's just one of those things where, you know, Ike said, you you just every time you plug a hole in the boat another hole spouts out and water leaks in and it just felt like one of those seasons from hell yeah i agree safe safe travels home buddy um and uh yeah it's just it it's it's just a it's a it's a downer downer yearer year. It's a massive disappointment, and it's just a bad year. And my one fear tonight, and I tease this heading into the break, my one fear, now it's already been a bad year, but my fear off of tonight,

and I know if you wanted to look at this glass half full, you could say, okay, they they came back they fought back and and they made it a tie game and ultimately they lost it late but if you're this team and you're going through the struggles that you've had and you do fight your way back into it um and you give it away late again. Eventually, those guys in that clubhouse, I think, are just going to throw their hands in the air, and they're going to be like, I guess we can't do anything this year.

Because I'm sure they felt that way with that loss tonight of like, are we going to get a break? Are we going to get one thing to go our way this year? And when you continue to lose games the way that they lost that game tonight, I just think that it does so much emotional damage in that clubhouse. I mean,

there was a really good article written by Alex Coffey before the game just about, like, there's a quote from Garrett Stubbs, and he's dropping F-bombs in it and saying, we've got to play better, and we can only get so many pats on the back before we've got to say, hey, what are we bleeping doing and stuff like that.

So when you battle back and you fight back and you lose again, and there's no jump start and jolt, it does emotional damage in the locker room. And that's my worry about tonight, is that they just say to themselves, is this it? Are we just going to lose and not get any breaks this year? I hope it's not the case. I hope they come out tomorrow and they fight.

But that was definitely something that I was thinking about. I'm sure there's a little bit of them like, man, we just can't get a break this year. It's maybe not our year. Hopefully tomorrow they can bounce back, but we'll see. 2-1-5-5-9-2. 94-94 is how

you get in. On the other side, we will look ahead to tomorrow before handing things off to Ryan Rossi. And all that's coming up next here on the Final Hour. Two balls, two strikes. The pitch to Thomas. Swing and a little blooper into left center field. On the run, Marsh. He won't get it.

It's a base hit. And the Nationals are back in front. 8-7 as the two-out walk comes home to score. Two-out walk. Stolen base. Lane Thomas. Bloop single. Fills lose.

Welcome on back. It is final out. Sponsored by Regency Furniture. Affordable. Never look so good. That was our play of the game, or Mike's amazing play of the game, presented by Mike's Amazing, the official mayo, mustard, and vegetable oil of the Phillies. And I think that if you wanted to point to a moment where it's like, that's when I stopped

believing, is that moment right there. For me, it was yesterday in New York. I know there's people that gave up hope a long time ago. But if you were holding out hope, and I will always hold out hope. Like I will, like I just, I'll watch, I'll believe, I'll root.

But objectively, like I don't see it happening. That's a moment you can point to and be like, I felt like it wasn't our year when Lane Thomas got a bleeder hit up the middle after he walked the nine hitter and he stole second base. To fight back the way they did and just suck us in, right? Like, just suck us in and say, don't give up on us yet. Because I felt it.

I'm sure you felt it out there. Like, okay, there's some fight. Now, it was sad because it's the Nationals. But, like, I would have rather they gotten blown out. Like, I would have rather lost 7-1 than then to go through all of that believe again and just give it away just give it away again there's just so much poor baseball and and not thinking baseball and you have the nine-hole hitter up. Can you just do your job?

Can anyone down there just do their jobs? Can my shortstop do their job? Can the leadoff hitter do his job? Can my ace do his job? Can the manager do his job? Can my bullpen pieces do their jobs? Can the guys I bring up from the minor leagues who are quad A, not even quad A,

Drew Wells is probably a double A player. Can he not get picked off early in the game? Like, just do your job. That's, it's the main message most nights, but again tonight, don't walk the 9-0 hitter with two outs. Don't let him steal second base, and you're not in the position to

face the top of the order, and you put yourself in the spot to have a bleeder falling against you, and you lose a game 8-7, thus deflating the locker room even more. We'll get to tomorrow in a second. But first, Brian is in Churchill. What's happening, Brian?

Jack, pleasure to speak. But I feel your pain, man. I mean, your rant and your thoughts on this team are spot on. I mean, what the heck? What the heck is going on? And not only, you know, we look at the bats,

you know, tonight they came back and all, and we all love Zach Wheeler. He's been a great signing. But dude, seriously? With that performance

against that team? Yeah. And it stinks. And I don't want to kill him. Well, yeah, because it was partially his fault. I mean, he let up a lot of base hits. He didn't miss many bats. But at the same time, there was awful defense too.

It was both sides, both sides of it. Yes, and I totally agree. And as much as the bats have been an issue this year, this team, and it's funny because we talked about it going into last season about defensively, this team stinks defensively. Wow. And the thing that is annoying is they really shouldn't. Like, Marsh should be a better defensive player.

He's misjudged balls seemingly a lot this year. Schwarber and Castellanos are bad. I mean, Schwarber is just... Last year, I felt like I didn't feel the Schwarber defensive problems like I felt them this year. Like, this year's Schwarber and left feels Hoskins in 18-ish. And for those of you that were around, for those of you that watched, Hoskins in left field in 18 was the worst thing I've seen put on –

I've seen a lot of bad Phillies. That was the worst. Cassianos, I think, has actually been decent in right field. Sosa's playing mostly every day. He's a good third baseman. Turner's been shockingly bad. Stosa's playing mostly every day. He's a good third baseman. Turner's been shockingly bad. Stott's really good. And Baum, I think, has been better than I thought he was going to be.

So there really shouldn't be, besides Schwarber and most nights, Castellanos. But it's not even defense. It's like little things on base running, pitch selection, at bats, some defensive miscues. They're just all around don't know what they're doing. There's just nothing good fundamentally what they're doing. And to your point, like what is – and we want to give Topper the benefit

of the doubt, but like what is he doing bringing Brogdon in in that situation? I mean, you know, I'm not a baseball guy or manager or whatever, but, like, that was stupid. It was something that, and I appreciate the call, Brian. To me, and he has done this a couple times this year, I don't like it. To me, they had him hot. They had him warmed up. And rather than, I can't use the term that it's usually used as,

but when you have him warmed up and then you sit him down, they basically count that as an outing. So I think he just put him out there. And he trusted him in a tie game. And I don't really know why. With Bob, there's been such a lack. I think the players have shown urgency. I think they are trying to figure this out.

And I like their quotes post-game. I know that words only matter so much. So it's not the end-all, post-game. I know that words only matter so much, so it's not the end-all be-all. But the manager has had too many lack of urgency moments for me recently when a season is spiraling. And I know when you're in that chair, you see the amount of games left, you can easily say, well, it's not really spiraling. I disagree. I just disagree. And in that spot, I know you don't want to have Connor Brogdon totally warmed up

and then sit him down and not pitch him. Sure. You don't want to get him hurt. Whatever. But these games against that opponent are too important to be putting him in that situation. He's been good this year, but it's been in more low leverage spots and when you're mostly losing games. That's a spot that Seranthony Dominguez has to be in that game. has to be in that game. He hasn't been overworked. He has pitched once this week, one time. Tonight was a spot where Sir Anthony had to be in that game, had to be in that game. It is a game that

you fought back in to make it a tie game that your guys showed heart and they showed hunger. Let them go win it. And he didn't do that tonight. Blake is in Narberth. What's happening, Blake? Hey, Jack. That was just another horrible, horrible loss by the Phillies. And it seems that I'm not as upset as I thought I would have been.

It's just like I saw that coming. And simply put, I really think the season's over. And I can try and break down what happened tonight, the bad defense, the bad pitching, the horrible offense. But I think it's just a bad baseball team at this moment. And one thing I wanted to talk about is I see a lot of people saying this is the same spot they were in last year. But there are a couple of key differences to me. Number one, there was no strike at the beginning of this year, so even though they were seven games under in early June, they played

a week less of games last season. They played six or seven more this season. Number two, they had a very tough schedule to start last year. This season, they lost early games to bad teams. The Reds, the Marlins, the Giants, now the Nationals. And finally,

the current team has a run differential of negative 46. That means they're not competitive in many of these games. The pitching's worse than last year, and the hitting's worse than last year when they had a run differential in the single-digit negatives. I don't know how they're going to turn this around, but what they say is Castellanos hits home runs when bad things happen. He hit two tonight. Personally, I think he marked the end of this team's season.

That's a good note. And maybe you're right. And I'm kind of at the point where I can't really see them turning it around. I don't know what they're good at. And I think if they are to turn it around, obviously the starters have to be better. They're not going anywhere with Trey Turner batting 235. They're just not.

Like, he's too important in that lineup. Without Reese Hoskins, he needed to be a difference maker. He hasn't been a difference maker. He's been killing them, actively killing them on a night in, night out basis. Tomorrow night, we got to do it again. And guess which idiot's going to be sitting there watching it? This idiot. He's going to be sitting there like a sucker.

I might as well put on a freaking clown costume and sit there and watch a bullpen game against the Nationals where Matt Straum can only give them two innings. Incredible. Very fun stuff. And because you had a bullpen game tomorrow, you couldn't have pulled Zach Wheeler early, which ended up being an extra run. The seventh run, which ended up coming back to bite them. So, yeah, everything is going well.

Everything is going well. Mackenzie Gore on the mound for the Nationals, a former top prospect that is kind of starting to right the ship for the Nationals. I mean, a couple years ago there was a lot of Kershaw comps to Mackenzie Gore, and just kind of flouted out a little bit.

He has like a 3-5 ERA this year. He's a 3-33 ERA in his last five starts, and in his last start against the Royals, 11 strikeouts in seven innings. So a lefty pitcher in a bullpen game against the Phillies. How's that make you feel? Doesn't make me feel great. Either way, we will be reacting to it all.

I'll be back on Monday. Ryan Rothstein's got you coming up next. Nick Gernshaw produced this portion of the program. Have a great rest of your night, or try to, and let's go get them tomorrow. This has been the final out, sponsored by Regency Furniture. Affordable never looks so good. Have a good rest of your night.