High Hopes: A Phillies Podcast - Final Out: What a Wicked Loss

Episode Date: May 6, 2023

Jack Fritz reacts to the Phillies' fifth-straight loss and criticizes the lineup that Rob Thomson trotted out against Chris Sale. To learn more about listener data and our privacy practices visit: https://www.audacyinc.com/privacy-policy Learn more about your ad choices. Visit https://podcastchoices.com/adchoices

Well, what a night in South Philly. Welcome on in. It is the final out sponsored by Regency Furniture. Affordable never looks so good. Brutal, tough, just uninspiring by the end. Lost by the Phillies tonight. And five straight losses. Like five straight losses when they got to two games over.500. They're back to three games under.500 now. And what really sucked about that, obviously,

there's a good amount of things that sucked about it, is that, again, the crowd early in the season has been so great. There was such a buzz in the building for Bryce's return. And what the start of the season has done is that it has had all the bad feelings of Phillies baseball over the last couple years all come creeping back. Whereas what happened in October and November last year sucked everyone right back in to where they felt like that's how the season was going to be. And I talked about this after the Dodgers sweep on Wednesday, where it was like, I felt like this season,

I was going to stop being annoyed at losses. I was going to stop treating every loss like an Eagles loss. And I would, I would just be like, okay, they lost, but it's not the end of the world. They're going to be fine. They have my benefit of the doubt. But what they've done since last Sunday night in Houston is that they've lost that benefit of the doubt. They've lost that benefit of the doubt. They have figured out ways to lose games rather than win games. They got bludgeoned in games one and two of the Dodgers series.

But they very easily could have won on Sunday night in Houston. They very easily could have won Wednesday against the Dodgers. And they very easily could have won tonight. And that's three games in a week that they found ways to lose rather than win. And when you're under 500 like they are now, that kind of stuff adds up,

and it's just incredibly, incredibly frustrating. 2-1-5, 5-9-2, 94-94 if you want to get in. You're leaving the complex, whether it's the Phils, whether it's the Sixers, just an overall disaster night. I mean, between Bryce returning and obviously Embiid getting his MVP and all the emotion that he showed pregame to go out and lay an egg like that. Like, it's just – it was an awful night. It was an awful, awful, awful freaking night.

And it's just – it's one of those classics. It's like, oh, this is what our parents talk about when they pass down Philly sports to us is a night like tonight. A night like tonight. Boston, one of our arch rivals, is in town in baseball and in basketball. And they just let us down. They just let us down. And it makes you feel like, why do I even do this?

Like, literally, that's – I know it's early in the season. I get it. It's like literally, that's, I know it's early in the season. I get it. It's only 15, 18. But it's just, it's so, so frustrating. 215, 592, 94, 94 if you want to get in. I got two main takeaways that I want to hit on in the open here from tonight's game. Number one is the lineup.

And to me, the game might as well have been lost when Marsh and Stott aren't in the lineup and it's just like I don't understand why this has to be so hard it's not this hard just set a lineup with guys that are your everyday players don't worry about lefty righty Don't worry about lefty-righty. Don't worry about a little matchup advantage. No matchup advantage, no analytic, no number is going to convince me

that Josh Harrison and Dalton freaking Guthrie should be in the lineup over Brandon Marsh and over Bryson Stott. I over Bryson Stott. I know Bryson Stott has been struggling for a little bit here. I know Marsh hasn't been as scorching hot. I even know Boehm.

Yes, the young kids have come back down to earth a little bit. But what are we doing here? What are we doing here? It is – Chris Sale was really good tonight. Ten strikeouts, one bad inning, and it looks back to being the good version of Chris Sale. But who cares? I mean, seriously, who freaking cares? Play Marsh and play Stott.

There is no matchup advantage to playing Harrison and playing Dalton Guthrie at this point in the season. You had off yesterday. There is no reason to sit there for two games. They're not tired, whatever. That was incredibly frustrating. Just incredibly frustrating. So the fact that Stott and Marsh wasn't in the lineup was very annoying.

And then we get to the top of the lineup. And I'm a Kyle Schwarber fan. I think he's a really, really important piece of this team. I think he is the emotional leader of this team. And I think that hopefully June comes along and hopefully they start getting into big games and he steps up, whatever. You can't have two strikeout guys,

two high strikeout guys batting one two you can't have it this is actually what cost you a world series last year like that's what cost you a world series is having two high strikeout guys batting one two that get later into the game with these nasty relievers with whose stuff is just amplified in the seventh eighth ninth inning who were easier to strike out two high strikeout guys. Did I know I was getting a high strikeout guy in Trey Turner? I had a feeling, but I didn't think he'd be this bad. And hopefully he can get right a month from now.

Hopefully he can get right and get this whole season back on track to where it's not a disaster, but not a freaking whatever. I don't want to have to deal with this year's version and Nick Cassidy-Onswell over again. Why do we put two high strikeout guys batting 1-2? Because late in the game, it just absolutely kills you. It kills you having two high strikeout guys batting 1-2. I don't get it.

And again, I feel like we're overthinking this thing. We're just overthinking it. You're trying to just look at the numbers and say to people, no, everything's fine. This is how it's going to work. He strikes fear in pitcher's eyes when he steps to the bat just because he looks at their home runs. You think they're really afraid of 185 right now? No, they're not afraid of that. And Trey Turner and Tucker gave me this stat before the show. 25 strikeouts with men on base this year.

25 strikeouts. Stop overthinking the lineup. Enough with the high strikeout guys batting 1-2 and enough with sitting Martian Stott against lefties. There's no need for it. You had

an off day yesterday. Tonight might as well have been a must win given that you just lost three straight and you're under 500 again. And you're sitting your two regulars. Why? Why? There's no explanation for it

other than you're worried about Chris Sale. You let Kyle Schwarber bat leadoff. You're letting Kyle Schwarber bat leadoff against Chris Sale. He can do it, but Bryson Stein and Brandon Marsh can't. Make that make sense. I can't. And my second big takeaway from tonight is that Zach Wheeler is not fully back yet. And that's honestly been one of the more crushing parts of this week is that Noble took a step back and Wheeler took a step back tonight.

He wasn't brutal. He was fine. But again, you know, his ERA is back over four now. And it just hasn't looked right. It just has not looked right and has not looked like the Zach Wheeler that we have been accustomed to kind of seeing here. And when you start to look at things that worry you for this summer and the team going forward, if Wheeler and Nola don't get right

and don't start helping you win ballgames rather than finding ways to help you lose ballgames, then it's going to be a long summer because I can't wait for you win ball games. Rather than finding ways to help you lose ball games. Then it's going to be a long summer. Because I can't wait for Ranger to get back. We'll see where Andrew Painter is. But this team is going nowhere. If those two guys don't start stepping up. It's as simple as that.

If those two guys don't start stepping up. And being the guys that we know they should be. Then this team is going absolutely freaking nowhere. They're going nowhere. So these guys have to figure it out. Because if they don't, then it's relying on Ranger. It's relying on Tywon Walker, Gulp. It's relying on Bailey Falter until Andrew Painter comes back.

It's relying on an offense that is struggling with runs and scoring position. And it's relying on the bullpen to keep games close so that hopefully the offense can pull that late. But if you don't have your 1-2, it makes this whole operation that much harder. 2-1-5, 5-9-2, 94-94. It's Jack Fritz here on the final. Now let's get to the player of the game. Brought to you by South Jersey Gas. Committed to providing safe, reliable,

affordable natural gas. Make the switch at southjerseygas.com slash lovemyhome. And it's got to be Chris Sale. Ten strikeouts tonight. Really only that one bad inning. And other than that, just neutralize the Phils. The Phillies tied the game up.

But the difference between Sale and Wheeler tonight was that Sale kept it 3-3. Wheeler didn't. And that ended up being the difference of the game. So Chris Sale was back to throwing like 99 again. His stuff looked pretty nasty. So

I kind of had that feeling pregame where I was like, this feels like one of those things where it's, Oh, Chris sales cooked. Well, wait, wait till he plays the fills. So, uh, just a frustrating night. And, and I think they're just making this whole thing harder than it has to be two one five, five, nine, two 94, 94. It's Jack Fritz here on the final out on the other side, we'll get to all of your phone calls, but also what my lineup would be. And frankly, I hope that Rob Thompson is listening on his drive home. It's the final out here on Sports Radio 94 WIP.

Welcome on back. It is the final out here on Sports Radio 94 WIP. Jack Fritz hanging out with you here on this Friday night. The final out, as always, is sponsored by Regency Furniture. Affordable, never looks so good. I'll get some thoughts on the lineup here in one second. Let's go to Jack in Egg Harbor Township. What's happening, Jack?

Yo, Jack. What's going on, brother? I tell you what, pretty bad night at the sports complex. Yeah, yeah, not enjoyable. I was at the game, so it was a pretty weary night. Not very fun. Nah. Listen, I'm starting to get some flashbacks of Joe Girardi here with this lineup.

Taking guys out, switching guys around. It's not how I enjoy to watch baseball. I like watching my guys play every night who are studs, you know, guys who should be in the lineup. Now, I'm not terribly uncomfortable with this whole season yet. I think if you can hang around 500 to the all-star break, I think you're all right. So I'm not totally out of the season yet,

but Rob Thompson has to play his starters every night. I don't want to watch Josh Harrison and Dalton Guthrie play baseball. I want to watch Bryson Stott, Brandon Marsh, guys who should be in the lineup. And they had a day off. I mean, they still had a day off, right? They had one day off. Now you're giving them a day off. I mean, they still had a day off, right? They had one day off. Now you're giving them two days off. It's just very unorganized to me,

and it gives me some wicked flashbacks of what Joe Girardi did with the lineup in the beginning of the year last year. Now, quick question and follow-up to that, Jack. Did you just say it gave you wicked flashbacks because you're around Boston fans all night, or is that just how you normally talk? What do you mean? I mean –

Wicked flashbacks. I've never heard – what are we saying, wicked flashbacks? We're not up in Boston. What, do you have one of the lobster rolls tonight down at the stadium? I mean, come on, man. We don't use the wicked around here. It's Joe Girardi, man. We don't use the wicked around here. It's Joe Girardi, man. I got wicked flashbacks to Joe Girardi.

Wicked, wicked. Wicked, yeah. It's wicked what Joe Girardi did with that lineup last year. I agree. That's the word I got for you tonight, wicked. All right. Listen, Boston fans, not only did they come down to South Philly and they got two wins both on the basketball court and the

baseball field, but I can't be having their terms being infiltrating the way that we talk, Tucker. I mean, you picked up what I was putting down there. I did pick it up. I don't think he necessarily did. I know. But, like, I've never heard someone from here say wicked in terms of like, you know, our teams. Yeah.

I try to refrain from using other cities, other cities slang. It was already a bad enough. It was already a bad enough night, Tucker. Like we now we can't have wicked be a part of our everyday vocab. That's just that's just me. So what I would do with the lineup and again like jack like the thoughts of the lineup are just there it's it does feel a little gerardi-ish and i hate to have to do that to rob thompson who was magical last year but part of what made it magical

last year was like trusting his guys and his guys. I watch them right now, and everything just feels like overthinking. It all feels like one big overthink, where it doesn't have to be. If your whole thing is, well, I'm worried about my lefties against Chris Sale, fine. Then why are you batting Kyle Schwarber leadoff? Answer me that. Why are you batting Kyle Schwarber leadoff if that's the case? I would take my chances with Bryson Stott. I would take

my chances with Brandon Marsh. Kyle Schwarber's batting 185. If Kyle Schwarber's batting 250, I would say you have a case, but he's not. That seems like an inconsistency from Rob Thompson. And it's just like, again, baseball, I love baseball. It's not the hardest game to figure out.

Like, it's just, it's not. It's simple. Just let the guys play who deserve to be playing. Brandon Marsh and Bryson Stott have earned the right to play every day. You had an off day yesterday. You don't need to give them two days in a row. Tonight was a must-win game. Like, for all intents and purposes, for May 5th,

yeah, that's a must-win game. Like, you've already lost four straight heading into tonight. You are already under 500 you're sitting with two guys for no reason so I'm just trying to give Rob Thompson some advice here and here's my lineup Stott, Turner, Harper, Castellanos, Schwarber, JT, Boehm, Marsh, Sosa. Just set it and forget it. Set it and forget it. And just see what happens.

I know that Bryson Stott has been struggling the last couple weeks. I get it. But the guy works a hell of a bit bad at the top of the lineup that forces pitchers to use a lot of their pitches that helps everyone else out in the lineup that forces pitchers to use a lot of their pitches that helps everyone else out in the lineup it's just not that hard it's not that hard just do it let's go to mike and westchester what's happening mike what's going on fritz uh first off on a night like tonight of all nights for that caller before me to bring up the word wicked is just a total violation. I mean, it felt totally wrong, right?

Like, I wasn't out of line to say, hey, what are we using wicked for? We don't say that in this situation. On a night like tonight of all nights against two Boston teams that ripped our hearts out, I mean, he should be banned from ever calling again if it was up to me. Well, listen, I'll forward it to Rod Lakin,

and we'll see what he thinks. We'll see what he thinks. What do you got in the game tonight, man? So, to me, the biggest issue is, and it was just an uninspiring loss, but to me the biggest issue is in the ninth inning, when your $300 million shortstop comes up, with a chance to tie or win the game, I feel like the game's over. I feel like he has no chance to hit Kenley Jansen, who's 40 years old.

I mean, he wasn't even close to touching him. And I still believe in him. I think he's game's over. I feel like he has no chance to hit Kenley Jansen, who's 40 years old. I mean, he wasn't even close to touching him. And I still believe in him. I think he's a great player. But, man, he's got to get it going a little bit for me at the top of the lineup here. What do you think on that? Well, what stinks about it, Mike, is that it feels like a lot of strikeouts, which is obvious. And, again, Tucker gave this before the show. 25 strikeouts to the man on base, which is unacceptable.

And, again, Tucker gave this before the show. 25 strikeouts to the man on base, which is unacceptable. It's annoying that it feels like he's just getting – anyone that throws 95-plus feels like they're getting a fastball by him right now. And then the one thing that I can't wrap my head around – well, there's two more things on Trey Turner – is that you don't have to swing at every first pitch. Take a deep breath. just take a deep breath. Like you have, you have three strikes for a reason.

It's been around for 150 years. Um, the, you know, the sport. And then even when he gets a first base, I feel like he's not looking to steal a bag where it's been the easiest to steal a base in 20 some years. Um, so I thought what, what Trey Turner is supposed to be is a guy that hits for a high average, hits for power. He has strikeout concerns.

That was always a problem when they signed him. But he would make up for it by getting on base and wreaking havoc. He's not wreaking any havoc on the base pass. And that's been concerning. It's almost like I want him to flip-flop his aggressiveness. I want him to be less aggressive at the plate but yet like i mean bigger bases the pitch clock everything he can fly like steal a couple bases get something going i i believe in him i'm not giving up on him

but he's got to pick it up for sure yeah mike and i appreciate the call and you know it's hard to completely just be like wow this guy's done whatever when you see what nick castellanos is doing this year like this might just be trey turner's castellanos year which is annoying i don't want to have to deal with that again um but that's the reality you know when these guys get this big money they come in with heightened expectations new city new environment and you know uh it just takes them a little while to adjust. And unfortunately, we might be having that with Trey Turner. And you just have to hope that as Bryce gets back and gets more comfortable, he's with Trey every day and actually playing with each other, you know, on the field, that he gets more comfortable and just kind of settles into a role.

But the fastballs being blown by him, swinging it seemingly every first pitch, that stuff's concerning. And I remember Bryce dealt with that his first year where it felt like fastballs were able to get by him, and it's something he's got to work on. But, man, it's just for a guy that's batting two and having your one-two guys right now being really, really high strikeout rate guys, that's concerning. 2-1-5, 5-9-2, 94-94.

On the other side, we'll run through all of your phone calls and look ahead to the rest of the series before handing things off to Sean Bell. It's Jack Fritz here on the Final Out on Sports Radio 94 WIP. Welcome on in. It is the Final Out. Sponsored by Regency Furniture. Affordable. Never looked so good. It's time for the Mike's Amazing Play of the Game

presented by Mike's Amazing, the official mayo, mustard, and vegetable oil. The Phillies did it, and for me, it's simple. First inning, you know, the Phillies could easily have the first out of the inning. Kyle Schwarber lets the ball, you know, clank off his glove, and he's on second base, and unfortunately

the scene happened out in the bullpen area. They eventually restarted the inning and that runner came around to score. When he loses a game 5-3, every run counts. It could have been easily avoidable if the ball just caught there in the first

inning. When a game is that close and when you are playing as shaky of a baseball as the way the Phillies are right now, every little thing matters. And, you know, it's just like lock in. You've lost four straight.

Someone's got to step up and make a play, and that was disappointing in the first. Jay is in Newtown Square. What's happening, Jay? Jack, we are an unserious baseball team with this lineup. Right now we are, 100%. You're a really good baseball historian. How many teams have won the World Series with a 180 leadoff hitter? Well, if those got close last year.

But hopefully it doesn't bat 180 all year. I feel like I just desperately want Todd Zielecki or somebody to ask Topper after one of the games, is there any objective threshold where we know this doesn't work? He's not hitting 250. He's not hitting 200. Is 50 enough? What's the marker where we know it's not working? Is there any marker where you know for sure it doesn't work.

And Jay, I mean, Rob talked pregame and he was basically like, we're going to ride this out and it eventually will make a switch. But right now they're not going to do it. They're not going to panic because this is what got them to game six of the world series last year. And my counter to that is like,

how about we just use our eyes and see that Bryce Stott gives you a better at-bat at the top of the lineup? Even if you wanted to put Trey Turner there again. Even if you put Trey back there, you put Stott two, you put Castellanos three, you put Harper four,

whatever. To have Schwarber there at this point, and I love Kyle Schwarber. I love Kyle Schwarber. But it's just such a damper. And I know he can hit home runs, but it's not like every home run last year was in the first inning. I mean, late in games, I'm sure there was also spots of runners on base that he could have done some damage with.

And it's just not happening. So, I bet, if I had to bet, and I know this is going to take patience and this is going to be something that we're going to have to have some intestinal fortitude for, is I think he's going to give them until mid-June

and if they don't figure it out, then they'll make a switch. Now, I think that's too long, and I don't know what the downside is to having Stott 1 and Schwarber 5, especially because before Bryce came back, I didn't think it was bad. I thought it was fine.

And they had a lot of hits. They need to work on runners in scoring position, but why can't Bryce be the guy that helps bring in runners in scoring position? It just doesn't make any sense to me, Jay, and it just feels like they're just overthinking this. To a certain degree, we needed a miracle to make the playoffs, and that's because of a super slow start.

We don't have to put ourselves in that position again, but we're electing to do it. We have a guy who's in the top three in hits in baseball. It's not that he's at the bottom of the lineup. He's not playing. He elected not to play someone with the top three hits so we could play someone who's hitting 180. What are you doing?

Well, it's not even just Schwarber. It's playing Josh Harrison over him, and I appreciate the call, Jay. And there's just no conclusion that you could come to that would tell me that playing Josh Harrison over Bryson Stotten, I gave this team a better chance to win. Or Dalton Guthrie over Brandon Marsh. Just play your studs. Like, we don't have to overthink this,

and that's what it feels like I'm watching ever since Bryce Harper came back. It feels like ever since Bryce Harper came back, it's one big overthink. Stott, Turner, Harper, Castellanos, Schwarber, JT, Boehm, Marsh, Sosa. I might go to bed tonight and if I'm struggling to fall asleep, I might say that lineup over and over in my head to help me fall asleep. Because it's

just that simple. As long as you do it. It just is. Johns and Hazleton, what's happening, John? You know, I knew the 11 games that they had after they beat Seattle in that two-out-of-three series were going to be bad. I predicted they'd win four at 8-11.

They might not even get there. They're playing good teams right now, and the way they're playing, they're not going to be good teams. You know, Dombrowski, so far, his big acquisitions this winter have been Kimbrel, who stinks, he's cooked. Walker, who I don't know why they gave him four years. I mean, I do think Turner's going to come around at some point, but so far has not been good.

There's a lot of flaws with this baseball team right now. I watch these games every night. I could see it. Like, you knew in the first inning with the era. You just know it. Like, what are we doing here? And here's the thing, and Jack, I could see it. You knew in the first inning what the era. You just know it. What are we doing here? And here's the thing, and Jack, I hate to say this. Boston's going 5-0

in Philly this weekend. I thought the only chance we had to get a win was tonight with Wheeler pitching. I really believe that. What do you think this Boston lineup is going to do with Bailey Falter? See, the Red Sox, they beat on bad pitchers. The Phillies don't. Sales had, what, a 6-7-5 ERA coming in tonight?

He pitched pretty damn well tonight against the Phillies. The guy tomorrow, Clover, whatever his name is, he's got a high ERA too. Watch him shut the Phillies lineup down tomorrow. Well, John, first of all, I don't think the city's standing on Monday if they go over 5 this weekend, so I would not appreciate that. But, yeah, I it was it was bad too because like probably around 5 30 as i was doing marks and reese and also thinking about final out i was like tonight is such a classic oh chris sales definitely cooked like the fills will hit

him around tonight oh wait bang there's 2018 chris sale back throwing like 99 with a wipeout slider and just destroying the fills except for one inning. It felt like a vintage performance. And one more quick thing with Topper. Look, I know they love him, the players I'm talking about. I know they like him. I don't know how much they respect him. And if he's going to keep throwing Schwarber out leading off,

like what is he doing? He cannot keep leading off. You have to get him out of there. He's batting 185. He's killing us right now. And was there ever a doubt that him and Turner were going to come out and strike out to end the game tonight? No, there wasn't, John, and I appreciate the call.

And, you know, Kelly Jansen going 3-2 slider there was a ballsy pitch, especially, you know, with the runners on base and whatnot. So, I mean, credit to him. I will say he got bailed on the 2-1 cutter that missed by at least six inches off the outside portion of the plate that would have made a 3-1 count, whatever. But, yeah, I think Trey Turner will turn it around. But I have zero faith in him in a big spot. And that's a very, very annoying place to be in

with a guy you just paid $300 million to. So fun times. Fun times down at Citizens Bank Park. But tomorrow, Foster versus Kluber, as John just mentioned. And let me just say this. If they get shut down by Corey Kluber, just cancel the

season. I mean, like obviously that's meant facetiously, but Corey Kluber is not a good pitcher anymore. Like Chris Sale, I'll give you the benefit of the doubt. You know, he had allowed one earn in his last start five before that and then one earned before that so um he was kind of on his way back

and just in watching him tonight just nasty you know i didn't feel like i was watching a a pitcher that was cooked um in in chris sale tonight cory kluber'skoff. And it's Billy Falter who, again, I know people don't like him. I just continue to believe that more often than not, he's going to give you a chance to win a ballgame. Now, the thing that has absolutely killed him is that he just has gotten absolutely no runner. He's got no run support all throughout the season. I don't know why I blanked there.

And that's kind of killed him. So hopefully tomorrow, I'm not asking for a lot. Again, I'm just a Phillies fan begging for a win. But if I could get five innings and less than three runs, I'll take that every single day of the week. So hopefully they can right the ship. And then we've got Tanner Howick versus Tywin Walker on Sunday. Awesome.

Actually, the more important start on Sunday is probably Ranger Suarez up in Lehigh Valley. He is anticipated to go 70 to 75 pitches. So hopefully he's healthy, feels good, and he can rejoin the rotation next week, thus moving Matt Strahm back to the bullpen, thus giving length to the bullpen and helping them out back there. But, man, what a disappointing Friday. And if you're driving home from Citizens Bank Park or driving home from the Wells Fargo Center,

Sean Bell is going to take all your calls, all of your reaction. Sixers get thrown into the mix with Sean coming up next. He can still react to the Phillies game. But that's going to do it for me here on the Final Out. And as always, the Final Out is sponsored by Regency Furniture. Affordable, never looks so good. That's going to do it for me. Sean Bell's got you next.

I'll be back Monday reacting to the Phillies weekend and all of that good stuff. Enjoy the rest of your weekend, and just don't let us down. Don't, like, lose tonight, whatever, bad Friday, win Saturday, take two on Sunday, and let's not have the whole city melting down on Monday. That's going to do it for me. Sean Bell's got you next here on Sports Radio 94 WI.