High Hopes: A Phillies Podcast - It's Time for the Phillies to Show Some Chutzpah

Episode Date: August 5, 2019

James and Jack discuss a disappointing home series vs. the White Sox, including the Roman Quinn game, Penvetta, and much more. See omnystudio.com/policies/listener for privacy information. To learn more about listener data and our privacy practices visit: https://www.audacyinc.com/privacy-policy Learn more about your ad choices. Visit https://podcastchoices.com/adchoices

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This is the High Hopes Podcast. High Hopes. It's a bunch of baseball nerds talking about the Philadelphia Phillies on Radio.com and Sports Radio 94 WIP. Yo, it is another edition of the High Hopes Podcast. Jack, we can't seem to do a positive High Hopes these days. We're trying. We don't get to do the happy shows anymore. Yeah, it's been fun.

Oh, man. Really enjoying Phillies baseball these days days on a weekend buddy oh listen i was in i was in boston uh for most of it so i caught uh like friday so friday night i was lucky you jack lucky you i uh friday night i was driving up to boston and uh thank god like i was obviously i felt bad for everyone involved but i was so glad the game went 15 innings because i was like i was like falling asleep with the wheel i was so tired and uh just being able to hear like it was so funny like you could hear in the announcer's voice like in france's voice or franski's voice it was basically like well this is a weird decision and it was just like it was just basically another extra two hours of like well this is a weird decision and it was just like it was just basically another extra two

hours of like well this seems weird i don't know it was it was uh it was very interesting um but it was just a uh yeah not not not a very fun weekend no well and it's a shame too because and we'll start with that game game one friday game one. But it's a shame because that could have been – if they had found a way to pull it out in the bottom of the 14th or miraculously in the bottom of the 15th, it would have gone down. And I don't think that it would have absolved people getting angry about the situation, but it would have gone down as one of the epic, fun Phillies wins in a really long time, Jack.

If they had found a way, if Velasquez's throw you know, I mean, what a play. If that had ended up getting the out that let them get to the bottom of the 14th and actually win that game and get a win for Roman Quinn as a pitcher in Major League Baseball, it would have been so great, Jack.

It would have been the Royals game all over again. It would have been Royals while playing. We would have been talking about it for years. No matter what happens, we would have talked about that game for years. Right. And instead, it's been melting down for three straight days about it because the offense can't get a big hit to save their freaking lives.

And we got a lot of Monday morning managers very upset about how Gabe managed Friday night. It's been a very fun couple days. All right. Well, let's dive into Friday night because that's certainly where the crux of a lot of people's issues have come in over the last few days. Look, I'm sure we're going to differ slightly on it. I think, look, anyone who doesn't blame the offense for putting up three runs over 15 innings over a dog-you-know-what White Sox pitching staff is is wrong I think there's no question you know

you blame the offense they have to do better so many opportunities with runners on base bases loaded what like twice in the first nine innings and coming away with nothing just unacceptable but having said that I still do blame Gabe Kepler for having to use a position player in the 14th inning I mean no and I know there are a lot position player in the 14th inning. I mean, no, and I know there are a lot of obstacles in the way and guys who can't go and Ranger Suarez isn't as tough as we thought Ranger Suarez was. And, you know, but, but I think the number one thing that he could have done, obviously we, you know, I think anyone would concede not having Velasquez throw a bullpen session before that game would have been a smart decision. And I know you can't foresee a 15 inning game coming, but I also have an issue from an organizational perspective that Zach Eflin is on the roster. If he can't go for you in that spot, why is Zach Eflin on the roster?

If he's in the frigging bullpen and you're in the 15th inning of a game and he's pitched two innings and he's done. And I know he's got injury issues and all that stuff, but I'm part of it because, in my opinion, whatever you have to do to make sure you have a pitcher left who can pitch five, six, seven innings for you, that's what you have to do. I don't care what it takes. That's what you have to do. But you seem to be a little less inclined

to really blame Kapler at all for the situation. No, I think he should have said to Vince, like, hey, we might need you tonight. We'll push your bullpen back. I don't know if he... I was thinking about, like, I wonder if he didn't want to do that because it would mess up the rhythm for Vince.

Like, Vince has been in a nice little groove here. Maybe just keep him on that same rhythm that he's been going with. And to see a 15-inning game happening, the small likelihood of it happening, of course it happens, so that kills that. So I wonder if from that standpoint they want to keep him on schedule as long as possible and try to keep his decent pitching, I guess.

I mean, is that where – is it decent? I mean, hey, I'll take what we can get these days, brother. I'll take this from Vince. But I just think it was one of those games where one in a thousand was what was happening during that game. It's just so hard to foresee that happening, and everything just seems so unlucky for him. He got so unlucky. Taking out Pavetta in the eighth inning with a bases loaded one out for a pinch hitter is an obvious move. It's 100% of the time.

If a manager doesn't do that, they should be fired on the spot. Right. And instead of them adding another insurance run and giving Juan Nicasio and Jose Alvarez, giving them a full inning with more than just one run to work with, it probably goes differently. In the ninth inning, Jose Alvarez, a simple ground ball to Michael Franco, but he's over on the shift and he can't get to third base. If Kingery's there, but they double switched him.

Everything that could have gone wrong on Friday night went wrong. I just think if a pitcher comes to you and says, hey, I'm feeling a little sore, we've had a lot of injuries, I don't feel comfortable going out there, you have to pull in there because guess what? If it comes out after the game that Zac Eflin came to Gabe and said, hey, I'm hurt, and then Zac Eflin gets more hurt during the game, then we're all destroying Gabe for that.

Ranger Suarez couldn't get warm. So to your point, if those guys aren't available in back-to-back days, and they have a lot of guys that aren't available in back-to-back days because they're starters turn relievers and going from a starter and being a reliever is just a way different story. If that's going to be the case, then you need to have more guys up here ready to go. You need to get Austin Davis back from Lehigh Valley

and make sure he's on the roster. Oh, God. I don't know. Where's Cole Irvin when you actually need him, right, Jack? Right. He could have been great. Honestly, Roman, Quinn, or Cole Irvin. Roman, Quinn, or Cole Irvin, who are you going with?

I don't know man i look i think you make some very good and fair points can i lay out the bad decisions that i thought sure yeah so what i thought were bad decisions was bottom 13th he should have let roman quinn steal and then bunt or whatever like 100 agree with you like not having roman quinn who who can just walk to second base basically at this point with how good he is at stealing bases like you take the guy getting to second there and then if you want to bunt him over then he can do it then and it takes out a double play it takes out all of that like and if you're gonna butt on there at least start him at least have him running so you can just automatically wipe out the double play like i thought that was

i thought that was ridiculous and then it. That was a horrendous decision, especially not to have him start running. The fact that you bump with Eflin and Eflin ends up on first base is basically a disaster in that situation. It is. 100%. And then he pulls Eflin for Vinny on second base.

It was that because he was injured and he knew he was pulling him anyway, so he might as well put Velasquez in there because he's a little bit faster or whatnot? See, but that's my issue, and I think that rationale is fair, but if you're going to pull him anyway, why don't you pull him before he goes up to bat? I know he's just bunting for you, but there is the possibility that he gets on base there. And why do you leave him in the game there if you're going to pull him out anyway? And wait until he gets to second.

I understand the idea of pinch running once he gets second base. Cause he could score on a single and all that, but like, why is he even running the bases then if he's hurt? Why is he even running the bases? Why is he on first base? Like it just, here's the thing. If it just makes the whole thing seem not real. Like it's like, if he really told you his tricep was tight, then why is he even bunting in

that shit why is he even stepping to the plate why are you not pinch running the moment he gets on first base it just doesn't jive you know what i mean but also but here's the contrary to that like what if he's the better bunner like what if he's a better bunner i thought about that i thought about that but then why don't you pinch run for him when he gets to first base that's the one you're taking him out of the game no matter what why aren't you pinching vinny's better runner anyway if there's a gap or whatever like why aren't you why yeah and also it doesn't jive with me and also like if if vince velasquez threw a pen and you don't want his arm to be hurting is it really the best idea to have him be playing left field and throwing 95 mile an hour bullets to home plate another great point

and look and obviously vinny out there was unreal and amazing and he could play defensively you feel like he could just step in and play left field today but um i'm with you i mean that to throw that distance in a high leverage situation like you do long toss but that's not firing a ball at top speed from the outfield i mean if there's anything that's going to hurt a pitcher's arm, like that's as likely as anything, Jack. Yeah. And man, I would keep Vinny Velasquez in the roster just to see him do dope things besides pitching. I know. I know. Well, if you think about it, the two best things he's done in the last whatever, since his 16 strikeout game have been the play in left field we just saw and that left-handed throw on the, you know, the infield grounder where he hurt we just saw and that left-handed throw on the you know the

infield grounder where he hurt his arm and tossed across left-handed those are the two number one vince velasquez plays that i remember and neither of them was pitching totally agree so so keep vince velasquez around for for doing dope things on a baseball field he's good at everything but pitching it's wild isn't he i mean he really was and then he makes that amazing catch i mean he's just uh he's super athletic and talented at stuff like that but and look i again i i the him throwing a brave out at home plate was one of the highlights of the season in terms of just pure baseball fun in having roman quinn on the hill and seeing that happen and as a baseball a lover of baseball i thought it was so cool in the moment that it happened and I was watching it, but that can't excuse the, the fact that in a tie game and look, Joe Giglio brought this up on the air today. I

thought it was a very good point last year. We saw the exact same thing happen here and it was Dave Roberts doing it and the Phillies ended up winning the game because of it. Shout out to Trevor Plouffe. doing it and the Phillies ended up winning the game because of it shout out to Trevor Plouffe but um I just think in this situation especially when it's frustrating because Jack again we've got a situation where this team is fun and funny enough as we talk in advance of the Diamondbacks game tonight late night baseball this week folks um in advance that they're still tied did play a playing game if the season ended today Jack oh to play a playing game. If the season ended at Ajax. Oh, dude. Play a playing game to get in. But it just feels, again, this is a series.

We said they have to sweep the White Sox, and they lost two of three. Yeah, they did not listen to the podcast when we said take two of three. No, no. You know what's so annoying, though? Honestly, I don't even want to live in a world where this exists, but the the parade that they're going to go on this front office andy mcphail matt klintzak and gabe and in a way is going to go on if they make the playoffs and patting themselves on the back

for having the quickest jack quickest turnaround my friend it there's nothing in the world that makes me more frustrated when they say that stuff. Because, like, dude, first off, it's the second wild card. You're going to win 84 games this year. And the cores of those other teams were Altuve, Bregman, Correa. The Cubs, it was Bryant, Rizzo, Baez. Like, legit superstars in the making. Meanwhile, we have Bryce who's, you know, would like him to start lifting the ball and, you know.

Would you? Would you? There was a... Jack, here's your update. There are 62 players in Major League Baseball as of right now that have hit more home runs than Bryce Hart for the season. There was a 10-minute period on Saturday where him and Freddy Galvis were tied for home runs.

I have never been more disgusted in my entire life. I loathe Freddie Galvis. He's only one behind right now, man. It's embarrassing. You need to start hitting him because Freddie keeps hitting him. It is embarrassing. I cannot believe he's not lifting the baseball. If you want me to really get on Bryce Harper,

let Freddie Galvis keep catching him in home runs, and that'll do it. That'll freaking do it. Yeah, I was wondering what the straw that would break the camel's back would be. As obviously in our last spot, I said I'm done defending Bryce. I've reached that point, and we couldn't get you there. No, but the closer that Freddie and we couldn't get you there no but this the closer that freddie gals continues to get to bryce and if he ever passes him they should just cut him on

the spot i mean dude he's got a 463 slugging percentage bad paul de young has the exact same slugging percentage as bryce freaking harper i't like that. I don't like that one bit. No. Here's a guy. How about this? Guess who has the exact same amount of home runs as Bryce Harper and a slugging percentage that is 20 points higher? Roberto Perez,

Jack. Roberto Perez? Roberto Perez has 18 homers and a 483 slugging. He actually, or excuse me, 19 homers. He has 18 homers and a 483 slugging. He actually, or excuse me, 19 homers. He has a 19 homers in 170 less plate appearances than Bryce Harper. Not great,

man. Yeah, but does he play a good right field? Derek Dietrich has 200 plusplus less played appearances, same amount of home runs. I mean, CJ Krohn has 100-plus, 130-plus less played appearances, same amount of home runs.

I mean, at what point do we start to have to say to Bryce, like, yo, man, I mean, there's 50-something, what, 57 games left in the season, Jack? Yeah. It's about time. It's way past time, man. I mean, there's 50-something. What, 57 games left in the season, Jack? Yeah. I think it's about time. It's way past time, brother. I just don't get it. That 0-6 on Friday night was as big and loud an 0-6 as I can remember.

It was. Just listening on the radio, I honestly, it was the first time I slammed something. I slammed my wheel. I was like, honestly, honestly honestly i was getting a little tired i i was i was starting to the eyes are starting to fade punchy yeah but then but then once bryce was continuing to be terrible on friday the the anger of clenching the the steering wheel got it out of me i was i was awake from that point on. The adrenaline. So Bryce is looking out for you even when he's not hitting.

It's just the worst. He needs to have his kids so he can not think about it. Yeah, look, even when Emily was pregnant, I was not struggling this much at my chosen fashion. The people would disagree. It's a good point, actually, Jack. What was that? You have no idea if you were doing well or not. That's a good point actually jack what was that i mean you have no idea you have no idea if you're doing well or not you know it's a good point i could always just be terrible and it doesn't

really matter there you go see isn't that nice all right saturday and we have a uh some headlines that we've buried we'll get to sunday and what happened on sunday aside from the game in a minute but saturday jack i mean we could talk about a lot of things on Saturday, but I feel like we're, what, 15, 12, 15 minutes into this podcast so far. Just pen veta, go. I mean, you guys all doubted me. You openly mocked me when I said he's a top 10 reliever in baseball. Yeah, top 10 reliever in the sport. I feel good about mocking you for that.

You openly mocked me, I said he's a top 10 reliever in baseball. Yeah, top 10 reliever in the sport. I feel good about mocking you for that. You openly mocked me, went on a Twitter crusade about how much of a joke your podcast partner is for saying that Nick Pavetta is a top 10 reliever in baseball. Oh, I did that? Or did everyone who listened to the podcast do that? I don't remember. Listen, if you're not first to a take, you're last. I am very first to this one. You are certainly first. only i think you're alone so it's good um but listen man i love the emotion i love the i love the fired upness i love

how much he cares like that one of the thing that one of the things we were worried about when he went to the bullpen was just checking out and emotionally checking out not fully being invested in the team and whatnot. And it's been the direct opposite of that. Like he's gone out there and I feel like he's kind of taking pride in, in closing out ball games. And I think the thing that's great about Nick right now is he can go, he can go multiple innings. Like he,

he said, I think it was after Saturday or maybe it was Friday. No, it's probably Saturday. After Saturday's game, he's like, yeah, my arm is a rubber arm. I have no problem going back to back days. Like I can just go. That's what. No, it's probably Saturday. After Saturday's game, he's like, yeah, my arm is a rubber arm.

I have no problem going back-to-back days. I can just go. That's what I've always been able to do. I've always just been able to go. And if you have a guy that can come in and do what he's doing right now and give you – if you can have Neres in the ninth and with all the injuries that have happened, like Tommy Hunter, David Robertson, Neshek, getting the ball to Neres is a struggle.

But if Pavetta can take down the seventh or eighth inning or seventh and eighth inning and get the ball to Neres, like maybe they can salvage us a little bit. But like, I don't know. My main takeaway from Pavetta this weekend was like, imagine thinking DFAing this guy was a good idea or like moving on from this guy was a good idea or moving on from this guy was a good idea. You don't give up on an arm like that.

And if he wasn't good, it would have been on the organization and not Nick Pavetta. Because if he went to the Astros, like we saw with Aaron Sanchez. Yeah, I was just about to say, look at Aaron Sanchez. Look at Aaron Sanchez.

If he went to the Astros, dude, he would be a star almost immediately. Smart teams figure out how to make Nick Pavetta into a weapon. And it didn't work as a starter. So far, it's looked pretty good as a reliever. He struck out 15 in 11 innings and only walked two. That is massive. You can have a guy coming out of the bullpen not walking guys

and striking out a ton of guys. That's allowed for the Phillies. I don't know if they knew that, but you're allowed to do that as a bull coming out of the bullpen and not walking guys and striking out a ton of guys. That's allowed for the Phillies. I don't know if they knew that, but you're allowed to do that as a bullpen member of the Phillies. I love the emotion. I love the hypeness. I love the feels like he wants to win it for his guys. I just

love having him out there. I think it's a legit weapon. The staff is fine. Smiley, I think, only made one bad pitch like I think he pitched well on Sunday and unfortunately one pitch was an absolute disaster but I think Smiley's fine I think Vargas is fine Nola's obviously Nola

the staff is kind of right itself a little bit you're not taking Arrieta out of it if Vince can give you five and less than three runs like that's a freaking win if you can use Pavetta in that role it just lengthens out the entire thing so uh i am gushing about nick pivetta if i liked it i like that everyone's calling him pen veta i feel i feel like a proud dad um it's good and i think that i think i really

do think that even the people that were like oh this guy sucks whatever see him in the bullpen and are like oh this is what they meant like you know what I mean? If you don't think Nick Pavetta has ridiculous talent and whatnot, then you just don't know what you're watching. That's about as simple as I can put it. You just don't know what you're watching. You should probably never watch it again. You should probably never be on Twitter tweeting at me. He is

a really talented pitcher that looks like the bullpen may be the best route for him. That's what I was going to say. I think that he's a reliever. He's route for him. So that's what I was going to say. I think that he's a reliever and he's meant for this. He's built for this. You can see it, like you said, especially if that's the way he feels about his arm and he can go, if it's like a rubber arm type thing. I mean, a guy like that, it can give you two, sometimes three in a pinch. That type of guy is so incredibly valuable if they can be dominant.

And you just see it with the stuff. I mean, the stuff just plays so much better when he's coming in all fired up and just able to throw as hard as he can for as long as he's in. He's just a different pitcher. He looks different. The attitude looks different. I love how you casually just slid in there. The staff is fine, which I thought was impressive. Yeah, I mean, I'm basically on the meme i'm the uh

everything's on fire meme right now just sip your sip and tea and and it's all good everything's fine but everything's fine everything's fine here's the thing though and it's funny because as you're talking about beveta and it got me thinking i think one uh two takes on beveta one he should never be a starter again i know starters are more valuable and i know that if you have a guy like i'm sure the brewers if josh hater if they think he could be a starter again. I know starters are more valuable. And I know that if you have a guy like I'm sure the Brewers, if Josh Hader, if they think he could be a starter, they'll still turn him into a starter. And that can work. But when you have a guy who looks like he can, and I joke with you about how quickly you say it, but Nick Pavetta could be a top 10 reliever in baseball. And certainly over time, really be a top 10 reliever in baseball and certainly over time really be a top 10 reliever in baseball with the ability to go multiple innings, the ability to pitch as many nights as it seems like he can.

But how about this for a take? Like when you really think about this team and I think that on the way you could argue, look, the offense needs to be better. That's the number one thing that's going to propel this team. But you could argue Nick Pavetta is the most important pitcher on this team moving forward in terms of ability to affect multiple different games in a lot of different ways there it is it all comes back full circle and i was right um i would just like to i would like to simply point out an absolute fact that is undisputable. At one point, Mariano Rivera also went three innings at a time.

Of course he did. That's how we all found out about Mo. Also had a rubber arm. Oh, God. I didn't even see what you were doing until I bit into it. Oh, God. That's good. And let me just throw one more absolute fact nugget out there for you um josh hater also has home run problems um and pivetta only allowed two so

everything is great everything is great minus the phillies all right moving on does anything else from saturday i don't think you know obviously Aaron Nola's awesome Pen Veta I mean the Nola for seven Pen Veta for two is something I could get used to that's a plan to win a World Series right there can we do it every night is that a thing we'll try

anything else on Saturday yeah I got a bit of a take and it is it's not going to sit well with you I'm just letting you know I can't wait for this then I think Andrew Knapp calls a better game than JT Romita

wait whoa whoa whoa you think he calls a better game than JT Romita they are Andrew Knapp calls a good game he does I was watching the game plan on Saturday night and I was like What is wrong with you? Andrew Knapp calls a good game. Oh, God. He does. I was watching the game plan on Saturday night, and I was like,

this is what I've been wanting from Nola. I was going in lockstep with what Andrew Knapp was putting on. Is this me thinking that I'm as smart as a major league catcher? Yes. But I'm just saying that me and Andrew Knapp were in lockstep when we were dissecting the Chicago White Sox vaunted offense. I don't even know if we can continue to do this podcast. I'm so hurt, Jack.

He does not call a better game. He does not call a better game than JT Romito, but I think he calls a good game, and I like his game plans. And that's why he's still here. Oh, man. Knappy! He calls a good game and i like his game plans and that's why he's still here oh man nappy he calls a good game man i'm telling you i was watching it and it was feeling right now but it is nice with nola like nola's kind of got to the point now where um i think he has good feel for all his pitches so like saturday night there was multiple times where well there was one time

that really stood out to me. And that was, it was, I don't know, the third inning or whatever. And it was a one, two count. And he threw a curve ball way out of the zone, like way out of the zone and whatnot.

The batter just spit on it. And in my head, I was like, he should just throw it again because he's not thinking curve ball here. He just saw that Aaron Nola threw a pitch way out of the zone. Like, why would he come back with a curve ball? And Nola came right back with a curveball in the zone

and didn't even swing at it. It was just like, oh, well, he got me. And it was that kind of stuff that I saw. And I was like, that's really good, solid pitching. His fastball location was just pinpoint, mixing the change up, had a good dive to it. So Nola, listen, we've said he's been back a lot, but I just think that

Saturday was the best that I've seen of him. Ability to sequence and go curveball, then go back to a curveball, throw a fastball out of the zone, and then throw a fastball in the zone and keep hitters just off balance the whole entire night. So, I thought it was a really, really good

Aaron Nola start. I think he probably just called his own game. He probably just shook Nap off and threw whatever he wanted to throw.ola start. I think he probably just called his own game. He probably just shook Nap off and threw whatever he wanted to throw. I disagree. I didn't see him shake it off once. I think that's what happened, Jack. I think he actually said, Andrew, you are the best catcher I've ever seen. God, what are you doing to me?

I give Penn Veta compliments and you just crap all over me. Well, you can't deny facts right in front of you with Penn Veta. All right, let's move on uh we'll get to the embarrassment on the field on sunday but let's let's get to it jack we're deep into this podcast how do you feel about mike kel island officially sinking to the bottom of the ocean it was like it's like one final blow to mike alfaro's like, well, we bench you all the time. I love, like, literally the number one tweet was just, wow. Everyone just tweeted, wow. It was crazy.

It was very unexpected. When you think about it, Michael Franco has been here for, like, six years. Like, Michael Franco has been on this team forever. And for him just to be back in AAA a like am i gonna be watching michael franco like iron pig like highlights it's weird it's just weird it's weird that michael franco is no longer here anymore um uh gelb i think wrote wrote this morning or last night like they didn't seriously pursue josh donaldson or mike mustakis offseason which infuriated me all over again because didn't did anyone say they should go after mike mustakis offseason which infuriated me all over again because it didn't did anyone say they

should go after mike mustakis i don't i didn't think anyone said that i don't know i was also told that michael franco is the same player as mike mustakis player they're the same guy so one triple a one was an all-star this year same thing um um like but it's so the franco thing is is again like the the player development like all like major league player development is just lacking like michael franco has legit talent like legit talent to to be a good major league player like be he's supposed to be the the the third base franchise third baseman um after like Pedro Feliz and whatnot. And plus he don't belong. Like he was supposed to be the guy that was going to help anchor the next generation of Phillies baseball.

And for him to be back in triple a at 27, 28, like that's, that's for as bad as it is for Franco. It's also a horrible look for the organization. Yeah, it really is. I mean,

he was the next great Philly. Remember that time where like, it was like Mike Kelp Franco? That's the future. That's the guy. And certainly was not. And look, I think it is absolutely a player development failure. Like you said, there's no other way to put it. This guy had whether he's ballooned up a little bit, he's not quite as slight as he used to be, but there's still talent there. And he certainly used to have the talent to be a good Major League Baseball player. And they just didn't develop it at all.

He's the exact same player he's always been. The flaws that he's always had, they're still freaking there. And maybe it is possible that Franco can just never be fixed. But I certainly wouldn't have been shocked if he went somewhere else and got it fixed because this team has had real issues in that department. And I'm, I, I, I really a hundred percent agree with you. And I've ripped Franco like crazy for years, but ultimately a large portion of it has to fall in the organization. And again, for an organization that is really lacked in terms of player development. I mean, their head coach, their manager is a guy who is supposed to be a player development guy even.

I mean, they have, and they just have failed player after player after player. It's the reason why they've been so bad for so long and why it's still, even when they're starting to quote unquote compete again we still don't feel great about it like i'm trying to think i'm trying to think of the last like really highly touted like top five prospect in baseball that was just horrible and and the answer is don brown yeah no yeah it is i mean there have been a few others who have not come close to reaching. Matt Wieters is a guy who was a number one prospect. Yeah, they're guys. But someone who came up, flashed, and then literally was never heard from again? No. It's great.

But he's a Philly. Yep. When I watch the Phillies right now, and when I've watched them for a little while now, it just always feels like there's something off like there's just something off and I do think like recently actually I've been encouraged by um some of the pitching guys they brought in like bringing in Smiley and telling him to throw cutters is interesting and it's a it's a it's it shows that they are paying attention and that kind of stuff. I think that's good.

They told Blake Parkle, like, hey, your split is really good. Throw that more often. They're doing stuff like that, which is what you hear about from smart teams, like the Astros, and I think that is a Chris Young thing. But the hitting stuff at the major league level, everyone that's come here has just either stayed the same or gotten slightly worse. And the only player who's gotten better this year,

and he's plateaued a little bit, but it was Kingery, and Kingery was doing the exact opposite of what they were teaching him to do. So having O-Chart here is awesome. I've been really impressed with what the young guys are doing in the system. The young hitters,

the guys that were maybe struggling and weren't great, it feels like they're starting to take a nice step forwards but like the pitching down there is is is horrible like i don't know what the development is and that's where i come back to like it's year four of clint sack like it's year four and it's still they still feel like a dumb team that's trying to play smart and it's just it's it's pretty frustrating i i don't i don't know where i'm at with this team something feels off yeah and it's funny it's it's pretty frustrating i i don't i don't know where i'm at with this team something feels off yeah and it's funny because that's like kind of a on a that's on a macro

scale but on a micro scale it's like a microcosm of this season you know it's like other than the first week of this season something has just felt off and they are competing again they're right there for the wild card they're not competing they're not i mean you're right competing for a wild card i should say they are not competing for a world series that is fair um but i mean that's the thing is though like it's it's it's you know they just feel bad they feel like a bad baseball team on a night-to-night basis and you wake up every morning it's like oh we're still in the wild card it's like it really makes it hard to evaluate and it almost brings up a thing where and and look my answer to it is i want them to make the playoffs just because as we've talked about i think it's important for the players the reps and all that but i bet you there are going

to be phillies fans who are going to say i don't want them to make the playoffs because i don't want capler back i don't want clintac to think he did things right like all that and while i don't feel that way i can't kill them for it like i don't think it'sac to think he did things right like all that and while i don't feel that way i can't kill them for it like i don't think it's a crazy way to think which is crazy i mean i i don't think it's crazy like it's gonna the most frustrating thing is that if they make the playoffs it's going to give them some kind of self-satisfaction that they that they did this they built this playoff team or whatever it's like it's i'm already dreading their their pat on the back parade around broad street for their for their 83 win baseball team that's that they invested like

that loses like five nothing in a playing game or whatever. It's like, yay. No, I know. Juan Nicasio gives up three runs in the seventh after Aaron Nola goes six and two-thirds and pitches well. Nicasio, I mean, doesn't that just feel like the type of thing that'll happen if they get to a wildcard game? It does. And the offense won't score any runs

and that'll be it. And don't even mention that. What if Nola has to start the last game of the season just to get them in the playoffs? Yeah, absolutely. And then you're starting Drew Smileyly really yeah think about how just as a baseball fan for your team to make the playoffs for the first time in seven eight years eight years and to roll out jason vargas in a playing game like i'd be embarrassed as if and look i

mean you know baseball's weird You never know what happens with stuff but It's embarrassing to think about that And there's I'll keep coming back to this Like I want to love the Phillies I want to love This team I just they're All I want to just be engulfed In a fun baseball team

And I want to have a smart baseball team I want to see a team Like take a shot on a guy Like I want to be I want to be like the Astros Where if you trade a guy to their team it's like It's like oh well he's going to have a smart baseball team. I want to see a team take a shot on a guy. I want to be like the Astros, where if you trade a guy to their team, it's like, oh, well, he's going to be a stud. Why can't the team... Oh, we'll fix him. Oh, we'll fix him.

He's going to be awesome here. Yes. I want to be that team. Oh, my God. I want to be a smart team. I want to be a team that is on the forefront of freaking baseball. And the fact that for four years,

and we're in the same... We're pretty much in the same spot with, except we have Bryce Harper, Dean Segura and JT Romulo. Now like it's a better baseball team, but like no one has gotten, no one has taken a step forward. None of that has happened.

Nola for the most part of the season was bad. And then he figured it out. Like talented guys like Pavetta have never gotten better. Talented guys like Vince Velasquez have never gotten better. I just feel like a crazy person. There's something wrong. There's just something wrong. And I've said it before, I'll say it again.

I will not sleep until I have a smart baseball team. And I cannot believe that they are as just unwatchable as they have been. The Chicago series should never happen. Should never happen. That team stinks, man. I can name like six players in that team. They got shut down in extra innings by Carson Fulmer, who's a huge bust. Like a giant, enormous bust.

And not even competitive at bats. And for Gabe to come out and say, oh, you know, he's scratching Claude and stuff. It's like, dude, dude, dude, your offense in extra innings got like one hit. It was toned down. You struck out like 16 times. It's a whole different thing. But you know that I can't listen to Gabe at the end of games anymore. It just is so.

And I don't need him to rip his players as we've talked about. But I just need him to be a little bit more real. I mean, that just is weak sauce. and you look at talking about no one improving no one and then you look over like the team like the braves and ronald acuna is gonna go you know like 35 35 this year like a 900 ops improvements all the time 21 it's like awesome i just hope that i hope they don't i hope they don't wait i hope they don't waste Bryce Harper. Wow. So far, Bryce Harper is helping to waste Bryce Harper too, Jack. Yeah, but I don't know if it's all Bryce. I'm with you.

Look, Bryce might be worse because of the Phillies. If Bryce Harper is on a smart team, I don't think he's having the same season that he's having. You're probably right about that. I think they're able to figure it out more. If he's on the Dodgers, man, I'm telling you, if he's on the Dodgers or Astros or one of those teams, he is having a way, way, way

better season. I'm just so frustrated with how dumb this team is sometimes. Yeah, I don't blame you. I think a lot of people are. We didn't really talk about Sunday. There's really not much to... If you have any specific things you want to harp on, but my just... I mean, to come out in that game when you know you

needed to win the series against the freaking Chicago White Sox and to get boat raced, it was just embarrassing again. This team so many times comes out in games where a good baseball team wins that game 99.9% of the time, and I feel like they always lose those games. Well, maybe they shouldn't have sent down one of the friendliest guys in that locker room before the game and a guy who's been there for six years and is a teammate favorite. And everyone loves that guy in that locker room.

Maybe you shouldn't have sent him down and just ruined that. I feel like that was like a ruined relationship. I feel like the clubhouse was like, why are you sending down Mikel? Yeah, I think you're probably right about that. I just think that they were like, really? I mean, obviously he's not very good but like everyone in that locker room loves that guy like that's true i didn't even i i didn't think about that perspective as well it's a great point jack i mean he's out there celebrating the first guy out there he's got the handshakes everyone i mean they they like his attitude they him. It's a good point, Jack. For a very minor benefit.

Look, I'm ready to throw Franco out with the trash as far as I'm concerned as a Philly. I'm good never seeing Franco play for the Phillies. But from that perspective, for the marginal, marginal upgrade that is Brad Miller or Sean Rodriguez, that's a good point. Or maybe they were really upset that Cliff Lee wasn't there. I think it's ridiculous that Cliff Lee wasn't there. I think it's ridiculous. I think it's ridiculous that Cliff Lee wasn't there.

I just think... For the 09 thing, I know. It's like, what's the point? Why even have it? He's the only reason that team was in the World Series. Yes, absolutely. When you think 2009 Phillies, you think Cliff Lee. That's it.

Well, it's not even... You think Raul earlier in the year. There's stuff you think of, but you really think of Cliff Lee. Well, it's not the Phillies' fault. I'm not ripping the Phillies. It's Cliff. No, no's not even... You think Raul earlier in the year? You know, there's stuff you think of, but you really think of Cliff Lee. Well, it's not the Phillies' fault. I'm not ripping the Phillies. It's Cliff. No, no, no, no, no. I know.

I know. I'm with you on that. It's Cliff's fault. Cliff doesn't like people, I think. Well, it's just like, dude, suck it up. Like, don't say you had a prior engagement when you knew that they were going to do this. I just...

It's just... I love Cliff Lee. He's my favorite pitcher here. Well, no, he wasn't. Rowe is my favorite pitcher, but Cliff Lee was up there, and he was an absolute legend icon in this town. And for him to just be like, whatever,

I just think it was stupid. And I just like, what's the point of the own on reunion? And if, if Cliff Lee is not going to be there, I just, it lost all its luster for me. Yeah,

I agree. Also, why are we, why are we, why are we having that reunion anyway? They lost in the World Series. Well, that was my whole point. It's the same team.

Do we really? Like, I get it with the 93 fills. That was a beloved team that, you know, hadn't gone to the World Series in a long time and wouldn't go back for a long time. And, you know, I get it. I got that. And it came out of nowhere.

We're the worst team in baseball in 92 and then went to the World Series in 93. Like, I get that. But the 0-9 team was a failure. I mean, they won in 0-8 and they didn't win back-to-back. They lost the Yankees in the World Series. Like, why are we...

What's the point of celebrating that? Like, especially because a lot of the guys were on the 0-8 team that we celebrate. It just felt weird. I'm very with you. Like, celebrating the 0-9 team really did little for me in terms of getting the emotions going.

Jack, big week, though, ahead ahead it's a west coast week which is annoying for all of us we all have to stay up late and all that but um you know two teams that you know you wouldn't expect to be there both teams are two and a half games back three against diamondbacks three against the giants and it's a spot where look they took two or three from the giants here but this is the type of spot where you need to be able to go win these series. You need to take two or three and you need to take three or four. You have to. And I know they suck on the West Coast. And I know that this is not a team that's particularly good on the road or that I should have any faith in that they're actually going to do it. But look, and again, a playoff team is a loose term because it's the second wildcard. But if they're going to be a playoff team,

they need to win these series. They also have to take two or three or sweep the White Sox. And you're right. You're right. They're a playoff team. You're right. You know what sucks, man? You have the 0-9 reunion.

There should be a ton of people there. There's 31,000 people there, and they lost again. You have the Marlins game, which was the Chase Utley night. They lose that game. They blow all these things. They blow blow every big night they have no idea how to they have no idea how to rise to a moment like at all we've talked about it with all their bed like it seems like whenever there's a big series they crap the bed it's just whenever it matters which which is probably a not a great sign for if they actually do make a wild card game or the

playoffs or whatever i would just this is just fun i would just like to see you know maybe maybe fight fear manager one time if you if you really like playing for gabe capler just i don't know if they do i don't know if they do why they never fight for the guy ultimately no one knows like no one knows if he's lost that locker room like people say that all the time but i have no idea if he's lost that locker room like i think you could tell by the end of Chip that he lost the locker room. No question. I don't have that same kind of sense here, but

on the other hand, it's like, hey, how would you fight for the guy one time? How about one player come out and say, I love playing for Gabe. Gabe's our guy. Same thing happened to Doug. The guys came out and said, we love playing for Doug. And then they won four straight guys came out and said, we love playing for Doug.

And then they won four straight games for him. Yeah. I mean, potentially save his job. In his first year? 2016, I'm talking about. Well, he lost the Ravens game, so it wasn't four straight. Oh, it was four or five or whatever. But the point was they went out, and that Ravens game they lost on the last,

but they could have won it if they hadn't gone for two, just because why not, you know? Because it didn't matter. But that's the point. I do think that that is a fair question is why – look, these guys aren't idiots. They live in this city. They hear the criticism that's hurled at Gabe, and I'm sure on one level maybe they should be grateful because he's taking a lot of criticism away from them, criticism that in a lot of cases should be on them. And people are criticizing Gabe instead instead but they're not idiots they know that this guy's how this guy is viewed in this city

they know that in theory his job is on the line through the rest of the season depending on what happens and it doesn't feel like they're fighting hard for him either on or off the field and that's a worry it is a worry i mean you you'd think, I don't know, like if you think if they like playing for the guy and they loved how much, like you would think that with the amount that he defends them to the media, that they would come out and say, I appreciate that or something.

I mean, he comes out and just waxes poetically about how hard they play. And then they come out and don't play inspired baseball the next night. Like it's, it's, it's there again. And I,

I like Gabe. And here's the thing. Here's my thing with Gabe is I think tactically. And I think baseball wise, I, I align with how Gabe thinks. Like I don't, like,

I think his decisions are rooted in, in philosophies that I think his decisions are rooted in philosophies that I think make sense. There's not many things that I see during a game where I'm like, that doesn't feel right. But what feels wrong with Gabe is the players, the emotion, the

grinding it out. And I know he says they grind it out, but they don't actually grind it out. Like the will to win and all that stuff like it just never looks like there's any energy or buzz or fun or whatever and i think like instilling that kind of culture and and and whatnot like i just i still think that that could be the reflection on a manager and i i just they're they need to they need to show something. If you're not going to make the playoffs, show something. Just show something these last 50-some games that you care,

that you want to play for the guy, and you want to keep him around. Because if they just limp past the finish line, I don't think you can bring him back. I really don't. Oh, he's fired. If they limp to the end, let's say they miss the playoffs by three games or something like that, gone. He's gone.

He's gone. If they play like this, and it's the same thing every single night there's there's just no way there's no way that john middleton is happy there's just no way that guy's happy yeah and and look he shouldn't be and granted we think that you know he shouldn't be to the point where he goes out and spends more money and does all kinds of things like that but um he shouldn't be happy and gabe is in the second year of a three-year deal like he's not going to be a lame duck manager next year either they're making the playoffs or they're showing some chutzpah and they're going to give him an extension

or he's gone like that's the way it's going to play out yeah right i mean like but again i just don't what did you say what do you say showing some chutzpah? Chutzpah. What is that? You don't know what chutzpah is, Jack? No, I don't know what chutzpah is. Oh, Jack. What is chutzpah? Chutzpah is Yiddish, my friend. Yeah, why? It means some gumption, some fire, some excitement.

They got to show some chutzpah. Chutzpah? Some chutzpah, Jack. Oh, I've never heard that in my life. Get out of here. I'm so confused. I was like, did you- Part of the popular vernacular. I think most people say chutzpah jack oh i've never heard that in my life get out of here i'm so confused i was like did you popular vernacular i think most people say show me some chutzpah show me some chutzpah jack okay maybe i'll name that maybe i'll name that this podcast show me some look up how to spell it because i guarantee you don't spell it right if you just go with chutzpah there's a c on

the front it's a ch for chutzpah you would never think that it's like chutzpah it's like high in bloom that's yes yes jack it is like high in bloom that is exactly what it is well done sir hey no problem we're learning i mean ever since you forced me to spend 21 dollars on a ruben i've i've been feeling a little bit forced is a strong word there suggested and it did not remember how expensive those rubens were but you know what it's always worth it for a ruben i sure did figure it out though thanks you sure did buddy hey you know what can i do what can i do i'm just trying to get you to eat rubens because you love rubens i'm just trying to help you out jack do you love a good ruben

you're darn right about that beautiful things thing. I also like breakfast, lunch, and dinner. All right. All right. No bag time. You got a train to catch. Yeah, I do have a train to catch. Actually, real quick. August 17th. Pin tweets.

Come to the ballpark and hang out with us. It's going to be awesome. High hopes night. And rate and review the podcast. No bag. Is it still high hopes night or is it just like, yeah, here we are. It's hang out with Jack and James night. How about that? It's hang out and Jack and James Knight. How about that?

It's hang out and let's drink and talk about how horrible we feel about this Phillies baseball team. Yes. That's perfect. I'm down for a good, some drunk rants about the Phillies. Yeah. Well, Manny Machado is white hot now, so I'm sure he'll come in and have a great game. Oh, yeah. And then I'll add pain of all of it.

Yeah. He will. No, there's no doubt in my mind. Oh, it's Locke. I don't really have any notebook thoughts. Like, my one notebook thought was about Pavetta and how, like, it would be organizational malpractice if they don't get the most out of him. So, I'll just go straight to my final thought.

And my final thought is that my boy O-Chart is starting to put in some work down there. I mean, Alec Boehm with the walk-off home run on Saturday was a beautiful sight. He's up to 10? He's up to, yeah, I think it's 10. Nine or 10. It's nine or 10 double-A home runs. I would much rather have Alec Boehm going forward than Austin Riley. I think Alec Boehm just doesn't strike out, puts the barrel of the baseball.

Now he's starting to drive the baseball. And the walk-off home run was glorious. And he looks more and more like Chris Bryant every single day. And Mickey Moniak is now leading the Eastern League in triples. And he's just like, he's top five.

He's top five in like every major offensive category in the Phillies minor league system. Like, that's pretty good. For a guy that, for a guy that for the guy that people a lot a lot of people just wrote off didn't think he's gonna be any good whatever he's a good player he's gonna be a major league player depends on how good he's gonna be but for a 21 year old playing in double a to be playing as well as he has for over three months

now i think is uh is really impressive and it's a it's a big step forward. And if he didn't just have such a bad March slash April, people would be way more excited about him. But I will be here. All right, I like that right there. About Mickey Moniak. And my final one is a guy by the name of Johan Rojas, who is 18 for another week before he turns 19. He went from the GCL all the way up to Williamsport now,

and now he's up in Williamsport. And the guy, I'm already, this is going to be, again, early to a take. It's a new guy. Early to a take. Early to a take. He's going to be our version of Hakuna slash soto like he's going to be our guy oh please god i'm just telling you he's already like he has come out of nowhere and he's he's already a top 10 phillies prospect there's just absolutely no doubt about it um little birdie told me runs runs, hits, throws, plays solid center field, already has good contact.

They had to change his bat path a little bit, figured that out, and now he's just absolutely exploding up in Williamsport. And Johan Rojas, you're going to hear a lot more about him. And just look out for him. Look out for him. He's the next one. I love that you have Little Birdies in this world. All over the place. You're getting Johan Rojas little birdie updates.

I think you should get a jersey. I'm in. I'll get it right now. Get me one. Start printing the jerseys. If you believe in him, I believe in him, Jack. I haven't seen him play yet, but very good things from everything I'm hearing. So I'm excited about Johan Rojas.

I like it. My final thought excited about Johan Rojas. I like it. My final thought is catch your train, Jack. And Thursday we'll be in studio together. And I just, I got nothing else to say. I really need them to take two or three against Arizona. Arizona team that is two and a half games behind the wild card, or I guess they're two behind the Phillies or two and a half back from the Phillies in the wild card, but also a plus 71

and run differential. Yeah, that's the good stuff right there. So I need them to take two or three and come to IOPs night. We're going to have so much fun. It's going to be awesome. That's all I got for it, T. I want to do a fun podcast. Is that too much to ask?

The fun podcast is going to come in the off season when they sign Garrett Cole. That's, that's, that would be a fun podcast. Yeah. We'd be all excited all over again. Yeah.

We'll do the, uh, why the Phillies are too cheap and we'll never sign Garrett Cole show. And then I'll sign. It'll be great. We'll do a repeat of last year. All right. Till Thursday,

two or three. He's Fred. Some'll be great. We'll do a repeat of last year. Alright, till Thursday. Two or three. He's Fred Sumsalter. All-star closer. Kenley Jansen, we have a question. What's the best podcast of all time? Baseball isn't boring, baby. I'm Rob Bradford, and every single day I'm sitting down with the biggest names to show you this great game is the greatest game. It's my podcast.

It's my passion. It's a cause I started more than two years ago. It is now the most prolific national daily baseball pod there is. Another fact. So jump aboard the BIB Express. Follow and listen to Baseball Isn't Boring, presented by Wasabi Hot Cloud Storage on the free Odyssey app or wherever you get your podcasts.