High Hopes: A Phillies Podcast - The High Hopes Phillies Podcast: Doc's a Hall of Famer and Harper Wait Continues

Episode Date: January 24, 2019

James Seltzer and Jack Fritz are back as the Harper wait continues. The guys also talked about Roy Halladay and a new Mike Trout thought.  See omnystudio.com/policies/listener for privacy information. To learn more about listener data and our privacy practices visit: https://www.audacyinc.com/privacy-policy Learn more about your ad choices. Visit https://podcastchoices.com/adchoices

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Interesting. Jack Fritz and I have just been walking around the studio just going up here and going like, High hopes? Listen, we... High hopes? We get very excited. High hopes? To do the High Hopes podcast. It's our favorite thinges? We get very excited. High Hopes? To do the High Hopes podcast.

It's our favorite thing. It is what I think about during the week. It is what I think about when I go to bed. When I think, hey, it's almost Thursday, it's only because I'm thinking about the High Hopes. I'm the same way. I basically just mail in my show on Thursdays just to get to 2 o'clock. Well, I mail in every show knowing that the faster I mail it in, the quicker I can get to Thursday. I think you're too busy watching Bryce Harper Highlights to mail in the show knowing that the faster I mail it in, the quicker I can get the Thursday. I think you're too busy watching Bryce Harper highlights to mail in the show.

So, funny story. So, my viewing this week has been, well, I finished the NOLA start in Boston, of course. Beautiful. I mean, once you start, you can't stop. And then, so, this week I was watching a Royals-Mariners game from April. I can confirm because I actually got a text from Jack saying, I'm watching Royals-Mariners from April, and I'll allow you to say what you said to me

with your thoughts from the game, but that was the opening of the text. Yes. And these are the texts I get from you. This is a very, it was not a surprising text to get I'm watching Royals-Mariners from April. Good. I hope that I am there to always be consistent.

Listen. We're going to love Gene Segura. We're going to love Gene Segura. The guy puts the ball in play whenever he wants. He's great. He is down. He is training with Mike Alfranco

right now. He's watching an Instagram live. Is that uncomfortable? I hope that Mike Alfranco is getting used to San Diego. Anywhere but here. But I will say, I will say,

I will say, for as anti-Franco as I am, he has instituted a leg kick. He is more closed off. And the ball is flying off his bat. This sounds familiar. I feel like I've heard this before. I can't place it. Closed stance Franco was one of the guiding principles of the high hopes podcast yes and then when i watched him in the season and he went back to being wide open

it was no longer a guiding principle this one is a check in the seltzer win column is what we'll call it okay okay so but you had more thoughts on the royals end of things as well mike misakis is good and he's like, like I just, I don't understand. There's this growing faction that like going from Mike Al Franco to Mike Moustakis would be a lateral move. And I just don't think that's just not true. Like,

sure. If you look at the, the whole end of season numbers, like Michael Franco batted 19 points higher or whatever. Like those were the most hollow numbers since jaleel okofor's rookie year yes like if you want to talk about fake news and like fake news being running rampant throughout the country i would say that you start with michael franco leading the phillies in batting average last year like that's just where i'm at that's exactly where i'm starting

there's no way that happened that didn't't actually happen. No, it didn't. It's not real. So, like, Mike Boustakis. This is music to my ears, by the way. Last year, Franco had a.2 war, which is horrible. Not good. Horrible. AKA, barely above replacement player level.

He was basically benched twice. I mean, remember, J.P. Crawford was in. If Crawford didn't get hurt, who knows? So, Crawford gets hurt. Franco comes in, and he goes on that six-week tear where it's like wow Michael Franco might be a guy and he's batting like 330 during that run it was ridiculous it was it was ridiculous he's he looked like a legitimate piece and then at the end of the season he's back down to to like his final month he batted 232 with like a 280

he was the Michael Franco we know and don't love right so and like here's the thing is that Michael Franco the thing that has crushed Michael Franco in the past is that he hits the ball on the ground and can't put the ball in the air. And that's the reason why he hasn't been able to. And he's not fast enough to beat out any ground ball. Right. Although he did get a stolen base off of Thor last year. That was the funniest day of baseball I can ever remember in a while. They stole six bases off of Thor.

Which is his problem, obviously, but yes. It was funny that they exploited it. Which is smart. I don't know why more teams don't exploit it every time they play. But anyway. So Moustakis is a guy that will lift the ball. And if he's coming here, it's his best part. In this park, baby.

He hit 38 home runs two years ago. In Kauffman Stadium. I don't know. A lot of people probably don't know park factors and all that. Kansas City, one of the toughest places to hit in all of baseball is an extreme pitcher's park. And he, two years ago, he's a year removed from the 38 home run season, playing a majority of that at Kauffman Stadium. Last year, he hit, I think, 28 homers. And traded the Brewers partway through the season.

And it's not like Milwaukee is some kind of hitter's haven. No, it's a better hitter's park than Kansas City for sure. Kansas City is. It's unbelievable. The fact that you had 38 homers in Kansas City is a really impressive number. Now, he had a higher walk percentage. Mike Moustakis last year. He's just a better baseball player than Michael Franco.

He was a two-and-a-half war player. Yep. Whereas Michael Franco's a.2. And even if you have issues with war, which I do too, I think we all do in certain cases and whatnot, but... Pitching war, definitely. It's really the defensive stats that I have issues with with war, but that is a

seriously significant difference. So if you're just looking on the surface level, sure, Michael Franco and Mike Moustakas look the same, but they're not. They are not the same. Mike Moustakas look the same but they're not they are not the same Mike Moustakas is a way better player you can actually rely on him a little bit unlike Mike Alfranco like he's sure he might have that six-week stretch where he's great but ultimately

he's gonna gonna go back in the tank I get that he's gonna be 26 this year I just I don't think I don't think you can go into next year trying to make a run trying to compete you add in bryce harper and i don't think you can trust a black hole like michael franco being in your lineup and to go get a mike mustakis it's it's a definite upgrade it's only going to be a year or two contract and then you can bring in alec bone and if even if you sign mike mustakis to a two-year contract that doesn't take you out of the arenado sweepstakes or the rendon sweepstakes like you can move mike mustakis if you have to. Absolutely.

He's a very fine stopgap that's probably going to hit 30 home runs here. I would say it's a really nice stopgap for that type of thing you're looking for. I think he's a perfect fit for a year or two. Alec Baum, by the way, up to what, 65th best prospect in all of baseball? Yeah, honestly, that's too low. It's too low. I'm very excited about Alec Boehm. People are really, really discounting Alec Boehm.

And everyone's freaking out that he didn't home run last year. It's like the guy was injured. Like, just give it a rest. The guy, throughout his college career, was a guy who didn't strike out and had legitimate pop. Was it like Chris Bryant level pop? No. He was not hitting 34 home runs in college and being ridiculous. But the power is

going to be there it's real he's just he's just getting better like relax with alec bone he is going to be a very good player i 100 that star 100 agree with you and it look and and the 65th prospect in baseball according to baseball america has nothing to sneeze at i mean that is a legitimate he's a legitimate legitimate prospect in their eyes i mean is a legitimate, he's a legitimate, legitimate prospect in their eyes. I mean, that is, you know, it's a legitimate spot. The top, anyone on the top 100 is an impressive number, you know? So, all right, let's get to it. We got a lot to get into today. Shout out to Roy Holiday, Hall of Famer Roy Holiday. We'll get into that later, but let's get real quick. Obviously, nothing has really changed in the last week since we talked.

Well, I mean, today. Well, except that's where I'm going. You threw me off for a second there. I'm like, wait, what? Except today. AJ Pollock, the Dodgers. I think a nice contract for what it's worth for them. Four years, $50 million.

It's the right type of number for him. I thought he would get more. I think we can officially cross the Dodgers off the Bryce Harper suitor list. Now, that might not stop Dodgers fans from making that. But, yeah, I would say that the Dodgers are out. They're out. Which means, and we've talked about how the Nationals are a paper tiger, Bryce Harper's going to be a Philly.

As we said on this show, it's just like, let's go. So what are your thoughts on why Bryce Harper is not a Philly yet? I have some thoughts, too. Listen, Bryce, this is from me to you and maybe Scott Boras because I'm sure that both of you are listening to this podcast. I think it has to go through Scott Boras. Scott and Bryce, I know you listen to the podcast because you want to get the correct gauge on Philly's fans.

Which is the only place to call them if they want that. Now listen to me. This is very serious. Real quick, for those who can't see, which is everybody listening to this, Jack is doing the thing where he's pointing to his eyes, and he's like, look at me. Look at me.

It's very De Niro. Yes. Just sign, baby. Just sign. Just do it. Just do it. Just come on home. What are you waiting for, buddy?

The Yankees are not going to get in the board. The Dodgers are out. The Cubs and their fraud-ass Theo Epstein operation out there can't afford to pay anyone because of how bad of a GM that Theo Epstein is giving out contracts. They can no longer afford to play you with Chris Bryant and Anthony Rizzo because their fraud GM is bad. Well, they have to sign those guys.

That's for sure. The Brizzo, as we like to call it. Brizzo. Just come on home. Come on home, Bryce! You don't have to keep on this cute little waiting game. You can just say, hey, Philly, I'm coming home. I want to be there.

We can announce it next week. You can announce it on this podcast if you want to. Sure. I'm just saying. Yeah, we'll do it. I had to think for a sec, but we'll do it. We will take that. If you want to announce it here week. You can announce it on this podcast if you want to. Sure. I'm just saying. Yeah, we'll do it. I had to think for a sec, but we'll do it. We will take that. If you want to announce it here, we're willing.

I don't, being real for a second, I don't know what he's waiting for. So I have a guess, and it's a purely, look, this is 100% a guess, and it'll probably turn out to be true. I think they're waiting for after the Super Bowl. I think they're waiting for no football talk no nothing the super bowl's over there's nothing but you know the the middle of basketball season hockey no one cares about sorry jackie pucks

i think they're waiting for after the super bowl they're gonna allow that monday to for people to react to super bowl and then i think it's in those next couple days i think they're waiting for the sports landscape for espn for everything for only one thing to be there that matters and it's bryce harper's son well that's my guess and i could be totally wrong but at this point we're trying to figure like we're as we're saying it feels like it's a lock that he's coming here to your point like why why not yet i think there could be other reasons pure hypothetical guests waiting for the landscape to be completely open and it to be the number one thing. It'll be the number one thing anyway, but just nothing else to interfere. Well, what if you did it this Saturday?

Well, I don't think they're going to ask. You think a Saturday? I think a weekday. I think it's going to be on a Saturday. Really? Why? Just a gut. Ooh.

All right. I like it. I mean, I don't know. Just a gut. So this Saturday, look, again, if I think- There's nothing going on't know. Look, again. There's nothing going on this weekend. Well, that's my point. If it gets to Monday, I'd be surprised if they do it during Super Bowl week is my point.

I guess if they did it over the weekend, possible. Or tomorrow, possible. A lot of people talk about Pro Bowl. Yeah, people love the Pro Bowl. I kind of agree with your theory. Maybe they're just waiting for the most pub possible. And again, this is me trying to make sense of something that right now just doesn't make a ton of sense. And what's going on with Machado?

Is he just going to have to take the White Sox offer? I think he might. Well, I think it's one of those things where it's like, look, if the Phillies don't want to sign both, which we're kind of leaning towards that right now, right? That's our guess. So if they don't want to sign both, I don't know what option he has. I think he's hoping that some mystery teams come in. The issue for Machado, which I don't't understand is once the Phillies sign Harper it's like your leverage is gone bro like I don't get it I'm I'm I'm I don't know I don't have a good answer for it I don't know what he's if I were him I would say screw it I'm signing

first I'm not gonna get what Harper's getting anyway I'm just gonna sign and get the most I can now what do you make of every beat writer, every national guy going silent on the Harper-Machado thing? I thought it was really, and you tweeted about this, I thought it was really fascinating that maybe it means it's coming to a head. Or maybe they didn't want- Or it just means there's nothing new to report. But they were reporting nothing anyway.

Yeah, but there was at least the meeting got reported, the meeting's coming up, the reaction to the meeting, this and that. There's no movement now. I mean, for what it's worth, I'm surprised we haven't had a new mystery team report in here anywhere. Because at this point, like we've discussed, I don't know where else Boris and Lozano can go with this. I don't know what they can do to create more of a market than there has already been because the market has played out in a really damaging way for their cases. Also, it is kind of fitting that all the stuff that's coming out today, after the Hall of Fame stuff, so maybe they didn't want...

I think that's part of it, too. I mean, you saw, who was it? Jeff Passon, I think, reports a couple days ago or even yesterday, he's like, hey, get ready for a lot of relief pitchers to sign, like the blah, blah, blah, whatever. Nailed it. I mean, we saw Brad Brock go today. We saw Hunter Strickland.

I'm sure we're going to see others. Well, I can tell you what, that Bryce Harper's not going to Seattle to play with Hunter Strickland. He is not. They do not like each other. He is not. No, they're not fans of each other.

I would say no. Yeah. Buster Posey will sit this one out as well, in case you're wondering. Yes. I legitimately hate Buster Posey. I hated him for that. For that? I didn't blame him for that

as much. I hate him for the cousins thing and the home plate change and all that stuff. He has single-handedly... In that spot, I didn't blame him as much because I thought Hunter Strickland was a total asshole and deserved to kind of get his ass beat in that situation because I thought he was in the wrong. But still, even still, you're his catcher.

Just do something to mollify the situation, whatever you've got to do. You don't have to 100% defend your guy, but you have to somewhat have his back. He's not a baseball player. He's a beta. Hall of Famer Buster Posey, right? He has done more to hurt baseball than anyone involved in the sport with his stupid freaking— Wow!

The Buster Posey rule. Wow. It's the worst rule in sports. I hate the rule. I agree with you. I think it's a dumb, stupid rule that was reactionary and wasn't thought out. It was like, oh, the best player on the World Series champs got hurt.

Oh. Horrible. I think that was it. It was terrible. So my thoughts on the Harper thing and why he hasn't signed yet is I kind of get the feeling that the Phillies, maybe Boris needs them to make another move to help out one of his clients while Harper's still out there. Pollock signs today, and I thought Pollock was going to get hurt by Harper not signing yet.

But it turns out he didn't really get hurt. He just signed first. No, he still signed for less than he wanted. There were reports he was looking for four for 60 ends at four for 50 i think a bit of a discount off what you would expect but i don't think he had a choice i think there are certain players are like all right i can't wait anymore i i gotta i gotta sign somewhere yeah so i'm wondering if boris is kind of strong arm in the phillies that way and maybe maybe that's why the mustaka stuff came out. And he was like, hey, sign my guy and I'll bring you Bryce.

Make sure my guy is signed and then I'll deliver you Bryce. Or maybe there's a guy on the team, like a Nick Williams who's a Boris client. Ah, I didn't realize Nick Williams was a Boris guy. That's interesting. So maybe get Nick Williams somewhere where he's going to play before we make this move taking him out of the line. And it would kill all his value, right?

That's the point. I'm saying the Philliesies if you trade him before you sign bryce harper and even then like we've talked a lot i'm guessing teams in around baseball we might not know what's going on but i think the vast majority of teams have a feel for what's going to happen so i think the leverage maybe is still less than it would be but yeah once they sign bryce harper it's like all right he's a bench guy why would we give you something valuable for a bench guy it takes some of that leverage and boris doesn't want that to happen to one of his clients. Absolutely. He wants to see him play somewhere else. And get

a contract and make him more money, and of course. And it's been reported that the Marlins have been interested in him, so maybe there's some kind of deal there to give him playing time, I don't know. I saw I can't remember who it was he put out to, it was Heyman or one of those guys where it's Marlins were in on Nick Marcakis still looking to sign an outfielder or something.

And I wanted to quote to it and be like, Bryce Harper to the Marlins confirmed. And I was like, not worth it. Wow. Not worth it. Nick Marcakis, by the way. Very adorable signing by the Braves. A 35-year-old. I think it's a fine signing.

He batted.250 at the end of last year. Yeah, I know. But he ended up at.313. Went up in his whole second half. Yeah. And look, I'm not a huge Nick Marquegas guy. But for $6 million, that's fine. That's a fine.

You can't rip this. It's $6 million. Are you kidding me? 35 years old. It's fine. Give him McCutcheon. Yeah, I guess. I don't know.

I know what you're saying. Obviously, as a player, I prefer McCutcheon. But four years, 50 for McCutcheon, one for six for Marquegas. Marquegas is probably a better deal. He probably is. Did you see the Braves, by the way? They're over under. How is that?

I was really shocked by that. I mean, the Mets at 84 and up, I know they made improvements. I was shocked by that, too. But the Braves being below the Phillies and the Mets and the Nationals, the Braves being the – they won the division last year, and they're young and growing. I was shocked by that. And they have Ronald Acuna.

They have the next Trout if there is one. And I don't think there is, but Acuna's that guy. But the pitching staff isn't that great. Right, and you assume Folti, Newcomb, all these guys who took a step forward last year are going to regress some. I will say that it's probably going to be Mike Scirocca season. I really, really, really like Mike Scirocca. I thought he was a guy who, when I saw him pitch last year, I was so impressed with him.

And, you know, obviously young, didn't get a ton of stars, a ton of opportunities. But I'm with you. I think Sirocco's going to be. They got a lot of talent. Tucson. I mean, they got guys in their system who. Tuki. Gohara.

I mean, they got a lot of young guys who have talent. So I think it's going to be interesting. It was interesting that the number was so low. I will say this. The NL East is going to be the most fun. It's been maybe my lifetime. It's the best division in baseball. I can't remember a time in my life when there's four legitimately good teams.

Yep. And when the Phillies add one of these guys, like, so let's say Harper signs here. Obviously, he just shunned the Nationals. So that's going to make that rivalry even more. It's great. CBP South. You've already got the Braves-Phillies thing from last year, which will carry over two young teams.

The rebuild's kind of aligning. And then everyone hates the Mets. So that works well, too. But I love when the Mets are good. Oh, it's great. Because the Mets-Phillies is the best rivalry in the city, just from a pure hatred standpoint. Well, what do you think? I think all the other ones are just more made up.

Eagles-Cowboys? Yeah, like, we got to hate the Cowboys. I know what you're saying. It's more natural with the Phillies-Mets because it is Philly-New York and all that. Okay, whatever. I'm just saying that, like, I'm saying 07 to 09 philly's mess was the best in my lifetime there's not been a better rivalry in this city now you were around for the

90s yeah um you were like you were like what in college in the 90s is that is that right high school you were in college is that your senior year early 90s was fun um all right yeah but it's fun for one year though yeah it was it was just one year well obviously the the nfc east and nfc east in the 90s was legit it was legit look it's a i'd have to think about it it's a fun one it's a good question i mean six are celtics in the 80s i wasn't alive for it but that that's legit i thought that was like your high school days you're cute over there thanks. All right. Enough jokes about my age. I'm just saying that the—

Which is incredibly old. The NL East. The NL East is going— People listening think I'm like 50 right now. I know. The NL East is going to be a lot of fun. Like, I'm thoroughly looking forward to— The fan bases are going to legitimately not like each other for the first time in a while.

Oh, forever. I mean, look, what I think also part of that comes from just like actually being able to care about a good Phillies team again because when you're bad, you don't really care about the right, no matter who's good, you're just like, eh, whatever. For us to be able to, and then to your point, these teams all get better, all competitive. It's going to be a tough division. Yeah, well that's, I mean, that's a whole

another level to it, which is just just awesome. Suck it. Alright. We'll get to the Hall of Fame in a little bit. Any other kind of rumblings or news that hit you this week? Still a lot of names out there. Dallas Keuchel, those types of guys. Kimbrell is a name that's been locked into a lot.

I think they're kind of just waiting on it. Is waiting on everything else. I don't think they're going to make a move for a starter unless it's a Keuchel end of February, early March. He's not signing anywhere, and he doesn't want to play for the Reds. Maybe they get him on a cheaper contract. Maybe that's something they could do. Which we would be fine with in that case.

Yeah, I'd be fine with it. So then you're heading into next season, and the Phillies have to make sure. They have a bunch of guys, right? The Phill they have a bunch of guys, right? The Phillies have a bunch of guys with talent, but you're not 100% sold on them being a part of the future. So when you're looking at the staff next year, you need a Nick Pavetta breakout season.

Which, by the way, quick tangent, a lot of Nick Pavetta breakout talk out there. Listen, there's been a lot. Every day there's a new Nick Pavetta breakout talk out there. Listen, there's been a lot. Every day there's a new Nick Pavetta breakout season article. Hey, come on. All right? Back up off our corner, all right? That's the Jack Fritz corner right there.

I want Jack Fritz credited. I want the High Hopes podcast credited. Anyone talking about a Nick Pavetta breakout, give us some credit. Say the name. Say the name. the name say the name it's not that hard it's a great name high hopes i'm just saying that after last year after two years ago we have like a six plus cra we came in the season nick that is a guy yes he's gonna be very good yes and for the most of last season he maybe looked smart on that yep tapered off there a little bit in the middle got people off the scent guess who never stops tracking that scent? Never.

Never. So I'm just saying. Some of the things you've said about Nick Pavetta are so absurd that I don't know how anyone could associate anything else with Nick Pavetta, but Jack Fritz loving him. Just saying. If there's Pavetta pieces out there,

just make sure you're at the boy or at High Hopes. It's not that hard to do. Like Pavetta is the guy. Like the MLB Network did when they used our podcast. They said High Hopes pod. Yeah. Not that hard. That's not that hard to do. Like, Pavetta is the guy. Like the MLB Network did when they used our podcast. They said High Hopes pod. Yeah. Not that hard. That's all I'm asking for.

Credit. And so I was reading. So Stolens wrote a piece about High Hopes. Not about High Hopes. John, if you want to write a piece about High Hopes. John, you're welcome to write a piece on High Hopes. I mean, you can do it. He wrote a piece on Pavetta.

Great guy. Loved it. Yes. And I was reading it. And I wasn't trying to like argue with john i was just pointing out that i was pointing out a difference in philosophy so the one thing he labeled was that um nick pivetta slider was going to be like a main that's the third pitch he needs to hone in and i just like pretty much disagree with that because there was a there was like that weird

remember that weird like six weeks or i would say a month stretch last year where he just lost his curveball yeah like it was like it was like a stretch where he could not throw his curveball yeah it started with that mets game on uh or might not sorry but it was in the middle of that the little league game yes and i started getting shelled yeah and it was it was so disappointing yeah because he would go through four innings like i remember the nationals game on Sunday night. He was dominating. Yes. And then he fell apart. And then he lost it.

Yep, vividly. So what I'm saying is that the slider was only really used by Pavetta because he couldn't use his curveball. He couldn't find the grip on his curveball, so he had to use his slider so he wasn't just getting shelled out there. And Matt Winkleman wrote a piece about how he struggles with runners on base and how everything skyrockets. So when Pavetta and Nola are out of the windup together, their numbers are pretty much in line, which gives me butterflies.

And then when he goes to the stretch, Pavetta falls apart. Which is a thing that we've seen with pitchers in the past. I mean, it's a thing that happens. Right. So Pavetta, when he goes to the stretch, kind of falls apart Sure Which is a thing that we've seen with pitchers in the past I mean it's a thing that happens Right So Pavetta when he goes to the stretch kind of falls apart a little bit I feel like when I watch Pavetta he doesn't totally have a plan For especially left handed hitters and when guys get on base Left handed hitters especially

Like when I'm looking at it from that perspective He needs to have something that goes away from left handed hitters And I just think that more than a slider Slider's going to go in on him from that perspective, he needs to have something that goes away from left-handed hitters. And I just think that more than a slider. Slider's going to go in on him. More than a slider where, when I'm thinking tunneling perspective, it just doesn't look the same. From a tunneling perspective, you want all of your pitches coming out. To look exactly the same or as close to the release point, the motion.

You want it to be as consistent as it can be. And when I watched Pavetta's slider last year, it wasn wasn't that way like his curveball and fastball were two different looks but the change up is something that you can learn to throw out of the same arm slot and looks natural looks normal you can throw a four-seam change up because he throws a four-seam fastball so it has the same kind of spin on it like like i would rather him perfect the change up i think a change up is more It makes more sense for his repertoire. It's more important to a Nick Pavetta breakout than honing in a slider that doesn't really help your attack against left-handed hitters.

Having a good changeup that he can put on the outside corner, that guys can kind of lean out in front of the plate, and then he can backdoor a 96 right on their hands. I mean, even if he throws it 15% of the time, 10% of the time, it can make a difference. And what I'm saying is, I would also like, if you already have a good slider grip, just make it a cutter. Like, if you want to have a cutter, that's perfectly fine from a tunneling perspective.

I just think for Pavetta to reach his peak, I don't think a slider is the best plan for that. I think a changeup is the best plan because from a tunneling perspective, his slider didn't look as natural as I think a changeup would. Fascinating stuff, Jack. I very rarely am interested in what you're saying, but that was – no, I'm kidding. I'm kidding.

I love what you're saying. I think a lot about Nick Lilleta. That was really interesting stuff, and hopefully we can get Nick on this pod at some point. It's our white whale. Yes. Nick. And then you can talk to Nick and be like, Nick, listen.

You can do the eye thing. Look at me. Look at me. Look at you. We got this. And if he wants to get really crazy, and be like, Nick, listen. You can do the eye thing. Look at me. Look at me. Look at you. We got this. And if he wants to get really crazy, and if he wants to actually be a Cy Young candidate and strike out 300 guys a year, learn a splitter.

Which is so hard to do, by the way. Learn a splitter. Real quick, do you know how many Phillies pitchers have ever struck out 300 guys in a season? Schilling did it twice. Carlton? End of list. That's it?

That's it. Only two pitchers in Phillies history to ever strike out 300 guys in a season. Okay. Regular season only, obviously. Obviously, it's borderline impossible. It's hard, especially now with the way rotations and bullmen's are. But 250, 260, whatever. I mean, 10 per nine, something like that.

I mean, that's real deal stuff. And I know at times he was hired and out last year, obviously. Listen, Pavetta, I forget who put it out this week. real deal stuff and i know at times he was hired in that last year obviously listen pivetta all i forget who i forget who put it out this week um but he was like either nick pivetta is the biggest outlier we've ever seen or 2019 is going to be his breakout year yeah well look i think that's the best way to put it well it's a great point because when and they're not wrong when you look at the history of guys who have struck out as many guys per nine as he does and walked as few guys as he does per nine like it usually leads to breakouts to great pitching i mean that it's just the numbers bear it out yeah i mean when you when you strike out as many guys as he does and walk as little as he does

that usually lends itself to a breakout exactly i don't think you can i don't think you just look at the numbers and predict that because when you when you physically watch him he doesn't have a good plan against left-handed hitters right now. That's just the way it is. And I think if he learns either a splitter or a split changeup, they both come out of the same kind of arm slot. And I think it might even be a better feel for a circle change or whatever. And the thing I love about Bavetta, I love his mentality. I love he's a pitcher. He's a bulldog.

He goes out there and like you said, he needs to do better with the planning, but in terms of going out there with the fire that I want to see, I mean, he brings it. Now, I will say that for most of his career so far he's been a thrower rather than a pitcher.

It's a great way to put it. Same thing with Velasquez. There was a little bit of Velasquez, but the main point is that they better be right in how they're evaluating their guys. You need a Pavetta breakout year. You need Arrieta to not go through months where he's just terrible. And you better hope that one of the F1 or Velasquez can kind of replicate what they did for the first four months of last season. But for the last two, which kind of just fell apart. Because if you're not going to sign anyone, then you need that.

And I understand what a lot of people have said, and I think this makes a lot of sense, is from whispers we've heard, is that they're going to wait until the deadline and then trade for a starter. Which makes a ton of sense. It really does. Go through the first half, see what your guys have. Get better value on some of these guys who you're paying for a half a season less of them and all

that type of stuff now the danger is that if like madison bumgarner goes out and turns back into madison bumgarner you have to pay more to get him and all that and then also there's also a danger in the sense that right now it does feel like that market is is very thin whereas come that time there's a chance at least that there are multiple suitors trying to bid against you for their services. Alright, coming up in just a little bit, we gotta find out about Jack's

confrontation, we'll say, with a Philadelphia sports media legend. We'll get into that. But Hall of Fame. Obviously macro discussions about the Hall of Fame are something we can have, but let's first start with the fact that Doc, Roy Halladay, I know one of your all-time favorites, one of the people you idolize.

For anyone that was playing baseball during that time, and especially pitching during that time, whether you were 12 or pitching in college, he was a guy that everyone looked up to. The work ethic perspective to the actual getting it on the field and what he did. To being just a great guy. Yeah, and a doctor on the mound.

Yep, and that nickname for a reason. Right. So I'm so happy he got in first ballot. He was arguably the best pitcher in the game for nine years yes and and what doesn't get talked about enough the best poster in the game in one of the toughest divisions to ever pitch in when you had those red sox and yankees teams of the late 90s and the jays were terrible and he's gone up against those teams you know i mean playing both those teams 40 times a year for his team at least so multiple multiple starts against the best hitters

in baseball year after year after year is really impressive. Yeah. So I'm glad he got in. Obviously, it absolutely sucks he won't be there. I kind of want to go. I want to go see him get drafted. Well, from what I heard, Cooperstown is projecting their highest turnout ever.

I'm sure Roy's a big part of that. Obviously, Mario Rivera is a big part of that as well. Yankees fans going out. First ever unanimous? Mel Rivera? And look, he should be unanimous. So should have many other guys who are in the Hall of Fame. I think I'm happy to see one of the dumbest

things in sports finally going away. The whole, well, Babe Ruth wasn't 100%, so I can't vote for him to be in it. It's so ass. It made me so mad year after year. It was just a ridiculous. Are they a Hall of Famer? Are they a high-level Hall of Famer?

Yeah? Vote him in the Hall of Fame, then. I mean, I hated it. I hated the 100% thing. So happy to see that barrier knocked down. I'm sure we'll see a lot more 100%ers. Derek Jeter next year could be another one. Yeah, I mean, I guess if you want to put in a guy that never won an MVP,

he'd animus. For one answer, I mean, Mo should be 100%. He should be. He's the best ever at what he did. So, yeah, Mo should have been a Hall of Famer. Unanimous. Very happy to see Edgar Martinez get in as well. Yeah.

Well-deserved. Best age of all time, probably. And, I mean, for what it's worth, when you think about it, I was thinking about this the other day when he got in. I mean, probably a top 10 pure hitter of my lifetime. I mean, legitimately. He had a career average of 315, 933 OPS. I mean, he was an amazing hitter. An amazing hitter.

I think he had a career average against Doc of like 542. Think about that. Think about that. I mean, that's insane. And the fact that he played in Seattle, the fact that he was a DH, he just didn't have that same sort of notoriety, and it's a man who deserved to be in the Hall of Fame. I mean, we won't talk about what Harold Baines has done for the level of Hall of Famer, but taking that type of thing out,

I mean, Edgar Martinez better than a lot of people in the Hall of Fame already. Yeah, I would agree. So he's in. Mussina, like, I get the Mussina case. Yeah, I think he's a Hall of Famer. It's just not a high-level all-vamer. Listen, the guy was never—he's like the fourth-best pitcher in baseball at his peak, I would say. Well, all right, so let me counter that with, do you think Bobby Abreu should get in next year?

Okay, good. So we're on the same page with that. Because a lot of the people who have similar outlooks on baseball that you and I do, you know, statistically driven or interested in that type of stuff, looking at all different types of things. A lot of those people, I'm assuming your host at night, probably one of those people, the way he thinks about it, who think Bobby O'Brie is a Hall of Famer, and I know the numbers are there.

Clearly, you look at the numbers, you compare him to other Hall of Famers. Sure. I'm sorry. I watched Bobby O'Brie, his whole career. He was not a Hall of Famer. At no point was he a top 10, top 7 player in baseball. Never. He never finished top 10 in MVP votes.

There you go. I mean, that, I'm sorry. Like, that matters. It matters who you're playing at the same time with, comparing him against those guys. Man, I... I think the eye test is more important in the is more important. I totally agree with you. We get so wrapped up in the stats thing, especially with this sport compared to all others.

I am so with you, Jack. I watched Bobby Abreu's whole career. He wasn't a Hall of Famer. He just wasn't. He's not a Hall of Famer. He's not. And people are putting his numbers against Tony Gwynn. I saw that.

And it's your buddy Ryan Spader. I love Ryan. He's great. I love his information. One of the best follows on Twitter. AceSpader on Twitter. Just a great follow. I saw that. And it's your buddy Ryan Spader. I love Ryan. Yeah, he's great. I love his information. One of the best follows on Twitter. Ace of Spader on Twitter. Just a great follow. So much information.

Fascinating stuff. Dude, that's asinine. Like, I'm sorry, man. I'm old enough to remember Tony Gwynn's feet. Tony Gwynn was a hundred times later than Bobby Abreu was. He just was. No, I know. And everyone is getting a little bit too obsessed with the numbers.

I agree. Stone Hall of Famers, when I watched Doc Halladay for his peak, he was best pitcher in baseball. Yep. When I watched Mariano Rivera, best closer I've ever seen in my life. Yep. No, I mean, there's players at their peaks that are probably better. Listen, my favorite Mariano Rivera stat. I love that you tweeted this out.

This is one of the more unreal stats that you could ever hear. More people have walked on the moon than have scored on him in the postseason. He's pitched something like 140-something innings or something in the playoffs with 11 runs. It's unbelievable. .7 ERA in the playoffs. It's unbelievable. And a.7 whip, for what it's worth. Just unbelievable.

When I watched him, he was a Hall of Famer. I got into baseball at the end of Edgar's career, but just from watching him. Old guy remembers Edgar. He was great. And Mussina's kind of in the same thing. I thought he was a fine pitcher, but if he's a Hall of Famer, then Cliff Lee's a Hall of Famer. See, I don't think, that's one of those things where, and again.

Or Johan Santana. Now, see, and I agree with you. Their peaks were probably better, but that's where you do things where, and again, I'll hunt Santana now. See, and I agree with you. Like their peaks were probably better, but that's where you do have to. And I am more of a peak guy than a longevity guy. I care more about how great were you for a certain period of time. That's one of those things where you do have to find a way to make gradations one way or the other.

And the fact that Musina pitched as long as he did one, 270 games, not that wins matter but like the the numbers well he did in the a whole least yeah and the numbers are there it's impressive enough to me where he's a he's a borderline in for me i would put him in but it's like the the lowest level of hall of famer but i think he's all of fame yep and i also think kirk schilling is a hall of famer well i think kirk schilling is a better hall of famer than my kirk schilling should be in before Mike Musina.

Granted, awful guy. Can't stand Curt Schilling. I was asking Joe yesterday, like, do they let him make a speech? Oh, wow. I didn't even think about that. I mean, and look, and that's the interesting thing about Schilling. And it's why, I mean, he's a Hall of Famer and is absurd. But he never cheated on baseball.

Like, he never did anything like that. It's just that he's as big an ass as you could possibly be. Listen, he's a bad dude. He's the worst. But he's a Hall of Famer. He was a Hall of Famer. Ty Cobb's a Hall of Famer. Ty Cobb killed a guy.

Really? He killed a guy. What are we doing here? Look, the Hall of Fame is not a moral judgment. Oh, was good guy was he a bad guy no sorry it's about what they did on the field and kurt schilling is a stone cold hall of famer in my mind yeah so um interesting next year though because jeter the only lock and i think probably the only first time hall of famer next year it's cliff lee it's a bray it's guys like that next year who i think are are not and certainly not first ballot hall of famers and i don't think Hall of Famers to begin with.

What do you think about, I think the big three and Larry Walker's in a similar type of percentage. I think Larry Walker's a tough one for me. I think he's probably a Hall of Famer, but it's another thing with the Colorado part of it. I never felt... I'm surprised that Griff's not getting more. Yeah, well, there's similar types of... I mean, Walker's so tough to judge. I don't know what to do.

I mean, his numbers are insane when you look at some of the seasons he had in Colorado. Yeah. And he did have a really nice career. I don't know if I'd put Larry Walker in. Bonds, Clemens, Schilling. And they're different cases. Manny? Well, Manny's not getting in.

I mean, it's just what it is. He's 22%. It's a shame. I would put Manny in. In a second. In a heartbeat. Manny is Well, Manny's not getting in. I mean, it's just what it is. He's 22%. It's a shame. I would put Manny in, in a second, in a heartbeat. Manny Rizzo, Hall of Famer. I just don't understand how you can justify Bonds and Clemens and then not put Manny in. Well, I mean, Because he failed it twice? Is that what people are bringing out about? Well, they didn't get caught in baseball. I mean, neither failed a test

in baseball. The Mitchell report for Clemens and Bonds didn't get, and Balco, but he never got caught when he was playing. Look, they all took steroids. That's my, look. You can moral judge it as much as you want. I agree with you.

That's my point, is either, and to make it even further, there are absolutely players in the Hall of Fame who took steroids. Pudge Rodriguez. Yeah, Pudge Rodriguez.

Absolutely. We don't know that for sure. We're pretty sure he took steroids. We don't know. Part of those Texas teams, the way he looked, the way he grew, you think he did.

Not Cassius Spurs. People are going to put Ortiz in. Absolutely. He actually kind of got caught. Didn't, but kind of did. There were enough rumors out there. Point being that we don't know who did, who didn't. Barry Bonds is the greatest baseball player I've ever seen in my lifetime. Period. End of story. Roger Clemens, top

two or three pitcher I've ever seen in my lifetime. Maybe the best. certainly the best numbers wise they gotta be in the offense it's silly if I'm gonna take my daughter I used to always say my kid because I didn't have a kid but now I have a kid if I'm gonna take Zoe Rose Seltzer to the Hall of Fame to Cooperstown

like my dad did when I was a kid and it was the best time and it was part of why I love baseball and go there and I'm showing her the history of baseball and then I get to the 90s and 2000s and I'm like oh yeah the best player and then I get to the 90s and 2000s and I'm like, oh yeah, the best player I ever saw played then, but he's not here.

How stupid is that? It's a museum that is supposed to tell the history of the sport and all the John Feinsteins of the world with the character clause. Really? Ty Cobb is in the Hall of Fame yet again. Alright? Enough. This is, it's so stupid yet again. All right? Enough.

It's so stupid, Jack. Now I want to ask you a question. Yes. You just talked about Clemens as one of the three best pitchers you've ever seen in your life. Yes, and that's just, you know. So where does Doc rank amongst the best pitchers you've physically seen? Well, Pedro Martinez in his prime was the best pitcher I've ever seen in my life. I have no problem saying that. After that, it's really interesting. I think

Clemens is in that next group. I think Clayton Kershaw's in that next group. Randy Johnson? Randy Johnson's in that next group, and then I think that Doc is right there after those guys or right with those guys in that general group. Yeah, so I think Pedro's the best. I would say Clemens, because he was my guy.

Before Halliday, Clemens was my guy. And I would put Clemens 2-2 because, again, that gets to my point where at some point you do have to take in the whole mess of all they did. And, I mean, Clemens won the Cy Young five times, six times. I mean, it's crazy. It's crazy. Randy, I would say. Then Halliday. And then Kershaw.

I would say Johan, Kershaw. No, Kershaw, Johan. You can't put Kershaw out of Johan. I mean, you can't put Johan out of Kershaw. But I know what you're saying. I think Johan is one of those guys who I don't think people remember how dominant he was for that five, six-year stretch, whatever it was. How great he was. Again, why I don't think he's All-Famer,

he just didn't do it long enough for me. Right. But he's up there. When Johan was at his best those few years, he was pretty great. I think that's the top six. And then Cliff Lee, CeCe. I'm sure there are guys we're forgetting. The Grom season last year was ridiculous.

One of the best seasons we've seen. If we're talking peaks, 2015 Arrieta. Yeah. I mean, best second we've seen. If we're talking peaks, 2015 Arrieta. Yeah. I mean, best second half in the history of baseball. Yeah. So, listen, I'm just happy Doc's in. Like, I think he's a Hall of Famer. Watching him on a night-in, night-out basis, the way he carried himself, how hard he worked,

how much of a model citizen he was in the game. Very, very happy he's in. I'm glad he's the first ballot Hall of Famer. I am, too. Because he's a Hall of Famer regardless. And that's another thing I hate. And I understand that's the way it works, but what's different from the first, second, fifth year? I also don't care what cap he goes in. I know Brandy came out yesterday and said that they're not wearing a cap.

Yeah. Can we talk about this for a second? Because this was actually a thing. I can't believe people care about this. His family said he wants to wear a Major League Baseball cap. Guess what? Awesome. Go with what his family... And on top of that league baseball cap guess what awesome yeah go with what his family and on top of that and i know there are people within the city and all like like look

major league baseball usually chooses for themselves as you know we discussed last time because wade boggs took a bunch of money from the rays to go in and raise that when it's absurd legend i love you wade but having said that um i think that if major league baseball had had to choose if it did not and i think that if Major League Baseball had had to choose, if it had not, and I think that they're doing the right thing to honor his family's wishes, I think that is what they should do, period. But let's be real. If Major League Baseball were choosing, he'd be in a Blue Jays cap.

Yeah, and he said he wanted to go in a Blue Jay. He should go in as a Blue Jay. Look, I loved having him here, and I know he only played in the playoffs here and all that, but he spent his career as a Blue Jay. He spent 15 years in that organization. I know we love Philadelphia and all that, but come on, guys. a Blue Jay. He spent 15 years in that organization. I know we love Philadelphia and all that, but come on, guys. Let's get over ourselves here for a second.

He should go in as a Blue Jay, and I'm happy he's going in the way he wants and his family wants and whatever. And they said it's to honor both cities, which actually is a really nice thing. They're saying we don't want to choose because we love both. But I mean, he's a Blue Jay. So, I think we can get over that. Alright, final thing. Jack Fritt. So. That's fine. I think we can get over that. All right. Final thing.

Jack Fritz. Yeah. The deacon. The dean of Philadelphia Philly sports media. The man that Jack Fritz and I can only hope to be someday. Jim Salisbury. Yeah. The best of the best.

You and Jim had a little thing. No, I got. Here's the thing. I don't think Jim knew you had a thing, but you knew. I got out-alfed by Jim. You got out-alfed. I got out-alfed. I got out-alfed by alpha i got out alpha i got out alpha by jim salisbury um i uh so last little little context so last week was the philly's prospects uh caravan or whatever so did you tell mickey moniak you loved him by the way or did you

not so this is part of being out alpha by jim salisbury um So all the prospects, not all the prospects, Moniak was in, Adonis Medina was in, Kyle Dowie was in, not Adam Haisley, which I was a little disappointed in. He was supposed to be. He was not there. Heard you were coming. He was a little worried you might be all up on him a little too much.

Yeah, I was going to roast his leg kick and say, figure it out, buddy. That's not how you hit. If you want to reach your peak here, also have a bigger load um get working with jason ochard immediately um so so so first off you know jim walking around walking the clubhouse i so there's a stigma of radio people with the beat writers where like don't ask any questions because you're idiots and you're not around here very often and i was trying to be like i'm not an idiot do you know who i am um have you heard of my podcast it's called high hopes uh and if you ever write a pavetta piece oh do you know who i am so like jack fritz baby so i just didn't want to i didn't want to be embarrassing to to the radio station so i kind of didn't really ask any questions

anyway so so we're in the the moniac scrum and i'm trying to get to get too close because i don't want moniac to be a little freaked out at how much i love him yeah and i did feel it radiating i did change my twitter bio to life liberty and mickey moniac second half splits um and i was so close to asking him if i should make that my bio but i just went anywhere so because he probably would have said no so probably good so we're in the scrum, and I'm waiting to ask my question. I just wanted to ask if you've talked to Jason O'Chart yet. Because I don't really have anything else. I let everyone else handle the—

Yeah, you just want to know. We love Jason O'Chart. Jason O'Chart, one of our favorites. I wanted to let everyone else get their fluff pieces in, because I was going to ask the hard-hitting. You want to get the serious question that matters. That's what matters. So Salisbury—first off, we're in the scrum. And Salisbury gets in like nine questions in a row.

And I'm just like. He's allowed to. He's the king. I'm like, is anyone else going to break in? Because no. Because Jim Salisbury, everyone's like, oh, he's such a nice guy. Guy's a hawk. He's an alpha.

Guy's a hawk. He's an alpha. And I got to say, he kept the microphone up to Mickey Moniac the whole time. My arm was getting tired. I didn't want to hold it up much longer. I had to switch arms and then go back to my right arm. Not for Jim. And my right arm was sore the next day.

Salisbury's got it right up next to him. So this is my first time really in the media setting. And I just want to say that for everyone that thinks Jim Salisbury is like this nice little guy. Guy's an alpha male. Guy's a hawk. And I got alpha'd by Jim Salisbury. You got that thinks jim salisbury is like this nice little guy guy's an alpha male guy's a hawk and i got out alpha by jim salisbury you got out alpha by jim salisbury i know this is amazing i know it made my day when you texted me i was like i was like this guy it's just it's just the big takeaway is jim salisbury is a badass yeah don't mess with the man yeah i was like man i did not expect this from jim he had like nine questions in a row to mickey

and then at the end when everyone when everyone was like starting to disperse i was like, man, I did not expect this from Jason. He had like nine questions in a row to Mickey. And then at the end, when everyone was starting to disperse, I was like, hey, Mickey. Hey, Mick. What was the answer? I said, hey, Mickey, have you talked to Jason Otrek yet? Yeah, what did he say? And he gave me this like, basically, I don't really know who that is. Nice. Which I don't think is a great sign.

No. Mickey, I suggest you get on it. But yeah, he was talking about how he started lifting the ball more, and his friends came down, and they didn't feel more comfortable, and how McCutcheon was hung out with the U.S. team at the World Series in 2015. Like that. And now they're playing together, and he's excited to get to big league camp. Life, liberty, and Mickey Moniac second half splits.

Also, I talked to Kyle Dowie. No one else talked to Kyle Dowie? I don't think anyone else really knew who he was. Actually, that's not true. Also, I talked to Kyle Dowie. No one else talked to Kyle Dowie? I don't think anyone else really knew who he was. Actually, that's not true. Matt Breen talked to Kyle Dowie. Okay. And I went over after Matt Breen. And he's jacked.

Like, legitimately jacked. And I walked up to him and I said... Matt Breen is jacked, huh? No, not Matt Breen. I know. And I walked up to Kyle Dowie and I said, Is it fair that some people in the media, a.k.a. me, have labeled you as Josh Hader 2.0?

And he did not confirm that he is Josh Hader 2.0, but he did say he took it as a compliment. He should. I mean, as long as we're talking about Josh Hader the pitcher, not the person. We're not talking about the Twitter accounts. I'm just talking about Josh Hader the pitcher, who is disgusting. Oh, so good.

So we're hoping that Kyle Dowie can become that. Other than that, I was weirdly impressed by how much in similar size I was to these guys. Ooh, it lit the fire, didn't it? I was just saying. Lit the fire, didn't it? I wanted to whisper in their ears, could have been me. That would have been so creepy. Oh, I wish you had done that yeah

I'm like the same size what is happening right now I'm the same size as Adonis Medina and like that's another thing it's like I didn't want to ask so Adonis Medina

had the had the translator with him and I want to ask like hey I think you get better at finishing like are you working on anything like that because then it just would have been

like a really tough like I want to ask translation yeah it would have been awkward at finishing what what are you talking about like when i watch him he doesn't like adonis medina's ceiling i think it may be higher than six those whoa six so by the way the number 13 prospect in the top 100 baseball america just saying i just i i have visions of six though all the time anyway adonis medina i'm just saying that if he if he

really if he really, if he really worked on finishing down and getting down the mound, I think you can throw even harder. He kind of, he's already high nineties. He like cuts himself off. I don't know. It's mainly because he's super athletic and he has to learn how to pitch a

little bit more. But Medina is really, really good. And I would, he's another guy. Like, I'm not sure I want to move him. Like I,

I kind of want to keep everyone keep them all baby now that they're all my children I wanted them to all stay around forever so yeah I got out alpha by Jim Salisbury

what a great he runs that place shout out to Jim I learned that very quickly Jim if you ever want to come on the High Hopes podcast and then out alpha him

again on his own show we'll take you I don't think I can do it again alright so we'll say it as we always do hopefully we'll have an emergency podcast coming well alright him again on his own show. We'll take you. I don't think I can do it again. Alright, so we'll say it as we always do. Hopefully we'll have an emergency pod coming. Well, alright. I got two more things. Ooh, I was gonna... Final thought things or in addition to your final thoughts?

I got one take and then I'll save the other one for final thoughts. Lay it on me. If the Phillies are serious about getting Mike Trout, they need to develop their guys better like you cannot have you you can't be spending money on andrew mccutcheon and then expect to add in the mike trout so you need ammoniac to fill left field you need bone to be third base you need louis garcia to be shortstop

in order for them to really be a serious contender in the mike trout sweepstakes they can't keep giving money to aging veterans because their prospects aren't along yet. So what I'm saying is that the addition of Jason Ochard, the other driveline guys, their investment in developing their minor leaguers as much as possible, I think is crucial when you're evaluating the payroll

for a potential Mike Trout addition. Because you're going to have Bryce Harper or Manny Trout,out probably bryce for like 32 to 35 million dollars a year like i think if i had if i had to guess right now harper signs here for 8 280 like i think that's what see i think he's gonna cross the 300 threshold even if it's deferred money and stuff i think they want that number out there okay so how about this well we'll come to an agreement so 8 280 is going to be the guaranteed because it's $35 million. And then there's the extra years or whatever. Which gets them over $330 million. Yeah.

That's what I mean. It'll be something like that. I think you're right. I think the heart of the contract could be something like that, whereas the sticker price will be over $330 million. Right. The AAV is the only thing that matters. Absolutely. $35 million puts them ahead of Grangie. And opt-outs and all that stuff matter in context. Right. So,

if we're projecting the offseason during that time, you're going to have the Harper contract, a Hoskins contract, a Nola contract. That's three pretty big money guys. You can't be dishing out $50 million to Andrew McCutcheon. Oh, I agree. You can't be trying to fill in holes because you're going to have to lay out $40 million for Mike Trout. So the development of the young guys is just as important in landing Trout as clearing the bankroll.

I like that. I think it's a good take. All right, final thoughts, Frenzy. Final thoughts is that Oduba Herrera has been working out with Miggy every single day of the soft season. Only guy down there. He's the first guy in camp. He ended last season at 232.

That's how much he weighed, not as bad on the average, even though it almost got there. He was weighing 232. That's how much he weighed. Not as bad on the average, even though it almost got there. He was weighing 232 pounds at the end of last year. He is down to 212, which is strong. I'm here for it. He was there every day at 730, and they were worried that he wasn't going to be there because he's been a bit aloof in the past. There at 730, he was working out with Miggy. He's down 20 pounds.

Odubel Herrera is going to finish top 10 in MVP this year. Whoa! What? I love it. He's going to finish top 10 in MVP. Hashtag pro-Double, baby. He is too talented not to. He's going to put it all together. 27 is when a player reaches his

peak. Very true. I think that's the thing with Odubel that we don't talk about enough is that he's only 27. It feels like he's been here for so long, he's been the best player on the team for a couple years, all that stuff. Still a young guy. And here's the other thing. Odubel Herrera, he never played above double A. That's a great point.

He was a Rule 5 guy. That's a great point. He never had the development. You know what? That's something that is not talked about ever. The fact that he didn't have that type of development. No one talks about how he was a second baseman playing center field. Well, he was a second baseman, yeah.

And everyone's like, well, why aren't you a gold glover out there yet? Yeah, because I was a second baseman my whole life. I just learned this. Right. Adubo, I think he is completely locked in, completely focused. If you get 162 games, I'll say 145 games of locked in Adubo Herrera. Oh, my God. I mean, that's the difference between first place and a wild card potentially

or that type of thing. I mean, it could be a massive difference. So the official Jack Fritz prediction, Adubo Herrera, top 10, MVP voting, and he's an all-star once again. That's a bold prediction. Okay. I like it. My final thought, rate and review the podcast. Do it for

Jack. It makes him so happy. And also a good week of reviews. Ooh, really? Yeah, we got like three more. You gotta send me some of these so I can check them out. Yeah, listen. Give us reviews. It helps us. Help us grow the podcast. Yes. We want to be the official podcast of the Phillies. All that fun stuff. Help us grow it. We really appreciate

it. And you guys are the best so you can help us. Again, we love the High hopes listeners so much i'm getting there i know what you're talking about maybe something coming right well we're getting t-shirts we're getting t-shirts that was my other final thought uh the first thing i said if i see a high hopes listener at citizens bank park with a high hopes t-shirt I will come up to you with tears in my eyes, say I love you, and I cannot wait for it. And then I'll buy you a beer. Yes.

Or drink a choice, or food a choice, whatever. I'll buy you whatever you want. If I see a human being other than me and you and people related to us wearing a High Hopes shirt, you will never see a happier person. No, and you, person wearing the High Hopes shirt, will instantly become my new favorite person. Which is, you know, if you care about us, that's a nice thing. Right.

We love you. Of course. So, look out for the shirts. We'll put out a link once they're all here. I think they ordered them yesterday, so they should be here soon. Cannot wait. And again, rate and review the podcast. And we will either be talking to you one week from now, or preferably an emergency pod.

Maybe Saturday. Maybe Saturday. Or maybe after the Super Bowl. Either way, can't wait emergency pod. Maybe Saturday. Maybe Saturday! Or maybe after the Super Bowl. Either way, can't wait to talk to you guys. All-Star Closer, Ken Lee Jansen, we have a question. What's the best podcast of all time? Baseball isn't boring, baby. I'm Rob Bradford, and every single day I'm sitting down with the biggest names

to show you this great game is the greatest game. It's my podcast. It's my passion. It's a cause I started more than two years ago and is now the most prolific national daily baseball pod

there is. Another fact. So jump aboard the B.I.B. Express. Follow and listen to Baseball Isn't Boring presented by Wasabi Hot Cloud Storage

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