High Hopes: A Phillies Podcast - The High Hopes Phillies Podcast: The Bryce Harper Meeting is Upon Us With Bob Nightengale

Episode Date: January 10, 2019

The Bryce Harper meeting is only a few days away and Bob Nightengale of the USA Today joins James Seltzer and Jack Fritz to discuss the Harper meeting and where things stand heading into the weekend (6:48). The guys also discuss the chances of landing both Harper and Machado and more! See omnystudio.com/policies/listener for privacy information. To learn more about listener data and our privacy practices visit: https://www.audacyinc.com/privacy-policy Learn more about your ad choices. Visit https://podcastchoices.com/adchoices

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Visit td.com slash small business match to book an appointment with one of our advisors. This is the High Hopes Podcast. High Hopes. It's a bunch of baseball nerds. Well, without the computers. Talking about the Philadelphia Phillies. On Radio.com and Sports Radio 94 WIP. Yo, it is another edition of the High Hopes Podcast.

I'm James Seltzer with me, my man Jack Fritz. And coming up in just a few minutes, we have a guest action. We have Bob Nightingale from USA Today. He's been all over the Bryce Harper situation from the jump we dive in. You're going to want to hear what he has to say because I think it's going to make you feel good. We're going to get to that in a little bit first. Jackie, what's up, buddy? James, I legitimately think I'm going to make you feel good. We're going to get to that in a little bit first. Jackie, what's up, potty?

James, I legitimately think I'm going crazy. I know. Saturday, man. It's all about Saturday. James, it's not even Saturday. I don't know if you've been on Twitter, but obviously I never leave Twitter for most of the day. What's Twitter? Is that a thing?

No, I mean you are, but you're not like- I'm not like you. That's very fair. Within the last 24 hours, right? Have you seen the MLB The Show controversy? Oh, I've been very intrigued by the mlb the show thing what are they doing uh it seems like they're trying to break news dude it's crazy so so they tweet they tweet um last night they said cancel saturday plans in relation to

the bryce harper thing and then wait you're missing one there was one yesterday during the day where the mark feinstein report about momentum gaining for the Nash for Bryce Harper, go back to the nationals. They quote tweeted it and put hashtag the lies. We all tell ourselves. So there was that heading into cancel Saturday plans. We all know what's happening Saturday and the, the,

uh, the video today, right? Well, no, but the link to that, that little mini video yesterday on the cancel Saturday plans, it was,

it was dash Bryce Fanatic. Yeah. And then in it, wasn't there a 1776 reference somewhere there too? Today was a number better than 76. But I think that's in

relation to Fallout. I don't know. This is what I mean. This is what I mean. I'm going crazy. Also. Real quick. We're at the age where

it is conceivable that a video game could break the news. He's on the cover. That's the point. That's what I'm saying. The whole plan of this whole entire thing was to have him unleash the jersey on the cover of Emily the Show. Which makes a ton of sense. So I'm going crazy with that.

I'm also going crazy because if you go on the Phillies website and you try to make a customizable Harper 34 jersey, they don't let you do it. They don't let you do it. But't let you do it but you can do a machado number eight jersey which like if you so it's not like you can physically make it but once you try to add it to the cart it doesn't let you do it first of all i love that you did that well i was it was i'm not gonna take credit for it it was it was sent to me saying i love whoever did that because that is that is some deep deep stuff oh my I mean, it's one thing when everyone's like, oh, look who they're following on Instagram or whatever. Everyone does that now. That's

some next level stuff right there. It's crazy. And then you have Kevin Matsuzak. I don't know how to say his last name. Yeah, I know. And now, see, he's not always serious ever on Twitter, but he's broken. He was serious like 0% of the time almost. I know, but he's broke the DeMarco Murray to the Eagles story. He broke the Alshon Jeffries story to the Eagles two years ago.

And he's now saying that Bryce Harper can be a silly. Like, I want to believe. Listen, I will believe anything. Like, I am all in. Everyone's saying he's going to sign on Saturday. Saturday will be the outside of, well, maybe more important than marrying Jill. Saturday. I'm just kidding.

Jill's not listening right now. But Saturday is going to be like- Top five most important days of your life. The first report that comes out post-Saturday is going to be the most important document in human history. Oh, God. I'm like, I can't even. Like, I'm so ready for this.

I'm all in on the MLB the show thing. I'm totally buying- I think it's real. It's gotta be. I mean, it's so aggressive. But that's the thing is it feels so over the top and so aggressive. I mean, that is like Mark Feinsand, who is a very well-respected baseball reporter, puts out a report, a report saying momentum gaining for going back to the Nationals and a video

game is saying, no, this is BS. Sorry. It's a lie. Not true. I mean, it's crazy. We are in a crazy time right now, Jack, with this BS. Sorry, it's a lie. Not true. I mean, it's crazy. We are in a crazy time right now, Jack, with this stuff. But that does all make sense, right? It makes sense.

I feel like I'm the Charlie Day gif. You feel like you're a me gif? Yeah. In the mail room? Or like Carrie in Homeland. All the same thing. I feel like I'm going crazy. I feel you.

It's amazing, though. This is what we live for. It's a good crazy. I haven't focused on work in years. I'm just literally. You can tell. Yeah. People say that my performance has been slacking around here for years.

But it is wild. I am so excited for Saturday. My body is ready for Saturday. If it comes out that he's coming, I am going to get so drunk and be so happy. Honestly, I don't care about the Eagles game on Sunday if they sign Bryce Harper. I do not care.

It is secondary. I will agree it's secondary. I still care. I care. I think the afternoon show had a poll which it was like what do you want more in a win on Sunday or Bryce Harper Simon to Phillies and it was like 70% a win on Sunday I was like are you people crazy yeah it's like I want to win on Sunday too but we're talking about the next decade of having Bryce Harper here I mean come on let's be real here like even when I'm

gonna be watching the game I'm gonna be envisioning Bryce Harper at Citizens Bank Park. It's, I, I want it so bad, Jack. I want it so desperately bad. I can't, it's one of those things where, and you and I have been very firm in this. We have said from the jump. I've been firm since last night. That's good. Oh, man. We have been very firm firm different kind of firm very firm about we think

that bryce harper is coming to philadelphia we set it from the jump we haven't wavered even with all the bs out there i still can't believe it's real like even though i believe it's gonna happen even though i've believed it's gonna happen for years now i've been saying it that look ahead to the class bryce harper is gonna be a philly until it happens ahead to the class. Bryce Harper's going to be a Philly. Until it happens, it's not real to me. I need it to be real. Me too. I completely agree with you. But if and when.

If and when. What a nerdy podcast this is. I love it. We're just like geeking out. It's going to be great. And Bob Nightingale is going to help us geek out even more. We're going to get to that in just one second. And we'll dive into the Machado stuff too because I feel like there's been a more intrigue around Machado as of late, more information coming out.

Yeah. The Yankees may be out and all that type of stuff. Tell you what, I feel really bad for those Yankees fans. I didn't know they were getting cheap. What a tough life, man. Didn't know they were getting cheap. Hate to see it. Can you imagine?

It must be real tough to be the Yankees. All right, let's get to it because I think we've teased it enough. And this whole the reason Jack and I sound so giddy right now is because we just spoke to Bob Nightingale. And you're going to listen to it. So let's get to it. Here's Bob Nightingale. And it is our distinct pleasure to welcome to the High Hopes podcast baseball columnist from USA Today and the man who has been all over the Bryce Harper situation this offseason, the man who has many times gotten us excited. We're waiting for that column to come out that will finally put us over the top,

but the one, the only, Mr. Bob Nightingale joins us on the show. Bob, thank you so much for joining us today. Sure, my pleasure. Thank you, guys. Well, Bob, you've been all over this Bryce Harper situation from the show. Bob, thank you so much for joining us today. Sure, my pleasure. Thank you, guys. Well, Bob, you've been all over this Bryce Harper situation from the beginning. Let's start, and obviously we'll get into Saturday. Big day, big meeting coming up. Philadelphia Phillies fans, basically it's the biggest day of our life, a lot of us feel like. Bob, I haven't slept in days, honestly. I haven't stopped thinking about it. It's all we can think about, Bob. But let's go back about a month and a half ago.

You kind of got the ball rolling for Phillies fans with an article that came out. We had you on the WIP Midday Show about it to discuss it. The basic premise of the article was, in your eyes, Bryce Harper to the Phillies, you can bank on it, I think was the terminology you used. The last month and a half, two months since then, has anything kind of wavered you on that stance? It really hasn't. The only thing that's come into effect since I wrote that column was the Nationals haven't gone away.

At that time, the Nationals said, hey, we offered $300 million. He turned it down. See you later. We offered $300 million. He turned it down. See you later. Since that time, the Nationals have remained engaged. To what degree?

No one's really sure. That's the only difference. So they're still in the mix. And the Phillies and the White Sox, and I think the Phillies will blow away the White Sox in the other offer. And the Cubs and the Cubs and Dodgers haven't set forward with any offers. So I really think it comes down to Phillies and Nationals. And with the Nationals, Bob, how are they going to make this work money-wise?

That's the one thing I can't get past. I mean, Rendon's a free agent after next year. They already are paying a boatload of money to the starting staff. How would they do this? They're at the luxury tax, I think, today after the Dozier signing got them to $200 million. How would they finagle this? Yeah, let's say you still don't care

about the luxury tax. They've gone over it three straight years. This could be a fourth. You're talking about a 50% penalty as well if you sign a guy like Harper. And they would like to have Rendon. So you're right. It'd just be a matter of being like the Red Sox a little bit or the Yankees back today where you just don't care about the money spent.

That's the only way they could do it. But because, you know, since he turned down that contract, you know, just looking this up this morning, they've dropped $190 million in free agent money. So I don't know how you do that in the Santa Harper to $300 million plus. Bob, with those numbers that are put out there, where do you think the market is right now for Bryce Harper? Obviously $300 million was the offer. People have said the Nationals have pushed that offer

potentially even further past that. What type of ballpark do you think the Phillies are looking at if they want to get this done? You know, I mean, I'm not sure they increased their offer. I think there was an annuity involved. The money was deferred. So it's probably worth anywhere between $250 and $284 when you factor in everything else.

So I would think for them to make sure the Nationals aren't involved, you've got to go probably more toward the 350 mark. So I would think maybe a 10-, 12-year contract between 300 and 350 would be at least a starting point to get it done. Probably 12 years. We've heard a lot about the Stanton contract, the 13 years, $325 million, and Harper wanting to surpass that.

How important is it to Bryce Harper, to Scott Boras, to their group? How important it is for them to get the highest, both AAV and also highest number of total dollars in a contract? Is that something that is imperative to them? Well, I mean, I think they'd like to have it, you know, for Eagle to set the standard in baseball. I mean, when Stanton signed that contract, he was even a free agent. So he didn't have open bidding like Harper has.

He was even a free agent, so he didn't have open bidding like Harper has. So I think they would view it as a little bit of an embarrassment considering how young he is and everything else, and more athletic that they'd have to take less than Stanton or barely even more than what A-Rod got in A-Rod's contract, and the original one was signed in 2001. So I think that part's more important. Let's help out everybody else here. The union will be ecstatic.

You've got to at least get over $300 million. Scott, do you buy into any of the he-doesn't-want-to-play-here stuff with Bryce Harper? The only thing I've heard is that there's been concern just the way the families have been treated a little bit at the ballpark as visitors. The Phillies fans can be rough, so can fans everywhere for that matter. I think the one thing the Phillies have got to do when they go there Saturday is say,

you know what, it's completely different, you as a home player compared to you as a visitor. You know, you'd be beloved here. You're not going to get booed. No one's going to taunt the family in the stands. That sort of thing. You know, maybe even say, hey, talk to

guys. Talk to Chase Utley, who played all those years. Talk to Jimmy Rollins, who made his home there. Maybe Jason Wirth? Yeah, maybe. And it's really worth knowing the area. And Wirth and Harper are very close friends. And talk to Cole Hamels, who still has a place there.

That sort of thing. So I think they just have to kind of be their more eyes wide open than saying, okay, as a visitor, we have the best experience there. All right, Bob, well, you just mentioned it Saturday, the big meeting. We're all just, you know, there are pictures of the Phillies boarding the plane on Twitter. I mean, everyone is losing their minds. What can you tell us about Saturday?

What do you know about this upcoming meeting? Well, it's the first time they've had Harper involved. Before it was Boris talking to the front office there, Andy McVeigh and Matt Klintock. Now you have John Middleton there. It throws a whole different, raises the stakes considerably because he's the one signing the check and everything else. He does have a nice rapport with Scott Boris.

And when the White Sox met with them earlier, and so did other teams, Jerry Reinsdorf was not on that trip. He did not meet with Harper. So I think it really helps the fact that John Milton's there and everybody that's involved in the decision will be there. I can't see them making an offer, you know, to Bryce Harper there, and everybody that's involved in the decision will be there. I can't see them making an offer to Bryce Harper there, but I would think they'd make one by Monday or Tuesday, and both sides would come away,

hey, there's a real good chance of this happening, or it's not going to. But for John Milton to be on that trip, I think it's a fabulous sign that they want to get this thing done. Do you think it's a good sign that this is their second meeting with him? How important do you think that is, getting a second meeting? They're progressing towards something? Well, I think the first one was just kind of, hey, where are you? What kind of money are we talking about?

That sort of thing. But I think the face-to-face with Harper, that's the big thing, that they haven't had that yet. And if Harper wasn't considering Philadelphia, if they weren't that serious about Harper, there's no way they would spend an entire day together, which they plan to do. So I just think the fact that Harper's there. It was just a meeting with Boris about Harper.

I would say that's a bad sign. But the fact that Harper and his wife will be there, and John Middleton, I think is a great sign. Speaking of Middleton, we've heard the whole stupid money thing and all that. And I think a lot of people in Philly, that's kind of one of those, a risky thing to do if you're John Middleton, in the sense that it does raise some expectations. What has been your you're John Middleton in the sense that it does raise some expectations. What has been your take on John Middleton during this process, and how desperate is he to actually go out and pony up what it takes to make this happen? Yeah, I like him. I've got to know him a little bit over the year at the owners' meetings.

And he was the one who told me that quote, we're going to spend some stupid money we have to. You know, kind of a laughing type of thing. But I think the fact, you know, it's almost like when you're the Yankees, man, everybody loved George Stonemer. If the Phillies, you know, hey, you would love John Milton. You know, if he wants to give him $500 million, $600 million, who cares? It's his money. It's not the fans' money.

So you want your owner to be aggressive. You want an owner that's tired of the rebuild movement and say, you know what, I was disgusted by what happened in September. I don't want to be on the playoffs anymore. I want to go to this thing. I mean, even when you have your own president, Andy McPhail, as John Milton told me, saying, hey, we've still got years after this.

We don't have to go all in one free agent winner. He kind of laughs it off, saying, well, hey, I'm the owner. I'm going to do what I want to do. Good. We're all for that, Bob. Sounds good to me, Bob. Because I'll tell you, a lot of people here in Philly were like, wait a minute, he said stupid money. This guy's saying they don't have to spend anything.

What's going on, Bob? Yeah, and I think the only thing is, and we talked about this, that you do set yourself up for expectation. Right. That if you don't get Harper or Machado, then it's considered a failure. You know, I mean, let's be honest. Eddie McCutcheon's a nice player. You know, he's not nearly the same player as he was.

And, you know, he's nothing compared to Harper Machado. So, you know, Dan Roberts is a nice reliever, you know, on and on. But, yeah, I think it would be a huge disappointment in Philadelphia if you don't get one of those two guys. Oh, it'd be massive. It'd be massive. But also along those lines, is there anything that the players' agents use? Do they look at that and say, all right, John Middleton's willing to spend stupid money. We're going to take advantage of that.

Does it work both ways? Oh, sure. I'm here in Detroit. You know, Scott Boras should always go to Mike Illich. And, you know, they sign Prince Fielder. Sure, yeah. All these guys, you know, Berliner got his money. So on and on.

But, yeah, the agents. Cabrera, all that stuff, yeah. Yeah, agents love the owners that will spend money. And, you know, there's hardly any people like that anymore. Everybody's so worried about, you know, the future and, you know, finances, everything else. The bottom line is all these teams are making a killing. I mean, all 30 teams they want to could afford Bryce Harper. It's just who wants to do it.

And I think it's great for Philly fans to say, hey, our owner wants to do it. We don't care. Whereas in places like in L.A. and Chicago, talking to people there, they're very disappointed and frustrated. Like, wait a minute. We have as much money as the Phillies, and how come we're not doing that?

Yeah, Bob, and today you tweeted, which you can always follow Bob, on Twitter. You mentioned how the White Sox haven't approached $200 million, or he's been offered a contract of $200 million. That seems kind of light on Manny Machado. Do you think there's a window here

where the Phillies could bring in both of these guys? I think it's possible. They'd be very interesting if it happened. Improbable considering the money involved. If you're the White Sox, you're thinking

the same with the Phillies too. On Machado, it's like, well, we're not going to bid against ourselves. Let's see here. I think the White Sox probably have a lower same with the Phillies, too. On Machado, it's like, well, we're not going to bid against ourselves. Let's see here. And so I think the White Sox probably have a lower bid than the Phillies, saying, you know what, we think you'd like to be the face of our franchise here, a great city in Chicago, and see what happens. You know, I think teams across the board, you know, nobody thinks that Harper, Machado will get the kind of money that they're seeking.

I get the sense that Harper will. I'm starting to get a whole lot of doubts that Machado will. All right, Bob. Last question. And obviously, this is just your opinion, obviously not reporting or anything, but if you here sitting here on January the 10th, heading up to this meeting on Saturday, if I asked you, where does Bryce Harper end up, where does Manny Machado end up, what would you say? I'm going to stick with the Phillies with Machado. I'm not going to stick with Harper. That's what I'm talking about, Bob.

That's what I'm talking about, Bob. I just think it's more probable than ever before, particularly that the big boys aren't involved. The Cubs aren't involved. The Dodgers. Young Dodgers are probably his first choice because he lives in Vegas and spring training in Arizona and everything else. But yeah, I

still got Bryce Harper going to the Phillies. And I had Manny Machado going to the Yankees. I'm going to switch now. I'm going to have Machado in the White Sox. I think he may fall in the laps. And let's be honest, the White Sox are really rooting for Harper to go to the Phillies. Yeah, I bet. They got the whole family reunion out there, right? Bob, is there anyone else they can bring in from the Machado family tree?

Does Machado's wife play baseball? Can she hop on the White Sox lineup there? I know. I was really surprised by the first one. Just a brother-in-law. He's a nice player. And those guys are best of one. Just a brother-in-law. Yeah. He's a nice player. And those guys are best of friends.

They're not just friends. Best of friends. John Jay makes sense. He's a nice player. Nice extra outfielder. But, yeah, it's funny. And they admit to it, too. I mean, they know there was a factor that you're bringing all of his friends. And who doesn't want to play with your buddies?

Thanksgiving in Chicago. It's creative, right? Yeah. I'll give them points for being creative, right? Yeah, it's creative. I'll give him points for being creative, right? I mean, it's an interesting thought. I don't know if I would. It depends on the money, right?

You know, $50 million or extra or going to play with my buddies, I'm probably taking the $50 million, but maybe it doesn't come down to that. Bob. Yeah, and the fact is those guys are being around for one year. Yeah, that's another great point. Yeah, that's another great point. Yeah, it's another great point. Bob, thank you so much. Everyone follow his work, USA Today, and on Twitter, at BNightingale. I know that I have been constantly refreshing Bob's Twitter feed,

just waiting for him to break my news for me. So, Bob, let us know, man. We're waiting for it, and hopefully you'll be the one to get it. But regardless, thank you. Thank you so much for taking the time to meet with us today. Sure, my pleasure. And, yeah, good luck. It should be a fun weekend to see what happens in Vegas.

He's coming to Philly, Jack! It's happening! Bob Nightingale not wavering. Not wavering. For as much as the High Hopes podcast has never wavered, Bob Nightingale has never wavered less. And he might. Has never wavered less even make sense? No, no, it's the same.

But it's redundant. But he might have more inside information than us. I've been a pretty good Deleave reader this whole time. But yeah, no, Bob is. The reason why I wanted to bring on Bob more than other guys is because Bob is the Boris guy. Yep. All throughout the industry, everyone knows that he is the guy that links Boris guys to teams.

He linked J.D. Martinez. He's linked guys for years. This is just what he does. And I still continue to believe that the national stuff is smoke. I understand they could theoretically make it happen money-wise, but I don't care. I think it would be organizational malpractice to pay 50% of the luxury tax and not pay anything. I would rather have

Rendon than I would Harper if I'm them. Because you have Juan Soto, you have... From an organizational plot, I mean, I wouldn't, but I know what you're saying. Rendon fits a bigger need for them. Yes. But I would still take Bryce Harper, but I know what you're saying. Right. I'm just talking, for us, it's obviously different.

Right. For us, Harper is like a face of a franchise guy. For them, like they- Juan Soto, they have Victor Robles who hasn't even stepped on a major league field. And Victor Robles was a better prospect. It was a better, significantly better. I mean, Victor Robles was a top five prospect in all baseball. Yeah.

And I traded him. Yeah. I traded for Aaron Nola in my fantasy league. Wow. That was a great trade. That's a win by me. That was a great trade. So they have win by me. That was a great trade. So they have Robles, they have Soto, they have Adam Eaton,

they have a bunch of outfielders in the minor leagues. You don't need Bryce. You don't need Bryce. I just think it would be dumb. I feel like they're being used to help make Bryce more money. Teams do do that. Of course they do. Every year we see it.

Teams are loyal to their guys to a fault. Like, hey, we'll help you get more money. I don't know if they do that for a division rival, but if it's like $50 million more. It just doesn't make any sense, the Nationals think. Because today they've reached the $200 million threshold. Like they added already. The Adam Bryce Harper, they're over it.

Yeah, way, way, way over it. And like Bob said, look, they might not care. I think they do. And the Nationals have not been an organization to say F it, we don't care. That has not been their mentality always. So I think, look, I'm with you, Jack. I think

Bryce Harper's going to be a filly. I really do. I don't know if it happened Saturday or not. It seemed like Bob didn't think it would happen on Saturday, but I think that Bryce Harper is going to be a Philly. I really do. We'll get back to Harper. Let's dive into some of this Machado stuff, too,

because we've talked a lot of Harper so far, and there's been a lot of Machado info out there. John Heyman, who, you know, not my fave, but comes out and says he doesn't think the Yankees have even, or he can't confirm the Yankees haven't made an offer, but there's a chance the yankees might not have made an offer even to machado it seems like the yankees are not nearly as motivated as the phillies and the white socks are um obviously we talk with bob about the whole you know family thing the white socks are doing it's creative uh it's adorable it's adorable like they're gonna be there for a year and then john j

and his fourth outfielder type is just going to leave. You're going to sign John Jay to a lifetime contract to get Manny Machado. Whatever it takes, Jack. Is Yonder Alonzo going to be your DH forever? It's a bad fit for Yonder Alonzo.

What do you think about the Machado thing? How are you reading these tea leaves? You just hyped up what a great tea leaf reader you are? How are you reading these tea leaves? You just hyped up what a great tea leaf reader you are. So how are you reading these tea leaves? I think he's going to be a white sock, I guess. Because I don't think the Phillies want to do it. I don't think they want to sign both. Because I do think they do have their eye on a South Jersey native.

I know that's like, for some reason saying I think Mike Trout's going to be a Philly is like, well, do you even know what you're talking about in relation to the Phillies?

I just think that they have an eye on them. I don't know if they want to tie the books with two 200 plus million dollar contracts. I think they should. I think if I'm the Phillies

and you can get Manny Machado for 250 million. Oh my God. What a steal. It's a bargain. First off, Bryce Harper for 350 million is a bargain. First off, Bryce Harper for $350 million

is a bargain. Yes. And so would Manny Machado with $250 million. So I think if you get the chance to get both of those guys, just freaking do it, man. I'm with you, man.

Let's put it this way. And I was told that I was crazy when I said this yesterday by three people who work at WIP. I will not throw them under the bus, but I said,

I said it. Well, one of them was obviously turtle. I said that. I think it is more likely that the Eagles get both or excuse me, that the Phillies get both of these guys, then neither. Would you agree with that statement?

I would agree with that statement. Yeah, I think so too. They said that was asinine. They thought it was crazy well once again once again where's i guess i guess people think bryce harper can go back to the nationals maybe and i guess machado could be a white sock but like i think both would well i think harper would probably rather go back to washington but that's just because he he's feeling nostalgic i think once he came here he would love it i don't think i don't think manny machado wants to go to Chicago. The White Sox are horrible.

I was talking to a guy that covers Chicago sports or whatever, and he was like, the White Sox are irrelevant. No one cares. They are irrelevant. They're irrelevant in Chicago. I will say, I think that Rick Hahn's a good GM. They've done a nice job of restarting. They've got some young talent.

They have guys coming up. He's co-packed. I think they've got guys who can have a future. I like Yon Mankata still. I'm still in on him. Eloy? Yeah. Eloy Jimenez is a top two prospect in baseball.

Was it Luis Robert? They've got some talent coming up. I love him. I could understand it from a baseball perspective. From a wanting to be someone who matters in a city perspective, I can't see it. Because I'm with you. No one cares about the White Sox in Chicago.

They just don't. I know. It's like 70-30 probably in relation to Cubs-White Sox. I was going to say it's like 85-50. I'm not even kidding. Yeah, but here's the thing. There are White Sox fans. I'm not saying that there's no one to root for the team,

but they are absolutely the second-class team. Well, Obama was a White Sox fan. Sure. Great point. They have one notable fan. Here's the thing. If I'm the Phillies, and I have a chance to

sign two 26-year-old future Hall of Famers... Generational talents. Generational talents for both would be bargains. I mean, $250 million for... I think he signs for $250 million. Machado, you're talking about. Right.

Why wouldn't he just do that here? And if you're the Phillies, why wouldn't you do that? I understand there's the allure of Trout, but you can't plan for two years down the road. What if he signs a contract extension this offseason and you don't take the chance of getting Machado? Absolutely. I mean, I agree with you.

And here's the thing. They're starting staff in a couple years. The Phillies minor league system is so loaded with pitching prospects, they might not have to go and buy a legitimate starter. Because they might have it in-house. Like, Nola's going to get paid $30-plus million a year eventually, right? You hope Pavetta takes a leap. But then you have guys like Sixto, Spencer Howard, and Donis Padina.

Maybe you can just keep all those guys in house and not have to go spend big money on a pitcher and allocate all your resources on buying bats. That's what I would do. I just don't... This opportunity only comes up... Never. It's never happened.

It never came up where a team had so little money on their books but they can spend so much money and again we've said this before but it has to be repeated there have never been free agents like this in the history of baseball guys besides a rod besides a rod and even then a rod was a little bit older i think when he signed with texas i could be wrong he might have been this young but other than a rod and that's why to this point he was $252 million in 2001. A-Rod is the, other than A-Rod, it never, ever, ever happens where guys are this accomplished. And even then, A-Rod at 26 wasn't as accomplished as Bryce Harper was at 26. Dude, A-Rod was 25.

He was 25. Wow. But either way, A-Rod at that age, not as accomplished as Bryce Harper was. Just a fact in terms of numbers. Harper came up younger. A-Rod, they're similar, though. If you want to look at one guy, there's been one guy in the history of baseball

that's been a similar type of free agent as these guys. Well, A-Rod's... No, A-Rod was way better. A-Rod, by that point, was ridiculous. I mean, he had two 50 home run seasons. By the time he was 25? No, he had 52 and a couple 40s. Dude, but, hold on.

All right, but A-Rod... couple 40s. Hold on. All right. But A-Rod. That's insane. I didn't realize it was that good of a title. A-Rod in his first five full seasons batted 315 with a 384 OBP, 236 homers, averaged 40 a year. Wow. I think you're underrated. I'm underrated how good A-Rod was by 25.

I take it back. A-Rod looks ridiculous. Regardless, A-Rod is the only free agent in the history of baseball who's been this young with that much accomplishment and that type of future

who goes on the market it doesn't happen no I agree so damn that is insane by the way

oh my god no wonder I don't think you need to focus on the rest of this podcast I'm like floored like oh my god

it's absurdity and played shirt stop really well it's absurd I just think that they have to take advantage of this opportunity. And even if Trout becomes available, you can move a Machado contract. You can move a Harper contract. We just saw Giancarlo Stanton get traded.

Yeah. And then on top of that. And they're actually good in bargains rather than overpaid fraud who can't hit a slider. Also, though, on top of that, there are going to be opt can't hit a slider. Also, though, on top of that, there are going to be opt-outs in these contracts. Oh, yeah, no matter what. This is not going to be just 10 years. These guys are one of the two. If you sign them both

10-year, whatever, $250-$300 million contracts, one of the two is going to opt-out. Alright, can we go inside the meeting on Saturday for like five seconds? Yeah, please. Do you think there's come to a time where, like, how I envision it going down is like Middleton sitting in the corner, not sitting in the corner, sitting at the end of the table and he's just kind of not saying much and they're letting McPhail and Klintak try to negotiate.

And then the way I envision it is Middleton just being like, 350, I don't care, just do it. Like, just goes like a rational, like he doesn't say anything the whole meeting and then just comes in and like, just get it done, 350. Sign, like, irrational. Like, he doesn't say anything the whole meeting, and then just comes in and, like, just get it done. Sign the contract, Bryce. Yeah, I don't see Middleton sitting idly by in that meeting. I don't know if it'll play exactly like that, but I agree with you. I think, I think, and Bob, look.

But couldn't you see Boris being, like, or couldn't you see them trying to play hardball, and, like, Boris is, like, and then Middleton's be like, just pay him. No, no, do it. It's like Teddy KGB, just pay him. Pay that man his money. Yeah. It was okay, Teddy KGB.

It was not my best. I'm not a great, do you got a better Teddy KGB? Pay him. Pay that man, no, that was bad. No, see, it was even worse. Pay him. Pay that man his money. Oh, that was actually pretty good. Pay that man his money. That was bad. Say it was even worse. Pay him. Paid that man his money. Oh, that was actually pretty good.

Paid that man his money. That was worse. The one in there was solid. And then I got it in my head. Yeah. Call me Mark Alfreds. But yeah, just pay that man his money, John. I do agree with you in the sense that I think, and look, Bob hit on that.

The fact that Middleton's going to this meeting, I can't believe that Jerry Reinsdorf didn't go to that meeting. What an idiot. They don't want him. I'm sorry. The White Sox are posturing. They do not want to pay the kind of money that it's going to take to get Well, maybe, although I did hear that a part- Jerry Reinsdorf is the cheapest owner in baseball.

Okay, but- For a long time, other than the Marlins now and all that. But, but, but, but, but but what i've heard is that i read an article i don't know why i'm saying what i've heard jackie sources right but what i read what i read is that part of the comcast deal they signed was you have to start spending money ah okay so that would make sense that's why they're actually probably even interested in these guys no because yeah ryan surf is a classic i'm screw that yeah i'm not spending money on that guy which makes no sense.

But supposedly Comcast is, like, forcing them. Or I should say, you know, I'm guessing by now it's Jerry Reinsdorf is, like, Weekend at Bernie's and they're just kind of propping him up and bringing him around places and whatnot. Not our owner, though. No. Our owner is a freaking swinging dick going out there being like, let's go, baby.

Yeah. I do think Middleton is the linchpin to this whole thing. I agree. The X factor. Everything that's coming out right now screams that the Phillies are just trying to get the best deal possible. And honestly, I don't blame them. Why would I try to pay $50 million more than I have to?

Well, it was what you talked about. I mean, that was one of your main points heading into this whole situation was I don't want them to A-Rod themselves. I don't want them to pay $50 million more than any other team just because they get put into that position and they're forced to believe what they're told. Yeah, and everything that's coming out right now just screams to me that they're trying to get the best deal possible. Everyone's freaking out that they haven't gone to $300 million

with Manny Machado. It's like, if the White Sox are going... If you don't have to pay for it. Why would I? Here's what I want everyone to understand. Is that no matter what happens, the Phillies are going to get a final offer. It's not like they're going to be like,

oh, they gave us 300. Sorry guys, they gave us 300. So we're not even going to ask you. Right. So no matter what happens, just remember the Phillies are going to get at least a last bid in or maybe the team will,

or the Phillies will make the offer and another team will have a chance to say no to that. So like everything's coming out right now with contracts. Like if the White Sox go to 280 and the Phillies have make the offer, and another team will have a chance to say no to that. So everything's coming out right now about the contracts. If the White Sox go to 280 and the Phillies have to go to 300, then that's their last bid. It's going to happen. Just because they haven't come out and be like,

all right, just take our $300 million. I don't care. That's just stupid negotiating. That doesn't make any sense. So everyone just calm down. I'm with you. I totally agree. I don't want them to pay more than they have to.

I agree. Yeah. It could be the difference have to. I agree. Yeah. It could be the difference between getting a reliever. Yeah. $20 million. It's a significant amount of money, Jack. Right. So, like, listen, if they have to pay $50 million more, whatever.

I'm just saying right now, I think it's still so early. I know it's crazy to say this, but it's still so early in the actual contract offering stage. Like, there's only been one contract offer out there. By the way, can we rip baseball for that? Baseball is horrible. I mean, I really think they need to fix this. There's going to be a strike. I mean, there's no doubt in my mind there's going to be a strike.

Oh, there's going to be a strike. But even outside that, just in terms of just with the free agency, period. And because like I do agree, there's going to be a strike. And it wouldn't shock me at all if there, not that there's collusion or whatever, but that owners talk and they're like, all right, no one go above this price. We're not setting this number. Whatever. I think that stuff happens.

Again, I'm basically saying they're colluding. But I'm with you, Jack. This is a real issue for the sport. It takes away excitement. I mean, you think about the NBA. You think about the NFL. Like, those offseasons matter. And baseball used to

matter that's my point baseball used to i mean the nba offseason nba is a 12-month sport now and baseball used to be and it's not i mean this is a dead time right now and the fact that these guys are going so long even just to even if it's not a 12-month sport make it a month where people are excited about baseball free agency and not you know baseball free agency opens the big guys will sign in three months and enjoy. Like, it's a real problem. Yeah, I mean, they're doing everything wrong. They are.

I don't understand why they're so anti-entertainment and why they're so anti, like, basketball has shifted everything to make everything. It doesn't have to be the same way it's been for 150 years or whatever. Like, it doesn't have to be. You can change things. Guess what? Innovate.

Be different. Yeah, I know. It's really frustrating because the entry over the soft scenes, It doesn't have to be. You can change things. Guess what? Innovate. Be different. Yeah. I know. It's really frustrating because the entry over this offseason has been ridiculous. I mean, everyone is consuming all kinds of content because people want to know what's going on. And I guess it's good if they drag it out because it makes our job better. But from the overall standpoint of... Fan enjoyment.

Yeah. This is just brutal. Yes. And on top of that... What sucks is that the middle tier is getting... Like, he has my grand doll signed a one-year contract

for $18 million. It's crazy. Like, that guy's one of the top five catchers in baseball. Easily. He should be signed a four-year $60 million

or something like that. Well, supposedly he offered it. I don't know if he actually did. But it was disgusting. That's the type of deal that he should be getting, though. Maybe he chose.

Maybe he said, I want to make more this year and bet on myself. Whatever. But I agree with you. I think there's a real issue there. And I mean, regardless, look, let's hope it works out for the Phillies this offseason and all that.

But I think it's a real issue with the way it's set up and interesting. And also the point where, yes, there's been a lot of content and stuff, but we're at the point where it's been so long that no one believes anything they read anymore. No one cares. I saw that Mark Feinstein report yesterday, and again, very good report, and I was like, whatever. I was like, I don't believe anything. Yeah, I'm dead to it all.

It's all fostering. And that's the problem. That's a problem, because then that takes away the actual interest. It turns people off to a point. Yeah, it's all the agents, and the agents are leaking stuff. Baseball is run by agents. That's crazy. And the thing that stinks the most about this impending work stoppage,

it's going to be right after the Phillies get Mike Trout. Yeah, that's a great point. Can you imagine how horrible that would be? It would be. No, I don't even want to talk. It's Jack. It's a fun podcast. We're thinking about positivity.

I'm going to pose a fun question to you. Okay. If John Middleton goes out there on Saturday and gets it done, does he become Jack Middleton? Is he cool enough to get to Jack? For me, yes. Yeah. I think he's Jack Middleton after this.

First off, all Johns sound better with the name Jack. Obviously. It's just a fact. I mean, Jack's just one of the best names possible. And Jack Middleton is a... It's a strong name. That's a freaking alpha name. That's what I'm saying. Jack Middleton's here. Look's a strong name. That's a freaking alpha name.

That's what I'm saying. Jack Middleton's here. Look out. Be careful. Jack will get you. Absolute alpha. But he's got to sign him. Otherwise, he's John.

Yeah. I do wonder if it's going to happen. A lot of people are speculating it's going to happen on Saturday. I don't think it is. I don't think it is either. Again, I'm also at the point where I don't think it's ever going to happen. Like anything, no one's ever signing. They're stopping baseball.

That's the way it feels like. Yeah, so maybe early next week. The first report after that. Last time we did a pod, we were like, this is the week for Machado. I know. It wasn't. Spoiler alert, it wasn't. I actually think Harper's going to sign before Machado. Look, I think that makes sense

in the sense that I think that Harper is the pri-prized asset, and thus I think that he will set the market, and that's what it will be. And I also think that for the Phillies, I think Machado is more of a backup plan. And look, they might get both, depending on what the pricing is and stuff, but I think, as we've all thought from the beginning, Harper was their No. 1 target, and it will affect what they want to offer Machado so the Machado market is is kind of unsure at the moment because Harper's still out there and Harper doesn't have to wait out the Yankees exactly like

I think I I the way I'm reading it is that Machado is waiting at the Yankees seeing if they'll ever offer him anything if they don't he'll go to the White Sox or the Phillies will just be like F it we'll get both of you here Harper he really only has two suitors and it's us and the Nationals. I still think the Nationals are a... Paper tiger almost. Yeah. I just don't fully believe it. And with him, like the Dodgers, no.

Cubs, no. Doesn't want to be a White Sox. I mean, look, Bob Nightingale even said it. Bob Nightingale said it. He said that the Dodgers and the Cubs just aren't in. They've just never been in on this. And neither have the Yankees. So he doesn't have to.

Machado is waiting out the Yankees to get some kind of offer from them. And it's, I mean, that's why they're the Yankees. It's like, dude, stop being so thirsty. Jeez, forget it. You want to be a Yankee. God. I know. Thirsty.

He should win the Memorial Thirsty Award of the Week for wanting to be a Yankee so good. I don't think he should. I think it's still you. I thought it was an award you guys give out. Like isn't it a weekly... I don't listen to the podcast. It's the James Seltzer Memorial Thirsty. I'm not saying it should be. I'm saying he should win the James Seltzer Memorial Thirstiest Award of the Week.

No, I just... I don't care if you guys... Oh yeah, you seem like you're doing okay, buddy. I don't listen to the podcast. I don't know anything about it. Okay, sure. This is the only podcast I care about, all right? As we both have our Go-Birds podcast. Yeah, well, I care about that, too.

All right, let me ask you something. So, let's say they bring in a Harper or Machado. This scenario does not work if they get both of them. It's only one of them. Do you think then they go crazy and bring in a Keiko bring in more Wilhelm pieces and try to ramp it up? Or do you think that if they don't get these guys, which we don't think they will

do they just going to sit out the rest of free agency? I don't know. I know what you're saying. I know what you're getting at. I don't think I think that if they don't get either, it's a different story. I think that then they try to do some things to kind of make up for it. Hey, look, we got Dallas Keuchel. Hey, AJ Pollock.

Hey, look at AJ Pollock. He's good. But I don't think, I think that if they get, I don't think, I think that getting one of those guys has always been part of their plan. And I think that they are still executing that plan. My main reason for asking this is that I think that if they get Machado or Harper, then I think they go and get a Keichel

and they go get Moustakas. I think they trade Franco and they bring in Moustakas and they get Harper. I just think they start going crazier because I think their window to win is expedited. Where if they don't get these guys, do we really want to pay Dallas Keuchel? No, I agree with you. This all comes into my theory.

See, I go the other way. I disagree. Really? I think they, I think, look, let's put it this way. I think that they are looking at that decision independent of the Harper decision right now. Okay. But I know what you're saying. I think it's interesting. I hope not. I don't

want them to go spend money on Dallas Keigel either way. How about that? Well, here's where I come down to get Dallas Keigel thing. I was actually watching him this week. I was just trying to make sure. I was trying to reconfirm my previous biases. And I came away not as hating him as much. Wow.

Just from the sense that he could still, I think he's still good. I think Arrieta is done. I think Arrieta is finished. Well, we talked about this. I think Keiko ages better regardless. Right. So, Arrieta only has one year left, basically. This is basically a contract year for him. If you can get rid of Arrieta after this year

and then Keiko becomes your four theoretically, don't hate it. Don't hate that idea. It all depends on money. It all depends on money. And Keuchel, I just think he ages fine to a 3.5 to 4 ERA.

Jack loves Dallas Keuchel. That's a big takeaway. And he'll eat a bunch of innings. Big Dallas Keuchel fan over here. So yeah, there's the there's the linchpin this whole offseason, which is these guys coming. I don't know if then they really... Because if you're going to get

a hard-run Machado, I've said this a million times, how are you going to next season with Arrieta as your number two and hopefully a Pavetta leap? I agree. Look, I think they're going to do something else regardless. And the other rumor that came out this week was their continued interest in Mike Moustakis. And for the interest in Mike Moustakis, whatever, that's just a report.

They do not care about Michael Franco one bit. Thank you. It's crazy. Well done, Philly. He is not even in their like, their stratosphere. Like, the fact that they're, like, doing this, like, no matter what, Franco will not be the third baseman this year. Yeah, I agree, and that's the way I felt.

Jack, it must be lonely with no one on Michael Franco. Well, there's still some. I'm just not one of them. Finally! I got off it. But, everyone's like, well, Moustakas is a linear move to Franco. Well, he's not... Like, heoustakas is a linear move to Franco. Well, he's not. He at least has 35-plus homer potential.

And he has, like, if you watched Franco last year and he told me his batting average is 270, I would say you're crazy. It's the ugliest 270 I've ever seen in my life. It's never consistent. It's always up and downs. You can't bank on him. At least with Moustakas here here you can bank 35 homers. You know what you're going to get.

You know what you're going to get. Solid defense. And honestly, they can sign to a one-year, two-year deal. It would be a one-year deal. I would bet on it. And he can just be a stopgap

for Alec Baum. I think that's the idea. Or Arenado or Rendon. Like if they can, if Moustakas is a one-year stopgap where he can pop 35 homers for you, cool. I'm cool with it.

Wow. I feel like everything I'm cool with it. Wow. I feel like everything I say you eventually come around to. I just have to do more research. You yelled at me last year when I suggested going after Mike Moustakas. Well, at that time it was justifiable. It was justifiable. All right. It's a different story now.

Saturday. We'll be ready to go. Saturday. Ready to go saturday if we're gonna be ready to go i'm gonna have my computer and the recording up so that 30 seconds after he signed with us i'm not i'm uh i i'm i am making no plans for saturday yes it's a wide open day well i don't do that anyway fritz final thoughts final thoughts is I I just I I want to speak can't even speak

oh wait no I do have a final thought I have two final thoughts how did you go from none to two because I was scrolling through my timeline that's good I want a live cam on on John Middleton I want to know what he's doing because I just I just envision him being like F at 350

I don't care and turns into Jack Middleton overnight Like I I can't I can't get the thought of John Middleton walking out of that meeting like being quiet Like I John Middleton better get taken out of that meeting in handcuffs The way I envision John Middleton like yeah, I know when they fall asleep, they dream about ponies and rainbows. Is that what people dream about? I dream about John Middleton meeting with Bryce Harper. Three-year-olds you're talking about? I dream about John Middleton meeting with Bryce Harper.

I do believe that you do. And my second thing is that the Phillies hired another driveline baseball guy yesterday for their minor league hitting coach. So excited. Give me all the driveline guys. Me and my boy Jason Ochart. Fan of the show, Jason Ochart. Yes. Hopefully we can get Jason on soon.

We will. We will make that happen. That would be... We're efforting some other guests as well. Oh, yeah. We're taking this thing to the moon. Yeah. The High O's podcast has officially arrived.

And rate and review the podcast. Rate and review the podcast. Rate and review the podcast. Check out, keep your eyes tuned to the MLB The Show Twitter account for the announcement. The single most important Twitter account ever. Of Bryce Harper. It really is. I'm all in on the MLB The Show podcast. But again, rate and review the podcast.

It means the world to Jack. It really helps us out. And if you like High Hopes, want to help us out. Right, Jack? Always. Forever. All right. Saturday.

We'll be all over it. Hopefully. Bryce Harper is a Philly either way. We will be back to talk to you all about it again. Thank you to Bob Nightingale for taking some time with us. And John Milton, go become Jack. All-Star Closer. Kenley Jansen, we have a question.

What's the best podcast of all time? Baseball isn't boring, baby. I'm Rob Bradford, and every single day I'm sitting down with the biggest names to show you this great game is the greatest game. It's my podcast. It's my passion. It's a cause I started more than two years ago. It is now the most prolific national daily baseball pod there is.

Another fact. So jump aboard the B.I.B. Express. Follow and listen to Baseball Isn't Boring, presented by Wasabi Hot Cloud Storage on the free Odyssey app or wherever you get your podcasts.