High Hopes: A Phillies Podcast - The Phillies Are Officially Eliminated From Playoff Contention

Episode Date: September 24, 2019

James Seltzer and Jack Fritz are back talking about a Phillies team that is eliminated from playoff contention.  See omnystudio.com/policies/listener for privacy information. To learn more about listener data and our privacy practices visit: https://www.audacyinc.com/privacy-policy Learn more about your ad choices. Visit https://podcastchoices.com/adchoices

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High Hopes. It's a bunch of baseball nerds talking about the Philadelphia Phillies on Radio.com and Sports Radio 94 WIP. Yo! It is another edition of the High Hopes Podcast. The last podcast ever. Let's say, Jack, the hopes are officially dashed. They're not even high.

They're just done. The Dead Hopes podcast. There's no hope. No hope podcast. It's over, Jack. Ugh. At least officially, even though we've known it for a month. Yeah, but it hurts worse.

Officially eliminated. It hurts worse when you put it over. It's over. It's over. It's done. Just happened. Hours ago. It's over, It's over. It's done. Just happened. Hours ago. It's over, man.

I know. I know. I know. It's not fun. No. Eight years. Like I said last time, we're getting near a decade, man. We're getting near a decade without the playoffs.

We're being lumped in with the Marlins, Padres, Mariners, White Sox. Fourth place team. I mean, the Phillies are a fourth place team. They're going to finish fourth place in the National League. Behind the freaking Mets, dude. Behind the Mets, who we mocked this whole season. I know. You know what made us look like a-holes?

Next lot. You know what I forgot today? At one point in the season, the Nationals were 12 games under.500. That's a good point. 12 games under 500. That's a good point. 12 games under 500. And to think about, it's especially gut punchy when you think about the whole Bryce Harper of it all and how much we mocked the Nash. Ho, ho, we got the guy.

Sucks to be in Washington now. We look like the idiots yet again. I feel like the Phillies have made me look like an idiot over and over and over again. And to be fair, wasted a lot of my time this year, Jack. Oh my God. I can't. I mean, the waste. I mean, obviously it wasn't all waste, but now it's like.

No, but a lot. We spent a lot of time watching a bad baseball team. I really felt that the 7-2 loss yesterday, it really felt like a waste. As I was watching that game, I am in my head saying I am wasting my time This is a waste of my life to watch this game right now. That's how I felt. Yeah Yeah, and you can't even really drink during games. No, I have to record a podcast right after so that sucks doubly It's the worst. Yeah, it's and I have to watch them every single one i can't miss it even if i wanted to i can't it's the worst it's a torture it is no it's gotten to become torture

yeah it's i like to apologize to my entire family given the amount of time that i've spent like i would i've shirked i would shirk my fatherly duties i would not talk to people at a family party to watch this baseball game. You did when you talked about that on the show. Every single time. I go to family parties in the summer all the time. I would ditch everyone to go watch this team. So not worth it.

I was had, dude, honestly, I was thinking today, you know, eight years without playoffs, right? And it's been a pretty quick eight years.

Like, it's for as horrible as it's been. I guess so, yeah. You would think it would be longer. Yeah. Feel longer. Right. Like, I just thought, I thought so. Yeah. You would think it would be longer. Yeah. Feel longer. Right.

I just thought, I thought we're going to get rally towels this year. Me too. I thought this was the year. And I thought this was the year that's Philly's, for the last four years, people have been like, oh, baseball's dying, baseball's dying, baseball's dying. Baseball's not dying if your team's fun and your team's in the run. Because then it's the best. It's the best.

Every single night you're looking forward to 705, what exciting thing are they going to do? Mm-hmm. And, like, for them to just do this again and to just fall, not fall apart, like, they fell apart earlier this year, but they stabilized a little bit. They did. No, it wasn't like last year. No.

It wasn't. I mean, it's turning into last year this week. Yeah, I mean, look, this last week, we all remember the Rockies series last year. I could see that happening again very easily. Yeah. Where they just look, this last week, we all remember the Rockies series last year. I could see that happening again very easily where they just get trounced in the rest of these games and it's embarrassing. Higher draft pick. Yeah, hey, look.

Higher draft pick season? Could we end up under 500 again? Because that is totally on the table. If they go under 500, like, Middleton, he has to clear house. Like, I think Gabe's gone regardless. Yeah, let's dive into this because I think that's very... I mean, Gabe was even asked about it after the game today.

You know, what do you think about your future? By the way, did you see Gabe's other quote after the game? No, I only saw about the 2020. He said, sometimes we fight too hard. Oh, God. God, Gabe! I love him. No!

You're going to miss that. No, I'm so not going to miss it. When Joe Madden... You said this to me earlier. When Joe Madden comes in and says, I'm just a shot in a beer kind of guy, I'm going to miss that. No, I'm so not going to miss it. When Joe Madden, you said this to me earlier, when Joe Madden comes in and says, I'm just a shot in a beer kind of guy, I'm in. Oh, dude. Give me Joe Madden.

Listen, when Joe Madden comes in and says, I'm a shot in a beer, this is a shot in a beer town, this city is going to be like, oh, finally, a real baseball guy. And then he's going to manage exactly like Gabe. And then he's going to rip the fans. He probably will. Yeah, that quote that you showed me from him in Chicago is basically like fans have no idea about bullpen.

Can I throw, before we get too far into this, can I throw a name that I didn't think about until today? Sure. That I think would be actually really, really interesting. And I would, I would, he's automatically at the top, my top three. Okay. Raul Banez. Oh, that's interesting. I would. Dodgers. Yeah. Well liked. Well, my top three. Okay. Raul Banez. Oh, that's interesting.

I would- Dodgers. Yeah. Well-liked. Well, very well-liked. Smart. Nice career. Was around the game forever.

Smart guy. Affable guy. Likeable guy. I think would do a lot better in the press conference arena. You could say that. You could definitely say that. I think if they're going to go with a first-time guy, I can't think of a better first-time guy.

Like, I would say, like, Banez- He's on that track. Look, Raul Banez is going to be a a first-time guy, I can't think of a better first-time guy. He's on that track. Look, Raul Banez is going to be a manager in baseball. He is on that track. He's one of those guys they talk about, just like it happened for Alex Cora before he got hired, like it happened for Gabe before he got hired. There are guys who just become these types of candidates,

guys who are on that track to become a manager, and Raul Banez is talked really highly of in MLB circles. Yeah, and Raul Banez is a guy that his teammates all loved. Whenever you talk to baseball people about Raul Ibanez, it was like, yeah, imagine that. That's what I'm saying. That's what I'm thinking about. Opening day next year. Come on. It'd be so funny. I think Raul will be

a really, really interesting choice. He comes from the Dodgers, obviously. For sure. I think he just connects. Obviously, you can have your opinion on Gabe or whatever and I like Gabe and I think Gabe's a very sound baseball mind but where where me as a baseball player like watching Gabe and and seeing how he interacts like he's just not a baseball guy like and like I know people will say well he played 14 years in the majors like that's not really the point like he's just because he played that long doesn't mean he's a baseball guy.

He just doesn't fit in the same way. There's a difference between being a baseball guy and just being like, well, Gabe. He is so just Gabe. He's just Gabe. He is, man. He's literally just Gabe. And we've talked about this before. And again, I don't want perception to rule my team's decisions.

I don't want my organization making decisions purely based on perception. But I just don't know if, and again, winning cures all and all that. But I just don't know if Gabe ever works in this city.

You know, I just don't know the way he goes about his business, the way he interacts with the media, the things he says after games.

I mean, it's just, again, to say we're still in it after yesterday's game, I know he can't say like, oh, season over,

but he's just so not real. just feels so forced and like again yesterday after or after the game today he's like come off the field guys great job you really killed it out there it's like no they didn't they didn't they had 18 straight they sucked don't do that just be real. Be us. Channel us just a little bit to know that this stuff just comes off as so hollow and so fake. And I think Gabe's gone. I've said for a while I thought they didn't make the playoffs. He's gone. And I think the way it's played out, I don't think there is any chance at this point they bring Gabe Kapler back. Because they're going to finish, what, seven, eight, nine, maybe ten games out of the playoffs at this point.

There's no way John Middleton can bring everything back. they're going to finish, what, 7, 8, 9, maybe 10 games out of the playoffs at this point? There's no way John Middleton can bring everything back, and I just don't see him getting rid of Matt Klintak. I want him to. I'm all for it. I just don't see it happening. What do we have to do to get high on Bloom to be our GM? What do we have to do? It's never going to happen. Did I just start high on Bloom

Lent? Sure. I don't think it'll be as successful as your last Lent. I know. I really don't. it'll be as successful as your last lent i know i really don't do you agree that clint tag's not going anywhere i agree unless they both finish below 500 and that's a real possibility what do you mean unless they fit they've there are 79 and 77 there's a real chance they finish i mean are you trust them to win three of the last six yeah they're scratching and clawing until the end. They're treating every game like it's game seven.

That's why Brad Miller is a cleanup hitter today. I saw it. The lineup today. That's why Blake Parker is starting a playoff game today. Game seven. Perfect Blake Parker. Let's call him Perfect Parker. He had perfect game stuff today. He did. He definitely did. I pray to the heavens that Andy McPhail's gone.

I just, I don't want that guy sniffing my organization anymore. He can't even be, I would honestly put a restraining order on Andy McPhail. That's how far I want him away from this team. To be fair, I don't think he does anything. I don't think he does that much anyway. I don't care. I agree with you. I want him gone.

I just never want to see his face again. I never want to hear his name again. Get out. But in terms of like product and whatever, I don't think he does anything. I think he literally does nothing. I think he literally sits at home and

you know, wears his adult diapers and does whatever he does and every once in a while Matt Klintak will call me like hey Andy, we need you in for the day. And I'll go in and that'll be it. Yeah. I think he also, I think he holds back them when it comes to when it comes back to

analytical journalism kidding everything about the adult diapers part that part too oh I could see it yeah yeah I just really don't like

Andy McPhail yeah I don't either he's a bad a bad symbol of the organization I agree he's a bad face of the organization but with the Kaplan

I mean him and him and him and freaking Billy Bean are the same title. It's unbelievable. They have the same title. And Billy Bean, yet again, with zero money, is taking the playoffs. 90 wins.

Yeah, they're going to the playoffs. Again. Like usual. It's just... Oh! Oh! And, okay. So, with the Kapler thing, too, just back to the point you just made about the message

to the fans. I do think that's another reason Kapler thing, too, just back to the point you just made about the message to the fans. I do think that's another reason Kapler will be gone. The message to the fan base that, A, they're trying to do something, and B, that they're not going to just send Kapler out there as the face of this franchise anymore because he makes everyone mad. Like it or not, he makes everyone mad. It's a shame it comes down to that. I just think it's such a Neanderthalistic mindset of like,

oh, we don't like this guy. I feel like he never really got a chance. No. Jack, he was booed the first time he stepped on the field. He never got a chance. That's it. The story of Gabe Kapler's tenure happened the very first time he stepped on the field at Citizens Bank Park and nothing has changed no matter what he did.

He couldn't do anything. Maybe if they make the playoffs last year and just become good, sure. That's the kind of thing that can change things, but considering the hand he was dealt from the jump, he did not really ever have much of a chance here. Yeah, and I think the craziest part

about Gabe possibly being fired, probably being fired. Probably. Very, very likely in my mind. Is that i think the city wants him fired but they'll also feel bad at the same time well and i also think i think you're right about that and i also think that at some point over the last couple months and i know we've talked about it for a really long time here but at some point over the last couple months i think it flipped i think that people don't like Gabe, but I think

people have finally started to put the blame where it truly deserves to be placed. More than not, I think people are starting to say, alright, Matt Klintak's not good. You're welcome. Matt Klintak, yeah. Matt Klintak did a bad job. He did a bad job. He did. Oh, yeah. Give me the whole oh, he's signed three All-Stars.

Let's talk about Klintak. Because we both need his back, but let's talk. He comes out, speaks in the media. John Heyman, Big Time Baseball something. Big Time Baseball Podcast. Powered by Radio.com. There you go. Thank you, sir. Good work.

Yeah, don't pull that. No, I was just saying, because there's really only one baseball podcast out there. You're listening to it. But I guess National. There's only one Phillies podcast. There you go. Okay, so if you're going to listen to a National podcast, make there's only one Phillies podcast. There you go. Okay.

So if you're going to listen to a national podcast, make it the radio.com big time baseball podcast. Clint Dax sits down with them. Great get by them. No question. And then he speaks to Jim Salisbury and the overwhelming takeaway for me, and I'm sure people have seen it by now. If not pause the pod,

go read it and come back and listen. But it's just that this guy doesn't think he did anything wrong. Nope. He doesn't think he did anything wrong. And he's got excuses for everything. At no point in any of those interviews does he say, yeah, my bad. Yeah, I screwed that up. Yeah, I did a bad job.

Not once, Jack. Not once. Does he put any, there's always an equivocation. There's always a blame to place somewhere else. There's always, oh, we'll go back and we'll look at our process. And just because the results didn't work doesn't mean the process wasn't. All that stuff. Matt, take some freaking responsibility, man.

Some accountability. Say, yeah, that's on me. Did you hear that once in the entire thing, and what was your takeaway from everything Glenn Tech had to say? You've heard me say this. Last year's starting pitching rotation was both healthy and effective. Nah. Not in a linear way, though, Jack.

The effectiveness wasn't linear. It was more effective in the first half than it was in the second half, but it was aggregate. That group of guys was pretty good last year. There's no question that we bet on some improvement from some of those players based on what they'd shown in 2018, based on their ages, their development curve, and what we thought would be more improvement than what we've seen.

Now, this is all context so far. He did not add in that quote, we expected Nick Pavetta to add a splitter. But in my head, that's exactly what he's saying. See, here's the thing is because it was them, they didn't expect that. You expected Pavetta to add a splitter. They just expected Pavetta to get better. Yeah.

It's hard to look back and second guess that thought process. It's easy to look back and second guess the results, just like many Phillies fans have second guessed. Made a lot of adjustments to our team last offseason in a lot of areas. Many of those have worked out, some have not. But I think the best we can do is to look at the reasons we made or didn't make decisions and try to learn from it. Matt.

Okay. Contact. So the last line, sure, yes, you should be looking at the decisions you made and try and learn from them. What I fail to hear there yet again, is at any point does he say, yeah, it didn't work out and that's our fault. Like just because you thought your process was fine and sure, going back and saying, yeah, we expected these guys to get better.

That's a fair expectation. They didn't get better. They got worse. Like how at any point is that not on you, Matt? What was the thought process behind signing Arrieta? Great question. What was your sound process then? And then not just signing him, but then counting on him again.

I know you're paying him, but you counted on him. You made him a big part of why you're going to be good this year. Yeah. And then again, real quick, just to, yeah, Pavetta and Eflin, I get it. You could say, and there were other people, I think, who believed that Pavetta would take a step forward. Not me. Not you, not me, not this show, but I get it.

I can at least understand the process. What's your argument? What's your process over results for why Vincent Velasquez was brought back for the... I can't even go into it. How many years do we have to watch Vincent Velasquez? How many years do we have to watch this guy to know that he's not good?

What do we have to do? What do we have to do to get Vincent Velasquez off this team? I think we have to riot. I'm ready to riot. Can you hear me? I'm yelling. You want to march on CDP right now? I am Charlie Dang as hard as I can Charlie Dang.

No, it's unbelievable. It's truly, and like to say that the fans thing, a lot of our fans are second guess. It's like, well, guess what, Matt? They're right again. Yeah. We second guess because we were right in your role. Maybe you stop ripping the people that are actually right and maybe you figure out your crap and

and stop blaming stop being such a prick towards your people who buy your freaking seats to barely fill your stadium because you can't do your job good enough you didn't want to spend 13 million dollars on dallas Keuchel. That's not the fans' fault, Matt. And you were wrong about it. Look, you can have whatever excuses you have for why you didn't sign him at the moment, but say, hey, guess what?

We should have done that. Very clearly. You'd have to be, in fact, you should be fired if you can't acknowledge that Dallas Keuchel, signing Dallas Keuchel was the right decision. It bore out. He pitched great for Atlanta. You sucked.

Your starting rotation sucked. Drew Smiley, Jason Vargas. Vargas. Here we are. Here we are? Vargas. I just, I wish he wasn't so arrogant. Well, that's the problem.

It's so arrogant, and you're talking down to a fan base that is ultimately supporting your product. And here's the thing, Matt. We're not a stupid fan base. Like, yes, we definitely have a portion of our fan base that is stuck in the Stone Ages. We get that. Jack and I talk about it a lot.

Jack, probably too much. We get it. But that doesn't mean that the entire fan base is stupid because we're not. And he talks to us like we are. he talks to us like we don't understand like hey you guys don't understand this okay like this is high level baseball stuff that i get and you don't so why don't you sit in your place yeah that's what it sounds like that's what it feels like when he talks to us yeah well i mean anytime you can show your track record from the angels right and the baltimore orioles they got another

scout by the way how about it super anytime you can get an oriole scout Angels, right? And the Baltimore Orioles. They got another scout, by the way. How about it? Super. Anytime you can get an Orioles scout, a 20-year Orioles scout. Whoa. Sign me up.

Think about all the great players that guy must have scouted for the Orioles in 20... Oh. Well, actually, I got a name for you.

Did he do one? Dylan Bundy? Josh Hader in the 19th round. Okay. You know, he was an Orioles farmhand first. Blind squirrel. Yeah.

Yeah. I mean, yeah. I mean, really? Really? Now, the way it was written. Just prepare yourself mentally. No. For the future press relief.

Nope. Phillies have hired XY from the Orioles organization to be their scouting director or from the angels organization or have promoted asshat number three from their own organization get ready nope get ready i refuse no there i will bet everything i have that they do not hire someone from a smart organization i'll bet everything i have and i'm i'm devastated about it i'm not happy about it but do you believe what matt klintak does is he insulates himself with people who he can control

people who are his guys he doesn't care if they're good clearly he doesn't care about finding the best and the brightest because he's threatened by them that's why

I mean what are we doing here that's why I can't wait for it to be Joe Madden or Joe Girardi or whoever who's going to come in and be like

no I'm not doing what you tell me to well the only way that's going to happen is if Middleton gets involved. You don't think he will? Maybe. He has to. You'd hope so. I'm a little down on John.

Not going to lie. He's definitely not Jack. Little down. Oh, my God. He lost Jack a while ago. I mean, again, the Phillies will finish the season as the 11th highest payroll in baseball. I thought we were supposed to be a big boy. John Middleton told me.

I was in the studio looking into that room while he was talking to Angelo Cataldi. I was right there watching him say, we're going to be a freaking big boy. We're bringing that trophy back or I'm going to die trying. No, you're not. If you're going to die trying, spend some freaking money. Do what you got to do. Hire smart people. Steinbrenner of the South. Runend freaking money. Do what you got to do. Hire smart people. Steinbrenner of the South. Run a baseball

franchise. Steinbrenner of the South. It's not funny anymore. It's not funny anymore. It used to be cute. It's not anymore. I really wish I could be cocky about John Middleton, but I don't have him. He's down there this week. They're all down there in

Washington. The whole brass is down there. Oh, God. Can't imagine being in those meetings. That must be some high-level stuff. What are they doing? They're obviously all there, right? And their only decision they're going to make is whether they're keeping Kapler or not. Yep, that's it.

If Klintak's in that room, like... That's it. Yeah. Oh, God. Can you imagine? And again, look, as far as it goes, I am not anti-Kapler comparative to the vast majority of people, but I just don't see any way they could. Klentak's going to fight for Kapler, obviously.

Well, he already did on the radio. Absolutely did on Radio.com podcast, on Salisbury's interview, on MLB Network. He has made it very clear that he thinks Gabe has done a fantastic job. Which, look, of course he's going to. That's his guy. He hired that guy. The moment Gabe Kapler gets fired, Matt Klintak is on the clock.

Why are you letting a GM make a second manager choice? That's my point. I don't think you can. I don't think you can. Because Klintak is going to stump for Kapler. He's going to fight to keep him. Scratching and clawing? Scratching and clawing.

Game seven? Till it's done. We're still fighting, Jack. We're still fighting. Man. So it's going to be a super fascinating offseason. There is a lot to go down. Would you rather...

I'm so annoyed that Matt Klintak's going to be back. I'm so annoyed. It hurts my soul thinking about another year of this guy setting this franchise back. All right.

I think we need to talk about this because I think it's really important. So Salisbury wrote today after the game, and he said this about Reese Hoskins. Oh, yeah, I saw this. Reese Hoskins went 0-3 with a walk. He's hitless in his last 25 at-bats, and his batting average is down to.229. He's hitting.182 since the All-Star break. Back in spring training, it at least seemed possible that the Phillies would try to lock up Hoskins with a long-term contract this winter.

That is highly doubtful now. It might be more plausible that the Phillies shop him in a trade for pitching this last season. Wow. Holy smokes. Wow. Holy smokes. I mean, here's the thing. The fall from grace for Reese Hoskins has been precipitous. What sucks is that

I feel bad for him. I watch him, and I feel bad. Because I think he's trying. I think all of that. He should be a face of this franchise he should be he already i mean is by the was and is and whatever yes and i just i think that there's a better player in there we've seen it like that wasn't all a mirage but i i keep waiting every single day for him to come out like oh nine ham yeah i know and just say like i can't wait for this to be over i'm done yeah in tears maybe right and i mean i don't blame him like he had to have sean rodriguez stand up for him he had to go to he in this offseason he went to japan he didn't

really have an all like he didn't he's been non-stop doing everything since he got up here it is i feel bad for him um but what do you i guess you just start You start moving Bome and And grooming Bome And then try to sign Rendon I Well I would love them to sign Rendon If you could have your choice If you could have

John Middleton Go get guys Spends money If you could choose one You're only allowed to choose one You can't choose both You cannot choose neither Cole or Rendon

Cole or Rendon Which is the better path For the Phillies I hate this question Specific to I'm I'm 99 times out of 100 I'm taking the Star hitter Which is the better path for the Phillies? I hate this question specific to... I'm 99 times out of 100, I'm taking the star hitter in that situation.

I just, I do. It's the way I lean philosophically. I think it has to be Garrett Cole in this situation. I think it has to be. I mean, I don't see any other path to getting elite starting pitching. I mean, did you see Spencer Howard last Friday? I'm excited about Spencer Howard,

but Garrett Cole is one of the five best pitchers in baseball. Yeah. Right? Fair. And he's been a horse. And he's getting better. He's better this year than he was last year. He's getting better.

Let's factor in the Astros pitching staff. Sure. The Astros pitching coaches. Yeah. Well, yeah. I'm sure he'll regress. Yeah. I mean, we'll see

why he gets his hands on him. We'll get back to Pirates Garrett Cole real quick. I feel like you can supplement production offensively a little bit easier with the free agents out there than, I don't want to pay

Madison Baumgartner. There are no other starters. Wheeler? I like Wheeler. 590 for Wheeler? I would take, yes. If they're not going to sign Cole, I would absolutely take a shot

on Wheeler. That dude has a ton of upside. He's been pretty good. How the hell was he in the Carlos Beltran trade? One of the worst trades of all time. Well, that trade was in 2011. Yeah, it was straight up. It was Zach Wheeler for Carlos Beltran.

Beltran was done. Donezo. Yeah. So anyway, back to the Hoskins point though. Well, I would say Rendon, by the way. I'm torn. I want to say Rendon. Would you say it definitively or is it a tough call for you? Tough call. But I just think that anytime you can get a guy. That's what I'm torn. I want to say Rendon. Would you say it definitively or is it a tough call for you? Tough call.

I just think that anytime you can get a guy... That's what I'm saying. I generally lean towards... I know what Anthony Rendon is and is going to be and he's just awesome. And Cole, arms, pitchers, it scares me. 123 RBI this year. He's 224 now. He's impossible to get out.

He's so good. He's like a souped up Jose Altuve. He's one of the best hitters in baseball. Maybe the best pure hitter. He's one of them. If you had to pick a guy to get you one hit in any spot. Mike Trout's always going to be the guy right now. But that's what I mean. Rendon, just pure bad skill,

bad on ball. He might be the guy to choose. Just to get me one hit. All I need is a single. All I need is whatever in any situation. I mean, he's up there. No, I know this sounds insane. Oh, good. I would never be able to get out Anthony Rendon. I know

that sounds insane. Because the idea that you could get out another major. What I'm saying is like that guy would, me and Pavetta both would get destroyed by Anthony Renzo. Basically the same thing, right? Same mental makeup.

Back to Hoskins. The issue with that, and I wouldn't be against if you can get a good young pitcher for him, sure. If he's writing that, they've soured on him. It's as simple as that. Very clearly, but my issue is you're going to trade him when he's in the worst slump of his career and he's like a shell of himself.

What's the upside there? Yeah, you're selling super low trade him when he's in the worst slump of his career and he's like a shell of himself. Like what's the upside there? Yeah, you're selling super low. The lowest. The lowest he's ever been. Reece Hoskins' value right now is the lowest it's ever been. Not even close. Yeah. Including when he was a prospect.

Like there is no value there right now. The lowest it's been since like 2015. Yeah. So at that point, like what's the upside? Why are you trading him then? Good question. Yeah. But unless they've soured him that much, they don't want him around anymore.

I just don't trust this organization. How bad is that? I just don't trust them to make these decisions. Who are they going to put at first base? It'd be Boehm, right? But then who are you going to put at third base? Kingery? Then you sign Rendon or something.

Well, you do your best, but I mean, do you really think they're going to shell out $250 million for Anthony Rendon? I don't think they're going to shell out anything for any of these guys I think they're not I think it's all bluster I think if Bryce Harper hadn't stretched it out

over 13 years and it was only 25 a year I don't know if they get it done I think that they want to stay below the luxury tax I think that

no I think they didn't want to do it this year well good they have to go over oh they don't have a choice it is time you wasted a year of the window you traded six they didn't want to do it this year. Well, good. They have to go over it. Oh, they don't have a choice. It is time. It is time.

You wasted a year of the window. You traded six percentages for a catcher with a year and a half left on his contract. Okay? You opened the window. I know. I know. They're going to go over it.

If they don't go over it, we are rioting. I need to see it happen. See, they're going to go over it. I need to see it happen. Oh, this is depressing. They're going to go over it. I know. It's very depressing. Don't say they're not going to go over it. I need to see it happen. This is depressing. They're going to go over it. Don't say they're not going to go over it.

Don't put that hate. Look, John Middleton has to prove to me again. I'm sorry. I've been very disappointed. Approve of the year? Yeah, it's approve of the year. And again, they're bringing Matt... The complacency for this team is unbelievable. They didn't care all year. Matt Klintak and McPhail

continually told us, we don't care. That's what they said. If we don't, we don't. That's what they said before the trade then. That is the way of saying, we don't care. If we don't, we don't. A.K. we don't care. Whatever.

It's cool. Whatever, man. And as mad as you want to get at McPhail and Klintzak for that, Middleton signed off on that. Absolutely. He signs off on everything. He's the owner. He's an involved owner.

And he's like, eh, can I go up $14 million? That's getting close. You don't want to go over. A little tight on the luxury tax. Yeah. So Hoskins, what could you even get? Now?

I don't know. Not much. What are you getting for him? You know what you're getting? You're getting someone else's... You're getting the Reece Hoskins starting pitching equivalent. Exactly him? Like what you're getting? You know what you're getting? You're getting someone else's. You're getting the Reese Hoskins is starting pitching equivalent. Exactly. That's what you're getting.

Exactly. Yeah, that's what you're getting. And that's not. What is the plan here? There isn't one. What is the plan? That's the problem. You trade Hoskins, put Bowman first, put King as a third baseman full time, start Hazley

in center field, have McCutcheon in left field. Is that their plan? I don't think they have a plan right now their plan? I don't think they have a plan right now. I don't think they have a firm plan. I don't trust this organization to make decisions. That's where I'm at. And it sucks and it's depressing, but I don't

trust them to make decisions. What if they hire Joe Maddon and bring back John Maylee as a hitting coach? Oh. World Series champ? Well, that won't happen. Look, I think if they, as we

both think, fire Kapler, I think it's going to be really telling to see who the hire is in the sense that if it is Maddon, if it is a big time name like that, I think it was Middleton's decision. I don't think that Klintak would bring in someone who's going to

have the clout to question him, to go against him, to not do his bidding as it were. That's how I feel. Yeah. I hate it.

It's going to be fascinating. It's going to be literally, for as awesome as last offseason was getting Harper, this offseason is going to be,

should be crazy. We've got to replace a manager, we have to find a starter, and we have to fill out the rest of the roster. And a scouting

director. And they've got to find another closer because Robertson's out, and we have to fill out the rest of the roster. And a scouting director. And they've got to find another closer, because Robertson's out. Of course they do. That's one of the things on the list. A closer, you need a bullpen. You need a bullpen. You have to find a bullpen. Tommy Hunter's gone.

Pat Neshek's gone. Juan Nicasio's gone. Like, you have to find a bullpen. Yeah. A full bullpen. Sir Anthony Dominguez, who the hell knows? I know Tommy John, so that's great. I'm sure it'll work out well.

What's going to happen is he's going to work his way back. He's going to hurt his arm again and he's going to get Tommy John. We're not going to see Sir Anthony for like two more years.

Right? Do you think that's a fair assessment if you had to guess? Yeah. I think we're not going to see it for two years. You want me to think something's going to go right?

I'm shocked Harper's here. Honestly, I'm shocked. It's honestly the most shocking thing that has happened in recent years. We never get that guy. No. No. Love it. I can't wait.

It's such a bummer. I'll turn this around real quick. You know how sad the first 25 minutes? We got a lot to do. I can't wait. You are the quickest turnaround. See, I told you. I've been dead since the Reds game. I can't wait. You are the quickest turnaround. Oh, I don't... See, I told you.

I've been dead since the Reds game. I've literally been dead. They haven't... They've killed me. I'm back. Are you really, though? Or is this

faux backness? I can't wait. There's so much intrigue. There's a lot of intrigue. I just wish... I just wish I had some level of confidence

that they were going to do the right thing. You never should. I know, but that's... They're the they were going to do the right thing. You never should. I know. They're the losingest franchise in the history of sports. How is that fun? Because one day they'll figure it out. They figure it out for five-year runs at a time.

Then they go back into the tank. Can't wait. Yeah. Can't wait. We'll have a lot to talk about. Our next podcast, realistically, because we're going to have a lot to talk about Our next podcast Realistically Because we're going to start

Going back to one a week Next week It might be the Emergency Gabe Kapler's Fired podcast What do you mean might be? I think it's going to be I think on Monday

Gabe Kapler will be fired That is my guess Will grown men Be weeping in the streets? Yay! They got him out of here About time Told you from day one that guy can't manage

In this city Doesn't match up well Coconut oil oven Doesn't know how to manage Pulled an OLA after 68 pitches People forget that I called in WIP The first day to get this guy out of here

Bringing a real baseball guy like Jay Madden. That call will happen. Yeah. That call will happen on Monday. I guess the one good thing is that Gabe will get his day. Thank goodness the Eagles are playing on Thursday night this week. So Gabe actually gets Monday.

It'll be a Gabe day. Won't be a reaction to the Eagles day. Something, right? Yeah. He deserves that. He deserves that. He deserves that. He deserves that. He deserves that. He deserves that. He deserves that. He deserves that. He deserves that. He deserves that. He deserves that. He deserves that. He deserves that. He deserves that. He deserves that. He deserves that. He deserves that. He deserves that. He deserves that. He deserves that. He deserves that. He deserves that. He deserves that. He deserves that. He deserves that. He deserves that. He deserves that. He deserves that. He deserves that. He deserves that. He deserves that. He deserves that. He deserves that. He deserves that. He deserves that. He deserves that Eagles day. Something, right? Yeah, he deserves that. He deserves that. He'll go for Gabe about that, right? He'll get his day to get the victory laugh that all the people will

be taking on Monday. I wanted to say something else there, but I didn't. I hope he goes on with Angelo after he gets fired. That'd be great, wouldn't it? Should. Come on and just go scorched earth. Hey, listen. Here's everything that went wrong. Hey, you want to know what the real story is? Here you go. I couldn't

do this. I couldn't do this. Klintak forced me to do this. I had to do this. Did you see my starting staff the last two months? Do you think I wanted to roll these guys out here? Do you think that was my decision? You saw Real Muto's face when Jared Hughes came in you should have seen mine. That is definitely the face of the season.

Romulo's face when Jared Hughes came in is like the season. 2019 Phillies. Yeah. Boom. Very fun team. It's great. It's going to go down in history. Maybe the most annoying season in my lifetime watching the Phillies.

It's up there. It's legitimately up there in the most annoying seasons I've ever had. When you've taken the expectations the night to night was brutal but I'm talking about when you've taken

the expectations we had the high hopes dare I say the night to night of it the inability to get on a run the massive amount of just brutal ugly losses

combined with the massive amount of just complete and total no shows I really it's up there man. If I had to make my of just brutal, ugly losses combined with the massive amount of just complete and total no-shows. I really, it's up there, man. If I had to make my most annoying seasons ever rankings, this one might be the top. It's up there. You gotta go back and watch one team.

This team or the Dream Team? I mean, that's an easy answer. Because the Dream Team's only 16 games. You're damn right! You are damn right! Dream Team all day. It's not 16 times 10. Oh my god, can you imagine going back to watch I'm sad that I've watched all

150 whatever it is so far. I'm sad. It makes me sad that I've spent all that time watching this team. A lot of baseball. It's too much. You might say. Alright. We've done enough bitching. Fritz, final thoughts. Um, let me look into my notes. In the note bag.

Okay. I got three things I want to hit on. Hit on. Go for it. So they're my final thoughts. It's a trio of final thoughts. Adam Haisley, who I really like and I think is going to be a good major league player, I think he's 5 for 45 on breaking pitches this year.

Whoa. Yeah, can't hit him. That's jarring. Yeah, it's not good. Not good. He can't hit curveballs. Not good. Trouble with the curve, some would say.

So he needs to spend. You did it. He spends all offseason, needs to work on that curveball and hitting curveballs and figuring that out. Because he hits the fastball pretty well. So just like Nick Pavetta spent all offseason working on a splitter, this got it.

Good. My second final thought is, I know he didn't pitch well today, but I've been impressed with Edgar Garcia since he came back. I saw you tweet about this. I like him. You're in on it. That slider is disgusting. It's a legit pitch. It's a really good pitch. And he's thrown with more conviction recently. He looks better. He looked better.

He looked better since being brought back up. I still think he can get more tilt to it. He needs to get on top of his pitches more and drive it down, drive his slider down. He needs to almost watch how Brad Lidge threw his. Because Brad Lidge created the perfect amount of tilt. Wouldn't it be nice if there was a pitching coach who showed him things? He only looks at heat maps.

See why. He's gone, too. No, he is. He is the lock of locks to be gone. Stone cold moral lock. Good thing, you know, they chose him over Rick Granitz. I mean, maybe. Look, let's put it this way.

Rick couldn't have been worse. No. And the evidence from, look, the same guys were better last year. They just were. And I mean, they were kind of better. They're also the same staff in September

that was horrible. Slightly better. And still, the point is, is not worse. Not worse. Yeah, I mean,

they're good for the most part of the season and then fell apart. Rick Kranitz is coaching in the playoffs. Chris Young isn't. Yeah, well,

that's also a product of more than just him being a pitching coach. Oh, no, I know, all right? Rick Kranitz. It's because of Brian Snicker. He's being a pitching coach. Oh, no. I know. All right. It's because of Brian Snicker.

He's such a great manager. Oh, unbelievable. He really taught Ronald Acuna a lesson when he sat him down. Right. As Ronald Acuna again. Oh, I'm saying. Two for two. He's real hard-nosed.

Made the playoffs every year he's managed. Just saying. This guy is a stone-cold fraud. Number three. And my final thought is that once again uh nationals fans are just the most embarrassing sports fans on earth um this is my first time i had seen the gerara para shark thing oh yeah the baby shark which is embarrassing i thought that was kind of stupid well you don't have a kid and then oh well yeah i don't wait it's baby shark not that zoe's into that but no imagine that except with grown people

in a baseball stadium it's kind of cute and i want cute and then today today have you ever heard them do this when they score they go n-a-A-T-S, Nats, Nats, Nats, woo! Okay. I mean, that's going to be the lamest thing you've ever heard. Well, first of all, they're stealing it. I mean, the woo part, I guess, is theirs, which is the lamest part, but that's J-E-T-S, Jets, Jets, Jets. That has been that forever. That's theirs.

Sorry. Can't use it. That's theirs. But the woo, that's the worst part. Yeah. That's so bad. I woo, that's the worst part. That's so bad. I mean, between that and attitude, it's just... Attitude is the worst thing that's ever happened. Ever happened in the history of baseball.

Just go back to Montreal. Can we just please be the experts? There's 20,000 people there and they're... 20,000? I was thinking like five, man. That's bad. It looked like there were 5,000 people there to this game. Dude, their ring of honor is Frank Robinson, Frank someone else, and Jason Worth.

Just wait till Ryan Zimmerman's in there, buddy. It's going to be great. They should put Harper in. They should put Harper in. Of course. He put their franchise on the map. Are you kidding me? Is Jose Vidro getting in?

Jose Vidro. He was more an expo than a nat, I would say. Chad Cordero. Brad Wilkerson? He is. Brian Schneider? I dug the expos. I'm sad they're the Nationals. Yeah. I wish I gnat, I would say. Chad Cordero. Brad Wilkerson. It is. Brian Schneider. I dug the Expos. Sad they're the Nationals.

Yeah. I wish I saw more of the 90s Expos. The Vlade Expos. I mean, that's the true tragedy of 1994, of the strike-shortened season, was the Expos. I mean, they were the best team in baseball. When was it going to hit 400? You might have. It was about like 396 or something like that.

Yeah. But, no. The true tragedy was, dude, the Expos were going to go to the playoffs. hmm when was gonna hit 400 he might have spent like 396 or something like that yeah but no the true tragedy was dude the Expos were gonna go to the playoffs the Expos were going to the World Series that would they were like they were like 10 wins better than everyone else in baseball

at the time of the strike they were awesome they had a freaking roster man oh I mean you remember those days like they were yesterday because that was your freshman year of college

uh not quite but yes I do remember those days like they were yesterday alright my final thought. It's a very simple one. Oh, by the way, hold on. Hold on, hold on. Anthony Rendon's

a modern day Tony Gwynn. A little more pop. Even better. Not as good a bass dealer. Alright, my final thought. It's a very simple. Rate and review the podcast. Please. We're going to get through this off season together. We're're gonna do it

we need you we need you desperately and you need us probably not we need you though so just stay with us last final thought

and it's very simple and it's very direct I never want to see Austin Davis pitch again I never want to see that guy and I'll usually say

I never want to see him pitch in a Phillies uniform again I never want to see him pitch in any uniform'll usually say, like, I never want to see him pitch in a Phillies uniform again. I never want to see him pitch in any uniform again. I don't want him allowed in a beer league. All right? No more Austin Davis ever. If I have to start Austin Davis Lent the other way around, I'll do that while Jack's doing Chaim Bloom Lent.

No more Austin Davis. He is pretty bad. I can't do it anymore. Him and Edebri. I just can't do it anymore. You know what? Give me a real bullpen next year. Yeah, please.

Austin Davis has sucked the life out of me, along with Mike Morin and Jared Hughes and all those guys. I hate them all, Jack. No, no. Would you stop? Jared Hughes has been good recently and Nick Vinson hasn't allowed a run in his last seven appearances.

I love Nick Vinson. Would you calm down? Didn't he allow a run today, Nick Vinson? I don't know. Maybe. I think he did. Were you producing the game when you were checked out?

I blacked out. You think I was paying attention to the eighth and ninth inning? He struck out Howie Kendrick in a key spot today. In a game seven. You doubted that guy. You think I was paying attention to the eighth and ninth inning? He struck out Howie Kendrick in a key spot today. Game seven. He's out of that guy.

They're still fighting, Jack. All right, the next time we talk to you will probably be because Gabe Kavler has been fired. If it's not, it's going to be a hell of an interesting podcast. So either way, he's Fritz. I'm Seltzer. Talk to you later. All-Star Closer. Kenley Jansen.

We have a question. What's the best podcast of all time? Baseball isn't boring, baby. I'm Rob Bradford. And every single day, I'm sitting down with the biggest names to show you this great game is the greatest game. It's my podcast. It's my passion.

It's a cause I started more than two years ago. It is now the most prolific national daily baseball pod there is. Another fact. So jump aboard the BIB Express. Follow and listen to Baseball Isn't Boring presented by Wasabi Hot Cloud Storage on the free Odyssey app or wherever you get your podcasts.