High Hopes: A Phillies Podcast - The Phillies' Art Of Winning | 'Baseball Isn't Boring'

Episode Date: June 15, 2024

Major League Baseball's second-best record. A unique combination of talented players. The most envied clubhouse in all the game. These are the Phillies. Bradfo sits down with Garrett Stubbs, Kyle Schwarber and Zack Wheeler to talk about their mindsets and what they value ... with confirmation from Stubbs that Philly does, indeed, have the top clubhouse in baseball. What do they they value and why do they value it. It's some insight into a really good team's mindset. To learn more about listener data and our privacy practices visit: https://www.audacyinc.com/privacy-policy Learn more about your ad choices. Visit https://podcastchoices.com/adchoices

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Let's go seize the night. That's the powerful backing of American Express. Visit amex.ca slash yamex. Benefits vary by car and other conditions apply. Yeah, there should be some passion. This doesn't have to be boring, boring, boring. One thing the game needs is more people like you, you, you. Until I'm grown, man, run around tight pants.

It's Mookie Betts. Daniel Bard. Steve Aoki. Eric Saltzlamarckia. This is Brock Holt. Hey, this is John Lester. Baseball isn't boring. Baseball isn't boring.

Welcome to Baseball Isn't Boring. Here's your host, Rob Radford. One for three. High drive, right field. Twins of Petco porch down the line and gone! Second straight day of the Padres have walked it off. This time it's the kid, Jackson Merrill, second home run of the day. Wins it for the Friars, 5-4.

There you go, Jackson Merrill. The guy who told baseball isn't boring. He once was asked to sign a toaster. With the home run and Don Arcillo with the home run call of the day. What a way to start the day. At BB isn't boring, Wasabi, Hot Cloud Storage, Wasabi Technologies walking side by side with us. Again, at BB isn't boring. big news today as we sit here on thursday we have the first ever wasabi challenge going to be

executed i don't want to give away too much but it's very very very exciting the first ever wasabi challenge involving an actual major league baseballball player. All right. Well, you're going to have to hold tight for that. We'll get to that on tomorrow's podcast. Today, it is the art of winning with the Philadelphia Phillies. Garrett Stubbs is taking over as catcher or getting a lot more time at catcher because of JT Real Muto. But it doesn't matter. It doesn't matter what he's doing because he is part of the fabric of the one of the winningest teams

in baseball and as we document once again thank you Garrett for actually backing us up on this Philly's best clubhouse in all of baseball. It's science now. It's science. So it's the art of winning with the Phillies, with Garrett. And then I ask, in a way to articulate once again why these guys are winning, I ask both Kyle Schwarber and Zach Wheeler, two of the best at what they do, what statistics do they value the most? And why do we say, well, that has to do with the winning?

Because it shows you how they view the great game of baseball. So Garrett Stubbs first, and then I'm going to ask Kylewarber his favorite stats and how he values things and then i'm gonna ask zach wheeler the exact same thing all great stuff on a great team all right here you go hope everyone's having a great day remember at bb isn't boring first up garrett subs all right there's no human being i'd rather be talking to right now than garrett how you doing good good how are you good good um so uh the first thing i want to talk to you sort of about i've been asked i asked kyle schwarber this about hitters i asked zach wheeler about pitchers for catchers what is the what is the stat or analytic that you say this is what i want to prioritize i

know that's a deep question right out of key yeah as a catcher yeah um wins yeah good one uh how many times am i behind the plate and and we win the game uh i think that that should be and probably is the mentality of everyone on our team. You know, when you're in the lineup, how can I help the team win that day? So as a catcher, you have a lot of say in that. You have a lot of guidance in getting your pitchers through a game, getting hitters out. So keeping them off the board and then offensively putting us on the board.

As a catcher, because of how much impact we have on the game, I think wins is the best step. Have you always realized that? I mean, we all evolve, right? You evolve as a baseball player, as a professional, and then as a major leaguer. Do you realize even more of that now than ever, being on this team, being in the league a while um i've always winning's always been it's always yeah i mean i tell my younger brother who's um in the minor leagues right now and we've talked about it since he was in high school and college uh that if you go out there and you try to win the game you're gonna be playing the game the right way. You're going to be doing the little things right.

You're going to be a full baseball player. Whatever situation arises, if you're just trying to hit a homer, even if a guy's on third base and all you need is a sack fly or a ground ball up the middle, you might get the homer every once in a while, but if you prioritize just getting that run in or as a catcher, if you're only thinking about throwing the guy out at second base when there's a runner on first and so you're calling heaters the whole time

or something, you know, that's not the way to win a baseball game. So if you're back there catching or whether you're playing shortstop or hitting, if you're prioritizing winning, you're going to get the best out of yourself. In minor leagues, you know, I've had this this conversation you see probably even harder to think that way because it's almost like aau right like yeah you're you're like you want your team to win sure but at the same yeah it doesn't matter nearly as much or at all no you're being judged on yeah but that's why i tell him you know even though winning is not a priority in the minor leagues, and do people really care from the top down about winning in the minor leagues?

No. But if you're going out there as a player and you're trying to win the game, you're going to play your best ball. I think it's actually a good way to look at it because it's sort of like a pitcher, and just bear with me, but a pitcher is getting the 6th and 7th inning, right? In the minor leagues, they weren't saying that. They were going, pitch counts. So when they got to that position in the major leagues, they were like, wait, what? What?

What's going on? If you look at our pitching staff, I think we have the most games thrown with a starter going into either the 6th or the 7th. And the other teams that are close to that are also winning organizations. So I think the Phillies are a solid proven model of winning. And, yeah, every single one of our pitchers wants to go into the sixth, seventh, eighth. They want to throw all nine innings if they can. And we prioritize that as a pitching staff.

So, you know, people do whatever they want. But it's been good for us. Do they do it? And maybe you don't know the answer to this. Do they do it in the minors? For us, I'm not sure. Yeah, so if I'm running in the minors, let's go on winning and pitching deep into games.

Yeah, I mean, learning how to win is an actual skill. You know, if you don't prioritize winning in the minor leagues, when they come to the big leagues, do they know how to win an actual baseball game? Because it doesn't necessarily mean four for four or making some sort of individual stat pop. Winning a game can be a ton of different things, and you can do it a ton of different ways as a player.

So, yeah, I think that's the priority. That's good, man. You've got to be pumped up. Yeah. Let's go. So I do want to get to the meat and potatoes. Like, obviously, with JT's injury, like, you're stepping up here. Take me through that. You're a major league player.

You're a good player. You're around this team. You're comfortable. But when you find that news out, a hit does your mindset change uh it changes because i'm you know i feel terrible for jt um he's an absolute dog and wants to be out there every day and borderline is out there every single day um so i feel for him i'm glad he's getting the surgery so that he can feel completely healthy. I know it's been nagging him for a little bit. So I'm glad that he's going to be able to get that move on from it and come

back even better than he was before. And, you know, for our team, it's a huge hit. You know, I have all the confidence in the world and myself. And like I said, we're out there to win baseball games. But no matter how you slice it JT's one of if not the best catcher in all of baseball so you know it sucks not having him around not only on the field but in the locker room he's a really good presence in our locker room and you know we'll miss him for the time that he's gone and for the time being you know we're gonna

like we did when Trey went down or other guys have gone down, there's going to be another guy in this situation, me, who steps in and does whatever we can to win the game. I'm sure if I ask JT, there's pieces of you that he's learned from. So from you, when you go out there now, like what are the pieces of him that you've learned from through your time together? Yeah, pretty much all-encompassing, right? The guy does just about everything. He hits, he manages the pitching staff well, he plays defense well, and he plays almost every single day. So I think just the mindset of going out there and, you know, no matter what,

prioritizing all of those things and not just one or the other is huge. Just getting to watch him on a daily basis, I don't think I can put my finger on just one thing. This is a really general question, but what's the most fun part about playing baseball for you? I think I've said it a few times now. Winning. Yeah. There's nothing better than winning a Major League Baseball game. Sorry, I leave.

No, that's it. No, that's it. It's the best thing in the world. Winning a Major League Baseball game is really hard to do. All right, so give me your top three wins. Of all time? Yeah. Ooh.

Man, I really have to think about this one, but I would say... I'm not going to hold it against you. No, I would say they're all probably going to be playoff wins. I would say the win over the Braves in 22 to head to the CS. The win in 22 over the Padres to go to the CS. The Miami Marlins win with Stoddard hitting a grand slam. Obviously, the San Diego one was with Harp hitting the homer. Those three are definitely popped for me.

I was kind of hoping you would rattle off a Little League one. Yeah. High school. Tough to beat a playoff one in the big leagues. There's not a third deck in Little League. So along those lines, and I've heard this, winning isn't as impactful as losing. You know what I'm saying?

Sure. Yeah, you go out there with the expectation to win, I think. And so when you lose, it hurts a lot more. Does it? So the losses stay with you longer than the good wins. Yeah, I would say the wins you look back on and you try to figure out or look back and be like, okay, why did we win that game?

But it's not as strenuous, right? But when you lose a game, you look back and you try to figure out all the things that you maybe could have done better to win that game. And that, looking back, always hurts more and stays with you more and you remember longer than the wins. Yeah, that's a good answer.

Last thing is that I would not remember this, but I asked you in the Florida playoff last year. Is this the best clubhouse in the major leagues? No doubt. No doubt. I think that's what you said, and I went back in spring training. I proclaimed that baseball sport. We proclaimed the Phillies. Congratulations, that's what you said. And I went back in spring training. I proclaimed that baseball support. We proclaimed the Phillies.

Congratulations. Best clubhouse. Yeah. So I took a leap of faith. But you have to explain why. Why you were so confident. Look, I don't know what goes on in other locker rooms in the league. I just know what goes on in ours.

I just know what goes on in ours. And I can't really imagine a better situation from individual players to teams to coaches to front office to ownership. I think it goes outside of the locker room and really anybody who represents, you know, the Phillies in general. From the top down, everyone's a good human being. We all enjoy being around each other, which you can't find very often. And we're all from different parts of the world. We come from different backgrounds. So to find a locker room where everyone enjoys hanging out with each other,

not just inside the locker room but outside the locker room, going to team dinners and hanging out and actually spending real time with each other and getting to know each other on a personal level, I don't think that happens everywhere. Maybe it happens somewhere else in the league. uh i can't imagine a better situation than being inside the phillies never had more team dinners you know that's yeah that's one of our fun things that we get to do changeable things we have right exactly um summer olympics or winter olympics i'm a summer olympics guy i grew up in San Diego. There's not much snow from where I'm from. So, yeah, I'm going to say Summer.

I appreciate you taking the time. Yeah, you got it, Rob. One of my favorite players to watch, Kyle Schwarber. Kyle, so I've talked to people about the hitting, the art of hitting, and what is being valued now. I've heard people crap over batting average, crap over a piece. I've heard people crap over batting crap over batting average crap over a piece i've heard people crap over everything you can grapple right so i i'm anxious to hear from you sort of where you land and what is important and what's not important well i think

it's a broad question because i think there's a lot of things that you can measure to make a good offensive player. You know, and I think it all determines on the construction of a team that, you know, there's going to be guys that like you'll value like you want to value bat the ball you want to value average you want to value um you know putting the ball in play and then there's sometimes where you're going to value a guy who uh is walk power ops things like that um you know, that that's important. For me, I think it's more of, you know, a combination of everything. You know, I don't, you know, I know my last few years have been low average, high slug, high on base. high on base um and i think that you you know you can ask anyone that if you're staring at a a one in front of your average are you happy no by not by any means so it's like you know if that's happening it's like okay i have to find a way to be valuable right so you

know that's okay walking that's slugging, that's driving in runs, whatever it is, but also, too, you work to be, you know, you want to get hits, you want to see a good average, right? So, you know, I think another thing, too, is just, like, a thing that could be underlooked is runners in scoring position, especially a guy on third base, less than two outs. How often do you get them in? That's an important stat.

Everyone can kind of get caught up in the home run. Everyone can kind of get caught up in high average, whatever it is. But if you have a guy on third base that's a that's a run that you can drive in and runs are the most important stat i mean exactly an rbi or run whatever it is creating runs right like you want to score runs you want to drive in runs so um i think all those things matter you know but I think that you can construct a lineup however you like. But, you know, for me personally, it's all about creating runs, driving in runs, and also, you know, being a hitter. When you, have you evolved in terms of how you look, have looked at things?

Like you said, it's sort of like, you know, maybe you were younger. Oh, my batting average is this, but, and I'm chasing that when that, when the reality is that you're doing so much more. Have you evolved in that way? Do you want to get in on it? No. For me, younger, you chase an average. You want to hit for a high average. You don't think about power numbers.

And OPS kind of became a big wearer in the game the last, like, you know, say, 10 years, right, you know, but, like, younger, obviously, you're wanting to hit for a higher average, you're wanting to do all these other things, right, and then you kind of get into the big leagues, and, and, you know, you, the game's so hard here. Like, this is such a hard game. And I think it's just trying to find a way to be valuable. And being a valuable player in the way that you invest your abilities, you know, for me, it's like, okay, if I'm not hitting for power, okay, I need to get on base

and I need to make sure I'm driving in runs and I'm finding ways on base and getting hits. And, you know, okay, then you start hitting for power. That's great, but, you know, you don't want to just keep trying to hit for power, right? You know, you want to have this same approach the whole time that, you know, you're going to run into a home run. You know what I mean? I'm not going up there trying to hit the ball in the seats you know trying to hit the red seat up there every swing right now you just want to have that same

consistent approach for yourself in a good position to hit the baseball the last thing isn't isn't a stat it's a measurement and which has been in the news lately it's sort of bad speed and i don't know if you've taken a look at this, and I know that probably it's something that has internally been looked at a lot more than even before this came out. But the thing that everyone jumped to was, oh, my goodness, the guy that a lot of people say the best hitter, Luis Arraiz, has the worst bat speed. Yet, I took a deep dive into it, and the top ten guys are all guys who are like,

holy crap, those guys are impactful hitters. So I don't know where you land on that. I don't train for bat speed. I don't try to do any of that stuff, right? I'm a short, compact guy, so I'm going to naturally have speed in my swing. It's not something that I'm in the offseason saying, okay, I need to train for this. You know, obviously you do baseball-specific things in the offseason

that are going to help you be powerful and help you be explosive. But I'm not going in there specifically saying I need to get higher bat speed. Because at the end of the day, the name of the game is put the barrel on the ball. You got to be the most efficient way to putting that barrel on the baseball. And if I can do that consistently, good things are going to happen. If you can't do it consistently and you're kind of going around the zone and trying to chase it out, it's not going to be a good thing. of going around the zone and trying to chase it out, that it's not going to be a good thing.

So, you know, trying to be in the zone and trying to be as accurate as possible with my bat. I appreciate it. Thank you. Okay, Zach, no wrong answers, as I said. When we talk about stats, I just talked to Kyle Schwarber about hitting. It's interesting, right? In this day and age of baseball, there's so many things to draw from and so many debates.

For you, what are some of the things that you prioritize? Stat-wise? It could be stats or it could be analytics. So one of the things that we had Andrew Bailey on, and I mentioned ERA, he cringed. So a lot of pitching coaches are doing that now. But, I mean,RA, he cringed. So a lot of pitching coaches are doing that now. But, I mean, again, no wrong answers.

Yeah, I mean, you know, I don't think ERA may be the best thing these days, but it's still up there on the board, and whether you look at it after the game or during the game, as you go, you know, you have a 2-3 up there or something like that, and the run scores, you see it jump, you're like, man, I need to get that back down. For me, it kind of just gives me, I don't know, it kind of gives me a drive to get it back to where it was and even lower. Or at a certain point in the season if i have a certain number say a two five all right second half i want to get it down to a two that type of thing so it kind of drives me to do that but i know it's not really important these days but for me personally can i just say

something like for all the people who don't like era tell me the bad picture that has a low year you know yeah i mean no some there's some luck, obviously, with it. They're giving away a lot more hits these days than maybe sometimes would be an error. So that affects it. FIP, I think, is maybe a better one for that.

But, I don't know, I'm still learning all of the extra stats or columns that they're coming up with these days of, you know, extra MOBA plus like all that stuff. Our coaching coach Caleb's really good. He's kind of a nerd with that stuff, so he's teaching me along the way

and I'm still learning. How about analytics? So there's stats and there's analytics. You know, you have extension, which maybe is something that you might want to lean into more because there's stats and there's analytics. You have extension, which maybe is something that you might want to lean into more because there's more ways to measure it. What are some of the things that you want to prioritize? So extension is always going to be there for me.

With me, I kind of like knowing spin efficiency. I think if spin efficiency is 90 plus, that's where I want to be. You know, at certain points in the season, it was 70s or 80s. It was still doing well, but it's not the fastball I want. The fastball I want is the one that spins true and is jumping out of my hand. What was that sort of thing that you didn't realize you were good at or that you didn't realize that this is sort of important to me until they started putting it in front of your face?

I've never been a big analytical guy even before. Everybody knew about it. So, like I said, with Caleb, just learning along the way the certain things that matter more than others. You kind of take things here and there. You don't go to after a start and say, okay, what was my extension? What was my spin rate? What was that?

It was just, did I get out? Yeah, I mean, that's the biggest thing, right? Get out. No matter what kind of stuff you have that day, you're going to have better stuff than some starts. So I'll ask Caleb, I'll say, what can I do to get better after that start or what was down, what was good that day and he'll just run through all that stuff and tell

me, you know, maybe slider wasn't moving as much as it should. Maybe it was going sideways more than down. So, we'll work on that next bullpen. The last thing is, you know, this is, I guess, a stat, but when we

talked to the Tampa guys, the Tampa secret sauce, throw strike one, your best pitch over the plate, strike one. Where do you, I know it's not as simple as that, maybe it is, but where do you stand on that? It's not really a

new thing, but I guess because these teams have had so much on that it's not really a new thing but i guess because these teams have had so much success it's become a thing right yeah i mean you know everybody you see those guys do well maybe guys who uh weren't as good as they are there now like uh maybe they were with um us oh no, I can give you examples. They were borderline and they went there and they were an all-star. Everybody wonders why. What did he do different? I know the coaches definitely think that because they had him at one point and

maybe they couldn't get him to that level. So they're like, alright, what could I have done different? That type of stuff. So I think the analytical stuff, you can see what other pitchers and other organizations are doing differently to make them have that success. So they can kind of take that and maybe use it. Everyone wants to throw a strike one.

That's the goal, right? In the minor leagues, I remember charting back in the day in the lower levels. There's three pitchers or less and strike one the hitters. That was one of the boxes that we had to fill out at the bottom. So that kind of stuck with me along the way because I always wanted to do well. And I felt like that was a key for it. Getting ahead of guys. Guys have always been swinging early on me because I have a good fastball

and I'm going to attack you. These days I throw a lot more strikes than I used to. So they know a strike is coming. They know I'm going to be around the zone if it's not a strike. And with a good fastball, you've got to be ready to hit it. So like yesterday, before the game, these guys are pretty patient. They don't swing out of zone. But at the same time, I know what teams do against me

because I've been doing it for a while now, and I know teams are usually aggressive early in the count, and that's what ended up happening. So I always take that kind of stuff with a grain of salt because I know my game plan and what teams do against me. You're educating young minds. I appreciate it. Thank you.

Thank you.