High Strange - Episode 05: Restricted Area

Episode Date: March 6, 2026

Area 51. Missing records. Conflicting timelines. We step into one of the most guarded stories on Earth and confront what holds up, what does not, and why it will not disappear.   Want more? Our High Strange music playlist is now available exclusively on Apple Music. Visit the link in our show notes or go to apple.co/highstrangeplaylist  To access our book list, go to apple.co/highstrangebooks  To find us in Apple Maps, go to apple.co/highstrangeguide For ad-free listening and bonus content, subscribe to Tenderfoot+ now! Members get all episodes ad-free plus bonus content throughout the season. Sign up at apple.co/highstrange. For Spotify, Google, and other Android users, visit tenderfootplus.com.   Follow along on social and the web: @highstrange on Instagram @highstrange on TikTok highstrange.comSee omnystudio.com/listener for privacy information.

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This podcast also contains subject matter which may not be suitable for everyone. Listener discretion is advised. News articles once again mentioned the talk about alien spacecraft, and subsequent articles in national magazines quoted unnamed sources about things of alien origin flying in Nevada. Out of nowhere like a Chiraco in the desert. He was in silhouette. He comes forward on the news and says, We are reverse engineering alien spacecraft at a place called Area 51,

which you haven't heard about, but it's out there in the Nevada desert. Nine flying saucers. And I was part of that program, and now I'm worried about my life. I feel a threat to my personal safety. That's my story. That's it. Done. The story of Bob Lazare will never go quietly.

He described a job. Not a moment in the sky, but a workplace. A schedule, a commute, the chain of command. He said, or reverse engineering alien spacecraft at a place you've never heard of. That place was Area 51. He says he was hired to work at an area called S4. At S4, he says, are flying saucers, technology that is seemingly beyond human capability. And overnight, a classified military test site became a cultural obsession.

Lazar's story is by any standards fantastic. He says he's telling it in order to protect himself. So George Knapp was like, who is this Lazar guy? His news people were like, is this true? He goes, I don't know. I'm going to find out. This week, we've heard the contention of UFO researchers that there is a secret government within our government.

It's a chilling scenario with worldwide implications that may have its roots right here. Area 51, that mysterious corner of the Nevada test site, is no longer much of a secret. The fact that secret of things go on here is a given, even to the Soviets, who make daily spy flights over the facility to take a peek at what's going on. The question was not just, is this true? It was, who is this guy? Very polarizing figure.

If people look into the UFO world, can we believe him? Can we not? Does he have a sorted past? Is he a liar? If Lazar is lying, it's an extraordinary lie. And if he's telling the truth, it's one of the most important revelations in human history. There is no middle ground. I was 13 years old.

And I hear on the radio, Bob Lazar's voice and George Knapp interviewing him, and that was like my gateway drug. That's where my curiosity got weaponized. Strange stories of lights in the night sky. No one who's worked at Dreamland has ever publicly acknowledged. what so many people have suspected for years that alien technology is being tested in the Nevada desert. It's very interesting building. It's got a slope of probably about 30 degrees,

which are hangar doors. Nine, flying saucers, flying disks of extraterrestrial origin. It's there, I saw it. This came from somewhere else, as a bizarre as that is to believe. I know what the current state of the art is and physics, and it can't be done. He says he was never told exactly what he'd be working on but figured it had something to do with advanced propulsion.

On his first day, he was told to read a series of briefings and immediately realized how advanced the propulsion was. You're like, okay, well, is this possibly true? The one thing he said that blew my mind was the way Babazar described the propulsion system. They run gravity amplifiers. There's no physical, hook up between any of the systems in there.

They use gravity as a wave using wave guides, almost like microwaves. Traveling these distances does require a level of technology that man has not yet achieved. But it has nothing to do with flying in a linear mode near the feet of light. We can distort the space time and, in turn, the distance between the point where we are and the point where we want to be. Lazzar doesn't talk like a storyteller. He talks like someone describing a machine. gravity amplifiers, non-reactionary propulsion.

I mean, are they just cool buzzwords? Or does he actually know what he's talking about? When you have a craft is propelled by something, most things are reactionary propulsion. Rockets to roller skates, you push something out the back, you move forward. The thing that Lazard said publicly that really struck me, he said this was a non-reactionary propulsion system, you can move through time and space.

You can move somewhere without pushing something out the back. And I'm like, what does that mean? It's like you push your fist into a bed and you've got a bowling ball on that bed and the bowling ball falls into the divot where you put your fist, falling into place. If what he said is true,

then the distance between stars and galaxies no longer matters. Because the big argument was, of course there's life out there in the universe, If you had a propulsion system that negated the entire dilemma you have of distance, time and space, then there's no boundary that's stopping contact from other civilizations. So all these things people see disks in the sky for thousands of years. Well, there's a possibility that could be true. So first time, I heard it explained in a way that made sense from a point of physics.

And I thought, holy shit, if what he's saying is true, then distance doesn't matter. And if that's true, dude, I got to find out. The hardware and technology I was exposed to should be placed in the proper hands of the scientific community. There is physical evidence which proves that there is life elsewhere and that at least one form of that life has been here. Lazar says he worked at S4, south of Groom Lake, inside hangers, built into the desert. Altogether, he claims to have seen nine crowds.

all different, all beyond human capability. What Bob Lazar said then, it is imperative that people try to understand what he meant by that and try to figure out from themselves if he is worthy of your trust. And then the story fractures. When he came forward, whether you believe it or not, the idea was that he was worried about his safety and his well-being. I know everybody who is with him at that time. They don't even like each other anymore, some of them.

They don't get along. They all agree on one thing. What Bob said happened, happened. He was temporarily employed trying to reverse engineer these UFOs. Immediately, when he came forward, George Knapp tried to dig into these claims and say, what can I prove, what is real, what is not real.

schools deny his education, agencies deny his employment. Records just disappear. Checking out Lazar's credentials proved to be a difficult task. He says he earned degrees in physics and electronics, but the schools we contacted say they've never heard of him. He also said he worked as a physicist at Los Alamos National Lab, where he experimented with one of the world's largest particle beam accelerators, a half-mile-long behemoth capable of generating seven

million volts. Very clearly worked at Los Alamos because guess why? George Knapp went there. Bob let him in. There's video of that. Los Alamos officials told us they had no records of a Robert Lazzar ever working there. They were either mistaken or were lying. A 1982 phone book from the lab lists Lazzar right there among the other scientists and

technicians. A 1982 clipping from the Los Alamos newspaper profiled Lazars and his interest in jet cars. It too mentioned his employment at the lab as a physicist. At the same time, physical evidence refuses to cooperate with that denial. Phone books, newspaper clippings, actual video footage from Los Alamos. This is where the Bob Lazar story becomes impossible to hold together in a clean way. Obviously worked at Los Alamos. but why did they tell George Knapp

that he didn't work there, never worked there, they don't know what he's talking about. We called Los Alamos again, an exasperated official told us he still had no records on Lazar. EG and G, which is where Lazar says he was interviewed for the job at S4,

also has no records. It's as if someone has made him disappear. Well, they're trying to make me a non-person. Explain, you called where? Well, the schools that I went to, the hospital that I was born at, past job, and essentially nothing comes up with my name in it. He smiles, but out of futility, knowing the whole thing must sound ridiculous. According to Lazar, his employer was the United States Navy.

He says he and other government employees would gather near EG and G&G, fly to Groom Lake, and then a very few people would get into a bus with blacked out or no windows and drive to S4. It took a while, Lazar says, before he actually saw one of the flying discs. However, there were hints everywhere. They had a poster, and it looked like a commercial poster almost, like it was lithographed, and you could buy it at a Kmart or something. But they were all over the place, and it had the discs that I coined the term the sport model. The sport model, his name for the craft stashed in the desert.

When I was let in, it was the first time I saw the sport model in the hangar, sitting down and I was told they could have walked me in the front door but they purposely wanted to walk me by it. I was still not to say anything and just keep my eyes forward and walk past the disc into the office area. As we went by it, I just kind of stuck my hands on it just to run it alongside the thing and after that I got to see it. I actually left off the ground and operate. The hangers are all connected together and there are large bay doors between each one and there were nine total that I saw, each one being different. Security at S-4 was oppressive, Lazar says,

and his superiors used fear and intimidation almost as a brainwashing tool. Did everything but physically hurt me? What a gun gear head? Yeah. Guards here with M-16s, a guy is slamming their finger into my chest, screaming in my ear, some people pointing weapons at me. It's not a good place to work.

lied about parts of his background, or someone tried very hard to erase him. If all I've just presented to you is true and the government is keeping this a secret, how can I make a video telling you about it? Well, the bottom line is, if there are any repercussions from making this video, it would simply confirm that what I told you is true. So what you do with this information is up to you. What's going on up there could be the most important event in history. You're talking about contact, physical,

physical contact and proof from another system, another planet, another intelligence. That's got to be the biggest event in history, period. I am telling the truth. I've tried to prove that. Not every detail is perfect. So the question becomes, does one false truth, or unresolved mystery, collapse this story altogether?

We have people ostensibly with credentials who are frauds and who have vlammed on to pop culture. Robert Scott Lazard, supposedly a nuclear physicist with a master's in physics from MIT, a master in electronics from Caltech, who supposedly worked on Area 51, back engineering flying saucers.

I did a lot of checking on Bob. I tried to meet with them twice. I was supposed to on one occasion, and he didn't go along. I checked at MIT. I checked at Caltech. Neither one ever heard of him. Well, but the government wiped his records clean as the response.

I talked to the legal counsel at MIT. No way to do that. I talked with a guy who has the degrees that commencement lists and all that sort of thing. No mention of Lazare. None of the yearbooks show Lazar. For master's degree, you need a thesis. I talk to the guy who holds those, no Lazar item there.

And the story goes on and on beyond that. And I get people telling me, well, I don't see why you don't believe him. He seems so sincere. Sincerity is not a check on truth. So if you go back in his history and he talks about going to college, there's no record of him being at this college, how is that so? What is the explanation for that? Okay, so let's open this up so your audience understands. So now we're going to like one of the points of contention. One of the first things George Knapp couldn't confirm was Bob

Lazar's education history. For certain things, he couldn't ever prove. Doesn't mean they didn't happen. Just George couldn't prove him. So in the first report, he goes, I cannot verify his claimed educational roles, what he said that he had. So it leaves you with one of three options. Either Babazar lied about his educational history that doesn't negate the fact that he did work at Los Alamos and doesn't negate the fact of what we now know about his employment out at the test range, Area 51.

That's version one. Okay, I'll accept that if that's true. Already you've got one thing, cool, does it make the difference for me? it's a part of it. Maybe I just want to know, is he a liar? What is the value of that to you? Maybe you're trying to figure out if he's a liar.

Well, it's like if you're on trial and this person had a history of lying about this, the defense would use that. That's evidence. You know, you look at the idea of, well, what's the other options? The other option is that back in the 80s or 89, when things were not as digital as they are now, Could you and would you scrub elements of his educational background? Okay, I could see some of that happening.

So then the third option is, what if Bob Lazar hasn't told us everything? What if he did have education at those schools he claimed, but he was maybe protecting a little bit the exact nature of that education? that's something that maybe Bob can talk about if he ever wants to. But that's a third option. I want people to keep on the table. When you bring up one aspect of the Bob Lazar case that is on your mind,

you have to assign it a value. Like how important is that, if we already know he worked at Area 51, and we have some proof of that. Like I have people that testified they saw him there. So then you have to assign a value to that. How much value does that one thing have you? It gave you three possibilities. maybe we don't know the full story.

That's how I would write the ship for you, the educational background of Bob Lazar, is that maybe there's something that we don't fully understand yet, or he's lying, or they scrubbed it. A sign of value to that. Just keep an open mind. If I found out he was lying, I would have already said so. And I could swallow the pill that if he came forward to,

said, hey man, I lied about this. I think he's more credible if he told me that. But just to be fundamentally clear, my understanding, like my belief, I guess my direct knowledge is that Bob Azar is telling you how it is, and there's probably more to hear from him. The other thing I think you should consider,

if there's tons of evidence in the favor of Bob having experienced what he said he did, we can't dismiss all of that. that based upon a few things that are unlooped for you. Don't just count. There is a mountain of evidence. The other thing you can reconcile is that it is possible

that someone like Bob Azar is the perfect person to bring into a program. Rocket guy, he's a pirate. If you wanted to discredit, Bob, you can do it. The bottom line is, some things add up, some things do not. And there's no one explanation that covers all of it, at least in a clean way. So instead of arguing about Bob Lazar as a person, let's widen the frame.

The deeper question is about how we decide what counts as knowledge. What do we accept as evidence? And how much uncertainty are we willing to take before we stop looking? More than a dozen agents serving federal search warrants. Taden is now chief investigator George Knapp, now with the exclusive story. Secrecy has always been paramount at Area 51, a once obscure outpost in the Nevada desert that might be the world's best known secret base.

He was pulled into court in crazy ways, pulled into court for setting up a security system for a brothel. Bob had a crazy life. And when you talk about discrediting the messenger so you can discredit the message, that's where it gets sticky. Just because you can discredit somebody from a what a moral standpoint?

Doesn't mean what they're saying ain't true. You should be disturbed by certain lacks of information in the Bob Lazar report, in what he has reported to us. It would make logical sense for you to be a little bit like, well, wait a second there, wait a second there. I was trying to catch Bob Lazar in a lie absolutely every day for my own knowledge. And I'm sorry to report. Blasar has never, ever been disingenuous with me. Not even disingenuous. It gave me access to everything.

30 years ago today, KLS aired a live interview with an anonymous man who made some really astonishing claims. He alleged that the U.S. military was secretly studying alien technology out of the Nevada Desert Area 51. A lot has changed in the decades since Bob Lazar first told this wild story. The Pentagon recently admitted that it really has been secretly studying UFOs and then it wanted to figure out and duplicate that technology. Pentagon officials reluctantly admitted to the New York Times that the military has secretly studied UFO incidents, in parts who it might figure out the technology.

It is what it is. But ultimately, I wasn't there. I don't know for fact that everything, he saw was what he thinks it was. The mysterious case of Bob Lazard, he's a hell of a guy, a really good person, and that's more important to me than flying saucers. Getting ready for a game means being ready for anything,

like packing a spare stick. I like to be prepared. That's why I remember 988, Canada's suicide crisis hubline. It's good to know, just in case. Anyone can call or text for free confidential support from a train responder anytime. 988 suicide crisis helpline is funded by the government in Canada. In 2023, a story gripped the UK, evoking horror and disbelief.

The nurse who should have been in charge of caring for tiny babies is now the most prolific child killer in modern British history. Everyone thought they knew how it ended. A verdict? A villain. A nurse named Lucy Leppie. Lucy Leapie has been found guilty. But what if we didn't get the whole story? The moment you look at the whole picture, the case collapses. I'm Amanda Knox, and in the new podcast, Doubt the case of Lucy Letby, we follow the evidence and hear from the people that lived it,

to ask what really happened when the world decided who Lucy Lettby was. No voicing of any skepticism or doubt. It'll cause so much harm at every single level of the British establishment of this is wrong. Listen to Doubt, The Case of Lucy Letby, on the Iheart Radio app, Apple Podcasts or wherever you get your podcasts. China's Ministry of State Security is one of the most mysterious and powerful spy agencies in the world. But in 2017, the FBI got inside. This is Special Agent Regal, Special Agent Bradley Hall.

This MSS officer has no idea the U.S. government is on to him. But the FBI has his chats, texts, emails, even his personal diary. Hear how they got it on the Sixth Bureau. podcast. I now have several terabytes of an MSS officer, no doubt, no question of his life. And that's the unicorn. No one had ever seen anything like that. It was unbelievable. This is a story of the inner workings of the MSS and how one man's ambition and mistakes opened its fault of secrets.

Listen to the Sixth Bureau on the IHeart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. I'm Nancy Glass, host of the Burden of Guilt Season 2 podcast. This is a story about a horrendous lie that destroyed two families. Late one night, Bobby Gumpright became the victim of a random crime. He pulls the gun. Tells me to lie down on the ground. He identified Tremaine Hudson as the perpetrator.

Termaine was sentenced to 99 years. I'm like, lo. this can't be real. I thought it was a mistaken identity. The best lie is partial truth. For 22 years, only two people knew the truth, until a confession changed everything. I was a monster.

Listen to Burden of Guilt Season 2 on the IHeart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. The bottom line is, some things add up, things do not. And there's no one explanation that covers all of it, at least in a clean way. So instead of arguing about Bob Lazar as a person, let's widen the frame. The deeper question is about how we decide what counts as knowledge. What do we accept as evidence? And how much uncertainty are we willing to take before we stop looking? To help do that, I wanted to bring in

two minds who approached this problem from a very different angle. not as whistleblowers or journalists, but as thinkers, scientists who are less interested in answers than in frameworks. That brings us to Gary Nolan, who you heard briefly in episode one, in the legendary Jacques Valet. It's like the end of adolescence, and now you need to get a job. Okay. You need to get money and you get to invest in structures, which is what Dr. Norland is leading. And that's possible now because, in part,

because of people like me writing those books and those books getting attention through the web and so on. A number of people know the basic fact. you know, the basic data. And a number of people have started to do their own investigations. And if you have a computer, today you can build a professional level catalog and you can do your own statistics if you're known statistics. You don't need to wait for somebody to give you authorization to do that.

That has changed the audience. It's made it a lot larger. and it has changed the level of professionalism that you can apply to that. The mystery goes through phases, and every phase is taken up by the media and then forgotten and then reborn in some other way. So I've seen all these different waves of interest along the way.

Then it became international. Today, most of the information suddenly that I get or that people here get is through the web. Now everybody can be in contact, know what's going on in other countries. I think we're at a point of major transition. You know, the media has driven that. You know, once you have television, then people have access to a larger audience and so on. before it was just radio interviews, you know, once in a while,

and they would only happen when there was some event. Journalists are not going to be interested in a subject where there is no breakthrough. When we're still standing here with no real answer to the mystery. I'm taking the time to answer your question, because I think that's the profound question. There isn't one truth. I'm an information scientist, so what I'm going to do is ask how many cases like that are there.

And I'm going to build a little catalogue of those cases. If I can, I'm going to go talk to the witnesses. In the other cases, they'll all like it. Then I'll try to build a pattern or a model of what the operation or what the situation was and where that person was with respect to that situation. And I think that's all I can do. That's the best I can do. Data is different than evidence.

The same data, I can have a list of numbers. It could be what last year's wine harvest is or what the output of the sewage plant was across the United States. Numbers, that's just data, right? but contextualized data, at least in science, in the context of a hypothesis, saying, okay, here's data that I've collected around biology. Does the data support in the context of the question, whether or not the hypothesis is correct? At that level, it starts to become evidence. And we call it evidence, but it's not.

Evidence is not proof. Evidence is no more proof in biology or UAP, UFOs than it is in a courtroom. Evidence is evidence and you have a jury of your peers who you are looking at the evidence and how you, the prosecutor or the defense, pitch it different ways of interpreting what the evidence means. But the evidence truly is just data. The question is, what is the question is, what is the evidence? nature of evidence. I mean, there has to be a framework. It's like in court. You can have a witness who is telling the truth about what he saw, and he saw a blue car. Now, I'm going to get other witnesses to come forward, and some of them will be truthful and they will

have seen a red car. And they are both telling the truth as they experienced it at the time. But at the time, the event was confusing. There were many people. There was blood on the floor. There was an accident. There was something happening. The police arrived with sirens and lights and everything else. Ambulances arrived. And everybody got very confused. If you look in the papers and you read the actual science of the papers, biologists and even often physicists will leave themselves so much diplomat. room to be wrong. They'll always say it is supportive of the hypothesis.

Do you leave yourself room to be wrong? Scientists are right today, wrong tomorrow, but righter the next day. You know, so what it is, it's an incremental reinterpretation of reality. Reality is a construct of my brain based on my perceptions and my perceptions are limited and they are limited by my culture. They are biased by, you know, my beliefs. Some people might see the Virgin Mary and I'll just see a light. If you want to go back to was it real or not, you have to ask that question and, you know, what do you mean by real? You know, what, I mean, was there a physical,

virgin Mary there, and they've saw how come only one person saw her? There's only really one place where proof exists, and that's in math, because you have set the parameters so tightly, usually in a mathematical regime, you've created a sandbox within which it's either right or wrong. One plus one equals two, always. But we do come eventually to conclusions. Certain things get accepted as fact because so many people have looked at it over time that it's like, okay, well, I don't need to check it again. Every time I've checked it and all the things that I do based on it continue to be true. So therefore, I can proceed as if it was a formal conclusion.

And if you decode it, the way I try to decode those, it says your idea of time is wrong and your idea of space is wrong. Now I can introduce you to my idea. some of my friends in physics, and, you know, in theoretical physics, who are telling me the same thing. There is no such thing as time, there is no such thing as space. Those are things that our brains and eyes

are constructing to account for things around us well enough that we can survive, you know, in this environment for a while. That's all there is. But that's not true in terms of the real. the way the universe is constructed. All those messages, whether they are overt or, you know, more subtle, implanted in the brain or whatever, they are at another level that needs to be decoded.

But you find the same message being told in many different cultures, many different ways, independently. You know, the physicists today are starting to teach that time and space are convenient variables to do math about this world so we can build the Eiffel Tower. But that's really not, the basic physics is a form of uncertainty, you know, a form of quanta or something like that. Okay, so physics is in a crisis because of that. They need to reconcile with reality the way it is, the way we manipulate it. We're facing something that's way ahead of us,

with control of physics that we don't understand, and control of life, you know, at a level that we haven't considered yet. To me, the driver is that this should be an inspiration for us. This is not a threat, which is why the Air Force wanted to get out of it, because everything they do is designed for war. This is not a war?

We don't know what it is. The science is based on observing nature, and being seduced by nature or threatened by nature and adapting to it. So this is part of our learning about the universe generally. We think we understand the earth, and that's not true, when you talk to the Navy people who are here. So I think we're getting humble. as part of this, and it's good for us to be a little bit humble.

For example, there are three universities in the United States that are now engaged with projects that are funded. There is, you know, Stanford and Columbia and Harvard. Excuse me, but those are not depending on money from the government. They do whatever they want. And a professor with tenure in one of those universities like Dr. Nolan or Dr. Avilo at Harvard can pretty much raise money from companies or from interested people and design the project he wants and get his students involved.

At the very beginning, when I spoke to Dr. Heineck, there were a number of secret projects. if you remember on the Air Force in the US and so on. The hypothesis was that this could come from an adversary, you know, as part of the Cold War, that this was part of spying, this was part of... And that hypothesis didn't work. I mean, what they were observing was beyond the capabilities of even the Soviet Union.

The thing that I saw as a kid, I have no idea. I would compare it to, you know, I could give you hundreds of observations just like it. Between 10 and 15 meters in diameter, a disk that flies without noise or trail, and has some sort of a dome on top, flying saucer. Getting ready for a game means being ready for anything. being ready for anything, like packing a spare stick. I like to be prepared. That's why I remember 988, Canada's suicide crisis helpline. It's good to know just in case. Anyone can call or text for free confidential support from a train responder anytime. 988 suicide crisis helpline is funded by

the government in Canada. In 2023, a story gripped the UK, evoking horror and disbelief. The nurse who should have been in charge of caring for tiny babies is now the most prolific child killer in modern British history. Everyone thought they knew how it ended. A verdict? A villain. A nurse named Lucy Letby. Lucy Letby has been found guilty. But what if we didn't get the whole story? The moment you look at the whole picture, the case collapses. I'm Amanda Knox, and in the new podcast, Doubt the case of Lucy Letby, we follow the evidence and hear from the whole story.

people that lived it. To ask what really happened when the world decided who Lucy Lettby was. No voicing of any skepticism or doubt. It'll cause so much harm at every single level of the British establishment of this is wrong. Listen to Doubt, the case of Lucy Lettby on the Iheart radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. China's Ministry of State Security is one of the most mysterious and powerful spy agencies in the world. But in 2017, the FBI got inside. This is Special Agent Regal, Special Agent Bradley Hall. This MSS officer has no idea the U.S. government is on to him.

But the FBI has his chats, texts, emails, even his personal diary. Hear how they got it on the Sixth Bureau podcast. I now have several terabytes of an MSS officer, no doubt, no question, of his life. And that's a unicorn. No one had ever seen anything like that. It was unbelievable. This is a story of the inner workings of the MSS and how one man's ambition and mistakes

opened its vault of secrets. Listen to the Sixth Bureau on the IHeart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. I'm Clayton Eckerd, and in 2022, I was the lead of ABC's The Bachelor. Unfortunately, it didn't go according to, plan. He became the first bachelor to ever have his final rose rejected. The internet turned on him. If I could press a button and rewind it all I would. But what happened to Clayton after the show

made even bigger headlines. It began as a one-night stand and ended in a courtroom, with Clayton at the center of a very strange paternity scandal. The media is here. This case has gone viral. The dating contract. Agree to date me, but I'm also suing you. Please search for it. This is unlike anything I've ever seen before. I'm Stephanie Young. This is Love Trapped. This season, an epic battle of He Said She Said,

and the search for accountability in a sea of lies. Listen to Love Trapped on the IHeart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. When you listen to people like Jacques Filet and Gary Nolan, it forces you to slow down, not because they're giving you answers, but they remind you how limited our frameworks still are. How much of reality we explain through habit and comfort

instead of actual understanding. Science likes clean categories, clear definitions, results that are repeatable, but the human experience is never that tidy. Making this season of High Strange, there's so many nuanced details that stand out to me. People's tone, their timing, body language, what somebody hesitates on, what they tend to rush through,

and what feels heavy. Not just the stories themselves, but the real-life moments around them, sitting across from someone and feeling the room change when a certain detail comes up, watching people light up or shut down. Realizing how much information lives in these pauses, they don't show up in transcripts, they don't fit neatly into an evidence folder, but they matter. This show is not just about what people say happened. It's about how they carry it, how it sits with them, how it shaped the way they move through the world. And the same goes for us. Every interview, every drive, every late night conversation, all that becomes part of the story too.

So in the next episode, I sit down with my team and we pull the camera back even further. We talk openly about the people we've met, the places we went, the moments that stuff with us and the stories that never quite fit into a single episode, but I just have to tell you. Since 2023, we've been researching this topic at length. We have dozens of more stories to share with you. That's why we're coming back again. Season three of High Strange will be even longer and begins on June 6. And before we get there, let's take the gloves off and talk about some aliens.

High Strange is a production by Tenderfoot TV in association with IHeart Podcast. Created, hosted, and edited by myself, Payne Lindsay. Executive producers are myself and Donald Albright. Editing by Mike Rooney, Cooper Skinner, and myself. Original score by makeup and vanity set. Sound design, mixing, and mastering by Cooper Skinner. Additional production by Mike Rooney, Dylan Harrington, Eric Quintana, Sean Nerney, and Meredith Stedman.

Our cover art is by Polygon. Special thanks to Orrin Rosenbaum and the whole team at UTA. The Nord Group, Station 16, and Beck Media and Marketing. Check out the show's website at highstrange.com. And if you're enjoying the show, please help us out by rating and reviewing the podcast and share it with your friends. Thanks for listening. I'm Clayton Eckerd in 2022. I was the lead of ABC's The Bachelor.

But here's the thing. Bachelor fans hated him. If I could press a button and rewind it all I would. That's when his life took a disturbing turn. A one-night stand would end in a courtroom. The media is here. This case has gone viral. The dating contract. Agree to date me, but I'm also suing you.

This is unlike anything I've ever seen before. I'm Stephanie Young. Listen to Love Trapped on the Iheart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. Ready for a different take on Formula One? Look no further than No Grip. A new podcast tackling the culture of Motor Racing's most coveted series. Join me, Lily Herman, as we dive into the under-explored pockets of F-1, including the astrology of the current grid,

the story of the sports most consequential driver's strike, and plenty of other mishaped, scandals, and sagas that have made Formula One a delightful, decadent, gumster fire for more than 75 years. Listen to no grip on the IHeart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. I'm Amanda Knox, and in the new podcast, Doubt, the case of Lucy Lettby, we unpack the story of an unimaginable tragedy that gripped the UK in 2023. But what if we didn't get the whole story?

The moment you look at the whole picture, the case collapsed. What if the truth was disguised by a story we chose to believe? Oh my God, I think she might be innocent. Listen to Doubt, the case of Lucy Lettby, on the IHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. Hey, tender for listeners. We want to hear from you. We just launched a survey and want to know about your favorite shows, your merch requests, and what you'd like to listen to in 2026.

Give us the gift of your feedback, and you might be one of our winners to get free merch and a $100 Amazon gift card. Head over to tenderfoot.tv slash survey for more. Thanks again. Now here's the show. This is an IHeart podcast. Guaranteed human.