Higher Learning with Van Lathan and Rachel Lindsay - Anna Wolfe on Brett Favre’s Impact on the Most Vulnerable

Episode Date: September 27, 2022

Van and Rachel welcome investigative journalist Anna Wolfe to discuss her reporting of the Brett Favre welfare funding scandal (21:05), before discussing the latest news regarding Boston Celtics head coach Ime Udoka’s suspension (1:00:09). Plus, a Tennessee principal says the “N-word” (1:23:09) and Rihanna’s performing at the Super Bowl (1:30:01) Hosts: Van Lathan Jr. and Rachel Lindsay Guest: Anna Wolfe Producer: Donnie Beacham Jr. Learn more about your ad choices. Visit podcastchoices.com/adchoices

Yo, yo, yo, yo, thought warriors. What's up? Howe Learning is on is Ivan Lathan Jr. That is me, Rachel Lynn Lindsay. What, what, what's your eel about? Well, like, your throat wasn't clear before, so it was like, Yo, yeah, yeah, what's, I was hiring? That's how you got it.

Rachel, people aren't perfect. This is the first thing people hear when they get on the podcast. People don't care about what I say on this podcast unless, I get. Oh, please. Unless I get something wrong, they don't care. They love you. Everything that you say,

butterflies and flowers, everything that I say, fuck them. Fuck them. So yeah, I'm in Atlanta, Rach. We know. Because, and I might,

Donnie, come on, come on this with me. Come on, on, on, on, top of the podcast. You've been acting, you're in a new city,

and you've been acting brand new. You don't talk the same. You don't dress the same? I don't dress the same. Yeah, pinky ring, yeah. Y'all want to talk about the pinky ring? Give us a story behind that.

I don't know what's happening in Italy. I bought the pinky ring in Greece. Okay, but you didn't put it on until you got to Atlanta. You've been back from Greece. You've been back from Greece for like a month. But I haven't worn the pink. Why would I wear the pinky ring like around the house? Like when I'm at home or whatever.

I wore the pinky ring plus I don't wear. I'm not really wearing jewelry in LA like that. Nope. Not going to happen to me. All right. But every time you keep showing off the pinky ring, you keep curving your finger like this. Yeah.

You know what I mean? Like, Dr. Evil situation. Look at it. You know who's on my pinky ring? Some Greek God. That's Alexander the Great of Macedonia. You know what I mean?

Conquered the known world. He was bad in terms of Africa. But look, I'm telling you this. I like, I have a colonizer on your pinky? Yeah, one of the first. Come on. But here's the thing, though. I have it as a reminder.

As a reminder. It's okay. Here's a reminder. Two things. Number one, you don't have to conquer the whole world. You only have to conquer the world that you know. And I always like that. Because back when I would learn about these conquerors and these people,

they conquered the known world. Well, it was available to them is what they did. So the only thing I need to try to control or try to understand is what's in immediate vicinity of my life. Don't feel the need to conquer the unknown, like Alexander the Great. And, you know, also, white dudes, so you want to put him on a pinky,

the least strong finger, because you know what I'm saying? You don't want to put him on the index finger because it's that point. You don't want to put him on the ring finger. He said, but put him on a pinky thing. I'll be honest with you. I like Alexander the Great. He's a historical figure that's all fucked up.

I like him. It's bad. It's bad. I like him since I was a kid. So he's on my pinky. It's all fucked up. History is fucked up. I guess you can call me the Black Bill Maher.

What have you been doing? I heard that you hung out with Kalika. I did. But wait, wait, real quick. Did you wear the pinky ring at the revolt conference that you? I definitely did.

I definitely did. Anybody ask you about it? Did you talk about it on stage? No, people asked me like, like somebody looked at me and like, Vanna, we to the pinky ring stage of life now?

It's a thing. It's just, I was taking aback when I saw it. The pinky ring? I like it. It adds a good 10 years to you. I'm not going to lie. I'm not tripping at all.

I like it. I think I'm to this point to where this is the thing for me. You know what I'm saying? Like sometimes it turns this way and it's like it points out. And when it points out, I feel like, ooh, this is me. This is me before with no pinky ring. Oh, man. This is me with a pinky ring.

Oh. This is me with no pinkie ring. Hey, how you doing? My back hurts. Well, I don't know. This is me with a pinky ring. Sizzle. sizzle, sizzle, yeah.

It changes you. Donnie, you should get a pinky ring. Case and point about the brand new. We don't know this man. Here's a situation. But I'm happy you feel good. I'm in Atlanta. I got to make it work here in the room

because I don't know where it's safe to go in Atlanta. I don't know. I keep telling people I want to go places. They're like, shit, don't go over there. That's like, I've heard this boy in Atlanta. You don't understand that we're becoming a world to where Like you understand what kind of world

We're becoming It's like that in LA Man I'm trying to go to world on wheel She ain't gonna catch me over there Shit niggas to kill you And like I'm in Atlanta now I was like man I'm about to

I need some I needed some Some white Air Force ones For the thing I ended up not getting them I'm like yo man I'm gonna go right over here To the Linn's mall

She You don't need to be in the Linnis Mall She won't catch me You could have gone to that That's not They say don't go to that bitch. Atlanta thought warriors or Solace Jackals, it don't matter. Tell us,

they say don't go to Lennox Mall. They say Linux mall as well happen to you more than any other place. Donnie? Do you go to Lennox? I've been once just to go and there's no need to go anymore. There's so many malls out here. Lennox Mall is one of the worst of them for sure. It feels bad. Donnie, you want to get dinner tomorrow night? You want to get dinner tomorrow night since I'm here?

Yeah, man. Let me know. Where should we, where the fuck should we go? Should we go to Papadoes? That's a good option. This is what makes you be kind of chilling on a Tuesday night. There's also another place called Papacitos right across the street from Papados, which is a Mexican. No, it's not as good. It's more like, there's not good Mexican food out here in Georgia.

Why would I come? See, this is the problem with you, Donnie. Why would I come to Atlanta and get Mexican food? Donnie. That's why I took it back after I said it. No. It's too late, Donnie. Donnie, Donnie, it's too late.

I come out here and whatever and you're like, let's go get Mexican food. Now, I'm in Atlanta. I want nigger food. I want the food of the slaves is what I want, Donnie. Okay. There's some chicken spots, too. We can go. Exactly.

Exactly. Donnie. Donnie, come on, bro. Exactly. I'm out in LA. You know what I mean? They got all the Mexican food. I'll get whatever.

Now I'm in Atlanta and you're like, let's go to Papacitos. Let's get some tacos with ketchup on them. No, I'll just provide an option. Just options. What do you go to you at? Speaking of the Pappado's is near Perimeter Mall, which is a pretty decent mall that you could go to get your Air Force once. Perimeter Mall. Let me see.

Where is Perimeter Mall at? Let's look. Perimeter Mall. Where's that at? Atlanta. Dunwoody. Dunwoody, Georgia. It closes soon, perimeter mall.

Dunwoody, Georgia. That looks pretty decent. Okay. They got a, they got a, they got a, I'm looking at it. They got a Christmas tree. I'm like, I don't want to go to perimeter tomorrow. I just saw a picture that threw me off.

What? I saw a picture of these. I'm not going to be honest I'm going to be honest with you I saw a picture of perimeter mall and it's of the the Apple store and I don't know

it looks like a black mirror episode for some reason I see all these niggas sitting outside it looks weird the ceiling looks low that's why I love LA we got real malls bruh you know what I'm saying this mall looked like a slave ship I'm not going

I'm not going anywhere okay I'm staying So that means he canceled dinner plans with you already, Donnie. Oh, no, no, no, no. Don, you can come over here to the, you come over here to the fucking. You come over here to the fucking is to get dinner. Stop telling people where you are. We've been through this.

Take that out. I'm going to do this. Yeah, Donnie, believe that. You can come over here. I was, uh, oh. Actually, they do have a great bar down there. Like, I like the little lounge spot that they have there. So, you may be there.

So check this out, Rachel. The first night that I got here, right? Saturday. I missed the shocking upset of Saturday in college football. I missed the shocking upset. It was just terrible. I was on the plane, so I didn't see it. The shocking upset.

So you wanted to talk about Bozeman and Kalika coming over? Nope. Nope. They calling it bad luck and Lubbock. University of Texas is going up there and down the earth against the Texas Tech Red Raiders. I missed that. I missed a lot of the games.

I missed Tennessee Florida. When I got there, I wanted to watch the LSU game and my back was hurting because of the flight and the whole thing. So Rachel, I decided I was going to go to the pool here at the hotel. Good for you.

They have a hot tub and they have a pool. Very nice hot tub. Very nice pool. Yeah. And so I'm thinking to myself, I'm in hotel. a lot. And for some reason

when I go to hotel pools, especially if they're indoor, there is never anybody there. Yeah. That's true. Like, never. Like, the whole time I was in Mexico, I would go to the pool. It was like my pool. You know, so I'm going to go down there because, let's be

honest. I'm not, I'm past the age where you can understand why I would be swimming with my shirt on. But my titty's massive. I just got some tits. on me. You know? Okay. Vanney Pardon. So, so, so my tits,

Vanny pardon, like that's what that's what my tits are big. Oh man. I don't, like, I don't feel the best with my shirt off. So I'm like, so I'm going down to the pool, right? And I'm like, this is going to be good. I brought my, my iPad so I can set it up and watch

the LSU game. And, I'm going to get in the thing, and then I'm going to swim, and then I'm going to come back and nobody's going to be down here. Well, I forget that it's the Revolt Summit, and they have all of us in the same hotel. Oh.

So they put us all in the same hotel. And so when I'm getting off the elevator, to go to the pool and to the thing, I hear, my career about the blast, like, blah, buddy, right? Trust me, three, six, five on the dashboard. I'm like, shit, who goes? getting it like that in the gym because you got to walk through the gym to get to the pool.

Uh-huh. And I'm like, what the fuck? Fuck I don't be over your old life, not T. I'm like, what the shit? And I'm like, as I get closer to the door, I'm like, fuck, that shit coming from the pool, man. I'm like, that shit coming from the pool. Are you closed? Do you have your clothes?

At this point, I'm closed, right? Okay. Like, at this point I'm closed, I'm like, that shit's coming from the pool. So I walk in there, that bitch is lit. indoor pool is people on the side it's people it's niggas in big ass chains you know what I'm saying with they various RICO organizations

um on the chain around their neck and it's like and when I walk in they know me oh shit van what up what up what up I'm like yeah now there's no way for me to play this off either I have to turn around and then leave and go back into in shame or I easily could have done that not really

because I got a towel I got flip flops I got all right you could be like oh I just wanted to come out and see what was going on down here but you were ready to go it's obvious

you have the starter pack it's obvious that I'm coming down here to get in the water so I look around I'm like Fuck. This didn't happen, but

when you're self-conscious and insecure like I am, it felt like the record scratch and everybody was like, and everybody started looking. Hey, hey, hey, let's wait for the fat nigga to take a shirt off. Let's wait for him to take a shirt off. Watch this. Watch this. Watch this. Watch this. Watch this. Let's see if some diabetes spills when he pulls

a shirt off right now. Let's see. So I go over there and I see them. What's up, man? A couple people coming over there. A couple people actually came over and took pictures with Let me get a flake. So I sit there and I, you know, I turn the water up in the jacuzzi because the jacuzzi's off to the other side of the pool. I put my foot in and make sure the water is nice. I'm looking.

I'm trying to make sure people are occupied before, like, I take my shit off. And I notice something. There's like, you know, like one of those little where some of our disabled brothers and sisters could get in the, a little chair and it could drop you into the hot tub. Oh, okay. Yeah, yeah, yeah. They have one of those by the hot tub. So I was able to do,

because I was able to get into the hot tub and hide behind that joint. And then take my shirt off and submerge myself in the water before anyone was able to see Moby Dick in all of his glory. I waited around and had a. great time, but I had to stealth it out. My titties didn't even float. People came over there, they talked to me, what I want out of this, what I want to do in my career.

There was one guy that said, damn, man, the pandemic kind of got you, huh? Yo, don't say that shit to me. Hold on, I got to address the camera here. Yeah. Hey, people, when you see me, I know. I've gained 40 pounds.

I get it. You know what I'm saying? Well, man, the pandemic got you. You know, it's about to get you. Hurt feelings. My hurt feelings. But I was able to get in there. I had a good time.

You know, people, I got to, I ordered some food over there to the thing. Oh, you really were having the good time. Were you in the pool or the hot tub? Never got in the pool. Okay. Checked down in the hot tub. Okay. I wanted to get in the pool, but I stayed in the hot tub.

I stayed in the hot tub. And when it was time to leave, I wrapped the towel around me. like women do, you know, when they put the tile around their thing, the little, where it covers your breasts. I wrapped the towel around me like that, and then I left. I was able, I had a good time. But I think about all of that to avoid the shame of Vanney Parton. Well, I'm, okay, I'm glad that you were able to enjoy yourself and you saw it through. Because it seems like you had a great time.

Also, I don't know how you eat in a hot tub. I would get way too hot to be able to have a full meal. I would have to like cool off in the pool before I would be able to do that. Rachel, come on. What? Why are you acting like you like to eat? Okay, you're right. I do eat to survive.

You're right. I don't enjoy food. I eat because I have to survive. Yes, I know. So it's not, it's like, I couldn't eat in the hot tub. Rachel, you couldn't eat in Paris. That's not true. You couldn't eat in New Orleans.

Like you couldn't eat, you know what I'm saying? It's not true. And I don't want people to think I have a disorder or anything. I just, I'm not a foodie. I just don't enjoy it in that way. So y'all went and saw Don't worry, darling. I heard of this. Oh my gosh.

That's right. I saw Click a Friday and Saturday. We saw Don't worry, darling. We are all excited with another friend as well. We were very excited. Candida, you can say her name. Okay, Candida. Shout out to Candida.

Candida. I don't know. I'm always like about weird with stuff like that. Yes, me and Candida all went out. I enjoyed the movie. I found there were a lot of issues with it, but overall, I think I was expecting something terrible because everybody talks about

how terrible this movie is. Oh, it's so bad. Oh, the real life drama is so much better than the drama that's in the movie. It wasn't that big of a discrepancy. I thought it was a good, solid movie. I would encourage people to see it, but I do have issues with it. I didn't like the ending.

And I'm big on the movie has to end right. There's a lot of things that were left unexplained. What's your favorite ending in the movie ever? It's a really good question. And you know I always struggle with movie questions. Favorite movie? This is Vann's very serious question of the week. What is Rachel's favorite movie ending ever? And then I'll tell you my favorite movie ending as well. I don't know. I don't know if I'm trying to think of that movie. that it ended and I was like, oh, so good.

I can't. I can't. Tell me yours. Let me think. Let me think. I got five. You ready? You have five. Venn's five best movie endings. Okay. All right. Mo better blues. Things ended up working out for Bleak. All right. Everybody came. Everybody grew up. Shadow and Bleak were cool The band was back together Bleak learned his lesson Didn't drill his son About playing the trumpet

Let him go outside Beautiful movie Shout out to Movedo Blues Jerry McGuire Just the smaltziest Like best You Complete Me Raw Tillwell

Catches the touchdown ending Ever Three The Matrix What the fuck Are you kidding me Are you kidding me at the end of the

Matrix? At the end of the Matrix? Matrix is a good one. We're talking about the end of the matrix? Like several different points the Matrix ends is off the chain. The end of the Matrix are you fucking nuts? Amazing. Okay. Number four There will be there will be blood. At the end

you drink I drink your milksick. I drink it up. and then what happens I don't want to spoil it for anybody it's shocking the only way that it could end okay at the end of number five

I got to keep it all the way real with the Lion King man I gotta keep it all the way real with the Lion King at the end of the Lion King not the Beyonce version talking about the true animation version everything that happens they hold Simba up

baby bro that's like The full circle moment the full circle of Nice. Yeah, it's the whole shit. Good one. I would add Black Panther. I like the way that that ends it. He obviously decided that, you know, like they could use their knowledge and money and power and all of that and bring it. It was almost a full circle moment as well. And bring it to the States. I liked that. And recently, I just saw this movie,

luckiest girl alive and I like the way that that movie ended. Right. I don't want to give it away because I don't even think it's come out yet. I think it comes out this week, but it's good. By the way?

The girl power moment at the end. Honorable mention for Django Unchained. Just, yeah. It's something to get some motherfuckers out of here. Honorable mention for Jangle and Chained. All right. Time to get into the show. You guys, we are,

going to do a little bit of a deeper dive here for the big deal of the day. We're going to talk to Anna Wolf of Mississippi today about the Brent Farrf scandal. You guys have no idea how deep this goes. You guys have no idea how layered this is and just how disgusting the graft and the predatory usury that was happening in the Mississippi is. And at the tip of it is all, one of the best quarterbacks of all time. And the son of his state, the pride of Mississippi, Brett Favre. Just how deeply he failed the people of Mississippi. You'll know it after our interview with Ann Wolf. That's coming up next and that's the big deal of the day.

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All right, guys. There's a story that I think encapsulates everything that's wrong with modern sporting culture, with the tremendous gap in resources here in America between the haves and have-nots. and in the way we consume and DFI people that perform at a certain level on the athletic field. And that story that we've touched on here at Higher Learning is what's going on with Brett Farrf down in Mississippi and how it's been uncovered that he has colluded to steal from the people of Mississippi. Now, we've talked about this around the edges, but we want to go a little bit deeper into it now that more information continues to come out.

That's why we decided to go to somebody who, to be honest with you, knows more about this story than anybody else. Who's in a brilliant, beautiful green room right there as well. Is this, Anna, is this typically the room that you, that you, that you podcast and do your interviews from and stuff like that, this room right? This is my new office. Yeah. And I just painted it. And I've got the contrasting colors on here. It's great.

Oh. I used to have a roommate and now I don't and this is my office now. There you go. Okay. Anna Wolf, you are with Mississippi today. Am I correct on that? Yes. And you were instrumental in breaking the news and getting the information out to the people about the breath of off scandal.

Thank you for joining us today on higher learning. I'll start with my first question for you. Take us to the beginning of this entire thing. When did we first learn about this? When I say we, I mean, you guys down there, what's the genesis of this? How did all of this get started? So my experience with this story sort of predates the breaking of this scandal. But back in 2018, I took this job at Mississippi today to cover poverty.

And I knew that because there had been a story that came out a short time prior to this, that the state was denying 99% of people who were applying for cash welfare assistance. But I knew that we got that money from the federal government every year regardless. It's a block grant. So it comes from the federal government to the state. And the state can spend it virtually however it wants. And I wasn't able to get any information from the department after, you know, records request after records request for expenditure data regarding how we were spending

this welfare money. I knew it wasn't going out primarily to people in poverty through direct cash payments. So where was it going? And I pushed and pushed and fast forward to early 2020, the auditor's office arrested six people in connection with a scandal to steal around $4 million from the Department of Human Services. Among the people arrested were the former welfare director, John Davis, and this nonprofit founder, Nancy New, who had really, been given the authority to spend a lot of the money. And one of the charges in those indictments

in 2020 was that she had embezzled $2 million in this welfare money and put it into a pharmaceutical company called Prebicus, which was developing a cure for concussions or a drug that would prevent brain damage after a concussion. Pretty quickly on, we were able to tie that company back to Brett Farrb. And we broke the first story that that illustrated how Brett Farrb was actually working with state officials to lure this company to Mississippi and had been communicating with the governor and the welfare director about this project. And then in that same month, February of 2020, we published a story about how $5 million went to the volleyball stadium. And these are stories that we were just able to put together through sourcing and

and documents that we retrieved. This was before the auditor had even reported anything about Brett Fav. In May of 2020, he came out with a report that said that Brett Favre himself had received $1 million in welfare payments to basically under a promotional gig to promote the welfare program. Okay, so all of that came out in 2020. Not a lot of fanfare, not a lot of national coverage, right? fast forward to this year and we're learning sort of there's been sort of a trickle of information, but we're learning more and more here recently through text messages, both that I obtained

and that have been entered into a court filing that show kind of how Farr was discussing these deals with, with welfare officials. So, you know, he was aware that this money was coming from the Department of Human Services. He was working with John Davis on pulling down this money. And his, the way that he spoke about it was really like, I'm trying to save myself some money here. Can y'all please help me out? Right. And getting the governor on board in order to make the deals happen. A lot of people are wondering, because at this point, you named Nancy New, you named John Davis. They had been arrested. I think John Davis just pled guilty. And we know that they're cooperating right now with the authorities. A lot of people, of course, are wondering now that this has become more public and the text messages are being released and it's very evident that Brett Farr was involved.

Why hasn't Brett Fav been charged or arrested? And I'm also wondering, is there any type of precedent that, you know, the authorities can lean on to show that what has been done before when someone has been misusing government funds for their own personal use? or, you know, for a business or something that they're involved in? Sure. So the federal authorities work very slowly and very quietly. So that is, it's not a very satisfying answer to your question, but it is the truth that these people that I just described who were facing charges and arrested in 2020, they were facing state charges. And the case just kept getting kicked down the road as federal authorities continue to

investigate. And John Davis, as you mentioned, not only just pled guilty last week, he was also charged last week for the first time federally. No one in the entire case had received a federal charge until last week, criminal charge, until last week against John Davis. And he pled guilty last week. And so that kind of gives you a sense for what the timeline is here. You know, it's not like the feds came in and charged people two years ago. Those were state charges. And so now I think you'll see the feds really heating up.

You know, we published some text messages that showed that Brett Farr had offered the governor stock in this pharmaceutical company in exchange for his health. And fast forward to two days after Phil Bryant left office, he agreed by a text message to accept that stock. And in the last year in office, he was received. updates from Brett Farb about how this company was receiving public money outside of the view of the public. After that story published, Nancy New pled guilty within a few days of the conclusion of that series publishing. So I think what we saw is that the case had really stalled over about a two-year period until that information was made public and officials could no longer ignore it, right? We can't say what they would have done, what may or may not have happened, depending on, you know, what we did or didn't do.

But I think that definitely the idea that they could ignore it or that they could kind of just, you know, charge Nancy, charge John Davis, let them go to prison. And that the end, maybe the end of it wasn't possible after we published those text messages. That was kind of a long-winded way of answering that. As far as a notion about precedent, you know, Nancy has been charged with RICO, with a RICO charge. It's racketeering. So typically we see when there are these kinds of criminal organizations

and enterprises, that's the kind of charge that you're going to be seeing. And so, you know, it doesn't just matter that there was a signature on a piece of paper. Like, you can be charged with participating in a scheme. if there is, you know, verbal agreements and especially written communication. So I don't think that anything's out of the question in terms of charges. Donnie, do you have it ready to go for Anna? Rico.

Rico. That's one of our magic words here. Rico. Everybody's saying Rico. All right. And I want to come back to this pharmaceutical company because I think this is very interesting. as I understand it with these pharmaceutical companies Is this is this pharmaceutical company public yet

Where they were they being publicly traded at the time That the Brett Fav was doing this was was the intent here With Brett Fav and other people to Invest into this company that has this drug Take the company company public and then make a shit ton of money What was the impetus for them to get involved of this was he trying to make the the people of Mississippi pay for his private investments and enticing others to do that? Is that what I'm to understand here?

I love this question because I don't think I've gotten this question before, and that is absolutely reflected in the text messages. At one point he said, at one point he said that he expected to make $20 million on the deal, on selling this pharmaceutical drug. At one point, he was asking the scientist who started the company if, you know, like how likely it was that this was going to pass, you know, FDA or like past these clinical trials. And the company owner came back and said, you know, if someone dies, well, we're done. But other than that, we'll keep going and keep raising money. Anna, quick follow-up. Do you think that the public at large is correctly digesting this story for the monumental graft, sleaziness, just complete, disgusting, advantage taking of the people of Mississippi that this is,

this is beyond measure to me. I've never seen, to me, a public figure involved in the NFL, on Brett Farms level, involved in this sleazy and disgusting of a story. I can't remember anyone that's done something like this and been called for it. Like, do you feel like this conversation in the news media is being had enough for what the story actually is. Well, it certainly wasn't, I certainly weren't doing, you know, interviews six months ago.

Really, I think the national attention has been pretty extraordinary here recently. But as far as digesting the story, I mean, it is a, that's a tall task for anybody to digest this story. I mean, it is massive. It's sprawling and ensnared so many people. And there are so many different nuggets to kind of latch on to. So on Saturday, I published a story about a new court filing in the civil case. There's a court battle going on right now between the former governor, Phil Bryant, and the nonprofit founder Nancy New, about whether or not Phil Bryant should have to release more communication, text messages,

these kind of things related to his involvement with the volleyball stadium, getting $5 million in welfare money to the volleyball stadium. And in those text messages that he entered into court on Saturday, there was a text from Brett Favre to the governor where he said that he was on kind of the next stage of the construction project and they needed some lockers to be built at the facility. And he was wondering if Phil Bryant could help him find someone to build the lockers for free, you know, so he didn't have to pay for it. someone to offer their time instead of donating money to get it built, just someone, you know, doing it for free. And then he said that, uh, that his friend had suggested maybe we could use prisoners to, to build. Okay. Where is Brett? Where is he? Like, just, I, obviously he hasn't given any type of statement. And I'm sure he, he's being advised not to, but has, is anybody

reporting like where Brett is? What's Brett doing with all this attention? I'm just curious. No, I'm curious too, because, you know, he does do some media, and I haven't seen that he's done any interviews here recently, but I don't know. So he's certainly not talking to me. I did see that his local hit in Milwaukee, they pulled him off of that. They said no more. They don't want him on doing that anymore. So, you know, maybe all this attention really is starting to have some sort of effect,

I guess, as far as the media's concerned, since his van was pointing out, people weren't covering it in the way that they are now. I guess a follow-up question would be, not to that, but to what I said before, what about Phil Bryant? He hasn't been charged at all. He's clearly a direct former governor's clearly a direct link between Brett, what, Brett Favre and what he was trying to get done and using those funds. What's going on with Phil? Yeah. And Phil Bryant, you know, he was the governor at the time and his office oversaw. the welfare agency. So, you know, you can even like go back to interviews and hear John Davis, the welfare head, you know, who is probably going to go to prison, talk about how Phil Bryant was his

boss and he took orders from Phil Bryant. And so you can't really separate what he was doing, especially when you consider that Phil Bryant was the one setting the tone and setting the goals and the mission of the agency. You know, what kinds of programs were, what did the state prioritize in the welfare program. You know, that was coming from the governor. So Phil Bryant was very much the subject of the series that we published back in April, where we published text messages about Previcus and the stock agreement and the way that he was communicating with John Davis sort of skirting agency guidelines about bidding by suggesting that he go ahead and fund just, you know, whoever the governor wanted him to fund. These kinds of examples

that showed how Phil Bryant, you know, wielded his control over this welfare director. Nancy knew pled guilty directly after that and agreed to aid prosecution. And so when you think about the chain of command here and who these people might be providing evidence against to prosecutors, the DA of Hines County said after John Davis pled guilty on Thursday that they were continuing to go through text messages and documents to go higher up the ladders, the words that he used. He said that they were, that John Davis was important because the ladder continues to go up. And so I think that that kind of language shows that they really do have their sights set on officials who are higher up chain. And we'll just have to see how that

shakes out, you know. I want to talk a little bit more about the relationship between Phil Bryant and Brett Farf. From your reporting and what you've uncovered, do you believe that the reason why Phil Bryant decided to endeavor into this predatory theft with Brett Farv was because he wanted to profit financially from the potential business opportunity of the pharmaceutical company, or was he in awe of Brett Farv's standing in Mississippi as the son of Mississippi, Green Bay Packers quarterback, Southern Mississippi quarterback, and that he wanted to. to do him a solid by getting him the money. Do you have any understanding of what the nature of the relationship between those two men was

and why, almost $6 million later, Phil Bryant would have done this? It's pretty hard to try to get into someone's head and speculate on their motives. But just in, you know, reading the communication and kind of seeing how they interacted with each other, I almost feel like this fun. was such a target. It was such a slush fund for politicians. But it's almost not even like they thought it was a big deal. You know, it's like, oh, Brett Farv wants some money for something. Like, if I help him out, he'll endorse me for my next race or, you know, he'll be a friend of mine and I can feel important and powerful because I'm friends with Brett Farb. And like, it seems like, why would you risk so much for

that kind of personal application, but they didn't feel like they were risking that much because that was the culture and that was the kind of the trend and pattern with the way that federal funds were being used at the time that they felt

that they could just use it for whatever they wanted. So it ends up being that it didn't, it ends up being that they could is the answer. They did because they could. And they didn't care about the people that it was directly impacting, which I want to ask you about this question. You had talked about, I saw it somewhere, about how a certain percentage, was it 99% of the people or whoever was applying to use these TANF funds? They, it wasn't, they were being denied.

And then when the state audit came out, the state audit that was released, I guess, in 2020 said that a, about $94 million of funds had been misused. And so I guess my question is, when it comes to specifics, like, what does that look like? For those of us who are reading the story, we're not there. When you talk about what was being misused and how these funds weren't being applied for the purpose that they were for, what does that impact look like? What programs weren't getting what they needed? What people were being denied? Because we talk about it in such a general sense, but like, let's talk about it.

about like let's put a face to it of what that actually look like for the people who weren't getting the funds that they were supposed to from the government or businesses or organizations, I should say. I've talked to a lot of people who, you know, maybe at one point had been on this program. In fact, I talked to a woman, let me give a little positive note really quick. So I talked to a woman recently. She was, I found her because she was used in an advertisement for this welfare program, the Nancy New Welfare program. They kind of put her on display and said, this is our model client, right?

And it's really interesting because she actually was a TANF client. She was a traditional TANF client. She received TANF cash welfare assistance and was receiving workforce supports, you know, job placement, that kind of thing. And she escaped poverty. I mean, she had this great DHS caseworker who set her up and for success.

She got the cash payments to kind of get back on her feet. Now she's like a regional manager at a bank. And she's like killing it. In fact, I talked to her not that long ago. She told me that she was coming over to Jackson. She lives about 90 miles away. She was coming over to Jackson to bring bottled water to Jackson. This woman who, you know, right?

And so what they did was they, put her on a poster basically saying this is the model client that we're helping through families first, this like bogus welfare program. But really she was a traditional DHS TANF client. And she was helped and found success through the actual welfare program. Okay, so that's that story. And then I talked to people who around Hattiesburg, when I went down to go see the volleyball stadium for the first time, I kind of hung out and went around the community and talked to people. And you wouldn't believe the kinds of stories that I've heard about people who had tried to go get assistance from the local community action agencies, like the agency that you go get light bill assistance, energy assistance or rental assistance, that kind of thing. We found a guy who was just hanging out who told us that he hasn't had running water in his house for a very long time.

And we talked to a guy who, and this one is very pointed, had his child taken away from CPS a few years prior to this. And he was homeless at the time. And to get his child back, the court required him to have housing. And he went to the assistance organization. And they didn't have any housing available for him. And he never got his kids back. So when you talk about what this looks like for people, you talk about $5 million,

what drop in the bucket, right? Life changing. Could have been life changing for so many people. And you don't get those years back. Man. When the federal government has a program like this where they're injecting cash, to a state. I'm from Louisiana, so I understand, you know, states that need help, people who need help.

When the federal government does this, is there no oversight? Is there not anyone that's federally watching to make sure that the funds are allocated properly? Honestly, not in block grants, which this is one. So block grants go to states and states can develop what's called a state plan around how they're going to spend the money. And that state plan goes to the federal government. And I learned this not that long ago that the federal government doesn't even approve those plans. They look at them and they see that they wrote a state plan. But they don't even, the federal government doesn't even have the authority to be like, no, no, no, don't pay for a bunch of motivational speakers as your TANF program. Like they don't even, they don't even have any

oversight like that. And then the federal reports that are produced within this program are virtually, they're so vague, you can't even tell what they're saying that the program is. So they just report spending in vague categories like workforce and, you know, two-parent family formation, whatever that means. And there are dollar amounts that are reported in each of those categories, but they don't send any expenditure reports to the federal government so that the federal government can see how they're actually spending the money. There just is not oversight on that level. It's the state auditor that's supposed to be offering that. And it had become such a kind of check the boxes process that the state auditor was doing that they missed all of this

misspending until someone finally brought it to their attention. I have one follow up for you. And it's going to sound like an odd question, but I don't know why it's jumping out of my school. The gentleman that you were talking about that lost his children, do you know whether or not he was a black man? Yeah. How much would you say that what Brett Fav and Phil Bryant did affect it specifically the black people of Mississippi?

So I don't have a racial breakdown for temporary assistance for needy families, but I know that at one point I read a study that showed that of able-bodied adults on Medicaid in Mississippi, because, you know, we don't have Medicaid expansion. So all of the able-bodied adults on Medicaid are single mothers, right? Or single parents, but typically mothers. and I want to say that the number was in the 90% of people on this program were black women. And what you see, and this is a national, this is a national pattern, in states that are more homogenous, in states that have a entire white population, those states have much more generous safety net programs. in states like Mississippi with higher black populations, that's where you see a legacy, a decades old,

you know, hundreds of years old, very punitive policies around federal funds for people in poverty. And it all goes back to these very racist, stereotypical notions about people living in poverty that basically make it suck for everyone. You know, we all suffer because of it. we all suffer because of the racism that has caused this, this bias and inequity within these systems. But race is baked into this story. So obviously the people, the officials who were

involved, some of them are being charged. Some of them have pled guilty. Some have not. And are under investigation. But at the end of the day, as you just talked about, and these are just a few stories of, I'm sure, thousands of stories. What happens with these people who needed this money, who needed this help, who went and went through the proper channels to get the help that they need? They were denied. Is there any type of restitution process? Is there anything for those who, like, they could track those who applied and were denied and maybe but rightfully did deserve these type of funds? Is there anything that can come about with? that. You know, I thought about this when I was sitting in the courtroom on Thursday. I think I'm

pretty sure it was a federal courtroom. And I think the judge had asked if there were any victims in the room. And I was like, oh, well, I mean, that's a standard question, but like, who's here, right? And of course, the victim was the director of DHS. DHS was the victim of this crime. The Department of Human Services was the entity that was stolen from. Of course, you and I are sitting here like that no the people were the victims the people in poverty were the victims but you know we had created such strict eligibility guidelines around getting these um these public funds this public assistance and so you know when welfare reform happened in the 90s and the and the TANF program began and replaced the old welfare program aid to families with dependent children

it was no longer an entitlement. So when you talked about, you know, what is there restitution for people? People were never entitled to this money. It literally just wasn't an entitlement. The state had stripped that from people. And so at that point, the people living in poverty were not entitled to it,

and it didn't belong to them because that's what the state had done with the program, if that makes sense. I mean, it doesn't make sense, but you know. Yeah, no, no, no, no. As a resident of Mississippi, are you from Mississippi? I'm not from Mississippi originally. Okay.

But as a resident of Mississippi, broad question, what's your opinion of breath off? I mean, you're reporting on this, and I'm aware that impartiality is a very important part of your job. And I don't want you to, you know, I'm not asking you to, you to, I'm not asking you to, you know, to cross that line. But I'm asking you, just from what you've seen here, what do you think of Brent Farr? Yeah, I don't really have any opinions. You know, I didn't, I'm not, I don't really, like, hold up people like,

like, celebrities like this. So I don't, I don't have any, like, notions that, you know, oh, it's like the fall of this celebrity or that this celebrity's reputation or their legacy is being tarnished. Like, I don't have any feelings like that. that about really anyone. So I would just probably leave it at that. I mean, I think I'm, I'm disappointed in the communication that I've seen. That has nothing to do with Brett Farr. That just has to do with the fact that someone was capable of manipulating this system in this

way. And for you, it wouldn't have mattered had it been Brett Favre or anybody else. It just happens to be that one of the most famous men in the history of Mississippi is caught up in all of this. That's right. My last question. You can't help but look at what happened under former governor Phil Bryant and Nancy knew when she was in office and John Davis as well and think that possibly there's more corruption outside of this. Do you know if there's any, and maybe you can't even say other investigations that are

now taking place to look at how they use funds in other ways that might have you know, bit at a disadvantage to the people of Mississippi. I don't think we're ever going to get to the bottom, the total bottom of this. And that spans, you know, I'm talking about even characters outside of those folks, right? You've got the Medicaid program. You've got DHS, that's the entity we're talking about. Then you've got Medicaid an even much larger entity that spends federal funds that is also in Mississippi privatizing. I don't know if I made the point that these nonprofits had essentially become privatized welfare.

And that's how all this money was able to be spent outside of public view, right? Now you've got the state of Mississippi essentially privatizing Medicaid through what are called managed care contracts. That is an entire, you know, I think untapped well of stories about spending in Mississippi. you've got the child care development fund that is a very tangential. It's a very similar block grant to TANF, but it provides the child care voucher to working parents. There was a five-year period during Phil Bryant's administration where there was not a single new child care voucher offered to low-income parents. And people have reported this. We've reported this, but like you would not believe because there's just so much going on that some,

a fact like that can just go sort of unnoticed. That money was still coming into the state. And some of that child care money is some of that 94 million that you described was, you know, go into these nonprofits into these, you know, some of the programs that we've described and are kind of distasteful. but the child care development fund is one that I don't feel like there's been a full audit of, right? Like there has been TANF. So, yeah, it's pretty much endless. Last question before I let you go.

Thank you so much for your time. I am just sick to my stomach. I know. I'm sorry for bumming y'all out. It's okay. No, no, no, it's your fault. No, I'm just joking. No, it's okay.

A lot of people have drawn a corollary between what we've seen with the graft and the welfare fund to the water crisis in Jackson, saying that obviously it's glaring that people in Jackson don't. There you go. Are you in Jackson? Oh, yeah, I live in Jackson. Right. So that people in Jackson, like yourself, don't have or didn't have running water, how to boil water. advisory and that the state was misusing funds that people in need were supposed to get. Do you see a corollary between a massive infrastructure failing like the Jackson Water Crisis

and this type of fiscal corruption that you're seeing with the Breffarf story? 100%. I mean, why? And not like I'm saying that TANF money could be used for infrastructure, right? That's not what I'm saying. I'm not saying that the money that that was stolen could be used this way, but it's illustrative. You know, Jackson is, okay, so why was like the TANF program so easily manipulated? It's because people living in poverty and DHS clients, they don't have very loud advocates. They don't have a lobby, right?

There are no lobbyists who make money off of getting the legislature to, pass policies on their behalf, right? That's why you can't see things done for people in poverty. Similarly, Jackson is, you know, it's 80% black city. It's a city with high poverty rates. And I think that just makes it easier for the state to ignore, just like they ignored DHS clients. You know, when you think about all of the money that the state controls

that could have been used to help Jackson get out of this infrastructure hole that we're in, you know, I mean, literal pot holes, but also just financially, we were, we're in a little bit of a hole right now with our water system. And the fact that this could go on for so long without the state coming in and providing some of that support, I think it's just indicative. Both stories are indicative of the state's regard for people who are suffering. Anna Wolf with Mississippi today. We're going to keep our eyes on this story, we think that it's incredibly important. I think that the magnitude of it can't be articulated enough in terms of, like you said,

it's just a picture book of how the rich and the wealthy and the privileged sometimes use systems to continue staying that way and how that affects the half-nots. fantastic reporting fantastic reporting and I have to ask you about those chairs behind you though what the hell is that did you did you go get a row from the bus station

and then put them in your room you got to look if you guys are watching on YouTube or on Spotify she's got like you got like movie theater seats yeah movie theater seats behind you or something like that what is that like what are those chairs

these are from an old theater and I took them from my neighbor's house but it's like you go into like some people's houses in Jackson and you'll see these chairs. I don't know. I'm not even sure which theater they came from, but I've seen them in different people's houses. Like clearly the theater was getting renovated and they, you know, gave them away. And so it's just kind of like a fun thing to like, I've got some of those, you know. Yeah, I see them.

All right. Hope your back's okay. I agree. I get it. I get it. I get it too. It's eye-catching. Anna Wolf, thank you so much for joining us today on Higher Learning.

We hope that we can book you again as more developments come out. Absolutely. Thank you for caring about the story and about Mississippi. No problem. Thank you so much. This episode is brought to you by Spectrum Business. Fast, reliable Internet means everything for your business. And even this podcast, that's why I trust Spectrum Business.

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That was a fantastic interview. Bum me out though. She's right. It did bum me out a little bit just to know that people are being taken advantage of in this way. We know it, but just to hear it, it's very, very upsetting. The specific stories that I was fidgeting because I was really trying not to cry.

and I was trying to hold it together in the interview because it's heartbreaking. I don't know, like we just talk about, last podcast we're talking about violence against black women and it not being recognized. We talk about how we're being gunned down in the street by the people who are supposed to be protecting us. We talk about all these issues that affect black people

and then you're hearing about this and it's just like constantly, it's like we can't win in any facet. It's just, I don't know, I don't want to cry. It makes me emotional. Let's talk about something that I feel like I have to kind of eat my words on. Maybe I went a little too hard without knowing the full story, which I know you think that thought warriors don't hold me accountable, but they definitely did when it comes to this about wishing that we might have had a little bit more information before we went in

on a topic. And I'm talking about Imei Udoka. So we talked about Emei Udoko. we talked about, you know, why are you calling this man Udoco? called Ime Udoko. I said Udoca. I said Udoka.

You don't like this, nigga. And so that's why you put it in the same. I'm saying. I made Udoka. Udoka. Did I say Udoka? Udoco. I may Udodo, girl.

That nigger name is Eme Udodo. Goh treat me along like that. Eme Udodo. That niggas, a dodo, bye boy. He may, coach E-May. I'm not even going to say it anymore because now I can't hear it right in my head and it ain't going to come right out of my mouth.

Okay. So a lot of people were like, jump the gun. We didn't have all the details. And we still don't have all the details. Let's be honest. We're still so much we don't know. And Matt Barnes is somebody who kind of did a little bit what we did too. So Matt Barnes came out and originally he came out.

He came to EMA's defense after hearing about the affair with the Boston Celtic staffer. And now he is backtracking that and clarifying his response. His response, Donnie, you got the soundless here. Without knowing all the facts, I spoke on EMA Udoka's defense. And after finding out the facts after I spoke, I erased what I posted because this situation in Boston is deep. It's messy. It's a hundred times uglier than any of us thought. And that's why I erased what I said.

Some things happened that I can't condone, I can't back. And it's not my place to tell you what happened. If it ends up coming out, it ends up coming out. But that was the reason why I raced in my post last night, because after I posted it, I got a call from someone who had all the details and shit is deep. man, praying for everybody involved. You know, hope everyone gets through this. And I saw a lot of blogs picked up what I said,

even though it was only on my page for like two minutes. So hopefully they picked this up too for me being wrong and jumping out there without the facts. A hundred times uglier. Yeah, go ahead. Well, I guess what words are you eating? I'm asking you. What did you say that you feel like you shouldn't have said?

me i mean i jump to you know talking about what we know about the history of boston specifically in sports and how black athletes and um have talked about this before about how they've been treated in boston and so when you hear about that he was suspended because it was consensual that's what we were being told it was a consensual relationship so here we are with a grown man and a grown woman having a consensual relationship. And yes, it was with an employee, but he was being suspended at the time to being suspended for a year seemed like a bit of a lead. It did it to me. And I said, and so I compared the history of what we know in Boston to the fact that this is the black coach and said that there seemed to be some sort of correlation where I can't separate the two. And it

seems like they're coming after him even more harsh with the black man. Somebody has a vendetta against him. I jumped to that. So I got to eat that. I assume that that's what it could be. And it's still big. Who knows? I mean, who knows? But as information is slowly starting to trickle out, I should not have been so quick to jump to a big assumption like that when we didn't have all the facts. And sometimes we do that when we have a microphone. And you got to own up when you're wrong about that. Yeah, Rachel, that's very well said. on the same thing with me what I would say is that

it's sometimes you're sometimes in a predicament right the predicament is people who listen to you and they come to you for takes that you're going to give I've been away and I've been on vacation before something that's happened and people like I can't wait to hear with Van and I'm not

in any way patting myself on the back but you guys you guys reach out to me sometimes like Van could you please talk about this Van, could you please discuss this? So even on this particular situation, with EMA, there were multiple people that reached out to me, like really dozens of people,

Star Wars, reached out to me and say, I can't wait to hear what you guys have to say on this situation. And the responsible thing to do would have been to analyze exactly what we knew through the lens of what we knew and didn't know. But it was so cagey what was coming out from Boston. It was KG was coming out from email and his team.

Neil Long hadn't spoken at all, and she still hasn't really said anything, that you were forced to do a little bit more conjecturing than you wanted to do, and we should never do that. Here on higher learning, we'll be better about knowing when we have to punt on the topic, when we have to talk about kind of what might have happened or what's going on or whatever.

We don't want to delve too deep into that. Having said that, I do know now, at least what's rumored to have happened in Boston. Are you going to share? Are you going to Matt Barnes? Because nope, I can't. I can't share because I don't know that it's true. And I think one thing that I've learned from this particular situation, number one,

let's be honest about why we care so much about this. Obviously, there was a racial aspect to this that I feel like a lot of people cared about. Obviously, there was an NBA team aspect to this, right? Because the Celtics, like we're talking about the defense. defending team, the defending Easter Conference champions, don't have their coach just before training camp comes out, right? They don't have their coach. And the backup coach that they have, Joe Masula,

he has his own issues from the past with domestic violence. Yeah, he was arrested back in the day. By the way, that's not me to the Celtics believe in Joe. They say Joe has been contrite. I don't have any issues with what they're doing there, but that's been something that's come up recently. The reason why we were really into this is because of this story's proximity to scandal to celebrity

and to nigger mess bullshit NMB n greg a mess bullshit Who is he fucking? Why would they fire him for fucking him? Nealong is out if anything else was happening in this story this story could be like we wouldn't care if he wasn't with

Neil Long people would have cared a little bit less like if he wasn't with Neil Long people would have cared a little bit less had they handled this quietly and not people People would have cared. There's so many, had this not been a sexual thing, people would have cared a little bit less.

You know what I mean? So it's like sex plus celebrity plus sports, always going to be something that's enticing. But that is no excuse to the audience here. We have to be the voices here that are going to pull back a little bit, even when everybody is rushing to judgment. And you called the people in Boston, you called the Boston Celtics racist.

I said Boston has a history of racism. That's on you. Rachel. That's on you what you did to Boston. Well, listen. Apologize to Mark Wahlberg. I... Mark Wahlberg. Apologize to Mark Wahlberg.

Speaking of history. Speaking of blinding a man. Speaking of throwing rocks at black kids when they get off the bus. God damn, Marky, Mark. He's changed. Without living in the old stuff. He's changed.

Without history. We're talking to straight. You did reference Neil Long had said anything before. I do want to say that she has responded. And she said this, quote, the outpouring love and support from family, friends, and the community during this difficult time means so much to me. I ask that my privacy be respected as I process the recent events. Above all, I am a mother and will continue to focus on my children. So you heard Neil Long, respect her privacy.

Leave her alone. And not only should you respect Neil Long's privacy as it relates to this scandal, respect Neil Long's privacy when you guys are shooting your shots. I want to take the time out to talk to my dear brother, New York Congressman Jamal Bowman, who just had the pre-come dripping out of his dick he was so ready. Like he was... Jamal, it was oozing. It was oozing out. He was so ready. Glistening!

It was glistening with Jamal. Jamal went on Twitter and said, sending nothing but love to Neil Long. We're not letting a man. Donnie, you know what? As I do this, as I read this tweet, Donnie, give me a little sexy music from what our brother Jamal had to say. Got you.

sending nothing but love to Nia Long. We're not letting a man who didn't recognize the luxury of her presence. Dem all her beauty and glory. Matter of fact, I need a Nia Long national holiday. They went in this, man. This is a little too horny. Jamal had to come out after this and post a piece of, of him and his wife.

And ha ha, y'all hilarious. Y'all do know it's okay for a man to show a woman love and support without shooting the shot. That's actually a thing he said. Then he tweeted a picture of him and his wife. It was just unnecessary for him to even do all of that. The fact that you reposted it and you go, it has begun. Yeah.

Because you said people were going to be doing this, shooting their shot. I don't think that's what it was, but it also was like, I'm sorry, what? We didn't need this from you. Not at all. To me, this is indicative of what's wrong with politics

and I'm not going to go super deep on it, but I'll tell you this. Jamal Bowman, love you, great guy. We don't need you chiming in on this type of shit. Like, you don't have to be a part of the Neo Long discourse, dog. Like, what's going on? Like, that's what makes you look like

it was pre-come. Because, like, you jumping in on makes it seem like you were compelled to say something, dog, like, it's like, relax. Like, we don't need y'all to be a part of the Nia long discourse shit. Maybe we shouldn't even been a part of it. But as more details come out about what happened to EMA Udoco, because this is a legitimate story as it relates to the world, relates to the world of the NBA and the world of sports, we'll have more for you, but we're going to promise to be responsible.

I have a question. Sorry, I don't need to rep. You have a question. If he, he's suspended from Boston for a year, and this is a team offense. if he says I quit I don't want to be there Can he go coach

for another team? He could But it's training camp now And all the head coaching jobs Are filled But I'm imagining Unless the league Off his hands down

The suspension That if he wants to be Added to a bench As an assistant That there's not going to be Any problem with that I would be super fucking surprised If you went that route though

Just wondering if it's available to him Oh it definitely is It's a team suspension As far as what we know now This brother's going to He's going to go away for a little while Not a long while Not a long while

Because remember We talked about the fact that this hasn't Really happened before It kind of has when I thought about it Right Coaches that moved in areas like this Bobby Petrino From

Arkansas Arkansas It was Arkansas He coached Arkansas He coached Louisville Bobby Petrino Got into a motorcycle accident When he got into the motorcycle accident, he happened to be on the motorcycle with, I think, a volleyball player from the school or an ex-volveyor player from the school that worked in the sports information officer or something like that.

He was having an affair that ended up being part of the end of Bobby Petrino there. Even my own coach, my ex-coach, Ed Ogeron. Part of the reason why Ed Ogeron is not the coach of the LSU Tigers right now is because he was a little bit too addicted to pussy. like that's like a real thing it's a real thing that Ed Ogeron is rumored to have tried to have sex yeah with a booster's wife after he met her at a gas station you know what I mean

you can even talk about and this was a little bit sketchier and hazier Derek Fisher's exit from uh from from New York and some of the rumors that was surrounded DeFish and some of the relationships he might have been having with women that were in proximity to guys in the organization and like what was going on there. So it hasn't happened exactly in this way before, but it's happened before. I do want to ask you this.

Okay. Last thing on this. You know how I feel. I don't believe that anybody can embarrass an entire culture because I don't believe that our culture is enough of a monolith to have it be embarrassed by one person, one entity or one action. However, there's been a lot of talk and I understand the talk. Young black coach graded his job in the situation that Ima Udoka was in. Emma Udoka being in that situation, young black coach, if it is in fact true that he was fucking multiple women on the staff, if it is in

fact true that he was doing whatever because some of the other stuff that's being reported, I mean there were reports that he was making unwanted advances, whatever, that he was that horny. Is that at all

embarrassing or in your opinion does it make you feel any type of way specifically because he is a black coach? Like why did it have to be the black coach? Do you feel way. No, because of what you said to me on the last podcast, you said 50% of the coaches in the NBA are black. Yeah. If he was standing alone, then yeah, but the fact that he's one of many,

it's just like, you know, some, not this specific, it wouldn't be this necessary reason as to why, but like somebody's going to do something eventually the more people that you have. And I'm not saying that it has to be this, but you know what I mean. So, no, he doesn't stand alone. So, no, I don't think that. I agree. Like, the reality is that if there's so many coaches, you know, one of the guys is going to be horny. Somebody's going to be horny.

You know, like, is just somebody who's horned up. All right, I saw this I saw this and I thought about you immediately. Because I thought about how a certain man that I respect lays down the law. Judge ordered to be removed after

pulling a gun on black man in court. Jesus Christ. What would the judge do? On Thursday, the state's judicial conduct commission ruled that Judge Robert L. Potori be removed from his position after pulling out a semi-automatic

handgun. God damn! On a black defendant while in the Whitehall town court in Washington County. Shit! After he braided about it, to his colleagues and friends for years, according to Syracuse.com.

This had happened in late 2015 or early 2016, but wasn't investigated until this judge boasted about it. He pulled out his legal handgun and pointed it at the defendant after he allegedly crossed a stop line in front of the

judge's bench. Your dad is a, your dad is a judge. Like, your dad is a judge. this guy that he pulled the gun out on he claims 6 foot 9 and of course that means that as a white person you have to be scared of him because he's a big black man

he pulled out his gun pointed at this guy in court my question to you is how in the fuck does this happen in 2015 or 2016 and he's not dismissed from the bench then what the hell are there special judge rules I don't know about no there's no judge rules how was nobody that is what's

it out to me, obviously him pulling out the gun, but the fact that nobody talked about it, people just moved on as if it was nothing. And he's been bragging about this for seven years. And finally, it's been brought to the attention of the higher ups to get him pulled off the bench. Has he done this before? Has he done this other times? Obviously, he felt he could do it and get away with it. This is what you have bailiffs for. If you feel threatened in any way, that's their responsibility to step in and protect you if you feel like your life is threatened, which it wasn't.

Because might I add, he wasn't 6'9, like they said he was, and he gave this guy. Oh, so the guy wasn't even 6'9? No, he was 6 feet. He was 6 feet. And less than 200 pounds.

And, but get this. What the fuck? This guy admitted to attacking his wife and another man with a knife, okay? The defendant in this, who got the gun pulled on him. The judge agreed to a plea deal and reduced his fine to meet the amount so the defendant could pay.

But you're going to pull a gun on him? You see what I'm saying? Like, none of this adds up. You obviously didn't feel he was that much of a threat to society because you tried to help this man make it out. You just pulled a gun on him because you wanted to and you felt like you could get away with it, which you did for seven years. Rachel, can I ask you a question? Do you guys have a grill?

Do you have a grill in the back of your house? Yes. Sorry. For a second, I thought a mouthpiece. That's why I pause. Yes, we have a grill. Please stop with the negressionist. Do you use the grill?

Brian uses it all the time. Okay. I'm making a corollary here. Do you know why Brian uses his grill all the time? Why? Because he has it. See, if you go by a grill, okay? You know what you think?

God damn, that grill is just sitting. back there. I need to use the grill to grill some stuff. You go to the, you look for a reason to grill. You go to Whole Foods and you go, hey, look at those steaks, I bet those will go good on the grill. You know, you go to the other place, hey, baby,

let's not bake the chicken in the oven. Let's put it on the grill. Okay, you bought the grill, you invested into the grill because you felt like you need the grill. Now you want the grill to justify its existence. I am saying that there is a particular percentage of the gun-owning public that looks at their firearms in the same way.

Okay? They don't want to just have the gun holstered in case they need it. You hear that from people all the time. But I know these people. They don't want to just have their gun holstered. They don't want to just have the gun. They don't want just take it. They want a reason to use their firearm.

They want a reason to use the power that their firearm gives them. They want a reason bragging of them. Bragging about the gun and bragging about the incident is letting people know, I'll draw down on you if I feel I have to. Yeah. When Mike Brown was coming at the officer that took his life, the guy described Mike Brown as a demon Hulk Hogan. He said he was like a gigantic Hulk Hogan coming at him. Mike Brown was a big kid, but he was a kid. You know what I mean?

This guy describes the black man in front of him as a six-foot-nine huge dude coming at him. The guy was under six feet. Darren Wilson was the man who shot Mike Brown. I want to make sure that you guys that we'd never forget that name. It's like we never forget Mike Brown's name. So, but I say all that to say this. Like, we talk about guns. we've talked about this stuff before.

America has the most guns in the country that's the least well adjusted for it. We're not even adjusted enough to have access to these firearms. If we're living in a society where a judge, somebody sitting on the bench, can look at a man and grow him

fucking nine inches because of his fear, his irrational fear of him. He's in complete control. And then on top of that, want to pull his gun on him, which I believe that this guy did, Yeah. This is what I'm talking about.

My dad used to say this. And my dad had more guns than anybody. My dad had a lot of guns, a lot of guns. And he was like, my thing is I'm carrying a lot of money around. But he was like, some people looking for a reason to show you they steal. They're looking for a reason. The gun is there to shoot people. It's begging you to.

They have conversations with their guns. They clean their guns. They read magazines about their guns. And when we're litigating gun culture in America, not to get too deep on this particular stupid issue, but that's what we're talking about. Like, you buy a grill, you want to put some meat on it. And I have to believe that some of these people that have guns,

they want a body. But they want to pull the gun out. They want people to know. So that's why I thought about when I saw this story. God damn it, I'm sick of the shit. Yeah, it makes me think Kyle Reddenhouse. Kyle Rittenhouse. He wanted

Rachel He wanted Absolutely He wanted He wanted To flex his shit Without a doubt You'd be stupid

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Get savings with yellow sale signs storewide and everyday low prices on 365 brand items. Enjoy the fresh flavors of spring. Save at Whole Foods Market. You want to do anything else or do to get on out of here, Rachel? I think we should do like some white mess one. I think we should do the principal sparked outrage for using the N-word

during the school assembly. Oh, I didn't even see this on the run. Is this? Oh, no. Dottis. Okay, man. Did you see the principal? Did you see the principal in Tennessee

that at a school assembly decided to use a word, he's white, mind you. He shouldn't have. Did you see this? No, I have not seen it at all. Or hear it, I should say. All right.

Donnie, roll the tape. She goes, I got to call the white kids niggers. Uh-uh. Don't say it. We got two ones in the same. The black kids want to call the white is a cracker. I just got that home video.

She goes, I just got that on video. I got to hear it again. I got to hear it again. One more time, Donnie. I got to hear it again. Give it to me again. Okay. So people are called the white kids

niggers. Come on. Don't say it. Because you're the same. And the black kids want to all the white's crackers. Okay.

So people are split about this because he has been, so the school district has said something director of the school district and he said he, meaning this principal, Paul Pillow,

of Trenton, Rosenwald Middle School in Trenton, to see. Okay. So those districts said that, director said he informs me of the nature of his message and of his regret as to how it was delivered. We agree

that some time away from the principal's chair was in order. Then he goes on to say, I would ask everyone to please consider his intent and the context in which he used the terms. So people are torn on this on social media. Because some people are saying,

well, did you listen to the context. I shouldn't say it. And when I say people, I mean everybody. Obviously, it's not black people. But some people are like, well, listen to the context and how he used it. He was basically telling them, you use this word against black people and you use this word against white people and it needs to stop. So he was reprimanding both sides. Black other people, the other side of it are saying he should have never used it. He just wanted an excuse to use the word. Van, you heard it. You laughed, I laughed. What are your thoughts?

So, remember I talked about the grill? The N-word is like that grill for white people. You know, sometimes I think of things, so I think black people make their ancestors very, very, very, very proud, right? But the bar for us to make

our ancestors here in this country proud is very low, right? Because, like, they couldn't do shit. So we get married, ancestors up in heaven to cry. We put our shoes on, walk to the goddamn bank. They're like, goddamn, look at him. He can go to the bank wherever he want. Like, we go to a restaurant.

Why do take our order? Like, my people from South Louisiana are up there in tears. They're like, look at my great, great, great grandson. Tell this motherfuckin fucking white man. to bring him his chicken fingers. We made it, right? I'm loving where this is going. I think that white people have it the reverse.

I think that sometimes subconsciously, white people say the N-word to make their ancestors proud. I'm being for real. I think that their ancestors are up there super mad. Like, God damn it. God damn it. Would you look at Carlin? what he's got that goddamn black lives matter thing on

huh what the fuck he's saying the N-word you don't call a nigger to the N-word you call him a nigger that's what you call him you call him a nigger that's your boy at your boy he's one of these new softies so every once in a while they just go fuck it I want my ancestors to be proud too nigger and they try to slip it in ways

that they think we're not going to catch it principal you don't have to say that. You don't have to say that, right? Right. It's like Jay-Z with the Super Bowl or the NFL. Like, you don't have to do that. Like, you don't have to, that's not, we don't, in order for you to do what you want to do,

you don't have to work with them. You don't have to do that, right? You're doing it because you want to do it. We're not stupid. We're not going to keep taking, we're not going to keep taking these accidental inwards. We're not going to keep What are y'all thinking? We're not going these mystery inwards

These these phantom niggers No more phantom niggas. Either you said it or you didn't. I don't give a fuck if you're saying it In the most complimentary way That doesn't exist. You could say we used to live in a, You could say you could be up there giving a speech

To the fucking Rotary Club or something. I am so happy. We used to live in a country where black people are beautiful, amazing brothers and sisters were called niggers. Even if you say that,

you're out. Mandatory two weeks off. What the fuck? We know like, how many times we have to have this conversation? Don't suspend him. Paul pillow, you're out.

You're too stupid. You want to make your ancestors happy. You dropped it with the hard R. Dog, what you want us to do? Like, I can't. These phantom niggas got to go. Fucking nuts.

Jesus Christ. What do you think, Rachel? What do you think? What do you think? I'm asking you. I agree with you completely. I knew where you were going with it. I love it.

I totally agree. We said this on the last podcast. We were talking about Robert Sarbert. It's like the kid who knows that they can't curse. But they feel like if I repeat what this person said, or I use it in this context, it'll be okay. Because it's not what I mean. I'm just using it in this way.

That's what Pillow tried to do. And it didn't work. I mean, obviously, he's still going to keep his job. I did find it interesting though that whoever posted it, maybe someone in the comments said, just another day in Trenton, which makes me feel like this is just kind of a regular occurrence, maybe not from the principal, maybe from somebody else in this town.

So Paul has got to take a seat. Did you want to talk at all about Rihanna doing the Super Bowl? I was going to ask you that when you mentioned JZ and you were like, like Jay Z in the NFL. She's a friend of the podcast. I don't really want to. Oh, no, no, I think it's, oh, no, I have no problem with Rihanna doing the Super Bowl. Love Rihanna. Like love Rihanna.

I think love Rihanna, love everything that she does. I have no problem with Rihanna doing the Super Bowl. I think that like when Jay-Z said we're past kneeling back in the day, I don't think it was true then, but I think it's true now. I think this signifies that it's past kneeling, that we're past kneeling. But I do have one observation about this that I can't shake out of my head. Okay. Rihanna doing the Super Bowl is a musical artist doing the Super Bowl.

Like we've seen that before. We've seen hip-hop return to the Super Bowl. Dr. Dr. Dr. M&M., everybody with Jay-Z's, With Jay-Z's connection to the NFL, we've seen the Super Bowl come back to prominence in terms of seeing artists like those do the event. That's been happening. This is nothing new. So no one should be that shocked or surprise than Rihanna doing the Super Bowl. I will say this, though, it does signify not even particularly the end of something to the NFL.

It's to me the end of an era. And let me tell you what the era is. the movement that began with Black Lives Matter with Colin Kaepernick's stance against the NFL, that entire critical mass that started building after Trayvon Martin, after Mike Brown, in places like Ferguson, and that Worldwide Network,

almost the new civil rights leaders that we had that came out of that that whole early mid to late 2010s, that era is over now. And there's been a confluence of events that have ended it, right? Ended that era of activism as far as I'm concerned. One was the crescendo of the George Floyd, of the George Floyd killing. That was the height of that. And it was George Ford's killing Brianna Taylor and Ahmad Arbery.

They weren't so different than some of the other things that we had seen. The difference was that at the time that they had, happened, organizationally and almost socially, a lot of those movements had the most power that they ever had had, right? And so when it was time to donate money or get active or move or do all of that stuff, for the first time, people had a plethora of different organizations and people that they could go to and say, okay, cool. And these places, these different organizations, they became flush with cash.

they then became they then became incredibly noteworthy and the people at the head of these organizations were turned into worldwide celebrities and we've seen that. The only thing that came out of that was for a lot of people and I'm not taking this away from anyone.

A lot of people have done it a lot of amazing work and they continue to do a lot of amazing work but we've litigated it almost we've litigated almost all of it when you see what happened with Patrice and the house, when you see what happened recently with Black Lives Matter and the accusations of the misappropriation of $10 million, that was over on that situation, right? Then you have Colin Kaepernick, and if we're being honest, what ended Colin Kaepernick's beef with

the NFL was the interest of Jay-Z into that discourse. Jay-Z comes into that discourse. He's as big, obviously, actually, no, he's a bigger cultural gun than Colin Kaepernick, and people are going to say if Hove is doing it then it must be okay so on that front that was over

and then you look in other places people started to lose trust and faith in some of the faces of these organizations these places and these people right and so what there was during that time

also was a proximity between those activists their work and celebrity and one of the the biggest celebrities was Rihanna, right? One of the biggest celebrities that was very supportive of all of that stuff was Rihanna, right? And when those lines were not to be crossed, she didn't cross them. She took the NFL, fuck you when it was time to tell them, fuck you. The reason why she's doing this night is because she's not crossing the line. Those lines are gone. That era of activism is over. History will be able to

to determine how successful it was, like what it got us, if anything, and what we learned from it. That's not a, I'm not making a negative, uh, observation here.

Oh, no. I'm saying that this is an opportunity, in my opinion for a new, slightly younger, um, different sort of activism to take place. And that's always exciting. That's always exciting.

That's always excited. as far as I'm concerned. The discourse over the NFL, as much as we had wanted to keep up, and I haven't spoken to Capon Nessa in a while, I know they just had a baby, so shout out to them. So I don't know where they stand with that. I know Cap has recently was still trying to get into the NFL.

I don't know how they feel now. But all of those things. And then, just to be honest with you, the fact that Colin Kaepernick still is actively trying to seek employment with the NFL for a lot of people saying, well, the organization can't be that bad if he still wants to play there. So that plus everything else is just it's okay to turn the page from the activism that we saw at that time.

It was what was needed at that time. The question that we litigate now is what's needed for this time because it always changes every 10 or 15 years. And when I saw this, I wasn't mad or disappointed or anything like that at all. I just thought, okay, cool. Well, that moment in time was that moment in time. And now we need to seek out a new moment in time. All those things that were happening then, Rachel, they're still happening. The cops are still out here going crazy.

Sure. It's still happening. The question is, what's the best practices in fighting and organizationally, individually, and as a human collective, you know? So well said. I'm not going to say too much because cop gardener's here. So coppers about to go really just lose it. But I was more interested in, I didn't have a problem with it.

I was interested in what your response was going to be. but the way you just laid it out there makes all the sense in the world. And for those of you who don't know, Rihanna was asked to be a part of the halftime show in 2019. She told them no. So now she's coming back.

And for every reason that you just said, it makes all the sense in the world. Yeah. Yeah. And by the way, we still don't know what she's going to do. We'll see. She has an opportunity.

People have an opportunity. Like we'll see what happens. Yeah, like Kendrick. So think about it. Think about the artists that have been there. Kendrick Lamar. Like what we've, seen since, you know what I mean?

So for better or for worse, I think the NFL has a lot more problems than Colin Kaepernick, but that remains, like, we'll litigate that historically. Okay. It is time for us to get this money and

tell you who are unexpected ally of the week is. Okay, this week's ally of the week is presented by State Farm. Small business owners have lots of decisions that need to be made. And when you're the one in charge, it's always your call. You choose when to work, you choose who you work with and every decision is made with the success of your business in mind. Choose State Farm small business insurance.

State Farm agents are small business owners too. They know what it takes and how to help you. Like a good neighbor, State Farm is there. Talk to your local agent today. Rachel, who is your unexpected ally of the week? All right. Mine is John Sina. Did you see this?

John Sina has set a Guinness World Record for the Make a Wish Foundation. I didn't even know that you could do this. So he began working with this charity 20 years ago. And 10 years later, after he started with him, he granted the Foundation's 1,000th wish to a certain fan. He's fulfilled 650 wishes through the Make a Wish Foundation, setting a New World Record for the decades-old nonprofit. it. So yeah, he started working with a charity

20 years ago and he's obviously done it in a beautiful way. He's made a difference in a lot of people's lives and specifically young black people. Oh, that's amazing. I love John Cena. I like John Cena a lot. He's the man.

Okay. My unexpected ally of the week is Anna Wolf. Well deserved. Low-hanging fruit, Lathan. Listen, well-deserved. And the only reason why I say that is because I knew that I didn't realize, obviously, guys, I did realize, you know what, just beat me up. This story is a black story.

I'm sorry, guys. The Brett Farr story, it's a black story. The people that he's hurting are black people. Yeah. It's a black story. I'm sorry. Maybe it's accidental. black, like the accidental teacher who

sat the accidental inward, like the, but, but this is a black story. It's not accidentally black. Right. I understand. I don't think he was, look, it's a black story. So I consider the work that the Mississippi today, and she's just doing a job, I consider that work

to be in the interest of the black people of Mississippi. I'll just be honest with you. Okay, so that's my unexpected ally of the week. And it's a good one, Van. This week's ally of the week was presented by State Farm, starting your own small business, investing all of your focus, time and energy into your goals. There are people that helped you every step of the way to get to where you are now.

Help protect your investment with State Farm's small business insurance. State Farm agents are small business owners too. So you can work with someone who understands what it's like to have one themselves. Like a good neighbor, State Farm is there to talk to your local agent today. All right, guys, that's enough. No more podcast for you guys. We love you all. Um, tell you think caps off, but do not stop learning.

I am Van Lathen Jr. I'm Rachel Lynn Lindsay. Go Cowboys. Got to go flush the thing. That's cool. Bye-bye.