Higher Learning with Van Lathan and Rachel Lindsay - Confederacy Month, the New Drake Diss, and Stephen A.’s Apology

Episode Date: April 23, 2024

Van Lathan and Rachel Lindsay start the show by addressing the new theme song and reaction from our Thought Warriors (00:15). Then, they give their impressions of the bizarre new Drake-produced AI track (20:56), and the internet’s reaction to Stephen A. Smith’s comments on Donald Trump’s relatability (38:36). Later, they expand the surprise that their birthday month falls during Confederate Heritage Month in Mississippi, and the reason behind its existence (1:18:34). Hosts: Van Lathan and Rachel Lindsay Producer: Ashleigh Smith   Learn more about your ad choices. Visit podcastchoices.com/adchoices

Yo, yo, yo, thought warriors. What is up? Howlern is on. It is I, Van Lathen, Jr. And it's me, Rachel and Lindsay. Rachel, what did you do this weekend? Wait, we have to acknowledge some things. We have to do, like, some house.

House. What is it? Okay, I'm not okay. What do you call? Housekeeping. Housekeeping issues. Okay. One, people were upset that we have a new theme song,

and we didn't address it. Okay. Okay, that's not our fault, guys. copyright issues, whatever. I don't know how we got away with it for four years. No, look, I'll tell you how it happens. It's like people talk to us and they say, hey, the old theme song that we have,

we can't do it anymore, we can't use it anymore, we have to get a new theme song. And then what you want me to say? I'd like, want me to fight for the old theme songs? No, but I think we didn't say, can you imagine you've been listening to the podcast for four years and then, bam, you look up or you're listening, you're like, am I on the right thing?

What happened here? Why are things changing? We didn't address it. To be honest, I didn't realize it was happening last episode. Hold on for a second. I actually fundamentally disagree with this. Okay, okay. Because I do disagree with this because I think this is part of the entitlement that I'm talking about.

So I'm being for real. So I've watched shows and stuff forever. And sometimes they change the theme song. They change it. Now, they'll change it. Now, they'll change something and sometimes people don't like it. Like power. Remember that?

Okay. They changed it and people didn't like it. It was a huge deal. They went back to the old one. Okay. Okay. But like when they change it, there's not a press release that is given or it's not like they come on before it and go, hey, just let everybody know.

There's going to be a new theme song. Okay. A television show changes the theme song. They don't come out and say, hey, we've got a new theme song now. It's a new theme song. you're free to tell us whether or not you like the theme song or you don't like the theme song after, but just us, hey, hey, you guys might have heard a new theme song.

It's much ado about nothing. Fair, but I just like, okay, after the fact, honestly, we didn't know that the theme song was changing that episode to be fair, and I probably would have said something, but people were talking about it, so here I am dressing it out. Second thing is we were in a different room. We're also in a different room now. That's just going to happen.

that's all I have to say about that. We're not always going to be in the same room. Last time we were in a different studio, people were like, what's up with that dark room? This time we're here. This is actually our old podcasting room. It's just going to happen.

So we do the podcast where we do it. And then sometimes, like today, I'll talk about it. We changed the time. We decided we want to be in person anyway. And so we're in a different room. Here's the thing about that. Anytime you see us in person, it's because we've decided that the podcast is better

for the visual experience if we can be in person and not be on Zoom. Which we're trying to do more. We've done every time if we want, which means we take it as we can get it, take it as we go, whatever, whatever, a lot of stuff's happening with video over here. It's the thing.

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Explore what's possible. Ask your doctor about Tramphia today. Call 1-800-526-7736 to learn more or visit trimfair radio.com. The playoffs are here, and you can predict the action all the way to the finals with Bandul Predict. predict the spread, total points, and even the game winner. Sign up and get a $25 bonus. Offered by Fandul prediction markets LLC, a registered futures commission merchant, 18 plus.

Bonus is non-withdrawable and expires seven days after receipt. Trading derivatives involve significant risk and may not be suitable for all investors. Manage your activity with our consumer protection tool. Restrictions apply. See terms at vandual.com slash predict slash bonus dash offer dash herms. First of all, before we get into the weekend, which will have a lot to do with parties and whatnot, I want to apologize to a group of people. I want to apologize to the people at the Minneapolis Film Festival.

I was supposed to be there this week. I was supposed to be there to present the movie once again for the very first time and to do a very special talk. I'd like to tell everyone that the film festival and the organizers of the film festival couldn't have been nicer and sweeter. It is a very important film festival. I would suggest that everybody pay attention to the movies that are being premiered there and to the festival itself. And I'll be an advocate for it in any way that I could. I literally was too tired and girded up with other things to get on the plane. I've never, ever, ever not gone through with something I had planned to do at that late of,

I literally made the decision last night, last evening that I just couldn't do it. You couldn't physically do it. Yeah. And that decision impacts people that had planned on having me out there. I apologize to those people very deeply, very deeply. But I just had to, I still got to move around a little bit. But I just had to stay home this week for a bunch of different reasons. So I did that.

I think people who listened to the last podcast, are probably glad that you did that. Without knowing any of the details of what's going on, you just seemed like you needed to take a beat. So when I saw that you weren't going or you text, I was like, good for him. Did my mom talk to you about that this weekend? Because my mom was very concerned about you.

No, I met pretty here for the first time. No, it's not the first time. She came in this podcast studio. That wasn't the first time I met pretty here. No, I remember she came in this studio, matter of fact, And she listened to a whole thing. We surprised you with her being here. You are tired.

Yeah, I think I am. But I was so energized when I saw her. What a light for the world. And your sister as well. That was your first time. No, you've met Heather before. You've met Heather before. And your sister as well.

And then other people, let me tell you something, man. Age is coming. Age is coming. And I'll tell you guys. how there are people who I've met and I know that I know them and I have no clue who they are. Happens to me all the time. People are walking down the street? Man, bro, how you been?

I'm like, what's up? They're like, talk. Man, it's good to see. Remember one? I'm like, shit, yeah. That shit was crazy. How you doing? How are your family?

Oh, man, shit everything. You remember my brother? Yeah, I remember him? Yeah, bro, that dude, that dude, man. Really, you could probably call him and talk to him, man. He might need to hear from you right now. Nah, not like that. Not, no.

Boy, I'm searching. I'll try to drop clues in to... You might. Like, drop clues in to try to figure out so they'll tell me where I know them from. Yeah. And because I just don't have... Now, I've decided that everything changes. I am finally to the place where I'm going to stop

put it in energy trying to be palatable. I'm just going to go, hey, brother, my man, where do we know each other from again? Just brutal. People will understand that. Okay. Let's see. Yeah, try it out.

People should. You meet a lot of people. You have a lot of different conversations. Because what happens to me is I can't remember who I was having a conversation with about. Or whatever we were talking. I'm like, who was that talking to about that? that again, that's what happens to me.

So then I repeat conversations, and they're like, you told me that. And I'm like, oh, that was you I was talking, having that conversation with. I'm sure that happens to you a lot, too, because you have way too many open tabs. Let's talk about this weekend. Because I want everybody to know something, something that I realized into the wee hours of my birthday, right? Beginning hours, middle of the night, because that's what time the party ended in my birthday. The playbook is a myth. Interesting.

I'm here to tell all you guys. I know how excited you are about it. I know Van loves posting things about me being scared of black dick, which is not true. You said? I didn't mean it like that. People at the party questioning me about this. I'm not.

I'm not. I'm just saying like, you know, anyways. It's not a fear. You don't want to go back. It's a good thing. Okay, well, I'm just saying, it's a good thing. Well, maybe if you, if we get rid of this,

It just scratches an itch. It just scratches an itch. Okay, because a lot of people are like, oh, she never been with the one before? I'm like, yes. You have. That's what I was trying to articulate to people

and I didn't. Obviously, I don't know Ashley was working with you because I kept asking Ashley to cut that clip and that clip never came out. No, she did not. Ashley did not tell me a thing. I just saw it on social media. Yeah, I just put it up there.

Shocked the people with it. It's a hilarious clip. And I think people, everyone has, everyone has their own thing. We can't fight people's things. There are certain things that people are going to want to believe about you. Certain people's things are going to be, we can't fight people's things. I put it up there. The clip spoke for itself.

First of all, everything that people were saying in the comments was like refuted by what was actually on the screen. You'd say you had never been with black men before. It's what people want to believe. every single thing I asked you, was it size? No, was it it? You said, no. Addictive personality. It's all in the clip if you watch the clip. The caption was some of my best words.

The caption was great. I'm never going to take it away from you. I'm going to acknowledge greatness. Something's funny. It was good. But the playbook is a myth. Okay? So this weekend, Kalika and I had a birthday party, but it also turned into Vann's birthday party. Very sweet.

His friends came from Louisiana. They surprised me with the player. Surprised him. I didn't even know they were coming. He didn't know. He didn't know. He didn't know. He didn't know.

He's, and got the pictures, we're going to put up the moment where you saw them for the first time. All this time were vans on the podcast like, how's your birthday? Oh, my birthday was terrible. I thought, my God, he does not even know that his friends are about to surprise him this weekend. So it was really sweet to see. And Kalika was like crying. And I was like, your makeup girl, your makeup. Yes.

This is your birthday. But it was a beautiful moment. But it was your birthday, too. Your name was on the screen. We're celebrating it. It really turned into Van's birthday because he started inviting people. Like half of, I felt like

the first hour of the party I had to keep coming to you because there was a list and saying, who is this person? Who's this person? Oh, Van invited them. Oh, they're on this person's list. All right.

So then I started thinking, wow, this could be a really great opportunity for the playbook to be in action. Right. Right. My birthday, along with Kalikas, I'm looking good, feeling good. This is an opportunity

for me to meet some of these men. Yeah. And you failed me. I didn't meet anybody. Didn't walk away with a number. Wasn't introduced to anybody new. And I thought to myself, and I said this to you as we were walking out,

the playbook is not real. Yeah. It is not real life. Hate to disappoint anybody. This is probably our last playbook conversation. It won't be. What this will actually be is a dissertation. in how things become a historical.

Okay, so let's go back and let's look at this party. And let's look at how this party was handled from the jump. And let's talk about how the playbook intersects with this party. Allow me a little lie to. This party was at a venue, Venice. Rachel and Kalika took the planning of this party on Venice. Very seriously. Very seriously.

It's very serious. planning the party. Okay. And the whole time that the party is being planned is Rachel and Kalika making a guest list for the party, inviting people to the party. And I'm being told that there's a set number of people that can come to this party. Now, the people that I invited to this party, let me tell you why I invited the people that I invited to this party. I invited the people to the party that I invited for me so that I would have somebody to hang out with throughout the night. You have to remember. I did not know that my friends were coming.

And by the way, it wasn't just friends from Baton Rouge that you guys surprised me with. My dear friends, Simon and Cleo. Shout out to Nick because Nick fucking May. Let me tell you something. I want to clear out real quick right now. I love Nick. Nick helped with the list. I want to clear out real quick, just real quick about Nick.

May. You guys, I want you guys to go follow, support, and love on my brother, Nicholas May. Nick May is one of the most amazing, solid, dependable people that I know. Like, seriously, if I got $100 million right now, if someone just gave me $100 million, I would give Nick 15. Only 15. I would give Nick 15. Nick is just an overly qualified human being. He's just a great dude. Does he make you mad and frustrates you sometimes by saying stuff like Tracy McGrady

is better than Kevin Durant? Yes. Does he get on your nerves? Does he like to argue? Yes. But if you have five people that you have to have in your foxhole, that you really can rely on, depend on, and that you want to see do good.

My brother Nick is one of those five. Yeah, he's great. This is a fantastic guy. Back to what I was saying. So I did not know that any of these people were coming. I didn't know that my dear friend Lawrence was going to be there, Simon, Clio, any of the people that were coming, I didn't know they were going to be there.

So when I'm actually inviting a handful of people to the party, a handful of people. That's why we were so strict, by the way, about like, you can't invite this person. Or I wasn't, Kalika was. Yes, right. It's because I'm hearing, yo, for every person that comes to the party over like 150 people or whatever it was. This is true. It's going to cost this amount.

So don't do this. Don't do this. Don't do that. And so I'm inviting people that I know from around here so we can hang out. Waws. Shout out Waws for coming by. Kerm, you fucked up. You didn't come by.

Shout out to the Midnight Boys. I'm inviting people that I can hang out with. Yeah. So how am I going to invite people in the playbook when I'm being told not to invite people over this amount of thing? I'm being, it's being so strict. Nobody told me, hey, we're having a party, invite whoever you want to invite. Boom, boom, boom. No one's doing that.

I actually said to you last week when you were telling me that Kalika was being strict with it, I said, just if you want to invite somebody, just let me know. That's what I said to you. I was like, if you just want to invite someone, let me know. But you could have said, Rachel, you know, I'd like to invite some people for the playbook. And I would have been like, please. This is what I'm talking about.

Please, it's my birthday. This is what I'm talking. First of all, first of all, there were still some playbookers there. The pickers were thin. But look, you know what? The pickers were slim. But you know what we should have? This is what we're going to do.

You're going to make it up to me. We're making it up to you. We're going to have, we're going to start having May playbook parties. People won't know that they're playbook parties. We won't call them playbook parties. Like, hey, it's a playbook party. But we'll know that they're Playboy parties. But this one right here, I don't accept it because I was not, I didn't have the latitude to do it.

Well, I will say this, though, if you were a single man, Saturday night was actually the place to be. It really was. We have a lot of single girlfriends. A lot of single women. beautiful, talented, fun, a lot of single girls. If you were a single man, Saturday night was the place to be. Because, like, some of the homies were looking around like, God damn, how did this turn, how did this party turn to this?

I'm like, these are all Rachel and Kalika's friends, man. Go out, be, you know, boom, boom, boom, hang out, whatever. Yeah, there were a lot, actually. Amazing party. I will also shout out Colin and Nessa for stopping by. dear friends of mine came by and hung out. Everybody was there. It was the place to be Saturday night.

If you weren't in Coachella, you should have been at Bigfoot West. Bigfoot West. How about that place that we found it? It looked like a whole saloon already. We had no decoration. We brought the hay, though. That hay we brought in.

Shout out to my assistant, Rachel, who's, her name's Rachel as well, who's amazing. She brought the hay in, had the signs up. We had the wanted posters. You had your own poster, too. It was great. It was great. Thank you for everybody.

Thank you to everybody who, came. I got fucked over by one of your friends. Who? I was, I'm not sure who this sister was. She was black. She was black. Me and my friends were outside.

It was a good mix of people there, too. It wasn't as many how wats. I know. We just said on perfect. I saw Wendy though. Wendy was there. You know my faithfuls were there. Yeah.

I, shout out Nina Parker and Molly, too. I'm just going to go down the list of people that I love. Wait, who screwed you over? Who was the sister that screwed you? So we were sitting down outside. It happened twice in a row. We were sitting outside, me and my homies, and I was having a very deep emotional conversation

with my friends about how important it was that they were there because how difficult the week was for me. And this lady comes out, I met her, and she goes, can y'all get up? because they wanted to take a picture. I wonder who it was. And then what's my homeboy that I know?

I love this guy. He's a friend of yours from Texas. Wayne? Is it Wayne? Alvin. Alvin. Alvin. Love Alvin. Alvin got one of the best energies ever. Yeah, he does.

Alvin great. So they got up and they're all taking the picture together. And then Alvin's like, we want Van to get into the picture. And she goes, no. I already know who it was. Just University of Texas people. I know. I'm like, at that point, I started to feel a little plate.

Because we looked around, because if a black woman asked us to get up, like, and so we were going to, so we got up and, you know, in the old days, either Ian or Ryan, what a, what did they? I was like, let's get up. And then so I didn't get up. And at my quote-unquote birthday party, I'm taking the picture, not a problem. Then people asked her to get in the picture and then she says no, only University of Texas people.

At that point, I almost started to put the drive on her. I did. I almost, at that point, at that point, I almost, I was very close to putting the drive on her at that one. I'm glad you didn't. But I was like, cool. And then they were like, hey, man, now could you get in the picture? I'm like, no.

So I walked away. I'm going to ask Alvin who it was. Yeah. But it was a great time. It was a great time. But it's fun. Also a missed opportunity. There won't be any misopportunities.

You know what? This is what I'm saying to everybody who has problems with this. Because now I'm ready for it. I know you are. That's the thing. I wasn't before. Now I'm in a place where I'm like, I'm ready. By the way, people know that you're ready.

I can't wait. We're going to have the most, it's still spring. We're going to have the most ignorant on-the-scenes summer. This is it. This is the last summer of being out there. Is it? Not for me. For me, yeah.

Okay. For me, it's over. Okay. For me, for me, Okay. It's time to start legacy building and getting serious and maximizing everything. But Rachel, your time is just beginning. Okay.

It doesn't feel like now, but it's coming. It's coming. It's coming. All right. That's enough, Pleasantries. Let's get into the show on the other side of this break. Rat beef. Let's do it.

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dot sweetgreen.com. There are things happening in the world that are more important, and we understand that, but we're going to get into rat beef right now. Drake has dropped yet another record and his ongoing beef against Kendrick Lamar. Let me say something real quick. The record sucks.

It's called a tailor-made freestyle. I just want to say something real quick. Drake objectively does not suck. Drake is one of the most quotable, one of the most influential, important artists of his generation. And Drake is also a very nice guy. Okay, this record sucks. It's corny.

It's cringy. It's whatever you want to call it. The record blows. It is Drake using AI versions of Snoop. It's Drake rapping, you can tell, but you use the AI filter to, to emulate Snoop and Pock. And I guess Jimmy Rabbit from 8 Mile,

Kendrick, by saying things that he thinks Kendrick would say, but using Pock and Snoop to do it. It is cringe and weird. So let me ask you this. Do you not like it because lyrically it's not good? Or do you not like it? I have a few questions. You don't like it because it's lyrically not good.

You don't like it because he used AI. or do you not like it because another disc record came out and you think that one is better? Or that's maybe how it should be done. So at this point, where we're at is Kendrick Lamar has yet to drop another record in response to push-ups, which was Drake's response to Kendrick dissing him in a way on like that. This is my problem with all of this. I think as an older millennial hip-hop fan, I don't want to speak for everyone,

but I think some of the sentiments are the same with people. I think my problem with all of this is that this beef, this round of it, is so lackluster, it's so uninspired, It's so it seems choreographed in a... Choreographs a good word. In a weird way that the impotence of this beef

really makes you for the first time question the health of hip-hop as a whole. Because the guys that are involved in this are the cream of the crop in terms of hip-hop artistry and popularity. You had Cole, Kendrick, and Drake, right? The big three. Whenever guys of that ilk have gone at it in a beef before, it's been culture changing and culture defining. If it's pock and big, culture changing, culture defining, right?

If it's Hove and Nas, culture changing, culture defining, new terms come out. Like it shifts the alliances and dynamics of hip hop. new alliances form. Some old alliances are gone. Like people lose jobs, gang jobs, new rappers emerge, other side beefs immerse. All of that happens. It's culture changing and culture defining when titans like that go at it.

That's why ultimately, even though there is a lot of static and foolishness that's involved, it's ultimately good for the game. Now, Big and Pock had some other stuff going on that didn't really have much to do with their beef, like Tupac was not killed over a beef with notorious B IGD. He wasn't. But there was some other stuff that was going on there that made that one a little bit more sinister. And the fact that those guys end up losing their lives,

when you look back on it now, you wonder, was all the animus worth it? And obviously, you don't ever want anyone to be in that type of situation. But normally, out of this stuff, you see, new eras of people's career embarked on. would say what you want about ether and I know there's been this revision, this history on

ether now and takeover since Jay-Z has gone on to become who he became, but at the time that ether dropped, I remember feeling like Nas giving a response to Jay that was in any way comparable to takeover was impossible because of where Nas was at the time.

but that beef, that response really honestly spurned or or it started a career resurgence and renaissance for Nas into some of the best rap that we've ever gotten in some of the best rap for Nas. Nas felt threatened. Nas hit the heavy bag. He doubled down on his talent. He doubled down on who he was. And now what we've seen from Nas since has been nothing short of glory. in terms of rap.

All of this stuff is what's supposed to happen. With this, it's just not happening like that. It's not. It's not happening like that. These records are barely good. The music is not great that's coming from this. Cole bowed out, which from a hip-hop perspective was disappointing. But now, from a life perspective, he's the only one that had any sense.

I apologize deeply and sincerely to Jay Cole. for any opinions that I had because J. Cole must have seen the fuckery written on the wall and just been like, why I'm going to end up doing this for the next two months? I'm sorry, I was wrong. He looks like the smartest person in the room. And like there's nothing coming out of this. No great records. No great lines. No great nothing.

Everything that people say about hip-hop, like the game is in a weird place, like the feeling is going, all of that. If you were to base your opinion on the game off this beef, It's the same shit everything else is a bunch of playing, a bunch of memes, and fake shit that we can't tell whether it's real or not. Okay, when Kendrick first dropped his verse on like that, that wasn't the take people had, right? Like nobody was saying it was trash or corny or anything like that. It was like, oh, Kendrick did this or whatever, right? The bigger response came to how Jay Cole responded to Kendrick. Yeah.

I would think that what Drake has put out so far with push-ups and the Taylor-made Free Space. style, you're kind of giving him enough rope to hang himself in the sense that Kendrick's probably like, why would I respond to this? What's the point of this? Kendrick has to respond. Does he have to? Yeah, he does. Because you have to respond. Okay, let me ask you this about something that you said. Because you said that you said that you're concerned. I apologize for raising my voice. Everybody, when they raise my voice, so I wasn't screaming at Rachel. No, that time you weren't. That time you weren't. But that time, you talk about the health of hip-hop. Is it just the people? Like, is it just that we're with, is this a different

generation, a different set of rapper, the way it used to be just doesn't exist anymore? And you could say that in the way that people rap, the songs that they put out, the albums they put out, the beef, since that's what we're talking about, it's just not the same anymore. So you're asking something of these people that they're just not capable of producing because they've never been those artists that you referred of. And this isn't a knock to their time. I'm not a knock because I'm a fan of, you know, some of the rappers we're talking about.

Yeah, I'm not. But when it comes to what hip hop was to what it is now, maybe you're asking something of them that they are just not. Last thing I say about this. And I'm not saying that you're wrong. Look, everything changes, everything evolves. Yeah. Everything becomes new, right?

Yes. But when people are talking about, um, the health of something. Even when you talk about the health of America, what you're essentially talking about are the fundamentals of it. You're not talking about cosmetically how it sounds to you or whether or not there's an evolution involved that you can get behind. You're talking about the fundamentals of it.

Are the fundamentals of whatever you're discussing, are they healthy? If you're talking about America, sure, there'll be different ways to make money. The financial system will change and evolve, right? The question is the American worker, which is a fundamental building block of the American economy, how healthy is that person? And that question will never expire.

There's no expiration date on that part of the fundamentals of what makes America a place where the economy works. If the American worker does not find success in America, and you're going to see an America that's not as healthy as it was before. It doesn't matter if he's working in retail, if he's working in industry, he's working whatever. He or she got to work. The question now becomes,

are the fundamentals of hip-hop as we understood them in a healthy place? And how could it be when we don't even know who's rapping? Think about this. I'm not talking about we don't know who's rapping in terms of, We don't know who wrote the raps. Right. I gave you. We don't know who's rapping.

We're not sure who's rapping. When I'm talking about the fundamentals of it, I'm not a hip-hop historian. I'm not Sway. I'm not ninth. Sway a gentleman and a scholar. Ninth Wonder, all of these guys. Charlemagne, all of these guys who know so much about this.

I'm not those guys. I am a dedicated hip-hop fan since birth, though, like really born into first grade when I heard I'm bad I'm listening to all these records I'm doing all of this like the fundamentals of it how you talk your shit

hip hop being competitive rapping writing your raps reflecting not even your genuine life but your genuine life observations you know what I mean

your genuine life observations all of these things, the fundamentals of it, rhyming, beat making, all of this stuff. Like, I'm looking around and I'm like, yo, I don't know if these things are healthy, man. I'm listening to something, I'm like, yo, is this AI? Is this real? I'm not sure if it's AI if it's real.

Then we don't know that. And then he uses AI on the song. He's rapping and then making his shit sound like, people have done this before, hey, I'm going to act like I'm too. I'm going to write this from Tupac's perspective and stuff like that. But like rapping the shit and then sounding like you Pock, And then sounding like you, that's some white boy shit.

I don't give a fuck what nobody talking about. Like that would be cool. Like that would be well received. That's almost the worst part. You put it out there and thought like this is going to hit. And something that last thing I'll say, I keep saying the last thing I'll say, is there's something else about this is that also the audience has changed. That's very true.

So being that the audience has changed, there's no real way to litigate this stuff anyway. It don't matter anyway. It's a dick-sucking contest. It's a stand contest. Bro, JZ was on top of the world. He was the number one rapper of ever, right? He was on top of the world, right? He drops takeover.

He solidifies his stranglehold on New York City. Solidifies the stranglehold on New York City. Solidifies it, right? Boom. Like, it was him saying, you know what? I've reached a point in the game that honestly, some of the other guys that I was even compared to. Nobody really wanted to say it.

Nobody wanted to say it. But around the time that the blueprint is coming out, blueprint era right after that, Jay had got to a point that honestly, Pock and Big never got to, right? He had gotten to a point that they really never, that they never got to. Big wasn't around long enough.

I'm not talking about in talent or an impact. I'm just talking about in rap kinghood. Sure. He kind of got to a point. It was a little different. And it still feels weird to say that now. And he was kind of realizing that and tiptoeing into it. He didn't want to just come out and say it.

But if I ain't better than big, I'm the closest one. He didn't want to come out and say it, but he was tiptoeing into saying it, right? And so the only guy really left, and there was more shit behind the scenes that was going on, that anybody even thought that Jay had. competition in was Niz. So they're going back and forth. Nass had kind of got at Hove. Jay decided, okay, it's time to shoot at Nause.

Takeover comes out. Jay Z, now, that's it. Nause can't come back from that. Like, he said a bunch of shit that people agree with. Stranglehold on Nause. Everybody's like, oh, JZ, JZ, JZ. Jay couldn't have been more up. And to me, just from where I'm looking at it,

and remember, I'm looking from Baton Rouge, Louisiana, that's the lowest point in Naz's career. My gosh, that's the infanize. Nage drops ether. right they then go and do a poll on hot 97 the people in the poll on hot 97 vote for nas over the hottest biggest at that point most relevant uh most up guy in New York or in rap period there was still enough objectivity in the game at that point from the fans for them to say you know what, even though this guy is the biggest fan stand, whatever, like this record is a harder record

perspective-wise coming out of this whole thing and takeover, who won this whole joint, put the records together, this record comes harder. It's a different feel to it. We can have a conversation about Ethan and takeover later. There's a different feel to it. That's impossible now. Yeah, yeah. It's impossible now.

the people that want Drake eliminated are never going to admit that Drake beat Kendrick even if Drake did drop a good record, which he hasn't yet. And the people that want, uh, that are Drake fans are literally, literally, literally,

never, ever, ever, ever, ever, ever going to admit that Drake took a loss. The, the dick throading is like at a level that makes it really, really frustrating. So this is the first time I'm like, We lost it. We've lost the plot. The recipes are, like, are being lost, and it's just not fun.

I hope nobody responds because I don't want to talk about it anymore. No, you don't like it. Did you like Chris Brown's diss to Cuevo? That was the hardest shit. That's why I asked you did that, because he really went at him. He didn't tipto all right. He just went every line was knocking Cuevo. That's the hardest shit.

That was the hardest shit. Now, there was some shit in there like any beef, right? some shit in there that's probably, you know, you shouldn't say to somebody. You know what I'm saying? Like in every, I remember when I first heard him up, I'm like, oh, my God. Yeah, that one. Like, we're going this far. Like, you know what I'm saying?

Talking about different people's, like, their wives and their, like, their, their health. You know, you know what I mean? All of that stuff. But Chris Brown and Cuevo is the purest beef that we have right now. Now, the only thing about that one is that that's the only one that I think you have to watch because it could turn actually violent because despite what some people might say, those crews have actually faced off in a violent way before. They have faced off?

Yeah, some years ago, we covered their teams. I can't remember when it was, but some years ago those crews actually came up. They actually faced off in like a violent way. It was like a, I don't think Chris and Cuevo got into it one-on-one, but there was some crew stuff that was going on. And, you know, you just, you can't trust Chris Brown not to smack the shit out of somebody. The nigger is off. So it, it, he just, he pops to it.

Like, you fuck with him, he pops to it. That's the way that it goes. But yeah, as far as the energy of a beef, that's the, that is the. I felt it when I was listening to it. I was like, oh, that's why I ask you, that coming out the same time as Drake, did it make it seem even, more water down. We also forget that Chris Brown be rapping a little bit. I didn't say he doesn't.

I didn't say he doesn't. Chris Brown could rap. But the way he wrapped about Cuevo is what you would have expected if Drake's going to come at Kendrick or anybody else because it seems like everybody versus Drake right now that's what he would do. And he asked. Yeah. Kanye jumped into it.

Yeah. You know, it's just it seems like this is people's opportunity to take Drake out, which I don't know how I feel about that. That feels choreographed too, but that's why I said that was a good word that you use. All of it just feels playing. All right, what's next? Our brother Stephen A. Smith.

Okay, so listen, our brother Stephen A. Smith. And when I say our brother Stephen A. Smith, shout out Stephen A. Smith. I saw Stephen A. Smith. I don't know if I told you this. I saw him at King Charles in New York. Oh. Stephen A. looking healthy. He lost weight.

Stephen A is doing his thing. He is. Always has. Always has. He went on Hannity Show. Mm-hmm. And he was talking about black voters and Trump. And the talking point that there are some black voters that are sympathetic to Trump because of Trump's legal trouble.

Let's play the clip that a lot of people responded to, Ashley. But I got to tell you something. As much as people may have been abhorred by Donald Trump's statement weeks ago talking about how black folks, he's hearing that black folks find him relatable. because what he's going through is similar to what black Americans have gone through. He wasn't lying. He was telling the truth. When you see the law, law enforcement, the court system and everything else being exercised against him, it is something that black folks throughout this nation can relate to with some of our historic iconic figures.

We've seen that happen throughout society. So no matter what race, what ethnicity you may emanate from, We relate to you when you're suffering like that because we know we have. And that's what he articulated. That is the clip there. The reaction was swift. From everybody. It was.

From everybody, yes. From people who are friends of Stephen A. Smith like Roland Martin. From organizations like the NACP. Came out and responded to that. Yeah. And then Stephen A. Smith responded. Now, actually, do we have a little bit or any of Stephen A. Smith's response? I don't even know if it's, it's, it was like a 20 minute response.

Yeah. But there was no specifically addressing that comment. It was more of how could you come at me as if I'm not pro-black or as if I'm pro-Trump when I've said this, this, this, this, and this. And he goes on a 20-minute rant about it instead of acknowledging the statement that people had an issue with. What he did say, though, is that his answer was, was, was, in the context of black people who are voting for Trump. He tweeted that, I think. He tweeted that, and he also said it during the Little Rang.

Okay. That his answer is in the context of black people who are voting for Trump. Black people that are, he's asking to speak from the perspective of black people who are voting for Trump. And from their perspective, there probably is some sympathy that they feel for Donald Trump or some kinship that they feel for Donald Trump because of the way that Donald Trump has been treated or the perception

that Donald Trump is being treated unfairly by the legal system I did not gather that that was listening to the whole Hannity clip I did not gather how he that was the context he was speaking with him. Right. So look this is the thing. I'm not

familiar with Stephen A. Smith's opinions on Donald Trump and who he's going to vote for. He's I got familiar during this. He said that he can't vote for Donald Trump. Donald Trump has done too much.

He believes there'll be a civil war. He believes there'll be a civil war. Donald Trump is too dangerous. He doesn't want to vote for Donald Trump. I'll say this, though. The disappointing thing is not what he said even. Because if we're being honest, what he said is something that's been said by people

since these indictments against Donald Trump first started. Like, hey, the right has said this many times about different things. Hey, black men or black people like Donald Trump because Donald Trump is gangster. Black people like Donald Trump because Donald Trump puts sneakers out. Black people like Donald Trump because Donald Trump is a businessman. He's got his money. He's got his money up. He's under.

It's like black people who are. like Donald Trump because Donald Trump is under criminal indictment. Two things about that. Number one, when they talk about why black people like Donald Trump, it's either directly transactional with, you know, giving out stimulus checks or it has to do with his cult of personality, right? Like who he is or who black people think that he is, which fine. Yeah.

Those things are more telling about what they think we respond to than anything else. True. Now, in terms of Stephen A. Smith, I do feel like how incredulous he was in the response to the criticism was a little bit annoying. I agree. Because if you go on Sean Hannity show, and he talked about this, he says,

I've gone on, I go on all kinds of shows. I've gone on, uh, He said Bill Maher, Abby Phillips, Abby Phillips, all that. And he asked,

when I met him, he was on King Charles, right? If you go on Sean Hannity show and you make the statements that you make

about Donald Trump that seem to be echoing or in agreement with things that they've said, you have to know two things.

Number one, Fox themselves will weaponize the clip. They, as part of what they, do intellectually, they'll say, hey, here's Stephen A. Smith, a surrogate for American cultural blackness saying this is why people like Donald Trump. That's number one.

And number two, the fact that a lot of black people look at that as a cultural away game, they're not wrong. I don't think that black people are wrong for looking at an appearance on Fox News, not saying that people shouldn't go on Fox News, but I don't think black people are wrong for looking at an appearance on Fox News as a cultural way game. It feels like Fox News is continuously doubling and tripling down on some of the worst tropes, some of the most inaccurate, misinterpreted things about black Americans

and putting them out there on Front Street. It feels like it's part of not just what happens on them, Fox, but a part of the apparatus there. It's a far-right, not as far-right at some of the other places, it's a far-right cable television station, right? And news apparatus, news organizations, should I say. So going on there and saying that, which is something that they've been saying, obviously there are people that are not going to want to hear that and are going to do their due

diligence to disprove it. So it's like if you're going to go on there, if you're going to go on there, go on there, drop your nuts, say what the hell you got to say, and then live with whatever the critique and the consequences are of that intellectually. But I don't understand why this is not just with Stephen A, with anyone anywhere, where you would go to a place knowing the perception of how people look at it and then come back and chastise them when the place that you've gone and talked about these things and espouse these views and the views themselves are inaccurate. They don't represent what black people feel

is true about themselves. They don't represent how black people want to be viewed in terms of we love everything criminal and we gravitate towards everything criminal and we have sympathy for every criminal that's ever been prosecuted. We don't want that. So when people, come back and they take you the task for it or they have they speak at cross purposes to it, I don't understand the chastising that came from him on the other side of it. Yeah. I think that it was more about being right than it was about because he constantly says, I don't care, right?

That's the part that I find interesting. I don't care. I don't care about this. I don't give a damn what people have to say, but then you go on your podcast and you're constantly trying to prove. how you aren't the things people are accusing you of without specifically addressing the statement that was at issue. It's not even just how he presented black people to this Fox News audience, which to your point,

Sean Hannity wouldn't have him on. They talk about being friends. That's how he introduces him. Stephen A. Smith doesn't like to say he's my friend. And Stephen A is like, well, I am your friend. I would imagine Sean Hannity knows how Stephen A was going to answer that question before. he even brought him on. Stephen A. Smith has to know that as well, yet he still goes on,

still tries to pretend like he's shocked or doesn't understand why people are coming after him when he knows the exact reason he's brought on to Sean Hannity and who he's speaking to. But I would say, too, it wasn't even just how he talked about, presented black people to this audience. It was also the watering down of Trump, which is why when he went on his podcast, he's like, No, I've said this, this, and this about Trump. Obviously, the comparing us black people in our struggles to Trump and the way we've been discriminated against is wrong. But just the lack of knowledge of the fact of why Trump is being indicted,

or not indicted, why he's on trial and what he's on trial for. And the sentiment that he was giving was as if it shouldn't even be happening. Right? We've talked about before about the timing of it. Yeah, sure. like that's politically influenced, but the fact that he is, there is enough evidence to show that he is tied to this crime or committed this crime and he's rightfully being prosecuted for it. There's enough to show that, especially when you tie that with Michael Cohen and him already

being convicted. I don't understand why Stephen A. Smith goes on these podcasts and isn't well versed. It seems like in everything that's going on and makes these generalizations when it comes to Trump and watering down what the real issue. are with him and then gives other people the permission or perpetuates these ideas to this audience of, oh, Stephen A. Smith says that. He represents the black community. Then that must be what all black people think. Or Stephen A. Smith doesn't believe that Trump should be indicted. And it's just like a silly case that they're just doing because the Dems can't win in another way. But isn't

well-versed to talk on it. So a couple of things. Number one, I think on some of these other places that there are enough black voices that the single voice of the black person isn't weaponized in a really specific way. So meaning, like, I go on CNN. I'll be on CNN this weekend, right? When I go on CNN, I give my opinion, but there are a lot of black people on CNN.

But not Fox. Not Fox. And so my point, and so, I mean, they're black people on Fox. I don't want to diminish the fact that they have black people on Fox. They do have black people on Fox. But what I would say is, like, in a lot of the, in a lot of the spots that we see prominent black people on CNN, you don't see them as much on Fox. So when you get somebody on Fox, a lot of times you're getting someone to speak directly to the Black, audience. And when they're speaking to the black audience, it almost seems as if the people

that are that are on Fox know it is that they're going to say. Now, I will say this. The Riley factor in the past was a show that was different about that. Like, you didn't see that as much. You saw he would have Mark Lamont Hill on there. He would have like whatever, whatever, whatever you think about Bill O'Reilly. And obviously Bill O'Reilly is a sleaze ball. But that was a show that was a little bit more open because it was a little fysier of a show. So when Stephen A goes on there or when other people go on there, you're going on there specifically to talk to the black audience and to say certain things. But he tries to act like he's not.

Right. He honestly might not be saying anything that he wouldn't say anywhere else. But you'd have to know that that's your function on Fox. Another thing is, I think a lot of what got Stephen A triggered or upset or made him respond was the idea that he is a sellout or that he isn't somehow a weak black man or a hidden right-wing conservative that doesn't have the best interests of black people at heart. I don't know if that's fair. I actually know that that's not fair.

I don't think that that's fair. No, it's not. And I think that's the response to some of it that he was getting, to some of it. But there's no acknowledgement about that key statement, right? If you even just look at what the NAACP tweeted at him, they're speaking to a specific thing about his comparison of how black people can relate based on discrimination because Trump is being discriminated against. And he and Stephen A. Smith even said when you look at historical figures, like he said these things. It's true.

And so what? He should have just acknowledged. There's going to be a part of the black intelligentsia that is going to be like, yo, you're too prominent of a voice for that to come from you and for us not to say, nah, not true. Now, then there are going to be people that say, hey, what Stephen A. Smith just said is not true and it's wrong, Roland Martin, NAACP, all of those people. Then there are going to be other people that go, Stephen A. Smith is a cooening and sellout.

And at a certain point, it's probably going to all feel like the same thing from him, right? is going to feel like all of this, it's just going to be like, oh, my God, they're coming at me, they're coming at me, they're coming at me. I will say something else. I don't know that I agree with you that the timing of Trump's prosecutions are politically motivated. I don't know if I agree with that. Oh, I'm almost positive you said that on this podcast.

Well, if I said that, I'm wrong. I think that the, I think that- Pushing it before the election, I do think is a little bit politically motivated. What do you mean pushing it before the election? Like, there's this been this push to how. have these criminal trials prior to November. And I think the reason being that is because it will affect some of the outcome, the outcome of the election.

I think that's what the thought is. And I'm not saying that, you know, he's got all these felony charges against him, what, 34 in New York, what, 88, 90 or something like that, total. I'm not saying that he shouldn't be prosecuted. I'm just saying I do think that there has been this push to get it done before the election. Yeah. So it's interesting. I think that's an interesting, and we'll talk about that.

in a second. I think that's interesting. I think it's interesting as we segue into something about the election. I think that's interesting. I think number one, I don't know if it's necessary, if it's necessarily politically motivated to want to have something adjudicated before someone runs for the highest office in the land. I don't think it's motivated by, I think you want to have the issue settled, particularly if it's an issue involving election interferes or something like that

you would want to have the issue settled. I don't know if it's to the way I would look at it. I don't know if it's necessarily to wound him because what I would say is if Trump beats, if Trump loses, if Trump beats the case up in New York, the Alvin Brad case, the hush money case, if he beats that case, it'll be like steroid to his political,

this political campaign. Sure. Well, for the people who are like die hard, the MAGAs for sure. No, for a lot of undecided voters too, I think. You think they'll, they have the Stephen A. Smith sentiment of that they went after him for. I think there are a lot of undecided voters because when you look at swaths of people, they're still amongst likely voters. There's still voters, like 10% of voters that are undecided. There's still a large portion of voters in the Republican Party that say if Trump is convicted in New York, that they don't.

don't feel comfortable voting for him. They don't feel comfortable voting for him. Right. I think that if he were to be acquitted on that case, then it would be a major shot in the arm. So it's, to me, it's, it's risky either way, especially once we realize that people didn't care about the indictment as much. It's risky either way. But I think that case. But even the Georgia case, they were trying to get done before. And I understand. Well, you would want to get it done before. I do. But I also think a little of that is, Yes, I'm not disagreeing with the reason you're saying, but I also think some of it is, yeah, like, you,

and I want people to be clear. I am not saying he should not be charged because that's what Stephen A. Smith was saying, at least with the New York case. He was trying to say this wouldn't be an issue if he wasn't running for president. I don't agree with that. I think that he should be charged.

I think that what they've shown is enough to indict, charge, whatever, go through with these cases or these trials. but I do think the push has to do with November and that it will hopefully some of it. I'm not saying the only reason. I'm just saying the timing at all. I get what you're saying. Not the reason he's being charged.

So I'll say something else. I'll say something else. There's a lot of stuff that's involved in some of these cases that have to do with political decorum as well. For example, Trump's ability to hold on to the documents that he had for as long as he had him in Florida. and the fact that they asked for the documents back and tried to get him to cooperate with turning the documents over

was because he's an ex-president and because it looks bad to raid the home of an ex-president, it looks bad to indict an ex-president. It looks like things that happen are the places that don't really happen here. And they didn't want to do that. They didn't want to do that. And that was the latitude that they were giving him because he is an ex-president.

But in the case of the Alvin Bragg situation, like up in New York, the only reason why people are saying, hey, they wouldn't do this to him or they shouldn't do this, is saying with who he is that this is something that people do and maybe you should let him off forward or give him latitude with it. It's because he's an ex-president. There's a certain amount of political, certain amount of insulation. that being an ex-president gets Donald Trump as well. I personally think, look, impropriety happens in 2020 in some of these things, sometimes later, right? You take time to build your case. When you've taken the time to build your case,

you feel like you have a good enough case, bring your case. Like, bring your case. If it's before the election, fine. But bring your case. First of all, another thing we talk about politics, You won't be able to try him if he wins because he'll have immunity. So if you're- Well, not Georgia.

Well, not Georgia. If you want to try him for some of this stuff, you're going to have to try him a lot of times before he gets into office because he'll be the president then. But all this to say, this is what I don't, why I don't understand the other part, besides what he said about black people, I don't understand. the point that Stephen A. Smith was trying to make when it comes to Donald Trump. There's enough information out here to show that a case should be happening in Georgia. A case should be happening in regards to the documents in Florida.

A case can be made for what's happening in New York. I don't understand why you're just going to say, oh, they're just after him because. No. Serious accusations. Okay. Real-life update. We were literally getting ready to go. And we saw on Twitter that Stephen A. Smith had posted, I guess, a clarification where some people are saying an apology for his statements on Sean Hannity.

So Rachel is saying this for the first time. I haven't listened to the whole thing. We're both kind of hearing it for the first time. So Ashley, run a little bit of it. I wanted to touch on something that I made news about just a few years. days ago. Let me say this, ladies and gentlemen. Accountability is where everything needs to begin in this world. It's something I say quite often. I certainly never hesitate to hold folks accountable when mistakes or mishaps occur, so I'm certainly not about to run from it myself. I'm fully aware

that I've been in the news over the last few days, paraded all over social media as well, after comments I made during my appearance on Fox News is Hannity last week with the one and only Sean Hannity himself. And I'm fully aware of the outcry that has ensued because of it. A lot of folks in Black America seem pretty pissed at me right now. From friends and loved ones to colleagues, contemporaries, and dare I say even the NAACP itself, quite a few folks will put off if not flat out offended

after my words were interpreted as associating support for Trump from the black community with all the legal issues he's facing. For that, I sincerely apologize. To be clear, my words were misconstrued. I'm stating right here for the record that my words were taken out of context, misrepresenting and depicting me in a way I found every bit as insulting and disrespectful as folks in black America

evidently felt about what they thought I said. but I'll own it anyway. Because you know, please know that I know, the buck stops with me. I'm in the communication business. I've been here for 30 years, so regardless of whatever interpretation that accompanies any words coming out of my mouth,

the responsibility ultimately lies with me first and foremost before anybody else. I've always felt that way. I still do. I always will. period. Blacks who refused to support Trump are aware of his history of issues. And we'll never forget how Trump claimed Obama, the nation's first black president, wasn't even qualified to hold office because he was born in Kenya, although Trump recanted the statement during his

2016 campaign run for the presidency. Yet Trump's dissenters were not the topic of discussion when I was talking Hannity. The support he appears to be receiving in the polls was what was being discussed. Five polls. Count them five. Emerson, NBC News, Daily Gus, O'Cos, New York Times, and Rasmussen, all big national polls had Trump leading over the last few weeks. Plus, according to 538, recent local polls also put Trump ahead in battleground states. He's up six points in Michigan, Arizona, and Georgia each. Insofar as Trump gaining support in the black community? Well, how about various publications with these headlines? The Chicago Tribune, this time Trump really does seem to be making black voter inroads. Why? The Washington Post,

voters of color are shifting right. Are Democrats doomed? How about the New York Times? As black voters drift to Trump, Biden's allies say they have work to do. Axios wrote, Big Biden's bummer. New York Times, Sienna poll shows gaps with key demographic groups. Wall Street Journal. Biden loses support among black men. The Hill. Biden losing support among black voters in swing states, colon, survey. Al Jazeera.

Why are black voters backing Donald Trump in record numbers? In CBS News, black voter support for Trump up from 4% to 23% poll finds. Why did I say all of that? Because I want to show you I didn't just open my mouth. I read, I listened, and I've seen a momentum shift as we all have. Anywhere I appear, no matter my subjectivity relating to what I feel, it's still going to be based on facts being presented into the stratosphere. That is who I've always been. It is what I will always continue to be. but it's never exercised with malice in my heart and soul, certainly never to insult or harm the black community,

my community. My thoughts are put out there to present views. I believe are pertinent that alerts us to what's going on, what missteps may be taking place, and how, if at all, they could be corrected. I hope everyone can understand and appreciate my intent, if nothing else, as we march forward right here with the Stephen A. Smith show.

But just because my intent was harmless, doesn't mean my words were harmless, and I know that. I can always do better, and I'll strive to do just that every single day that I'm alive. Apology rating. I've done one of these in a while, right? First half. Like the first minute?

Mm-hmm. I mean, you got to give it a solid six seconds. Okay. He butts it and then tries to, you know, say these were the factual things I was saying. But that wasn't, people didn't have an issue you saying Trump was ahead in the polls. He didn't even need to do all that. When we were talking about him earlier, for me, it was, I felt he was very defensive in his initial response and wasn't listening to what people were saying they were offended by. What he said was very problematic.

He still didn't fully acknowledge it, but he did fall on the sword and say, say it stops with me. I apologize. So for that, the recognition coming back, because he said he didn't care, came back. Obviously, somebody got to him. It's probably family because he does mention family this time. And he said, and he wanted to address it. So for that, I will give him a six.

Six. Okay, six pretty high. Interesting. But he butted it. I mean, look, once again, I don't think that, I think people are trying to get their own, the gins is off about what they think about Stephen A. Um, yeah. But I, I, I really do just believe that the, the trope that black people love Trump,

because, uh, he's in trouble with the police or he's in trouble with the law, it's deeply, deeply deep. To me, it's deeply offensive. Of course. It's deeply offensive. Okay. Um, take a break. For adults with crime.

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Okay, so let's stay on the election real quick. Let's talk about AOC. She was in a talk with METI Hassan, who used to be over on MSNBC. He's not on... He's not? Yeah, Mady Hassan's been gone for a while. It's been gone. I mean, it's actually been that long.

Okay. It's been that long. But Mdi Hassan's show was not renewed by MSNBC and now, you know... Oh, maybe I knew that. He still has, like, a tremendous platform. She was in conversation with Medi Hassan, and she was asked, giving her stance on what's going on in Palestine right now, how she thinks voters will respond to Joe Biden,

who have huge problems with the way the war is being carried out over there. Check it out. What do you say to a young, progressive or an Arab American who says to you, I just can't vote for Biden again after what he's enabled in Gaza? What do you say to them? I mean, I think everyone comes to, this prospect and this conversation with a different history, different background, what they bring.

You know, for an individual Palestinian-American that has had their family killed, there is nothing, I mean, I am not here to lecture anyone. I also think that this election is more, in my personal view, I believe this election is about more than president. And also, it's not just one election that's happening. We're having hundreds of elections. The balance of Congress, the balance of the House, the balance of the Senate, and the presidency. And I have a vested interest in protecting democracy, not just here domestically, but globally. And it isn't, I truly do not believe this as a lesser of two evils type of situation.

I think about what conditions do I want to be organizing under in the next four years. You can look at both of these individuals oppositional as well, depending on what issue you have. But I would rather, even in places of stark disagreement, I would rather be organizing under the conditions of Biden as an opponent on an issue than Trump, who is not, he seeks to disney. mantle American democracy. And I am taking that personally, very seriously, because we will not be able to organize for any movement towards anything if we are facing the jailing of dissidents.

I mean, this is the kind of authoritarianism that he threatens. And we have to take it seriously. We yet. More people need to hear this, because I think people, She didn't say, hey, I'm voting for Biden, but she definitely is like, I don't want to do anything that's going to get Trump in office. I don't think a lot of people are thinking AOC was going to vote third party. So to hear her speak in this way, and a lot of people, especially progressives, the younger generation, really liberals, look to AOC. And I think that what she's saying is exactly right. She hit it right on. It is so important to understand what it is.

to live under Trump the next four years. You have to understand exactly what it is he's saying he's going to do, which he's putting it all out there. He's not hiding it. And I just don't think, I think people are more, a lot of people get on to me because they're like, oh, she's so pro-Biden, she's so pro-Biden, she's trying to push us on Biden. I'm not, I more so take the stance that AOC is saying. I'm listening to what Donald Trump is going to say, and I'm not saying that Biden is the

best option, but what else do we have? And I know that sounds so bad to say, well, I'm voting for. for this because I don't want this to happen, but those are the options that we have at the moment. And I do understand people wanting to use their right to vote and use their power to vote for someone that they're passionate about. And that might not be Biden or Trump. But if a vote for someone else is going to further the opportunity for Trump to become our next president, then I'm not down with that. And I think that what AOC is saying here is extremely important. So there's been some polling coming out, some new poll.

Biden is surging a little bit to the degree that he can surge. Also, it has been unclear who the candidacy of Robert Kennedy Jr.

affects more Biden or Trump, but there seems to be some polling at least recently that suggests that he pulling from Trump's pool a little bit more. What about Cornell West? Excuse me. Let me put some respect on it.

Cornel West. I'm hoping to have Cornell West and Medina Molina Dula on the podcast. On the podcast. I don't think there's enough of a, I don't think it'll be statistically relevant, honestly, what they're able to do. I think their campaign to me is about more than winning the presidency. I don't know if they think they're going to win the presidency over there. Maybe they do. So maybe it's not even third party. It's just maybe speaking to the people who don't feel like they even want to vote. Right.

So I think the people that are going to stay home, look, it seems clear right now that RFK Jr. is going to have an effect on the election in some kind of way. I think this more has to do with people who may be reluctant to vote for Joe Biden in key states because of our country. the war. I don't know how much influence AOC has with those people. She's been a couple of places recently in the last

months where she's actually been protested and people have actually been calling on her to be more progressive? Well, no, to be more anti-Israel. I mean, I think she's been the subject of, yeah, more progressive.

To be the subject of some heckling. She's been the subject of some heckling. She's been the subject of some people taking her to task. But I don't know if that's entirely fair. I would always say that it's absolutely not fair. But I think the framework that she comes at this which through is very interesting. Because AOC, she said it in there. She's not talking about a list of a wants and needs and an abstract. Yeah, Drake. She's not talking about an abstract

who do I like more. Right. Or who am I mad at? What she said was very functional. She said is who in the worst case scenario is even the best opponent. Like who can you organize under?

What can you do based upon whose leadership and who affects the country the most? She wasn't talking about how she felt Joe Biden was doing as a president, how she felt Joe Biden was handling geopolitical turmoil that we have going on. She was talking about the opportunity for things to get better.

And who provides you a better opportunity for things to get better? And for her, that is a very concrete structure. It's very functional. There's a lot of functionality to it because she actually has to work to get things done. She's an organizer. She's a lawmaker. So for her, it's who provides an easier path for me to do the things that I need to do to make the change that I think needs to be made? And she seems to think that that's clearly Joe Biden.

The average American, I don't think, looks at politics that way. No. And I wonder if that's the way that we should look at politics a little bit more. Well, at least in this election. No, in any election. In any election, should you think? think, in my opinion, in any election, should it be, well, okay, I might like this guy, I might like this guy, I might like this lady, I might like this lady.

Who is a bigger roadblock to me getting the America that I want? And when you think about Donald Trump, think about whether or not you're going to feel empowered in an America where your reproductive rights will be on the chopping block, probably the final death blow to those if he's willing to go through with the federal abortion ban or if him and his party can continue to complete 180 that they've done in some places on this issue people like Kerry Lake. If things will get worse with Donald Trump, if then Yahoo will have more of a shield around him or arm around him, if some of the things that the Republicans want to do in terms of voting rights in terms of just all of this stuff, if it'll be easier to get those things done or easier

to affect those things under one guy or the other guy. And not just at the federal level. Think about how it's for everybody to think about. Think about how Donald Trump and his influence on America emboldens and affects the surrogates that he has under him, not just the political surrogates. but the ideological surrogates and the cultural surrogates that then tighten their grip on what they feel like is their country. It's funny. We're going to talk about this a little bit later.

But there's one group of people in America that believe, with 55 percent of them believe, according to polling, that the Confederate flag isn't a symbol of hate. There's one group, one section of the country. That is white non-college educated voters. They believe that the Confederate flag is not a symbol of hate. There's also the same group that goes for Donald Trump the most. The overlap there, I heard that stat when I was looking up the research for a another topic that we have coming up.

But when you think about that, those are the people. I'm not making a specific observation about college or whatever. What I'm saying is those are the people that have their guy. And they didn't get to make the country the way they see fit.

And that's a question that everyone has to ask if you're really ready to cede the country to those people. So I thought what she said was It actually reorganized my feelings on things a little bit Yeah, for sure, for sure Yeah, because you've been anti-Biden That's not true.

I haven't been anti-Biden See, this is the games that people play I'm gonna go Stephen A. Smith on your ass one of these days, man. Well, I like Stephen A. Smith. Yeah, but like the way he'd be getting that people. It's part of his charm. I'm gonna do that to you. Okay, Tate Reeves proclaims Confederate Heritage Month

in Mississippi, April 24, Confederate Heritage Month, 31-year-old tradition that started in 1993. In Mississippi, Lord, Mississippi, the governor has proclaimed April Confederate Heritage Month, and next Saturday, if you're not busy, April 27th, specifically was proclaimed Confederate Memorial Day. The proclamation was shared by the Facebook page of the state landmark,

the Jefferson Davis Home and Presidential Library, Check out the caption here. They invite you to come celebrate with us. Celebrate with you. Your thoughts on this, Rachel? I didn't even know this existed, did you? I celebrated it every year. Well, our states are two of the states that have celebrated it,

even though post-2020, it seems like most states don't. But Mississippi is still going strong. Seems they do it every year. I did not know April was Confederate History Month. Our birthday month. Our birthday month. And then I started looking. at it. And I'm like, when did this start? You already said it, 1993. And I'm like, who was

pushing this? Obviously, we know it was somebody white. I could have assumed it was a white male or group of white males. And then I saw it was the sons of Confederate veterans. And then I started looking up. Which I could begin, by the way. Why don't you? I was talking to somebody about it. Did you look up membership? Like, I was talking to someone. and we should go do it just to fuck their shit up. Because you have to be a man. You have to be a man and you have to be the descendant of a Confederate officer. Because there's a woman group.

It's like United Daughters. Yeah, something like that. And then I saw that the Southern Poverty Law Center said that, because the group is like trying to water down what it all means, right? It's like, oh, it's not about slavery. It's about unity. and, you know, whatever else that is that they say. But they said that a significant membership overlap with the SCV is with the League of the South.

And that organization defends slavery. And claims that the federal... Oh, wait, I'm not even going to read all of that. But it defends slavery. It's a racist group, right? It's a racist group. So, which we could already probably assume, right? The people who are behind this obviously are trying to pretend.

And that Heritage Month is really about honoring the South, preserving the South, honoring those who fought, you know, for this country. But they don't really want to talk about the reasons that they fought for this country. None of this is really shocking to me. I think it was shocking that there was a month. But when I saw that it's Mississippi, that it's doing it, I'm like, such are things in Mississippi. Yeah. Let's take a little dive into it.

Just a little bit. I won't get too much of the stench on this. Let's dive into it a little bit. I'm going to read something real quick. It excites you. You're trying to join the group. Shut up. This is from Alexander H. Stevens.

This is a cornerstone speech. It's March 21st, 1861 in Savannah, Georgia. I'm going to try to be quick in reading this speech. I'm going to read the whole thing. What year? 1861. Okay. It's the vice president of the conspiracy at this point.

We are passing through one of the greatest revolutions in the annals of the world. Seven states have within the last three months thrown off an old government and formed anew. This revolution has been signally marked up to this time by the fact of its having been accomplished

without the loss of a single drop of blood. It's proud of that. This new constitution or form of government constitutes the subject to which your attention will be partly invited. In reference to it, I make this first general remark. This first general remark,

Cornerstone. It aptly secures our ancient rights, franchises, and liberties. All the great principles of Magna Carta are retained in it. No citizen is deprived of life, liberty, or property, but by the judgment of his peers under the laws of the land. The great principle of religious liberty, which was the honor and pride of the old constitution,

is still maintained and secure. All the essentials of the old Constitution, which have endeared it to the hearts of the American people, have been preserved and perpetuated. Some changes have been made. They form great improvements upon the old Constitution. The subject of internal improvements under the power of Congress to regulate commerce is to put at rest under our system. The power claimed by construction under the old Constitution was at least a doubtful one. It rested solely upon construction. The true principle is to subject the commerce of every locality

to whatever burdens may be necessary to facilitate it. If Charleston Harbor needs improvement, let the commerce of Charleston bear the burden. If the mouth of the Savannah River has to be cleared out, let the sea-going navigation, which is benefited by bear the burden. Not that bad, right? Sure.

It's okay. All right. The new Constitution has put at rest forever. All the agitating questions relating to our particular institution. African slavery, as it exists among us, the proper status of the Negro in our form of civilization. This was the immediate cause of the late rupture. and present revolution. Jefferson, in his forecast, had anticipated this

as the rock upon which the old union would split. He was right. What was conjecture with him is now realized fact, but whether he fully comprehended the great truth upon which that rock stood and stands may be doubted. The prevailing ideas entertained by him and most of the leading statesmen at the time of the formation of the old Constitution were that the enslavement of the African was in violation of the laws of nature,

that it was wrong in principle, socially, morally, and politically. It was an evil they knew not well how to deal with, but the general opinion of men of that day was that somehow or other, in the order of Providence, the institution would be evanescent and pass away. This idea, although not incorporated into the Constitution, was the prevailing idea at that time. The Constitution, it is true, secured every essential guarantee to the institution while it should last, and hence no argument can be justly urged against the constitutional guarantees, thus secured, because of the common sentiment of the day. Those ideas, however, were fundamentally wrong. They rested upon the assumption of the equality of races.

This was an error. It was a sandy foundation, and the government built upon it fell when the storm came and the wind blew. Our new government is founded upon the exact opposite idea, or should I say exactly the opposite idea? I'll say that again. Our new government is founded upon exactly the opposite idea. Its foundations are laid. its cornerstone rests upon the great truth that the Negro is not equal to the white man, that slavery, subordination to the superior race is his natural and normal condition.

This, our new government, is the first in the history of the world to be based, based upon this great physical, philosophical, and moral truth. Now, I read that entire thing for two reasons. The first reason was so that you can see the way the set up to that, the cornerstone speech, as it's historically known, was to affirm Stephen's idea of freedom when he thinks freedom to be.

And he qualifies that he thinks freedom is the freedom that's outlined for free people in the Constitution and that they are maintaining that constitutional freedom. That they are saying, hey, we don't have any differences

in what we think freedom is. Freedom was set about, set aside. in the Constitution, a Magna Carta, a whatever, series of laws or whatever, same. What we differ is that in his opinion,

the slavers that framed the country were begrudging slavers. That they in some way were hypocrites because they believed that

slavery was morally reprehensible Jefferson was a student of the Enlightenment. So the formation of his intellectual philosophy, his societal philosophy, was based in abolition because that's what the Enlightenment really talked about. Not specifically, but that was part of Enlightenment thinking. But Jefferson was a capitalist like any other capitalist, and so slavery was part of his birthright,

and he took his birthright, whatever. But he says we're different. The basis of the society that we want to build, the way that we see the world, the way that we look at the world, is based upon the fact that black people are inferior to white people and therefore should be in slavery and perpetuity. And that the framers of the founders, whatever you want to call them, of America, at some point knew, that slavery couldn't last forever because it was at cross purposes with the things that they wrote in their document.

This is not to absolve them, but it's to say that this is what he believed. And we don't believe that. It's what it's built on. Now, I'll encourage everyone, as we don't have the time here, to go into it, to investigate and read up for yourself

on a lost cause ideology. What that essentially is, is a way of thinking that lionizes the South that came after the war was over and reimagines the Southern cause

as one of states rights, bravery, nobility in a lot of cases. And reimagines those men as not insurrectionists, not slavers, but as heroes.

This is a school of thought that, was widely, widely propagated and accepted in the early 1900s, and that gained a shit ton of steam with the release of the movie Birth of a Nation in 1915, where the Confederate battle flag was then probably displayed because that flag that gets flown, I'm sure everybody knows, is not the flag of the Confederacy. It's like the fourth or fifth flag, and it was never the official official flag of the Confederacy. It's the flag of a regiment in Virginia

or something like that. But the flag itself became something to rally around for Southern sympathizers and Dixiecrats to be to rebel against civil rights.

I say all that to say this. A lot of times we tell this huge lie. Sure. And the lie is that there are things that we just have, things that we just look at in different ways. We just look at things in different ways.

Heritage and not hate is something that you would hear growing up in the South. Heritage is not hate. Southern heritage, not hate. It's not hate. It's that gone with the wind and all these other things told us about this southern way of life, this way of life that we're trying to preserve and that that heritage is what's important to us and that doesn't have any to do with hating anyone.

And that's a school of thought. That's a way to look at things. Another way to look at things is to say that the flag represents hatred, that there are two different ways to look at it. That's a lie. It's a historical. And I'm not saying that based upon my opinion. Sure.

is a fact that that that is a historical. That flag, its prominence, and its place in American culture, has a distinct beginning that is unassailable. It has a distinct beginning. And that beginning is very, very direct. what Stevens is talking about in the Cornerstone speech, it's not some nebulous, amorphous idea.

This is how we view things. This is what we want in our society. They get their asses kicked. For a little while after they get their asses kicked, things start to change. There are the seven mystic years in which there was actually a time, a chance for a racial reckoning where people are like

what's going to happen to black people now when by the wayside things quiet down 1915 comes birth of a nation comes other people start to come the Ku Klux Klan

regains its strength they begin flying the Confederate battle flag which now is a symbol of white terrorism right the Confederate way of life confederacy

the Confederacy is a symbol of perpetual bondage and enslavement to black people. There is no other side to the argument. I implore people to get rid of the yoke of toxic both-sizes. There is no other side.

If you have a Confederate flag, if you attend Confederate flag, Memorial Month. If you go there, you are a racist. You are celebrating something that in its intent,

in its intent is the rape, bondage, and torture of black people. No way around it. And when we talk about the Republicans, when we talk about who they are as a party and what they represent as a party

and what they are as a party, I got to be honest with you. This is them. The modern Republican Party has to coddle and bring these people into their tent because these are the people

that make up their base. The Republican governor of Mississippi devoted a whole month to celebrating the perpetual and everlasting bondage of black people.

As stated by the architects of the Confederacy. That is the truth. There's no other version of the truth. There's no other way that you can say it. There's no difference of opinion. There's nothing. History and fact,

to note that there was a purposeful myth that was told about the South in order to affect the lives of black people and to change the perception of the South in the psyche and cultural reality. of America. It's lost cause ideology, lost cause myth. Look it up. There's plenty of good stuff on it.

All of this is real. So when you see someone saying we want to have Confederate History Month, it is exactly the same as Hitler Month. There's no difference. It's exactly the same as Hitler

month. There's literally no difference. It comes from a philosophy of superiority of white people. It comes from a philosophy of the mongrelization of an entire race of people. It's the same thing. And I'm sorry to say it to a bunch of Americans, but those people are your great, great, great, great grandparents.

Those people, unfortunately, are my great, great, great grandparents. That's what we're dealing with. So having a whole month for that is not a small thing. No, it's not. If you understand the stakes and the intellectual reality of it, having a whole month of that is a disgusting, deeply, deeply, deeply, deeply, disrespectful, vile, and racist thing to have.

It's interesting when you talk about the way we look at it in a different way, because not that I want to talk about this topic, but Taylor Swift made news, because she talks about... T. Swifty. In her song, I hated here, she talks about picking a decade. There's a lyric in there, right?

Remember, a lot of people say she's the voice of our generation. She's one of the greatest poets. There's a line in there where she talks about how her friends go back and pick they play this game where they pick decades that they want to go back to. She picks the 1830s.

But she says, I want to do the 1830s without the racist and without women being sold off to the highest bidder. And it upset a lot of people, and rightfully so. The rest of the lyrics in her song, in that song, talk about how the problem with playing this game, and I'm generalizing here, or the problem about going back and saying,

I wish things were back like this, or I want to go back to this time, is that we romanticize nostalgia. And that's the point of the whole song. And so, you know, like, yeah, it was a stupid line. She definitely could have done it better. But the point is that we romanticize these things. And that ties into exactly what you're saying about the people who want to fly the flag

or who want to do these reenactments of the Civil War or want to honor a time that existed in our history. But they want to cut out the reality of the situation and what was really going on and what it really meant. And instead they want to focus on, they want to pick apart something that they find that was great. or they want to water it down and say, oh, it really wasn't that bad, this isn't what it is. Oh, we stand for this. It's really about unity.

It's really about honoring those who we lost that are a part of our heritage. But the reality is, no, it wasn't. For all the reasons, as you just said, it was a terrible time, as was the 1830s in general, by the way. But we do that. We do that with everything.

At the shit in the hole. Like, can I say something now? Yeah. I mean, some people do it with everything, but let me give you a small pushback. Please. We don't do with everything. Do we romanticize 9-11?

No, no, no. The point is not an event. We don't romanticize an event. We might romanticize the early 2000s. Do we romanticize Nazi Germany? It's not, I'm, the point in the song is not events. The point is time period. I'm talking about a time period, Nazi Germany.

I'm talking about 1930-5-3 to 1940. But people might say, oh, in the 1940s, this. happens. That's my point. I know, but understand what I'm saying, and it's not to be argumentative, even though it is a podcast. You're totally being argumentative, but,

but no, but I'm pointing, but look, but let me tell you why. And maybe I am, but let me tell you why. Because there are certain periods in time that I'm telling you they're not going to romanticize. Like, they're not, they might,

there are certain things that are that the world looks at, they're pointing you like this before I fall all over my words. History is a decision. People think that history is a set of facts that you look back on.

History is a decision. It's a decision. It's a decision. It's a decision. It's a decision that you make. It's a decision that you make intellectually, and it's a decision that you make emotionally. And there was a decision made when you talk about the Holocaust or you talk about Nazi Germany. There was a decision made

and that decision involved a lot of people. The decision was, hey, this was an incredibly disgusting and putre time. The people that perpetrated this are the lowest of the lowest scum. For two reasons.

The first reason, first reason being the Holocaust and the people that were drug into concentration camps, 12 million people. Yeah. And killed and maimed and experimented on and starved, tortured, right? The second reason being that Hitler started a war and that war killed 3% of the world's population. They fundamentally changed the world, right?

So these people are crazy. They're bad. It's almost like they're aliens. They swooped in for a while. We had to purge them, destroy them. You can't even own Nazi paraphernalia in a lot of places. And when you, it's illegal. And when people see that you have, like think about it right now if you walked into somebody's house right now.

And they had an Iron Cross or a swat. Or a Hitler youth knife or something like that, you would immediately turn around and leave. Sure. But think about the homes that you've been around in the South, where people might have had Rebel flags or might have had, it's not the same way. The reason why it's not the same way is because a different choice was made.

Like a different choice was made. There was a, there's a, we shouldn't romanticize anything. I don't know. There's certainly things we shouldn't romanticize. But I'm telling you, when it comes down to the Confederates and this particular part of American history, a very specific choice was made. The first choice was to let it go.

Okay, we need them to come back into the union, right? We need the economics from the South. I mean, slavery's gone, but it's still a lot of land. We still have to repair the union. So the first choice was to let it go. And then there was a second choice made. The second choice was to romanticize it. There was a cultural choice.

In the movie The Searchers, probably the great- My mom loves that movie. Do you know John Wayne's character? In The Searchers, John Wayne's character is an ex-Confederate soldier. He's the hero of the movie. So like what I'm saying is there was a cultural choice made. Just as there was a cultural choice made. Just as there was a cultural choice not to look at the slaughter of Native Americans as one of the greatest crimes of humanity ever.

There was a choice made to romanticize that period as a period of great American frontier life, of great American discovery, of American expansion, of American exceptionalism, and to look. look at the people that were fighting against an invading, invading savage group of people as the actual savages. That was a choice that was made. So when we romanticize that, we play cowboys and Indians. Cowboys shoot Indians dead. And culturally and politically and all of those things. So I'm saying it's like, look, there are things to be romanticized.

I mean, sometimes you romanticize shit. Like I'm going to look back at my time at McKinley High, and I'm going to feel like it was the best time on my life. Four years at McKinley High, LaSanta Jones, greatest cheerleader of all time at McKinley High, Ryan's wife, you met her, okay? I'm going to romanticize that. It's a decision.

It's a choice, right? If I had been getting my ass kicked and sexually assaulted every single day of my high school life at McKinley High, romanticizing that time, would be a choice. And so all I'm saying with this, and maybe we've spent too long on this,

all I'm saying with this is, we sometimes act like these things are more complicated than they are. Agreed. Like, it's all right there. Just be responsible for what it is as you don't know. Just take, fucking, literally,

take 30 minutes. Let me give you guys three things. Three things for homework. Read up on... Lost cause. Lost cause. Ideology. Read up on the origins.

I'm sure our audience is well versed. Read up on the origins of the Confederate battle flag, the one that you say is the Confederate flag. That's not the Confederate flag. Read up on when different state houses actually put that flag on their state houses, right? Read up on all of that. Just literally take an hour and just know that this is deeply, deeply, deeply, deeply problematic and offenses to black people.

And it propagates the myth of eternal servitude of black Americans. So it's not a small thing to have a Confederate, to have a Confederate Heritage Month. It's a big, big, big, fuck you. What's the third thing? What else else? I said three things. You said three. But maybe two and three were together.

Maybe two and three were together. I don't know. You have to use a bathroom? I do. me wiggily? Yeah, I've been tapping his foot for a while. You're such a human. You are the hungriest, bathroom-iest.

You're such a human. You got up and used the bathroom earlier. That's not what I did. Okay, well, you got us. I'm human because I have to blow my nose all the time. All right. All right, we got to go. We've spent too much time on this.

This was a very serious show. We didn't get a chance to even have any fun. I would like to take the time to thank Kalika and Rachel and just say real quick. Like, you guys had no idea how much I needed to see my boys. Kalika did. Kalika, like Willemouse. I had no idea how much I needed to see my boys. And it was one of the single most amazing things anyone's ever done for me.

You have the best partner in life. And I just hope you always know that. She knew what you needed. And she brought it to you. I played a small role. I say, yes, they can come. That was all her, that is all her idea. I heard some other stuff about that, too.

That was all her idea. I heard you were fighting it. No, oh my God, that is not true. I heard you were fighting it. Your guys coming? Oh, and they're beautiful wives? No, I did not. I heard you were against you.

That's a lie. Anyways, I called her after the last podcast and told her how concerned I was about you. And I said, Kalika, I'm so glad we have this surprise coming because he needs it and you knew it before, you know, anybody else. So anyways, yes, it's all Kalika. All right. Take the thing caps off. Do not stop learning. I'm Van Latent Jr.

I'm Rachel and Lindsay. Bye, guys.