Higher Learning with Van Lathan and Rachel Lindsay - Da Baby Wants to Be Da Bad Guy, Plus Olympic Patriotism 

Episode Date: July 27, 2021

Van Lathan and Rachel Lindsay react to Da Baby’s recent comments during his Rolling Loud performance (13:46) before discussing the most recent news about R. Kelly (30:04). Fortunately it’s not all gloom and doom—Van and Rachel follow up the darkness with some Olympic talk (38:14) and LeVar Burton’s ‘Jeopardy!’ hosting this week (47:47). Hosts: Van Lathan and Rachel Lindsay Producers: Trudy Joseph and Donnie Beacham Learn more about your ad choices. Visit podcastchoices.com/adchoices

Yo, yo, yo, thought warriors. What is up? Higher learning is on. It is I, Van Lathen. And it's me, Rachel Lentie. Rachel, I'm super excited right now. Are you? What's up?

Why are you so excited? You don't sound this. Well, because I'm excited, but I'm also focused. Okay. It's a focused excitement because tomorrow something happens that I've been waiting for for a while now. Oh my gosh. I'm excited for you.

Wait. Can we do a guessing game? Can you give me a multiple choice option? Sure. Multiple. No, well, no, I don't want to give you multiple choice, but you can guess. Okay. July 26th. You got a new show.

No. A new car. No. I would never do that. I just took my- Eventually you're going to have to. I just took my baby. I just took my baby to the doctor today.

Get her right. 2010, a Honda Cor Corr cross tour. We ride into the wheels fall off. How many miles are on it? I think like 160,000. That's 2010? That's not that bad.

Yeah, 160,000. Okay. Yeah. Last one. Last one. Let's do it. I don't know. I don't, go ahead. I don't know.

Tomorrow is the day I start my journey to become a pilot. because Microsoft I don't like this Microsoft Flight simulator is coming out for the Xbox and I ordered it a long time ago and I ordered my own little throttle system I got my own

little my instruments I ordered my instruments and so I ordered even a stand I ordered a stand I literally ordered like a cockpit from my living room like a stand to put my throttle on and to put my like pilot stick on and it's coming out tomorrow. Microsoft Hotlight Simulator. I'm going to start off on the small crass.

I'm going to work my way up to taking trips around the world and a 737 baby or maybe an airbus baby. It starts tomorrow and I could not be more excited. I'm like a little baby. I'm like a little toddler, a little infant flying baby with a bib. and I'm going to have some applesauce. I'm fly all over the world. That's me. Let me tell you why I'm looking at you like this.

I'm mad at you. Why did you even let me guess? You knew there was no way that I was going to guess that. Why did you waste our time and our listeners time? But what if you would have? Cut that. What if you would have? You would have been shocked if I knew that that was dropping tomorrow.

Are you mean telling me tomorrow's the day that Microsoft Flight Simulator X comes out on the Xbox X. I'm like, Jesus Christ, Rachel, what the thing? the fuck. Then I got concerned. I'm like, you do not need to be out here flying planes. But then when you told me it was game, I'm like, okay, now everything is back to normal. No, I don't want to fly a plane in reality, man. As a matter of fact, like,

I see all these videos of people fighting on the plane. If somebody fought on your plane that you were on, wouldn't you be scared? Yes. Yeah, right? I put it in. I wouldn't need to see what's happening. Yeah. I couldn't continue to fly the plane and hear all of that. Can't they, if they're fighting, can't they tip the plane over or something with all that movement?

That's a no. They can't? That would be a no. You don't know that. That's not what came to my mind. It's a plane. Soul plane is hilarious. I know.

To a point, right? And then it gets serious. That was the first time I saw Kevin Hart. Like 2004. That was the first time I ever saw Kevin Hart. Kevin Hart. I don't know if it is. He was the lead in Soulplane.

They had been trying to make Kevin Hart a thing. And now Kevin Hart didn't know if I had seen him before, but I've definitely seen SoulPlay. Kevin Hart, baby. Kevin fucking Hart. How was your week? You know, I worked. I went to Disneyland. Are you a big Disney fan?

Absolutely, of course. I went to the premiere of Jungle Cruise. Yeah, don't have high hopes for that one, though. I mean, it's good. You like it. I mean, the Rock is good. The Rock and Emily Blunt together are fantastic. Whoever thoughts have put them together as a duo, that was great.

They work well together. It's a cute movie. It was fun though because they had like all the pomp and circumstances of everything, right? It was right in front of like the exhibit. Mickey and Minnie were there dressed in safari clothes. You had all the workers dressed like they were on the jungle cruise as well. It was cute. So I appreciated that.

And it was, you know, red carpets are always fun. And the movie was cool. Yeah, I didn't stay for the premiere. You know, I saw the screener. Some of it. Some of it, a little bit of it, enough to know the open credits. When you, listen, when I was out there for almost, it's like a seven-hour thing. So you don't want to stay and watch the movie because you got to drive out to Anaheim.

You got to hop on the bus. Had to take a COVID test on site. Then you're waiting for the stars to arrive. They never get there on time. Everybody comes at once. You know these red carpets are. I haven't told the story of Disneyland and my dad on this podcast. I never told that?

Yes. I did. Actually, you did. Splash Mountain. Disney World. No, it was Disneyland. It was a land. Okay.

It was, yeah. Splash. my mind as well. Yeah, the Splash Mountain store. Yeah. So that's the first time I went there. I tried to go ride Splash Mountain by myself. This nigga did not appreciate it.

He was very upset. Anyway, love you, dad. But, but, no. So did you get to experience the park at all? No, it was all about business. I had to be there on the carpet at a certain amount of time. I didn't get to. If I had thought about it, I would have planned it better.

But I didn't. But you're there for work. Like, plus you probably had a, a, a ball gown on, what you're going to go ride on a small world with like a gown and all your makeup and a full face of makeup? No, no. We don't go all dressed. When you're like reporting

and as a matter of fact, I even forgot my heels, so I was in like some flats. When you're reporting, you're not thinking about being all glamorous in these ball gowns. It's like you got a job to do. You're trying to get the bites. You're trying to make headlines and then bounce and get them to talk to you. Trying to get the bites. Can I tell you? I felt very special

because Tiffany Haddish walked the carpet and she would not do interviews unless she knew you as a reporter. She stopped by old extra. Tiff had. Good people. Tiff had. Good old Tiff had. And did you feel the magic when you were inside the Disneyland?

I did. Now, I'm one of those people who drinks the Kool-Aid, say that for a future episode. I feel the magic as soon as I can hear the music, I step into the park, or I see the first dressed up Disney character. I love it. I love looking at children's faces. I love to see them running around. I like to see them holding their candy, their popcorn. I just buy into it immediately.

I probably got that for like five seconds. And then I was like, okay, I got to go work. I want to do right now, I want to do my extra drop. Like if I was working with extra covering jungle crews. Hi, it's Van Lathen coming to you from Disneyland in Anaheim. I am here super excited to let you guys see first look images at the premiere of Jungle Cruise. Everyone is here. Of course, The Rock is here.

Of course, Emily Blunt is here. Let's go over to where everything's happening. Give you guys a sneak peek of the stuff. First of all that was so good. Let's cut that clip. Say that to Extra. You can do the next premiere. I'm laughing because people always say there's three different

Rachel's. And when I just watched you do that, I realize how different I am on a red carpet extra than when I'm here. Right. Because you know damn well you're not that excited about that shit. You don't care. Like, hi, we are so awesome.

We're going to get you guys over here. It's going to be amazing. We're going to see fucking saw two. You know, like we don't care. But you have to make it. When you're delivering, you got to do it. You got to do it. Like, when you say that The Rock and Emily Blunt have chemistry in this movie,

is it like sexual chemistry? Like, do they? That's not where I was even going. They have good banter. She's very witty. And he's more, I wouldn't call him witty, but more like sarcastic dry humor. Right. And so they play well off of each other.

And even on the red carpet, it was like they were still in sync, like straight off the screen onto the red carpet, still doing. still doing their bit together. Right. So it was good. And you, did you ride the Jungle Cruise while you were there? You didn't ride it? So let me tell you something about that.

Midway through my interviews, my cameraman goes, you know the Jungle Cruise is not a roller coaster, right? No. It's a boat. So as I was interviewing people, I was like, have you been on the Jungle Cruise ride, the Jungle Cruise roller coaster? And, man, the thing is, people were like,

Yeah, I've ridden it several times. No. Right back, just both of us just loud and wrong with one another. Oh, yeah, yeah, yeah, I've been on it a couple of times. I've read several people asking that. And then my carrie man was like, you got to stop saying that. There is no roller coaster. It's a roller coaster.

It's a boat ride. It's a boat ride. It goes around with some questionable shit that they show you do. Some Africans and bones in their noses and shit. I think they got rid of it now. But it's some questionable shit. But look, it was a long time ago. Plus Walt Disney was a Nazi.

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See terms at fanduil.com slash predict slash bonus dash offer dash terms. I will say this. So there are three rides at Disney World at Disneyland that you ride when you pop edible and it makes the ride amazing. And those would be. Obviously it's a small world. Okay. You just, it's a small world is a pretty useless thing.

But if you give yourself not like a fool because you don't want to freak out on it's a small world because it's like really weird. But if you give yourself like a little bit of an edible and you get on Isle Small World, that's the most hilarious shit ever. You'll have a great time. Two is the jungle cruise. You're like, because it's a very slow ride. It goes through the guys are telling all of these like super corny jokes.

Give yourself a little bit of an edible. But the best one, you take a full one for this one, is the Pirates of the Caribbean. Because I have to ride the Pirates of the Caribbean when I go to Disneyland. I have to. When I say it's a nothing ride, you're cruising around in the water, going through places there's maybe one little bitty drop. But then there's a part where the people are eating over at the Blue Bayou little restaurant and you cruise past them.

And like when me and my friends are in there, we get super aggressive with them. Yo, we're pirates motherfuckers. Like you go nuts. And you try to see the game is to try to see how many people you can make turn around while they're eating over there. Have you been on Pirates of the Caribbean before? Okay, I've been at Disneyland once. Disneyland, yeah, that's where it is.

And I didn't ride all the rides. I only remember riding cars. I don't remember riding that. Cars is another one. Cars are so fucking fun. I know because that's what we were on. And I do remember that for cars, but I don't remember the other ones. Yeah, cars was fun.

Cars that cars talk to, they look like the real cartoons. I know. Great job. They got to drink her great job with that shit That shit was freaking me out when I first saw it I was like yo man Like this nigga They made the cartoons come to life

Man I don't know if I'm fucking with this But I gotta get back to Disneyland Well that's great Look Did you miss being in Miami For this past week weekend Because rolling loud was down there You know what

I did when I heard about it I was like man rolling loud was this week And then I saw the crowd And I was like Nah I'm good Yeah Rolling Loud. There's a lot of people there.

So a lot of stuff happened to Rolling Loud. There was a Coilet had like a performance that people were talking about. You know, they didn't, Meg the Stallion was there. Why are people so mean to her? They are very mean to her, but I think it's going to be good for her. I think the fact that people are mean to Coiletet is going to be good for her in a long term. Why? I'm telling you, I interviewed her on a red carpet and she could not have been more sweet.

She was so excited to be there. She's young. She was happy. Just celebrating the moment. it was a first for her to be at that award show. I just don't understand why people have to be so rude to her. They pick on her for everything. They do.

But she builds up because she actually has talent. So that means that she'll be able to almost the same thing as what happened to Doja Cat. Like you build up your like stars need scabs. So you need to be able to kind of build up your resistance to everything that people are saying. But then when you keep coming out with the quality shit, and that's not to say she's like a lyrical master or anything like that. But she's got a sound. She's got a like a distinct sound So I think it'll be good for the overall development

Of her start See people don't believe this People don't remember a time When people were hating on Beyonce People don't remember that There was a time when people were hating on Beyonce There was a little More so people saying she couldn't dance

That's what I remember people saying They were hating on Beyonce They were saying I remember one time Beyonce was singing Amazing Grace and she was like You know I can tell this sort She's like yeah

Maybe y'all definitely not going to boo God But all of these things online People like Beyonce is a bitch and all of this stuff because she broke up Destiny's child. People were hated on for a second. Yeah, you're right. You're right.

The talent wins. But something else happened at Lurland Lyle. Our friend, the baby, um, the baby is desperate, desperate to be disliked. I know. And I've never,

and I like him so much. And he's really making it. The baby is desperate to be disliked. And I actually have a theory about this. A couple of things happened. Um, At first, the clips that were coming out from the baby's performance had more to do with the fact that he brought out Tori Lanes. It actually didn't surprise me that much because he did a song with Tori Lanes.

He and Meg and party all way already went back and forth over the Tori Lane thing. So I wasn't surprised at that. I just thought that that would take us through Monday as far as people talking shit about something. The next thing, though, that happened was a little bit more of the why, my G. like why the baby went on like a mini rant while he was performing his set and I'm not even going to repeat

all the stuff that he said I think it's necessary I'm just going to let you guys hear what it was the baby said you didn't show up the day with HIV AIDS any of them dead essential mass many diseases that'll make you die two three weeks put the cell on like a lady if you push the smell like water Put a cell phone like the hell.

Fellas. Lights up. Fellas, if you ain't sucking a dick in the parking lot, put your cell phone lights in the hell. Let's be real about this shit. Yeah, keep it fucking real. Some of that niggas suspect as a motherfucker. Let's be real. All right.

So obviously people got mad. Yeah. You know what to me? Like, I don't know what people think. I don't know what people expect. Obviously, many people from the LGBT community and not just them, but. I gotta get you to say this right because you've made this mistake.

What do I say? The what community? The LGBT. It's like you get lost in it and you're like the LGBT community and you just say LGBTQ plus. LGBTQ plus? Yeah, I just want to help you out real quick.

Do me a favor. Say it backwards. It's not necessary. I'm not. Hold on. No. Nope. Because I was like, can you say it backwards?

I bet I can. You can't say it forward. Well, well, maybe I'll make it back. say it back was easier. Let's see. Plus QTGBL. Boom, baby.

No. Okay. So obviously a lot of people from the LGBT plus Q community were upset about that, but not just them. Any allies and people who are aligned with wanting everybody to have, be able to do their own. shit was upset. They thought that what he said was, first of all, disparaging against people who have HIV and AIDS and who are living their lives with HIV and AIDS and of course,

also homophobic. Did you think those comments were? Absolutely they were. And I just, this is why I just get so, I really liked a baby. And I, and I don't want to have to put him on, like, blacklist him. But he keeps doing things that I find so offensive and that are hurting so many people and they and like not that it when you do something wrong it should make sense but it's like I'm trying to understand the why and it made even what he said it was like are you okay is something wrong with you what's what's going on and then he tried to defend what he said like blamed it on the internet blamed it on trolls blamed it on bitter people and it's like no you are at fault you cannot say people weren't at your show and misconstrued what you said

what you said what you said there's nothing confirmed. confusing about it. He said what he said. He was wrong about it. It was extremely offensive and it was coming off the hills of you offending women based off what you did with Megan. And I want to go back to what you said about Megan really quickly. It wasn't just that he brought Torrey Lanes out. It was when he brought him out. Cry Baby was still playing in the background when he brought that big old mascot, bobblehead mascot out there with Tori Lanes in it. So it's like Meg the Stallion's playing you're in her song and you're going to bring Tori Lanes out in the middle of her song. That's when he did it.

Then he cut the music and started talking about it. So DeBee knew exactly what he was doing. He intentionally put him out in that moment and played that song. He wanted people talking. He wanted people to say something. Yeah. And so he came back and he kind of did his best to, I guess, explain. Did he do his best?

I guess it's his best. I don't know. What the baby said is... It's like he was rambling, like he was still on stage. He was rambling, but these are the two things he said. Number one, he said that the baby fans that came there, they wouldn't have HIV and AIDS. So he wasn't talking about them.

I forgot about that part. Yeah, he said, he says, my fans ain't reckless. My fans don't just do anything. My fans ain't out there. They take care of their bodies. They take care of all of that. They wouldn't have HIV and AIDS. They just wouldn't do that.

Okay. So nobody, none of the people that are there that come toward the baby, that the baby fans would be so reckless and upset and not even upset, so reckless and careless and just irresponsible to go out and get HIV and AIDS, which automatically when you say that casts everyone in the world who has HIV or AIDS in that light, right? It wouldn't happen to your fans because your friends are too good for that. So everyone that's gotten this disease that we've been trying to learn to live with, for more than a generation now must have been irresponsible,

didn't care about their body. He said, none of my fans ain't junkies, because we also know that people that get HIV and AIDS share needles and they're like junkies in some cracked den somewhere or heroin den somewhere. We're literally going with 1986 stereotypes here, literally going for them,

literally going for these. Okay, and then the other thing that he said about the comments that he made about you know, you wouldn't, you wouldn't, you wouldn't, you wouldn't, you wouldn't, you wouldn't, you wouldn't suck dick. What did he say? What do you? Make sure. Let me make sure you get this right.

He said, also the thing he said about, you know, put your phone up if you're not like a, if, if you didn't give oral sex. He said, in the parking lot, yeah. Yeah, if you didn't give oral sex in the parking lot. And then as DJ said, and you just said, okay, some of y'all are suspect. Some of y'all is suspect. Some of y'all is suspect. He said that. And he said, in response to that, what he said was that, you know, his gay fans wouldn't do that.

His gay fans, you got to take them to a five-star hotel. They wouldn't do that in the parking lot. It's nothing where he's not talking about doing it in the parking lot as far as, you know, something wrong with doing it. He's saying his fans wouldn't do that. You got to go to a five-star hotel with them or you got to go to like their house to do it. Okay. So we've gotten to the baby and all of this stuff. You know what I think this is really about?

Number one, I think this is about. about obviously some of the stereotypes that go along with homophobia, you know, and some of the stereotypes and how ingrained it is. I also think that some brothers are just allergic to success. And the reason why I say that is because there was absolutely zero reason for the baby, someone who the culture has rooted for, someone who people have really gotten behind, especially prior to the Meg thing, right? Somebody that we've all loved.

I love the way to do raps. I love the way he carried himself. I loved everything. I think his disposition, he could be violent at times, but he also was a guy who came from a certain situation. But people get to this position and they don't want to be

successful in a way that means everybody gets to like them. They've been the villain their whole life. They've been the bad guy their whole life. And they don't think they're winning unless they're the bad guy. The baby

knows damn well what he said was wrong. He knows damn well what he said was wrong. He knows it's hurtful. He knows his harmful. He knows it's disgusting to say that about people who may or may not be sick. He knows

it's disgusting to say that about people who are out here trying to live their lives as free and unencumbered as they can. He knows one million billion percent. He said that to piss people off because he wants to be the villain. He wants to be the bad dude. He wants to be the one that's not quite safe because in his life, that's always been a way to ensure his survival. So what do you have to do to not be safe and not and not be taking to play with where the baby is from? You have to hurt somebody. You have to

hurt somebody to show somebody else that you are just like the guy, the scary one, the one you don't know. So he's intentionally hurting people, but it's just not going to end up the way he thinks he's going to end up now. So my question to you is, if that really is what he's doing, does it excuse it? Of course not. As a matter of fact, it makes it worse because at this point, you've transcended. The hardest thing to get people to understand, especially when they come from a deprived

circumstances, when they've transcended, when it's okay to learn and grow. That's the only thing. Because sometimes, to be honest with you, they might not feel it's okay to learn and grow. Even in the first couple of years where you still tie to the streets, where you still got to do whatever it is that you've got to do. But when is it okay for you to look at the world in a new way? When is it okay for you to bring more people into the tent? When is it okay for you to be like, hey, I thought this was the way, but it's really not.

And indict not only yourself, but the people that are around you and that make the, what is it okay to evolve? It's interesting that you say that because it's almost what I say when people used to talk about like athletes and how they have been treated a certain way and accustomed to a certain lifestyle. And they just keep elevating from a Pop Warner to junior high to high school to college and then to professional. And so they've never been held accountable or responsible necessarily for certain things that they do because they've gotten away with things for such a long time. You could say the same thing about that with the example that you give for DeBaby. If that's the case where this is the circumstances that you come from, this is all you've ever known. But yet you've been able to get that far coming from that. Why would you ever change?

You've gotten that you've gotten this far. You've made it this far despite what you've been through, despite your circumstances. you've gotten away with certain things. Why be any different? If anything, it makes your head even bigger that you're above it all. And you can continue on this path because you can get away with it. Because now you actually have the fame and the success and the money. It seems that way.

But if you really looked at the baby's life, he's changed a lot. He's dating different women than he ever dated before. He's staying in different places than he ever stayed before. So much about his life, his palate for life, his experiences, what he wants out of life. So many of those things are broadening, right? And the more successful a brother like that becomes, the more sort of out there a brother like that becomes,

the more the demands of the people that consume him are going to become foreign to him because he's going to touch people that he didn't think that he ever touched before. He's going to meet people that he never think, he meet before. And then the measure of who he really wants to be is how he's going to deal with the new information that he gets. And too often we do what's comfortable. Too often we go back and we say, hey, this is what I remember. This is the people we used to make fun of. These are the

people who were bad to us. Despite the fact that I'm out here and I'm seeing this very diverse crowd is rock with me. Everybody's out there with me. There's safety in being that old fucked up version of yourself. There's safety in it. And the ones that stay in that, that stay in that place, those are the ones that, excuse me, end up on loving hip hop. You know what I mean? The people who can't evolve and can't continue to grow, I love you, Mona. The people that can't evolve and can't continue to grow and can't do, like, this was on call for. It was a shot at an entire group of people.

It was a shot at a group of people, some of whom are sick. And it was something he just didn't have to do. and when I see somebody do something like that, what I'm always wondering is, what are you trying to prove and who are you trying to prove it to? Right. And so, like, I was disappointed. I was, I was, of course, legit disappointed

and even more so because I respect the young man and everything he's been able to do. So, you know, that's why in situations like this, as hard as parts of it, the community need to be on the baby is that's how hard they need to be because these discussions we've got to have talks about why the stuff

and look and tip Tip jumped off the roof you didn't see what Tia said tip jumped off the roof Trudy brought it to my attention and Tip said if the baby can say what he said if Will Nazez can do what he's doing

why can't the baby do what he's doing that you guys we're taking a dish and making it to algebra. The... Don't even give T.I. That credit. Like, what Little Naz-X is doing

is being him and put it out there in this art. What the baby just did was this an entire group of people. We can't... We can't make that logical. And this is not me

even getting on here wanting to shit on these brothers, but we got to be better than this. Well, somebody needs to say something to the TI. I'm so tired of it. There's a difference. When T.I. says something, it's as if what he is saying is so profound and he's above it and he's on another level and he's really just breaking down some stuff that everybody needs to take and listen to. That's the dumbest comparison I've ever heard in my life. That's so stupid. That's why I said don't compare it to algebra. It's, it's the dumb. It's not even math. It's comparing addition to not even math. It was it was the stupidest thing. And that's not foreign when T.I. makes these type of comments. He says,

It's just, I can't, I can't take it. I don't know what happened to TI. Did you get good grades in algebra? That shit was hard for me. That she was tough for me. It's a letter. Why would it be in the, why would, why, why we incorporate in letters? I would ask the teachers these problems.

I was very, actually really good at algebra. Not me. I'm like, why, why is it a letter? Well, the letter represents, well, nigger just put in what it represents. See, I wasn't, I was, tell me how to do it and I did it. I'm not going to question why there's an X, Y, Z and how that equals 16. I'm not even do that. I just figured I figured out.

No, I was questioning it because I didn't understand it. Like, like I didn't understand like what is an integer? I don't want to talk about it. I don't want to do it. That we don't use in. That we don't use for nothing, for nothing. Wasn't one class. Now, wasn't one class on how to claim a dependent, which actually gets you fucked up.

But whatever. Oh, look. interesting here. R. Kelly. Have you heard the R. Kelly news? When does it stop? I swear, we keep hearing stuff about R. Kelly. Yeah. So, something else just happened here with R. Kelly that I think we have to discuss

and it kind of stays with the whole theme of what we were just talking about with the baby. Now, obviously, R. Kelly has jumped off the good guy train a long, long time. ago. But something interesting happened here are Kelly is facing new accusations.

A court filing alleges that a 2006 incident when Kelly sexually abused a 17-year-old boy recruited him at the McDonald's which was a popular place for him to recruit children. He used to farm children.

I was about to say everybody knows that. Yeah. And then asked him what he was willing to do to make an amusement business. Apparently after this, he met that 17-year-old boy's friend and R. Kelly, according to these new allegations,

abuse both of them. All right. When this hit the internet, the reaction was completely different. Like, when this hit the internet, people, people were shocked in a brand new way. And the reason why people were shocked in a brand new way, in my opinion, by this R. Kelly News, is because, I think people hate gay people more than they love little black girls. Because because this was male on male, it was seen as something more untoward. It was seen as something nastier.

It was seen as something more evil. But when it was little black women getting picked up 14, 15, 15, 16, 17 years old at a McDonald's and getting taken advantage of and groomed by this guy there were a lot of people that were willing to make excuses for him Can I play devil's advocate for a second? Because I didn't see the uproar that was on social. I just more so read the article.

Do you think that yes, for a long time the community ignored the rumblings that we would hear about R. Kelly. And but once he was, you know, charged, once he got put in jail, once the documentary came out, people could no longer turn a blind eye to it. And people are really understanding the monster that he was and is. So now that you're additionally hearing that there, it wasn't just young girls, he was also praying on young men that it just is even more upsetting because it's like, where did it stop? there were no lines for him. The man is just a terror. Anybody young he was after and was terrorizing.

Could it be that? Or is it the fact that it was just men? See, I'm sure it could be that for some people, but I don't understand what the distinction is. I'm not making a distinction. It's just more like we ignored it. If it had been young boys back then, we still would have ignored it

because nobody wanted to believe that R. Kelly. No way. I do. They would have just been rumors. Yes, they would have. I really stand by that. No way. It's just been rumors.

No way. And this is interesting as we compare it to Michael Jackson. But I think if the evidence, if the- Come on, Van, you don't want to believe it. No, but look, I do think that there's a difference in the evidence here. I think there's a difference in evidence. And by the way, let's make something clear, even as it relates to Michael Jackson. That's a van problem.

Like, I don't have the same, a lot of the stuff that happens with Michael Jackson, I'm not going to argue for Michael Jackson's innocence, but I am going to say, that from an art standpoint, there's an emotional connection to the music that I can't divorce, right? I get that. So that doesn't have anything to do with whether or not

I think Michael Jackson was a great guy or not. So isn't it fair to say that people feel that same way about R. Kelly? Some do. And if you had heard that about little boys back then, people would be like, nah, not R. Kelly, not the way he's singing about these women and these songs. Perhaps there's a point that some people might have,

so what you're saying is some people might have that same emotional connection to R. Kelly than I do to Michael Jackson. and would not have believed any rumor. Except for the fact that there was a tape. So if there was a tape that came out in 2000 with R. Kelly and it was a young boy that he had been with, it's over. Nobody believe. When it was a young girl, people weren't taking into consideration.

They were like, that's not R. Kelly. That's his brother. Oh, that doesn't look back at him. That is the difference to me. Because it was a young girl. and people still in a way, and there's a lot of this, and we could have another conversation about this as well. There was a lot of older guys fucking with younger girls in the 80s and the 90s

that Jerry Seinfeld, when he was 39 years old, he had a 17-year-old girlfriend. Wow, did not know that. Shoshana, he had a 17-year-old girlfriend. I was illegal in the state of New York for him to have dated her, but right now if you were 39 with a 17-year-old girlfriend, Like you're going to get destroyed, even though Tiger a couple of years ago was overage and had a, like was 24, 25 had like a 17, 16 year old girlfriend and Kylie Jenner. So there are things that to people as fucked up as it was, I think there would have been an extra line for people had that been a young man or a young boy or a teenage boy that he was with.

And it would have had to do more with the fact that it was a teenage boy than the actual age of the person. And I still believe that there's some people that look at sex with a, the R. Kelly's sex with a 14 year old girl as sex and R. Kelly's sex with a 14 year old boy as molestation. And there's still, there's still a thing there because the reaction to this was, look how nasty this guy is. Well, look how nasty is it to pray on a 15, 16, even 17-year-old girl at a McDonald's for the purposes of having her come to your crib and having sex with her and then taping it and pissing on her? Yeah, no. I mean, I'm not denying that there are some people who have a problem with that, right?

Who have a problem that it was a young boy, just for the simple fact, it was a young boy more than it being a young girl. But I truly believe that if the tape back then had been a young boy, and I stand by this, I still think it would have been so hard for people to accept that that was R. Kelly, because he was that big of a star, not just in his own right, but the way that he was writing songs for people, he's collaborated with everybody.

He was so big. I just, I really believe that. And I think that a lot of people are so upset and even more disgusted is not because this is adding boys. Like, even when I read it, I wasn't shocked. This guy's a mom. He doesn't stop at anything. And I think that that's what it was with people.

It's like even more so. Even more. Now here he is after young boys as well. I'm telling you. The man has no boundaries. If a tape comes out in 2000 where R. Kelly pissing on a little boy, we is over.

You know why I also disagree with you on that is because it's not that people were like excusing the tape because they believed it was R. Kelly. People went as far as just saying that wasn't even him. That's what they were saying. saying that's what they would have done with the boy no way that's our Kelly if they did it with the girl they would have done it with the boy

see this is what this is if Jesus if this is what the different age brackets come in because we didn't dispute I was in college right you were what you you were in 2015 15 okay so yeah we like we didn't we didn't we didn't dispute that it was our Kelly

I don't know anyone that said that wasn't our Kelly behind closed doors everyone was like we know that's like that was our Kelly that was our Kelly but it was our Kelly but in public, people were like, I don't know. That looks like he could be his brother.

That could be, that's why he wasn't, that's why he wasn't convicted back then. Well, he wasn't convicted on something else. And they didn't testify. And she didn't, yes. Different stuff. Yeah. All right, let's take a break.

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The what is? The Olympics. I haven't been able to catch any of it. They haven't watched it. Like last night I tried to watch it was skateboarding and volleyball and I'm missing like track, you know, in gymnastics and swimming and all that. By the way, that's exactly what the athletes in Tokyo are hoping to be able to say. About what? I haven't been able to catch any of it.

That's what they're hoping. Shit. They're hoping that they're not able to catch any of it because it's out there. Delta, Delta, Delta, nigger. more athletes reported to catching it inside the village? Not yet, but it's there like a fucking silent assassin. Yeah. The ooop strain is running through the world and they try not to catch it.

Okay. So a couple of things going on there. USA basketball lost. They lost to France. Did you watch it? I did. Like here's the thing. I don't, I don't.

It's a weird thing. It's a weird thing. I'm not like a super patriot until the USA gets on the court or like until the Olympics come. I don't want to. The United States is like that fucked up sibling that you have. Like you want them to get right, but you don't want nobody else fucking over them. Right, right, right. You don't want, I don't, I still want to be.

B, well, yeah, yeah, we got institutional racism, nigger, but we can hoop, though. Fuck out of here. And it's, I don't know why. I keep telling myself, I'm not, since I'm not super patriotic, why does it hurt me when the USA loses, like in basketball? What's that like, why does it hurt me when they lose in basketball? I'm still like, damn, we lost to France. And I'm bringing up old shit.

I'm like, how we lost to France when we bailed them out of World War II? France, as soon as we step on the court, as soon as we step. step on the court, France ought to just lay down and be like, you know what, y'all got it. Because if not, the motherfuckers will be speaking German right now. As you would say, that's math and algebra. Trying to bring up the war. We did. We helped France out.

I know we did, but still. It's not the same. We're dinking on us after we storm the beaches to get them the shit. You should never dunk on us. They should not dunk. France should not have been allowed to dunk on the U.S. Anybody in the NBA playing on the France? Hell yeah.

Hell yeah. They got 48. Gobert. They got Rudy Gobert out there looking like a prime shack. You know what I'm like? It's just so weird. International play is different. The rules are different.

The pace of the game is different. The quarters are shorter. There's just a lot of things that the U.S. men are still adapting to. But it still sucks to watch them lose. Do you have like Olympic pride in the United States? I do. But more so I never really watch USA basketball. Track is more my thing that I like to watch.

And I do have a lot of pride. I do have a lot of pride when it comes to that. Because like, you know, in track, you know, we know that black people are still going to win. We run fast. It's not always the case. Sometimes the others win. Nigel, when we lost in track? Which race?

The 100, 200 shirt. I'm talking about the sprints. Come on. Let's be honest. Well, 400. Yeah, nobody cares. Nobody cares. Okay.

I'll be sure to tell. Sign your Richards Ross that the next time she comes on our podcast Sonia Richard Ross knows that nobody cares about the 400 She knows that is so everybody loves the quarter Come on okay so the quarter is a fun race to watch when you're already at track Like nobody is tuning in just to watch the 400 It depends who it is like I mean I mean yes everybody Obviously everyone wants to see the 100 meters

And so I'd say I'd say people are more and it goes 100 meters than the quarter, then the 200. I would definitely say people are more interested in the quarter. Yep, yep. That you might be right about. Because it's new faces, because sometimes a lot of the people who run the 100, run the 200, it's like, oh, we already saw you,

or 400 and 200. 100 meters, I know I'm right. I still don't know. I still don't know. I still think the 200 is, because look, the last- Michael Johnson. I was about to bring up Michael Johnson. Michael Johnson.

The last male 400 runner that we cared about was Michael Johnson. That's the last male forger running that we heard about. I think the others liked when Jeremy Warner won. I don't even know who that is. Well, he won the 400 and he's white. Is he from Britain? He's from Texas. He's from Texas?

He's from Texas. Oh, he's American? He's from Texas. He went to Baylor and he ran the 400 and he won. Good for him. My thing is I don't think, I don't think that people care. The 400 is not, but what I'm saying is, what I'm saying is, look, St. Richard Ross.

Go ahead and do your thing, girl. Do your thing, woman. He did your thing. gold medal. I don't have no gold medals. I don't have no gold medals. I could go grab something I do have, but no. Sonia Richards-Ross, yeah, I guess what I'm saying is we're going to win the sprints and I take in the Olympics, like I can't, I wasn't like super proud of

Usain Bolt because he was black. Like, he'd beaten Americans. I was like, I'm still, I still, I should have been. I should have been like, but it's just, also, that's not something to be proud of that a black man is the fastest man. And we, that's like, we're not proud of that. Why we're going to, that's not something to be proud of. We always do that. That's what we've been doing. You know, the question is, what would happen?

What was, what if a white man or woman, an American white man or woman, won the 100 meter dash. we as Americans still be proud of a white American dude who won the 100 meter dash. You think they would? We as black Americans. We as black Americans. Oh, my God. I think we'd be like, whoa, where'd this boy come from? Yeah, I think, I think we'll be okay.

Bro, if a white boy won the 100 meter dash. You're going to be mad? No, no, no. There's no doubt. You would be the biggest sports star in the world. Of course. Of course. Like if the white boy that wins the 100 meter dash is going to be the biggest sports star in the world.

I wonder when's the last time that happened, right? Has it happened? No. Do you know it was only like 10 years ago that a white dude ran under a 10 seconds? I mean, how far back are we going, right? Because pre-Jessey Owens, I'm pretty sure white folks will win in the 100 years. Oh, you're talking about period in the history. We're talking about the all white track days.

Pre-Jesse Owen. Let's look at this. What none of us winning. White 100-meter Olympic champions. All right, let's go. I know you don't have pictures, so you're just going to choose a name. This sounds about white. Okay.

Oh, guess what? Alan Wells. What year? 1980. Okay. Alan Wells was a British track and field sprinter who became... He was British. He was like he was the 100 meter champion in the 1980 fucking Olympics.

And I don't know if we went to the 1980 Olympics. Did the U.S. boycott the 1980 Olympics? Oh, that's a good... Yeah, no, it was in Moscow. We didn't go. It don't count. It was in Moscow. We didn't go.

It don't count. Yeah. Yeah. Sorry, Alan. Sorry, Alan. I'm looking at you right now. I'm looking at them right now. No, Alan's swollen as hell, though. Yeah, I'm looking at it right now.

That's funny. Yeah, it is. Hold on real quick. I'm reading an article right now that says, that talked about the fastest man in the world being white. This is this guy. Okay. So in 2010, La Maitree became the first white,

La Maitre became the first white European or American to run the 100 meters under 10 seconds in 2010. His 9.98 time was good, but far off Bolt's record. But apparently this guy. With a disclaimer. It was good, but. Hey, man. White people keep running. Y'all just keep, yeah, y'all keep running.

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or because of reading rainbow. Yep, it's roots. When I was five years old, I like to watch niggas get lynched. That was the favorite thing that I liked. When I was five years old, I would go to my mom. It came out before you were five. I said childhood, though.

But when I was five and six, I would go to my mom. I was like, mom, you know, I think I want to watch this Saturday morning. I think I want to watch Kuta can take his foot cut off And my mother would be like, yes, son Let's see what Toby's up to today on Roots No, of course it's it's reading Rainbow

By the way, I didn't even know that he was a When I was a kid, I knew him as LeVar Burton from Reading Rainbow So when I saw Roots, I was doubly fucked up Interesting, I only, I did not watch Reading Rainbow I knew him as Interesting, no, I watched, I watched, I watched Ruth and at first it was hard. I'm like, you know, who would want to fuck over him?

Like, he teaches you how to read books about butterflies and stuff. It's interesting. But he's, he's got his wish. He went on a, LeVar Burton went on a long campaign to get a chance to guest host Jeopardy. A lot of people feel like he is like really uniquely qualified for this job. He went on a long campaign for it. And guess what? Yo man got it.

And it's starting this week. LeVar Burton. Jeopardy, baby. We got another brother heating up the block doing Jet Pari, Les Gilles-Pardee, I know it well. Your thoughts about Lavarberg getting his dream. I got to be honest. I don't like it.

I'm happy that he's getting to be on the show. I don't like the way he went about it. I just, it's the sense of, he literally begged to be on the show. He's finally getting on. Let's be on. Aaron Rogers got on before he did. Now, it makes sense when you have like a Robin Roberts or maybe a Katie. People who are like who have experience and are hosts on TV,

they put Aaron Rogers before they had Lovar Burton, who is more qualified, I might add. This man created, I believe he created his own petition. Correct me if I'm wrong, but there is a petition out there to be the host. He's begged to do it. The executive producer said he hit him up shortly after Alex Trebek passed away. and said that he wanted to do this show. It's just a little too much. I don't like that the brother is begging for this position.

Just let your qualifications speak for themselves. Yeah, say, say, I want to do the, oh, no, no, you know how people are like. Who are you? Yes. I don't like the begging. Let your qualifications speak for yourself. I don't like the begging. I think I'm very bothered by the fact that he keeps begging.

It's one thing if people are like, hey, you know, LeVar Burton would be great. And he's like, you know what, I would love that position. That's not what he said. He's like, this is the only thing I want to host. I'm begging for it. I'm calling up people. I guess maybe if we didn't know who he was and he was really hustling to get his shine, it would make sense.

But he has been doing his thing since the 70s. And I just, there's something that it really is disturbing to me the way he is begging for this job. If he gets it, I'm going to be like, well, you should. I mean. Damn. You should. The way you don't beg for this position.

I don't know. He's deserving of it. But the way he's going about it just has me a little bothered. So he has a fantastic podcast called LeVar Burden Reads. Have you ever listened to it? He literally just goes on the podcast and reads short stories. It's amazing. It really is amazing.

I don't have any problem with it. Look, it's something that he wanted. He has a little clout. Let me ask you a question. Have you? used social media to call out a brand that did you wrong? That's not the same thing. Why?

You're on this math and algebra thing. Why? Why is that the same thing? Well, to answer your question, I don't believe I've called out a brand who's done me wrong. So you've never used social media like you go to the, you go to like, I think I might have been like, oh, my postmates sucked. Like postmates didn't come out today. Postmates sucked.

Did you? At postmates. Yeah. At postmates. Okay. So the question. is why are you doing that? The reality is Postmates has a customer service line.

No, it's the same thing, Rachel. You're using your celebrity. Rachel, I do it. We know how the game goes when you get the blue check. We know what the blue. I'm saying this isn't the same thing. It is. You're using your celebrity to get something to leverage who you are.

What was I trying to get? Tell me what I was trying to get, though. By venting that I was frustrated that my postmates canceled on me and I didn't get my food. What was I at? What was I trying to get? Trying to get your food. No, I wasn't.

My food is not going to come because I at Postmates. It was over and done with. Nor was I going to get Postmates canceled. Nor was I trying to get people to hate on Postmates. It says lift me saying, hey, I had a fantastic day to day. My favorite song came on the radio at, you know, at DaBaby. It's not. Instead, I said, I'm frustrated, you guys.

I'm hungry. I'm going to wait two hours with food at Postmates. did it to me again. Right. And you, you, you, you,

the reason why you mentioned Postmates in that is because you know that Postmates customer service is monitoring Twitter from any,

uh, mentions from verified people. Instagram, whatever. Instagram is worse. You got, you got nearly a million motherfuckers on there.

You know why you do that. And that's the same thing that LeVar Burden is doing for Jeopardy. No, it's not. He's using the fact that he is,

is Levar Burton and he's put the time in to give him a leg up. He's cutting to the front of the line and I love it. But that does not compare to what, to me vensing on social media. It does. It's like leaving a negative review. No, it's not. Yeah, but why would you mention post-based fit? Because I mention things that happen in my day.

Just like I give positive things. I vent about things that frustrate me. No, I'm not talking about why would you not mention them overall. Why would you actually use the mention feature, the app feature? on Postmates. Again, I do it for various things, positive and negative. Right. Now, do you want LeVar Ball to be successful? I don't want LeVar Ball to be successful on Jeopardy at all.

Can you imagine? Oh, God. Let him host, now that would be funny. Let Levar Ball. Let Levar Ball. Let Levar Ball host Jeopardy. That would be so fucking funny. It would be hilarious.

Funny. It would be hilarious. No, I do. Of course, I think it would be great for him if he gets it. Again, it's just the method that he's going about. It's a little too much. It's a little too much for me. Well, look, I hope he does well.

And I'm glad I got the chance to say that because I've been thinking of that for some time now. You have an axe to grind. You have an axe to grind. Ooh. Excuse me. That's something we haven't talked about. Speaking of openings. Speaking of what?

Openings. there's an opening coming on Leview The view That's not Why they're already talking about I think the person who They're interested in

Somebody who was on it before She's a Greek last name I can't think of her name right now Anton Nakupo They got Yana's mom to be on the show First off the championship Look That's actually not a Greek last name

It's Nigerian What would be a Greek last name like Papathopolis. Papathopolis. Yeah, Papathopolis or like what's the yogurt company? Orrincoast or something. Shout out to all my Greek people.

Shout out to my big fat Greek by Greek wedding. I love that movie. I do too. Natalie Vardalos, that's another Greek name right there. So she's Greek. Maria Minunos. Maria Minunos is Greek? That last name's Greek.

I'm pretty sure. She's also thick. A little thickness around there. Is she? Yeah, she definitely is. or at least she used to be. But look, so, so I need to dig something up on this person then?

Find out who her name is. I'll put her in the next. I'll put her in the Nexus, find some stuff. Hit piece coming out, three, two, one. You don't want the job? You don't want to be on the view? Oh, I had a fantastic time when I was on the view. Mm-hmm.

I just don't think that I'm on that level. I don't understand this. Debbie, that's her name, Debbie, Debbie, Mattinopoulos. She used to be on there before. Yeah, yeah, yeah. Debbie Madnapolis. Debbie Madnopoulos.

They used to do the Derby segment with her from, they're going to bring her back to the view. Do you realize I was in college when she was on the view and like, it was like Barbara Walters hated her or something? Barbara Walters is the reason that she got on the show. She's the one who told her to interview. I know, but like they got Debbie off of the show after a while. They used to do, they used to do Saturday Live sketches about the fact that like that Debbie.

They're not. bringing Debbie Madenopoulos. That's who it's rumored. That's what that's what's rumored. No, I had a fantastic time on the view. Yeah. I watched a show every day pretty much. Do you?

Mm-hmm. I like it. I think the show's going to be less watchable now that Megan McCain is going. It's interesting. I think people, she's some people hate watch her. And they like the back and forth. And so I do think that they're going to have to bring somebody who's more leaning to that side.

or at least just going to say something controversial or rattle people. The view trends every single week every other day it's on Twitter. It's a big deal. All right. We love you, LeVar. Let's take a break. This episode is brought to by WeatherTech. Everyone knows winter is the MVP and make it a mess.

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Look, we missed this. We missed this topic last week. We were supposed to do it last week. We missed it. If this is what I think it is, I'm not comfortable doing it. Why? What's the topic? It's Emmanuel Acho

Wait a second We have to be talking about it We forgot it It's Emmanuel Acho saying That Janus Antenacoupo cannot be the face of the NBA We forgot about it Okay

We meant to do it Here's the thing So he's So you know I'm not even saying anything You know what? I'm not even going to say anything You Don't do this to me

I'm not doing it I'm just, I'm asking you, do you feel like maybe? And I spoke to Acho, we talked. Not about this, though. Not about this. Are we losing Emmanuel Acho? When you sent me that text message. Because I did in all, in all, to be transparent, thought warriors, I saw the clip and I sent it to Van.

And Vance response was, I saw it. We're losing it. We're losing them. We're losing them. Like we're losing him. Like he's over there and he's getting a little comfortable a little bit. And it's just like, why is Acho like, what the hell, man? This wasn't it.

I don't know what's happening over there, especially coming from someone who's Nigerian. It was just shocking to me that that's the hot take that you would have. And I get it and I understand it. And I don't know if we've talked about it here. I've heard Stephen A talk about the fact. that this was shocking coming from Emmanuel Ajo who is Nigerian. There's a lot of, or Max, it's a lot of pressure to talk about sports or whatever it is every single day and to have to say something that's different or from a different point of view or that hasn't already been said.

This was not the route to go, especially coming off the heels of Stephen A. Smith literally making this same mistake, not even a week before in the way he talked about an Asian baseball player. Yeah, Otani. Otani. So we literally just had dealt with this and an apology from Stephen A. Smith and then here you come piggybacking on this with somebody with you said a Nigerian last name. Right? Yeah.

Emmanuel Ocho is Nigerian. Yeah. Right? First generation born here. His parents are Nigerian came here. It was just shocking the fact that you would take a stance of that they don't, people can't, we should basically. acclimate to the culture that we're in

and that you can't learn somebody's name. You can't learn how to say somebody's name. I just, I mean, it's, there's really no reason to go into depth about it. He was wrong. It was a bizarre take. I'm curious and I haven't looked. Has he come out with any type of statement after? Not that I've seen.

Not that I've seen. Also, this is like a little streak. He's on a, he's on a, he's on a, he's on a bad take streak. Like, even the Richard Sherman thing. bothered me a little bit. Then you have this. Then you had don't smoke weed or else. Shakari.

You'll throw somebody, you'll impel somebody with javelin. Acho, you know what? Open invitation. Acho, come on the show. He'll come on the show. But it's more of, I just, I, this is one of those things. It's like, you can't keep saying it and then come back and be like, okay, you know, like I was wrong on that take.

Like, you're right. It's a street. It's too many different things, especially you coming from that, from the same culture, Nigerian, the background. It's just we learn how to say people's names. That's what we do. Not just in sports,

in entertainment, in politics. People are all in the spotlight. You learn how to pronounce their name. It's a form of respect. And to say that that title can never be achieved by someone who doesn't have an American last name

is bizarre. Yeah. It's bizarre to feel that way and to acquiesce to that too. Because even if it's, It's bizarre. I would rather challenge people to open up to the great person and the amazing basketball player that Janice Antonin Kupo is

rather than say there are too many barriers between him and them that they'll never appreciate that. I just understand why we would ever be okay with that and why we ever state that as a definitive fact. And not that I'm going to, oh, I'm sorry. No, that's fine. No, it's your problem. I was going to say, and not that I'm trying to promote the American, quote, dream.

But Janice has a story that people who want to tap into that love. Oh, this is a man who, you know, like, against all odds, came here. And, you know, the story of him celebrating about having his first smoothie and all of that. And to look at where he is now, that's somebody people want to say, hey, he did it. You can do it too. So just the fact that you would take that approach with Janus as well was just off. Listen, Emmanuel needs to maybe have an uncomfortable conversation on how we approach diversity in last names or something.

I don't know. That needs to be the next next. Well, he should come over here and have an uncomfortable conversation with us. I love to talk to Emmanuel Acho about those things and about just hot take culture in general and whether or not it actually serves. Yeah, you know, whether or not it serves. It serves us. Okay.

It's coming back. It's been gone for a little while. Are you ready for Vans very serious question of the week? Yeah, bring it back. Van's very serious question. We don't need another song. Just bring back the question. It's not a query

for the me Yeah. It is Vance Very serious question Of the week. Yeah. Okay. So we're going to do This is a problematic question.

Oh no. We're going to do a one got to go black leaders edition one gotta go black leaders edition if you four black leaders oh my gosh one got to go you gotta take away everything

that happened as a result of this one one got to go oh wait so wait it's not a cancellation it's like you wipe them away like everything that they've done one got to go all their accomplishments is as if they were never were Okay.

One got to go. Okay. One got to go. One got to go. Martin Luther King Jr. Oh my gosh. Malcolm X. Barack Obama.

Rosa Parks. One got to go. It's got to be Rosa. Oh, Rosa. You're taking Rosa out. You're taking out, Rosa. Wow. It's Rosa.

Okay. So let me tell you why. Tell me why. Tell me why it's Rosa. And I just want to be clear here. There was no correct answer. Every single one of these people have done something that has impacted our culture, our community, and has started some, ignited some type of movement.

The reason I chose Rosa is because Rosa is tied to the bus boycott. Rosa was involved, because remember, Van said the stipulation. is you have to erase away everything they did. Rosa was a part of the movement. She was involved. But I can't say she was as influential as a leader as Malcolm X, as Martin Luther King Jr.

And as Barack Obama. She worked for the movement. She was involved. And she became a figure when she sat on the bus refused to get off. So if I'm going, if I'm forced to do this,

somebody else could have sat in the seat. Oh my God. But, okay, so this is my thing. It's easily Barack Obama. Our first black president? It is. Our first black president?

Easily Barack Obama. Like, it's not even, I don't even, I don't even, hesitate. No. It's easily Barack Obama. Please go ahead and say why. Okay, so Dr. King was doing this thing prior to the Montgomery bus boycott, but I could

argue that without the Montgomery bus boycott, that Dr. King doesn't become who he becomes, and that leads to so much. And I can also argue that without Rosa. Rosa didn't start the bus. boycott. It was, it had been formulating. It was years and years of people coming together. And Rosa is the person they chose to take, to sit

in the seat. I know, but the thing is... So it could have been somebody else. The thing is, they tried to do it before and it didn't work. It was something about Rosa Parks, okay? Without that moment, you don't even get Dr. King to... So it could have been, they would have kept trying.

My thing is, my thing is, I'm just looking at history the way it played out. I personally, this is the most problematic conversation we've ever had. I personally think that you, I'm not getting rid of, to me, the one that you can't get rid of more than any of them is Malcolm X. You can't get rid of Malcolm X.

I know you were going to say that. You can't get rid of Malcolm X. You just can't. Malcolm X represented black man. You can't get rid of, you can't get rid of Malcolm X. You can't get rid of Dr. King. Got too much done. And he, like, you know what I mean? It's a lot of stuff.

Rosa Parks. So Barack Obama did nothing. We never have a black president. I'm saying we never have a black president I'm saying that if you just look at how consequential these people were to the lives of black people They would have kept trying to put somebody else on the bus

The bus boycott was going to happen regardless Like look if you look at how consequential These people were to the black experience I think that Barack Obama is Without a doubt the least consequential person To black people in that whole thing It's because him getting a lot what it did for black people and like the spirit and the hope and up you you know where you

were in 2008 I know November of 2008 and that it like it ignited something in black people it made you feel seen it made you feel and I'm like that moment in time did so much for people you had people like civil rights leaders who were with Dr. King crying and saying I never thought I'd see the day for this to happen so for those people who lived during that time and to be crying and to be moved by the election of President Obama lets me know that it meant something. It's got to be Rosa. And I hate to do that to Rosa.

And you know what? Those people cried again in 2016 when Trump was elected president as America. Took it back, baby. White supremacy. Please. Please.

I'm very curious to what people have to say. One got to go. One got to go. We're going to put it up there. One got to go. But let's just talk about how problematic it is that Van's serious question was to eliminate a civil rights leader,

especially on the week that we lost one. Yeah, well, look, here's the thing, though. So I just, that's very, like, here's the thing, though, one got to go. Shit. It's a game we play. And every time we play the game, and every time we play the game, every time we play the game,

you got to make tough decisions. It just allows us to talk more about these people and what they did and how much they made. It's a celebration. One got to go. It's like versus a celebration. If I had said Barack, would you have said Rosa? No.

The answer is clearly Barack. No. It's different. The, yeah, the answer is clearly Barack. All right. You guys, we did an amazing interview before we started this podcast. We're going to give you guys a special COVID episode

to doctors on different sides of the vaccine. Rachel, we did a interview already. Amazing. It's not how, yeah, I would say amazing. I would say, it took us by surprise. It was, it was different. It was interesting. It was interesting. Yeah, definitely was.

Definitely was. So, yeah, that's coming pretty soon. That's going to be its own episode, but it's not going to be on a Thursday or a Friday or a Monday. I think we're just going to put that out. We're just going to drop it, like a surprise drop, like Donda. shout out to Kanye West, didn't drop the album. Oh, we have to do Kanye.

You know what, Van. How many, please take a drink every single time Van says, we got to do Kanye. Every time Kanye's in the news, we got to do Kanye. We don't have to do Kanye. Let's do Kanye. So for those of you don't know, Kanye's, the album did not drop like Justin La Boy said it would,

which since when did he become the promoter for Kanye? Since when does he do all things, Kanye? Is this certified? Shout out Justin LaBoy. He's tied into the Kanye crew. He's not with them. Apparently not, because we would already be listening to it. I, Friday, open up my phone, trying to find it on Apple Music,

trying to look forward on Spotify, try to Google. How do I listen to Donda? Not realizing that Justin LaBoy gave us false information. And Kanye is still living in the Mercedes-Benz Dome. Yeah. Try to get it done. So there's reports that Kanye is living in the Mercedes Ben's theater and that he's attending events there.

He went to a soccer game. I'm not just thinking so funny. I'm sorry, he's attending events. He's going to a soccer game. We're in the same outfit. We're in the same outfit. Like wearing the same outfit.

He went to a soccer game. I guess he wanted to take a break. Or maybe it was too loud to record because the people were going crazy over soccer. He went to the soccer game there And we still don't have the music Shout out to Charles Holmes One half of the Midnight Boys, PooPew And the host of the Ring of Music Show

We were supposed to do an emergency Kanye podcast And Charles was the first one to go Yo, just to be honest with you just be ready In the morning because I don't really think That this is coming out Because after people heard the stream Did you listen to the music on the live stream?

It just wasn't done It wasn't really done So he had 72,000 people fill up the dome to listen to unfinished music. Music that wasn't even finished. I would feel bamboozled. I would not. I would be so upset if that was me.

Now I don't care. Well, actually, I'm actually intrigued by the fact that he's so like, I guess, upset or bothered that it's not done that he hasn't left. To me, that intrigues me. I said, okay, you better put in that work. So I'm, I'm ready to hear Donda. Got JZ on it. Got JZ on it.

As soon as Kim Kardashian left, Jay-Z was like, yo, I want my friend back. Got Jay-Z on it. Is that the story? Or did Kanye say, hey, she's gone, can I come back?

Either way. Either way. It's obvious that something was going on. Okay. Yay will be out. Maybe not. We're just going to do it. Surprise drop,

but we're actually going to drop our podcast. We're definitely going to drop our podcast. Give you some information about how you keep yourself and your family safe during these uncertain times. All right. Now we're actually leaving. Take us out in your extra voice. Hey, take your thing caps off, but do not ever stop learning.

We're going to wrap up another amazing episode of the Higher Learning podcast with myself, Van Lathen Jr. and my partner, Rachel Lindsay. Until the next time, bye. Bye, guys. And take care. Take care. Ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha.