Higher Learning with Van Lathan and Rachel Lindsay - Delroy Lindo the Thespian and CNN’s Platforming of Donald Trump

Episode Date: May 12, 2023

Van Lathan and Rachel Lindsay react to CNN’s Donald Trump town hall and what it means for the upcoming election (7:51), before welcoming actor-producer Delroy Lindo to discuss his role in Hulu’s ���Unprisoned’ and portraying fatherhood on the big screen (32:32). Hosts: Van Lathan Jr. and Rachel Lindsay Guest: Delroy Lindo Producers: Donnie Beacham Jr. and Ashleigh Smith Learn more about your ad choices. Visit podcastchoices.com/adchoices

Yo, yo, yo, throat warriors. What is up? Power learning is on. It is I, Van Lathen, Jr. And it's me, Rachel and Lindsay. Yeah, I bet. Oh, is that the kind of mood that we're setting? This afternoon on Thursday, you good, Van?

You okay? Let's do it. Let's do it. A wellness check. How are you, Van? I'm drinking AG1 from Athletic Greens. Here he goes again. They're getting so much free promo.

out of you. Is it really that good though? Because here's my thing with those type of drinks. It tastes nasty. Like is there a sweetness to it, a tartness? No. It tastes in a life more. It's smooth.

Okay. It's smooth. And it makes me feel good. It makes me sleep good. You know? It makes you regular? Absolutely. Which is tough because of the...

My, ma, ma, ma, ma, ma, ma'am, ma. Never mind. I'm not even going to talk about it. I'm going to talk about it. Rachel, you told me I shouldn't talk about. Yeah. You said what? You told me I shouldn't discuss it.

Yes, that's right. That's right. It's not a thing that should be discussed. What are you got going on, Rachel? I got a new wig. I see. You've been messing around with the wigs. I think I'm going back to,

I've been away from the wigs for a while. And I think I'm going to go back. I got a new wig. That's not new. I just pulled it out the closet. Go ahead. You want to say something? fan. I see the smirk.

No. Go ahead. Because you had the other wig on before. You had the red one. I named them. That was Shelly. Okay. This is, this is Dawn. I got the honest with you.

A brown wig was a good wig, man. You like Shelly? That you had a whole look. Yeah, man. It was kind of like an end vote type of thing. Oh, hold on. To your love. You got to.

Okay. You know, that's kind of cutting up I like. If you want to turn this podcast into a sing-along, we'll ignore the audience, but that's the kind of cutting up I did. Van, I don't really sing on the podcast, but in real life,

I'm always singing. Like, when you talk about making up songs, I make up songs for copper all the time. We talked a little bit about this. I do this all the time. Why, if that's the case,

see, this is the kind of stuff I don't like. If that's the case, then why do you get at me for it? I don't get to. Why does everyone try to stop me? everyone tries to stop me. Stop trying to stop me.

You know what it is. Nobody tries to stop you. We like you unhinged, unhinged, which you are at times. But you go, we'll be like, okay, that was a Q1 song. And then you want to give us five more. I have a lot of songs. You know what I mean? Save them.

We got a lot of podcasts. We do this twice a week. You ask me what I got going on. I got the white. can't jump from here tonight. I'm kind of excited about that to see how that goes. And what else do I have? Nothing really.

I kind of have a chill weekend. I'm catching up with some friends that are in town that I haven't seen in a minute. I mean, they live here. I just haven't seen them in a minute. So I got a very... Who are they? Why don't you see them?

Because one is the stylist for The Bachelor and he's always traveling and he's rarely in town. So he happens to be in town. So I'll see him. And then the other ones, you know, Whitney, and I don't think you've met Christina. Never met Christina. Are these people?

Cacazoids! They both, yes. Yes. All right, so we're, um, so we're, okay, we're expanding our cultural horizons tomorrow, what you're doing? That's okay. What are you guys going to do?

You guys are going to play some croquet. Maybe some lawn bowling. What do you do when you hang around your white friends? Seriously. Like, is it different? The same thing you do when you hang around your wife friends. Why are you acting like you don't have any white friends? I didn't act like that.

What I said was, what do you do when you hang around with a white friends? Okay. What do I do normal things? Like tomorrow we're going to dinner. We're catching up. This is a late birthday dinner that they're doing for me. You guys going to Long John Silvers for dinner? I've never been there in my life.

I've never seen black people in Long John Silvers before. I guess they go there. I guess black people go to Long John Silverers. I've never been inside of them. In Texas, they do. I've never been inside of the Long John Silvers before. I've never, but I see, when I see it, I see white people going in and out of there,

Long John Silvers. We are really generalizing this podcast. What? Yeah. How? How am I generalizing? I bet if I get Steve from the ringer verse, On right now.

Hold on. Let me see. I bet if I get Steve from the ring of verse on right now, Steve likes Long John Silvers. Let me call Steve real quick. Poor Steve. If I get Steve on right now, I bet he likes Long John Silver.

So let's call Steve real quick. Just real quick, let's call Steve. Let's see if he answers. I bet he likes it. Steve! Poor Steve. What's up? You're on higher learning right now.

Hey, Steve. You're on higher learning right now? Yeah, you're on higher learning. I need to ask you a question. What's up? Have you ever been to Long John Silver's before? Oh my God. I think like maybe when I was a kid.

Okay. Did you like it? Like, I remember liking it. Yeah. Okay. It's like an event thing. Like you take your family to like a nice, not nice, but like a fun time with the kids.

Yeah. Thank you, Steve. I'll call you back. Bye-bye. Long John Silver's. Would you like for me to call a white friend? No, because it doesn't matter. Because the reality is, did you hear what he said?

First of all, that Steve, who is so good at his job here at the Ringer, that it's disgusting what a good producer Steve is. Steve, Donnie, Kerm, I get all the best producers, all the best producers at the Ringer. Fantastic. Okay, here's the deal. He said it's an event. to go to Long Island. He didn't say. He was very excited.

He was very excited. Jesus Christ. All right. We have to show rate. Yeah, so we're going to dismiss with the pleasure trees. And we're going to get you to an interview with Del Vourlando

that we have on the pod. One can only hope that one enjoys this interview because this interview that me and Rachel did a little while ago is an interview that one should listen to,

that one should really prioritize and it's listening and it's importance. It's an interview that one should really endeavor into kind of really falling into with all of yourself and who you are. So later on, we're going to ask all of you, every single one of you, the ones out there, that are listening to this podcast to really get into this interview that we're giving you

with the one and only, Delroy Lindo. But before we get to that, let's start with Donald Trump. Big deal of the day, seeing in town hall. For adults with Crohn's disease or ulcerative colitis symptoms, every choice matters. Tramphia offers self-injection or intravenous infusion from the start. Tramphia is administered as injections under the skin or infusions through a vein every four weeks, followed by injections under the skin every four or eight weeks. If your doctor decides that you can self-inject Trimphia, proper training is required.

Tramphia is a prescription medicine used to treat adults with moderately to severely active Crohn's disease and adults with moderately to severely active ulcerative colitis. Serious allergic reactions, increased risk of infections, or lower ability to fight them, and liver problems may occur. Before treatment, get checked for infections and tuberculosis. Tell your doctor if you have an infection, flu-like symptoms, or need a vaccine. Explore what's possible. Ask your doctor about Tramphia today.

Call 1-800-526-7736 to learn more or visit Trimfairadio.com. The playoffs are here and you can predict the action all the way to the finals with Fandulul Predict. Predict the spread, total points, and even the game winner. Sign up and get a $25 bonus. Offered by Fandul prediction markets LLC, a registered futures commission merchant. 18 plus. Bonus is non-withdrawable and inspires seven days after receipt. Trading derivatives involve significant risk and may not be suitable for all investors.

Manage your activity with our consumer protection tool. Restrictions apply. See terms at fanduel.com slash predict slash bonus dash offer dash terms. All right, Rachel. Have you seen the discourse over the town hall featuring the Donald? Former president of the United States of America, Donald Trump, that's been cream it up. Ever since it aired on Wednesday night.

Have you been seeing the discourse? And did you see the town hall itself? Okay. I saw the town hall. And I think I've seen majority of the discourse. Yeah. Like even before, because I came home late, before I saw the town hall,

I saw certain things trending on Twitter. So I was like, okay. What happened? What happened? I saw Thank you, CNN. I saw CNN did. I saw Dear CNN. And I was like, what happened?

So, yeah. This was in Manchester, New Hampshire. It's the first primary state. Trump is right now, I guess the frontrunner to get the Republican nomination. A long time, a long time to go. but he is the frontrunner in the race. And a lot of people were disgusted by what they saw on the stage. Of course, this came right after something that we didn't get a chance to cover yet.

Trump was found liable for sexual abuse and defamation in a suit brought by E. Gene Carroll. And so that news wasn't even fresh when this town hall happened. very serious accusations made by Ms. Carroll against Donald Trump, and he seemed to not give a fuck. Here's some of the audio from that night and what Trump had to say. Usually you leave office, you say, I'm sorry, but I'm going to back home.

I'm back home to my family and everything. I'm going to be resigned. My poll numbers went up, and they went up with the other fake charge too. Because what's happening is they're doing this for election interference. This woman, I don't know her. I never met her. I have no idea who she is.

I had a picture taken years ago with her and her husband. Nice guy, John Johnson. He was a newscaster. Very nice man. She called him an ape. Happens to be African American. Called him an ape. The judge wouldn't allow us to put that in.

Her dog or her cat was named vagina. The judge wouldn't allow it to put that in. All of these things. Why was I in this clip? Rachel's laughing. See? This is what happens. See?

Why is this what happens? that we're starting with. Of all the outlandish things he said, why are we starting with this? This is the thing, because that's important. Donnie play it again. Nobody can deny that Trump is not funny, but he's despicable

in the midst of it. But go ahead. Right. No, actually, no, don't play it. Don't play it again. We don't need to hear. Trump continued to, obviously, that's all bullshit.

He knows exactly who she is. He remembers meeting her. It's all bullshit. He lied, repeated. during the town hall, continuing the claim that the 2020 election was rigged, that former Vice President Pence had the authority to send the election back to the states.

He did not. That Pence wasn't under threat that day, which of course he was, that Trump requested 10,000 troops to secure the Capitol and that Nancy Pelosi didn't want that to happen. Lie, lie, lie, lie, lie, lie, that he had the right to take the classified documents

to Marlago. Lie, lie, lie, lie, lie, lie, lie. Okay. This is the crux of the argument, Rachel. As people are putting it out on a Twittersphere. Doesn't matter what sound we play you from Trump's town hall. We can play you sneakily pro-Pooten stuff. We can play you, obviously pro-Pooten stuff.

We can play you Trump talking about the debt scene. We can play you any number of things that Trump said that were untrue or hypocritical or just downright nasty. The central question is, should CNN have put Trump on to do this town hall, knowing who Donald Trump is, knowing who he's always been,

and kind of what would end up happening here? They chose Caitlin Collins to moderate and run the town hall. She's someone who's had it back and forth before with Trump. Her performance up there people have talked about.

I think she did it. a great job. I think she did the best job that she could have done. But besides all that stuff, the question is knowing what Donald Trump was going to do, if you're CNN, do you put them up there? What's your answer to that question? I'm glad that that's what we're talking about because no, CNN should have never had Donald Trump on their airwaves in that, in that way, right? not in front of a live audience that was pro-Trump, not live on TV where he could be unleashed and keep going and going and going

instead of it being a taped interview where you could cut things down and edit certain things. What CNN did was allow him the opportunity to spew out misinformation over and over and over again where and with that audience that was like, it was like church for him. Like it was like a back and forth. It was a Trump rally at that point.

The cheers, the laughs, the laughs, the clapping. I mean, going back to what you originally says, should CNN have put him on? No, but did CNN get exactly what they wanted? Yes. Did Donald Trump get exactly what he wanted? Yes. CNN has everybody talking about them.

They got, I don't know the ratings, but I'm sure they're the best that they've been for CNN in a long time because everybody knows that CNN has not been doing well. Trump got a platform to speak to his people. Trump was trumping per usual. He didn't say anything that was shocking

or out of his character. He was completely on brand. The problem is that CNN, and I've seen people say that a lot of people are overreacting in regards to getting mad at CNN or Caitlin Collins or whoever it may be. But what they were saying is that CNN is not supposed to choose a side.

And they're not supposed to run away from Trump. They're supposed to face things head on. That is all out the window when it comes to the person spewing out misinformation. And that's exactly what happened. And even though Caitlin, I do think Caitlin did a good job as best as she could do, I heard somebody say this. I think that she's had an extremely fast trajectory. Like, I've been on a fast trajectory fan.

I think she's been on a fast trajectory as far as her role at CNN. I don't think she should have been the person in there. But I also don't think she did a bad job. But the reality is that, and I heard somebody say this, Trump can lie faster than any interviewer can fact check him, which is why you don't put him on live TV in front of a live audience. where he can just go on and on and on and on. It was a lose-lose situation.

She was doomed to fail. She's just doomed to fail. So, yeah, this should have never happened. But that's where I think the focus has to be. Is this what we expect from now on with CNN? Are they going to continue to give Trump and Trump supporters and all those who have those thinking, who are in line with that type of thinking,

a platform to push out these conspiracy theories? It's almost like Fox News drop these pieces and CNN's picking them up where they left off. Like picking up where they left off. What do you think? I disagree. Do you really disagree or you disagreeing for the sake of argument? I vehemently disagree. Not as vehement.

No, no, no. Say it with your chest. Say it with your chest. On your shoulders. You said it. Steve, I can see Steve. You passionately disagree. I disagree.

Let me tell you why. I disagree. Okay, so CNN doesn't have to talk to Trump supporters. They don't. But if CNN is covering the race on the Republican side, they have to talk to Donald Trump. Not in that way. Donald Trump is leading the Republican field.

And not only do they have to talk to him, they need to, if they're covering this, right? Because what I want for my news is I don't want to slant. I want the news as it is. Ugly, disgusting, or whatever, I don't want it as it is. The only thing that you can do there when you're talking to Donald Trump, you don't even want to have a pre-taped situation with him where you edit out lies. You don't even want to do that.

Because then that's not giving the American people an accurate assessment of who Donald Trump is. to me, the way that you get an accurate assessment of who Donald Trump is, is to talk to Donald Trump, and then when Donald Trump lies, to call him on the lie. Here's the thing. We know that Donald Trump does not tell the truth. We know that his constituency doesn't care whether or not he's telling the truth or not. They don't care, and he's going to lie. So it doesn't matter where he's at. that's going to happen. It does matter where he is. This is good. And I know everyone doesn't think what happened on Wednesday is good.

Why? Because as upset and mad as people are, they need to remember that when it comes time to vote. Because the reality is, if Donald Trump is allowed to lay dormant, if he's allowed to skate, then there are parts of,

of this country that might look at the situation that they feel like they are in and make what they think is a political decision, right? Because there are a whole bunch of people that go, hey, I didn't mind the tax cuts. I didn't mind whatever, whatever. Not that any of Trump's policies were good, especially for the average American. But people might look at that and go, hey, whatever. If they're not hearing from Donald Trump, it might to some people, in my opinion, they might lose the frame of reference

they need to remember who he is. Like, we tried to ignore Trump. His base won't let it happen. They're not going to let him be ignored. So if you want people who are on fire to go and vote, who are on fire, not just to go and vote out Donald Trump, but to vote out Trump-era politics,

you need to know exactly what their figurehead is, who he is, and how he acts. So I think this little refresher course for America was good. Now, I think that everybody's pissed off because I think that we're at a point where people don't know how to be anything other than mad. So rather than look at the guy on the stage and be like, the reality is that there is a large portion of the country that agrees with him or not even agrees with him, finds him agreeable in the way that he acts, they'd rather be mad at CNN for reminding them.

That's not CNN's, CNN doesn't have the opportunity to say this isn't real. They're news organization. And I would be talking the same way, if this were MSNBC, if this were Fox, if this were ABC, their news organization. What they have to do is they have to feature the people that are affecting American political disqualification.

course. And I think that it's clear that Donald Trump is one of those people. So I'm not saying that they have to silence or run away from Donald Trump. What I'm saying is they could have controlled the way that they presented him to the public. And that doesn't necessarily mean editing. I gave that as an example. It doesn't mean having a taped interview and editing. But in a town hall where it's live, where he can just filibuster and say all these things, CNN does have a duty to not let them say things. aren't true. She did. She did that. She did as best as she could, but it still landed.

And the other thing is, to what you were saying, if he is always going to be Trump and say the things that Trump's going to say, nothing changed with him, he has not changed. He has not grown from when he first started running back in 2016, 1516. If he's always going to be him and the mega and the MAGA audience is always going to be there. and they're not going to change. And the people who are disgusted with him are always going to think the way they are, then how was it beneficial at all to allow that display to happen?

You can't convince me that CNN did that for the sake of news. CNN did that for ratings because they are not doing well. And even afterwards, there was an anchor that had someone on who, again, was reiterating the things that Trump said on CNN. What do you want them to do? Are they supposed to act like those people don't exist? No.

But there could have been a debate. I watched a whole panel with Byron Donald's and Van Jones and Anderson Cooper and all of those guys were, Byron Donald's refused to answer the question about whether or not he thought the 2020 election was rigged or not. and it's Van Jones and Anderson Cooper.

I watch all the coverage, Van Jones and Anderson Cooper, looking at him going, like, do you have courage enough to answer the question? I mean, that's all you can ask for. If you want an echo chamber where one side acts like the other side doesn't exist, that is what you go to Fox 4. And that's what we criticize Fox 4. I think the criticism of CNN on the other side is actually unfair. And I also think, I think of any liberal, of any liberal station,

It liberal slanting station, Trump type of criticism, Trump criticizing station or network. I think that's unfair. I think it's unfair to say, hey, all Fox does is give you conservative news with a conservative slant. We want some place that gives us all liberal news with a liberal slant. I personally think this rage that people feel, as misplaced as it is towards CNN, it's actually good. And once again, I don't think that CNN did this. for news over ratings, but I don't think they do anything for news over ratings.

I think the reality is that every time CNN cuts to commercial, every time Box cuts to commercial, every time ABC, NBC, all of these places cut to commercials, they're advertisements. So they're all capitalist organizations trying to make money. But when you say

that people are outraged and this is a good thing, it's the people who are already going to be outraged. You don't have new people who are outraged, this, it's the same thing. So that's why I say it didn't hit in any, you think new people were outraged by this? No, but I don't think that that matters. But because what I think, what I personally think is what I see, and this is me making my own assessment, I see a lot more passionate fire on the other side of the political aisle than I sometimes see on the left. What I see on the left, a lot of times is, and this is not necessarily the fault of, I don't know, the White House or

left-leaning leaders or anything like that. It's just that the left, we've talked about this before, has a much more diverse palette of people to try to, to cater to. So a lot of times what you see is, hey, you're not liberal enough for someone. Hey, you're not moderate enough for somebody. Hey, you don't think this, like Joe Biden gets up there

and says he's funding the police. There's a whole part of the progressive movement that's mad at them, myself included. Kamala Harris gets up there and she says, America is not a racist country. There's a whole portion of black people that are mad at her, myself included, when she's trying to actually

stay in good standing with moderate, suburban, white ladies who are one election away from being Republican and she feels like she can't say that. I feel like it's bullshit. She's got a harder job. I get that and I understand that. I still need to make sure to keep people

like her and President Biden accountable for what I think is most important to me in my life. I don't give a fuck about those women in the suburbs. I don't give a fuck about anybody's political career. On the other side, they're in lockstep for a large degree. They think niggas, unhoused people, undocumented people, and all the rest of them are going to take their country over and take their country over and they're on fire about it.

And they're willing to get out, wrap on doors, do whatever, talk, rally, brave COVID, whatever to make it happens. That emotion needs to be met by the electorate on the left side. And if that means remembering just how shitty this guy is and getting upset

about it all over again because you see him again because he hasn't been deep platform on Twitter, Trump is not dead. It's still alive and well. Yeah, we saw it. And to me, I watched people get upset about it.

I thought it. I thought it's good at their man. That's all I'm saying. No more filibustering for me. But I thought I thought it's good at their. Yeah. I again, I'm not saying they can't have Trump on their airways. I'm just saying that it needs it did not need to be in that format. I fully expect for there to be when there's a presidential debate. Let Trump do his thing. Let Biden go at him and let those two do their thing against each other with the moderator. That's something that we're using. This to me seemed above and beyond, and I believe, for ulterior motives, for the ratings, not because of what you just said about firing up people so that they can get out and vote and to show people that Trumpism is alive and well.

I'll never see it that way. I just felt, and I'll stand by it. I just felt I'm not one of those people who was outraged either. How dare CNN? I'm never watching CNN again. That wasn't me, but I did feel that last night was unnecessary. didn't give us anything that we didn't already know and we haven't already seen. And you don't need to be super outraged at Trump.

Because if you're not paying attention, he's in the news all the time. There's literally a lawsuit just filed against him. Not filed against him, but I mean, a judgment just against him. He's always in the news for doing something that is not right. But wasn't this more visceral? But wasn't this more visceral? Wasn't this more visceral? Wasn't this more miserable?

He was saying the last time. But here's the thing, no. Once again, I want to make sure that what I'm saying about CNN is understood. I don't think that CNN did this to fire up the left. They're not supposed to do anything to fire up the left. Not supposed to, yeah. They're not supposed to do anything to fire up the left. CNN, ABC, NBC, Fox, none of these places are supposed to do anything to fire up the left.

of these places are supposed to do anything to fire up the left. The problem is that they are. The problem is that we need information that we can synthesize and then go use it to make decisions in our lives as a part of the American society. And what we're actually getting are sermons from capitalist news organizations who are feeding into parts of us that they know we're, parts of us that they know trigger us in order to further their own money-making situations, right? Now, CNN in this particular situation, to me, has an obligation to interview the Republican frontrunner. And whatever way they want to do it, and whatever way that we can talk about whether or not it was the most effective way, that's fine. I'm here for that argument.

You want to do it a different way, that's cool. But if Joe Biden's going to have a town hall, then the other side has to have one, too. and you fact check the lies as best you can and you let the American people know what is real and what is not. But I'm not saying that they did this to fire up people to be mad at Donald Trump. They're not supposed to be doing that.

And so that's actually not what they should be doing. So to me, I saw ALC and everybody like that. It's like to put him on CNN, he didn't put himself on CNN. If Donald Trump wasn't a viable candidate, he wouldn't be on there. So what I'm telling you guys right now is the problem isn't the fact that he is who he always was. The problem is that he still has a large swath of people that make him, I'm sorry, politically and politically viable in the country. I don't think anybody would disagree with that.

Last thing I will say about this is do you think that they should have had people asking questions? Because I know they were like, this is a Republican in an undeclared audience. It seemed like everybody was Republican in the audience. I don't, is that how it, I don't watch a whole lot of town halls. But if it was Biden, for example, is everybody a Democrat are undecided? I mean, Biden's the president now, so they probably would do a little bit different then. But normally when you're campaigning and you put the people in the room, you put them in a room. in a favorable room is what you're saying.

That's a primary crowd. So it went back in. Yeah, yeah, yeah. Right. If you're going to do it during a general, you put them in there with everyone. But we're talking about a primary right now. This is primary politics.

So it's a little bit different than when things come out of the prime. Okay. I'll put a button in it. You fucking, you fucking hate them. I hate, you hate CNN. You like,

you hate all. You know what? Fuck. All right. I thought it was good. I think that's a good. I think that's a good back and forth about, you know, and I was having this conversation with a lot of different.

I did not know you were going to say that. No, no, no, no, no. Look, I personally, if I don't have any problem with deplatforming somebody, I don't. I think it's actually good. But in this particular case, if poll numbers are saying that this guy, by the way, the poll numbers aren't just showing Trump competitive or kicking up Ron DeSantis. The poll numbers are showing Trump in the dead heat with Joe Biden.

And in some polls, they're showing him slightly ahead. Yeah, you told us that. That's the one thing he wasn't really lying about. I need people to remember what the stakes are or who the guy is. So put some light on. And whatever. Agree or disagree, but, you know, Del Rolendo time.

Look, look, you guys, we're going to get to an interview with Del Rolendo. Fantastic actor. He is on a show right now on Hulu called, imprisoned. I would hope that as one sat back and listened to this interview, that, you know, one would really open their mind up to be able to get all the knowledge that's about to be dropped on you from Dill-R-Lyndo. This is one of the books. Shout out to Bitracial. That's podcast. All right, Dill-R-Lando, another side is break. This episode is brought to you by Spectrum Business. Fast, Reliable Internet means everything

for your business. And even this podcast. That's why I trust Spectrum business to keep companies of all sizes connected with internet, advanced Wi-Fi, phone, TV, mobile services, plus 24-7 U.S.-based support. Millions of business owners already trust Spectrum business. So visit Spectrum.com slash business to learn more. Restrictions apply. Services not available in all areas. For adults with Crohn's disease or ulcerative colitis symptoms, every choice matters.

Tramphia offers self-injection. or intravenous infusion from the start. Tramphia is administered as injections under the skin or infusions through a vein every four weeks, followed by injections under the skin every four or eight weeks. If your doctor decides that you can self-inject Trimfaya, proper training is required. Tremfaya is a prescription medicine used to treat adults

with moderately to severely active Crohn's disease and adults with moderately to severely active ulcerative colitis, serious allergic reactions, increased risk of infections or lower ability to fight them and liver problems may occur. Before treatment, get checked for infections and tuberculosis. Tell your doctor if you have an infection, flu-like symptoms, or need a vaccine. Explore what's possible.

Ask your doctor about Trimfaya today. Call 1-800-526-7736 to learn more or visit Trimfair Radio.com. So our next guest is I tried to do something before we got them on. And I tried to think of what my favorite signature role of his was, and I couldn't do it. It's been too consistent. It's too much work over the course of the years that I've been watching him. It could be West Indian Archie.

It could be clockers. It could be, what's the point of living in L.A. if you're not in the movie business. It could have been so many different roles. He's contributed so much. to the arts. We're glad to have them on. Delroy Lindo joins us today on higher learning. How are you doing, Mr. Lindo?

Doing okay. How are you? You're doing okay. How can we get you to be doing fantastic? What can we do? Because of the technical challenges doing this. Connecting with you guys. It's very, very frustrating. But that's okay.

That's okay. We appreciate your patience and we're glad that you were here with us. We've been looking forward to this. So thank you. We really do. And what I said about you earlier is absolutely true. I've enjoyed so much of the work that you've done over the years. Thank you.

I appreciate it. Thank you very much. A gigantic tree for me. Get Shorty is literally one of my favorite movies. One of my favorite movies. So I guess that's why I'll start. You know, you have a show that you're doing right now. It's called Unprisoned.

That's with you and Kerry Washington. I think the show hits close to home for me as somebody who recently lost their father, watching the show where someone has to sort of relearn their dad and get reacquainted with their father under not the greatest circumstances. It's a very powerful show to me. It's a very powerful show to see that, we're called it multi-generational dynamic. What does it mean to you at this point in your career to be able to act with an actress like Carrie Washington and to be able to play that sort of patriarch? in a different way than we normally see them on television.

So many of the roles that you do are so powerful, but this one deals with a lot of dynamics inside the black family. What was it like for you to do that? I guess the first thing is that I noticed you said that it resonated for you. And in speaking with various members of the media, various folks have said that. So that is very, very gratifying that it seems to be, resonating in very, very personal ways for the audiences that are seeing this work?

I was one of the people who had the opportunity to speak with you at the premiere of Unprison, and it was powerful to watch it. I was able to watch it back then and finish it later. But when you spoke about not just the response that you hoped that it had, but you talked about the power of the message and what this represents, this relationship between the father and daughter, the fact that he has been in prison

and is coming and meeting his family, can you speak to the power of the message with unprisen? And from then talking to you at the premiere to now, what has the response been from the audience as they have received unprisome? Well, as I just mentioned, a lot of people have responded very positively lead to the work.

And it seems to resonate for people in very, very personal, personal ways. The fact that this family is presented, this family, who

happened to be black, right? The fact that they are being presented facing the challenges of reconnecting, father, to daughter, daughter to father, grandfather to grandson,

how the grandfather's presence inside the family impacts the relationship between the son and the mother. All of those various components seem to be resonating and people seem to be appreciating the fact that as you said, this family is being presented dealing with negotiating all of those various dynamics within the within the within their family dynamic and the fact that um so often audiences perhaps i mean i'm not sure um the various impacts of of having a family member be incarcerated

then there are the various dynamics that go along with having a family member incarcerated. Then the fact that there are so many family members who are impacted by that one event. Then when the family member is going through the process of returning to society, the various dynamics that impact so many people, family, extended family, the individuals themselves. And so the fact that this work, unprisoned, is attempting to illuminate, shed light on all of those various dynamics. It's really gratifying for me to be involved with a piece of work that's resonating on all. all of those different fronts for audiences. You know, I've seen your career and watched your career.

You've worked with Spike a lot. This is when I first came to see you. You worked a lot with Spike Lee. I've seen you in all different types of movies, different types of productions. You have an incredibly varied, a wide-ranging career. So when I say that, I mean, you've been in movies that were considered to be black movies,

But then you've been in movies that people were considered just are bigger Hollywood things with some of the biggest stars in the world. When I ask you about something that we covered here on higher learning, Richard Dreyfus made a little news a couple of days ago. You're shaking your head. You don't want to ask you. I'm shaking my head. You don't want to talk about it. Okay, cool. All right.

Well, then it will come to my next question. the theater. Let me say this before we move on. The reason I'm shaking my head is because whatever causes any person, whether it be Richard Dreyfus or anybody else, to have the opinions that they express are entirely their prerogative to state the obvious.

My reaction, I prefer to share with my loved ones, my family. I prefer to keep my reaction to that, those kinds of comments private. I think that if you ask yourself, both you guys, what your response to hearing that, those comments are, they probably encapsulate what the responses of various people that we know are. I guess what I will say is the idea, the idea of inclusion in this society is something that I support 7,000%. And as somebody who has traditionally been excluded from certain areas, not only inside the entertainment industry, but in life, I am acutely aware for myself of the benefit to society. of being more inclusive. There you have.

Rachel. Yeah, yeah, no, absolutely. In Unprison, obviously we see you play a father in this series, but over the span of your career, we've seen you play many different types of fathers or father-like figures. With looking over your entire career, which is the father-like figure that you've played,

that you feel that you've most resonated with, or it's most like you? It's virtually impossible for me to answer that question because I'd have to, you know, revisit so many aspects of the work. So it's really, it's really, it's virtually impossible for me to answer that. This is what I will say, and I am not saying, that the character that I played in Clockers, Rodney, is like me. But one of the things that was really interested,

let me be really clear about that, that is not what I am saying. Okay. What I will say about playing Rodney in Clockers was one of the really intriguing and tragic components of playing that part for me was in addressing

the question why is it that a character like a human being like Rodney becomes a father figure to these young men. It speaks to

various components inside our families and inside society that are missing as our young people are raised, as our young people grow. It speaks to various components that are missing that a human being like Rodney can become a father figure.

Now, I really, really, really, really need to be very clear. I'm not judging Rodney. Yeah. In saying what I just said, that is not a judgmental. I do not intend it to be a judgmental statement because the fact of the matter is

in playing Rodney I had to try my best to understand who this man is and frankly to be empathetic towards him but it was an intriguing

component of playing that particular character as it relates to you know why is this man, a father figure to these young, these young men. And then last weekend, I happened to be speaking with A.J., Arthur, I used to call him Arthur Jaffa,

but apparently he now pronounces it Jafah, Arthur Jaffa, who was the DP on Crooklyn. and we were I call him AJ. Everybody calls him AJ AJ. AJ. And we were kind of marveling at the fact that Crooklyn has

stood the test of time in the way that it has. The father that I played in that film, Woody Carmichael, again, I'm not saying he's a favorite

of mine more than some other father-like figures. But I do appreciate having played Woody, having been a part of that film. And I have profound appreciation for the fact that that particular father, that particular family inside that film have stood the test of time the way it has. So I didn't really answer your question, but that's just addressing.

Oh, you did? Yeah. Okay. I need to be clear that in highlighting those two, you know, Rodney and and Woody Carmichael, I'm not necessarily saying those two resonated more strongly for me than others. I'm just saying that in attempting to answer your question or respond to your question, I'm just kind of articulating some things, some thoughts that I have,

having played those two particular parts. What does, what does Dary Lindo do for fun? Like, what do you do? You're coming off the set. You're going to take a load off. You're going to unwind. Like, what do you,

what do you do to kind of just wind down and kick back? Well, you know, physical exercise is really important to me because of the physical and the psychological emotional benefits. I'm a swimmer. And swimming is really important to me. My family is really important to me. But with regard to your, specifically your question about winding, what I do to wind down,

I would say that it's really, really important for me to exercise consistently for the benefits not only physically, but mentally, mentally, emotionally, mentally, emotionally, psychologically. Literature, books are really, really important to me. you know, as it relates to broadening my mind or making the attempt to broaden my mind and have a deeper understanding of the world in which we live. So literature books really, really important to me.

Crack open a book. I love to read as well. So you're a nonfiction, a fiction guy? Like a, like what do you get into? Yeah. Again, that's hard for me to answer because both, both, depending on, you know, what the content is and what kind of a journey it's taking me on. So I would say, I would say both. I mean, I, you know, I like a good novel, a good piece of literature, but a nonfiction, I'm sorry, fiction, a good piece of fictional literature. but, you know, fiction, nonfiction, similar, depending on, you know, the journey that the words that the book is taking me on.

On prison, you have a producing credit. And I'm wondering, are you at the stage in your career where you're going to looking to do more things to get involved behind the camera? Very much so. It's very, very important for me as much as I can to expand, you know, my footprint. And that absolutely involves producing, directing, much more.

I've directed for the theater. I'm in the process of putting a project together, a feature film that I will correct. So the answer to your question is, yes, I'm very, very, very interested and committed to broadening my footprint and broadening my relationship to the various projects that I work on. You're a very decorated actor. I'm looking at the list of awards that Doroa Lindo has won, and it's expansive and extensive, my brother. We talk a lot about, we get into the various award season races that happen here.

Like, how important is that stuff to you? Do you want to win an Academy Award? You want the Golden Globe? You want all of that stuff? Or is that stuff just kind of tangential to the art that you make? And if it comes, it comes. If it doesn't, it doesn't. I know there's a lot of hubbub about Angela Bassett,

not winning for Wakanda forever. Like, your name has been in those discussions before. How important is that to you? What I've learned is that the work, the content of the work has to be the most important component because to the extent

that one assesses oneself quote unquote judges oneself inside the process of creating any piece of work that is the most important for me because in expecting that one's work will be recognized externally,

one is setting oneself up for disappointment. So what's most important for me is my relationship to whatever creative process I've been engaged in and how I feel about the success, a lack of success of that work. Last question for me. I thought it was really interesting and a full circle moment with you working with Carrie Washington on Unprison, because I read where she talked about

watching you on screen in Malcolm X, and the arc of your character transformed her and really developed, helped her develop her craft throughout her career. And then now you guys are working together on this successful series. When you hear something like that, does it make you think about your legacy

and what you want that to be? It doesn't make me think about my legacy per se. It does make me profoundly appreciative that my presence as an actor has impacted a colleague in that particular. particular way because that's really all one can ask for, you know, to be appreciated, to be respected for one's work, for one's output. And when it comes from one's peers, you know, one's colleagues, that's when it really, really, really has an extra special

meaning for me. Yeah, Carrie has been very, very, you know, effusive in her and speaking about how, you know, my work in Malcolm X impacted her.

And that's just really, really special. You know, one, because I'm really proud of the film, I think it's a fabulous film. And I'm certainly proud of, you know, my contribution to the film. And, you know, what's interesting, an added component with regard to, and I've said this a lot over the years,

one of the most gratifying components for me, one of the most gratifying aspects of having played West Indian Archie specifically is the fact that in a three-hour film, No, Malcolm X is, Spikes Malcolm X is, you know, three hours long. And West Indian Archie is in the film maybe 15 minutes, maybe, maybe a little longer. I don't know, somewhere around there. But the fact that the character impacts the film, as he has proven to do, is particularly gratifying and satisfying.

because it's not like, you know, I'm not in the film a lot, right? But when West Indian Archie is there, it's very, very impactful. And I would say what I've always said is that it's that last scene. It's the final scene in West Indian Archie's final scene when Malcolm comes to visit me in the SRO that kind of puts the capper on that, on West Indian Arch's. journey throughout the film. Without that final scene, perhaps it would not have been as impactful. But seeing West Indian Archie, you know, from a dramaturgical, from a narrative point of view, seeing him at the beginning of his journey in that film and seeing where West Indian,

where I end up toward the end of my life just completes that journey. And I think it makes the audience awareness of that journey that much more complete. You know what? I think about Archie in that film, and I've always felt this since I watched it as a kid. The very first scene between Archie and Red,

and by the way, every time I watch the movie, I can never remember whether or not Red had the number or not. I can never remember whether or not he actually had the number. But when I watch the movie now, and especially knowing what I know about the life of Malcolm X, the first scene between them, Red so desperately wants to be Archie. He so desperately wants to be him. He's like, you're conning me?

He's like, why? He's like, because I want in. He wants it so bad. But in order for him to become Malcolm X, he has to do what he does, which is Escape Archie. So the entire time there, Archie represents like something that Red could actually never be. I think, let me just say this. I mean, I don't know if you've ever had a chance to speak with Denzel.

You'd have to ask Danzel whether or not he wants to be Archie. What seems to be clear from the script is that certainly as, as Malcolm says, I want in. He certainly wants into that lifestyle. He certainly wants into the lifestyle that he feels West Indian Archie represents. And to your point, yeah, in order for him to become the Malcolm that we all appreciate and love, he had to, of course, escape that lifestyle, yes. But I'm not really sure that Malcolm wanted to be West Indian Archie per se, but certainly it's clear that he wants into, he wanted into that lifestyle.

For sure. The whole thing. So my last question is about the theater. You've done a lot of theater work. Yeah. We've talked to some pretty important people here in the town who talk about the fact that actors need to make sure that they stay connected to the theater because that is an incredible way to hone your ability.

And it's a way that separates creatively or I guess from a talent perspective, really, really incredible actors from actors that are more kind of just movie stars. Do you feel like more serious actors take theater more seriously? Do you feel like the art of the theater is dying? What do you think about that? I don't think the art of the theater is dying.

What I'll say about what my experience in theater did for me is that it did indeed help me to hone my craft. It helped me to develop my relationship to myself as a person, as an instrument. It absolutely helped me to hone certain aspects of my craft. And through working in the theater, because I worked pretty much for 10 years as a theater actor

out of New York City. I was a New York City based theater actor. Oh, exclusively. The first 10 years of my career. Oh, interesting. And in those 10 years, I'd like to believe that I was able to develop, to become

sufficiently conversant with the craft of acting. So when I started working for the camera, I was able to take some of the work ethic, the ethos

that I had developed into the theater and translate that into the work that I did for the camera. And I believe that having worked in the theater that has contributed

to the longevity that I've been fortunate enough to have. And for any young actors who may be listening to this and anybody that has ever spoken to me about this, I always say, if you can, work in the theater, examine your craft

through working in the theater. Because when you start them working for film, hopefully the kinds of the work ethic and the ethos that you develop as a theater actor, hopefully you can then transfer into your work for film. Well, Delroy, we are really honored that you, that you would join us today. Unprisoned is the show.

It is on Hulu. Yep. It's on Hulu. with Kerry Washington, the entire cast there. It must be a pleasure for them to get to talk to you every single day. So,

thank you for joining us today on higher learning, man. It's really been a treat. Thank you very much. I wish you guys. Wish you guys the best. All the best. Thank you. Thank you.

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Off campus, L, every year after, the love hypothesis, Sterling Point, and more. Slow burns, second chances, chemistry you can feel through the screen. Your next obsession is waiting. Watch only on Prime. Okay. Mel back. Del Rolindo, what did you think?

I got to talk, what, what was your, you know? Delroy has a lot of wisdom. I mean, when you look at all that he's done, I like that you talk to him about the theater, too, because he's been nominated for a Tony Award and everything. Like, this man has really, is really a best. Yeah. It was great to talk to him.

I mean, he's a legend. Dope. Fantastic. You know, there's a lot of other stuff. stuff. I'm going to let you guys know, Rachel's got to go. So there's a lot of other stuff that we're going to get to and we're going to get to on Monday. The Georgia Bulldogs, Alex Haley,

which is deeply disturbing. Like, why? Sorry. Why? That's a tough one. And Gavin Newsom. Okay. This was Deroa heavy.

But right now we have to get to the, to mailback. And one would hope that during mailbag, we would get to some questions that really, really moved us. Okay, Melback time, let's go. Mailback time, time to read your letters, and then we'll reply to them. Oh, it's mailback time.

Write us with your queries, and we'll chime in. All right, let's see. First one is from Z. Jenkins. they ask in honor of National Teachers Week, which this week is, what is your funniest, weirdest, or wildest interaction with a teacher? It's Teacher Week, wow. Yeah.

I don't know. I don't have a wild story. I don't think I have a wild story about a teacher either. I have great teachers that I like, though. Mr. Gabbauer was a great teacher, Ms. Smith. Yeah, Ms. Hulet, Ms. Mary, men.

Yeah. One time I was late on delivering the paper. So I delivered the paper to Doc Walsh's house and maybe like 8.30, 9 o'clock at night. And I have a feeling that I almost got shot because I knocked on the door. Like, hey, this is my paper. I'm delivering it to Doc Walsh. It's like, it's too damn late. Her husband said.

And I was like, oh, I said this nigga is about to go crazy. I'll deliver the fucking paper. I shout out to teachers, though. Yeah. even know that. I like a teacher. You ever call your teacher, teach? What's up, teach?

You never did. You look like the type of person that, like, had that type of relationship. I'm telling you I didn't do that. You ever put like, I'm a front of the classroom type person. Yeah, you do. Like, hey, teach.

Hey, it's me. You ever put your pencil in your hair and was like, teach? Teach. It didn't. It didn't, man. Not one time. You never put the pencil on your hair.

It was like, look, teach. I was thinking about what you were saying. No, you didn't. Okay, fine. Next one. I think you should create a whole thing. of what you think I was really like.

A short film on what you because this image that you have of who you think I was back in the day is really interesting and couldn't be more wrong. That you and you ever watch Facts of Life? Here and there. I think you were a mix

of Joe and Tudy. Well, I would hope I had some Tudy in me. You were a mix of Joe and Tudy. You were Judy. Like Judy Lindsay, you come in there. Were you on the school paper? No, I didn't do the school paper. What did you?

Did you do yearbook or anything like that? I did yearbook like briefly. I did theater my last year. Bye bye Birdie. I was behind the scenes and the production. See, okay, hold on real quick. Because we got to go, but I do want to say something. The only worst, there's only one thing worse than theater kids.

I wasn't a theater kid though I kind of wish I was The only thing worse First of all shout out to theater Okay we talked about Delo Lindo We talked to him about theater And one hopes that you guys

Took something away from that But the only thing That I never understood about Because it's one thing to be in the theater But there's another thing to be like The grip On like a high school Things situation

You know what I'm saying It's like Rachel's back there It's like somebody's walking out You're pulling fucking sandbags from the fucking scene. It goes dark and I'm moving stuff. And you're moving stuff around. Dressed it all black.

You know what it was my favorite, my favorite teacher was over the department. And I, it was like one of the things that I hadn't done was my senior year. And I was like, you know what? I want to do something that I haven't done before. So you're standing there

with an eraser in your ear and a pencil in your ear. Chewing gum. Hey, I need to move that over. Stage lap. stage length. Hey, hey, hey, hey, hey,

this new shipment of, of, of, of, a fucking powder just came in. You got to talk to Lindsay about that. I asked for this

fucking two weeks ago. All right. Put it in the back. The stage manager. Did my powder come in? Huh? We need it. God damn.

We're doing a little shop of horror here. One more question. One more question. I wish we could have done that. One more question. Huh? I need my sad bag. Who's going down the loads to get the sandbacks?

Huh? That's the fucking do everything around here. God damn it. Okay. Throw my clipboard on the ground. The third clipboard that. Fuck! All right.

Okay, concert. Okay, concert asks, what was your first job? My first job was at Walmart being a Code 50. Rachel's first job was being a stage manager of little shop of whores. And then, God! God damn it. My first job was playing piano in Sunday school at age 11. Jesus Christ, you had a good life, man.

I'm going to be honest with you. I shout out to the judge of pretty hair. Rachel, you were set up for success. My God. Like, Rachel, I love the fact. You know, my first job was out with a fucking rubber boots for a concrete. in some of the worst places that we're slinging concrete around.

God damn it, 95 degrees. And my dad's saying, be a man, don't cry. You don't need no water. I'm like, God, what? You don't need no water. You know what? Water is for words you should.

You don't need no water. Do it. Shovel. Take that wheelbarrow over there. He used to say, you're a Cajon. That's Cajun for Hall. He'd be like, you know, Cujon de la. Come on.

Cujon. Be a Cujon. And I would have to be out there full of sweat, grown men, ex-comvits, drinking, all kinds of stuff, just going crazy. You know what I'm saying? But you have, okay, cool. And then there was me. Then it was you.

Playing chopsticks or playing. It was for church. It was for church. Oh, so what would you play? What would you play? You know, like, I woke up this morning with my mind. Oh, my God. Oh, my God.

And that's what you tell people when you're on the stage, you're like, bring the piano in. know all about a good piano. All right. I play piano for choice. Keys. Keys. Bring the baby granny. We need it right here for the solo.

Rachel, could you calm down? Get out of here. Tony, take us. Take it off. Take it off. Take it. I'm flirting. I'm Rachel.

Clipboard, Keys, Lindsay. Bye, guys. I woke up this morning with my mind, and it was stay on Jesus. Well, I woke up this morning with my mind. And it was stay.