Higher Learning with Van Lathan and Rachel Lindsay - Drake’s ‘Iceman’ Album Review. Plus, Tom Steyer’s Plan for California.

Episode Date: May 19, 2026

Van and Rachel review Drake’s highly anticipated new album, ‘Iceman.’ Did it live up to the hype? Then they discuss a white college student’s alleged scheme to attract Black athletes before gubernatorial candidate Tom Steyer joins the podcast to shed light on his potential policies for the Golden State. (0:00) Intro (8:33) ‘Iceman’ album review (35:06) Black athlete scheme (54:59) Tom Steyer joins the show (1:56:00) Polls in CA races Hosts: Van Lathan and Rachel Lindsay Guest: Tom Steyer Producers: Donnie Beacham Jr. and Jade Whaley Social Producer: Bernard Moore Video Supervision: Chris Thomas and Jacob Cornett  Learn more about your ad choices. Visit podcastchoices.com/adchoices

Yo, yo, yo, thought warriors. Donnie. What is up? Tyler, it is on. It is Ivan Lathan Jr. And it's me, Rachel and Lindsay. Donnie, can we talk for a second? Donnie, you knew this was coming today.

I don't want to be, I'm not, because I got love for Detroit. Shout out to all my people in Detroit. Shout out to Jason Wilson, Alexis, the whole family, the young man, everybody. Shout to all my people in Detroit. Shout out to Royce the 5-9. Shout out to all. all my people in Detroit. I got a lot of people in Detroit that I fuck with.

And the city right now must be kind of hanging their heads a little low. Donnie, what the fuck was that last night? Jesus Christ, bro. What happened? It was bad. They did not meet the moment. But, you know what, I have, I have a good job of looking at things from like a broad perspective. And I feel like with this team specifically, we're okay.

two years ago, we had a historically bad season. I think we're ahead of schedule. We're young. We're in a spot where a lot of teams would love to be in. A lot of fans will love their teams to be in our position. So, you know what? Overall, things are looking up for the Pistons. Go Tigers.

Okay. Okay. Okay. Okay. So, Donnie, before we move off this, let's just get a vibe check on the state of Detroit Sports, because let me look at the MLB standings right now. All right, let's not do that.

Things aren't great for the Tigers right now. Oh, what the fuck? You have time. You have plenty of time, Donnie. It's just, things are just getting started. Okay, so the Tigers are 20 and 27, but let's be honest, they're only five games out of first.

The Central is like drowning in mediocrity. So they're only five games out first. But look, the Dodgers hit a little skid too over there in the National League, the Dodgers, but they still 29 and 8. team. That's a skid for the Dodgers. You know how we get busy. Okay. So then lions, before we move on, lions, tigers,

and bears, pistons. Which team are you the most excited for do you think has the most chance, the most upside right now? That easily is the lions, especially after the schedule was released. I mean, you can't count your eggs before they hatch, whatever that cliche is. But based off of our schedule and the team that I know we have,

It is looking like we have a really good chance of... Donnie is so flussy right now. Donnie, you're not doing a good job of hiding. Donnie, I normally do this kind of thing. I can't get sayings right. Yeah. Donnie, you have to count the eggs. You have to count the eggs.

That's like you have to count the eggs. You need to know if you have a half dozen eggs. It's chicken. It's chicken. The eggs must be counted, Donnie. The chickens, on the other hand, you don't want to count them before they hatch because they might not hatch.

They might not hatch. It didn't feel right. I knew it was wrong. But yeah, you get what I'm trying to say. I feel like I feel really good about the lions looking at their schedule. Season is looking great. The tigers are like being devastated by injuries right now. But like I said, it's a long season.

And the pistons have a bright future. But overall, I feel like the lions, I should say, are in immediately set up for success in a way that the other teams might. It might take a minute. All right. I just wanted to check in with that. I saw that last night. I could not believe that goddamn score. Rachel, what's up?

What was your weekend? Oh, man. It's supposed to be chill. Friday, meetings, chilled. Saturday. I actually took the day. I'm very proud of myself. Normally I'm go, go, go.

I said no to a lot of stuff. I only saw the Devil We're's Prada too. Did you like it? Yeah. I felt like it put a nice bow at the end of like that franchise. And then my cousin, she's my favorite cousin, she's from Texas, Corpus Christi, but was celebrating her birthday in San Diego,

and I found out at the last minute, because I didn't realize she had sent me an invitation. So I drove to San Diego yesterday and back the same day to celebrate her 83rd birthday. We had so much fun. Shout out to Mary Louise. Happy birthday, Mary. We went to eat by the water.

We were at Coronado Island. and then, or on Coronado Island, and then we went to the juke joint. The juke joint? It was truly, and Brownie was there. Yeah. Yeah. I think it's called Fleet Reserve.

Shout out to them. Walk in, pool table, like good music. Like people know everybody, like family friends. The game was on. It was a good time. Fleet Reserve. I think that's what it's called. But that's my cousin.

Like when she used to come to Dallas, she would stay with me, and she would take me to all her spots that she used to party at that are still open. And they'd just be like these small juke joints in Dallas that we would go to. So fleet reserve, is this a military thing? Is that what it said? What does it say? So military fleet reserves, San Diego. Let me see.

Wait a second, because I knew you're going to look it up and now it's. Imperial Beach, California. Yeah. It's a social club and veterans advocacy hub featuring full bars, outdoor patios and community events. Okay, so it's like a, so you went down there was partying with Pete Hickson.

Like, shout out to my cousin. Not Pete Hicketts, stop. Shout out to my cousin. She lives life to the fullest. 83 years old, still doing her thing. She is so loved. These were her friends in San Diego that were throwing her this party.

It's like her fifth birthday party she's had for 83. Awesome. I just love the way she does life. Where, uh, were there like Navy people there? Not that I saw. You ever wonder, you ever been to like a Navy bar

or like a military bar. No. I have it. I see him in the movies all the time, right? I see him in the movies all the time. And for a black guy in the Navy bar, it only goes one or two ways. It either goes the way that it went for Jay Ellis

and Top Gun Maverick, where he's a part of the group. Or you walk into a bar and it's a bunch of like Marines in there and they come over there and they fuck with you. They go, ha, ha, you're a long way from the base. That's the movie. Oh, wait, you know what?

Let me take that back. You said, I only saw that movie. My cousin's cousin on her other side, he's not related to me, he was there, he's in the Army, and he's 103 years old. Wait, he was at Fleet Reserve? You was athlete reserve? He was at the dinner, at lunch with us, and then we went to Fleet Reserve. He's 103 years old. Shout to him.

Fought at Normandy and still outside, drives, lives by himself. He asked me to get him a bourbon on the rocks straight up. I was like, I love this crowd of people. just fully just like nothing stops them. Yes, yes. It was beautiful to see. Okay. Stephen A. Smith has threatened. This is not on the rundown.

What are you doing? What are you doing? Let me look at it first. It's not even nothing. So Stephen A. Smith has, how many athletes has Stephen A. Smith threatened at this point? He threatened. Donnie, can you remember all the top of your head?

Has he threatened or criticized? No, threatened. Straight up threat. Donnie, all the top of your head, how many athletes has Stephen A. Smith straight up threatened. Do you remember? I don't remember him threatening anybody.

Wow. How many times has he done this? So he threatened, remember he threatened Kevin Durant? You don't want me to do, you don't want to make an enemy out of me. Remember that? And now he's just threatened Jalen Brown. Jalen Brown, be careful what you wish for.

You really want me to start reporting on that level? Locker Room? How the organization might think of you? How the city might feel about you. This is a great. impersonation. How Jason Taylor may or may not feel about you.

You really want to make an enemy how to meet? That's Stephen A. Smith. Okay. LeBron James, Tiki Barber, Michael Carter Williams. Yeah. Matt Barnes. Matt Barnes and now he just went in on Jalen Brown. We'll have time for that. You know why?

Because Drake dropped. Iceman has hit the stores. How old are you? The rollout for Iceman, Drake's Iceman, reached his conclusion this weekend with the release of the aforementioned album, along with two others, Habibti and Made of Honor. So in total, that was 43 new songs released by Drake, almost two and a half hours of music. You all listened. What were your thoughts on Ice Man?

So I only made it halfway through Habibti. Thank God. Okay. I was going to say. And made of honor? Just because it's. It's so much music that I feel like there's no way to, like, give unless you just listen to music all weekend long an accurate assessment of all three albums. So I did listen to Ice Man all weekend long.

Okay, rate them. I can't rate them because I really didn't get into them as much. I feel like you could listen to half of Maid of Honor and Habibti and get a general sense of the album. I mean, I don't really want to rate them just because I just would rather just talk about Ice Man because I didn't really look. listen to these that much as well. I'll listen to a little bit. I heard Sexy Red and the Chachy Slide. They did a record of that. I'll listen to that. But like the other two

I really haven't dove into to be able to rate them. Ice Man I think is interesting. I think almost everything everyone is saying about Ice Man is true, which is like really weird for a piece of art. Almost everything everyone is saying is true. And what does everyone say? So everybody is saying it's not really something

that's like grabbing you and arresting you and like shaking you up and getting you to the point to where you're like wow it's not wow music but then people are also saying that it gets more palatable the more that you listen to it that's true which is also true

so I feel like Drake kind of set himself up in not the best way in the amount of time and this you know it's not really its fault it's just the way that everything you know kind of shook out with the whole Kendrick Drake thing but I feel like the expectations

were so high because the weight was so long and we didn't and it was supposed to come out and then it didn't and it felt like it kept getting pushed back and it felt like it kept it kept getting pushed back because and and who said it Rory or Mao said that they've never seen anything like this before and I'm assuming they're talking about the other two albums or heard anything like this or Drake is on something different and so there was just this expectation that we were going to see or at least for me that I was going to hear something that I had never heard from Drake before and it shouldn't be a letdown because I actually enjoyed listening to Ice Man. It felt familiar to me.

I told you, it felt like views. That's kind of how I felt listening to it. And I liked it. I enjoyed it. But it wasn't anything that was mind-blowing that I thought. And it was kind of what I expected. I expected for him to go after certain people and rap about that. Like even the context in what he was rapping felt the same.

It was like the same old stuff, like who he is, what he's done, how he's great, who he's against, you know, like how he's going to keep going forward. It's like the same content that we normally get from him. What's interesting is how the response to some of these records is exactly opposite of how you used to respond to Drake's shit. like when Jumpman first dropped when trophies first dropped when you first heard Drake's verse on

Versace when even headlines first came out these are not even in the pantheon I guess now of like classic Drake joints I remember there's a song on I think it's views called Child's Play it's one of my favorite Drake words

when that song first came on You're like, oh shit. Like Drake used to have this ability to get you into a record, like to push you into a record to where you could not disconnect from the fact that you knew you was going to be listening to this song for a long time. It's different now. It's opposite now. That kind of don't exist anymore. Now you are listening to the record because you're giving it a chance because it's Drake. Yeah.

So like as I'm driving home from, I was at a screening, I'm driving home from the screening, I'm listening to Ice Man, I'm like, yo, this sucks. This is whack. That's what you thought. On first listen. I'm like, this is whack. This sucks.

Then I'm like, man, it can't be whack. It can't be as whack as I feel like it was. So let me go spin it back again and listen again. And then the second time I was like, oh, okay. Well, now my expectations have been curbed because I don't think that maybe Drake does well with expectations in this particular point of his career. So now I'm just into the music itself.

It's not whack. And then on the third time, I was kind of like, oh, well, it's cool. Mm-hmm. Like, it's cool. But the first time I heard it, there was nothing to make me go, oh, my God, this is great, fantastic music. And still, I don't feel like it's great fantastic music. I feel like it's cool. It reminds me a lot of what Cole just put out not too long ago.

It's cool. It's cool. Yeah. Yeah. It's cool. But as far as the stuff that used to hit, and I used to be like, oh, shit, listen at this. Like the first time I heard nonstop, you know that joint?

Yeah. The first time I heard nonstop, I was in the islands. I was in Anguilla. Chilling. We had a private house. You know what? Ox tail, boats. You know what?

I wish you would do it again. Remember the days you used to take vacations? You need another one. I, yeah, just a vote, you know. You need another one. Just chilling, you know, doing the whole thing. I was on that. And I'm like,

ah, this is going to be my shit for a long, long time. It's going to be my shit. But it's different now. Like it's, now it's like,

for the people that are saying that Ice Man is trash, they could be right. For the people that are saying that Ice Man is good, they could be right. The music isn't,

to me, singular enough to distinguish itself to where there's any definitive truth to it or about it. And that's it. That's it. And I think when you, the word definitive,

when you, oh, I see Jade, by non, Head, G's... Gene Z. Gen Z. Corner getting activated.

Also, by the way, just let you know this is old nigger shit. I'm old. But, but we do... What about the Z's. Oh, by way, Tom Steyer's on the show today. But... Like, California gubernatorial candidate Tom Steyer's on the show.

But... But I do think because we... I'm so curious to hear y'all's take because the way we first heard of Drake, the way we consumed Drake, I don't even know what the first... Like, I don't even know the first time the Z-Quart.

corner over there has heard it. But I agree with you wholeheartedly. It's the word definitive. And I think that was what I was expecting. But I will say, I enjoy Ice Man. But I also kept thinking, I wonder which one of these is like the radio or clubbop.

That I don't think that... Or Ice Man? I think he gave... I think the point was to give you two more albums of that stuff. But that... I didn't hear it. I don't know. The other two albums are... The other two albums are... Sound totally different. I know, but those albums, aren't those albums supposed to be from what I was here? people were saying, I listened to half of a BT.

I did. I actually, that was a vibe too. You liked that one. I was listening to it while I was working, and I was like, oh, this is the type of album I would listen to while I work. But I only got through half of it as well. But yeah, I didn't hear the club. And I think that, all those songs you named were radio hits or club hits that we

rap along to. I did not hear that in Iceman, which is why I kind of compare it to views. Because I can listen to views. Most of the songs I listened to were never. on the radio and I just love that album that's what this kind of felt like to me in a way that's interesting um because I love views too but I didn't really compare it to views um I've been listening to Drake since really he started music uh my brother is a heavy young money listener so I was nine listening to young money so so far gone thank me later like that's what I

grew up on. This album, I gave it a five out of ten. Iceman? I gave Iceman a five out of ten. I didn't listen to the other albums. There was no club. There was no radio song. Why? Well, I think a few things. I think something that you guys

are pointing to is the fact that there wasn't this motivation or this energy that got you hype like his previous albums. I think that has to do with where he's currently at. I feel like this album was like

so repetitive to a lot of what he's already been talking about but also these are like they're just repetitive internal thoughts that I'm just kind of like okay we get it like the struggle of fame is crazy for you like your beefs are crazy I will say his disses were sharp

his disses were sharp we'll get into some of those in a second we can get into some of those which I appreciate it but the album as a whole this is a one time album list for me. It's like, okay. Damn. In terms of like, in terms of listening.

No, I gave it a second listen. But I'm saying like, no, I said like, well, I gave it a second listen so we could like, you know, I could have some, something to talk about. But I'm saying after doing this for research purposes, I'm not, there probably, there probably won't be another time where I listen to this album straight through again. I took my, my three songs that I liked out of 18 and I'm going to keep it pushing. Well, Bernard, I mean, you have anything? A white woman?

Bernard, just keep going. Bernard just pushed through. Come on. Come on, Bernard. Just keep going. Never knew that. Jesus. He was black.

Don't bring him into it. What? Nothing. No, but no, the album, didn't listen to the full album. I think I heard about... Y'all hate this nigga. Yeah, no, I didn't listen to that at all. No, it's not that I hate them.

I think it was just to the point where it's like Yeah He put a big old box of ice You know it was like a hype Everybody wanted to see what his next album was gonna come And like you said it was delayed So I honestly forgot about it I didn't even know it came out

Until we're gonna show Has Drake Pete? I think with the three albums He's also royalty maxing I think he's doing it Well didn't you do it just to fulfill his contract Like it was strategic That's what people are saying

But I just like The way I'm just like The way I look at it is, look, number one, this music obviously is not for me, right? It is music that is like the skill level of everybody involved is probably too high to make some shit that's like straight whack unless they just go in a crazy creative way. But like I will say that if you are comparing this to GNX, GNX seemed, which you have to now every time you have to compare them. GNX seemed inventive, it seemed inspired, it seemed like cutting edge, it seemed like it was like a true representation

of Kendrick culturally, but also sort of a broadening of his sound while maintaining the same creative juice. And this kind of just sounds like music. We've heard it before. It all very much so stayed the same. What did you say? He could have came at this so differently.

Like he could have approached the music sonically in a way that was groundbreaking for Drake. But he didn't do that. He just decided to do whatever cookie cutter. Do you think it's possible on Iceman that not to cut you off, but to cut you off? Do you think it's possible on Iceman that Drake felt like he had so much to say that he wanted to make sure that the actual content of the words lyrically that the ideas he had so many people to address that he chose beats with a little bit less

energy. He chose songs that conceptually aren't very ambitious, right? The songs aren't really about anything. That's what I was going to say. But that's because he wanted to make sure that everybody heard him. So the beats are a little bit slower. You can hear the bars are a little bit slower.

little bit better because he's addressing like all of hip hop and everything that's basically said about him in the last year. No, I don't think that that's it. I think well then what is it then? Okay, coming out from like a look, Drake's Scorpio so he's going to say what he wants, what he feels

and I think he needs to get that out but I think along with that you could do, you could, I mean all the biggest different, the biggest things that he had in this were beat switches. He just had like 10 billion beats switches. I know, but He had a bunch of beat switches, but John, what I'm saying is it used to be that a Drake song would have a specific cadence.

It would have melody. It would have something that was uniformed throughout the entire record. And that would be the DNA of the song. He's definitely not doing that anymore. So the question would be, why do you go away from that? Why do you go away from? I just hit this. And nobody else is doing it.

Even like on mob ties. Mob ties is about something. Like I could just throw out so many different. records that Drake has made that these records are contained and pointed and direct and they have sonic aspects of them that also make them unique. I was talking to somebody that said that that's not really Drake though. Like Drake does, this is why I say it sounds familiar. I don't think that he's done this grandiose thing or sonically like you're describing.

This sounded like what Drake does. This is the reason where I ask you, has he peaked? Because to me, it might be that people have moved past it. You compare it to GNX because like you said, how can you not? To me, what was so great, not just in, there were so many different sounds. Yes, which is something Drake didn't do, but it's also the storytelling. There was no storytelling in this. Like, I want to catch what you're saying and at least like follow it all the way through.

I did not get that from this album. And I think that that's what I was craving at the end of the day. If the music stays the same sounds the same, at least I'm hearing you tell some type of story that I can catch on to. And I just didn't get that. Okay. So Drake, over the course of his career, has been incredibly diverse with how he, incredibly ambitious with how he crafts a verse.

Like, think about worse behavior. like think about other records that Drake is on like the Drake songs that you know how Drake actually matches his his lyrical style to the beat get you in and out of pocket say so think about all my exes live in Texas like I'm George straight or they go to Georgia State with tuition his handle by now that's a Wayne song but Drake has normally took uh uh and done the he was never a gangster rapper Correct. But what he would do creatively on songs is what set him apart.

Lyrically. Like, lyrically. I'm talking about the sound. Hold on. But I'm saying lyrically, lyrically, melodically, which is part of the song. The first thing that got me into Drake is when Lust for Life comes on, Drake starts singing in the middle of the verse. And I was like, whoa.

Like, I was like, did he try to do that? Did I get a bad copy of the fucking thing? And it was always creativity fucking around with different sounds and doing all of that stuff. And on this, I don't hear a lot of that. But this is certainly a departure where he essentially gives you 18 timestamp records. And even in that, it's still not the same as those were. I think everyone out there like they wanted an album full of timestamp records. But the reason why the timestamp records stood out was because they were in contrast

to the type of creativity and adventuring that he would do sonically on the rest of these albums. That's why I think they stood out because it would just be like Drake at 1 a.m. in Atlanta rapping. But if you do that for 18, it don't hit the same to me. So I don't know. I don't know what the deal was, but I just think he just had a lot of shit

he wanted to say, look at everybody he diss. Look at everybody. Look at all the disses. He dis, look at all the disses. Okay Drake on this This Kendrake

Calate Cardi Rick Ross Rocky Rocky and Grange which I don't understand like what is

relationship Jay Z Mustard Farrell Push a team Lebron James I understand but sometimes

it seemed like there was I don't know what the fuck is going on it seemed like things are all

Damar de Rosen Dr. Dre and Joe Button dissed everyone yeah which that is something people were

expecting But that's what people were expecting. And they got it. And they got it. Well, yeah, he felt like everybody turned against him. So I quite naturally expected him to address it all in this album. And that's the one expectation he fulfilled. Didn't it sound familiar to you?

It did. But I think, again, his motivation in this one is different than his motivation in views. So you think it was really about he just needed to say this more than anything else? Yeah, I think he just had to get this off his chest. be honest. But I think that's kind of why, besides the royalty maxing in the contract, that's why he put out the other ones maybe to kind of allow people to have a different vibe, but I haven't listened to the other two, so I can't speak on those.

Yeah. Look, he's obviously had this sound before. I'm not saying that. I'm just saying to do this for this entire time. I mean, there are hardly any features on there. There doesn't seem to be that much. there wasn't any I said that I've said before there wasn't any ambition in it it was just

hey I really need to say this and what I need to say is more important than the way that I say it so because of that give me this mid to low tempo beat and let me wrap over it you should have just titled in journals like I feel journal entries

can I ask you this did he did we put this expectation on him or did he put this ex-bit, like, did he say, or someone in his camp or whatever things being leaked that this was about to be this, you know, mind-blowing album? Or did we as fans put that on him because it was coming after G&X?

We haven't had new music in a while. We do it to him every time. I know we do it, but I know we do that, but I'm just asking, did he say anything in regards to that? Not really. I mean, I think the rollout of it was like Iceman coming, Ice Man coming, Ice Man coming. I think the name Ice Man, like he's cold-hearted. He's not about to take no prisoners.

He's about to freeze up everything, the whole nine. He's got a lot of shit to say. I think all of that made people think that he was going to go scorched earth. And really what he did was go therapy. And that's not a dis. Like I think people thought it would be a scorched earth album and a high energy album, but really it was a therapy album. And when I say therapy, I mean, I think Drake legitimately thought that he had a whole bunch of friends in the industry.

Yeah, he didn't. And, and well. I'm interested to see how the rest, how people, as people continue to listen, because I think three albums was a lot. And I think three albums did turn some people off. If we weren't going to talk about it on this podcast, I don't know how much I would have listened to. Because the moment I heard three, I was like, I got to like put this in my schedule.

As more people are listening to it, I'm curious to see what some of the response will be. We've already seen people like the White House respond. Oh, this is interesting. It'll be interesting to see if Drake calls out the White House for co-opting his Iceman stuff. Now, I'll say this. other people have

Sabrina Carpenter Don't use my shit Theo Vaughn Don't use my shit I think it was either Lady Gaga or a Chaparone I think a couple other people There have been a lot of artists

That have been like Don't use my shit It'll be interesting to see Over the next couple of days As Trump becomes more aggressive Using the Iceman stuff if Drake will be like, don't use my shit in your stuff. You think that Drake will say that?

No. Why? Because he would have already done it. They would have already come out. I mean, the album's been out since Friday. When did they put that up? Saturday? They've done it a couple of times.

Yeah, so like, to me, you would have already done it. I can be wrong. I hope I am. But it doesn't take much to say, as you just laid out, several artists already have. Once they found out, they were like, hey, no. I guess my question is not whether or not he's going to do it or not. Let me peel back a layer. If he doesn't say, hey, Trump, stop using my stuff.

The question is, why would he not say that? Yeah, that's a great question. Do you have an answer? I do not. But I know who would say something. Who? Kendrick Lamar? You think so?

I think he probably would. And if he didn't like that, he would do it in a creative way, if he didn't do it an outright way. And maybe that's what Drake. Let me give him, that's actually not fair then. Drake might do it in a creative way. He might put out a song. He might do something else.

But I also, can I say this? I also don't think the White House would use Kendrick stuff. And maybe that's saying something right there. Huh. The White House rolls out. Cringe MAGA rebrand of Drake. So the White House never used Not Like Us or anything like that? No, it's been used against them.

Maga melts down over Kendricka Marshall. I just think they... Maga melts down is such a good headlight. Maga melts down. I think, yeah, I think they would know that they would, Kendrick would get at them. But I guess my question to that is... And I don't know if they would want to be affiliated with Kendrick.

That's what I'm saying. So, like, that, you could look at this and saying, well, why would they use him? Why would they feel comfortable? Because you named white artists that he's used. And I'm sure they're black. White, and have said no, and I'm sure there's some black artists. I don't know.

I was trying to move past that. Ativan. Ativan. Ativan. But now that's my train to thought, oh, you only named white artists that have spoken out and said, don't. I'm sure they're black artists too. But in this instance, why would he use Drake? Why would he feel comfortable?

Drake hasn't said anything yet. Maybe he will. It's just something to think about. There's somebody who was born over the weekend, by the way. Who? Ice fan. What do you mean? Why are you sitting like that?

I wrote some raps. Ice fan coming. Should we have the same level of expectations that we had for Drake's Ice fan? I'm saying. If Drake don't really get into the, If you don't rebuke MAGA, I got some Ice Van MAGA rap, so I'm going to debut on Thursday. I want to know what you think of him. What is that?

That's the ice. You got your pinky out? That's the Ice fan sign. That's what Drake be doing. It's the Ice. What is this? This is the Owl? That's the OVO.

So I'm going to do some Ice Van Raps. The list of people who have stopped, Donald, who have got on Donald Trump, Kenny Loggins, Sabrina Carpenter. The Isaac Hayes Estate. Shout out to Ike. Okay, black. Celine Dion, Abba, the food fighters, Jack White, Beyonce, because they used freedom.

Yes. Yeah. Well, that I guess is kind of, Kendrick. Yeah. Neil Young, Adele, Errol Smith, and then you have like Theo Vaughn,

you know what I'm saying? So like there have been a lot of people who have called out Trump for using this type of stuff. I wonder if Drake will do it. We'll see. We'll see if you will. But I'm telling you out something.

Ice fan coming there. There's a new Iceman. town. No, Ice Van. Oh, Ice Van. I'm sorry. Cute. You know. There's a new ice van. We're ready. Do you support? Yes, I'm eager. Will you be sexy red? Can't wait till... I would love to. Ice van and sexy red. Ice van and sexy R? I would love to be. Sexy R at IceVan. All right, Donnie, you're not even involved in the podcast today because of what happened to the piss and so we can just move on after talking about Drake, okay? But you're not

even engaging with this as you normally would. I don't know. I definitely was engaging. I mean, I actually looked up an article of a bunch of black artists who also who did mention who called out Trump. Okay, go for it, Donnie. Music, including we got Prince, his estate,

we got Aretha Franklin's estate, we got Earthwind and fire. There's others. Forrell. There's a bunch. That's all. Okay. Okay, cool. So Donnie was working while you were accusing him of not. Very unfortunate was Okay, Rachel, would you like to do your...

Oh, no, let's just do this. Let's just get... Okay. Let's just stay on... Well, I'm not going to say it that way. Just go ahead. So, Donnie... You've been eager for...

You wanted to do this last week. First of all, can we not do this where one of the hosts of the show gets indicted even before the topic comes out? I just really want to know what you think about this. I don't have a lot of thoughts. Donnie, go ahead. It's not for me.

Yeah, these text messages have allegedly exposed what's being described as a white college student's scheme to attract and keep wealthy athletes. Screenshots from this alleged text thread involving a student identified as Halen M, a roommate Lexi, and Lexi's sister went viral recently after first being shared by the Bish gossip. Okay. So this is what is going on in this group text.

I'm going to read these group texts. I want a football player NFL preferably A tall chocolate one This is what these white women are saying Like you did I want your life That's easy

The response comes in With a white thumb With a white thumb A white ass thumb Like a super white thumb But you have to play your cards right You can't be an emotional Little girl

Teach me she says Number one he's the prize These are the rules For white women to catch a black buck. Go ahead. These are the rules. Number one, he's the prize.

Remember, he can change your life. You can't change his. Number two, dealing with cheating. Don't look for it. Girls will throw themselves at him and some will succeed. But if it's just a fling, let it go. But don't let him get emotionally attached

to one of them. P.S. He'll all. Always be attracted to black girls. Activate that shenan-ne-nay in her by picking at her and let him see it. He'll ditch her quick L-O-L. Jesus fucking Christ. If she's like us, it'll be harder because more than likely she's playing to win him too.

Make him choose. Three, be an asset to him. Fold his clothes. Buy and bring him his food. Do his homework. Completely integrate yourself into his life where he can't function without you. Number four, don't embarrass him. Don't cheat.

Don't text other men. His cute friends and teammates will try you. God damn, ignore it. Just in case the relationship goes south, another athlete will see you as gold. Five, go completely wild on him and bed, wild. Use throat spray. It's so fucked up, bro. Do any and everything, be spontaneous.

Make it go down anytime, anywhere. Six, his mom. Lexley, do not. tell his mom any personal information, especially something negative. She will tell his entire family and he'll blame you. Just smile and wave and be quiet. Number seven, always look good and appealing. Hair and face always has to be done.

Push for marriage or at least to have multiple kids and you've got them. In two years on Draft Day, you'll be a millionaire and all your friends will work hard in school and literally never live the life you live. It's so sweet and rewarding. Lex, I'm in Cancun right now. So a couple of questions here. One, do you believe this to be true? Do I believe that this text message happened or do I believe her rules?

Do you believe that the... I do believe girls do this. You believe that girls do this. Yes. Okay. How successful do you think that it is? I mean, look around. I mean, do I need to give, do I need to, like, if you look around, the statistics are there.

You know, we've referenced this multiple times on the podcast, but there's always that picture of I can't remember what team it was or sport. It was basketball, football, and it shows all the wives. And I think one is black. So, you know, that's just one picture, one team. But statistically, the stereotype exists for a reason. So, yeah, I think this is true that girls absolutely go in there on a mission. I went to the University of Texas. I saw it 20 years ago.

I saw it 20 years ago. So let's say that this is true. Okay. Let's all assume that this is true. If, in fact, this is true, does it slightly alter our perception and the conversation around these guys dating these women? Why would it alter the conversation?

Because I'm going to tell you right now, what she doesn't say and which is the underlying theme here is y'all are fucking stupid. That's what she's saying. And y'all can be easily manipulated and it doesn't take much. All you do. No, she's specifically talking about attracting a black athlete, successful athlete,

not just anybody on the team, successful, which is not hard to find at a major school. That big school. So she's basically saying, these men are stupid, and I'm going to tell you exactly what you need to do. It's not that hard. So I think this is more of an indictment, if I'm being honest, on black athletes,

than it is on anything else. So this is what the question was going to be. Because it seems as if it's what the thought was that is that these guys get to a spot and they don't want black women anymore. They get to a place. They don't want black women anymore. It seems as if this woman doesn't even believe that. It seems as if her life experience or whatever, and I'm not taking this as gospel, even says that they will always. be attracted to black women. She's saying that.

It seems like she's saying that they must use nefarious means. They must cajole and connive to undo that. Does that change the way you look at the guys? No. Because the guys seem

to be victims of a multi-generational Becky con game that is looking at them and targeting them and doing all this stuff. They're like, no one's ever done this type of stuff for me before. She must really love me when really it's the Vanilla Vixen playbook of taking a Derek, taking a, see what I'm saying?

Yeah, like, thank you, Bernard. Taking a Derek, taking a goddamn Marlin, taking a Jalen, and making him into a slave for the white Becky society. And he doesn't see it coming. They see it coming. They see it. I mean, I told you before when I was at Texas, I literally would have guys say to me like, I don't date black.

We're college. We just got there. They're already coming in with this perception of, I'm dot dating black women. This is what I'm going to date. Black women are too difficult. This girl I ain't even gotten to you yet. And you're just already anticipating that.

So I can't say like, oh, they would have black women, but they've been targeted. And these women have come in here and calculated, it's so confusing that they couldn't help themselves. No. If I believe that,

then I have to still believe that you're stupid. So, I mean, stupid, they could be stupid. I'm not even saying that they're, I'm not stupid. I think that, and I can't say this for everybody.

And listen, I'm sure people fall in love with the opposite race just to fall in love. But I have seen this. I've seen it from black women, too. Seeing what from black women?

I mean, they say it in here. They say it in here. It's like, there will be, if the black girls like us, meaning she's coming at you the same way, then this is what you do against it. So it's not just why what I'm just saying, like when there's an athlete, people see dollar signs.

Like girls can see dollar signs if that's what they want them for. I think the difference is here is that if a black woman was doing this, I don't think there would be, there's some obvious racism. There wouldn't. Yeah, she's calling you. She's going to say nenees and all of that stuff. So this person is a racist. So like, just for all the guys out there that think this is great, just let you know,

this woman is calling your mama and your sister and everybody. and everybody shouldenay. These are racist that are getting into this. They're specifically, this girl is specifically implanting negative stereotypes and false things about black women in order for you not to like them. Right.

Which is crazy. Right. Things that they say that not only that, but they assume that these men believe these things. So I'm with you with all of this stuff. But there is an intentionality here. And the question is that, is this intentionality in and of it?

itself something if you were even to extract some of the more obviously racist things out of here does this intentionality change the way you look at these guys because they're essentially being preyed upon and they're being and they're being prayed upon it they're being preyed upon by someone that is going so far over and above that it might look like love you don't think that because i've also had athletes say this about like oh the what they were warned about when they come specifically by their black mothers. So they're not walking in where it's like, oh my gosh, this is happening. They are also warned that you are going to be preyed upon, especially now with like an NIL.

You are warned. These top athletes are warned that people are going to be after you because of your athleticism, because of what you can potentially provide, because of your potential millions. They know these things. So to be like, oh, they're preyed upon. They, like, they're victims and all of this. Like they had no idea. No, I'm saying.

But as if that's what it's insinuating, as if they had no idea, like, it's not their fault. These women are coming at them from all ways. I think that, like, it's one thing if you just want to have fun and have a good time, but to fall into this. I say, I just, again, it's an indictment. It's an indictment against my guy. I tell you why. I'll tell you why. I never look at women as victims of falling for love bombing.

because what I think is, of course. Like, of course you would believe that this guy was all crazy in love with you. Sure. Of course you would believe if you walk out your house and it's a Shetland pony. And here's the Shetland pony. His name is Maricio. I bought him for you. I'm going to take care of him.

And there is a carriage to take you to work. And there is all of this. And he starts to pay your bill and all of this stuff. And then he locks you down and then all of that goes away. I look at people like that and I go, because a lot of guys on the other side of the love bombing thing go, well, look, I do what I want to do. And then I stop doing it when I stop doing it.

When I hear people talk about the love bombing, I go, yeah. Of course, anyone will believe that this person is down for them in this incredibly profound way if they were doing all of this stuff. And then if you stop doing all of that stuff, then you love bombing. I think that's a legitimate thing. But are you an everyday person? Are you somebody who's got status, profile, and money? Because now I'm going to look at it differently.

Are you after me for me or are you after me for what I can give you? But you're not an everyday person. The guy, but here's the difference. A woman to men is not an everyday person. See, a woman, see, like when a guy is trying to get something from a woman, men don't look at women as particularly beautiful women, particularly attractive women. That's like not an everyday person. That's like the whole purpose of the whole thing.

The reason why you would see like a guy that is like super popping and on and stuff like that, Mary a lady that is beautiful that he loves that doesn't have his same stature is because the fact that she has that entire package and she's gorgeous and she all that is just very meaningful. But you're talking from their perspective. I am saying as the woman, my response to you is different. as far as accepting the love bombing. I'm talking about from my perspective, not why they do it because of how they see a woman,

which is I'm comparing the woman, we're comparing the woman to the athlete right now, right? So I know that I have something that is different. So I am going to respond to what you're giving me in a different way. That's what I'm saying these athletes could do. So the fact that are not, the idea that we're talking about

is these women are being strategic and they're going after them, and you're saying, well, is there this argument of they're being preyed upon? I'm like, but they know, coming in most of them that girls are going to be after them for a particular reason. So they shouldn't necessarily, or they should be skeptical about why a girl is coming after them. So I'm just saying, like, they're, the way they perceive it should be different.

Just like me as a woman, if I know that I have something, a status or money or whatever, I'm not going to be so quick to fall for love bombing if I know, if I'm, I'm more skeptical about why it is that you want to come after me is the point I'm saying. I don't think I said that well, but... For a question. Are women unaware that men seek to use them for their bodies and stuff like that? Are women aware of that? Yes.

Women are unaware of that. Oh, sorry. I said aware, aware, aware. Right. Women are aware that a lot of times men are saying things and doing things. I'm comparing the right. But the love bombing is still a thing that is called out and used as an explanation as to why their defenses were lowered. So I'm comparing this.

I'm saying these athletes, sure, know that people are taking advantage of them. And by the way, I'm not saying that these guys don't have. I'm not doing that at all. I'm just saying as an intellectual exercise, these athletes know that people are taking advantage of them. They know that. Women know that men are there to take advantage of them in a lot of times. But a lot of times, like love feels like love. And what we actually, at the end of the day, criticize are the people who are

make something other than love look like love to draw somebody in on false pretexts. And that's what we're doing when we're talking about love bombing. When we're talking about love bombing and I think this is, we're talking about love bombing. There are a lot of women that are saying,

hey, this guy never really felt this way, but he did all of these things to get me in to harvest my body, then got away from it. This is different. These women are willing to be in the situation but they are harvesting these men in a way. So just to me, there are things in here that are like really disgusting, but I do see this as being a sort of love bombing. And love bombing is normally, normally, normally something that we blame the love bomber for and not the victim of the love bombing. Do you blame women when they're a love bond?

I don't think it's the same thing. Okay. It's not exactly the same thing. You're right about that. I just don't think it's the same thing. So, no, I think anybody can be susceptible to love bombing. But I don't think that what you're saying is the same thing as this. You don't think that love bombing is, you don't think, even though she's describing it to a T.

Hey, man, let me tell you something out there. If you were defensive lineman, you know damn well that girl wasn't fucking with you. Okay? I'm just like, I'm letting you know. Shout out to my niggers, man. Shout out to my niggas. I love the O and D lineman. Y'all got a, huh?

I like the D lineman and an O lineman, but, you know. Well, you, that's my point. You will. You will. Because, like, them guys always has something in, like, but you know, goddamn well, man. Y'all be, y'all keep your head on the swivel out there. They know, but I think sometimes they just don't,

and this is a generalization, they don't care. Like, they, there is a prize in it for them as well. well. Just like when you see like a super rich, a really pretty woman with a really wealthy guy who's not an athlete. There's a, it's a give and a take. But that also goes that also plays into the love bombing thing when a guy shows you all of this stuff. Oh, but I'm not even saying it's love bombing. I'm just saying it's transaction. I know. But also when somebody does all of these things for you, that's a part of the love bombing, the part of the love bombing is the fact that this person can't, the fact that this person is well off, the fact that this person is well off, the fact that this person can afford to send flowers and they can afford to do all this. And they can afford to do it. So part of it, all of that stuff is par for the course. I just think the biggest takeaway from this is they think black athletes are stupid. Like they can all you, you can follow this to a T and you can, she says it. You can have every single one of them that you want. It is an indictment.

I'm sorry. It really, this text message exchange is truly that. And like, that's why when you were like, you want to talk about it, I'm like, I shouldn't even be the audience. This should be a wake-up call. It won't be. But a wake-up call, they should read these text messages. This is so interesting to me. They should read these text messages.

You know how like before you go into the draft, you got like the finance classes and like remember Dion Sanders brought Britney Renner to speak? They should read these text messages. You're like just by the way, just by the way, I would love to conduct the class. PowerPoint, give me a pointer. I just think that hearing somebody's talk about you and black women, you might have a sister cousin, aunt, mother. Like, I just think, like, we know these things

before I even saw this, right? Again, went to Texas. But when you see it like this, if I'm the person they're talking about... I'm like, you can't do that to me. I would be like, oh. Get off me. Okay.

Leave me alone. Let me go celebrate these black queens. Get with the black queens. Get away from me. But I'm saying we also should say this. These are like 19, 20-year-old guys. I mean, like, we just, like, I'm not, I'm shooting a lot of bail.

Yes, there's an immaturity. No, no, no. To be fair, there's an immature year. These are 19, 20-year-old. There's an immaturity. Like, these are 19-20-year-old guys. These are young guys. That's why I think, I thought this was an interesting conversation just in the case of, like, when I'm looking at it.

And this is anyone, because, like, women can love bomb as well. It's not just men who love bomb. Women can love bomb. Men can love them. Yeah. Women can love. And so when I looked at this, I was like, when I see somebody, doing that just to catch somebody.

Now, if you really fall in love with someone and you want to do all of this stuff for them, making the sister into a shenay and all of that dumbass shit, then that's one thing. But if you are doing this as a fishing expedition, then you're like one of the worst types of people around. Just like

if you're overly, overly, overly love bombing somebody just to get something from them and then cast them back out, I think that's fucked up too. It is. And so I was just wondering what you thought. But then, you know, fellas, head on a swivel, man. Head on a swivel. Cause these draft day, these draft day camera shots

are starting to get tough. Your mama don't like that girl. I'm sick of watching that man. Your mama don't like that girl. I see this black woman on the couch. She's like, mm-hmm, the girl trying to hug her. Your mama don't like that. This episode is brought to you by Activia.

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It's starting to get tough. Start to get tough. Okay, we are trying to help California decide and in doing that we have to talk to one of the leading candidates in the California gubernatorial race I like to call him the Uncle Tom of the billionaires I've not heard you say that never heard that one before man I should have been used that Tom Sire joins us today on higher learning how are you I'm great how are you we're going to get right to it because the race is heating up you guys just had a debate

and I personally am noticing something else. I'm noticing a swell of people, progressives that I know, people that I trust, getting on the talent train, a lot of them, people that I really trust. I wonder, though, if they're being paid. The New York Post recently did a story of your campaign paying $100,000 to an influencer named Carlos Eduardo Espina, maybe. Are people responding to your policies or to your pockets? How do you respond?

to people that are saying that you have a paid enforcers campaign? We don't pay anybody to endorse me. Okay. We believe influencers have a job and need to be paid. And so we pay them for their time, but we don't pay anybody for endorsements. And in fact, the people are putting this out, which is the Bessera campaign, works through influencers in independent expenditures that aren't transparent. We're completely transparent about everything we do.

And so do I believe that people are responding to what we stand for? I'm Van, I'm assuming you've looked at some of the policies in this, right? Absolutely. And I don't want to, you know, make complete assumptions. But look, I'm the person with all the progressive policies. I'm the person who has actual plans to change things for working people in this state. I am the person who's actually taking on the corporate special interests. They have already spent a record amount to stop me.

So when you say, what are people responding to, look, I can tell you the people, the corporate special interests think I'm a threat. And they're not spending a penny against anyone else in this race. And if you look at the people who are supporting me, I mean, I was just telling you I was down at SoFi Stadium with the Unite Here workers. I was the only person running for governor who was there. But I have union support. I have progressive support. I have environmental support. I have our revolution Bernie Sanders, the organization Bernie Sanders started as support.

So what is actually happening in this race is, to me, a very simple thing. Do you want to take back the state from the corporate special interest who run this state, which is the only way we drive down costs for working Californians? Or do you think basically the way it works now where the oil companies and the electric monopolies and the health insurers control this state? And I'm saying it's way overdue for working people to get fairly represented that this is the richest state. in the country with the highest poverty rate. This is a state that used to be number one in education. We're somewhere in the 30s. This is a state that has basically created immense wealth for a few

people and is leaving everybody else behind. And that's not right. And so, you know, do I think, I don't know why people respond honestly, but I can say this. My policies are completely different from everybody else. There's no one else taken on the electric monopolies. There's no one else taken on the oil companies. I'm the person pushing for single payer by far. hardest and everybody knows it and the corporations know it and the billionaires know it. You know, and if you looked, there was a debate, not the last one, but the one before, they asked, do you want to tax billionaires? Seven people on this stage, six knows one yes. You've said that Californians deserve a life they can afford and a lot of people would say you

specifically don't have to worry about that. Why should they trust you and your read on what they need. So let me say this. I don't think, first of all, you should know my whole job in this campaign is to see more Californians than anybody else, to look more people in the eye, hear exactly what they're saying. This is an incredibly diverse big state, 40 million people. You know, there's the valley, there's the north. This is a very, very diverse state. And my job is to meet as many of those people and listen to what they're saying. But let me say this. I think everybody knows California's can't afford to live in California. The real question that I think people should be asking is who genuinely wants to change it and who has gotten results in history. And if you look

in the private sector, I started a business. We're sitting in a room with no windows. I started in a room with no windows and nobody else. And I made a business out of it. I had to get results and I did get results. And as a private citizen, I've gotten results in the public sector. I've taken on three big corporate special interests at the ballot. Every time people said, you're a nut, you don't know what you're talking about, they're going to cream you, and we smashed them every time. I've registered 1.2 million young Californians because I felt like you want a representative democracy. Young people are part of that. They're way underrepresented. My wife and I have started a non-profit community bank that's in the billions of dollars to undo basically racist redlining around the state. We have worked

We worked for years to put together a coalition that got free breakfast and free lunch for every school kid in California. We have worked, we have 20 people in Sacramento who for the last 11 years have been working on every piece of progressive legislation in this state, run by a black guy named Arnie Soell, who has done a fantastic job. So when you say, how can everybody knows what the problem is in this state, housing is way too expensive. Healthcare is way too expensive. We pay twice as much for electricity as the average American. But oil companies are robbing us at the pump every day. We know the problems.

The question is, what are you going to do about it? And are you really willing to do it? And if you guys look, I mean, I always tease about it, but I'm somewhat serious. We have a plan on every one of these that's detailed. It's on the web. You look at artificial intelligence. We had the first plan. We have by far the most comprehensive plan.

And it's one that's looking forward to the tsunami that's coming at us. So when you say, why should people trust me? I've done this full time for 14 years. I've been working on these issues for a really long time. I've gotten results as a private citizen. Somebody needs to step up in the state. I asked a bunch of people if they do it before I ran. Right.

Someone has got to take on these special interests. And I'll give you an example, Rachel. The lobbying group for the oil companies is called the Western States Petroleum Association, WUSPA. A week ago, the head of WUSPA said in a public meeting in Sacramento that he believed it was the fiduciary duty of the oil companies to charge every cent they could extract from Californians as a result of the Iran War. That is not a group of people that I see I want to put my trust in. Sure.

And I think we need somebody who's going to stand, I've been standing up for those guys for, you know, at least 16 years. Would you be in favor for a windfall tax? I talk about it every day, Van. It's like it's a windfall profit. They put this guy into the presidency. He started a war to control oil and gas. We're paying for it at the pump.

They're making $70 billion and people are, you know, people are basically spending a day of their earnings a week on gasoline. That's where we are. There is a windfall profits tax on the books that we could activate. We don't have to pass a law. There's a law in the books. I'm the only person, if you listen to those debates, they keep saying, should we give up on the gas tax? I'm like, give up on the gas tax.

That's 40 cents. I want a buck 50 from the oil companies going directly to Californians. They are robbing us ruthlessly. And their lobbyist said their duty is to rob us as much as they possibly can. I think somebody's got to be on the other side of that. So I think something that's happening, particularly with young people on the left, is they're asking which politicians that they can trust. They hear a lot of plans, but they wonder if the will is there. So conversation specifically around you, in your past, you've invested into private prisons.

You're now against private prisons. You've invested hundreds of millions of dollars into fossil fuels. You're environmentalists now. You've campaigned against single-payer health care. You're now a single-payer health care champion. Do you think it's fair for people to ask who you really? are based upon some of the... Of course it is.

Okay. Of course it is. And let me say this. There are no hard questions in this world. They're unprepared answers. So let me go... Can I go through each one of those ones if you don't mind? Private prisons.

So I ran an investment firm. We owned hundreds of... It's a stock. 22 years ago, we bought stock in a very small private prison company. And within a year, because I was talking to activists, I thought, this is wrong. we just made a mistake. We just shouldn't be doing this. And we got out.

That is over 20 years ago. I didn't just take it. I made a mistake and I stopped making a mistake. First of all, it's a big reason I left my business. People ask, why did I walk away 14 years from billions of dollars? The reason is that wasn't why I was put on the planet Earth. I didn't care about that. I'm from a family that believes in service and giving back.

And I felt like I'm not even living here. I'm just making money. I don't want that life. And this was a big thing. part of it, that it was a wake-up call. But I have also worked to push California away from a period of mass racist incarceration towards rehabilitative justice. And we have worked on that in multiple ways. We've worked to decertify officers who misbehave. We've worked to get rid of sentence enhancements. We've worked to end the death penalty. We've worked for bail reform.

We've worked in every single progressive way to move us from that system of mass racist incarceration to rehabilitative justice, towards treatment, towards the concept that people need to get a second chance, need help in going back into the community, need to go back as productive citizens so they don't commit another kind and get incarcerated, but in fact, are prepared to have a life that's successful and productive. We have done that, and that's one thing I want to say. And the second thing is we have not just started working on ice. I mean, I have a campaign. I've said ICE should be abolished, and I have a strong anti-ice platform, including prosecuting ICE agents for racial profiling, which is illegal in California, or committing crimes against California violence against Californians and going up the chain, including the people who send them to do. But I didn't just start doing that. We worked to make California sanctuary state in 2019. In 2018, my wife and I put together a private program basically to hire lawyers for people who are under threat of deportation.

We have worked, you know, I'm a huge believer in immigration. I'm a huge believer in protecting immigrants. That's a big part of what I was doing today down at SoFi Stadium is they're trying to bring in an ice to the World Cup and to get all the information. So in answer your question, I made a mistake 22 years ago. and I've worked very, very consistently and hard to undo it. And let me say this, if you want to follow the money, the people who are the most progressive criminal justice organization in this state is called smart justice.

They endorsed me and nobody else. And the prison guards are spending millions of dollars against me because they believe, they're spending their money because they believe I'm against mass incarceration. They believe I'm for rehabilitative justice. They believe I'm for treatment and halfway house. to try and prepare people to go back into the community. So I will say, yeah, I made a mistake. And for people who are religious,

the most famous story about this is Paul on the way to Damascus, having been the biggest opponent of Jesus, and saying, I made a mistake, I'm going to make a U-turn, and in fact I'm going to be the biggest supporter of Jesus. And so I'm not saying I'm St. Paul, but what I am saying is people can change. Right. I'm saying for people who are incarcerated, you get a chance at redemption.

You get a chance to remake yourself. And I'm asking people to believe, I've worked on this for way over a decade. I want people to believe that actually, in every one of these instances, I've come to realize something new. And look, I've worked so hard on clean energy and environmentalism and environmental justice and climate. every environmentalist in this state and in this country is endorsing me. You know, I've beaten the oil companies at the ballot box when they were trying to gut cap and trade in 2010. I've been fighting, you know, I'm the only person who's used the words, windfall profits tax. Everybody else who's running has not said a single word.

Every time I go like, this is what we should be doing. Everything looks at me like, you're a fool, the oil companies are going to come and try and destroy you. And they're right on that. But I'm not a fool. because if we don't stand up for ourselves, we're going to get taken to the cleaners and we're getting taken to the cleaners right now. And in terms of single payer,

let me talk for a second about single payer. I believed part of the thing that's happened for me, I went to business school. And I grew up thinking democracy, capitalism, that's how people get their rights. I grew up in the middle of the civil rights revolution. And I believe this is how we give people more rights. this is how living standards move up.

And what happened was, as I got older and saw things and got the facts in front of me, it was like, okay, maybe that's right in the hole, but these things are very, very wrong. And so when I think about single pair, I know because I've looked at the numbers that health care is chewing up every family in this state. It's chewing up every business that has to pay for their employees' health care,

and it's chewing up the budget of the state of California. and the only way, I think health care is a right for everything in California. It's the right. If we're going to deliver health care for everybody in this state at a good level, the only way I can see being able to afford it is going to single payer. It's not about me. It's just the facts. And I listened, I listened originally thinking,

everyone in business was like, Tom, we'll get this. Competition will drive down costs. There are people on that stage saying exactly what I just said, we're going to introduce competition, blah, blah, blah, blah, blah, blah. blah, blah. No, healthcare has gone up at twice the rate of inflation for 50 years. We can't afford it. It is eating us up. And all I'm saying is we need to accept that fact and accept that health care is a right. Now, what can we actually do to change it? And there are a bunch, you know, Javier Bissera said he was for single payer. He went behind closed doors. He talked to the biggest lobby against single payer. And they endorsed him the next day and gave him the maximum amount of money, saying he very clearly stated,

he's not for single pair. So let me say, I'm, look, a lot of this is about who can you trust. That was the question you asked, Rachel. I'm trying to tell you exactly why I did these things and to acknowledge when I'm wrong, because if you don't acknowledge when you're wrong, how can you be right? Yeah. Yeah. I want to kind of piggyback on what Van was saying. Van laid out how your policies have changed over the years, and you talked about it even further. Obviously, the candidates in the race aren't going to highlight, other candidates in the race aren't going to highlight that. Their biggest talking point against you is that you are the only billionaire in the race. And that plays into this mindset that maybe some voters may have of can they trust a billionaire? You talked also about how you were the only candidate who believes in a billionaire tax for this state. Why, or let me ask you this way, should billionaires exist? And if so, why? So let me say this. When we think about, my basic campaign is about shared prosperity.

And when we think about California, the thing that we do as a state, different from every other state in this country and pretty much any place else in this world, is we innovate. You think about the film and entertainment business. That wasn't even a business. That was made up in Los Angeles, California. Certainly. And built by tens of thousands of extremely talented people, they made something up and created a whole business. And if you look at what's going on ever since,

is that. What Californians do is they create. They look forward, they imagine things, and then they make them happen. And when that happens, a lot of times there's value associated with it. I want people in California to continue to do that because that's actually our strength. And so when I look at, and I can give so many examples of people outside this straightforward business world, you know, who have created, who've come up with new ideas.

Magic Johnson is somebody from L.A. who just, he was a great athlete, sure. But then he created a whole other thing going on around it. And I don't want to stop that and I don't want to put a lid on it. It's like as far as I'm concerned, sky's the limit. But the reason people come here to do that from all over the world is because, you know, you know, this is the place where you can do it. This is the place that has an ecosystem that supports it. We have great schools. There's, you know, Hollywood, there may be a bunch of stars and a bunch of directors, but there were tens of thousands of incredibly talented people to make those companies

actually work. When you look at building an IT company or an AI company, why are they all here? Because the people you need to make that happen are all here. And this state was built by working people, it runs on working people. People have been, and let me say this, and this is the part that I find most emotional. This system has been built over a thousand years, mostly by very poor people standing up for freedom, liberty, and democracy. That is, and the rule of life. That is why we have our system. That didn't just happen. Elon Musk came here from South Africa to create a company. He could have stayed in South Africa, but that didn't exist there. So I don't mind people coming here, I encourage people to come here and create, to innovate, to do new things.

It's fun. And this guy's limit. You can't come here and rip us off. You can't come here and spit. That's why I was so mad at SoFi Stadium. You can't come in here and rip off the working people that make this whole state run. And also the descendants of the people who for a thousand years have stood up for what's right and often died in the mud. I think the conversation over billionaires is an interesting one because it's sort of dueling thoughts on the existence of a billionaire. One is sort of the American paleo-capitalist idea that people create an abundance and they make a lot of money because they're innovative or they take chances. The other one is the belief that the existence of the billionaire itself in this country

is proof of a systemic contagion that allows someone to make that much money and hoard their wealth and then continue to hoard their wealth to the point that they have an abundance of resources while other people are sleeping on their share. And that's, I totally buy the second. It's the hoarding part.

That's what I was trying to say. You can't come here and create and make all this money and not pay back. Even in the creation of all of that wealth, just the breathtaking systemic dysfunction that has to exist to produce somebody that has $500 billion, but also someone else who doesn't have a home. So I guess the question is specifically on billionaires, and the question is, do you think that that type of wealth creation for a single person or entity should be something

that happens in America or in California? I am not opposed to people creating. I'm opposed to people hoarding. And let me say this, just so you know, my wife and I have taken a pledge to give the bulk of our money away while we're alive. I'm not going to die a billionaire or anything close to it. But we've said, look, I started a business. I mean, give it another way to. Where do I put my? Your request? Yeah, what I put my request there? My wife actually probably better than me.

No, but I'm being serious. Because my point is this. Look, do I, I started a business and I made a bunch of money. I don't want to hoard it. I want to use that money to actually push for justice, for economic, racial, and environmental justice in the state of California. And that's exactly what we've been doing. And so, I agree with you on the hoarding part. I don't think it's positive at all. I think that, and that's why I'm in favor of, that's why I'm for taxing billionaires. That's why I'm going after these big corporations. Because to me, the idea that we could create trillionaires when most Californians can't make rent is

absolutely wrong. And that's, look, if you look at this race, the person who is attacking that idea head on is mean. And it's in, if you look at every single policy and compare me to other people, I'm just in a completely different place because of what you said. I'm not opposed to people starting a company that people think is worth a lot of money. I'm opposed to people hoarding that money when other people are suffering. And that is why I was down at SoFi Stadium. FIFA is going to make $13 billion from this soccer tournament and they're trying to screw down on working people who are not being fairly paid and they're calling in ice.

That is my idea of exploitation. The idea that you're going to make your money on the backs of working people is not fair. And the idea that you're coming into this windfall and you're not sharing it with the people who make it possible and who have made it possible is not fair. And that's my point is like, look, we can't have a system where people make these phenomenal

amounts of money and don't share it. And that's why I keep saying shared prosperity. This has to be a sense that we're building a society that's fair, that's just. And I don't believe that the kind of society that you're describing, then, it's not only that it's not just, I don't believe it can possibly work. I really don't. And I think that that is not, that is a very un-American society, in my opinion, very far from the values. But look, we're obviously at a crisis point in the United States of America. I mean, you look at what happened in voting rights last week. You look at what's happening with ICE, what the president wants to do with it. You look at this war where he's said, we are not going to have money for Medicare and Medicaid, or in our case, Medi-Cal. Because we're

fighting wars. It's like, what? We're at a real crisis point in terms of democracy, in terms of economics, in terms of fairness. And we're in a crisis in the natural world. And I'm saying, That's what this election is about. If California is going to lead, we have to have someone lead for goodness sake. Someone who's going to take on the delusions coming out of D.C. And the stranglehold these corporations have unworking people. And that's all I'm trying to do. You know, we've seen you on other progressive platforms and the support that you've got there

and even some of the backing that you're getting from some progressive organizations. I'm curious as to what you would credit to the rise of the progressive billionaire candidate because it just seems so like when we were in the Citizens United era and that Supreme Court decision came out and it was the left that was opposing all of that. Why do you think that there's this rise now of the progressive billionaire candidate? Well, let me say this. I have, I don't have to take money from all of these corporations in order to run. Yeah.

Honestly, Rachel. And do I think that's fair? No. and do I think, am I for changing the way campaigns get financed? Yes. And do I think Citizens United was a complete disaster? Complete disaster for the, but I also think, let me go a little further and say this, I don't have to take their money, which means I can tell the truth.

I don't have to take their money, which means I can stand up to them. And, you know, corporations spent over half a billion dollars lobbying in Sacramento, California in 2024. for. The big money is in this race that the billionaires absolutely do not want to be taxed and the corporations absolutely want to be able to control this state. And so I don't think it's fair, but the truth is someone has to stand up to these people who's not going to back down and won't give in. And it's not fair, but somebody's got to do it. And I asked a bunch of people if they would run because I'm not coming here as a savior. I'm coming here hopefully as a important part of a coalition of people across this state who stand up for what I think of as California values,

which have a lot to do with justice and a lot to do with equity and a lot to do with being an incredibly creative, innovative, and productive state. But in a way that it's shared. And so I look at this as this. I mean, obviously these oil companies own deal. That seems to me incredible. They want to own Sacramento. The electric monopolies. They have a legal monopoly. They love that.

They are charging us. They're absolutely overcharging us and stopping us from using innovations that would put money in people's pockets. Because it's not in their interest. And it's like, I see this. Maybe I have more insight because I spent time in business. Like I know a lot.

You know, when you talk to him about insurance, I, for better or worse, know a lot about insurance and a lot about, well, but someone has got to stand up, and it can't be one person. It's got to be this coalition of people who say, we need more justice in this state. We don't want to, we want to be a productive state, we want to be an innovative state, we want to do all the things California does. But it's all of us, and we should all take pride in creating the 21st century state the way it's supposed to look. And that's what I'm really trying. It's like, this is not the 20th century. Certainly. I want to get specifically into some of the policy in a second. Really more so, I mean, your policy, I encourage everyone if they want to know about Tom Steyer. There's a bunch of downloadable TVF. You can go into the visor of all of that stuff. But before we get to it, just to put a bow on this sort of talk about capitalism and exploitation and how it exploits people.

What policies of yours do you feel like specifically stop or cartel, gangster cartel-type capitalism that exploits working people and creates these really aggressive monopolies? Talk about that. Okay. So let's talk about it. I mean, a lot of this revolves around energy and a lot of it is going to revolve around AI. So I want to talk about oil companies, electric companies, and artificial intelligence. oil companies. Look, they're obviously overcharging us. They've admitted to it and said it's their duty to charge us every last penny. They obviously pollute the water and air, particularly

in low-income, black and brown communities. They don't pay for that. And they're also, it's quite clear that our climate and our natural world are in trouble and they're a gigantic contrary to that. And they don't pay for that either. And they're working really hard to make sure they never pay for that. They are asserting, monopoly power on us. The price of gasoline has gone up a buck 50. Their costs have not moved by a penny. So they're making windfall profits.

Someone has to stand up for them on all of those scores. I believe polluters pay, period. We can talk about exactly how I think about pollution in the natural world and environmental justice, which in my mind are all one question. But there's one group. And I've said windfall profits taxed, polluters pay, you know, we're moving.

Cabin invests. We're moving to clean energy. It's cheaper. It's much cheaper, and they're trying to prevent us from doing it because they own the fossil fuels and they want us to only use fossil fuels. But the cost lines have crossed. We've got to move. We've got to be on the right side.

We've got to save the money. We've got to build the businesses around it. The second one is the electric monopolies. You're not, you know, just to give you guys some numbers. It probably costs two cents. to generate electricity per kilowatt hour from solar. Just take the two. And it probably costs two cents to store it in a battery.

So they're charging us 35 to 40 cents. And it's illegal to compete with them. And I'm saying, no, no, no, no. We need to allow people to generate and store electricity and have localized grids so they can compete because they're charging us an amazing amount of money to do the distribution. for the, and it's, they can charge whatever they want because it's a monopoly.

So that's the second one. I definitely want to change the way the electrics. And you guys should know, and most people don't. There is an electricity revolution going on in the world. The price of electricity is plummeting. The price of storage is plummeting batteries. It's a revolution all around the world. You know, Pakistan increased their electricity.

electricity generation by 50% in one year without telling the government or going through the utility. That is going on in every continent. They're trying to prevent us from participating in that and using all the new technology, which is mostly invented in California. So that's two. What was the third one I was going to? It was oil companies. AI.

AI. Yeah. Let's say you're running for governor. You tell us. I'm in like seven fights, man. I'm trying to remember the three I chose for this. So artificial intelligence. It's here.

You know, people keep saying, it's coming. It's not coming. It's here. Well, it depends on what you believe. Well, these companies have got huge contracts. That's true. They have, on paper, created unbelievable wealth. Right.

And people are adopting it in multiple verticals, many, many, many, verticals across our economy. So it's, and if you talk to young people coming out of college in California, which I do, they're terrified about jobs and they can't find jobs. And they, you know, I talked to some guy, I think two days ago who's a senior at Cal who's like, we don't even know what to do. We're not getting job offers. You know, I'm about to graduate. I don't, literally don't know what to do about it. My only point being, we cannot allow attention. technology created in California, 60% of the world's artificial intelligence is California. So this is the, you know, all the companies that we talk about are California.

And I always say there are two things to know. We can't have 12 trillionaires and millions of people put out of work. And we need to think of AI as a tool for workers, not a replacement of workers. So the policy we have, the two things you should know, number one, protect workers. I think we have a guarantee that we will produce a job, a good paying job for people who lose their job to AI. And secondly, Californians own the beach. You know, we own the beach on the Pacific Ocean from Canada to Mexico, the people of California. No one can buy that from us.

We need to own part of AI. This is a California threat. It's also a big boon. We need to participate in the upside so we can protect workers. What would be your take then on AI data centers? I mean, if they're like obviously you're talking about energy. We're talking about a water demand. There's so much reporting about what these data centers do to communities that surround them.

Do you think that there should be a moratorium? I don't think there should be a moratorium. What do you think that we should do? But I do think no data center should be allowed to raise the price of electricity for any community that goes into by a penny. These are companies worth hundreds of billions of dollars. They can afford to pay. So they shouldn't be allowed to raise the price of electricity. And they shouldn't be allowed to take water from a community that needs it.

And so in every instance, I mean, if you think about it, they go into a, you know, farmers and ranchers use 80% of the water in this state. A farm without water is worth nothing. a ranch without water is worth nothing. And so the idea that a huge hundreds of billions of dollars corporation is going to put a data center, talking about a data center, I think that says twice the size of Manhattan Island could come into a community and raise the price of electricity and take water that people need to do. That clearly is not fair. Clearly not fair.

And when people think about these, building a data center takes a lot of jobs. You know, it's a construction job, right? Running a data center takes almost no jobs. So you're doing, you don't want to make this trade of a short-term gain for something that will devastate your community over time. And so to a very large extent,

to answer your question, I want to make sure that communities are aided by this or it doesn't happen. Also, Tom, though, if they, I'm sorry, Well, I was just going to say quickly that Governor Newsom had veto SB 1047. Would you have... So would you remind me what that is? That was about like safeguard.

It was a proponent to like have safeguards around artificial intelligence. Yeah. Would you have, he vetoed it. Would you have signed this bill? So I'm not, don't know the specifics. But let me say this. We absolutely need safeguards around AI. You know, and that doesn't, look, I'm also talking to the people who run these companies.

They know this. Like my brother is a big proponent of safeguards around young people's use of AI. Knowing some of the negative effects of social media on young people, this is that on steroids. And so the idea that we should have regulations to protect young people, absolutely. One of the things that people are worried about is that they would release things to the public before they've been tested to see if they work. of course that should be true. So the idea that regulation is stifling innovation and all that stuff, that's not true. You know, we need to protect the public from obvious things.

But the other thing that is true is we need to make sure that workers are protected. And I'll take you back to the 70s and 80s and the auto business. You know, when the foreign competition and mechanization came into the auto business, millions of people lost their jobs. And the politicians kept saying, you know, we're going to do training, we're going to help. And they never did. And if you look at those cities, the big auto cities, Detroit, Cleveland, Gary, Akron, they're hollowed out. And we can't let that happen here. And we've got to be ahead of it.

And that's why I'm saying our policy starts with protecting workers and guaranteeing jobs. But it's also about owning part of the upside so that California protects itself and can afford to take care of workers. Last question on AI. The bet on AI is that all of these data centers will be useful because to your point, you know, AI can be a productive tool for workers or, you know, some people believe that they'll capture a machine god, our official general intelligence will come along and allow us to build time travel flights back to hang out with, you know, whatever. But the bet on AI is not just a bet, it's a belief.

It's a belief that AI has this incredible usefulness that will undergird American productivity for a long time. You seem to share that belief. I guess my question is, what evidence have you seen that that is the case? And then secondarily, you want AI to increase the productivity of workers and not take jobs away. What does that look like? So the first one, let me talk about it a little bit, okay?

So the reason the thing that the people in these companies say is their limit is compute. How many computations can they make? And the reason that AI is powerful, and I'll give you an example, when you're talking about some of these new medical breakthroughs, you're talking about infinite number of things you could change to put together to see if they work. and so for a really smart person, they're doing that, but there's still someone having to do it. These guys can do infinite calculations really fast.

So if you're trying to see which combination, what DNA sequence will make the difference, they can run those computations. You know, you've got a PhD working 24-7, 365, at an incredibly fast pace. So when you look, the reason I think this is going to work, and I'll give you an example. A couple years ago I was looking at a business,

where they're doing customer service in India for American companies. And you can actually have AI do the voice response and dealing directly with the customers. And it is, I think, literally 10 times faster, much cheaper, and we'll end up being much more active. That's so funny. I went to Popeye's on Laurel Canyon not too long ago

and they clearly had an AI that was shaking my order a million fucking times. I had to drive to the window to be like, yo, I said, yeah. So it just depends. I'm a little less bullish on the AI thing. But to the second part,

we have limited time with you. So to the second point, how would AI, give me an example of AI increasing the productivity of... Well, certainly, so I'll give you an example. So my cousin, if you can believe it, my cousin's been writing a book. and he is writing it with his co-author is Claude,

the Anthropic, you know, AI bot. And I said, you know, Freddie, how is this going? He goes, look, it's kind of to your point, to be honest, fan. He goes, I give it an assignment. It comes back. I go, no, that's stupid. Do this. And it comes back.

And I say, no, no, no, no, you're still not getting it, do this. And I said, how is that working? He said, look, it makes me much more productive. It actually makes me more creative. It enables me to have a whole bunch of work done for me that I would otherwise have to do. That, as you said, is very far from what is acceptable. But if you keep iterating with it back and forth, it's a tool for him to be more productive. That's a perfect example.

Or the other one, if the three of us are trying to figure out a cure for a specific cancer, trying out all the different sequences and variations can be done a lot. so the three of us could have a much better chance of solving that because we're getting so many iterations. So it really can be a tool. The issue is going to be that's what we, if you think about AI, it's basically taking all the existing knowledge and experience in creativity and putting in a machine. And the question is, don't those people deserve to be compensated who did all that work that you just took their work and their creativity and their experience and stuck in a machine? That's really, and then one person owns the machine and starts charging for all the work that all those people did for all those years.

Not right. But I can say, I can see people are applying it in an awful lot of verticals, man. They really are. And so to me, getting ahead of this and it's going to create a lot of jobs. There are a lot of jobs people in California are going unfilled. But we actually have to be proactive about making sure that we are ready to help people get real-time jobs. at real-time wages at a specific place. And we can't wait and let the tsunami hit us and go like, okay, now what?

I want to be ahead of this game. A couple of questions or a question on some of your policy. Housing affordability, big issues here in California. You pledged to build one million homes in four years. Governor Newsom pledged 3.5. He's come nowhere near that at all. What specific mechanism would you use that would get those million homes built? and would you be interested in signing a bill that ended single family only zoning?

Statewide. So let me say this. This is a complicated area. And I want to talk about, I want to prepare you. I want to talk about five different things. Okay. And some of them, a lot of people are talking about. And some of them nobody's talking about.

So here are the five things. First of all, we need faster, cheaper, simpler permitting. It takes a really long time to get permits to build here. There are multiple agencies asking for different things. They're not at all coordinated. And in real estate time is money. That drives up the cost of every house. As time goes on, the cost of holding things goes on, and it just adds to the base cost of the house. So we need simpler, faster, cheaper permitting. That's one. Two, the question about single family, I'm someone who believes in dense building around public transportation. I'm someone who thinks that's the correct thing to do.

That's the cheapest thing to do. We get rid of people having an hour and a half commutes. We unclog the roads. It's better from an environmental standpoint. But I also believe people like neighborhoods. They like not being isolated. They like having streets that are fun to walk down and places to go and restaurants, food to eat. and seeing other people.

And this is this, part of my belief is we're in this rainbow coalition of this thing. And isn't that great? And so I want to build densely because I want people to enjoy that and have that experience. And it's also by far the best thing to do. So that's two. Three, you need to build cheaper. Build cheaper. Like the physical act of building.

There are tens of thousands of units that are permitted and zoned in my home city of San Francisco that are not being built because they can't afford. No one can afford to pay the price of what it cost to build. How do we do that? Just so you guys know, there are new techniques for building, which involved sort of industrial construction offsite and assembling that stuff on site. And it drives down the cost by about at least a quarter.

And if they actually get going, the economies of scale, I think can go substantially beyond that. So we need to bring in new technology about building so that we can drive down the cost so people can afford to buy a house, so rent's good. That's three. Four is one of the big reasons we don't build in this state is the cities and counties don't want to build. I mean, it's a cliche to say a city or a county would much rather have a use car lot that pays taxes than a new housing project where they have to take care of the education and health costs of the people in it.

That's been going on for decades. they view a new housing project as an unfunded mandate because there are going to be people in there, they're going to have to pay for them. And a lot of times that's why they charge these huge upfront fees because they're saying, you're asking us to take care of these people and we don't have the money to do it. So 20% of the cost of a house can be an upfront fee from the city. What I've said is on day one, I'll call a special election, close a corporate real estate tax loopball, split roll, if you're, remember that one from a while ago. It's worth $20 billion.

It goes to the cities and counties. So now they don't have an unfunded mandate. They have a funded mandate. And we can use that money to push them to permit things because they don't want to build housing and they have stood in the way because they feel like it's unfair. They can't pay for it, but the state insists they do it. So they just don't do it. That's four. And I'm the only person saying that, but it's a huge part of this. And the fourth thing is this. Our nonprofit community Bank has financed 17,000 low-income housing units. I believe the state of California has a slightly bigger balance sheet than cat and me. We should be using the balance sheet of the state of California to provide much subsidized

loans to make housing happen and low-income housing happen. And we should be doing down payment assistance. You know, if you think about, it's important that young people be able to buy a house in this state. And if you think about what is a house to a person, It's two things. It's your down payment and it's your monthly. And if we do financing well, we can really change the monthly cost.

And if we do down payment assistance, we can really change the down payment. We need to get back to building houses that people can afford to buy. And we are going to come at it at every angle. But I really want to drop the cost so rents go down. This is a critical element for the state of California to succeed in. But, you know, housing and health care, we have to get these things right. because otherwise people are just getting squeezed at a level. People are giving up health care insurance to be able to pay the rent.

We've got people fully employed people who've been fully employed for 20 years living in their cars. That is not the way a society is supposed to work. I mean, going back to your question, I keep talking about shared prosperity. To have a bunch of people hoarding vast amounts of money while other people are living in their cars who are fully employed and have been fully employed for decades. It's not the way as society is supposed to wear.

LA is an interesting place. I'm from Baton Rouge, Louisiana, as the audience knows, as I say, 16 times every podcast. LA is an interesting place to me because you can get an entire journey on, like, one street. Like, you can start on La Siena, and you can take Lassianiga all the way down and go south with Lassianca. By the time you drive up, Lassianca, you'll drive through Beverly Hills. You'll drive through West Hollywood. You'll drive through places that the city is investing in, and you'll drive away from places that the city is absolutely not investing in.

And the people that reside in these two different areas of La Siena or whatever streets you want to choose, they look different. As a black man, why should I vote for Tom Steyer? What specific to me do you have in mind? So let me say this. It's not just what I'm talking about. Let me talk about what I've done. One of the things about American society that I believe deeply is we have structural racism.

And it goes to multiple parts of our society and it's not historical. I mean, of course, it's been true, but it continues to be true. And so let's say, why did my wife and I start a nonprofit community bank to go to the places that commercial banks wouldn't go. go to lend to the people that commercial banks wouldn't lend to. And that very much goes to structural racism. When I talk about, I mean, I've spent a lot of time on the natural world on environmentalism on climate. There are only three rules that I have about environment, natural world and climate. And one of them is every policy has to start with environmental justice because we have structurally put the roads and the exhaust that make people sick and the toxic plants

in low-income black and brown communities. And so that is structural racism. And everything we do in terms of the environment has got to begin with and include leadership with people from those communities because it's been pervasive and intentional. When I talk about education, I was saying to you guys, we used to be the number one education state where someone in the 30s, I want to put money into that. I want to support kids. I want to support them by getting the best possible teachers,

training them and retaining them. I believe that the money should go to the, we should get that money coming in on a regional basis, and the money should go to the school districts that need it the most. Because there has been structural racism. So when I talked about in mass incarceration, that was a strictly racist thing.

Intentionally racist, structurally racist. In every one of those, if we're going to make a change, we have to make a structural change. And you can't undo structural racism without at least it's starting by pointing it out, admitting it, establishing that fact, and then intentionally addressing it. You don't just do away with it. You intentionally address it every time. So in answer to your question, the policies that I'm pushing are definitely include the idea of undoing structural racism whenever I see it. And I'm just saying, here are examples of things that I've been working on.

We started our bank 20 years ago. You know, we, the person who runs our Sacramento policy shop, next-gen policy, is a black guy named Arnie Soell who's run it from the beginning and has done a spectacular job. Do I believe that he has a different experience and a different perception as a result of who he is? Yes. And let me say this specifically about the black community. I am also very aware of the moral leadership in America being provided consistently by the black community for longer than I've been alive. Black women specifically. Thank you.

Well, let me say, and I always say this. It's honest to the brothers, but I have that I power to systems. Well, let me say this. The one senator or congressperson who stood up against the Iraq War as an immoral war and a dishonest war, at the time, Barbara Lee, black woman from Oakland, California, took death threats, stuck to her guns, one of my heroes. And I'm just saying, so when I think about this community, I'm very aware of the contributions that have been made.

I'm very aware of the need for that leadership going forward and that it's not a fluke that Barbara Lee was there. It's not a fluke that Arnie's been running our office. It's, I view that as an incredible strength of this community that has been, let's face it, hundreds of years. It doesn't seem to be changing. And when we're talking about last week who's standing up for voting rights, it's like, let's be clear.

This is a community that I know that there's been structural racism against, and I'm very aware has provided immense moral leadership for this country on a continuing basis for longer than I've been aware of life. And it's not something that I'm going to do without in any organization that I'm, you know, responsible for hiring for or putting together any coalition that I'm part of. I think if you don't have that, I don't think you're going to be successful. I have to tell you, one of the things back in March when I think it was the first debate that. Did I say something stupid, Rachel?

No, it's what you didn't say, actually. It's what you didn't say. I think this was the K-C-R-A. debate and every candidate was asked to grade Governor Newsom on his first, or not first, but his two terms as governor. And I was kind of disappointed at the grades that were given or the lack thereof because you didn't give him a grade. Can you give him a letter grade now?

And then I'll just, because we're limited on time, also ask you, if you were elected, what's one of the first things that you would change within your first 100 days? you would actively reverse or change as governor. From what he's from? From some of his policies, yeah. So, look, I think everybody in California is very grateful to Governor Newsom for standing up to Trump and for pushing back and to rep, you know, trying to push on democracy itself and to support people that he's victimizing and racially profiling.

And I think everyone's happy about that. I think obviously I'm running because I think that a whole bunch of physical things haven't been done and there's been structural inequality in this state and that the corporations are strangling us. And I think that, you know, on the first part, I would give him a very high rate in terms of standing up to Trump and doing that. But I think that a difference between me and Gavin that's very clear is my willingness to take on the corporations and stand up to them and push back. And my willingness to talk about what Van is, I think, talking about, which is the gross inequality in income and assets in our state

and the fact that we have the highest poverty rate in the United States and willing to take on the people who are, in fact, hoarding the wealth and doing everything they can to make sure that it's kept away from people who are needy. And on that, you know, that's obviously a big deal for me. And so when I think about the things that I want to change, look, on day one, I'm going to try and start the ball rolling for closing this corporate tax loophole because we need the money and we need the money for schools and we need the money for health care and there's no question about it. And no one else will talk about that. I want to start the ball rolling in terms of single-payer. You know, it's going to, that's going to be, it's a process we have to go through.

And now we say, best time to plant a tree 20 years ago. Second best time to plant a tree today. Right now. And so that's going to be get that ball rolling. You know, I think I'm going to put, you know, there's a, I'm going to do, I hate to say this, but I think Trump tried to get going on day one. I'm going to try and get going on day one. Because I think we have a chance here to create a state that actually succeeds but brings

everybody along. And that's my whole goal. And so every one of those things, am I going to start working on the electric stuff? Yes. Am I going to start working on the housing stuff? Yes. In every, you know, in terms of the issues for the black community, am I going to be focused on environmental justice on day one? Yes. You know, and let me say this. I'll give you the example. So 11 years ago, my wife Kat and I went to Fresno. And we went to the zip code with the highest toxicity in the state of California. It's in southwest Fresno. It has a 22-year lower life expectancy than northwest Fresno, which is two miles away.

22 years different. Are we going to start working on that on day one? Yes. Look, the things in this state that we can do, there we are in a position where we can do an awful lot and we can create an amazing society, an amazing society that goes for everybody. And so I'm going to start on day one, on all those things I was talking about,

I'm going to push really hard. I'm going to push really hard to get kids going in pre-K at three years old because I know if you can read in third grade, you have a different life than if you can't. I don't know if you ever look that stat. It's an amazing step. My brother's been a,

my mom is a school teacher in Harlem. She taught in prison after she got through teaching in public schools. My brother's been an advocate for at-risk kids for his entire life. I have heard for 40 years, if you get to kids at three, you have a much, much better chance of turning them around. The earlier you start, the better. And so are we going to do that? I'm going to push really hard on this stuff because this is not rocket science. It's not rocket science.

This is all obvious stuff, I think. The question is, do we have the will to do it? You were saying, who do you trust, Rachel? Okay, who do you trust? Like who is willing to really lay it down. Yeah. Okay. We're going to get Tom out of here.

You've been gracious with your time. I have no idea what time to do. I know where to watch. Your team does. 30 seconds, though. My friends would be super upset if I did not ask you this. I came out here to write and produce movies. I've produced several movies, done all this stuff.

People are scared that live in California. That is our auto industry. That is our steel here in Los Angeles, the entertainment industry. 30 seconds. You got to go out now. I want to keep the team. 30 seconds on why you will be able to stem the tide of productions leaving California. Okay.

So let me say this, fan. I am a business person. I am on Team California. This is a business. We have the best people in the world. that means the only problem we have is structural. So let's talk about what it looks like. Part is it about tax credits.

People are trying to buy our business, right? And we can't afford to let that happen, which means we have to be much more aggressive in terms of the use of tax credits. We also have to be much more, we've got to go through every regulation about shooting here to make sure that it's absolutely necessary and it's not something that's particularly going to stifle small productions.

We should be getting together, believe it or not, this is one of the very few places where I think this is possible. We should be working with the federal government to protect American Californian, but other American productions against foreigners who are trying to buy our business too. And I also believe we should be supporting apprentices

and learning for people in the industry. We should be supporting live entertainment and live venues. Look, this is about a broad-based entertainment ecosystem that exists that we cannot allow it to stop. Because once it's stopped, we ain't getting it back. Right.

And so to me, We should be fight. To me, this is a business proposition where we're fighting. And look, you don't know this about me, but it's true. I'm very competitive. I am, you know, I played sports my entire life. Oh, for real? You hooping.

Hoop and soccer. Okay. Those are my two sports. Okay. Yeah, but I'm saying, look, I'm on Team California. We are the best in the world. We are not going to allow people to cheat us out of our business. And we're going to do what it takes to win, period.

And honestly, driving down costs, driving down health care costs, driving down housing costs is the other way we're going to win long term. Because we need people to be able. We need to compete and win every time. And that is my goal. And especially on this, if you think that- Hey, y'all, it's Kelly Clarkson with Wayfair. Ever order furniture online and wonder what if? Like, what if it doesn't hold up?

That sofa was four days old. You should have ordered from Wayfair. With Wayfair, there's no what-if. Just style you love and quality you can trust. Visit Wayfair.cair.com. Wayfair, every style, every home. that I'm going to be a softy about this. There's nothing soft about me when it comes to Team California.

Tom Sire, thank you for joining some higher learning. Thank you guys for happening. What did you think about him? I thought it was good. I thought, you know, one of the things you kept talking about is how detailed his website is and all the policies. It is. But we just live in a time where people aren't going to take the time to read it. And so I think that one of the things that really came out in this interview was how passionate he is

and why he wants to do, you know, this race and why he wants to run for governor. You know, take that, but take the time to look at the websites. What's there? What's not there? What's not there? So right now, ooh, ooh, hold on. You still looking at the polls? So looking at the polls.

So, coordinator Emerson polling is where we at. Bcerra, 19%. He's leading. He's a dem old crack. Very much so. Hilton. I wish we could have gotten to some Bcerra questions, but we had to let him go. Hilton is second at 17.

But Steyer is tied with Hilton at 17. Okay. Well, we'll see. We'll see what happens. Katie Porter, 70 to 10, Chad Bianco, 11 to 14%.

So we'll see. There's still, though, a whopping 12% of voters that remain undecided, which means election day is truly going to tell the tail. The polling might be,

might be. Look up the mayor race on that same thing. Let me just see what that's looking like. Oh, let's do that. Oh, you want to go? Okay. Okay.

Okay. Los Angeles mayor. I mean, everything is blue. Everything is Bass. Emerson May 9th to 10th has Bass plus 12. Arroman at 23%. Tavern Research has Bass plus four. Pratt at 18.

It's all Bass. But I mean, who are the top two? Well, if Bass gets over 50. That seems unlikely. It's the Emerson College right now May 9th to 10th I wonder if there's a later poll here You said plus 12 so I don't know what that percentage was

That's plus 12 And let me It has it has Raymond and Pratt tied At 23% So it seems as if Right now That's crazy

Yeah Hey I'll tell you guys something right now The The The rich people in L.A. And a lot of the entertainment class are coalescing around Spencer Pratt. It's like Bizarro World.

You don't like it. It's almost like they're doing it for themselves. I don't know. And most of them can't even vote. They don't live in an area where they can vote. It's just, it's weird. You look at it on social media and it's what's happening. I will tell you this, though.

This makes me believe something. The political career of Spencer Pratt is just beginning. Oh, where do you think he's off to next? I do not think that Spencer Pratt will necessarily. leave Los Angeles if he loses this because I think that Spencer Pratt might stick around and do what? And take a shot at Congress, take a shot at something

else. I think that for a guy like that this sort of political ascension with him being a even if he moved to another state, I think you would take another crack at it. It's not even political ascension, it's popularity. If you've been following him since he's been on

reality TV, this is a man who chases the spotlight, who chases the fame, if he can't get it, he'll put his push his wife forward to do it. He will sell photos of underage people to publications. He will step on the backs of the unfortunate in order to boost himself up. Like, of course, he is addicted to the spotlight. And right now, the people who are backing him, playing the piano for him, singing for him, hosting at their homes, letting them use your courtside seats.

all of these people are making him just creating the monster that he is and all he cares about is the attention, not the people. And I got to give this this phrase to politics girl who's on scene. I don't know if you ever done the show with her. I have done it with her. I am politics girl.

She said, I am politics girl. She said the reason these people are supporting you is because they know that you are for sale and that because they know they need favors, they're going to need favors from you should you go into office. And that's really what it comes out there. That's all, that is.

That's it. And he wants it so he can cozy up and have all the perks and do whatever the rich need for him to do in the city. So according to, we'll get out on this. According to USA Annenberg Media, Karen Bass has received 30% of the support. Mr. Pras, Nathan Raymond, 22 and 19%. So you might end up having an all-blue runoff for the mayor's race too, which would be fucking interesting if that were to happen. If it was Bass versus Raymond. both candidates are hoping to advance in the November runoff

but this is very important. Based on this poll that USC ran, 16% of voters remain undecided. That is down from March in which 51% of voters remain undecided. So when Bass was leading in March, it seemed as if it was kind of foolswomenes. gold because so many people had not made their decision about who they were going to vote for.

And Karen Bass had a very strong constituency with El Blex. And so they were like, we want Bass, we want Bass, we want Bass. It's like, you know, if you're actually in a fishing tournament, that's how they sounded. Now, now, though, with this being down a little bit, this seems to be a stickier indication of who is actually going to vote for who and how much support they have. So this shows that Spencer might have a little work to do, but it's neck and neck between him and Nithia. It seems as though the Bass is pretty comfortably ahead,

you know, unless something were to happen. So, you know, vote. However you see fit Los Angeles and whatever, but that's where the state of the marriage race is right now. A lot of stuff going on in politics. All right, we got to go. Anything else you want to say about, drink before we go.

I'm good. Anything you else want to say about, you want to say you want to say about niggas and these, well, don't, hey, don't, you call our sister Sheney's.

We should, we should, we should, we should identify these white women and bring them before the table. So they could make the table.

Yeah, don't hide, don't hide in your, in your messages. You want to have them on the show? Why not? Come talk to Sheney. Come on talk to Shonayne.

Come on talk to Shonayne. Come on. Take the key caps off. But then I stop learning. I'm Derek. That's Sheney. Bye, guys.