Higher Learning with Van Lathan and Rachel Lindsay - Five Things the Democrats Can Do, Plus Doechii Pisses Off Straight Men

Episode Date: March 11, 2025

Van and Rachel remember the life of D’Wayne Wiggins and the impact of Tony! Toni! Toné! (:37), before Van breaks down five things Democrats can do to win back voters (11:01), Gavin Newsom calls trans athletes in women’s sports unfair (45:51), and Dana White welcomes Andrew Tate with open arms (1:02:19). Plus, Doechii’s dating red flag had some men upset (1:14:10), LeBron confronts Stephen A. Smith (1:22:55), and Dr. Umar has a social media spat with his daughter (1:36:33). Hosts: Van Lathan and Rachel Lindsay Producers: Donnie Beacham Jr. and Ashleigh Smith Learn more about your ad choices. Visit podcastchoices.com/adchoices

Yo, yo, yo, thought warriors. What is up? Hard learning is on and is I Van Lathen Jr. And it's me, Rachel Lynn Lansing. Coming to you, hi. Atop Spotify, New York offices, Rachel's at the home base in L.A. Rach, how are you doing?

How are you feeling this morning? I'm good. I'm feeling fine. Shut up, Van. I'm holding it down on the West Coast. You got it on the East Coast. We're coast to coast. Coast to coast.

Coast to coast. Coast. Coast. Higher learning. Big higher learning today. Unfortunately, we have to start off with another in memoriam. Ridiculously sad news. Duane Wiggins, founding member of Tony Tony Tony's died of cancer at 64.

Yeah. Was it not that it should have been, but I didn't know that he was battling cancer. I feel like this was a private battle. Did you? I did know that he was going through this. Dwayne Wiggins is one of the most, I would say, important yet unsung musical legends that we have with the amount of work that he did with Tony, Tony and Tony. Obviously, Raphael Sadeek is the frontman of Tony, Tony, Tony, Tony. But, you know, Dwayne Wiggins was instrumental in signing Beyonce and Destiny's Child.

He was a great musician who was behind some of the rhythms and the music that Tony, Tony, Tony had. He was a guitar, producer, composer, philanthropist, founding member of the group. It's just, it's very sad. It's sad stuff losing him. I loved them. Their music was like, omnipresent. Yeah, it really was. Yeah, omnipresent with me growing up such an eclectic vocal style and so many of the other things that he did.

It's very sad to hear of his passing, but what a life well lived. Absolutely. I had no idea about some of his behind the scenes accomplishments. Obviously, I know I'm from Tony, Tony, Tony, but 64. It's young. I used to call Tony, Tony, Tony, Tony, when I was a kid, Tony, Tony, Tony. I mean, I could see you. I thought you were going to say Tone, but I could see you making that mistake.

Or were you doing it purposely? I wasn't doing it purposely. I was doing it. I thought it was Tony, Tony, tone. And one of my cousins, and I had a physical altercation over me calling it that. It's like, it's Tony, Tony, Tony. Did you say a physical altercation?

Yeah. Why did it come to that? It's Baton Rouge. Everything ends up going to blows. Everything ends up going to blows. any dispute in Baton Rouge all disputes come to blows

up to a certain age it and then you know even after that depending on levels of respect but it was it was the game

Madden that'll come to blows everything will come to blows everything will come to blows you'll fight you'll fight and I was calling it Tony Tony and Tone

and he said it's Tony, Tony, Tony, Tony. And I was like, well, I say Tony, Tony, Tony. And he was like, it's Tony, Tony, Tony. And me and him went back and forth and back and forth. And he just, he hauled off and he swung. He punched me in my chest. Then I punched him. And then the next thing you know, we're fighting.

Do we know why the group is called that? I don't. I know that they got some hits. What's your favorite Tony, Tony, Tony, and Tony song? I really have always liked anniversary. Interesting. Why do you say it like that? Because I don't have one anymore.

That's a good one. That's a great song. Anniversary is good. It never raised in Southern California. It's good. It feels good. I really liked that one. It feels good is one of the greatest songs of all time.

It's one of the, I used to, we were living in California when it came out. Mm-hmm. And I would legitimately get amped up when the record was, about to come on the radio. Like, I remember one time being on the beach with my aunt and them and it came on and I

started dancing and going crazy and the whole family was laughing. I love that song so much. I take it back. I love it feels good. That's my favorite fast song they do. I did not mean anniversary. I meant me and you. Me and you was good.

That's what I like. I want to make sure that all of the artists of that era get their flowers. I wish that I would have appreciated me. Mr. Wiggins, in some way, got the chance to interview him or tell him just how much I love that music while he was still around. Because I think about Tony, Tony, Tony, I think about mint condition. Yeah, mint condition. Mint condition is the shit. All of those artists, we got to appreciate our brothers and sisters while they're still here.

90s R&B, man. 90s R&B. There's nothing like it. Nothing like it. 90s artists. R&B, but you guys trade it all in. Let's not do, let's not do I'm out Rushmore because people

are so upset about our Neo-Soul about Rushmore, which I'm not mad at them about that because the fact that we forgot DeAngelo is criminal. I don't think DiAngelo's Neo-Soul. Oh, 100%. You don't think DeAngelo is, but you think Music Soul Child is? I think Music Soul Child is more Neo-Sou. old than DeAngelo.

Oh, got to disagree. Okay. It's hard to think of all these artists on the spot when we're just having an impromptu conversation. So I forgot about DeAngelo, but that's, he absolutely should have been on our Mount Rushmore. And the fact that you don't consider him as a part of that genre is wild. So he's just straight R&B to you? Well, DeAngelo drops is 95, right?

When he comes out, I'm like in the ninth and tenths grade. when DiAngelo first drops brown sugar, all of that stuff comes out, it's 95, he predates to me what I consider the Neo-Soul movement to be, which it kind of starts with Erica Badu And that whole deal.

Donald, that's like 97-98, though. It was a couple of years later. What I would say is he doesn't have the Neo-Sole the Neo-Sole aesthetic. He wasn't to me like Afrocentric soul-shine.

life, all of that stuff. DeAngelo didn't really have that aesthetic. DeAngelo, to me, was more of a straight-up R&B. Not, not to me. Find pictures of DeAngelo. Like, when he's got, like, the headband. DeAngelo came out, and he was wearing a leather jacket and playing the guitar in a cool R&B club.

Okay? He changed his style from that. He was playing. It was a cool R&B club that he was playing it. He was cruising. He did. Baby, this cruise away. And by the way, I could be wrong.

And if I am wrong, fuck it. Our top five was terrible. And I wear that. But I still think that there is a good argument that DiAngelo is not part of the Neo Soul movement. That he's not. Voodoo comes out, what? It's like 99, 2000. And in the voodoo joint, he ain't got no clothes on.

And to me, the Neo Soul people were all like, they were wearing the headwraps and they were doing all of that stuff. He did that. I don't know. I don't think he's Neo Soul. But people said him, they said Maxwell. Yeah, we should have put Maxwell. I don't consider Maxwell to be Neo Soul. Why?

He literally checked every single box. You just said. I don't think that. The aesthetic? The sound? I don't think Maxwell's. check that aesthetic at all. Maxwell was a smooth.

I don't think was, okay, so who else was Eric Bonaid Neo Soul? Was Kenny Latimore Neo Soul? No, definitely not Keats. Okay, so like to me, was Eric Benet Leo Sol? Neosol, I don't think all of these people

are Neo Soul to me. I don't think Eric, I wouldn't consider Eric Benet Neosol. I wouldn't. Eric Bonae Maxwell would like the same nigga. Not even close. Yes, they are. Maxwell got some hits too.

Yes. He made that song in concert not too long ago here. I was very upset. I didn't know about that. Yes. He made that one song that make all women cry

about how tough their lives are. This woman's work. You put that song on. My mama gets a crying. Do you know who originally sang that song? Joni Mitchell. No.

No. Not Johnny Mitchell. The lady who sang, don't tell me. Yes. You're on it. You're on it. Okay.

So it's not Joni Mitchell. It's the lady who sang the theme song for Working Girl, who is... Oh, hold on, hold on, hold on. It's Carly? No. No. It's not Carly Simon?

No. She sang the song in Stranger Things that had... They put it in Stranger Things, and it just brought a whole resurgence of feel like of her, career. She's a, she's a watt, right?

She's a white. For sure. She's not, I don't know. Kate Bush. Oh, I didn't know that. I thought it was one of these other whites. Put them all together.

Kate Bush, Carly Simon. Okay. That put them all together. I didn't know. I was never going to get that. Anyway, all right, let's get into the show.

On the other side of this, this little break, I want to talk about the Democrats. And I think we should have a healthy conversation about the Democrats. Donnie can get us into it because we have to talk about this. Some people were upset with some of the things that were said about the Democrats in the last show. And we have to talk about it, but on the other side of this break. Did you know about one in three people with plaques psoriasis may also develop psoriatic arthritis, which causes joint pain, stiffness, and swelling?

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Manage your activity with our consumer protection tool. Restrictions apply. See terms at vanduel.com slash predict slash bonus dash offer dash terms. All right. We've kind of hit on this a bit in the past few weeks and months since the election. The Democratic Party is kind of struggling for an identity. And over the weekend, Van said that he wanted to talk about five things to, to fix the Democratic Party.

So let's do it. Okay, Rachel. You got the answers? I don't. Okay. It's not five things to fix the Democratic Party. What is it? It's five things that the Democratic Party could be doing.

Okay. Because this is what I've heard. Okay. And I'll ask you first. What I've heard from a lot of people is that it makes no sense to talk about how the Democrats are comporting themselves right now in government or in culture because they're not in power and they can't do anything.

Do you subscribe to that, Rachel? Yes and no. I mean, I think there's a point, right? Yeah, there's only so much they can do, but I don't think that that frees them from being able to talk about. They're not off the hook. You don't just get to chill

because you don't have the power. Yeah, so look, I understand people's concern. I understand people saying, hey, it doesn't make any sense to criticize the Democrats for what they're doing right now. now because they don't have any legislative power. They can't, they don't have the numbers in the House.

They don't have the numbers in the Senate. I get that. I understand what people are saying that. It seems as if there's never a good time to talk about the Democrats themselves for some people. But for others that would say, hey, there's literally nothing they can do. I understand why people would say that and think that. I get it. We were talking about them last time as it related to the We Shall Overcome situation.

And I think that there are some who are frustrated looking at the left itself as a circular firing squad that always looks to exterminate each other at the first sign of any type of trouble. I don't want to come across as if I'm doing that. I am not a part of the Democratic Party machine. I would like to tell people that. So I don't owe the Democrats anything. other than honest critique and conversation around what's going on with them.

Here at higher learning, we don't get paid by anyone. We don't have anybody injecting any guests into our ecosystem. We try to stand upon our principles. We try to write our wrongs. And we try to look at things in the way that we see them. So I don't. get any calls from Hakeem Jeffrey saying,

talk about this or don't talk about this or whatever. However, I thought that at least from my perspective, and we're going to do this together, we could talk about some things that I think the Democrats could be doing because there's, people are saying that they shouldn't do stuff that they can't do

but the question is, what could they do? You know, what could the Democrats be doing? All right, so here's, I'll jot it down some things. I think the Democrats could be doing. Five things of Democrats could be doing. First. They could vote not to fund the government. That's a legislative thing that they could do. Now, Mike Johnson unveiled a CR that they want to vote for this week.

I think it's on Thursday that that vote would happen. Thursday or Friday, the government would shut down. It's the 14th. So that's Momoh's Birthday. Love you, Mamo. So that's Friday. And they're going to have to vote on a continuing resolution to keep the government funded until the end of this year. and then the Republicans

to try to get their new budget through. The Democrats could vote not to fund the government. The margins are so thin in the House when they do a reconciliation vote, the Democrats do have some legislative power in that they could vote not to fund the government as it's currently constituted in the CR that Mike Johnson laid out

and try to push the Republicans to change some things that they're doing right now. some of the funding that they're putting out there, some of the ways that Doge is running around acting, they could try to use the little bit of leverage that they have in order to change the way Republicans are running the government. Now, here's the deal with that, just to let people know. If they were to do that, which the Republicans have done in the past,

have threatened not to vote to fund the government unless Biden put certain immigration things into the budget, blah, blah, blah. If the Democrats did that and the government shuts down, then the Republicans come back and they say the Democrats shut the government down. They used the budget as a partisan policy tool to shut the government down. All kinds of things happen when you shut the government down. If there are any wiretaps up, investigating criminals, all that types of stuff, all different types of funding, all of that stuff stops if the government shuts down. Nobody likes a government shutdown in Washington.

But I think it's important for the Democrats to use this. as a policy tool, as a tool of politics, because they have to show the people that are supporting them that they're willing to go to the mattresses and emiserate the Republican Party and make Donald Trump's presidency tough unless the Republicans act with some thought and some plan that doesn't just involve hacking things up

and doing whatever destructive things that they want to, to the federal administrative state, or, you know, in terms of information sharing with some of the stuff that Doge has access to. So I don't think personally that the Democrats should vote for this continuing resolution in the way that it's currently constituted. It's a risky political move, but that's something that they could do,

Rachel, what are your thoughts? Well, I think that if I agree with you, they need to push back. And if they have some, this goes against what other people were saying about, well, what can they do? They don't have the power. Well, if they find a place where they have some power, then I think that they should press and move that forward. My thought is, and I guess the other thing is that the Republicans, regardless, are always going to blame anything bad that happens on the Democrats. That's just part for the course right now with where we are with Congress and with this administration. So that's like they shouldn't even be afraid of that consequence of them saying,

hey, this is because of the Democrats. They're going to always find a way to do that. That's what they do. But my question is, should they, you know, assert this power and they're able to get the government shut down? What I don't see, Congress is going to do whatever Trump tells them to. I don't think Trump cares about the government shutting down. So what are the implications of that? Like who, I mean, I know that federal agencies have to stop what is, non-essential functions,

but what does that look like? How long can that go? Oh, we've had government shutdowns that have lasted for a while when these issues were really contentious in legislation. A government shutdown is terrible across the board for any administration. They will do everything that they can to avoid. and to be honest with you, the Democrats will do everything that they can to avoid it as well. However, it is legitimately their only legislative bargaining chip right now.

It's the only thing that they can use in any way to try to exert some control over what Doge is doing. There are things in this budget that Doge and the president need to commit to funding they need if this is a continuing resolution from last year's budget then what they need to do is some of the cuts that those just put in and some of the things and people have been fired and all this stuff that's going on if they're going to vote for this CR they need to vote for this CR based upon the budget that it is actually continuing and make sure that the things inside of there are actually funded through to September where then you can come back and if the Republicans have enough votes or whatever,

they can pass their budget through. But they need to act in the way that they say that what Doge and Trump are doing is so irresponsible. Yeah. And they need to go to the mattresses, in my opinion, to protect it. And I would say, as the CR is,

from what Johnson put out, I don't think they should vote for it. It's risky, but I don't think they should vote for. That's the first thing. I just haven't seen them make any sort of concession to for the other side, like the Republicans for the Democrats. And so it would be interesting. And I'd like to see, I agree with you.

I think they should not vote for it. But it would be interesting to see how it plays out because we haven't seen them give anything to the Dems. So, yeah. All right. What's number two? You guys have heard this. This is not an original thought. Very few of these are going to be completely original thoughts.

But this is more important than the Democrats could ever, ever imagine. They need to draft their own version of Project 2025. Now, I know that you've heard this before, but it's extremely important now because that'll do two things. Number one, that will show people that the Democrats can get on the same page intellectually and from a policy perspective. There are so many factions inside of the party. The Republicans have factions inside of their party as well.

They have the Freedom Caucus. They have other Republicans that are more or less beholden to different arms of private money. But the Democrats have such pronounced factions in terms of the left, the moderates, the older wing of the Democratic Party. that them actually being able to come together and craft a vision of America that is oriented around working people and the betterment of their lives

has never been more important. It's never been more important for the Democrats to say, this is the way we view America. Not simply these are the things that the Trump administration of the far right is doing, but this is the way that we view America. This is the way you succeed in our version of America.

Forget about who is going to take away your rights and who is going to do all of that stuff. We've articulated that as well as we possibly can. But the question is this. You are an average American working person. How is your life better by casting a vote for someone with a D by their name? not how we are going to take care of you. Forget about that. How are we going to better your life?

I'm not saying that they've never spoken to this. It's be clear. Kamala Harris talked about her opportunity, economy, and all of that stuff. I'm not going to say that they've never spoken to this. I'm saying they haven't spoken to it robustly enough. And that is what a document or a shared vision from the party could do for people right now.

And they could really coalesce behind that and behind the heat that they got from that in order to move into 2028. Hmm. I mean... Not 2028, so the midterms, I mean. Again, I agree with you. When I think of what their version,

we'll call it Project 2029, would look like, it seems like it would be a lot of undue, of what we're going to endure these next four years. What's already happening? What's to come? We have no idea. And my fear or my pushback would be they'll undo it.

And then the next four years, it happens again. And it's just this back and forth, back and forth, back and forth. I'm not saying, I agree with you, the Democrats should have a vision. I think that that's one thing, one of the things that they've been, you know, the Republicans have done much better than them. whether there are divisions within the party or not, they're all able to come together and say, we're going to support this.

You know, they have that cult-like mentality, whatever Trump says they're going to do, they're not going to go against it. Whether they would agree with it or not, they're all going to unify behind it, and they're able to push their vision forward. The Democrats need to have that type of mentality, and I don't know if they can.

And I know we're going to talk about this later, but just look at what's happening right now with the statements that Gavin Newsom made. Not saying I agree. I'm just saying, look at the response to that. Look at what's happening to even some of the Democrats speaking on DEI. Yes, there's always division, but for some reason we want to be so loud

about the way we disagree with one another to impress constituents, to impress the masses, to build your political platform for the next election, whatever it may be. My fear is they can't get on it. There's Project 2029 will literally just be undoing everything that was done in this current administration. I agree. You're not saying anything wrong, but I'll say this.

This is the truth. Some of the stuff that Donald Trump is going to do in the next four years, you're not going to be able to undo. If Donald Trump is successful in dismantling the Department of Education, if some of these agencies are fundamentally, fundamentally stripped and destroyed. Some of that stuff that he's going to do, it's going to be very difficult to undo. So some of it is going to be about, hey, some of the tariffs that he puts on, we already discussed this. You're not going to be able to take those tariffs off with the way they affect worldwide

economies and the new economic realities that hit people that are living with the tariffs. So while undoing a lot of that stuff is important, at some point they have to move the football. At some point, they have to tell people what their offensive strategy is. It's very simple. Why is your life better when we're in power? Now, I could speak to why that is, I could speak to the 50 million jobs that have been created under Democratic presidents, to the 1.5 million jobs that have been created during Republicans. I could speak to the global financial crisis. And under the Bush administration, I could speak to the wars under the Bush administration.

I could speak to the economic recovery and the Obama administration. I could speak to the budget surplus and the balancing of the budget that. happened that was able to happen to be honest with you in a bipartisan way under the Clinton administration. I could think to the economic, you know, Bill Clinton being who he was, Bill Clinton had some very center-right beliefs. I mean, you want to privatize Social Security. I could think a lot of things to talk about why your life is better and why the economy expands, like under the left. But coming from the porn addict with the cowboy hat is just not as impactful as it is coming from the Democrats.

So they need to speak to Americans about why life is better under them and stop kind of acting like the kids that are getting picked on by the bullying class. Well. Right. And so I think that a document that states what they are or even an initiative that states what they are is very important. We want to agree now. Yes, I just want to say to your point about the undoing at the, the Supreme Court to that.

Right. The way the structure of the Supreme Court. Also, to my point, we talked about this, we touched on it the last podcast. The new chairman of the DNC says that nothing needs to change. Like, they got a long way to go.

Yeah. They got a long way. It has to happen. It has to happen. Okay. Number three, grassroots civic engagement aimed at reorienting not just information and education

in their constituencies, but re-learning how to communicate with the American people. I like this. So what I'm saying is the reason why the Democrats need to get grassroots is for as much as the education of the American people as it is for them. They need a crash course in how to communicate and talk to people. And the easiest way to get that information is, communicating and talking to people.

I'm talking about, think outside the box of the town halls. The town halls that you're doing now, I'm sure they're effective in a way. I'm talking, think of some new ways to connect with your constituency. So you understand the way that those people need to be communicated to. Get off the hill for a little while. Everybody's saying you can't do anything on the hill. Like, get off the hill for a little while. Like all of the acting and the grandstanding inside of Capitol Hill and in session,

it doesn't move the American people. It doesn't move the American people telling people off or standing up or reading people. None of that's moving them. None of it's moving them. Nothing that you can do in those situations is moving them. You have to go move them. and being in contact with them in ways that they can feel you and talk to you and feel connected to you. It's not just going to change them.

It's going to change you. I think that there's a bubble that the party lives in a little bit. And I think they need to pop that bubble. They need to deprogram a little bit. I agree with you. I think this one might be my favorite. I think this is the way to be most effective, even though it'll definitely be a marathon

and not a race. I think when you look at what happened in this last election, this is what was not being done. When you set the bubble and I go, it's so true. Kamala Harrison, and the movement that was happening around her was loud,

it was big, it was exciting, but it wasn't hitting Americans. Like, it wasn't, it was big in L.A. It was big in New York. big in these cities. And we talked about this and I knew we had lost our way when I saw certain people, they were more caught up and who was performing at the rallies than they were about understanding what people actually wanted. And to add to what you're saying, when they have these grassroots help movements or whatever they do or how they decide to do it to reach

the constituents and understand what they want, I think one thing that Democrats do too much is I think they spread themselves too thin with their messaging. And I think they need to tailor it to a few things that most, what most people want. I think we try to please, they try to please too many different groups and too many people. And they spread themselves so thin. And then sometimes they're not getting to the heart of what Americans actually need. So when they're doing their grassroots, I think that will actually do it. And that's something that the Republicans really spoke to a lot of Americans, which is why

people voted for that instead of what was loud. Yeah. Yeah. By the way, when you talk to some of these people, when you talk to them, if they communicate in the way to us

that they communicate, if they just talked to the American people like they talk to me, this wouldn't be a fucking problem. I'm telling you, some of these people reach out. How do they talk to you? How do they talk to you?

Like their people! Yo, Van, what's up? They talk like their people. And then they get on Meet the Press, and you have to remember, I'm the son of a small factory worker from Boise, Idaho. I know what it's like to wake up in the morning and not be. I know what it's like to have to take that extra bus to school.

I know what it's like. They don't want to hear about you. They want to hear about them. Talk to people about them, their life. Right? Like, it's like, it's, okay, moving on. Four. Number four.

Invest into left-leaning media. I'm not just talking about a financial investment, but a sweat equity investment. That means a peer-prioritize, calculate. Not just politicians either. Convinced left-leaning celebrities and cultural figures, the same people that you use to raise money,

use them to raise culture. Raising money is one thing. What the right has done is they've raised a lot of cultural currency by having the sphere online that they've had. they have just been able to connect some really tough dots. And that's because of an ecosystem. That's the Rogan to Flagrant, to Theo Vaughn, to who else exists in this sphere. Jake Paul.

Like, I said Flagrant. Oh. It's like all of these different people who, it seems like it's bros just kicking back, having a good time. but at the same time, the thought that you're getting from these places, it's a lot more aligned with center-right politics than it is with anything else. And what happens on those shows is it's not just politicians that go on there and have these conversations. It's guys like Elon Musk.

It's Shane Gillis. It's other people who seem just like normal people having normal. talks about normal stuff that then mainstream these ideas to people who are more agnostic politically that are listening to them. That's because they go, oh, this guy that I like, this woman that I like, this person that I like that's in that thing is having a real common sense talk with someone else about something. And it makes me feel not so crazy to have some of the takes that I have. being pro-choice, it's not a crazy take. Being pro-Medicare, it's not a crazy take.

Thinking about the lives of black people and thinking about the lives of indigenous people, it's not a crazy take. Things have been made to be crazy because the conversations that normalize them are not loud or nutritious enough And it's odd, it's weird, it's because the infrastructure

to have those conversations and keep those ideas mainstreamed doesn't really exist. And so to me, when you're looking at the investment into left-leaning stuff, I listen to it all. Majority Report, the Vanguard.

Shout out to the guys over at the Vanguard. If you're not listening to the Vanguard on YouTube right now, listen to them. There are a bunch of fucking scamps on the left that are calling out everyone. I love the guys at the vanguard. I love FD Signifier. I love a black guy that just sits down

and looks directly at the camera, no production, no nothing, and just tells you that what's going on is bullshit. I love the bituation room. I love all of these different left-leaning situations that are out there. Leah Jane, all of these people that are out there that are just talking to people,

but I don't see them get the same support from people on the left that I do that people on the right get. I don't see that being the same way. Okay. Something, I don't know about this one because I'm trying to see how,

I'm trying to see how it works because there's a difference in the people that you just named because first my question was going to say to you, what's that network that they, like what are those round of places, podcast, YouTube channels, left-leaning media,

what does that circle look like that these people should go on? That was my first question. Then you started naming them. Then I thought the people that you're naming or the outlets that you're naming would call out the Democrat that came on the show.

Doesn't matter. That's good. No, but this is my point. The people that you named on the right, don't do that. Well, okay. Well, they're two differences. So it's a, so I, because what I was going to say is, I think that people, and I'm not saying that this is how it should be, but I think they'd be scared to go to those places because

they would be held accountable, which they should be. On the right, it's a very friendly, bro-y place when they, when they go to those places where they'll do it because they know it's a safe space. And all it's going to do is just reiterate the ideas that they already have and not hold them accountable. Okay. So I think that you're right, but I think two things. So some of these guys would call some of these Democrats out because the places that I just named are leftists. They're progressive. So they're not going to be interested in the majority report, places like that. By the way, if you haven't watched, watch the Jubilee Sam Cedar versus 20 Republicans. Okay? Just watch it. Mark Lamont Hill, all of these people, watch them. Okay.

Some of these places are going to be a little bit more critical of politicians in particular that come on to these spots. Some of these places are going to be a little bit more critical. They're going to be anti-Israel, which none of the Democratic brass is going to be. They're going to be pro single-payer health care, which you're not going to be able to move politicians on either side very much. There are a lot of issues that are going to be, um, contentious in these places. But there's one thing that they're all going to be able to agree with is that people are just generally unsafe.

The American worker is generally unsafe in a Trump presidency. That democracy matters, that bodily autonomy matters, that being able to access the history of black people and indigenous people, that that matters, that protecting the environment matters, there are going to be things to agree on. So what the left has to do, in my opinion, is stop prioritizing the things that they disagree on and start prioritizing the things that they agree on.

It's not going to always be an easy conversation. But I don't think that Americans expect an easy conversation. conversation. Also, not all of these places. Shout out Roland Martin here as well, because he's one of the only black guys that has their own network to do this. You love Roland, you hate Roland, whatever. Roland's doing this thing on his own. Mark is building his too. But I would say that not all of these places, these aren't the only places. There are comedians that have that don't have bad politics that you can go sit down with. There are places like here,

and I'm not caping for people to fucking come on higher learning. We barely even do interviews. To where you can sit down and have a conversation that's a little bit less grueling. We're going to give you what we think, but we're not going to take the opportunity here to go into the ends and outs of your voting record or anything like that.

We want people to come away with an understanding normally when we sit down with someone, even though I'm going to start kicking people's ass in these fucking interviews. I'm sick of the shit. I'm sick of it. I'm sick of it. I'm sick of it.

Okay. So I think it's there to be had. But I think there has to be the wants. All right. Last one. And it kind of goes back to what we're talking about. You got to play some away games.

Okay. The Republicans are in power. The party in power to me is going to have the most exposure in a divided government. and that's going forward, that's going to be a thing, you got to play some away games. We're at the point now to where it's going to be easier to be the opposition

than it is to be the party in power. Everyone thought that they wanted Donald Trump and all of the things that he was talking about, but now they have to contend with them, and people are starting to crawfish a little bit. You have to continue with tariffs. You have to continue with ICE bursting into schools. You have to contend with losing federal workers

and people losing their jobs. You have to continue with the reordering. of the world political order. You have to contend with all of those things, and people aren't liking it. Just like things like inflation and the border. Border crossings are down right now, and Americans aren't even talking about it.

Nobody is spiking the football because there are less border crossings now than there were a year ago at this time. It seems like people don't even care. It seems like they've moved on to what bothers them and not even celebrate it what you would think would be a win for the right,

which is that border crosses are down. Now, I will say the border crossing started to come down way before this. They have been going down steadily over the past six months to a year. But they are at all-time lows right now and you just don't hear people caring about it that much and that's an issue that we were told that people voted on.

So what I'm saying is knowing that that's the truth, you cannot silo yourself. You have to go places that'll be uncomfortable to go to. You have to have conversations on these platforms where people don't want to talk to you. I see other people outside of the left establishment do this all the time. And whenever they go there, they win. I see these people go on Patrick Bet David.

I see them go on Tim Pool. I see them go on Jubilee and talk to the 20 Trump supporters. And whenever they do it, what the Dean Withers and all of these people, I see them talk to these people, Mark Lamont Hill, I see them debate these people all the time. And their ideas are just better. However, you never see it in the main show. shit, I see it on Meet the Press

where Lutnik goes on Meet the Press or Christy Noem goes on Meet the Press and these are they're being interviewed by Legacy Media and when they go on there, I've seen Lutnik look crazy on Fox News, the Commerce Secretary, look crazy on Fox News.

So I'm saying you cannot sit on the football. You have got, I have got to see these people talk to people who disagree with them, who don't like what it is that they're talking about, and they have to be able to show the American people to diagnose the crazy, you kind of have to excise it in a real way.

And I think that the whole conversation about who it is that you platform or who it is that you talk to or what needs to be thrown in the back of the, it just didn't work. It just doesn't work. It didn't work. The people, what happens is we didn't talk at those people or to those people. And then they became the only ones that were talking to each other. and I think it costs a large chunk of the American side.

The silo was blown up, blown up. The silo that you were in, it was bombed. It was destroyed with bad ideas. And so now you have no choice but to get out of it. Pick yourself up, dust yourself up, come out of the wreckage and go out and talk about these things and places outside of your silo. I agree. I don't even really have anything to add to that one. I mean, I think that when we did see that happen, it was exciting.

We saw that particularly, which is why it's interesting what's happening now, but we saw that particularly with Gavin Newsom. I remember on this podcast, we would say, like, oh, he did such a good job. You know, like, this is what we need to see more of. Whether it was going on media or having a debate, whatever it may be, it was a challenge that we weren't used to seeing from the Democratic Party. but when you do go, I think then there's that level of responsibility,

which is what we didn't see this last time, of, I guess, staying true to the values of the party and not switching it up, where then the message becomes confusing and allows the other side to poke holes in, well, what is it that you really stand for? What are your motives?

Yeah. I agree with you. Speaking of Gavin Newsom, Donnie? Yeah, this is a good transition. He's got a new podcast that just came out recently, and it's called This is Gavin Newsom. In an interview with Charlie Kirk on said podcast, the California governor suggested that allowing transgender athletes to participate in female college and youth sports is unfair. This is what he had to say.

So you right now should come out and be like, you know what, the young man who's about to win the state championship in the long jump in female sports, that shouldn't happen. You as the governor should step out and say no. No, and I appreciate. But like, would you do something like that? Would you say no men and female sports? Well, I think it's an issue of fairness. I completely agree with you on that.

So that's easy to call out the unfairness of that. There's also a humility and grace that these poor people are more likely to commit suicide, have anxiety and depression. And the way that people talk down to vulnerable communities is an issue that I have a hard time with as well. So both things I can hold in my hand. How can we address this issue with the kind of decency that I think, you know, it's inherent in you, but not always expressed. All right, I'll let you guys take it from here.

But watching it just now, I notice that there is an edit in here that happens as soon as Gavin starts talking when he makes his first point to a second, his hand is in a different position. So they definitely took something out of the podcast. But what do you guys think of what Gavin had to say? The first part of what he says is that it's unfair, right? And then what's the second part where you saw the hand change? I'll play why the edit happens.

Well, I think it's an issue of fairness. I completely agree with you on that. So that's easy to call out the unfairness of that. When you watch it, you can see that his hand is doing two different things. Okay. I mean, Rach, like, the five Democrats thing went way too long and I talked too much. It was a good back and forth. I think that the reason that people have such an issue with it is because although when you listen to the whole thing and not just the headline,

it really does seem like he's, Gavin Newsom is talking about fairness and he does hold a space for trans athletes and talks about a community that is constantly at attack. That's not in the headline. But it also seems like he is sacrificing the issue of trans athletes in order to make a case for himself to appeal to the other side. That's what that feels like he's doing in this interview, which is what people have such a problem with, which I somewhat agree. If I'm zooming out and we're talking about issues that are important to the country as a whole, I don't think that this is as big of an issue. But what I think that, and I'm not saying that to beat down on, you know, a marginalized community.

And I don't agree with what Gavin Newsom said because I think he gives space for people to attack trans athletes even further by now saying that it's it's about fairness, making it seem as if it's unfair. And then he doesn't even provide any backing or evidence to that. So I think this is a problem. This leads to a problem of people attacking the trans community. But if I'm zooming out, he's doing this because I think he's looking at polling numbers who when, you know, there's a statistic that shows that most of the country disagrees with this.

I'm not saying I agree with that. most of the country doesn't agree with, according to polling, trans athletes competing in women's sports. I think he's looking at that, and I think that he's trying to make an appeal to the other side in order to further his own political journey. I think that that's a slippery slope. I think that that's dangerous. And it makes me nervous moving forward with Gavin Newsom being a favorite for a lot of people. he might not be anymore. I don't think the answer is appealing to the moderate side of things

because I'm like, what does Gavin Newsom stand for at this point? All right. The name of the podcast should be Gavin Newsom, I'm running. That should be the name of the podcast. This podcast is Gavin Newsom announcing to the world that he's running in 2028 and getting everybody like, you know, sort of familiar

with him and who he is. Now, in the past, I've said that Gavin Newsom comes across as very presidential and, you know, you see him on Fox News and you see him as somebody who could actually captivate a lot of Americans. He sucked the cock of Charlie Kirk. I listened to the whole interview.

Gavin Newsom gave Charlie Kirk a blowjob. on his own podcast. He sucked his dick. No way around it. Gavin, wipe your mouth. You sucked Charlie Kurt's dick. My kid likes you. You're this, you're that.

To me, that's the wrong way to do it if you're going to do it. That's the wrong way to do it. Now, it's his podcast. He can do whatever he wants to do. This is why I say about this particular issue. There's a conversation that needs to be had about this, but let me tell you who the conversation needs to be had with. I would never have a conversation about anti-Semitism with a Nazi

because the Nazi in this conversation would be trying to make me hate Jewish people. I don't need anybody to do that. Right. I wouldn't have a conversation about black people with a member of the Klan, right? Because the Klan is going to try to reaffirm white supremacy to me. Now, I might have a conversation with someone who I feel like is being influenced by that, who is being lied to about that, right? Who says, oh, I heard this and then that's not true. But when you're that deep in anti-riterate, to me,

I don't personally think that there's much of a conversation that needs to be had on that particular issue. but there is a conversation that needs to be had on this issue and the conversation is between the left and the trans community. I think there needs to be a lot more education about what the actual realities are

about competition, advantage, and fairness in this particular realm, like what it actually means. I think these are probably going to be tough conversations. They're going to be tough conversations, but they have to be between people who are committed to protecting one another.

Like, I would much rather have a tough conversation with this with trans activists and trans advocates and trans people about how this issue is being weaponized to depress their rights in the long run than have a conversation. conversation with someone who is trying to deny their humanity about why they shouldn't feel that way. So anytime that you have this conversation, this particular conversation, with somebody on the right, and you are not locked up to your point in the science and the American reality of public sentiment. Yeah. And in the realistic place that we sit on this, all you're going to

to do is end up empowering their viewpoint, which you're going to end up saying, we can't win elections believing in trans rights, because this issue is not just a specific issue. It's been made the mascot issue for anything involving trans rights. And when we're talking about trans rights, at least when I'm talking about them, I'm not talking about specifically who can spike a volleyball, who can wrestle, who can do this. I'm talking about children who run away from home because of who they are. Children who have higher rates of

unaliving themselves because of who they are. People that get killed because of who they are. I'm talking about protections and a cultural understanding of people that are trans. Yeah.

And that has a lot to do, that has way more to do with humanity than it has to do with sports. So taking a wedge issue and using that to destroy somebody's way of life, you have to be on top of that. I would say that having that conversation with Charlie Kirk, it's more important to litigate what Charlie Kirk thinks about the trans community overall than it is to have a conversation

about what Charlie Kirk thinks about or what happens in some district in Idaho, Minnesota, Massachusetts, or Texas. So to me, when you do what Gavin Newsom did, you say, hey, I want to appeal to a group of people who have basically stated that they're not ready to have the trans conversation yet. And so to me, what we have to do is have conversations with people in the trans community. And these are going to be hard conversations. They're going to be hard conversations because if you're going to be hard conversations because if, you see some type of story from some place where trans athlete is dominating in a girls or women's sport, you need to know from a scientific level how true that is, what the realities behind that are,

and how that particular instance is going to be used to vilify trans people on the whole. have to because the reality is and it's and it's that conversation in and of itself is not going to be fair you have to because what you have to come down to is whether or not a position right there is going to be worth actual legislation that dehumanizes trans people and if it is then you go to the mattresses on it and you come out of come out the other side of it but you have the conversation and you let people know, we don't really know how to talk about this because the chips are stacked so against us. Yeah. I think, and you touched on it and I said it a little bit, I just don't understand why the Democrats continue to run away from this, either run away from this

topic or concede in some sort of way. They got the asses kicked on it. Yeah. In the last election, for sure. Or they concede. And I don't understand that. I don't understand that. I I don't understand why we're not working with Charlie Baker, who's head of NCAA, who testified that they're less than 10 trans athletes in the NCAA. I don't understand where we're not working with them to understand the science, the evidence. Like, I just don't understand why we keep skirting around it and talking about it and not finding, not actually doing the research or understanding the science behind it all. We're just making these accusations that it's unfair or there's some sort of it. advantage and I would love to be able to support or not support that claim. Second thing is what Gavin Newsom is doing with this podcast, the idea of somebody who is potentially

running for president and having a podcast, I actually love it. I think it's good. I don't know if you've ever seen it. But to your point, when you were making the five points, what Gavin Newsom is doing here is not talking like he's talking to you or me. He's being a politician in this podcast. And to me, if he wants to do it. something different or he wants to be more successful in getting the message to the American

people or making the American people feel him. I think that he's going to have to take off his political hat and stop trying to be a friend to the other side in these interviews and really just almost do what he did when he went back and forth with DeSantis. That's the kind of energy that I want to see from him in this podcast. He has a very unique opportunity and he's doing something different, but he's fumbling in the way that he's doing it. This makes me not want to listen to him. I'm more likely to vote for him for president because he's going to show me

just how much he has in common with Charlie Kurt. He's out of his fucking mind. Right. And this is where they, this is where Democrats mess up, where they lose it. You're looking at polling and you're saying, huh,

America feels more, the majority about this on this issue. So I am going to speak to that. That's not the answer. That's not the way to, do it. Yeah. So, anyhow, but once again, the, the trans athletes issue is oftentimes, um, uh, it's oftentimes, um, an issue that in the grand scheme of things is a non-issue for the American people, but I have to be honest with you.

It's an issue that everybody cares about. the trans community cares about it because it seemed at least the the members of the trans community I've talked about because it's seen sport and participation. It's seen as a fundamental right, right? The left cares about it because the trans community cares about it and we caucus with them.

And then the right cares about it because it's a way to score political points with Americans who are not affected by it, but who just feel disconnected from it because they're unaware of the actual depth of the plight of trans people or whatever. So it's a small issue, but it's one of those issues that everyone seems to give a fuck about. I actually think it's a huge issue. And I just want to say it.

I think this is what Republicans make you want to want to make it seem like this is just about fairness and protecting young girls. But if you really look at it, you called it a human rights issue. And it is. It's a human rights issue that transcends sports. Because what you're doing is you're putting fear in trans athletes, in trans people. Because it's not just collegiate. We're not talking professional. We're talking about them participating in high school, junior high, elementary sports, period. And it leads to the erasure of a group of people, a marginalized group of people. It starts with sports. that's the issue that they're focusing on, but you're basically already telling them they're not women, they can't participate,

they're not like you. It really is a huge issue being masked as I'm just protecting young girls from an advantage of a trans athlete has in sports. It's not that. It's protecting trans people. And it'll start here and it'll go on to something else.

So it's really important, one, that the Democrats start speaking on this and really standing up for it, but not just focusing on sports, focusing on trans people as a whole. Talk to the trans community about this issue. The conversation needs to be with them, with trust and truth and honesty.

And look, there has to be some trust because you're going to get things wrong. And if you get things wrong, you know, and you're called transphobic and you're thrown out of the thing, that's not going to work. So there has to be some conversation about this and a way, a strategy to combat this, but it has to come between people who are coming together to acknowledge the basic humanity of people. Because once again, I just don't think a lot of people are very deep on the issue.

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Donnie, did you see the UFC fight? I didn't. I'm not a UFC guy. But I used to be a power slap. Really? What the fuck? Really? Yeah.

I mean, it would come on like TNT or, something and it was just dude slapping each other. That was good background. It's so background. That's like people who go to sleep and watching like documentaries on serial killers and murders and stuff. Like that's not the same. That's, it's barbaric.

It's inhumane. I think the slapping, when people's faces get all distorted, I don't understand why you would subject yourself to participating or watching that. Can't, Rachel, did I tell you about my, my new, videos that I'm watching. What is it now? So I'm not on interrogation videos anymore. I'm on First Amendment auditors.

First Amendment auditors? Yeah. Have you heard of these people? No. Yo, my nigger, these are the best niggas. The First Amendment auditors, y'all are the best niggas. Y'all are the best. So there's this channel called Audit the Audit. and what they do is they talk about the cases of First Amendment auditors everywhere.

This is what First Amendment auditors do. They'll sit in their car and just be in their car. Right. And then someone calls the police on them because they've just been in their car all day on the street. The police come over, they're knock on the glass, they go, hey, people have been calling about you sitting in your car. Can I see your license and registration? And then they'll look at them and they'll go, no. You can't happen.

And they'll be like, why? And they'll be like, because Terry versus Ohio said that you must have reasonable, articulate suspicion of a crime to actually ID me and get my ID from me. You can't have my ID. I have rights. And what their whole life is to call out the most chilling fact that I've learned is that the police don't know the law at all. The police don't know where you can go.

They don't know when they can stop you. They don't know when they can hold you. They don't know what you can say or not say. They have no fucking clue. So a lot of the times we are saying police are violating your rights. They are because they don't know what rights you have. And so all of these First Amendment auditors, they have all of these different statutes memorized.

And they basically put the police in a situation where the police have to react to that. and the police don't know and they made the cops look dumb. And what audit the audit does is it grades the audits of other people. And I've been having a great time. I'm kind of interested.

I'm not going to lie. What race are these auditors? What race do you think they are? Yeah, okay. If they was black, it would be audit the killing. I don't know. I don't know if the computer is listening.

but all I started to type in was first, like first A, and amendment auditors was the first thing that popped up. Because it's growing. It's a whole thing, how to deal with them in an uncomfortable situation, like a step-by-step thing. Should we do it? You know who got a successful audit going? Warren Sapp.

He did it? So I don't know if he did it on purpose, but Warren Sapp has a legitimate lawsuit against a police department in Central Florida somewhere. He was on audit to audit. Warren Sapp was, somebody else was getting arrested, and Warren Sapp was talking to the cops. And the cops then detained and arrested Warren Sapp for obstruction,

clearly unconstitutional, which the auditors point out. And he was then brought to the station, and the whole deal, actually went back and forth with Sapp about it a little bit, go watch Warren Sapp's episode of Auditors, at the audit, and then you'll see that I think he has an ironclad lawsuit against the police. I think it's in

Tampa or Central Florida somewhere. Somewhere. I can't remember where it is. But I don't know if he was trying to conduct the police audit, but he certainly knew his rights that made him seem like an auditor. I, it could be dangerous, but I would love to sit in a car with you and just sit and wait

and have a First Amendment auditing experience. Oh, no, that doesn't happen. When the cops pull me over, I'll turn into Tim Scott. No. It's like it doesn't, no. I'm not going out like that. The cops pulled me over, sir.

I said it would be dangerous. God damn it, sir, I back the blue. Yeah. No, no, no, no. It's not happening to me. I love the auditors that they do it. But I was, like, I feel like I would go, You know, according to, boom, boom, boom, boom, boom, boom,

Johnson, Johnson, Johnson, radio. Man down, man down. He was reaching for his God damn shirt. You see, he had a cowboy hat on, and she probably had a gun. Now, I'm not going through it. It's not happening to me. It's not happening to me.

Okay. How did we get here? The slap videos, the slap videos. Okay. Oh, okay, so back to the UFC. Oh, by the way, Andrew Tate was, went to the UFC fight, UFC 313, and he was loved by everybody there, loved on by everyone hugged Donald.

The UFC has now ceased to become a sports league or an entity. The UFC, to me, is a white supremacist, broumanosphere propaganda organization. It is a direct organization. If you have sons, teenage kids that are into the UFC, you should stop them from watching it. The UFC is dangerous. To me, the UFC in it of itself is grooming, particularly the young men of our society to be white supremacists, anti-women. Manosphere

fucking soldiers. When you look at the fact that you had a UFC fighter, I think it was Bryce. Bryce Smith was his name. Look up what his name was. Bryce something a couple of months ago that outwardly praised Adolf Hitler,

openly praised Adolf Hitler, and received no sort of blowback for it, no sanction, no punishment from the UFC for praising Adolf Hitler. When you see that, you talk about power slap, Dana White invented power slap. He got into a power slap situation with his wife. Yep. Okay?

On video. And so when you look at all of this stuff combined, Andrew Tate goes to the UFC event, a guy who is wanted in two different countries for sex trafficking offenses. Romania is one, but also in the UK. And here. And there's charges here. And is welcomed and hugged up and broed up by Dana White.

There seems to be a lifestyle and a method of thinking and a method of being that the UFC is intellectually and culturally codifying. Of course. That, to me, is super duper dangerous. Well, you already talked about Dana White and his transgressions, and he was not punished. He continued to be on ESPN. He is continuously rewarded for being who he is without any sort of repercussions. And so, of course, this man is going to embrace Andrew Tate, who is a,

known proud misogynist who is accused of the things that you just said wanted in three different countries and how is he rewarded he's because he was not allowed to leave Romania now he's allowed to leave comes in on a private jet comes to Florida shockingly desantis is against it does not want him to be in Florida and then goes and sits front row at a UFC fight where he's praised by a crowd of people and the person who created the event that he's at and says, welcome home. When you're a young boy and you're watching Andrew Tate put down women or put down people that he has nothing or groups of people that he has nothing in common with because he continues to want to make himself the center of the worldview or the world and shits on anything else

that is anti that. And you have these young boys who are in this time in their life where they're trying to figure themselves out. They're trying to figure out their place in this world. And they see themselves being praised and big up by him and this whole community. And then whatever they do, they're not punished for it. It seems like they can do whatever they want. And, you know, Andrew Tate also teaches these classes of how to be a hustler and how to be successful. They're looking at this like, I want to be like this guy. I can't think of anything thought. But yes, like that's, of course this is a breeding ground for this type of behavior and it'll continue as long as it's unchecked.

I'll say it very simple. The UFC is, in my opinion, now a political organization. It's not an entertainment organization. It's a political organization. It is one of the most influential and dangerous political organizations that exist today. It has a direct main line to a certain demographic of young men and teenage boys. and the type of things that the UFC normalizes main lines and promotes, to me, are racist, sexist, and in and of itself, completely wrong for young men to be taken into their minds.

I'm not trying to mommy or daddy anymore, but to see somebody who's wanted three different places for sex crimes. Look, I don't know what Andrew Tate did or didn't do. I don't. But I know that it's typical for someone to stand trial for the things that they're accused of and be exonerated of those things before they are then responded to or treated like a hero by someone as influential as Dana White or an organization that has as much, I guess, cultural relevance as the UFC. but for as much talk as how political the NBA got

or political or apolitical that the NFL is, the UFC is directly political. Their founder speaking on behalf of President Trump and the rest of the things they've done. And no one seems to care about that part of it. And I think that their politics are bad. Yeah. All right, let's take a break.

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Visit weathertech.com today. Let's talk about Dochi. People were pissed at her after she appeared on Hot On's verses with DJ Miss Milan. During their round of discussions, Dochi revealed what her biggest red flag was or is and people got pissed. Let's hear Doci. Okay. What's my biggest dating red flag? Is it being on the DL?

You're on the right track. I have my answer. Ah! Is it close enough? Are you, you want to guess one more time, what would be a red flag for me? Bad music taste? Oh, that is a good one, because that's one for me. That is a good one.

What do you mean? You don't listen to Michael Jackson. But, okay. Okay. This is a huge red flag for me. All right. You're a man. Yeah.

And you're heterosexual. Yeah. I was going to say, so technically, because my mind was already there, I don't think I deserve to eat a wing. I think you do, friend. I think there was a lot of social media outrage about the fact that Dochi said this. And I think a lot of praise, a lot of criticism. And when I looked at a lot of the criticism, I thought, I think you're just proving Dochi's point with all of it.

I guess I just don't understand. And you are a straight male. I don't understand why people took this, or maybe straight men, took this so personal when she is talking about her personal preference. Oh, yes, you do. She's, no, no. She's talking about... She's talking about her personal preference.

How easily can I debunk this? Go, go, go, go. This is going to be the easiest thing that I debunk ever. Go. You do understand why. No, I don't. Okay, so I'm going to ask you a question, and I want you to answer it honestly.

You know what question's coming. So I'm going to ask you a question, and I want you to answer it honestly. Okay, go ahead. You just answer the question honestly. Go ahead. Let's just say that that's not Dochi. Let's say that that's, oh, let's say it's Shibuzi.

This is a good one to go with. And they asked Shibuzzi, what is a red flag for you in dating someone? And Shabuzzi writes down if they are a black woman. That's not what she did. How is what she did any different than that? Okay. Hearing a black man say that he doesn't, that a red flag is a black woman is so layered and there's deeper than that. Her saying a straight man, I don't think that that's the same thing.

Why? Especially when she's queer. Okay. It almost makes sense. It almost makes sense. She's not even into straight men. Okay. So my thing is this.

First of all, I still fuck with Dochi the long way. Yeah, yeah. This doesn't bother me at all. right? Not at all. Right. However, if we just say... If she said black men, totally different situation. Why?

If she said my red flag is a black man, because of a black woman saying that she doesn't like her own race, that's layered. It sounds like you have a lot of self-hate. It sounds like it's black people putting down black people. Like you're saying it so everybody, you're allowing other people to jump. jump in on that and put down a black man as a race, it's different to me than her talking about because so what I'm saying is it's different to you because your example was different to me. Okay, I get it. It's different to you because it's more meaningful to you because it's more meaning that particular I have a preference is more meaningful to you. It means something more

more if you have a preference that is anti-black woman than if you have a preference that is anti-straight man, right? And we can talk about that, whether or not that's valid or not. We can talk about what straight men have meant to women's safety and all of that stuff, but it's still a preference, right? If you say you might have a... But that is particular. You might have, what I'm talking about right,

now, it's not a one-to-one comparison about whether or not you're anti-straight man or whether or not you're anti-black women. What I'm saying is we litigate people's preferences all the time. Sure. For whatever reason. And the normal reason why we litigate those people's preferences is because how their preferences make us feel. And it's probably a lot of straight men that was rocking out to Dochi and all of that stuff that went, oh my God, me being. who I am, who I was born as, is a red flag to Doche. Well, that kind of sucks.

It makes me feel bad. The question is whether or not straight men are allowed to feel that way. That's the question. Because we understand that black women are allowed to feel. I think we all feel that way, that if you say that, then black women are allowed to feel a certain way about it. The question is really about whether or not straight men are allowed to feel well, I should not be treated a certain way because of the way that I was born.

Now look. I guess I don't feel, if Shibuzi, to your example, said, I don't, my red flag is straight woman, is a straight woman. I wouldn't feel that that was targeted, even as a straight woman to me. If he said a black woman, it makes it more personal, more specific. I wouldn't feel, I wouldn't be like, man, I'm a straight woman. That sucks. I don't know.

I don't feel anything. It's too broad. for me to feel anything from it. And I agree with you. Your reason, you're right about it being personal and we litigate it because we feel like you're,

you know, you're being personally attacked. But that's so broad, it wouldn't, it wouldn't move me either way. So that's why I guess her saying it. To me. So I don't feel Doche's was specific enough.

Straight man, that's a lot of, that's a wide, cast a wide net. It just wasn't that big of a deal to me. And if you're doing, if you're using another, big star who said straight women,

I feel the same way. I'd be like, all right. But I wouldn't like if Jocchi said black men. I would not like that. Right. This is my thing. I didn't care at all. I thought it was funny.

But I do understand why, and it's interesting, I do understand why some guys were just like, damn. Yeah, I mean, maybe they liked her. They thought they had a chance. I get that. Oh, no, no, no.

And by the way, even the thought that they had a chance thing is crazy. Because it's not even thought that they, do you understand that someone saying that they don't like you as a human being is much more important, much more powerful than someone saying that they like you? Someone just saying that they don't like you for whatever reasons, particularly the reason that you can't control, is much more powerful than someone saying that they like you. Just the way that we're wired. Yeah, I get that. And so, look, I get it. I'm a straight guy and I'm older. So I get wires like, you know, like, you know, we're disgusting.

I understand it. Part of that disgust is hardwired into us and it's who we are. We got to deal with it. But I also do say, I mean, if niggas was mad about it, these people were mad about it, These people were mad about just, we can't do the preferences thing because the preferences argument can go so far. Okay. White women are his preference.

Maybe that's his preference. Maybe that's who we like. That's probably who Shibuzi like. Any day now, Shabuzi's going to pop up with somebody from the cast of Yellowstone. Okay. It's going to happen. And then you're going to dis some. you're going to use that in the Shibuzi Willie Jones War.

Stop. There's no beef. All right, let's move on. Okay. Stephen A. Smith and LeBron James, it's been like a back and forth for about a week or more now. Last week, video surface of LeBron confronting Smith court side during a game. And that video went viral. And after that happened, Stephen went on his podcast.

and tried to clear up exactly what went down between the two. He approached me during the game, and he said, stop effing with my son. That's my effing son. Stop effing with my son. I said, what? Nah, nah, nah, nah. Straight up, man to man.

Real talk. Stop effing with my son. And I saw how furious he was. and I said we could talk about LA. Nah, F that, F that. Stop effing with my son. That's my son. That's my son. I said, all right, though.

Fine. And he walked away. That's all he said. I knew what he was talking about. I've spoken about this before. Matter of fact, I heard that not many, not all, but a few players were upset at me about that. I think one player in particular was train

on Green, who I haven't spoken to since and has no desire to speak to me primarily because of this, I suppose. I think she might have to go to the bathroom. Oh my God. Rachel just fucking disappeared. Keep this in the podcast. I turn around

and Rachel is gone. Ninja like, she just snuck away. She got out of here. She didn't care what Stephen had to say. She was like, all right. She doesn't give a fuck about what Stephen A had to say. I'm over this. Donnie, while Rachel's gone,

let's talk about the top five guys that we can hook Rachel up with. I think, I mean, we're too late. Give me your celebrity, Rachel Lindsay dream pairing. Oh, boy. This on the spot.

Willie Jones. Willie Jones. Donnie, you're such a fuck. cuck. You just cucked out right there. Okay, shout out to Willie, but you just cucked out. Ooh, what about Willie Jones? Yeah, I think that's a good one too. Ashley hit it. That's the one.

Y'all are so cuckified. So, so, so, so cuckified. So, so, so cuckified. J.D. and the Brat should get back together, and they should remix So Funkified to So Cuckafide. So Cuckified. It's the B-R-A-T. Right-T-T-T-T-T-T.

But no, people don't even remember that record. So Funkified is a hit, man. Sorry. So. So Funk-Fifide. We should, we're going to redo, we're going to do so cuckified whenever someone is a cuck. Donnie, send me the instrumental.

I want to re-record it for so cuckified. Since you guys just cucked out when I asked you guys the question. Leave all of that in, too. Rachel will hear. All right. Go ahead. Take it. Take it, take it, take it.

Stephen A invited this. Stephen A told everyone that if you have a problem with anything that he says, pull up. It was funny when he, because it's lingering, because like on the broadcast of the Laker Celtics game during half-time, Stephen A was like, we've talked enough about LeBron James. Let's talk about Jason Tatum. So this is going on for a while. It's obvious that they have some sort of long-lingering beef.

But Stephen A said it. He said, if you have a problem with me, he said, I'm at all of these games, I'm at all of this stuff, you see me pull up, and LeBron did that. What's the big deal? I don't think any of this is a big deal. But I will say this. LeBron James coming up and saying, you know, having a Will Smith moment and saying, your son, my son's name out of your mouth,

if I'm brawny, I'm embarrassed. Would you not? I mean, it just, it's like, I don't think Stephen A. Smith has said anything that bad because I've taken an issue, we've taken an issue, I think, with a lot of the things that Stephen A. Smith has said, but when it comes to Bronny, I really haven't thought that he's said anything that disrespectful or that bad. I understand as a father, you don't want anybody speaking about,

you know, your child. And I understand the need he feels to step up and take up for him. But it's like, that's kind of what people are, like, let Brony do his thing. I would be embarrassed if I was Brony and I'm like, Dad, please don't yell at Stephen A. Smith. I'm sorry. Dad, please don't yell at Stephen A. Smith on my behalf.

I don't know. Ronnie's an adult. Ronnie's a part of this game. He's got a contract. He's in the G League. He's playing some NBA games. Let him do his thing. I think I would have rather LeBron take issue with other things Stephen A. Smith has said about him than this.

It's just, it's like let Ronnie grow up. Let him stand on his own two feet. Let's look at the whole gaggle of truth. The whole gaggle of truth is this. Number one, Brony would not. be in the NBA right now if it wasn't for LeBron James. Of course. I do believe that had Brony gone to a smaller school, play for three or maybe four years,

that Brony has what it takes to have worked himself into an NBA player. I've seen similar players. Now, Scottie Pippin Jr. was a much better player in college than Brony was. But he didn't go to USC and get thrust into the light and all of that stuff like that. We've seen it. We've seen guys like that work themselves into legitimate. NBA players. And Bronny could have done that.

I think he went to too big of a school. There was too much of a spotlight on him. I think if he would have gone someplace and got a lot more minutes and been allowed to grow, that he could have played himself into an NBA player. He also went into cardiac arrest. Had a very, very serious medical condition

that happened to him at the beginning of his basketball career. That's a fact. So that's true. It's also true that LeBron James and Stephen A. Smith have had an ongoing thing that dates back forever. And so I think what LeBron James was trying to say was if there's any part of that legacy with us that is informing the way you talk about my son, I'm not fucking with that. I think what LeBron James wants is a clean slate, which is impossible because of the way that LeBron James has gone about putting LeBron James Jr. into the NBA.

It's impossible for us to have an unbiased opinion of LeBroni because of the biased way that LeBroni was that Brani was put into the league. It's impossible to just look at him as any other 55th pick that goes into the NBA. It's impossible to do it. However, I think LeBron would like people to try. But that's only going to happen

when Brony makes his own name in the league. to your point. I think brawny versus Stephen A. Brony, this is your time. Drop your nuts. Let him do it. Talk shit to Stephen A. You know what I'm saying? Boe up on Stephen A. Right now, if Stephen A and Brony dropped them hands, I got, I'm taking

brawny. I think Brony right now would drag Stephen A by his tie. I just wish. I would hate to see happening. I wish LeBron could see some of the damage of what he's doing. It's like, all right, you used, you know, your status, your leg. your legacy, everything that makes you you to get your son to where he is now.

I mean, in the league, you know, drafted a contract, all of that with the Lakers. Now you got to let it go and you got to let him stand because it's doing damage. It's still looking at him as a child when he's a man in this league. And I just think he's doing more harm than good at this point with moments like this. You did your thing. Now let him do his. I was up. I hate that that's what he said.

So this is my thing. Oh, Justin Fields just signed with the Jets, two-year, $40 million deal, $30 million guaranteed. So this is my only thing with it. I remember I was maybe like 23 or 24. Me and my dad were like going through some issues. My dad had actually kicked me out. So mom had moved out of the house. They got divorced.

Mom moved out the house. I don't know. I don't know if I'm talking about. talked about this. I've never understood the value of a woman more than I did when my mother moved out of the house and left me and dad in the house by ourselves. Like, mom moved out of the house and the house literally fell apart. And she wasn't just like a homemaker. Like, she had a job, but the house literally fell apart. Everything about the house became janky. Everything, there was just little things about keeping your world in order and beautiful that a woman provides

and functional that two grown men just didn't do. Everything fell apart. Everything. Before you know it, it was like we went from being a Popeye's to a church's chicken. But me and dad ended up clashing and he kicked me out the house. So the day I was leaving, I was leaving to go to Ian's house. Ian took me in when dad kicked me out. So I was leaving to go to Ian's.

I'm coming back to get some of my stuff. Like the large animal veterinarian is coming there to look after one of the horses. So I get there. Dad isn't there yet. So I didn't know that the vet was supposed to be coming to look at the horse. The vet is mad that dad is late. But he loves animals. So he wants to continue to look at the horse.

I get there and he goes, Are you Van Lathan? And I go, yes, but I'm not the one that you're looking for. And he goes, well, how are you not the one that I'm looking for? You're Van Lathan. This is your place. And I can't even explain to him that I am Van Lathen, but you're looking for my father, who is also Van Lathen.

So I'm trying to say, yeah, I know what you're here to do, but I can't, I'm not the Van Lathen that you're looking for. This guy starts to lose it on him, right? And it's like, old man, kind of getting in my shit a little bit because he's mad. I'm not tripping on it. I think it's kind of funny. So I'm just standing there. I'm like, if you should shut up, I'll tell you that you're looking for my father.

This goes on for maybe like 90 seconds and dad rolls up. When dad rose up, he sees somebody getting into it with his son, his son that he has kicked out of his home. He sees somebody getting into it with his son and he just gets out of it. car and he very calmly says, and he says, I see you raising your, your, your voice to my boy, it's a pawn in the back and you very close to in it. I'm 23. He goes, it's a pawn in the back. You're going to be floating in the pond if you keep raising your, raising your, uh, raising

your voice to my boy. He goes, now he ain't shit. And he need to go in there, get his shit and leave my house. But you don't talk to. him like that. You don't raise your mouth to my board. You know what? How about this? And anytime my dad says, how about this? You know what? How about this? Get your motherfucking stethoscope. Get the fuck off my property. You got 10 minutes and bullies going to start flying. Dude, calls the police. The whole thing crazy. Dad threatened him. But he, don't matter how old I am,

he don't appreciate you fucking with his son. I get that. You know, You know, he don't appreciate you. So I can, you know, I get it. I understand it. I get it too. And then after that, the nigger yelled at me because when I left, I tried to take a carrot cake. There was some carrot cake sitting up there. He only taking one slice of the carrot cake.

Shit, I go out. I put the carrot cake in the car. And he's like, you fat, slovenly, you mean to tell me you going pack the carrot cake? Get the fuck out of my house. I'm like, I bought it. Then me and him about to fight over the carrot cake. but he still, Stephen A. Smith, the guy that was yelling at his son over the horses. The only person that, the only people that lost was the horses because they didn't get checked out.

Ah, damn it, I missed my dad. Anyway, speaking of dads. Oof. Yeah. Dr. Umar's daughter posted a video recently. Speaking about her relationship with her father, let me play a little bit of what she had to say. Hey, TikTok, so I just wanted to come on here with a small, short announcement. I just want to start this video off by saying, I'm not trying to get clout. I literally just want to have a conversation with my father. My biological father is Dr. Umar.

He has another daughter. I tried to contact him about, you know, getting to know my sister on my dad's side. I asked him if he knows her or if he has her number. He ignored me and never responded. I'm 22 years old now. My dad has never been to anything important, no graduation, no birthday parties, nothing. He has not been in my life. Again, I'm not making this video to bash him.

I'm making this video to state facts, okay? You can't get on Instagram and get on social media and portray to be an activist and talk about how black kings need to be with black women, but you're not even in your black woman's daughter's life. It doesn't make sense. You're being an hypocrite. And it's frustrating because I reached out to you. I reached out to you.

All right. So she went on for a few more minutes. But Dr. Umar has responded a few times. He wrote a lengthy IG caption where he basically said, this is a money grab. Nothing more, nothing less. My daughter and I have been in contact with each other for several years now. She's reached out to me intermittently for the past eight years or so since high school. Each and every time that I've heard from my child, I've asked to see and spend time with her.

She has never accepted my request for a meeting in all these years. Family mess for the public. What do y'all think? Play his other response. It's a, it's a, did he do a video? I thought he only wrote. Yeah, he did one second. I need y'all to stay focused.

I appreciate those of y'all who are standing, fighting for me. I appreciate the love. But we're going to let all the negativity cycle through. We're not feed into it, no. more positive vibrations we in the new year black history month just ended this is black march positive vibrations that's all we're going to do everybody who want to throw this and throw that and let them do it i'm not worried about that let them do it we're going to do what we got to do you feel me so everybody stay focused everybody stay blessed and we're going to do what we need to do we got a bill

y'all we got a bill stay focus don't let the evil take us if you whip me you with me if you ain't you ain't. I'm not begging nobody. If you whip me, you whip me. If you ain't, you ain't. The only thing good that's coming out of this unfortunate situation is everybody got to pick a side. Pick aside and stay on it. Please stay on your side. No more frenemies. I don't want no

more frenemies. Either with me or you not, let's do what we got to do. Black Queens forever. I don't like being in stuff like this. I don't like it either. I, and I'm not a doctor, umar fan, but how do you even talk about this when you don't know,

I'm sure the truth lies somewhere in between. Obviously, I'm not going to say that it's a money grab. I don't like that part of it. I don't like him saying, hey, she's after me because of my money. The girl is saying she doesn't want a relationship with him. She just wants to get to know her sister. She posted another video, said that she found her sister. If that's all she wants, I hope that, you know, it's unfortunate that she doesn't

and have a relationship with her biological father. It doesn't seem like she wants one. I think that's also unfortunate. But she says she wants to meet her sister. Sounds like she is. I just, this family business and it's so messy. I hate it.

I will say this, though. That audio piece from Dr. Umar is, that's not, that's insufficient. Dr. Umar can't do. that. You got divorced and you were going through a divorce, a family situation that was reported on. Dr. Umar took a post from what was going on in your divorce and he used it to make a statement. He got in your business because you were married to a white man. Dr. Umar decided that he wanted to make a statement about your relationship ending. Okay.

And the only thing I'm saying is this. Like, I don't, to your point, things between families, I know more than anyone that there are layers to the situation. However, it is completely appropriate for anyone to wonder what the situation between Dr. Omar and his children are because he's opened himself up to that type of scrutiny with the way that he has peered and had opinions on other people's personal. lives. He has an opinion of what type of woman you should marry. He has an opinion of what type of woman you should be with or what type of person of the way that you should do it, the way

your finances should be conducted. And by the way, all of that's fine. I'm not saying that I don't like look at what he says and doesn't think that there's anything worth any merit. He talks about keeping resources and keeping pride inside of the black community. Sure. Whether or not you agree with Dr. Umar and and everything he says, the reality is there are certainly some things that he says that you can understand at least why he's saying them. However, if we were to find out,

if people were to find out, I don't know whether or not this is true. Like I said, I don't even want to be in the middle of it. However, if people were to find out that this were true, that Dr. Umar had a child or children, particularly black women children, black female children, that he did not have a relationship with financially or not just financially.

From the standpoint of a guidance and availability standpoint, then that would certainly be pertinent in the way that you look at him for someone that talks as much about the black family unit and standard as he does. That would certainly, certainly be. something that people deserved to know and talk about. If you hold yourself up in that regard, I talk about my dad all the time. My dad would preach that family shit, preach that family stuff, preach it as much as I miss him,

the reality is this. When I preached that responsibility and morality shit, when I learned after that he had a couple of kids that he didn't have very much of a relationship with, it fundamentally changed the way I looked at him. Not the way I looked at myself. I didn't feel like I had some sort of, I don't know, like he loved me more than he loved them. I thought about who wasn't getting the same guy that I got. And if you preach that shit, you got to stand on it.

So him saying, we're going to ignore it and focus on, if it's not true, it's not true. But it's certainly, certainly for someone that has litigated other people's lives as much as Dr. Umar has. And I'm not going to say it's not funny when he does it or whatever. or that I disagree in every single case, right? But, you know, yeah, you certainly it would change your opinion of him if you found out that something so core to what he's talking about that it wasn't consistent.

Yeah, I mean, you know, for reasons you stated and more, I don't have the best opinion of him. But, yeah, I'll just leave it there. I think he's top five most entertaining people on the planet. I didn't say he wasn't entertaining. I even laugh at the things he says. Top five most entertaining people on the plan. He is 100% entertaining.

Yeah. But I don't agree with everything he said. Would you want to have Dr. Umar on to talk about this and other things? We can absolutely have Dr. Umar on. I don't agree with the way he goes about certain things. I like I like the pride he has for black people, obviously. But the way some of his methods of going about it, I'm not necessarily. Rachel, I've, I've,

I have a question for you. Are you mixed race? No. Do you bunny hop? No, not anymore. You didn't get the job. Am I mixed? I should didn't.

Wait, am I mixed race? No. Donnie knows. That was a good, it was a Dr. Umar impression. He was being. Well, I knew you were, I knew you were doing Dr. Umar. I knew you were doing Dr. Umar. But is that the joke?

Is Dr. Umar's funniest moment? Are you mixed race? No. Are you a bunny hopper? It's the funniest moment. Joe might not know who the fuck cleans this. The son just hit me. Shoot.

Are you mixed race? No. Or you're a bunny hopper? I knew you were doing him, but okay, I thought that there was something else. Sorry. Before we get out of here, before we got out of here, this is the coldest shit of the week. I'm going to start doing this.

The coldest shit of the week. This shit is the coldest shit. Rachel, you don't agree? Go ahead. Go ahead and introduce your new topic. A guy named Carney Jarrett, he's a Twitch streamer. He full combo. Donnie, bring it up.

Through fire and flames at 200% on Guitar Hero. He spent nine months and 50,000 a tips to get here. Donnie, put it up while I'm talking about it. You better get there. Dude is cold as shit. As a matter of fact, put it in after. No. So people can see it while I'm talking about it.

He is going crazy. And as I watched this, it was so dramatic to me. It's so crazy to me how nuts he was going. Just doing the whole day. Everybody in his Twitch stream cheered him on. And then he gets it. Perfect. 200%?

50,000 attempts, Rachel. you better get it after 50,000 attempts. I'm not saying to watch it was extreme. But there's so many nine months and 50,000 attempts, the amount of time that you put into this for this moment, 50,000, you better get to there at this point. Do you think you could do it after 50,000? That's a lot of practice on one song to get there.

I get the 200% speed. I'm just saying it's a lot of time that's, put into it all to play a song that you can't even play on a real guitar. Y'all are so crazy. Every time I see a human being do something like this, I'm inspired. I, like, I would be honest with you. I couldn't do this. Yes, you could do all things after 50,000 attempts.

I don't think I could do it even in 50,000. I just don't have it. Like, I'm not going to, I can't, I can't do, I look at some times people that do choreography and I can't do things. Like I can do stuff, right? But I can't do anything that you have to do for a long time based upon memory and not mess it up. Remember we talked about the electric slide and all of that stuff?

Like my brain glitches out after like I can do something. If you have to redo something, I can do it for the third or fourth time. And then on the fifth time, I'm going to mess it up. Okay. If it's improvisational, it's fine. But if it's something that has to be remembered and stuck to, like choreographed, I can't do it. I don't practice speeches because if I think about what I have to remember, I'll definitely forget. I'm like that.

I don't like this talk. Van, the next time you say you can't do something, I want you to look at yourself in the mirror and say, yes, I can. After 50,000 times. But you have to look at what he's doing. He's using his elbow to strum the shit. Rachel, you don't think that this is dope, man. When I watched it, my mouth was open because I just couldn't believe it.

I was in awe for different reasons maybe than you, but I was. I don't like the people that are coming at this guy. Because there's so many people coming at this guy talking about how much time you wasted. It is a lot of. of time. Imagine if you apply it to other things in life. This person is obviously focused and dedicated and can do things when they

put their mind to it. Put it into something else. Why? This is what I kept thinking. You know what I kept thinking? What now? What next? What next? Look. He just, he just, look, look at this. He, he tweeted this

nine hours ago. Yo, they are cooking me on Twitter today. I don't want to play real guitar. He doesn't want to play the real guitar. I know he doesn't. But he could be great. I'm, I don't think that there is a real guitar player

in the world that's as good at the guitar as Carney Jarrett is at Guitar Hero. Probably so. And they probably don't care. It's a fake guitar. I think it's cold.

Well, four or five buttons. Carney Jared, I'm fucking with you. Like you, he's, he's, I will, I think. He was beating that thing too. Carney, he was going, look at the focus, man. Look at them right now. Look at the focus, man. Carnie Jared is the fucking man.

Let it go. All right, that's enough. All right, that's enough. No more podcast for you guys. It's a lot of podcasts right there. I'll tell you things caps off, but do not stop learning. I am Van Lathen, Jr. And I'm Rachel Lynn Lindsay.

Bye guys