Higher Learning with Van Lathan and Rachel Lindsay - Michelle Obama 2024 and Cerise Castle on LAPD’s Use of Force

Episode Date: December 31, 2021

Van Lathan and Rachel Lindsay react to the deaths of the legendary Archbishop Desmond Tutu (14:07) and coach-broadcaster John Madden (18:52). Plus, discussing Joe Rogan's suggestion of Michelle Obama for president in 2024 (27:42) and journalist Cerise Castle joins to provide insight on violence from the LAPD and gang affiliation within the department (35:38).  Hosts: Van Lathan and Rachel Lindsay Guest: Cerise Castle Producers: Trudy Joseph and Donnie Beacham Learn more about your ad choices. Visit podcastchoices.com/adchoices

Yo, yo, yo, thought warriors. What is up? High Learning is on. It is I, Van Lathen, Jr. And it's me, Rachel and Lindsay. Rachel Lentzy. Okay. Um, yeah.

What's going on? It's time to do the podcast. You okay? Yeah, I'm good. Good. It's raining a lot, you know? I mean, we were off on Monday. You know, did you have a happy holiday?

Yeah, it was happy. Happy many times. We did nothing. We did nothing. We watched snowfall and I cooked and that's it. Let's talk about snowfall. How you feel? And I'm happy to say we are done.

We finished it quick. We went through all four seasons within this month. Right. I got to tell you. I had one final thought and I sent it to you when I was done. I hate Franklin. I hate Franklin St. I hate Franklin St.

I'm conflicted. I understood. It's very Walter White. You know, you see the, you see them change. The game changes. you almost have to as a as a way of survival. Mm-hmm. But what I love so much about him, I can't stand.

What? I can't stand. I just, there's, nothing is off limits, you know? And then when he is, like, for a second, Leap, spoiler alert, Leon had to go. If you were going to let go at anybody, Leon had to go. Not right. Yep.

Leon, Leon had to go. You just do your people like that? He lost way too much. You just do your people like that? But think about what Leon did to him. No, no, no, no. See, nobody's talking about what Leon did. Leon fucked up.

And because Leon did, Leon was disrespectful to the rules, to the game, to everything that had been set in place. Leon took matters into his own hands. This is a consequence of Leon's actions. Leon had to go. I want to let them old-school dudes handle up on him

or let Diamond in Dallas, whatever their names were. Oh, my God. Oh, my Lord. It sounded like he was just doing nothing. And look at all that happened. It was like a trickle-down effect. Right. From Leon's actions, Leon's selfishness.

Remember, Leon left Franklin. This is fresh on my mind. I got to talk to somebody about it. That's funny. Leon fucked up. That's funny. That's funny. I'm glad you're into it.

It's a good show, right? I love it. What do you think about Wanda? I love Wanda. What do you think about Melody? What do you think about Melody? I'm mad. Melanie's still with us.

So I see what I'm saying. The wrong people are being punished. Melody had to go. It was so heartbreaking when Melody started smoking rock. I was so mad about it. But you know what frustrated me? The guy who was like, let's do it, apparently he was fine. He hit it once and left.

but she got hooked. Well, we don't know what happened to him, you know. That happens sometimes in movies, though, because, like, remember traffic where, you see traffic, so Tofer Grace was introducing Amanda Seafre. It wasn't Amanda Seafre? He was introducing, no, I don't think it was Amanda Seafree.

She wasn't in traffic. Who was that? Who was the, she played an amazing drug addict. It was, what's her face? Is traffic with Tandy Newton? that is crash that's crash that's crash okay so that crash traffic is with uh similar movie in terms of the ensemble cast traffic has don chiello is in both movies uh traffic is traffic has don chiegel it has um michael douglas it has katherine zeta jones it has uh um fucking

what's this guy's the guy's name from i'm mixing the two movies together No, traffic. What's my man's name? He's, oh, my God, I can't believe this. My guy from usual suspects and he plays the collector. Edward, Ed Norton. No, wrong. He's non-usual suspects.

How is this happening to me? Traffic has everybody's in traffic. Tofer Grace is in traffic, but I don't think it's a man to see free, though. Maybe they need to put me on the rewatchables. Oh, Benicio del Toros, who I'm thinking about. God damn it. That's all my New Year's resolution to be able to record on the rewatchables. You're never happy.

Bill, if you're listening, put me on, put me on. You got a long way to go. At this retreat that I'm at, there's a girl who's a big fan of, fan of the rewatchables because she saw my ringer hat. And I was like, they won't let me on the show. I've asked. Well, there's got to be some movie you could do a rewatchable. Think about it.

Do they do Disney movies? Depends on the kind of Disney movie. I mean, they might do what, if you're talking about like, remember the Titans as a Disney movie, they might do that, you know? But that's got to be some movie you could be on the rewatchables for.

That's what we should do. It's not about, it's not about you getting your film knowledge up to the point to where you can be on a rewatchables. It's about finding the movie that like you could do rewatchables on. I'm trying to think what it is. Is there any movie?

Should we podcast on season five of Snowfall? Yes. Because it's so fresh, it's so fresh on my mind. I have to talk to, I have to talk to somebody about it. We have to. And it's coming pretty soon. We're doing it. So Thought Warriors catch up.

If you haven't already, you can do it on Hulu. Catch up. It's Erica Christensen, not Amanda C-free. What am I thinking? You just mixed up your blonde white women? Mixed up my blondes. Mists up my blondes, you know. Yeah, so

I've never seen it. You've never seen traffic I'm looking at the cast I've never seen it I'm only thinking of crash directed by Stephen Soderberg like traffic is a good movie It's very it's a lot of it has a lot to do with drugs though

It's all centered around drugs drugs drugs drugs drugs drugs drugs drugs drugs drugs from the standpoint of the Mexican cartel Michael Douglas becomes the new drugs are Then Then Luis Guzman and Don Cheadle all play I think they're DEA agents and they're looking for they're trying to bring down this job

but all the stories intertwined and then Tover Grace is in it is why I was getting to as Erica Christensen's boyfriend who introduces her to crack she then yes Tover Grace she then gets hooked on crack but Tover Grace's perfectly fine

that's to connect it back to what you were saying she gets hooked on crack Tover Grace he's cool he's going to board in school he's doing crack. It's a tough drug to do recreationally. Let's say that.

I'm sure some people do, but it's a tough drug to do recreationally. Interesting. I'm going to watch this now. Yo, so I got to take a moment here. And, oh, you know what? Before we do this, I want to talk to Trudy real quick. Trudy jump in.

Hey, y'all. So, Trudy, you're hot in these streets right now. You know, it's like, it's not a Monday. So it's not time for. for Trudy's Corner, we'll do that next Monday where we bring you in and kind of get your opinion, you know, you bash black man for five minutes or whatever it is.

What easy. I'm getting for free game. So how are you dealing with the attention that being toxic is like, like throwing onto your life? I mean, toxic are telling the truth. I mean, really, which one is it? But I will say, I was minding my business last night, okay? Like, I mean really minding my business and watching don't.

look up on Netflix and it was a part of the movie when they were saying don't look up chanting and I was like, let me look down at my phone and all hell broke loose because you posted that which y'all didn't even know. Like three, four weeks ago at this point. So like I just need to know from you. Did you just decide to be chaotic in the last couple hours of 2021 or what was it? This is why I decided. Yeah.

This is why I decided. I'm calling on the thought warriors right now. I've decided that it's time for us to take the next level in podcasting. It's time for us to grow the audience of the Thought Warrior Nation. And I hadn't posted that clip. That's a good clip to get people talking. This is what I want people to do. Everybody who is listening to my voice right now, how many people that listen to the podcast,

I don't know if we got 30,000 listening. I don't know if we got 40,000 listening. We don't know. I don't know how many. You don't know that. What are you talking about? No, I said we don't know. No, I said, you're right.

I have no idea how many. I'm agreeing with you. We have no idea how many people are listening, 100, 150. What I'm saying is, if you're listening, go join the Reddit group. I need the Reddit group. The Reddit group is as about 3,000 people, even if you don't participate. I need the Reddit group at 10,000 people. I need what's going on on higher learning.

I need all of our socials going up. Hit the follow button. Trudy, tell them where our socials are. we are higher underscore learning on Twitter and higher learning one word on Instagram. Yes. Like, subscribe, do all that stuff. It's time for us to go up a little bit. The podcast has a fantastic audience, but it's time for us to grow even more.

So I was looking at that. I'm like, let me put something to get people. Let me follow on Reddit. Let me put something to get people a little spiced up. Get people spiced up. You know what I mean? Spiced up. No, you shouldn't follow the Reddit.

I don't follow it either. because it's like when I used to be a lot more active on there but then they were right it's really more for them than it is for us oh do you write in it though I write it I post every now and again but like but I don't follow it the Reddit is for the fans okay I don't want to lure over the Reddit okay okay keep an eye on the Reddit post on the Reddit they would love to have you on the Reddit by the way they love you um so I said hey post this Trudely Kill it we never posted it I've never posted it

posted it post a Trudy clip And truly, your true colors once again were exposed. People saw you for who you are. So how do you feel about that? Like, I'm literally just saying what everyone's thinking. Like, I honestly didn't say with it the term half fishing, but that's really what it is. It's half fishing.

But I do want to say, I really don't got, I don't want no smoke with men who are bald. Like, I really don't got a problem with you. It's just that those men that need to let the hairline go. Like that is who I'm talking to. But, you know, everybody in my DMs and I got in your comments on Instagram a little bit. She did.

I'm reading now. I fight. Stay ready so you ain't got to get ready. They got the right one at all times always. Trudy said, hashtag Trudy tribe, check in. It makes you feel you better. Trudy. I didn't like the post.

Okay, boom. Trudy, Trudy, Trudy, Trudy, Trudy, Trudy, Trudy. I said what I said. And if anybody got a problem, they can refer to to Real House of Atlanta when Portia said, buy ashy. That's how I feel to all y'all. Bye, assy.

Wait a minute. Someone has exposed themselves, and that would be in the comments. And that is Walter Gino McLaughlin. Remember when Walter, when man said that his airlines skip school, now I can put a name to the face. That's my man.

Gino underscore 1911, he's Omega? He's a Kappa. Cut that part out. Well, no, leave it. One years, Omega, 1918, 1980? Wow.

Whoa. No, it's 1911. It is 1911. Isn't it? I have no clue. Shit. They're your brothers. It's too,

it's been too long. Yeah. It's not a big deal. All them dates get jumbled together. 06, 08, 1911. Like, all them dates, you know, wear a shirt with a date on it. Like, yo, this was the year.

1906. I can tell you one thing I'm happy that 1906 was a good year for the alphas it wasn't a good year for niggas I can tell you that for sure Oh it was 1911 I know I'm not crazy

So the Cigmas and the Cappas are the Cigmas The Cues and the capals are the same year Okay I know I'm not crazy All right yes yes they are You're right it wasn't a good year for black folks What did he just All of those years

We're not Now look I will say The seven Missic years between slavery during reconstruction, the seven mystic years were pretty good. But then after that, that new wave of white supremacy came back and God damn, go read about the seven mystic years

that actually, when we actually start to gain a little economic and political power, but then people were like, oh, no, and then they came to us out. They ran us out of those cities, yep. Did you know about one in three people with plaques psoriasis may also develop psoriatic arthritis,

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Restrictions apply. See terms at bandool.com slash predict slash bonus dash offer dash herms. I want to talk about two people that we lost. Trudy, we'll come back to you Monday on Trudy's Corner. Look, you guys, some of you like the Trudy's Corner stuff. Some of you don't like the Trudy's Corner stuff. I happen to love it. So does Rachel?

Yeah. give us not only mailback questions, but send your questions in for Trudy. Okay. Relationship questions for Trudy. You can ask, ladies, ask Trudy questions about, we've got to Trudy's group chat. It's a new segment.

Ask Trudy questions about the landscape right now. We're out of practice. We don't know. Ask Trudy questions about the landscape right now. We'll get to that on Monday. But send the questions in to either the Reddit or to the Instagram. All right.

We lost two people that were very important for much, much different reasons. Obviously, we start with Archbishop Desmond Tutu who passed away. Can't overstate the importance of Desmond Tutu.

Desmond Tutu, Archbishop Desmond Tutu, one of the main individuals who help spearhead the fight against South African apartheid has passed away at age 90. A life so well lived. A Nobel Peace Prize winner Just went across racial lines to really call attention

to one of the biggest misjustices in the history of our civilized world or our uncivilized world, which was South African apartheid. Obviously, it's a huge loss that Bishop Tutu, he leaves a great legacy. But when you talk about, I know that he's gone and that's very sad. But what a well-lived life.

What a mark made. What an absolutely fierce and loving individual. You know what? I was a kid and I was watching a Michael Jackson video. I can't remember which one. Nope.

It's man in the mirror. That's how I first knew who he was. Yeah. Yeah. I was a kid and I was watching a Michael Jackson video. And I remember, you know, we've had our discussions about Mike,

but I just get chills thinking about them. We can talk about this though. I have chills thinking about the man in the mirror video. My mom just love the video. So, and I would be like, yo, who is that man? Mm-hmm. And my mom was like, oh, that's Desmond Tutu. But why did he stand out to you?

Do you remember why? Because he was black and he had a like a, what was it? He's praying and he's crying. Yeah. And I remember as a kid saying who, and his, that image is multiplied in the background. And it was like, who is this. This man, what is so heavy on his heart that he is praying, he's crying. As a kid, it resonated with me because it's a big focus in the, and then the song is

just, you know, powerful in itself. And Michael Jackson is not even in the video. It's not in the video anywhere. Yeah. Yeah. A lot of moving images have like the, remember the little girl that got stuck in a well? Do you remember that? You weren't around for that.

Wait, for the pipe in the pipe? The well or the pipe? Like, she went down the little thing. Yeah, it was a well. It was a well. It wasn't a well. It wasn't a well. It wasn't a well.

I know exactly. And yes, that is. And it because remember that that man, that man committed suicide later. He couldn't handle all that. The guy who got her out of the pipe? Yeah. Yeah. Can you find that?

What was the, wait, I just want to clarify. I think her name was baby Jessica. That's exactly what it was. Like, I think it was baby Jessica, the rescue of Jessica McClure. It wasn't a well. It was a, it was a, it was a, it was a, it was a, it was a, it was. was a well or a pipe? Okay.

They definitely said well. But it was like, it was like, no, but man, it wasn't like a well like you saw the girl come out of the ring well. It was like a small, it was tiny, right? Am I making, am I making this up? It's a fucking well. It wasn't a big ass well because they had a hard time going down there. It wasn't like somebody could just rope themselves and climb down there.

It wasn't like that. I remember the whole. nation. People were praying and all of that stuff. Everybody was united. There was no Twitter. We could, you just feel the kinetic energy. People come home and be like, yo, have they got the baby out of the well yet? And it's like, no, like, oh my God, we pray. What? An eight inch diameter well. Do you see now why I didn't think it was a well? You're going, you're going to the well one too many times here. I'm just saying it was so that was that that's what was such a big deal. She was trapped in it and it was hard to get her. Right. She was there for over a day,

I think. Yeah, she was there. So, but back to the arch, archerbishop of Tutu, just an amazing, an amazing, an amazing man. I want everybody to take a little time to go find out about the life of Desmond Tutu because African apartheid is among the most evil things that have happened. You know, obviously American apartheid is evil in its own right. And, you know, we see it here. And there's a lot of hypocrisy in our country. And the fact that we divested, a lot of people wanted to divest from what was going on in Africa. At the same time, they kick a niggas in the ass.

It's just, it's different. But what a fantastic life. And I was saddened that Desmond Tutu was gone. But I was also happy about a life well lived. And not even in the same realm. of importance but another death that I have to be honest was moving to me was the

death of John Madden which was announced what was it a couple of days ago now in no way does John Madden equate to what Desmond Desmond Tutu was able to do no way one of the guys changed the world the other the guy another one of the guys entertained us

but it still was very very very very moving for me to think about John Madden who was like a gigantic football fun machine. Didn't even seem like a real person. Was at the top of his craft not only in coaching but then in broadcasting but

it didn't even seem like something capable of death. To know that John Madden is gone. It was just it hit me. John Madden is a big, big, big part of my life. Gigantic part of my life. Yeah, man. Like there's this professor. his name is Andrew McGregor

who said that the creation of the Madden Video Game was not a great development for the U.S. It further glamorized violence and dehumanized black athletes helping to establish a plantation cosplay

that has grown worse in the era of fantasy football. Okay. Everybody's entitled to their opinions. I know that we live in an era where someone dies, it's time they get the takes off. You know?

It's time they get to takes off. Somebody's dead. Let me make my body. point about why this person shouldn't be revered, why we shouldn't eulogize them, whatever. I understand that. I'm not even going to be moaned that. This is just all wrong, you know? I understand that football is a problematic sport for myriad reasons.

I could make the argument that as far as wholesome black male bonding, that Madden itself, the creation of that video game is one of the most important tools. that we've had. Like, staying in the house, not being out, like, talking. You know how many important conversations I've had with my bros over a game of Madden?

The third game of Madden, like how much you learn about each other, you're sitting there, you're talking, you're kicking it, you're doing that, how many friendships I've made. How many friendships I've made not just, I've made friends from other parts of the world by playing Madden online.

Sure. You know what I mean? So obviously a video game can't be that important in the grand scheme of things, but I don't know why we have to go out of our way to demonize everything. Football in and of itself has all kinds of problems. We understand it. In my opinion, Madden is the most sanitized and safe way to play football because nobody's getting their hair crushed it.

You know what I mean? Like no one is getting their hair crushed in. So I thought that that opinion, while eloquently stated was ill-timed and a bunch of fucking bullshit. I don't, then take away that eloquently stated

because that's not how I felt when I saw it. It was like, okay, nobody asked for this tweet. Nobody asked for this opinion. At first I thought, you know, I'm not a gamer. I've always been heavily annoyed when I dated someone who was a huge gamer.

I mean, hearing you talk about the connection and all of that, I understand it. But to date a gamer, if you're not a gamer is really hard. But, just my opinion. So I thought maybe I'm missing something. So I tried to research it.

Like, is this a thought that's out there that I just don't know about? And it's not. So then I was like, okay, video games in themselves can be dehumanizing. That's not just particular to John Madden. But I was just like, nobody asked for this. And this is one of those things

where people are trying so hard to be liberal. or to show how down they are, that they take it to a level where it becomes problematic. I'm reminded of if you're currently watching the Sex and the City reboot and just like that, we're watching it happen right now to the character Miranda. She's trying so hard to prove that she's liberal and she's down, that she ends up saying things that actually hurt the cause or are problematic in nature. That's what I felt like about this tweet.

It gives the other side a reason to make fun of. people who are who have liberal opinions. I don't even know if that's what I would consider this or who are trying to say something that exists in regards to racism or to a culture. Because that because when I looked at that look this up, it was all the other side saying see and this is people taking it too far. And it is an example of people taking it too far. This was just too much and this hurts the cause rather than help or bring awareness. So I didn't think it was eloquent when I saw it. I thought it was extremely problematic. Well, it's eloquently stated in the way that, you know, know, in the actual way that it's stated, but your point is well taken.

I think this is people angling for, you know, invitations to that mythical barbecue. I want to tell you guys something about the barbecue. I want to let y'all know something. There is a kid's table at the barbecue. I also want to let y'all know something. There's a kid's table at the barbecue. So, like, even if you come to the barbecue, because I'm sure this guy has some good Black Lives Matter tweets that I'm probably into, I'm sure he has some amazing tweets

on systemic racism, redlining, because I've looked at some of his stuff. I'm sure he has some good... So I'm not saying it, but there's a kids table. There's a table where, yeah, man, come on in, but go sit your ass down somewhere. I ain't nobody trying to hear that. We're playing Madden.

We playing Madden is what we're doing at the barbecue. At the barbecue, I want people to know this. I want Andrew McGregor to notice. At the barbecue that you want to come to, we playing Madden. Van, he plays Madden. People were digging up his old tweets where he was tweeting about playing Madden.

Yeah. See what I was saying? It's like, but you were playing it. If this was so these things, why do you have Madden? Why do you play it? And then to tweet about it, you were really into it too.

Yeah. By the way, he probably trashed. He can have a seat. I've been running the same offense since 03. Can I ask you this? I've been running the same office. Let me tell you something. I go in there right now.

I pick the Saints, It's hard to play with them now. Don't have a quarterback, so sometimes I play with the Bengals. I go to, I go with the West Coast heavy offense. I set my audibles. Put me in the eye form near. I got my Texas play for short yardage. I got a deep shot over the middle.

I got a zone beater. I got a three high safety beater. I got a, I got verticals sometimes with guys like to play too many safeties high. I know what you in. I know what you in. I can see what you in. I got all kinds of situations. I get a little jiggy with my back,

get a little rotation. Sometimes I got a pass catching back in. Sometimes I got a power back. I like to press it a little bit. I'm a trap runner. I like to let my tight end come across, grab somebody at the end, hit that hole popping with Camara.

I got my, you know what? Fine. Whatever. That's cool. You know what? That's fine. That's why you don't like it. This is the kind of talk I like.

I got blitz beaters. I got all kinds of stuff. Stop. This is the only question I will ask you about Madden. Because when I was reading up, on all this with John Madd. I didn't realize it was built. I thought it was always more of a form of entertainment,

which obviously it is, but I didn't realize that the purpose of it too was to teach people about the game of football and to understand certain techniques and how intricate the sport really is. Do you get that from that? Because then I was like, well, maybe I want to, I want to learn more about football.

So is this a good tool for me? Can I do that without playing? You can. And the real thing is, of course there's some video game. There's some stuff that's just video game stuff that's going to happen to a mad game like some people are going to be really good on the sticks

so if you see them their dexterity is so amazing that they're going to be able to juke you or get you out of it. But then there's some things to where it's man on man that's just scheme based. Like there's some things that like

there are certain defenses there are certain personnel groupings there are certain things on there that the game is going to be hard to win if you don't know what you're doing. Can't you cheat? Aren't there like cheat codes?

Wasn't that a thing? or was that the different game? Was that NBA? Was that NBA 2K? They're glitches. The game will glitch. There are ways you can take advantage of the game. Glitching.

Not really cheat codes. Like nobody's going to put a code in. You know? I mean, it's like, come on, man. Respect yourself. I don't know. I don't know. All right, Andrew.

Andrew, relax. Like. Andrew, relax. Relax, Andrew. Yeah, just don't speak again unless you're called on to speak. Because that was too much. It was too much. It was too much.

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Listen to what it sounds like to be a million miles away. Trimphaya, guselcomab, taken by injection, is a prescription medicine for adults with moderate to severe plaques psoriasis, who may benefit from taking injections or pills or phototherapy, and for adults with active psoriotic arthritis. Serious allergic reactions and increased risk of infections and liver problems may occur. Before a treatment, your doctor should check you for infections and tuberculosis. Tell your doctor if you have an infection, flu-like symptoms, or if you need a vaccine.

Imagine being a million miles away. Explore what's possible. Ask your doctor about Trimfaya. Tap this ad to learn more about Trimfaya, including important safety information. Joe Rogan is back in the political arena. That's what we need it. Joe Rogan. Host of a very popular podcast.

I don't know if you've heard of it called the Joe Rogan experience. And it's here on Spotify. It's one of our coworkers. Joe Rogan, Rogan. He's talking about politics again. Remember, Joe Rogan is Bernie supporter. Also, not really. He's in the rightosphere.

You know, he's, Joe Rogan is, Has that changed recently? I mean, if he was Bernie, is it like once Bernie didn't get, he's definitely anti-Joe Biden. We know that. Doesn't fuck with Biden that much. Doesn't at all.

So that's why I'm asking, do he step into that realm since Biden? Or has he always been that way? I don't know. I don't listen to him regularly. I don't know. I know that he couldn't bring himself to say that he was really a huge Trump supporter. And he didn't like Joe Biden.

So it seemed as if Bernie, was his guy for a couple of days. Default. Okay. Yeah. Yeah. But, you know, Joe Rogan has his own politics. He has his own view on things. So, you know, whatever. Um, he's talking now about Michelle Obama. He says that Michelle Obama could beat Donald Trump in a 2024 presidential ticket. He says she's intelligent. She's articulate. Yeah. She's definitely intelligent, articulate. She fucking went to Harvard. So yeah. You know, let's take a break for a second. Like, hold on. Not an actual break in the podcast, but a real break.

just on some real shit not trying to be Nick Peaky about it like we don't need you to tell us that ladies that went to Harvard black ladies that went to Harvard are intelligent and articulate he said it twice in his statement

twice repeated I'm even trying to be that guy I swear to God I'm not well I am because that was the first question I had for you with this topic I'm not trying to be that guy what you think about that statement yeah she's intelligent she's articulate Yeah, she's fucking with Harvard. You know, we're intelligent.

We're articulate, you know what I mean? I just like... He's talking about her like she's an anomaly. Like, she should get it because she's actually a black person that's smart. That's how I felt when I read that. And it's like she doesn't stand alone in that, right? She doesn't say... It was almost like he was like, she's just so exceptional because she's a black woman and

she's smart. She can actually articulate the things that she's saying. I didn't like it. And he kept emphasizing that. He said it multiple times. He didn't emphasize the fact that she was a black one, did he? No, but you're speaking about her as a black.

Well, later on, he says she and Kamala should team up and have double diversity. So he was speaking of her in that way because she's a black woman. Yes, best president that we've had in our lifetime in terms of a representative of the intelligent articulate people. She could win the podcaster said of Michelle Obama. So the only thing that we're getting away would be if she brought in some of the policies that destroying businesses in America that are making people scared. We're talking about mandates and things of that nature.

Your question, a question to you, forget them, forgetting about the sort of improper way that this was framed from a language standpoint, which is, you know, just an annoyance to me. Do you believe that he's right? Could a Michelle Obama-led ticket win in 2024? Well, he said she could win if she doesn't do the mandates and doesn't get crazy with COVID policy. So she can win if she minds, like, stays in her place, is kind of what. said. And I don't know. It's hard for me to even entertain it because Michelle Obama has said multiple

times she has no interest in running for office. She had a front row seat to it for eight years and still came out of it and was like, uh-uh, that's not me. She's not Hillary. She doesn't want to do it. She wants no parts of it. But what I find interesting is like when he says she'll be great if she does this. The reason people like Michelle Obama for office and think she'd be great is because she hasn't done anything that's considered disruptive. She hasn't done anything that's problematic. She's walked a straight line. Let her step into office and let her be a black woman asserting her power and watch how quickly they turn on her. Because history has shown us that when black women step up and assert their power, it is not well received, especially by white audiences,

particularly the men. So she's great now because she's never shown herself in that way. Let her doing it, do it. They'll find her a problem with her. They'll try to destroy her. And Michelle Obama knows that. And that's why she is sitting happy doing her thing in Chicago and being a coworker with us on Spotify podcast. So this is all co-worker talk. Brogan co-worker, Michelle Obama coworker. This is all co-worker talk. I think it's very interesting that it keeps getting floated when she has said that she's not interested in it. Because we have no options. Because we don't have options.

Well, I also think there's something else. I think there's something to be said about how the agency of black women is actually viewed in American circles. Black women are seen a lot of times as a thing of need. When you need a black woman, she will magically appear to be what you need her to be. Doesn't matter what she wants to do. It doesn't matter what goals and dreams she set for herself. When one is needed, one will be there to provide America what America needs. Okay, it doesn't matter what she said.

All right, there are black ladies out there who would quite frankly want to be the president. Stacey Abrams want to be the president? Sure. She's talked about having all types of different offices. Are we talking about Stacey Abrams, a black lady that actually wants to do it? No, we're talking about a black lady who says she likes her. life just the way it is right now, you know. So, you know, you talk about it.

It doesn't matter what you want. It matters what we need you to be. Now, I don't know if that's something that's ingrained or something that's like kind of, you know, just a part of the American psyche. But the reality is give our ladies a chance to do what they want to do. Michelle Obama has said she doesn't want to be the president. Would I like her to be the president? Yeah.

be great. You know what I mean? Be great. But she said she doesn't want to do it. Let it go. You know, let it go. This is Rogan doing his opinion thing. He's entitled to that.

Do I think he's right? Probably. I don't know if Kamala Harris signs up for four years of vice president with Michelle Obama because that means you never get a shot at the big seat if that happens. But yeah, he's probably right. But stop bringing her up. She doesn't want to do it. Now she changed your mind.

we can talk about it. If there are any reports, reports out of the Obama camp is Michelle wants to, then that changes. But right now, just let black women define themselves. Yeah. Come on, man.

Biden says he's going to run against. She's not going to run against Biden. Biden. Can't wait. I'm on fire about that. But she would never go. I cannot see her in a primary. Let me tell you something right now.

If there's one thing that I am super excited about, more than anything, it's more president by God damn I'd run through a wall for that guy Stop, okay, what's next? What's next is Jolaine Maxwell But before we get to Jolene Maxwell Who's been found guilty of certain things

We have a very special guest that we're going to talk to right now We're going to talk to Ceres Castle Who is a fantastic reporter a journalist who covers LAPD here, the LAPD here, and goings on around the LAPD here in Southern California. And she is going to tell us about a very disturbing rash of killings. Officer involved shootings that the LAPD has been involved in. And also going to tell us a little bit about some of the gang activity that goes on inside of the L.A. sheriff's office.

It's a very, very tense situation in Los Angeles right now. And it suffice to say that the police are not responding very well to it. So we're going to get to Saracin. Then we're going to talk about Jelaine Maxwell after we're done with her. So we're going to take a break and get back to it. All right. So unfortunately, the LAPD law enforcement period in Los Angeles is in a particularly violent spell right now. There have been a couple of tragedies that have happened over the course of the last couple of weeks to a month.

one I'm sure you guys have definitely heard about which was a shooting a terrible horrific shooting by the LAPD inside of a Burlington Coat factory out in the valley and there's been more there's a lot of stuff going on we have somebody joining this today who in my opinion does the best reporting on law enforcement law enforcement misconduct gangs inside of the L.A. Sheriff's Department of anyone her name is Saris Castle and she joins us today on higher learning. First of all, how are you doing today? I'm doing okay. And thank you so much for that high praise coming from you, such an esteemed journalist yourself. I really appreciate that. Thank you, fan. Thank you very much. And I'm glad

to know that you have such a high opinion of TMZ. So I guess what I'll ask you is a lot of our listeners are not from the Los Angeles area. So they might have not, might not have heard of what's happened here with a couple of incidents in these last couple of weeks. Why don't you tell them exactly what's going on? Of course. So over the past week, we have seen a series of shootings by the Los Angeles Police Department. And those shootings have resulted in the deaths of five people. I have been able to identify three of the five. There's Rcendio Oliver Jr., Margarita Lopez, Brandon Cormillinga, and one person who the LAPD has not released any information on, and another person that they haven't even acknowledged yet that they are responsible for the killing.

But of course, probably the killing that's getting the most attention is the shooting that happened at the Burlington Coat factory. Essentially, what happened was an officer by the name of William Dorsey Jones, Jr., arrived on the scene last out of a group of officers that were responding to calls of a man with a bike lock going around the store and hitting objects. Jones, although he arrived last on the scene, decided that he wanted to be the first one to enter the store and essentially goes in body cam rolling, gun drawn. It appears to be a weapon that may be personal. It doesn't appear to be something that's standard issue from the station. And he enters the store and pushes the other officers that have made a tactical plan and are planning to apprehend the man that is later killed with less lethal weapons.

He pushes them out of the way. And as they're telling him to slow down and hold up, he runs ahead of them by several feet and fires at the man who had the bike walk killing him. One of those rounds passed through the wall that was behind him and hit the 14-year-old girl, Valentina Oriana Peralta, killing her. She died in her mother's arms. What has happened to Officer Jones since this killing? So Officer Jones, you know, before this incident,

And he actually maintained a pretty prolific presence on social media. He maintained at least four different social media accounts, both tied to himself as a police officer, tied to youth sports coaching that he does, a nonprofit that he has. And interestingly enough, a fitness training business he started called use of force training. He was on a leave of absence from January of last year through February this year. And in that time off, he was arguing with Twitter activists online. He was defending other fatal shootings by police officers. And he was actually advocating for racist voting ID laws.

He recently came back to his post at the North Hollywood Station, in the Los Angeles Police Department and he was called to respond on this day since that he's been put on paid administrative leave and that is where he will remain for the foreseeable future. He earns about $173,000 a year and he will continue to cash those paychecks as he is on leave for this killing.

Now I'm asking this question because I think it's important to ask the question. Just so our listeners know, Officer Jones is black. He is a black guy, yes. He's from Louisville, Kentucky. He said on his Twitter, he tweeted, I am a black man. I am the father of a black son.

He was, and while saying that, he also would repeatedly parrot, you know, thin blue line language and say that, you know, I support blue lives, blue lives matter and all that type of stuff. I think it's important to say that because I think it's important to identify the cultural problem that we're talking about. The cultural problem that we're talking about as it relates to law enforcement, it, of course, manifests itself in race

all the time, but specifically to me, it's a blue problem. Mostly when we're dealing with law enforcement. There's a culture that exists inside of the law enforcement, in my opinion, that can radicalize or militarize the guys such as Officer Dorsey, Officer Jones,

shall I say, that makes them think that they have to go and, like his business says, use force in a situation like the Burlington Coat factory shooting. Now, as it relates to sort of the overall climate in the LAPD right now, how do you feel like the police department's response has been to this rash of incidents? Atrocious. I mean, this is the United States. Extrajudicial killings are still very much illegal. Everyone in this country is entitled to a fair and speedy trial. You know, being a suspect of crime does not give the police carte blanche to, you know, murder people. That's not how we are supposed to process justice in this country. I guess this is why I'm confused,

because I feel like the LAPD has been bragging or touting about all these reforms and changes. that they have made to the departments such as de-escalation techniques and training, such as community programs that were built to build a better relationship between the community, the people, and the police force. And I feel like things are worse. I know they're worse. I saw the statistics. They're worse in regards to police shootings this year than they have been the last couple of years. So what happened to all that? Is this all just talk? Or are they really trying to put things in place to make people have trust and faith in the police department again. One interesting thing about the community policing program in Los Angeles is really the whole

story of how it came about. The community policing program in Los Angeles is the product of a civil lawsuit that was filed by a family that was living in public housing projects here in L.A. County. And they were harassed so badly by police. that they were forced to take legal action. And when I say harassed, I mean brutally beaten, detained for no reasons, thrown up against the wall, and searched without cause, stuff that we see and hear about in our community every day. And this family decided to do something.

And they won that lawsuit. Well, they didn't win. They settled that lawsuit. And a part of that settlement was the creation of the community policing task force. what that really means is that it was an excuse for LAPD to hire, you know, hundreds more officers and send them in to communities that already have, you know, front relationships with police and have been subjected to police abuse for generations. Now they're just sending more in.

They're not really given, you know, any special training. They're just sort of, you know, rolled in there by the hundreds to, continue to harass people. These community policing programs are given these like nice shiny names, but at the end of the day, it's really just more of what we have been seeing for generations. There's been a lot of talk, not just here in the city, but nationwide, really, about the state of crime in L.A. You've heard people say, it's the purge in L.A. There's, you know, been some high-profile rappers. Draco the Ruler was killed. at a festival, I think it was last week, maybe a couple of weeks ago.

And everyone's talking about how bad L.A. is right now. Do you think that there's any correlation to police response to some of the things that we've seen here recently and to, I guess, the sense that L.A. is more of a dangerous place, meaning does continuing to sort of parrot that narrative make police hypervigilant in their responses to crimes? So crime actually increased every year from 2014 to 2018, and the LAPD budgets increased every single one of those years by $82 million. And crime continued to rise. But the LAPD weren't saying back then, hey, we overfunded the police, and that's why crime increased 30%.

No, in 2020, you know, crime was lower than 2019. And that was also the year that LAPD had the proposed budget decreased by $150 million. And, you know, they weren't really talking about that. Today, the media and for the most part and LAPD are blaming defunding the police as to why crime is so high, why it's rising. But when you look at crime, you know, historically, we're living in one of the lowest times of crime in Los Angeles from a historical perspective. Yes, crime is up. But you also have to look at the fact that we are entering, you know, this is going to be the third. year of a pandemic. People are losing their jobs. People aren't working like they used to. People are sick.

And when people don't have money, yes, you do see property crime go up. Unfortunately, the government doesn't want to pay us to stay at home and isolate. People are forced to, you know, do things. But again, you have to remember, contextually, this is still the lowest point that we've seen instances like this in 20 years. Do you think that the national attention that's being taught like in regards to this 14 year old child that was in it was innocent and killed in a shopping a store in burbank do you think that that national attention is going to put pressure on lAPD where they actually might have to start being about the change that they talk about well i certainly hope it does you know like i mentioned at the top you know valentina was one of several people

that were killed by LAPD this week. In those other five incidents where people died, we still don't know the names of the officers. We still don't have body camera footage. We still don't. And LAPD still hasn't even acknowledged that one took place. And this is routine. You know, and it's not just LAPD that's doing this. The sheriff's department shot somebody yesterday. And we still don't know her name. I don't know what her condition is. I'm a journalist. I've been calling and I can't find anything out. This is routine. out here in Los Angeles, unfortunately. And if I can, I just want to say something quickly about Draco being killed at a festival. I mean, first of all, may he rest in peace. Drakeo was an incredibly influential person. And he made an impact on my life. But let's just say something about the fact

that he was killed while he was at work at a festival. That was being under police surveillance. This was police for providing security. How was someone able to bring a weapon? into an event that is supposed to be under police control. And this is in the wake of the tragedy at the Astro World concert. You would think that the police department would be on their mind, really minding their peas and cues and making sure nothing happened.

But and yet they stood by and let a black man be murdered. Mm. Insanely good point. So I want to hit on one thing. And then before you go, I do want to ask you an update on and make sure people know where they can go to get information on the gangs inside of the Sheriff's Department, which is chilling. Just a chilling idea and thought. The family of Valentina has spoken out. It was very emotional.

There was a press conference, I believe, Tuesday morning. It was very emotional, obviously. It's hard to watch. What specifically are they asking the LAPD for right now? now. And is there any news of a lawsuit? What is the family doing? How is the family seeking to gain some sort of closure from this? The family has made repeated calls for all evidence to be preserved. You know, I'm sure your listeners know all about the police have this tendency to make things disappear when it makes them look bad. And I think, you know, that's incredibly important

in this instance. You know, we did see some of the closed circuit TV footage released, but But again, it was very edited. We don't have that raw footage available at this time. And that needs to be turned over to the family. They're asking for transparency in the investigations that are going on at the level of the Los Angeles Police Department, as well as the state level. The California Department of Justice is looking into this. And they want to make sure that there is complete transparency in that investigation. And Valentina's father said a quote that really resonated with me at the end of his speech yesterday.

He said in Spanish, you know, justice for my daughter is all these criminals out top to bottom. Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm. Okay. This is my last question to piggybacking off of what Van said. What has been the response from the top, the police? What has been the response from local politicians in the area in regards to not just this killing, but also the other five that have happened? Because people are looking for answers, which I will say, too,

I feel like this is why they don't tell us names and identify because we don't, then we're not connected to who's been shot and who's been killed. And then we disassociate from it. And so we move on. So I, you know, it personalize it when you know who it is, the age, what they do and their relation to the community. Okay, that's just my little soapbox. But if you can't say, what, what has been the response from police and from local politicians? Definitely. Well, the police have yet to release this officer's name. I was able to identify him just through old-fashioned reporting and able to locate his social media, which he has since worked very hard to delete. We've had words from a few local politicians. The city councilman that oversees the district where the shooting incident took

place did not comment for several days. Instead, the city councilman for the area tweeted out a Christmas card and the city attorney made a remark about rainbows, but it took them it took they only made a comment after I called their offices and asked for comment. And also I want to note that I called us for comment, posted a picture of the city council and then posing with the officer that killed that fired those lethal shots. And then he put out a statement. Okay. So we're going to stay on top of this and make sure that we are keeping Valentina's memory alive and that the people who are responsible for all of these killings. are brought to bear for them. We're going to make sure our listeners are engaged. Before we go, though, I want to want you to touch on a little bit of some of your really amazing reporting that

you've done on gangs inside of the LA Sheriff's Department, let people know where they can go and read some of this amazing stuff and about what that is and what the situation with that actually, how it actually exists here in Los Angeles County. Definitely. And thanks for bringing it up. Yes, here in Los Angeles County, we have had a gang problem inside of our Sheriff's Department for the past 50 years, I was able to identify 18 different gangs within the Los Angeles County Sheriff's Department. Yes. And many of them are still active today. Several candidates for sheriffs, because we do have an election coming up in Los Angeles in 2022, several candidates for sheriffs are actually affiliated with many of these gangs. Several are reported members of these gangs. And I have written

in depth about all of this stuff, all of those candidates. You can read it all over at knock. please make sure you check it out, especially if you live and vote in L.A. County. This is quite literally life-saving information. Amazing. Serise Castle, thank you for joining us on Higher Learning today. Is it okay if we come back to you on this stuff every now and again and get you back on the podcast?

This is really amazing. I would love that. Thank you so much for having me. And be safe, Saris. I know, like, you are doing some serious work out there, and I know that it can be scary at times. So thank you for what you do. Oh, thank you.

It's my pleasure. When y'all want to have me back to talk about the police surveillance that I've experienced, I'm ready for that too. I knew it. I knew it. Oh, no, they're not. It's bad. Yeah. Yeah.

We definitely will. And we're going to keep you protected and covered. So thank you, sister, for joining us today. Thank you. Yes. All right. This episode is brought to by WeatherTech. Everyone knows winter is the MVP and make it a mess.

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Jeffrey Epstein's cohort in all this weird, disgusting sexual abuse stuff, has been found guilty on five of six counts. related to her role with Epstein's sexual abuse of minor girls between the years of 1994 and 2004. She is 60 years old. She faces up to 65 years in prison. Now, we haven't really talked about this.

We haven't really discussed this. Do you feel like we should have talked about the Jelaine Maxwell case? No. All I wanted to know was what was going to happen with that verdict. You know, I just, I mean, it's, no. I didn't think it was something that we really needed to cover in detail. Honestly, I didn't think that there was going to be, I thought she was going to be found guilty.

I didn't realize that it was going to be a possibility that she couldn't be. So to me, I never really, I'm not really even paying attention to it. So let me ask you this. Now comes the time where people start to wonder. Mm-hmm. She's been found guilty. Are there any more dominoes that are going to fall here in the maximum? Maxwell Epstein situation. Are you at all looking at people who she might implicate or bring with her?

I guess I would have thought that would have already happened, right? It's been a long time for this trial to actually come to fruition, to take place. Now there's a verdict. To me, if she was going to make some sort of deal with the prosecution, then I think that those names would have already come out. Or we would have heard that she, you know, she's talking and pretty soon they're going to continue on with this investigation and other, you know, people are going to be implicated. I just don't think that that's going to happen. I think she's just taking her secrets with her. I mean, again, I'm saying this and I don't even know, I don't even know if she testified at trial. I have no idea. Do you know what she do? Epstein, when he was actually found guilty, you then brought

to jail, he ended up committing suicide. Suicide in quotes. Do you think that Maxwell will survive her incarceration being that there are possibilities that she knows a lot of stuff about a lot of very powerful people? But see, I will want, I have no idea if she, if she's going to suffer the same fate that, that F-S-Efstein did. But I really believe that if she was going to name people, she's already been found guilty. She's about to be sentenced. I mean, unless she does it now to less in her sentence,

I feel like if she's going to make a deal to start naming people, she already would. There's no point in her naming people at this point when she's already been sentenced to whatever will be sentenced, to whatever it is the amount of time that she'll spend in jail, probably for the remainder of her life. I just don't see it. I just don't see it happening.

Because when it happened to Jeffrey, wasn't he a waiting trial? No. Okay. I don't think so. I think that he had been found guilty and was going to encarro. Maybe. Maybe he was. I feel like he still had more, maybe on that charge he was, but I feel like there was more coming.

Because he had been in. But maybe not. Let's look that up. Donnie, give us that. Was Jeffrey Epstein awaiting trial or had he been? had he already been. Well, an hour ago, prosecutors dropped the case against Jeffrey Epstein's

jail guards. Oh, so Jeffrey Epstein was a waiting trial. So you see why? So, like, that makes sense why I could see what happened to him happen. That's not the case with her. So you think she's got a nice, long life of incarceration to look forward? It's a rap for her. It's a rap.

I'm looking at the high profile people that Epstein, was friends with Donald Trump, Leslie Wexner. Alan Dershowitz was implicated. Bill Clinton. Prince Andrew, Duke of York. It's such a disgusting, goddamn situation. Such a disgusting situation with all of it.

Well, whatever. All right. Did you see there's a real world reunion? Real World Season 2. Were you saying this? World? Was it ever your show? Okay. Okay. I used to watch it. Not in the beginning, but you know. Loved it. Everybody looks really different. That's the first thing. Like, it's been 30 years. Everybody looks really different. So they're in their 50s. They're in their 50s. So they look a lot

different. I'm in my 40s. So I'm not hating on anyone, but everybody looks really different. Tammy Roman if you guys did not know this the first time we knew who Tammy Roman was was because Tammy Roman was an original cast member on the real world season two she was in the singing group she was doing her whole thing I remember her and David Edwards got into an argument David not an argument David Edwards had pulled a towel off of her when she was like whatever and yeah there was a whole thing in real world season two David Edwards, they were horse playing or whatever, and he was pulling the towel off

of her when she was in like her underwear and then they kicked them out of the house. Like they kicked them out of the house. Everybody's, it's true. I wasn't watching it then. Yeah, that was a scandal. Everybody, back then a lot of people were on David's side.

Saying that they were just playing. What? I'm telling you. A lot of people were on David's side back then. Anyway. So, What? There are clips. I want to play these clips real quick.

Different clips of what is like for Tammy Roman, who you guys know now from the Real Housewives. No, from basketball wives. Excuse me, from basketball wives. Tammy Roman, who you guys know now from basketball wives, to be in. I wish we had the video that we could show everybody because her face, as she's smoking a cigarette,

It's just priceless. Three different incidents. Three different incidents with her old housemates that Tammy Roman was in. This is her and John Brennan. If you guys remember, John Brennan was the country cowboy, the country singer that was on the show, who is now, I guess, in Alabama, and he's some kind of pastor. And this is what he had to say about some of the kids. that he works with that apparently means he's not a racist.

Check it out. I live in the South, y'all. I live in Alabama. Do you know who's in my house right now? Young black-colored people that I minister to and I'm a father figure to. Well, please don't ever call them

black-colored people. Well, they don't mind. They call themselves words that I don't repeat. I didn't even see that clue. Okay. Good grief. I didn't even see that. one. All right. All right. This is the racial, this is the racial gauntlet she went through. All right.

It's not just, it's not just John, no. It's Irene Barrera. Irene Barrera. Irene Berra Curns also had some things to say to Tammy. Donnie, roll it. I have no idea what it is to be a, okay? I can't. Do not ever say that. You don't say any. Obviously, that bleep was the end word, and that was Tammy with a cigarette hanging out of her mouth. All right. That's not the last one. It's okay.

Glenn Nacens, who also was on the show, who they brought in after they kicked Dave out. Okay? He wanted to try to get through to Tammy as well. And check out what Glenn said to her. The first time I really felt what you're passionate about was when I was with my friend John. And I went to a pizza place, right? And they called him a... You don't say it.

That's what he was called. But you don't say it. They called him that. But I just think that you shouldn't say it. They called him that. I'm saying that you can say he was called the end world. They called him that. You shouldn't feel comfortable.

They called me that when they called him that. They weren't calling you that. They weren't calling you that. And you don't understand what I'm saying to you that the word should not come out so white-ass-mouthed. They called him that. So what? I'm telling you, friend. I got to be honest what you made.

I got to keep you real. Those are the three of the funniest clips I've ever done. It's funny because of Tammy's reaction. Tammy is so. exasperated. She can't believe what's going on. She is physically

smoking a cigarette to try to calm her nerves. David Dennis had an amazing tweet about this. I'm not going to read it. Wait, was he one of the people

involved? No, he's a journalist. Oh, okay. It's a great journalist. He says, I think people are starting to realize that the central component of the real world,

reality shows in general, are putting black people in traumatically racist situation and filming its impact on them, do you agree or disagree with that having been on maybe the most popular reality show in the world? I'm going to put it like this. I have been trying to get a project off the ground for almost a year that deals with being black on reality TV and the impact that that has on the contestants. And the way that audiences perceive us through certain stereotypes that we're forced into are certain situations.

When I tell you, nobody wants to take on this project because nobody wants to admit that they do things to put us in situations just like the clips that you heard. Nobody wants to touch it. And it's not just my experience. It's other black reality stars that I have talked to. across the board on various networks, various production companies, and no one wants to touch it. Because nobody wants to admit that this is true. Nobody wants to put it out there in one place. There have been articles written about it.

There have been like in newspapers, magazines. There have been published articles in journals, but nobody wants to put it on film. We'll sidebar. I'll sidebar with six feet productions later about this. Okay, talk about it. I love to do it. I'm saying that to say, yes, I absolutely believe what David Dennis Jr. is saying. And it is true. And on my show, did I personally necessarily get put in that? No, but what I learned afterwards is that the black men on my season were being antagonized by a white country singer from Mississippi who had never been around black people and kept saying certain things to them to get a rise out of them. but I was so separated from that.

I didn't realize what was going on until I watched it later. So the men from my season were absolutely put in that type of situation. I'm going to ask you a straight up direct question. Based upon your experience, batch nature, based upon your experience, batch nation in the bachelor, is reality TV a racist cesspool? Yeah. And in the, well, maybe not as blatant. It's not always as blatant as what you're watching in these clips with the, with the real world. But what they do is they put us into boxes by playing certain stereotypes that are racist. They want to show us in certain ways, whether you're a Sambo, whether you're a Mammy, whether you're a Jezebel, whether you're like the Bible thumping preach. Go, you know, and you can go back to a.

to flavor, flave, to an I Love Me, where you can see all these different boxes that they place us in because they feel like that's all that we can be. And that's the only way that we're going to be entertaining to white audiences and sometimes to our own audiences as well. So yes, in that form, I absolutely think it's racist. Which one did they put you in? Which category

of those? I was angry black female. I was angry black female. But that's an extra one because you didn't have that. You said what? It's an extra category. It's beyond you. Oh, no. That is. What are the ones you said? You said, Sambo. There's like nine categories. I can't name them off the top of my head. But let's just stick to the four that you name.

But I'm an angry black female. I was angry black female. That's yours. Yeah. I just wanted to see if you were going to call yourself one of those. I was, I absolutely got put in as the angry black female for sure. So you're a right.

It was fine when I was angry towards a black man. They loved it. They praised me when I was. But when I was angry towards a white man, it became, she's a bitch. We're seeing the real Rachel. She's awful. Oh, but when I told this dude to get the fuck out,

everyone was like, yeah, I told this too. Oh, that's so, they want, they want you to fight you. Yeah. They don't want you to fight them. And nobody got it until 2020. It was like, Rachel's always complaining. She's always talking about it. But then, you know, when everybody woke up in 2020 and then they stayed there,

they really didn't bring it into 2021, then people start to understand what I was saying. Right. So you're seeing it right now because it was interesting to see Tammy back in this situation because a lot of the reality a lot of the reality TV that she's done. I love Tammy. It's been devoid of this kind of dynamic because it's been her

with a whole bunch of sisters. But now that she's back with them, she's kind of seeing it. Where can I find this? I got to go back. I got to watch it. I bet it's on Paramount Plus. Roll, roll a sound again just one more time. Which one? Let's go back.

Let's go back. White people, y'all got to hold on for a second, man. Hold on for a second. White people. Y'all have got to chill, man. I don't know. I swear this, Tammy is all of us in these clips. She is all of us.

Well, I tell you, but I swear to y'all, y'all, y'all got to chill. Y'all got to chill, man. run the clip of Glenn. Wait, can I just say too? You cannot say, I'm talking to white people again. You cannot say, will they do it so you can to? Please stop saying that. Will they call themselves that and worse?

That does not give you an invitation to partake in that. Please stop. I had to have those conversations at TMG. I'd be like, yo, it don't matter that what the rapper said. You don't ever quote that. Don't ever say that ever. Like, you don't quote that. I had to have those conversations at TMZ.

People at TMZ, hire people, let some inwards fly. And I have to be like, uh-uh, fuck no. Don't ever, ever, ever. I don't care what he said in that video. You don't repeat that. Not around me unless I would have gone out like I went out way before. Like, like, once again, though, play the, play the Glenn sound. Play the, I want you to play the Glenn sound.

This one, because look how, listen to how, listen to how, listen to how, Sir Glenn is. The first time I really felt what you're passionate about was when I was with my friend John and I went to a pizza place, right? And they called him a... The music. The music

doesn't help. You don't say it. That's what he was called. But you don't say it. They called him that. They called me that. But I just think that you shouldn't say it. They called him that. I'm saying that you can say he was called the end world. They called him that.

You shouldn't feel... They called me that when they called him. They weren't calling you that. They weren't calling him. He's my friend. And you, in this moment, you don't understand what I'm saying to you that the word should not come out so white-ass-mouthed.

They called him that. So what? White people, y'all got to chill. I'm just asking, can y'all chill? In that clip, you can see, first of all, the music is amazing. But you can see that she's, like, counting to five before she responds.

She held her composure so well and he kept pushing her buttons and pushing her buttons. It's crazy to me how he felt he could speak on, and this happens a lot. He could speak on the situation better than she could as a black woman. Come on, y'all.

Just stop. When black people are trying to tell you how it is, listen. That's very simple. That's very simple. To listen. Don't argue with us. I'm going to keep it gang,

so I'm going to watch them clips like five, ten more time. I'm not going to play them no more. But wait, there's a black. black man sitting there on the couch. David Edwards. Why is he silent? David Edwards. Remember David Edwards, maybe he's letting Tammy find her own battles.

David Edwards is the guy who got kicked out of the show. Oh, he's the one who pulled the towel back in the day. And then he went on to come back to the Real World Rule Rules Challenge. He's spit in Puck's face. Or no, Puck spit to his face. I do remember that one. Remember Puck spit in his face and David turned around. It's so funny.

Him and Puck were going back and forth. Puck spitting David's face. and David goes, disqualification. He goes, he goes, he goes disqualified, disqualified,

and then they, they came and they got puck off the boat. Oh, so Tammy cusses him out in the next episode, why does she cuss them out? And her husband pulls up to fight. That page just went real quick.

By the way, they got me. They got me. I wasn't watching this shit. I'm about playing my plus. Is it on Paramount Plus, Donnie? Yeah, it's not Paramount Plus.

I watched it today. Yeah, I'm going to watch it. I'm going to watch it. It's on Paramount Plus. I got to see. I got to see. Nuts. Nuts.

Okay, okay. Let's get the mailback. Let's get to mailback. Mailback time. Time to read your letters. And then we'll reply to them. Oh, it's mailback time. Write us with your queries.

And we'll chime in. All right. from puffs and candles. What did you learn about yourself this year? I feel like I haven't thought about that yet. Yeah. Hmm. Can we have a different question for a second?

Let's come back to me. All right. Renee underscore nay, N-A-Y-Y. Do you do New Year's resolutions? If so, what is slash are yours? So I don't do the whole, I'm going to, you know, hit a certain target weight or, you know, work out or whatever. I don't do all that anymore because it never happens.

So I've started to have words for it as a theme for my year. And I'm big on meditation and yoga. So it's part of my intention that I said for myself. So in 2021, it was better. And that applied to every aspect of my life. And in 2022, it's invest. And I just don't mean financially, but that is a part of what I want to do. I just more so mean investing in myself because I feel like I've been challenged a lot

this year, maybe professionally in ways that I didn't think that I was going to be. And I don't mean that in a positive way. And so I want to invest back in myself. So, yeah. I have got to lose the pandemic weight. As I say, I don't have to talk about. No, no, seriously. I'm not even taking.

I'm not even taking like the whole year. By my birthday, which is April 16th, this is four months of hell. We're getting at it, baby. We're getting at it. You should come where I am right now. It's kind of like what you did when you were in Hawaii. It's a wellness.

Like I'm off the grid. I'm actually surprised I have signal right now. And part of what they do are the meal plans and the certain calories and how you eat. And it's like workouts every single. hour all different kinds. You should come for like a week. Try it out.

I'll do it. Maybe I don't need them though. Maybe I don't need their help. Maybe you don't. Maybe they can get off me. Oh. Okay. Yeah.

Maybe they can jump back. No reason for me to be that way. Keep going. Next question. That Tammy, the Tammy Roman in you. Tammy, Tammy got me jammed up. Hold on for a second. Before we get to this, play John Brennan real quick.

Stop. Play John printed real quick. Play John Brennan. Play it. Play it, Donnie. I got to hear him talk about the color kids that he gets to us to. Who says that now? How do you not think that that's okay?

Play John Brennan. Play. I live in the South, y'all. I live in Alabama. Do you know who's in my house right now? Young black colored people that I minister to and I'm a father figure to. Well, please don't. ever call them black colored people.

Well, they don't mind. They call themselves words that I don't think. See what I'm saying? Love you. Can Thought Warriors from Alabama please let me, like, DMB, Van, the page, whatever?

I'm very serious when I ask this. I have heard in the last couple of years that several people in Alabama still say colored. I want to know if that's really a thing. Because just to hear him saying again, is that, it's never acceptable, but is that really a thing in Alabama

where you constantly refer to black folks as color? Let me know. Let us know. Let us know so we'll know to smack the fucking fire out of you. Because I'm not even, you know what? Whatever. Next question. Next question.

Right out. From meow underscore it's underscore A.L. Favorite moment slash memory with higher learning this year? Um, Freddie Kruger. Really? Freddie Kruger was funny, man. I'm so glad.

I'm glad you enjoyed it. Freddie Kruger. Okay. I wasn't expecting that. I was going to do something a whole lot worse than that. I just want you to know. And it didn't work out. And I'm not going to tell you just in case I decided to do it again.

Okay. Just know. I'm not going to tell you. Just know. Just know that it's like, just, just, know that I have anxiety, so just be careful with that. So mine is you winning the Oscar because there was, it was a progression. You saw anybody who listens to the podcast that whole month of April, you kept like talking

about it. It wasn't a big deal. Like you were proud of what you did. You were excited about it to be nominated. You didn't think you'd be nominated. Then you got nominated. Then he was just like, yeah, you know, I'm not going to cry or whatever. And then you got it.

And I just, I mean, like all of us here on higher learning thought words, we was just so proud of you. So like that, that was a big moment. And I'm happy we got to one, celebrate in person with you, but then two, also on the podcast. Isn't it amazing that both of our moments was something that the other person did? Yes. Look at us. Nice. Look at us.

Look at us. Look at us. Look at us. I said for mailback. I'm not feeling any more of these questions. That's it. Don't say that. That's it.

That's it for mailbag. I'm not feeling any more of these questions. Let's wrap the podcast. Do you have an unexpected ally of the year? Oh my gosh. Of the year? We're doing our year-end show, a recap of 2020 show, 2021 show on Monday.

It'll be out Tuesday. But can you think of an unexpected ally of the year? Of the year? No. No, but maybe I will by Monday. I'll think about it about Monday. Yeah, that's a, that's tough. Yeah.

So do you have one for the week? Nah. Nah, no I expect that by the week for the Jews. But I actually do have one, John Brennan. No, we're not doing that. I'm serious. He ministers to the colored kids. We're not doing it.

Community. The little nigglets in his community. I love the word nigglets. The little shines. The little. spooks. He minishes to all the Negro kind in his community. John Brennan, you are the one. I always knew that motherfucker had some problems. He was cool on the first show, but I always knew something was awful about John, all the black color. What's say? Are they fucking with her on,

before I leave? Are they fucking with her on purpose? Is that what you were saying earlier? Are they doing that on purpose? Is production telling them. I definitely think that they were, they sat them down and were like, 2020's been a big year. So much has happened since the last time. Let's talk about the things that you've learned. I guarantee you that was it. Now, did they know that they were going to say all that? Absolutely not. But it's almost like I can see something's going to happen.

Take the caps off, but do not stop learning. I am Van Lathen, Jr. And I'm Rachel and Lindsay. Happy New Year, guys. Happy New Year.