Higher Learning with Van Lathan and Rachel Lindsay - Mourning Takeoff and Kyrie Irving Gets Suspended

Episode Date: November 4, 2022

Van and Rachel react to the news of Takeoff’s untimely death and the culture of mourning (5:13), before welcoming Jade Magnus Ogunnaike from Color of Change to discuss disinformation and holding Twitter accountable for hate speech (27:36). Plus a discussion of Kyrie Irving’s indefinite suspension (44:56). Hosts: Van Lathan Jr. and Rachel Lindsay Guest: Jade Magnus Ogunnaike Producer: Donnie Beacham Jr. Learn more about your ad choices. Visit podcastchoices.com/adchoices

Yo, yo, yo, thought boy, I. What is up? Our learning is on. It is I Van Lathan Jr. And it's me, Rachel and Lindsay. Rachel, I got a new nickname for you. Uh-uh. I don't want it.

I rebuke it. It's like, if I don't receive it, you can't give it to me. Rachel text mex Lindsay. That's good. What have your DM's been telling you? What if your team is telling you? Hey, hey, bro. People have been coming at me?

I want to say something to everybody in my DMs. I don't care about that Tex-Mex shit. This is an excuse for us to have a fucking food off. And I've learned so much about Tex-Mex in the last couple of days. First of all, they say that you can't compare Tex-Mex to Mexican food. It's different. Okay, so then you're not even talking about the same thing. But, like, Texas is known for Tex-Mex.

Right. That's why I, you're the one who wanted to do the Mexican food versus There's one whole, there's only one text mix place in all of Los Angeles that I know of. It's Justin Kaisos on sunset. You ever be though? No. Justin Koso. It's actually not bad, you know.

But that's the only place that's pretty good, actually. It tastes good. That's the only place I know. So there's no, everything's canceled because there's no, you never said that the Mexican food was better. You said that it was the Tex-Mex. And I got people sending me, what the fuck do y'all be going through? I love y'all so much.

I love people. What are they saying to you? Sometimes people send me shit and they don't expect me to respond. I'm just going to respond. People send me long things about the history of text-mex. It's actually not bad, though. That's not bad.

I feel like you would respond to somebody if you were passionate about it in a very long DM as well. These are your people. They're not in my DMs. Yeah, because they know that you're not. going to respond. Y'all message me. I'm getting, I feel

left out. I'm going to respond. Message me. Can I just say, I miss so many thought warriors when I was in New York. I cannot tell you how many people. I'm at the Brooklyn next game. So many people were coming up to tell me how much they love the podcast,

thanking me for the conversations that you and I have about black and Jewish people and everything that's gone on. They've loved the discourse. They've been sending it on of their other friends. I'm telling you, I had lunch with a friend. She's like, I was just talking to my friend and they said, hey, you should listen to this

podcast. And she's like, this is Callie, Callie. She's like, I'm a part of the ringer as well. So she's like, yeah, I know that. Man, shout out Callie Curry, man. Yeah. Shout out Callie, motherfuckerucking Curry. Shout out to the entire Rivers.

He loves Curry family. I love them, man. I know you do it. What you all you are saying. understand I've been knowing Austin. I've been knowing Austin. Has this all the time. Austin one of the best guys.

The sound, the sound, Donnie. We haven't done this in a while. Hold on. Why don't you get the sound? I don't need a job. What are you talking about? You just brought up that you was at the game with you what I'm saying? No, I was at the game of Cali.

I wasn't at the game with somebody else. But what I said was I had lunch with a friend. I was like, oh, no, she worked. You know who she is. You are named dropping. Donnie, ding it up. Donnie, Donnie, hold on, Donnie. Who said Callie's name first?

Rachel, you did say it. Yeah. I did. I did. So what are you talking about? I tell him story. Oh, my God. See what I'm saying?

Like, see, see how the shit is unfair? It's unfair. I'm saying I love their family. It was unfair. And you do love their family. You do. It's my favorite collection of light skins. It's so funny because it's like a colt.

You know what I mean? Because it's like, it really is like a light skin cult. Think about it. Steph's sister married Damian Lee. Yeah, I ran into them for the sons. Light skin. Okay. Then you got Steph and Aisha, beautiful family, light.

You got you got the curry and the river situation. Light, light. It's like they're like, you know, know they sew down they blackety black black right but it's a light skin situation going on you know what i'm gonna crash they shit i'm gonna bring my brown ass i'm gonna bring my brown ass up in their place and just fucked up the paperback test all over their thanksgiving what a great group of people um okay make sure they listen to this all right um enough about light skin people we have to talk about some incredibly devastating and very disappointing news.

The death of takeoff is the big deal of today. We'll have that on the other side of this break. The playoffs are here and you can predict the action all the way to the finals with Fandul predict the spread, total points, and even the game winner. Sign up and get a $25 bonus. Offered by Fandul Prediction Markets LLC, a registered futures commission merchant, 18 plus. Bonus is non-withdrawable and inspires seven days after.

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Tramphia is a prescription medicine used to treat adults with moderately to severely active Crohn's disease and adults with moderately to severely active ulcerative colitis. Serious allergic reactions, increased risk of infections or lower ability to fight them, and liver problems may occur. Before treatment, get checked for infections and tuberculosis. Tell your doctor if you have an infection, flu-like symptoms, or need of a disease. vaccine. Explore what's possible. Ask your doctor about Tramfaya today. Call 1-800-526-7736 to learn more or visit Trimfaira Radio.com. Everyone knows by now. Tears are still being cried, fresh tears. Take off. Kirst Nick Kari Ball, 28 years old,

one third of one of the most important hip-hop groups, really in the history of the genre, guys can say whatever you want about it is true he was shot and killed Tuesday outside the front door of a downtown Houston bowling alley um Houston police chief Troy Finner confirmed press conference that afternoon got many calls out from inside of Houston outside of Houston everyone spoke of what a great young man this is how peacefully he is what a great artist he was that's true the people that were upset about the death of takeoff were um or upset because, you know, for them, takeoff was one of the most approachable guys,

one of the sweetest guys. He's a guy to talk to. He's got to get along with. Apparently there was a private party. He was there with Cuevo. Him and Cuevo had been making music on their own. There was some animus between them and offset that is native here nor there now, but they have been hanging out pretty tough.

For those of you who might not understand or be aware, Quabo is actually Takeoff's uncle. All the Amigos are related. Altication broke out. Cuevo was not injured in the incident, but it looks like takeoff who shot three times.

He died on the scene. Rachel? Yeah, so I was in New York. I was by myself. I woke up in the morning, and the first thing that I usually do is look at my phone. and I look at the news and what's trending on Twitter.

And it's scary now because you see somebody's name trending on Twitter and your thought immediately goes there. And then you click on the name and you're like, ooh, okay, you know, they just said something or they dropped some new music or a new movie or something, something like that. So to see takeoff trending and then to see what happened, it just, took my breath away because you're like, one, you're like, not again. You're angry. You're frustrated. You immediately start searching for answers. Why? It doesn't change what happened. But immediately, you're like, how did this happen? What happened? And in the middle, and you can't talk about one

without the other. So immediately, when you're starting to search for answers on, is this real? Is this, you know, what happened? You're hit with videos and photos. of it. And you're not looking for it. You don't want to see it, but you can't miss it because so many people are so quick to want to post a lifeless body on social media. Yeah. And it's as scary as it is with the way we're losing our black men, the way, you know, these public figures, rappers. you know, whatever you want to talk about, in the same way that that is scary and it makes you fearful of your own life. It is just as scary how quick we are to want to throw up a video or a photo of someone dying and not consider anybody else in the process, not their family, not their friends, not someone who has had a similar tragedy, not someone just being a black person scared when they step outside that they might be, you know, that they're fearful of their own lives in the same way. we just are totally void, it seems like, of a feeling when it comes to the death and just life in general. And it's so terrifying. And I couldn't separate the two. I couldn't stop thinking about

this senseless tragedy and how it happened. And then the fact that I saw, I saw his body as well. Same thing with P&B Rock. Because I saw it in the same way. We saw Nipsey. It's just such, a tragedy and I'll just stop it there before talking about anything else. So there are many things here. Many things. Mm-hmm. During the show, I got an intimate firsthand account of, well, I call the one thing regret. Everybody goes through the one thing regret.

I lost a friend. I've talked about this guy before. You know, his name is George Temple. His name was George Temple. he cut off a funeral procession, right? And then he got into it with a cop. When he got into it with the cop, somebody walked out of an auto zone and killed George.

Shot George a bunch of times. It's very hard. And I would think, man, I would think to myself, I would be like, yo, what if George was 10 minutes earlier? What if George was 10 minutes later? What if the person who's, funeral it was hadn't have died just so many one things that would change that so many one things you know so many mornings you go out to your car and your car's on a flat you're going to leave at a certain

time but you get held up you know what if whatever gt was going to do wouldn't have been that day when i look at this i start to break down the things that are going on here i think about the ones that are uncontrollable and that of course makes me think about the ones that were controllable and avoidable

there's a fracas over something it seems to be all of these reports are hearsay unconfirmed from eyewitness accounts of people

who we're not sure there they might have been there they might have not been there act went on his his uh his uh twitch his YouTube

and some people say he solved the whole crime um and there's course everybody's pointing fingers blame blame blame blame blame blame blame blame blame blame blame blame um if in fact there was an argument that led to someone shooting you know at first i heard that take off was shot by a straight bullet but now i see the take off was shot three times so was he shot by three straight bullets it's possible you know but it seemed it would seem more likely that

you would be hit by one it's about whose protection he was under all of this kind of stuff If everyone's pointing fingers at everyone. Right. Except for the fact. And I wonder if people care because if we care, when I say care, I mean, I wonder if we really care because there are ways to avoid outcomes like this. There are. I saw the entire hip-hop world respond to the death of takeoff with the appropriate sadness. gut-wrenching messages to further the RIP culture that we're in.

We're in this weird RIP culture. Rest and peace to my dog. Let's post the pictures of us together. Let's post the last text message that was sent. Let's talk about this. Let's talk about that. But don't worry because Thanksgiving's in three weeks. And by that time, the only people who remember and take off will be his family because that is how fast things.

move. Okay. So what I'm wondering is if you really care, if you care enough to admit some things that are tough. And these are the things. It is absolutely true that white supremacy, gangster capitalism and social economic terrorism has put a part of our community in a place. where we're forced to make very difficult, sometimes illicit and dysfunctional decisions.

A lot of people wonder why, like we're so used to some of the stuff that we grew up around. Like it would be at home back in Baton Rouge and it just seemed normal. But you put somebody in a dysfunctional situation, of course they'll get used to it. Human beings can get used to anything.

Like you get used to prison. You'll get institutionalized to where you don't want to be free. It'll happen. It happens all the time. You'd rather be in jail than be able to eat a Big Mac, which Rachel has never had. You know? So obviously you can get used to live in a fucked up place.

The question is not if you can get used to it. The question I'm wondering is can you get unused to it? Can you get to a point to where you no longer feel. the need if you are lucky enough to have transcended right to where you no longer feel the need to be a certain way have a certain posture or put yourself in certain positions this is not saying that take off put himself in any certain positions what i'm saying is that the streets fucking suck. All of that street shit

that has been Ballyhooed, talked about, worshipped, packaged, sold, commodified for all of these years that looked so cool to us it sucks. It sucks. It's stupid.

It's dumb. you get one fucking life you get one you get one you get one a billion years from now takeoff will still be dead like you get one life one life for you to give it up for you to be willing to give up at 20 give something up we got to really think about this we can't think about I get that we got used to certain things that we had to normalize certain things

I'm asking the question can we stop but in a real way and I mean everything I'm not talking about look I'm what I'm gonna get back is I'm not talking about fucking rap music

I'm not talking about none of that I'm talking about this dealing drugs is bad period dealing drugs is bad were there choices for a lot of people no they did a bad thing because they had no other choices dealing drugs and putting that shit out is bad it's bad a lot of things are bad but that's one of them

shit working at TMZ is probably bad but dealing drugs is bad fine dealing drugs is bad being like being having an itchy trigger finger is bad there's nothing dope about being so hard that you're willing to kill. All of these things in the net are bad. And take off wasn't even the one in the fucking argument. Two other people got shot.

Two other people, like there was somebody there whose ego, for whatever reason, couldn't take the fact that there was an argument. They pull out and they start letting some go. Right. Over what? And if we're, and if we're unable to proper.

diagnosed the fact that there is an entire lifestyle in a way of life that is not leading to positive outcomes for a large portion of our community, not even a large portion of our community, for a very valuable portion of our community, for people that we love and care about, then we don't fucking care. Everybody stop front, stop acting like you a gangster. when you got to stop acting like you did, stop acting like you did, stop leading with all of this shit that's on your chest. Figure your shit out.

It's time. Okay. You say it's not music. You say you're not talking about rap music. I'm not talking about just rap music. No, right. Yeah. And you say drugs, dealing drugs is bad, right?

Having an itchy trigger figure is bad. what is it that makes it seem so cool to do those things? Well, I mean, that's easy. That's easy. Okay. It's not just us that thinks those things are cool. I know.

Snoop Dog posted a video the other day with two white kids looking like they were in the middle of the streets of their suburbs, acting like they were shooting an AR. Like singing a rap song, making their own music video, acting like they were shooting an AR because they thought it looks cool.

right so if we're gonna change that you got to change what what is highlighting like what makes that seem cool what are the things that are doing that is it is it music is it lifestyle is it culture is it like what makes that cool what makes people want to pretend like they're shooting an AR what makes people want to pretend like they're living that lifestyle and I think that's go ahead no go ahead my bad I'm sorry no I'm saying that's what you got it that's that's that's the core of it. Like, that's what you, if you're going to stop it, make it, that's got to stop, right? Makes what, you got to stop making people aspire for that. Hmm. So a part of this comes from the fact that being a black American is like you're in a lot of ways, and I can't

speak for all over the place. In a lot of ways, uh, being a black American adult, at least for me, was about how much you've been through, right? How much you've survived. I'm not from the suburbs. I'm from the streets. I'm from this place. I'm from that place, right? I have come through our existence is so connected to struggle.

Correct. Our existence is so connected to overcoming. People think that if you don't overcome something, that you're not a fully formed human being. My point is very few people in life, get to 30 years old without having overcome something. Thank you. The question is, what are you overcoming?

To me, a lot of the things that seem just normal to me are extraordinary looking back. And that's because I'm not in the same situation that I was in 1996. So what I'm wondering is if we care enough to be like, hey, there are certain parts of this that we really, really need to, you know, let me play it like this. Fuck it. The street shit is done. The street shit sucks, man. Like, seriously, I don't know why I'm being around the bush.

I don't want to, man, niggas is out there doing it. Y'all doing whatever. The street shit, the street shit sucks. The street shit's got to stop. And when I say it's got to stop, I'm not talking about the fact that people like are not going to do crime and do whatever they have to do. But we have got to stop romanticizing the streets. That's it.

We have got to stop romanticizing the streets. And by the way, when I say us, I'm like, I'm like, look, I'm being real. So people are going to say, hey, Van, everybody romanticizes the streets. That's right. They too. The greatest fucking movie of all time is what, the Godfather, some street shit. The greatest TV show of all time, the sopranos, some street shit. Like people who live counter and like outside of American culture, laws, and structures will always be,

will always be to people that are living inside of those things they'll always be like, hey, like America likes a rebel. America likes somebody that says, fuck, and I'm going to do whatever I want. Somebody who doesn't stand in line. I get that.

I understand all of that stuff. But what I'm telling you is that, like, we can't have a significant group of people who are influenced by either hyper uncontrollable violence, criminality or anything like that.

that we have got to put that shit in a box. Because the niggas that we're talking about, excuse me, the black men that we're talking about, they're not criminals anymore. Right. They have no business getting murdered. They just don't. They have no business getting murdered.

And by the way, nobody has any business getting murdered over this stuff. Like, no, like, like, the fact that, be honest with you about something else. Because I'm just babbling now and emoting and not being as smart as I need to be. but I really am sick of this. We had Michael Rappaport on this, on this podcast not too long ago, right?

Some time ago, I yelled on him for posting all of that shit. I'm not so sure he's not right. And I'm like, and, and, and look, what do you mean by that?

What I mean is that every single fucking day, we need to be inundated with the images of people who America is consistently forgetting. because the only time we're reminded of the incredible changes that need to happen in certain points of this country is when we lose a rapper. And then we see that there's no escape from the cloud of dysfunction and violence that sometimes follows us around because we can't get away from it. Right. And so for me, I'm mad because it's a fucking white boy, right?

on his fucking shit posting shit every day referring to the people as whatever whatever it feels wrong it feels weird but the reality is we live too much life we live too much without remembering how certain people are facing their everyday life and how it can't they can't shake it even when they get to the next point of where they're going how you make fucking 15 million dollars and you still end up dead in the fucking bowling alley. Yeah. Like we like like like how do you hear him at the bowling alley. Dolph buying cookies.

Rock at the motherfucking, uh, Roscoe's chicken and waffles. This shit is wild. You know, like it's is it's wild and it's so much death. It's everywhere. Everyone and no and we, we're continuing to make excuses for things that we've had to make our peace with a long time ago. I get why we had to make our peace with understanding. But I'm telling you right now, the conversation we have with America is incredibly important.

America owes black people so much. But we have got to have a serious, full-throated, not for public consumption, not with sponsors. we have to have a conversation with ourselves. Yeah. And it's not to make nobody feel bad. It's not to put nobody on the outside. It's to be real about shit. We want y'all to live.

We want y'all to live. We want y'all to live even if y'all don't understand what that is. We want to redefine what living means for our brothers and sisters who don't have a good grasp on it. Mm-hmm. And it's just like, it's not so, but this shit is, this shit is dumb. That's what it is. That's exactly what it is. Telling you by next week, nobody's going to be talking about it.

Something else going to happen. Well, sadly, that's just, even if nothing does happen, nobody's going to be talking about it because that's just, that seems to be the society. That seems to be human nature. You move on. Or, as I said at the top of all this, we're so desensitized to it. looking at a dead body and then moving on next week like it's nothing because we just saw one the week before the month before whatever. Yeah. You guys, I'm sorry, none of that was smart.

None of that was put together. Yes, it was. You know what it was? It was passionate and we're tired of having to have and we're tired of having to talk about it. That's what I really thought was like, we don't have to talk about this again. How many times do we have this conversation? Yes, it's crazy. Next up we have Jay Magnus Agoneki from Color of Change.

She's going to talk to us a little bit about, some of the stuff color of change has been doing talking about with revolt and the conier west interview on drink champs but also about a meeting that they had with Elon Musk and kind of what their expectations for Twitter are going to be moving forward I'm sorry about blathering on about that but I don't know the niggas depressed all right jade's up next for adults with Crohn's disease or ulcerative colitis symptoms every choice matters injection or intravenous infusion from the start. Tramphia is administered as injections under the skin or infusions through a vein every four weeks, followed by injections under the skin every four or eight weeks. If your doctor decides that you can self-inject tremfaya, proper training is required. Tremfaya is a prescription medicine used to treat adults with moderately to severely active Crohn's disease and adults with moderately to severely active ulcerative colitis, serious allergic reactions, increased risk of infections or lower ability to fight them, and liver

problems may occur. Before treatment, get checked for infections and tuberculosis. Tell your doctor if you have an infection, flu-like symptoms, or need a vaccine. Explore what's possible. Ask your doctor about Trimfaya today. Call 1-800-526-7736 to learn more or visit Trimfairadio.com. This episode is brought to by WeatherTech. Everyone knows winter is the MVP. and making a mess. You don't need weather tech floor liners in the summer, unless you hit the beach or go camping. Then you'd want a cargo liner or a road trip goes sideways, ketchup goes rogue, ice cream drips. Yeah, you'd be pretty happy about those weather tech seat protectors. So just to be clear as the mud, you're inevitably going to step into the summer. You don't need weather tech

unless you plan on doing summer. Visit weathertech.com today. Okay, guys, we have a special guest for you. Welcome to Jade. Magnus Ogunaki, Jade Magnus. Wow, what a name. It's joining us from Color of Change. Look, I have friends. Okay, we've talked about it on this podcast before. I am friends with the people over at Color of Change, a great organization.

Shout out to Rashad and everything else that they're doing over there. I'm also friends with the people over at Revolt, which is going to make this next conversation pretty interesting. And of course, you guys know that there was fallout over Yew West's appearance on drink champs, which is a podcast that has the visuals appear up here on the Revolt platform. You can watch on the Revolt app or the Revolt YouTube space. Now, obviously, we know that when Ye was on there, he said some pretty, pretty, really disgusting things about George Floyd. And my friends over at Color of Change hit me up and we're like, we want to send Jade. on there to have a discussion about what was said and what color of change feels like

revolt should do about it. Jay, thank you for joining us on How I Learn today. And I will let you take it over from here. Thank you. And to be clear, we talked to Revolt. You know,

we had a great conversation with Itavio. So we're friends with Revolt too. But, you know, I was in the car with my husband on a Sunday. I had not watched the Kanye drink champs interview at all. and I was scrolling Twitter and, you know, I'm seeing clips and I saw, you know, something that really shocked and startled me, which was that Kanye had said that George Floyd did not die from police violence, which we all saw with our own two eyes, but that he died from a fentanyl overdose. And so, you know, if Kanye had just gone on revolt and said, or on drink champs and said, white lives matter, you know, there's nothing for us to do there. People are allowed to say, whatever sort of like wild reaction that they want.

The problem that we have at Color of Change, which for those who don't know, we're the nation's largest racial justice organization. We're a Black-led organization with millions of members. The problem that we have at Color of Change is when somebody's intentionally spreading disinformation. And there's a difference between saying something wild or saying something reactionary and spreading disinformation.

And I really want to outline it here. you know, the difference is that disinformation is bad information that's deliberately created to mislead and deceive people, right? And so Kanye did not pull the George Floyd died of offense on an overdose. He didn't just pull that out of his head, right? That's actually a lie that was intentionally spread in 2020 in the spring to discredit what we all saw, the largest protest movement of all time, the movement for black lives. And so, you know, our stance was news networks like Revolt, particularly Revolt, which is a black-owned news network, they have to have a hard line against airing disinformation, right? People are allowed to have their own viewpoints. They're allowed to have their own opinions, but it gets really dicey when you're spreading disinformation because it's such a huge problem in this country, in this world. You know, some people first really notice disinformation around the election, right? That's like, you know, the whole Russian conspiracy is what a lot of people. people that was their first introduction to disinformation. For me, I started thinking about it a lot

around COVID and how hard it was to find good information about how to stay safe. I remember when COVID first hit, I live in New York, I was seeing posts like black people aren't getting COVID. I'm like, okay, you know, I was trying to assess it out. Like, is this good information? Is this bad? Drink ginger ale and it'll cure it. Yeah. Absolutely. Right. And so sometimes people are just saying things, right? And they're not trying to say anything bad. They're just speaking, you know, we all have like an uncle or a cousin who's like the pyramids or created by aliens, right? There's nothing intrinsically harmful about that, right? That might be misinformation, which is just...

We don't know. Accurate. But, you know, that just might be misinformation. The problem is that there's an entire industry that's designed to create lies to discredit any tiny ounce of progress in this country. And so, you know, color of change is not like we're just going after a revolt. We've gone after every news network possible to really have a hard stance around this. info because the problem is that when you say a lie what there have been studies that show around disinformation that when you say a lie and then you fact check it people never remember the

fact check they only remember the lie right and so we have a demand to all news networks and not just revolt and as I said I had a great conversation with de Tavio you know all news networks have to draw the line when it comes to airing disinformation because it can really be a matter of life or death. And we really saw that around COVID, right? There were so many people who were just honestly overwhelmed with good and bad information. And many of those people, you know, were unable to stay safe because of the horrible information that they received. And news networks everywhere are really grappling with how to deal with it. It's a new thing, right? The fact that everybody has a platform, the fact that everybody can, you know, open their mouth and pretty much

say anything. And it can spread, you know, the thing about social media, and the algorithm is that it rewards extremism. Saying the nuanced, thoughtful thing doesn't spread on social media, saying the extremist thing always spreads on social media. And so we see the ways that lies circle the globe so quickly based on this amazing, sometimes amazing, sometimes awful thing called the internet.

And so, you know, we reach out to Revolt and ask them to take it down, not because Connie was saying things that were anti-black, not because he was saying things that were, a misogynist, but because he was spreading disinformation and we felt like the news network needed to take a hard line stance against it. So, oh, you got a question? No.

Okay. So all very well said. And we definitely discussed this, you know, when it happened on Dreamchamps too and the fact that it was on Revolt's platform. I'm interested in how those conversations are going because I do think that what was even more is shocking. at the time that this came out and it came out in revolt, is that we were hearing that the shop also did an interview

and decided not to air it. And I do think that as black people, we have a level of responsibility, a higher level of responsibility to be gatekeepers when it comes to this disinformation that you're speaking up. Do you think maybe we will get an apology statement from them? Well, the conversation that I had, it was a confidential conversation. I can't say too much, right?

But I will say that color of change is invested in helping black organizations and black news networks get it right, right? And so, you know, we're not just going to them with the demand. We want to help them understand disinformation because, as I said, like, there are many news networks who don't understand it. We ran a campaign during the 2020 election asking them, you know, to turn off, you know, to stop airing Donald Trump's lies about COVID. And we're working with revolt to really, we want to work with revolt to really talk to them about disinfo and really train. and not just revolt. There are other black-owned publications and outlets that we want to talk to, too,

because, again, disinformation is a fairly new concept. Even the most established networks don't really have a way to air it. And, you know, I'm not sure if the shop didn't air what Kanye said because it was so reactionary and he was saying some things that were like very wild

and were offensive. Or it's because he was spreading disinfo. And so, you know, color of change is not, you know, I'm not, look, Connie was to say white life matter. I think that's so corny, right? I think it's like the corneest thing ever. But it's just not worth my time to run a campaign against.

What is worth my time to run a campaign against disinformation that's seeking to reduce trust or belief in the fact that black people are consistently harmed and killed by the police. That is an issue. And, you know, the wild thing about disinformation is we all sought with our own two eyes, right? We all start George Floyd get killed. I think a great information, a great example of this

that's happening right now that's not harmful at all, but it's like the Drake and 21 Savage rollout, which we're seeing, right? They're like, oh, they did the cover of Vogue, right? You know? And then it's like, oh, no, they didn't do the cover of Vogue. Or, oh, they're doing a tiny desk. And like, no, they didn't do a tiny list, right?

It just proves how easy it is on the internet to mislead and confuse people. And so when you're a news network, when you're a news organization, you have to have a really high standard around that because people are looking to you for truth. So I talked to some people over a revolt. My pals over there.

shout out to the peeps and they seemed very very uh concerned and open to the conversation i think the what what i was able to to get from them was that um you know the brass at revolt and i host a revolt black news not too long ago i was out there i'll do the revolt summit every single year i have so much respect for what they're building and what they're trying to build over there but it's very important at revolt in particular for them to represent the entire diaspora. They don't want to seem like there is a liberal slant. They don't want to seem like there is a conservative slant.

They don't want to seem like there's any type of slant. They're seeking to build a platform where black people can come. And I know that this statement has been poisoned, but speak freely. They want to build a spot where they can come speak freely. And I think they felt. like the disclaimer at the top of it was enough to let people know, hey, this is not what we're saying. This is what he's saying. Why do you feel like the disclaimer

falls short of that? Well, you know, again, it's not, for us, it's not about left or right. It's about right and wrong. And so, you know, I'm not saying, again, I'm not saying that Kanye can't go up there and say Trump 2024, you know, that is a... He just can't lie. You know, and it's like, none of us can't, like, you know, of us can go to our job and spread a lie about our boss, right? Like, we will get fired. Like, you can't just lie on people. There's consequences for lying, first of all. So that's the first thing. But when those lies are coming from, like, the grossest, most disgusting, hateful parts of the

internet, it takes on another dimension because we know that those people don't mean black people any good at all, right? We know that they don't mean us any good at all. And so really, that's like where the challenge comes through. You know, how I feel about it is that, that, you know, where is the line drawn with disinformation, right? So Connie can get on there and say, like, oh, George Floyd died of a fentanyl overdose, right? That's a lie. So before the election, let's say Ron DeSantis's Black surrogate goes up to revolt or any other news network. What if he gets on there and says felons can't vote? Will we air that? Because that's also disinformation that's seeking to deceive and confuse us. Where is the line drawn about which lies can be said and which

lies can be not cannot be and that's why I really feel like there has to be we feel like color of change there has to be a really hard stance against this information um you know it can be edited out right like you know I'm not saying you know there are people who and I may have my personal opinions about whether or not Kanye should be platformed or deplatformed I'm not bringing those into this conversation I'm talking about our concern that color of change is around disinformation and he can't get up there and just lie on people yeah um Last question for me. Speaking of,

you mentioned the darkest places on the internet. We're seeing a rise in what's going on on Twitter. I'm not a Twitter person. Like Van, I had such a good joke. You said darkest place in the internet. I don't want to deprive you of it. Go ahead.

It's inappropriate. Yeah, it's inappropriate, man, you know. He's itching. Look at him. He's wiggling. He's always to say it's so bad. Listen, I was going to say just to what you were talking about, about the darkest places on the internet, we're seeing a rise and hate speech and not just against black people against other races and marginalized groups as well. You guys at Color of Change were involved in a meeting with Elon Musk over the increased usage of the N-word on Twitter.

How did those talks go? And do you think it made any kind of impact on how we're going to see? Twitter move in the future? Yeah. You know, color change has been running campaigns against Twitter like for like probably almost a decade now. You know, like we were the people who ran the campaign before we used to get Trump kicked off Twitter.

And when he finally did, it was like a huge moment for us. You know, we've been literally on the phone with them in meetings like, get this man off Twitter. Same thing. He's lying. He's threatening people. You got to get this man off Twitter. And so a couple things.

One, our president, Rishal Robinson was invited to him meetings. represent color of change and talk to Elon Musk directly with some other civil rights leaders, Derek Johnson from the NAACP. And, you know, they went in with three demands, which he agreed to immediately and said, like, yes, I will do that. They were all very short-term demands. They were things like keep the election integrity policy that you guys currently have that doesn't allow disinformation around elections to spread.

They are around things like don't bring back people. who are the platform for hate speech, you know, a number of... That's President Trump. Period. Right. And so that included him, totally. And so, you know... Are you telling me that Elon must promise

not to bring President Trump back to Twitter? So he said he will not bring back anyone, their very short-term demands, that he would not bring back anyone who's de-platform for hate speech until he has his new counsel. Because, you know, he's like trying to bring together this whole council with people from, like, varying viewpoint to develop a system criteria for who gets to be on Twitter.

So these are the things he committed to. And so, you know, I run campaigns against corporations every day of my life. It's very rare that I go into a first time conversation with somebody and they're like, yes, I will do that, you know. But at the same time, the demands were extremely short-sided. And I do not want to, like, give so much credit, right? Because, like, they were short-term demands to, like, sort of get us over this election hunt. And, you know, at a time when, I mean, the latest that I saw was that the end of the end,

where it has risen up like 1,700 percent. At first it was like 500 percent. Now it's 17 hundred percent. You know, seeing that, seeing how, you know, the whole board of directors was fired and he's in total control. I mean, we're dealing with the richest man in the world who's extremely powerful and color change is all about fighting back against corporate power. And so while the conversation went well and the demands were met, it doesn't mean we're like, oh, that went so good. Like, we're going to leave Twitter alone. Elon's great. Totally. not there, totally thinking of other avenues to protect black people on the platform, because we know that black people and particularly black women are much more prone to harassment,

bullying. That's why, you know, you said you're not on Twitter. A lot of black women, you know, in the public eye are not on Twitter because of the extreme hate that they receive and the violence that they receive. And so. So based upon you guys' meeting, would you say you're meeting with Elon Musk? I'm not to cut you off, sister. But I did.

But I'm so sorry. I'm so toxic. Would you say that based upon your meeting with Elon Musk that Twitter is a safe space for Black people to be on right now? No, no. No. No. It never was. It's not going to be a safe space now.

Absolutely not. I would never say that. No, absolutely not. I mean, Twitter before Elon Musk was not been a good job at protecting black people on any levels. No. Right. Right. Is it going to be like, oh, automatically so much better?

No. The Internet's not, you know, these social media spaces are not safe. Yes, in general. It's just the truth. Yeah. Thank you so much. Jade Magnus. We want to have you back because we want to, especially with the Elon Mustang.

Y'all might have your shot for the Elon Mustang. Wow. I'm joking. I'll tell, no, tell, no, tell, no, tell, no. Tell Rashad to kick it. No, no, no. Tell Rashad to kick it. Tell Rashad Vance's kick it.

because I want to know if he follows through with everything. Well, that's what we're trying to follow through too. You know, it's like you're going to the meeting. Someone says they're going to do everything. You know, now we're waiting to see, you know, so let's see. Jay, thank you for joining us today on higher learning. Please keep our number and come back whenever you got something. Thank you guys so much.

Have a good one. This episode is brought to you by Spectrum Business. Fast, reliable Internet means everything for your business. And even this podcast, that's why I trust Spectrum Business. to keep companies of all sizes connected with internet, advanced Wi-Fi, phone, TV, mobile services, plus 24-7 U.S.-based support. Millions of business owners already trust Spectrum business.

So visit Spectrum.com slash business to learn more. Restrictions apply. Services not available in all areas. Somewhere out there is a Chevy truck. And the person who drives it, well, that's a Chevy person. You'd probably know one, your buddy, your sister. Once who always show up. They're the first to rise, the last to leave.

They always have that little extra something. And maybe you've got it too. Chevrolet, together let's drive. Visit chevy.com slash trucks to explore the lineup. Thank you. You too. Well, we'll see if Elon Musk listens to him or not. I'm not hopeful.

I mean, I'm shocked. I took the meeting. All about appearances. Sadly, as well. what I feel, but, you know, maybe we'll be wrong. Do you know what I did earlier today? What did you do? I watched the movie.

Man. I did. I was too curious. I had to watch it. You watched the movie. Have you changed your opinion from what we said last week after having seen it? Because now you are no longer curious. You have seen it. You are well equipped in a way maybe that you want last week to speak on what Kyrie said. Yeah. And this documentary,

did you find that it had anti-Semitic language, thoughts, rhetoric in it? Okay. So. Uh-oh. Uh-oh. Oh, my ass.

Okay. So the documentary is very interesting in the way that it starts. because it starts in a lot of different places, you know, talking to, it starts with an interview with a couple of the guys and they're talking about some things.

And then there's like a, almost like an extended sort of montage of different people that they say are waking up to the enlightenment of stuff. So it goes through that. But then it kind of begins in the infotainment part of the documentary. And this is what it begins with. This is what happens in the documentary. Okay, so I taped it on my phone.

I'm not going to replay their stuff, but this is what it begins with. This is one of the first things, one of the first pieces of information that you get when the documentary actually starts. This is about 24 minutes in, but still the earlier 24 minutes, they're talking to you about stuff, but they lead up to a point and they say, then, okay, it's three hours long. And then they say, okay, we're going to get to it. This is one of the first things they have. This is a quote. The Christian cannot read his Bible except through Jerusalem.

Jewish spectacles and therefore reads it wrong. As a result, Christians don't have God's word on a certain matter. They have the Jews' word. Judaism is not only the teaching of the synagogue, but also the doctrine of every Christian church that's in single quotes in America. Through our propaganda, the church has become our most avid supporter. This has even given us a special place in society. a special place in society, they're believing the lie that we are the chosen people and they the Gentiles.

Okay. That quote is from Henry Ford in a writing called the International Jew, volume four, page 238. They have it all cited right there.

This is scrolling. This information is scrolling. Okay, so it goes on right and it gets to the end it says the Jews have established five major falsehoods which work to conceal their nature and to protect their status and power to wit the Jews are Israelites number one and thus God's chosen people two Jesus Christ was a Jew three that six million Jews were killed in a holocaust or in World War II four that all races are equal or that all are brothers and five

that the Jews are just another religious group. We are obligated to conceal our own particular character and mode of life so that we will be allowed to continue our existence as a parasite among the nations. That is attributed to Ascanazi Jew Harold Wallace Rosenthal in an interview in 1976 by Charles A. Weissman published in June of 1992. This is the beginning of the document. documentary. Okay. So I'll tell you why I point that out. So if you were uninitiated to who Henry Ford was or the Dearborn, the Dearborn Independent, which was Henry Ford's newspaper that he routinely used to disseminate anti-Semitic teachings, if you didn't know any of that stuff, right? and you were watching that, you'd say, hey, this is what Henry Ford and whoever this other guy was.

And I'll have Donnie look him up real quick so that we can kind of suss out who he is. And you think this is just adding context to what it is that we're going to talk about. What I'm telling you, though, is that when this documentary starts to get down to its information piece, it starts with not coded not um covert not undercover it starts with virulent anti-Semitism like virulent like classic Henry Ford who uh I guess he saw the light later on in his life whatever Henry Ford is responsible for putting into the world some of the most aggressive anti-Semitism that we've ever seen so much so that he inspired Adolf Hitler. I want to follow up with the supposed words attributed to Harold Wallace Rosenthal.

It took very little curiosity to suss this out. Harold Wallace Rosenthal is described in that quote as an Ascanazi's Jew. The only problem with that interview is that it's not real. The Anti-Defamation League has called it a fabricated document and questioned why the author would wait to publish that 18 months after he had spoken with Rosenthal who was murdered in 1976. So this guy was dead when this came out. Okay?

And there is a lot of confusion about whether or not Rosenthal, who was a senior aide to Senator Jacob K. Javitz and was murdered in a terrorist attack in Istanbul, Turkey in 1976, even said those things. So for me, you have one thing said by one of the most virulent anti-Semitism. Semites ever and you have another thing that a lot of people are saying wasn't really even said that it was a bogus interview that the guy had already died, had been dead two years before this came out and it was just attributed to him by someone and said that he said that. So it starts off in a very questionable way. So I think, and the reason why I say this is to bring up the point that I think people are missing about this particular doc. So I watch the entire doc and the doc talks about

ancient Africa it talks about I have family members who are Hebrew Israelites these are things that I've heard before how the lost tribes and you know the sons of Noah and how that relates

to the earliest understandings of Hebrew the earliest understandings of what we as black people really are and who we were basically simply put, we are the original Jews and Judaism was practiced in large degrees in Africa and parts of southern India. All over different places, there's a connection to us being the original Jews, right? Okay. That in and of itself isn't problematic. To me,

it's not problematic to say that in a world bygone that black people were made up of all different types of situations that we weren't just Christians and Muslims sure sure sure but that there was actually a large contingent of Africans and darker skin people who were Jews we've talked about this we've long held the notion that Jesus Christ was probably a much more dark-skinned man than Michael Angelo painted him,

that a lot of this stuff is sort of re-contextualized through the lens of the history of, you know, whoever's writing the story. I think the problem in this is that the reasons why this history is lost

starts to be put squarely on the backs of a worldwide conspiracy led by a select few people whose goal it is to cut black people all over the world and all over the country away from their true heritage, true ancestry, and true knowledge of self. The reason why I'm letting this out for people is because it's important for them to know why this is so enticing and intriguing

to a large portion of Black America. And I'm attempting to do this with some nuance because I want to believe that these brothers are wrong and not evil. But for people who've had so much of their history, mangled, shredded, and stolen, there starts to be more there starts to be a lot of humanity in what's missing missing and a lot of vindication in who took it and people are looking for someone to blame so the fact that it would

start off with if if we were listening to uh if someone was making a documentary about the state of black Americans in this country and it started off with a quote from david Duke. You would say the rest of everything in here is bullshit. Like contextually, why would I listen to anything in here? And I'm not saying that the history in this documentary is accurate because I don't think that a lot of it is. You know what I mean?

I think it's fascinating to a degree if you're uninitiated to kind of, you know, some of the criticisms of what the black Hebrew Israelites are doing. if you're uninitiated to win certain parts of Africa might have accepted Judaism based upon historical study and when they're saying they accept them. I think that, you know, it's stuff that you hear from people who have a specific dogma, right? This is a religious sect that we're talking about.

But, you know, in terms of like what this really meant and how people should feel about it, the reality is if you're Jewish, you shouldn't be putting up with this shit straight like that and it just I watched it like seriously it starts off

and it starts off with a quote from here before and I'm like yo so to you oh sorry I'm sorry I'm sorry no no I'm just saying I'm like yo and I wonder does he know what he's watching

does he have a clue of what he's looking at like and I'm looking at all the rest of this stuff and I'm like this is like classic shit I mean, every classic thing. Whoa. There's a little bit of Jesus stuff in there. Like there's some Holocaust denial in there.

All of the classic shit when it started. I'm like, wow. Okay, where are we going from here? Well, I do think that there's, if I'm looking at his history and I'm looking at him posting what he did about Alex Jones, he wasn't as informed as to who Alex Jones is. So he might not have been as informed about Henry Ford or some of the things that he we're seeing to be able to immediately recognize how anti-Semitic this film is, not excusing him, but it might go to your argument of wrong versus evil. But listen to this. Let's stay on,

Kyrie, because listen to this, because if you play into the wrong versus evil, Kyrie doesn't necessarily think that he is the type of, he is a person who can have anti-Semitic beliefs. Donnie, can you play the clip? having anti-Semitic police? Again, I'm going to repeat. I don't know how the label becomes justified because you guys ask me the same questions over and over again, but this is not going to turn into a spin-around cycle of questions upon questions. I told you guys how I felt. I respect all walks of life and embrace all walks of life. That's where I sit. I think what people want to hear those is

yes or no on that question. Yes or no. I cannot be anti-Semitic. if I know where I come from. I cannot be anti-Semitic if I know where I come from. You believe that? Oh, yeah. I mean, I believe that he believes it. Well, I mean, look, so, I mean,

because Kanye said the same thing. And I know, but like, you guys, like, I've been hearing that since I was fucking nine years old. Like literally one uncle in the nation, one cousin in the nation, another uncle, black Hebrew, Israelite. Like, I've been hearing that since I was a kid. We are the true Semitic people, so I cannot be anti-Semitic.

I've been hearing that for so long, okay? So long I've been hearing that. My question is this. So black people are the original man, right? Life started in Africa. Starts there. We talk about ourselves. We refer to ourselves as the original man.

You guys can put a kufi on my head if you want. I believe it. I believe it really is. So the question is, and I would ask Kyrie and Yates, can white people be racist? If a white person comes up to you and says, hey, originally I am black. So what's up, my nigger? It's obvious to me. Yes, yes, I've always felt this just like I think you could be anti-Semitic.

I think it's very obvious. But as you stated, and as we're seeing from these two individuals, there are a lot of people who don't believe that that's possible. You can't be, I've had white people say to me, but can Kanye be racist if he's against black people if he's black? Yeah. I mean, you can be you. You know what. Look, I don't know what's going to happen with Kyrie. I don't know what's going to, how this is going to end up.

I've had people in my friend group very close to me, hit me up and tell me how good they thought that documentary was. I just be host with you. That doesn't shock me from your group. You've shown us of spectrum. You've shown us a spectrum of your friends. You know, if I told you the friend that said it,

you would be shocked. Would I know them? Yeah, you know them. You met them before. I don't have to have a long, And I have to have a long conversation. They live here?

Nah, man. Now, I have to have a conversation. I have to have a conversation. But see, but see, A, but look, look, I don't, these are my brothers, man. And they, and they, you know, and they, you know, these are my brothers. I know that we just, we got to talk things out. And for Kyrie to say that he wasn't promoting. the doc, the fucking doc is the hottest movie of the fucking holiday season now.

Well, yeah, you watched it too. I just couldn't. You know what? People call me out. They were like, Van, you didn't even watch it. You had to sit down and look at three hours of my life. It's three hours. Well, at least you can speak to it.

Thank you for doing the heavy lifting because I was going to watch it. So thank you. Okay, full disclosure moment here. on on higher learning. We are coming back to tape a little bit more because something that's just happened. As a result, actually, Rachel, do you have the statement from the Brooklyn Nets in front of you right now? I can pull it up. Okay.

Would you like me to read it or you want to take? Are you? If you have to go. Okay. So Carrey Irvin has been suspended. He has been suspended without pay until further notice. by the Brooklyn Nets. I will now read the Nets statement in full. Over the last several days, we've made repeated attempts to work with Kyrie Irvin to help him understand the harm and danger

of his words and actions, which began with him publicizing a film containing deeply disturbing anti-Semitic hate. We believe that taking the path of education in this challenging situation would be the right one and thought that we had made progress with our joint commitment to eradicating hate and intolerance. We were dismayed today when given an opportunity in a media session that Kyrie refused to unequivocally say he has no anti-Semitic beliefs nor acknowledge specific hateful material in the film. This was not the first time he had the opportunity, but failed to clarify.

Such failure to disavile anti-Semitism when given a clear opportunity to do so is deeply disturbing, is against the values of our organization and constitutes conduct, detrimental to the team. Accordingly, we are of the view that he is currently unfit to be associated with the Brooklyn Nets. We have decided that Kyrie will serve a suspension without pay until he satisfies a series of objective remedial measures that address the harmful impact of his conduct and the suspension period served is no less than five games. Rachel, what you got? No less than five games, so it could be more.

I assume it will be more. I think there's a fair chance that Kyrie Irvin never plays for the Brooklyn Nets again. Unless he apologizes. I don't see it happening. Yeah. I'm not saying that I wish that. I'm saying that this is a pretty big deal. Yeah.

Well, I think it kind of has to be. I feel like they're back with everything. I'm not saying that they don't wholeheartedly. leave every single thing that you just read, but they're almost backed into a corner because of everything that's happening right now in society. And Tyree has been given a number of chances to take back the things that he said. He's given the, excuse me, he's been given the opportunity to hear other people say why the things that he's saying are so harmful and how they're offended by it. He has not taken responsibility for the information he put out there or the things that he said.

And so at this point, you can't allow it. And you're not really having a lot of other people come out publicly and BA players and condemn Kyrie's actions. I myself was at a Brooklyn Nets game where it was business as usual. People cheer like crazy over Kaan, well, I'll say Kanye West, cheering like crazy over Kyrie despite the things the messages that he's putting out there that are so harmful. I think that if you don't do something, then it opens the door for other people to be able to speak out in a similar fashion. And if you don't do it with this, if someone comes out and says something that's racist against another group of people, are you going to let that ride? Are you going to punish that. I think that there has to be something that's done because it becomes a slippery slope

if you don't. Honestly, a slippery slope either way, but something has to be done. You know, I'm hoping for the best in this situation. You know, I'm hoping for the best for the people out there that have been harmed by these words. I'm hoping for the best for Kyrie Irvin. Look, this is an interesting situation for a lot of the players in the NBA to be in. because what they're being asked to do is advocate for another community that's been hurt historically and traditionally as well, you know. Yeah. And it might be something that they feel like stepping out too far puts, let me just be honest

with you. There's some tribalism going on here. And in times when there are assailants, everybody, everybody clings to their tribe. And there are probably a lot of NBA players who are uncomfortable with coming out against Kyrie Irvin because not because they agree with what he's saying, but because they may actually feel like what's happening to him. They might not understand the weight of it. They might not understand. Not that they agree, but some of them might be feeling like, wow, why is this this serious a deal? Are they ODM by coming with him like this?

And remember, you guys have to understand coming at him like this. You guys have to understand. Like, there is something that happens sometimes within the community where we realize that somebody is wrong, right? And we're like, all right, they're wrong. And then the penalty and the punishment for what they've done is so severe that we go, well, hold on now. Y'all going too far with it. You know, we're going too far with it. You get like, it's like, I remember like a friend of mine sent me, you know, I'm not even

going to do the friend of mine shit because, yeah, I'll get this. Whatever. But what I'm saying is that there might be some players here that don't know what they're supposed to do and don't want to be out of the NBA fraternity and feel like they're betraying Kyrie or anybody else by not coming out and saying what, what a lot of people feel like they need to be saying. but this right here is a really interesting development, Rachel. It really is.

And let me pull up a good chat on mine. Go ahead. Personally. This could make it worse. Well, and that's what I was going to say. This has the, this has, this move right here has the potential. This is a very delicate situation for the, for the Nets and NBA to martyr Kyrie Irvin. and in martyring him, it's already happened.

Sorry, I don't mean to cut you off. No, go for it. But to that point, I'm looking at a group chat of mine that's totally on board with that. They're talking about how messed up it is, how they're forcing this black man to apologize again and to do what they want. They're saying who's going to support him now,

being scared of, of, I'm reading what's in the chat. y'all don't come out me but just like being scared of of i don't even want to say that part i know what what i'm telling you guys there there's there are people who it's going to have the opposite effect which is and i and i and maybe that's why people are from to your point why some people are afraid to speak out but they're saying this is kind of plays into this whole narrative of being scared to go against the community i'm trying to i don't i don't agree with this I'm just saying, being scared. Okay, so what?

Being scared to speak out. Yeah, just, so look, there are people that say, even when Kanye started losing everything, there are people that go, okay, hey, gotcha. This is proof that the Jewish community has some sort of absurd amount of power to, like, smack you on your face or smack you on your behind when you say something crazy.

And that's why I'm saying, like, I'm not in any way. saying that that Kyrie Irvin shouldn't be disciplined. But they have to walk a really this is risky. Well, that's why I take a slippery slope on either

either way you go. Yeah, or doing something. By suspending him, it raises this to an all new level. I'm telling you right now, anyone out there that is serious about

black Jewish relations needs to get busy. We're going to have, I'm going to reach out to my, to my friend, Rabbi Ari Lam, and we're going to have some people on here. We're going to talk about this because we are at a very precarious time with two people that represent that are at the top of their games in their, in their respective industries and talking, talking about fashion and basketball, uh, mainstreaming a real divide

and something that may have been festering for a lot longer than what we think that it has been and people need to get serious and I have yet to see whether or not this in a grand scheme of things will make all of this stuff worse and I think that it probably will. Well, if you compare it to the Trump effect

of Trump constantly saying, watch, if I say this, watch if I do this, the fake news media is going to do this. And then it happens. And he's like, see, I told you all they can't be trusted. I'm not saying it's necessarily, you know, the same thing. But it's like Kyrie said this. You know, some people say, yeah, he said this. And then, then you have something that happens. To your point, I'm not saying that all those different ways we're talking about this. I'm not saying that I necessarily agree with that. But it's important. to talk about because there is a large group of people as I'm reading a group chat of my

some of my good friends. So it's just fans friends. I'm putting my friends out there too who are really like this is a form of slavery. It's what they're saying in the chat. I don't even want to keep going. Rachel's so, Rachel, they got you enslaved. You're scared. I don't want to put my friends out there.

I know. This is what I'll say. This is what I'll say. This is what I'll say. If this was. were your community that was were being assailed. If this were your community, whoever you are, whoever you are that are listening right, that, that's listening right now, if this were your community that was being assailed,

you would want this same thing to happen. You would want a line in the sand drawing and a bar set that says don't jump. And that's the way you will want this dealt with. And I think part of the problem with this. is for black people, we do get fucked over. We do get, why can't I say the N word?

Like, when I was at TMZ, I got, why can't I say the N word? Like, I got those arguments. They never said the N word from me, but like from Harvey. Sure. So it was like, well,

people are buying it and singing the music. Like, why can't they say it? And I'm like, well, and there's times where you go, well, shouldn't we be able to understand, the pain of something I've told this story before. It was like there was a time when we

would have these and these will always be like these hypothetical intellectual landmines to put van in and now let's argue with the opinionated black guy. And I remember one time, you know, Lil Dickie was on the show and I had a camera guy ask a little

Dickie about the fact that he says the K-Warden in his raps. And so then I'm pitching that that I'm pitching that to Harvey and him. I'm saying, well here, little Dickie is saying the K word. Would you guys like to litigate whether or not it's okay. Now far before me,

I did not want to say the K word. Sure. But I wanted them to know that what rappers do on songs should not translate to what a consumer of those songs and those words then gets to say.

And he shut it down so fucking quick. Like he shut it down. And I remember somebody else was like, Van, are you saying you want to say the K word? I'm like, no. Are you guys saying you want to say the K word? I'm like, no.

want to say the N-word? Like, what's the difference? And so because of that sometimes, and these are things that, you know, cultures butt heads with against, because of that sometimes, people end up on the wrong side of arguments because of the way they feel, they don't feel like it's the same for them. Kyrie Irvin is 100% wrong in this situation, like 100% wrong, but they're going to be people that say they're going too hard on him. They are. They will, and they are. And can I just say also about the NBA backing themselves into a corner of having to respond. NBA, the NBA, WNBA and the NBA were very outspoken in 2020. And they did a lot of, you know, surrounding Black Lives Matter and in a response to what was happening with this 2020 racial awakening and really stood

behind the movement. Okay. So if you're going to stand behind one margin, marginalized community, how when one of your players is speaking out and putting out anti-Semitic rhetoric and refusing to apologize, you're going to have to stand behind that community as well. So I- Stuff. We'll see. This story is going to be ongoing. And we're going to keep talking about it. So y'all just, you're ready.

Duane Wade's ex-wife accuses him of pressuring the treasurer. trans daughter to change gender for his own financial gain. This is one of the nastiest fucking stories I've heard about in a long, long time. Savon Funches Wade objected to multiple factors outlined in her ex-husband's petition to legally change the 15-year-old's name. Obviously, we're talking about Zaya Wade. She says that Dwayne Wade, who's 40 years old, is positioned to profit from the kids name change and gender change with various companies through contacts and marketing opportunities,

including but not limited to deals with Disney. Dwayne Way's ex-wife is asserting that Dwayne Wade wants to pressure a kid into changing their sex so that Disney will pay them for it. Yeah. Listen, I don't think that the ex-wife has custody. He has custody, but I don't know what her relationship to this day is with Zaya. I looked up and on the, I looked around there. She's pretty involved in the lives of the kids.

I looked around. I did a little research. It doesn't seem like there's any estrangement right there. Well, yeah, because what doesn't make sense to me is if you've heard one interview, one conversation, the Zaya has had with any outlet, whether it's on social media, she's very clear in who she is and what she wants. So I think to make this accusation as if maybe she doesn't want these things really is gross. I mean, that's pretty big allegations.

And then I guess if I'm just looking at the history of this relationship between Duane and his Dwayne and his ex-wife. Like, this isn't the first time that it's gotten really messy, but to throw a child in between and say that the father is using the child for his own personal gain, which, let's be honest, Duane Wade doesn't look like he needs anybody's money at this point. It's just really gross.

And I just hate that a child is involved in any of it, any of it. So she says that in April 22, there was a meeting with Wade in Atlanta. And she says that Dwayne Wade said a lot of money had already been made in relation to Zaya's name and gender issue. Question for you. Two parents here. Father has full custody. Yeah. Mother not have full custody.

I'm very aware of this story because I covered it when it was happening on the old TMZ. Right. Um, Dwayne Way was able to get full custody of his kids. Uh, it was very long and drawn out. And it seems like, uh, Miss Funches Wade is still trying to, you know, figure out what their life is going to look like, you know, as co-parenting or get custody back or whatever. I did wonder in this situation, though, if the child is going to change their gender and stuff, how do you do that when you're co-parenting?

Is that something that both parents should have a say in? Or does like, how does that work? Well, I would be interested in whatever the custody agreement is between. I mean, if he has full custody, he does have full custody. Then I wonder, I'm not a family law attorney, but I wonder with full custody, does he have full control of the decisions that are made. Or did she agree to allow the name change, but then maybe is upset now with what she feels is exploitation?

I don't know. So if somebody has full custody over the kids, then whatever they say goes. Yeah, I would think that they're in charge of all decisions when it comes to the child. I would assume that. Again, I don't know with this particular situation when it comes to changing the name and the gender, but usually when you have full custody, you're in charge of everything. And then there might be some visitation rights that are afforded to the other side. Let me tell you why this is so nasty. this is waving the conspiracy flag like high in the air this is like really dirty fighting this is

this is this is what everyone thinks this is playing on the the dark corners of what everyone thinks when it in regards to trans people and stuff is like zaya doesn't really want to change her her her sex she really doesn't want to transition she's doing so because there's some incentive to it. Like Disney's going to pay. Like there's an agenda. This is like, it's very quiet that there's an agenda. Disney has an agenda to make little black boys change their sex.

And Dwayne Wade is somehow going along with Disney's agenda. The agenda that's being pushed. And there's a little bit of that. that I'm sure the lawyers and everybody knows is going on. And there's going to be an entire portion of people who read this story who are going to be like D. Wade is forcing his kid to transition to get paid from Disney, which is just like a fucking wild thing to have floating around there, man.

Yeah, this is, I mean, Duane has come out and spoken out against these allegations and has basically said, listen, Zaya has a 4.0 GPA, great for her. She's in honors classes, and she's been able to do that all while navigating all this unsolicited and harmful attention and debates about her gender and sexuality. And it goes on to say, no one in our house would ever force Zaya or any of our children to do anything against their will, much less force an identity on them. I mean, from what I've seen, they've really tried to protect her. I know I've interviewed Gabrielle U.N. before for extra. The way that she speaks about her relationship with Zaya and how they support Zaya,

they turn off Zaya's comments, they really try to protect her, allow her to be herself free from all the outside noise. And, you know, I just hope that Zaya is able to continue to stay on that path and just shut it all out and be the best version of her. So have you heard the discussing audio of Courtney, Clenny hurling racial slurs at her boyfriend before the alleged stabbing? Yeah. Okay, so I don't really want to cover this story, but I do want to say one thing.

So they put this story up there, right? Mm-hmm. And I said under the story, I said Dr. Umar was right. Because it just sounds so bad. It's like Dr. Umar was right, right? Uh, now I want to say two things about that. Number one, that was me just saying something, you know. Did people come at you?

They didn't come at me. Okay. Okay. They didn't come at me. Even though that's probably an inappropriate joke to make when somebody lost their life and I take full responsibility for that. But in that moment, my first thought was, I'm sorry that I thought this. In that moment, my first thought was, God damn.

It's like, this dude is in a relationship with a white woman. and I'm going to be honest with you. I kind of meant that. Like in that moment, like in that moment, in that moment, this guy's in a relationship with a white woman

and she is super mad at him and calling him a nigger over and over and over again and then he gets stabbed up, right? So anyway, I put that there. It's up there still if people want to get on my ass about it. I was,

this is on the shade room. I put this under this. I'm now a frequent shade room commenter. I was, was disgusted disgusted by you weak-ass niggas that jumped under that comment

capable of white women no look let me tell you something right now I don't have one ounce not one ounce of vitriol in my heart

for anybody in an interracial relationship. Do your thing. Like, do your thing. But whatever would make a black man, a black man jump to the defense of a white woman, alleged, accused of stabbing a black man over 20 times calling him a nigger on audio whatever level of self-hatred that you must have to say like black women never get white like black women never get white like black women never get white we're talking about black women nigger and you don't probably need to be talking about them either Like, I could not believe everything they say about you niggas is true. I'm looking. I'm on the post right now. I'm looking because I would just-

Everything they say about you niggas is true. Listen, do I think that your comment was a little insensitive about Umar was right? Sure. Too broad. That's true. Maybe you could have given a little context. Maybe you could have given a little context.

But I think that I don't think insensitive. Yeah. I think that I think that you have to talk about what happened in the audio that we're listening to. And you can talk about that. And you can litigate that separate from the fact and still and not disrespect the fact that this young black man lost his life. I'm sure that that the audio, that situation. doesn't stand alone. And obviously, I'm trying to look through these comments from what you're saying.

It sounds like some of these people in his comments, either like that or in very similar situations. It's absolutely disgusting. We've got to have way more respect for ourselves. You got to. I'm in a... What? Why are you bugging your eyes at me?

I'm listening because you're right. I'm like, I'm so mad. We got to start a pot. I'm just mad. So angry this podcast, man. Well, it is, it's an angry podcast. It's a sad podcast. But, I mean, just the level of hatred you have.

have to have to let somebody continually call you out of your name in the absolute worst way and then stay with this person. I just being in an interracial relationship, I feel like this y'all make us look so bad. I've said this time and time again. I would never, this is disgusting. I would never allow my husband to call me out of my name. I was about to ask you.

Let me ask you this. This is a serious question. I have to ask you. You're interracial. I think I got to speak up on interracial relationship. Let's say you get in an argument with Brian and he calls you the N-word. Would you guys get a divorce? It's going to end up one or two ways.

And I think you know what I mean. I would rather not incriminate myself to say it on the podcast. It's one or two ways. One of two ways, I mean. Is there any. There's no way. If you know me because before you even fix your mouth to say that, you already know, you should know how detrimental that word is, how violent that word is, how disgusting that word is. Before you even fix your mouth to even think that word, you should already know.

So then the fact that you would fix your mouth to say that towards me, what are you trying to give for me? What are you trying to make me feel? What are you trying to make happen here? I just, I could, if I heard Brian say it to somebody else, we still go have the same issue. I'll just never understand that. Thank God. I'm not that way. But when a situation like this happens, I feel like I got to speak up on behalf of interracial

people. It would be like, we're not all like this. This isn't what goes down. Irrational relationships. I'm sorry. I'm upset. I feel like I got to be like, what goes down behind closed doors. This isn't how it is.

this is a man who clearly, and I'm sorry if it sounds like I'm speaking ill of the dead, but I'm speaking towards the audio recording that he heard. This is a man who did not love himself, who did not love, I'm sorry, not loved his people and allowed other people to just disrespect him in the most disgusting way. I just, I mean, even in the audio, he says, yeah, I am. Yeah, I am. Like, so what? Like, the word didn't mean anything to him or the fact that.

She was spewing at him didn't mean anything. It's like he didn't gather the hatred that was coming out of her mouth multiple times as she was calling him the N-word. Oh, honestly, I wish that recording had come out. We know this woman clearly hated this black man. We know that she, we know that she stabbed him this many times. We know that she murdered him and had no respect for him or his entire being. I didn't need to hear the recording.

Well, rest in peace. Rest and peace culture. All right. Just real quick about this, five lions escaped the zoo during the roaring snore sleepover for quest for guests. Five African lions broke out of their enclosure on Sydney's harborside, Taranga's zoo on Wednesday. Donnie?

Sorry, I wasn't ready. This podcast got me in my feelings. Exactly. I was just about to say that. Alarms blared through the zoo and guests were rushed to safety before the lions were tracked down and returned safely to their exhibit. the zoo's executive director Simon Duffy Toe reporters One Lion Cub had to be tranquilized

I in the month of November I'm gonna have a zoo person I want to host a debate Between a zoo person and somebody who was against zoos Because I'm not sure where I stand I know you gotta have zoos I don't think that they should be locked up man But at the same time you know you gotta have a zoo

But then you shouldn't have a zoo right I struggle with this too Yeah I'm in between circuses and zoos. No, no, no, no, no. Fuck the circus, dog. I just, I'm like very, I get it. Circus.

Circus, sea world, all of that shit, done. Zoos and aquariums, different. Circus, sea world, all of that shit, done. No, fuck all that. Fuck the circus. I punch a circus nigga in his mouth. Okay? Even universal.

Nah, universal. No, universal. Don't use no animals, though, do they? I don't think they use no animals. then what are they doing? They're like flipping around and shit. Wait, is it like Circus? I don't think they have animals.

I've never seen it. I don't know if they have. I never heard of a nigga go, I went to Universal Circus and I fucking saw Bear rapping. You know, I never, I never, I never, I don't think the Universal Circus has any, has any animals like that.

I don't know if they do, Rachel. I don't think they do. They at least did. I don't know if they still do. I'm seeing people. Why I felt like I saw an elephant one time. Okay, go ahead. Okay, maybe I'm wrong.

No, PETA has a petition. I don't know how old this petition is, but it says Universal Circus is still exploding zebras, camels, and other animals. Okay, so that, now that's, I can't, okay. They use dogs. Wait, here it is. Universal Circus uses animals in several of the routines, and this is not advertised anywhere on their websites.

Had I known before, I would have not bought tickets for my family, they use dogs versus camels, zebras, and a miniature. her horse. I don't fuck with the circus, man. Let me keep a gangster with you. Fuck the circus. I also think that if lions escape to zoo,

that they should be allowed to if they got out, if they made it out. If they, I think that should be a rule. If you, if the lions make it out, they should be allowed to stay free.

Because it's not like they're in there under no penalty. They're in there on some bullshit anyway. And so if they escape to see what, see if, I would like to see a movie, lion versus New York.

You know, like in real life. Just put the lion out there and let's see if the lion, can you imagine just walking down the street in New York? Like that's, that to me, I would look at the lion and I'd be like, you got it, dog.

No, you were not. You're a man. I mean, I'm a run, but I'm gonna be like, I'm on his side. I wish I could talk to him. I wish I was the Beastmaster. But Bozeman jumped in a

bed this morning and he looked over at me. Yo, me and Bozeman understand each other. I get it. So the copper. Yeah. I looked at Bozeman like, hey, bro, 10 minutes, huh? 10 minutes. Bozeman went, all right.

He knows 10 minutes. We're going out. He's like, all right, cool. I'm telling you, I got a deeper connection with animals than anyone in the world. Mailback, let's go. Quick one. Mailback time. Time to read your letters and then we'll reply to things.

Oh, it's mailback time. Write us with your queries and we'll chime in. All right. First one is from Tracy J on Instagram. She or he asks, What is your least favorite animal? Gotta have one. Birds.

Least favorite animal? Birds, all of them. No, I'm not doing it. This is. Van. Van. Something came to mind. Something came to mind.

And what was it? I don't like, like, those woolly caterpillars. One got on me when I was a kid and it was very traumatizing. Are we considering that an animal? Yes. Why wouldn't that? You know, sometimes Rachel, like, Rachel, like, sometimes, Rachel, sometimes you say stuff. is my wife asked me that same question last night she was like our ants and bees consider animals

I was talking about animal games and I was like yes I think this is a logical question I think this is a logical question thank you shout out to your wife okay come on let's go all right this next one isn't necessarily a question is more of a PSA but I feel like it needs to be said judy povey on reddit says or asks not a question but a hard ask from me to Rachel and Van and to all thought warriors, have they voted yet? And if not, do they have a voting plan? And can you check on three friends to make sure they have what they need to vote? Yes, I work a lot with vote.org and I posted tag three people to get out and vote, but I will do three more. And I'm a person, I like to vote in person. It's my first time

getting to vote in California. So that's how I will be voting in person on the vote. November 8th. Mind your business, Judy. Man. Don't worry about whether or not I'm voting. You make sure you do your thing. You don't ask me about my personal shit, Judy. I fuck with you heavy. I love names that rhyme and you're probably a lovely person. You ask me about who I'm, you know what? You know who I voted for? I voted for Ralph Nader. She didn't ask that. She didn't ask who you voted for. She asked.

Just about your plan. How you voted yet? Judy getting into my business a little bit, man. Judy, man, back off, dog. You know what I mean? We do a lot around here. Y'all wouldn't even know how much I did in 2020. You know what I'm saying?

Like, there was a lot being done. A lot, a lot that people get, that people do. Judy, you know what I'm saying? Look in the mirror. Judy Pudy. You know what I'm saying? Pooby. Is that her name?

Poovie. Oh, my bad. Judy Poovie. Jesus. I love you, Judy. I'm sorry. All right, we're joking. All right, one more.

All right, last one is from the Lady J from NYC on Instagram. She asked, Van, if you had to prepare a fast food menu that Rachel had to eat, what five items would you choose? No. Fast food menu. Okay. This is what we're going to do. So Rachel, I mean, I'm sure you eat Popeye's chicken and stuff like that, right? Love it.

Okay, so that doesn't count. So we're going to go hamburgers, okay? No. Rachel, you need to chill. I'm being serious, okay? You need to chill. Rachel, I'm going to give you a double whopper with cheese and bacon, cut in half. Why is the cut in half?

Because for some reason, you don't eat cheese. You know this. I really don't do dare me. I don't want to fucking do this. I don't, because, but I tell you straight up, because Rachel can't have a milkshake. Rachel can't have no cheese. Do you know what a bird? burger with no cheese is.

Great. A fucking failure. That's what it is. A burger with no cheese is a failure. I don't want to do it. You know what, Rachel? Don't eat fast food. Don't eat anything that tastes good ever.

Eat pork shop sandwiches for the rest of your life. You know I'm a frequent wing stop goer. Yeah. I don't always eat great. I eat wing stop way more than that should. Okay. Lady Jay, this is. such a great question. So I'll give you my

fast food items, okay, that I like. Double wopper. Cheese and bacon, cut in half. I'm not eating that anytime soon, but it is a monster. Fries, I like to get Wendy's fries.

Wendy's fries are good. Really salty. Wendy's fries. I'll also get a frosty from Wendy's. That is the three things. Okay, you don't like the frosty from Wendy's? you don't like it You get the frosty from Wendy's Also for me personally We're talking fast food

Even though they have some questionable politics I will get a cookie from chick-fil-a Because they got the chocolate chunk cookie They got the cookie I like a cookie I'm a fat I'm a fat boy Get a cookie

Cookie for my tithes for my titty's okay I don't think we need to get to a fifth I love cookies Okay that's fine We'll even need to get to a fifth one If you want mine, I'd have Do you want mine?

Yeah, sure Poppice chicken Three piece dark spicy Fries from Popeyes or Chick-fil-A Love a baked potato from Wendy's Interesting. I haven't had that in a long time, but it's good. Right? I had one the other day. And I love chicken nuggets from Wendy's spicy chicken nuggets. There you go. I do eat fast food. I don't like spicy stuff. It's good, though. Your menu was

curiously better than mine. It's curiously better than mine. It's better. Okay, you got unexpected ally of the week? Oh, no. Do you? Yeah. No. Actually, I do. Okay. I thought about this. I wrote this down. Daniel Radcliffe. What did she do?

Yeah. He spoke out against J.K. Rowling and her anti-trans beliefs. Says, not everybody in the franchise agrees with her. That's Harry Potter calling out the God of the Potterverse. Uh-uh. Weird out now. What do you mean weird out? Oh, he's weird out

Because he was in the weird out movie Let's keep it a buck Nobody saw that shit That nigga Harry Potter man A nigga would have to make like six more Weird out movies for Like that shit was cool Like he

That's Harry Potter All right Okay But yeah But yeah shout out to Daniel That's a that I thought that that was amazing Gotta support people Everybody

Please take care of each other and please take some breaks. You know, the weekend's coming. It's a lot of bad news. Take one extra minute in your life and try to find some good news. I am Van, Layton, Jr. taking the cap so off,

but do not stop learning. I'm Rachel and Lindsay. Bye, guys.